00:07:37.100There are a lot of PPC protesters here, actually.
00:07:40.080Maxime Bernier and the People's Party upset about not being included in the official debate,
00:07:45.460so they decided to have a rally outside the Canadian Museum of History here in Gatineau.
00:07:50.160It's been very peaceful, no issues in the time that I've been out here.
00:07:54.120As of right now, I'm actually in the secure part of the debate venue, outside, as we await the arrival of the leaders.
00:08:00.940So far, just Annamie Paul has arrived, which means there are four leaders left to go for the five who will be debating tonight for the first and only time in English.
00:08:11.460Interesting. And so what are you expecting for the debate? Are the leaders there yet? Has anyone arrived?
00:08:18.120so just anime paul has arrived right now the the others will be on route very shortly because this
00:08:24.460is kicking off in about an hour's time one of the interesting things that that i think uh from the
00:08:29.620last debate which is the french language debate last night that will be a bit different is that
00:08:34.200this one's a lot more widely viewed this is the one that's more likely to get clipped and picked
00:08:38.400up by the media so if there were leaders that were holding something back in the tank if you will
00:08:43.320I think we can expect to see that come out tonight.
00:11:06.660Yeah, and I'm sure Hamish can tell you when you get to discussing things later on that foreign policy does not traditionally move votes, but that doesn't make it less important.
00:11:15.140And the whole reason for the government takeover of the debates, the formation of this Leaders Debates Commission, was to supposedly create a debate that wasn't beholden to the interests of private media companies that would serve a public interest.
00:11:27.560So you have to look at and say whose interests are being served when some pretty key issues that matter to the country are being left out of the discussion.
00:11:35.200So I think that's a big, a big issue here.
00:11:38.000And again, you know, there are other opportunities that leaders can still bring up whatever issues they want in the scrums, depending on what they're asked and throughout the course of the campaign.
00:11:46.080But that's going to be one of the noteworthy aspects of this.
00:11:48.540And just looking at kind of the analysis from last night's debate, the French debate, a lot of the times what is discussed matters a lot more than what's said in response to it.
00:11:59.000One notable example of this is a question on climate change from an 11-year-old.
00:12:03.840And the entire premise of the question was based on gloom and doom.
00:12:07.800The question used the term climate catastrophe.
00:12:10.640The 11-year-old was saying he's worried about his future kids.
00:12:13.160And so it becomes very difficult for any leader to really have a discussion about this when it's already been framed in a particular way.
00:12:38.100but honestly like the idea that he was asking about what his kids like 11 year old saying what
00:12:44.280will my kids future look like I don't know an 11 year old that thinks that way I have a hard time
00:12:49.860believing that he came up with that question on his own it was actually it was almost like a lost
00:12:53.560in translation moment like did I hear that correctly this little 11 year old just asking
00:12:57.380about his own kids that to me that was just pure political uh propaganda and it was really
00:13:02.240disappointing to see. Andrew, quickly, just one more question. What can we expect format-wise?
00:13:08.200So we have a two-hour debate, and then let us know a little bit about what to expect after that.
00:13:15.980So it's going to be just the debate itself for a moment. It's going to be broken up into five
00:13:19.520themes. So roughly, that will work out to be the two hours divided evenly among those themes.
00:13:25.820And interestingly enough, I think what we're likely to see is a fair bit of crossover there.
00:13:30.400So I do think that some of the discussions won't be as easily confined to their section just because of the format.
00:13:36.340And then after the debate, all the leaders, all five who are participating, will come and do a 10-minute scrum each for reporters.
00:13:43.640And this was something, if anyone did watch the French-language debate last night, you'll know I was able to get a couple of questions in.
00:13:49.140One to Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and another to NDP leader Jagmeet Singh.
00:13:53.700And it's kind of a bit of a luck of the draw as to which leader you get to ask a question to.
00:13:57.780But obviously, you know, the reason I'm here is because that opportunity to put questions to leaders who might not otherwise take questions from reporters or take questions from us allows us to ask things that do matter to a lot of people but haven't really been front and center in much of the campaign coverage.
00:14:13.340So, you know, it may just be, you know, a 50-minute period after a debate, but it's a very important 50-minute period because that's where you get an opportunity to sometimes go beyond the talking points or at least beyond the issues that have been taking up a lot of the oxygen of the campaign.
00:14:27.000Right, and I mean, it's the closest that we at True North come to being able to ask Justin Trudeau questions and hold him accountable.
00:14:33.780It's great that you got that question into him last night, Andrew.
00:14:36.300And unfortunately, you know, Justin Trudeau's never answered a question, I don't think, in his life.
00:14:39.760He talked, you know, you asked a question and then he talked for a minute, but he didn't really address your question or answer it in any way.
00:14:47.220But still, you know, you've got to take your chance and put questions in.
00:19:42.500So we asked people basically lockdowns made you more concerned about the government's
00:19:46.500amount of power the government has or lockdowns made you more grateful the government has
00:19:53.500the power to take actions to look to keep you safe.
00:19:56.500And 35% of people say lockdowns made you more concerned about government power.
00:20:02.50035% say they're more grateful for the government's power, but 35%, you know, in our conversation
00:20:09.460with us, Candice, you know, like 35% in Canada, that's actually a good number and a good start.
00:20:14.540And interestingly enough, when you think of these poor deaths we've been seeing, especially
00:20:17.480in Quebec, that number is highest in Quebec.
00:20:20.080I think it's 47 or 48% are more concerned about the growth of governor power in Quebec,
00:20:27.980which I think is very interesting and could certainly lead to all sorts of interesting things over there.
00:20:33.660Well, 35%, I mean, it seems bad because obviously the overwhelming majority of Canadians just feel good about having Big Brother taking care of them.
00:20:41.040But, you know, 35%, if that's like the upward ability of Maxine Bernier to win,
00:20:47.460I mean, that would be a total game-changer in Canadian politics if he could manage to kind of recruit all those people.
00:20:52.880But I think that, Sue, and you're right, that the sort of anger people have,
00:20:56.640it's not just at being anti-vaccine and this is something that really bothers me the way that
00:21:02.160Justin Trudeau tries to sort of own science like it's like whatever his opinion is is the science
00:21:07.200like capital T capital S and he uses it all the time even you know last night at the debate he
00:21:11.620took a shot at the rebel and he said you know it's because of you that people don't trust the
00:21:15.180science and it's like I overhear people's conversation even today I was at the hairdresser
00:21:20.560getting my hair cut and the guy next to me was complaining about people who don't get vaccinated
00:21:24.260saying that because of them his kids still have to wear masks at school and he's just fed up
00:21:28.980and he wants like you know he's just ranting this guy right and i'm kind of thinking like
00:21:33.300just because you're vaccinated doesn't mean that covid goes away right like like just anecdotally
00:21:38.880i know somebody who's fully vaccinated they had been on a business trip to dallas came back and
00:21:43.000had covid right there's a big outbreak happening in texas right now so just because you're fully
00:21:47.660vaccinated doesn't make covid go away but people have this perception and trudeau's the one that's
00:21:52.640pushing it that as soon as we get to this level where everyone's vaccinated we can just go back
00:21:56.960to normal it's like is that even true like like where are we where are we headed because people
00:22:02.000can still get it i mean if we're talking about back to normal justin trudeau's double vaccinated
00:22:06.400and he still walks around with a mask half the time he's like why are you wearing a mask if you're
00:22:10.000double vaccinated a couple of them have added as well so sophie rivar trudeau had it so they've
00:22:18.800they've had two doses of vaccine they've had the virus itself some of them not all of them
00:22:23.440but but i think you know to your point about trudeau stressing these points so hard i mean
00:22:27.760that still gives the government the end to say we have the magic silver bullet solution and you just
00:22:33.520have to come to us and we will solve this for you i remember well over a year ago they said all you
00:22:37.440got to do is download our contact tracing app and they were really pushing that said this will end
00:22:41.120the pandemic subsequent things have come along usually provincial issues and i can hammer
00:22:45.600different premiers on that that all we mean is this that or the other vaccine passports is the
00:22:49.560newest thing if only we bring in the vaccine passports it's all done uh right away but after
00:22:54.700doug ford cave and said he'd bring one in in ontario just three hours later the ontario science
00:22:59.260table i came over the report saying well we still might need to have a fall lockdown so you're like
00:23:04.500clearly there is no magic silver bullet solution but i know the politicians would like to dangle
00:23:10.040that idea uh in front of us and to your point about the anecdote of the hairdresser i mean
00:23:14.600No, I think a lot of people are buying it, sure.
00:23:17.280Well, if any thinking person would see that the goalposts keep changing.
00:23:21.800So if you want to travel, if I were to jump on a plane tomorrow,
00:23:25.740I'm double vaccinated, have been since April.
00:23:29.880I still have to get a COVID test before I leave, show it, show proof.
00:23:35.220I'm going to a Broadway show in a couple of weeks.
00:23:37.440They've sent me a whole thing telling me what I have to do.
00:23:40.020Wait, you didn't mix vaccines, did you?
00:26:44.540We've got Andrew out in Gatineau, and we're going to go back to him.
00:26:48.100So Andrew, tell us a little bit about, we're talking to Andrew Lawton, True North contributor, True North senior fellow.
00:26:54.820Tell us what the scene is over there in Gatineau outside of the federal leaders' debate.
00:27:00.280Yeah, thanks. It has been a bit interesting.
00:27:03.200So the noises that you might hear from time to time tend to time with whenever a politician's motorcade or vehicle is coming into the area.
00:27:11.300and people are not quite pleased with it.
00:27:13.320These are overwhelmingly People's Party of Canada protesters
00:27:16.740who were gathered with a very simple message at first,
00:27:55.400What are the benchmarks that we are using to get it there?
00:27:58.060And interestingly enough, last night, all of the talk was really about, when it came to COVID anyway,
00:28:03.780about how much aid was given, what that aid was being used for.
00:28:07.320There was some discussion about CERB and CRB and the longevity of some of these programs, the labour shortage that we're seeing all over the country.
00:28:15.340These were some of the ideas that came up.
00:28:17.240But none were really getting to the crux of the matter, which is we've got travel restrictions, we've got vaccine passports, we've got further encroachments on what we can do in our individual lives in most provinces in Canada.
00:28:29.720What is your plan to get us out of that?
00:28:31.580And that was not something that we heard at all.
00:28:33.620So that's going to be something I'm listening for in tonight's debate.
00:28:36.380And not to tip my hand too, too much, but something that I might actually ask about in the scrums after.
00:28:41.780So that's going to be one of the big things that I'm keeping an ear out for and keeping an eye out for in the debate.
00:28:47.560And just to give you a sense of where things stand now, as far as the arrival of leaders,
00:28:51.780we're only waiting on, I think, one or two more.
00:28:53.880Justin Trudeau just arrived a couple of moments ago, so things should be getting started up.
00:28:58.300And this is, for those who are just tuning in, the English language leaders debate starting at 9 p.m.
00:29:04.080But it's going to be certainly an interesting night anyway.
00:29:06.380That report, Andrew Lawton on the ground in Gatineau, which is just right outside of Ottawa.
00:29:12.900We're really excited, and thank you for giving us that update.
00:29:16.940Yeah, you can see Ottawa in the background, so we're close there.
00:29:19.720There it is. Oh, yeah. Oh, is that Parliament right behind you?
00:36:28.840hopefully us as well. And, you know, he didn't want them coming and doing whatever they do.
00:36:37.840I mean, it was silly because it just made him look bad. And today, you know, he gave
00:36:42.840Rebel a platform to, you know, grandstand even more. And, you know, we won, we won.
00:36:49.840But a debates commission, to me, is just evidence of the total control, I think, including bailing out media and giving them handouts that has occurred during Justin Trudeau's reign.
00:37:07.840Well, I mean, there's a couple interesting things.
00:37:10.840It's like, okay, they didn't learn anything the first time around by banning...
00:37:13.840So in 2019, people aren't aware of what we're talking about.
00:37:16.760Both True North and The Rebel were banned.
00:37:19.580The Debates Commission said that we were not media companies,
00:37:22.820and they let us know at the very last minute.
00:45:42.680We've seen in this country in the past with the reform party emerging in the late 80s
00:45:46.320And, you know, and we'll see how many votes the PPC gets on election night, but their message really more than anything else is we're out for the consensus.
00:45:54.920And, you know, I don't think they're going to end up at 10% like they told the other day, but we're going to get more votes to the Greens.
00:46:03.120Yeah, I mean, similar to what happened with Fort Nation, you know, when people like Rob
00:46:11.120Fort, you know, they sought out somebody who wasn't like everybody else and was not, you
00:46:20.120know, smooth and all that kind of stuff.
00:46:23.120So people like us, you know, the elitist.
00:46:28.120and he did very well at first. So yes, I think people are crying for that and that's why it's so disappointing that the PPC hasn't been involved in any of the debates, hasn't given any chance because, you know, whether they win or they don't, they probably will get more votes than anybody imagines, but they elevate the, I think, the debate onto issues that aren't being discussed, like we've talked about before.
00:46:58.120those sort of things. Security, safety and security in Canada, that's a big issue. It's a big issue in urban centers.
00:47:05.120Absolutely, and instead of really tackling the issue, we just get this fake debate about assault rifles and who's for them and who's against them.
00:47:12.120Folks, we're just going to take a quick one-minute break. Please bear with us. We're having a little bit of technical difficulties.
00:47:17.120We'll be back in one minute to continue with the analysis for the pre-debate show here.
01:00:42.660You can imagine if the Green Party candidate or I think Roseanne Barr was running for president as well.
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01:00:46.720Then if she had been on the stage there and yet to give her equal airtime, it just wouldn't be, you know, the main event.
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01:00:52.660You want the main fight card up there.
01:00:54.260I also think the topics are a little frustrating in tonight's debate.
01:00:59.180I mean, Hamish listed off those main topics.
01:01:01.600And of the five, three, three and a half of them are also provincial and municipal domain.
01:01:08.020I mean, they are not they're not following the subsidiarity principle very well.
01:01:11.540And the one thing that doesn't have its own topic, foreign affairs, that's not a municipal issue.
01:01:17.240That's not a provincial issue. That is the exclusive domain of the federal government.
01:01:20.860And if you ask some libertarian purists, you know, what should the federal government do?
01:01:24.500They probably cancel half the federal departments out there.
01:01:26.920But, of course, keep foreign affairs, because that is, you know, one of the original duties of any time a federal government has formed in history.
01:01:33.960So it is frustrating, particularly in the intro, Candice, you were saying earlier in the hour, we've got Afghanistan, we've got China.
01:01:40.720I mean, these are things that really have to be hashed out.
01:01:43.040And when you want to talk about housing, I mean, there's, as Sue Ann has covered very well, there are committees at city halls all across this country that are delving into housing and throwing billions at it.
01:01:52.500Maybe we can talk about foreign affairs just a little bit.
01:01:54.820Well, and to your point, I mean, that's the whole sort of purpose.
01:01:58.300And we were talking a little bit earlier, at least I was, about how it feels like the leaders kind of have the same opinion on a lot of things.
01:02:04.480Maybe if we were having a broader debate, including, you know, Hamish, the poll that you did for Turn North,
01:02:08.980we found that conservatives and liberals care about very different issues.
01:02:11.960So if you're a liberal, you care about COVID and climate change.
01:02:14.340If you're a conservative, you care about debt and the economy and jobs.
01:02:17.600And so it just seems like the topics are geared more towards liberal voters and the liberal worldview.
01:02:52.520Not with assault rifles, but with the massive shootings and the absolute enabling in our justice system of the criminals and not giving them tough consequences.
01:03:11.700What we care about is the drug addiction issues and mental health issues, which is one thing that Erin O'Toole has covered quite well.
01:03:21.340But this is what we're caring about in cities when we see addicted drug users walking the streets, when we see just the absolute enabling of crime and shootings and, you know, and people, that's what people on the ground are worried about.
01:03:41.540Yeah, and yet there's very, very sort of little about that. Even the issue of childcare, which is something that a lot of people do. I know both of you fellows over there have young kids, and I have young kids as well. We probably have like 10 kids between us, almost. But anyway, yeah.
01:08:19.860I think, first of all, I want to thank Canadians for being here tonight, making an important choice,
01:08:25.040and also, quite frankly, for everything you've done over the past number of months to help get ourselves and our neighbors through this.
01:08:32.600Tonight, over the next couple of hours, you're going to hear some very, very different, very strong ideas that are radically different about how we're going to move forward through this pandemic to end it, how we're going to build back better.
01:08:46.140Those decisions are going to be taken by your government now, in the coming weeks, this fall, not a year from now, not two years from now.
01:08:53.460Could it not have waited a few months, Mr. Trudeau?
01:08:55.720I know you want to go harder and faster on vaccinations.
01:08:58.700I know you want to go harder and faster on climate change, and you get to choose exactly that in this election.
01:13:03.880But on your watch, sexual misconduct in Canada's armed forces continues to run rampant.
01:13:10.480Tell me, why are you allowing these unacceptable conditions to continue?
01:13:15.200I think we recognize that there are systems and institutions that need to change across the country.
01:13:19.900And that's why, from the very beginning, we stepped up with policies, new policies, stronger policies and processes to support every survivor, everyone who comes forward.
01:13:29.480because nobody deserves to work in a workplace
01:13:32.880where they are being discriminated against,
01:13:35.400where they are being harassed or hassled.
01:16:01.620It's a piece of luck that we can produce green energy in a large amount.
01:16:06.940But the whole planet cannot afford this idea, this very Canadian idea, this very conservative idea.
01:16:12.840And as far as I know, this very liberal idea that we have to produce more oil, export more oil, believing that the money from it will reduce gas emission, which won't happen.
01:16:23.780All Canadian families deserve an economic recovery, including families in Western Canada that feel left out after six years of Mr. Trudeau.
01:16:32.340When it comes to leadership, our natural resources sector is a leader in environmental, social governance.
01:16:38.180Any time Canadian resources are removed from the global supply chain, you know who fills that gap?
01:16:46.600All of these organizations and companies are getting their emissions down.
01:16:50.820Let's get emissions down and Canadian resources to market so that we can have jobs opportunity and fight climate change.
01:16:57.560When it comes to leadership on fighting this essential crisis, one of the biggest crises we're up against,
01:17:05.100we've got a difficult choice for Canadians.
01:17:07.120You've got on one side someone who doesn't believe there's a crisis, and then on the other, you've got Mr. Trudeau who doesn't act like there's a crisis.
01:17:14.100And what it's going to take is real leadership, because the solutions are there.
01:17:17.580We can invest in green energy, clean energy.
01:19:08.120You put your own political interests ahead of the well-being of thousands of people.
01:19:12.960Leadership is about putting others first, not yourself.
01:19:17.340Mr. Trudeau, you should not have called this election.
01:19:19.380You should have gotten the job done in Afghanistan.
01:19:21.260that. Mr. O'Toole, as of the beginning... Hold on. This is not open debate, leaders. This is
01:19:25.760a situation where we're asking a question to each of you. No problem, Mr. Trudeau. I'm trying to
01:19:32.100keep track of myself. I would like him, Ms. Curl, because he called an election in the fourth wave
01:19:36.060of a pandemic with fires in British Columbia and with unfinished business in Afghanistan,
01:19:40.940Mr. Trudeau. All right. Thank you, Mr. O'Toole. I'm going to give the opportunity next per the
01:19:45.060draw to Mr. Singh. You guys will have tons of time to debate, so hang tight. Mr. Singh.
01:19:49.480sadly what's happened in in afghanistan is a tragedy that was something we knew about we
01:19:57.340knew about the withdrawal date we knew from president biden what that date would be and
01:20:01.780and sadly i agree with mr otul on this one point that it was a bad decision to call an election
01:20:07.600while this crisis was going on particularly because we've got allies on the ground that
01:20:12.100put their lives at risk to support our canadian forces who are now looking at peril for their
01:20:17.840lives and may never get out of afghanistan we know the impact on women and girls in afghanistan
01:20:22.660it's heartbreaking and it could have been avoided veterans had told mr trudeau and his government
01:20:28.020for a long time that the current approach was not working those calls were not heated and as a result
01:20:33.980we're in this really horrible situation thank you thank you mr singh mr blanchett first good news
01:20:39.260i seem to understand from what i read a few hours ago that kabul airport is now being open for some
01:20:45.240to get out of the country, which is very good news.
01:20:48.240This should have been worked a long, long time ago.
01:20:51.240I agree with Mr. O'Toole that Mr. O'Toole
01:20:54.040should have put those people's interests before his own.
01:20:57.180However, the problem is that Canada has failed many times
01:21:00.680to create some strong partnerships with other countries
01:21:04.300in order to be stronger facing a situation like Afghanistan now.
01:21:09.240Because by itself, we must admit, Canada is not a world power.
01:21:14.240Thank you, Mr. Blanchet. Mr. Trudeau, I invite you to respond now.
01:21:18.200Thank you, Ms. Curl. It's unfortunate to hear the members, the leaders on this stage talking down the incredible work that our Canadian Armed Forces, that our diplomats, that our consular officials did from the beginning of the summer to ensure that as of the very beginning of August, well before this election, we were getting flights out of Afghanistan.
01:21:39.520We got 3,700 people out of Afghanistan, and over the past weeks, we've been working with the Qataris, for example, on exactly that good news that we've seen of more people, more Canadians getting out of Afghanistan.
01:21:52.500We work closely with our allies because we know Canadians sacrificed in Afghanistan for a better future.
01:21:58.400We need to stand by the people who helped us, who helped themselves, and we will with even more people coming to Canada in the coming months.
01:22:08.420As a former diplomat and with a husband who provided advice on the peace negotiations in Afghanistan,
01:22:16.940we were hearing the stories all the time in the months leading up that this was foreseeable.
01:22:22.760And so it seems like we got better information on our smartphones than Mr. Trudeau got from our entire intelligence service based on what he's saying.
01:22:29.560the thing is that when you people count on you when you make a promise to them then you do it
01:22:36.840so that people can count on canada's word when someone is your partner you go with them you go
01:22:41.700for them or you don't amount to much and so leaving behind people in afghanistan rocking up
01:22:47.760to rito hall and calling an election under these circumstances was not the right thing to do
01:22:52.100and to borrow a line from mr singh from 2019 mr chadokha just say hey man i messed up all right
01:22:57.500Ms. Paul, thank you very much. Thank you all. And now it is our time for a first attempt at open
01:23:04.040debate. Jumping off of this question, Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor have been in Chinese
01:23:11.180prisons for 1,004 days. The next prime minister has key decisions to make about our already tense
01:23:20.480relationship with China, such as telecommunications security and foreign investment.
01:23:25.240Some say this all comes down to a trade-off between Canada's economic growth and recognition of human rights
01:23:32.040I'd like to know where you all stand. I'm sure you want to exchange on that. Mr. Singh, for the draw you begin
01:24:05.740And that's exactly what we've been doing.
01:24:07.660Over the past three years, we have worked with international allies to put pressure on China in every single one of their meetings.
01:24:14.200We've worked closely with the United States.
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01:24:16.400We at the G7 a few weeks ago worked with the international community to make sure we're moving forward on challenging China where necessary and human rights, competing with them economically where we need to and holding them to account on the rule of law as a global community.
01:24:32.580And Canada's voice has been very strong on that.
01:24:35.940Canada's voice has been absent, Mr. Trudeau.
01:24:38.400We have not worked with our allies on Huawei.
01:24:41.180We have not stood up for the 300,000 Canadians in Hong Kong.
01:24:45.260We've not fought for the two Michaels and put pressure on the communist regime.
01:24:50.120We have not stood up for human rights.
01:24:52.080Sir, you did not show up for a vote declaring a genocide towards the Uyghur people.
01:26:23.640When we make a promise, we have to keep those promises.
01:26:27.080That's how, when we need help, we get it.
01:26:29.580You know, my mom grew up on a farm in a small community,
01:26:32.520and she learned very young and taught us
01:26:34.280that you have to give your word to your neighbors,
01:26:36.560and they have to be able to count on it
01:26:38.360so that when you need help, they're there for you.
01:26:40.960And so when we don't show up, when we're asked for vaccines from COVAX and then we take vaccines from COVAX,
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01:26:47.580when the Uyghur ask us for help to declare a genocide and we don't do that,
01:26:52.240when we don't show up on the climate by setting targets that are ambitious but at the same time in line with our international partners and do our fair share,
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01:27:01.860then our word doesn't count for much and then it makes it very hard for us to help people like the Michaels when they need us the most.
01:27:07.980Mr. Blanchett, did you want to get in on this?
01:27:09.420Stirring tomatoes might not be the solution,
01:27:12.100but I would submit humbly that doing nothing
01:27:59.080Canada is needed back on the world stage.
01:28:00.980We may be smaller than China with respect to population and economy, but we are a giant when it comes to our commitments to human rights, to dignity, and to the rule of law.
01:28:09.800And we have to start working with our allies to take a more serious approach for human rights, standing up for our workers on fair trade, and making sure that our voice is a principled one on the world stage again.
01:28:20.540The problem with Mr. O'Toole and his principles is he says all the right-sounding things,
01:28:25.940and he's working on reassuring everyone that he's right there as a strong leader.
01:28:29.180But he can't convince his candidates to get vaccinated.
01:31:39.260That's why in April, long before the election,
01:31:41.600I put out a substantial package, pricing carbon to meet our Paris targets.
01:31:47.460And what's interesting, our low-carbon savings account will allow people to actually make green choices to lower their carbon footprint.
01:31:54.960This approach is innovative because it would allow all Canadians to know what their carbon footprint is and make those innovative investments to lower it.
01:32:02.500I think we all have a role to play, and our plan is detailed, and we'll deliver on it.
01:36:29.280Well, here's the thing. We just heard Mr. O'Toole and Mr. Trudeau argue about who's worse.
01:36:34.840And honestly, it's a tough question to answer.
01:36:37.400Let me tell you, you're not stuck with these two. Better is possible.
01:36:41.260We can invest in a clean economy. We can end fossil fuel subsidies.
01:36:46.000We can make sure we're creating clean transportation, and we can invest in provinces and territories to make sure they have the resources necessary to fight the climate crisis.
01:36:55.500I'm hopeful. I'm optimistic. I'm going to be a dad soon, and I want to make sure my child grows up into a future that has the same opportunities that I had, that has clean air, clean water, a clean place to live.
01:37:07.660I want to make sure that that's different.
01:37:08.780As far as I understand it, it is not a national or even less original issue.
01:37:14.560it is a planetary issue and it has to be tackled by everybody at once but i would be glad to give
01:37:23.120some of my precious time to mr otul because a week ago a little more than that he said in french
01:37:29.120that he did not want anymore to have a pipeline to go through quebec that was quite a statement
01:37:35.440he said that in french no more pipeline through quebec i want to hear that in english tonight
01:38:03.160This is a nonpartisan issue, and we have got to be able to come together across party lines.
01:38:08.300I wanted I said that I was available for a debate just on the climate because it's that important but we and we've invited many times all of the parties to join us in a joint cabinet a cross party cabinet to deal with this the way that we dealt with the pandemic together people were so inspired to see these leaders come together in the early days of the pandemic we have got to bring that same approach here let's come together because that's what's needed.
01:38:34.060Thank you very much. I absolutely agree. We do need to come together. I can lay out what we
01:38:38.240shouldn't do and what we need to do. What we shouldn't do is what Mr. Trudeau did,
01:38:42.060set targets and missed them. We shouldn't promise to end fossil fuel subsidies and then increase
01:38:46.500them. We shouldn't put a price on pollution and then exempt the biggest polluters. What we need
01:38:50.800to do is end those fossil fuel subsidies, invest in provinces and territories with infrastructure
01:38:56.920that's going to help us fight the climate crisis. Hold on, Mr. Singh. With the greatest of respect
01:39:03.040With the greatest of respect to Mr. Singh,
01:39:05.140we have been making this invitation for years,
01:39:08.720and it has never been accepted by the NDP or any other party.
01:39:12.220So it's great to hear that they agree.
01:39:14.060We have to wrap this section now, leaders.
01:39:16.080It is time for me, with great pleasure,
01:39:18.180to welcome Mercedes Stevenson of Global News.
01:39:21.260She is joining us now, and she's going to be asking
01:39:23.720each of you a direct question on climate change.
01:39:27.100This round starts with Mr. Trudeau. Hi, Mercedes.
01:40:53.200Your party often criticizes the oil and gas industry in Canada's western provinces.
01:40:59.020You've said that you would block pipelines trying to go through Quebec.
01:41:02.640While you were the environment minister, though, you allowed oil exploration and carbon-intensive projects without environmental assessment.
01:41:09.920So why the double standard, and what do you say to Canadians who feel that you're blocking their prosperity?
01:41:15.160There were three issues that have been raised since I've been into this election.
01:41:21.260The first one is having reversed the 9B line of Enbridge, which has been reversed a few years sooner without any evaluation or anything.
01:41:41.540And the other one was to have an environmental, I will come to that, evaluation after the exploration.
01:41:49.700This is all a buildup made by the previously environmentalist Sylvain Guilbault from the Parti Liberal, which the prime minister did not even know about when he attacked me with it.
01:42:02.080My record is also I've been having signed the carbon market with California,
01:42:08.180which is still considered the best way to tackle the gas emission through incentives and tariffs around the world, at least North America.
01:42:20.220That is time. Mercedes, your next question.
01:44:45.060We can keep moving towards a mirage and that is what these promises are, a mirage that's just out there in the distance that we never arrive at.
01:44:53.800Or you can send people back to Ottawa from every single party who are committed to working together across party lines on the greatest existential challenge of our time and seizing the opportunity of a truly green recovery.
01:45:07.640Mr. Singh, you accuse the Trudeau government of being all talk and no action when it comes to
01:45:15.340climate change and yet you won't even give Canadians a straight answer on whether or not
01:45:19.620you would cancel the Trans Mountain Pipeline expansion. You've had years as NDP leader to
01:45:24.940develop a climate plan. Your platform has lots of big ideas and big targets but almost no details
01:45:31.080on how you would get there. Don't you owe Canadians a clear answer on your climate roadmap and will
01:45:36.840you provide one tonight absolutely and i'm honored to do so we've got a bold plan that's going to
01:45:42.240take a lot of courage that requires lots of investment because we know how serious this
01:45:46.540crisis is and we know what we're up against unlike mr trudeau we're not going to blame
01:45:50.800previous governments we know that in power we have the power to make a change and if we vote
01:45:56.380for the same things we're going to get the same results so i want canadians to know you have a
01:45:59.980choice we are committed to ending answer we'll lay some of it out one of it is to end fossil
01:46:04.800fuel subsidies, use that to invest in clean energy. We would make sure we prioritize investing
01:46:10.320in electrified transportation. We would invest in retrofitting homes and buildings to reduce
01:46:14.940our emissions. There is so much that we can do. We are confident we can do it. But there is a cost
01:46:20.120if we continue down the same path of conservative or liberals who don't take this seriously. You
01:46:25.460have a choice. All right. Thank you. Now it is time for open debate. Mercedes is going to keep
01:46:33.860you leaders on theme. I'm going to keep you on time and make sure everyone has a chance to be
01:46:38.480heard. Ms. Paul, we're starting with you. Back to you, Mercedes. Thank you. Canadians want their
01:46:45.540government to fight climate change, but they also worry about the cost for their families,
01:46:50.900and we know there will be a cost to this. Why should Canadians trust your party to see us
01:46:56.760there is a global green rush going on now to create the competitive green economy of the future
01:47:06.420what the greens don't want to see is canada being left behind because that is exactly what's
01:47:12.760happening you know i'm sure that the last candle maker was the person that had the market cornered
01:47:19.240on candle making but if everyone has moved on to led lights then you're in trouble and so what we
01:47:24.340want to see is a seizing this opportunity and mercedes to your earlier question if denmark and
01:47:29.180greenland other cold countries can end oil exploration then certainly we can do it and
01:47:34.140if 27 countries in the european union can come together collaboratively to have an ambitious
01:47:39.960plan for the climate then surely with leadership we can do the same here in canada i know canada
01:47:45.360can do anything that any other country can do absolutely i think we absolutely can if if any
01:47:51.680type of energy is removed from the global market, Canadian energy. It's replaced by a bad actor
01:47:57.860country that doesn't have carbon reduction programs. It doesn't have human rights. It
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01:48:02.040doesn't have engagement with indigenous communities. Indigenous partnerships in natural
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01:48:07.020resources is huge. So you said the cost. There are tens of thousands of jobs that deserve an
01:48:12.740economic recovery just as much as anyone else. There are indigenous partnerships, economic
01:48:18.240reconciliation and a move towards a made in Canada net zero by 2050. So let's be leaders
01:48:24.900in getting carbon emissions down and being world leaders on how we have natural resources,
01:48:31.620whether it's energy, timber, rare earth minerals for EVs, then we can be world leaders again.
01:48:37.140Let's talk about the cost. The cost of inaction is an entire town of Lytton being wiped out by a
01:48:43.840climate forest fire. The cost of inaction is forest fires and flooding and heat waves that
01:48:49.180mean Canadians lose their lives. The cost of not acting means a young woman I met in Hamilton
01:48:54.500who looked me in the eyes and said, what's the point of me pursuing my education? What's the
01:48:59.440point of me finding a partner or even starting a family when I don't know what type of future
01:49:03.920I'll live in, let alone my child? That's the cost of inaction. That's the cost of Mr. Trudeau,
01:49:09.800who had six years to do something about this.
02:00:40.600it should be Jody up here answering that question.
02:00:43.280And it should be Mumala Kakak up here answering that question.
02:00:46.920We need to make the space for Indigenous leadership to guide this process.
02:00:51.380And above all, we need to make this a priority.
02:00:55.360All that is left now is political will.
02:00:58.260But that is exactly what we have been doing, Ms. Paul.
02:01:00.920When we called the National Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls
02:01:05.740after years of governments avoiding doing that,
02:01:08.620we ensured that we brought the truth forward.
02:01:10.460And then we worked with indigenous leaders groups, indigenous women's groups to co-develop the action plan that we are now fully funding so we can get justice for the victims, healing for the families and put an end to this ongoing national tragedy.
02:01:25.980It will take a lot of work by all of us, but we are walking this road in partnership because we know it needs to be done and there is much more to do.
02:01:35.560Mr. Trudeau, sadly, and I don't take any pleasure in this,
02:01:38.560the calls to justice are out there, and you haven't acted on them.
02:01:41.720And I meant it when I said you can't take a knee one day
02:01:44.100if you're going to take Indigenous kids to court the next.
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02:05:20.720You know, Canada has more children in government custody right now than at the height of residential schools.
02:05:26.820New legislation, child welfare legislation, actually takes the onus and puts it on the First Nations communities
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02:05:33.060to bring their kids back, cleaning up the mess that Canada has created, essentially.
02:05:38.720And those children are going to have to be brought back to all of those same problems that still exist
02:05:43.300that were the grounds for apprehension.
02:05:45.620What would you do in the House of Commons to make sure that poverty and trauma issues are addressed?
02:05:52.640Thank you very much for that question.
02:05:54.940And absolutely, we mentioned that not that long ago in one of our statements that the residential school system had been replaced by children in care and that this was just perpetuating the legacy of trauma.
02:06:10.140It really comes back to what I said before, which is that the Indigenous leadership is there.
02:06:15.020It is ready to guide all of these processes.
02:06:17.660We have all of the recommendations we need.
02:06:19.660What we are missing is political will.
02:06:21.780What we are missing is those who have been in power for a very long time,
02:06:25.680making space for new voices and diverse voices.
02:06:29.200I actually had to pull my jaw up, which just dropped,
02:07:59.120Progressives always know there's more to do.
02:08:01.820But when we came into office, there were 105 long-term boil water advisories.
02:08:06.300We lifted 109 of them, and for each of the ones that are remaining, we have a project lead, a project team, and an action plan, and we are going to lift those all.
02:08:16.160There are tens of thousands of kids across this country, indigenous kids, who've started the school year in new schools or refurbished schools.
02:08:24.020We have moved forward on settling more agreements and more land claims and more partnerships than any other government over the years.
02:08:31.760We continue to work in partnership and respect and invest more money in Indigenous communities than any previous government.
02:08:40.160I think the money, I don't think anybody's questioning the money spent.
02:08:43.260I think that they're questioning the results for the money that's spent.
02:08:46.500My next question is to you, Mr. Singh.
02:08:48.860You know, federal forces, including the RCMP and the Department of Fisheries and Oceans,
02:08:52.940have been used throughout Canada's history to prevent First Nations from exercising their treaty rights to fish and to hunt and to defend land and water.
02:09:01.220This is happening right now on both coasts, including under the NDP party in British Columbia with regards to fishing and logging.
02:09:09.380So my question would be to you as prime minister, what would you do to ensure indigenous rights and title are finally respected in this country?
02:09:17.120I really appreciate the question. First of all, we need to respect indigenous treaty land and rights.
02:09:22.760That's a fundamental step towards walking the path of reconciliation in a real meaningful way.
02:09:27.040But you mentioned the RCMP, and I've got to talk about the really sad reality that there's been violence, heavy-handed violence, against indigenous communities, against peaceful protesters.
02:09:39.280And we have long called, I have long called, for reform of policing.
02:09:43.200When I was in the provincial level, I fought against carting.
02:09:46.100I've continued to use every platform I have to say, we've got to stop the use of force.
02:11:37.820I think if there's one thing that Canadians and Indigenous people can all agree upon, it is that this Indian Act system is not working for anybody.
02:11:44.960How would you dismantle this broken, top-down system, and what would you replace it with
02:11:49.760that would ensure that Canada still is living up to its constitutional obligations to Indigenous people?
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02:11:55.780First of all, we are looking forward to dismantling the Indian Act.
02:11:59.920It is a commitment of ours, but it is not something that Ottawa gets to decide.
02:12:04.300And what replaces the Indian Act will vary from community to community as we live up to our obligations.
02:12:10.760And that's why over the years, as we've moved towards self-government, we have accompanied communities, some who want to start with health, some who want to start with education, some who want to start with economic development.
02:12:22.580Every community, every nation across this country gets to help define what its path is forward.
02:12:28.580We will be there to listen, to partner, to build a better future every step of the way.
02:12:34.040The way to go forward is to listen to leaders. And Mr. Trudeau ignored one that he had in his
02:12:39.240own cabinet, Jody Wilson-Raybould. That was a huge lost opportunity. We've been speaking to people
02:12:44.360with how we can accelerate treaty resolution. There are some treaty negotiations, Ms. Ridgen,
02:12:49.140that have been going on, as you probably know, for decades. We need to solve it and we need to
02:12:53.460work with Indigenous leaders. There's incredible Indigenous leaders in non-profits, in the private
02:12:59.280sector in industry in academia we need to use that governance capacity to finalize treaties
02:13:05.920and build partnerships absolutely because the best way forward is success for indigenous peoples
02:13:11.600alongside their neighbors along this one point i think absolutely the solution has to be indigenous
02:13:20.960led and i think that's the starting point and for a long time we've seen that there's been a
02:13:25.120top-down approach that has to change it has to be indigenous people at the table but i want to talk
02:13:29.120just so we understand how severe this is,
02:13:31.820how the Indian Act is creating injustice
02:13:59.120I want to go back to what Mr. O'Toole has been saying, because he's very able at saying all the right things, but there are countless examples of him actually not living up to his words.
02:14:08.640We've seen him on a number of times during this campaign, but on indigenous issues specifically, he says we need to listen to indigenous peoples.
02:14:15.840Well, he proposed that he would raise the flags that are at half mass for the kids in unmarked graves in residential schools.
02:14:23.160And he didn't talk to or listen to any indigenous leaders when he made that decision.
02:14:28.380And that's something that is important and symbolic, but wouldn't cost a cent.
02:14:32.600How do we believe that he would be able to actually make the investment early necessary?
02:14:38.220I'm going to give Ms. Paul and Mr. Blanchett a chance to jump in.
02:26:41.840I made a straightforward promise to Canadians
02:26:43.560that we would have your backs, and that's what we did.
02:26:46.660During this pandemic, we were there to support people,
02:26:48.920but at the same time, we need to continue that.
02:26:51.000That's why we've put forward a $10 a day child care proposal that will save the average family in Toronto close to $10,000 more than Mr. O'Toole's approach on child care, which he would cancel.
02:27:04.200We also put forward a national housing plan that will invest $4 billion to work with municipalities to create 1.4 million homes.
02:27:13.560The housing crisis has gotten worse under you, Mr. O'Toole's plan on housing.
02:36:16.920We believe that transforming our own resources, natural resources, with our own clean energy in our regions of Quebec will create more wealth.
02:36:28.360This wealth will come from an environmental, I will get this word, environmental preoccupation as well.
02:36:37.580and we will do that and we should be entitled to do that with our part of the money that is being
02:36:43.240sent again and again in oil and gas. There's one thing I want to add, even if it's not exactly,
02:36:51.340I don't know if there's time eventually. Not really, but quickly, quickly, quickly. I will
02:36:55.400take a few of those seconds. Yes. Will we have some seconds to speak about French-speaking
02:36:59.920communities and Acadians? Well, not in this section. This is about cost of living, sir.
02:40:25.360We were able to lift a million people out of poverty and create a million jobs at the same time with the right kinds of investments over the past five years.
02:40:33.620And Mr. Trudeau, I have to I'm sorry, sir.
02:40:36.060I have to wrap you right there because it is now time for our next theme on COVID recovery.
02:40:41.620Rosie, thank you so much. Thank you very much.
02:40:44.100okay from saskatchewan ethan herman is standing by in saskatoon he's an undecided voter and he
02:40:57.860wants to hear from you about covid recovery hey ethan go ahead
02:41:02.340hey good evening leaders my question is this
02:41:08.020Coming out of this pandemic, how are you, if elected as Prime Minister, going to unify and drive Canada forward with respect to health care, jobs and the economy, and ensuring a higher quality of life is achievable for all Canadians, regardless of race, colour, creed, or sexual orientation?
02:41:28.020All right, leaders, you've heard from Ethan. Mr. O'Toole, you're up first.
02:41:31.400Thank you, Mr. Herman. That is exactly why I launched Canada's recovery plan on the first day of the campaign.
02:41:37.220We're going to create a million jobs in one year.
02:41:39.720We're going to clean up the accountability mess in Ottawa.
02:41:42.560We're going to have national leadership on mental health.
02:41:45.320We're going to be more ready for a pandemic, and we're going to get our finances under control.
02:50:22.800And in order to give them the care they need, the care they deserve, those responsible for those cares, provinces and Quebec should have without conditions because it is their responsibility, their knowledge, their expertise, the resources required.
02:50:45.060When the army came in Quebec, they did, they wrote a report afterward.
02:51:29.400Your pandemic recovery plan is uncoasted.
02:51:32.360You have no plan to balance the books, but you promised to pay for your expensive promises.
02:51:37.060New programs like Universal Dental Care with Taxing the Super Rich and Taxing Corporations.
02:51:42.100What specifically would you do to create the 1 million jobs you're promising and make sure Canada stays competitive?
02:51:50.760We have the only credible plan that's not going to cut help to Canadians, that's not going to put the burden back on the same people that have struggled.
02:51:59.220We're the only ones on this debate table that I can say clearly, we would tax the billionaires.
02:52:04.840We would make sure companies like Amazon start paying their fair share so we can invest in those new jobs, so we can invest in people.
02:52:12.100left to Mr. Trudeau or Mr. O'Toole, they are going to put the burden back on you. They've
02:52:16.560already started. Mr. Trudeau has already started by cutting the CRE, cutting help to people.
02:52:21.380But what new programs, sir, specifically? Well, I believe in making sure we invest
02:52:24.960in pharmacare, we invest in dental care, we invest in retrofitting homes and buildings.
02:52:29.700In doing this, we're going to lower the cost of living, help people save money,
02:52:33.280but also create jobs by investing in the future economy, the economy of the future.
02:52:37.640All right. Mr. Trudeau, to you. Only four months ago, you released a budget that was billed as a pandemic recovery program, a plan that had $101 billion of new spending. Since then, COVID numbers are up, growth numbers are down. Now you've got a new plan that adds $78 billion of new spending, essentially rendering your last budget out of date.
02:52:57.700How do Canadians trust that these new massive spending promises will not just keep growing in another few months?
02:53:04.080And what do you say to the next generation who say, how are we going to pay for this?
02:53:08.320First of all, I made a promise during this pandemic to have people's backs.
02:53:11.900Every time I came out of my house early on in the pandemic to talk directly to Canadians, I told them, I'd be there for you.
02:53:19.840And it wasn't just being there for people because we're nice, although, of course, we are.
02:53:24.120It was being there because that is the best way to ensure a strong recovery.
02:53:29.560Now, yes, our budget showed our ambition for this country, including with $10 a day childcare that Mr. O'Toole is planning on ripping up.
02:53:36.800But it also shows a responsible fiscal track.
02:53:40.400And even with our fully costed platform that is even more ambitious on the fight against climate change, on housing, on supports for people,
02:53:48.380the debt of our country as proportion of the GDP continues to decrease.
02:53:54.600Yes or no? Is it important to have a plan to balance the budget because you don't have one?
02:53:57.640It is important to stay fiscally responsible. And that's what we're doing. Our debt continues
02:54:01.840to decrease as a share of our GDP. Ms. Paul, to you now, you have not been clear if you support
02:54:08.480the need for vaccine passports or mandatory vaccines for federal workers or even mandatory
02:54:13.520vaccines for your own candidates. Given that the fourth wave is really a pandemic of the
02:54:17.880unvaccinated and threatening to overwhelm many health care systems, how do you justify not
02:54:23.600supporting the very measures that have proven to be most effective at increasing vaccination rates?
02:54:29.560Evan, we just filmed a video today asking everyone to get vaccinated. We have been unequivocal
02:54:34.500in our support for vaccinations. Mandatory vaccinations and vaccine passports.
02:54:41.000Well, again, you know, this is just a, you know,
02:54:44.280this is, again, where policy gets put aside
02:55:00.000And every single person on the stage has also said
02:55:02.540that, of course, there are going to be people
02:55:04.420who are not able to get vaccinated for certain reasons,
02:55:07.320and we have to reasonably accommodate them.
02:55:09.300We will always be guided by the science.
02:55:11.840We will never put partisan concerns ahead of public health.
02:55:15.720Mr. O'Toole, you promised a $60 billion increase in health care transfers over the next 10 years,
02:55:21.880but according to the Independent Parliamentary Budget Officer,
02:55:24.620it's actually only a transfer of $3.6 billion for the next five years,
02:55:29.360which is not much different than the status quo.
02:55:31.500But you also support private-public synergies, in your words.
02:55:34.720Can you specify here tonight exactly what kinds of private health care innovations you want to see more of?
02:55:41.220And if a province introduces more private health care, would you enforce the Canada Health Act by holding back any of your promised funding?
02:55:50.060I 100 percent support our public and universal system.
02:58:48.280That's a great question, Evan, because we didn't see the government adapt to the changing crisis.
02:58:54.420What we support and we all work together, the wage subsidy, the CERB, needed to be adapted as there were labor shortages in Quebec, as we can't find enough people for restaurants and service industries.
02:59:04.940We need to target the highly impacted sectors.
02:59:08.000That's what our plan, Canada's Recovery Plan, does.
02:59:10.460We get those service, tourism, restaurants back on their feet, get people working,
02:59:16.380and with keeping cases low, we can then wind down the other programs
03:06:59.400And then on top of it, they had this really, the format was so bizarre in that you had
03:07:04.580this situation where the moderator kept on going back to making sure that all five of
03:07:09.000the of the leaders got a fair enough say or at least were able to jump in but there was enough
03:07:13.720leeway that if a leader wanted to push through they could get more and more time Blanche at one
03:07:18.200point complained that Trudeau had spoken for four more minutes than him um which you know makes
03:07:23.240sense in that one of those guys is running for prime minister and that really allowed i think
03:07:28.240it really allowed um saying to sort of use the format to his advantage that he just jumped in
03:07:33.480all the time and everybody else kind of deferred to him and let him push through so especially in
03:07:39.500the you know the sort of last two-thirds of the debate it was really the Jagmeet Singh show now
03:07:43.860I don't think he's saying anything radically different the interesting thing is the NDP
03:07:47.920campaign in this election seems to be doing something they were not interested in doing
03:07:51.620not been interested in the past which is attack Justin Trudeau from the left um we'll see if it
03:07:56.800has any impact but Singh's in a battle to to hold on to his vote right we saw we saw on the poll we
03:08:02.500talked about earlier today, Candace, that as many as 20% of NDP and Green voters say they are very
03:08:10.780likely to vote Liberal to stop the Conservatives from winning. If Singh loses those votes, he's
03:08:15.120going to be right back down to more or less what he got in the last election. So he's got to show
03:08:19.960to those people that you can't just vote Liberal. That's really what it was about for him. We'll see
03:08:23.820over the next week whether he's successful or not. Well, I agree that Singh did a good job. He
03:08:27.460showed his personality, kind of came through, and you're right, he jumped in in ways that I wish
03:08:31.560Erin O'Toole would kind of push back more and part of it again was the moderator because a lot of
03:08:35.640times it would be like you know they do the two person back and forth and they wouldn't she wouldn't
03:08:41.140let the person respond and then she would just randomly go to someone else look I like I kind
03:08:45.020of like anime Paul I think that she has a nice personality she actually had some really strong
03:08:49.780moments in the campaign and she called Trudeau out for being a fake feminist right to your point
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03:08:54.600Hamish right in the beginning when everyone was paying attention and she talked about Jodie
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03:08:58.060Wilson-Raybould. I thought that was devastating to Trudeau because he couldn't really say anything.
03:09:01.740He didn't have anything to go back on. And so I don't begrudge her, but a lot of times she just
03:09:06.920wasn't really relevant to the conversation. I wanted to see more Trudeau versus O'Toole.
03:09:11.660And again, I thought that O'Toole really, in this one, earlier in the pre-show, I was complaining
03:09:16.300that in last night's French debate, I felt like there was just too much. They all agreed and
03:09:21.040there wasn't really a lot of interesting divergence of views. I felt differently tonight.
03:09:26.120I felt like Aaron O'Toole did a better job defending conservatism, that there were a few moments where he really was pushing back against this sort of mainstream narrative.
03:09:34.420But I just felt that overall, the debate just missed the mark in terms of the issues that Canadians care about.
03:09:41.040Like, we're in the middle of a pandemic.
03:09:42.820We have all these issues with small business owners, with people not being able to find employees,
03:09:48.500for people worried about the future of their industry, particularly folks in Western Canada.
03:25:05.140and that in some areas like English television and digital,
03:25:08.540We shouldn't see the government competing with the private sector that is trying desperately to innovate and hold on, particularly with advertising.
03:25:16.860So we'd like to see a modernization to see less of that competition, less government subsidizing newspapers and other organizations,
03:25:25.420taking that state competition out and making sure we support the creation of private sector content and creation.
03:25:34.340And let's try the phone line once again.
03:25:37.620operator is there a call on a question from the phone from the phone yes our first question
03:25:43.400tonight is from uh dylan robertson from winnipeg free press please go ahead your line is open
03:25:49.080mr otul why won't you tell us how many of your candidates are vaccinated
03:25:55.860as you know as you know i encourage all canadians to get vaccinated they're safe and effective for
03:26:04.100use, and I've been fighting for better access to supply, and I will respect personal decisions
03:26:09.320about health care, and we need to work together to overcome any questions that people may have.
03:26:15.500In fact, I was proud to work with Mr. Singh and the other leaders tonight to film a video talking
03:26:20.980about how important and safe vaccines are in our fight against COVID-19. What I haven't liked
03:26:26.320with Mr. Trudeau's pandemic election is this attempt to divide people when we should be
03:26:32.400working together in our fight against COVID-19.
03:26:35.860Operator, please, we'll take another question from the phone.
03:28:38.660It's the time to respect all provinces and that would be my approach.
03:28:45.000It's our time to work together and respect all provinces.
03:28:48.200We need to partner, particularly coming out of COVID-19, and respect provincial jurisdiction and try and come together to partner.
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03:28:56.780I think we need to fight against the decline of the French language.
03:29:01.220I think having French as the language of work, this is an area with Bill 101 and the federally regulated enterprises in the province.
03:29:09.360I think it's a matter of fairness that those large players like the banks and others take the same approach that medium-sized players do, making French the language of the workplace in Quebec.
03:29:20.260That's all the time we have. Thank you very much.
03:29:25.680And really, I thought that Erin O'Toole did a great job, but there's a couple things
03:29:37.720that I noticed. The first several questions were all about COVID and the economy, because
03:29:43.860those are the issues that Canadians care about. Unlike the debate where we focused on climate
03:29:47.380change, we focused on reconciliation, things that sure are important, but they're not the
03:29:52.300dominant issues in the campaign, it was interesting that even the journalists, even the out-of-touch
03:29:56.180journalists in Ottawa picked up on the issues that mattered to Canadians.
03:30:00.660I thought that O'Toole did a great job.
03:30:01.920He looked really comfortable, and, you know, he's confident.
03:30:06.400He's got his message, and he sticks to it, and I thought he did a great job there.
03:30:11.340Yeah, it is interesting that they focused on what was missing from the debate.
03:30:16.980They didn't hear answers during the debate, so it's just natural that they would ask.
03:30:22.300As you say, I just want to make one point because Andrew Lawton got a great question in there and it was great to have to North being able to ask that question.
03:30:34.080It wasn't, you know, an easy thing for us to have Andrew there.
03:30:37.120And the question he asked was, you know, what's the end point of this pandemic?
03:30:52.160And that's what I think is going to be interesting when we look at policies like vaccine passports, right, which we see are reasonably popular when you look at it on the polls.
03:30:59.820But I think that's based on a tacit belief that most people have that they're a temporary thing.
03:31:04.140Well, they'll have this vaccine passport until COVID is no longer a threat.
03:31:07.860If you say, well, it's going to have this vaccine passport for a significant length of time, probably could the popularity be lower.
03:31:13.780And Andrew's question is a very, very important one is what's the criteria for pulling back on all these restrictions?
03:31:20.100Right, because we need actual, like, an endgame here.
03:31:23.340It's like we keep having moving goalposts.
03:31:25.340And I think a lot of the reason that people agree to vaccine passports,
03:31:28.660I think, look, I think the vaccines are important.
03:31:30.540I think everyone should go and get them, that they're safe and effective.
03:31:34.120But the idea of the government trying to manage this passport system,
03:40:30.280Yeah, it's just, you know, it adds insult to injury.
03:40:37.120In theory, he's there because even though they run candidates in Quebec that, you know, what he says could be of interest to the Anglophones in the West Island of Montreal who, of course, vote, you know, like 3% of them vote for the bloc or 1% of them vote for the bloc or something.
03:40:52.120You know, so he's there, in theory, speaking to a group of people who, by their very nature, are very disinterested in what he has to say.
03:41:00.280The debates would clearly be better in a much more focused manner, but it's been a long
03:46:46.140And our approach has been unequivocal on this.
03:46:49.080We believe that people who have done the right thing, as almost 80% of Canadians have, and gotten vaccinated should be able to feel free from risk when they get on planes, when they get on trains, when they go into work.
03:47:05.920And that's why we're working as well with the provinces on vaccine credentials that will allow people to enjoy non-essential services without fearing that their kid, who is seven and therefore not able to get vaccinated, could be exposed to someone who is.
03:47:23.560We have to be very, very clear that we are a country of science in which millions of people have stood up to do the right thing for themselves and for their neighbors and continue to encourage that.
03:47:35.120It's unfortunate that Aaron O'Toole can't even get his own candidates to get vaccinated
03:47:42.260and pretends he wants 90% of Canadians to get vaccinated
03:47:46.540when he can't guarantee 90% of his candidates are vaccinated, as I said during the debate.
03:51:24.060Hi, Mr. Trudeau, Abigail Beeman, Global News.
03:51:27.060When your opponents criticized you tonight on Afghanistan, you gave a vague comment about helping to bring more people home.
03:51:33.060wondering with the news of 43 Canadians coming out of Kabul, whether there's anything specific
03:51:37.280you can offer about how many more Canadians are left to help, whether the government will send
03:51:41.580planes, or whether there's any news about commercial air flights being able to leave there again.
03:51:47.000As I've said, we have worked with our international partners on putting pressure on the Taliban to
03:51:52.980allow Canadians, permanent residents, and indeed anyone with Canadian travel documents to leave.
03:52:00.520And that's why over the past number of weeks, we've been talking with the Qataris specifically to enable facilitating Canadians leaving as they did just last night from Afghanistan.
03:52:13.520We know there is much more to do, not just to get Canadians out, but to get the tens of thousands of Afghans that Canada is determined to welcome to a new home, new life in safety.
03:52:25.440and Canadians quite frankly are excited about welcoming to their communities across the country.
03:52:32.160Thank you very much. Merci beaucoup. This is all the time we have.
03:52:43.520Interesting to see Justin Trudeau go up. He got two questions from independent media,
03:52:49.520so we had a sort of long-winded triple question from the rebel, the French reporter there,
03:52:54.960who asked this almost sounded like she was giving a speech but she was asking uh three distinct
03:52:59.840questions trudeau just basically said i'm not going to answer that i already told you why
03:53:04.400yesterday then the very next question came from kian bexy also an independent reporter also
03:53:10.000a member of the independent press gallery of canada he asked a question about china and it
03:53:15.440was really an interesting question because we don't really hear that much about the incident
03:53:19.600that happened in the winnipeg lab we know that there's something there and that we're not being
03:53:22.960he told it, but we don't really know. And so it was great to hear that question get put to Trudeau
03:53:28.060and he actually addressed it. He didn't really answer it because Trudeau doesn't really answer
03:53:31.220questions, but he didn't just completely say no to Kian Bextie and he answered it there. He seemed
03:53:37.880pretty calm and confident just looking at his demeanor. It seemed like he felt like pretty
03:53:42.380proud of himself and pretty good about his debate performance, just judging by his sort of smug
03:53:48.380arrogance. But that's Trudeau, right? He seemed really agitated and really bothered during the
03:53:52.560debate there. He seemed like he was back to his smug, arrogant self. And I just make one final
03:53:57.580note. He had to go there once again. We could have had a drinking game. We didn't. We totally
03:54:03.140dropped the ball tonight on the debate night drinking game. But if there had been a True
03:54:08.160North drinking game, there would have been two points where we would have drank. But every time
03:54:11.720Trudeau invoked the word Harper, which we got a Harper there. We got a couple of Harpers throughout
03:54:16.680the course of the debate. And then also every time he called Canadians racist. And he called
03:54:21.020Canadians racist, the ones that were protesting. So when, when there's angry conservatives is
03:54:25.640because they're racist. Exactly. You know, Trudeau, uh, he doesn't like being, being
03:54:30.940confronted in a, for, in a strong manner, right? That's why he, the debates, I think he got a
03:54:37.060little flustered in the debate, especially when there was two or three leaders coming out of it
03:54:40.560once and they were talking over each other. And it's why he doesn't really like the House of
03:54:43.820Commons. Uh, and he tries to avoid it as much as possible. Um, but press conferences, he quite
03:54:49.140likes him. Even questions from non-friendly reporters are generally not shouted in a way
03:54:54.180that sort of knocks him off his game. He can take his time, respond to them, and he certainly was
03:54:58.700much more sort of calm and collected here, even in the face of questions from non-friendly reporters
03:55:04.620than he was during the debate. And it's, you know, so that's one of the reasons why we have so few
03:55:10.100debates, right? You know, if Trudeau really loved debate or thought debate would add, we would have
03:55:15.660more, he would agree to more debates. He would have gone to the city TV debate in Toronto
03:55:22.020two years ago, or maybe he would have agreed to other debates. The Monk debates had talked
03:55:27.280about having a foreign affairs debate at one point as well. But he doesn't like that, and
03:55:31.900he knows he's on the defensive there, so that's why we don't have them, because he doesn't
03:57:59.680Mic number one, please. Sorry, mic number two.
03:58:03.100Hi, Mr. Singh. Olivia Stefanovic, CBC News.
03:58:05.820You were criticized in the debate for having a platform that lacks details.
03:58:10.700I'm wondering why that is. Why is your plan so general?
03:58:13.200And do you have any regrets about releasing a platform so early, even before this election was called, without the fine details for voters to read?
03:58:21.280Not at all. We laid out a plan, a vision of what we stand for.
03:58:25.880And our plan is, not surprisingly, a lot of the things that we fought for before because Mr. Trudeau didn't do them.
03:58:32.540We still believe that people should have access to medication and they shouldn't worry about how they can afford it.
03:58:37.540We believe strongly that people shouldn't have to worry about whether they can afford or have coverage to get dental cover, dental care.
03:58:45.440We absolutely believe that we need to make the ultra-rich pay their fair share.
03:58:49.040And these continue to be really pressing questions on the minds of lots of people who can't afford their medication, who can't afford dental care, and are worried about who pays for the recovery and who pays the price of this pandemic.
03:59:00.900We are the only party with a credible plan that says we're not going to cut the help
03:59:05.280that people receive, and we're not going to put the burden back on the people that have
04:07:30.220And they really, really, you know, if there's one group of people that it's totally socially acceptable to just say, like, the nastiest things about, it's these billionaires.
04:07:38.060And it's like, what are you going to do, take all their money?
04:07:39.960They're the ones that are, in many ways, leading these huge companies and leading the growth.
04:10:05.420Well, it's interesting, just to your point, that the NDP doesn't want to be too harsh on the Liberals because the NDP voters like them.
04:10:10.360There are several times in that debate where I heard Jagmeet Singh say that he liked the liberal plan or that the liberal had a good idea or that he agreed with it.
04:10:18.340And it's almost a little jarring watching a debate because you're so used to people saying, no, your plan's wrong.
04:10:24.100This is why my plan's better. And it was it was weird to see Singh do that a few times.
04:10:27.780But given that context you just gave, it kind of makes sense that at the end of the day, the NDP and the liberals agree on most things.
04:10:35.140It's just a matter of like, how are we going to get to these same end goals?
04:10:38.720Well, and not even how, but off just the timeline.
04:10:41.620Somebody once said NDPs are just liberals in a hurry, right?
04:10:47.660If the liberals say we'll do it in 10 years, NDPs say we'll do it in three, right?
04:10:50.800And that's the big difference to them.
04:10:52.440And I think that's a really interesting point, Candice, because he might agree with the liberal plan,
04:10:56.040and he often says he agreed with Trudeau's intentions, but not his record in actually getting there,
04:11:00.860which is, I think, where the NDP has clearly discovered that's their effective line of attack.
04:11:05.460We say we can't criticize Trudeau's intentions because our voters won't believe that he's a bad man not trying to do these things.
04:11:11.360But we can say he's been ineffective at delivering on the things that we care about.
04:11:15.320Right, and that was that great line that Singh just had, saying that, look, you could have been implementing a national, I think it was pharmacare that he was talking about, but instead you call this election.
04:11:25.380So, you know, you've been promising this thing for the last 30 years, and the liberals have, and Trudeau has in his political career.
04:11:31.420instead of going and implementing it and working with the NDP.
04:11:33.980This is a question that I wish that someone would have asked Jagmeet,
04:11:36.460and it's interesting because usually the legacy media is so interested in process questions,
04:11:41.380process questions, figuring out, you know, what's the strategic thing to do.
04:11:46.380I was surprised when no one asked him whether he would be willing to prop up another Trudeau liberal minority
04:11:50.700because given that that was what we just had, if Trudeau again wins a minority government,
04:11:55.260I think it will be a huge loss for the liberals.
04:11:57.020It will be a huge loss for Trudeau because he created this vanity election.
04:12:00.860He's spending, what, $650 million on this election.
04:12:03.940If the result is exactly the same, I think that that is a loss for Trudeau,
04:12:07.860and he should be shamed and probably removed from his office.
04:13:23.940I want to hear you talk a bit about the exchange you had with Mr. Blanchet.
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04:13:27.540As you noted earlier, you're the first racialized woman to wind up or to earn her way out of this debate stage.
04:13:36.760What was your reaction to sort of being hectored by the bloc leader over supposedly, I think in his words, as he said earlier, calling Quebecers altogether racist?