KINSELLACAST 409： Floor-crossers, big tents and more with Lilley, Belanger, Sa'd, Bennett - plus Sailor Honeymoon, Grauzone, Fad Gadget, Bloodhound Gang
00:11:53.020and you had a very big Liberal tent that was featured.
00:11:57.840You wanted to have a big liberal tent. And at the time, a lot of people were saying, well, you know, we represent all the point of views within the liberal caucus. Therefore, voters can find a reason to vote for us, whether they are more progressive or more conservative. And I guess it's working for Mark Carney right now.
00:12:14.680Is he biting off a lot of trouble, though?
00:12:17.400Is this something that he's going to regret?
00:12:19.500You know, Marilyn Gladue against, like in favor of conversion therapy and against abortion, against equal marriage for gay people in the same caucus as another person he got to cross over in a different way.
00:12:34.640Dolly Begum in Scarborough Southwest used to be the new Democratic provincial house leader or deputy leader.
00:12:41.060like how do those two people it's like two universes colliding in his caucus how does he do
00:12:46.940that yeah it will make for very interesting uh internal debate but the question is will he be
00:12:53.580able able to to impose some kind of discipline uh or would it be a free-for-all and we'll see that
00:13:00.460in the months to come uh because when there's a free-for-all when you have a situation where
00:16:26.940Now, it could be a minority government, which would create a very interesting dynamic in the National Assembly, because, you know, you would have two separatist parties, most likely represented, with Quebec Solidaire being the other one.
00:16:40.180And we'll see what happens with the Collision near Quebec.
00:16:42.860They're choosing the next premier this weekend.
00:31:01.860I mean, that's what you're saying, right?
00:31:02.960Yeah, that's exactly right. An investigation is needed. And, you know, surely there is a code of conduct for public service employees that would address some of beyond our one time encounter.
00:31:21.140There is a pattern that this particular person demonstrates that is just open hatred of people based on religion and ethnicity, not in a way that is even necessarily couched as disdain for particular political actors. Just open hatred.
00:31:44.000It was awful. And I'm sorry that you had to experience that, that kind of open racism and bigotry that came from this man at this performative prayer that was taking place. It's just appalling. But it, you know, more broadly, this is the kind of stuff that you've been seeing as you and your videographer have been documenting these events over the past almost three years, longer than that.
00:32:12.400um this is the kind of stuff that's happening more and more often and it it's a failure of
00:32:18.600in many cases of policing isn't it yes um i mean i i am so wary always about police policing
00:32:29.300language or feelings right yeah um so i don't know that it's entirely a police problem where
00:32:35.700the police have more to do is addressing bad behavior that is criminal in nature, mischief,
00:32:44.060intimidation, assault, etc., etc., that goes unchecked at protest. And I have seen sort of
00:32:51.080a slight change in approach over the past couple of months, maybe, with less tolerance toward that,
00:32:59.140But the problem already exists and has been normalized.
00:33:03.540The other side of this is it's a social problem because policing to a large degree, it kind of relies on all of us to follow the law.
00:33:15.180And the police can't be everywhere all the time.
00:33:19.740So the system is premised on most people doing right most of the time.
00:33:27.480And somehow the norms and values that are central to a free and democratic society are like, what's happening? Why are these dissipating?
00:33:42.980So it is a social problem, a cultural problem, a political problem, to the extent that you have politicians who encourage or endorse or fail to call out things that benefit them that are bad for society more generally.
00:34:02.540and more generally um i mean my view i think you know is that uh benjamin netanyahu bb as he is
00:34:12.600called is a terrible politician a terrible leader and needs to be removed from power by the people
00:34:21.320of israel hopefully that will happen in the vote in coming months and that's something that we
00:34:26.400touch upon in the documentary the campaign in which you were a big part um the polling which
00:34:35.080i pay close attention to and you don't maybe pay as much attention to because you're a normal human
00:34:40.780being you're not a weirdo like me is public opinion in the west is dramatically and swiftly
00:34:49.820moving against israel because of the conduct of the the war against iran and now the war
00:40:57.400Let's start with Marilyn Gladue crossing the floor.1.00
00:41:00.820I think it came as a bit of a surprise to people.
00:41:04.260What was your response when you first heard that Marilyn Gladue was joining the Liberals?
00:41:09.200Well, I know that a lot of Liberals are saying that the party is a big tent,
00:41:13.340but I think the big tent is in danger of becoming a circus.
00:41:16.240I just couldn't believe that they would consider Marilyn Gladue a suitable candidate for a member of their caucus
00:41:26.780I mean the Conservative Party disqualified her from running for leader themselves
00:41:31.180and she was an enthusiastic proponent of the convoy
00:41:35.800and basically all the stuff that has been damaging to the Conservative Party
00:41:41.380has now become part of the Liberal Party caucus
00:41:45.180So I was pretty surprised by that, that the prime minister apparently is so intent on getting a majority, he was willing to hold his nose and accept a member of parliament like this.
00:41:57.820Mark Carney also said that any MP who joins the caucus, the liberal caucus, must adhere to liberal values, including supporting choice for women and LGBTQ rights.
00:42:10.960What kind of a conversation do you think the Prime Minister and Marilyn Gladue would have had before this announcement?
00:42:18.240Well, you know, I encourage everybody to take a look at her Wikipedia entry.
00:42:21.980Like, it's not just abortion or equal marriage.
00:42:27.100You know, she voted in favour of conversion therapy, you know, which is considered a criminal offence in a lot of jurisdictions.
00:42:36.180And, you know, she just has a very bad record,
00:42:40.120which is why I know some Conservatives who had unease about her.
00:42:44.120So I guess in some sense they're glad that she's gone.
00:42:46.680But it does present a problem for Mr. Pollyov
00:42:49.300is he's got members of his caucus voting with their feet.
00:42:52.500And it certainly doesn't look like a lot of them are enthusiastic about his leadership.
00:42:58.220What does this say as well about, you mentioned the hopes, obviously,
00:43:03.840of the prime minister of getting a majority government
00:43:06.020that's, again, willing to accept somebody
00:43:32.520and I really don't understand the Prime Minister's motivation here
00:43:37.620other than attempting to acquire that majority.
00:43:41.300But on Monday, he was going to have the majority anyway
00:43:44.280because he is almost certainly going to win a by-election in Rosedale in Toronto
00:43:51.040and in Scarborough Southwest, also in Toronto.
00:43:54.960And he had an excellent shot at the riding at Terrebonne,
00:43:58.040which he's previously won in the province of Quebec.
00:44:00.900You know, so he would have had his majority. Why you would need to make a deal with somebody like Ms. Gladju is beyond me. But it certainly tells us a little bit about his desire to achieve that majority. Maybe he feels he needs this in order to deal with the Trump threat in a very, you know, unstable world at the moment. But it's not a good look to bring somebody like this into your caucus.
00:44:26.600And I'm glad you brought up the by-elections because I also thought that the timing was a bit strange,
00:44:32.620that these three by-elections are taking place on Monday.
00:44:36.000And as you said, very good chances of picking up at least two seats, which would put him into majority territory.
00:44:42.440So wouldn't it have made more sense to wait?
00:44:44.800And if things didn't go well with the by-elections, if he didn't get the majority there,
00:44:48.620then maybe reach out to somebody who he had to know was going to be extremely controversial when this news broke.
00:44:56.960Yeah, no, I think that's what he should have done.
00:45:51.140He needed to be, you know, stop being oppositional all the time, stop being Trumpy to the extent that he was.
00:45:57.500He's doing all of that stuff and he's not getting any credit for it.
00:46:01.100And I think members of his caucus have decided this guy is kind of politically dead man walking and they're voting with their feet.
00:46:08.420They're heading towards the Liberals. They're heading towards the exits.
00:46:11.340And it's not a good sign for Paul Yeo.
00:46:13.680I wanted to ask you as well about some other news that didn't get, obviously, as much attention as the crossing of the floor of Marilyn Gladue.
00:46:22.320But you posted about Katie Merrifield leaving her role as director of communications in Pierre Polyev's office.
00:46:30.680And I think you posted something saying that this was an even bigger deal than Gladue crossing the floor.
00:46:36.320What is what is the the takeaway or what do you read into the director of communications for Pierre Polyev leaving her role?
00:46:46.020Well, you know, full disclosure, she's somebody I know and I like her and I admire her.
00:46:50.560And I think that she's very smart and she's the person who is behind all of those things I just described.
00:46:57.460You know, more engagement with the media and going on Joe Rogan and smiling more and changing his image.
00:47:04.120The person who was principally responsible for that, along with Polya, was Katie Merrifield.
00:47:09.780And, you know, everybody in B.C. is familiar with her.
00:47:12.880She, you know, previously with B.C. United and B.C. Liberals.
00:47:16.800She worked for Premier Clark when the director of communications there.0.98
00:47:54.280He's talking about land claims and about court decisions that have raised some questions about private property rights.
00:48:01.100What does he need to do? Like you said, he had been advised about what he needed to do to better connect with people.
00:48:07.820There are still probably other Conservative MPs who are considering crossing, leaving, making some kind of move.
00:48:15.080What does he have to do, do you think, at this point to keep the party together or to keep his role as leader?
00:48:22.220Well, you put your finger on what I think the biggest issue they've got, and it's not just a threat, Paulie have.
00:48:27.900If someone, you know, under this so-called Reform Act that the Conservative Caucus has subscribed to, Michael Chong's Reform Act, where the caucus can vote out the leader, as they did with Aaron O'Toole, if that happens with Polyev, and I wouldn't necessarily be surprised in the coming weeks and months to see that happen, if the polls continue to be bad for him, I could see the Conservative Party of Canada splitting in half.
00:48:54.000So you have the Western kind of mainly reform base heading in one direction and the Central Canada progressive conservatives heading in another direction.
00:49:04.540And, you know, then that's 10 years of liberal government at that point, as there was previously.
00:49:11.260And like, you know, I'm not a conservative, but that's that's not good for the Conservative Party, but it's not good for the country either.
00:49:17.420We need a viable, you know, effective opposition to hold this liberal government to account.
00:49:24.000And presently, you know, we don't have that because once again, the Conservative Party is, you know, arranged itself in a circle and they're all shooting each other in places like the Toronto Star, no less.
00:49:34.620So, like, it's not a good look and it doesn't suggest to voters that these guys are ready for government when they're fighting with each other.
00:49:42.720Warren Kinsella, we will leave it there for today.
00:49:45.140As always, thank you for coming on the show and talking more about this.
00:54:13.740and we're back we're back with brian lilly and i'm on cheap headphones that i bought a canadian
00:54:35.560tire apologies for the audio and brian is in california and you can hear a californian bird
00:54:42.420chirping in the background. Is it wearing Birkenstocks?
00:54:47.260No. No, this year they'd be wearing like
00:54:50.580coca running shoes. Very trendy style of
00:54:54.520running shoes. Very active lifestyle down there in Palm Springs.
00:54:58.900Well, tell us about, let's just start things off. I mean, the big political,
00:55:02.400I mean, there's lots of big political stories, but I think the biggest one in the United
00:55:06.220States this weekend is that the leading
00:55:10.500Democratic candidate for governor in the state you're in is being is alleged to be a rapist0.99
00:55:18.100not just a sexual abuser but a rapist so tell us more about that yeah Eric Swalwell uh he's0.94
00:55:25.800someone who's been in Congress for quite a while now represents an area just outside of0.98
00:55:30.680San Francisco uh kind of Silicon Valley area down between San Francisco and San Jose he uh
00:55:38.420A bit of a rising star in the Democrat Party and what looked like he was going to secure the banner for Democratic gubernatorial candidates for later this year.
00:55:51.380Gavin Newsom, not running again, lots of speculation that he's got his eyes on running for the White House, where I think he'd be a threat to the Republicans.
00:56:00.680Despite not being super popular at home anymore, he's got a great national presence.
00:56:05.280So Swalwell, you know, he's 40. He's not quite 50 yet. He's fit, good looking, speaks well, and now four different women of sexual assault.
00:56:21.220You know, you should be cautious as a journalist on these stories, making sure that you're not just throwing out things that are not true.
00:56:30.780just look at the frank stronic trial in toronto where they've you know the judge i believe it's a
00:56:36.540female judge as well thrown out several of the uh cases against them saying you know they simply
00:56:43.500don't believe the the victim so you got to be careful but four women and he came out just on
00:56:50.220friday night with a video saying these are patently not true uh i'm going to stay in the
00:56:55.580the race i'm going to fight to clear my name but now there's a if that happens i think
00:57:02.460will lose because the next leading continues there billionaire climate activist he was he
00:57:13.120was key to shutting down the keystone xl pipeline despite making his billions in oil and gas he then
00:57:18.800turned around and decided to fight the oil and gas industry uh so canadians might remember him
00:57:24.720from that a decade ago he's just not charismatic um he's a boring finance guy and you've got on
00:57:34.480the republican side uh you know they're they've got their primary between steve hilton the fox
00:57:40.720news commentator immigrant from england he's been endorsed by trump and then i believe it's the
00:57:47.440sheriff of the county i'm sitting in um a former sheriff is running both of them are polling higher
00:57:53.920than any Democrat right now. Republicans haven't won a statewide office here since 2006. Trump
00:58:02.440did win Riverside County, which includes Palm Springs in the last election, which shocked
00:58:08.260a lot of people. So I think after so many years of uniparty rule, I think there's a
00:58:14.960bit of openness to saying maybe we try the other guys. But that would shock if that were
00:58:21.780to happen but swalwell was i mean he was positioning himself as a great democrat hope and he was
00:58:30.100trash talking trump all the time he was i'm coming for you guys i'm going to show you and now he's on
00:58:35.580his back foot with these allegations well lots of churn in american politics lots of churn up here
00:58:41.700too so there has been floor crossing there have been polls liberals are having their convention0.94
00:58:48.000this weekend so from your distant perch from afar what's your take on all of the crap that's0.72
00:58:54.320been going on in canadian politics this week they wanted maryland gladu0.60
00:58:59.700what come on does it doesn't the liberal party accommodate somebody who's
00:59:05.920in favor of conversion therapy and against gay marriage and um strong supporter of the trucker
00:59:13.400convoy uh she was courted by the guy that she got into the argument with about vaccine mandates on
00:59:19.440tv there's a clip that was going around all weekend or all week after her making comments
00:59:27.640about vaccines on evan solomon's show when he was still a tv host with ctv he's the guy that
00:59:33.440recruited her to come over um there is nothing that marilyn gladu stands for um whether it's0.89
00:59:41.000hanging out with 14-year-old prostitutes in Thailand,0.99
01:01:06.260I think I've mentioned this to you before, the law banning floor crossing was challenged in Manitoba when, oh, what's his name, the former Manitoba Premier Brian Pallister, he kicks Stephen, another former federal consultant, Stephen Fletcher.
01:01:29.560He kicked Fletcher out, and Fletcher just wanted to start his own new party.
01:01:33.440The way the law was written, he couldn't even start his own party.
01:01:36.820He challenged it, and the judge upheld it and said,
01:01:40.420no, this is legal, this does not violate your charter.
01:01:44.020It could happen, but turkeys don't vote for Christmas.
01:01:48.280The liberals aren't going to ban the lower crossing when they're winning with it.