Juno News - Prosecuting Thought Crimes

00:00:00.000 Welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show.

00:00:06.740 This is the Andrew Lawton Show, brought to you by True North.

00:00:12.860 Coming up, conservative silence on what should be the hill to die on, free speech,

00:00:17.840 and why celebrating Canada Day is now a subversive act.

00:00:23.360 The Andrew Lawton Show starts right now.

00:00:26.880 Welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show.

00:00:32.980 This is the Andrew Lawton Show on Tuesday, June 29th, 2021.

00:00:37.940 It is my great pleasure to have you aboard.

00:00:42.660 Listen, we are going to be talking about, as I promised last week, C-36 a great deal.

00:00:49.220 This is probably one of the worst.

00:00:51.620 I would actually say it is the worst bill that the Justin Trudeau government has put forward

00:00:56.880 because it goes after what I believe wholeheartedly is the mother of all freedoms, freedom of speech.

00:01:03.240 This is the online hate bill that would restore Section 13 of the Canadian Human Rights Act,

00:01:09.380 that would essentially outlaw communicating what the government says is hate speech online,

00:01:15.960 if that goes against one of the designated protected groups under the Canadian Human Rights Act.

00:01:21.220 And it also has criminal provisions as well, like the imposition of a peace bond on people

00:01:27.240 who are likely to commit an offense in the eyes of a provincial court judge.

00:01:32.940 I'm going to talk about that later on in the show,

00:01:34.860 but I want to talk about the political stakes of this right now,

00:01:38.500 because it has been six days, six days, and believe me when I say I've been counting,

00:01:43.760 since the Liberal government tabled this.

00:01:46.080 It was on the final day of the parliamentary session,

00:01:48.740 which, as I said last week, is evidence of something very concerning,

00:01:52.440 which is that the Liberals, if all of the election rumors that an election is coming this summer are true,

00:01:58.180 believe they can win an election on this.

00:02:01.880 Because by tabling a bill when Parliament's rising,

00:02:04.320 you don't even have time to do second reading, committee, third reading, to send it to the Senate.

00:02:09.020 You're really just doing it because you want to have it on the record.

00:02:13.260 So when the Liberals do that,

00:02:15.700 they're saying that if there's a summer election,

00:02:17.700 they believe they can hold this bill up,

00:02:19.720 look to Canadians and say,

00:02:20.900 vote for us so we can finish the job we started.

00:02:24.360 As opposed to burying it at the beginning so everyone's forgotten about it,

00:02:27.600 the Liberals think that banning online speech is a winnable proposition.

00:02:31.260 And if the last six days is any indication, they may be right. 0.77

00:02:37.260 The Conservative Party of Canada has been effectively silent since this bill was put forward.

00:02:43.200 I say effectively because there was one statement from one member of Parliament.

00:02:47.980 Conservative leader Aaron O'Toole has said in the time since this was tabled,

00:02:52.360 not a single word in public, so far as I can tell, about C-36.

00:02:57.660 I pointed this out in a column when it was five days past.

00:03:02.920 And I said, listen, five days since this was tabled,

00:03:06.100 Aaron O'Toole has said nothing.

00:03:07.340 What's the issue?

00:03:08.100 And the point that I raised is that this is the hill to die on.

00:03:11.780 A Conservative Party that does not stand up for free speech

00:03:14.460 is not a particularly Conservative Party.

00:03:17.880 It's one thing to say, yeah, we want to lower your taxes a bit.

00:03:20.320 But if you're not standing up for free speech,

00:03:21.880 if you're not there on the issues that matter, who really cares?

00:03:25.060 So Aaron O'Toole and his caucus will probably vote against this if and when it comes to it.

00:03:32.060 The issue is that they should be shouting from the rooftops that this bill is bad

00:03:37.520 because it is a bill that supports censorship.

00:03:41.780 Especially after the last couple of months has seen the Liberals try to impose Bill C-10,

00:03:46.480 which does sweeping regulations to bring the internet and internet content providers

00:03:51.300 under the purview of government regulation.

00:03:53.840 And the Conservatives have been very solid on C-10.

00:03:56.820 They've been talking about how C-10 will allow the government to control the internet and censor content.

00:04:01.700 So you may wonder, why is it they are not prepared to do the same for C-36? 0.62

00:04:06.320 There are a few theories that I have.

00:04:08.820 One is confusion.

00:04:10.160 They know that most Canadians don't know the difference between a C-10 and a C-36 and a Section 13,

00:04:15.780 so they don't want to start muddling it by talking about another bill.

00:04:19.600 That's one possibility.

00:04:20.620 The other possibility is that the Conservatives are scared.

00:04:24.340 And I suspect this is the case.

00:04:26.180 And let me tell you why.

00:04:27.520 It is safe to stand up and attack C-10. 1.00

00:04:31.220 It's very safe.

00:04:32.040 C-10 doesn't deal with anything polarizing.

00:04:34.420 It is a bill that talks about the Canadian Radio Television Telecommunications Commission.

00:04:39.340 It is a bill that is as dry as it gets with significant implications.

00:04:43.180 But the subject matter of the bill is completely banal.

00:04:47.800 So when the Conservatives talk about free speech in the abstract, it's very safe.

00:04:52.920 There's no political pushback.

00:04:54.200 They can just say, oh yeah, they're trying to regulate what you post online.

00:04:56.900 The government says no, and that's that.

00:04:59.440 C-36 is different because C-36 goes after a very specific type of speech.

00:05:04.680 What the government says is hate speech.

00:05:06.940 And most Canadians would say, oh, I like free speech, but oh, I don't like hate speech.

00:05:10.920 Hate's mean.

00:05:11.400 We're not hateful people.

00:05:12.320 I don't want hateful content.

00:05:13.580 And I would agree.

00:05:14.340 I don't like hateful content.

00:05:16.020 I don't like people smearing others based on their race, religion, sexual orientation.

00:05:20.160 I don't like, in a civil society, people being hateful, people being rude.

00:05:25.200 The issue is I also don't like government being the arbiter of what people can say when

00:05:31.540 we have a civil society to mete out responses and remedies to unkind and uncivil things.

00:05:38.100 That's the whole point of a community and a society.

00:05:42.160 So my issue here is that the government is redefining speech it does not like.

00:05:47.520 Unapproved speech as hate speech.

00:05:50.160 So as to justify the censorship of it.

00:05:53.220 This means, however, that if the conservatives stand up against this, if the conservatives

00:05:58.280 say, no, no, no, we support free speech, they will have to defend demonstrably unpopular

00:06:04.500 speech.

00:06:05.820 And this is the issue is that when you're defending free speech in the abstract, it's easy.

00:06:09.780 When you're defending it in very specific circumstances, it's incredibly difficult.

00:06:14.360 I'll give you an example from my own life.

00:06:16.120 I was talking a few years ago on my former radio show about Holocaust denial, which is 0.88

00:06:22.240 probably one of the easiest examples to use when you're talking about free speech.

00:06:26.800 And I said, Holocaust denial is egregious.

00:06:29.600 I have talked to survivors of the Holocaust.

00:06:32.400 I have been to the Holocaust Museum.

00:06:34.240 I am very much pro-commemoration and remembrance of the Holocaust. 0.91

00:06:38.080 I do not believe Holocaust denial should be censored.

00:06:42.360 And I had said in a discussion at one point, I said, yeah, if some university student group

00:06:47.860 wants to debate whether the Holocaust happened, they should be allowed to do it.

00:06:52.700 And it was interesting.

00:06:53.860 That got picked up by some left-wing smear hatchet machine as Andrew Lawton thinks the Holocaust

00:07:00.380 is debatable.

00:07:02.000 As Andrew Lawton thinks the Holocaust should be debated.

00:07:04.700 When I said, no, the belief in free speech does not mean the endorsement of individual

00:07:11.280 or particular expressions of speech.

00:07:13.760 And this used to be something that people could take for granted.

00:07:16.780 No longer is that the case.

00:07:19.120 So when Aaron O'Toole and the conservatives say, we support free speech, the liberals are

00:07:23.820 going to say, oh, that means you support this claim of this group being like this, or this

00:07:27.460 claim of contempt for that group, or whatever the case may be.

00:07:30.740 And you may say, okay, well, you're proving the point.

00:07:32.980 That's why the conservatives are not wanting to do it.

00:07:35.480 Well, let me take a step back further and say, I don't care.

00:07:38.960 When you decide that something is the hill to die on, it means you have to stand up there

00:07:45.400 and take the slings and arrows that come from speaking out on that issue.

00:07:50.680 Because there are some issues that nothing really matters without them.

00:07:55.980 And free speech is very much one of those.

00:07:58.820 So the conservatives need to be shouting from the rooftops that C-36 is bad, especially

00:08:04.840 conservative members of parliament who were there from 2011 to 2015, those four years of

00:08:10.280 Stephen Harbour's majority in which section 13 of the Canadian Human Rights Act was repealed

00:08:15.720 thanks to a private member's bill by Brian Storseth.

00:08:19.400 Any MP who was there in 2012 when that was passed, the repeal went into force in 2013.

00:08:24.460 Anyone who was there should be loudly speaking up against it.

00:08:29.340 So why has there been no response?

00:08:33.160 I want to read, if I can here, a statement that was sent out by the justice critic for

00:08:38.460 the conservatives, Rob Moore.

00:08:39.860 And when I say statement, this was not proactively sent out.

00:08:43.080 This was not issued in the same way that the conservatives put out statements on things

00:08:46.380 they want to draw attention to, like the Wee scandal or vaccine procurement.

00:08:50.080 No, this was something that a media outlet asked for and they provided.

00:08:54.240 Rob Moore said this,

00:08:55.320 Once again, we see all Canadians can expect from the Trudeau Liberals are photo ops and

00:08:59.980 announcements.

00:09:00.600 The fact this bill was brought forward in the last minutes before parliament ends for the

00:09:04.540 summer shows this liberal government is only interested in political posturing ahead of

00:09:09.680 the next election, not rooting out hate speech.

00:09:12.740 Conservatives condemn all hate speech and speech that incites violence, but this bill will

00:09:16.920 not target hate speech, just ensure bureaucrats in Ottawa are bogged down with frivolous complaints

00:09:22.000 about tweets.

00:09:22.980 The minister responsible for the first censorship bill and the Trudeau Liberals are empowering

00:09:28.380 a bureaucracy to subjectively restrict the rights of Canadians.

00:09:33.300 Well, he has a couple of things there.

00:09:35.120 He implies that it's a censorship bill.

00:09:37.700 He doesn't talk at all about free speech in this statement, not a single reference to

00:09:42.640 free speech.

00:09:43.380 And a couple of the issues that he brings up are a bit weird.

00:09:46.360 You're concerned about the bureaucrats workload, about bureaucrats being bogged down with tweets.

00:09:51.240 In fact, I think if bureaucrats are being bogged down with some things and they're not

00:09:54.520 doing other things, that seems like it might be a win-win.

00:09:57.040 It also talks about political posturing and that it might not go far enough, that it's

00:10:01.940 not actually going to go after hate speech.

00:10:04.560 So the issue is completely missed here.

00:10:08.520 This is not a bad bill because it's ineffective.

00:10:11.220 It's not a bad bill because it's going to be taxing on bureaucrats.

00:10:15.120 It's a bad bill because the design of it and the function of it will be of censorship.

00:10:22.180 That is the focus, the goal, and the effect of the bill.

00:10:26.640 In constitutional law, they call it the pith and substance.

00:10:28.960 The pith and substance of this bill is a bill that limits free speech beyond the existing

00:10:34.660 criminal threshold of speech.

00:10:36.500 And I've seen a few people defend this by saying that, well, you know what, currently the government

00:10:42.800 doesn't have the means to tackle online speech.

00:10:45.240 Bruce Party says it best.

00:10:46.460 Anything that is illegal offline is illegal online.

00:10:50.660 So you don't need a new law if it's an enforcement issue.

00:10:53.760 You need a new mechanism of enforcement.

00:10:55.740 That's not what they're going after here.

00:10:57.400 They are going after very directly a limiting of the bounds of discourse.

00:11:03.920 You do not need speech protections for speech that everyone agrees with.

00:11:08.340 You need speech protections for speech that you revile.

00:11:12.140 So if you read through C36, you can see that the government is trying to legislate an emotion.

00:11:18.240 And yes, they are trying to legislate against thought crimes, both through the Canadian Human

00:11:23.480 Rights Commission, and also through the criminal code, as we'll talk about in a few moments

00:11:27.940 time with Ezra Levant, who knows full well the power of human rights commissions and this

00:11:34.360 human rights regime that is underscoring the so-called prosecutions of hate speech.

00:11:41.080 So we have a government that wants to prosecute Canadians for thought crimes.

00:11:45.540 We have a process that will very much be weaponized by critics.

00:11:50.480 I have no doubt that there will be groups and activists that just non-stop file complaints

00:11:56.900 against people they don't like, against bloggers, podcasters, against Twitter accounts.

00:12:01.160 They will just do this non-stop because this was already happening to some extent when Section

00:12:05.540 13 was around for the first time.

00:12:09.080 So all of this is to say that this needs to be the bill that every politician stands up and

00:12:15.300 speaks out on.

00:12:15.960 The fact that none are in a substantive way is very concerning for Canada and very concerning

00:12:22.380 for any Canadians who value free speech, a group that I fear is dwindling in number.

00:12:29.160 And I did mention this when I talked about this on Thursday's show last week, that some people

00:12:34.040 might not have been around or aware of the fight that was taking place on this about a decade

00:12:40.720 ago.

00:12:41.040 And it was actually more than that.

00:12:42.120 It was beyond that when this really started.

00:12:43.760 You had this whole regime.

00:12:45.740 And by the way, it wasn't just the Canadian Human Rights Commission.

00:12:48.240 It was other provinces commissions as well that were having this moment in the early

00:12:53.280 2000s.

00:12:54.120 And they eventually poked the wrong bears by going after people like Mark Stein and Ezra

00:12:59.520 Levant and a lot of others.

00:13:01.320 And I want to just show you what happens in these sorts of prosecutions.

00:13:07.260 Before I introduce my next guest, I want you to take a look at this video clip from one

00:13:12.760 of these very star chambers.

00:13:14.780 And I always, in an investigation interview, I always ask people, even though they've been

00:13:21.500 as thorough as you have, in summary fashion, what was your intent and purpose of your article

00:13:27.520 with the cartoon illustrations published on February 27, 2006?

00:13:31.420 Why is that a relevant question?

00:13:33.780 Under Section 3.1a, it talks about intention, purpose.

00:13:45.220 We'd like to get some background as well.

00:13:46.980 Is it, you'd like to get some background or does this determine anything?

00:13:51.660 If we publish what we publish, the words in the picture speak for themselves.

00:13:57.480 Are you saying that one answer is wrong and one answer is right?

00:14:03.460 Well, will a certain answer, is a certain answer contrary to law?

00:14:08.160 No.

00:14:08.440 So, if I were to say, hypothetically, that the purpose was to instill hatred, incite hatred,

00:14:16.660 and cause offense, are you saying that's an acceptable answer?

00:14:21.360 I'd have to look at it in the context of all the information and determine if it was indeed.

00:14:26.420 I think you're playing silly bundry here.

00:14:28.000 I think you know that the answer here, that that answer would be illegal.

00:14:33.880 Anything is possible, I guess.

00:14:39.520 But, again, I look at it, this kind of Section 3 case takes a lot of analysis.

00:14:44.340 So, there's a lot of things I have to look at.

00:14:46.440 That piece of information is just one.

00:14:48.760 My answer to your question is as follows.

00:14:54.340 We published those cartoons for the intention and purpose

00:15:00.300 of exercising our inalienable rights as free-born Albertans

00:15:06.520 to publish whatever the hell we want, no matter what the hell you think.

00:15:10.400 That was, of course, our friend Ezra Levant being grilled by an investigator

00:15:15.160 with the Alberta Human Rights Commission, Shirlene McGovern,

00:15:18.600 as to what his intent was in choosing to publish, at the time in the Western Standard,

00:15:24.860 the infamous Danish Muhammad cartoons.

00:15:27.140 Because this is exactly what human rights regulations and regimes do

00:15:32.680 when they start tackling free speech, delving into your thinking

00:15:35.800 behind doing certain things, which all should be protected under free speech.

00:15:40.800 Fast forward to 13 years, we have Ezra Levant, rebel commander himself

00:15:44.980 and great friend of this show with us.

00:15:46.780 Ezra, good to talk to you. Thanks for coming on today.

00:15:49.320 Well, it's my pleasure.

00:15:50.200 I'm afraid the law, under which I was prosecuted over a dozen years ago,

00:15:54.700 it's coming back through the Liberal Bill C-36

00:15:58.580 and actually it's coming back sort of weaponized.

00:16:02.440 You know those killer bees and then there's Africanized killer bees 1.00

00:16:06.180 that are even tougher apparently.

00:16:08.100 This isn't just like Section 13 I was grilled under.

00:16:11.320 This is like a killer bee version of that that is much worse

00:16:14.820 and I'm happy to tell you why.

00:16:16.600 Yeah, and I want to talk first off because a lot of people have looked at this

00:16:20.400 and said, okay, well, you know, Mark Stein and Maclean's were prosecuted

00:16:23.900 under the BC Human Rights Tribunal.

00:16:25.960 You were taken to task by Alberta

00:16:28.060 and this is of course the Canadian Human Rights Commission

00:16:30.540 that will have these new powers. 0.76

00:16:32.280 But my position on this has always been that

00:16:34.920 first off, the provinces tend to follow the lead of the federal government

00:16:38.460 but also they're all part of this one major regime

00:16:41.980 which is a regime that decides the speech that is uttered by individual people,

00:16:46.600 by media platforms, now by bloggers and people on social media.

00:16:50.840 It's all part of the same overarching discourse.

00:16:55.340 Yeah, well, I'm afraid that the pendulum is swinging against free speech.

00:17:01.220 I think the pendulum swung towards free speech

00:17:04.540 because of the overreach by the Alberta Human Rights Commission

00:17:09.360 in the video you showed there and their attack on Mark Stein.

00:17:12.460 But that was more than, that was about a decade ago.

00:17:15.540 And since that time, cancel culture, woke racial identity politics

00:17:21.800 have become mainstream.

00:17:23.520 They've leaped out of the fringes of academia

00:17:26.340 into the courts and certainly into politics.

00:17:30.000 And so it's coming back and it will be used vigorously

00:17:33.260 and they've added some accelerant to it.

00:17:39.080 Let me give you two examples.

00:17:40.400 That video you just showed, I was filming, that was actually at my law firm's office.

00:17:49.300 We had the right to film that interrogation, to talk about the accuser against me

00:17:56.440 who was a radical imam born in Pakistan, came to Canada,

00:18:00.380 didn't accept our ideas of the separation of mosque and state, etc.

00:18:03.780 That would be impossible under the new rule.

00:18:07.660 Because under Bill C-36, the Human Rights Commission has the right to ban anyone

00:18:14.400 from knowing who the accuser is, who the complainant is.

00:18:20.420 So not only would I not be able to know,

00:18:23.540 but no one else in the media, in the public would be able to know.

00:18:27.180 We have secret complainants and now secret witnesses.

00:18:33.960 Those are explicitly outlined in Bill C-36.

00:18:39.800 So it's not just the same censorship as before.

00:18:43.640 It's the same censorship, but they want to ensure that no one will ever be able to fight back.

00:18:48.840 You'll never know who's coming for you,

00:18:51.180 whether it's a, oh, I don't know, a disgruntled ex-employee,

00:18:55.940 a disgruntled ex-wife or ex-husband or ex-boyfriend or ex-girlfriend,

00:19:00.000 a rival, or I think the most likely scenario in Canada,

00:19:04.480 one of the Liberal government's paid aggressor groups,

00:19:09.000 like the laughably named Canadian Anti-Hate Network.

00:19:12.180 They just got a quarter million dollar grant from Stephen Gilbeau

00:19:14.780 to go out and hunt and complain against conservative opponents of Justin Trudeau.

00:19:20.980 They literally got a quarter million dollar budget

00:19:23.440 to hunt down Trudeau's enemies online and complain against them.

00:19:27.540 Well, who do you think is going to be the number one customer

00:19:29.320 of this hate speech provision, but we'll never know.

00:19:32.500 This is tremendously important, though,

00:19:34.160 because this body, the Canadian Human Rights Commission,

00:19:36.820 is not like a crown attorney.

00:19:38.380 It's not supposed to have an independent prosecution arm.

00:19:41.480 But when Section 13 was around the first time,

00:19:44.380 almost all of the complaints were filed by one single person.

00:19:47.820 And we just know that there will be activists whose full-time job

00:19:51.300 is finding this Twitter account they don't like,

00:19:54.200 this episode of your show, of my show,

00:19:56.280 and just filing in a systematic way these complaints.

00:19:59.820 Well, yeah, and I forgot to mention,

00:20:02.560 not only can the complainants be a group or a corporation

00:20:06.220 that's kept secret,

00:20:08.620 and not only can they give evidence in secret,

00:20:11.200 and by the way, we don't do that for any other kind of law.

00:20:13.340 Well, you can be prosecuting the mafia,

00:20:16.240 and you still have to take a stand, say your name,

00:20:19.180 because we have to know, well, who's the,

00:20:21.140 is it a grudge from a rival mob boss?

00:20:23.300 Yeah, I think I learned that in grade 11,

00:20:24.940 that the right to face your accuser

00:20:26.760 is one of the cornerstones of the rule of law in Canada.

00:20:29.900 Yeah, otherwise, how do you know what the angle is?

00:20:31.920 How do you know what the grudge is?

00:20:33.580 So, not only are you allowed to be a secret complainant

00:20:36.240 and give secret evidence,

00:20:37.180 but you get 20,000 bucks a pop

00:20:39.600 every time you catch someone.

00:20:41.940 And under C36, not only do you get up to 20 grand,

00:20:46.260 but the person who made the offensive Facebook post

00:20:49.200 has to also pay the government 50 grand.

00:20:53.240 So, I missed this.

00:20:54.460 You're saying you can actually claim a bounty

00:20:56.200 if you haul someone before the commission and win.

00:20:59.840 Yeah, it's right there in the legislation,

00:21:01.500 up to $20,000 per case.

00:21:04.260 So, that's a really profitable business.

00:21:08.460 And I think that's tax-free.

00:21:11.200 You go to the Human Rights Commission in secret.

00:21:14.460 You don't have to hire a lawyer.

00:21:16.180 They do it for you.

00:21:18.000 The bad guy is put on trial.

00:21:20.700 You can give secret evidence.

00:21:22.240 Obviously, you're not going to be cross-examined on it

00:21:24.260 in any meaningful way if you're secret.

00:21:26.580 And if you win, you get 20,000 bucks.

00:21:28.860 Well, why wouldn't people make a living out of this?

00:21:31.180 This is creating a whole new industry.

00:21:32.780 But I have to tell you, Andrew,

00:21:36.260 what we've been talking about

00:21:37.420 isn't even the worst part of the bill.

00:21:39.460 It's terrible,

00:21:40.520 but it is nowhere near the worst part of the bill.

00:21:43.980 This bill, C-36,

00:21:46.000 does bring back the censorship provision.

00:21:49.720 It does reintroduce the counterfeit right not to be offended.

00:21:55.300 It has all of that in there.

00:21:57.300 The pre-crime,

00:21:58.580 like you publish something likely to cause hurt feelings.

00:22:03.320 All that's back,

00:22:04.700 and the new secrecy provisions in there,

00:22:07.080 and the $20,000 bounty,

00:22:08.740 it's in there.

00:22:09.060 Check for yourself.

00:22:09.520 It's all in the bill.

00:22:10.860 That's not the worst part, Andrew.

00:22:12.980 The worst part is they also,

00:22:14.780 in the same bill,

00:22:16.160 make changes to the criminal code,

00:22:18.320 changes I've never seen or heard of

00:22:19.960 anywhere in the free world,

00:22:22.000 and I can explain them to you in two minutes.

00:22:24.960 The criminal code,

00:22:26.280 so I'm not talking about some kangaroo court,

00:22:28.520 Human Rights Commission.

00:22:29.400 The criminal code is being amended

00:22:30.960 in this same bill

00:22:32.460 to allow anyone in Canada

00:22:35.060 to go to a provincial court

00:22:37.320 and apply for what they call a recognizance.

00:22:42.500 It's like bail.

00:22:44.280 Apply to get their enemy,

00:22:46.980 their political rival,

00:22:48.340 to have a bunch of conditions put on their life.

00:22:52.180 It's like a restraining order,

00:22:54.200 but it only applies for biased crimes and hate crimes.

00:22:58.360 You can't get this restraining order

00:22:59.920 if someone is a robber or a murderer

00:23:03.520 or a rapist or any of those things.

00:23:06.440 It's a special criminal code provision

00:23:09.940 only for biased crimes,

00:23:12.020 but get this.

00:23:12.740 You can get it for someone

00:23:16.540 who hasn't done anything yet.

00:23:20.580 They haven't done anything yet.

00:23:21.440 Yeah, this is the Minority Report peace bond 0.70

00:23:23.580 for a crime that someone may commit in the future.

00:23:26.980 In fact, the title of this is

00:23:29.040 Fear of a Hate Crime.

00:23:31.800 So you go to court and say,

00:23:33.260 Your Honor,

00:23:33.860 he hasn't done anything.

00:23:36.560 He's not accused.

00:23:37.820 He's not charged.

00:23:38.780 He's not convicted.

00:23:39.660 He's not tried.

00:23:40.220 He's not sentenced.

00:23:41.180 He's not a criminal, Your Honor.

00:23:43.520 But this new section of the Criminal Code

00:23:45.480 says if I'm afraid of him

00:23:47.440 only for hate,

00:23:49.780 that human emotion,

00:23:51.080 not for he's going to kill me,

00:23:52.600 he's going to rape me, 0.99

00:23:53.200 he's going to stab me, 0.94

00:23:53.880 he's going to rob me.

00:23:54.860 No, no.

00:23:55.520 I'm afraid that he's a hater.

00:23:58.080 You can get a judge

00:23:59.320 to give you a list of things

00:24:00.800 that would shock you, Andrew.

00:24:02.080 Let me tell you some of them.

00:24:04.020 You can get someone put under house arrest.

00:24:07.260 You can limit the places they go

00:24:09.920 if they're allowed out

00:24:11.240 for certain hours of the day.

00:24:12.280 You can ban them from any place,

00:24:15.100 whether it's their work, school,

00:24:17.460 business, family.

00:24:20.260 You can ban them from communicating

00:24:22.100 directly or indirectly

00:24:24.020 with any person.

00:24:25.660 Again, family, friends,

00:24:27.080 political party,

00:24:28.540 associates, employees.

00:24:30.560 You can get any firearms

00:24:32.500 they own legally seized.

00:24:35.380 You can ban them,

00:24:36.720 this is crazy,

00:24:37.560 from drinking wine, beer,

00:24:39.180 or any other alcohol.

00:24:40.560 And subject them to testing

00:24:42.300 of that, it looked like.

00:24:43.460 Oh, yeah.

00:24:44.160 And they have to take a blood,

00:24:45.780 urine, or DNA test

00:24:47.000 on command.

00:24:47.920 The no communication part

00:24:51.820 is insane.

00:24:53.540 The no meeting people, 0.99

00:24:55.140 no going places

00:24:55.940 is insane.

00:24:57.800 Oh, and an electronic

00:24:59.400 ankle monitor,

00:25:00.740 like you would put on

00:25:02.900 a sexual predator

00:25:04.200 or something.

00:25:05.560 You can't go to court,

00:25:07.440 Andrew,

00:25:07.980 and say,

00:25:08.540 I'm afraid of that sexual predator

00:25:09.900 to put an ankle monitor on him.

00:25:11.860 Because the courts would say,

00:25:13.140 that's a pre-crime,

00:25:15.280 he hasn't done it yet.

00:25:16.140 When he's done something,

00:25:17.080 we'll arrest him.

00:25:17.900 You can't say,

00:25:19.080 that man,

00:25:19.600 I think he's going to kill me.

00:25:21.260 The judge would say,

00:25:22.400 he hasn't done it yet.

00:25:24.080 We'll stop him

00:25:25.020 if he moves on you.

00:25:26.200 But only for these new

00:25:28.200 hate crimes under C-36.

00:25:30.880 Hate's a human emotion,

00:25:31.900 by the way.

00:25:33.380 You can go to court

00:25:34.360 and get a preemptive strike

00:25:37.200 against your political enemies

00:25:39.380 for all these things

00:25:41.300 we lined up.

00:25:41.920 Ankle monitor,

00:25:43.040 no alcohol,

00:25:44.080 blood, urine,

00:25:45.000 and DNA testing,

00:25:46.320 no firearms,

00:25:47.960 no leaving the house

00:25:49.520 during certain hours,

00:25:50.460 no going to certain places,

00:25:51.620 no communicating directly

00:25:52.700 or indirectly

00:25:53.300 with certain people.

00:25:55.240 I've never heard of that before.

00:25:57.400 That's a pre-crime

00:25:58.700 like minority report.

00:26:00.820 And I've never heard

00:26:02.080 of anything so illiberal.

00:26:04.020 If that law becomes,

00:26:05.700 if that bill becomes law,

00:26:07.480 I truly think we will

00:26:08.600 live in an,

00:26:10.360 I'm not going to say

00:26:10.960 an unfree country,

00:26:12.660 but I'll say just

00:26:13.500 a partially free country

00:26:14.880 if that becomes law.

00:26:16.120 And just while we're talking

00:26:17.320 about the peace bond here,

00:26:18.920 I want to read if I can.

00:26:20.540 This is under the bill

00:26:22.500 section 810.012

00:26:25.740 subsection 5.

00:26:28.200 If you refuse

00:26:29.380 to enter into this recognizance,

00:26:32.080 you can be put in jail

00:26:33.520 by the provincial judge

00:26:34.880 for 12 months.

00:26:36.280 Yeah.

00:26:36.380 So if the judge says,

00:26:38.280 yes,

00:26:38.540 we think that person X

00:26:40.240 is right to fear,

00:26:41.540 you may commit

00:26:42.160 one of these new hate offenses

00:26:43.740 and you say,

00:26:44.860 I'm not playing ball,

00:26:45.920 you can be put in jail

00:26:46.860 for that alone

00:26:47.540 for 12 months.

00:26:49.100 And you are right.

00:26:50.000 I mean,

00:26:50.140 I talked to Christine Van Gein

00:26:51.740 of the Canadian Constitution

00:26:52.880 Foundation

00:26:53.480 about this last week

00:26:54.540 and she said peace bonds

00:26:56.060 are already subjected

00:26:58.160 to a lot of criticism

00:26:59.600 from civil libertarians

00:27:01.040 because of the nature

00:27:02.720 of them going

00:27:03.660 for future crimes,

00:27:05.120 crimes that you've not

00:27:06.020 been charged

00:27:06.560 or convicted of

00:27:07.440 and to apply that

00:27:08.980 to something

00:27:09.480 that involves

00:27:10.220 a level of thinking,

00:27:11.520 a thought crime,

00:27:12.900 is absolutely egregious.

00:27:15.440 Yeah.

00:27:15.960 I mean,

00:27:16.160 I remember when I was

00:27:17.020 an articling student

00:27:17.760 way back in the day,

00:27:18.780 one of the very first things

00:27:19.840 I did was to serve

00:27:21.440 a restraining order

00:27:22.380 on a bad guy

00:27:23.780 to keep away

00:27:24.700 from his ex.

00:27:26.240 And I remember drafting that

00:27:27.860 and it was a very powerful

00:27:29.140 legal tool

00:27:29.900 and I served him on him.

00:27:31.380 He was actually in jail.

00:27:32.580 I went into the maximum

00:27:33.460 security jail

00:27:34.220 to serve him

00:27:35.300 with this restraining order

00:27:36.180 which just sounds weird

00:27:37.300 but he was going to get out

00:27:38.580 and his ex was afraid.

00:27:40.820 Even in that restraining order

00:27:42.640 against a convicted criminal,

00:27:45.840 he still had rights.

00:27:47.600 At the bottom of the restraining order,

00:27:49.220 it basically said,

00:27:50.820 if you disagree with this,

00:27:53.240 come back to court

00:27:54.220 and say why

00:27:55.140 and it might be modified.

00:27:57.120 But the bar was high

00:27:58.980 to get that.

00:28:00.580 And to have

00:28:02.480 a political restraining order,

00:28:04.840 if you are afraid

00:28:06.340 someone has the human emotion

00:28:07.900 of hate,

00:28:09.120 not that they're going to hurt you.

00:28:10.740 Let me just be crystal clear.

00:28:12.140 Another thing Bill C-36 does

00:28:14.200 is it defines hate

00:28:15.960 as an emotion

00:28:17.780 which is true.

00:28:19.800 So you're criminalizing

00:28:21.220 an emotion

00:28:21.880 and criminalizing it

00:28:24.180 because if someone's afraid

00:28:25.960 you're going to have an emotion

00:28:27.060 and can commit

00:28:28.300 an emotion crime,

00:28:29.940 they can go to a court.

00:28:31.020 Now, I should note

00:28:32.060 that the Attorney General

00:28:33.260 has to sign off on that

00:28:34.400 but these days,

00:28:35.380 what Attorney General wouldn't?

00:28:37.620 So...

00:28:38.100 Well, yeah,

00:28:38.440 and by the way,

00:28:39.080 just on an aside,

00:28:39.960 we know what happens

00:28:40.800 when Attorney Generals defy

00:28:42.400 or Attorneys General rather

00:28:43.620 defy the political will

00:28:45.480 of the governments they serve.

00:28:46.680 Just ask Jody Wills and Raybould.

00:28:47.920 So there is no protection

00:28:49.300 about this process

00:28:50.520 not becoming politicized

00:28:52.280 on both the Human Rights Act

00:28:53.780 complaints

00:28:54.300 and also this peace bond power.

00:28:57.060 Yeah,

00:28:57.640 and it's terrifying

00:28:58.780 and I have to tell you,

00:28:59.820 I was thinking about myself

00:29:01.460 when I read this

00:29:02.300 and I'm not out of vanity.

00:29:03.960 I just thought,

00:29:04.560 who do they have in mind?

00:29:06.820 Who in this country

00:29:07.900 would they try and shut down,

00:29:10.240 say you can't talk

00:29:11.920 to your employees,

00:29:13.020 you can't talk to the public,

00:29:15.180 you can't go places,

00:29:16.660 like I think that they have

00:29:18.980 clearly in mind,

00:29:20.560 I mean,

00:29:20.720 they've come for me before,

00:29:21.920 you just showed a clip of that.

00:29:24.140 Of course,

00:29:24.600 they're going to talk

00:29:25.140 about Rebel News.

00:29:25.980 I think they might come

00:29:27.080 for TNC.news also.

00:29:29.900 I think they might even go

00:29:31.040 for Maxine Bernier.

00:29:32.500 They've already arrested him

00:29:34.040 for going to a peaceful

00:29:35.640 political protest in Manitoba.

00:29:37.700 I think this is absolutely

00:29:39.580 100% about political,

00:29:43.040 shrinking the bandwidth

00:29:44.420 of political dissent

00:29:45.520 in this country.

00:29:46.400 It's got nothing to do

00:29:47.260 with real crime.

00:29:48.060 Let me give you

00:29:48.480 this example, Andrew.

00:29:50.360 In the last week,

00:29:52.240 five Catholic churches

00:29:53.840 have been burnt by arson.

00:29:56.360 That's a real crime,

00:29:58.080 destruction of property,

00:29:59.420 destruction of the religious center

00:30:01.280 of so many of these communities,

00:30:03.420 not even a statement

00:30:05.100 from Justin Trudeau.

00:30:06.720 You've got a crime wave.

00:30:08.180 You might even call it

00:30:09.660 a terrorist crime wave.

00:30:11.180 It's certainly a hate crime wave.

00:30:13.220 Real life,

00:30:14.220 not a peep from Trudeau.

00:30:16.480 And frankly,

00:30:17.060 Aaron O'Toole's

00:30:17.660 been pretty quiet too.

00:30:18.960 Well, I've talked earlier on

00:30:20.640 about Aaron O'Toole's

00:30:21.600 silence on C36.

00:30:23.600 Let me just ask you,

00:30:24.640 before we wrap things up here,

00:30:26.380 Ezra,

00:30:26.640 you literally wrote the book

00:30:28.060 more than a decade ago

00:30:29.620 about this.

00:30:30.180 It was a great book,

00:30:30.940 Shakedown,

00:30:31.840 How Our Government

00:30:32.580 is Undermining Democracy

00:30:34.100 in the Name of Human Rights.

00:30:35.620 It's in 2013,

00:30:37.120 you saw the repeal

00:30:38.880 of Section 13,

00:30:40.360 and this was a victory

00:30:41.640 for people who like free speech.

00:30:43.720 Did you envision it

00:30:44.960 coming back at that point?

00:30:46.320 Did you think that it was

00:30:47.140 going to be a short-lived victory?

00:30:49.580 Well, I was worried

00:30:50.380 because when that bill

00:30:51.760 passed to repeal

00:30:53.320 the censorship provision,

00:30:55.400 only a single

00:30:56.520 non-conservative MP

00:30:58.200 voted for it.

00:30:59.180 Scott Sims,

00:31:00.040 the Liberal,

00:31:00.780 who's still an MP.

00:31:01.580 The Bloc, 0.93

00:31:03.080 all the other liberals,

00:31:04.540 the NDP

00:31:04.920 voted for censorship.

00:31:06.580 So I knew

00:31:07.380 that it was time-limited

00:31:09.260 because those parties

00:31:10.420 don't believe

00:31:11.320 in freedom of speech anymore.

00:31:12.780 And we see that now.

00:31:14.340 My worry

00:31:14.940 is that the Conservatives

00:31:17.040 don't believe

00:31:17.480 in free speech either.

00:31:18.920 I'm worried

00:31:19.840 that our judges

00:31:21.120 don't believe

00:31:21.700 in free speech either.

00:31:22.720 I'm worried

00:31:23.120 that our civil liberties

00:31:24.140 NGOs

00:31:25.020 don't believe

00:31:26.340 in free speech,

00:31:27.020 at least for

00:31:27.580 certain people.

00:31:28.980 And we've seen that

00:31:30.120 through the lockdown

00:31:30.860 and the shrinking

00:31:32.480 of our civil liberties

00:31:33.480 over the last year

00:31:34.180 and a half.

00:31:35.000 I am worried

00:31:36.100 not just that

00:31:36.820 the liberals mean it,

00:31:38.440 but that most

00:31:39.140 of society does too.

00:31:41.500 And it's a shame

00:31:42.840 because,

00:31:44.080 and the media,

00:31:45.100 by the way,

00:31:45.980 when I was charged

00:31:47.620 with hate speech

00:31:48.360 a decade ago,

00:31:49.860 90% of the media,

00:31:51.300 including most

00:31:51.980 of the CBC,

00:31:52.760 were supportive of me.

00:31:54.420 These days,

00:31:55.720 they would be

00:31:56.480 cheering a prosecution.

00:31:58.880 So I hate to say it,

00:31:59.960 but the cultural

00:32:00.960 leadership of Canada,

00:32:02.600 the political leadership,

00:32:03.920 the legal leadership,

00:32:05.220 the academic leadership,

00:32:06.740 it's completely

00:32:08.180 for cancel culture.

00:32:09.360 This bill,

00:32:10.940 Bill C36,

00:32:12.520 is the legislation

00:32:14.380 of cancel culture.

00:32:17.140 And the only people

00:32:18.240 against it

00:32:18.940 are the people.

00:32:21.560 I don't know

00:32:22.520 if that's enough.

00:32:23.260 All the establishment

00:32:24.140 is for it.

00:32:25.420 I know ordinary Canadians

00:32:26.760 are against it,

00:32:27.700 or at least I hope so.

00:32:29.280 Maybe they've been infected

00:32:30.280 with wokeism too,

00:32:31.320 Andrew.

00:32:31.680 I wish I could have

00:32:32.700 brought you on

00:32:33.200 to be the bringer

00:32:34.380 of better news.

00:32:35.420 But you know what?

00:32:36.000 People need to understand

00:32:36.780 how bad things are

00:32:37.780 to understand the stakes

00:32:39.140 in fighting back.

00:32:40.120 Ezra Levant,

00:32:40.740 rebel commander,

00:32:41.780 and even though

00:32:42.300 it's 12 years old,

00:32:43.160 I have to promote

00:32:43.760 that book again.

00:32:44.460 Author of

00:32:44.840 Shakedown,

00:32:45.460 How Our Government

00:32:45.980 Is Undermining Democracy

00:32:47.320 in the name

00:32:48.520 of human rights.

00:32:49.480 Buy it before

00:32:50.200 it is banned.

00:32:51.500 Ezra,

00:32:51.860 always a pleasure.

00:32:52.540 Thanks for coming on.

00:32:53.260 Thanks, my friend.

00:32:53.980 Thank you.

00:32:54.900 We've got to take

00:32:55.840 a quick break here

00:32:56.760 when we come back.

00:32:57.440 More of The Andrew Lawton Show

00:32:58.800 on True North.

00:32:59.940 Stay tuned.

00:33:02.780 You're tuned in

00:33:03.660 to The Andrew Lawton Show.

00:33:07.220 Welcome back

00:33:07.980 to The Andrew Lawton Show.

00:33:09.380 This week is Canada Day,

00:33:11.960 as your calendars call it,

00:33:13.540 or Dominion Day,

00:33:14.640 as I still call it,

00:33:16.060 or National Hate the Country Day,

00:33:18.340 as the mainstream media

00:33:19.420 is, I believe,

00:33:20.140 gearing up to call it.

00:33:21.400 I will say

00:33:22.280 that there's no better way

00:33:23.600 to get Dominion Day

00:33:24.700 people like myself

00:33:25.720 on board with Canada Day

00:33:27.060 than to try to cancel

00:33:28.660 Canada Day,

00:33:29.320 which forces us all

00:33:30.200 to go into just

00:33:30.920 contrarian mode

00:33:31.740 and start screaming

00:33:32.880 Happy Canada Day

00:33:33.760 from the rooftops

00:33:34.480 just because everyone's saying

00:33:35.540 you are not supposed to do it.

00:33:37.580 I will say

00:33:38.560 that for years

00:33:39.820 the political right

00:33:40.900 was trying to fight

00:33:41.780 the war on Christmas.

00:33:42.680 And you would see

00:33:44.560 occasionally those buttons

00:33:45.880 people wear.

00:33:46.460 It's okay to wish me

00:33:47.220 a Merry Christmas

00:33:47.900 and all that.

00:33:48.800 I never thought

00:33:49.600 that Canada Day

00:33:50.520 would be the next holiday

00:33:51.540 to get cancelled.

00:33:52.900 I thought Easter

00:33:53.520 probably stood a good shot.

00:33:55.140 I knew Christmas was,

00:33:56.040 I mean, that one

00:33:56.480 just for sure.

00:33:57.180 But I didn't think

00:33:57.880 Canada Day

00:33:58.460 was going to be the one

00:33:59.180 to go to the top,

00:33:59.960 but it is.

00:34:01.960 Discoveries of

00:34:02.700 unmarked graves

00:34:03.620 that have been alleged

00:34:04.380 by native bands

00:34:06.000 in British Columbia

00:34:07.440 and Saskatchewan

00:34:08.300 and likely elsewhere

00:34:09.540 have caused

00:34:11.000 this reckoning

00:34:12.120 with Canada's

00:34:13.600 past treatment

00:34:14.160 of indigenous peoples,

00:34:15.120 a reckoning

00:34:15.620 that has invigorated

00:34:17.260 what a lot of people

00:34:18.700 are taking

00:34:19.180 to be a visceral loathing

00:34:20.900 of this country.

00:34:22.960 And I should say,

00:34:23.700 by the way,

00:34:24.040 in a lot of cases

00:34:24.820 this is not coming

00:34:25.740 from indigenous peoples.

00:34:27.460 Ellis Ross,

00:34:28.380 who's a BC politician

00:34:29.660 and indigenous MLA,

00:34:31.500 has said

00:34:32.020 that you need to build,

00:34:33.860 you don't need to destroy.

00:34:35.900 And he did

00:34:36.540 a great interview

00:34:37.340 on CBC's

00:34:38.420 cross-country checkup

00:34:39.560 in which he talked

00:34:40.820 about this.

00:34:41.600 I learned a long time ago

00:34:43.080 instead of giving

00:34:44.020 into my anger

00:34:44.720 and my thoughts

00:34:46.440 of revenge,

00:34:47.660 it's better to build.

00:34:50.560 Anybody can tear down.

00:34:53.160 Anybody can rip

00:34:54.080 something apart.

00:34:54.720 It's easy.

00:34:55.520 It's easy to say no.

00:34:57.500 It's much tougher

00:34:58.640 to build something

00:34:59.380 and I've got the scars

00:35:00.460 to prove it.

00:35:02.020 And being the bad guy

00:35:03.300 to stand up and say,

00:35:04.240 no, Canada's not

00:35:05.280 what it was,

00:35:05.880 the same thing it was

00:35:06.680 a hundred years ago,

00:35:07.860 a hundred fifty years ago.

00:35:09.240 Yes, there are some things

00:35:10.240 that we have to resolve.

00:35:12.060 For my part,

00:35:12.880 I think what's really

00:35:14.060 unresolved,

00:35:15.140 especially in terms

00:35:15.780 of residential school,

00:35:17.460 it's an open wound.

00:35:19.600 And I've got some ideas

00:35:21.080 behind that

00:35:21.700 and how to help

00:35:22.580 heal that wound,

00:35:24.080 but not with all this

00:35:25.580 rhetoric going around,

00:35:26.760 not with,

00:35:28.060 I mean,

00:35:28.380 I don't really support

00:35:30.560 anything that causes

00:35:32.240 divisiveness.

00:35:33.560 There was something

00:35:34.460 very poetic in that

00:35:35.940 and this is a man

00:35:36.860 whose parents went

00:35:37.840 to residential schools,

00:35:38.920 his friends,

00:35:39.840 he said,

00:35:40.180 went to residential schools

00:35:41.240 and he says that

00:35:42.160 anyone can tear down,

00:35:43.260 anyone can rip something apart,

00:35:44.780 it's tougher to build something

00:35:46.160 and he is saying

00:35:47.500 that as a country,

00:35:48.460 we need to build

00:35:49.180 and that's a part of healing,

00:35:50.540 not simply destroying.

00:35:52.380 It's one thing to add

00:35:53.960 to Canada Day.

00:35:55.000 Say, you know what,

00:35:55.580 on this country's

00:35:56.580 celebratory birthday,

00:35:58.000 we have to take a look

00:35:59.260 at our past

00:35:59.980 and we have to understand

00:36:00.820 it better

00:36:01.320 and, you know,

00:36:02.000 I look at my own education,

00:36:03.340 I did not learn

00:36:04.280 all that much

00:36:05.200 about Indigenous

00:36:06.080 people's history.

00:36:07.060 I would have loved

00:36:07.740 to have learned more.

00:36:08.500 It's a part of this country

00:36:10.000 but when you celebrate

00:36:12.440 your country,

00:36:13.920 you are celebrating

00:36:15.080 it warts and all,

00:36:16.040 you're not whitewashing it

00:36:17.440 but you're saying

00:36:18.460 that there's something

00:36:19.280 there to celebrate

00:36:20.400 and Canada is

00:36:22.260 as a country

00:36:23.060 built upon its history,

00:36:24.880 built upon tradition.

00:36:26.640 We cannot destroy that

00:36:28.220 without trying to destroy

00:36:29.660 the very foundation

00:36:30.680 and the very underpinning

00:36:31.740 of this country

00:36:32.660 which is what a lot

00:36:33.480 of the activists want

00:36:34.600 and remember,

00:36:36.680 it wasn't that long ago

00:36:37.680 that when you were

00:36:38.180 to stand up for a statue

00:36:39.920 whether it's Sir John A. McDonald

00:36:41.300 Sir Wilfrid Laurier

00:36:42.400 of Egerton Ryerson

00:36:43.720 they would say

00:36:44.700 and you would say

00:36:45.440 well, you're trying

00:36:46.080 to erase history.

00:36:47.160 The activists would say

00:36:48.000 oh no,

00:36:48.980 you're just taking down

00:36:50.180 a statue.

00:36:50.920 You're not taking away history.

00:36:52.560 It's not going to go

00:36:53.500 beyond that

00:36:54.120 and everyone

00:36:55.620 said it was not

00:36:56.860 a brilliant observation

00:36:57.880 but everyone said

00:36:59.240 well,

00:36:59.900 they're not going to

00:37:00.560 stop at statues

00:37:01.440 and this is exactly

00:37:03.100 where we are.

00:37:03.920 They aren't just

00:37:04.400 stopping as statues.

00:37:05.400 Now they're going on

00:37:06.240 to Canada Day itself

00:37:07.860 and there are two questions

00:37:09.700 that come to mind

00:37:10.480 of that.

00:37:10.880 Number one,

00:37:11.940 look around the world.

00:37:13.820 What country do you like?

00:37:15.960 Name a country

00:37:16.620 that you think

00:37:17.120 is worth celebrating.

00:37:18.840 I bet that

00:37:19.940 if you were to have

00:37:20.980 a look around

00:37:21.780 you're not going to

00:37:23.120 find a country

00:37:23.840 that's better than Canada 0.54

00:37:25.180 on all of these

00:37:26.100 different grounds.

00:37:26.860 This is a country

00:37:27.580 that literally has

00:37:28.460 enshrined in its existence

00:37:30.540 multiculturalism

00:37:32.120 which we can debate

00:37:33.680 the implications of

00:37:34.660 but if you want a country

00:37:35.760 that's pluralistic

00:37:36.580 and inclusive

00:37:37.100 you're not going to

00:37:38.080 find a better example

00:37:39.340 than Canada.

00:37:40.940 So a lot of these

00:37:41.680 activists could not

00:37:42.380 point to a country

00:37:43.200 that they particularly like

00:37:44.500 which speaks to

00:37:45.700 MLA Ellis Ross'

00:37:47.000 belief that they're

00:37:47.720 only interested

00:37:48.620 in destroying.

00:37:49.420 They're only interested

00:37:50.280 in tearing down.

00:37:52.720 And yes,

00:37:53.500 there are indigenous

00:37:54.180 communities around

00:37:55.180 the world that are

00:37:56.020 behind this

00:37:56.660 but by and large

00:37:57.480 it seems to be

00:37:58.620 non-indigenous

00:38:00.460 activist

00:38:01.320 leftist voices

00:38:02.680 that are pushing

00:38:04.380 this anti-Canada

00:38:05.720 narrative

00:38:06.540 that are pushing

00:38:07.180 this loathing

00:38:08.060 this visceral loathing

00:38:08.980 as I called it

00:38:09.700 of Canada.

00:38:11.240 Not exclusively

00:38:12.100 and I actually want

00:38:13.480 to talk about this

00:38:14.100 piece in Chatelaine

00:38:15.160 which I admit

00:38:16.000 is not on my

00:38:17.000 regular reading list

00:38:18.020 but there was a

00:38:18.620 Chatelaine article

00:38:19.340 that crossed my

00:38:20.260 my desk that I

00:38:21.800 not a physical copy

00:38:22.840 it was online

00:38:23.440 that I wanted to

00:38:24.680 read from

00:38:25.260 because there was

00:38:25.780 something about this

00:38:26.480 that I actually

00:38:27.360 found very

00:38:28.760 I'm not a

00:38:30.460 particularly angry

00:38:31.400 person but very

00:38:32.480 frustrating.

00:38:33.840 The article is

00:38:34.340 called

00:38:34.660 As a Muslim

00:38:35.460 I Face Islamophobia

00:38:37.020 As an Immigrant

00:38:38.340 I Failed Indigenous 1.00

00:38:39.500 People

00:38:39.960 It's written in

00:38:40.760 Chatelaine by

00:38:41.700 journalist Fatima Syed

00:38:43.400 She is an immigrant

00:38:44.960 to Canada

00:38:45.520 from Pakistan

00:38:46.700 and she writes

00:38:47.760 of this experience

00:38:48.660 of coming here

00:38:49.320 She says

00:38:49.760 When my family

00:38:51.280 moved to Canada

00:38:52.180 from Pakistan

00:38:52.900 we weren't told

00:38:54.160 that this was

00:38:55.380 a land built

00:38:56.420 on genocide

00:38:57.280 and erasure

00:38:58.240 No one would

00:38:59.740 want to move

00:39:00.560 to such a country

00:39:01.440 Instead we believed

00:39:02.940 that Canada

00:39:03.500 was an economic

00:39:04.280 opportunity

00:39:04.900 We believed

00:39:06.100 it was the greatest

00:39:07.340 multicultural country

00:39:08.640 in the world

00:39:09.120 We believed

00:39:10.060 it was a safe

00:39:11.140 country

00:39:11.580 It didn't take me

00:39:13.040 long after we

00:39:13.920 immigrated to Canada

00:39:14.760 to realize that

00:39:15.600 none of that is true

00:39:16.460 It took me much

00:39:17.640 longer to realize

00:39:18.560 that immigrants 1.00

00:39:19.040 are also part

00:39:20.040 of the problem

00:39:20.600 We are guilty

00:39:21.680 of Indigenous

00:39:22.260 displacement

00:39:22.940 I think many

00:39:23.980 of us

00:39:24.320 are just

00:39:24.820 starting to

00:39:25.320 realize it

00:39:26.000 and very slowly

00:39:27.460 No one

00:39:29.620 would want

00:39:30.320 to move

00:39:30.960 to such

00:39:31.580 a country

00:39:32.280 A land

00:39:33.520 built on

00:39:34.220 genocide

00:39:34.860 and erasure

00:39:35.760 So this speaks

00:39:37.980 I think

00:39:38.520 to the point

00:39:38.960 I just made

00:39:39.620 No one

00:39:40.440 would move

00:39:41.320 to Pakistan

00:39:42.180 and then start

00:39:43.020 saying

00:39:43.300 I don't like

00:39:44.080 the way

00:39:44.320 Imran Khan

00:39:44.920 is doing

00:39:45.280 things here

00:39:45.880 They don't

00:39:47.460 respect

00:39:47.800 religious freedom

00:39:48.480 You'd find

00:39:49.400 yourself

00:39:49.820 very quickly

00:39:50.600 thrust out

00:39:51.500 of Pakistan

00:39:52.000 or worse

00:39:53.000 if you were

00:39:53.920 to do that

00:39:54.340 Now

00:39:54.560 I'm not a

00:39:55.520 relativist

00:39:56.000 I believe

00:39:56.420 that things

00:39:56.920 have a value

00:39:57.940 in and of

00:39:58.380 themselves

00:39:58.680 So Canada

00:39:59.720 being better

00:40:00.600 than other

00:40:00.960 places

00:40:01.320 does not

00:40:01.760 mean that

00:40:02.160 Canada

00:40:02.480 is necessarily

00:40:03.520 great on

00:40:04.020 its own

00:40:04.400 However

00:40:05.000 Canada

00:40:05.420 is a

00:40:06.160 great

00:40:06.420 country

00:40:06.820 and Canada

00:40:08.100 does have

00:40:08.980 all of these

00:40:09.860 tremendously

00:40:10.260 positive things

00:40:11.100 to celebrate

00:40:11.780 which makes

00:40:12.680 me wonder

00:40:13.220 why someone

00:40:14.120 who has

00:40:14.720 received an

00:40:15.460 opportunity

00:40:16.020 in Canada

00:40:16.680 that they

00:40:17.680 and their

00:40:18.260 family

00:40:18.680 did not

00:40:19.340 think they

00:40:19.780 were getting

00:40:20.180 in their

00:40:20.480 home country

00:40:21.220 thinks it's

00:40:23.420 appropriate

00:40:24.060 to crap

00:40:25.500 all over

00:40:26.280 that very

00:40:26.840 country

00:40:27.200 that's given

00:40:27.740 them that

00:40:28.280 and I've

00:40:30.100 got very

00:40:30.580 little tolerance

00:40:31.740 for Canada

00:40:33.120 hating

00:40:33.500 from people

00:40:34.160 that chose

00:40:34.860 Canada

00:40:35.260 for a reason

00:40:36.280 and in a

00:40:38.160 certain way

00:40:38.540 if you were

00:40:38.920 born in Canada

00:40:39.620 you've lived

00:40:40.040 your whole life

00:40:40.580 here

00:40:40.780 this is just

00:40:41.580 where you are

00:40:42.120 okay

00:40:42.440 the idea

00:40:43.360 of just

00:40:44.080 fleeing

00:40:44.620 somewhere else

00:40:45.360 when you

00:40:45.700 don't necessarily

00:40:46.300 have a place

00:40:46.900 to go

00:40:47.220 if you don't

00:40:47.580 like your

00:40:47.880 country

00:40:48.180 is a little

00:40:48.960 bit difficult

00:40:49.440 but anyone

00:40:50.280 who chose

00:40:50.900 to live

00:40:51.320 here

00:40:51.640 what is it

00:40:53.280 about Canada

00:40:54.320 that keeps

00:40:55.440 you here

00:40:55.820 then

00:40:56.060 and I don't

00:40:57.580 think that

00:40:58.000 Fatima Syed's

00:40:59.000 position is

00:40:59.840 representative of

00:41:00.920 the immigrant

00:41:01.640 experience

00:41:02.240 from my

00:41:02.820 experiences

00:41:03.780 anyway

00:41:04.140 she already 0.99

00:41:04.420 used the word

00:41:04.720 experience

00:41:05.160 now thrice

00:41:05.760 in a sentence

00:41:06.240 Rupa

00:41:06.960 Subramanya

00:41:07.860 in the

00:41:08.220 National Post

00:41:08.820 had a great

00:41:09.500 piece about

00:41:09.940 this

00:41:10.100 she said

00:41:10.460 to those

00:41:11.100 who choose

00:41:11.540 to come

00:41:11.900 here

00:41:12.060 cancelling

00:41:12.540 Canada

00:41:12.880 Day

00:41:13.200 seems

00:41:13.840 utterly

00:41:14.320 bizarre

00:41:15.040 she says

00:41:15.780 the idea

00:41:16.460 of Canada

00:41:17.100 is worth

00:41:17.780 celebrating

00:41:18.560 she points

00:41:19.540 to the

00:41:19.760 polling that

00:41:20.320 says

00:41:20.560 most Canadians

00:41:21.600 agree

00:41:21.960 and says

00:41:22.280 it's a small

00:41:22.720 number of

00:41:23.100 far left

00:41:23.460 activists

00:41:23.960 who are

00:41:24.540 calling for

00:41:25.020 cancellation

00:41:25.660 of a nation

00:41:27.320 they don't

00:41:28.320 really believe

00:41:29.180 in

00:41:29.600 and she

00:41:30.360 nails it 0.77

00:41:31.040 here

00:41:31.240 she absolutely

00:41:32.140 nails it 0.77

00:41:32.620 she says

00:41:32.940 they believe

00:41:33.500 that Canada

00:41:34.060 as a nation

00:41:34.740 state

00:41:35.120 is fundamentally

00:41:36.220 evil

00:41:36.720 a white

00:41:37.660 colonial

00:41:38.260 settler society 0.67

00:41:39.320 that is

00:41:40.140 illegitimate

00:41:40.700 and immoral

00:41:41.260 their extreme

00:41:42.060 views

00:41:42.560 must not

00:41:43.620 be allowed

00:41:44.120 to shape

00:41:44.520 a legitimate

00:41:44.980 national debate

00:41:45.820 on how

00:41:46.680 Canada

00:41:47.120 can better

00:41:47.720 itself

00:41:48.140 and that

00:41:49.100 that is

00:41:49.440 perfect

00:41:49.700 and I would

00:41:50.180 say

00:41:50.480 to extend

00:41:51.440 that thought

00:41:52.060 a lot

00:41:52.720 of them

00:41:52.940 I think

00:41:53.200 object

00:41:53.480 to all

00:41:53.980 nation

00:41:54.340 states

00:41:54.700 they object

00:41:55.160 to the

00:41:55.440 existence

00:41:55.840 of a

00:41:56.180 nation

00:41:56.420 state

00:41:56.780 because

00:41:57.380 they don't

00:41:57.880 have a

00:41:58.400 country

00:41:58.860 in which

00:41:59.820 the

00:42:00.180 indigenous

00:42:00.780 people

00:42:01.560 have had

00:42:02.680 a relationship

00:42:03.380 with a

00:42:04.260 national

00:42:04.660 government

00:42:05.080 a settler

00:42:05.620 government

00:42:06.000 as they

00:42:06.260 call it

00:42:06.640 that they

00:42:07.460 would model

00:42:08.120 Canada

00:42:08.700 after

00:42:09.120 all of

00:42:10.420 them

00:42:10.520 have

00:42:10.700 dealt

00:42:11.120 with

00:42:11.280 this

00:42:11.440 Australia

00:42:11.980 New

00:42:12.300 Zealand

00:42:12.800 United

00:42:13.540 States

00:42:14.000 and

00:42:14.280 it's

00:42:14.600 not

00:42:14.760 to

00:42:14.880 say

00:42:15.020 there

00:42:15.160 have

00:42:15.320 not

00:42:15.540 been

00:42:15.720 positive

00:42:16.200 inroads

00:42:16.620 made

00:42:17.080 but this

00:42:18.120 is a

00:42:18.500 dynamic

00:42:19.160 that no

00:42:20.000 one can

00:42:20.360 point to

00:42:20.760 a country

00:42:21.220 that seems

00:42:21.720 to have

00:42:22.020 nailed

00:42:22.360 it

00:42:22.700 and that's

00:42:23.880 very

00:42:24.160 important

00:42:24.640 so do

00:42:25.860 we dwell

00:42:26.520 in the

00:42:26.980 past

00:42:27.460 or do

00:42:28.720 we accept

00:42:29.240 the past

00:42:29.720 acknowledge

00:42:30.120 the past

00:42:30.640 learn from

00:42:31.100 the past

00:42:31.520 and move

00:42:32.280 forward

00:42:32.640 a process

00:42:33.560 which is

00:42:34.160 part of

00:42:34.600 why you

00:42:35.080 celebrate

00:42:35.520 a country

00:42:36.000 that is

00:42:36.680 capable

00:42:37.200 of that

00:42:38.180 introspection

00:42:39.120 and that's

00:42:40.760 what Canada

00:42:41.240 is

00:42:41.720 so no

00:42:43.040 celebrating

00:42:43.520 Canada

00:42:43.880 is not

00:42:44.360 this

00:42:44.560 chest

00:42:44.940 thumping

00:42:45.320 jingoistic 0.58

00:42:46.200 exercise

00:42:47.780 that's devoid

00:42:48.860 of understanding

00:42:49.960 history

00:42:50.440 quite the contrary

00:42:51.300 it's accepting

00:42:52.260 the role that

00:42:52.860 history has played

00:42:53.640 in bringing us

00:42:54.400 to where we are

00:42:55.060 and striving

00:42:55.940 to continue

00:42:56.540 to make the

00:42:57.040 country better

00:42:57.640 and better

00:42:58.000 that is the

00:42:58.640 idea of Canada

00:43:00.020 when you're

00:43:00.420 celebrating

00:43:00.820 Canada Day

00:43:01.560 you are not

00:43:02.580 celebrating

00:43:03.420 every single

00:43:04.300 decision that

00:43:05.000 Canada has 0.52

00:43:05.540 made

00:43:05.960 you are

00:43:07.020 celebrating

00:43:07.600 a longer

00:43:08.260 narrative

00:43:08.820 that is

00:43:09.200 still

00:43:09.500 on its

00:43:10.080 way

00:43:10.320 forward

00:43:10.760 and a lot

00:43:12.180 of these

00:43:12.440 people I

00:43:12.980 think would

00:43:13.400 want a

00:43:13.940 regime change

00:43:14.860 when they want

00:43:15.920 to topple the

00:43:16.440 statues of

00:43:17.000 John A.

00:43:17.380 Macdonald

00:43:17.720 they want to

00:43:18.460 do what

00:43:18.980 they want to

00:43:20.140 do what

00:43:20.440 Iraqi rebels

00:43:21.220 did in

00:43:22.200 2003 with

00:43:23.380 the statue

00:43:23.800 of Saddam Hussein

00:43:24.540 not just to

00:43:25.080 take down

00:43:25.420 the statue

00:43:25.900 but to just

00:43:26.780 topple the

00:43:27.380 regime and

00:43:28.000 replace it

00:43:28.500 with a new

00:43:28.900 one

00:43:29.340 except they

00:43:30.020 don't have

00:43:30.540 anything new

00:43:31.100 they're not

00:43:31.500 in the

00:43:31.880 building game

00:43:32.560 as Ellis Ross

00:43:33.460 said

00:43:33.620 they do not

00:43:34.180 know what

00:43:35.080 it is

00:43:35.340 they want

00:43:35.660 to create

00:43:36.120 they only

00:43:36.940 know what

00:43:37.500 it is

00:43:37.780 they despise

00:43:38.560 and celebrating

00:43:40.260 Canada Day

00:43:40.940 I didn't think

00:43:42.020 would be a

00:43:42.580 subversive act

00:43:43.400 but here we

00:43:43.840 are in

00:43:44.520 2021 and

00:43:45.480 it is

00:43:45.780 and I know

00:43:46.320 I criticized

00:43:46.960 Conservative

00:43:47.780 leader Aaron

00:43:48.380 O'Toole

00:43:48.700 earlier for

00:43:49.340 not taking

00:43:49.840 a stand

00:43:50.200 on C36

00:43:50.920 I will say

00:43:51.940 the Conservatives

00:43:52.620 have been very

00:43:53.120 good on

00:43:53.760 Canada Day

00:43:54.560 low-hanging fruit

00:43:56.540 again I

00:43:57.040 didn't think

00:43:57.720 that that would

00:43:58.140 have to be

00:43:58.640 political boldness

00:43:59.660 to stand up

00:44:00.200 for Canada Day

00:44:00.880 but here we

00:44:01.760 are and

00:44:02.320 just this

00:44:02.840 morning Aaron

00:44:03.800 O'Toole had

00:44:04.400 a very

00:44:04.880 thoughtful

00:44:05.400 answer on

00:44:06.040 this

00:44:06.360 when you

00:44:07.360 cancel an

00:44:08.660 event that

00:44:09.260 celebrates our

00:44:09.840 country you

00:44:11.100 lose the

00:44:11.660 opportunity to

00:44:12.540 not only

00:44:12.980 celebrate the

00:44:13.680 great aspects

00:44:14.240 of our

00:44:14.600 country and

00:44:15.660 the opportunity

00:44:16.200 to challenge

00:44:17.200 the citizens

00:44:18.020 of your

00:44:18.960 community of

00:44:19.540 your province

00:44:20.020 or the or

00:44:21.040 the country in

00:44:21.660 general to do

00:44:22.620 better in the

00:44:23.080 future I think

00:44:24.240 as I said

00:44:24.880 last week our

00:44:25.700 country is not

00:44:26.600 perfect but I'm

00:44:29.320 inspired by our

00:44:30.380 commitment to do

00:44:31.860 better our

00:44:32.820 commitment to

00:44:33.680 reconciliation

00:44:34.540 in one of my

00:44:35.980 communities on

00:44:36.620 Canada Day we

00:44:37.460 had a First

00:44:38.500 Nations chief who

00:44:39.500 would speak about

00:44:40.980 reconciliation if

00:44:42.260 events don't take

00:44:43.220 place you can't

00:44:44.920 celebrate and you

00:44:45.700 cannot rededicate your

00:44:47.040 efforts for this

00:44:48.400 country it's time to

00:44:49.800 build our country up

00:44:50.800 to to address

00:44:51.980 reconciliation to

00:44:53.160 address inequalities

00:44:54.160 not by cancelling

00:44:56.080 celebrations or tearing

00:44:57.620 Canada down but

00:44:58.540 recommitting to the

00:45:00.520 to the principles at the

00:45:01.800 core of this country

00:45:02.600 so despite whatever

00:45:04.280 frustrations I have

00:45:05.680 with various

00:45:06.560 governmental policies

00:45:07.760 like you know Bill

00:45:08.560 C-36 or C-10 as a

00:45:10.400 country we are bigger

00:45:11.380 than the government of

00:45:12.360 the day as a country

00:45:13.440 we are bigger than our

00:45:15.060 history but we build on

00:45:16.400 our history and I will

00:45:17.640 never be ashamed of

00:45:19.960 being proud and no one

00:45:22.440 else should be either

00:45:23.260 we've got to end things

00:45:24.820 here my thanks to you

00:45:26.120 all for tuning in to the

00:45:27.320 Andrew Lawton show

00:45:27.940 today if I don't see it

00:45:29.060 before then happy

00:45:29.920 dominion day god bless

00:45:31.500 you all thanks for

00:45:32.560 listening to the Andrew

00:45:33.460 Lawton show support the

00:45:34.800 program by donating to

00:45:35.900 true north at www.tnc.news

00:45:39.520 fergus.com

00:45:41.120 fergus.com

00:45:41.300 fergus.com

00:45:42.900 fergus.com

00:45:42.960 fergus.com

00:45:45.280 fergus.com

00:45:46.140 sendme to of or

00:45:46.920 fr斯

00:45:49.720 for

00:45:51.000 ここ

00:45:59.180 happens to you

00:45:59.900 experience

00:46:00.220 you

00:46:01.060 hopefully

00:46:01.480 anniversary

00:46:02.220 of

00:46:02.680 there

00:46:03.280 there

00:46:04.100 are

00:46:04.800 there

00:46:05.060 צ

Juno News - June 29, 2021

Prosecuting Thought Crimes

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