Juno News - May 22, 2026


RCMP union demands answers over CBC’s fake interview scandal


Episode Stats


Length

27 minutes

Words per minute

152.57

Word count

4,154

Sentence count

193

Harmful content

Toxicity

3

sentences flagged

Hate speech

1

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

A group of actors and producers pretending to be media hosts were somehow connected to the CBC, which takes $1.4 billion from Canadian taxpayers every single year. They lured Mounties and former Mounties into a fake studio and then flipped the script on them.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 welcome to the fighter i am your host chris sims i'm the alberta director for the canadian
00:00:09.400 taxpayers federation and what a story that is unfolding here in canada at first when i heard
00:00:18.180 this story i couldn't quite believe it but you've seen it all over juno news you've now seen folks
00:00:24.100 within the rcmp standing up and speaking up and defending themselves so here's the story in a
00:00:29.560 nutshell. As far as we know, a group of actors slash producers in the media world were pretending
00:00:39.400 to be media hosts somehow connected to the CBC, which takes $1.4 billion from taxpayers
00:00:51.040 every single year. Thank you very much. And unfortunately, apparently APTN was involved
00:00:58.160 with this as well, according to these stories. So fast forward, they tricked some people into
00:01:06.160 doing interviews with them and then flipped the script on them. They lured them in with emails
00:01:11.600 and saying they were going to promote their book, as you saw with Lindsay Shepard, things like that.
00:01:16.140 But then it got deeper real fast. Turns out these same people lured in Mounties, cops,
00:01:26.380 RCMP both retired and now we're learning active duty Mounties I didn't know that part
00:01:34.380 lured them into a TV studio on at least one occasion that's been documented under the
00:01:41.140 premise that they were going to be thanked for their service because they'd been working as
00:01:46.600 cops or had worked as cops for years in Canada and then all of a sudden after their phones were
00:01:52.140 taken away and they got sat down were then set upon. And this was all supposed to be funny and
00:01:59.120 a joke. Well, frankly, I have not heard from one person, no matter what side of the political
00:02:05.300 spectrum they're on, that finds this funny. In fact, I was just watching YouTube last night
00:02:12.940 and one of the former Mounties, he's retired, went on YouTube for about an hour and described
00:02:20.540 from his perspective what his experience included listen to this and he goes Clint you know what
00:02:27.100 um that we we did this yesterday with three other cops and one cop gave his surge up gave it to us
00:02:34.940 and I remember and I said no that didn't happen he didn't do that yeah he did and I'm starting
00:02:41.800 to think well you they couldn't leave you you arranged it for that to happen okay so at the
00:02:49.220 Taxpayers Federation, at the minimum, were paying for this. Why are taxpayers being forced to pay
00:02:59.000 for this? Why is the CBC hosting stuff like this? Who thought this was a good idea? How many people
00:03:08.960 were involved with this? What resources, which are sucking up taxpayers' money faster than a Hoover, 0.61
00:03:16.380 What resources were poured into luring Mounties and former RCMP into a fake interview and then going after them like this?
00:03:30.940 Like, who thought this was a good use of taxpayers' money and a good idea?
00:03:36.920 More importantly, perhaps on a personal level, what are these police thinking now?
00:03:44.220 Like you're talking about active duty cops and recently retired Mounties who could have seen some stuff in their lines of work.
00:03:54.220 And we've got the state broadcaster doing this.
00:03:59.120 So very interestingly, and it's rare for law enforcement to come off the bench and actually talk about what's happening in the news.
00:04:07.980 But in this case, it's directly affecting their rank and file and their members.
00:04:13.240 So actually, the founder of the National Police Federation put out a very firm news release on this.
00:04:21.280 Not pulling any punches, saying this is a taxpayer-funded institution, the CBC, and there is definitely some chain of command here.
00:04:30.580 So who approved all of this?
00:04:32.840 And what does accountability look like after something like this?
00:04:37.940 How much money was being spent on this?
00:04:40.400 What were they thinking?
00:04:42.320 Let's find out. Joining me now is Brian Sauvé. He is the president and founder of the National
00:04:49.280 Police Federation. Sir, thank you so much for joining us today. Before we get started,
00:04:55.040 can you just describe for our viewers, both on Juneau and the Taxpayers Federation,
00:04:59.600 they may not be familiar with your organization. Would you describe it as
00:05:04.480 kind of a union representing the Mounties? How would you describe it?
00:05:07.680 Exactly that, actually. It is a union representing the rank-and-file members of the RCMP.
00:05:14.880 And, you know, your viewers might not know that the RCMP were prohibited from forming a union
00:05:20.200 for almost 140 years. In 2015, the Supreme Court struck that down. So we started the NPF in 2016
00:05:28.440 and have been certified by the Federal Labor Board since 2019. So we're just growing,
00:05:35.960 but we're the largest police union in Canada and the second largest in North America.
00:05:40.760 Outstanding. I also wanted to point out, you helped found this, you founded this union.
00:05:46.840 Can I just ask you personally, was it your experience as a Mountie
00:05:50.440 that compelled you to want to speak up for a fellow RCMP?
00:05:55.800 Yes. I mean, not necessarily my personal experience, but definitely what I've seen
00:06:01.720 our members go through and the experiences that they had. There was a need for
00:06:07.640 an independent body that was outside of the RCMP to actually represent them.
00:06:13.080 And it was time for the RCMP to get into the fold. Every police service in Canada
00:06:18.200 and many in the United States and worldwide have union representation. And we were just
00:06:23.640 falling behind the universe in so many ways, shapes and forms.
00:06:28.040 I don't think I've heard falling behind the universe, but I might pick that up from you.
00:06:31.920 All right. I wanted to ask you, I got to say, when I first heard about this story and how it's bloomed into tricking former Mounties, veterans of the RCMP into fake interviews, it's just a bizarre story.
00:06:52.980 As a person and as somebody who represents Mounties, what went through your mind when you first started hearing about this?
00:07:02.540 Well, we heard about it or I heard about it.
00:07:05.440 A former member actually emailed me probably about 10 days ago.
00:07:09.520 And that was the first instance.
00:07:11.440 And that particular email was, wow, if this is true, this is weird.
00:07:17.060 And then we started digging into it a little bit, speaking to the Veterans Association.
00:07:20.540 And we ended up getting some phone calls from serving members, not just veterans, who had been done, gone through some similar process.
00:07:30.520 You know, just the entire, it's kind of like a spy versus spy novel, right?
00:07:36.500 You know, using underhanded tactics to get someone in uniform, take away their phone, put the mini in a room where they think they're going to be celebrated for their service.
00:07:46.920 and, you know, I don't know, maybe provided some kind of an accolade and then all of a sudden to
00:07:52.520 flip the script and send them on that emotional roller coaster where they're confronted about
00:07:57.720 an institution that has had challenging times with certain communities across Canada in the last 155
00:08:05.000 years. Can you go into that a little bit? Before I was at the Taxpayers Federation, I did work at the
00:08:11.960 the Ministry of Veterans Affairs. I have law enforcement in my family. My uncle, actually,
00:08:17.220 my late uncle was RCMP and he was in forensics. One of the last big jobs he did was at the
00:08:22.700 Picton farm. Can you talk a little bit about what that will do or could do to somebody who's either
00:08:30.640 current RCMP or former RCMP in that situation to suddenly have, as you say, the script flipped on
00:08:38.040 them, their phone taken away, they might be in uniform, and then they're kind of set upon?
00:08:44.920 Well, I think what Canadians need to remind themselves of, and, you know, from your experience
00:08:50.480 at Veterans Affairs Canada, obviously dealing with the CAF as well as others, right? What we
00:08:55.940 need to remember is that, you know, when someone signs up to join the Canadian Armed Forces,
00:08:59.620 someone signs up to join the RCMP or a local fire station or a municipal or provincial police
00:09:06.140 service by, by joining those ranks and entering into service to Canadians to
00:09:11.060 keep them safe, you're signing a contract where you're basically saying,
00:09:14.600 I'll give my light for you.
00:09:18.320 Full stop.
00:09:19.500 Yep.
00:09:20.120 So that's a serious amount of commitment and dedication from probably 140,000
00:09:28.300 Canadians out there serving in that first responder community.
00:09:31.800 And I think that needs to be recognized.
00:09:33.620 And I think Canadians do it.
00:09:34.840 We do it quietly, like we do a lot of things in, in, in remembrance.
00:09:39.880 And, uh, you know, we just came out of national police week last week where
00:09:45.020 Canadians recognized and police services all across the country recognize police
00:09:49.120 officers in their service and their contributions to it.
00:09:52.140 So when a member of the RCB or a member of police service or any
00:09:56.680 first responder community gets asked, Hey, why don't you come down to our
00:10:01.580 media studio in uniform?
00:10:04.060 We'd really like to have a little private session to recognize your contribution to Canada, your contribution to service.
00:10:12.520 That's a rarity in Canada.
00:10:16.100 So I think, you know, these members, these veterans went there on a high thinking, well, finally, a media outlet, the national media outlet is actually doing something that's going to recognize, you know, Canadians who have given their life in service.
00:10:35.440 So you're walking in probably really high, really proud, and maybe a little attention to the uniform to make sure everything's in the right place.
00:10:43.360 And then all of a sudden, that flits.
00:10:48.300 So that emotional rollercoaster, I cannot imagine how traumatizing that would be in the moment.
00:10:55.640 Perhaps even disbelief that this is happening.
00:10:59.360 And those who have spoken to us or reported this, I would even suggest that those numbers are probably highly, they're way below what actually happened.
00:11:09.580 Because I think as cops who have spent their life investigating, you would think that their fraud meter is fairly honed and they would probably be embarrassed to come forward and admit that they were misled in this particular scenario.
00:11:28.880 No different than a lot of dating scans or senior scans where they get taken advantage of.
00:11:34.080 Those numbers are hugely underreported in Canada just for fear of embarrassment.
00:11:38.680 So the numbers that we have, you know, we're not talking about one, we're not talking about two, we're not talking about five, we're talking about a lot. It is probably a multiple of that number who actually were interacting here or were actually exposed to this, I can't even say shenanigan because that's really too light a word, to embarrass them in their service to Canada.
00:12:05.560 So I know you don't want to give the exact number because you're looking into this, but fair to say, like you said, this is, this is more than two police officers or former police officers this happened to?
00:12:18.680 Yes, definitely.
00:12:21.720 Okay.
00:12:23.180 So, and to be clear...
00:12:24.300 I, I, I, we, we don't write letters to the minister, um, essentially seeking formal inquiries into publicly funded organizations on a whim.
00:12:35.560 No. And I wanted to say to your point, yes, police are often putting out warnings of please be careful, don't be taken in by scams, even if it sounds like your grandson on the phone, asking for money, make sure you check.
00:12:50.540 But my goodness, being flown, according to these stories, being flown to Vancouver, being put up in a hotel, being told to come to the CBC studio downtown, it's in prime location right there.
00:13:02.920 Like, this isn't some, you know, pretend hotel out in the back parking lot where they're doing some stunt.
00:13:08.380 Like, this all looked very official.
00:13:10.720 Is that what you're hearing from these Mounties and former Mounties?
00:13:15.040 Oh, exactly.
00:13:16.200 And I've been to CBC Vancouver studios.
00:13:18.800 I've been in there.
00:13:19.300 I've been interviewed there, you know, and, you know, I know, so you walk in the main doors and you come up to the commissioner's desk, they got to give you a lanyard, they take your name, piece of ID, all that great stuff.
00:13:28.900 So, I mean, I can understand how someone would think, oh, well, I got to give up my cell phone because as police officers, we've also been in places where you're not allowed to bring your phone and surreptitious recording and all that great stuff.
00:13:39.660 So I can understand all that part that could still be reasonably understood.
00:13:43.580 uh and then you know to go into an interview room okay all reasonable and understood uh but then
00:13:50.960 just the the flipping of that switch and you know the confrontation is kind of like
00:13:56.980 really whoever thought this was a good idea or funny i know you don't want to give your
00:14:02.840 commentary on whether or not something's funny but like this topic isn't funny the situation
00:14:07.980 isn't funny. It's just such a bizarre situation. So what now? What would your organization
00:14:16.860 want from the Taxpayers Federation perspective at the bare minimum? At the minimum, because we're
00:14:23.980 getting a lot of outraged emails. We hear you folks. At the minimum, this is a huge waste of
00:14:29.780 taxpayers' money. The CBC gets $1.4 billion per year from taxpayers. Our money was used
00:14:37.180 to do this to people, including current and former Mounties, along with other people.
00:14:44.360 So at minimum, we're saying this is a huge waste of taxpayers' money. And we want, actually,
00:14:50.020 we want evidence. We want names. We want to know who thought of this. We want to know who approved
00:14:55.320 of this. And we want to know how many people were involved with this. From your organization's
00:15:00.100 perspective, what would, what do you want to see happen now?
00:15:05.380 Well, I think similar, you know, for example, today I was in an airport
00:15:09.460 on my way home and I was just on a lark.
00:15:12.280 I looked up the CVC's webpage and I'll give them credit.
00:15:15.620 Their webpage is quite easy to navigate, but on that webpage, obviously they have
00:15:19.700 their standards and their journalistic standards.
00:15:22.000 And should you disagree with something that was published, this is where you go.
00:15:25.880 One of the interesting things on that webpage is that, you know, uh, they
00:15:29.160 actually say, if they're going to use hidden microphones, video, or approach
00:15:32.920 people, undercover, if you will, or use some kind of surreptitious investigative
00:15:41.180 authority, that it must be approved by a director.
00:15:45.000 And I can understand that, right?
00:15:47.200 You know, as police officers, we don't just show up at work one day and say,
00:15:50.840 we're going to do an undercover operation at the corner of walk and don't walk.
00:15:54.620 No.
00:15:54.840 We have to have a business plan and an office plan.
00:15:57.200 has to go through the chain of command usually there's a budget associated with it for illicit
00:16:02.160 buys and all of that great stuff and it goes all the way up staff sergeant inspector sometimes
00:16:06.960 superintendent chief superintendent and above for approval so it's a multi-layered process 0.97
00:16:12.400 to ensure that we don't do something idiotic or silly so in this case i would assume that a 0.97
00:16:20.960 publicly funded government overseen body has similar processes and policies in place to reduce 0.98
00:16:28.240 the embarrassment of the cbc and its image which is also in their journalistic standards
00:16:34.800 the preamble is this is designed to protect our reputation um and and ultimately someone
00:16:41.040 made a really poor decision so how does that come about and what's the reaction to it and
00:16:47.760 And what I was thinking today is, gee, there was an Air Canada CEO that had to step down because they couldn't speak French.
00:16:57.020 That's a pretty little bar to set.
00:16:59.720 So it's not like he made a silly decision.
00:17:03.500 It's not like he embarrassed an institution or some employees of that institution.
00:17:08.540 What we've seen now thus far is the CBC is trying to deflect, deny, and defer by basically saying, oh, it's not CBC News.
00:17:16.320 This is CBC Entertainment, completely different.
00:17:21.440 So we're not responsible for that.
00:17:24.300 And I sit back and say, well, in Air Canada,
00:17:27.900 well, you're not the CEO of Air Canada Rouge or Jazz.
00:17:31.540 You're the CEO of Air Canada.
00:17:33.400 And I think Canadians expect the same treatment
00:17:35.800 on all three business lines of Air Canada,
00:17:38.520 which is one brand.
00:17:40.020 Therefore, CBC Entertainment, you're part of CBC.
00:17:43.840 And that's one brand.
00:17:44.980 hence why we wrote to the minister
00:17:47.480 versus just the president of the CBC
00:17:51.080 because the president of the CBC
00:17:53.580 is a government and council appointee
00:17:55.860 meaning they serve at the pleasure of the government
00:17:59.140 so should the minister or cabinet
00:18:02.300 deem that this particular GIC appointee
00:18:05.840 is no longer operating CBC
00:18:08.640 in the spirit and intent of Canadians
00:18:11.380 then perhaps they no longer serve
00:18:13.680 at the pleasure of government
00:18:14.980 So, you would like to see the president and CEO of the CBC step down?
00:18:21.780 Well, I think maybe there should be a response from, you know, maybe the minister and cabinet
00:18:31.500 can demand some accountability.
00:18:33.800 And should that accountability not be transparent, truthful, or satisfactory, that there are
00:18:41.920 consequences.
00:18:42.920 That's fair.
00:18:44.820 And for folks who are watching from home, the CEO of the CBC, if you're researching,
00:18:51.760 is a level seven CEO within Crown Corporations.
00:18:55.320 And that means he or she is paid around half a million dollars per year, plus a massive
00:19:01.940 bonus.
00:19:03.060 So these folks need to be held accountable to your point, sir.
00:19:08.420 What are you hearing from your members in the sense of...
00:19:14.820 Are they worried that they're going to be emailed?
00:19:17.700 Are they wanting an apology?
00:19:20.600 Like anything else that you're hearing from your rank and file without giving away like whatever internal investigations you guys are doing?
00:19:29.120 Well, I think from our perspective, you know, I think Canadians probably do realize that a serving member of the RCMP today or even recent veterans in the last decade,
00:19:41.880 none of them participated in the 60s scoop. None of them were around for the atrocities that
00:19:50.140 occurred 75 to 100 to 120 years ago. So if an organization wants to attack the institution
00:19:59.840 of the RCMP, have at her, go for it. But recently retired or serving members did not participate in
00:20:08.600 that. And from what I've seen and from what I've heard, they have served with
00:20:13.820 dignity, professionalism, compassion, and have done everything in their power to
00:20:19.340 modernize and reconcile relationships.
00:20:23.120 The RCMP itself has come a long way in the last 30 to 35 years with respect to
00:20:29.600 that. And, um, okay.
00:20:31.640 So if you want to attack us for something that happened a hundred years ago or 75
00:20:37.360 years ago, or 60 years ago, attacked the institution.
00:20:41.360 But there are most probably no members left who were part of that.
00:20:46.660 So it's irresponsible to ask them to bear the brunt of history.
00:20:54.480 And individually, that puts a lot onto someone to have their phone
00:20:59.400 taken, you know, just think of that.
00:21:00.840 Like I tried putting myself in those people's shoes, being brought into a
00:21:04.620 studio, have my phone taken away.
00:21:06.140 And then all of a sudden, like you say, the script is flipped.
00:21:08.520 That puts somebody through quite a bit.
00:21:12.160 It does.
00:21:12.680 And, uh, I haven't found out yet.
00:21:14.360 And it has, has yet to be determined.
00:21:17.700 Um, you know, when the script was flipped, were those members free to leave?
00:21:23.240 Because if they weren't free to leave, then, you know, maybe we're
00:21:26.500 talking about possible confinement, which is a completely separate issue.
00:21:32.220 It's a whole nother kettle of fish.
00:21:33.760 Wouldn't it be?
00:21:34.980 My goodness.
00:21:35.680 As of tape time, so today it's May 21st right now, late in the afternoon.
00:21:42.080 Have you heard anything back yet from the minister responsible?
00:21:46.660 No, nothing from the minister, nothing from the CBC, nothing from the ombudsman.
00:21:52.340 We're obviously in discussions with the RCMP Veterans Association, trying to support them as best they can.
00:21:57.920 They're mostly a volunteer organization, so resources versus none.
00:22:02.400 um and uh off we go so we'll wait and see what should viewers who are watching this who are
00:22:10.460 upset on your behalf and upset on these mounties um and just to be clear there are some current
00:22:16.080 like actively still working mounties wow i did not know that okay um for our viewers who are
00:22:23.100 watching this and who are upset on these mounties and former mounties behalf um what should they do
00:22:29.160 well obviously don't accept an invitation from a PTN or CBC to come to an interview to celebrate
00:22:38.700 your service on the one hand um because it's it's it's a ruse uh but secondly just a second
00:22:45.340 isn't that crazy to have to say that can I just say like it is I I send interview I send invitations
00:22:50.820 to interviews all the time from people from across the political spectrum on tons of different topics
00:22:56.120 i have done so for 20 years you having to say with all earnestness don't accept an invitation
00:23:02.520 to come have an interview celebrating your service that's crazy it is or you know at least maybe run
00:23:11.080 it through someone else or call us ahead of time so we can assist and vet and make sure they're
00:23:17.000 real reporters and what the story is and and such and you know have us go with you that that type
00:23:22.920 of thing. We're happy to do that. But yeah, from a Canadian's perspective, I think, I mean,
00:23:29.320 all media outlets go through different levels of scrutiny. And it's unfortunate that today's
00:23:35.880 day and age, we appear to be in a click-based society where the loudest and weirdest and
00:23:43.400 most outlandish stories are out there to garner an audience. And it's unfortunate that
00:23:50.520 to respected institutions. I have a lot of time for the CBC. I have a lot of time for APTN,
00:23:56.600 and they do a lot of good work. I did too. They had a really good investigative journalism team,
00:24:01.560 but I will admit I'm pretty ticked off right now. So go ahead, sir. Yeah. So it's unfortunate that
00:24:08.200 this will be a stain on their reputation. And unfortunately, it's going to erode trust even
00:24:13.400 further between the membership of the RCMP and mainstream media. So that's too bad.
00:24:19.960 Should civilians, folks who aren't members of the police or former, I guess writing, I would
00:24:26.300 personally encourage them to write to the minister. Like phone the minister, email the minister, say
00:24:32.020 we want action on this. Yeah, the minister and or the ombudsman of the CBC. Excellent. Anything I
00:24:38.840 have not asked you, sir, about this situation that you want our viewers to know? No. Well,
00:24:45.740 I think our members, you know, as much as we've kept this in the media cycle, it certainly would
00:24:51.900 be nice, I think, for some closure that someone actually takes some action so that those who were
00:24:58.100 impacted on it are continuously re-traumatized every time they see a media headline about the
00:25:03.400 same story. But, you know, we have to get some attention. It's got some attention. And then
00:25:09.060 hopefully the minister will be following up for sure. Sir, I know law enforcement are often
00:25:15.560 hesitant to speak up on stuff like this, even when it's coming after them directly. So thank you
00:25:21.740 for speaking up for this. No, it's my pleasure. Thanks for having us.
00:25:27.080 Thank you for joining us. Once again, folks, that is Brian Sauvé. He is the president and founder
00:25:34.340 of the National Police Federation. You can find him on their website. They were founded right
00:25:41.060 around 2019 and their news release is right on there saying that they want accountability they
00:25:47.840 want transparency after this I won't even call it a stunt after this trickery happened to I think
00:25:56.980 that's news not just former Mounties but currently serving police officers within the RCMP
00:26:04.140 were attempted to be lured into this.
00:26:08.080 What a strange story.
00:26:09.880 Folks, what do you think about this situation?
00:26:13.080 What do you think about what Brian just told all of us?
00:26:16.300 Let us know in the comments.
00:26:18.200 Be sure to head on over to Juno News and subscribe
00:26:21.180 because we need to support independent journalism.
00:26:24.640 And head on over to the Taxpayers Federation
00:26:26.880 because we're trying to find out
00:26:29.140 how much of your money was spent on this.
00:26:31.960 We see the CBC routinely
00:26:33.680 going to committee on Parliament Hill crying broke saying oh we don't have any money we're
00:26:39.560 underfunded we're underfunded 1.4 billion dollars and they have time for this they have time to
00:26:46.720 bring people down to their studio in Vancouver with this nonsense so taxpayers federation at
00:26:52.560 the very least want to know how many people were involved in this and how much did this cost
00:26:57.840 taxpayers. Most importantly, folks, make sure that you like this video and share it with people who
00:27:05.300 need to know because the folks who were caught up in this need to have themselves and their stories
00:27:11.760 heard. Thanks for watching.