Leo D.M.J. Aurini - May 18, 2014


The Difference Between Good Narrative and Great Narrative

Hosted by
Leo D.M.J. Aurini
Mentioned
Confused Matthew Koopa Troopers S.F. Debris Gargamel Koopas Mario Pixar
What are Martial Arts Films Do Not Underestimate Stupid People

Episode Stats


Length

16 minutes

Words per minute

136.3

Word count

2,275

Sentence count

262

Harmful content

Toxicity

21

sentences flagged

Hate speech

4

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

What's the difference between a good and bad narrative in a video game? In this episode, I talk about a point and click adventure game I played recently, and the problems it had with the narrative, and how to fix them.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
Hosts, guests, and mentioned names generated with spaCy (en_core_web_sm), reconciled against Wikidata.
00:00:00.000 Folks, I want to talk about the difference between a good narrative and a great narrative using a few different examples.
00:00:11.860 I think I'm going to pull from video games for the most part, because video games, especially the older video games, the narrative is such a challenge.
00:00:21.340 You know, it's on the surface, video games are about the mechanics.
00:00:26.940 Is the game fun to play?
00:00:28.440 And yet the difference between a good game that's fun and a great game that you remember 10 years later is whether they embraced the principles of narrative.
00:00:43.100 Specifically, there was a game I played recently, and I'm not going to specify because, well, quite frankly, the guy has produced, the group, I should say, the group has produced a ton of games.
00:01:00.260 They're not about to listen to me, and this would just come across as mean-spirited criticism.
00:01:08.260 So I'm not going to name names with this.
00:01:10.600 But it's a point-and-click adventure game, which, you know, when I'm hungover, I absolutely love those things.
00:01:15.800 And this particular game, well, let me tell you about the setting.
00:01:23.180 As a game, though, as a game, as a point-and-click adventure game, it is an excellent game.
00:01:29.240 Most of the things in it make perfect sense.
00:01:32.280 You know, they don't have the bizarre moon logic that is sadly on the present in many of these things.
00:01:38.260 The game makes sense.
00:01:39.520 You can intuit what the puzzles are.
00:01:42.780 It's fun to play in and of itself.
00:01:46.160 But where it really falls apart is in the overarching narrative of the thing.
00:01:51.780 Now, you might say, this is just a video game.
00:01:54.260 It's about the mechanics.
00:01:55.780 It needs to have good mechanics.
00:01:58.120 And if mechanics are good, then we can forget the narrative.
00:02:02.180 But again, that's the difference between a great game and a good game.
00:02:05.300 The setting of this game is that you are a kid wandering through the woods who ate some berries that made you shrink until you were, like, an inch or so tall.
00:02:18.260 And you have to go do a bunch of adventures for these weird, fuzzy, smurf-type people. 1.00
00:02:25.460 And then they'll give you the potion to get back to regular size again.
00:02:30.500 Yeah, it's a very artificial construct.
00:02:32.800 Very cheesy.
00:02:34.040 I don't know if I'd call it a trope exactly because it's not that common, but it basically is a trope.
00:02:42.400 Now, here's the problem.
00:02:44.400 Here are some of the problems with that narrative.
00:02:49.360 First of all, you're introducing this weird magical kingdom of furry smurf people without explaining what these people are exactly or where they came from or why we don't know about them. 0.98
00:03:01.960 You know, whereas the smurfs, the actual smurfs, it's kind of implicitly understood that they hide out from humans and Gargamel is the only person that knows about them.
00:03:12.980 Everybody else thinks he's crazy for believing in them.
00:03:16.100 So you've got that issue right off the bat.
00:03:19.160 Then you've got another issue.
00:03:21.720 One of the things you have to do is climb up a tree by nailing boards to it so that you have a sort of makeshift ladder.
00:03:28.420 Well, first of all, how are you climbing up a tree if you're one inch tall?
00:03:34.480 Second of all, where are they getting the nails?
00:03:37.340 Okay, do they have mines going on?
00:03:40.100 Like, they're only an inch tall.
00:03:41.600 To dig down to the point where they could find iron would be pretty difficult.
00:03:45.760 And, oh, so many problems with that.
00:03:48.400 It assumes a normal macrospective of reality.
00:03:56.580 And then, what really stood out to me was that one of the furry smurfs, they have a fire in their little smurf home.
00:04:10.820 A fire of wood built off of matchsticks.
00:04:15.940 Now, in a game like this, you obviously don't expect perfect realism.
00:04:22.040 But you do expect consistency, coherency.
00:04:26.500 Yet you need a believable world.
00:04:29.760 And matches?
00:04:32.040 Like, these are logs.
00:04:34.180 Logs.
00:04:35.120 Roughly the size of matches.
00:04:37.380 These are not going to burn a sustainable campfire for hours on end.
00:04:41.860 You know, I'm not saying that you need to do all the physics of this world, but you need to think about this world.
00:04:49.260 You need to actually create a believable, consistent reality.
00:04:56.780 And so, although the game is fun, figuring out these puzzles, it's ultimately quite disappointing.
00:05:04.080 Because you don't believe in the world.
00:05:06.700 The whole time that you're playing the game, you are aware of the fact that you're playing the game.
00:05:12.360 Now, let's contrast, let's contrast that game to Super Mario Bros. 1.
00:05:23.360 You know, you might not have noticed it, but every third world in Super Mario Bros.
00:05:30.220 was happening at night.
00:05:36.300 This is a, this is a, it's a significant feat of programming, but not a huge one.
00:05:43.160 You just change a few values.
00:05:44.680 You know, the greens become blues, the blue sky becomes black.
00:05:48.160 You know, every third world, you apply this variable to it.
00:05:51.560 It's not that hard.
00:05:53.080 But coming up with this idea, that is genius.
00:05:56.860 That is showing that you care about the narrative, about the world that you're describing.
00:06:04.340 Because what this implies, and, you know, as Red Letter Media says,
00:06:08.980 you didn't notice it, but your brain did.
00:06:13.100 What you are doing is going on a three-day journey to rescue the princess.
00:06:18.540 And there's other subtle variations you get.
00:06:23.760 For instance, the second time that you do the foothills,
00:06:26.700 it's either the second or third time,
00:06:28.960 the foothills are no longer made out of grass.
00:06:31.740 They're giant mushrooms.
00:06:34.800 Now, that took a fair bit of programming to put into this tiny cartridge with almost zero memory.
00:06:41.600 And yet they did it.
00:06:43.160 They added this element to enhance the world.
00:06:48.540 To make this world more three-dimensional.
00:06:51.480 To give it greater depth.
00:06:55.000 And so Super Mario Brothers, like, the mechanics of the game aren't that amazing.
00:06:58.640 Not that amazing nowadays.
00:07:00.260 They were revolutionary at the time.
00:07:02.260 But that's not why the game is so incredibly memorable.
00:07:06.100 That's not why Mario became the character that he is today.
00:07:08.800 The reason that the game was so memorable is because on the subconscious level,
00:07:15.260 they created a fleshed-out three-dimensional universe.
00:07:20.500 Using only two dimensions and absolutely...
00:07:23.740 Like, the only text in the game is that your princess is in another castle.
00:07:28.200 And yet they managed to create this fleshed-out physical world.
00:07:34.760 And it's all these little tiny details they put into it. 0.87
00:07:38.220 That the first seven Koopas you kill are actually fakers. 1.00
00:07:41.760 You know, it's a Goomba pretending to be Koopa. 0.94
00:07:44.160 Et cetera, et cetera.
00:07:44.860 They thought about this world.
00:07:50.000 Even though they're just making a platformer.
00:07:51.960 A simple, basic platformer supposed to be sold to kids.
00:07:56.560 And yet, they came up with this world with so much depth to it that it demanded sequels.
00:08:03.000 It demanded an exploration.
00:08:05.480 They made cartoon shows about this ridiculous video game. 0.68
00:08:09.440 Because they spent the time thinking about it.
00:08:18.300 You know, a good movie that thought about its plot was...
00:08:24.980 Was that Pixar film, WALL-E.
00:08:29.540 It thought about what it was doing.
00:08:33.760 Because there's this one scene in WALL-E.
00:08:36.620 And I'm going to have to credit SF Debris.
00:08:38.800 For noticing this.
00:08:41.420 But it's such a small, small little thing that matters so much to the movie. 0.84
00:08:46.400 When WALL-E, he's the dirty trash robot that's trying to clean up Earth. 0.61
00:08:50.900 And the humans have all flown away on their spaceships. 0.98
00:08:54.640 And they don't care anymore.
00:08:56.260 WALL-E shows up on the spaceship.
00:08:58.520 And everything's regimented.
00:09:00.080 Everything is iPod clean. 0.99
00:09:02.160 And WALL-E is just this dirty weirdo.
00:09:06.300 They get to the decontamination center. 0.86
00:09:08.800 And there's this obsessive-compulsive robot that cleans everything before it comes onto the ship.
00:09:14.840 And he runs into WALL-E.
00:09:16.020 And WALL-E is just a giant mess. 0.98
00:09:17.500 Because he's a garbage compactor robot.
00:09:19.580 Now, on the surface, this is just a silly little scene where the obsessive-compulsive robot keeps trying to clean the garbage robot.
00:09:31.280 And the obsessive-compulsive robot is freaking out.
00:09:34.500 He's having a panic attack. 0.84
00:09:35.700 Just a silly little one-joke slapstick scene. 0.91
00:09:41.500 Right? 0.89
00:09:44.560 Except, those jokers of Pixar did a little bit more with this.
00:09:53.560 See, even though it's just a slapstick scene, they introduced an element where the cleaner robot always traveled down specific paths.
00:10:04.080 These lines in the ground that were his official domain.
00:10:07.520 And WALL-E, because he doesn't understand, because he's, you know, he doesn't care.
00:10:16.280 He thinks for himself. 0.89
00:10:18.580 He thinks the whole cleaning robot's ridiculous. 0.73
00:10:20.740 And he just goes off in his own direction.
00:10:22.800 Doesn't even notice that there are lines on the floor that he's supposed to follow.
00:10:25.700 And after he leaves, the cleaning robot has this little moment where he's having a panic attack.
00:10:32.340 There's these dirty footprint, like, tracks going at a 45-degree angle.
00:10:37.980 And he's like, I'm not supposed to leave the line, and yet I'm supposed to clean.
00:10:42.120 What do I do with this dilemma?
00:10:45.540 And he cuts the Gordian knot.
00:10:47.700 He jumps off his line and starts cleaning up the 45-degree dirty tracks that WALL-E left.
00:10:53.740 And as S.F. Debris pointed out in his analysis of the film, this is the effect WALL-E has on everybody.
00:11:02.760 That WALL-E seems to break people out of their preconceived programming.
00:11:08.440 And that's what makes him into a hero.
00:11:10.980 It's not that he has superpowers, it's that he thinks for himself.
00:11:15.200 And by thinking for himself, he makes others think for themselves.
00:11:19.120 And they communicated all of that in this tiny little scene.
00:11:25.640 This slapstick, throwaway scene of WALL-E being dirty and the other robots not liking dirty.
00:11:33.560 They turned that into this broad, like, this character-driven, this tiny piece of the narrative.
00:11:42.280 It's building the universe.
00:11:46.260 It's the exact same thing as Super Mario Bros.
00:11:49.420 Nothing but a platformer game, you know?
00:11:51.240 Get some mushrooms, jump on Koopa Troopas. 0.94
00:11:55.160 And yet this silly, simple game aimed at children? 1.00
00:12:01.880 They gave a shit. 1.00
00:12:02.960 They added elements to make it even more. 1.00
00:12:10.420 And you didn't notice, but your brain did.
00:12:16.920 That's the difference between a great narrative and simply a good narrative.
00:12:21.240 You know, Transformers is a good narrative.
00:12:27.540 It has plenty of explosions.
00:12:29.400 It has characters you can relate to.
00:12:31.480 It has these arcs, you know?
00:12:34.440 Friends become friends, then they break out of friendship, but they become friends again.
00:12:39.060 It's got all of those basic building blocks.
00:12:42.580 Those basic tropes that make up a story.
00:12:46.420 And yet there's no greatness in it.
00:12:48.280 There's no profundity.
00:12:52.800 When they made Transformers, it was nothing but a vehicle for explosions and excitements and basic narrative.
00:12:59.860 They didn't think about these things.
00:13:02.620 They didn't take, like, yes, yes, Transformers should have just been a simple movie.
00:13:10.140 That's all we were asking for.
00:13:12.760 But they treated it as simple.
00:13:16.060 Contrast the movie Independence Day.
00:13:20.960 It is absolutely simple.
00:13:22.680 Absolutely a popcorn flick.
00:13:25.140 And, and yet, and yet.
00:13:29.560 That movie stands out to me.
00:13:31.560 Because there's one scene where the vice president, he's the villain.
00:13:36.360 He's the bad guy that doesn't believe that the protagonist,
00:13:39.460 Oh, this newfangled plan of yours will never defeat the aliens.
00:13:44.500 He's the, the antagonist amongst the humans.
00:13:49.320 And eventually he gets his comeuppance.
00:13:51.580 He's proven wrong.
00:13:52.860 The heroes show that they have the thing.
00:13:54.560 And I, I believe I'm quoting Confused Matthew here.
00:14:00.520 Let's give him credit where credit's due.
00:14:02.900 Uh, but this guy, this, this vice president who was the naysayer, who was negative, he was the bad guy.
00:14:09.720 It would have been so easy to turn this guy.
00:14:15.100 He could have found, Oh, now I'm going to side with the aliens.
00:14:18.820 You know, to give them one more point.
00:14:20.500 But no, no.
00:14:22.540 He realized he was wrong.
00:14:24.000 He admitted that they were right.
00:14:25.680 And instead of going for that, that cheap, you know, villain gets their comeuppance.
00:14:29.580 They could have, they could have gone the cheap route and turned him into a bad guy that sabotaged the mission
00:14:35.420 because of, because a human would sabotage the mission against aliens that were going to kill everybody.
00:14:40.400 But no, they, they went the mature route.
00:14:44.040 And they, they said, you know what?
00:14:46.520 Even though he was the antagonist, he's not really a bad guy.
00:14:49.880 He's actually a pretty good guy.
00:14:51.940 And now that you've convinced him, he supports your plan.
00:14:57.440 See, that's, that's courage.
00:14:58.760 That's thinking about it.
00:14:59.520 Even though you're just making bubblegum, you're just making candy.
00:15:04.200 You can still make really good candy if you think about it and if you care about it.
00:15:12.860 Caring about something.
00:15:15.320 Doing something that's worth it.
00:15:17.900 You know, like, even if it's bubblegum, it doesn't matter.
00:15:21.060 Approaching everything you do, like, it matters.
00:15:25.420 You know, even if you're making, you're making a Ford Focus.
00:15:28.240 It's not exactly a Lamborghini.
00:15:31.000 But, somebody's going to be driving that car. 0.99
00:15:34.340 So, why not give a rat's ass and make something good? 0.98
00:15:40.960 It might just be a Ford Focus. 0.99
00:15:43.020 It might just be a silly video game.
00:15:45.140 It might just be a popcorn summer blockbuster flick.
00:15:50.500 But, it's going to wind up being something beautiful in its own right.
00:15:56.440 Arrini out, folks.
00:15:59.120 One last reminder.
00:16:03.920 Today's the last day of voting for my short film, Lust in the Time of Heartache.
00:16:07.360 So, if you could spend a minute of your time, click the link below and go vote for it.
00:16:10.780 I'd be much obliged.
00:16:12.080 Thanks, folks.
00:16:12.620 I'd be not will be waiting for a short film.
00:16:14.640 Thanks.
00:16:15.160 Bye.
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