Juno News - October 08, 2021MLA urges Albertans to vote ‘yes’ to end equalization
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Summary
On October 18th, Albertans will be voting on whether they want to end equalization with Ottawa. In this episode of the Andrew Lawton Show, Andrew talks to Independent MP Drew Barnes about the importance of the vote and what it means for the future of equalization.
Transcript
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We've been given a fair bit of attention in the last few weeks
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to the upcoming equalization referendum in Alberta
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And I would say just before we get into the discussion here,
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there's not been a lot of coverage of it at all,
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but even so, a lot of the problems we've been talking about for years
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about Western alienation, a growing independence movement,
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a lot of these are going to be assessed in this referendum,
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whether they think equalization should be removed from the Constitution.
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Obviously, a bit of an uphill battle getting that adopted by the federal government,
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He's an independent, but previously sat in the UCP caucus
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And we've talked to him about that in the past.
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So let's start set the stage here for this referendum.
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Is this kind of the be all and end all of the independence fight right now?
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Or is it just one of many tools that should be looked at by Albertans?
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It's a necessary first step for over 80% of Albertans that want a fairer deal with Ottawa.
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Yes, for some of them, that fairer deal is independence.
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But for most, it's about the opportunity to have a fair deal,
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more economic freedom for their families and their communities.
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Hey, let's not forget that since 1965, Alberta has sent $650 billion to Ottawa.
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Most of it gets redistributed to Quebec and the Maritimes.
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And equalization has become the buzzword for all of the inequities,
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whether it's unfair treatment in the Supreme Court, the House of Commons, the Senate,
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The average everyday Albertan is upset and realizes this is the first step.
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Is your sense that the Jason Kenney government is having this referendum
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to sort of check the box and say, yeah, we're listening?
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Or do you think they actually want this to succeed?
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And the reason I ask that is because I have not heard a lot of advocacy
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And I've not really heard any encouragement from the government, by and large,
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You know, Jason Kenney's been totally invisible.
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He's not getting behind his own referendum to vote yes to end equalization,
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take equalization out of Clause 36, Subsection 2.
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You know, maybe it's because his popularity is so low.
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In Alberta, Andrew, his popularity is less than even Justin Trudeau's.
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But it's unexplainable how this is his referendum.
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But, you know, I don't know his rationale for that.
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But I do know what Albertans are saying to me in the coffee shop.
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Most of them are saying it's time to push for a fair deal with Ottawa.
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It's time to push for pipelines and resource movement.
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And if we can't get that, second, they'll decide how they will hold Ottawa accountable.
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One of the concerns that I've heard from a lot of people that are on your team on this,
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they want equalization over, is that because there's not been a lot of discussion about
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this referendum, because a lot of Albertans don't know what's happening or don't necessarily
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know the stakes of it, it could have a very underwhelming turnout or it could fail.
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And I'm curious what the implications of that would be at the risk of putting the cart
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If this doesn't have an overwhelming showing that is lining up with yes, what's that going
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to mean for the people that have been talking about these issues that you've just brought
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We've seen a lot of people that believe in big, big government say that this is the
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opportunity to come out and vote to keep equalization, just to send a strong signal against Jason
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Kenney and how so many Albertans feel he hasn't met expectations.
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But Andrew, I will say this, and I'm so grateful for all the volunteers in the third-party
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advertiser that have asked me to work with him, vote yes to end equalization.
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Bill Buick and another PAC has worked hard to get the message out.
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When I talk to Albertans, they know that this is a crucial first step to increase economic
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freedom, increase prosperity for Alberta families and communities.
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And Andrew, let's not forget it's good for Canada.
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When Alberta's strong, you know, we pay lots of taxes.
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This is a necessary step to make Alberta free and prosperous, and if Canada wants, bring
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One of the things that's come up in the past with the Alberta independence discussions,
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and not secession, but asserting more independence and autonomy as a province, is that there are
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a number of things that provinces could do unilaterally, like launch an Alberta police force,
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launch an Alberta pension plan, basically recreate a lot of the Quebec sovereignty measures.
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But in Alberta, and this is not something that depends on equalization as directly, and
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I think that these are still things you'd agree should be pursued by Alberta, regardless
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Alberta having its own pension plan would be a $3 billion net benefit to Albertans.
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So, you know, seniors right now, they can't afford to pay their utilities.
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We could give them a decent retirement benefit, or we could have lower premiums for employees
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Our own police force, I mean, God bless the individual RCMP officers, but they're so overtaxed
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And, Andrew, let's not forget that it's almost 21 years since the famous Alberta agenda letter,
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you know, called the firewall letter, penned by Stephen Harper, Ted Morton, Ken Boozencall,
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And it's time to gain this leverage with Ottawa that, you know, we want equality, we want
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fairness, or we want to look at things differently.
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And yeah, absolutely, whatever the outcome of the vote Yaston equalization referendum on
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October 18th, all those Alberta agenda items need to be pursued and implemented.
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Let's talk about equalization specifically, because the constitutional amendment being sought
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would basically take that section out of the Constitution that requires equalization.
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Constitutional changes are virtually impossible in the Canadian political system, especially
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because they would require buy-in from provinces who are receiving equalization.
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Changing the formula could be done by federal cabinet.
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I know Maxime Bernier has said, you know, he was in cabinet once when they changed the formula
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But that nuance is not reflected in the referendum question.
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So what I would ask here is, would you settle for a change of the formula that was a bit
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Again, first of all, because I mean, any political movement could change it and change it back to,
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you know, Alberta's disadvantage, which again is Canada's disadvantage.
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And the fact that the Quebec Succession Act, the Clarity Act of 1998, set out a mechanism
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where Alberta has, Alberta, I'm sorry, where Ottawa has to deal with a strong yes vote to
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And the fact that that's leaked independence is kind of ironic in Quebec in 1998.
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Yeah, no, there's other constitutional issues that have to be addressed, like the inequity
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in the Supreme Court, the inequity in the House of Commons, how ineffective and useless
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So yeah, Albertans are telling me they want to push back.
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Let's get equalization out of there so we can plan for the future and Alberta can be
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What are the big, let me take a step back here and ask this a different way.
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Obviously, I know most small C conservatives are in favor of scrapping equalization.
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I also haven't heard too, too much from Rachel Notley and the NDP on this.
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And I'm curious if this is a left-right issue or if the battle lines are a bit different.
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The NDP, you know, believes in big government, believes in wealth transfer.
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Clearly, they believe in as much money coming out of Alberta as possible.
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That's why they were so devastating in their four years in government here in Alberta.
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But I would suggest that Rachel Notley is looking at how low, low Jason Kenney's popularity
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is in Alberta when a lot of her people and public servants are saying, hey, let's vote
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to keep equalization just to send Jason Kenney a message with how disappointed we are that
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All the more reason, Andrew, that Albertans everywhere need to get out and vote yes to
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end equalization so Alberta families and communities can be stronger, so Canada can be stronger.
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So how does ending equalization make Canada stronger?
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Well, first of all, right now the equalization formula is so, it's unclear, it's had unintended
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You know, it's clear that some provinces don't develop their resources, don't develop their
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revenue base, so they won't affect their ability to collect equalization dollars from Alberta
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through Ottawa, so a system where Alberta, first of all, could be stronger, so there'd be
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more job opportunities and more wealth created for all Canadians, and secondly, where the other
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provinces have the ability to develop their resource bases and their revenue bases stronger,
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which would be good for all Canadian families and even for public services because it would
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Equalization has created a dissent to create wealth, to create revenue, to make Canadian
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provinces strong, with one we always hear about is New Brunswick and Nova Scotia and Quebec
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not developing their shale gas resources, so they won't affect their equalization.
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You know, no doubt there's other examples of where their economies are being held back to
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So, you know, Canada has the people, you know, Canada has the commodities, you know, we should
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be the freest, most prosperous place in the world, and of course what we're seeing under our current
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federal leadership and current equalization formulas, we're seeing us slip, you know, into
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It's embarrassing and it's just a matter of the right policy to change.
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Yeah, you're very right, and I think this is the one takeaway that people, even outside
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of Alberta and outside of the Havre provinces, need to realize here, which you've touched
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This is not just a rainy day fund to help provinces going through tough times.
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This is a program that by design breeds dependency, and it takes away any incentive for a Quebec
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to develop its energy sector because they can replace that revenue more consistently and
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stably by profiting off of Alberta's energy sector, particularly ironic given that Quebec
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does not want pipelines in Alberta oil, but they want the checks that come from Alberta
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At the same time, the demand for oil and gas in the world was increasing, particularly
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We're producing less, and Canada is not energy self-sufficient.
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My goodness, if line five closes, can you imagine the effects of that on Quebec and Ontario?
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There's just so many things that have made it happen that have held us back to where,
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you know, like, as an example, Andrew, from 2004 to 2014, when Alberta was really, really
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rolling, Ottawa didn't have to put anything into Alberta.
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We were paying lots of extra pension, lots of extra taxes.
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We were creating jobs for all Canadians, and Ottawa had to pay less unemployment and less
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The equalization program is based on provinces with different fiscal capacity, being able
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to have the same approximate taxation levels so they can have the same quality of services.
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But, Andrew, what's been happening is now all the fiscal capacity of all the provinces is
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narrowing as Alberta falls, as Alberta becomes less and less able to create wealth and create
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We've created a situation that's hurting 37 million Canadians, never mind the 4.4 million
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So let's all vote yes to end it, and let's decide the strengths of this confederation, and
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The equalization referendum in Alberta coming up on October 18th.
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And just to be extra clear and crystal clear here, Drew, the good vote is the yes vote.
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Take it out of 36, subsection 2 of the Constitution.
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Yeah, so if someone tells me after I voted no to equalization, I'd be like, okay, no,
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So always have to be concerned when you're in the negative and the affirmative on these
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Thanks for listening to The Andrew Lawton Show.
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Support the program by donating to True North at www.tnc.news.