Juno News - January 06, 2026Freeland’s Ukraine side-gig sparks conflict-of-interest uproar
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Summary
Learn English with Justin Trudeau. Prime Minister Justin Trudeau speaks to the media about the Venezuelan crisis, his plans for a new pipeline to the Pacific Coast, and the departure of Chrystia Freeland, who has accepted a role as Ukraine's economic advisor.
Transcript
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Well, Prime Minister Carney is in no rush to build a new Canadian pipeline to the Pacific
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despite the sudden availability of all that Venezuelan oil to our biggest customer, the
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United States. Since the arrest of dictator Nicolas Maduro, some analysts in Canada say
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Venezuelan crude might soon replace Canadian exports of oil to the United States. We could
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lose our main customer. In a letter to the Prime Minister, Conservative Party leader Pierre
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Polyev wrote, the removal of Maduro and possible end to American sanctions on Venezuelan oil
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could eventually displace some of Canada's oil exports to our biggest customer. Polyev
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says it's time we race to approve a pipeline to the Pacific coast and break our dependency
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on the American market. But the Prime Minister says Canada remains a reliable supplier of
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oil to the United States. And that's not about to change.
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President Trump has said one of the key reasons that he went into Venezuela was to get the
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oil out. Do you think this will impact the Canadian oil sector? And does that increase the need
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in your estimation to have a pipeline to the northwest coast of BC?
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It's been our view, and we're working towards this, that Canadian oil will be competitive because
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it is low risk, clearly low risk, low cost, the marginal cost. There's been huge progress in
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getting down the cost. And low carbon, which is what the Pathways Project carbon capture will
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bring. And that makes Canadian oil competitive, Canadian oil competitive for the medium and long
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term. So we welcome the prospect of peace, peaceful transition, democratic Venezuela. We welcome the prospect
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of greater prosperity in Venezuela. But we also see the competitiveness of Canadian oil. And we're
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investing or we're putting in place measures so that that's going to happen. And in that context,
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a pipeline and exports to Asia, we've got competitive product, and we'd be diversifying our markets. And
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that's one of the reasons why we signed the comprehensive MOU with Alberta. So we'll be working towards that.
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So the Prime Minister also weighed in on the fate of MP Chrystia Freeland, who has accepted a role
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as Ukraine's economic advisor. Freeland posted this on X. Ukraine is at the forefront of today's
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global fight for democracy. And I welcome the chance to contribute on an unpaid basis as an economic
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advisor to President Zelensky. In accepting this voluntary position, I will be stepping aside from my role
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as the Prime Minister's special representative for the reconstruction of Ukraine. In the coming weeks,
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I will also leave my seat in Parliament. But for now, Freeland is still an MP. And even the CBC is asking
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the obvious question, who is Freeland actually working for right now?
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You ponder now a situation where, yes, the two countries are allies, but their interests may not
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always perfectly align. And it's unclear how Freeland can sit on both sides of the table at the same time,
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without being in a position of a conflict of interest. To this point, we have asked the Prime
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Minister's office to clarify exactly which government Chrystia Freeland is working for at the moment,
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ahead of the Coalition of the Willing talks in Paris tomorrow.
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Now, Carney says, any questions about her continued role as a member for Rosedale
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were settled once she accepted the appointment from Ukraine? Let's listen.
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Ms. Freeland was on yesterday as your special representative. Did you ask her not to quit
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because of the minority Parliament situation right now?
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Let me... No, just to be clear, just to be clear. Ms. Freeland, Chrystia has served our country
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for well over a decade in a formal role as a parliamentarian, certainly in a number of ministerial
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posts and served with great distinction. She was... I had her as my special envoy after she left
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cabinet for the Ukraine reconstruction. Judgment became her judgment that she could be more useful
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for that process as she was leaving, as she was retiring as a parliamentarian, as a direct advisor.
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My judgment was that taking that role would be consistent with resigning as an MP,
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and I welcomed her doing that, and I'm pleased that for Ukraine.
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So, the loss of an MP means the Kearney Liberal government will be one more member shy of a majority
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in parliament. Conservatives say Liberals are stepping up. They're pushed to lure opposition members over to
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the government side. MP Scott Anderson of Vernon, B.C. was approached and released this letter saying,
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he told the Liberals, what are you going to offer, or rather, what are you going to try and bribe the
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next Conservative MP with? A stinging reference to ex-Conservative MPs Chris Dantremont and Michael Ma.
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Anderson went on to say, it'll be a cold day in hell before I even consider betraying my constituents,
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and you should probably stop asking because I will certainly advertise it every time you try.
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We're now joined by Duff Conacher, co-founder of Democracy Watch, an ethics watchdog. Welcome, Duff.
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Let's start off talking about Chrystia Freeland and the whole question about around who she works for
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right now. She, as you know, has accepted this role as economic advisor to Ukraine. The problem,
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of course, is she's also a sitting member of parliament. And yes, we know she's going to quit.
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We don't exactly know when she's going to quit. She should be quitting immediately, but there are
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things that she is doing that potentially put her out of conflict of interest. What do you make of
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this situation? Yes, she actually should have quit before the position was confirmed. And right now,
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she's in violation of the MPs code, which has a rule that says you can't improperly further
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another person's or entity's private interests. And it's very narrow, the MPs code. It does cover
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financial interests though. And she's been an economic advisor to the government of the Ukraine.
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And of course, her advice will affect all businesses in the Ukraine if they are able to do economic
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development. And that's furthering the financial interests of the government and those other
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entities, those other businesses and organizations in the Ukraine. And it's clearly improper. She took an
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oath of allegiance to Canada when she became an MP and does so after every election again.
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And as well, it's just improper to have this conflict of interest between her role as an MP
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representing voters in Canada and her role advising another foreign government.
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Yeah, you get the sense that she thinks that the interests of Ukraine and Canada are exactly the
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same, but they're obviously not. We're two different countries, two different interests.
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I mean, you're either serving the interests of Canadian taxpayers who are paying you, by the way,
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or you're serving the interests of the Ukraine. And the other part of this is that the fact that she
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didn't accept a salary, I mean, I suspect that there are some financial perks in there somewhere,
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if you look at the contract. But she seems to think that that's maybe a factor here,
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because if you read what she says in accepting this voluntary position, I will be stepping aside
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from my role as the Prime Minister's Special Representative for the reconstruction of Ukraine.
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In the coming weeks, I will also leave my seat in Parliament. I mean, does it matter that this is
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a voluntary position, an unpaid position, or not?
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No, it doesn't matter at all. You can still have a conflict of interest just based on
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relationships and the interests that you are representing. And the past ethics commissioners
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have ruled that interests go beyond financial. And as well, she's representing the financial
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interests of the Ukraine because she's advising on economic development. So there is a financial
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factor in there, even though it may not be personal for her. I'm guessing her expenses are going to be
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covered. If she goes to the Ukraine, she's not likely to be paying for that herself. And she had to
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leave the position, the Cabinet position of the Special Advisor to the Prime Minister on the Ukraine,
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the Special Envoy. And she did that yesterday, but she's still sitting as an MP. So there's different
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rules for members of Cabinet. And if she had stayed in that position, she would have been violating those
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rules. But she's still violating MPs have their own separate ethics code, and she's still violating the
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rules in that. She said she got advice from the ethics commissioner's office. The ethics commissioner
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treats that advice as confidential. And if the ethics commissioner cleared it, the ethics commissioners
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created a giant loophole in the federal ethics rules, essentially saying you can represent a foreign
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government while being an MP. So hopefully we're going to file a complaint about it. Democracy Watch
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is, and hopefully an MP will file it as well. That will force a ruling from the ethics commissioner that
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can be challenged in court. And if the ethics commissioner's ruling is that this is fine,
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then Democracy Watch will go to court and challenge that ruling because it's clearly not. It's technically
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legal under the oath of allegiance. It doesn't say that you can't do other work. It's technically legal
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under our foreign interference laws, which have a huge loophole in them that really should say MPs cannot
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be representing foreign governments or entities. But under the MPs ethics code, I think it's a clear
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violation and the ethics commissioner should rule that and find her guilty now. She should have resigned
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before and she's violated the code by not doing that. And the longer she stays along, it's just extending
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the violation. Yeah, and she's continuing to get paid. I get the sense that she's
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stretching this out so she can keep, you know, collecting that sweet salary of hers.
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I think that's part of it. I think the other part is the government is close to a majority.
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If they can get a conservative MP or MP from another party to switch over, they'd have a majority.
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If she leaves, then it's a by-election. That seat is, if she resigns, that seat's vacant. So she can't
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vote any longer with the government. And that's advancing the private interests of the Liberal
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Party, which is improper as well, to be sitting there as an MP in a conflict of interest. And why
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are you sticking around? You're sticking around so that your party can ram through parliament,
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whatever it wants, and also derail a bunch of investigations that are going on at committees.
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Because if the Liberals get a majority, the Liberals will have a majority on every
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committee and all the good work that committees are doing right now holding the government to
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account will stop. So that, again, that's a conflict of interest if she's sticking around
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for that reason, because she's furthering improperly the interests of the Liberal Party,
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as opposed to upholding the public interest, which is what you're supposed to do as an MP.
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Yeah, I think what's going on in committees is an excellent point. And the Liberals would love to
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tax. And I think that's one of the reasons why they're pushing so hard to lure Conservatives over.
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And I'll get to that in a minute. But first of all, I want to just end this discussion around
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Chrystia Freeland, because I think ultimately the buck stops with the Prime Minister, doesn't it?
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I mean, shouldn't he dismiss her rather than wait for her to resign?
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He certainly could kick her out of caucus for this, because it's a clear violation of the MP code.
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There are no penalties for violating the MP's ethics code, just like there's no penalties when
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cabinet ministers or top government officials violate the key ethics rules in the federal
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government ethics law. It's crazy, but politicians write these codes and laws for themselves and they
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don't put in penalties. But if as what should happen, the ethics commissioner finds her guilty of
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violating the ethics code, well, does Mark Carney want to wear that? So he should tell her you resign
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now or I'm kicking you out of caucus because I think it's a violation. You're violating fundamental
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rules that protect democratic government and you're not going to be able to stay in caucus
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as a result. And if he doesn't do that, he should wear it. Her conflict is his conflict,
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because he's accepting it. And it wouldn't be surprising from him. He has a deeply unethical
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attitude towards governing. We know that because he is in a financial conflict of interest himself,
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because of his million dollars of stock options in Brookfield, while he's sitting there making
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decisions that affect companies within the Brookfield conglomerate almost weekly. Any
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decision he makes about businesses in Canada affects Brookfield. And he's invested in Brookfield
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and knows he's invested in Brookfield and has a sham not blind trust and a sham unethical smokescreen
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and says and is fine with that and says this whole cover up that he's doing is fine. So I wouldn't be
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surprised if he's also fine with Christy Freeland breaking the fundamental ethics rules.
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Yeah. When you look at Ukraine and the rebuilding of that country, once this war ends,
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I mean, this thing is going to stink to high heaven because of course Brookfield will want to play a
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huge role along with other companies like BlackRock, for instance, in the trillion dollar operation
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that is going to be the rebuilding of this destroyed country of Ukraine. And as Brookfield, of course,
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plays a role in that. Canada will have a role in that through its government and then Carney will be
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able to enrich himself through that whole rebuilding process in Ukraine. I mean, and of course,
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they've got Christy over there as well, you know, advising the Ukrainians. The whole thing is just
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not good. Optically speaking alone, it's just horrible. It is. And we'll see whether she does
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the right thing very soon. But she stayed one day as MP and so she's violated the law and should be
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found guilty of violating the MP's ethics code as a result. But the longer she stays, it's just going to
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continue and compound the violation and the conflict of interest. Let's talk about the Liberals now
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luring Conservatives. I mean, this is unsavory. I think a lot of Canadians are going to look
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at this and find the whole thing extremely troubling. You know, it's going to breed a sense of cynicism that
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these people can play musical chairs, you know, based on whatever the government party is dangling
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before some of these opposition members. Can you talk a little bit about your view around the ethical
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concerns of luring Conservatives or any other member over to the government side?
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Yeah, well, first of all, there is also in the MP's ethics code, some expectations. And MPs are expected
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to act with honesty and uphold the public's confidence and trust in the integrity of themselves and the
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House of Commons overall. And so I think when an MP crosses the floor, it's dishonest. If you have run
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for a party, taken your oath under that party as an MP, thanked your voters, the voters from that party
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for voting for you, and then you vote with that party for months, as Chris Dontremont did, the Halifax MP
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that switched and also criticized the governing party very strongly as both he and Michael Ma,
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the other Liberal Conservative MP who have switched to the Liberals. I think that's a violation of the
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code. Unfortunately, those rules in the code, again, MPs drafted these rules themselves. They just say
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they're expectations, not requirements. And the ethics commissioner has talked out of both sides of
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his mouth, this guy, Conrad von Finkenstein, who was handpicked in secret by the Trudeau cabinet.
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He said it's a requirement to follow these rules of avoid apparent conflicts of interest, act with
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honesty, uphold the public's confidence and trust. But then we filed a complaint about Dontremont switching,
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saying it was dishonest and didn't, you know, shattered the voters trust that have voted for him in
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Halifax. And I know other voters from Halifax area wrote as well to the ethics commissioner. Sorry,
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I'm saying Halifax, Nova Scotia. He's not directly from Halifax, Chris Dontremont. And the ethics
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commissioner said, Oh, no, those rules are not enforceable. So he said they were enforceable in
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his annual report last spring. And then now he says they're unenforceable. If there was an offer from
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the liberals of some sort of favor in return for switching, that's illegal, that's bribery. And also
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it's a violation of the MPs ethics code to, to switch on that basis, because you would be advancing
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your personal private interests by switching. So we haven't had evidence come out so far of the
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liberals actually offering directly a job, a cabinet post, even being a committee chair, you get paid
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more. If you're an MP, we haven't had that. And there hasn't been a direct connection. But if those
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rewards come later, then we will be filing complaints that that for an investigation by police to
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investigate whether that offer was on the table before the MP switched because it's bribery and it's
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illegal. Yeah, I mean, that's exactly what it is. And now we see this BC conservative from
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Vernon, Scott Anderson, shaming the liberals for doing it. Maybe that's a good approach here,
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saying, you know, and publishing a letter, you know, basically just constituents saying,
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I was, I was approached, I told them where to go and challenge them basically to answer the question,
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you know, what are you going to offer the next conservative MP to join your ranks? Of course,
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which is blatant bribery. I mean, at what point do the police get involved in this sort of thing, Duff?
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Well, unfortunately, in the past, they haven't gotten involved. Back in 2005, 2006, with the biggest
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case being cases being David, David Emerson, switching from the liberals to the conservatives and
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and Belinda Stronick and the switch there. And there was lots of evidence that they were guaranteed
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cabinet posts if they switched. And so you're paid as an MP, you're paid much more as a cabinet minister.
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And so they were offered a financial benefit to switch. And that was bribery. And the people doing
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the negotiating at that time and the offers should have been charged and prosecuted. And unfortunately,
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they weren't. So we'll see what happens in this situation and where it goes from here. I'm hoping
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as well that some liberals will stand up on principle. If this does continue to happen and the liberals get
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a majority through these very smelly defections, I hope liberal MPs will leave caucus and some of them
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will show that they actually believe in democratic principles and will leave caucus and citizen
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independence and deny Prime Minister Carney the majority. Because you should win a majority in
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election, not through luring MPs to switch and their dishonest, unethical actions of switching after
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running and being elected under another party's banner.
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Yeah. And liberals should be upset by this because if conservatives are being offered things like cabinet
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posts and other goodies, then those are things that are not going to die hard liberals. The loyal liberals,
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people who thought they were on the winning side, but are seeing conservatives getting goodies
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that they should be getting by all rights as the party in charge.
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Yes. And they should be upset about it just generally. Mark Carney is not following the liberals'
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platform from the election. Stephen Dubot has already left as environment, formerly environment minister and
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more recently heritage minister. He's left cabinet. I would hope he and some other liberals would
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stand up on principle and say, no, I don't support getting a majority this way. I'm going to leave
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caucus and maybe I'll vote for you in the House of Commons still with the liberals. But that would at
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least ensure that the opposition parties control committees. And that's really what Mark Carney's after.
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Yeah. The ethics committee has been looking into Brookfield and the Conflict of Interest Act and
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changing that act to essentially prohibit what Carney's doing, which is secretly profiting from his own
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decisions as prime minister through his investments in Brookfield and making decisions that affect those
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investments. And he would love to end that and many other committee hearings that are going on now.
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If liberal MPs leave, then the liberals don't have majority and opposition parties still continue those
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committees and those investigations and reviews of key democracy laws will continue.
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So we'll see what happens. We need a law, of course, to ban MPs from switching unless a few things happen.
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If a party leader did violate every promise made in the last election, then I think an MP could justify
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switching and they'd have to file with the Ethics Commissioner and the Ethics Commissioner would
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make a ruling on doing that. Or if a party leader changes and the new party leader takes it in a
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totally different direction, then you should be able to leave as an MP, but not join another party.
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You should go and sit as an independent until the next election or otherwise you should have to resign
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Absolutely. How do people support the great work you do at Democracy Watch?
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We'll see everything at democracywatch.ca. We welcome donations and also people sending letters
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calling for these many key changes that we need to actually have a democracy.
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Jeff Conacher, thank you so much for coming on the show.
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And that is it for this edition of Straight Up. Appreciate you tuning in, my friends. Let's do it