Juno News - May 13, 2021


The Zero-Sense, One-Dose Summer


Episode Stats

Length

35 minutes

Words per Minute

172.22586

Word Count

6,141

Sentence Count

337


Summary


Transcript

00:00:00.000 Welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show.
00:00:06.700 This is The Andrew Lawton Show, brought to you by True North.
00:00:12.940 Coming up, Justin Trudeau throws some crumbs to the peasants with his offer of a one-dose summer,
00:00:17.780 a caucus mutiny in Alberta's UCP government,
00:00:20.620 and calling out dishonest reporting about Israel from the mainstream media.
00:00:26.280 The Andrew Lawton Show starts right now.
00:00:30.000 Hello, welcome to Canada's Most Irreverent Talk Show.
00:00:35.980 This is The Andrew Lawton Show on True North, May 13th, 2021.
00:00:40.900 Just coming up in a few weeks' time is our one-dose summer.
00:00:45.880 I know, I'm so excited. I've been looking forward my whole life to having a one-dose summer.
00:00:50.080 Sounds like a weird band from the 90s, or alternatively some weird summer chick flick teenage rom-com type film
00:00:59.380 where you get to have your one-dose summer.
00:01:01.640 You've been cooped up. You finally get to come out and have a little bit of fun with your friends,
00:01:05.440 but not too much because it's only a one-dose summer.
00:01:09.180 Yeah, this was something that Prime Minister Justin Trudeau threw to us as being in some way a good thing.
00:01:15.980 Why don't you take a look?
00:01:16.940 We all want to have a summer where we can see our loved ones and invite friends over for barbecues.
00:01:22.820 We can have that summer. We can have a one-dose summer.
00:01:28.820 But for that, two things need to happen.
00:01:32.500 First, restrictions need to remain in place until cases go way down with more screening, testing, and contact tracing.
00:01:41.000 We need to successfully limit community transmission.
00:01:45.800 Second, as Dr. Tam said, at least 75% of Canadians need to have received their first shots.
00:01:54.260 And we need to keep ramping up those second doses.
00:01:57.820 If we can do this, then we can have a more normal, better summer.
00:02:02.760 So Trudeau's saying this is all part of the big master plan.
00:02:05.620 A one-dose summer sets us up for a two-dose fall.
00:02:08.140 And then, I'm not sure if you heard it, but the wording is very important here.
00:02:12.180 And in the fall, we'll be able to talk about going back to school, back to work, and back to more normality.
00:02:20.740 So not that in the fall we'll be able to go back to a normal life,
00:02:24.940 but in the fall we'll be able to talk about maybe at some point, somehow,
00:02:29.900 at some point in the next 72 years, having a back-to-normal plan,
00:02:34.440 which is pretty much the only crumbs we're being thrown from our leaders and overlords right now.
00:02:40.320 And I'm not exactly convinced.
00:02:42.340 After all, remember when he said this?
00:02:44.260 It's all too likely we won't be gathering for Thanksgiving,
00:02:48.000 but we still have a shot at Christmas.
00:02:51.600 Together, we have the power to get this second wave under control.
00:02:55.540 Yes, that was in the lead-up to Thanksgiving of 2020,
00:02:58.400 when Justin Trudeau said, well, we still have a shot at Christmas.
00:03:02.260 Alas, there was no shot to be found.
00:03:04.500 If you're a Hamilton fan, we all threw away our collective shot,
00:03:07.760 as we're doing now with our one-dose summer.
00:03:11.420 Now, I know not everyone watching this wants to get their COVID-19 shot.
00:03:15.840 Not everyone wants to be vaccinated.
00:03:17.540 I am a complete believer in your right as an individual to make that determination for yourself.
00:03:22.280 But we cannot ignore the fact that there are countless people in Canada
00:03:26.480 that desperately want to be vaccinated, but cannot be.
00:03:30.340 They want to get their shots, but are unable to,
00:03:32.660 because Justin Trudeau's government has completely mishandled this.
00:03:36.660 Well, Britain is having large, huge raves in Liverpool,
00:03:40.480 and the United States is reopening, stripping away mask mandates,
00:03:44.160 stripping away gathering restrictions,
00:03:45.800 while the cruise industry is firing up.
00:03:47.920 What we see in Canada is that people are going to be limited
00:03:51.400 to just a few nice little outdoor masked activities in the summer months,
00:03:55.180 and only potentially maybe just sort of talking
00:03:57.960 about getting back to a normal restriction-free life in the fall.
00:04:02.080 And if this government's record is any indication,
00:04:04.500 I am not convinced that is going to happen.
00:04:06.780 And if you need proof they don't know what they're doing,
00:04:08.720 just look at what Canada's chief medical officer, Dr. Theresa Tam, said,
00:04:12.900 that by the summer, we could as a country be mixing and matching vaccines.
00:04:16.460 If you got one dose of this, they might give you a second dose of something else.
00:04:20.340 AstraZeneca for dose one, Pfizer for dose two.
00:04:23.040 This is not what you do when you have your crap together.
00:04:26.680 This is what you do when you're floundering,
00:04:28.500 when you have no guaranteed trajectory for your vaccine supply,
00:04:32.200 and when you are actually just making things up on the fly
00:04:34.880 because you didn't have any long-term planning.
00:04:37.720 The thing about the way that the vaccines were supposed to be taken,
00:04:41.260 the two-dose regimen, three or four weeks apart,
00:04:43.700 is that it's a lot easier to control
00:04:45.780 because you're only looking three weeks down the line, basically.
00:04:49.580 When you're starting to plan four months down the line,
00:04:52.260 you cannot, certainly not in Canada right now,
00:04:55.080 guarantee that if someone has a dose of something in May,
00:04:58.320 that they will have a dose ready for them four months from that point.
00:05:02.780 And that's the problem Canada has now,
00:05:04.980 which is why we're stuck with a one-dose summer,
00:05:07.140 because no one thought that,
00:05:08.280 hey, maybe we should get things moving earlier on
00:05:10.920 to have the two-doses available for when the people
00:05:13.960 who want to get vaccinated are ready to get vaccinated.
00:05:17.380 And then you have health minister Patty Hajdu saying that,
00:05:20.500 well, you know what, people should probably check with their doctor
00:05:22.740 if they've had AstraZeneca,
00:05:24.700 and politicians that are making really dumb calls on one hand,
00:05:28.680 but not even wanting to own them.
00:05:30.780 Michelle Rempel-Garner, the conservative health critic,
00:05:33.480 had put to Justin Trudeau a very realistic question,
00:05:36.720 a very valid question,
00:05:37.720 which is that given the mismatch we've seen in health guidance
00:05:41.200 about what AstraZeneca is supposed to be used for,
00:05:44.580 who should use it,
00:05:45.720 should people who got an AstraZeneca shot be talking to their doctor?
00:05:49.540 Here's the exchange from question period,
00:05:52.260 and instead of owning that the Liberal government has messed this up,
00:05:56.100 Trudeau just goes to his default,
00:05:58.040 which is name-calling and insulting Conservatives.
00:06:00.960 The Prime Minister received his first dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine.
00:06:04.680 Will he be getting a second dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine,
00:06:08.560 two doses of Pfizer or Moderna,
00:06:10.820 or one dose of Pfizer or Moderna in the future?
00:06:14.300 Which one will it be?
00:06:15.880 Right, Honourable Prime Minister.
00:06:17.720 Mr. Speaker, I thank the Honourable Member for Nosehill
00:06:20.560 for her questions about my well-being.
00:06:22.780 Let me assure her that I talked to my doctor just last week.
00:06:26.460 He recommended that I indeed get a second dose of AstraZeneca
00:06:29.980 in the coming weeks or months when it becomes available,
00:06:34.480 when my turn comes up in the province of Ontario.
00:06:39.400 That is what I am focused on doing.
00:06:41.720 I know there are questions being asked around the world
00:06:43.960 about the data that involves mixing and matching doses.
00:06:47.580 There are no recommendations around that yet,
00:06:49.660 but I know scientists are leaning in carefully
00:06:51.380 to see if it may be the right option for many people.
00:06:54.980 Honourable Member for Calgary, Nosehill.
00:06:57.300 Is the Prime Minister and the government recommending
00:06:59.980 that people who receive the first dose of AstraZeneca
00:07:02.580 get a second dose of AstraZeneca with that comment he just made,
00:07:06.440 or is he advising them to contact their doctor?
00:07:09.460 The Right Honourable Prime Minister.
00:07:11.900 The Prime Minister and the government
00:07:13.380 don't make health recommendations.
00:07:15.320 That's not my job.
00:07:16.680 My job is to...
00:07:17.760 I shared, for example, what the member asked
00:07:21.680 what advice I personally got from my doctor.
00:07:23.920 I certainly encourage all Canadians to talk to their doctors.
00:07:26.800 Who will then be informed by experts and doctors
00:07:30.500 both in their jurisdictions, in their provinces and territories,
00:07:34.440 and by the national guidance from NACI and from Health Canada.
00:07:38.960 That is the best way to move forward.
00:07:41.100 Don't take recommendations from politicians,
00:07:42.900 particularly not Conservatives.
00:07:44.380 Take recommendations from your doctors and the experts.
00:07:47.360 Just like Stephen Gilbeau, whenever you're backed into a corner,
00:07:49.880 just name-call the Conservatives,
00:07:51.320 and all your problems will go away.
00:07:53.420 What about all of that civil tone and Team Canada stuff
00:07:56.440 that we were supposed to be hearing about?
00:07:58.420 Well, that only works when you're talking to Conservatives, apparently.
00:08:02.160 So right now you have a government
00:08:04.160 that has completely lost any ability for the population to trust it.
00:08:09.580 This poll I found not all that surprising,
00:08:12.280 that Canadians have less trust in political leadership
00:08:15.180 because of how the pandemic was handled.
00:08:17.180 This is true of Jason Kenney.
00:08:19.480 It's true of Doug Ford.
00:08:20.960 It's true of Justin Trudeau.
00:08:22.580 Oddly, it's true of everyone but Francois Legault,
00:08:25.360 which is odd because Quebec has been
00:08:26.900 one of the more restricted provinces in Confederation.
00:08:30.380 But pretty much every leader in this country
00:08:32.480 is less trusted now because of the pandemic.
00:08:36.180 So Trudeau doesn't get to say,
00:08:37.460 well, political leaders don't give health advice.
00:08:39.800 Yeah, you do.
00:08:40.820 You're actually responsible for imposing restrictions.
00:08:43.260 You're responsible for vaccine supply.
00:08:45.980 And your staff are responsible for giving the guidance
00:08:49.020 that has been the source of all of the confusion right now.
00:08:52.920 And incidentally, even trust within parties,
00:08:55.880 within governments is waning.
00:08:57.900 This is a huge bombshell out of Alberta.
00:09:00.620 You may remember I spoke to Premier Jason Kenney on the weekend.
00:09:04.340 His caucus chair, an MLA,
00:09:06.920 has stepped down from caucus
00:09:09.400 with the reason being he does not trust
00:09:13.700 Jason Kenney's handling of the pandemic.
00:09:15.500 And he actually slips into his letter this.
00:09:18.980 Along with so many Albertans,
00:09:20.540 our understanding was that we in the UCP
00:09:22.700 had united around our shared principles,
00:09:25.140 integrity, and common sense approaches to governing.
00:09:28.080 In short, an Alberta strong and free.
00:09:30.380 We did not unite around blind loyalty to one man.
00:09:33.600 And while you promoted unity,
00:09:35.160 it is clear that unity is falling apart.
00:09:37.440 I know that many Albertans, including myself,
00:09:40.660 no longer have confidence in your leadership.
00:09:43.300 I thank you for your service,
00:09:44.860 but I'm asking that you resign
00:09:46.440 so that we can begin to put our province back together again.
00:09:50.660 Now, he hasn't resigned from the UCP.
00:09:52.640 He's resigned from his leadership role
00:09:54.380 to say to Jason Kenney,
00:09:56.060 you've got to go.
00:09:57.540 Now, this does not speak to specific restrictions,
00:10:00.440 although I think those certainly contributed to it,
00:10:02.660 but rather a leadership style
00:10:04.320 that Todd Lowen is calling out here,
00:10:06.140 where he says individual voices who've wanted to speak up
00:10:08.960 do not have the right to,
00:10:10.400 and it's basically the Jason Kenney show.
00:10:13.420 And you may think,
00:10:14.380 oh, well, it's just one disgruntled MLA,
00:10:16.880 except it's really not,
00:10:18.380 because another MLA hours later came out
00:10:21.340 and said the same thing,
00:10:23.160 and that was UCP MLA David Hanson
00:10:25.660 supported his colleagues' courage.
00:10:28.340 Those are his words.
00:10:29.140 He said,
00:10:29.420 Todd, I applaud your courage
00:10:30.600 and stand behind your decision.
00:10:32.620 I hear the same thing from our supporters in my area.
00:10:35.740 I, along with many of our colleagues,
00:10:37.420 share in your frustration.
00:10:39.000 We, along with many Albertans,
00:10:40.600 worked too hard to unite conservatives
00:10:42.920 to hand this province back to the NDP.
00:10:45.240 Thanks for taking a stand.
00:10:46.420 He doesn't specifically say he wants Kenney to resign,
00:10:49.160 but he speaks up in support of a letter that does.
00:10:51.820 And if he's being truthful
00:10:53.240 when he talks about many colleagues sharing the same thing,
00:10:56.020 this is going to be bad news for Jason Kenney.
00:10:59.020 And the thing about Alberta
00:11:00.300 is that Alberta's caucus
00:11:01.400 has a lot of true believers in it,
00:11:03.200 people that are genuinely bona fide conservatives
00:11:06.040 that are not going to take a lot of these measures
00:11:08.800 if they persist.
00:11:10.700 And this is just me putting on my analytical hat now.
00:11:13.460 This is not even a judgment call on my part,
00:11:15.820 but there are a lot of people
00:11:17.140 that I think in Alberta would not hesitate
00:11:19.500 to dethrone the king, so to speak,
00:11:21.960 in a way that we don't see political leaders
00:11:24.780 and politicians doing in Ontario,
00:11:26.860 where everyone's just shut up
00:11:28.080 and gone along in lockstep with it,
00:11:30.040 especially after the PC party made an example
00:11:33.340 of Roman Baber and Belinda Carajalios
00:11:35.420 by kicking them out,
00:11:37.460 by kicking them out for daring to criticize
00:11:39.880 earlier on even their government's handling
00:11:42.080 of the pandemic.
00:11:44.260 So I expect we'll see a lot more of this,
00:11:46.300 certainly in Alberta, maybe in other provinces,
00:11:48.700 but less likely there in the days and weeks to come.
00:11:51.400 But when you can't even command
00:11:53.540 the confidence of your caucus,
00:11:54.800 you certainly cannot command the confidence
00:11:57.180 of your country or your province,
00:11:59.760 whatever the case may be.
00:12:01.020 And that is why we see a trust pandemic going on,
00:12:04.440 or rather a mistrust pandemic.
00:12:06.480 We've got to take a break.
00:12:07.620 When we come back,
00:12:08.280 we will turn our attention to Israel
00:12:09.640 here on The Andrew Lawton Show.
00:12:11.260 Stay tuned.
00:12:11.800 Welcome back to The Andrew Lawton Show.
00:12:24.440 I want to turn to what's been happening
00:12:26.380 over in the Middle East,
00:12:28.140 an inflammation of the conflict
00:12:30.040 between Israel and the Palestinians,
00:12:33.180 particularly between Israel and Hamas,
00:12:36.140 which is the de facto governing authority,
00:12:39.240 if you can call it that, of Gaza.
00:12:41.800 And the interesting dynamic that's taking place here
00:12:44.440 has been so woefully misrepresented by the media.
00:12:47.420 Yes, you've got rockets and missiles
00:12:48.900 that are going back and forth
00:12:50.340 between Gaza and Israel,
00:12:51.880 between Hamas and Israel.
00:12:53.860 But the effect it's having on civilians
00:12:57.060 has been misrepresented.
00:12:58.720 The chronology has been misrepresented.
00:13:01.220 And even the tension that actually triggered this
00:13:04.400 has been misrepresented.
00:13:06.160 A dispute that goes back
00:13:08.340 to a specific area of Jerusalem
00:13:11.440 and Palestinian families being evicted.
00:13:14.620 But I want to talk about this in great detail
00:13:16.560 because, again, the facts are important
00:13:18.500 and are not being told
00:13:20.020 in the mainstream media coverage,
00:13:21.580 which is why Mike Fegelman
00:13:23.240 of Honest Reporting Canada does what he does.
00:13:25.860 He goes through,
00:13:26.580 and if you look at his website,
00:13:27.560 you can see point by point
00:13:29.080 anytime the media passes off
00:13:31.240 a falsehood as truth
00:13:32.540 or makes even an honest mistake
00:13:34.560 that has significant implications,
00:13:35.920 he's there to record it
00:13:37.920 and to actually get it corrected
00:13:39.940 and has a fair bit of success
00:13:41.680 with this in the past as well.
00:13:43.820 Mike Fegelman, good to talk to you.
00:13:45.160 Thanks for coming on today.
00:13:46.500 My pleasure.
00:13:47.140 Good to be with you, Andrew.
00:13:48.080 So I want to start with,
00:13:49.640 because this is so complicated
00:13:51.120 and people like you
00:13:52.220 who immerse yourself in this
00:13:54.640 have a background knowledge
00:13:56.620 that a lot of Canadians
00:13:57.920 might not have looking at this,
00:13:59.960 if we bring this most recent bout
00:14:03.280 of tension and conflict back,
00:14:04.980 it seems to be something
00:14:06.360 that most people are triggering back
00:14:08.060 to what has itself been misrepresented,
00:14:10.840 which is this eviction
00:14:11.820 of Palestinian families
00:14:13.600 from their home.
00:14:14.240 And I want to play a brief clip here,
00:14:15.980 if I may,
00:14:16.880 of a radio report
00:14:18.500 that aired on CBC Radio.
00:14:20.860 A spokesman for Hamas in Beirut,
00:14:23.000 Osama Hamdan,
00:14:24.140 isn't making any promises
00:14:25.500 about how long they will continue,
00:14:28.300 but he sounded just as defiant,
00:14:30.600 blaming Israel
00:14:31.340 for weeks of clashes in Jerusalem,
00:14:33.520 where Israelis are trying
00:14:35.280 to evict Palestinian homeowners
00:14:37.100 and where Palestinians
00:14:38.420 and Israeli police
00:14:39.760 have clashed
00:14:40.720 at the city's holiest shrine,
00:14:43.100 Al-Aqsa.
00:14:44.120 So that reporter,
00:14:45.760 Sasha Petrikic,
00:14:46.800 says that there are Israelis
00:14:49.080 trying to evict
00:14:50.740 Palestinian homeowners.
00:14:53.060 This is not, though,
00:14:54.360 as you point out,
00:14:55.300 accurate.
00:14:55.700 Well, it's not.
00:14:57.460 And quite frankly,
00:14:59.300 what the Palestinians are doing,
00:15:01.420 Hamas and Palestinian Authority,
00:15:03.040 they're exploiting
00:15:03.640 what is traditionally
00:15:04.380 a real estate dispute,
00:15:06.040 something between tenants
00:15:07.100 and landowners,
00:15:08.740 into a nationalistic claim
00:15:12.900 with a fervor
00:15:13.620 to incite the masses
00:15:15.280 to convict violence.
00:15:16.600 The issue is simply
00:15:17.360 that the Palestinians
00:15:19.060 who are living in these homes
00:15:20.520 are living there rent-free
00:15:22.500 and are squatting
00:15:23.460 and not paying rent
00:15:24.420 to the Jewish owners.
00:15:26.500 And, you know,
00:15:27.300 Israel, it's a democracy
00:15:28.840 and it's an issue
00:15:30.380 that's being dealt with
00:15:31.280 and adjudicated
00:15:32.060 in the Israeli courts,
00:15:33.480 Supreme Court, mind you.
00:15:34.860 The Israeli government's
00:15:35.780 not taking a position.
00:15:36.740 This is for the judiciary.
00:15:39.280 And yet this issue
00:15:40.940 is being used
00:15:42.540 as a pretext,
00:15:43.940 a whipping tool,
00:15:45.260 really,
00:15:45.780 to foment a discord
00:15:47.460 between Israelis
00:15:48.240 and Palestinians
00:15:48.940 of the likes
00:15:49.600 that we're seeing
00:15:50.120 play out in the streets
00:15:51.480 of Jerusalem
00:15:52.040 and as you see
00:15:53.920 with, you know,
00:15:54.460 2,000 rockets
00:15:55.360 that have been fired
00:15:56.060 on Israeli cities
00:15:56.900 like Ashkelon
00:15:57.660 and Sderot.
00:15:58.840 Yeah, and the shameful
00:16:00.100 part of this
00:16:01.320 is that you are
00:16:02.320 very correct to point out
00:16:03.540 that there are people
00:16:04.300 that want to turn this
00:16:05.700 into something different
00:16:07.140 than what it is,
00:16:07.840 who want to misrepresent
00:16:09.220 the facts
00:16:09.720 and who want to stoke this.
00:16:11.160 But a lot of people
00:16:11.920 in the media
00:16:12.520 are buying into it.
00:16:14.400 And I have to ask,
00:16:15.340 is this just because
00:16:16.220 of ignorance
00:16:17.160 in a lot of ways?
00:16:18.020 They don't know this
00:16:18.840 or is it because
00:16:19.820 there is a more,
00:16:22.120 if I can use the word,
00:16:23.160 a more insidious bias
00:16:24.300 that's taking place
00:16:25.240 where they just want to view
00:16:26.440 that Israeli dynamic
00:16:28.560 through that lens?
00:16:30.620 Yeah, so I think
00:16:31.260 it's a combination.
00:16:32.180 I'll draw back
00:16:32.920 to the report
00:16:33.940 by Sasser Petrasek.
00:16:35.440 You know,
00:16:35.580 do I think that he has
00:16:36.440 an axe to grind
00:16:37.220 against Israel?
00:16:38.100 Not necessarily,
00:16:39.380 but I do think
00:16:39.900 that he got the facts wrong
00:16:40.960 because the Palestinians
00:16:42.120 were not homeowners.
00:16:43.720 They were just living
00:16:44.740 in a rental establishment.
00:16:47.140 You know,
00:16:47.500 Andrew,
00:16:48.080 if you rent your apartment
00:16:49.380 and you don't pay it,
00:16:50.900 you're going to have
00:16:51.580 to deal with
00:16:52.000 the legal process.
00:16:53.100 You know,
00:16:53.600 the next step
00:16:54.640 is not to,
00:16:55.720 you know,
00:16:56.740 throw rocks
00:16:57.340 and shoot people
00:16:58.960 and lob rockets
00:17:00.680 at Israelis.
00:17:01.540 But there are,
00:17:03.560 you know,
00:17:03.780 it's a case-by-case basis,
00:17:04.900 but there certainly
00:17:05.380 are journalists
00:17:06.080 who have inclinations
00:17:09.240 where they have
00:17:11.020 certain partisan favoritism
00:17:13.680 of certain issues
00:17:15.100 and their opinion
00:17:15.940 sometimes gets disguised
00:17:17.280 as news.
00:17:18.460 It can be subtle
00:17:19.280 and other times
00:17:19.880 it can be really quite obvious.
00:17:21.900 I mean,
00:17:22.100 a report that we flagged
00:17:23.080 this morning,
00:17:24.080 a CBC journalist,
00:17:25.540 a freelancer,
00:17:26.460 had claimed that Gaza
00:17:27.420 is an open-air prison.
00:17:29.120 That's highly
00:17:30.200 inflammatory language
00:17:31.260 for a supposed
00:17:32.540 neutral and objective
00:17:33.880 journalist to use.
00:17:34.980 But therein,
00:17:35.880 you see,
00:17:36.460 you know,
00:17:36.920 representatives
00:17:37.520 from Canada's
00:17:38.940 public broadcast
00:17:39.700 or our tax dollars
00:17:40.620 who are using
00:17:41.580 that kind of
00:17:42.720 incendiary language
00:17:44.060 and it's just
00:17:45.460 not objective.
00:17:46.780 And essentially,
00:17:48.260 what we do
00:17:48.740 at Honest Reporting,
00:17:49.360 we're not trying
00:17:49.780 to impart
00:17:50.540 and tell the media
00:17:52.700 that they have to
00:17:53.260 report in a certain way.
00:17:54.460 We just want them
00:17:55.020 to get the facts straight
00:17:56.180 and to give Israel
00:17:57.960 a fair shake,
00:17:58.740 but we're not seeing it.
00:18:00.220 Yeah,
00:18:00.780 and open-air prison.
00:18:02.000 I mean,
00:18:02.180 I've heard that term before.
00:18:03.580 It's frequently used
00:18:04.420 by people who are
00:18:05.600 quite anti-Israel,
00:18:06.740 whatever the motivation
00:18:07.540 of this particular journalist
00:18:09.820 that CBC tapped
00:18:11.700 for this segment was.
00:18:12.960 But it's a values judgment.
00:18:14.460 There's no way about it.
00:18:15.620 It is a value judgment.
00:18:16.980 It is an argumentation point
00:18:19.380 that people could debate,
00:18:20.660 but it's not a neutral point.
00:18:22.380 It's not a fact-based point.
00:18:23.540 I saw another news report
00:18:25.480 not from Canada
00:18:26.240 that kind of nonchalantly
00:18:27.820 refer to Israel
00:18:28.820 as occupying Gaza,
00:18:30.360 which as well is not true.
00:18:32.140 Someone would hear that, though,
00:18:33.460 and that inherently frames
00:18:34.820 the way they listen to
00:18:36.340 and consume coverage.
00:18:38.140 And for a region
00:18:38.880 that has so much history,
00:18:40.100 I mean,
00:18:40.240 I've been to Israel twice.
00:18:41.560 I've studied this extensively.
00:18:43.000 It's a part of the world
00:18:43.960 that I'm very passionate about.
00:18:45.260 And even I wouldn't proclaim
00:18:46.600 to be an expert
00:18:47.400 on all of these details
00:18:48.820 and nuances.
00:18:49.600 And whenever I've written
00:18:50.420 about Israel,
00:18:51.160 I'm very nervous
00:18:52.240 of accidentally using
00:18:53.720 the wrong word
00:18:54.540 or stumbling into
00:18:55.560 some sort of a landmine.
00:18:57.640 And people are going
00:18:58.820 to make mistakes.
00:18:59.560 I get it.
00:19:00.280 They need to be corrected.
00:19:01.840 You've been flagging these.
00:19:03.100 Has there been,
00:19:04.080 in this particular case,
00:19:05.380 any response from CBC
00:19:06.880 that's saying,
00:19:08.100 yeah, you know what?
00:19:08.720 You raise a good point there, Mike.
00:19:11.060 So what I'm happy to say
00:19:12.980 is we have a very good dialogue
00:19:14.440 with the CBC.
00:19:15.360 We speak to their teams,
00:19:17.380 various teams,
00:19:18.140 different leverage points
00:19:18.900 to the CBC very regularly.
00:19:21.520 In some media,
00:19:22.760 there's a feeling
00:19:23.480 that they're immune
00:19:24.020 to criticism.
00:19:24.920 In some levels of the CBC,
00:19:26.180 that exists.
00:19:27.280 But I think that the CBC
00:19:28.720 is cognizant
00:19:30.520 that mistakes are being made.
00:19:32.500 I'd like to think
00:19:33.460 that they are taking
00:19:34.740 remedial action.
00:19:35.800 It doesn't always happen.
00:19:37.500 You're right to point out
00:19:38.360 that covering
00:19:39.160 the Arab-Israeli conflict
00:19:40.340 is probably the most complicated,
00:19:43.240 difficult assignment
00:19:44.060 for a journalist to do.
00:19:46.120 You know,
00:19:46.300 the lexicon of the Middle East
00:19:47.560 is a ticking time bomb.
00:19:48.600 You refer to people
00:19:49.800 making claims
00:19:50.740 that Israel's occupying Gaza,
00:19:52.480 though it doesn't.
00:19:53.760 And it disengaged in 2005
00:19:55.960 and Israel pulled out
00:19:56.960 its armed forces,
00:19:58.620 just, you know,
00:19:59.140 removed all 21 settlements,
00:20:01.280 8,500 settlers.
00:20:02.760 And what did it get?
00:20:03.380 It got a forward launching base
00:20:04.740 by an Iran proxy
00:20:06.080 shooting 2,000 rockets at it.
00:20:08.080 And it's,
00:20:09.060 the issue mostly
00:20:10.060 is that kind of context
00:20:11.520 is stripped.
00:20:12.820 You know,
00:20:13.340 when we talk about
00:20:14.120 the rocket fire,
00:20:15.320 we don't really consider
00:20:16.800 how, you know,
00:20:17.360 you hear the media say,
00:20:19.060 these are homemade rockets.
00:20:20.380 Well, the reality is
00:20:21.300 these things are really
00:20:22.940 going great distance.
00:20:24.440 They're lethal.
00:20:25.820 And the real concern is
00:20:27.720 not just with these,
00:20:28.940 these kind of rockets
00:20:29.920 that exist now,
00:20:30.640 but what could happen
00:20:31.680 in the future
00:20:32.180 if Palestinian terrorists
00:20:33.900 or Hezbollah terrorists
00:20:34.980 in Lebanon
00:20:35.420 or elsewhere
00:20:36.060 could get ICBMs,
00:20:37.700 intercontinental ballistic missiles,
00:20:39.520 which could really
00:20:40.980 put Israel in paralysis.
00:20:43.360 We saw last night,
00:20:44.300 there's incredible footage
00:20:46.320 of planes trying to land
00:20:48.420 at Ben-Gurion Airport
00:20:49.280 in Tel Aviv
00:20:49.980 where you see
00:20:50.920 the rockets being fired in
00:20:52.860 and Israel's missile interceptor,
00:20:54.380 the Iron Dome,
00:20:55.000 trying to repel them back.
00:20:57.040 And that's what
00:20:57.660 these terrorists
00:20:58.280 are really trying to do.
00:20:59.400 On top of,
00:21:00.140 you know,
00:21:00.540 ultimately committing
00:21:01.480 the genocide of Jews
00:21:02.440 and wiping Israel
00:21:03.700 off the map,
00:21:04.280 they're trying to paralyze Israel
00:21:05.520 because what ends up happening
00:21:06.980 is,
00:21:07.320 and we had,
00:21:08.100 I think,
00:21:08.260 three or four different
00:21:09.180 major airlines
00:21:10.520 cancelling flights to Israel
00:21:13.700 perhaps indefinitely
00:21:14.680 until the hostilities stop.
00:21:17.240 And that's what
00:21:18.220 they're trying to do.
00:21:19.000 It's another effort
00:21:20.180 to put a stranglehold
00:21:21.040 on Israel.
00:21:21.980 So when you have
00:21:22.680 different people
00:21:23.320 who are,
00:21:23.740 you know,
00:21:24.400 cavalierly advocating
00:21:25.420 for weapons sales
00:21:27.740 to be cancelled on Israel,
00:21:29.080 whether it's Canadian politicians
00:21:30.320 or elsewhere,
00:21:31.240 what they're actually doing
00:21:32.280 is saying,
00:21:33.020 is putting out a welcome mat
00:21:34.220 for Israel to be
00:21:35.420 on the continued receiving
00:21:36.740 end of rockets.
00:21:38.380 And I should add,
00:21:39.260 if that kind of a policy
00:21:41.000 took hold
00:21:41.620 and other governments
00:21:42.940 worldwide said,
00:21:43.940 you know what,
00:21:44.660 we shouldn't sell arms
00:21:45.520 to Israel,
00:21:46.340 that's welcoming
00:21:46.980 Israel's destruction.
00:21:48.580 And,
00:21:48.920 you know,
00:21:49.580 naturally Israel
00:21:50.540 is doing everything
00:21:51.420 in its power
00:21:52.940 to safeguard
00:21:54.880 its citizenry
00:21:56.500 and it has that responsibility.
00:21:58.500 And it goes without saying
00:21:59.560 that any civilian life
00:22:00.900 that is lost
00:22:01.980 is tragic.
00:22:03.280 But the reality is
00:22:04.320 Hamas is committing
00:22:05.200 double war crimes.
00:22:06.420 It's firing on civilians
00:22:07.880 while hiding behind civilians.
00:22:09.260 And that's the issue
00:22:10.660 that the media
00:22:11.160 are really missing out.
00:22:12.500 Well,
00:22:12.680 that is so tremendously
00:22:14.120 important, Mike,
00:22:14.960 because we see the footage
00:22:16.700 of,
00:22:17.220 in the last few days,
00:22:18.580 apartment buildings,
00:22:19.340 for example,
00:22:19.880 that have become
00:22:20.600 very ravaged
00:22:22.120 by Israeli responses
00:22:24.280 to Hamas rockets.
00:22:27.500 And what people
00:22:28.500 don't realize
00:22:29.240 is that Hamas
00:22:30.820 literally uses
00:22:32.120 civilians
00:22:32.940 as human shields
00:22:34.040 in this case.
00:22:34.780 But in the media,
00:22:36.000 these stories
00:22:36.620 tend to get told
00:22:37.480 as examples
00:22:38.320 of just rampant
00:22:39.480 and indiscriminate
00:22:40.280 Israeli aggression.
00:22:41.600 And one story
00:22:42.680 that you flag as well,
00:22:43.720 CBC National
00:22:44.480 claiming that
00:22:45.280 Palestinian rocket fire
00:22:46.540 was, quote,
00:22:47.440 in return,
00:22:49.020 unquote,
00:22:49.740 of Israeli airstrikes.
00:22:51.020 Again,
00:22:51.360 two words
00:22:51.900 that very fundamentally
00:22:53.100 change the dynamic
00:22:54.340 of how people
00:22:55.300 view the news.
00:22:57.220 Yeah,
00:22:57.640 and what they
00:22:58.340 actually did
00:22:58.840 is they reversed
00:22:59.540 the chronology
00:23:00.700 of how these
00:23:01.640 hostilities began.
00:23:03.700 And,
00:23:03.800 you know,
00:23:04.520 in the CBC's mind,
00:23:06.280 and mind you,
00:23:06.800 it was on CBC The National,
00:23:08.300 which is its flagship program,
00:23:10.600 you know,
00:23:11.260 and largely the source
00:23:12.940 where a lot of people
00:23:13.800 get information.
00:23:15.460 The story
00:23:16.400 and the narrative
00:23:16.980 that was told
00:23:17.600 was that Israel
00:23:18.680 initiated the violence
00:23:20.460 by shooting rockets
00:23:21.880 and the Palestinian terrorists
00:23:23.620 like Hamas
00:23:24.100 and Islamic Jihad
00:23:24.960 merely responded.
00:23:27.200 And that's just,
00:23:28.160 it's morally obtuse,
00:23:29.540 it's morally repugnant,
00:23:30.820 and it's just
00:23:31.300 flat out wrong.
00:23:32.860 And it's my job
00:23:34.880 to make sure
00:23:36.060 that the media
00:23:36.660 gets out the narrative
00:23:37.480 correctly
00:23:38.020 as it actually happened.
00:23:39.420 And we encourage
00:23:40.180 our members,
00:23:40.680 we have about 50,000 subscribers,
00:23:42.480 to complain directly
00:23:43.780 to the media
00:23:44.860 to voice their concerns.
00:23:47.420 Yeah,
00:23:47.980 and I'm glad you do that
00:23:49.040 because I do think
00:23:50.000 there is a,
00:23:50.580 the way you said about,
00:23:51.740 you know,
00:23:52.260 two war crimes
00:23:53.260 basically taking place
00:23:54.440 is incredibly valid.
00:23:55.640 Israel does what
00:23:56.300 it can
00:23:56.720 to minimize
00:23:57.660 collateral damage,
00:23:58.920 civilian casualties,
00:23:59.960 where Hamas does
00:24:00.680 what it can
00:24:01.240 to increase them
00:24:02.540 on both sides.
00:24:03.720 And that's the
00:24:04.380 particular evil here
00:24:05.420 is that,
00:24:06.160 yes,
00:24:06.340 they want to kill
00:24:06.960 Jewish lives,
00:24:08.020 but they also
00:24:08.840 are completely fine
00:24:10.180 killing their own citizens
00:24:11.420 if it helps them
00:24:12.480 in their PR battle
00:24:13.420 against Israel.
00:24:14.120 And I think it's incumbent
00:24:15.060 on Western media
00:24:16.420 to not go along
00:24:17.560 with that.
00:24:18.780 Oh, absolutely.
00:24:19.780 And I'll give you
00:24:20.340 a particular example.
00:24:21.180 even a Palestinian
00:24:22.740 human rights group
00:24:23.720 reported,
00:24:25.100 I believe,
00:24:25.360 yesterday or the day
00:24:26.080 before,
00:24:26.960 that eight Palestinians,
00:24:28.440 two children,
00:24:29.600 were killed
00:24:30.000 by errant
00:24:30.720 Palestinian rockets.
00:24:32.500 And what's interesting
00:24:33.140 to note is that
00:24:34.180 Israel speculates
00:24:36.040 that about
00:24:37.740 a third
00:24:38.580 of the 2,000 rockets
00:24:40.220 that have been fired
00:24:40.860 at Israeli cities
00:24:41.960 prematurely
00:24:43.220 exploded
00:24:44.100 or landed
00:24:44.940 errantly
00:24:45.380 within Gaza.
00:24:46.180 So when you hear
00:24:47.400 about the casualties
00:24:48.640 within the
00:24:50.760 Palestinian territories,
00:24:51.700 within Gaza,
00:24:52.500 which,
00:24:52.860 mind you,
00:24:53.660 are told by the
00:24:54.680 Gaza Ministry of Health,
00:24:56.380 which is an arm
00:24:57.060 of the Hamas terror group,
00:24:58.520 so you've got to question
00:24:59.200 the combatant
00:25:00.480 and civilian casualty
00:25:01.760 counts right there,
00:25:03.440 you're not really
00:25:05.000 hearing that,
00:25:06.140 well,
00:25:06.460 how many of these people
00:25:07.340 were killed
00:25:07.800 by Palestinian munitions?
00:25:09.920 And,
00:25:10.580 you know,
00:25:10.880 Israel suspects
00:25:11.560 that about 30 of,
00:25:12.880 I think,
00:25:13.460 at this point,
00:25:14.360 given,
00:25:14.800 you know,
00:25:15.060 where we are right now,
00:25:15.980 about 60-some-odd
00:25:16.920 Palestinians who've died
00:25:18.000 are actually terrorists.
00:25:20.580 But you don't hear
00:25:21.620 those numbers,
00:25:22.080 you just hear
00:25:22.540 the total number.
00:25:24.060 And that really paints
00:25:26.000 a misleading picture
00:25:26.960 that what's depicted
00:25:27.960 is that Israel is,
00:25:29.120 you know,
00:25:29.700 de facto and implicitly
00:25:30.960 targeting innocents.
00:25:32.400 And that's just not
00:25:32.940 the case.
00:25:33.560 They're,
00:25:34.180 with pinpoint precision,
00:25:36.200 targeting terrorists.
00:25:37.580 And they're doing it
00:25:38.240 in a way that minimizes
00:25:39.480 civilian casualties,
00:25:41.040 doing things like,
00:25:42.240 that are really untold,
00:25:43.580 to warn your combatant
00:25:45.080 that you're even
00:25:46.600 going to carry out
00:25:47.160 an attack.
00:25:47.720 So they'll,
00:25:48.700 you mentioned the buildings
00:25:50.420 that were destroyed,
00:25:51.320 which,
00:25:51.540 mind you,
00:25:51.840 were Hamas
00:25:52.680 terror infrastructure
00:25:54.700 they were using.
00:25:56.160 They warn them
00:25:57.240 with cell phone calls,
00:25:58.960 with text messages,
00:26:01.340 leaflets,
00:26:02.000 thousands of leaflets
00:26:02.900 that are dropped.
00:26:04.300 And then they use
00:26:04.840 a technique called
00:26:05.800 the roof-knocking technique,
00:26:06.780 where they drop
00:26:08.000 miniature munitions,
00:26:10.860 non-lethal munitions,
00:26:12.240 on the top of the roof,
00:26:12.980 to tell people
00:26:14.020 if they didn't heed
00:26:15.340 their warnings
00:26:15.840 to get out of the area.
00:26:16.980 There's no other army
00:26:18.080 in the history
00:26:19.340 of modern warfare
00:26:20.240 who would ever do this.
00:26:21.980 And that's why Israel
00:26:22.980 can proudly say
00:26:23.880 it's the most moral
00:26:24.520 military in the world.
00:26:26.440 Very well said.
00:26:27.700 And I appreciate
00:26:28.220 all your work
00:26:29.020 having to keep glued
00:26:30.260 to the mainstream media
00:26:31.180 day in,
00:26:31.680 day out
00:26:32.040 to call these things out.
00:26:33.720 But it is important
00:26:34.400 because when facts are gone,
00:26:36.000 you lose a whole bunch
00:26:37.320 in the way of any ability
00:26:38.540 of having an honest discussion.
00:26:40.000 Mike Fegelman,
00:26:41.040 Executive Director
00:26:41.880 of Honest Reporting Canada.
00:26:43.700 His great work
00:26:44.320 is updated pretty much
00:26:45.760 in real time these days.
00:26:47.140 And that's at
00:26:47.560 honestreporting.ca.
00:26:49.100 Mike, always a pleasure.
00:26:50.280 Thanks for coming on.
00:26:52.040 My pleasure.
00:26:52.940 Andrew, thank you.
00:26:54.080 Honest Reporting Canada.
00:26:55.400 They do absolutely
00:26:56.560 tremendous work
00:26:57.400 and so important to do.
00:26:59.020 And a lot of people
00:26:59.600 are going to say,
00:27:00.120 well, you know what?
00:27:00.780 That's a pro-Israel outlet.
00:27:02.540 Why are they the authority
00:27:04.580 on this?
00:27:05.180 And I'll say two things on that.
00:27:06.860 Number one,
00:27:07.760 they put everything
00:27:08.900 out front and center
00:27:10.040 completely with the facts
00:27:11.380 to let you decide
00:27:12.220 for yourselves.
00:27:13.040 But more importantly,
00:27:14.440 not everything
00:27:15.320 is morally neutral.
00:27:16.960 In fact,
00:27:17.320 a lot of things aren't.
00:27:18.720 And I would say
00:27:19.520 that we could all look
00:27:20.580 to the Jewish people
00:27:21.700 and the Palestinian people
00:27:22.860 and say, yes,
00:27:23.400 it's not fair
00:27:24.020 that they end up
00:27:24.820 as individual people
00:27:26.260 in the front lines
00:27:27.800 or in the crosshairs
00:27:28.700 of these conflicts.
00:27:30.460 But if you are stacking up
00:27:32.060 Israel and Hamas,
00:27:34.020 100% full stop,
00:27:36.240 Israel's the good guy,
00:27:37.200 Hamas is the bad guy.
00:27:38.420 There is zero justification
00:27:39.780 for any other position.
00:27:43.160 And it doesn't have to be
00:27:44.220 a 100% full-throated defense
00:27:46.460 of every single domestic decision
00:27:48.120 made by the Israeli government,
00:27:49.520 but it's talking about
00:27:50.960 rule of law
00:27:51.900 versus law of the jungle,
00:27:53.560 respect for life
00:27:54.560 versus destruction of life.
00:27:56.680 And this is something that,
00:27:58.380 again,
00:27:58.800 Canadian politicians
00:27:59.800 would be well-suited
00:28:01.080 to realize
00:28:02.340 that not everything
00:28:03.360 has to become
00:28:04.360 this morally neutral pablum,
00:28:06.880 which is what
00:28:07.500 Mark Garneau's statement
00:28:08.700 about this,
00:28:09.520 which came out yesterday,
00:28:11.020 was.
00:28:11.320 He said,
00:28:11.640 Canada was gravely concerned
00:28:13.080 by the situation,
00:28:14.420 urges all parties
00:28:15.320 to take immediate steps
00:28:16.460 to end the violence.
00:28:17.580 He says,
00:28:18.180 yes,
00:28:18.420 the indiscriminate barrage
00:28:19.540 of rocket attacks
00:28:20.380 fired by Hamas
00:28:21.360 is unacceptable
00:28:22.520 and must cease.
00:28:24.180 But then he goes on
00:28:24.980 and says,
00:28:25.440 ah,
00:28:25.480 but Canada is gravely concerned
00:28:26.860 by the continued expansion
00:28:28.360 of settlements
00:28:29.000 and by the demolitions
00:28:30.440 and evictions,
00:28:31.360 including the ongoing cases
00:28:32.920 in Sheikh Jarrah
00:28:33.720 and Silwan.
00:28:34.900 He says,
00:28:35.360 these actions impact families
00:28:37.020 and livelihoods
00:28:38.100 and do not serve peace
00:28:39.800 or international law,
00:28:41.260 even though it's a case
00:28:42.720 going before the Supreme Court
00:28:44.360 that is just a real estate dispute.
00:28:46.220 But Mark Garneau
00:28:47.080 didn't get into that.
00:28:48.360 And then he said,
00:28:49.200 Canada wants a two-state solution
00:28:50.820 with Palestinians
00:28:51.720 living side-by-side
00:28:53.120 with an Israel state
00:28:54.760 and Canada reiterates
00:28:56.340 its call
00:28:56.860 for immediate de-escalation.
00:28:59.120 Now,
00:28:59.620 Candace Malcolm,
00:29:00.560 my colleague,
00:29:01.140 made a brilliant point on this.
00:29:02.540 She said,
00:29:02.940 the statement is equivocal nonsense.
00:29:05.120 It's like they took
00:29:05.820 a conservative news release
00:29:07.160 condemning Hamas terrorism,
00:29:08.700 then found an NDP news release
00:29:10.500 demonizing Israel
00:29:11.540 and stapled them together.
00:29:13.460 And I still chuckle
00:29:14.280 when I see that
00:29:15.120 because I think
00:29:15.600 she captures it well,
00:29:17.080 whereas they didn't want
00:29:17.800 to actually take a position.
00:29:18.840 So they figured,
00:29:19.480 all right,
00:29:19.960 let's criticize both sides.
00:29:22.100 And maybe everyone
00:29:23.340 will love us.
00:29:24.820 And if you look at the response
00:29:25.740 to Mark Garneau's tweet,
00:29:27.160 all of the Israel lovers
00:29:28.840 are saying,
00:29:29.880 well, you know,
00:29:30.280 this is terrible.
00:29:30.880 And all the Palestinian lovers
00:29:32.680 are saying,
00:29:33.140 well, this is all terrible.
00:29:34.300 So they did that whole thing
00:29:35.500 of trying to walk the line
00:29:36.580 and keep both sides happy
00:29:37.700 and ending up alienating both,
00:29:39.960 which is why you need
00:29:41.180 to stand up for truth.
00:29:43.260 Canada should never shy away
00:29:44.820 from being an ally of Israel.
00:29:46.560 And I lament
00:29:47.600 that we have lost
00:29:48.920 that strong bond
00:29:50.360 that we had
00:29:50.960 under Stephen Harper,
00:29:52.200 who put out
00:29:52.940 a fantastic statement
00:29:54.100 on this.
00:29:55.140 Clear and concise.
00:29:56.360 Horrific scenes
00:29:57.100 out of Israel
00:29:57.680 over the last 24 hours
00:29:59.020 as civilians shelter
00:30:00.100 from a barrage
00:30:00.960 of terrorist escalation.
00:30:03.060 Attacks on the state
00:30:04.120 of Israel
00:30:04.660 are attacks on us all
00:30:05.820 and must be immediately
00:30:07.260 condemned
00:30:07.820 by international leaders.
00:30:09.300 I pray for the safety
00:30:10.540 of everyone in the region.
00:30:12.500 There's respect for life,
00:30:13.580 but a clear
00:30:14.340 and unequivocal stand
00:30:15.460 that Israel
00:30:16.540 is the one
00:30:17.520 being attacked.
00:30:18.600 Israel is not
00:30:20.080 the aggressor.
00:30:21.760 And when people point
00:30:22.680 to the sophistication
00:30:23.840 of Israeli weaponry,
00:30:25.340 Israel is better at this.
00:30:27.060 But that does not
00:30:28.000 make them the bad guys.
00:30:29.420 And Mike Fegelman
00:30:30.180 pointed this out
00:30:30.940 quite clearly.
00:30:32.040 Israel goes through
00:30:32.880 painstaking efforts
00:30:33.920 to minimize
00:30:34.540 Palestinian casualties.
00:30:37.240 Yet Hamas
00:30:38.040 goes to every effort
00:30:39.700 possible to maximize
00:30:41.000 casualties
00:30:41.740 on both sides
00:30:43.200 of the Gaza wall.
00:30:44.780 their own people
00:30:45.640 and those of Israel.
00:30:47.840 So when you get people
00:30:48.580 like NDP leader
00:30:49.580 Jagmeet Singh
00:30:50.180 calling for a halt
00:30:51.240 on Canadian arms sales
00:30:52.420 to Israel
00:30:53.040 as violence escalates,
00:30:54.980 what the NDP is saying
00:30:56.100 is that Israel
00:30:56.660 does not have the right
00:30:57.960 to defend itself.
00:30:59.740 He says,
00:31:00.220 by arming one side
00:31:01.360 of the conflict,
00:31:02.120 it is undermining
00:31:02.780 the peace process
00:31:03.600 and it is supporting
00:31:04.840 illegal occupation.
00:31:06.920 Illegal occupation
00:31:07.820 of whom?
00:31:08.700 Gaza is not occupied.
00:31:11.200 There are no settlements
00:31:12.420 in Gaza.
00:31:13.040 Israel unilaterally
00:31:14.860 left Gaza
00:31:15.780 and said,
00:31:16.480 fine,
00:31:16.980 we will take
00:31:17.800 the first step
00:31:18.440 and what has Gaza done?
00:31:19.840 It has replaced
00:31:20.640 a government
00:31:21.160 that it had
00:31:21.780 that was not
00:31:22.240 particularly great
00:31:23.080 with one that's
00:31:23.620 even worse
00:31:24.160 which continues
00:31:25.300 to seek
00:31:25.920 the complete
00:31:26.680 destruction
00:31:27.520 of the Jewish state,
00:31:29.140 the complete
00:31:29.640 elimination
00:31:30.180 of the Jewish people
00:31:32.360 and they're the ones
00:31:34.020 who are somehow
00:31:34.720 painted in Canadian media
00:31:36.580 and by the leader
00:31:37.840 of the NDP
00:31:38.440 as being the victims.
00:31:40.240 And interestingly enough,
00:31:42.740 I mentioned to Mike
00:31:43.580 a few moments ago
00:31:44.680 how fraught
00:31:45.380 a lot of discourse
00:31:46.320 about Israel is.
00:31:47.320 Things that you're
00:31:47.800 not allowed to say,
00:31:49.020 things that are
00:31:49.620 very loaded terms
00:31:50.700 and ways in which
00:31:51.620 you could accidentally
00:31:52.700 do it.
00:31:53.140 One of them,
00:31:53.860 which is very deliberate,
00:31:55.220 is where you recognize
00:31:56.960 Israel's capital
00:31:58.060 as being.
00:31:59.340 Now the reality
00:32:00.140 is functionally,
00:32:01.620 Jerusalem is the
00:32:02.800 capital of Israel.
00:32:04.100 Israel has had
00:32:05.000 control of West Jerusalem
00:32:06.580 since Israel existed
00:32:07.840 for the first time
00:32:08.780 and Israel has had
00:32:10.180 control of East Jerusalem
00:32:11.460 since the end
00:32:12.840 of the Six-Day War.
00:32:14.040 But functionally speaking,
00:32:15.760 Jerusalem is Israel's capital.
00:32:18.340 Historically speaking,
00:32:19.700 Jerusalem is Israel's capital.
00:32:22.360 Yet countries around
00:32:23.440 the world are terrified
00:32:24.640 of realizing that.
00:32:25.940 Just three countries
00:32:26.840 of I believe
00:32:27.460 the 90 countries
00:32:28.640 that have embassies
00:32:29.380 in Israel
00:32:29.880 have them in Jerusalem.
00:32:31.820 The most notable
00:32:32.480 of those
00:32:33.040 is the United States
00:32:34.460 which moved its there
00:32:35.540 in 2018
00:32:36.540 at the behest
00:32:37.320 of Donald Trump.
00:32:39.160 Aaron O'Toole
00:32:39.780 has said that
00:32:40.820 Canada's conservatives,
00:32:42.200 if they form government,
00:32:43.140 will move Canada's embassy
00:32:44.700 in Israel to Jerusalem.
00:32:46.280 But interestingly enough,
00:32:47.480 I stumbled on
00:32:48.160 a pretty significant story
00:32:49.800 that Global Affairs
00:32:51.220 Canada staff
00:32:52.180 actually prepared
00:32:53.620 for a move
00:32:54.840 of Canada's embassy
00:32:56.120 to Jerusalem.
00:32:56.960 A tremendously
00:32:57.580 important step,
00:32:58.820 although it never
00:32:59.780 actually happened.
00:33:00.800 The reason being
00:33:01.540 there was no buy-in
00:33:03.100 from Justin Trudeau's liberals.
00:33:04.740 But how I found this
00:33:06.700 is I reached out
00:33:07.740 to Global Affairs
00:33:08.600 with what's called
00:33:09.240 an access to information request.
00:33:10.800 So trying to get a hold
00:33:11.620 of internal government documents.
00:33:13.960 I did it in 2019
00:33:15.440 and I've only just gotten
00:33:16.580 a non-response now.
00:33:18.340 But I actually did it
00:33:19.600 after former
00:33:20.440 Conservative leader
00:33:21.440 Andrew Scheer
00:33:22.160 had pledged
00:33:23.340 if he was elected
00:33:24.120 that he would move
00:33:24.940 the embassy to Jerusalem.
00:33:26.640 And I said,
00:33:27.260 well, I wonder
00:33:27.660 what Global Affairs staff
00:33:28.820 are saying about this.
00:33:29.920 So I put in the request
00:33:31.180 for May 2019
00:33:32.300 when Scheer made the pledge
00:33:33.720 to December
00:33:34.700 when I put in
00:33:35.560 the access to information request.
00:33:37.560 So pretty much
00:33:38.520 a seven-month period or so
00:33:40.440 or six-and-a-half-month period.
00:33:42.040 I just last week
00:33:43.420 got a response
00:33:44.260 that said the following.
00:33:45.920 I have looked
00:33:46.460 through the documents
00:33:47.440 received from
00:33:48.140 our respective program area
00:33:49.640 and although the department
00:33:50.980 did in fact prepare
00:33:52.500 for a possible move
00:33:53.780 of the Canadian embassy
00:33:55.000 to Jerusalem,
00:33:55.920 the move did not happen.
00:33:57.820 Since the relocation
00:33:59.100 of the embassy
00:33:59.640 did not happen,
00:34:00.660 many of the documents
00:34:01.580 contain information
00:34:02.680 for the preparation
00:34:03.720 of the move
00:34:04.440 and therefore
00:34:05.300 all contain references
00:34:06.980 to cabinet.
00:34:08.220 Cabinet documents
00:34:09.000 are confidential.
00:34:10.240 They are not subject
00:34:10.960 to access to information laws
00:34:12.760 which means that
00:34:13.740 any document
00:34:14.360 that was destined
00:34:15.080 for cabinet,
00:34:16.120 the government
00:34:16.560 doesn't have to disclose.
00:34:18.320 But the non-response
00:34:19.960 of these documents,
00:34:21.040 the non-production
00:34:21.800 of them tells me
00:34:22.600 that there was
00:34:23.040 a very serious,
00:34:24.420 although it's not clear
00:34:25.220 how serious,
00:34:26.540 push towards
00:34:27.740 moving the embassy
00:34:28.820 or at the very least
00:34:29.720 something that would
00:34:30.860 have been given
00:34:31.400 to a cabinet member
00:34:32.400 for sign-off
00:34:33.300 but it did not happen.
00:34:35.680 Now on background,
00:34:36.840 a Global Affairs Canada
00:34:37.920 source told me
00:34:38.660 there was no formal
00:34:39.620 memorandum to cabinet
00:34:41.180 which would have been
00:34:41.760 a document that
00:34:42.520 the foreign minister
00:34:43.300 at the time
00:34:43.820 would have brought
00:34:44.620 to his colleagues.
00:34:45.500 That didn't happen.
00:34:46.820 So we know that
00:34:47.760 Justin Trudeau's position
00:34:48.880 on this has not changed
00:34:50.140 which is absolutely not.
00:34:51.920 As Global Affairs
00:34:52.680 told me,
00:34:53.760 Canada will not be
00:34:54.940 moving its embassy
00:34:55.620 from Tel Aviv
00:34:56.320 to Jerusalem
00:34:56.960 and the long-standing
00:34:58.120 position is that
00:34:59.040 the status of Jerusalem
00:34:59.980 can only be resolved
00:35:01.160 as part of a general
00:35:02.600 settlement of the
00:35:03.640 Israeli-Palestinian
00:35:04.980 dispute.
00:35:06.040 So again,
00:35:06.760 not taking a clear
00:35:07.680 position but it's not
00:35:09.000 like the equivocation
00:35:09.920 is dismantling
00:35:11.460 any of the conflict.
00:35:12.740 It's not like the
00:35:13.300 equivocation is
00:35:14.580 contributing towards
00:35:15.520 de-escalation.
00:35:16.420 It just means that
00:35:17.480 there's no moral grounding
00:35:19.060 in Canada's position
00:35:20.680 on this at this time.
00:35:22.040 We've got to wrap
00:35:22.840 things up but my thanks
00:35:23.740 to you all for tuning
00:35:24.900 in to the program today.
00:35:26.360 We'll talk to you
00:35:27.040 next week with more
00:35:27.960 of Canada's
00:35:28.680 most irreverent talk show.
00:35:30.340 Thank you,
00:35:30.880 God bless,
00:35:31.440 and good day.
00:35:32.120 Thanks for listening
00:35:32.760 to The Andrew Lawton Show.
00:35:34.180 Support the program
00:35:35.000 by donating to True North
00:35:36.240 at www.tnc.news.