Juno News - July 08, 2026


Liberals shut down debate on Carney’s condo bailout

Mentioned
Mark Carney Richard Martel Berna Tom Pitfield App Store E. Forcing Ron Butler David Eby
What Carney’s $24B submarine deal means for Canada Ambassador Pete Hoekstra claims U.S. tariffs “improved” Canada’s position

Episode Stats


Length

14 minutes

Words per minute

155.89

Word count

2,282

Sentence count

135

Harmful content

Hate speech

4

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

Ron Butler, better known as the Mortgage Guy, describes himself as a big, old, overly opinionated, mortgage broker who is worried about the future of housing for average Canadians. Ron talks about the government's proposed $1.45B plan to buy 2,200 overpriced Vancouver condos, and why he thinks it s a bad idea.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00.000 The Conservatives are calling for a study into the Kearney government purchase of 2200 overpriced
00:00:11.640 Vancouver condos. They say it's a billion dollar bailout for developers, including
00:00:16.600 well-connected liberal backers, at the expense of taxpayers. Prime Minister Mark Kearney recently
00:00:22.940 announced a plan to bail out developers, bankers, and investors by using taxpayer dollars to purchase
00:00:29.200 more than 2,200 unsold condominium units in British Columbia.
00:00:34.080 B, this bailout will not make housing more affordable,
00:00:37.240 but will prevent a price correction from taking place,
00:00:40.420 preserving high prices for developers rather than lowering them
00:00:44.280 for British Columbians trying to enter the housing market.
00:00:47.080 C, questions remain about which ministers were lobbied and by whom
00:00:51.720 in the lead-up to this announcement.
00:00:53.820 D, questions remain about which developers and lenders will benefit from this bailout,
00:00:58.580 which condo units will be eligible, how prices will be determined, which financing tools
00:01:04.180 will be used, and which entity or entities will ultimately own the units.
00:01:09.080 E. Forcing home buyers to compete with their own tax dollars while raising housing prices
00:01:15.340 for the benefit of developers is not in the interest of Canadians.
00:01:19.840 And F. Prime Minister Mark Carney is building an economy of bailouts and handouts to Liberal
00:01:25.200 insiders while creating higher costs, debt, and taxes for everyone else.
00:01:30.340 Now, Carney himself has spoken about the potential losses facing those Vancouver developers.
00:01:35.680 Developers who helped raise money for Carney could be on the hook for huge losses given
00:01:42.060 the downturn in the Vancouver real estate market.
00:01:45.440 If the Liberals didn't campaign on this policy, why are they suddenly deciding to pursue it
00:01:50.860 now?
00:01:51.180 Whose idea was it?
00:01:52.160 Who lobbied for it?
00:01:53.060 is this being planned for more Canadian cities and maybe most importantly which
00:01:57.980 well-connected developers big banks and foreign investors stand to benefit the
00:02:02.880 most now I want to take a moment to share with the members of this committee a
00:02:07.220 particular dictionary definition that I just think describes the direction of
00:02:12.720 economic policy in Canada over the past year and I quote an economic system
00:02:18.240 where business success depends heavily on close ties between corporate
00:02:22.680 executives and government officials instead of competing in a free meritocratic market companies
00:02:30.040 thrive by securing political favors such as bailouts tax breaks subsidies or specialized
00:02:37.080 regulations that block competition that colleagues is the definition of crony capitalism and it does
00:02:44.280 increasingly in my view represent the official economic policy of the liberal party of canada
00:02:50.520 The committee's study would also look into whether Carney's former company, Brookfield Asset Management, might stand to benefit eventually from the government bailout.
00:03:01.140 A $1.45 billion purchase of the Vancouver units would see each unit sell for an average of $659,000 per condo.
00:03:11.760 Well, the Conservatives have lost another MP. This time it is Richard Martel quitting caucus to sit in the Senate.
00:03:19.400 Prime Minister Carney appointed Martel as an independent member of the upper chamber.
00:03:25.460 This post by Canada Proud, Conservative MP Richard Martel has decided to betray his constituents
00:03:31.900 and has resigned from his seat so he can accept a Senate appointment from Mark Carney.
00:03:39.180 Carney also appointed three others to the upper chamber, including his principal secretary, Tom Pitfield.
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00:04:50.400 special offers. Make sure that you're prepared. It's better to be safe than sorry. Our guest
00:04:55.720 today is Ron Butler, well known as the mortgage guy who has a podcast he's more than happy to
00:05:01.820 tell you a little bit about. He describes himself as a big, old, overly opinionated mortgage broker
00:05:08.300 who is worried about the future of housing for average Canadians.
00:05:12.180 Overly opinionated mortgage broker
00:05:14.520 who is worried about the future of housing for average Canadians.
00:05:18.360 Welcome to the show, Ron.
00:05:20.060 Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
00:05:22.640 All right, so the Liberals have shut down debate
00:05:24.660 over the proposed probe into the BC condo buyout plan.
00:05:29.100 I think a lot of us were hoping that that would move forward
00:05:32.340 so that we could have people like the condo king testify.
00:05:36.200 It looks like that's not going to happen, but I know you have some strong views about that bailout.
00:05:41.640 Can you elaborate?
00:05:45.560 Listen, I mean, bailing out condominium developers just makes no sense.
00:05:52.920 I mean, the idea that the BC government has put forward that they're going to take a great opportunity to buy condominiums below cost, below construction costs, and offer them to families as some kind of benefit on some kind of weird rent-to-own idea, it's not even rational.
00:06:16.820 It doesn't even make sense.
00:06:17.740 if these condos cannot be sold, then let the developer go into receivership and have the
00:06:25.120 receiver auction off these condos and achieve the actual lowest price. That's the way the
00:06:30.940 free enterprise system is supposed to work. And there's no sense in circumventing it. I mean,
00:06:36.760 it's just not rational. According to the premier of British Columbia, David Eby, I mean, these are
00:06:42.740 rock bottom prices, liquidation. I mean, the government's going to be getting these at prices
00:06:48.060 that are below the construction costs. I mean, he's saying we can't resist such a deal and then
00:06:54.860 make them affordable to make them available to Canadians who can't afford the market rates
00:07:01.180 currently. Well, then tell the truth and liquidate them. You know, get a receiver involved. I mean, 1.00
00:07:07.280 get get them put them on an open auction let's that's one way to get uh you know restrict the
00:07:13.320 auction to first-time home buyers i mean there is no way in the world that i would let the
00:07:19.340 provincial government of any province not even be let alone british columbia decide what rock
00:07:24.780 bottom pricing is like that is that is not an the right approach that's not a fair approach that's
00:07:30.840 not a sensible approach with taxpayers money let these units be auctioned off let's find out what
00:07:36.920 the real below construction cost price is let's just not have somebody in a provincial government
00:07:42.840 decide what it is well what does it say about the government that they frankly don't really want
00:07:48.320 those values to go down much more than they already have done and so by the actions that
00:07:54.240 they're taking they're essentially propping up these condo values currently aren't they
00:08:00.500 well you the right approach is always just to let free enterprise find its correct point but
00:08:08.420 the idea that a provincial government would buy one single unit of something a developer says
00:08:15.060 they're having a hard time selling is not rational it's it's it's not it's not free
00:08:22.660 enterprise. It's some kind of assistance being given to that developer. And that's wrong on all
00:08:32.180 accounts. Here's the main thing. Developers in British Columbia minted money for 20 years. They
00:08:39.000 made profit after profit after profit after profit. I don't believe that they contributed
00:08:44.940 any of the profits to affordable housing. They just took the profits. Okay. So now it's time
00:08:52.380 for them to pay the piper on bad investments.
00:08:55.960 And there's no way British Columbia or the federal government
00:08:58.980 should be involved in buying one single one of these units.
00:09:04.220 Could Toronto be next?
00:09:05.600 I mean, if they do it in Vancouver,
00:09:07.840 I mean, I'm sure that there are probably some developers that you know
00:09:11.220 that would say, hey, how about us?
00:09:15.440 Well, actually, they have done something.
00:09:17.800 They took a different approach, though,
00:09:19.660 a approach that's much more rational.
00:09:21.440 They said, okay, we're going to put on a HST holiday.
00:09:26.920 We're going to put on a tax holiday.
00:09:28.360 So we're going to use the money from the feds plus some provincial money,
00:09:31.680 and we're going to say there's no tax on the sale of construction properties.
00:09:39.200 So this does two things at once.
00:09:40.640 It does allow these developers to get out from under tax,
00:09:44.100 and therefore it's a more attractive offer for the condos they're stuck with.
00:09:47.460 But it also, and this is the important part, it also stimulates the building of some other kinds of new construction, which keeps construction workers working.
00:09:56.820 Like, the crazy part about BC is if you just buy the units, you're not creating any new construction.
00:10:02.640 There could be no construction of condos in BC for the next five years, and all those workers are out of jobs.
00:10:09.300 I mean, I give them credit.
00:10:10.960 The Ontario idea is a much better idea than just buying unsold condos.
00:10:17.460 Now, you've spoken about demographics and how aging boomers will soon be looking to sell a lot of these properties, people our age, you know, aging, getting older, and so they'll be looking for buyers.
00:10:30.840 And the people that are most likely to be interested are already saddled with massive debt.
00:10:37.580 How do you see that affecting the market going forward in the years ahead?
00:10:41.680 Well, it is a real demographic shift.
00:10:43.980 I mean, the boomers are the biggest group of age bracket of people in North America, hell, in Europe, for that matter.
00:10:51.160 I mean, it's a huge demographic.
00:10:53.440 And yes, their early boomers are entering their 80s.
00:10:57.620 I'm a young boomer, but eventually I'll be dead, too.
00:11:00.500 I mean, we'll all be dead.
00:11:01.560 I mean, that's just the way it goes.
00:11:03.160 And the houses will be sold or we'll need to go into care and the houses will be sold.
00:11:07.420 But it's going to be a little more gradual than people think. 0.99
00:11:11.240 Now, is it true the young people have too much debt? 1.00
00:11:15.120 Yes, of course it's true, absolutely true. 0.98
00:11:18.660 Could the prices fall?
00:11:20.260 Yeah, they could fall, but that's just commerce.
00:11:22.820 That's just the natural cycles of marketplaces.
00:11:26.700 Excuse me, I have no problem with that.
00:11:28.280 No problem at all with prices going down.
00:11:32.360 Well, there was this post by Shazi,
00:11:34.720 Canada's housing correction is now the largest on record.
00:11:38.820 I know that's that.
00:11:39.580 national home prices are down 20% from the 2022 peak.
00:11:44.760 But after inflation question mark,
00:11:47.160 they're down 29% erased back to roughly 2016 values.
00:11:52.700 This is no longer a Toronto problem.
00:11:56.400 It's a housing reset.
00:12:01.180 It's a housing reset.
00:12:02.880 I guess, how bad are things going to get market-wise?
00:12:06.120 thank prices will prices will continue to fall uh the main thing to understand is particularly
00:12:13.380 in ontario and particularly in ontario particularly in british columbia they're starting to fall in
00:12:18.440 quebec it's just starting right now it's just starting to come off in quebec prices are down
00:12:22.900 in calgary um all right i think this is only good news this is not cause for any worry um
00:12:30.820 you know it's it could be bad news for people who need to sell those homes who bought at the wrong
00:12:34.880 time. But the important thing to understand is it's a market cycle. I mean, in the United States,
00:12:41.200 in the world financial crisis, they did bail out the banks, but they didn't bail out a single
00:12:47.860 property owner, not one. So I see no reason why we would bail them out here. And I guess that
00:12:55.040 you're also looking at interest rates and the willingness of banks to lend to younger people
00:13:03.680 as well. Those are all factors, aren't they? They are, but interest rates are still relatively low.
00:13:09.240 We have all kinds of five-year fixed rate mortgages at 399, 404. Those are not high rates
00:13:17.620 in the scheme of things historically. And banks will lend. I mean, there is no qualified buyer
00:13:23.600 who wants mortgages turned down by a bank as long as the financials are right, the income is right,
00:13:29.960 the credit score is right. Banks are eager to lend. Banks are doing mortgages. The reality is
00:13:36.120 price. And the fact that today, even in British Columbia and Ontario, in many regions, it's still
00:13:44.080 seven, eight, nine times family income is what the price of homes are. But when boomers bought
00:13:51.280 those homes, it was two and a half times income. So these younger families are at a disadvantage
00:13:57.380 still. How do people access your podcast? Angry Mortgage Podcast on YouTube and Spotify,
00:14:05.560 Apple Store, all the places you want to go for the podcast, the Angry Mortgage Podcast.
00:14:10.900 YouTube gets a little bit more action. There's more videos on YouTube. And by all means,
00:14:17.500 we'd love for people to subscribe. Thank you so much for coming on the show,
00:14:21.560 ron appreciate it thank you if you enjoyed the show consider supporting great independent
00:14:27.800 journalism by becoming a premier member of juno news please go to junonews.com
00:14:32.760 backslash straight up you can find the link below it helps us do what we do thank you so much for
00:14:37.720 tuning in.