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Juno News
- May 07, 2023
Resisting the mob (feat. Caylan Ford)
Episode Stats
Length
27 minutes
Words per Minute
180.16673
Word Count
4,949
Sentence Count
283
Misogynist Sentences
2
Hate Speech Sentences
2
Summary
Summaries are generated with
gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ
.
Transcript
Transcript is generated with
Whisper
(
turbo
).
Misogyny classification is done with
MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny
.
Hate speech classification is done with
facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target
.
00:00:00.000
I spoke in the previous show with my colleague, Rachel Emanuel, about the Alberta election,
00:00:13.620
which is currently underway right now. We're getting all the press releases from all the
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candidates. They're announcing their platforms. Yesterday, Rachel Notley, the former premier
00:00:23.440
seeking to return to the seat, had a press conference in which she said she wanted to
00:00:28.600
send a message to conservatives that were thinking of voting NDP for the first time. And I was like,
00:00:34.620
well, this actually sounds quite interesting. So I went on Zoom because you could connect via Zoom
00:00:39.260
and I joined the press conference and you have to click the raise hand button if you want to ask a
00:00:44.060
question. And they never called on me, the only one on that press conference that has, I'd say,
00:00:49.460
probably a larger share of conservatives in the audience that are the people Ms. Notley
00:00:55.140
ostensibly wants to speak to. But they called on one reporter twice. So that was how much they
00:01:00.580
really, really, really didn't want me to ask her a question. But when we talk about this election,
00:01:06.000
I think we need to also take a look back into four years ago, the election that elected Jason
00:01:11.320
Kenney as premier of the UCP government, the first ever UCP government. And one particular story
00:01:19.100
that may not be politically relevant to a lot of people now, but is culturally relevant
00:01:24.320
and is incredibly relevant to the individual at the center of that story. And that is Kaylin Ford,
00:01:29.960
who I have interviewed in the past. And we'll talk a little bit about that in this show. She was a star
00:01:36.260
candidate called a unicorn by some people in the 2019 election. She was running for the UCP in a seat
00:01:43.620
that wasn't a traditionally conservative seat, but they thought was within reach, incredibly well
00:01:48.300
educated, incredibly eloquent, and was the victim of a horrific smear campaign by someone who she once
00:01:54.540
called a friend. And that smear campaign was very much enabled by mainstream media outlets and by some
00:02:01.720
alternative media outlets. And Kaylin Ford has released a new documentary about this ordeal and
00:02:08.340
also about the broader themes it touches on. It's called When the Mob Came. And Kaylin joins me now.
00:02:15.480
Kaylin, it's good to talk to you again. Thanks for coming on today, firstly.
00:02:19.320
Thanks, Andrew. And to clarify, the documentary is, as we speak, being rendered and will be released later
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tonight. So don't forget to run, but later this evening, it should be public. And yeah.
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Wonderful. I appreciate that clarification. And I had the good fortune of being able to see an
00:02:37.520
advance copy of it, which was quite compelling. And even having followed your story and having
00:02:43.960
known you in some capacity, I learned things from it and was forced to reflect on certain things.
00:02:50.000
And I don't want to rehash a lot of the details that the people can find for themselves. But
00:02:54.940
I'll ask, firstly, why you wanted to do this? Because for someone that's gone through what you went
00:03:00.200
through, it wouldn't surprise me if you wanted to just kind of shut the door and lock it on that
00:03:04.900
chapter of your life and move on. And I know you've done that largely. You've started a fantastic
00:03:09.720
school in Calgary, or you're trying to open one in Edmonton as well. Why go back to this time in
00:03:15.440
your life?
00:03:17.180
Well, so in answer to that question, look, we talk about people being cancelled. And there's
00:03:21.580
obviously a spectrum, right? Some people might be deplatformed on one or several occasions.
00:03:26.000
In my case, my life was annihilated.
00:03:29.200
I was on the front page of the Toronto Star four times. They said I came from a trash heap
00:03:35.320
and that I had been caught promoting white supremacy. Three different CBC headlines said
00:03:40.400
that I basically was a white supremacist. It was on CBC's The National with Wendy Mesley.
00:03:45.960
And it didn't stop for a month. So it was almost daily coverage, making these claims about me.
00:03:52.980
Any attempt that I made to try to tell my own side of the story ended up suppressed. We can get
00:03:57.380
into that. Employers wouldn't engage with me. I was told I couldn't sit on charitable boards.
00:04:02.640
Friends left me. They faced ostracism from their social circles if they continued engaging with me.
00:04:08.500
This was complete character assassination. I couldn't earn a livelihood. It took me
00:04:14.340
almost four years before I was able to get new employment. And that was through an organization
00:04:19.560
that I founded. So I was persona non grata. I couldn't just move on. And this is one of the
00:04:26.120
misconceptions that I hope this documentary will maybe prompt people to reflect on is
00:04:30.080
when you are subject to this sort of like shame storm, the media will move on. The mob will move
00:04:37.560
on. That person's life has been completely torn through. And they can't just always pick up the
00:04:46.180
pieces and sort of reassemble it. So on the one hand, this was I had no platform to tell the story
00:04:51.960
and I had no employment. But I did have a background in documentary filmmaking,
00:04:56.620
which is very fortuitous.
00:04:58.600
One of the interesting dynamics here is that you're obviously interviewing some of the people
00:05:03.700
in this documentary. You're releasing it, but you're featured in it and it's about you. And there
00:05:08.560
are other people that are being interviewed about you. And I'm wondering why, just from a production
00:05:14.160
standpoint, you decided to approach it in such a personal way. Because oftentimes, and I know this is
00:05:19.560
someone who's written about cancel culture, there can be a temptation to deal with it in the abstract
00:05:24.400
because it's a bit safer. You can talk about other people being canceled and hope that that may,
00:05:29.160
you know, in a roundabout way, kind of get people to sort of take your side on it without having to
00:05:34.160
really expose yourself again.
00:05:36.440
Yeah. So making a documentary about my own life is, it is horrifying. You know, it is, I was sharing
00:05:44.260
with you, it feels to me like just the height of narcissistic self-indulgence. And it's very obvious,
00:05:49.220
and I'm very upfront about the fact that this is a persuasive piece, that my goal is actually to
00:05:52.960
change people's minds about me. And that's, that's extremely personal. I'm kind of like laying my heart
00:05:58.600
bare for the world. And I may or may not find that that's a cathartic event. You know, but yeah, it is,
00:06:07.220
it is challenging. You'll notice in the film, I often slip into speaking in the third person. And I think
00:06:11.300
that's just a, that's a coping mechanism that I acquired to try to intellectualize the experience,
00:06:15.700
because I found it, it's very difficult to talk about me in this context. But yeah, so it's,
00:06:21.380
that's really challenging. I had to, the way I tried to overcome that was by dressing it up
00:06:25.460
intellectually and sort of couching it in a philosophical framework. So the entire documentary
00:06:30.080
is actually kind of framed by Plato's Gorgias dialogue. And the central thesis, if I might summarize,
00:06:37.560
that comes from that dialogue, is that we should take greater care to avoid doing wrong,
00:06:44.020
than we should to avoid suffering wrong. And that above all else, we should care about actually
00:06:50.140
being good and rather than making people believe that we're good. And this relates to cancel culture
00:06:56.420
in the sense that I think cancel culture, it's obviously not culture, it's an anti-culture,
00:07:01.300
but it's a culture of intellectual and moral inversion, where false virtues or the performance
00:07:07.180
of false virtues is celebrated at the expense of the real thing. And so this is a documentary about,
00:07:13.980
well, is it better to strive for the real thing, or to sort of perform the counterfeit?
00:07:21.580
And is it better to suffer injury or to do it from the vantage point of the soul? So this is how I've tried
00:07:28.060
to overcome the difficulty of turning the lens on myself in my own life.
00:07:32.380
One of the challenges that I believe you would presumably admit you faced is that you are, as
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people can tell, I think from your answer there, and from any of your other work, an incredibly
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intellectual person. You're a very cerebral person, you're well-read, you have references
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dating back thousands of years for things. And intellectual exercises are not really all that fitting
00:07:53.740
in modern politics, which is about sound bites and brevities. There's one, you know, little illumination
00:07:59.340
of this in the documentary, when your former campaign manager is talking about canvassing,
00:08:03.180
which is when you go knocking on doors, and your role in the party's view of things is to
00:08:08.780
knock on a door to find out if they're voting for you or not, and move on to the next door.
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You're not trying to persuade them, you're trying to identify them. Whereas your view is
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the one that would make campaign managers have an aneurysm, which is let's sit and have a
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conversation for 20 minutes or 30 minutes. And how difficult is that for you, coming from an
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academic background and an intellectual background, where you believe that everything can be approached
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with reason, and that every kind of conflict can be the start of a conversation, when I think the
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crux of the problem here is that you have people that aren't interested in conversations, that aren't
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interested in challenging their perceptions, however wrong they are.
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Yeah, and you see me struggle with that in the film, I think, because my general assumption is that
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people are reasonable, and they can be reasoned with. On the campaign trail, I actually found that
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that assumption was usually borne out. Most, you know, generally, people, when you meet them face
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to face, they are quite reasonable, but...
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Yeah, that's the Twitter is not real life thesis, which I generally agree with.
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Exactly. But, you know, I was really struggling with this. And I think part of the explanation is
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people who deploy the tools of cancel culture, I just take for granted that most people assume that
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truth is good. And that in the case of a dispute or a sort of moral contestation,
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you can engage in dialectical conversation where you're both parties are aiming toward truth.
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And this is the means by which disagreements can be adjudicated. But if you're dealing with people who
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don't believe truth is good, then it has no moral weight, you can't appeal to it, it doesn't make any sense
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to try to say, you know, what you're saying is untrue. They don't care. The point is to suppress
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truth in the hopes that by doing so, you will create some space for a new reality, a supposedly
00:09:53.980
better reality to flourish. And so that's why cancel culture sort of undermines the fundamental
00:10:00.140
logic of civilization. It destroys even the most sort of fundamental means by which we might adjudicate
00:10:06.140
disagreements. But yeah, I mean, you see me like struggling with that at a very personal level in
00:10:09.740
the film. Well, and you mentioned something which I think was it was incredibly astute,
00:10:14.380
which I hadn't really thought of, which is that and I'm going to butcher your line,
00:10:17.420
so I won't pretend I'm quoting it accurately. But the premise of it was that cancel culture
00:10:22.620
only works if there's an institutional application of it and that, you know, everyone just shouting in
00:10:27.340
the void about how you are X or Y is not really cancel culture. It's when some other organ, whether it's
00:10:33.340
a political party or an employer or a media outlet decides we're going to apply this to reality.
00:10:39.260
I was wondering if you could elaborate on that a bit.
00:10:40.860
Yeah. Well, so, you know, there's kind of two dimensions of cancel culture. There's the
00:10:44.140
public shaming and the de-platforming. And cancel culture is sort of when these two things come
00:10:48.540
together. So the public shaming, so having people sort of say terrible things about you on a very
00:10:54.460
large scale, that is a devastating experience. And anyone who has gone through it will know even when
00:11:00.700
it's just online, it affects you very deeply. You know, it triggers a sort of fight or flight response.
00:11:05.660
It makes you question your perception of reality and your beliefs about yourself. So it's devastating.
00:11:13.260
But what the sort of mob aims to do is not just to humiliate you or harass you. It is to appeal to
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authorities to strip you of your platform, your livelihood, your ability to speak, your ability
00:11:27.820
to defend yourself. So they're asking institutions, they're asking people in positions of power,
00:11:33.420
whether it's your employer or media outlet or venue or whatever, in my case, a political party and
00:11:38.140
others. They're asking them to sort of de-person you. And so the actual cancellation is only affected
00:11:44.460
through an act of institutional capitulation. It is, you have to have someone willing to
00:11:51.180
submit to the demands of the mob for this to actually be, for it to work.
00:11:55.580
One of the things that I found quite interesting is that, I don't know if it was intentional on
00:12:01.500
your part, but there seems to be a bit of conflict, even in the way you discuss it, about whether you
00:12:06.460
did anything wrong. And I think, generally speaking, you are of the mind or should be of the mind that
00:12:10.780
you didn't. But it's very easy when discussing it to fall into that trap of wanting to make amends,
00:12:16.540
still.
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Yeah. So look, when, from my vantage point, it looked to me like the entire world was saying
00:12:24.700
that I was a terrible person, that I was morally abhorrent. You know, people, if you, if you read
00:12:30.220
the tweets carefully that appear on the screen, you'll see people saying, you know, your family
00:12:33.420
should be so ashamed. You deserve to be exiled. It's great. You'll never work again. The person who
00:12:38.860
outed you is full of courage. We should have more people like him in politics, things like this.
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And moreover, like I said, employers wouldn't, wouldn't touch me, wouldn't respond to me,
00:12:50.140
like media wouldn't engage with me. So you start to really doubt your perception of reality. And
00:12:56.540
what happens when the outside world has, seems to have one view and you hold an internal perception
00:13:02.940
that's different, this creates a deep dissonance that you're naturally going to try to want to
00:13:08.620
resolve somehow. And there's sort of three main ways that you can try to resolve that. You can either
00:13:13.740
try to persuade the world to see things as you do, or you can adopt the world's view of you,
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or you can go a kind of stoical approach where you separate the internal from the external and
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you no longer rely on any kind of external validation to tell you what's true, just sort of
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guided by, you know, sort of faith in things unseen. And, and I kind of oscillate between all three of
00:13:36.220
those. And so you'll, you know, you'll see me really grappling with well, why are thousands of
00:13:41.500
people demanding apologies from me? Why is a premier, two premiers and a mayor of a city and
00:13:46.780
all of these news sort of media figures, why are they all asking me to apologize for what? And, and I
00:13:53.980
really grappled with this question. And I would ask people in earnest, you know, what, what have I done
00:13:59.420
wrong? Cause I don't understand. And I never got an answer. When you talk about the employer aspect
00:14:07.580
of this, I mean, the one thing that, that really is the most jarring about cancel culture, defenders
00:14:12.300
of it will often say, well, it's not about cancel culture. It's consequence culture. They say that,
00:14:17.180
you know, it's the, they almost appeal actually to conservative language where they say, well, no,
00:14:21.580
it's, you know, it's about justice. It's about consequences. It's about the idea of the marketplace of
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ideas. And, and the problem with that is that no one who fuels this is interested in proportionality.
00:14:33.340
They don't say, you know, you sped, so you should get a speeding ticket and pay it and move on with
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your life. It's like, everything's the death penalty, basically to use an extreme, I'm actually,
00:14:43.260
to be honest, it's, it's not even all that extreme in some cases with how they view. And that's the
00:14:48.540
problem here. So it's that even if people believed you were unfit to be a candidate, which I don't feel
00:14:53.660
was the case, that's not what they wanted. They wanted you stripped of your party membership,
00:14:57.260
they wanted you prevented from working again, there would be people that would have said,
00:15:00.940
I'm sure her family should disown her and her friends should disown her. And if you were to,
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like, get a job as a barista at Starbucks, that would be offensive to them. And I was wondering if
00:15:09.180
you could, not if you could, but if you have come up with an explanation for why, why is that the case?
00:15:16.700
Why is it so extreme, in a sense that I don't think anyone could, if you were to talk to them
00:15:21.500
one-on-one, explain how saying this thing, even if it was what they claimed, warrants this outcome?
00:15:29.580
So you've touched on one big aspect of what's wrong with cancel culture, which is that it's not
00:15:34.060
actually an administration of justice. It's not justice because there's nothing resembling due
00:15:39.100
process, there's no rules of evidence, there's no right to a defense or presumption of innocence,
00:15:44.380
or all of these things that we would associate with. Or to face your accuser.
00:15:48.060
Or to face your accuser, right? I had an anonymous accuser and I was further publicly
00:15:53.900
shamed for identifying him. I now have a restraining order against him. My case led to
00:15:59.180
the recognition of a new tort of civil harassment in Alberta. That was the person accusing me,
00:16:05.260
who was trumpeted as a hero in the media. So that's the deeper problem, is that cancel culture
00:16:11.420
reflects a complete failure of clear moral reasoning. If you start to think that sort of
00:16:17.740
quasi-criminal harassment is okay and defensible and good, if their target is someone who has an
00:16:25.900
opinion you disagree with, then you are morally, like you're, it's not that you're morally,
00:16:31.020
you're morally and intellectually bankrupt, if you think that. So it's that the crimes that they
00:16:36.460
identify don't make any sense. You never see people being cancelled for actual criminal acts,
00:16:41.740
you see people being cancelled for often extremely ambiguous violations of emergent social norms,
00:16:47.980
or social norms that a small minority wants to see sort of in ascendancy. So I think that's
00:16:57.180
that's the deeper problem, is that having an opinion or observing a fact or asking a question in good
00:17:04.940
faith is just not really a transgression that merits this. But on the other side, the people who engage
00:17:13.020
in cancel culture, I talked earlier about how it's sort of, it celebrates false virtues at the expense of
00:17:20.220
the real ones. What I mean is that cancel culture aims to snuff out loyalty, charity, forgiveness,
00:17:29.340
a commitment to truth, a slowness to judge, you know, friendship, solidarity, all of these kinds
00:17:36.460
of virtues are suffocated in the climate created by cancel culture. And the fake sort of performative
00:17:42.700
virtues are outrage, you know, a quickness to judge, to believe the worst of other people, to listen to
00:17:48.620
slander, to make sure that that person is injured permanently. So that's, I think, the real problem
00:17:56.380
with this phenomenon. And it leads to a complete breakdown. You were talking earlier on your show
00:18:00.540
about the long effects of COVID. It destroys social trust and solidarity, and sort of social comedy,
00:18:05.980
and cancel culture has the same effect. There is obviously this cultural and social dimension to
00:18:12.540
your story. And there's also a media story. And I know there's a lawsuit underway that you've waged
00:18:18.380
that touches on this. But to further the discussion of just the lack of proportionality, it wasn't
00:18:24.460
enough that, you know, these allegations had you dethroned from your spot as a candidate and prospective
00:18:29.900
MLA. But the de-platforming continued long after that. Anytime you popped up to tell your story,
00:18:36.300
like on Danielle Smith's show with me, even that was seen as offensive to the mob for you to have the
00:18:41.580
rights, even after you've already paid the price, to discuss it.
00:18:45.660
Yeah. So one of the, this is a plot point in the documentary, but I, the first public interview I
00:18:52.860
did was on now Premier Daniel Smith's show. And the sort of NDP acolytes, Progress Alberta, which was
00:19:01.420
basically a sort of third party advertiser or PAC for the NDP, they put out a petition saying she should
00:19:06.780
be driven off the air, she needs to apologize, or, you know, they're going to go after their
00:19:10.780
advertisers. Former Calgary Mayor Nahid Nenshi was, apparently was agreeing with the premise of
00:19:16.780
this petition, telling reporters that they should boycott her show. And then the person who was behind
00:19:22.460
the accusations against me also threatened legal action against them, Karim Devraj. And eventually
00:19:27.420
they capitulated, chorus took down the interview from all their platforms, and something very similar
00:19:31.660
happened to you. Yep. That's your cue to elaborate? Well, I don't, to be honest, I don't know what
00:19:40.380
more I can say on that. I mean, it was, it was very difficult for me, because when you and I did that
00:19:46.380
interview, I think it was almost an hour in length. It was very difficult to do for me as well, because I
00:19:52.540
had gone through my own experience, not as national as yours was in 2018. And there was a bit of a
00:19:58.620
catharsis in that conversation. And then to have that sort of inner interview, and not just, you know,
00:20:05.020
sort of threatened with legal action, but then even when you re uploaded it on your own platform,
00:20:09.740
that sort of continued of, you know, I was sort of asked, why, why are you letting her do it? I was
00:20:14.060
like, I had nothing to do with it. But it's, it's, it struck me as just so profound, it goes back to what
00:20:22.220
you said about the lack of justice in this, that, you know, even someone being able to defend themselves
00:20:27.420
or, or even not even defend, because the damage had been done. But to put on record,
00:20:31.900
their side of the story was something that was
00:20:36.140
continually taken away. And it's no, it, it, I don't have words for it. It's terrible.
00:20:43.980
Yes, it is.
00:20:46.140
And I guess my question to you would be, how much of that, when you had people disowning you,
00:20:52.540
when you had media that kind of was doing what we just described, how much of that was from people
00:20:58.220
that, in your view, knew it was all nonsense, and went along with it versus people that actually
00:21:04.220
believed maybe there was a kernel of truth to it?
00:21:07.500
Yeah, the difference between the expression, the public versus the private opinions that people
00:21:13.340
expressed was very stark. Cancel culture is, it's a preference falsification machine.
00:21:20.860
Because when you see all these people on Twitter sort of saying terrible things about you,
00:21:25.020
attack anyone who dares to defend you, or even sort of withhold judgment about you,
00:21:31.660
it creates a climate of terror that, that leads people to believe, well, it's not safe to support
00:21:36.220
this person. Now, that's a false appearance, because Twitter isn't representative of real life,
00:21:40.860
media is not representative of real life. In real life, people were, for the most part,
00:21:46.620
exceedingly generous, kind, I still get people to this day who will come up to me and say sorry
00:21:52.700
that for what happened to me. And it was the complete opposite in the sort of online and public
00:21:59.180
realm, people felt that they could not do this. So, you know, the one one of the journalists who tried
00:22:04.300
writing a kind of investigative feature story about what what had actually happened here, he found it was
00:22:09.980
very, very challenging to get people willing to go on the record, that they would privately say,
00:22:15.820
you know, what an injustice, this is so terrible. And they couldn't say so publicly. So, you know,
00:22:21.820
you sort of, you know, and speaking of like, where's the kind of the moral, you know, the damage,
00:22:27.980
I expect the NDP to behave the way they behave, right? In a way, and there's an I have legal recourse
00:22:38.060
there. So I've, I've launched a $7 million defamation suit against the CBC, the Toronto Star,
00:22:42.380
the NDP, Progress Alberta, all the all the others, where there's no recourse, and where there's no
00:22:47.980
comprehension is the betrayal of friends. And I don't know if you've had analogous experiences,
00:22:53.900
but betrayal is one of the strangest forms of suffering, because it's one that can really turn
00:22:58.860
into an internal affliction, because it remains incomprehensible. You can never ask people,
00:23:05.100
why did you abandon me in my hour of need, right? So that's, that's actually the one that kind of
00:23:11.180
cuts deeper. Yeah, and it also, I mean, for in my case, it, I was fortunate that it didn't happen
00:23:17.660
hugely. The bigger issue was people that were the quiet friends, but you know, they're only quiet friends.
00:23:22.940
And the challenge that I experienced was that the way that I could sort of reconcile
00:23:28.940
what was happening was that, well, everyone who knows me knows it's nonsense. So when someone who
00:23:33.900
does know you doesn't behave the way most of the people who know you are, it does force you to sort
00:23:38.540
of question, wait, maybe, and it goes back to what we were talking about earlier, and you start to
00:23:42.620
internalize some of what other people are saying. And just to be more precise on the media side of
00:23:47.260
things, I'll say, and I'm not proud of this by any stretch, but litigation, and the threat of
00:23:52.300
litigation are very powerful forces. I mean, when a company be at True North or Chorus is served with,
00:23:58.300
with a legal notice, I mean, it very much triggers that political impulse of well, you know, making it
00:24:03.980
go away, because not everyone has the capacity or the bandwidth or the funds to make everything the
00:24:09.740
hill to die on. So you've actually turned around and have used this process to seek justice. And
00:24:16.540
I'm wondering if you were optimistic that that would work?
00:24:18.700
With the litigation? Yeah. So I mean, for context, you and Chorus and one other podcast were served
00:24:29.740
with legal notice from Jivraj. Other podcasters were threatened with legal action. He never pursued
00:24:34.300
any of that. It's a bluff, because everything that I've said was true. And he knows that.
00:24:40.380
But, you know, if you're a small outlet, that's a potent threat. But I'm now
00:24:47.980
two years into discovery against some of the nation's biggest media outlets. And
00:24:53.500
obviously, I can't say too much about that. I don't want to breach the implied undertaking rule. But
00:25:00.380
I am more optimistic now having learned what I've learned than I was when I started this process.
00:25:05.020
But it is a long process. And it's very costly. And you know, that's kind of one of the perverse
00:25:08.620
ironies of being cancelled is, if you're defamed in such a way that makes it difficult to earn a
00:25:13.020
livelihood, it may take a decade and a half million dollars to use litigation to try to seek redress
00:25:21.020
for that. So that's challenging. But like I said, I'm optimistic that it's a meritorious case.
00:25:26.940
We have a clip from the documentary. I want to show people and then we'll
00:25:32.140
we'll wrap things up in a moment. But people can take a look at that right now.
00:25:34.940
Controversy surrounding a United Conservative Party candidate has caused her to step down.
00:25:40.300
Yes, Kaylin Ford has resigned as a UCP candidate in the riding of Calgary Mountain View after
00:25:46.620
a report claiming she echoed white nationalist rhetoric. What was shared was her private messages.
00:25:52.300
She was engaged in a Facebook chat with somebody. The accusation was that she had said something
00:25:59.100
in a private conversation that had echoed the words of white supremacists.
00:26:04.300
Kaylin Ford says those Facebook messages were taken out of context.
00:26:08.300
The statement did not have one word of contrition, apology or backing down from those statements.
00:26:13.820
The NDP has now started running attack ads framing the United Conservative Party as intolerant.
00:26:19.820
I was utterly shocked to hear of the comments that that candidate who was of course a star candidate for
00:26:27.100
the UCP made.
00:26:29.980
That is a bit of When the Mob Came featuring and produced by Kaylin Ford. It comes out tonight.
00:26:37.740
Congratulations on this. I know this has obviously been four years of your life now.
00:26:42.220
And as we've discussed, the story is still unfolding in some ways.
00:26:45.900
But I'm glad you're standing up and talking about this, Kaylin.
00:26:48.860
Thanks for coming on today.
00:26:49.900
Thank you, Andrew.
00:26:50.700
Thanks for listening to The Andrew Lawton Show.
00:26:53.020
Support the program by donating to True North at www.tnc.news.
00:26:58.700
Thank you.
00:27:00.540
Oh, man.
00:27:09.260
Oh.
00:27:10.060
Oh, man.
00:27:10.460
That's huh.
00:27:11.220
Oh, man.
00:27:12.860
Oh, man.
00:27:13.340
Oh, man.
00:27:14.340
Oh, man.
00:27:14.680
Oh, man.
00:27:14.940
Oh, man.
00:27:15.360
Oh, man.
00:27:17.860
Oh, man.
00:27:17.960
Oh, man.
00:27:18.680
Oh, man.
00:27:19.300
Oh, man.
00:27:20.360
Oh, man.
00:27:20.880
Oh, man.
00:27:21.940
Oh, man.
00:27:22.300
Oh.
00:27:23.340
Oh, man.
00:27:24.540
Oh, man.
00:27:24.860
Oh, man.
00:27:25.680
Oh, man.
00:27:26.360
Nah.
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