Juno News - May 31, 2022


Ontario’s New Blue party commits to banning vaccine passports


Episode Stats

Length

19 minutes

Words per Minute

182.321

Word Count

3,593

Sentence Count

143


Summary


Transcript

00:00:00.000 We have a lot happening this week.
00:00:10.220 Ontarians go to the polls for the provincial election on Thursday.
00:00:13.780 Of course, advanced polls were already taking place,
00:00:16.760 so a lot of Ontarians have already voted.
00:00:18.340 But still, I think it's important to talk about the themes
00:00:21.340 that are coming out in this as Doug Ford
00:00:23.820 and the Progressive Conservative Party seeks re-election.
00:00:26.920 New Blue leader Jim Karajalios joins me back on the program here.
00:00:31.460 Jim, we talked a little while ago,
00:00:33.560 but I wanted to drill in to the policy aspect here.
00:00:37.000 Tell me about the new blueprint.
00:00:38.760 What is this?
00:00:39.720 Well, thanks for remembering the name of it, Andrew.
00:00:41.460 And we're really happy with the new blueprint.
00:00:44.000 It's the most important topics going into this election
00:00:47.640 for the new Blue Party and our candidates,
00:00:50.220 presented in six bullets,
00:00:52.420 in addition to the COVID-related legislation
00:00:55.920 that we've been pushing back on
00:00:57.360 since Belinda voted against Doug Ford's lockdown bill, Bill 195.
00:01:01.300 And we're really, really proud of it.
00:01:03.180 I'm happy to go over some of the key highlights for you.
00:01:06.320 But of course, we've been talking since last summer
00:01:08.940 about banning the use of vaccine passports,
00:01:13.600 not just making them optional in the public or private sector,
00:01:16.860 but banning them.
00:01:18.200 I was there.
00:01:19.360 I saw you in Ottawa at the trucker convoy
00:01:22.000 talking about restitution for some of those truckers
00:01:25.040 who had their businesses, 39 of them,
00:01:27.300 had their businesses shut down without due process.
00:01:29.800 And for some of the churches who had their doors shut
00:01:32.940 and their keys taken from them
00:01:34.580 and couldn't access their facility.
00:01:36.320 But we knew that the PCs were going to run away
00:01:38.940 from their COVID record
00:01:40.060 and make it sound like they had nothing to do with it
00:01:42.540 or wasn't their fault in the last two years.
00:01:44.160 And so we've been very diligent to make sure
00:01:46.840 that we're talking about fiscal, social and democratic issues.
00:01:50.300 We're the only party out there talking about scrapping
00:01:52.620 the per vote subsidy for the establishment political parties
00:01:56.340 that Doug Ford brought back and increased by 40%
00:01:59.340 over $100 million in 10 years has gone to the PCs,
00:02:02.880 the Liberals and the NDP.
00:02:04.100 We're talking about cancelling the Toronto Star's
00:02:06.480 online gambling license.
00:02:07.920 And we need one provincial party that fights for free press.
00:02:10.940 And we're talking about bringing down electricity rates
00:02:13.600 by getting rid of the wind turbines.
00:02:15.740 And I'm happy to get into that some more with you
00:02:18.260 because it's a complicated file.
00:02:19.660 And of course, we all remember Belinda was the only MPP
00:02:22.560 to vote against critical race theory in Bill 67.
00:02:25.960 And we launched that stopwoke.ca petition
00:02:29.320 that Belinda read on the last day of the legislature.
00:02:33.620 And in our platform, the new blueprint
00:02:35.640 is getting rid of critical race theory in our schools
00:02:38.080 and offering tax credits for those parents
00:02:41.360 who've chosen alternatives in education.
00:02:44.060 Let me go back to what you said at the beginning there, Jim,
00:02:47.020 which is preventing the government
00:02:48.600 from being able to do some of the horrific things
00:02:51.300 they've done in the name of public health and COVID
00:02:53.580 with vaccine passports and mandates and all of that.
00:02:56.680 I mean, the federal government has a constitution
00:02:58.980 which theoretically, and I mean, there's a big debate
00:03:02.060 we could have about the efficacy of the courts here,
00:03:04.060 but theoretically constrains future government's actions.
00:03:07.060 If you were to get in and you were to pass this,
00:03:09.800 what's to stop a government from basically doing
00:03:11.840 what the Doug Ford government did,
00:03:13.660 which is ripping up the law and ripping up all of this
00:03:16.520 and saying, we're doing it anyway.
00:03:17.960 I mean, a government that can impose a restriction on itself
00:03:20.720 could also remove that restriction
00:03:22.260 when it was expedient to do so, couldn't it?
00:03:24.640 And it's kind of a similar question on a variety of policies,
00:03:27.820 even in Doug Ford's industrial carbon tax
00:03:30.040 that we're talking about, that's part of the new blueprint.
00:03:32.140 But I've always said that these are not just legal questions,
00:03:36.020 these are political questions.
00:03:37.480 And I remember, Andrew, when I was in law school in Ottawa,
00:03:40.800 I hope the viewers forgive me for going to law school.
00:03:44.000 Belinda did when she met me.
00:03:45.540 But I remember some of the judges that we had met
00:03:48.460 admitted that when they make some of these charter decisions
00:03:51.540 or constitutional decisions,
00:03:52.820 they do look at public sentiment
00:03:54.440 and they do look at what the debates are in the legislature.
00:03:58.240 So it's not just a legal answer.
00:04:00.960 And lawsuits are necessary in advocacy,
00:04:04.720 just as are protests and rallies and petitions.
00:04:08.020 But the other piece is having a political party
00:04:10.760 fighting to change legislation
00:04:12.600 and pushing back when legislation is changed in the future.
00:04:16.620 So we saw the government throw away a lot of the,
00:04:21.200 what we thought were constitutionally protected rights
00:04:23.940 and freedoms.
00:04:24.440 And we saw Doug Ford take emergency powers
00:04:27.540 that we traditionally thought
00:04:29.400 were only for a period of time of under a month
00:04:32.280 and expand it to two years.
00:04:34.160 And you're right.
00:04:35.020 A future government can do that
00:04:37.800 under the current political climate that we have here.
00:04:41.400 But we need a political party to say,
00:04:43.280 it's not enough to just walk away
00:04:45.660 and say vaccine passports are going to be optional now.
00:04:49.060 We need, government created this problem.
00:04:50.900 We need the pushback to be government
00:04:52.780 is going to solve this problem.
00:04:54.040 And it starts with advocacy from the new blue party
00:04:56.880 saying we're going to ban vaccine passports,
00:04:59.400 public or private sector.
00:05:01.000 And I think that's an important step
00:05:03.080 in ensuring that future governments
00:05:04.480 know not to try this again.
00:05:07.100 The pessimism that I had through a lot of the pandemic
00:05:10.940 came from the fact that it seemed like
00:05:12.640 a lot of Ontarians welcomed restrictions.
00:05:15.260 A lot of Ontarians welcomed vaccine passports.
00:05:18.180 I mean, how do you square what you're proposing
00:05:20.320 with what I fear was at times in the pandemic,
00:05:23.540 a democratic will for some of these things?
00:05:26.340 Well, I think in the early going,
00:05:28.200 there was a lot of fear that came over.
00:05:30.980 And even when Belinda voted against Bill 195,
00:05:34.880 we saw a lot of politicians vote in favor of it
00:05:39.880 who later cheated.
00:05:41.000 And so sure, the public was afraid.
00:05:44.060 And part of the problem, I think,
00:05:45.400 is that the government was,
00:05:48.200 I've said this publicly,
00:05:49.760 it's nefarious that St. Joe's and Hamilton
00:05:52.560 had early treatment for COVID.
00:05:54.800 And it wasn't readily being promoted and expanded,
00:05:59.460 whether it's monoclonal antibodies
00:06:02.160 or other early treatments.
00:06:03.340 It wasn't expanded across Ontario.
00:06:05.080 So the public's fear was there's no treatment for this.
00:06:08.360 Nothing can be done.
00:06:09.300 And that gave the government some early leeway.
00:06:12.860 But if you look now,
00:06:14.440 the PCs have been running away from their record
00:06:16.760 and they're scaring the public
00:06:18.840 about these types of mandates and lockdowns,
00:06:21.220 saying that the NDP might do
00:06:22.840 exactly what Doug Ford did a few times.
00:06:25.320 So I think it's important with advocacy,
00:06:28.540 the public responds.
00:06:29.820 And the public mood may shift,
00:06:32.300 depending on more information that comes out.
00:06:34.280 And so maybe in the beginning there was skepticism,
00:06:37.480 but I think largely the more people find out
00:06:39.900 about treatments for COVID
00:06:41.300 and the studies that have come out
00:06:43.620 and in discussion that the lockdowns did nothing
00:06:46.220 to curb the spread.
00:06:48.240 And there was no such thing as COVID zero.
00:06:50.480 And the same with the vaccine passports.
00:06:52.940 I think the public comes around.
00:06:55.120 And I would also remind people on this
00:06:57.040 that the government and their public health advisors
00:07:00.000 have not ruled out the return of these things.
00:07:03.540 I mean, it's all well and good during an election
00:07:05.240 to see everyone mask-free, vaccine passport-free.
00:07:08.340 But Kieran Moore has gotten up there and said,
00:07:10.600 you know, once winter comes around,
00:07:12.080 who knows what's going to happen.
00:07:13.860 And we've got to,
00:07:14.600 that's why the new blue party
00:07:15.540 is just getting started on June 2nd.
00:07:17.300 It's no conclusion.
00:07:18.500 We need a political party
00:07:19.820 in every corner of this province, Andrew,
00:07:22.040 that when the establishment parties,
00:07:24.140 and we know, it's not even if,
00:07:25.620 we know that they're not going to stick
00:07:27.660 to their commitments and especially the Ford PCs.
00:07:30.100 We're going to be there.
00:07:30.740 The new blue party outside the legislature,
00:07:32.420 hopefully inside the legislature
00:07:34.240 to keep advocating and keep pushing.
00:07:36.840 And one of the things that COVID brought up
00:07:38.780 in the last two years,
00:07:39.660 you'll know this, Andrew,
00:07:41.280 that the power that some of the local bureaucrats
00:07:44.140 have in the name of public health.
00:07:45.840 So you can have specific regions
00:07:47.960 just declaring without any due process,
00:07:50.560 without any debate in the legislature,
00:07:51.960 they're going to shut down businesses.
00:07:53.600 And part of the new blueprint
00:07:54.600 is doing a comprehensive review
00:07:56.500 of what those legal powers are
00:07:59.460 of local bureaucrats
00:08:00.440 in the name of public health.
00:08:01.980 They have no idea what it's like
00:08:03.340 to operate a church
00:08:04.740 or worship
00:08:05.560 or run a small business.
00:08:07.460 They shouldn't have that power
00:08:08.620 in many instances
00:08:09.960 to shut down small businesses
00:08:11.280 and tell people how many people
00:08:12.860 they can have over for Christmas
00:08:13.920 and Thanksgiving.
00:08:15.320 Yeah, I mean,
00:08:16.000 there was a time not that long ago,
00:08:17.720 I guess two years and a bit,
00:08:19.220 where the public health officer
00:08:20.880 was the one telling you
00:08:22.020 about getting your malaria shot
00:08:23.740 before you go to Africa,
00:08:25.220 teaching people about
00:08:26.120 the importance of safe sex
00:08:27.620 and, you know,
00:08:28.720 making sure that there were
00:08:30.080 drug overdose responses available.
00:08:32.420 I mean, these things
00:08:33.020 that most people associate
00:08:33.960 with public health.
00:08:35.040 The amount of power
00:08:36.260 that we've learned
00:08:37.060 was always there,
00:08:38.120 but has only more recently
00:08:39.280 been deployed
00:08:39.920 is shocking to people.
00:08:41.880 And I guess the question is,
00:08:43.520 how big of an overhaul
00:08:44.900 do we need to rein that in?
00:08:47.060 We need a comprehensive overview
00:08:48.660 of the laws and the regulations
00:08:50.460 on the books
00:08:51.000 for the local bureaucrats,
00:08:52.180 in addition to repealing
00:08:53.460 all of the laws
00:08:54.740 that Doug Ford put in
00:08:56.160 under the guise of,
00:08:57.200 you know,
00:08:58.060 lockdown mandate
00:08:59.100 related legislation,
00:09:00.320 including Bill 100
00:09:01.400 that he put in
00:09:03.260 near the end
00:09:03.920 of the legislative sitting
00:09:04.960 that allows him
00:09:05.640 to go after people
00:09:06.520 without due process
00:09:07.300 and shut down businesses.
00:09:08.920 It's got to be
00:09:09.640 a comprehensive overview
00:09:10.780 of the last two years
00:09:12.040 of COVID lockdown
00:09:13.700 related legislation
00:09:15.140 and mandate
00:09:15.700 related legislation
00:09:16.720 and proactive legislation
00:09:18.980 because of the problem
00:09:20.600 the PCs have created
00:09:21.880 in many instances
00:09:23.340 where Doug Ford
00:09:24.500 is now saying
00:09:25.140 it's an option
00:09:25.940 for people
00:09:26.680 or facility operators
00:09:28.520 whether they want to use
00:09:29.460 the COVID vaccine passport.
00:09:30.760 But a few months ago
00:09:31.680 when Belinda was standing
00:09:33.080 in the legislature
00:09:33.740 challenging them on it,
00:09:35.540 whether it was
00:09:36.060 a liberal private members bill
00:09:37.380 or otherwise,
00:09:38.740 the PCs were advocating
00:09:39.960 for it publicly
00:09:40.680 and in the legislature
00:09:41.720 telling facility operators
00:09:44.260 to impose COVID vaccine passports
00:09:46.860 and the nurses
00:09:47.500 that were terminated
00:09:48.420 from their jobs.
00:09:49.300 It's only increased
00:09:50.020 the backlog of procedures,
00:09:51.520 the new blueprint calls
00:09:52.480 for rehiring those nurses.
00:09:54.280 So there's a lot of work to do
00:09:55.840 but it starts with ensuring
00:09:57.220 that the discussion continues
00:09:58.980 and the advocacy
00:09:59.780 in the right direction continues
00:10:01.480 and that's what
00:10:02.340 the new blue party
00:10:03.040 of Ontario was started
00:10:03.920 for two years ago
00:10:05.080 and we're just getting started
00:10:06.160 on June 2nd.
00:10:07.400 You've gone in the new blueprint
00:10:08.900 back to basics
00:10:09.720 on I think conservative
00:10:10.920 fiscal policy here,
00:10:12.160 a reduction in the HST
00:10:13.600 from 13% to 10%.
00:10:16.080 So that's a pretty significant
00:10:17.500 reduction in the provincial
00:10:18.780 portion of that.
00:10:19.680 I'm not even going to pretend
00:10:21.320 that I'm opposed to that.
00:10:22.500 I think that's wonderful.
00:10:23.600 I'd say bring it on.
00:10:24.780 How would you pay for it though?
00:10:26.660 The payment's got to be
00:10:27.840 through economic growth.
00:10:28.940 I mean conservatives
00:10:29.600 in the past, Andrew,
00:10:30.680 would say we don't have
00:10:32.040 a spending problem,
00:10:33.180 we have a revenue problem.
00:10:34.740 Well, under 20 years
00:10:35.960 of liberal and PC governments,
00:10:37.580 we have a spending problem
00:10:39.000 and we have a revenue problem
00:10:40.540 because the economy's growing
00:10:41.700 at over 1%
00:10:43.060 and we all know that
00:10:44.140 the more you increase taxation,
00:10:46.300 the economy's not going to pick up
00:10:47.820 and we saw it with Doug Ford
00:10:49.320 put in an industrial carbon tax
00:10:51.240 that's part of the same tax relief
00:10:53.060 we're promising
00:10:53.680 in the new blueprint
00:10:54.920 and every time you add
00:10:56.720 one of these taxes,
00:10:57.540 you're just slowing down
00:10:58.460 the economy.
00:10:59.520 Our new blueprint
00:11:00.180 has the best plan
00:11:01.040 to get the economy going again.
00:11:03.340 It starts with reducing
00:11:04.340 electricity rates
00:11:05.420 by taking down
00:11:06.140 and decommissioning
00:11:06.880 those wind turbines
00:11:07.740 and reducing the HST
00:11:09.420 will also have
00:11:10.340 an economic impact
00:11:11.800 and that's how
00:11:12.700 we're going to pay
00:11:13.260 for tax relief
00:11:15.140 and for social services
00:11:17.220 going forward
00:11:17.800 and social services
00:11:18.600 are in trouble
00:11:19.200 because if we keep
00:11:20.240 growing this economy
00:11:21.180 at a fraction
00:11:22.360 of what our spending increases,
00:11:24.120 we're going to have
00:11:25.280 a big problem.
00:11:25.780 But I'll say one more thing,
00:11:26.840 Andrew,
00:11:27.100 I said this to someone
00:11:28.280 who interviewed me
00:11:28.920 the other day
00:11:29.480 from a publication.
00:11:32.160 When it's time
00:11:33.580 for the PCs
00:11:34.140 or the liberals
00:11:34.760 to spend money
00:11:35.660 like Doug Ford just did,
00:11:37.000 he spent more money
00:11:37.800 in the last four years
00:11:38.700 than any government,
00:11:40.140 he's run greater deficits
00:11:41.620 excluding COVID spending
00:11:43.000 than any government
00:11:44.400 in the history of Ontario.
00:11:46.040 It's amazing
00:11:46.560 that the establishment press
00:11:47.700 never says,
00:11:48.640 how are you going
00:11:49.160 to pay for that?
00:11:50.080 It's just like,
00:11:50.820 it's a bottomless pit
00:11:51.880 of money
00:11:52.660 when it comes to spending,
00:11:54.020 when it comes
00:11:54.640 to $6.9 billion
00:11:55.720 to try to keep
00:11:57.440 hydro rates down.
00:11:58.340 But when it comes
00:11:58.880 to tax relief,
00:12:00.080 the left is all
00:12:01.060 over the place
00:12:01.640 and the establishment
00:12:02.260 media are screaming,
00:12:03.420 you can't pay for it.
00:12:04.340 Well, the best way
00:12:05.080 to afford tax relief
00:12:07.140 is by doing a tax relief
00:12:08.600 and getting the economy going.
00:12:10.900 Are there any
00:12:11.360 big significant expenditures
00:12:13.440 that you see?
00:12:14.320 I mean, obviously,
00:12:14.700 you're not in there
00:12:15.440 and you don't have access
00:12:16.540 to the full books
00:12:17.320 in the sense that you would
00:12:18.600 if you were the premier,
00:12:19.780 but are there things
00:12:20.660 going into it
00:12:21.340 that you know you could cut
00:12:23.060 that are big ticket items
00:12:24.260 or that you would
00:12:24.760 at least look at for cuts?
00:12:26.660 Well, one of the ways
00:12:27.480 we reduce spending
00:12:29.400 is through the alternative
00:12:30.460 schooling tax credit
00:12:31.860 and other wasteful spending
00:12:34.360 like the $100 million
00:12:35.180 a year that Doug Ford's
00:12:36.520 been doing
00:12:37.100 for the political parties
00:12:40.080 over the last 10 years.
00:12:41.100 He didn't do the $100 million,
00:12:42.360 but the establishment party
00:12:43.480 set it in motion.
00:12:45.060 But the other big spending,
00:12:46.720 $6.9 billion a year
00:12:48.280 of taxpayer money
00:12:49.060 being used
00:12:49.780 to artificially deflate hydro rates
00:12:52.220 when the solution
00:12:52.980 is to take down
00:12:53.720 the wind turbines.
00:12:54.720 And we just saw him
00:12:55.720 for two months
00:12:56.480 make promises
00:12:58.420 in the billions,
00:13:00.760 hundreds of millions
00:13:01.580 of dollars worth
00:13:02.900 of green energy,
00:13:05.460 electric vehicle subsidies.
00:13:07.240 And I hate using
00:13:07.980 the term green energy
00:13:08.780 because it's not.
00:13:09.660 It's not green energy.
00:13:11.280 So right there
00:13:12.300 with his commitments
00:13:13.240 that he's promised,
00:13:14.580 totally opposed
00:13:16.040 to the electric vehicle subsidies,
00:13:17.900 corporate welfare
00:13:18.520 going to create
00:13:20.160 these industries
00:13:21.540 that are entirely
00:13:22.720 going to be dependent
00:13:23.480 on government funding.
00:13:25.400 And the minute
00:13:25.920 the government can't afford
00:13:27.040 to fund them anymore,
00:13:28.060 those industries
00:13:28.660 will collapse.
00:13:29.860 So there's a lot
00:13:30.800 of wasteful spending
00:13:31.560 that the Ford PCs
00:13:32.520 have continued
00:13:33.720 in continuing
00:13:34.880 the McGuinty-Winn legacy
00:13:36.180 and trying to create
00:13:37.480 a provincial paradigm
00:13:39.160 here in Ontario
00:13:40.600 of whatever
00:13:41.060 Justin Trudeau wants federally.
00:13:43.440 Things like accountability
00:13:44.920 are not
00:13:45.720 or should not
00:13:46.360 be left-right issues.
00:13:47.960 The COVID handling,
00:13:49.160 I've seen a lot
00:13:49.800 of criticism
00:13:50.380 towards what Doug Ford's
00:13:52.080 done here from the left
00:13:53.080 and from the right.
00:13:54.280 And I think increasingly
00:13:55.220 from people
00:13:55.760 that aren't even political
00:13:57.020 or aren't even
00:13:57.560 on the political spectrum.
00:13:59.080 So let me ask
00:13:59.740 how you envision
00:14:00.780 your party fitting
00:14:01.680 into the political
00:14:02.340 landscape here.
00:14:03.140 Are you trying to be
00:14:04.060 an alternative
00:14:05.040 for conservative voters
00:14:06.320 or do you actually
00:14:06.980 see something in here
00:14:08.060 that's going to attract
00:14:09.440 votes from
00:14:10.140 former liberal voters,
00:14:11.840 NDP voters,
00:14:12.780 Green voters,
00:14:13.540 and non-voters?
00:14:15.240 One of the biggest
00:14:17.120 components of our supporters
00:14:19.080 are people who have
00:14:19.820 stopped voting
00:14:20.600 for a long time.
00:14:22.660 We get it
00:14:23.220 in Kitchener-Conestoga
00:14:24.780 and Cambridge
00:14:25.320 and across Ontario,
00:14:26.280 people who have said
00:14:27.600 they gave up
00:14:28.740 on the establishment
00:14:29.640 parties because
00:14:30.260 they're all the same
00:14:31.100 and whether it's
00:14:32.880 we are talking
00:14:34.040 about issues
00:14:34.820 that voters
00:14:36.640 previously would have said,
00:14:38.240 you know,
00:14:38.500 I consider that
00:14:39.300 a right-of-center issue
00:14:40.740 or they thought
00:14:42.140 that that was not
00:14:43.040 a right-of-center issue
00:14:43.960 and they're coming around
00:14:44.860 and realizing
00:14:46.320 that's actually
00:14:46.960 a good solution
00:14:47.780 or whether we're
00:14:49.920 talking about
00:14:50.640 the things
00:14:51.280 on accountability
00:14:52.520 and democratic reform
00:14:54.160 and not wasting money
00:14:55.240 that a lot of voters
00:14:56.760 used to think
00:14:57.380 was common
00:14:58.360 amongst all the parties.
00:14:59.500 For example,
00:15:00.480 the idea
00:15:01.020 that you're subsidizing
00:15:02.080 a political party
00:15:03.000 for their operations,
00:15:04.440 I don't think
00:15:05.040 there's a voter
00:15:05.640 out there
00:15:06.140 on the left
00:15:06.660 or the right
00:15:07.320 that thinks
00:15:08.020 that's a good idea
00:15:08.960 or very few at least.
00:15:10.180 The idea that,
00:15:11.000 you know,
00:15:11.580 the PCs
00:15:12.160 would not allow
00:15:13.700 Belinda's private members
00:15:15.020 bill to pass
00:15:15.960 in 2019
00:15:16.800 and they parked it
00:15:18.400 at a committee.
00:15:22.700 Oh,
00:15:23.340 I think we,
00:15:23.960 I think you froze there.
00:15:25.320 Do we still have Jim?
00:15:26.760 Which was to,
00:15:28.260 for the first time,
00:15:30.260 Yeah,
00:15:30.540 sorry,
00:15:30.740 we got you back now.
00:15:31.600 We're carrying on there.
00:15:32.740 So,
00:15:33.340 in Ontario's history,
00:15:34.800 there's never been a law
00:15:35.960 against voter fraud
00:15:37.140 in internal party elections
00:15:38.560 and Belinda proposed
00:15:39.980 that private members bill
00:15:41.080 and she got
00:15:41.620 unanimous support
00:15:42.960 from all the parties
00:15:43.860 in the legislature
00:15:44.540 because the Greens,
00:15:45.840 the Liberals,
00:15:46.280 the NDP,
00:15:46.820 they all know
00:15:47.400 that their voters
00:15:48.360 wouldn't be in favor
00:15:49.200 of voter fraud
00:15:49.740 but the Doug Ford PCs
00:15:50.960 just parked at a committee
00:15:52.480 never allowed
00:15:53.220 that private members bill
00:15:54.340 to become law.
00:15:55.380 I mean,
00:15:55.540 what kind of party,
00:15:56.440 Andrew?
00:15:56.760 wouldn't pass into law
00:15:58.180 a bill against voter fraud
00:16:00.000 in internal party elections
00:16:01.200 and a lot of voters
00:16:02.480 in Ontario,
00:16:03.240 whether it's Cambridge
00:16:03.820 or otherwise,
00:16:05.060 they had no idea
00:16:06.580 that there are no laws
00:16:07.800 on the books
00:16:08.360 against voter fraud
00:16:09.480 taking place
00:16:10.020 in a leadership
00:16:10.620 and a nomination
00:16:11.520 at a party convention
00:16:13.000 and of course,
00:16:14.480 the other promise
00:16:15.580 we've made
00:16:16.060 is to scrap
00:16:16.660 the Toronto Star's
00:16:17.540 online gambling license
00:16:18.620 and Andrew,
00:16:19.640 you're one of the best
00:16:20.920 read on this stuff.
00:16:21.640 you'll see a lot of
00:16:22.960 left-leaning commentators
00:16:25.200 writing articles
00:16:26.260 on this stuff
00:16:26.920 saying this is a terrible idea
00:16:28.440 to mix online gambling revenues
00:16:30.700 with print media
00:16:31.880 is a terrible idea
00:16:33.020 and there's other local issues
00:16:35.440 that we've been fighting for
00:16:36.380 like Belinda's been standing up
00:16:37.540 against a drug injection site
00:16:38.740 in Cambridge
00:16:39.240 and voters
00:16:40.960 that traditionally
00:16:41.840 may have voted
00:16:42.420 on the left
00:16:42.920 or the right
00:16:43.440 or never voted
00:16:44.260 are coming around
00:16:46.700 and saying
00:16:47.020 I agree with that.
00:16:47.740 So we are talking
00:16:48.560 about the things
00:16:49.280 that the establishment parties
00:16:50.760 and others
00:16:52.020 in the political process
00:16:53.320 are not talking about
00:16:54.400 and that's where
00:16:55.420 we've been building
00:16:56.020 our support
00:16:56.560 for the last two years
00:16:57.460 and even before that
00:16:58.360 since I started
00:16:59.980 the Acts of Carbon Tax campaign.
00:17:01.720 I know about 15 years ago
00:17:03.680 Ontarians voted
00:17:04.580 in a referendum
00:17:05.360 on electoral reform
00:17:07.040 on introducing
00:17:07.920 mixed member
00:17:09.000 proportional representation
00:17:10.180 which would have allowed
00:17:11.320 for some proportional
00:17:13.180 representation
00:17:14.020 in the legislature
00:17:15.120 which would have allowed
00:17:16.620 for newer parties
00:17:17.660 and upstart parties
00:17:18.580 to have a bit more
00:17:19.400 of a direct path in.
00:17:20.500 Is that something
00:17:21.020 you'd support
00:17:21.920 or you have a position
00:17:22.940 on as leader of New Blue
00:17:24.080 electoral reform?
00:17:26.240 It's not in the new blueprint.
00:17:27.920 It's something
00:17:28.460 that we're always looking at
00:17:29.640 ways to strengthen
00:17:30.600 our democracy
00:17:31.340 but in the immediate future
00:17:33.520 we're fighting for
00:17:34.820 a cleanup
00:17:35.860 of the internal party process.
00:17:38.380 So I think
00:17:39.860 that's the immediate thing
00:17:40.960 that needs fixing
00:17:41.740 and tinkering
00:17:42.480 with the general election system
00:17:44.200 is kind of, you know,
00:17:45.720 jumping a few steps ahead
00:17:46.980 federally
00:17:48.240 you remember
00:17:48.940 in 2005
00:17:49.840 Stephen Harper
00:17:50.660 brought forward
00:17:51.340 the Accountability Act
00:17:53.080 and he made a clear line
00:17:55.540 between lobbyists
00:17:56.500 getting involved
00:17:57.100 in internal party politics.
00:17:59.000 Provincially
00:17:59.400 we've seen
00:18:02.060 those same guys
00:18:03.560 like Doug Ford's
00:18:04.380 campaign manager
00:18:04.940 taking advantage
00:18:05.720 of the fact
00:18:06.240 that in Ontario
00:18:07.100 there are not
00:18:08.320 as strong laws
00:18:09.260 against that
00:18:09.960 and we've seen
00:18:11.340 lobbyists
00:18:11.980 or reported lobbyists
00:18:13.260 on the PC side
00:18:14.200 jumping on caucus calls
00:18:15.560 and telling caucus
00:18:16.980 how they should be voting
00:18:18.360 and the entire
00:18:19.420 internal party system
00:18:20.780 in Ontario politics
00:18:21.960 is totally broken
00:18:24.040 not just damaged a bit
00:18:25.720 where it's entirely driven
00:18:27.200 by the leader
00:18:27.900 and whoever
00:18:28.540 the gang in the back is
00:18:29.760 so the focus
00:18:30.720 has to be on
00:18:31.520 cleaning up
00:18:32.060 the internal party system
00:18:33.220 first
00:18:33.620 I think
00:18:34.460 before we start
00:18:35.160 tinkering with
00:18:35.860 how the general election
00:18:37.980 model works.
00:18:39.140 Now I mean
00:18:39.500 just one last question
00:18:40.580 Jim
00:18:40.760 if that happened
00:18:41.860 is a party
00:18:42.540 like the New Blue
00:18:43.260 needed
00:18:43.680 if the major parties
00:18:45.300 or the established parties
00:18:46.740 are subject
00:18:47.580 to the rules
00:18:48.180 that you've proposed?
00:18:50.080 Well that's just
00:18:50.960 one element of it
00:18:51.940 but the New Blue Party
00:18:52.860 of Ontario
00:18:53.780 I worked really hard
00:18:54.900 and Belinda
00:18:55.260 worked really hard
00:18:55.980 and there were
00:18:56.460 thousands of others
00:18:57.420 that really worked
00:18:58.480 very very hard
00:18:59.220 for many years
00:18:59.840 to influence
00:19:00.560 the Ontario PC party
00:19:04.580 work from the inside
00:19:06.240 is what they said
00:19:07.040 to push for the solutions
00:19:08.460 that the establishment parties
00:19:10.080 don't want to talk about
00:19:11.120 and June 2nd
00:19:12.420 is just a starting point
00:19:13.400 for us
00:19:13.800 we're not going away
00:19:14.640 we've balanced the narrative
00:19:16.540 we've changed the course
00:19:17.920 and we've challenged the left
00:19:19.060 for the last few years
00:19:20.380 and we're going to continue
00:19:21.140 to do that.
00:19:23.060 Jim Carajalio is leader
00:19:24.380 of the New Blue Party
00:19:25.420 I know it's a big week
00:19:26.220 with the election
00:19:26.720 coming up Thursday
00:19:27.520 so thanks very much
00:19:28.360 for joining me again.
00:19:29.520 Thanks Andrew.
00:19:30.020 Thanks for listening
00:19:30.600 to the Andrew Lawton Show
00:19:31.800 Support the program
00:19:33.060 by donating to True North
00:19:34.320 at www.tnc.news
00:19:40.080 www.tnc.news.gov.au