Juno News - Mainstream media gets crushed in Munk debate

00:00:00.000 hello and welcome to you all this is another edition of fake news friday here on true north

00:00:15.240 swimming through the blizzard of lies trying to make sense of it all and having a little bit of

00:00:19.680 fun in the process i am andrew lawton joined as always by harrison faulkner harrison how was the

00:00:26.100 week pretty good andrew i mean we've got some we've got some hilarious stories to get into some

00:00:30.340 just i i would say pretty emblematic of the state of legacy media right now so it's going to be a

00:00:36.260 good show but all in all a pretty good week we're kind of coming down off the emergencies act hearings

00:00:40.620 which uh is a welcome relief coming down you talk about it like it was just some big prolonged acid

00:00:46.540 trip but uh it might have been better and more tolerable if it were i i think we're going to

00:00:51.620 start with a bit of a victory lap here because i i think we can claim some vindication even not true

00:00:57.560 north directly but i think in general the issues that we talk about with this debate that took place

00:01:03.320 uh wednesday night in toronto the monk debate which if you've never been they're very well put together

00:01:08.220 they debate really key issues they bring out good people and the debate was on the following resolution

00:01:15.180 be it resolved don't trust mainstream media are advocating for the motion douglas murray and

00:01:23.220 matt tabby against it malcolm gladwell and michelle goldberg now the debate itself you think okay what's

00:01:30.900 the big deal so what monk debate does when you go there everyone is pulled on what they believe

00:01:36.880 on the motion when people walked in pro so in favor of don't trust mainstream media 48 con 52 so a pretty

00:01:48.300 even split the final vote when they all left after the debate had taken place pro 67 con 33 so the way

00:01:59.180 you measure success in a monk debate is not by your final tally but by the swing from the first tally

00:02:05.520 to the end so by the end of it people were resoundingly in favor of this idea that the

00:02:10.680 mainstream media cannot be trusted i mean it's it's it's just a perfect visualization andrew those

00:02:17.300 graphics i think that of what we're seeing right now why why we're seeing groups like true north

00:02:23.180 grow and why we're seeing so much distrust in the legacy media it's because even even when even when

00:02:28.620 legacy media advocates are forced to try and defend themselves forced to try and you know say to a group

00:02:33.240 of people well yeah you know we know that people don't trust us anymore but here's you know maybe

00:02:37.660 why you should compared to these online news outlets it's obvious that they're just losing their grip

00:02:43.020 their control in the narrative and it's it's just perfect and i mean the the monk debate social media

00:02:48.300 account pulled quotes from the evening and i just want to read a couple of them because it kind of shows

00:02:53.300 you i mean i wish it was there it just shows you what the what the what the argument was for people

00:02:58.500 who were trying to defend the legacy media it was it was almost embarrassing i mean the best one of

00:03:03.600 the best quotes that they had all night i guess for the defense of legacy media came from michelle

00:03:09.200 goldberg the new york times the new york times columnist and she said the mainstream media has

00:03:13.540 gotten the big things right i'm sorry but last i checked throughout most of covid they didn't get

00:03:20.320 most they got most of that wrong uh freedom convoy in canada they got most of that wrong how much

00:03:25.520 have they gotten wrong hunter bides's laptop laptop story deliberate deliberate subversion of it the

00:03:30.640 exactly the entire trump russia scandal which turned out to be a nothing burger they were rolling they

00:03:36.420 were rolling with that for years so for them to basically say of the new york times the new york

00:03:41.340 times columnist standard to say we got the big things right it's it's embarrassing almost it's

00:03:46.480 embarrassing and if that's if that was their argument and this is the result of it clearly it

00:03:50.480 didn't fly in the room and just take a look at some of these quotes as well douglas murray who's from

00:03:53.840 the uk he's great commentator he came in and just basically laid it out for everyone in the canadian

00:03:58.300 audience just said your mainstream media is funded by the government a totally corrupted system and

00:04:04.100 basically the best that your side has been able to come up with so far tonight is to say we get

00:04:09.000 things wrong quite often but you should trust us anyway so that's exactly that's basically it that's

00:04:14.200 all they that's really all they can offer andrew it's embarrassing yeah i i wasn't able to see the

00:04:19.280 whole thing live unfortunately so i'm going to watch the video when it's posted but a friend of

00:04:23.740 mine who was there said that douglas murray actually talked about the freedom convoy in his comments and

00:04:28.860 talked about how there was this divide between people that were reporting on the narrative they

00:04:34.100 wanted to be true and those that actually went out and talked to people people like rupa subramania

00:04:39.460 people like you and i and a lot of others from from different independent media outlets and the thing that

00:04:44.940 was interesting and i i don't want to generalize too much here but the monk debate is a downtown

00:04:49.620 toronto event it attracts a lot of downtown toronto elites now they're obviously a type of elite that is

00:04:57.000 okay to go into things with an open mind but if you think of that context of it the vote swing is

00:05:01.940 particularly important so this was like a group of downtown well-to-do toronto types that by the end

00:05:08.040 of it were saying two two to one yeah we don't really trust the mainstream media no exactly that's that's

00:05:14.480 that's an important note to make i mean the monk debates are not are not you know i i would say

00:05:19.260 likely it's not like the rebel news live event i was no exactly like it's not a really hard and

00:05:24.420 fast like dyed in the wool like independent media rah rah uh group it's a group that is typically very

00:05:31.800 much in that not laurentian elites but certainly the toronto elite category well yes andrew they are

00:05:36.600 the globe and mail readers they are the cbc lovers i mean i think that's a pretty safe assumption

00:05:40.920 to make and for douglas murray and for matt taibbi who matt taibbi is is an amazing journalist i have

00:05:46.320 to say he's he you really can't pin him down one side or the other he just tells it like he sees it

00:05:51.060 that's a very uh it's a valuable asset to have as a journalist today because it's so it comes so far

00:05:56.140 and few between but uh uh you know that that's a really important note to make the monk debate was

00:06:01.060 not full of you know i would say i don't think it was 100 true north uh readers andrew uh like i said i

00:06:06.820 think it's more globe and mail cbc readers uh legacy media legacy media types who were there for

00:06:13.340 an interesting conversation and i think they really got something that was that was you know

00:06:16.940 worth noting i mean look it was another quote that's from malcolm gladwell in this that basically

00:06:21.660 said again you just got to look at the social media account to see the quality of arguments that

00:06:27.100 were being made you could see douglas murray and matt taibbi really getting to the point bringing up

00:06:30.680 key examples of failure in the legacy media and then the legacy media defenders were trying to just

00:06:35.360 you know make these grand statements and say well it's not like as apparently malcolm gladwell said

00:06:39.740 it's not like there are a bunch of uh legacy media journalists getting into a room in the morning

00:06:44.140 and discussing what the narrative is i mean i actually think that is what it is maybe i'm not

00:06:48.620 maybe it's not true but i i i don't get i don't get a front row seat into the you know globe mail

00:06:53.160 editorial in the morning uh editorial meeting but i am pretty sure actually that they do have a

00:06:58.380 narrative andrew they do stick to that narrative and they just don't report things that don't that

00:07:02.320 don't go in line with it i mean it's pretty obvious that's the case yeah and you know i will say that

00:07:07.660 one of the great things about the monk debates is that people that go there generally speaking i i

00:07:12.020 think have at least a tolerance for the other side and and this swing that we're seeing here has

00:07:17.840 happened before there was the famous one i can't remember how long ago it was maybe five five six

00:07:22.820 years ago between mark stein and nigel farage on one side and louise arbour and simon shama on the other

00:07:28.880 and they were debating refugee policy and like the room was stacked against mark stein and nigel

00:07:34.020 farage but by the end of it the room had come around to their side because certain things when

00:07:39.000 people hear the facts and they hear them laid out they realize there really isn't a compelling

00:07:44.580 argument for it and i think that line that douglas murray gave is quite a strong one that

00:07:49.120 yeah we're saying you're saying that you keep getting it wrong but we should keep trusting you

00:07:53.060 anyway and michelle goldberg's view well yeah we get the big things so you gotta but even then you

00:07:58.400 don't but even if you did that's hardly the selling point you think and i think one of the

00:08:03.900 challenges here is that we're seeing increasingly this line that some people attempt to draw between

00:08:09.860 official or so-called real media and alternative and independent media and we saw this in a round

00:08:17.100 table that the public order emergency commission hosted this week and you can take a look at the

00:08:22.300 clip of this one particular comment here so what we've seen is that more and more extremists extremist

00:08:31.540 groups use what we call alternative media my colleagues were talking about the social media

00:08:37.480 but more and more what we see are fringe social media that are emerging and i don't want to advertise

00:08:44.980 any of them so i'm not going to give you specific names they were extremely present during the convoy in

00:08:50.220 ottawa and we saw journalists and so they're self-made journalists because anybody can proclaim that

00:08:57.600 they themselves a journalist using these platforms and so and they were producing re-information or

00:09:05.840 alternative information on the events so they were saying there were 100 000 people but you've seen

00:09:11.820 the police reports even on a big day there were about 10 000 people in ottawa and so that kind of

00:09:18.280 that's the kind of information manipulation we see but that is a direct result of the distrust of

00:09:25.420 official media but it's now widespread within the general public and public so these alternative media have

00:09:34.660 emerged and some have a lot of followers hundreds of thousands of followers with and they appear just as

00:09:44.900 credible as mainstream media with reporters on site on the ground so i think i wouldn't call it a war but

00:09:54.180 there there there's definitely a rivalry between these alternate media and mainstream media and of course

00:10:02.660 these media need funding and they do have access to substantial funding so i mean what he's saying there

00:10:08.020 and this is a university of sherbrooke professor who's on a harmful online content advisory board so i think

00:10:14.660 the bias is probably pretty inherently visible there but what he's saying is that extremist groups use

00:10:23.140 alternative media so anything that's independent anything that's not on the government payroll is just some

00:10:28.980 tool of radicals yeah and then in that clip you can see as well he makes the point about the the growing

00:10:36.180 rivalry between alternative media and legacy media and how these not not much of a rivalry if the monk

00:10:42.260 debate results are to be well that's exactly right and just i i would be so interested if we were able to

00:10:46.900 take this question and and and take it outside of the downtown toronto you know sort of global mail cbc

00:10:53.300 sphere of influence and really get a real consensus from canadians about what they feel i mean i am

00:10:57.860 absolutely not i'm not i'm not afraid of those results but i have to say i bet you some of the

00:11:01.860 legacy media would be it's interesting to note though he says that there's a rivalry between the

00:11:05.540 alternative media and the legacy media and then he makes the point about how these alternative media

00:11:09.780 sites they have some really have a large following they have a really large following and then

00:11:13.380 and then he also makes the point injury which is i thought to be very interesting he says they appear

00:11:18.580 like legacy media journalists because they have reporters on the ground on the scene and you were

00:11:24.340 at you were at the freedom convoy i was at the freedom convoy and rebel were at the freedom convoy

00:11:28.260 lots of independent media were there among thousands of citizen journalists who were there with their own

00:11:35.700 cameras telling the truth not with the giant tv broadcast camera the producer the cameraman the uh the

00:11:43.860 the the the other producer and then the journalist the bodyguard right exactly you know we didn't need

00:11:49.060 a four-person team to just tell the truth and the legacy media did and i think what's really going on

00:11:53.620 here is there's a there's a kind of a growing concern from whether it be academia these legacy media

00:12:00.740 journalists about the fact that they once were able to have confidence that everyone who saw the world

00:12:07.540 through their eyes everyone who thought the same thing about the country they could they could basically

00:12:12.820 control who was a journalist and the idea that the idea that people who were you know maybe not from

00:12:17.940 the not from you know the the universities not from the big media which could potentially be journalists

00:12:23.940 scares them and they want to do everything they can to villainize them to to basically say that they

00:12:28.820 they attract extremists they're not telling the truth he says they manipulate the information

00:12:34.020 that to me tells a lot about the fear that these people have on their on the narrative that they

00:12:39.460 they they no longer have access to the complete control of the narrative because groups like true

00:12:43.860 north other independent media outlets and just the citizen himself with his camera are now doing a

00:12:49.140 better job of telling the truth that speaks volumes to me yeah and i mean i would just say to close on

00:12:53.300 this it's not a left-right issue as well there are lots of people on the political left that i i think

00:12:58.100 are also increasingly tiring of the mainstream media narrative which is why when i say independent media it's not

00:13:04.260 about conservative media i want more voices i want more people in this space so that consumers of

00:13:09.380 media can decide things for themselves and i think a case in point of this is this associated press

00:13:15.700 article which ctv picked up in a number of outlets around the world about china's covet approach now let me

00:13:22.820 first off say that when you look at all these protests that are taking place in china right now

00:13:27.460 people are protesting policies that are rooted in china's zero covet approach this view that the chinese

00:13:33.620 regime has that one covet case is too many so they're using this to lock people in their homes

00:13:39.620 to do these incredibly draconian and orwellian crackdowns to keep covet passes and vaccine mandates

00:13:46.500 and passports going almost indefinitely and the headline china's zero covet limits saved lives but there's

00:13:54.740 no clear exit so yeah it's great at saving lives but the problem is that they don't have an off-ramp

00:14:00.820 for it nothing else is wrong with it if they put in an end date it would all be fine is what they're

00:14:04.980 saying this goes right to the heart andrew of why so many people are just sick and tired of the legacy

00:14:10.660 media i mean they couldn't if you read this article it really just it really just uncovers a lot about

00:14:16.980 what what's really going on behind the legacy media narrative they they first talk about how you

00:14:21.140 know the zero covet policy of literally putting you forcing you to stay in your apartment in your

00:14:26.100 massive high-rise building for months on end you know not being able to leave in in some cases

00:14:32.100 welding your doors shut in in china i mean there are videos all over social media of of the chinese

00:14:37.940 police welding doors to apartments shut so that you can't leave it's tyrannical it's completely insane

00:14:44.020 with their whole idea of trying to basically like you said stop any any case of covet from entering the

00:14:49.540 country it's never going to happen everyone knows that it's a failed policy but they're doing it anyway

00:14:53.460 so the article rides along the chinese protest um interest that's going around around the world

00:14:58.900 everyone's trying to pay attention to what's going on so this article picks it up and says well yeah

00:15:02.900 the zero code policy it saved lives according to the chinese communist party data which again if you

00:15:08.900 take the communist party data uh you take that data at your own at your own peril i mean i i i don't think

00:15:15.140 you should trust that data for a second they apparently had the low the article pump pumps up the chinese

00:15:20.820 zero cover policy as well saying well china's policy had the resulted in the lowest deaths per capita

00:15:26.260 in the world i mean i don't believe that for a second personally i'll leave that up to you the

00:15:29.860 viewer to decide what you want to take of it but then at the very end of the article at the very bottom

00:15:34.500 of the article they kind of let the truth slip and it ends up just being becoming an advertisement for

00:15:39.540 pfizer and moderna vaccines who could have guessed andrew just look at this paragraph at the end here

00:15:44.100 dr barat pencania an infectious diseases expert at the university of exeter said china should

00:15:49.780 import mrna vaccines made by pfizer and and moderna uh sounds a lot like an advertisement

00:15:56.340 for the vaccines i have to say i mean it is pretty brazen and then and then at the end he also says

00:16:02.020 this should not be about saving face the chinese population is clearly fed up with lockdown after

00:16:06.260 lockdown and the quickest way out is to immunize as fast as possible so there you go andrew who could

00:16:11.140 have guessed actually the policy is just to vaccinate and not to actually just call out what's really

00:16:15.940 going on which is tyrannical covid policy that the chinese people are clearly fed up with yeah it also

00:16:21.140 forgets that like all these western countries like canada that said you would vaccinate vaccinate your

00:16:26.260 way away from restrictions kept restrictions in place long after the vaccination rate got saturated to

00:16:32.980 you know well over 80 pushing 90 so absolutely absurd and it's terrible that the media is not seeing

00:16:39.700 through this i mean you could save a life but if while saving a life you are trampling on everyone's

00:16:44.980 civil liberties and making that life not worth living which is what china is doing you're not

00:16:49.380 actually able to claim a win in my view on this but absolutely shameful that chinese propaganda

00:16:55.140 finds such an easy home in legacy media outlets uh we go to a bit of a fun more fun one here a

00:17:02.580 legacy media journalist went clothing shopping harrison yes andrew he went he went he went christmas

00:17:08.020 shopping tried to get in on the early uh deals he found himself and i i really do feel bad for glenn he

00:17:13.620 he had to he had to withstand some serious some serious uh danger here he went to one of the

00:17:19.460 outlets just outside ottawa and take a look at what he was faced with i mean the absolute horror andrew

00:17:24.660 the absolute horror of seeing an underarmor sweater with the word wait for it freedom with a canada flag

00:17:32.260 andrew i mean it's it's bordering on hate speech this is the kind of stuff i think that c11

00:17:37.780 the online uh all this legislation the online hate speech bill that's going to come through

00:17:42.660 this is the kind of stuff that we need to censor because it's just too much to handle andrew yeah

00:17:47.380 so this is a glenn mcgregor ottawa journalist went to the i don't know if it's tanger or tanger or

00:17:54.500 tangier maybe it's in algeria i don't know he went to this tanger outlet store outlet mall in canada

00:18:00.260 which is a suburb of ottawa he is uh there he sees this and doesn't actually comment on why it

00:18:08.820 troubles him he he plays it very smart he just posts the tweet he plays it straight and then

00:18:14.260 everyone immediately jumps on him as though he he's effectively triggered by the word freedom now

00:18:19.700 here's the thing glenn mcgregor covered the convoy so i assume that what he's seeing there is that

00:18:25.780 perhaps this is a nod by under armor to the freedom convoy but the reality is the under armor

00:18:32.260 freedom campaign has nothing to do with the convoy nothing to do with canadian politics

00:18:38.020 it is actually about veterans it is a veterans initiative proceeds from the sale of under armor

00:18:44.740 freedom products go towards veterans who are fighting for freedom but glenn shares this and here's

00:18:51.540 just some of the response that he gets uh terry hagan writes wow they just lost my business uh

00:18:57.460 ms t mick says what honestly i have to throw out so much now uh and bellissimo says never buy from that

00:19:05.460 company again now whether these people were under armor customers to begin with i have no idea but the

00:19:11.300 point is is that now people are whipped up into a frenzy based on what is a misrepresentation tacitly

00:19:18.180 anyway of what this thing was because i don't have an easy time believing it was just being shared

00:19:23.940 because he liked the pattern that was on it i think the libs of tick tock response was my favorite here

00:19:29.940 this is hate speech literally shaking did you survive yes no exactly i mean that's all you can

00:19:35.620 really do when you look at something like this it's absurd andrew and i mean it's it's we've reached

00:19:40.660 a point now where the legacy media glenn mcgregor being one of being one of the one of the main

00:19:46.500 offenders in my opinion because of the convoy have been so shaken that the sight of the canadian flag

00:19:53.780 and we know this to be true because the legacy media write articles about the canadian flag all

00:19:57.220 the time the canadian flag being a symbol of hate being seen as a as a freedom convoy symbol it's a

00:20:02.340 negative thing the sight of the canadian flag is is is horrifying to some of these people let alone

00:20:09.540 andrew even worse the word freedom on top of the canadian flag i mean you can't even you can't even

00:20:14.660 begin to imagine how how horrifying it must be for these legacy media journalists but think about

00:20:18.500 this this all goes back to the conversation we started the show off with about legacy media and

00:20:24.180 independent media i have not i i don't for a second believe that the canadian public seeing the word

00:20:30.820 freedom and the canadian flag are triggered are are you know are hit with uh hit with a tsunami of

00:20:37.700 phantom honking andrew that they can't they can't handle themselves i mean i don't believe that to be a for a

00:20:42.500 second but legacy media journalists who created their who created their sort of their information

00:20:47.380 silo where they really believe this stuff they believe the fandom honking they believe the fact

00:20:51.220 that the canadian flag is seen as this as they believe that freedom is now this fringe ideal right

00:20:56.580 exactly they literally believe this stuff and that then that becomes their reality that becomes their

00:21:02.580 truth and there's just no way there's no way that that is what that is what the majority of canadians

00:21:07.620 really think of when they see the word freedom there's no way that that's what the majority of canadians

00:21:11.460 think of when they see the canadian flag but you know it takes a certain person i really do believe

00:21:16.260 this to be triggered by the word freedom and a canadian flag so much so that they'd be willing

00:21:22.100 to embarrass themselves by posting it on social media um you know he didn't add context but like you said

00:21:27.300 we all know what he's getting at here it takes it takes a certain level of of complete you know removal

00:21:34.340 from i believe the normalcy uh real life reality to be willing to post something like this totally

00:21:43.460 absurd ridiculous and honestly what else can you do other than laugh and just say you know you hope

00:21:48.580 that uh you hope someone like glenn can recover one day from this horrifying experience

00:21:54.580 yes indeed and you know what we always have the quiet comfort of cbc to get us through the tough

00:22:00.980 moments harris why don't you take the lead on this one because i still haven't been able to figure out

00:22:04.260 what on earth is happening well for those of you that saw ratio yesterday i i brought this up as the

00:22:09.220 ratio of the week award the the cbc gem which is the streaming service you have to pay more for

00:22:15.620 because the 1.2 billion dollars that we all pay the cbc isn't enough to get if you felt they need more

00:22:21.140 of your money there is an option and to access such gems as this i mean you have to take a look at this

00:22:26.820 i won't even bother to try and explain it all you got to do is just watch it it's less than a minute

00:22:31.300 do your best we hope that you stick around after the next 56 seconds to hear our commentary on this

00:22:36.100 because it is a bit it is a bit difficult but watch this sabi are you listening to me sabi are you

00:22:44.500 listening to me totally then they said they're open to deepening their relationship with me at

00:22:51.060 other galleries in the foreseeable future and i was like what does that mean are these chia vulvas so

00:22:57.300 there i am thinking i'm getting a very subtle brush off and then they offer me are you ready

00:23:04.020 yep you seem weird i'm not you sure yep berlin they offered you the city in germany

00:23:12.340 duh that's russian to work at a gallery in the queerest city in the universe germany literally

00:23:18.500 legalized a third gender option on birth certificates can you imagine curating there

00:23:22.900 while paid internship being there sabi i'm gonna have the most delicious orgy god is like good yeah

00:23:29.860 totally allahu akbar so andrew i mean uh that is uh that is comedy in the eyes of canada's state

00:23:37.860 broadcaster they've got 1.2 billion dollars to work with some of that assume some of that i presume goes

00:23:43.380 to salary some of that i presume goes to their news coverage which is pitiful but you have to imagine a

00:23:48.260 good amount of money goes to the comedy uh wing of the cbc um and this is what they come up with

00:23:56.100 a story a comedy bit about chia vulvas if i'm getting that right the show is called sort of

00:24:04.340 and the dialogue where they where they kind of just slip in the the germany being the queerest

00:24:09.300 country in the world they legalized a third gender on the birth certificate and how this woman says

00:24:15.220 i'm going to germany god is like a great and then the other person says alahu akbar like oh my god

00:24:21.140 it's so hilarious i mean that's just just brilliant stuff and you're totally totally brilliant and uh

00:24:28.420 i mean i'm not even going to try and bother to add even more context just i actually i actually love

00:24:33.060 this in a way and the point that i made on twitter when i saw this is that you know everyone jumps up and

00:24:37.780 down on pierre polyev for talking about defunding the cbc but i feel cbc makes the most compelling

00:24:43.460 arguments for defunding the cbc when they publish stuff like this so here's the thing i'm not actually

00:24:49.860 a prude i don't care about chia i believe volvae is the proper plural if my latin is correct it's you know

00:24:57.540 v-u-l-v-a-e although that probably is not the most important point about it all in any case

00:25:04.500 i feel like like i don't actually care about the bid i i care that canadians don't have to

00:25:11.780 support it or not support it like they do with any private sector thing like if true north for

00:25:16.740 example were to pivot from fake news friday and the andrew lawton show and ratioed and instead do

00:25:23.460 something like this the audience would be the one that had to decide if it was worth supporting us

00:25:28.980 in continuation or not cbc fails or succeeds uh ratings wise it doesn't matter they still keep

00:25:37.460 getting the money and typically they get more of the money so uh take from that what you will and

00:25:42.820 know that the queerest gallery in the world has chia volva so maybe that was actually the reboot of the

00:25:49.700 national you never know uh that does it for us you can catch harrison on ratioed you can catch me on

00:25:55.140 the andrew lawton show and you can catch us both next week on fake news friday thank you and have

00:26:00.100 a great weekend

Juno News - December 02, 2022

Mainstream media gets crushed in Munk debate

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