Juno News - Futile Apologies

00:00:00.000 Coming up, conservative capitulation, Trudeau's unrequited G7 love, and Maxime Bernier on

00:00:18.840 his arrest in Manitoba.

00:00:22.720 The Andrew Lawton Show starts right now.

00:00:26.320 Hello and welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show, Tuesday, June 15th, 2021.

00:00:36.420 Great to have you aboard the program here, Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show on True

00:00:41.780 North.

00:00:42.400 A lot to get to today.

00:00:43.700 Going to speak later on in the program with People's Party leader Maxime Bernier about

00:00:48.280 his arrest by the RCMP in Manitoba for embarking on what he called the Mad Max Speaking Tour.

00:00:55.000 That's going to be coming up later on in the show.

00:00:57.500 Also going to be talking about the CBC playing nice with the Prime Minister of Pakistan in

00:01:03.400 an interview in which that Prime Minister also called for censorship in Canada, which

00:01:09.120 ended up being a claim he made without any pushback from CBC.

00:01:13.320 That's coming up.

00:01:13.960 But I want to talk first and foremost about what seems to be an increasing trend of conservative

00:01:20.300 apologies.

00:01:21.240 There's a philosophical problem in this that I'll talk about momentarily, but also a very

00:01:27.720 practical one.

00:01:29.280 It's been nine days since that horrific attack on a London, Ontario Muslim family took place,

00:01:34.300 an attack that has galvanized the country, and rightfully so, because events of this nature

00:01:39.080 are thankfully rare, which makes them absolutely shocking to our sensibilities and our understanding

00:01:45.700 of what Canada is.

00:01:47.080 But the narrative that unfolded from that was that this is not rare, that this is something

00:01:52.200 quite common in Canada, something unsurprising that should be, you know, no shock to anyone

00:01:57.200 who lives in Canada.

00:01:58.580 Because underlying a lot of the political discourse, which, as I said on the show last week, I resent

00:02:03.880 has infiltrated what should be a solemn recognition of this family and a remembrance of them.

00:02:11.100 It's now become politicized, which is quite awful.

00:02:13.240 And what's noteworthy about this is that a lot of the activists who are trying to insert

00:02:18.820 and inject a political agenda into this discussion are doing so because they fundamentally think

00:02:24.560 Canada is a bad place.

00:02:26.780 And that's unfortunate to listen to.

00:02:29.280 But even more unfortunately than that is how many people seem to be accepting that premise

00:02:34.540 in a way.

00:02:35.600 And this is what brings us around to the apology tour I mentioned at the beginning of the show.

00:02:40.080 A couple of Conservative members of Parliament have stood out in this way.

00:02:43.420 One in particular is Michelle Rempel-Garner, who released a statement in which she had taken

00:02:49.780 basically atonement as what she needed to seek regarding the 2015 Conservative campaign

00:02:56.920 and the barbaric cultural practices tip line, the proposed niqab ban. 0.94

00:03:01.680 In certain contexts, she said she was sorry to the Muslim community for not fighting against

00:03:06.720 these things then.

00:03:08.260 And that was, I think, a fine statement if it's what she believes and what she stands

00:03:12.760 up for.

00:03:13.480 But then it went beyond that.

00:03:14.700 Michelle Rempel-Garner's statement was shared by Amira El-Gawabi, formerly of the National

00:03:19.640 Council for Canadian Muslims, an organization which has never been a friend or an ally to

00:03:24.800 Conservatives.

00:03:25.900 And Amira El-Gawabi had shared this and said, look at the climate Conservatives have created.

00:03:31.060 To which Michelle Rempel-Garner replied and says she humbles herself and asks forgiveness

00:03:36.620 and seeks to make things right, saying, I have privilege.

00:03:39.760 I am cis, straight, white, but I am also a woman who works in a system dominated by white

00:03:45.600 maleness.

00:03:46.440 But no excuses.

00:03:47.660 I will do what I can.

00:03:49.160 That is all I can do.

00:03:50.880 But it is much.

00:03:53.100 There were some people that thought this was a parody when it was first uttered.

00:03:57.800 Some people that thought this was some sort of a joke.

00:04:00.600 No, she means it.

00:04:01.560 And you know what?

00:04:02.320 To be fair, any politician who speaks in an authentic way about the things they believe,

00:04:06.380 power to them.

00:04:07.520 This is not something you would expect to hear from a Conservative.

00:04:11.580 And you may think, all right, well, maybe if this Conservative approach to these issues

00:04:15.940 from a Conservative MP is going to move the party in the direction that all of these people

00:04:20.920 that are maybe not friendly to Conservatives now, but could at some point vote for, maybe

00:04:25.920 they'll all reward this.

00:04:27.600 Well, just look at the response from the Canadian Anti-Hate Network.

00:04:31.800 Immediately, one of criticism.

00:04:34.020 Slim majority of Conservatives will support any legislation on online hate.

00:04:38.340 We expect your party to oppose it.

00:04:40.240 You could support it.

00:04:41.520 And if you do that, it'll make the next attack less likely.

00:04:44.600 So these words don't actually win the support from any of the advocates and activists they're

00:04:49.460 supposed to be appeasing.

00:04:51.580 They don't at all.

00:04:52.340 All they do is anger the base and show weakness to a lot of the critics of the right.

00:04:59.160 I've not seen anyone respond to Michelle Rempelgarner's tweet in a way that suggests,

00:05:03.880 you know what, I was not going to vote Conservative before.

00:05:06.200 Now that she's done that, she's acknowledged her privilege as a white, straight, cis woman.

00:05:10.600 You know, I'm on board.

00:05:11.560 I'm not going to do that.

00:05:13.340 So if, and again, this is where I have to speak kind of out of both sides of my mouth

00:05:17.560 here, because if it's authentic and it's who she is and it's what she believes, power

00:05:21.460 to her.

00:05:22.560 If it's done because people think this is the way you make friends and win support, it's

00:05:28.320 not going to work.

00:05:30.080 Another example is Tim Uppel, long time, a former Conservative member of Parliament who

00:05:34.720 left and is now back.

00:05:36.220 Tim Uppel, great guy.

00:05:37.380 I've interviewed him a number of times.

00:05:39.300 He put out a statement taking aim at a lot of those very same things that Michelle Rempelgarner

00:05:43.780 spoke about and says he regrets not being a stronger voice and taking aim at the divisiveness

00:05:51.020 of Harper-era policies.

00:05:53.620 Now, remember, a lot of these MPs that may be speaking out about this era of Canadian

00:05:57.940 politics now owe their entire political careers to that era, to that party, and to Stephen Harper.

00:06:04.820 So for them to start disavowing that as a divisive chapter in Canadian politics, well, they weren't

00:06:10.680 just a part of it, it created their political career.

00:06:14.240 They were inextricably linked with that party in that time.

00:06:18.800 And it is awfully convenient that a lot of them only seem to be raising alarms about it

00:06:25.320 now that they think the media and the political climate has moved in a different direction.

00:06:31.540 And there's a lot of opportunism when you see what seem on the surface as though they are

00:06:38.340 very feigned or contrived apologies that capture a political climate that exists now, rather

00:06:44.800 than any genuine reckoning, by and large.

00:06:48.460 Now, I don't know if these are MPs that are going rogue.

00:06:51.580 I don't know if Aaron O'Toole's office or the Conservative campaign is behind this in a

00:06:55.580 way.

00:06:55.740 If so, it is a strategy that is not going to yield anything in the way of dividends.

00:07:01.880 As I said earlier, it angers the base and it lets the Liberals and the NDP and the media

00:07:06.620 smell blood so that they can pounce.

00:07:09.220 Because all of a sudden, they can point to the record anyway and point to your recantment

00:07:13.500 of it and say, well, you know what, if these people are going to pursue these policies and

00:07:18.340 then apologize for them, they can't be trusted.

00:07:20.800 There's no winning.

00:07:21.640 There's no coming out ahead when you do this.

00:07:23.360 Which brings us to the philosophical objection to this.

00:07:28.820 If you are speaking from your heart, an apology is completely fine.

00:07:33.960 And I would say it is encouraged.

00:07:36.120 If you are not, it is not going to do anything at all.

00:07:42.060 And what Conservatives would do well to realize here is that a lot of the climate that they

00:07:48.880 think is there, that they must play the rules of the game by and all of that stuff, is not

00:07:54.160 all that authentic.

00:07:55.560 It's not all that genuine.

00:07:57.420 And the reason I say that is because there's this growing disconnect between ordinary citizens

00:08:04.060 and the media.

00:08:06.040 Ordinary citizens and the political elite.

00:08:07.960 What actual people think and what we're being told actual people think.

00:08:12.280 And I mean, just a few weeks ago, I spoke about transgender athletes in sports.

00:08:16.560 Probably one of the greatest examples of this.

00:08:18.220 If you were to poll, you know, 100 people, 95% of them would think this is insane.

00:08:22.720 Why should, you know, some transgender athlete be able to out-compete just by virtue of their 1.00

00:08:27.640 biological sex?

00:08:28.880 But if you were to talk to the political elites, the elites at a lot of the sporting associations,

00:08:33.420 they would call you a bigot for raising that very question.

00:08:36.740 The same goes for a lot of things here.

00:08:38.620 If you were to say to any Canadian, whether they were born here, whether they immigrated

00:08:43.040 here, whether they're a visible minority or not, and you were to ask them, is Canada

00:08:46.980 a hateful place?

00:08:48.580 They would say no.

00:08:50.120 That's why they live in this country.

00:08:53.400 And a lot of those policies, like the barbaric cultural practices tip line, may not have been

00:08:58.460 politically saleable.

00:09:00.280 But a lot of these things were being driven by concerns from immigrant communities who didn't

00:09:05.840 like people importing the very things that they fled in their home countries.

00:09:13.020 That was where a lot of the support for this came from.

00:09:15.740 And you can talk about this with Jason Kenney, who was a longtime immigration minister in Canada,

00:09:20.720 other conservative MPs.

00:09:22.020 A lot of the support they were getting from people were actually from immigrants themselves

00:09:27.800 who didn't like or were concerned that Canada would become the type of place that they left

00:09:33.260 to move to Canada.

00:09:35.160 And we have Canada Day upon us.

00:09:37.200 And a group of activists, again, are trying to cancel Canada Day in Victoria, BC.

00:09:41.700 They've succeeded.

00:09:42.500 They've succeeded in scrapping the official ceremony because apparently it would not be

00:09:46.760 conducive to reconciliation to celebrate Canada.

00:09:50.020 And the question to anyone I would ask, if they want to cancel Canada Day, is what is

00:09:55.700 it that draws you to Canada then?

00:09:58.520 If you do not think this country is worth celebrating, why are you here?

00:10:03.260 And that's, this is not, by the way, a dog whistle, as they say.

00:10:06.440 I'm asking that of people who are born here.

00:10:08.320 If you think Canada is such a terrible place with a terrible history, point on a map to your

00:10:12.140 model society.

00:10:13.160 Point on a map to your model country and go there.

00:10:15.800 I bet they would love to have you.

00:10:17.140 And if you are someone who wants to move to Canada from another part of the world, as

00:10:22.260 Canada is so often referred to as one of the most welcoming places in the world, the question

00:10:27.420 stands, what is it that draws you to Canada if you are uncomfortable with the Canadian

00:10:34.440 approach to diversity and race?

00:10:36.220 I mean, if we are a country that has a prime minister that stands up at every waking moment

00:10:41.520 and says diversity is our strength, what more are you going to get?

00:10:47.940 What more are you going to get?

00:10:49.600 And this is a legitimate question that I've never heard the left actually provide a reasonable

00:10:54.800 answer for.

00:10:56.840 But we are now living in an era where to stand up and say Canada is not a racist country is

00:11:04.300 in some way an act of racism.

00:11:06.340 If you look at the way people have been maligned to say that, the way last summer claiming Canada

00:11:10.960 is a systemically racist country became the magic words that a politician had to say, liberal

00:11:16.080 conservative doesn't matter, to get the media off their backs. 0.93

00:11:19.980 And so many conservative politicians went down that road and accepted that premise and now

00:11:25.580 are finding themselves in the same vein still being criticized.

00:11:29.620 Aaron O'Toole, for example, did everything the media wanted him to do.

00:11:32.600 He came out, he spoke at the vigil for that Muslim family who was slain by a killer, a

00:11:37.560 killer, by the way, who has now been charged with a terrorism-related charge, which is

00:11:42.880 very important.

00:11:43.780 And this is as police go forward with their investigation.

00:11:46.840 Aaron O'Toole did that.

00:11:48.420 And what was the media coverage?

00:11:49.760 Just look in the Toronto Star focusing on, well, he says he cares about all these things

00:11:53.960 now, but remember, he voted against M103 a few years back.

00:11:57.280 So I don't know about that Aaron O'Toole guy.

00:12:00.700 It's never going to be enough.

00:12:01.880 It is never going to be enough.

00:12:03.880 So if you're doing it just to appease the mob, don't even bother because it's not going

00:12:08.100 to work.

00:12:09.680 This summer, the conservatives have, alongside every party in parliament, agreed to host

00:12:14.520 an Islamophobia summit.

00:12:16.800 Now, I don't know what this summit is going to look like.

00:12:19.280 If it's about just diagnosing things that are happening in society the same way they're

00:12:23.480 doing for the anti-Semitism summit, have at it.

00:12:26.700 But I fear the response is going to be very predictable because the government has already

00:12:32.740 determined it wants to legislate against what it calls online hate.

00:12:36.760 And when you say to grieving citizens in the Muslim community, in the Canadian community

00:12:42.640 at large, when you say to a grieving family, we're going after online hate, it sounds nice.

00:12:50.160 It sounds like the kind of thing that's going to make a difference.

00:12:52.980 Most people don't realize, well, hang on, hate speech is already illegal in Canada.

00:12:56.640 So what other speech are you going to go after?

00:12:59.660 And invariably, discussions about banning online hate speech will result in a lower threshold

00:13:05.300 for hate speech than the one that exists now, which means you're talking about online censorship.

00:13:10.820 That's what we are moving towards.

00:13:13.880 And this brings us to an interview that took place on CBC's Rosemary Barton Live, an interview

00:13:19.960 in which she spoke with the Prime Minister of Pakistan, Imran Khan.

00:13:25.440 And they spoke about a number of things.

00:13:27.400 He expressed his condolences and very quickly pivoted to what he believes is a growing problem

00:13:32.780 in the West, which is Islamophobia.

00:13:35.220 He didn't offer a solution per se, but Rosie Barton offered him one.

00:13:40.100 Take a look at this exchange.

00:13:41.780 It appears it was one person radicalized in some way on his own who did this.

00:13:47.360 What is it that government should be doing, for instance, to shut down online hate toward Muslims?

00:13:52.560 I think there should be a very strict action against it, this, because you see these hate 0.64

00:14:00.560 websites, which, again, as I said, would divide humanity by creating hatred, ignorant about

00:14:09.540 the other human community.

00:14:10.760 And you target them and this hate material, and especially with the growing social media

00:14:18.860 and social media is it completely, you know, the world is just coming to grips with it because

00:14:25.320 it's a new phenomenon.

00:14:26.500 And unfortunately, I mean, while there's so many benefits of social media, it's changing

00:14:33.960 the whole world.

00:14:35.100 But this one particular bit, when there are these hate websites, which create hatred amongst

00:14:41.460 human beings, there should be an international action against them.

00:14:45.140 And what would that look like to you, Prime Minister?

00:14:48.440 What would be the mechanism for doing that, if you will?

00:14:51.820 Whenever the international community, and by that I mean the world community, the world

00:14:57.060 leaders, whenever they decide upon taking action, this will be dealt with.

00:15:03.040 The problem is, at the moment, there is not enough motivation.

00:15:06.220 Some international leaders or leaders in the Western countries actually don't understand

00:15:14.520 this phenomena.

00:15:16.080 They, too, think that the Muslims are these weird people who have these weird customs, and 0.82

00:15:20.840 they need to be put in place.

00:15:23.900 So it just needs to be brought together, and there has to be understanding, and this can be

00:15:28.920 promoted by world leaders.

00:15:31.060 Do you plan to reach out to Justin Trudeau to have a conversation about this?

00:15:36.220 Yes, I will.

00:15:38.180 I've had previous conversations with Justin Trudeau as well, and I have to say we mostly

00:15:44.280 agree with most things.

00:15:46.660 By the way, you should watch the entire interview.

00:15:49.300 It's about 10, 11 minutes long, and not a single challenging question is asked.

00:15:55.220 It is the leader of a country that has a dismal human rights record, no religious freedom, 0.99

00:15:59.480 no free speech, getting a completely free ride on Canada's state media, propagandising

00:16:05.820 to Canadians, and in this case, selling Canadians on internet censorship.

00:16:10.420 But it wasn't even his idea.

00:16:11.980 The premise for the question that government should clamp down an online speech came from

00:16:16.200 Rosie Barton, the CBC host.

00:16:18.720 And at first, I thought, oh, maybe she's doing this interview trick where you get someone 0.92

00:16:21.980 to say something, and then you hammer them on it.

00:16:24.020 And no, she just moved on and talked about, so how's your relationship with Justin Trudeau,

00:16:28.060 basically?

00:16:29.040 And then that was the other dimension of this, that the Prime Minister of Pakistan says,

00:16:33.080 yeah, he and Trudeau have spoken about censoring online hate speech, and they agree on pretty

00:16:37.700 much everything.

00:16:38.880 At this point, it's just, you know, a he said, but I would be very interested in hearing Justin

00:16:43.300 Trudeau's response to this.

00:16:45.120 If those two have been all buddy-buddy when talking about censorship, we've got bigger

00:16:48.840 problems in Canada.

00:16:49.840 So at a time when Canada should be digging in its heels and supporting free speech and

00:16:54.280 saying what I said last week, which is that free speech did not claim the lives of this

00:16:59.360 family in London, we now have the Pakistani Prime Minister shilling for censorship on Canadian

00:17:05.860 state media without having to field any criticism of it.

00:17:09.540 And later on in the interview, Rosie Barton gave, I guess, what might be more of a challenging

00:17:15.000 question, although she didn't push him on it, which is to say, all right, you're speaking

00:17:18.700 out about how Muslims are treated in the Western world, what about Uyghur Muslims in China?

00:17:23.680 And he said, ah, you know, China's a friend, anything we want to bring up with them, we'll

00:17:27.320 just bring up privately and not here.

00:17:29.020 But the West, the West is the problem.

00:17:31.340 And she just said, okay.

00:17:32.940 And not a single reference to Pakistan's human rights record, to the lack of religious

00:17:38.460 freedom in Pakistan, not a single reference until this little like 10 second blurb at the

00:17:44.380 end of the interview after she's cut Prime Minister Khan loose.

00:17:48.100 Then she says, oh, by the way, I should say, you know, Pakistan's not great about this.

00:17:51.580 You just had the guy on.

00:17:53.080 Why didn't you bring it up when you were talking to him?

00:17:56.160 So there was something quite shameful about CBC's handling of this.

00:18:00.280 But beyond that, that this appetite seems to have a place in Canada right now, this appetite

00:18:06.320 of censorship, that there seems to be some receptive current to that sweeping through

00:18:11.560 Canada is downright dangerous.

00:18:13.700 And the Liberals have been promising this online hate restriction bill for months now.

00:18:19.740 They've actually, it's been going back since prior to the 2019 election.

00:18:23.140 And I just know that like when they introduced the order in council banning various models of

00:18:30.460 firearms, they are waiting or were waiting for a moment at which that bill would have the

00:18:36.420 most impact.

00:18:37.160 And if the Liberals introduce this bill now, especially while the accused in this attack

00:18:42.840 is facing a terrorism charge, what's going to happen is it's going to make it very difficult

00:18:47.700 for anyone to oppose it because it's going to look like they are being insensitive to the

00:18:52.720 human toll of online hate, even if free speech, again, is not the thing that we can blame

00:18:58.860 this attack on.

00:19:00.160 And Justin Trudeau, even without knowing, Justin Trudeau, without knowing anything about

00:19:05.920 it, this is before the terror charges were laid by his own admission, not knowing what

00:19:10.500 was happening, blamed online hate for these murders.

00:19:13.560 Take a watch.

00:19:14.320 We just had a terrible tragedy a couple of nights ago where a Muslim family, three generations 1.00

00:19:19.700 out for a walk on the side of the road.

00:19:21.500 And they were viciously and inexplicably run down deliberately.

00:19:29.020 And we don't yet know all the causes or reasons, but there is probably an element of online incitation

00:19:36.420 to violence or access to things that we have to think about.

00:19:39.500 And I think that becomes all of our responsibility to work together to make sure that we are cracking

00:19:45.940 down on hatred, that we are not allowing people who represent a small fringe of the society 0.89

00:19:52.040 to take actions that weaken the fabric and the coming together of our entire communities.

00:19:59.380 So Justin Trudeau, quite brazenly, without the facts, can say, oh yeah, this is an online

00:20:02.980 hate thing.

00:20:03.480 The liberals are already laying the groundwork to politicize this tragedy and, yes, this

00:20:09.480 act of evil for their own partisan political gain.

00:20:13.380 Except this isn't just a gain of the liberals at the expense of the conservatives, this

00:20:16.920 is a gain of liberals in the government at the expense of Canadians' freedoms, which

00:20:22.080 is why this is such a frustrating and, yes, infuriating at times dialogue.

00:20:28.960 Because whenever someone talks about banning online hate speech, they are curiously avoiding

00:20:34.660 defining hate speech and curiously avoiding the fact that hate speech is already illegal in

00:20:40.840 Canada.

00:20:41.120 It just has a very high criminal threshold.

00:20:44.620 Any restrictions below that only narrow the confines and narrow the boundaries of discourse.

00:20:51.220 And now it's a global effort.

00:20:52.940 We've got the endorsement of the Prime Minister of Pakistan.

00:20:55.340 Well, what more do we need to justify this policy?

00:20:57.920 I would say that is probably the greatest justification for why this bill should be defeated.

00:21:03.120 Just before we take a break here, a few words on the G7 summit.

00:21:07.460 But it's beyond mask theater now.

00:21:09.660 Trudeau was wearing the mask and then he was doing the elbow bumps.

00:21:12.700 And then, as you see, they're all just standing shoulder to shoulder, cheek to cheek, looking

00:21:16.440 up at the flyover and partying it up and sitting down and having a meal.

00:21:20.720 The pandemic is over in Cornwall for the G7, just as it's over in Brussels, where Trudeau

00:21:26.500 later hopped for a NATO summit.

00:21:29.440 But this story in Bloomberg, you've probably read it by now, but I have to share it with

00:21:34.920 you.

00:21:35.460 Angela Merkel is stepping down.

00:21:37.540 She's not running again, which means as far as the politicians who make up the leaders 0.93

00:21:41.940 of the G7, Justin Trudeau is the longest serving.

00:21:46.140 So he's been there the longest period of time compared to all of his counterparts.

00:21:50.700 And the Bloomberg article says he is positioning himself as the new elder statesman, but no

00:21:57.500 one sees him owning the role in the way the German chancellor did.

00:22:02.500 And they say even if Joe Biden's new to the presidency, he's got lots of experience.

00:22:06.500 Macron has aggressively positioned himself as Angela Merkel's heir in Europe.

00:22:11.560 The Italian prime minister, Mario Draghi, has years of running the European Central Bank,

00:22:16.240 and he tends to make an impact and make a big noise whenever he speaks up.

00:22:21.180 And then it says in the company of such heavyweights, the leader of the smallest G7 economy cuts

00:22:26.640 a marginal figure in spite of efforts to be the new dean as he became known among the Canadian

00:22:32.640 delegation at this weekend's summit.

00:22:35.300 So it sounds like the Canadians have been trying to like pump up this idea of Justin Trudeau

00:22:39.860 being the leader of the G7, but no one else is paying attention and no one else cares.

00:22:44.640 And if you want more evidence of that, take a look at this.

00:22:48.360 Canadian officials say the 49-year-old prime minister genuinely believes he can help the

00:22:53.500 UK and the European Union find a solution to their trade dispute.

00:22:57.460 No one has taken him up on the offer, it seems, even as Brexit tensions boil over on the last

00:23:04.060 day of summitry.

00:23:05.720 So Canada is desperately trying to carve out a niche, and it's this middle power delusion

00:23:10.820 I've talked about in the past, where Canada thinks that it has a much greater impact on

00:23:15.200 the world stage than it truly has.

00:23:18.540 And Justin Trudeau is the embodiment of that, whether it was the United Nations Security

00:23:22.380 Council seat or now trying to position himself as the dean of the G7, a role that no one

00:23:28.700 asked him to fill and no one wants him to fill.

00:23:31.420 And his longevity as Canadian prime minister, for now anyway, doesn't seem to be convincing

00:23:36.980 when you're going toe-to-toe with the US president and the British prime minister and the French

00:23:41.080 president and all these other people who are, whatever I may disagree with them on, more

00:23:46.080 heavyweights than Justin Trudeau is, certainly when it comes to global politics.

00:23:51.380 All right, we've got to take a break.

00:23:52.780 When we come back, more of The Andrew Lawton Show here on True North.

00:23:56.220 Stay tuned.

00:23:58.080 You're tuned in to The Andrew Lawton Show.

00:24:06.980 Welcome back to The Andrew Lawton Show.

00:24:09.320 They say a picture is worth a thousand words.

00:24:12.140 Not sure how many pictures a video is worth, but I do want you to take a look at this because

00:24:16.360 what you will see is more insane than how I could ever imagine describing it for you.

00:24:25.080 Afternoon, sir.

00:24:25.920 Yes, yes.

00:24:26.520 I'm with the RCMP.

00:24:27.640 Yeah.

00:24:27.840 I can get you to step out of the vehicle.

00:24:28.880 I'm going to place you under arrest right now.

00:24:30.120 Yeah.

00:24:30.380 Right now, you're under arrest under the provincial health orders.

00:24:39.580 Okay, so if you can just put your hands behind your back, face towards the vehicle.

00:24:43.780 Okay, give me one hand here.

00:24:45.560 I'll get you to see the vehicle, okay?

00:24:47.060 Yeah.

00:24:48.860 The other hand.

00:24:50.600 Do you have any weapons or anything on you, sir?

00:24:52.640 Weapon?

00:24:53.200 No, no weapon.

00:24:54.060 Only my words.

00:24:55.780 Anything like that?

00:24:56.540 Sorry?

00:24:57.100 Anything on you that's going to hurt me or anything like that?

00:24:58.600 No, no, anything will hurt you.

00:25:00.340 Only my words.

00:25:01.160 Only my philosophy.

00:25:02.320 Only what I believe in.

00:25:03.420 Okay.

00:25:03.960 All right, come on over this way.

00:25:05.680 I'll explain a few things that you hear right away.

00:25:13.900 In that video, People's Party of Canada leader Maxime Bernier arrested by the RCMP in rural

00:25:20.820 Manitoba, not just given a ticket or a fine for violating some lockdown restriction, but

00:25:25.520 as you can see, ordered out of his vehicle, frisked, handcuffed, put in the back of a police

00:25:31.180 car, and then taken to jail where he stayed for the better part of Friday afternoon, late

00:25:36.880 into the evening, was eventually released on bail.

00:25:40.620 But as we'll talk about shortly, you can never get that time back, time that your liberty

00:25:44.840 has been taken away, time you've been forced to spend behind bars.

00:25:48.900 Maxime Bernier's been unapologetic about this.

00:25:51.260 He says he has a right to stand up for his constitutional freedoms.

00:25:54.600 Let's talk about that with him now.

00:25:56.060 Maxime Bernier, People's Party of Canada leader, joins me on the line.

00:26:00.100 Maxime, good to talk to you.

00:26:01.040 Thanks for coming on.

00:26:02.380 Thank you, Andrew.

00:26:03.920 Now, you're back home now.

00:26:05.380 So they didn't detain you for too long, correct?

00:26:08.100 Yes, eight hours.

00:26:09.460 That was long enough.

00:26:10.600 And one thing that people would have seen there and heard there in the video that I

00:26:15.700 thought was very clever and very important, which was that they asked you when they're

00:26:19.780 doing the arrest if you had any weapons, and you said, only my words.

00:26:23.520 Explain that.

00:26:24.960 Yeah, first of all, because it's not about COVID anymore.

00:26:28.620 It's about political repression.

00:26:30.420 As you know, just Thursday before I started my tour in Manitoba Friday morning, I was arrested

00:26:38.220 Friday at 2 o'clock p.m. and released around 11 o'clock p.m. the same day.

00:26:44.920 But it was all about, you know, the premier of Manitoba, Mr. Pallister, didn't want me to

00:26:52.960 be there.

00:26:53.520 And actually, he did a press conference the day before Thursday, and he said, if Maxime

00:26:58.840 Bernier is coming here, his wallet will be affected.

00:27:03.360 So he doesn't want a political opposition.

00:27:10.480 And so, you know, I did my goal to do meetings with people in Little Town in Manitoba.

00:27:17.120 I started at 11 o'clock Little Town there.

00:27:20.280 And I had a meeting outside, in a park, and with my partisans and the members of the People's

00:27:28.460 Party of Canada.

00:27:29.520 And my goal was, as a politician, to be ready for the next election.

00:27:33.920 I'm campaigning all across the country.

00:27:35.760 And as you know, the People's Party of Canada is the only party against these draconian lockdowns.

00:27:42.760 So I spoke with them, and I answered their questions.

00:27:46.380 We were 15 there, and just after that event, the first one in the morning, Friday, the

00:27:52.220 police came and gave me two tickets, and they said, if you do another rally, you have a chance

00:27:59.000 to be arrested.

00:28:00.180 So after that, I knew that I was taking a chance, and I called my lawyer, and he told me, Maxime,

00:28:07.100 it's your constitutional rights to travel across the province and to speak.

00:28:11.560 You're a politician, and you have to explain your platform.

00:28:15.280 You have to gain support, and we understand that.

00:28:18.160 So I decided to do the second event in a little village, St. Pierre, Jolie, about a thousand

00:28:25.160 people, maybe an hour south of Winnipeg.

00:28:28.760 And we did that rally in a park.

00:28:31.220 And at that time, I think we were eight, including myself, outside social distancing, and I was

00:28:38.960 speaking to them.

00:28:39.840 And actually, the COVID-19 health orders in Manitoba, they are not allowing a meeting

00:28:49.660 outside more than five persons.

00:28:52.580 So, and after that rally, police came, and you saw it in the video, and they arrest me

00:28:58.780 and handcuffed me and treated me like a criminal just because, you know, I was exercising, I

00:29:05.920 was speaking, my freedom of speech, my freedom of assembly.

00:29:08.700 And actually, I was the only one.

00:29:11.260 All the other person over there didn't have any tickets.

00:29:15.840 They were not in jail.

00:29:17.300 That was motivated by the premier of Alberta and to try to stop me to campaign.

00:29:25.200 I was supposed to have a big rally, a real open to the public rally that Friday night.

00:29:30.780 I was in jail, was not able to be there.

00:29:33.320 And Saturday afternoon, I was supposed to have a good, a big rally also in Winnipeg, open

00:29:39.580 to the public.

00:29:40.880 And so, but the police released me around 11, 11.30 p.m. Friday night.

00:29:46.020 And they were very direct that I was not welcome, and I must take the first flight back to Montreal.

00:29:52.340 That's what I did early Saturday morning.

00:29:55.980 So that's crazy that now a politician cannot speak in a province of our country.

00:30:03.580 It's like being in China. 0.95

00:30:04.760 If your plan was to fight this and to take these tickets to court eventually and to stand

00:30:11.060 up for your rights, why not go ahead with the Saturday rally?

00:30:14.100 Why did you decide to basically go along with what the province wanted and go back home?

00:30:19.540 Yeah, first of all, because actually I would be back in Manitoba.

00:30:23.260 I would campaign in Manitoba as soon as I would be able to do that.

00:30:27.760 Second, I need to appeal in from the court.

00:30:30.900 One of the conditions for me was to bail $100,000 to be sure for them, to be sure that I'll be

00:30:38.800 in Manitoba July the 27th.

00:30:41.220 And I will do that contestation in court, and we will win that for sure.

00:30:48.840 So, and also, the other risk for me was to be back in jail for more than eight hours until

00:30:56.640 the 27th, June 27th.

00:31:00.040 And I don't have time for that.

00:31:02.320 You know, we'll be in an electoral campaign maybe early this fall.

00:31:06.380 So, and I had a plan to campaign all across the country.

00:31:09.740 The risk was too high for me to be in jail for a longer time, and I had the full agenda

00:31:16.120 during the summertime.

00:31:17.000 One interesting aspect of this is that they accused you of violating the gathering restrictions

00:31:23.560 and also of violating the province's provincial quarantine.

00:31:28.520 So if anyone goes from out of the province to Manitoba, they say they have to isolate

00:31:32.440 for 14 days unless they're given an exemption.

00:31:35.380 And I actually wanted to do some filming of a documentary I'm working on in Manitoba and

00:31:40.180 specifically didn't because of that policy.

00:31:42.760 Although we are supposedly, in Canada, guaranteed free movement between provinces.

00:31:47.800 This has been a hallmark as old as Confederation.

00:31:50.680 Was that something you were very aware of going into it?

00:31:54.040 That, you know, within provinces, provinces don't have the right to put up barriers?

00:31:58.080 Yeah, absolutely, yes, because the civil servant at the head of the Department of Health

00:32:04.640 Health in Manitoba sent me a letter the day before saying that I'm not welcome and if

00:32:11.200 I'm going there, I need to quarantine, like you just said, for 15 days.

00:32:15.840 And my answer was public to that.

00:32:18.080 I tweeted just after that that, you know, I have constitutional rights to travel across

00:32:23.680 this country and I will be there.

00:32:27.120 And that's why, you know, they arrest me.

00:32:30.480 But that's unconstitutional, illegal.

00:32:33.440 And all that is not based on science anymore.

00:32:36.320 It's based on compliance.

00:32:38.800 It's an authoritarian government in Manitoba.

00:32:43.360 And I will fight that in court July 27th.

00:32:49.120 So let's talk about the politicians that are putting this forward.

00:32:53.440 We have not seen in Ontario, where I live, anyone that I'm aware of offhand jailed for this.

00:32:59.840 But in Alberta, which has Conservative Premier Jason Kenney, we've seen pastors behind bars.

00:33:04.960 In Manitoba, which has a Premier who positions himself as a Conservative, Brian Pallister.

00:33:10.400 We have seen you jailed.

00:33:12.640 Why is it that we're seeing these from Conservative governments that are traditionally supposed

00:33:18.080 to be the most freedom-loving governments, the most freedom-loving politicians?

00:33:22.480 You're absolutely right about that.

00:33:24.080 I hope I can have the answer of your questions.

00:33:27.520 And if you look at it in B.C., it's an NDP government.

00:33:31.120 And they were the freest province in all the country.

00:33:35.520 I was there before, and I was able to eat in a restaurant inside without any

00:33:42.400 recognition measures and being free to do what you want to do in a B.C. government,

00:33:47.520 in an NDP government, sorry, in B.C.

00:33:51.280 So I really don't understand.

00:33:53.040 And speaking about Alberta, I know personally Jason Kenney.

00:33:57.200 I was sitting with him around the cabinet table when I was a Conservative minister,

00:34:02.160 when he was a minister.

00:34:03.520 He was a real conservative at that time.

00:34:06.640 Now I don't recognize him.

00:34:08.640 I think all these are premiers, and you can include the premiers of Quebec, Legault.

00:34:13.840 They are following the establishment medical experts.

00:34:18.400 And they don't want to have any other point of view.

00:34:22.240 And they scared the population in the beginning.

00:34:25.280 And actually, in Quebec, as you know, Andrew, they spent more than $135 million

00:34:31.600 last year on advertising on COVID-19.

00:34:36.480 It was pure propaganda, more than every other provincial government in this country.

00:34:43.440 So with all that money that they spent, the fear, and I think they enjoy also their authoritarian powers.

00:34:51.120 I really don't understand why it's supposed to be conservative

00:34:54.880 government that are doing these lockdowns.

00:35:00.720 And it is also worth noting that right now we have Justin Trudeau overseas, elbow to elbow,

00:35:06.080 shoulder to shoulder with all of these world leaders.

00:35:08.880 But also, let's go back to last year.

00:35:11.040 Justin Trudeau took a knee at a Black Lives Matter protest in Ottawa, which was an illegal protest.

00:35:17.920 He took a knee there, surrounded by his own police officers, the RCMP.

00:35:22.720 They didn't arrest him, but the RCMP in Manitoba arrests you.

00:35:26.480 And not only arrests you by giving you a ticket, but actually handcuffed and put to jail.

00:35:32.080 And the double standard is incredibly, incredibly stark here.

00:35:35.920 They don't like, they don't like the opposition.

00:35:38.000 They don't like what I'm saying.

00:35:39.520 And it's why I said that, you know, the only weapon is my words.

00:35:43.520 I'm a politician and what I believe.

00:35:45.920 And they don't like that because they're not following our constitution.

00:35:50.400 And they don't want that to be well known.

00:35:53.280 They prefer to keep their authoritarian powers with these health orders.

00:36:01.120 So I feel like not being in Canada, it's sad.

00:36:06.640 It's sad that this is happening in 2021 in our country.

00:36:10.800 And if you look around the world, like you just said,

00:36:12.960 in the U.S., it's all open.

00:36:15.200 You can do it.

00:36:16.320 The majority of the states are open.

00:36:18.400 No more lockdowns in other countries also.

00:36:21.520 But here in Canada, we are one of the worst.

00:36:25.920 We need to fight.

00:36:26.880 And I don't understand that we don't have any opposition in provincial parliaments or legislatures.

00:36:33.520 And also in Ottawa, the official opposition are not opposing that.

00:36:38.960 They are not doing their job.

00:36:43.040 We are in a crazy world.

00:36:44.400 Well, when Ontario MPP Randy Hillier was charged at Queen's Park, I believe it was, a few months ago,

00:36:51.840 I had said that an opposition politician being charged for protesting the government

00:36:57.680 is a story you'd expect to see in Belarus, in China, in Russia, but it's happening in Canada.

00:37:04.320 They went one step further with you and actually put you in jail.

00:37:08.560 Again, opposition politician jailed.

00:37:10.480 Not a headline we would expect to see in Canada.

00:37:13.440 But you are right to point out that this is very political.

00:37:16.240 The people that are prosecuted are people who protest against the government.

00:37:22.320 Absolutely, absolutely.

00:37:23.680 And they don't want us.

00:37:25.600 You know, we are dissident.

00:37:29.440 And they don't want any dissident.

00:37:31.360 And they will.

00:37:32.800 They will have to deal with it.

00:37:33.920 And I'll be back in Manitoba.

00:37:35.840 I'll be back on the road this week.

00:37:38.560 You know, it's too important.

00:37:40.320 It's not about Maxime Bernier.

00:37:41.760 It's not about the People's Party of Canada.

00:37:43.840 It's about our ideas, our values, our freedom.

00:37:47.200 And I hope that a lot of people will look at it twice.

00:37:51.600 You know, we are in Canada and we cannot take for granted our freedoms anymore.

00:37:56.160 People must realize that and they must do the fight.

00:37:59.200 And I will certainly cover that when you are back in court.

00:38:01.920 So thanks for coming on, Maxime Bernier, leader of the People's Party of Canada.

00:38:05.680 Always a pleasure, Max.

00:38:06.960 Thank you, Andrew.

00:38:07.600 Have a nice day.

00:38:09.280 That was Maxime Bernier.

00:38:10.880 And I will say, I know I've made this observation before.

00:38:14.080 When you get a ticket or a fine, I think it's an overreach in a lot of these lockdown-related

00:38:19.440 offenses.

00:38:19.920 But you can fight that in court.

00:38:21.520 You're not out any money for the fine unless you lose.

00:38:24.880 When you are put behind bars, when you are jailed, whether it's for eight years or for eight days

00:38:30.320 or for eight hours, that is a point of your life, a period of your life you can never reclaim.

00:38:36.640 That is liberty that has been taken away from you.

00:38:40.000 And these things are very important because you can never undo that no matter how small

00:38:44.560 a chunk, relatively speaking, it might have been.

00:38:47.840 So when Maxime Bernier, whatever you think of him, whatever you think of his party, when

00:38:52.080 he's put in jail for attending a rally of, what did he say?

00:38:55.680 Eight people.

00:38:56.240 We're not talking about a super spreader event here like some other possibilities.

00:39:00.160 When he's arrested and put in jail for eight people at a rally, that is a level of confiscating

00:39:06.560 liberty that is incredible for a country that relishes freedom as Canada supposes to.

00:39:15.040 Absolutely shameful.

00:39:16.800 We've got to leave things there.

00:39:18.720 However, there won't be another episode of The Andrew Lawton Show from me this week.

00:39:22.560 I'm working on a special project, so I have to hunker down and focus on that.

00:39:26.800 But you'll get more from that and about that in the coming days and weeks.

00:39:30.880 But my thanks to you all.

00:39:32.080 This is The Andrew Lawton Show, Canada's most irreverent talk show here on True North.

00:39:36.240 Thank you.

00:39:36.640 God bless and good day.

00:39:38.080 Thanks for listening to The Andrew Lawton Show.

00:39:40.240 Support the program by donating to True North at www.tnc.news.

00:39:48.720 www.tnc.w.at

00:39:53.440 Thank you.

00:39:54.880 Thank you.

00:39:56.880 Bye.

00:39:58.880 Bye.

00:40:00.880 Bye.

00:40:02.880 Bye.

00:40:05.040 Bye.

00:40:07.040 Bye.

00:40:09.040 Bye.

00:40:11.040 Bye.

00:40:13.040 Bye.

00:40:15.040 Bye.

Juno News - June 15, 2021

Futile Apologies

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