Louder with Crowder - Socialism is Evil | Change My Mind

00:00:00.000 Oh, I don't even know where I'm going!

00:00:13.000 What is this? Alright, hey!

00:00:16.000 Hey, I saw you on the Twitter!

00:00:18.000 Thank you! Thank you very much!

00:00:21.000 Good? Alright, how you guys doing?

00:00:27.000 Jeez! This is, as you probably know, this is not the show we expect...

00:00:33.000 Is that a dog? I thought I was going to be the biggest violation of code tonight.

00:00:39.000 Guys brought a Yorkie.

00:00:41.000 Okay, so, listen, it's obvious...

00:00:42.000 Hey, that light went out there, Naki Jaren, just so he...

00:00:44.000 Hey, Naki Jaren, everybody! He's here, he's going to help me.

00:00:48.000 So, hold on a second. Before I move on...

00:00:51.000 Oh, damn it. Some of you have seen my binder, but don't ruin it for the people behind you.

00:00:54.000 This is our first time doing a Change My Mind live broadcast.

00:00:58.000 Anyone know the topic of tonight?

00:00:59.000 It's a new topic. We've never done this before.

00:01:03.000 Can we unravel this and show it to the crowd before we get on the table?

00:01:08.000 All right. Let's get out and show it to the crowd.

00:01:10.000 Of course, anyone is welcome.

00:01:12.000 It is so... James, throw these people!

00:01:17.000 Socialism is evil!

00:01:19.000 What do you have to say about you guys?

00:01:27.000 Thank you so much. This is not the show we planned on doing.

00:01:31.000 Anyone here see the SMU show last week?

00:01:34.000 Yeah! How riotous it was.

00:01:36.000 Anyone want a show like that? Yeah!

00:01:38.000 Well, we couldn't because your campus officers actually wouldn't show up.

00:01:43.000 So, hold on a second. There's one who did show up today.

00:01:46.000 There's one who showed up. Let's give it up for Officer Stillerson.

00:01:49.000 Yeah! One who showed up, and there are some private security details out here who are off-duty officers, and just so you know, the same lieutenant who told them that no one would show up because there was no credible threat told these off-duty officers, you can't carry on campus.

00:02:04.000 Well, he called someone above the lieutenant's head, and he said, what's he doing?

00:02:08.000 You carry, and I quote, you carry your f***ing gun!

00:02:11.000 Yeah! And a lot of them are amongst you who you do not know.

00:02:19.000 So thank you so much. So there was a mix-up.

00:02:21.000 Obviously, we couldn't get out here and do the show that we wanted to do.

00:02:23.000 It was going to be kick-ass. We wanted to do this whole, like, SMU. But instead, we loaded all of our misfits into a bus and shipped them across country against their will.

00:02:32.000 Gross violation of labor laws.

00:02:35.000 We said, we can't do the big comedy show.

00:02:37.000 We'll come back and do it. But we can do one hell of a change my mind because all we need is a table, some coffee, and some good conversation.

00:02:42.000 Are we right? Right? Right?

00:02:45.000 Thank you, guys. And one guy just yelled, and weed!

00:02:48.000 What was that? And a pin. All right, first off, I can't see while I'm in here.

00:02:52.000 Is there anyone out there who disagrees and would like to change my mind on the idea, the premise that socialism is evil?

00:02:58.000 Okay, now, by the way, okay, we see one person.

00:03:01.000 All right, let's bring one person in to start.

00:03:05.000 Hold on one second, hold on.

00:03:06.000 No, no, no, hold on, hold on, hold on.

00:03:09.000 We've got to pick one person.

00:03:10.000 There's two hands going up.

00:03:12.000 Are you an actual...

00:03:13.000 Okay.

00:03:16.000 One second here. One second.

00:03:17.000 One second. All right. And this is why we had to downscale this.

00:03:20.000 But by the way, I appreciate...

00:03:21.000 We actually have the ability to see any leftist organization in the country and how many people show up.

00:03:26.000 And just so you know, every time there's an Antifa protest, unless they're stabbing Ben Shapiro with an axe pick...

00:03:32.000 Every time there's an Antifa protest or Occupy and they post something, we can actually tell you that on average about 8% of people who claim they'll be attending, attend.

00:03:40.000 Whereas here, this is the last minute, there was a cancellation, we said, hey guys, we're gonna be in the quad, and I think it's actually two to three times the number of people who said they were coming.

00:03:48.000 So you guys actually show up!

00:03:52.000 And I know that's hard because many of you have jobs.

00:03:54.000 So that's what we're going to be talking about tonight.

00:03:57.000 For those who don't know, this isn't a comedy show.

00:03:59.000 I know some people are saying, well, why don't you come here and do a lecture?

00:04:01.000 It'd be like having Alice Cooper play jazz piano at Carnegie Hall.

00:04:04.000 I don't do lectures. It's not fun.

00:04:06.000 But with this, the goal here is not to, by the way, just to argue.

00:04:10.000 It's not ad hominem. It's the opposite of cable news.

00:04:12.000 If someone disagrees with me, I want to sit down.

00:04:14.000 And we use a Socratic method to rationalize their position.

00:04:17.000 Now, I know a lot of you won't be able to see me or hear me, so I wouldn't blame you if you walk out.

00:04:21.000 Like I said, this was last minute planned.

00:04:22.000 We appreciate every one of you who is here.

00:04:24.000 But I would love to sit down with someone who disagrees with me.

00:04:27.000 And everyone here, by the way, I know how high energy you are.

00:04:29.000 But make sure you give respect to anyone who sits down and disagrees and give them the chance to make their argument.

00:04:36.000 So hopefully we can be productive.

00:04:37.000 Now, okay, Jared, who do we want?

00:04:39.000 Who do we want to grab? Who's grabbing who?

00:04:40.000 Yes, Jared! Alright, so people keep saying messenger bag.

00:04:44.000 So Mr. Messenger Bag, hold on one second, come on out.

00:04:46.000 One second, come here, come toward me.

00:04:48.000 We're going to have someone pat you down real quick. 0.97

00:04:51.000 You got one person you can pat him down?

00:04:54.000 Nake Jared, there you go.

00:04:57.000 I fulfilled my legal obligations.

00:05:00.000 Alright, listen, what's your name, sir?

00:05:02.000 Ian. Ian, Ian, brass balls.

00:05:05.000 Come sit down, appreciate it. Give me a round of a hand.

00:05:08.000 A round of a hand. I don't even know what that means.

00:05:11.000 All right. What was that?

00:05:14.000 Actually, by the way...

00:05:15.000 By the way, because I know many of you here are still reeling from your rejections from Northwestern.

00:05:24.000 Don't insult Urbana!

00:05:25.000 Come on, that's asking a sparrow not to sing!

00:05:29.000 Urbana champagne, as we call it, the gates of hell.

00:05:34.000 You're like Detroit without the balls to follow through.

00:05:36.000 All right. We're kidding, but DePaul actually has rescinded their decision, and we will be going to DePaul sometime next semester.

00:05:44.000 And I'm kidding. Urbana's the best city in America.

00:05:47.000 All right. So, I believe, hopefully people can hear me.

00:05:51.000 We're just going to sit down and go through this point by point to see where we find common ground.

00:05:56.000 It's the first time we've ever broadcast it live.

00:05:58.000 A lot of people say, well, we think maybe you edited our hand-picked opponents.

00:06:02.000 Hey, can someone actually grab some water here and give him a clothes bottle so that, you know, he doesn't...

00:06:07.000 It is a really nice mug.

00:06:10.000 Wait, you ordered one?

00:06:12.000 Yeah. Wait, that means you're a fan.

00:06:14.000 You can't come up here. No, no.

00:06:15.000 I still have thoughts. No, you still have thoughts.

00:06:17.000 No, get out of here. We have to have someone who actually disagrees.

00:06:20.000 You can't be a fan.

00:06:21.000 Who here actually disagrees with me?

00:06:23.000 I appreciate it. I appreciate it, brother.

00:06:25.000 It's not evil. It is evil.

00:06:27.000 You, this guy seems to be really eager.

00:06:29.000 Or this guy in the orange. All right.

00:06:34.000 Okay. Well, let's bring up the guy in the orange.

00:06:36.000 Sorry. Hey! I know, I know, but listen, we didn't plan on this.

00:06:41.000 We have no idea. We usually just show up and do it, and people want us to get out.

00:06:45.000 What's your name, sir? Alex.

00:06:47.000 Alex, are you old enough? Do you go here?

00:06:49.000 No, I go to Urbana High School.

00:06:51.000 Oh, Alex, we can't do high school.

00:06:53.000 Hold on a second, hold on a second.

00:06:55.000 If I do this with a high school student, next thing that's going to happen is they're going to Laura Ingram me and say that I mocked someone who's not of age.

00:07:01.000 Are you 18? No.

00:07:02.000 Your parents have to give you permission.

00:07:04.000 I can't actually film you.

00:07:05.000 I appreciate it, Alex. I'm sorry.

00:07:06.000 This guy. Come on, let's bring this guy up here.

00:07:08.000 I'm so sorry. This is the process.

00:07:11.000 We don't want to break the law because we only have one officer who showed up because that's all you need for a crowd like this.

00:07:20.000 Alright, what is your name, sir?

00:07:22.000 Yusuf. Yusuf, nice to meet you.

00:07:24.000 Steven. So, I believe, let me explain my position.

00:07:26.000 I believe that socialism is fundamentally evil.

00:07:30.000 And I have this here. We usually don't reference this, but it's sources in case someone wants to look at them afterward, but I don't think, I won't use it.

00:07:35.000 It's not fair for me to use them. So, I believe socialism is evil.

00:07:38.000 You disagree. I would love to hear you change my mind.

00:07:41.000 Okay, well, what's your position on the minimum wage?

00:07:44.000 Hold on a second. This is your changing my mind.

00:07:47.000 I want to make sure. Yes, I want to get started.

00:07:48.000 Okay. My position is the minimum wage.

00:07:50.000 Yeah. You know what? I'm not a fan.

00:07:52.000 So you think there shouldn't be any minimum wage at all?

00:07:55.000 Yeah, not a fan. Not a fan.

00:07:57.000 Okay. Are you against illegal immigration and legal immigration from poor third world countries at the scale that we've been having it so far?

00:08:04.000 Am I against illegal immigration?

00:08:06.000 What was that? We're gonna do everything we can.

00:08:09.000 Like we said, this is last minute because we're not necessarily friendly here.

00:08:13.000 No, I mean, they don't consider us friendly.

00:08:15.000 So like I said, we appreciate you supporting us.

00:08:17.000 Of course I'm against illegal immigration. 0.94

00:08:19.000 But again, socialism, I believe.

00:08:21.000 The idea of socialism, let's do this before we go on, okay?

00:08:23.000 Because this is something, and I think this is important, this is something that we often see from both the right and the left.

00:08:27.000 See, we started with the premise where I made a statement.

00:08:30.000 Socialism is evil. And you've moved on to different questions and different topics.

00:08:34.000 So I'd like to first, before we move on, if it's okay, let's define socialism.

00:08:39.000 Okay. How do you define socialism?

00:08:40.000 So I know that we're agreeing on that premise.

00:08:44.000 Socialism is a system in which the state redistributes wealth from what it would be under a pure capitalist system.

00:08:50.000 Okay. I think we agree on that. Okay.

00:08:51.000 And then I think it's important to...

00:08:52.000 Don't move! This is just an actual discussion.

00:08:55.000 I might be wrong here. And what do you think I mean by evil?

00:08:59.000 Or what would we both agree the definition of evil is?

00:09:03.000 Harmful to society. Not necessarily in society.

00:09:06.000 I believe morally reprehensible.

00:09:07.000 It's immoral, okay? So as we both agreed, socialism is basically a collective, a governmental control of the means of distribution or production.

00:09:19.000 And when I say evil, I mean I believe that that is immoral.

00:09:22.000 So can we both agree with that? I don't agree that it's evil.

00:09:25.000 No, no, no, but we agree that that's what I'm saying.

00:09:27.000 That's my position. Yes. Okay, so what part of my position do you disagree with?

00:09:30.000 Again, the goal here is to change my mind, not score points.

00:09:34.000 Well, I'm trying to convince you that your own objectives, if you're a conservative, cannot be achieved under capitalism.

00:09:39.000 Okay. And so I'll give you an example of that.

00:09:41.000 Yeah. You have a lot of Republicans like Paul Ryan who are obstructing Donald Trump.

00:09:45.000 Well, hold on.

00:09:47.000 Hold on. You cannot deny that he is a big capitalist and he has lots of capitalist donors that would like nothing more than to increase their profits.

00:09:55.000 I think you can agree with that. And people like that have been opposing immigration reform for decades because they believe that mass immigration will lower the wages of the working class and increase their profits.

00:10:06.000 Now, I would say a lot of what you just said is correct.

00:10:08.000 In that many conservatives, Republicans, believe that mass immigration from countries like, say, Mexico, from quote-unquote third-world countries, could lower the wages.

00:10:17.000 Yeah, I do believe that a lot of Republicans believe that.

00:10:20.000 So I would agree with you on that.

00:10:21.000 So if you impose a minimum wage, you're not going to have this mass immigration coming in because the companies that are taking these illegal immigrants and taking these low-wage immigrants, if they had to pay them $15 an hour, we wouldn't have mass immigration like we're having right now. 0.71

00:10:34.000 Yeah, I don't necessarily know that I agree with that premise.

00:10:36.000 So let me kind of go, because first off, I would like to take that, hold it.

00:10:41.000 What example would we point to before we go on?

00:10:43.000 Because I know a lot of times we disagree, of a successful socialist country.

00:10:47.000 Well, there are different kinds of socialism.

00:10:49.000 I think you're thinking of the Soviet Union and Venezuela when you say these are unsuccessful countries.

00:10:53.000 But you also have Sweden, you have Norway, you have Finland, you have Denmark, you have Germany.

00:10:57.000 These are countries that have robust economies and high levels of socialization.

00:11:00.000 Right. What's their minimum wage?

00:11:04.000 I don't have the numbers off the top of my head.

00:11:06.000 What if I told you that they have no minimum wage?

00:11:09.000 There are plenty of countries that have high minimum wage.

00:11:10.000 Australia has a high minimum wage.

00:11:12.000 I know, but we didn't talk about them.

00:11:13.000 We talked about successful socialist economies.

00:11:15.000 Now, first off, I think it's interesting.

00:11:16.000 This is important because we need to find the premise.

00:11:18.000 First off, we're away from the premise, which is the moral argument.

00:11:20.000 I believe socialism is immoral.

00:11:23.000 The redistribution of something that you have not earned, I believe, is fundamentally immoral.

00:11:28.000 I believe that's theft. Are you an anarchist?

00:11:29.000 Are you an anarchist? Hold on a second. Hold on a second. So now we've moved on from that to the pragmatic.

00:11:33.000 And no, I'm not an anarchist.

00:11:36.000 And then you brought up some successful examples in Denmark, Norway, Sweden, I believe.

00:11:40.000 First off, these aren't socialist countries.

00:11:42.000 Now, the reason we would point to countries like, say, Venezuela or Cuba, for the same reason Bernie Sanders did for decades, is because they're true examples of socialism.

00:11:50.000 The Danish Prime Minister said, Bernie, stop referring to us as a socialist economy.

00:11:53.000 We're a free market economy.

00:11:55.000 They don't have a minimum wage, as we know it.

00:11:57.000 They only allow collective bargaining between unions, higher skilled unions, and their employers.

00:12:03.000 So these are countries, by the way, if we want to get into their immigration laws, the only way to make it work, if you refer to those countries, I guess I would have to ask, it sounds almost as though you're making an argument, are you a nationalist?

00:12:14.000 I would say I'm an economic nationalist.

00:12:16.000 You are an economic nationalist?

00:12:17.000 Yeah. Okay, so there you go. So you part ways with a lot of probably your more left-leaning brethren.

00:12:21.000 I never said I was a liberal. Okay, so you're a conservative socialist.

00:12:24.000 They're hard to come by.

00:12:28.000 So, no minimum wage there.

00:12:29.000 But again, this doesn't change the idea.

00:12:31.000 Let's get to the fundamental premise before we move on to the pragmatic, and I'd be happy to.

00:12:34.000 But I believe that socialism, the ism that we both agreed upon, the collective means, seizing of distribution, production, is immoral.

00:12:44.000 I mean, the argument is absurd, because if you say that it's immoral, then you also have to say that government funding of police is immoral, government funding of the military is immoral.

00:12:51.000 Anything the government does is immoral, and that's ridiculous, because you have to have some state that's going to socialize certain things.

00:12:56.000 And so the question is not, do we have socialization?

00:12:58.000 It's how much. Sure. I would disagree with that.

00:13:02.000 Now, would you know where I disagree with that?

00:13:04.000 Guess what I'm going to say.

00:13:06.000 I assume you're going to try to argue that government funding of the military and police is not socialism.

00:13:11.000 Why would I say that? Well, because if you don't argue that, then you're going to have to give some ground on socialism.

00:13:17.000 No, absolutely. I think you're right.

00:13:18.000 If I have to concede that police force, as he's saying, police force, military, roads, is socialism, the same as healthcare, education.

00:13:27.000 And I'm assuming that's why you're referring to Denmark and Sweden.

00:13:29.000 They're not socialist economies, but they have more of a social safety net.

00:13:31.000 That's kind of what you're talking about, right?

00:13:33.000 Yeah, they're social democracies.

00:13:35.000 Well, they're market economies with higher emphasis on a social safety net.

00:13:40.000 That's how they describe it. That's what a social democracy is.

00:13:42.000 So, okay, we agree on the term.

00:13:44.000 Let's go with social democracy. I just want to make sure we don't get confused like democratic socialism is all that changes anything.

00:13:48.000 But we just talked about this conceding that ground.

00:13:54.000 I don't believe that the military and the police force would be the same as socialized healthcare school.

00:14:01.000 Why not? Sorry, because we only have one microphone.

00:14:03.000 We had to do a late setup. I appreciate you working with me.

00:14:06.000 Well, I mean... Why not? Why not was your question?

00:14:07.000 Our definition was that... So why not?

00:14:09.000 Okay, so I want to make sure you don't...

00:14:10.000 Why not?

00:14:12.000 Because there's a difference between a public good and a commodity.

00:14:15.000 Can you explain to me the difference between public goods and a commodity?

00:14:18.000 Well, in economics, a public good is a good that is, I believe, non-excludable and non-rivalrous.

00:14:24.000 Exactly. So that would include things like the police, the military.

00:14:29.000 You'd be hard-pressed to even find hardcore libertarians to say that we don't need those.

00:14:32.000 So there's a big difference. There's a fundamental difference between that And something like healthcare or school.

00:14:38.000 Or it goes to free internet, as Sven Computer talked about in Germany now.

00:14:42.000 High-speed internet is a right. The second you declare any commodity to be a right or to be a fundamental role of government, that means the government can now remove that right depending on who's in power, and that's the problem.

00:14:51.000 That's why I think it's fundamentally immoral for someone to take something they haven't earned, regardless of who's in power.

00:14:56.000 I think it's immoral for Donald Trump's administration to take it from you, just as you probably think it's immoral for Barack Obama's administration to take it from me.

00:15:02.000 So the difference there would be first, public goods versus commodity.

00:15:06.000 And I think that's an important distinction for everyone here to make because it's a common argument we hear from the left.

00:15:09.000 If you support any role of government at all, that means that this is socialism.

00:15:13.000 But it's not according to the definition that we agreed upon.

00:15:16.000 Something else I think it also matters is the constitutional parameters of government, right?

00:15:21.000 The Constitution defines what our government is and what fundamental human rights are.

00:15:26.000 Well, I want to get back to your earlier point where you said that because the military is a public good, that therefore it's not socialism.

00:15:32.000 In your definition, you never made any distinction between different types of goods.

00:15:35.000 You just said a socialist economy is one that takes wealth from some people and gives it to others, and that's what financing a public good is.

00:15:41.000 No, no, it's not. You talked about redistributing, the redistribution, the common means of production or distribution.

00:15:48.000 So, if we want to frame that in, I certainly wouldn't say that that's the police.

00:15:51.000 Oh, someone's yelling.

00:15:53.000 Hopefully we're good. So I would not agree with you if the military or police would be socialist.

00:15:58.000 But to move on here, again, let's go to the Danes, Denmark, Norway, Sweden.

00:16:05.000 You pointed to them as successful examples of socialism.

00:16:08.000 Because that would be different from your definition of socialism.

00:16:10.000 So now I've moved on from the idea that taking something you haven't earned to give to someone else is morally reprehensible, regardless of the reason, because socialism can only be enacted through the threat of violence.

00:16:19.000 That's really what taxes are.

00:16:20.000 At the end of the day, we all agree on that.

00:16:23.000 Violence is part of life. Okay.

00:16:25.000 Well, I don't believe there should be a part of life for someone with guns to come in if I don't pay for Timmy's healthcare.

00:16:30.000 I just disagree with that. If you don't pay taxes, you're going to have other forms of violence that arise spontaneously.

00:16:35.000 This sort of autistic libertarian idea of, oh, you can have a non-aggression... 0.90

00:16:40.000 Stop it! Stop it! 1.00

00:16:41.000 He's been watching Matt Damon videos.

00:16:42.000 Continue. This idea of a non-aggression principle is just fantasy.

00:16:47.000 Okay? You have to have some...

00:16:48.000 You just said autistic.

00:16:50.000 And this was very civil until you brought that up.

00:16:53.000 Define autistic here.

00:16:55.000 Well, it tends to be characterized by an overemphasis on logic and philosophy as opposed to reality.

00:17:05.000 You know, it's very easy to argue from syllogisms and axioms and all that.

00:17:08.000 So hold on a second. I want to make sure. Before you move, because what you do is you speak in these paragraphs.

00:17:12.000 We need to determine what these definitions are.

00:17:14.000 I think we both agree that's fair. Fine.

00:17:15.000 Okay. So you just said that autism, if I'm not mistaken, And I would love for you to bring this up, is rooted more in philosophy and theology than facts?

00:17:25.000 Than logic or reason?

00:17:26.000 Logics, syllogisms, that sort of thing.

00:17:28.000 That's what you believe is the definition of autism?

00:17:31.000 Well, because it leads you down these intellectual...

00:17:33.000 No, no. Do you believe that's the definition of autism?

00:17:35.000 No. No, you don't. I'm using it in an informal way.

00:17:37.000 Okay, so you're using it in an insulting way.

00:17:39.000 You could say that. Okay.

00:17:40.000 A little bit of banter. A little bit of, yeah.

00:17:41.000 Well, we don't call that friendly banter, generally.

00:17:43.000 We call that being a dick. So I want to go back to hopefully keeping it civil.

00:17:49.000 I wouldn't call you retarded.

00:17:51.000 I wouldn't say that you had a fight with the Clippers and the Clippers won.

00:17:53.000 I wouldn't do this. Let's keep this very civil.

00:17:57.000 So let's go back to Sweden, Denmark, Norway as examples.

00:18:00.000 You pointed to them as successful examples of socialism.

00:18:03.000 It was interesting to me that you said, I know you'd want to point to the USSR or Venezuela or these places, but really we should look to these Scandinavian countries.

00:18:10.000 Why? Because they provide a good quality of life for their citizens.

00:18:14.000 You don't have this gigantic gap between the working class and the upper class.

00:18:18.000 There is a commitment of the state to the well-being of their citizens, and I think that's a wonderful thing.

00:18:23.000 Okay. So, first off, I agree with you that, first off, the overall well-being of citizens is a tremendous thing.

00:18:29.000 I think we would all want, I think everyone here wants a better society, wants a better America.

00:18:33.000 I don't think that you want a worse America.

00:18:35.000 I hope that you don't believe I want a worse America, despite the fact that you implied I might be autistic.

00:18:39.000 So maybe I don't know what's best for America.

00:18:42.000 You know, autistic and such.

00:18:45.000 Keep your hate speech off this campus.

00:18:47.000 But your reasoning there, and correct me if I'm wrong, you said there isn't the same kind of gap, the inequality gap.

00:18:55.000 That was your, I want to get, because you speak in, like I said, in longer paragraphs, it seems the fundamental premise there was Denmark, Norway, Sweden, their examples, because they're successful, they have a higher Quality of living and the main purpose, the main justification you used was there's less of an inequality gap.

00:19:10.000 Am I correct? I don't want to misrepresent you.

00:19:11.000 Yes. Okay. So your problem is with inequality.

00:19:15.000 It's one of several problems.

00:19:17.000 I think another problem when you have...

00:19:18.000 But that was your first issue.

00:19:19.000 Let's go point by point. Okay.

00:19:20.000 Fair enough. Inequality. What's immoral about inequality?

00:19:25.000 Because there's this idea that you're going to have this society and everybody has social obligations, but If you have a situation where people are being crushed, where people's wages are going down, you lose the social cohesiveness of that society.

00:19:39.000 You lose the commitment that everybody has to advancing that society.

00:19:42.000 Now you're getting into potential results.

00:19:45.000 The hypothetical, almost autistic one could say.

00:19:48.000 But I ask again, what is immoral about inequality?

00:19:53.000 What's immoral is that it ruins the society.

00:19:54.000 That's what's immoral about it.

00:19:56.000 How does inequality ruin society?

00:19:58.000 Because it sounds to me, if I'm not mistaken, what you just went down to describe was a problem with poverty.

00:20:03.000 Yeah. So your problem is with poverty then.

00:20:06.000 But poverty is a consequence of inequality.

00:20:09.000 That's not necessarily true.

00:20:11.000 As a matter of fact, I would argue that there are two very different things.

00:20:14.000 Because I would say, and I think we'd probably have to agree, that the free enterprise westernized capitalist system has pulled more people out of poverty than any system in existence.

00:20:22.000 And if you look at countries, you said don't point to countries like Venezuela or true socialist economies.

00:20:26.000 There's tremendous equality, but everyone is equally poor.

00:20:30.000 So the problem you have is with poverty, it sounds like.

00:20:33.000 And I think we both have a problem with that, that we want to solve ways to eliminate as much poverty as possible.

00:20:37.000 It's not just poverty. Inequality matters too.

00:20:40.000 Because if you have inequality of wealth, you're going to have an upper class that controls the political system and secures its own interests instead of the interests of the people.

00:20:48.000 So yes, inequality matters as well.

00:20:50.000 Okay. So, describe to me, and I'd like to go back to that, examples of this.

00:20:54.000 The upper ruling class determining the political system.

00:20:57.000 Do you want examples of that? Yeah, I would like some examples of that.

00:21:00.000 For example, let's say you mentioned that inequality hurts people.

00:21:04.000 I would argue no, and I think that's because, again, this is more of a leftist view.

00:21:07.000 I know you said you're not really liberal, but I can tell you by your worldview in economics that you do lean more left because you're seeing it as a zero-sum game.

00:21:13.000 Wealthy people can't get wealthy off of the backs of poor people if they make them more poor.

00:21:17.000 That's kind of, if we're going to talk about motives and attributing motives that you've done a couple of times here, if I believe that, if I want everyone to be wealthy, I would necessarily, if I need a system of government that would want people to be wealthy, it would require people to be wealthy.

00:21:32.000 For someone who would want to control a system of government like in socialist economies, who would want to consistently talk or gain the votes of the poor, they could only be elected if people are poor.

00:21:42.000 Bernie Sanders is not going to be elected by a rich country.

00:21:45.000 We're not trying to make everybody rich.

00:21:46.000 That's not possible. We're trying to create a fairer distribution of wealth.

00:21:49.000 But I want to get back to your earlier question about how are the wealthy controlling the political...

00:21:53.000 Well, yeah, so an example of that.

00:21:54.000 I don't believe that inequality necessarily hurts someone.

00:21:56.000 I don't believe it's a zero-sum game. You know, for example, Tim Cook.

00:21:59.000 And I don't like Tim Cook, by the way.

00:22:01.000 Apple people, Android, they're going to start yelling.

00:22:04.000 Tim Cook creating a better iPhone, even though the iPhone X kind of sucks.

00:22:09.000 Thank you. That's where we get the passion.

00:22:10.000 That doesn't hurt me. Him making billions of dollars for that doesn't hurt me.

00:22:13.000 Poverty. Bread lines.

00:22:15.000 $160 for a dozen eggs.

00:22:17.000 That hurts me. I have a problem with poverty.

00:22:19.000 I don't care if someone else has more than me, so long as I have a system where I'm able to do okay.

00:22:22.000 Do you understand that it's the upper class and the capitalists that want mass immigration and want illegal immigration because it's in their economic self-interest?

00:22:29.000 If you're a Republican and you're with the capitalists, you're going against your own interests.

00:22:32.000 The capitalists are not conservative.

00:22:34.000 They're not. Well, honestly, we're talking about capitalists, conservative, Republican here.

00:22:38.000 So you're saying that capitalism, we're talking about the ism now, socialism versus capitalism.

00:22:41.000 I don't care what Paul Ryan does in his own time.

00:22:43.000 I don't care what his front page news press is doing P90X and what he thinks about immigration.

00:22:47.000 I couldn't care less. I don't believe, it seems that you would agree in securing the borders.

00:22:52.000 You would agree in stricter immigration laws.

00:22:54.000 I would. And you're not going to get it if you shill for the capitalists.

00:22:58.000 They're against you. Define shill. 0.90

00:23:03.000 I know you like to sound really intelligent by speaking in paragraphs.

00:23:05.000 One thing, you've misused words several times.

00:23:08.000 And if someone were to call you on it and be as rude as you are, you might look what you might refer to as stupid.

00:23:13.000 So saying autistic or shill.

00:23:16.000 Define, because it's a very specific definition.

00:23:17.000 You came in and just said shill.

00:23:19.000 And I'm really quickly ready to give the microphone to someone else if you don't stop doing this, because this isn't the goal of this.

00:23:24.000 What's a shill? Well, I think you're getting upset because you're losing the debate.

00:23:28.000 That's fair, that's fair.

00:23:30.000 What's a shill? No, no, no.

00:23:32.000 The person losing the debate is the one who refers to the other person as autistic and a shill.

00:23:36.000 That's generally a good sign.

00:23:38.000 So what's a shill? I don't have the exact definition, but essentially someone who's, I guess...

00:23:45.000 Pushing or advancing somebody else's interests, I suppose.

00:23:47.000 For profit. Fair enough.

00:23:49.000 But a lot of these conservatives who...

00:23:50.000 Well, you're not talking to these conservatives who are talking to me.

00:23:52.000 This isn't a performance hall here.

00:23:54.000 That's why we're doing this out here. This is a conversation.

00:23:56.000 You're talking to me. I just said that I'm against illegal immigration. 0.95

00:23:58.000 It's okay. You can look me in the eyes.

00:23:59.000 I'm not mad at you. I just think it's rude.

00:24:01.000 It's okay. Don't worry. We're okay.

00:24:03.000 I'm used to people being rude to me.

00:24:04.000 I'm sure you're probably aware of this to one degree or another.

00:24:06.000 Let's move back to, again, Norway, Sweden.

00:24:08.000 We didn't really kind of go to that. You've talked about them as successful examples.

00:24:12.000 Now, And I would agree.

00:24:14.000 I would agree that if we're going to take a model and say they've created a social safety net that functions better than many other countries.

00:24:22.000 For example, socialized healthcare and education.

00:24:25.000 Yeah, what's wrong with that? Good.

00:24:27.000 Well, like, so you would support school vouchers.

00:24:30.000 I think, you know, in general vouchers I think have a problem because they do lead to the incentivization of private schools.

00:24:36.000 But any way that the government...

00:24:37.000 That's what Sweden does.

00:24:39.000 So you would support more of a flat tax and increasing taxes on the middle class and the lower class?

00:24:45.000 I want a progressive tax. Okay, well that's not what happens in Denmark.

00:24:48.000 They should change it. Okay, so you would want a lower corporate tax rate.

00:24:53.000 Not necessarily. Okay, so here's the one thing.

00:24:55.000 We point to, and I appreciate you taking, what was your name again?

00:24:58.000 Yusuf. Yusuf. I appreciate Yusuf taking the time.

00:25:00.000 Everyone give a hand to Yusuf.

00:25:01.000 Appreciate it very much. We'll grab someone else here.

00:25:02.000 Thank you, Yusuf. This is always interesting to me because we talk about this a lot, and I know, and if we look here, just so, I think we've talked about this, we're going to be actually selling for like five or six bucks.

00:25:14.000 I'm not looking for New York. We're going to be selling the Change My Mind pamphlet so that you guys can actually be prepared for some of these arguments.

00:25:19.000 Right here on page three, I actually have, if anyone here, you know what, kind of like a magician.

00:25:23.000 Oh, you have a MAGA hat. Can you come here really quickly?

00:25:26.000 What are the words written down right there?

00:25:29.000 Denmark. Denmark?

00:25:32.000 Sweden. And?

00:25:33.000 Norway. And Norway.

00:25:35.000 So, if you guys know where people are going to try and direct the conversation, you don't get distracted by words like, you know, autistic or shill, which is what they throw out, you can be prepared very often for how people disagree.

00:25:47.000 Now, here's the thing. To provide a brief education on Denmark, Sweden, and Norway, I didn't think that was going to go anywhere super productive.

00:25:54.000 They made their wealth long before they became what you would call socialist economies.

00:25:59.000 Now, by the way, they're not socialist economies.

00:26:01.000 The Danish Prime Minister, when Bernie Sanders was saying, we should be like Denmark, socialist, he said, shut up!

00:26:07.000 He said we're a free market economy, and we place emphasis on social safety, which they are now scaling back.

00:26:13.000 Here's what's so interesting there.

00:26:14.000 If you look, they have far lower corporate tax rates than the United States.

00:26:18.000 Does anyone know the corporate tax rate here in the United States?

00:26:20.000 The marginal highest tax rate?

00:26:21.000 Yes. 35%, but now it's 27 with the tax tax.

00:26:24.000 It would go down to, yes.

00:26:25.000 The marginal rate, I believe, was up as high as 39.

00:26:27.000 Yeah, 39.

00:26:29.000 I think it's 35, but the marginal highest tax rate was 39%.

00:26:31.000 And in Norway, Denmark, Sweden, I think the highest they have is 25.

00:26:35.000 Some of them have it as low as 22.

00:26:36.000 So a good 10 points lower.

00:26:39.000 So they have corporate taxes low.

00:26:40.000 I think if you're comparing it to the United States, if you make 1.2 times the average income, so in the United States, that would be $50,000.

00:26:47.000 If you make $60,000, you'd be paying 60% income tax.

00:26:51.000 So what they do is they understand that they can't stifle businesses, so they have lower corporate tax rates, and the United States doesn't sound very socialist, and they have increased taxes on the middle and lower classes.

00:27:01.000 They pay more taxes. Everyone pays something.

00:27:04.000 By the way, super strict...

00:27:05.000 Well, it's changing, but at one point, super strict immigration laws.

00:27:08.000 Not everyone gets to take part in the social safety net if you haven't paid in.

00:27:11.000 And again, these are people who have the population about the size of Ohio or Michigan.

00:27:17.000 So to compare an entirely homogenous population...

00:27:20.000 To a country of 300-something million people.

00:27:22.000 By the way, I'm against illegal immigration, but the big difference between us and Denmark and Norway and Sweden is we're not a people.

00:27:28.000 We are a country of ideals.

00:27:30.000 And if you're willing to come in and make a go of it, we're going to provide you with equal opportunity, not ensure equal outcome.

00:27:35.000 That's the difference that requires a racial national identity and a constitutional republic.

00:27:42.000 So ironically, socialism almost invariably tends to be racist.

00:27:46.000 To a certain degree.

00:27:48.000 Which is funny when we say national socialism, democratic socialism.

00:27:51.000 Theft is theft.

00:27:53.000 If it's ill-gotten gain, something you haven't earned, theft is theft.

00:27:57.000 Something else I also find very interesting.

00:27:58.000 And I was talking about this. I just wanted to bring this up so you could see that these are things you can prepare for.

00:28:02.000 These are very common arguments.

00:28:04.000 Very interesting. If we take that kind of cultural, social fabric of Denmark, Norway, Sweden.

00:28:09.000 So take them. They do have a higher standard of living on average than the average American.

00:28:13.000 But if you take the Danes who are in America, if you take Swedish-Americans, if you take Norwegian-Americans, they actually have on average a 55% higher standard of living index than the Swedes in Sweden!

00:28:25.000 So it's because they've brought a culture with them.

00:28:27.000 Again, if you look at the very storied culture of hard work ethics, of personal accountability, of shame, they do better there, and they do far better in the United States than even in their homeland.

00:28:37.000 You get people who have that work ethic, who have that kind of cultural fabric, who have that history, and you give them a free enterprise system, my god, watch them bloom.

00:28:45.000 But I appreciate, I forgot his name, Yusuf, thank you very much.

00:28:47.000 Does anyone else want to disagree?

00:28:50.000 Yeah, Yusuf, yes, alright.

00:28:53.000 I see, balls of steel, thank you, Yusuf.

00:28:55.000 And by the way, I do mean Yusuf does have balls of steel to sit down and do this.

00:28:58.000 I have a tremendous amount of respect for anyone who enters the arena.

00:29:02.000 Yeah. I hear some people yell.

00:29:05.000 I don't want to yell anyone down.

00:29:07.000 Like I said, this is not the show that we wanted to do.

00:29:11.000 We'll bring that back through. We've never done this.

00:29:13.000 Usually a change of mind is sitting down with a couple of people, not a few hundred people out there in a quad, with a don't tread on me flag.

00:29:21.000 Looks like the Patriot.

00:29:23.000 He's going to be hitting someone with a tomahawk.

00:29:25.000 Yes, Pink Floyd shirt, I guess.

00:29:27.000 You have your hand up. Now, you're not a fan, correct?

00:29:29.000 Well, I just wanted a hand.

00:29:31.000 No, no, we can't do that.

00:29:33.000 We've got to have people who disagree.

00:29:34.000 I appreciate it. Yes!

00:29:37.000 I can't see. Could you pat him down?

00:29:40.000 Hold on, let Naki Jared pat you down, Mr.

00:29:42.000 Illinois. He's not gay, so it's okay. 1.00

00:29:44.000 It's okay. Thank you.

00:29:49.000 I love you too. Like I said, I'm really...

00:29:51.000 Thank you guys so much for hanging out.

00:29:53.000 We appreciate it. I know it's not what we planned to do.

00:29:55.000 Cheap pin? Someone, I don't know what this is, but I know someone's going to complain about it, so I'll have to look at it later.

00:30:03.000 I can't wear a pin.

00:30:05.000 Someone hands me a pin, like, wear it, so I can put it on, and anthrax.

00:30:09.000 I have no idea. What's your name, sir?

00:30:11.000 I'm Drew. Drew? Nice to meet you, Drew.

00:30:14.000 Appreciate it. So, again, like I said, I believe that socialism, the ism, socialism, is fundamentally evil.

00:30:20.000 Okay. Immoral. And if you disagree with me, and you think you can change my mind, I'm open to you.

00:30:25.000 Can you elaborate just a little bit on, like, evil?

00:30:27.000 Like, what do you mean by evil? I mean, immoral.

00:30:29.000 Immoral. Okay. Well, actually, I wrote a paper on this a couple years ago, and I mean, I'm not an expert by any means, but...

00:30:38.000 Why'd you bring up the paper?

00:30:40.000 What? Oh, okay, alright, alright.

00:30:42.000 I'm kind of an expert!

00:30:45.000 But I think that, based on research from past countries, That capitalism is great when a country is trying to get back on its feet.

00:30:57.000 But I think once you kind of, I don't want to say peak as a country, but economically, Once you kind of reach that stability and like you feel like your economy is thriving, I think then there should be a shift towards socialism, but not, I don't think a full-blown like socialism reform, socialist reform by any means.

00:31:16.000 But I think, like, I would...

00:31:18.000 So how would you define socialism?

00:31:19.000 Because I wouldn't go full-blown, so I want to make sure we know what we're agreeing on.

00:31:22.000 I mean, it in a sense is a redistribution of wealth, but not to the extent of communism.

00:31:27.000 Okay, so here, well, sorry, my right, your left, here's anarchy, here's communism, Here's free enterprise, here'd be socialism, and here'd be kind of the middle?

00:31:37.000 Yeah. Okay. We agree.

00:31:40.000 I just want to make sure. Because a utopian capitalist economy is anarchy.

00:31:44.000 A utopian socialist country is communist.

00:31:50.000 So I'm not as far as the communist side.

00:31:52.000 Although I think both of us could probably- I have no idea what- I know now they're teaching in school anarcho-communism.

00:31:57.000 Have you heard of this? Uh-uh. It seems redundant, doesn't it?

00:31:59.000 Yeah. I know, people told me I was the idiot because I was like, that doesn't make sense.

00:32:02.000 Yeah, that's totally stupid.

00:32:03.000 Look, we found common ground! Yeah.

00:32:05.000 It's very rare nowadays.

00:32:06.000 Yeah, I did a video saying, there, look, common ground!

00:32:09.000 And by the way, you seem very friendly.

00:32:10.000 I appreciate you being respectful.

00:32:12.000 So, again, this is one thing that I find pretty common with the Change My Mind.

00:32:17.000 And I think this is important because we have changed quite a few minds with this segment.

00:32:21.000 A lot of people have come back and said, hey, you know what, I didn't think about this before, or I hadn't looked at it from that angle before.

00:32:26.000 The premise and addressing the premise is important.

00:32:28.000 If someone fundamentally, and that's why it's framed this way, believes that something is evil or immoral, If you don't get them off of that, you have almost, you know, if I can't convince the mother, I have no hope of convincing the child.

00:32:39.000 I mean, I'll go on 34th Street. Anyone know?

00:32:40.000 No? All right. So, because they're doomed to a life of fear, dominated by doubt.

00:32:46.000 Anyways, movie quotes. I could go on all night.

00:32:47.000 Sorry, this is very rude of me. The point is, if you don't change my mind on the idea that it's immoral, because you said, I think once a country establishes itself, then they can kind of shift towards socialism, but not full-blown socialism.

00:32:59.000 So, let me, I guess, frame it this way.

00:33:02.000 I believe it's immoral to take something that you haven't earned.

00:33:05.000 Theft is the felonious taking of something that is not rightfully yours.

00:33:10.000 We would agree on that. So taking something that isn't yours is immoral.

00:33:15.000 I believe socialism is immoral because it's theft.

00:33:19.000 Now, how does that change if an economy is more stable or less stable if it's theft?

00:33:25.000 Exactly. I get where you're coming from with that.

00:33:29.000 I think the money that's being redistributed is going towards things that everybody can use.

00:33:38.000 Because I honestly, like this is coming from, I'm very left on this issue, not very, but I'm pretty left on this issue, and I think welfare is very abused.

00:33:46.000 But I think it is needed, um, to some extent.

00:33:49.000 And I think that, I mean, that goes hand in hand.

00:33:50.000 Like a battered housewife who won't leave her husband, like, okay, I'll make the roast! 1.00

00:33:54.000 Okay, well, yeah, alright, alright, alright, yeah.

00:33:56.000 It's abused, but it's needed.

00:33:58.000 That sounds pretty, you would understand how that sounds pretty dark.

00:34:01.000 People take advantage of it.

00:34:02.000 I would agree with you.

00:34:03.000 But... I think some people do need it.

00:34:05.000 I've met people that do need it.

00:34:08.000 But I think there's...

00:34:09.000 I'm getting off track here, but...

00:34:11.000 No, no, that's okay. Can I address this?

00:34:13.000 Because you said some people do need it.

00:34:14.000 And I don't disagree with you that there are people in this country who could use a leg up.

00:34:17.000 Exactly. So people... I would actually even go, let's remove the people who abuse welfare because we agree.

00:34:20.000 Look, common ground! I wish it was that easy.

00:34:22.000 Yeah, I know, but let's remove that from the argument, because we already agree, right?

00:34:25.000 Exactly. Let's talk about the people who would actually, let's say, legitimately need welfare.

00:34:29.000 So people we would both agree on.

00:34:30.000 I'm glad. See, this is a productive discussion.

00:34:33.000 You don't call me a retard. Again, let's take this as an example.

00:34:38.000 You see, because they really need it.

00:34:39.000 So, let's say I... Let's use an example of something I think people could all agree on.

00:34:45.000 The kids with cleft palates could probably use the $20 in my pocket far more than I can, right?

00:34:50.000 Exactly, yeah. And there are charities that provide fixes to this. 0.96

00:34:54.000 Yes, exactly. So, if you were to punch me in the face repeatedly, you know, go bam, bam, bagel on me and headbutt me and take my $20 and give it to a charity that helps kids with cleft palates...

00:35:06.000 Would that be moral? Would it change the fact that you Bam Bam Bigelow'd me and took my money? 0.86

00:35:10.000 No, I mean, I wouldn't. But I mean, the process is much different than punching somebody in the face with socialism.

00:35:14.000 Not all that different. Well, yeah, I understand where you're coming from totally.

00:35:17.000 That definitely makes sense.

00:35:19.000 I think... So if we agree that something is immoral, and it seems that we both agree theft is immoral...

00:35:24.000 Yeah, I agree. It doesn't change regardless of the need.

00:35:27.000 Yeah. So it comes down to, really, you'd have to present the argument, to change my mind here...

00:35:33.000 How socialism, how the redistribution, I see it as theft, is in fact moral.

00:35:38.000 Because it seems like we're both agreeing that it's not really moral.

00:35:41.000 Yeah. Yeah, I definitely get where you're coming from.

00:35:43.000 I'm glad you're, um, I mean, kind of changing my mind in a sense.

00:35:46.000 Hey! Hey! 0.97

00:35:48.000 Drew, was it? Yes.

00:35:50.000 Thank you, Drew. Look at that.

00:35:51.000 I want you to keep talking, though. This is great.

00:35:52.000 Now, by the way, you're changing my mind because now I realize that far leftists who write papers on socialists aren't dicks!

00:35:57.000 Hey! Hey! But, can we agree?

00:36:01.000 Alright, so I would say the U.S. economy, to make a rough estimate, is around 80% capitalist and maybe 20% socialist.

00:36:08.000 Just if you had to give percentages.

00:36:10.000 You know what, here's one thing. I don't know percentages, but I would agree with you that certainly the United States as it exists today is not a true free market economy.

00:36:17.000 We do have certain welfare states.

00:36:19.000 Exactly. My goal isn't to go even the majority socialism.

00:36:24.000 It's just, I think that a more shift, maybe like a 30-70, 60-40.

00:36:29.000 You know, 60% capitalism, that is, and 40% socialism.

00:36:33.000 I just want, I don't want a full-on socialist.

00:36:35.000 I just want a little bit, you know, a little bit more, like, more...

00:36:39.000 More taxing, more redistribution.

00:36:41.000 I'm not fully socialist reform, like, you know, let's overthrow any sort of...

00:36:48.000 So let's reduce kind of the comparison.

00:36:49.000 It sounds to me like, let's say instead of punching me, you pickpocketed me.

00:36:52.000 I wasn't looking. So you didn't hurt me, but you still took the $20 and gave it to the kid with cleft pallets.

00:36:57.000 That's the example of 60-40 versus 80-20.

00:37:00.000 Is that any more moral because you think it might be better, pragmatically speaking?

00:37:05.000 No, yeah, I agree with you on that point.

00:37:08.000 Have you heard? I guess we agree that socialism is immoral, the idea of socialism.

00:37:14.000 It seems like we agree on that, as we define it.

00:37:17.000 Yes. Okay, well, I appreciate that.

00:37:19.000 See, look, we agreed on something.

00:37:21.000 You said, maybe I'll concede this territory.

00:37:23.000 And now I would like to give you an opportunity, since you're well-spoken and very respectful, to go to the pragmatic.

00:37:28.000 I think that's also an important component.

00:37:30.000 It doesn't change the premise, but I would love to give you an opportunity, because I think you can probably articulate it well.

00:37:36.000 So I think the hard part about socialism also is you're always going to have an asshole dictator that's going to take over and try to make a communist because he wants it all.

00:37:45.000 Like Bernie and Jane Sanders.

00:37:49.000 Oh, that gets an ooh?

00:37:50.000 Shut up! But there have been cases where they have worked, but it's on a very small scale.

00:37:57.000 So we're talking small communities.

00:37:58.000 Everybody knows each other. A lot of people don't feel bad stealing from the poor guy if you don't know him.

00:38:04.000 But if you know the neighborhood drunk, that was just like a...

00:38:08.000 I don't understand.

00:38:11.000 It has worked on very small communities.

00:38:15.000 Could you give me some examples of where socialism, I guess, has outperformed what free enterprise has created with America today?

00:38:21.000 Because that's the standard I'm using, right?

00:38:23.000 I come from a socialist province, Quebec.

00:38:25.000 I wouldn't say an example of it working very well.

00:38:27.000 The French are assholes. No, there's definitely very bad examples. 1.00

00:38:31.000 I think Venezuela was mentioned earlier.

00:38:33.000 Sure. But I'm not going to talk about the Norway, Sweden.

00:38:36.000 That's already been done. Let me ask you this, honestly.

00:38:39.000 Before that guy left, were you planning on talking about Norway and Denmark and Sweden?

00:38:42.000 Well, my friend has a girlfriend who lives in Denmark.

00:38:45.000 Give me a yes or no first.

00:38:47.000 No, actually. Okay, good.

00:38:48.000 I was more focused on the percentages when I was telling you about Blake.

00:38:51.000 Okay. But, no, he has a girlfriend in Denmark, and I think the car sales tax is, like, above 200%, and that's outrageous to me.

00:38:59.000 I think that's, like, that's insane.

00:39:01.000 Oh, that's one more thing, actually, I should add that's very interesting, because probably if you wrote a paper on this, one thing, too, that people understand, not only is the income tax significantly higher in the middle and lower class, but the value-added taxes, these, you know, we call them VAT taxes here, those obviously impact consumers on a scale, which people would say, you know...

00:39:16.000 Here in the United States, Bernie Sanders, Hillary Clinton, they're very much against value-added taxes because they negatively affect consumers and the middle class more than the billionaires because how many yachts can you buy?

00:39:26.000 That's a huge component to the centralized economy in Denmark.

00:39:31.000 I'm glad you brought it up. I have firsthand experience with this, and I think they have one car for their whole family, which is not heard of in America.

00:39:42.000 But it encourages public transportation more.

00:39:44.000 It encourages, I think, more green.

00:39:47.000 We're not going to talk about that. Hold on a second.

00:39:49.000 You're using the word encouraged because you're a very nice man.

00:39:52.000 Yeah. If someone can't afford even a piece of shit car because of a 200% tax, encouraged to ride the subway is a little bit of a...

00:40:01.000 80% of campus, pretty much.

00:40:02.000 I mean, we all ride the bus here. That's because you're all poor and don't work jobs yet.

00:40:05.000 Exactly. I'm guessing you guys aren't necessarily recreationally choosing Urbana's luxurious public transit.

00:40:13.000 Oh, it's great. I love it.

00:40:16.000 So, again, discouraged.

00:40:17.000 So now we're talking again about the government being a moral arbiter of what behavior is acceptable.

00:40:22.000 Yeah. That to me is immoral.

00:40:23.000 Yeah. No, I agree with that too.

00:40:25.000 Okay. Yeah, I don't know where I was going.

00:40:28.000 I was talking about the small colonies that are working, but I just think it can never work on such a large scale.

00:40:34.000 That's why I'm not for a total reform.

00:40:37.000 I think it's just better, just a little shift.

00:40:39.000 It doesn't have to, you know, I think just progress towards a more...

00:40:42.000 Even though you agree that it's fundamentally immoral?

00:40:46.000 I think to be totally socialist is fundamentally immoral.

00:40:50.000 To take something you haven't earned is immoral.

00:40:52.000 Yes. You're talking about the pickpocket thing, which, I mean, that's a good way of putting it.

00:40:56.000 I agree with that. Sorry, go ahead.

00:41:01.000 Pickpocketing isn't the same thing to me.

00:41:04.000 I'm having a hard time articulating it, but I understand what you mean with the pickpocketing and the punching.

00:41:12.000 And the punching, and the kicking, and the screaming, and that you're autisticing. 0.87

00:41:16.000 Socialism is violent. Socialism is violent, and that's why anywhere you see true socialism, like you said, it runs into becoming a violent regime very quickly.

00:41:25.000 Which I think a lot of it has in fact to do with military.

00:41:30.000 Military and, like, dictator interference.

00:41:33.000 Well, that's another... A couple... Okay, two points now, and then I'd like to leave it here, because I think we've agreed on quite a bit.

00:41:37.000 Two points that you just brought up. You said, you know, well, I don't necessarily know that it's immoral.

00:41:40.000 Sorry, I know I'm touching your knee. It's just because I have to get the mic.

00:41:42.000 It's kind of cute. I like it. Is it kind of cute?

00:41:44.000 You're kind of cute. Not kidding.

00:41:45.000 Jared was... He was making eyes at you.

00:41:49.000 So one thing we talk about, you're like, well, maybe kind of if we redistribute it, when we get to a certain point...

00:41:55.000 Let's just say you don't agree with the pickpocketing or the punching example.

00:41:59.000 This is something I've never, and Thomas Sowell has talked about this, I'm not bringing anything new, so please people, I'm not ripping it off.

00:42:04.000 I know that these are not new arguments.

00:42:05.000 I've never understood why it is considered moral for someone to take money from someone else, that someone else has earned.

00:42:14.000 And I think maybe you can help me with this, but it's immoral for me to want to keep money that I've earned.

00:42:19.000 Yeah, no, that totally makes sense.

00:42:20.000 And I think...

00:42:22.000 Because that's what socialism is. Yeah, maybe my views will change when I'm making bank and I don't want anybody to take, you know, any money from me.

00:42:28.000 But, I mean...

00:42:31.000 As of now, I know what it's like to be a college student, a poor college student, and have parents that are helping me pay through college.

00:42:38.000 It would just be nice to have a little bit more of a break with that kind of stuff.

00:42:43.000 Listen, I agree with you.

00:42:44.000 Here's the thing. I agree with you, and I would actually like to see college be much more affordable.

00:42:49.000 I would like to see you do very well in this country, and I do believe that your views will change.

00:42:52.000 Statistically, they're very likely to change, especially considering how open-minded you are and how civil you've been.

00:42:57.000 I really, really appreciate you, Drew, sitting down very much.

00:43:00.000 Thank you. I just think...

00:43:03.000 See, this is a good example.

00:43:05.000 I'm glad we broadcast this live.

00:43:07.000 Would you say this is probably a more productive discussion?

00:43:09.000 Oh, no, this is great. This is, like, I love having conversations with people who have different views of me.

00:43:12.000 But would you say this is more productive than, say, like, Yusuf?

00:43:14.000 Oh, I caught the tail end of that.

00:43:16.000 But, yeah, I mean, from what I caught, that was probably more productive.

00:43:18.000 Yeah, the tail end is a good way to describe it.

00:43:20.000 Yeah, I definitely feel like...

00:43:22.000 I don't know. You changed my mind on some aspects.

00:43:24.000 I feel like I also made you see that like, you know, not everybody that's kind of more left is just a bad person.

00:43:29.000 Well, yes. Well, I don't believe that everyone who's left is a bad person.

00:43:32.000 Yeah, I know. What I do believe is that you're, I do believe your premise is incorrect.

00:43:36.000 And I do believe that then if we get to the pragmatically speaking, which we didn't really get to because it sounds as though you're kind of acknowledging on a grand scale it couldn't work.

00:43:43.000 I just think it's important to leave this conversation knowing that I understand you want what's best for America.

00:43:48.000 You understand that I want what's best.

00:43:49.000 Yeah. We disagree, and here I've given you something to think about, and I appreciate you taking the time to do it.

00:43:53.000 Yeah, definitely. Thank you, Drew.

00:43:55.000 I appreciate it, brother. Someone's yelling at him.

00:44:01.000 Someone's yelling at him. What?

00:44:02.000 What? What? What? Max, I don't know.

00:44:05.000 Hold on. Don't come up behind me like that.

00:44:10.000 All right, someone's going to pat you down, Max.

00:44:14.000 Hold on a second. Ho, ho, ho, ho! 0.99

00:44:17.000 Wait, wait, wait! Johnny boy, pat him down.

00:44:23.000 This guy yells, he's fine.

00:44:24.000 I'm gonna take your word for it.

00:44:26.000 The guy who gave me the pin. Max.

00:44:27.000 Max, nice to meet you, Max.

00:44:29.000 I appreciate it. Gosh, you were just chomping at the bit.

00:44:31.000 You just rudely elbowed some girls and came right on in. 0.98

00:44:34.000 I do not mean to be rude or anything.

00:44:36.000 That's not me. Okay, well, that's not me.

00:44:39.000 Alright, well, thank you. I think now we're just saying names.

00:44:44.000 Radicals! No, that would be socialism. 1.00

00:44:48.000 You can't have my water. Alright, Max, I believe that socialism is fundamentally evil.

00:44:53.000 Right. If you disagree and think you can change...

00:44:56.000 And then, by the way, after this, we'll move on to another topic.

00:44:58.000 Who'd like to do, actually, in this climate...

00:45:00.000 What? No, no, no. Hold on a second.

00:45:01.000 We're going to do the gun topic.

00:45:03.000 Pro-gun. Yeah! That seems like a crowd of people who like guns.

00:45:10.000 I know Max, but you can't take every...

00:45:12.000 Alright, hold on, calm down.

00:45:13.000 Max sat down. So I believe that socialism is fundamentally evil.

00:45:16.000 We don't have a ton of time on this, and we'll move on to guns with someone else.

00:45:18.000 Change my mind. So, I have some reservations about it.

00:45:22.000 I would not consider myself a full-on socialist.

00:45:24.000 That being said...

00:45:25.000 Nobody who sits down, by the way, does here.

00:45:27.000 That's what's so interesting. Everyone's kind of like hedging their bets.

00:45:30.000 It's kind of like that friend in high school who no one...

00:45:32.000 You want someone to be his friend.

00:45:35.000 You wish that he had friends, just not you.

00:45:36.000 So you're like, oh, he's not really my friend.

00:45:39.000 Full on, but kind of.

00:45:40.000 That's socialism, it seems, to everyone on this campus.

00:45:43.000 But I think dismissing all aspects of it as evil is guiding us away from some important policies that can be enacted.

00:45:50.000 Okay, well first off, I haven't disregarded all aspects of it.

00:45:54.000 I'm talking about the premise, the fundamental premise, the ism of socialism, right?

00:45:57.000 Isms are important. Right. So, I guess let's let you define.

00:46:00.000 Sorry, I know it's not ideal.

00:46:01.000 We just showed up and we appreciate everyone who's here.

00:46:03.000 If you can't hear me, I apologize.

00:46:04.000 The stream will be up online tomorrow.

00:46:06.000 I really do apologize. Again, thanks to the security who did come here to make sure we could do this tonight.

00:46:15.000 And we will try and come back.

00:46:17.000 So, I disagree with the fundamental premise.

00:46:20.000 For people who think, he said all aspects of socialism.

00:46:23.000 The ism is what matters. 1.00

00:46:25.000 So socialism, let's define that.

00:46:27.000 We've done it with everyone else. How do you define socialism?

00:46:30.000 So, you know, I wouldn't say there's a concrete definition.

00:46:34.000 You know, talk to various people.

00:46:35.000 You get various definitions. Let's go with the dictionary.

00:46:39.000 Right. So I guess you could argue that it is the communalization of the means of production, the socialization of the means of production.

00:46:47.000 Hold on a second. Hold on a second. This is very important.

00:46:49.000 And this is one thing I know when I went to college and I see them doing it more and more.

00:46:53.000 It's okay to say you would presume this, or maybe one might presuppose and talk about your arguments and opinions.

00:46:58.000 But there are certain things that aren't arguments or opinions.

00:47:01.000 There are certain things that are facts.

00:47:03.000 I think we have to agree on that. So I can't go with you down that trail if you say, I suppose you could argue that the definition you just gave, if you could repeat it and say we agree that's socialism, then we can have a conversation, because I'm not arguing what it is.

00:47:15.000 Well, what do you believe socialism is?

00:47:16.000 You said you're not quite socialist.

00:47:18.000 I want to know how you define it.

00:47:19.000 You just defined it in a way that I think we would agree on.

00:47:22.000 Can you redefine it?

00:47:23.000 Okay, sure. I believe that socialist leaning policies are ones that attempt to socialize means of wealth.

00:47:32.000 Means of production or distribution.

00:47:34.000 Wealth, means of production, distribution.

00:47:36.000 Those are your words. I just want to make sure.

00:47:39.000 Socialism is the means of socializing or the collective ownership taking or control of means of production or distribution.

00:47:47.000 Correct? Okay, hold on. We're going to have some time.

00:47:49.000 Don't worry. I just want to make sure we agree on that.

00:47:50.000 Yes, for sure. Okay. And I believe that that is immoral.

00:47:54.000 Definitely. Now remember, you were sitting down to change my mind.

00:47:57.000 Right. So that's the premise.

00:47:59.000 That's not all the tenetism.

00:48:00.000 That's the ism. We agree on the ism. 0.90

00:48:01.000 I believe it's immoral. Definitely. Okay, go ahead.

00:48:03.000 So what I wanted to say is that I think that, you know, blanketing these statements that socialism is as evil is driving our society away from A couple of beneficial policies.

00:48:14.000 One of them, I believe, is guaranteed basic income, which is an economic system that's been proposed by capitalists, by socialists.

00:48:22.000 Basically what it would do is it would change the welfare state as we know it, where everybody would be guaranteed a certain amount of income.

00:48:30.000 This would be around the poverty level.

00:48:31.000 So we're guaranteeing everybody, you know, like shelter, food, Clothing, however, it would create an incentive for free market enterprise at the same time and create an incentive to work, an incentive for people to get out and profit.

00:48:43.000 I don't think he was yelling at you.

00:48:45.000 I think he's just drunk on a Thursday.

00:48:47.000 Okay, can I address that? Yeah, certainly.

00:48:49.000 Go ahead. He said I'm a communist?

00:48:54.000 Alright. I think he must have been talking to you.

00:48:57.000 So, here's one thing that you just said, I think it would be to sort of eliminate this through the idea that it's evil, would be to not acknowledge the virtues, I guess you said, the beneficial economic effects, economic benefits of socialism.

00:49:12.000 Again, this is really important because it comes back to the idea that it's evil.

00:49:17.000 So, for example, many people in Germany argued, especially after the Treaty of Versailles, they would say, well, Hitler was great for the economy. 0.60

00:49:24.000 Does that change his idea of national socialism?

00:49:29.000 That's a total false equivalency.

00:49:31.000 No, it's not. The idea is what he did immoral if it had beneficial effects for the economy.

00:49:35.000 But he blamed it on certain classes of people.

00:49:38.000 That's not what people who promote socialist policies do.

00:49:42.000 So who would you blame the inequality problem on today?

00:49:44.000 Well, the inequality problem is dealt by problems with With, I guess, the rich.

00:49:52.000 The rich! The upper class! 0.94

00:49:54.000 See? It's a different classism.

00:49:56.000 Hitler's, you know, we say the 1%, Hitler said, the Jews! 0.75

00:49:59.000 So, the point is, no, no, it's not a false equivalency.

00:50:03.000 The point is, it doesn't change the fundamental morality of the policy, regardless of how beneficial it is economically.

00:50:11.000 I'm not saying it's rich people's fault.

00:50:14.000 I'm saying that that's where you get the wealth disparity.

00:50:17.000 But before that, as you said, it's to deny the economic benefits.

00:50:20.000 If the act that would drive economic benefits, for example, you're probably taught in school that the United States was built on the backs of slavery.

00:50:27.000 I don't agree with that, but you've been taught that, right?

00:50:31.000 I mean, that's a touchy subject.

00:50:33.000 I'm not going to get into it. Okay, so people say...

00:50:36.000 Let's agree that the United States has, let's say, built the backs off of slavery, right?

00:50:40.000 The Chinese built... There were definitely immoral acts committed with slavery. 0.87

00:50:43.000 I couldn't agree.

00:50:44.000 Okay, so let's say there are economic benefits to enslaving people.

00:50:48.000 There certainly are for some people.

00:50:50.000 It still goes on across the Islamic world.

00:50:52.000 Today, it still goes on because there are beneficial economic effects to certain groups of people.

00:50:57.000 Does that change the fact that slavery is immoral?

00:51:00.000 I'm kind of confused with how this can relate back to the topic that we're talking about.

00:51:04.000 Let me be really clear. Socialism is immoral.

00:51:08.000 Okay. Your point?

00:51:10.000 That's my only point.

00:51:11.000 And you're here to change my mind, and you're like, well, I'm disregarding that it's immoral.

00:51:15.000 What if Z? But it does matter if it's immoral. 0.86

00:51:18.000 How do you get socialism out of slavery?

00:51:20.000 No, the point is they're both immoral, regardless of economic impact.

00:51:24.000 The benefit of something doesn't change its inherent morality.

00:51:27.000 We used this example before. If I steal, I can steal money, and I can use it to go get hookers and blow, or I can steal money and I can give it to Bono's charity, which actually is a horrible example because Bono's charity gives less than 1% of charity.

00:51:38.000 That's not what I'm advocating for. Well, it is.

00:51:40.000 That's what socialism is. Well, I'm advocating for universal basic income, which is a socialist policy.

00:51:45.000 How do you provide it? Well, you provide it by taxes.

00:51:48.000 How do you get taxes? Tax people's income?

00:51:52.000 How do you do that? The IRS? What if I don't want to pay income taxes for universal income?

00:52:00.000 I mean, you go to jail.

00:52:02.000 You have to pay taxes.

00:52:03.000 That's a fact. And that is?

00:52:08.000 What do you want me to say to that?

00:52:10.000 That is the forceful taking of something that you have not earned.

00:52:14.000 That's the definition of theft.

00:52:16.000 You've just described theft.

00:52:17.000 But surely, I mean, you talked about this with someone earlier.

00:52:22.000 There are necessary goods that need to be provided via taxes that wouldn't be provided because of a free rider problem.

00:52:30.000 In this case, you can link that back to the universal basic income.

00:52:33.000 It provides goods that some people can't afford normally.

00:52:37.000 Again, we're going back. I think you're jumping around here, and I think we're about out of time.

00:52:41.000 We're going to do the gun argument. Because if I say that socialism is evil, and you grant that, well, maybe it is, but some people really need that theft to occur.

00:52:48.000 That's not what I'm saying. Well, that is what you're saying.

00:52:49.000 No. So you don't believe that threatening someone with jail, if they don't pay additional taxes to take their money...

00:52:56.000 It's not additional. It's not additional taxes. It's overhauling the welfare state system that we have in the status quo.

00:53:01.000 Okay. So how much is enough?

00:53:03.000 Wealthy people in America today pay about half.

00:53:06.000 What's the number? What's the moral number?

00:53:08.000 The moral number of a percentage that they should pay?

00:53:11.000 Well, I think it's important to audit where our money is going first and then evaluate how much it would cost for a universal basic income.

00:53:19.000 After that, you talk to the economists and you decide what would be an appropriate income tax level to provide for a universal basic income.

00:53:30.000 So, I mean, I'm not an economist.

00:53:31.000 You don't have those numbers?

00:53:32.000 I'm not an economist, so I don't.

00:53:34.000 I haven't heard of any legitimate economist who's argued that it would work.

00:53:37.000 What was your name again? I'm Max.

00:53:39.000 Max. I appreciate it, Max, because, again, if we both agree on the premise, you haven't changed my mind as to the fundamentalism of socialism.

00:53:46.000 Thank you, Max. I appreciate it. You can give the floor to someone else.

00:53:47.000 Thank you. You know what, Naki, Jared, let's change this to the firearm argument, the pro-gun change.

00:53:52.000 We have that, right? Do we have that banner?

00:53:55.000 Yeah. I don't know who the radicals are.

00:53:57.000 Are there radicals here? Hold on one second.

00:54:02.000 We are going to change...

00:54:03.000 What was that?

00:54:06.000 Okay, hold on. I got it by knock it here in three minutes.

00:54:08.000 So we're going to go with the next topic.

00:54:10.000 I'm sure you've seen this before.

00:54:11.000 Who here is pro-Second Amendment?

00:54:12.000 Woo! 0.99

00:54:13.000 That's so good!

00:54:16.000 Okay, so, pro-Second Amendment.

00:54:20.000 This is one, obviously, it's a hot topic right now.

00:54:23.000 You have a lot of high schoolers who are making the rounds.

00:54:26.000 And I know it's unpopular to say, I don't think that people should be determining policies, certainly as it relates to fundamental human rights, on an emotive response, regardless of whether they're 16 or 96.

00:54:37.000 I'm pro-Second Amendment.

00:54:39.000 For those who don't know, I was raised in a country where there is no Second Amendment, Canada.

00:54:43.000 There is also no First Amendment.

00:54:45.000 So when I came here, I shot my first gun.

00:54:49.000 I love this!

00:54:51.000 Alright? Kind of violates the principle of civil dialogue and changed my mind.

00:54:57.000 Denigrating an entire nation of people.

00:54:59.000 But the truth is Canada's pretty silly.

00:55:03.000 And so this is an issue right now that is, I think, particularly for a lot of people here, particularly, obviously, as we're talking about today, here at the school, you know, listen, we want to do this big show that we did, like, at SMU here, and we can't do it without security to ensure the security of the audience and the security of the venue.

00:55:17.000 And this is also something, before we get into the second event, so it's very near and dear to our heart, because many members of our team have had restraining orders or they've had serious security threats where, I won't say who, but some of them do have to carry.

00:55:28.000 Maybe I have to carry. Who knows?

00:55:29.000 I don't know anyone here whether you have a carry permit or not.

00:55:32.000 Isn't that the wonder of it?

00:55:34.000 Roll the dice. Let's see if you win the lottery.

00:55:37.000 So it's an issue, obviously, that's near and dear to my heart.

00:55:41.000 And I also think it's important to see kind of the bias by omission from the left that you see on campus.

00:55:48.000 It's one thing to just ban somebody on campus.

00:55:51.000 And it's another thing to make it impossible to bring in certain speakers.

00:55:54.000 It's another thing to make it impossible for people to come in and do what they've planned to do.

00:55:59.000 This right here is not ideal.

00:56:02.000 Yeah, we wanted to bring in like an SMU who had a fog machine and light shows.

00:56:06.000 My half-Asian lawyer, Bill Richman.

00:56:07.000 Who knows Bill Richman? Tranny Bain showed up.

00:56:11.000 It's a lot of fun. It's a stage performance.

00:56:13.000 We wanted to be the funnest party on campus.

00:56:15.000 Sven Computer was there, BP. Sven is an intern.

00:56:20.000 Sven is working home base to stream right now.

00:56:22.000 As a matter of fact, hi Sven. I think he's doing the live tweeting.

00:56:24.000 Hi! But this is something that's important.

00:56:28.000 The constant change, and it relates back to the Second Amendment.

00:56:31.000 With the campus, the reason that we did this is because we ran into a lot of roadblocks.

00:56:35.000 We knew it couldn't be safe.

00:56:36.000 We knew we weren't able to do the show we wanted to do last minute.

00:56:39.000 I think we're going to be doing it at A&M, if I'm not mistaken, later in April.

00:56:42.000 We'll be broadcasting that. We already taped some sketches and some segments and have some guests booked.

00:56:47.000 But we said, you know what?

00:56:49.000 Rain or shine, we're going to show up anyway.

00:56:50.000 This is what we can do.

00:56:52.000 Yeah! It's like that scene in Fred Claus where they make the hula hoops and the baseball bats.

00:56:57.000 All that matters is that a kid has a present to open up on Christmas.

00:56:59.000 That's what this is. We didn't want the fans to be screwed.

00:57:02.000 We know it's not ideal, but we appreciate you showing up.

00:57:04.000 And hey, look, we didn't get any rain.

00:57:07.000 So, I'm pretty sure that's a sign God hates socialism.

00:57:12.000 And then as to the rules that change that we talk about, I'm sure plenty of people have dealt with this with Facebook and Twitter and YouTube.

00:57:18.000 They make up these new violations and they change the rules and you don't know how to play by them because there really are no rules.

00:57:23.000 That's what happens when we often try to come to campus.

00:57:25.000 That's what often happens when we try to get everything booked in advance.

00:57:28.000 The rules change. There were some miscommunications here.

00:57:31.000 So we appreciate the private security detail who came out.

00:57:33.000 We appreciate the one officer who was willing to show up today.

00:57:36.000 And that's the same thing, yeah.

00:57:41.000 I'm sure Illinois unions have nothing to do with that.

00:57:43.000 If you show up to the Lotto with Crowder event, you'll meet the brass knuckles.

00:57:47.000 I don't know why Urbana sounds like a guy from New Jersey.

00:57:49.000 I have no idea. That's what happens with the Second Amendment, right?

00:57:53.000 We see that a lot. What do they say?

00:57:54.000 The ever-changing rules.

00:57:56.000 And so I think the premise is important, what the Second Amendment is, what it ensures.

00:58:00.000 Otherwise, you get into the territory of, oh, no one wants to take your guns away.

00:58:05.000 No one wants to do it. And now do we see?

00:58:07.000 We saw Justice Stevens say, let's repeal the Second Amendment.

00:58:09.000 Reiner. I know, and everyone tried to blame, like, yeah, that's a conservative thing because he has an R next to his name.

00:58:15.000 How many people here don't care if someone has an R next to their name?

00:58:18.000 It comes down to what your principles are.

00:58:21.000 Not being imprisoned?

00:58:23.000 What? Oh, shall not be infringed.

00:58:25.000 Yeah, I appreciate it. Thanks for yelling out.

00:58:28.000 I can't really hear you guys that well, so if I ignore some of your yells, I did hear Canada sucks.

00:58:32.000 That one was loud and clear. I think they heard you in Nova Scotia.

00:58:37.000 So I think it's important. This is why we go back to the fundamental issue.

00:58:40.000 As we talked about earlier, I appreciate you.

00:58:41.000 It's like nothing up my sleeves. You can see these notes here.

00:58:44.000 You know what, here, one second. You guys want to do an exercise before?

00:58:46.000 I can't show this to all of you. But what's your name?

00:58:48.000 What's your name? Debbie. Debbie. 1.00

00:58:50.000 Debbie. Would you mind sitting down, Debbie, real quick?

00:58:52.000 I know you're a fan real quick.

00:58:54.000 So, we're going to go to Second Amendment.

00:58:56.000 Oh, shoot. Sorry, I just spilled water.

00:58:58.000 Shoot, I got water all over myself.

00:59:00.000 So, this is what we have written down, as you can see here, kind of in red, while some of these are in black, are the claims that they might make.

00:59:07.000 And could you do me a favor? These are arguments that are very commonly made by the left.

00:59:11.000 So, it doesn't take a genius.

00:59:12.000 You just have to know the branch and then kind of the sticks that go off from the branch.

00:59:16.000 Now, guess what? You don't get off the branch if they can't convince you that theft, that socialism, is somehow moral.

00:59:22.000 Sorry, are you cold? I know, I wish I had hand warmers.

00:59:24.000 I'm freezing. That being said, we have these arguments.

00:59:30.000 Let's be careful. No, no, that's okay.

00:59:32.000 Thank you. I appreciate it. You're in a t-shirt.

00:59:33.000 You want to show that you do racy jujitsu, I appreciate it.

00:59:36.000 What are you? Bluebell? Purplebell?

00:59:38.000 Okay, good for you. Can you do me a favor?

00:59:40.000 Just so you guys can kind of see this, I don't think we've heard anything today.

00:59:43.000 Debbie? Debbie. Debbie, that we weren't already prepared for.

00:59:47.000 And this is something that's a fundamental difference between the right and the left.

00:59:50.000 It is very easy to prepare.

00:59:51.000 Why? Why is it easy to prepare?

00:59:53.000 Because they have the same arguments. Well, because what did I do?

00:59:55.000 I looked at what your professors here on campus say.

00:59:59.000 And by the way, it's the exact same when you go back to Marx, to Bernie Sanders, you go all the way to the media when they talk about democratic socialism, there's nothing new.

01:00:07.000 Now, it doesn't mean that you shouldn't prepare yourself for every possibility, but all I have to do is look at what your professors say, and we heard that parroted today.

01:00:13.000 So can you do me a favor here? Let's just read kind of these claims so people can kind of see.

01:00:17.000 We won't go through the rebuttals, but we'll just see the claims that we anticipated today.

01:00:20.000 Sure. The top 0.1% have as much wealth as the bottom 90% or any variant of that stat.

01:00:27.000 This income inequality is outrageous and immoral.

01:00:31.000 Now, of course, I wrote it as a more angry liberal.

01:00:33.000 But did you saw us run into that?

01:00:35.000 The idea of inequality, that that's more immoral than socialism.

01:00:38.000 Well, guess what? We were prepared for that.

01:00:40.000 And actually, we even agreed with Drew that that's not fundamentally immoral.

01:00:43.000 This one here, you saw socialist countries like Denmark, Sweden.

01:00:46.000 I don't think we actually had the corporation argument here.

01:00:48.000 Let's see what else we got. So, okay, let's read this one.

01:00:53.000 So what if it costs a lot?

01:00:54.000 Universal healthcare is way better in other countries.

01:00:57.000 You're reading it like Andy Kaufman reading The Great Gatsby.

01:00:59.000 You're very enthusiastic. It is better in other countries.

01:01:03.000 I appreciate it. We didn't hear someone bring that up, but we did hear people bring up the virtues of socialized healthcare.

01:01:07.000 One thing there that's really easy, by the way, Really, really easy.

01:01:11.000 When people say universal healthcare in other countries, because now we've gotten off the moral argument, keep bringing them back to, well, hold on a second.

01:01:16.000 If Hitler provided universal healthcare, I'm not comparing Bernie Sanders to Hitler, but I'm saying if you use nationalist socialism to provide healthcare for a certain nation of people, does that change the fundamental immoral act of that ill-gotten gain? 0.89

01:01:30.000 It doesn't. But even then, when we get to the pragmatic results, and we write this here, actually, we have these stats, but You don't need all these stats.

01:01:36.000 For example, 45% more likely to die in British hospitals.

01:01:38.000 Emergency rooms, you can see here, nine hours in Canada.

01:01:41.000 In the United States, it's two hours. I dealt with that one as a kid.

01:01:43.000 You don't need those stats. There's one stat you need to know when it comes to universal healthcare.

01:01:47.000 The only example that the left can point to of universal healthcare working better...

01:01:51.000 is our subjective polling methods where people are asked if they're satisfied with their level of health care.

01:01:57.000 Well, it's just like with college kids here.

01:01:59.000 If someone gave you a crappy 2002 Kia and you'd been riding the Champaign-Illinois bus for weeks, you would think that that was awesome.

01:02:05.000 If someone said, do you like your car, you'd probably say yes, right?

01:02:08.000 Now, that being said, someone who has a five-year-old Cadillac and is ready and is able to afford something better and wants to, they would have a different standard.

01:02:15.000 So the only stat that leftists point to, or I would say, I don't want to say only because I'm like, well, there's this one in this colony with these tribes.

01:02:22.000 Let's remove that. The main staff that's pointed to, and I would question your professors on this, when they say universal healthcare works better than these other countries, now we've gotten away from the moral argument, we've gotten away from the economic nationalism that you see in these countries, you're talking about subjective standards.

01:02:36.000 Because objectively, longer wait times are not better.

01:02:39.000 Objectively, higher mortality rates are not better.

01:02:42.000 Objectively, your chances of dying from some kind of a serious illness or not getting care are not better.

01:02:48.000 Objectively, the standards are not better.

01:02:51.000 Subjectively, they're better.

01:02:52.000 Be prepared for that and know that, because it's the most common argument I see, and I see so many conservatives going, well, I guess I didn't know that Cuba had better health care.

01:03:01.000 Did you see that? And Michael Morsico, for a perfect example, he claimed Cuba had better health care than the United States.

01:03:07.000 Why? Because they thought it was better.

01:03:09.000 They said, do you like your health care more?

01:03:10.000 And they said, yes, we think it's better.

01:03:12.000 But it's not. Alright, do we need to...

01:03:13.000 Wait, don't end it.

01:03:15.000 Hold on, this is a family show. Oh, no, no, no, we're good, we're good.

01:03:18.000 Okay, here's one that I think we ran into a few times.

01:03:20.000 Can you read this claim right here? Sure.

01:03:22.000 We already have many socialist policies in the US. Public roads, police, military.

01:03:28.000 Do you want to abolish those as well?

01:03:31.000 What's the harm of adding more?

01:03:33.000 Free healthcare. Nothing up my sleeve!

01:03:36.000 So see how many, I think all three of us, all three arguments run into that, right?

01:03:39.000 Yeah. This is what we call really a false equivalency.

01:03:42.000 Now how does that work? How do you prepare yourself for it?

01:03:44.000 And that's what we're going to be printing these booklets.

01:03:46.000 Hopefully, you know, any Mug Clubbers here, the more people who join Mug Club, the more we'll have time to print them out. 1.00

01:03:51.000 And money to do so. We're going to self-publish that.

01:03:54.000 Again, it's a false equivalency.

01:03:56.000 You need to know the difference between a public good, as we discussed, right?

01:03:59.000 Right. And a commodity.

01:04:01.000 Once you define that, that's why it's so important to define your terms.

01:04:04.000 What is socialism? What do I mean by evil?

01:04:07.000 What is a public good?

01:04:08.000 What is a commodity?

01:04:10.000 What's the difference? When you get down to the definition, Andrew Breitbart was a man who actually coached me.

01:04:14.000 I was just a stand-up comic... Thank you very much.

01:04:16.000 Yeah, he was a great guy.

01:04:18.000 Great guy. I'm talking about Breitbart the man, not the trademark, just the man.

01:04:21.000 I knew him personally. He was a tremendous guy.

01:04:23.000 I can't say enough good things about him.

01:04:24.000 And by the way, very flawed as well, as many great people are.

01:04:27.000 You look at the story of Churchill. I would certainly say he's comparable in the war on new media.

01:04:31.000 He always talked about knowing your definitions.

01:04:34.000 Because if you say, well, one could argue that socialism is, don't let him do that.

01:04:38.000 Because then guess what?

01:04:40.000 Now they can say, well, hold on, that's just one definition.

01:04:42.000 No, no, let's define what it is.

01:04:44.000 And let's discuss that. Do not allow the conversation to go on undefined.

01:04:49.000 Not only is it no longer productive, you'll just begin talking in circles and it becomes a cable news soundbite gotcha game, but it's also just a way to not be able to make a constructive argument.

01:05:00.000 It's just not helpful, and sometimes you end up looking stupid because you haven't defined what it is.

01:05:04.000 So, here we go.

01:05:06.000 That's all we have here on the socialism.

01:05:08.000 So what would you say? You say that pretty much all the arguments we heard were right here in this booklet?

01:05:11.000 Yes. Oh, there you go.

01:05:13.000 Debbie. 99.5 in your opinion? 0.94

01:05:17.000 Okay. Just like the 80...

01:05:18.000 95 to 99.

01:05:20.000 All right. What are you like?

01:05:21.000 It's like Mathry Roderick in the computer wore tennis shoes.

01:05:23.000 He's just... You're like Sven Computer. Beep, beep, boop.

01:05:25.000 95%. And by the way, we also have, as you can see, we have death rates here, all of these sources, which would be in the Change My Mind book when we release it.

01:05:32.000 Debbie, did you have any questions?

01:05:34.000 We're going to move on to the Second Amendment thing, but I appreciate you watching my back there, and I appreciate you helping me out with this.

01:05:38.000 Is there anything else you have to say? Can you follow me on Twitter?

01:05:41.000 I will follow you on Twitter.

01:05:43.000 What is your Twitter? Debbie Bernal.

01:05:45.000 Debbie Bernal? Add Debbie Bernal. 1.00

01:05:47.000 Everyone here, follow Debbie on Twitter.

01:05:49.000 Debbie Bernal. Oh, and by the way, if I can ask you guys, everyone here has a smart device, the stream is live on YouTube and Facebook.

01:05:56.000 If everyone here could take out your smartphone and make sure to tweet out the hashtag ChangeMyMind and Crowder Illinois Takeover, which was not self-titled, but I think it's pretty...

01:06:05.000 I'll go with it.

01:06:07.000 I appreciate it. You can take a selfie.

01:06:10.000 Yes, Debbie, because you assisted so well.

01:06:12.000 Thank you. So everyone follow Debbie and everyone retweet the stream.

01:06:18.000 You guys are fantastic.

01:06:19.000 Stop! Spell Bernard. 0.97

01:06:21.000 Bernal. B-E-R-N-A-L. B-E-R-N-A-L. Debbie Bernal.

01:06:26.000 Okay, no creepy... No one Anthony Weiner that.

01:06:28.000 I can see already people lifting their jacket, taking the Space Odyssey angle.

01:06:33.000 Sick puppies, all of you.

01:06:35.000 All right, so I am pro-Second Amendment.

01:06:37.000 This is a hot-button issue today.

01:06:39.000 I guess we don't really need this.

01:06:40.000 The socialism is evil.

01:06:43.000 I'm pro-Second Amendment.

01:06:44.000 Change my... Hold on one second.

01:06:46.000 Let's knock it, Jared.

01:06:47.000 Or someone, we need someone just to give him a check.

01:06:50.000 Right here!

01:06:52.000 Who's behind?

01:06:54.000 Hey! 0.99

01:06:56.000 Wait, is it MAGA hat?

01:07:01.000 No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

01:07:03.000 He has a MAGA hat? Let me see.

01:07:07.000 Make data great again.

01:07:08.000 Okay, Silicon Valley fan.

01:07:10.000 All right, let's go. Bring him on.

01:07:12.000 What's your name, sir? Carvick?

01:07:19.000 Karthik, sit down, Karthik.

01:07:20.000 Nice to meet you. Everyone give a hand for Karthik sitting down having a discussion.

01:07:24.000 Nope, you don't get to take the microphone.

01:07:26.000 Sorry, sorry, sorry. Wow, that's a very college student of you.

01:07:29.000 My microphone! But you didn't earn it.

01:07:32.000 Mine! I'm kidding.

01:07:34.000 So, okay, I am pro-Second Amendment.

01:07:37.000 I support the Second Amendment wholeheartedly.

01:07:39.000 It seems to me that you disagree. If you do, I'm willing to hear your arguments and have my mind changed.

01:07:43.000 Sure. So, I just want to clarify.

01:07:45.000 I don't necessarily disagree with the Second Amendment itself.

01:07:48.000 All right. You don't disagree with the Second Amendment itself?

01:07:51.000 I disagree with certain implementations of gun policy itself.

01:07:55.000 Does that work?

01:07:56.000 No, it doesn't work.

01:07:58.000 It doesn't work if we say, well, first off, what do we agree on the Second Amendment to mean?

01:08:02.000 And this is something that we see a lot.

01:08:04.000 You see a lot when people come up, and they're a little bit more confident, and then people see some discussions kind of unravel the way they did, and they go, well, I'm not really a socialist.

01:08:12.000 I'm not really against the Second Amendment.

01:08:13.000 I'm against gun policy implementation, is what you've said now.

01:08:16.000 It doesn't work for me, but let's go along that trail.

01:08:20.000 First off, what do you believe the Second Amendment to mean?

01:08:23.000 I mean, I believe it's the right to bear arms, regardless of whatever type of gun.

01:08:27.000 I know you're going to have to have you speak up, Karthik.

01:08:29.000 Okay, sorry. You can yell at me, it's okay.

01:08:31.000 Just don't call me autistic. Can you hear me?

01:08:33.000 Yes. All right, so, I believe that the Second Amendment is...

01:08:43.000 I mean, it's the right to bear arms.

01:08:45.000 That can include any type of gun.

01:08:46.000 Okay. But I think from a policy standpoint...

01:08:49.000 Can you guys hear them?

01:08:52.000 Karthik, you have to speak up or we can't do this.

01:08:55.000 Okay, so I believe that from a policy standpoint, we have to regulate certain types of guns or just certain types of situations to account for certain external...

01:09:03.000 Karthik, you're very nice, but your voice is like white noise.

01:09:07.000 Okay, okay. We need to hear you.

01:09:10.000 And I'm not saying, I don't want to give you the boot, but if they can't hear you, we can't have the conversation.

01:09:15.000 Okay, so I really believe that the gun...

01:09:18.000 There we go! You starting to hear them?

01:09:19.000 Yeah? Good! Good!

01:09:21.000 I'm cheering you, Karthik!

01:09:23.000 They're rooting for you over me!

01:09:24.000 Go! Sound off like you got a pair!

01:09:26.000 I believe that there are certain situations where the government has to step in to account for certain externalities that might exist within, you know, whether or not that's the economy or the society.

01:09:35.000 So, from a certain standpoint, I agree that we should, you know, be very, well, I use the term lightly, but I believe we should be very liberal in terms of the type of guns we allow in the society.

01:09:47.000 I just think that we have to place certain regulations to prevent certain...

01:09:50.000 So, I'll get into that, right?

01:09:53.000 Well, hold on a second. What matters most is you said the Second Amendment is the right to bear arms.

01:09:58.000 Yes. You said period. Yes.

01:09:59.000 Okay. So what matters is also the why.

01:10:01.000 Why? I mean, I believe that it's to, you know, prevent against, like, an oppressive government.

01:10:07.000 Yes, yes. Well, both internal and external threats.

01:10:10.000 So we would both agree on that? Yeah. Okay, good.

01:10:12.000 Because, well, actually, they're often not teaching that in schools.

01:10:14.000 So I appreciate that you actually acknowledge that, that, okay, the Second Amendment is to protect ourselves from a tyrannical government, historically understand why that exists, and you said that should include, we should be very liberal, including most firearms.

01:10:25.000 And now you've said certain externalities.

01:10:26.000 So that's, the reason why is it's, and by the way, we would both have to agree it's Amendment No.

01:10:30.000 2 in our Constitution.

01:10:32.000 It's a fundamental human right.

01:10:33.000 Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so now I'd like you to go on with why and when we should strip people of their human rights. 0.57

01:10:38.000 Sure. So, from my general understanding, there are two major problems with guns, and I don't think that mass shootings in general is...

01:10:46.000 I mean, I think it's a...

01:10:47.000 Can you guys hear Karthik?

01:10:49.000 Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay.

01:10:50.000 Okay, okay, so I don't...

01:10:53.000 Okay, so I... So I don't believe that mass shootings are the problem that we have to be looking at.

01:11:04.000 Because when we look at gun violence, the problems that I see are gang violence and gun-related shootings related to suicide, right?

01:11:12.000 So these are the real problems that I think I see with gun deaths, gun violence right now.

01:11:16.000 So I think these are the externalities that we have to try to account for.

01:11:20.000 So you mean, for example, you talk about gang violence.

01:11:23.000 So externalities like crime.

01:11:27.000 Yeah, sorry. Now you guys got him nervous.

01:11:29.000 He's literally eating the mic. Jerks.

01:11:32.000 Like crime. Right, absolutely.

01:11:34.000 So we should outlaw crime.

01:11:35.000 No, look, I agree.

01:11:37.000 I think that we do need to attack this from a standpoint.

01:11:42.000 Okay, hold on. So let's stop doing this. What changes would you make to the Second Amendment, or what do we need to do differently?

01:11:46.000 Because I don't want to walk around in circles here, especially when people get here.

01:11:48.000 The Second Amendment right now gives me the right to keep and bear arms, to protect myself against a tyrannical government, or someone kicking in my door, or all of the above.

01:11:56.000 What problem do you have with it?

01:11:57.000 So I think just as an addendum to the Second Amendment, right, and this is going to be very, very unpopular, right, but I believe that I think we need gun registry.

01:12:06.000 I think we need to keep a tally on who has guns.

01:12:09.000 And hold on, hold on.

01:12:11.000 I believe this because I think it can actually aid in law enforcement, right?

01:12:14.000 You can actually create risk pools, so where gun violence is likely to occur based on, you know, how many suicides have occurred in a certain situation.

01:12:22.000 In a certain area, right?

01:12:23.000 So if you have a gun registry, you can actually tally that data, and you can create...

01:12:28.000 I appreciate you taking time, Karthik.

01:12:29.000 That's where we're going to end this one. Give it up for Karthik, everybody. 0.94

01:12:31.000 It's hard to hear him. And the only reason I'm doing this is because there's no way...

01:12:36.000 Hold on a second, hold on a second, hands down.

01:12:37.000 There's no way... You can go wherever you want, or you can hang around for a bit.

01:12:40.000 There's no way that my mind will be changed on this, because we just talked about, okay, the Second Amendment, what it is, it's a fundamental human right to defend against a tyrannical government.

01:12:48.000 And this is one thing that kind of happens with the left.

01:12:50.000 It's a circular feedback loop.

01:12:51.000 What's the solution? To give the government the ability to know exactly who has guns, when they have guns, where they have guns.

01:12:59.000 Why? To empower the police force.

01:13:02.000 Keep in mind, the left today, as we know them, of course, as today's social movement, these are the people who believe that police officers are offing black kids in record numbers just because of the melanin in their skin.

01:13:11.000 So to say that we acknowledge that the Second Amendment is a fundamental human right to defend against a tyrannical government would fly in the face of the idea of a gun registry.

01:13:18.000 And if you look at this, you look at the Australian buyback that people often point to, you look at what's happened in places where there are gun registries, Yes, it is used directly to infringe upon people's human rights, which is the entire purpose of the Second Amendment in the first place.

01:13:31.000 I just didn't want to continue down that trail.

01:13:32.000 I know you guys couldn't hear him. I don't think it's a particularly convincing argument.

01:13:35.000 The second I hear gun registry, I'm not on board.

01:13:38.000 But yeah, this guy, good to go?

01:13:40.000 Go ahead. You have a gun registry in the state of Illinois?

01:13:44.000 Well, then don't be so upset when I insult Illinois.

01:13:46.000 Gosh. All right.

01:13:48.000 Sorry, go ahead. What's your name again?

01:13:50.000 Jonah. Jonah. Jonah, nice to meet you.

01:13:52.000 I am pro-Second Amendment. Appreciate it.

01:13:54.000 Change my mind. I can't you guys have a gun registry in Illinois

01:13:57.000 Okay Yeah, I was gonna say you guys

01:14:06.000 Oh, geez. Okay.

01:14:07.000 All right, guys, guys, guys, guys.

01:14:08.000 This isn't Gangs of New York, okay, Mr.

01:14:11.000 Dead Rabbits? These aren't the four corners.

01:14:14.000 Everyone just calm down. Jonah is here.

01:14:16.000 We want him to be calm, collected.

01:14:18.000 I am pro-Second Amendment.

01:14:20.000 I appreciate you taking the time to sit down.

01:14:21.000 I appreciate you finding the crowd down a little bit.

01:14:23.000 Thank you very much. I appreciate it.

01:14:24.000 You look like that kid, that actor who was in the Black Donnellys.

01:14:27.000 You ever see that show? I have not.

01:14:28.000 There was a film, I think, called The Ruins.

01:14:30.000 By the way, can people hear me all right?

01:14:31.000 I think we can. I thought that was a big issue.

01:14:33.000 All right, sounds good. It was a pretty big issue.

01:14:34.000 If they can't hear you, you know, obviously, then they can't hear you.

01:14:36.000 It's hard to have an argument, I guess, right?

01:14:37.000 Discussion. Or discussion, whatever you want to call it.

01:14:39.000 Sure. Hold on a second. Hold on a second.

01:14:41.000 Let's define our terms, right?

01:14:42.000 No, no. This isn't an argument.

01:14:44.000 I want to be really clear. I think we've had some really, really productive discussions with several different people today.

01:14:48.000 I mean, I don't think that there's necessarily a negative connotation.

01:14:52.000 I wouldn't give a negative connotation in this context with an argument, but this is beating around the bush.

01:14:57.000 Discussion, fine. Okay. Okay, so you're pro-Second Amendment, right?

01:14:59.000 Yes. Okay, and as you just did, let's define what Second Amendment is, purpose, and I totally agree with you.

01:15:07.000 Well, let's read it, actually.

01:15:08.000 Good. Appreciate it.

01:15:10.000 I don't have notes. I have the internet, you know.

01:15:13.000 No, and listen, by the way, I'm not using them.

01:15:17.000 People keep an eye on this.

01:15:18.000 I'm not using the notes. So I would love for you to read the Second Amendment.

01:15:22.000 Hold on, hey, Russian collusion. Jonah, I would like for you to read the Second Amendment.

01:15:25.000 Don't worry, they're just rambunctious because they didn't get Tranny Bain out here. 0.99

01:15:29.000 If you can read the Second Amendment for me, I would appreciate it.

01:15:32.000 A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

01:15:42.000 Hold on a second, one thing, one thing, one thing.

01:15:45.000 Hold on, hold on, calm down, hold on a second.

01:15:46.000 Guys, guys, hold on, calm down.

01:15:47.000 It's hard to have a discussion if I can't speak, right?

01:15:50.000 Yeah, I know, but you've seen, I'm doing my best, but I get to do this.

01:15:54.000 They're going to listen to me. They're probably not going to listen to you.

01:15:57.000 That's great. They love America.

01:15:58.000 Okay, so you just read the Second Amendment.

01:15:59.000 Wonderful. So we both still agree on what it is.

01:16:02.000 Yes, and let's just clarify it, right?

01:16:04.000 So it is the right to keep and bear arms to protect yourself against foreign and domestic threats.

01:16:10.000 Good. Including the government.

01:16:12.000 Thank you. Appreciate it. So, let's do that.

01:16:16.000 The implications of that statement are, I want a tank.

01:16:19.000 I should be able to go buy me a tank right now.

01:16:21.000 Yeah. Would you agree with that statement?

01:16:23.000 Here's what's ironic about that statement.

01:16:27.000 First off, tanks are allowed in Europe, which is very interesting to me.

01:16:30.000 And are you aware of Madison's letter of mark and reprisal?

01:16:34.000 I'm not. Okay.

01:16:35.000 So this is a letter actually giving...

01:16:37.000 It was a letter issued to a private ship that said, hey, are we allowed to have cannons on this ship to protect from pirates?

01:16:43.000 And Madison said, the Second Amendment. 0.98

01:16:45.000 Of course you are. So will we say that cannons are at least similar to a tank?

01:16:50.000 Back then it was the most basically advanced weaponry you could have.

01:16:54.000 Well, so...

01:16:55.000 So let me make sure I understand what you're saying.

01:16:58.000 You're saying that back in the day you could get, not just musket, but you said you could get a cannon.

01:17:06.000 A cannon, yes, yes, yes.

01:17:07.000 I'm saying that, yes, back in the day the Second Amendment covered, yes, all small arms, all individual arms that could be used defensively, yes.

01:17:15.000 So you're saying that I should be able, I'm 18, should I be able to go buy a tank?

01:17:19.000 Is that what you're saying?

01:17:20.000 Yes! First off, I know you brought up the Constitution.

01:17:27.000 Why don't we do this? Let's bring up, do me a favor, bring up the definition of arms.

01:17:33.000 Can I grab it?

01:17:34.000 They look pretty nice.

01:17:37.000 I'd like you to bring it up.

01:17:39.000 I'd like you to bring up the definition of arms to make sure that we're not going on down a rabbit trail where maybe we disagree.

01:17:45.000 If I search up arms, I'm going to get arms.

01:17:49.000 No, search up arms.

01:17:50.000 I'm sure Merriam-Webster, smart document there.

01:17:54.000 It'll give you the definition of arms.

01:17:57.000 Since I'm not using reference, I'm asking you two, because I don't think it would be fair for you two.

01:18:01.000 I will say one part about UIUC I can't stand is the Wi-Fi is terrible.

01:18:05.000 That's the only part? Well, anyway, it's not quite working here, but anyway.

01:18:11.000 It's not bringing up arms?

01:18:13.000 It's not. Can someone bring up the definition of arms?

01:18:16.000 Okay, who has the definition of arms as it relates to weaponry?

01:18:19.000 What's the definition of arms?

01:18:23.000 You said you had it.

01:18:24.000 You're like that kid in class, like, I have the answer, I have the answer, just because you want to stand up.

01:18:27.000 I forgot my answer. Okay.

01:18:29.000 Arms. Okay, do you want to read that for me?

01:18:33.000 Thank you, Nucky, Jared. Weapons and ammunition, armaments.

01:18:41.000 Okay, weapons and ammunition, armaments.

01:18:43.000 Okay, and then it says underneath that it includes a list.

01:18:46.000 Uh, let's see.

01:18:49.000 Weapons, firearms, guns, artillery, ordinance.

01:18:54.000 Yeah. Well, you know, the last kid said...

01:18:57.000 Hold on a second, I don't know how to lock this. Do you want a society...

01:19:00.000 Because, I mean, the Second Amendment, right?

01:19:02.000 The whole point of why we have a court, right?

01:19:04.000 Why we have a judiciary is to interpret what that means, right?

01:19:08.000 No. And what the implications are.

01:19:09.000 Really? So you don't think that the courts were...

01:19:12.000 The Founding Fathers made... 0.76

01:19:15.000 That made the judiciary to interpret the Constitution, to interpret our laws and those implications.

01:19:19.000 To ensure the authenticity and the implementation of the Constitution.

01:19:23.000 That's why I think we would both have a problem with activist judges on either side.

01:19:28.000 Activist judges, I mean, it's supposed to be an inherently non-political position.

01:19:32.000 That's obviously not the case.

01:19:34.000 Right. But certainly, like, you know, the lifetime appointments, right?

01:19:38.000 So you'll have both judges on both sides.

01:19:41.000 Okay. But forget about that for a second.

01:19:42.000 Let's go back to your thing, because I don't want to get you off topic, and I don't want you to think that I'm being unfair.

01:19:46.000 Let's go to the judiciary decision, the most recent of which is...

01:19:49.000 I'm not quite sure who's wrong.

01:19:52.000 D.C. versus Heller. Okay.

01:19:54.000 I'm not familiar with D.C. versus Heller.

01:19:56.000 Okay. Well, that's the most fundamental Second Amendment case in modern history.

01:20:01.000 So this is actually where we went down and there were dissenting voices at LOST, so the Second Amendment is currently as it is interpreted.

01:20:08.000 And it's interpreted as a way that you and I disagreed upon.

01:20:11.000 Which is, people have the right to keep and bear arms, period.

01:20:14.000 So, this was up Helen versus... 0.99

01:20:16.000 Helen. I was about to say Helen Keller.

01:20:18.000 I always get it. Heller versus D.C. What's really important there is you talk about the judiciary, because now we're talking about interpretation of the Second Amendment.

01:20:24.000 So, let me be really clear before, because then I'll let you know what the judiciary interpretation was of the Second Amendment.

01:20:29.000 What's your interpretation of the Second Amendment?

01:20:32.000 Well, as I said, I said it when we first started.

01:20:36.000 Okay, good. So we agree on that.

01:20:37.000 But I guess I'm saying, right, like, the First Amendment.

01:20:40.000 Then where's the disagreement, then?

01:20:41.000 I guess I don't see. Okay, so we can limit the First Amendment, no?

01:20:44.000 No. What is libel, right?

01:20:47.000 No, see, that's different.

01:20:48.000 Libel, slander, those are all limitations on your freedom of speech in the same way that you can limit your Second Amendment, right?

01:20:54.000 Incorrect, but continue. Come up here.

01:20:57.000 So, I don't believe that I should be able to go buy a tank.

01:21:02.000 Per se. Okay. I'd say that's promotion of general welfare.

01:21:08.000 That's domestic tranquility, right?

01:21:10.000 So, I think that the government has a variety of purposes.

01:21:13.000 And I know you believe in a small government.

01:21:15.000 That's fine. But there are inherent purposes in having a government.

01:21:18.000 That's why we have a country. We agree on that.

01:21:21.000 Okay, fine. So, in my mind, the government should and ought to limit certain things.

01:21:27.000 For example, I should not be able to buy a tank.

01:21:31.000 This is your opinion, yeah.

01:21:33.000 What I would really like to get back to is, I mean, do you believe that I should be able to have a...

01:21:37.000 Could you do me one favor? I don't want to...

01:21:38.000 Could you do me a favor? Because you just kind of jumped around to a bunch of different things.

01:21:41.000 The First Amendment. First off, you went through libel and slander, two very different things, and they're illegal, by the way, for different reasons, which do not infringe upon the First Amendment.

01:21:50.000 Just like when people use the argument yelling, fire in a crowded theater, it's the call to action.

01:21:53.000 Libel or slander is actually something that is designed to hurt somebody.

01:21:57.000 One in the written form, one in the spoken form, which is untrue.

01:22:01.000 So what you're effectively suing for is that it's a crime because it causes damages in a very tangible way that is fundamentally untrue.

01:22:07.000 It's not about freedom of speech.

01:22:09.000 You can say anything you want.

01:22:10.000 You can right now say anything you want.

01:22:12.000 You can yell out right now that I'm a dick.

01:22:14.000 I don't disagree on that.

01:22:16.000 Yeah, okay. Yeah, thank you very much.

01:22:18.000 So you can, and I'm not suing you.

01:22:20.000 There are no damages there.

01:22:21.000 Okay. Let's get back to the Second Amendment. 0.99

01:22:23.000 Because you just jumped around and said there are limitations of the First Amendment.

01:22:25.000 I agree, and let's try and stay on top.

01:22:27.000 So let's go back to the Second Amendment. 0.87

01:22:28.000 Now, the Second Amendment, we agreed on it, but now you're saying there are limitations that need to be interpreted judicially, correct?

01:22:35.000 Well, I'm saying I think oftentimes you will hear conservatives take this extreme approach whereby they would say, oh, Let's talk about, like, right now, right?

01:22:47.000 People are trying to, you know, ban semi-autos or etc.

01:22:51.000 There's a whole bunch of things, bump stocks, the whole thing, right?

01:22:54.000 Repeal the Second Amendment. Well, let's not talk about that, Greg, because that's not what all liberals think, that we should repeal the Second Amendment.

01:23:01.000 Many of them do. I don't know if that's true.

01:23:03.000 I mean, where are you getting that?

01:23:05.000 You just discussed, in theory, repealing the First Amendment.

01:23:08.000 That's what you just did. I did not say let's repeal the First Amendment.

01:23:11.000 I had no point in that. When you say let's put limitations, we can put limitations on the freedom of speech, we currently cannot do that.

01:23:16.000 That is fundamentally altering the First Amendment.

01:23:18.000 Let's call it an addendum as opposed to repeal.

01:23:22.000 I'm saying libel and...

01:23:23.000 Again, let's get away from the First Amendment.

01:23:25.000 My point is... What's your problem with the Second Amendment?

01:23:27.000 Let's get to this, because you're talking around. What is your problem with the Second Amendment, as we both agreed it to be?

01:23:31.000 And then we'll move on from here. Conservatives often will say, I want my high-capacity magazine, because when the government ultimately becomes tyrannical, and that's up for debate, but sure, fine.

01:23:43.000 Under the assumption that all governments become tyrannical...

01:23:46.000 No, no, no, no, no. Okay, hold on a second.

01:23:48.000 This is something that you can't do.

01:23:49.000 I know you came in and you said looking for an argument.

01:23:51.000 I think... Are you more of an argumentative person?

01:23:55.000 I mean, I don't know quite how to answer that question.

01:23:57.000 I'll say yes. Because what you just did was you presumed my premise.

01:24:01.000 You said most conservatives, and then you brought up something that most conservatives do not believe, and then you said all, the assumption that all governments become tyrannical.

01:24:10.000 So these are presumptions that you're making that I didn't make.

01:24:12.000 So what I want to do is avoid that.

01:24:14.000 And I talk about this a lot. Anyone who follows the program, I've not assumed your motive.

01:24:18.000 I've not assumed your position.

01:24:19.000 The reason for picking our terms and our definition here It's not trickery.

01:24:23.000 It's the opposite of it because I don't want to assume your position.

01:24:27.000 I want to hear your position. So your position in the Second Amendment, your problem with it, as you've agreed with me, it to be.

01:24:35.000 Again, so let me explain.

01:24:36.000 I'm saying oftentimes I hear conservatives say...

01:24:40.000 Is that better? Well, no, you said all government's becoming tyrannical.

01:24:43.000 But what is your problem with the Second Amendment?

01:24:45.000 So I'm getting there. Okay, go ahead.

01:24:46.000 My problem with...

01:24:47.000 It's not even so much...

01:24:49.000 So my problem with the Second Amendment is how conservatives talk about it and then not

01:24:53.000 follow through on their logical premise.

01:24:56.000 So I guess what I'm saying is, oftentimes...

01:24:59.000 Guys, don't shut him down.

01:25:01.000 Okay, listen, you guys, let's have this conversation.

01:25:03.000 I think it's more productive if we can hear what he has to say, and I appreciate him sitting

01:25:07.000 down.

01:25:08.000 So I appreciate your enthusiasm, but let's let him go.

01:25:10.000 I'm saying oftentimes I hear conservatives say...

01:25:12.000 Oh, I need an AR-15, I need a high-capacity magazine because I need to be able to protect myself from the government, which is the purpose of the Second Amendment.

01:25:20.000 And so then I'm going to say, okay, so in order to fully protect yourself from the Second Amendment, you ought to have a tank.

01:25:26.000 Is that what you're saying? And I think that's kind of an absurd thing.

01:25:29.000 That is not what I'm saying. I'm not saying in order to protect, you ought to have a tank.

01:25:32.000 That's not what I'm saying. Okay, so let's say the military all of a sudden tomorrow wants to take over the government, do a coup d'etat, whatever.

01:25:39.000 Then they'll come stroll into your house and do whatever they want, right?

01:25:43.000 Because they have a tank, and you can shoot them with your semi-automatic weapon, but like, the tank's gonna win.

01:25:47.000 No. No.

01:25:51.000 You'll go with an AR-15 over a tank, right?

01:25:54.000 Like, that's ridiculous. No.

01:25:55.000 No. Hold on. Everyone quiet.

01:25:57.000 No. I'll go with an entirely armed citizenry over a government with a registry able to take their guns away.

01:26:04.000 So hold on a second. You just made a bunch of presumptions.

01:26:07.000 No, I'm not saying you ought to own a tank.

01:26:09.000 It seems to me your problem is with conservative interpretation of the Second Amendment.

01:26:13.000 And so what you use to substantiate that is what I think you guys, if anyone takes philosophy in college, this reverse nirvana fallacy.

01:26:19.000 So you're talking about an imbalance of power.

01:26:21.000 The government has tanks, right?

01:26:23.000 So you're allowing this presumption to, let's say, this theory, the philosophical portion of this equation.

01:26:29.000 The government, let's say, became tyrannical, okay?

01:26:31.000 Sure. You're saying if it became tyrannical...

01:26:33.000 That's the purpose of the Second Amendment.

01:26:34.000 Right. You're saying there's potential.

01:26:35.000 Let's agree with that. So you're saying if they perchance became tyrannical, they would have this incredible advantage because they'd have tanks, not to mention drones, nukes, and your solution to this imbalance in power is to create an even greater discrepancy in power.

01:26:53.000 So I see what you're saying, and that makes sense.

01:26:56.000 I guess my point is...

01:26:57.000 I'd take an AR-15 over nothing, I'd take 300 million Americans with an AR-15 over a tank, and I certainly would take my fundamental human right to own one over someone else's opinion.

01:27:07.000 Yeah! Say that again? 0.97

01:27:08.000 I didn't hear that last part. And I certainly would take my fundamental human right over someone else's interpretive opinion of it.

01:27:14.000 So, this doesn't change the fact of...

01:27:16.000 None of us have disagreed.

01:27:17.000 It doesn't change the fact as to what the Second Amendment is.

01:27:19.000 But again, yes, if you look at Afghanistan, you look at guerrilla warfare, you look at, for example, Switzerland with World War II. Armed citizens, it is.

01:27:26.000 It absolutely is a deterrent.

01:27:28.000 We know it to be a deterrent. Switzerland was neutral in World War II. No, Switzerland was neutral in World War II, but Switzerland, every person was armed.

01:27:35.000 Geographically and because of an armed populace, if you look at documentation, that was a big part that allowed them to be neutral.

01:27:40.000 You read about the Japanese talking about the Americans where they didn't want to get into a land war.

01:27:43.000 That's ridiculous. I'm sorry.

01:27:45.000 If you actually think that a military is...

01:27:47.000 Yes, I do.

01:27:50.000 Well, I guess then we have a very fundamental misunderstanding that you think a military is scared of the U.S. population because they are well-armed.

01:27:58.000 Be quiet. I'm talking, right?

01:27:59.000 Like, calm down. Like, calm down. Here's the reason they're doing it.

01:28:05.000 They're getting upset because you're not being very civil when you presume things that I didn't say.

01:28:09.000 Okay? So, none of this changes what the Second Amendment is.

01:28:13.000 Pragmatically speaking, absolutely.

01:28:15.000 Of course, I do believe that an armed citizenry versus a tyrannical government is far better than a completely disarmed citizenry.

01:28:20.000 I know you disagree there, but yeah, I think that that's better overall.

01:28:23.000 And it doesn't change the fact that I have a fundamental human right in this country to self-protection, regardless of your opinion.

01:28:29.000 So the reason I ask you this is because your problem has been with the interpretation from conservatives, as you said, of the Second Amendment.

01:28:34.000 We're going to have to wrap it up here.

01:28:35.000 So this is my issue.

01:28:37.000 I have a problem with the leftists, the liberal interpretation of the Second Amendment.

01:28:41.000 And that goes back to when I asked you before about Heller versus D.C. Because we're talking judicially, the Supreme Court.

01:28:48.000 Do you know what the dissenting opinions, the opinions on your side of the ledger were for their view of the Second Amendment?

01:28:53.000 Well, I don't, but I know that in New York State, right, so there was another...

01:28:57.000 Well, I'm going to give you that, and then I appreciate it.

01:28:59.000 Was it Jonah? Jonah.

01:29:01.000 Thank you very much. Let's give it a round of applause for Jonah.

01:29:03.000 I appreciate it. I would encourage people to look up New York State Rifle and Pistol Association versus Cuomo.

01:29:11.000 Okay, great, thank you. And AR-15s were not protected under the Second Amendment.

01:29:15.000 Okay, I appreciate it.

01:29:17.000 But I would like you to look up Heller vs.

01:29:19.000 D.C. And this is so important because Heller vs.

01:29:23.000 D.C. It's not so much, by the way, we have an interpretation of the Second Amendment as we know it today.

01:29:28.000 How long have we been doing this?

01:29:31.000 An hour and a half. Alright, this is actually going to be the last one, so thank you to Jonah.

01:29:34.000 I want to leave it on this because this is really important.

01:29:37.000 We've talked about this quite a bit.

01:29:39.000 I actually have written it down. Actually, I would have you come and look at this to see if we can corroborate it, but you know what?

01:29:43.000 The truth is, I don't even know the... Actually, do you want Debbie to come on back out?

01:29:48.000 Debbie! Debbie Bernal, come on back out. 1.00

01:29:50.000 I think I have it. Do you have it?

01:29:53.000 I think, hold on a second, Debbie.

01:29:55.000 I don't know where this is. There's two genders, changed my mind. 1.00

01:29:58.000 Male privileges, a myth, changed my mind.

01:29:59.000 Pro gun is somewhere back here.

01:30:01.000 Debbie, you want to talk while I do this to buy time?

01:30:04.000 Who wants to hear from Not Gay Jared? 1.00

01:30:05.000 Jared, say something. Everybody, I just want to thank everyone again for coming out.

01:30:13.000 We're not wrapping up here, but just a big shout out to support.

01:30:16.000 That's a fun one.

01:30:17.000 Everyone come in and support this in this lovely weather.

01:30:21.000 It's awesome.

01:30:23.000 And we appreciate the love.

01:30:27.000 Sound off like you've got a pair.

01:30:31.000 See, now you see what happens when I give him control of the mic.

01:30:37.000 No, give it up for Naka, Jared. 0.95

01:30:38.000 He's the guy who made all this happen and came out here.

01:30:40.000 Oh! 0.60

01:30:42.000 There we go.

01:30:44.000 Jared! Jared! Jared!

01:30:52.000 Jared!

01:30:54.000 Jared!

01:30:56.000 Okay, so Debbie, I want to sit down.

01:30:58.000 By the way, don't take any pictures because we're going to sell them.

01:31:00.000 It's only for $5, but come on.

01:31:02.000 You guys can't just steal the intellectual property.

01:31:04.000 That's another argument. Does intellectual property actually exist?

01:31:06.000 And where does it infringe upon the rights of physical property?

01:31:09.000 Changed my mind. Okay, so something that I find interesting, actually here, he surprisingly didn't, no one brought up the mass shootings argument.

01:31:17.000 We have an overall kind of strategy that I write down.

01:31:19.000 I have a brilliant researcher named Reg who helps me and we prepare.

01:31:23.000 We sit down and kind of do mock debates through every scenario.

01:31:25.000 Listen, by the way, I'm showing you this to show you I'm not some skilled debate.

01:31:28.000 I'm not like a Ben Shapiro.

01:31:29.000 I'm not this brilliant. I'm not a Thomas Sowell.

01:31:31.000 I'm a comedian who happens to have a platform and I'm so humbled and grateful for it.

01:31:35.000 And I'm just hoping that I can help you guys go forward so you can have these conversations and actually change people's minds.

01:31:41.000 That's one thing that Naki and Jared and I will say.

01:31:43.000 You know, when we went out and we did Change My Mind the first time, We thought there's no way this is going to be a hit because I had been on Fox News for four and a half years and they were always like, soundbite kids, soundbite!

01:31:51.000 You know? That's why Al Sharpton just made things rhyme before he has the stroke and the teleprompter.

01:31:57.000 And we would sit down and do an hour conversation.

01:32:00.000 And it was just, what, tens of millions of plays?

01:32:02.000 I don't know how many. It's been one of our most successful segments because it tells me that there's a craving for truth out there right now.

01:32:09.000 That people want to see something raw.

01:32:11.000 They want to see something real.

01:32:12.000 And it surprised us.

01:32:13.000 It overwhelmed us. And so it's unbelievable that we're able to do this and people will listen.

01:32:17.000 And I do hope that it's productive and I want more people to go out.

01:32:20.000 We see people sending in pictures with Change My Mind booths.

01:32:22.000 We appreciate it. And so eventually we're going to do the book.

01:32:25.000 Yeah, it's a meme now too.

01:32:26.000 P is stored in balls. I know.

01:32:29.000 Bring it! Please continue memeing me.

01:32:31.000 So we have some strategies here, Deb, where we kind of write down overall, and this will be in the book when we sell it.

01:32:36.000 Make them define their terms.

01:32:38.000 Make them determine what the Second Amendment is.

01:32:40.000 Make them substantiate their claims.

01:32:42.000 In this case, no one really actually had any changes to the Second Amendment, but ask for their solution.

01:32:45.000 Determine exactly where their line is.

01:32:47.000 Have some positive... This is something very important.

01:32:49.000 Have positive solutions to offer, right?

01:32:51.000 But I want to see... The last claim that he made was, you think you should be able to have a tank, I believe, right?

01:32:58.000 Hold on. Let's see.

01:32:59.000 Let's see where this is. I believe that this is in here somewhere.

01:33:04.000 Hold on a second. One second.

01:33:08.000 Okay, here you go. Let's read this claim right here.

01:33:10.000 Debbie Bernal.

01:33:12.000 Okay. Okay.

01:33:13.000 So you say we need guns to resist tyranny.

01:33:16.000 Do you seriously think that you can resist the U.S. government with your own guns?

01:33:21.000 Yes, we can! That is the exact argument that we just heard, correct?

01:33:25.000 Yeah. And this is exactly what we talked about.

01:33:27.000 This is a reverse nirvana fallacy.

01:33:30.000 It's this idea of, well, we already live in a society where there's this discrepancy in power, where the government has so much power.

01:33:35.000 So the solution, I don't know, it's so illogical to me, the solution should be to strip the people who are already less powerful of the power they currently have.

01:33:43.000 It doesn't stand to reason.

01:33:45.000 Does the argument hold water?

01:33:47.000 It does not. It doesn't hold water.

01:33:49.000 And that's what the Socratic method is.

01:33:51.000 I've talked about this quite a bit.

01:33:52.000 Debbie, do you have anything else you want to peruse or read?

01:33:55.000 No? Debbie! 1.00

01:33:57.000 Debbie! Debbie! 1.00

01:34:05.000 DEBBIE! DEBBIE! DEBBIE! DEBBIE! DEBBIE! 0.99

01:34:10.000 What? Oh, hold on a second.

01:34:12.000 Alright, so we are going to have to get going pretty soon here.

01:34:14.000 And that's... well, thank you very much, I appreciate it.

01:34:16.000 Like I said, hopefully next time we come into Urbana, we bring one...

01:34:18.000 Debbie! Debbie! 1.00

01:34:22.000 Debbie! With the kick-ass fog machine, the light show, the security. 1.00

01:34:29.000 We just did SMU. By the way, we have been, we're so grateful and so humbled.

01:34:33.000 We've been grossly underestimating the audiences that show up.

01:34:36.000 As we did here today, this is last minute.

01:34:38.000 It was planned yesterday.

01:34:40.000 With McFarland Auditorium at SMU, we had to turn away people in a 2,500-seat auditorium.

01:34:44.000 Just making sure that the exits there are secure required, I think, 18, 25 police officers.

01:34:50.000 And so we're really trying to get everything up to snuff here.

01:34:53.000 We actually, specifically for you guys, just so you know, Specifically because of the miscommunications that fell through and security not being as helpful as we would have liked them to, and specifically because we weren't able to get in and bring in our equipment, we bought a shitty news van slash bus to equip so that when things like this happen, we can in an emergency drive across the country and get to you guys faster.

01:35:13.000 That way we can actually broadcast from the van.

01:35:18.000 We will broadcast from the van on the side of the road, if we have to.

01:35:22.000 We'll find a place. This is the deal.

01:35:25.000 We've talked about this. This is no longer just coming to play nice.

01:35:27.000 This is intellectually a hostile takeover.

01:35:30.000 We are coming to your campuses, period.

01:35:33.000 Whether you ban us or not, we're going to find a way.

01:35:35.000 We'll be right near the campus.

01:35:37.000 We want to come in and do the Lotter with Crider.

01:35:38.000 It's a comedy show. We want to do the same shows that liberals are able to do on campus.

01:35:42.000 We want to come in and make it entertaining for you guys so everyone can have a night of laughs and escape for a little bit.

01:35:46.000 But if we're not allowed to, if they start putting up these roadblocks, we'll just get in a bus and drive up anyway.

01:35:53.000 Because you guys...

01:35:57.000 And I say this, I'm hunched over here.

01:35:59.000 I feel like the BFG. You guys, this is genuinely about everyone out here, and I appreciate everyone here being respectful and not shouting anyone down.

01:36:06.000 This is not about the police officers on campus.

01:36:10.000 This is not about the college Republicans.

01:36:12.000 This is not about me. It's not about Nakai Jarrett.

01:36:14.000 It's about the audience here, the fans, people out there who crave truth, who want to walk in the light of truth right now on campus.

01:36:21.000 And I know it's hard. I know it's time to...

01:36:22.000 I had an email here today.

01:36:24.000 This is something I hate to end it on a dour note, but this happened at SMU. Can I talk about this?

01:36:32.000 It's a little bit kind of sensitive.

01:36:34.000 This kid sent an email today.

01:36:36.000 He talked to me, and I gave him an email to send it to.

01:36:39.000 And this is not to be self-aggrandizing.

01:36:41.000 It's because I think Nakei Jared would agree we've realized the responsibility that we have.

01:36:45.000 And that's why everyone got into a van and drove 14 hours?

01:36:49.000 Yeah, 14 hours. I had to fly, but I'm getting in the van back with him.

01:36:53.000 I'm not looking forward to it.

01:36:54.000 There was one flight left to Champaign.

01:36:57.000 Apparently a bustling airport.

01:36:58.000 But a kid came up and he talked to me after SMU. And he said, you know, your show saved my life.

01:37:05.000 I know that sounds like, well, how could it?

01:37:07.000 He said, I felt so alone, and I was very depressed, and I'm a conservative on campus, and I was constantly vilified, and as I came out of the closet as a conservative, I lost friends, and I think, I won't get into private details, but this is someone who obviously has some mental health issues.

01:37:23.000 Which is also why, by the way, I don't believe in removing fundamental human rights for people who have mental health issues because that's one thing when we talk about not wanting to stigmatize all gun owners, I think it's also important to not stigmatize anyone who has PTSD or someone who as a teenager was depressed and miserable because they tried to whack them out on drugs because they weren't more like kids and then tell them they can't own a gun to protect themselves because they have some issues.

01:37:45.000 He said, I was depressed.

01:37:47.000 Apparently, I shouldn't say kid.

01:37:48.000 Apparently PTSD. Apparently this is someone who I believe served.

01:37:52.000 It wasn't entirely clear.

01:37:53.000 You never know with the left. Sometimes they'll say PTSD because we came on campus.

01:37:56.000 But I do believe this man actually had it.

01:37:58.000 And he said, you know, really, I was depressed.

01:38:00.000 I was in a bad place. I was suicidal.

01:38:02.000 And watching this show made me feel less alone.

01:38:05.000 And here's the thing. The only point to this, and this is, we want to arm you guys.

01:38:08.000 Arm, gosh, we're going to get in trouble. With the ability to provide information to everyone on campus, we want you to all be able to provide your own arguments.

01:38:17.000 This is the opposite of exclusivity.

01:38:18.000 This is the opposite of having some secret formula.

01:38:21.000 We want to give it out to as many people as possible.

01:38:24.000 We want all of you to be able to have these conversations and change minds.

01:38:27.000 We want you to be able to do so in a way that's productive.

01:38:29.000 You don't, listen, obviously our show is pretty offensive, but we don't want to give, you don't want to give the left an excuse just by being a dick and not being able to substantiate it.

01:38:39.000 That's why we're out here, is to make sure that you guys don't feel alone.

01:38:42.000 To make sure that you guys don't feel afraid.

01:38:44.000 And if you see people like us, if you see us get banned from Twitter, if you see us get banned from YouTube, if you see us not able to be able to visit campus, I know.

01:38:52.000 We see kids, what shot do you have?

01:38:53.000 We get these emails all the time. This kid, this guy said he was really depressed and it made him feel less alone.

01:38:59.000 And this is one thing that I think everybody needs to understand.

01:39:02.000 I think it changed my mind. This whole conversation has helped.

01:39:05.000 You see with Black Lives Matter. 0.98

01:39:07.000 You see with the idea of male privilege.

01:39:09.000 You see with the idea of modern feminism. 1.00

01:39:11.000 You see it with Antifa.

01:39:13.000 And by the way, here's the thing. I understand that some of these people have had some pretty bad breaks in these groups.

01:39:19.000 I understand that some of them have legitimate grievances.

01:39:22.000 But what I also understand is they do not have a corner.

01:39:25.000 On feeling alone. Or on being afraid.

01:39:28.000 None of them do. No one has a corner on being afraid.

01:39:30.000 No one has a corner on having a tough life.

01:39:32.000 Listen, Black Lives Matter coming out and talking about systemic discrimination.

01:39:35.000 I get that this guy might have had a bad encounter, but are you going to tell me that just because of the melanin in his skin, his experience was worse than a guy who came in out of the military from an abusive alcoholic father who was suicidal with PTSD, felt so alone he was close to blowing his brains out, and then what helped him was watching a show with Not Gay Jared and I dressed up like Swedish twins.

01:39:56.000 That should tell you how afraid people are right now out there.

01:39:59.000 And the reason we do this, the reason we came here and showed up, and like I said, I know it's not ideal, we really wanted to put on something else for you guys, is just because I want you all to understand that you don't have to be afraid.

01:40:11.000 There are a lot of things to be afraid of.

01:40:12.000 Speaking up is not one of them.

01:40:14.000 The fact that you're here should vote for your confidence.

01:40:17.000 Look! Look at everyone here!

01:40:19.000 There's a movement right now, and I've been around for a long time, there's a movement afoot that I have not seen since I've been involved, since I've been alive.

01:40:26.000 This is an opportunity right now, and everyone, look at this, this would have not happened five years ago.

01:40:30.000 This would have not happened right after Barack Obama was elected.

01:40:33.000 And not only did it happen, it happened without riots, it happened without looting, and it happened where we actually seated people down, and you were more polite to them than they were to you, even though you watch a show that has people like Tranny Bain and my half-Asian lawyer telling Twitter to go f**k themselves.

01:40:47.000 You can have fun and you can still be productive.

01:40:50.000 And above all else, do not be afraid.

01:40:52.000 We love you guys so much. Let them hear your warrior!

01:40:55.000 Everyone! God bless you!

01:40:59.000 God bless Illinois someday!

Louder with Crowder - March 30, 2018

Socialism is Evil | Change My Mind

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