kinsellacast - KINSELLACAST 363： Whither thou goest, Murky Mark？ Lilley, Pierson, Mulroney, Lavigne, Harrison - plus Horsegirl, This Is Loralei, Soft Play, Bowie and more!

00:00:00.000 It's the KinsellaCast, starring Warren Kinsella.

00:00:21.840 Hey, it's Warren. Welcome to the KinsellaCast. How does my voice sound to you? Does it sound

00:00:27.620 all right? I'm using a new microphone, a new Shure. It's an MV5, I think. And I had to

00:00:39.160 get it. It all relates to the dogs. I was in the lake, and I brought in my phone so I could

00:00:46.520 take a picture of Tommy jumping into the lake for the first time. Tommy didn't jump into

00:00:51.340 the lake. My phone got wet. Clients started to say they couldn't understand me, which

00:00:56.780 is something that happens quite often. So I had to get a new phone. I had to get an

00:01:00.660 iPhone 16, which has got a USB-C instead of the lightning thing. The European Union told

00:01:08.160 Apple, quit screwing around. Anyway, long story short, I had to get a new microphone, and this

00:01:14.940 is it, and hopefully it sounds good. And if it doesn't, blame the dogs, because I was in

00:01:20.860 the lake, and it got the phone wet, and that's the end of the phone. Other technical problems.

00:01:27.860 Last week, John Mraz was on the show, but you'd never know that, because for some reason, it

00:01:35.700 got cut off when I was uploading it. Part of a radio segment I had was also cut off. I have

00:01:43.480 no idea what happened. I apologize to John. I spoke to him again today, Saturday, and now

00:01:51.980 I can't find the audio. So I'm wondering if John's got some secret spy thing on his phone.

00:01:58.860 Anyway, hopefully he and I can work this out, and he will be on this show. And if not, I think

00:02:05.600 I need to buy him a phone. I think that's what I got to do. So anyway, apologies to John.

00:02:10.720 Apologies to you guys. Hopefully we get that all sorted out. Great show this week, however,

00:02:17.420 with Mr. Lilly talking about all things political. Also, Alex Pearson and I talking about the bubble

00:02:24.180 zone law in Toronto and elsewhere in the wake of the terrible shooting of the young couple

00:02:30.740 in Washington. God bless them, and God bless their memory. Then I'm on with Ben Moroney and

00:02:37.960 my buddy Brad Levine from the NDP and Kate Harrison from the Tories. It was great. We

00:02:43.760 did it video like it wasn't audio. And I can tell you, like I've got a face for radio. Okay.

00:02:51.080 I'm not sure they should do this, but they did got cut off at one point. But anyway, they're

00:02:55.680 working the bugs out. So I'll have that and hopefully John Mraz. Things I definitely have

00:03:01.960 is I've got Horse Girl. Horse Girl with this song called Switch Over. This is, I think, the

00:03:08.360 song of the summer. Since I discovered this, their second album actually did not blow me

00:03:13.620 away. But this song did. And I think it is extraordinary. And Horse Girl are from Chicago.

00:03:20.620 They're all about 15 years old. No, no kidding. Nora Chang, Penelope Lowenstein, and Gigi Ricci.

00:03:30.500 And they're brilliant. And this song is genius. So you're going to love it. Lorelei, this is

00:03:36.500 Lorelei, is Nate Amos, no relation, from New York. And he's recorded hundreds of songs under

00:03:45.860 the, this is Lorelei name. And this is one of the best, I think. But you just woke me up.

00:03:56.680 And anyway, it's a good song. Softplay next with Chokehold. They're an English punk duo.

00:04:03.440 So they got Isaac Holman on lead vocals and drums, and Laurie Vincent doing backing vocals,

00:04:08.940 guitar and bass. This song came out in 2024 and has had a billion downloads. It reminds me actually,

00:04:15.120 of a song that Shit From Hell used to do. Long story. Then something cool. Low by David Bowie.

00:04:26.920 Recorded in Berlin with Brian Eno and Tony Visconti. Low is one of my favorite albums of all time.

00:04:34.900 It's in the top 10 list. It was introduced to me in high school at Bishop Carroll in Calgary

00:04:39.440 by John Henderson and Colin Tomlins and some others, Lee Hill. And I love that record. And this song

00:04:48.540 is new. This is a new song, previously unheard by me, at least. And it's from those sessions. I'm going

00:04:56.720 to play you that. And then finally, Stevie, can I? I don't know how you pronounce her last name. But

00:05:04.340 anyway, she's from Harrison, New York, in a band with several other people. It's adult low. Finally,

00:05:10.100 I'm getting around to it. It's quiet. Quiet can be good. I can be quiet sometimes, not always, but

00:05:17.980 sometimes like a me quiet. And so yeah, I wanted to talk to you about Mark Carney. Like what kind of

00:05:30.420 a government can we expect from him? The election campaign did not provide us with much in the way

00:05:38.480 of answers. Like voters had strong opinions about Conservative leader Pierre Palliot and NDP leader

00:05:45.120 Jagmeet Singh. Both lost the election. Both lost their seats. But Carney, he flaunts us still. He

00:05:55.480 remains an enigma wrapped in a riddle. He is a mystery man. What can we expect from his government?

00:06:01.580 It is unclear. For example, his finance minister, Francois-Philippe Champagne, Frankie Bubbles,

00:06:08.000 as Brian Lilly calls him, declared that there would be no budget this year. That caused a big stir. So

00:06:14.280 Carney then overruled his minister from Rome and said that there would be, in fact, a budget in the

00:06:19.240 fall. Okay. Here's another one. Carney's newly minted housing minister, Gregor Robertson, stepped on a

00:06:26.600 policy landmine and proclaimed that housing prices should not, and this is what he said, not go down.

00:06:36.020 That too caused an uproar. And asked about Robertson's mistake, Carney said, well,

00:06:41.420 this is a quote. I want to read this to you. We're talking about time horizons. Once we increase

00:06:49.220 the rate of home building as a country, then that is going to make home prices much lower than they

00:06:56.460 would otherwise be. But that's a medium term effect. Time horizons, medium term effect. If anybody can

00:07:06.680 understand any of any of that or even explain it, congratulations, you have a master's degree

00:07:12.160 in Carney speak. Another example, Stephen Guibo is blessedly no longer the minister of the environment

00:07:19.660 and post shuffle. That did not stop uneven Stephen from pronouncing on the issue. And this, he said,

00:07:27.020 basically, we shouldn't be talking about building new infrastructure for a pipeline. Let's use what

00:07:33.800 we've got. And he said, as far as I know, there are no investors right now. There are no companies

00:07:38.660 that are saying they want to build an east-west pipeline. Well, no, Stephen, that's not what

00:07:45.580 Mark Carney said either. One, just one day before, the liberal prime minister told CTV, if you want a

00:07:53.800 simple answer on will I support building a pipeline? Yes, that's the simple answer. I've given that

00:07:59.120 multiple times. Gotcha. Those are just a few of the ministerial mangled messages that have taken

00:08:07.700 place in recent days. But Carney has personally added to the pile as well. For example, during the

00:08:14.220 election, he gave everybody the impression that Canada was forcibly responding to every single one of

00:08:22.660 Donald Trump's tariffs on Canadian goods. And he issued press releases on it and so on mid-election.

00:08:30.280 After the vote, well, as we've learned via Bloomberg, the vast majority of the reciprocal tariffs

00:08:37.200 had been paused by Carney's administration in secret. Now, Frankie Bubbles angrily denied that. He said

00:08:47.780 that 70% of the reciprocal tariffs were still in place. But whatever the reality, the message had

00:08:53.400 again been muddled. Here's another one. Trump reportedly wants a golden dome, that's what he

00:08:59.600 calls it, over North America, presumably, not golden showers, golden dome, presumably to protect us from

00:09:06.840 the terrible North Korean Navy threat. And Carney, who had March 27th declared our relationship with the

00:09:13.140 United States over, was now talking about a golden dome with the United States, whatever a golden dome

00:09:20.280 is, less than two months later. Our relationship with the U.S. really isn't over, is it? Murky mark.

00:09:29.080 And then there, of course, is that old Pearson building favorite, the bulging inconsistency on Israel file.

00:09:37.000 Well, Carney's been all over the map on the Jewish state, threatening undefined action against it on

00:09:43.860 Monday, and then on Thursday, offering prayers for the entire Jewish community. Which is it? The

00:09:51.140 answers, again, are elusive. Criticizing Benjamin Netanyahu's increasingly isolated government is

00:09:57.900 totally acceptable. It's not anti-Semitic. It's acceptable. But remaining distant on attacks on Jews in

00:10:05.660 Canada is not, ever. Prime Minister Carney needs to pick a lane. Anyway, that's the problem across the

00:10:12.340 board, isn't it? It's hard to figure out from one day to the next where Mark Carney and his government

00:10:16.600 stand on any number of important issues, whether it's budgets, or housing, or energy, or Trump, or

00:10:23.500 Israel. Like, it's messy. And the National Post's Christopher Nardi opened up, offered up a fascinating

00:10:30.600 explanation in Friday's papers. Carney, Nardi said, is revealing himself to be an obsessive micromanager. He's

00:10:39.140 getting way too far into the weeds, which is always a good way to miss the proverbial forests or the trees,

00:10:45.680 isn't it? And whatever the cause, the ailment is there for all to see. Near total message incoherence. And a government

00:10:56.400 whose priorities, you know, are as clear as mud.

00:11:26.400 Say, say, say, say, say, what you wanna say. Say, say, say, say, what you wanna say.

00:11:55.400 Switch over, switch over, switch over

00:12:25.400 Switch over, switch over, switch over, switch over

00:12:55.400 Switch over, switch over, switch over

00:13:25.400 Switch over, switch over

00:13:55.380 Switch over, switch over, switch over, switch over

00:13:57.380 Switch over, switch over, switch over

00:13:59.380 Switch over, switch over, switch over

00:14:01.380 And we're back, and we're back with my friend Brian Lilley, and Brian just came back from John Micotishian's, what is it called? Conservative Leadership?

00:14:10.380 The Conservative Leadership Foundation.

00:14:12.380 Right, and I've spoken at it a couple times before, even though I'm not a Conservative, and John is always open to hearing different voices. So you were there to talk about what happened in that federal election thing that happened a few weeks ago. So why don't you give us a taste of what you said to the assembled crowd?

00:15:03.180 Really talk about Doug Ford and the provincial word. But, you know, there was some applause when I said, you know, if you guys want to win, you got to stop having purity tests and saying, oh, you're not a real Conservative. We don't want to talk to you. I said, you either have to get everyone on your team rowing in the same direction, or just accept that you're not going to win. And I wasn't sure how that would be received.

00:15:33.180 It got applause. People definitely agreed with that. And, yeah, so Tash and I were breaking down where we felt that things change. I invoked your name, and not in vain.

00:15:46.780 I said that shortly after Trudeau had resigned, I was doing a Batra's burning question with Adrian Batra and Warren Kinsella. And Adrian said, Brian, what does this mean? I said something about how I think the Liberals can win the next election. And I said, if you find the video of Warren, he'll look like he's going to fall over. Because you thought I was nuts when I said that.

00:16:15.660 I was surprised. But you were right. As I was right about Justin Trudeau leaving, you still owe me a lunch, by the way.

00:16:24.980 Yeah, well, come to town and actually meet me at the Patricia and you'll get your lunch. Don't just whine about it.

00:16:31.360 So they didn't want to talk about Doug Ford, who's the winner. That's interesting. Does that mean something?

00:16:38.640 I didn't sense any animosity. I think it was, how did we lose this thing?

00:16:44.360 And, you know, you and I have written about it. We've pontificated. We've talked about it. But, you know, I still think not pivoting at the right time, was it?

00:16:56.600 Now, I'm going to disagree with our friend, Corey Tanik, who said they've got to pivot to talk about Donald Trump more.

00:17:02.960 I believe some of the analysis that says if they talked about Trump more and not the other issues that was motivating the people voting for them, they could have reinforced the liberal message and help the liberals.

00:17:16.700 So, but, I mean, there were things they could have done. Like, they didn't pivot to the fact that Trudeau was gone right away or early enough.

00:17:27.300 Mark Carney's line in the debate, Justin Trudeau's not here.

00:17:31.380 And then Pierre's line before that, you know, just like Justin, it's like, fuck, Pierre, if I've tried to find a guy who was not like Justin Trudeau, it would be Mark Carney.

00:17:42.080 That couldn't be more different. But Carney, like, I mean, did you guys talk about how he's doing so far?

00:17:47.940 Because I don't think he's doing that shit hot.

00:17:50.220 A little bit. We, you know, I spoke a bit about the column that I wrote in response to Chris Nardi's really good piece in the National Post that detailed the difference.

00:18:03.220 Yeah, excellent piece.

00:18:03.780 And you read it for the context, right? But, you know, my takeaway in the column was, we're excited about the fact that the Prime Minister is on time, that he's punctual, that he expects other people to be punctual,

00:18:19.020 that he expects results, that he wears a suit and wants proper spelling.

00:18:24.560 Like, that's how low Justin Trudeau lowered the bar.

00:18:28.740 It's so true.

00:18:30.240 You're describing every PMO I covered, and I covered Harper and Martin and Crankin.

00:18:37.660 I don't go far back enough to have covered Mulroney.

00:18:41.580 But, you know, I covered all those guys.

00:18:43.640 And, yeah, that's how things are supposed to operate.

00:18:46.020 And then they didn't for so long that we're excited about the fact that, hey, this guy acts like an adult.

00:18:54.020 And I'm like, doesn't this be the bare minimum?

00:18:57.740 Hold on a second. I dropped you.

00:19:00.960 Hold on a second.

00:19:02.220 You got me so excited there, I dropped the phone.

00:19:05.060 You're laughing so much.

00:19:06.460 Do you hear me?

00:19:06.860 You know, yeah.

00:19:07.660 Hold on a second.

00:19:07.980 So.

00:19:09.560 Where the heck?

00:19:10.220 Oh, God damn it.

00:19:14.400 Okay, there we go.

00:19:16.140 Are you back with your phone?

00:19:17.900 You figured it out how it works?

00:19:18.700 I'll have to edit that.

00:19:21.280 There we go.

00:19:21.920 Okay.

00:19:22.260 So, yeah.

00:19:23.180 So, the adult.

00:19:24.320 So, do the adult thing again.

00:19:25.780 That made me.

00:19:26.400 Well, maybe I'll just say, the reason why we broke up there, folks, is Brian made me laugh so hard that I dropped the phone.

00:19:34.560 So, we've been doing this for a couple of weeks now.

00:19:37.120 Like, when Carney said in his first news conference after the election, yeah, I'll call a by-election for pure polio as quick as possible.

00:19:46.020 No games.

00:19:47.140 Everyone's like, oh, wow, that's magnanimous of you.

00:19:51.080 It's like, no, that's how things used to work.

00:19:54.140 Trudeau was just like, you know, he's such a departure.

00:19:58.080 But I was asked at one point, you know, if I'm worried about the future of the country with him, and is he going to be radical like Trudeau?

00:20:06.940 And it's like, I honestly don't know, and I'm not sure if he does or his cabinet does.

00:20:11.420 Back to your point about them not being too shit hot.

00:20:15.300 You know, the first couple of weeks, who is Mark Carney?

00:20:19.580 How is he going to govern?

00:20:20.680 I'm not sure I'd buy the idea that he's a blue liberal.

00:20:24.580 Will he be a green radical?

00:20:26.380 Well, I don't know.

00:20:27.720 Like, what Mark Carney is going to be there?

00:20:32.300 Does his cabinet know their roles?

00:20:34.520 Apparently not, based off of their first week.

00:20:38.520 But, you know, did he crack the whip?

00:20:39.920 I got to wonder what that first cabinet meeting or the cabinet meeting this last Tuesday was like.

00:20:47.040 The cabinet retreat that they had, where, you know, just days earlier, Carney had to step out of the Pope's inaugural mass and say, oh, by the way, there will be a budget.

00:20:59.520 Ouch.

00:20:59.720 You know, was he pointing at Frankie Bubbles a lot and saying, cork it?

00:21:04.340 A little bit.

00:21:06.760 A little bit.

00:21:07.620 It's not exact.

00:21:08.720 It's quite a repudiation that he has to do that at the Pope's funeral.

00:21:12.480 And so, like, and then all the others, like, did he give them a straighten up and fly right talking to?

00:21:21.140 They needed it.

00:21:22.800 They need, like, on housing, on energy, on the budgets, on Israel.

00:21:28.280 Like, you know, it's like, who's on first?

00:21:30.840 Like, pick a lane, you know?

00:21:32.940 Where are you guys going?

00:21:34.420 And it, you know, that's the column I wrote, as you know, for Post Media this weekend is, I can't figure it out.

00:21:41.000 Yeah.

00:21:41.440 So, I was asking, are you worried about the direction of country?

00:21:45.140 I said, I don't think we know where we're going yet, and I don't think he does either.

00:21:48.580 So, we'll see.

00:21:49.580 The mandate letter thing, I found interesting.

00:21:53.220 I'm not a big fan of mandate letters.

00:21:55.520 Yeah, who cares?

00:21:56.580 Being public, and, like, there's been a big court case all the way to the Supreme Court to try and get Doug Ford to force him to release his mandate letter.

00:22:04.420 If a mandate letter is public, it tells you nothing.

00:22:06.700 If they think it's going to be made public, it tells you nothing.

00:22:10.540 But Carney just did one mandate letter for the whole thing, basically said, here's our priorities, everyone focus on this.

00:22:16.480 Yeah, big deal.

00:22:17.280 And like you pointed out, like, you know, I was chief of staff to different cabinet ministers.

00:22:23.040 Like, I couldn't tell you what was in our mandate letters.

00:22:26.120 You know, it's, the prime minister picks up the phone and tells you to do something, you do it.

00:22:30.760 That's your mandate.

00:22:31.960 Yeah, that's, you know, people think.

00:22:34.420 There's always long-term planning in government.

00:22:36.740 No, it's falling from one crisis into the next, and then you think you're through it, and something comes out of left field and takes all your attention.

00:22:46.720 I mean, and that's regardless of party or level.

00:22:50.440 That's just how it is.

00:22:51.440 Well, interesting poll came out, speaking of direction.

00:22:57.560 I don't know who did this.

00:22:58.700 Maybe it was Reid, maybe it was Abacus, saying, you know, what's the main reason you, Canadian voter, think that the Tories lost the election?

00:23:08.460 And the issue ahead of the policies, policies was number two.

00:23:14.220 Number one was Pierre Polyev.

00:23:16.920 What do you think about that kind of result?

00:23:20.120 And if it's true, if your gut tells you it's right, are the Tories making a mistake with, you know, sticking with this guy?

00:23:27.860 So I haven't looked at the full poll, but if the number that's sticking in my head is 48% said they didn't like Pierre Polyev.

00:23:34.700 That's right.

00:23:37.080 There's two ways you can look at that.

00:23:38.560 You can look and say, see, we've got to change.

00:23:40.820 Or you can say, well, let's get 52% of people voting for us, and we'll have a huge majority.

00:23:46.700 Fair enough.

00:23:46.920 So they may need to start thinking, and we'll see how the NDP goes, they may have to start thinking about a world where the NDP is just not there.

00:23:58.700 And it is more of a two-party or two-party-plus, tiny bit, party system.

00:24:06.400 And if that's the case, then they've got to change how they operate in their elections.

00:24:10.120 And, you know, we've talked a lot about how the NDP collapse really helped the Liberals.

00:24:18.360 Interestingly, on the panel, and I had read the column where Tasha did this for National Post, she examined it.

00:24:25.780 And in a lot of writings, the NDP vote went more to the Conservatives.

00:24:31.100 Places like Windsor, Hamilton, Timmons, the blue-collar appeal really worked.

00:24:37.560 It's just that it didn't work in enough writings for them to win.

00:24:43.860 But, you know, is there a different future where 41.3% since, what, the 70s?

00:24:52.720 That would have given you a huge majority.

00:24:56.140 Is that going to not be the case in the future?

00:25:00.640 I mean, look, Carney got 43.7, I think it was.

00:25:05.560 He couldn't get a majority.

00:25:08.600 It's four short right now.

00:25:09.900 We'll see if he picks some people off over the summer.

00:25:12.400 I think, you know, that might be my job or my thinking if I was him.

00:25:16.840 How do I find two dippers and two Conservatives or a block east to join me?

00:25:23.200 Speaking of jobs, Marco Mendoncino is staying in his as acting chief of staff to the prime minister of Canada.

00:25:30.020 And you know and I know that Marco wants to be mayor of Toronto.

00:25:35.560 And that is his plan.

00:25:38.860 This week, you know, we all got to see, with lots of evidence, the weakness of Olivia Chow on the bubble zone issue.

00:25:47.760 And, but she's going to win again, isn't she, if Brad Bradford and Marco Mendoncino and God knows who else runs.

00:25:57.200 John Tory.

00:25:57.820 John Tory and Abayo.

00:25:59.700 Like, they're going to split the vote and Olivia's going to win again, isn't she?

00:26:04.060 Notwithstanding how bad she looked this week.

00:26:07.540 Yeah, it's funny.

00:26:08.640 I put that out there months ago that Mendoncino was looking and CTV and the Star looked like they were surprised.

00:26:15.200 You can find the photo of me with Marco up at Bistro on Avenue having wings back in January.

00:26:26.000 And that was before he decided to jump back in and help Carney.

00:26:29.500 And, you know, we were talking about him considering a run and where does he have to pivot?

00:26:36.160 You know, because he's always been identified with the Liberals.

00:26:38.880 He knows he's got to get Conservative votes.

00:26:41.360 You know, he's thinking about it seriously, but so are a lot of people.

00:26:45.380 And that is the problem.

00:26:47.060 That is the problem.

00:26:47.820 In that, in Toronto municipal politics, most Liberals and Conservatives end up coming together to try and vote for a sane person.

00:26:57.880 And then, you know, the really progressive Liberals join with the NDP and elect Olivia Chow.

00:27:02.800 And, you know, Olivia is, you know, an absolutely lovely person.

00:27:09.040 But she is, her policies are horrible.

00:27:13.500 And I'm just not a big fan.

00:27:16.740 No, 100%.

00:27:17.800 And, you know, full disclosure, I helped run her first failed mayoralty race.

00:27:24.960 And you're exactly right.

00:27:26.360 She actually is a very nice person.

00:27:28.740 She's decent.

00:27:29.600 But she's just, she's not a good leader.

00:27:31.780 So, on the bubble zone bylaw, she opposed every amendment coming forward.

00:27:40.140 Tell people in Calgary, tell people in Calgary what was going on this week with this bubble zone thing.

00:27:47.360 So, there was an attempt to say that what we need is for, I think the original proposal was,

00:27:58.080 you couldn't be within 20 meters of protected schools, churches, synagogues, mosques, daycare centers, or the like.

00:28:09.480 And, look, this could be as many as 3,000 locations.

00:28:14.640 But the reality is you're talking about predominantly Jewish locations.

00:28:19.760 This has been supported in the past by the Muslim community as well,

00:28:23.140 because some of their mosques and community centers have been targeted.

00:28:26.440 So, you know, free speech absolutists are saying, oh, no, this can't go forward.

00:28:33.220 This is an assault on free speech.

00:28:36.140 And if we wanted to be absolutists, then sure.

00:28:40.120 But we have bubble zone laws in Ontario already that was passed by the former liberal government

00:28:48.040 with the support of the NDP on abortion clinics.

00:28:52.040 Yep.

00:28:52.700 And you can't be within 50 meters.

00:28:54.520 So, all of a sudden, all the lefties down at City Hall who support the bubble zones on abortion clinics

00:29:00.460 are saying, no, we can't have this.

00:29:03.780 Chow was one of the few lefties, other than Diane Sachs, who was voted for because she's Jewish,

00:29:08.600 Jewish community in her ward.

00:29:10.760 But, you know, people like Paula Fletcher, who's this woman that talks about using jazz hands at council all the time,

00:29:18.280 she's there saying, oh, well, we can't afford to police 3,000 locations.

00:29:24.740 Nobody's asking you to, Paula.

00:29:26.660 Like, such bullshit.

00:29:28.300 It's not 3,000 locations.

00:29:29.700 It's going to be a handful of Jewish community centers and daycares that have been targeted.

00:29:37.380 I've got one walking distance from me.

00:29:39.760 Blur and Spadina.

00:29:41.600 These Hamasniks showed up and were absolutely brutal outside of a child care center.

00:29:47.140 It's disgusting.

00:29:47.640 In Ottawa, they had them outside of a senior's home that houses Holocaust survivors screaming about Intafada at them.

00:29:57.100 It's disgusting.

00:29:58.980 I've got some kind of march going past my window right now of a...

00:30:04.520 I'm looking to see it.

00:30:06.360 It looks like the Iranian flag.

00:30:08.020 I thought it was going to be Hamasniks because they regularly come by.

00:30:11.080 Well, the Iranian guys are good.

00:30:12.600 We like them.

00:30:13.640 Well, they've got the old Iranian flag with the lion on it.

00:30:17.640 So, are you going to...

00:30:18.940 It's not the Republic guys.

00:30:19.820 Are you...

00:30:20.320 I'm in town in part to do the Walk for Israel tomorrow.

00:30:25.200 Hopefully, it doesn't rain.

00:30:27.200 So, we're talking early for the podcast.

00:30:30.040 Are you...

00:30:30.600 Hopefully, you're going to be able to make it because I know a lot of people want to see you there.

00:30:35.180 Yeah.

00:30:35.700 I'm going to try and make it out there first thing tomorrow morning.

00:30:38.500 It's a shortened group for security concerns partly, but, you know, show solidarity.

00:30:44.920 Absolutely.

00:30:45.620 Excellent.

00:30:46.000 All right.

00:30:46.620 Well, hope to see you there.

00:30:47.640 Listen, man, thank you so much.

00:30:49.500 Thank you for your insight and your wisdom as always.

00:30:52.300 And have a great day and a great week.

00:30:54.420 You too.

00:30:54.760 Not to blame for falling when it all comes down.

00:31:16.620 I'm waiting on the ground.

00:31:17.620 I'm waiting on the ground.

00:31:22.280 See you through the window.

00:31:27.820 Yeah, the days are long when you are not around.

00:31:32.960 I can hear you calling.

00:31:33.960 I can hear you calling, so I drown it out.

00:31:44.020 Sometimes it hurts too much.

00:31:46.880 And I want to sleep.

00:31:48.880 And I want to sleep.

00:31:50.860 But you just woke me up.

00:31:51.860 But you just woke me up.

00:31:52.860 But you just woke me up.

00:32:03.600 Can't be blamed for trying.

00:32:08.720 If you don't.

00:32:09.720 If you don't hear back.

00:32:10.720 If you don't hear back.

00:32:11.460 If you don't hear back.

00:32:11.480 I didn't make it out.

00:32:17.260 I am in the building.

00:32:22.460 You don't want to know what my dreams are about.

00:32:31.000 I can hear you crying.

00:32:36.800 So I drown it out.

00:32:39.200 Sometimes it hurts too much.

00:32:43.240 And I want to sleep.

00:32:45.880 But you just woke me up.

00:32:48.380 And when it all comes down.

00:32:52.820 I'm waiting on the ground.

00:32:57.420 Yeah, the days are long when you are not around.

00:33:04.820 It's only 20 meters surrounding the facility.

00:33:09.020 But most importantly, it's not a ban against protesting outside any synagogue, for example.

00:33:16.220 The institution has to actually prove that within the last 90 days, there has been a protest that has impacted people's ability to enter the facility.

00:33:30.180 You're listening to The Alex Pearson Show.

00:33:32.740 That is the voice of April Engelberg talking to Greg Brady this morning about City Council, which we'll meet today.

00:33:38.600 And they will likely vote tomorrow on this proposed bylaw to create these defined buffer zones around facilities, things like schools or places of worship.

00:33:48.700 And you very much do have a right to speak freely in this country.

00:33:51.840 But that doesn't mean there are no consequences for what you say.

00:33:54.480 And if the people that you're talking to are spewing your stuff at don't have a chance to walk away from either the humiliation or the intimidation, then you're holding someone captive to a hostile message, which is not freedom of speech.

00:34:07.420 And so, again, other areas have done this.

00:34:11.300 Vaughn and Brampton have both enacted 100-meter bubble zones around places of worship.

00:34:14.960 It passed unanimously.

00:34:17.360 But in Toronto, they're not even asking that.

00:34:19.880 They're asking you to go 20 meters.

00:34:22.480 And there's all this worry that this is an encroachment on charter rights.

00:34:27.960 But again, the question becomes, where does your charter rights end?

00:34:31.400 Where does mine start?

00:34:32.400 But at what point can we get some basic leadership on this issue?

00:34:37.180 It didn't have to come to this.

00:34:38.220 Let me talk to Oren Kinsella, president of the Daisy Group, lawyer, political consultant, author.

00:34:43.380 I know you've got a new book coming out, which we'll probably talk about very soon.

00:34:47.120 But glad to have your time on this.

00:34:49.540 Well, thanks for having me.

00:34:51.000 Boy, oh, boy.

00:34:51.600 I should ask how many chapters would be dedicated to the lack of leadership in this country on things like, you know, Jew hate, anti-Semitism.

00:34:59.100 But what is your mind?

00:35:00.640 I mean, you know, this was not an issue for Patrick Brown.

00:35:03.380 This was not an issue for Stephen Del Duca.

00:35:05.060 It was just this is what we're going to do.

00:35:06.700 And they did it.

00:35:07.720 And yet in Toronto, you cannot get Demke out of his office to deal with these protests over 18, 19 months.

00:35:12.740 And we can't get Olivia Chow to do anything proactive.

00:35:15.880 And we've got a huge increase in protests and mob, mob action, frankly, targeting the Jewish community since October 7th.

00:35:26.440 And like, you know, in Toronto, as you know, Alex, 4 percent, less than 4 percent of the city's population is Jewish.

00:35:34.340 And they account for the victims of more than 40 percent of all reported incidents.

00:35:41.460 And like, we're not even learning about all incidents.

00:35:44.900 Like, not everything gets reported to the police because people have been intimidated into silence.

00:35:50.360 And so we've got schools and hospitals and places of worship being targeted.

00:35:53.900 And like, as my colleague, Brian Milley at The Sun reported today, the police have taken this hands off approach to dealing with protesters to the point of allowing them to block access or an ambulance responding to call for assistance for a child.

00:36:11.560 Like, that's that's crazy.

00:36:13.580 That's nuts.

00:36:14.520 And this is why, you know, there are reasonable limits on free speech.

00:36:18.700 And this would be one of them.

00:36:20.260 If you are intimidating and, frankly, terrorizing people around a place of worship, whether it's a synagogue or a mosque or a church, you should you are breaking the law.

00:36:31.340 That's certainly the case now with abortion clinics.

00:36:33.880 Well, yeah.

00:36:34.500 And again, there was not a lot of hysteria around that was understood.

00:36:37.580 I mean, we wouldn't have to have these laws, Warren, if people were just civil and decent.

00:36:41.220 But we certainly know with with the groups and I don't want to let everybody in with them.

00:36:45.900 But these protests, 18, 19 months long, I mean, attended by a lot of the same people who either don't have jobs, but they're being paid somehow.

00:36:53.040 And you've reported on it.

00:36:54.520 It's been reported on by The National Post about the funding of these particular protests.

00:36:59.260 And, you know, they're going on by nefarious actors who are working against us.

00:37:04.300 And yet we've got city councillors.

00:37:06.000 We've got the mayor.

00:37:06.720 We've got the chief.

00:37:07.420 And they cower.

00:37:08.340 They're like ostriches on this.

00:37:09.840 It's crazy to me why they don't see the threat.

00:37:12.740 And the mayor and the majority of council, when this first came up, voted against it.

00:37:19.500 Now, the federal, the Kearney liberals have said in their election platform, so it'd be hard for them to wiggle out of this one.

00:37:27.080 They intend to make it a crime to obstruct access to any place of worship, you know, including schools and churches and synagogues and so on.

00:37:36.120 So that's good.

00:37:37.740 And Chow said, well, you know, we'll act on that when they do it.

00:37:40.860 But as you pointed out so many times on your show, she has the power.

00:37:45.820 She had the power to deal with this way before now in the way that Patrick Brown or Stephen Del Duca did.

00:37:52.220 And she didn't act.

00:37:53.740 Well, in fact, it would have been easier just to lump herself in with them and say that all municipalities are doing that.

00:37:58.160 And therefore, you know, she's if she worried about her base coming after her, well, we all agreed to do this because it is not just a Toronto problem.

00:38:06.260 These things have been going on. And frankly, I think a lot of people don't know about them, Warren, because we don't cover them every day of how bad it's gotten.

00:38:13.620 I mean, when you drive through areas of Toronto, certainly Montreal, where you've got Jewish people now having to pay for 24 seven security.

00:38:19.740 That's not cheap. And frankly, you shouldn't have to pay for security to be able to live in this country.

00:38:25.260 But that's where we're at, because no one's taking action.

00:38:28.060 No. And, you know, I've spoken at lots of synagogues in recent weeks about, you know, this book that I've written and this documentary that we're filming.

00:38:35.960 I just got back from Israel where we were filming there.

00:38:38.520 And like you go into these synagogues, places where people worship, you know, places where people are at their most vulnerable.

00:38:45.680 And yet it's a wall of police and private security and they have to pay for that.

00:38:50.700 You know, they they've got to come up with the money.

00:38:53.260 And increasingly, a lot of these small congregations and Jewish communities, they don't have the money to do it.

00:38:59.500 And and so we've seen across the city the consequence.

00:39:03.200 We've got fire bombings of, you know, synagogues and Jewish businesses.

00:39:08.260 We've got schools for little Jewish kids being shot up like two, three times.

00:39:14.180 Like the policing of this issue in the city of Toronto is and I can say this now because I've written a book about it is one of the worst in the world.

00:39:23.980 It's not it's not the worst in Ontario.

00:39:26.560 It's one of the worst in the world.

00:39:28.620 Well, we're top three.

00:39:29.600 We're number three for anti-Semitism with Austria.

00:39:32.640 I mean, it's appalling what we what we say and what we don't do.

00:39:36.340 Like, hey, it has no place here.

00:39:37.420 Well, yeah, it does.

00:39:38.920 Clearly.

00:39:40.120 And and, you know, there's accountability for that.

00:39:43.640 But some people who their job is to protect citizens, protect, you know, those they represent, like Olivia Chow and Chief Demki.

00:39:52.960 They're not doing their job.

00:39:54.840 And this is the reputation now that we have around the world.

00:39:57.840 And journalists from around the world, not just in Canada, have written about this issue.

00:40:02.300 And it like this is basic protecting people when they go into a place of worship, whether it's a synagogue or a mosque or a church.

00:40:09.760 That's something we should be doing.

00:40:11.720 And we're not doing it.

00:40:12.960 No.

00:40:13.180 And we've let churches burn and all the rest of it.

00:40:15.480 And we just kind of just don't say anything.

00:40:17.020 It's met with a shrug.

00:40:18.360 I would say this.

00:40:19.200 So there does seem to be selective, you know, anger and outrage for the convoys.

00:40:23.580 It was bring out the Emergencies Act.

00:40:26.140 Right.

00:40:26.380 And they saw that as a threat, the political threat.

00:40:28.560 And yet I never felt threatened.

00:40:30.400 I don't think Jewish people in order felt threatened.

00:40:32.540 And yet when you've got something going on for 20 months, they do nothing.

00:40:35.780 There's got to be consistency.

00:40:38.040 There has to be.

00:40:38.800 And, you know, you're absolutely right to cite that precedent.

00:40:42.120 They brought in tougher policing.

00:40:45.360 They brought in cops from across Canada to deal with, you know, a protest that was supposed to last a weekend and ended up lasting, you know, more than a month.

00:40:53.840 And I thought that was an appropriate thing to do.

00:40:55.980 And the same thing applies here.

00:40:57.780 When you're intimidating people in their neighborhoods, you know, when you're threatening them, when you're attacking them, when you're, you know, doing all the stuff we're seeing happen, you've got to take action.

00:41:08.780 And like this weekend, we've got the Walk for Israel taking place on Sunday.

00:41:12.960 I'm going to be one of the people attending it.

00:41:14.780 And the bad guys have already said they're going to blockade it and they're going to try and stop this from happening.

00:41:21.400 So the police, they're going to have to act and they're going to have to take action to protect citizens because right now they're not doing it.

00:41:28.560 Yeah.

00:41:28.640 But what does that look like?

00:41:29.620 Right.

00:41:29.820 Because it's become so normalized and there are a lot of theatrics that go on at these things.

00:41:34.800 The bottom line is this has been so normalized when I feel like it's too late.

00:41:39.060 Like, no, there's no Jew you're going to talk to, present company included.

00:41:42.200 No one feels safe.

00:41:43.400 No one's waiting for police or anyone to protect them.

00:41:47.040 And so, like, where's this going?

00:41:48.660 Because I think this walk could get very ugly and it didn't have to and it should never have come to this.

00:41:54.240 No, it's just like it's a family event.

00:41:56.280 I went on it last year.

00:41:57.800 There's little kids and seniors and so on.

00:42:00.360 So, you know, I guess it will be a big test this weekend.

00:42:03.440 I hope you're wrong.

00:42:04.200 I hope that it goes off peacefully like it largely did last year.

00:42:08.620 But the early indications are not good.

00:42:11.240 Well, you know what?

00:42:11.940 Let everybody open their eyes on this and can't say they weren't warned.

00:42:15.760 All right, Warren, we'll watch how that vote goes tomorrow and the pretzels, how they'll twist.

00:42:20.020 But I appreciate you and we'll talk about your book.

00:42:22.380 Thanks, my friend.

00:42:23.320 There you go.

00:42:23.900 That is Warren Kinsella and he has been outstanding, unequivocal on this issue.

00:42:29.100 Because, again, whether it's, you know, it starts with Jew hate, it doesn't end there.

00:42:33.380 And that's what's so frustrating where people don't understand.

00:42:35.980 It's like they come for the Jews, but they will come after you, whether you're black or pink or red or green or gay.

00:42:41.140 Well, they don't care.

00:42:42.680 They don't like our way of life.

00:42:45.320 But this is a no-brainer, should have been stopped, and it hasn't been.

00:42:49.660 So I think politicians, without their lack of leadership, have made things much, much more difficult for everyone.

00:42:56.200 I was a sadist for her main play.

00:43:24.180 I did not like this.

00:43:26.500 Yeah, I need Liz to say.

00:43:28.460 But when she left me, I took it badly.

00:43:32.280 I was a right mess, you see.

00:43:34.520 I loved her madly.

00:43:36.480 I felt rejected and disrespected.

00:43:40.360 I thought I'd do her.

00:43:42.460 I stand corrected.

00:43:43.760 And now I'm lying here.

00:43:46.220 Clearly, this is what to say.

00:43:48.360 Because now my pillow smells like a hairspray.

00:43:52.680 Choco, choco.

00:43:56.080 Choco, choco.

00:44:00.080 So cold, you're so cold.

00:44:03.700 The way you turned on me.

00:44:08.020 I proceeded to self-medicate.

00:44:12.660 I was shamefaced.

00:44:14.520 And I was full of hate.

00:44:16.700 Two weeks later, that's when I saw her.

00:44:20.620 I was out of breath from treading water.

00:44:23.740 So I was embarrassed.

00:44:26.660 All my friends were there.

00:44:28.300 So I pretended that I didn't care.

00:44:32.480 But on the inside, I was burning.

00:44:36.400 My eyes were trembling.

00:44:38.460 I started turning.

00:44:40.640 Choco, choco.

00:44:44.740 Choco, choco.

00:44:46.740 Choco, choco.

00:45:16.720 And I'm out to try

00:45:18.640 Just like you did to me

00:45:23.760 I guess that this is goodbye

00:45:26.440 Goodbye

00:45:27.760 Choco, Choco

00:45:31.140 Choco, Choco

00:45:35.140 So cold, you're so cold

00:45:39.700 And the way you turn on me

00:45:42.520 You've got the inner

00:45:44.080 Choco, Choco

00:45:48.080 Choco, Choco

00:45:52.080 So cold, you're so cold

00:45:56.080 Why you turn on me

00:45:58.080 You've got the inner Choco

00:46:00.080 Choco

00:46:04.080 Choco

00:46:08.080 Choco

00:46:14.080 Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show

00:46:19.240 And it's Friday

00:46:20.080 Which means we've got to take a look back

00:46:21.940 At the biggest political stories of the week

00:46:24.360 And we do so with a great political panel

00:46:26.980 Please welcome back to the show

00:46:28.440 Brad Levine

00:46:29.100 President of Council PA

00:46:31.200 NDP Strategist

00:46:32.220 Welcome Brad

00:46:33.120 Say hi to Warren Kinsella

00:46:34.540 Former Special Advisor to Jean Chrétien

00:46:35.960 And CEO of the Daisy Group

00:46:37.120 Still with his tan

00:46:38.480 Clearly from his time in Israel

00:46:40.140 Great to see you my friend

00:46:41.380 No, it's blood

00:46:42.980 High blood pressure

00:46:43.900 And Kate Harrison

00:46:45.620 Vice Chair at Suma Strategies

00:46:47.500 To all three of you

00:46:48.140 I say happy Friday

00:46:49.680 Happy Friday

00:46:51.220 No tan here in Ottawa

00:46:52.420 I know

00:46:52.960 Well not with the weather

00:46:54.000 We would have it anywhere

00:46:54.920 Around here

00:46:55.700 My goodness

00:46:56.280 I don't think spring's coming

00:46:57.220 For a while now

00:46:58.020 All right

00:46:58.600 Let's break down

00:47:00.100 What I think is

00:47:01.060 Is going to continue

00:47:02.820 To be one of the biggest stories

00:47:03.840 Is Canada's relationship

00:47:05.480 With Israel

00:47:06.940 And all the knock-on effects

00:47:08.880 Let's listen to

00:47:10.660 Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu

00:47:12.000 Calling out Mark Carney

00:47:13.100 And other leaders

00:47:14.340 I say to President Macron

00:47:16.400 Prime Minister Carney

00:47:17.500 And Prime Minister Starmer

00:47:18.700 When mass murderers

00:47:21.100 Rapists

00:47:22.020 Baby killers

00:47:23.180 And kidnappers

00:47:23.960 Thank you

00:47:24.500 You're on the wrong side

00:47:26.500 Of justice

00:47:27.120 You're on the wrong side

00:47:28.800 Of humanity

00:47:29.560 And you're on the wrong side

00:47:31.520 Of history

00:47:32.400 Now these leaders may think

00:47:34.680 That they're advancing peace

00:47:36.020 They're not

00:47:37.080 They're emboldening Hamas

00:47:39.200 To continue fighting forever

00:47:40.520 And they give them hope

00:47:42.220 To establish

00:47:43.320 A second Palestinian state

00:47:45.040 From which Hamas

00:47:46.280 Will again seek

00:47:47.020 To destroy the Jewish state

00:47:48.140 All right

00:47:50.760 So listen

00:47:51.680 Is it fair

00:47:52.320 And I'm going to start

00:47:52.940 With you Warren

00:47:53.400 Because you were just there

00:47:54.280 Is it fair

00:47:55.500 To connect the dots

00:47:57.160 Between

00:47:57.860 The position

00:47:59.260 That Canada took

00:48:00.000 And the shooting

00:48:01.420 In Washington

00:48:01.980 Is that

00:48:03.060 Is it fair

00:48:03.680 Or is it

00:48:05.260 I mean

00:48:06.520 We'll leave it

00:48:07.940 At that

00:48:08.280 Is it fair

00:48:08.880 Well let's put it this way

00:48:11.960 I mean yeah

00:48:12.500 So I was in Israel

00:48:13.780 For a few weeks

00:48:15.560 And got back

00:48:16.680 Just a few days ago

00:48:17.700 The government

00:48:19.220 Of Benjamin Netanyahu

00:48:20.900 Is really

00:48:22.720 Unpopular

00:48:23.620 In Israel

00:48:24.320 The war

00:48:25.120 Is unpopular

00:48:26.020 In Israel

00:48:27.080 The focus there

00:48:28.820 Is to get

00:48:29.680 The hostages home

00:48:30.800 And to get

00:48:31.780 The war over

00:48:32.540 So

00:48:33.160 You know

00:48:34.560 There's

00:48:34.900 There's no question

00:48:35.700 About that

00:48:36.320 The statement

00:48:37.600 By Carney

00:48:38.760 And Keir

00:48:40.120 Starmer

00:48:41.580 And Macron

00:48:43.160 Was a strong statement

00:48:46.460 I think it caught

00:48:47.320 The Netanyahu

00:48:48.000 Government

00:48:48.500 Off guard

00:48:49.460 And knocked

00:48:50.520 Them off balance

00:48:51.520 I think

00:48:52.220 Having Netanyahu

00:48:54.040 Out there

00:48:54.760 As your spokesperson

00:48:55.600 For Israel

00:48:56.500 Is just not

00:48:57.520 A good idea

00:48:58.200 He's very unpopular

00:49:00.480 In the West

00:49:01.300 And I

00:49:02.740 You know

00:49:03.180 I personally think

00:49:04.220 Associating those

00:49:05.280 Three leaders

00:49:05.900 With Hamas

00:49:07.580 Is not

00:49:08.620 Not helpful

00:49:09.660 Yeah

00:49:09.920 You know

00:49:10.920 At the end of the day

00:49:11.620 Israel needs

00:49:12.680 The West

00:49:13.560 To continue

00:49:14.260 To support it

00:49:15.160 So

00:49:16.040 But you know

00:49:17.080 To me

00:49:17.520 It's symptomatic

00:49:18.300 Of the overall

00:49:19.600 Problem with the

00:49:20.440 Keirny government

00:49:21.560 I'm writing about this

00:49:22.620 For Post Media

00:49:23.220 This weekend

00:49:23.680 I can't get a clear

00:49:25.140 Sense of where

00:49:25.960 They are

00:49:26.520 On key issues

00:49:27.540 You know

00:49:27.800 Having a budget

00:49:28.700 Energy

00:49:30.100 Israel

00:49:31.420 A relationship

00:49:32.220 With the United States

00:49:33.040 It's messy

00:49:34.020 And this is another

00:49:35.060 Example that

00:49:35.900 They need to clean it up

00:49:37.120 Kate the irony is

00:49:38.500 Prior to October 7th

00:49:40.240 It looked like

00:49:40.800 Forces were aligning

00:49:41.660 To turf

00:49:42.160 Benjamin Netanyahu

00:49:43.200 With his

00:49:44.140 The changes

00:49:44.820 That

00:49:45.020 Unilateral changes

00:49:45.880 He was trying to bring

00:49:46.440 To the

00:49:46.720 The Israeli Supreme Court

00:49:48.000 I mean it really

00:49:48.660 Looked like his days

00:49:49.600 Were numbered

00:49:50.140 Hamas ensured

00:49:51.100 That he would stay

00:49:51.640 In power for years

00:49:52.600 After that

00:49:53.180 And so

00:49:54.220 But

00:49:55.020 I keep going back

00:49:56.480 To him saying

00:49:57.440 They've been emboldened

00:49:58.260 We've got the

00:49:59.140 This murder on the

00:50:00.100 Streets of Washington

00:50:00.900 People saying

00:50:01.820 Free free Palestine

00:50:02.780 I heard some

00:50:03.380 Protesters

00:50:04.080 Some video of

00:50:04.900 Protesters here

00:50:05.560 In the city of Toronto

00:50:06.560 And I'm looking at it

00:50:07.720 Through this lens

00:50:08.380 That you know

00:50:09.200 Are our leaders

00:50:10.540 When they are making

00:50:11.680 What I think

00:50:13.020 Are hot takes

00:50:13.920 And poor takes

00:50:15.120 And lack of

00:50:15.780 Like missing the

00:50:17.420 Nuance of the situation

00:50:18.680 Is it allowing

00:50:19.900 Is it giving cover

00:50:20.860 To people

00:50:22.320 Who really

00:50:23.560 Don't need that cover

00:50:24.980 And when they have

00:50:26.640 That cover

00:50:26.980 They can go to

00:50:27.540 Those extreme lengths

00:50:28.320 Two things are true

00:50:30.740 In this scenario

00:50:31.840 Number one

00:50:32.620 Politicians are not

00:50:34.340 Responsible for the

00:50:35.540 Actions of madmen

00:50:36.600 That is just as true

00:50:39.040 In this case

00:50:39.880 As it was when

00:50:41.080 You know

00:50:41.580 Liberal MPs

00:50:42.400 Were accusing

00:50:43.020 You know

00:50:44.200 Right-winger

00:50:44.940 Conservatives

00:50:45.720 Of violence

00:50:46.480 Being linked to

00:50:47.040 Pierre Polyev

00:50:47.780 Sometime last spring

00:50:49.300 They are not

00:50:50.780 Responsible for that

00:50:51.600 For the actions

00:50:52.760 Of terrorists

00:50:53.380 However

00:50:54.320 Our politicians

00:50:56.420 Lack of courage

00:50:57.460 Does contribute

00:50:58.700 To a climate

00:50:59.440 And an environment

00:51:00.360 Where people do

00:51:01.620 Feel emboldened

00:51:02.640 To take extreme action

00:51:04.280 And I would point

00:51:05.460 To the lack

00:51:06.260 Of enforcement

00:51:06.880 Of laws we have

00:51:08.120 Put aside

00:51:08.980 You know

00:51:09.300 The discussion

00:51:09.820 Around bubble laws

00:51:11.260 At the municipal level

00:51:12.400 But we're not even

00:51:13.520 Enforcing laws that we have

00:51:14.820 We're not providing

00:51:15.660 Clarity of conviction

00:51:17.200 On these

00:51:17.940 On these matters

00:51:19.220 That was a problem

00:51:20.340 With the Trudeau government

00:51:21.300 It looks to be a problem

00:51:22.560 For the Carney government

00:51:23.500 From what I gather

00:51:24.460 That statement

00:51:25.800 That he signed on to

00:51:26.800 Which was praised

00:51:27.620 By Hamas

00:51:28.260 Was not necessarily

00:51:30.400 Run through the town

00:51:31.640 Before he signed on to it

00:51:33.240 So this is going to

00:51:34.800 Continue to be a problem

00:51:35.940 Unless the government

00:51:37.980 Stands on this issue

00:51:39.600 One way or another

00:51:40.480 They're going to try

00:51:41.080 To have their cake

00:51:41.700 And eat it too

00:51:42.280 It didn't work

00:51:43.060 For the last government

00:51:44.060 I doubt it will work

00:51:44.940 For this one

00:51:45.540 But the lack

00:51:47.880 Of that conviction

00:51:48.560 And that courage

00:51:49.280 And those words

00:51:50.060 We cannot equate

00:51:51.520 That to the

00:51:52.860 To the violence

00:51:53.840 And the terrorism

00:51:54.620 That we see

00:51:55.180 South of the border

00:51:55.860 Or some of the

00:51:56.520 Activities here

00:51:57.200 Brad

00:51:58.320 We just had

00:51:59.420 Warren say

00:52:00.900 That he doesn't know

00:52:01.780 Where this government

00:52:02.760 Stands on

00:52:03.460 On a number of key files

00:52:04.760 Kate said

00:52:05.500 They want to have

00:52:05.960 Their cake

00:52:06.320 And eat it too

00:52:07.220 Is that how you see it

00:52:08.340 That this is a government

00:52:09.760 That is going to do

00:52:10.860 Its best to be

00:52:11.780 As opaque as possible

00:52:13.000 For as long as possible

00:52:14.180 Well I think the short answer

00:52:18.120 Is probably

00:52:18.780 Because that's what

00:52:20.100 That's what liberals

00:52:20.860 Do best

00:52:22.260 I think that

00:52:24.500 The last handful of years

00:52:26.060 Were particularly troubling

00:52:27.820 For the Liberal Party

00:52:28.840 Of Canada

00:52:29.280 And of course

00:52:30.000 Warren with his years

00:52:31.780 Of involvement

00:52:32.400 Would know this

00:52:33.000 Very very well

00:52:33.680 For years

00:52:34.700 I think the Liberal Party

00:52:35.720 Was seen as a party

00:52:36.600 That was behind Israel

00:52:39.280 And I think by and large

00:52:41.880 Would compete with

00:52:43.480 The Conservative Party

00:52:44.600 And had I think

00:52:45.780 Especially a handful

00:52:47.960 Of years ago

00:52:48.560 Enjoyed a lot of the

00:52:49.560 Support of the Jewish

00:52:50.440 Canadian diaspora

00:52:52.320 I think that under Trudeau

00:52:54.480 I think that they

00:52:55.560 You know

00:52:56.580 Lost a lot of that

00:52:57.540 And I think a lot

00:52:58.020 Of the Jewish community

00:52:58.820 Particularly in the

00:52:59.420 Greater Toronto area

00:53:00.200 Moved over to the

00:53:01.140 Conservative Party

00:53:01.760 Now we'll see

00:53:02.360 What Mr. Carney

00:53:03.340 Wants to see

00:53:04.700 What he wants to do

00:53:06.040 In terms of putting

00:53:06.660 His coalition together

00:53:07.640 And I think that

00:53:08.500 A lot of that

00:53:09.260 Particularly after

00:53:10.240 October 7th

00:53:11.280 Is challenging

00:53:12.000 Inside the Liberal

00:53:12.760 Caucus

00:53:13.220 Of the elected

00:53:14.320 Members of Parliament

00:53:15.360 Before the last election

00:53:16.260 So we'll see

00:53:17.700 Where he wants to go

00:53:18.760 As for giving aid

00:53:20.900 To Hamas

00:53:22.760 I think that

00:53:24.120 You know

00:53:24.500 If you take a look

00:53:25.160 At where

00:53:26.100 Like obviously

00:53:26.960 Donald Trump

00:53:27.640 Is a huge

00:53:28.580 Netanyahu supporter

00:53:29.660 Huge supporter

00:53:30.460 Of Israel

00:53:30.980 And yet this

00:53:31.940 Horrible atrocity

00:53:33.480 In Washington

00:53:34.560 Was only blocks away

00:53:36.200 From the White House

00:53:37.680 So you can't say

00:53:38.380 That whether

00:53:39.540 It's the Prime

00:53:40.180 Minister of UK

00:53:40.900 Or Canada

00:53:42.360 And the leaders

00:53:43.300 Of France

00:53:43.820 Are supporting

00:53:45.600 Hamas

00:53:45.920 Yet this

00:53:46.440 Horrible atrocity

00:53:47.620 Took place

00:53:48.180 Blocks away

00:53:49.040 From Donald Trump's

00:53:49.960 Residence

00:53:51.020 So I don't think

00:53:52.580 That it's serving

00:53:53.440 The interest of peace

00:53:54.440 In the Middle East

00:53:55.000 To call out

00:53:56.280 Kearney

00:53:56.720 Starmer

00:53:57.880 And Macron

00:53:58.880 So I want to

00:54:00.020 Take a moment

00:54:00.560 And talk about

00:54:01.280 This new

00:54:01.840 Bubble bylaw

00:54:03.140 In the city

00:54:03.700 Of Toronto

00:54:04.240 And for those

00:54:05.880 Who are listening

00:54:06.480 Who are unaware

00:54:07.200 Of it

00:54:07.620 It's a bylaw

00:54:08.520 That just got passed

00:54:09.420 It offers protections

00:54:10.440 To certain key

00:54:11.860 Public locations

00:54:13.360 Like schools

00:54:14.280 And places of worship

00:54:15.380 There are about

00:54:16.060 3,000 locations

00:54:17.120 That would fall

00:54:17.720 Under the purview

00:54:18.960 Of this bylaw

00:54:19.960 And it is not

00:54:20.740 Specific to the

00:54:21.460 Jewish faith

00:54:22.620 It's churches

00:54:23.760 It's mosques

00:54:24.480 It's synagogues

00:54:25.820 It's schools

00:54:26.660 And the like

00:54:27.340 But my question

00:54:28.760 Kate I'll start

00:54:29.440 With you

00:54:29.920 I think a lot

00:54:30.580 Of us were surprised

00:54:31.480 That it got beefed up

00:54:33.120 That the 20

00:54:34.180 Meter bubble

00:54:36.220 Was extended to 50

00:54:37.500 And so on

00:54:38.460 There's a few

00:54:39.080 So it actually got

00:54:39.960 Improved from the

00:54:41.380 Watered down version

00:54:42.160 That it was before

00:54:42.820 Very very quickly

00:54:43.780 It's sort of a pivot

00:54:45.060 From my first question

00:54:46.360 If that violence

00:54:47.380 Hadn't happened

00:54:47.900 On the streets

00:54:48.360 Of Washington

00:54:49.000 Do you think

00:54:49.780 We would have

00:54:50.160 Seen a beefing up

00:54:51.160 The way we did

00:54:52.280 Of this bylaw

00:54:53.100 I'm sure that

00:54:55.220 Recent events

00:54:56.340 Resulted in that

00:54:57.760 That law being

00:54:58.740 Augmented

00:54:59.280 I do come back

00:55:01.560 To you know

00:55:02.360 We do have

00:55:02.920 Existing laws

00:55:03.760 That could be

00:55:04.780 Enforced

00:55:05.360 You know

00:55:05.640 I generally

00:55:06.300 Am supportive

00:55:06.900 Of making sure

00:55:07.540 They're safe spaces

00:55:08.480 But passing new laws

00:55:11.020 When the current ones

00:55:11.900 Aren't being enforced

00:55:12.720 Properly

00:55:13.280 Is not going

00:55:14.040 To fix this problem

00:55:15.320 Brad I'm going

00:55:16.620 To give you

00:55:16.820 About 15 seconds

00:55:17.800 On this

00:55:18.180 Oh

00:55:20.940 Can I

00:55:21.840 How about you

00:55:23.760 Warren

00:55:24.060 Well I

00:55:26.300 You know

00:55:26.940 Having bubble zones

00:55:28.360 Around places

00:55:29.320 Of worship

00:55:29.760 And not just

00:55:30.460 Jewish ones

00:55:31.180 You know

00:55:31.600 In Quebec City

00:55:32.580 We all saw

00:55:33.380 You know

00:55:34.180 How critically important

00:55:35.600 Like this could have been

00:55:37.000 On that terrible occasion

00:55:38.620 When so many

00:55:39.920 Muslims of prayer

00:55:41.080 Lost their lives

00:55:42.100 This is something

00:55:43.260 That's supported

00:55:43.860 By most

00:55:45.220 Religious communities

00:55:46.460 And it's something

00:55:47.740 That already exists

00:55:48.900 In respect of

00:55:49.840 Abortion clinics

00:55:50.720 And health providers

00:55:52.480 So like

00:55:53.880 This was

00:55:54.720 An easy thing

00:55:55.700 To do

00:55:56.140 But of course

00:55:56.820 Typically

00:55:57.380 Toronto Council

00:55:58.860 Turned it into

00:55:59.680 A torture chamber

00:56:00.680 We're on for hours

00:56:02.440 Warren we're going

00:56:03.040 To leave it there

00:56:03.560 I'm going to grab

00:56:04.600 Pick you up

00:56:05.060 After the break

00:56:05.660 Don't go anywhere

00:56:06.140 More with our panel

00:56:06.940 Welcome back to

00:56:08.640 The Ben Mulroney show

00:56:09.380 And welcome back

00:56:09.920 To this week in politics

00:56:10.840 And welcome back

00:56:11.620 To Brad Levine

00:56:12.300 Warren Kinsella

00:56:12.880 And Kate Harrison

00:56:13.680 Guys I want to

00:56:14.520 Jump right back in

00:56:15.300 And I want to look

00:56:16.100 Forward to

00:56:17.500 Kenanaskis Alberta

00:56:18.520 For the G7 summit

00:56:19.940 This will be

00:56:20.340 Mark Carney's

00:56:20.940 First as the host

00:56:22.460 Prime minister

00:56:23.180 And it's also

00:56:24.240 Donald Trump's return

00:56:25.380 To the world

00:56:26.340 Of multilateralism

00:56:27.480 And I think

00:56:28.460 It's going to be

00:56:28.860 A very interesting

00:56:29.760 Backdrop

00:56:30.280 Given the fact

00:56:30.900 Of what he

00:56:31.800 Essentially tweeted

00:56:32.780 Today

00:56:33.120 Disparaging

00:56:34.140 In the most

00:56:34.960 Inaccurate

00:56:36.420 And

00:56:36.960 Well inaccurate

00:56:38.280 Terms

00:56:38.740 The European Union

00:56:39.720 Which he said

00:56:40.080 Which was formed

00:56:40.700 For the primary

00:56:41.380 Purpose of taking

00:56:42.140 Advantage of the

00:56:42.720 United States

00:56:43.180 On trade

00:56:43.680 And now he's

00:56:44.820 Suggesting

00:56:45.520 A massive

00:56:46.220 Trade deficit

00:56:47.020 He's recommending

00:56:47.980 A straight 50%

00:56:49.220 Tariff on the

00:56:49.960 European Union

00:56:50.660 Starting on June 1st

00:56:52.140 So two weeks

00:56:52.900 Before the summit

00:56:54.140 Warren

00:56:55.120 You know

00:56:55.640 You worked with

00:56:56.120 A prime minister

00:56:56.640 Who attended

00:56:57.180 A great many

00:56:58.060 Of these summits

00:56:58.800 Talk to me about

00:56:59.820 I mean

00:57:00.460 Who's walking

00:57:01.300 Into a buzzsaw here

00:57:02.420 Well actually

00:57:05.120 None of them are

00:57:05.860 Because Kretzian

00:57:06.560 When I worked for him

00:57:07.320 I said to him

00:57:07.960 Because I'm from

00:57:09.020 Alberta as you know

00:57:10.320 Ben

00:57:10.600 And like

00:57:11.160 Why just stick it

00:57:12.440 In Kananaskis

00:57:13.620 And he said

00:57:14.260 Well if any

00:57:14.980 Protesters try

00:57:15.920 And get in there

00:57:16.440 They're going to

00:57:16.820 Get eaten by bears

00:57:17.960 So like

00:57:19.260 It's pretty isolated

00:57:20.500 So it's going to

00:57:21.080 Be very difficult

00:57:21.840 For any of the

00:57:22.740 Many many

00:57:23.620 Protesters

00:57:24.560 Who I think

00:57:25.100 Would like to

00:57:25.940 Target Mr. Trump

00:57:27.140 From showing up

00:57:28.880 You know

00:57:29.260 It's

00:57:29.580 If you're in

00:57:30.560 The secret service

00:57:31.680 Of the RCMP

00:57:32.540 Protective service

00:57:34.140 It's a dream

00:57:35.120 Scenario for you

00:57:36.340 Because it's the

00:57:36.900 Best location

00:57:37.800 For something

00:57:38.520 Like this

00:57:39.680 I thought the

00:57:40.620 Kearney

00:57:41.080 But what's

00:57:41.760 I mean

00:57:41.940 What's going to

00:57:42.960 Happen with these

00:57:43.520 What's going to

00:57:44.160 Happen with the

00:57:44.560 European leaders

00:57:45.320 Who show up

00:57:46.220 Being subjected

00:57:47.060 To 50% tariffs

00:57:48.300 Because Donald Trump

00:57:49.620 Feels that the

00:57:50.560 European Union's

00:57:51.260 Sole reason

00:57:52.020 To exist

00:57:52.680 Is to take

00:57:53.780 Advantage of

00:57:54.380 The United

00:57:54.660 States on

00:57:55.140 Trade

00:57:55.440 Yeah and

00:57:57.520 You know

00:57:58.200 That is the

00:57:58.800 Problem with

00:57:59.340 Trump

00:57:59.680 Is just

00:58:00.140 When you

00:58:00.520 Think we've

00:58:01.440 Got a period

00:58:02.120 Of enduring

00:58:02.800 Quiet

00:58:03.400 Oh I think

00:58:05.640 We just lost

00:58:06.220 I think we

00:58:06.740 Just lost him

00:58:07.440 Kate I'm going

00:58:08.200 To jump on

00:58:08.740 And ask you

00:58:09.400 What do you

00:58:10.220 Think this is

00:58:10.640 He just keeps

00:58:11.460 Lobbing bombs

00:58:12.380 Doesn't he

00:58:12.820 Just when you

00:58:13.320 Think everyone

00:58:14.200 Is rowing in

00:58:14.840 The same

00:58:15.100 Direction and

00:58:15.620 We might be

00:58:16.080 Able to have

00:58:16.420 A little

00:58:16.740 Peace in

00:58:17.180 The valley

00:58:17.620 Something like

00:58:18.320 This pops up

00:58:19.020 Yeah that's

00:58:20.460 A feature

00:58:20.940 Not a bug

00:58:21.720 Of Trump's

00:58:22.420 Negotiation style

00:58:23.660 Right so

00:58:24.480 You know he

00:58:25.320 Starts at 50%

00:58:26.360 Today and the

00:58:27.400 Lead into the

00:58:27.980 G7 you know

00:58:29.240 Then we end up

00:58:30.060 Somewhere around

00:58:30.780 15 and it

00:58:31.620 Still looks like

00:58:32.200 The US has

00:58:32.880 Secured something

00:58:33.580 He always goes

00:58:34.740 To the extreme

00:58:35.420 And then walks

00:58:36.480 It back a little

00:58:37.120 Bit I think

00:58:38.040 Where there's

00:58:38.360 Going to be

00:58:38.660 Tension around

00:58:39.480 The G7

00:58:40.080 Table Ben

00:58:40.760 There might be

00:58:41.800 Some of course

00:58:42.440 With with

00:58:42.860 European leaders

00:58:43.620 But how that

00:58:44.860 Interaction goes

00:58:45.700 With Vladimir

00:58:46.600 Zelensky

00:58:47.120 Because he will

00:58:48.520 Be there

00:58:48.940 Canada I think

00:58:49.840 Will have some

00:58:50.380 Positive things

00:58:51.060 To say about

00:58:51.540 Support for

00:58:51.980 Ukraine around

00:58:52.560 That meeting

00:58:52.940 We know that

00:58:53.480 The Trump

00:58:53.780 Administration

00:58:54.300 Has a very

00:58:55.180 Different view

00:58:55.820 On the role

00:58:56.920 That they should

00:58:57.540 Continue to play

00:58:58.280 In the Ukrainian

00:58:59.440 Russian conflict

00:59:00.320 So I think

00:59:01.360 That might be

00:59:01.900 An opportunity

00:59:02.480 For sparks to

00:59:03.260 Fly it might

00:59:03.640 Be the first

00:59:04.120 Chance that

00:59:05.040 Trump and

00:59:05.600 Zelensky have

00:59:06.300 Being back in

00:59:07.240 The same room

00:59:07.780 Together

00:59:08.140 So I think

00:59:09.220 That that's

00:59:09.620 Where we could

00:59:10.060 See some

00:59:10.540 Tension around

00:59:11.700 The G7

00:59:12.240 Table how

00:59:12.780 Canada navigates

00:59:13.720 The Ukrainian

00:59:14.320 Conflict and

00:59:15.720 The support that

00:59:16.300 We provide

00:59:16.720 Their advice

00:59:17.460 Where no

00:59:18.440 Americans want

00:59:19.200 To go

00:59:19.420 Which is

00:59:19.760 Stepping back

00:59:20.340 From support

00:59:20.880 In that

00:59:21.140 Conflict

00:59:21.600 Brad give

00:59:22.340 Me your

00:59:22.840 Quick take

00:59:23.620 On the

00:59:24.140 G7 and

00:59:24.920 What we can

00:59:25.300 Expect in

00:59:25.960 Light of

00:59:26.300 Donald Trump's

00:59:27.000 Opening foray

00:59:28.180 With the

00:59:28.500 European Union

00:59:29.440 But then I'd

00:59:30.160 Like to

00:59:30.420 Pivot to

00:59:31.560 The larger

00:59:32.180 Conversation

00:59:32.900 About you

00:59:33.740 Know this

00:59:34.060 The Mark

00:59:34.660 Carney

00:59:34.940 Prime

00:59:35.660 Minister

00:59:35.940 Is not

00:59:36.420 Mark Carney

00:59:36.960 The candidate

00:59:37.720 From the

00:59:38.200 Counter tariffs

00:59:38.880 Secretly being

00:59:39.720 Gone to

00:59:40.580 Calling Donald

00:59:41.240 Trump

00:59:41.440 Transformational

00:59:42.240 To asking

00:59:43.040 To be part

00:59:43.520 Of the

00:59:43.820 Golden

00:59:44.180 Dome

00:59:44.640 Is this

00:59:45.380 Good

00:59:45.720 Diplomacy

00:59:46.420 Or a

00:59:46.880 Bait and

00:59:47.200 Switch

00:59:47.520 No I

00:59:49.080 Well I

00:59:49.440 Think that

00:59:50.040 He's looking

00:59:50.680 For

00:59:51.240 Particularly

00:59:52.160 With the

00:59:52.520 G7

00:59:52.900 Coming up

00:59:53.840 On Canadian

00:59:54.260 Soil

00:59:54.740 In a

00:59:55.720 Short bit

00:59:56.280 This is

00:59:57.180 All

00:59:57.500 I think

00:59:58.240 He's just

00:59:58.480 Keeping

00:59:58.860 He's not

01:00:00.440 Saying no

01:00:01.120 To Trump

01:00:01.680 On anything

01:00:02.260 Of substance

01:00:04.100 The transformational

01:00:05.200 Comment in the

01:00:05.980 White House

01:00:06.300 I mean I

01:00:06.600 Think that

01:00:06.920 Most Canadians

01:00:07.460 Would give

01:00:07.900 Him a

01:00:08.600 Solid grade

01:00:09.380 On his

01:00:09.740 Performance

01:00:10.160 In there

01:00:10.480 Particularly

01:00:10.760 We saw

01:00:11.260 What he

01:00:11.820 Did

01:00:11.960 To

01:00:12.240 Zelensky

01:00:12.700 As well

01:00:13.160 As the

01:00:13.520 Leadership

01:00:14.160 Of South

01:00:14.560 Africa

01:00:14.860 Just a

01:00:15.180 Couple of

01:00:15.480 Days ago

01:00:15.900 So I

01:00:17.040 Think that

01:00:17.880 Security

01:00:19.200 Will be a

01:00:20.960 Big thing

01:00:21.420 I think the

01:00:21.880 Golden

01:00:22.140 Dome

01:00:22.600 And what

01:00:23.080 European

01:00:23.600 Allies

01:00:25.800 Think of

01:00:26.960 Canada's

01:00:27.440 Participation

01:00:28.140 In this

01:00:29.480 In the

01:00:30.060 Missile

01:00:30.320 Defense

01:00:30.800 Initiative

01:00:31.600 And the

01:00:32.440 Fact that

01:00:32.740 We're still

01:00:33.280 Keeping our

01:00:34.280 Options

01:00:34.740 Open on

01:00:35.380 That

01:00:35.620 I think

01:00:36.120 Will be a

01:00:36.500 Big

01:00:36.640 One

01:00:36.820 And also

01:00:37.500 I'll

01:00:37.760 Just add

01:00:38.200 I think

01:00:38.780 Alberta

01:00:39.240 Separation

01:00:39.920 And the

01:00:40.900 Idea of

01:00:41.760 Us selling

01:00:42.760 Our natural

01:00:43.380 Resources

01:00:43.820 Particularly

01:00:44.260 Oil

01:00:44.840 And all

01:00:45.940 Of that

01:00:46.220 Will be

01:00:46.740 Something of

01:00:47.420 Great interest

01:00:47.960 To the

01:00:48.920 Global media

01:00:49.620 On Canadian

01:00:50.680 Soil

01:00:50.980 In Alberta

01:00:51.540 Yeah

01:00:52.000 Warren

01:00:52.380 You know

01:00:52.880 Brad brought

01:00:53.880 Up his

01:00:54.780 Performance

01:00:55.340 And that's

01:00:56.580 I think

01:00:56.900 At issue

01:00:57.440 Here for

01:00:57.860 Me

01:00:57.980 Is like

01:00:58.180 How much

01:00:58.460 Of this

01:00:58.700 Is a

01:00:58.940 Performance

01:00:59.360 What

01:00:59.620 Are this

01:01:00.700 Prime

01:01:01.000 Minister's

01:01:01.420 Values

01:01:01.820 How does

01:01:02.280 He

01:01:02.400 Actually

01:01:02.860 See

01:01:03.220 The

01:01:03.420 World

01:01:03.740 Mackenzie

01:01:04.360 Gray

01:01:04.600 Of

01:01:04.720 Global

01:01:04.980 News

01:01:05.420 Put it

01:01:06.720 To

01:01:06.820 Him

01:01:06.920 He said

01:01:07.080 Explain

01:01:07.760 The elbows

01:01:08.340 Up when

01:01:08.720 You're the

01:01:08.980 One

01:01:09.160 Your team's

01:01:10.040 Calling

01:01:10.380 Wanting to

01:01:10.940 Integrate

01:01:11.640 More deeply

01:01:12.040 With their

01:01:12.360 Military

01:01:12.700 On the

01:01:13.080 Golden

01:01:13.320 Dome

01:01:13.680 We find

01:01:14.300 Out about

01:01:14.620 The tariffs

01:01:15.500 That were

01:01:15.780 Secretly

01:01:16.160 Removed

01:01:16.600 During the

01:01:17.040 Campaign

01:01:17.500 Never mind

01:01:18.220 The fact

01:01:18.480 That Danielle

01:01:18.900 Smith

01:01:19.140 Was called

01:01:19.580 A traitor

01:01:20.120 For the

01:01:20.460 Very same

01:01:20.960 Policy

01:01:21.440 That she

01:01:22.380 Upheld

01:01:22.760 But

01:01:23.140 He mentioned

01:01:25.040 He mentioned

01:01:25.080 Something

01:01:25.460 In his

01:01:25.960 Explanation

01:01:26.620 To

01:01:26.800 Mackenzie

01:01:27.180 Gray

01:01:27.460 When he

01:01:28.140 Said

01:01:28.420 Look

01:01:29.500 Everything

01:01:29.920 Has

01:01:30.340 Changed

01:01:30.760 And now

01:01:31.400 We are

01:01:31.940 Willing to

01:01:32.340 Cooperate

01:01:32.880 When we

01:01:33.380 Can

01:01:33.720 But we're

01:01:34.000 Not

01:01:34.160 Necessarily

01:01:34.760 Going to

01:01:35.000 Cooperate

01:01:35.520 And I

01:01:35.980 Thought to

01:01:36.240 Myself

01:01:36.540 Explain

01:01:37.560 Explain

01:01:38.860 Jean Chrétien

01:01:39.900 Staying

01:01:40.420 Out of

01:01:40.660 The Iraq

01:01:41.060 War

01:01:41.380 None

01:01:42.260 Of that

01:01:42.580 Is

01:01:42.740 Different

01:01:43.140 It

01:01:43.480 Just

01:01:43.660 Happens

01:01:43.940 To

01:01:44.060 Be

01:01:44.200 That

01:01:44.600 We're

01:01:44.740 In

01:01:44.880 A

01:01:45.020 Different

01:01:45.300 Time

01:01:45.760 So

01:01:46.200 How

01:01:46.460 Do

01:01:46.640 You

01:01:46.820 See

01:01:47.180 This

01:01:48.100 Is

01:01:49.520 It

01:01:49.620 A new

01:01:49.820 Mark

01:01:50.040 Carney

01:01:50.300 That

01:01:50.460 We're

01:01:50.560 Seeing

01:01:50.780 Well

01:01:52.280 You know

01:01:52.580 If

01:01:52.720 You're

01:01:52.880 In a

01:01:53.400 Daily

01:01:54.060 Campaign

01:01:54.560 And

01:01:54.860 We

01:01:55.020 Are

01:01:55.260 Now

01:01:55.640 Your

01:01:57.100 Message

01:01:57.520 Has

01:01:58.020 To

01:01:58.160 Be

01:01:58.340 Coherent

01:01:59.060 Your

01:01:59.440 Message

01:01:59.780 Has

01:02:00.280 To

01:02:00.480 Be

01:02:00.860 Understandable

01:02:02.100 And

01:02:02.780 Too

01:02:03.080 Often

01:02:03.520 Whether

01:02:03.920 It's

01:02:04.140 On

01:02:04.300 Energy

01:02:04.740 Or

01:02:05.160 Housing

01:02:05.600 Or

01:02:07.560 Now

01:02:07.920 I

01:02:08.100 Mean

01:02:08.240 Like

01:02:08.440 The

01:02:08.880 Golden

01:02:09.220 Dome

01:02:09.660 So

01:02:09.940 Trump

01:02:10.280 Wants

01:02:10.600 To

01:02:10.780 Put

01:02:11.060 A

01:02:11.320 Golden

01:02:11.620 Dome

01:02:12.000 Over

01:02:12.280 North

01:02:12.560 America

01:02:13.060 To

01:02:13.640 Protect

01:02:14.040 Us

01:02:14.280 From

01:02:14.580 The

01:02:14.960 Extreme

01:02:16.180 Threat

01:02:16.860 We're

01:02:17.240 Facing

01:02:18.020 From

01:02:18.280 The

01:02:18.420 North

01:02:18.620 Korean

01:02:19.040 Navy

01:02:19.440 I

01:02:19.680 Guess

01:02:20.040 So

01:02:20.780 But

01:02:21.520 Mark

01:02:22.100 Carney

01:02:22.580 Said

01:02:23.100 On

01:02:23.460 March

01:02:23.800 The

01:02:24.020 27

01:02:24.680 I

01:02:25.040 Checked

01:02:25.540 Our

01:02:25.980 Relationship

01:02:26.780 With

01:02:26.980 The

01:02:27.080 United

01:02:27.300 States

01:02:27.600 Was

01:02:27.800 Over

01:02:28.180 And

01:02:28.800 Less

01:02:29.000 Than

01:02:29.160 Two

01:02:29.360 Months

01:02:29.640 Later

01:02:29.940 He's

01:02:30.200 Like

01:02:30.380 Hey

01:02:30.580 Let's

01:02:30.800 Go

01:02:30.960 For

01:02:31.100 This

01:02:31.260 Golden

01:02:31.620 Dome

01:02:31.960 Thing

01:02:32.240 And

01:02:37.560 So

01:02:38.100 You

01:02:38.560 Know

01:02:38.620 I

01:02:38.740 Think

01:02:38.880 We

01:02:39.020 Can

01:02:39.140 Put

01:02:39.300 A

01:02:39.400 Lot

01:02:39.540 Of

01:02:39.660 This

01:02:39.800 Down

01:02:40.120 To

01:02:40.640 Growing

01:02:41.940 Pains

01:02:42.460 And

01:02:42.660 New

01:02:42.800 Government

01:02:43.240 New

01:02:44.220 Prime

01:02:44.520 Minister

01:02:44.920 But

01:02:45.760 You

01:02:45.960 Know

01:02:46.100 It

01:02:46.620 Actually

01:02:47.020 Is

01:02:47.380 Having

01:02:47.660 The

01:02:47.860 Effect

01:02:48.140 Of

01:02:48.320 Making

01:02:48.600 Us

01:02:48.900 All

01:02:49.120 Kind

01:02:49.340 Of

01:02:49.440 Look

01:02:49.600 Back

01:02:49.920 Nostalgically

01:02:50.700 On

01:02:51.400 The

01:02:51.700 Justin

01:02:52.240 Trudeau

01:02:52.880 Era

01:02:53.220 Well

01:02:53.620 I

01:02:54.500 Don't

01:02:54.640 Know

01:02:54.780 About

01:02:54.940 That

01:02:55.220 But

01:02:57.020 Kate

01:02:57.500 I

01:02:57.680 Didn't

01:02:59.180 I

01:02:59.480 Didn't

01:02:59.700 Vote

01:02:59.900 For

01:03:00.060 The

01:03:00.180 Guy

01:03:00.320 So

01:03:00.480 I

01:03:00.640 Don't

01:03:00.780 Feel

01:03:00.940 Like

01:03:01.100 I

01:03:01.200 Had

01:03:01.320 The

01:03:01.480 Will

01:03:01.640 Pulled

01:03:01.960 Over

01:03:02.140 My

01:03:02.340 Eyes

01:03:02.560 But

01:03:02.700 There

01:03:02.840 Are

01:03:02.940 A

01:03:03.120 Lot

01:03:03.320 Of

01:03:03.440 People

01:03:03.660 Who

01:03:03.820 Got

01:03:03.960 Very

01:03:04.580 Heated

01:03:05.500 Because

01:03:06.060 They

01:03:06.280 Believed

01:03:06.840 In

01:03:06.980 The

01:03:07.120 Narrative

01:03:07.620 That

01:03:08.120 The

01:03:08.300 Liberal

01:03:08.560 Government

01:03:08.920 Was

01:03:09.100 Telling

01:03:09.340 Them

01:03:09.480 About

01:03:09.720 Our

01:03:09.900 Relationship

01:03:10.660 Being

01:03:10.860 Over

01:03:11.220 And

01:03:11.680 So

01:03:12.340 How

01:03:12.780 Are

01:03:12.900 Those

01:03:13.100 People

01:03:13.340 Feeling

01:03:13.660 Today

01:03:13.900 Do

01:03:14.040 You

01:03:14.080 Think

01:03:14.280 Yeah

01:03:14.760 This

01:03:15.480 Is

01:03:15.680 Not

01:03:16.000 Growing

01:03:16.360 Pains

01:03:16.820 This

01:03:17.200 Is

01:03:17.340 Political

01:03:17.780 Opportunism

01:03:18.720 Things

01:03:19.520 Changed

01:03:20.220 With

01:03:20.500 The

01:03:20.620 Relationship

01:03:21.360 The

01:03:21.560 Moment

01:03:21.800 Mark

01:03:22.080 Carney

01:03:22.300 Got

01:03:22.520 elected

01:03:22.940 He

01:03:23.400 Turned

01:03:23.740 Up

01:03:23.860 The

01:03:23.980 Volume

01:03:24.300 On

01:03:24.540 People's

01:03:24.940 Anxieties

01:03:25.500 And

01:03:25.780 Fears

01:03:26.120 About

01:03:26.520 You

01:03:27.640 Know

01:03:27.820 The

01:03:28.180 Relationship

01:03:28.780 With

01:03:28.920 The

01:03:29.040 U.S.

01:03:29.480 Whether

01:03:29.660 Or

01:03:29.840 Not

01:03:29.960 We

01:03:30.080 Would

01:03:30.180 Become

01:03:30.420 A

01:03:30.560 51st

01:03:31.080 State

01:03:31.380 And

01:03:31.940 Don't

01:03:32.140 Get

01:03:32.280 Me

01:03:32.380 Wrong

01:03:32.620 Donald

01:03:33.180 Trump

01:03:33.460 Started

01:03:33.880 That

01:03:34.120 Fight

01:03:34.400 Yeah

01:03:34.620 But

01:03:35.060 Mark

01:03:35.300 Carney

01:03:35.540 Certainly

01:03:35.900 Didn't

01:03:36.240 Back

01:03:36.440 Away

01:03:36.680 From

01:03:36.900 It

01:03:37.060 It

01:03:37.180 Was

01:03:37.320 Elbows

01:03:37.600 Up

01:03:37.780 The

01:03:37.920 Way

01:03:38.300 Until

01:03:38.820 He

01:03:39.000 Got

01:03:39.200 In

01:03:39.320 The

01:03:39.440 Saddle

01:03:39.800 And

01:03:39.980 Said

01:03:40.140 You

01:03:40.260 Know

01:03:40.360 What

01:03:40.540 This

01:03:40.740 Is

01:03:40.860 Going

01:03:41.000 To

01:03:41.040 Be

01:03:41.280 A

01:03:41.800 Little

01:03:41.940 Bit

01:03:42.160 More

01:03:42.400 Than

01:03:42.760 That

01:03:42.980 Than

01:03:43.180 We

01:03:43.300 Can

01:03:43.460 Handle

01:03:43.800 So

01:03:44.080 I

01:03:44.740 Can

01:03:44.900 Understand

01:03:45.280 Why

01:03:45.540 A lot

01:03:45.760 Of

01:03:45.860 Voters

01:03:46.120 Would

01:03:46.280 Be

01:03:46.380 Feeling

01:03:46.700 A bit

01:03:46.960 Betrayed

01:03:47.560 By

01:03:48.240 The

01:03:48.540 Way

01:03:48.740 Mark

01:03:49.000 Carney

01:03:49.220 Has

01:03:49.540 Handled

01:03:49.960 His

01:03:50.140 Interactions

01:03:50.620 With

01:03:50.820 The

01:03:50.940 U.S.

01:03:51.260 And

01:03:51.360 The

01:03:51.460 President

01:03:51.800 Since

01:03:52.540 The

01:03:52.700 Election

01:03:53.080 I

01:03:53.620 Think

01:03:53.840 That

01:03:54.020 He

01:03:54.160 Is

01:03:54.320 Doing

01:03:54.580 Things

01:03:54.960 Correctly

01:03:55.620 In

01:03:56.040 Terms

01:03:56.380 Of

01:03:56.580 Not

01:03:57.220 Shutting

01:03:57.600 Down

01:03:57.820 The

01:03:57.980 Golden

01:03:58.200 Dome

01:03:58.520 Even

01:03:58.700 Though

01:03:58.840 I

01:03:58.960 Think

01:03:59.100 It's

01:03:59.220 A

01:03:59.320 Crazy

01:03:59.580 Idea

01:03:59.940 That

01:04:00.100 Will

01:04:00.220 Never

01:04:00.440 Happen

01:04:01.080 He

01:04:01.460 He's

01:04:01.520 Probably

01:04:01.760 Going

01:04:01.960 To

01:04:02.040 Play

01:04:02.260 The

01:04:02.720 Game

01:04:03.000 With

01:04:03.160 Trump

01:04:03.500 But

01:04:04.320 At

01:04:04.420 The

01:04:04.560 Same

01:04:04.740 Time

01:04:05.000 Is

01:04:05.160 A

01:04:05.280 Very

01:04:05.500 Different

01:04:05.780 Mark

01:04:06.020 Carney

01:04:06.320 Than

01:04:06.880 What

01:04:07.020 We

01:04:07.160 Saw

01:04:07.500 At

01:04:08.280 The

01:04:08.400 End

01:04:08.560 Of

01:04:08.680 March

01:04:08.980 Or

01:04:09.200 Even

01:04:09.420 April

01:04:09.800 When

01:04:10.320 The

01:04:10.440 Election

01:04:10.680 Was

01:04:10.880 Held

01:04:11.100 Yeah

01:04:11.340 That's

01:04:11.700 The

01:04:11.800 Thing

01:04:12.120 I'm

01:04:12.280 Not

01:04:12.400 Getting

01:04:12.600 Heated

01:04:12.940 Over

01:04:13.260 What

01:04:14.940 He's

01:04:15.280 Doing

01:04:15.720 Day

01:04:16.660 To

01:04:16.800 Day

01:04:16.980 Because

01:04:17.280 By

01:04:18.040 And

01:04:18.200 Large

01:04:18.440 These

01:04:18.680 Are

01:04:18.780 Things

01:04:18.960 I

01:04:19.140 Agree

01:04:19.440 With

01:04:19.740 I'm

01:04:20.280 Just

01:04:20.500 Putting

01:04:21.080 Myself

01:04:21.440 In

01:04:21.560 The

01:04:21.700 Shoes

01:04:22.060 Brad

01:04:22.500 Of

01:04:23.120 Someone

01:04:23.460 Who

01:04:23.640 May

01:04:23.800 Have

01:04:23.960 Voted

01:04:24.540 For

01:04:24.820 Him

01:04:24.980 Because

01:04:25.220 They

01:04:25.380 Felt

01:04:25.680 That

01:04:25.900 There

01:04:26.320 Was

01:04:26.500 A

01:04:26.700 Cultural

01:04:27.660 And

01:04:27.980 National

01:04:28.360 Imperative

01:04:28.900 To

01:04:29.100 Do

01:04:29.280 So

01:04:29.600 Only

01:04:30.120 To

01:04:30.240 See

01:04:30.580 That

01:04:30.740 It's

01:04:30.860 Business

01:04:31.180 As

01:04:31.400 Usual

01:04:31.780 Yeah

01:04:33.620 Well

01:04:33.820 When

01:04:34.020 It

01:04:34.160 Comes

01:04:34.780 To

01:04:35.020 Something

01:04:35.720 Like

01:04:36.040 This

01:04:36.780 Missile

01:04:37.120 Defense

01:04:37.580 Kate's

01:04:38.460 Right

01:04:38.680 This

01:04:39.080 Is

01:04:39.220 Never

01:04:39.460 Going

01:04:39.640 To

01:04:39.740 Happen

01:04:40.720 And

01:04:40.940 It's

01:04:41.920 A

01:04:42.040 Crazy

01:04:42.640 Idea

01:04:42.940 It was

01:04:43.060 A

01:04:43.160 Crazy

01:04:43.400 Idea

01:04:43.740 When

01:04:43.940 George

01:04:44.300 Bush

01:04:44.860 Jr.

01:04:45.720 Put

01:04:46.600 It

01:04:46.780 To

01:04:46.900 Paul

01:04:47.220 Martin

01:04:47.600 20

01:04:49.000 Plus

01:04:49.340 Years

01:04:49.560 Ago

01:04:49.800 But

01:04:50.680 You

01:04:51.040 Know

01:04:51.200 As

01:04:51.700 A

01:04:51.820 Negotiating

01:04:52.340 Tactic

01:04:52.680 You

01:04:52.920 Don't

01:04:53.220 Have

01:04:53.380 To

01:04:53.520 Say

01:04:53.720 No

01:04:54.020 To

01:04:54.160 Something

01:04:54.440 That's

01:04:54.740 Never

01:04:54.920 Going

01:04:55.080 To

01:04:55.140 Happen

01:04:55.500 You

01:04:55.720 Can

01:04:55.900 Keep

01:04:56.180 Them

01:04:56.320 Going

01:04:56.680 And

01:04:57.160 Saying

01:04:57.480 Well

01:04:57.880 We're

01:04:58.240 Going

01:04:58.380 To

01:04:58.480 Find

01:04:59.040 Out

01:04:59.200 More

01:04:59.380 What

01:04:59.560 He

01:04:59.660 Says

01:04:59.900 That

01:05:00.100 That

01:05:00.320 Gets

01:05:00.560 Trump

01:05:00.840 Excited

01:05:01.360 And

01:05:01.960 Perhaps

01:05:02.620 It's

01:05:03.020 A

01:05:03.200 Negotiating

01:05:04.460 Tactic

01:05:04.900 To

01:05:05.360 Get

01:05:05.520 Him

01:05:05.620 On

01:05:05.840 To

01:05:05.960 Other

01:05:06.160 Things

01:05:06.500 Because

01:05:06.760 We

01:05:06.960 Haven't

01:05:07.220 Said

01:05:07.420 No

01:05:07.700 To

01:05:07.840 Something

01:05:16.780 As

01:05:16.880 A

01:05:17.000 Conversation

01:05:17.560 Is

01:05:17.700 Going

01:05:17.820 And

01:05:18.160 Now

01:05:18.400 He's

01:05:18.680 Distracted

01:05:19.240 Again

01:05:19.420 And

01:05:19.540 Now

01:05:19.680 He's

01:05:19.800 Looking

01:05:19.980 Over

01:05:20.140 The

01:05:20.300 Europeans

01:05:20.740 On

01:05:21.960 A

01:05:22.060 50%

01:05:22.600 Tariff

01:05:22.940 There

01:05:23.120 So

01:05:23.340 Maybe

01:05:23.860 There

01:05:24.140 Is

01:05:24.320 A

01:05:24.460 Method

01:05:24.720 To

01:05:24.900 The

01:05:25.040 Madness

01:05:25.520 All

01:05:25.960 Right

01:05:26.120 To

01:05:26.640 All

01:05:27.140 Hey

01:05:27.380 To

01:05:27.840 All

01:05:28.020 Three

01:05:28.240 Of

01:05:28.360 You

01:05:28.460 I

01:05:28.660 Say

01:05:28.840 Thank

01:05:29.140 You

01:05:29.260 Very

01:05:29.460 Much

01:05:29.680 I

01:05:29.780 Hope

01:05:29.880 You

01:05:29.960 Have

01:05:30.060 A

01:05:30.180 Great

01:05:30.460 Weekend

01:05:30.920 And

01:05:31.200 I'll

01:05:31.300 Talk

01:05:31.480 To

01:05:31.540 You

01:05:31.600 Soon

01:05:31.920 Thanks

01:05:32.840 Ben

01:05:33.060 Thanks

01:05:33.760 Take

01:05:34.100 Care

01:05:34.280 Say

01:05:47.960 Bells

01:05:48.660 And

01:05:48.900 Snow

01:05:49.420 Cinder

01:05:53.920 Cool

01:05:54.540 Blazing

01:05:55.400 Eyes

01:05:56.820 Some

01:06:01.860 Are

01:06:02.200 Bound

01:06:02.700 To

01:06:03.220 Fall

01:06:04.360 Summer

01:06:10.220 Winter

01:06:11.220 Song

01:06:12.220 Ah

01:06:16.220 Ah

01:06:18.220 Ah

01:06:20.220 Ah

01:06:22.220 Ah

01:06:24.220 Ah

01:06:26.220 Ah

01:06:28.220 Ah

01:06:30.220 Ah

01:06:31.220 Ah

01:06:32.220 Ah

01:06:33.220 Am

01:06:35.260 Ah

01:06:36.220 Ah

01:06:40.220 Ah

01:06:41.220 Ah

01:06:42.220 Ah

01:06:42.620 Ah

01:06:43.220 Ah

01:06:43.800 Ah

01:06:44.220 Ah

01:06:44.440 Ah

01:06:45.220 Ah

01:06:46.200 Ah

01:06:46.560 Ah

01:06:47.360 Ah

01:06:47.560 Ah

01:06:48.220 Ah

01:06:49.220 Ah

01:06:50.480 Ah

01:06:51.220 Ah

01:06:51.460 Ah

01:06:52.220 Ah

01:06:52.280 Ah

01:06:56.400 Thank you.

01:07:26.400 Say bells and sing, cinder corner raising eyes, some are bound to fade, some are winter sun.

01:07:56.400 Say bells and sing.

01:08:26.380 Say bells and sing.

01:08:56.360 Say bells and sing.

01:08:58.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:00.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:02.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:04.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:06.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:08.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:10.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:12.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:14.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:16.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:18.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:20.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:22.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:26.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:28.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:30.360 Say bells and sing.

01:09:32.360 Say bells and singing.

01:09:34.360 Say melody and sing.

01:09:38.360 Say and sing.

01:09:42.360 But I can't not remember it now

01:09:47.500 I made the best of what became a bad deal

01:09:56.820 I talk shit with the nurses

01:10:01.860 And clock a heart on a deep end drill

01:10:06.740 Can't be scared when you're asleep

01:10:11.420 For the first of the six weeks

01:10:14.820 I felt like I could barely speak

01:10:20.780 Of what I say

01:10:24.020 Anyway

01:10:41.420 I try to see the finish drop

01:10:53.920 But the light at the end keeps getting further out

01:10:59.960 But once again

01:11:02.400 It flippers and blinks

01:11:07.100 Just enough for me to get through it again

01:11:12.100 Another day

01:11:17.360 Another pain

01:11:19.960 But at the end of it

01:11:22.640 I think I'll be okay

01:11:25.360 I think I'll be okay

01:11:26.360 I think I'll be okay

01:11:26.760 I think I'll be okay

kinsellacast - May 24, 2025

KINSELLACAST 363： Whither thou goest, Murky Mark？ Lilley, Pierson, Mulroney, Lavigne, Harrison - plus Horsegirl, This Is Loralei, Soft Play, Bowie and more!

Episode Stats

Length

Words per Minute

Word Count

Sentence Count

Summary

Transcript