Juno News - July 14, 2024


Is Trudeau’s net-zero plan destined to fail？

Topics
regulatory harms and energy demands emissions hawks hypocrisy nuclear power
Mentioned
Andrew Lawton Show Kenneth Green Jagmeet Singh
Doug Ford stands firm on alcohol sales expansion Are you glad Trump's attempted assassin is dead？

Episode Stats


Length

14 minutes

Words per minute

177.66

Word count

2,561

Sentence count

173


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode, we take a look at one of the most profound examples of virtue signaling by the state, putting a lofty ideological goal ahead of anything resembling science and facts, and that is the commitment to what is increasingly becoming a very dangerous net zero goal.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Topics generated with Qwen2.5-3B-Instruct.
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00.000 And again, we're going around the world here.
00:00:12.080 We're covering everything.
00:00:12.900 We're covering education.
00:00:14.000 We're covering indigenous issues.
00:00:15.380 We're talking about Jagmeet Singh.
00:00:16.820 We're doing it all.
00:00:17.780 But we have to cap things off with a look at one of the most profound examples of virtue
00:00:22.560 signaling by the state of putting this lofty ideological goal ahead of anything resembling
00:00:27.700 science or facts or evidence.
00:00:30.060 And that is the commitment to what is increasingly becoming a very dangerous net zero goal.
00:00:36.320 Now, this is not being a quote unquote climate denier.
00:00:39.440 It's certainly not for being anti-science.
00:00:41.180 It's about looking at the facts.
00:00:43.760 We have had a couple of major international agreements that have dealt with fossil fuel
00:00:49.640 use and emissions.
00:00:50.480 We had Kyoto back in 1997.
00:00:52.260 We had the Paris Accord back in 2015.
00:00:55.500 Since both of those, we've seen fossil fuel consumption go up.
00:00:58.440 We've seen emissions go up.
00:01:00.060 The entry into a carbon tax by Canada that has continued to increase has not stopped emissions
00:01:06.160 from increasing.
00:01:07.740 And we're wondering if you've been naive and just expected the government knew what it was
00:01:11.860 doing.
00:01:12.180 You've probably been wondering why.
00:01:13.860 Well, the reality is that this is just not working.
00:01:18.180 And what we have from our friend Kenneth Green, who has written a piece in the Toronto Stunt
00:01:23.520 about this, is a call on the government to abandon what is increasingly an unfeasible
00:01:27.900 and damaging net zero plan.
00:01:30.400 This has not worked.
00:01:31.500 It's requiring a massive phase out of fossil fuels without an alternative.
00:01:36.500 And that is the so critical part of this.
00:01:39.060 Dr. Kenneth Green joins us once again.
00:01:40.900 Always good to see you, Ken.
00:01:41.800 Thanks for coming on today.
00:01:43.140 Always good to be with you, Andrew.
00:01:44.580 So this number has just become so arbitrary.
00:01:47.500 We have to reduce by 2050.
00:01:49.420 They'll occasionally say 2040.
00:01:51.060 We have to go net zero here.
00:01:53.120 We've got to reduce emissions by this amount.
00:01:54.980 And none of it really matters in a way because they're not doing any of it.
00:01:59.080 We're not seeing any record here.
00:02:01.060 But the policy mechanisms that are supposed to get us there are causing some real harms.
00:02:06.300 Are they not?
00:02:07.440 Yes, they are.
00:02:08.000 And another one of the arbitrary targets we have is the 1.5 degrees C limiting warming to
00:02:13.200 1.5 degrees C, which actually drives all of the other ones beneath it.
00:02:18.720 The regulations on the energy sector are actually causing significant economic harm.
00:02:23.360 And in Canada and also in the United States and around the world, because energy is intrinsic
00:02:29.620 to producing economic growth and economic productivity.
00:02:34.520 And it's economic productivity and growth that lead to prosperous and thriving societies.
00:02:39.660 And so these regulations, which are increasing the cost of energy to manufacturers, to producers,
00:02:46.080 to consumers, to homeowners, are all basically causing economic suppression.
00:02:52.720 And therefore, lowering people's quality of life.
00:02:56.840 In some cases, the regulations themselves are also causing economic, leading to environmental harm,
00:03:02.840 separate from climate change, for example.
00:03:06.380 So with plastics regulations, Canada has a goal of facing out, reaching zero plastic waste by 2030.
00:03:13.940 The studies show that the substitutes people are using for plastics are actually causing more harm to the environment.
00:03:18.880 They generate more amounts of waste that have to be managed, and they pose health risks to people different than plastics do.
00:03:26.600 So the regulatory, the crusade for, or jihad for net zero 2050, is leaving a considerable amount of damage in its wake.
00:03:36.560 And the one thing that I find so fascinating about this is that no one is talking about, I shouldn't say no one, you are,
00:03:44.980 but no one in the government is talking about energy demands.
00:03:47.980 We have a lot of very ambitious goals, even if we go all in on electric vehicles, and this will require energy.
00:03:54.620 And I've yet to see anyone even so much as have a discussion about where that's going to come from.
00:03:59.060 Even when people talk about renewables, it's all very theoretical.
00:04:02.720 They have not actually provided a roadmap of matching energy needs, which will only increase,
00:04:07.820 but even at the current level, with alternative energy.
00:04:11.000 Well, energy needs are huge, not only in Canada, but in the United States, but around the world,
00:04:17.260 and especially in developing countries that are still using wood and dung for cooking fires and things.
00:04:25.340 And so the global energy demand is massive, and it will only expand with population, the global population.
00:04:34.280 But the question you ask is a really valuable one, which is how are we going to match the demand with supply?
00:04:40.020 And this is an area where governments, I believe, especially governments who are in the Western governments
00:04:46.620 and those who are in the net zero school of thought and the climate are concerned about,
00:04:51.600 basically have climate change as their center of their existence.
00:04:56.680 This is where I believe they're actually mostly insincere because they actually don't intend to supply the demand.
00:05:02.380 They promise, but they don't intend to deliver.
00:05:04.800 And historically, that's what has happened, which is they promise you an alternative
00:05:08.220 or a better version.
00:05:10.500 It's not that we don't want you to have energy.
00:05:12.660 We want you to generate it with this way, wind or solar, instead of fossil fuels.
00:05:17.000 It's not that we don't want you to have your refrigerator.
00:05:19.020 We want you to have this super hyper-efficient refrigerator.
00:05:21.940 It's not that we don't want you to have a barbecue, but it has to be an electric barbecue.
00:05:24.760 But the thing is, when the time comes for them to give you that alternative,
00:05:29.740 the electric car that matches your vehicle, you don't get it.
00:05:33.980 They don't give it to you.
00:05:35.040 And the prices never come down to match the pre-existing competitive sources.
00:05:40.640 So these things just don't manifest.
00:05:42.440 And I think that's actually a goal, which is they want to actually reduce humans' access to energy
00:05:48.680 because they want to control people more rigidly and have them do less things.
00:05:53.160 They don't want you flying around in airplanes.
00:05:56.560 That's not for the commoners.
00:05:58.160 That's for the elites.
00:05:59.780 They don't want you living in sprawling bigger houses or independent houses
00:06:03.120 or even individual houses.
00:06:05.920 They want to constrain people's behavior and constrict humanity
00:06:09.440 because that is their philosophy, is that human activity is detrimental to the world,
00:06:14.700 is killing the world.
00:06:15.660 I mean, the other thing you have to look at as well is, I think, the moving goalposts on this.
00:06:23.340 And the goalposts have not just moved on the target and on when,
00:06:26.200 but even whenever the UN COP summits on this come up,
00:06:29.800 you'll always have these radical groups that will say,
00:06:33.180 no, no, no, net zero isn't good.
00:06:34.400 We need absolute zero.
00:06:35.720 So they're actually against things that industry can do to mitigate emissions.
00:06:40.180 They're against things like carbon capture.
00:06:41.940 They're against carbon, you know, all of these alternatives.
00:06:44.040 And when you hear people talk about absolute zero, and again, it's not just fringe people.
00:06:48.760 It's some legitimate people.
00:06:50.220 They actually are anti-industry.
00:06:52.360 I mean, they're anti-human.
00:06:53.360 They want us to all just be sitting in dark rooms alone.
00:06:56.020 And that is the goal.
00:06:57.920 And that's why whenever you hear, you know, occasional proposals from some city council
00:07:01.740 in, you know, Quebec, say, to ban wood stoves,
00:07:04.680 I mean, it's actually quite revealing about just the state of contempt they have
00:07:08.340 for Western 21st century life.
00:07:10.820 It's not even Western 21st century life.
00:07:13.420 It's the life since humans harnessed fire and learned how to cook their food.
00:07:17.620 Humans need energy and use energy to transform things into the substances that keep them alive,
00:07:23.740 materials and things that keep them alive.
00:07:25.560 And so, yeah, the goalposts shift constantly.
00:07:28.340 That's something that, of course, is well-known.
00:07:31.420 And, of course, all the subsidiary goals shift as well, which is, no, it's not enough for the West
00:07:35.920 to give the developing countries a billion dollars a year.
00:07:38.680 Now they have to give them a trillion dollars a year.
00:07:40.320 Now they have to give them two trillion dollars a year in order to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions.
00:07:44.400 It is a never-ending shifting goalpost, and it has been since Kyoto in 1997.
00:07:49.140 But, again, of course, we're seeing some of that here at home as well, which is, you know,
00:07:53.700 back over the last 20 years, it was, you have to phase out coal.
00:07:58.660 We want you to phase out coal, and you can use natural gas.
00:08:01.120 And now the new call is no natural gas either, just wind and solar.
00:08:05.420 And when wind and solar, if that were to ever happen, it was all wind and solar,
00:08:09.240 then they would no doubt find a way to say, well, yeah, but no wind.
00:08:11.820 Because it's, you know, wind wheels are causing, killing birds.
00:08:15.700 And it is a ratchet to zero.
00:08:18.240 It's a ratchet to extremism.
00:08:20.240 And it is, in fact, a rejection of the idea of human nature as being an empowered species,
00:08:28.280 humanity as being an empowered species that can change the world by the use of energy and materials.
00:08:34.660 It's a rejection, a fundamental rejection of the acceptability of having human beings on your planet.
00:08:41.820 Now, I'm from Ontario, so obviously my experience is different than it is for other people,
00:08:48.060 because we have an Ontario hydroelectric.
00:08:49.860 We also have nuclear.
00:08:51.560 But nuclear is probably the greatest way to expose the utter hypocrisy from a lot of the emissions hawks,
00:08:58.500 because these people that want low emission energy sources, you bring up nuclear,
00:09:02.040 and all of a sudden, no, no, no, not like that.
00:09:03.940 Absolutely.
00:09:04.640 And that's what I say is you can recognize their actual goals by what they do,
00:09:10.060 which is the rejection of nuclear power, which was known, of course, as a non,
00:09:15.220 very low greenhouse gas emitting activity, and it's been safe, safely used for 60 years,
00:09:22.220 or actually 80 years, maybe.
00:09:24.600 The rejection of nuclear power, absolute rejection and continued rejection of it,
00:09:28.620 does show their complete and utter insincerity about the reality of what they want to achieve.
00:09:34.520 They don't want to achieve greenhouse gas emission reductions at the least cost,
00:09:39.080 while still maintaining humanity's energy profile.
00:09:43.540 And they have rejected that every single time in favor of socialist measures that control and redistribute wealth.
00:09:50.700 That's the other thing, which is you don't get to reward too many cronies if you're really relying on nuclear power.
00:09:55.220 And you don't get to play the subsidy game very much because nuclear power doesn't require a lot of subsidies.
00:10:01.640 Yeah, and I mean, it's low cost as well.
00:10:04.320 It's accessible.
00:10:06.280 I mean, obviously, there's a significant upstart cost.
00:10:08.720 But yeah, and the one thing I guess I'll say on this is that when you see electricity shortages in Alberta,
00:10:16.580 when you see other things like this, it forces people to realize that some of these discussions are a bit of a luxury item.
00:10:24.060 And that when people are giving, are living through some minus 40 degree winter,
00:10:28.780 it forces them to realize that, okay, maybe I don't want to just shut things down entirely.
00:10:33.420 So I do think that for the non-activists, there is a bit of a realization coming that some of these things are just infeasible.
00:10:40.200 I think that's true.
00:10:41.200 That's true.
00:10:41.700 I think for the non-activists, for the non-committed believers,
00:10:45.100 I think people are looking at the effects of the climate policies on their wallet,
00:10:49.120 on their house, on their wallet, on their safety, in their cars and in their houses,
00:10:54.460 and then against the climate, basically.
00:10:58.000 Safety from fires, safety from storms.
00:11:02.060 And they're seeing these climate policies are not desirable and not giving them anything of benefit.
00:11:09.400 They're not giving them a benefit, but they're certainly imposing a cost that people are increasingly seeing,
00:11:13.680 taking a bite out of their paycheck every month.
00:11:17.060 And I think that there's a loss of appetite for these extreme plans,
00:11:21.660 not only in Canada, but also around the world,
00:11:23.320 where some governments that are shifting right are vowing to move away from net zero.
00:11:29.100 At 2050, much less not going to absolute zero.
00:11:31.440 No one is ever going to absolute zero carbon emissions because it's impossible.
00:11:35.460 But I think there is a waning of enthusiasm for this.
00:11:41.300 In polls, climate change doesn't come up very highly compared to other people's other needs
00:11:47.800 for what they think is important, such as affordable housing, good education,
00:11:53.380 health care, health care, and health care.
00:11:55.160 However, I think climate has never polled very well amongst the normal people who are not activists,
00:12:01.840 which is, I think, why we have actually seen the activists held down in terms of their ambition,
00:12:08.240 the scope of their ambitions for so many years, since 1997,
00:12:11.680 to oppose draconian regulations, draconian taxes,
00:12:15.000 draconian limitations on energy for energy use,
00:12:19.240 bans on fossil fuels and things like that,
00:12:21.160 because people are not buying the extreme rhetoric.
00:12:24.860 They look out the window.
00:12:26.200 That's the thing, right?
00:12:26.920 Because one of my former colleagues or a former climatologist used to say,
00:12:31.320 don't look away from the weather report on your phone and look out the window.
00:12:35.360 Does the world look like it's being destroyed?
00:12:38.640 And so are you seeing the disasters that you're hearing about constantly,
00:12:42.680 all of the wildfires, floods, and droughts?
00:12:46.240 Is that happening near you?
00:12:48.180 And people are looking at it going, yeah, you know, I'm just not seeing it.
00:12:50.800 The air is cleaner than it's ever been before in Canada and the U.S.
00:12:54.700 in terms of normal pollutants, conventional pollution.
00:12:59.200 There's a quality of life is good.
00:13:01.320 Safety is high.
00:13:02.340 So, you know, I think people are losing enthusiasm for these issues.
00:13:05.500 And it's only a matter of time until that's reflected in the vote.
00:13:08.520 I always like when the delegate for the Maldives at the UN Climate Summit will say,
00:13:12.180 you know, we're going to be underwater any minute now.
00:13:14.160 And then you look and realize that the Maldives has opened like 30 beachfront resorts in the last year.
00:13:19.180 And you're saying, well, you're not behaving like a country that's drowning.
00:13:23.720 Yeah, they're actually growing in land mass.
00:13:25.980 That's one of the things that was the funniest things of all about the climate change and the low-lying islands thing.
00:13:30.940 And it turns out when sea levels come up, the islands grow because they're actually partly live, live ecosystems.
00:13:36.760 And so a lot of these islands that were supposed to be underwater by now have actually expanded in their land area.
00:13:43.980 And the coral reefs, of course, which were supposed to be dead 20 years ago, and dead and extinct 20 years ago, are just exploding with vigor.
00:13:55.780 So, you know, Australia was just saying, my God, we're going to lose our economy because we're going to lose our coral reefs.
00:14:01.040 It's not happening.
00:14:01.840 And they're not behaving as if they think it's going to happen.
00:14:04.180 Yeah.
00:14:04.620 Oh, it's the same.
00:14:05.280 You get the fear-mongering about polar bears in the north and their population's thriving.
00:14:09.100 So, well, it's a great piece in the Toronto Sun.
00:14:11.660 Dr. Kenneth Green, senior fellow at the Fraser Institute.
00:14:14.040 Always a pleasure, sir.
00:14:14.820 Have a great weekend.
00:14:15.720 Thank you, Andrew.
00:14:16.220 You too.
00:14:16.680 Take care.
00:14:16.900 Thanks for listening to The Andrew Lawton Show.
00:14:19.420 Support the program by donating to True North at www.tnc.news.