Making Sense - Sam Harris - Vaccine Mandates, transgender athletes, billionaires… (AMA #19)

In this episode of the Making Sense Podcast, host Sam Harris answers a question from an anonymous reader about being pro-vaccine and anti-restrictions, a position unmoored from any political base, in this interesting timeline. Sam's AMA is hosted by Alex Blumberg and features audio from the first part of his conversation with the anonymous reader, who asks about the impact of restrictions on access to vaccines and other preventative care in the post-9/11 world. This is a great episode to listen to if you ve ever wondered what it's like to live in a world where vaccines aren't available everywhere, or if you don't have access to them, and if you want to know what it really means to be pro- or anti-lockdown, this is the episode for you. Sam and Alex discuss: What is the difference between good and bad luck when it comes to dealing with a pandemic? Why is it that some people have it easier than others, and why is it more important than others? What does it mean to be a good or bad luck in the long-term? And is there a difference between luck and good luck in dealing with pandemic epidemics? Is there any such thing as luck, and is it possible to be prepared for something new in advance of the next pandemic and prepared for the next one? Sam answers these questions, and much more, in a thoughtful, thoughtful and thoughtful answer to your questions! Thanks to anonymous reader's questions. We don't know who you'd you'd like to hear from Sam Harris, and we'd love to hear your thoughts on the answers to them! Make sure to the questions you have submitted by Sam. Subscribe to The Making Sense podcast! Subscribe on Apple Podcasts! Subscribe to our podcast! Subscribe on iTunes Learn more about your ad choices and subscribe to our new podcast, and become a supporter of the podcast, too, using the promo code MINDING MONDAYSUMMING MADE Sense, by searching for "MAKING SENSE" in iTunes, wherever else you listen to podcasts are listening to this podcast? You can get 10% off your ad-free version of the show? Subscribe and get 20% off the latest episode of Making Sense, plus a FREE 7-day shipping throughout the week, starting on January 1st, only $99 a month, shipping worldwide, shipping free, free shipping, and more!

00:00:00.000 Welcome to the Making Sense Podcast.

00:00:08.860 This is Sam Harris.

00:00:10.920 Just a note to say that if you're hearing this,

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00:00:46.140 Welcome to the Making Sense Podcast.

00:00:48.420 This is Sam Harris.

00:00:51.420 Okay, jumping into an AMA here.

00:00:54.520 We got questions over Twitter and by email.

00:00:58.100 I have audio for, I believe, most of those questions.

00:01:03.800 Let's jump in.

00:01:05.280 First question.

00:01:06.800 Hi, Sam.

00:01:07.620 I'd rather remain anonymous.

00:01:09.540 My question for you pertains to being pro-vaccine

00:01:12.020 and anti-restrictions,

00:01:13.640 a position unmoored from any political base

00:01:15.860 in this interesting timeline.

00:01:17.060 I listened intently to your last

00:01:19.500 On Disappointing My Audience segment,

00:01:21.860 and I'm wondering if perhaps you're allowing

00:01:23.440 your understandable frustration

00:01:24.900 with a backwards, anti-vaccine minority

00:01:27.560 to obscure your view of what these restrictions

00:01:30.460 have really been like for much of America

00:01:32.560 that does not have the luxury of remote work.

00:01:35.540 My wife and I have been incredibly fortunate

00:01:37.440 these past two years,

00:01:38.760 but we have many friends that have lost careers,

00:01:41.480 businesses, and family

00:01:42.580 without the ability to stay home and stay safe

00:01:45.380 that is increasingly classified

00:01:47.020 as a virtuous position.

00:01:49.020 I consider myself deeply pro-vaccine

00:01:51.860 and also vehemently anti-lockdown,

00:01:54.680 a position born of a career managing risk

00:01:57.300 in complex systems for the aerospace

00:01:59.280 and defense industries.

00:02:01.360 The absolute risk that children

00:02:03.160 and vaccinated individuals have faced from COVID

00:02:05.900 has been well below ordinary background hazards

00:02:08.960 for nearly a year now,

00:02:10.460 and I believe our failure to grasp

00:02:12.520 the harm we are inflicting on children,

00:02:14.980 working women, and the poor

00:02:16.520 risks further polarization

00:02:17.940 if it is not immediately stopped.

00:02:21.080 Do you feel that unrelenting mandates

00:02:23.020 and restrictions from the left are justified?

00:02:26.120 And what do you feel they will do

00:02:27.620 to our already splintered political

00:02:29.520 and class structures if allowed to persist?

00:02:32.300 Thanks so much for taking my question.

00:02:34.560 Okay, well, good question.

00:02:36.040 Actually, I agree with most of that,

00:02:39.300 probably all of that,

00:02:41.040 and yet the question was asked

00:02:43.400 as though I was expected not to,

00:02:47.620 which makes me think there's something,

00:02:49.060 and I'm also looking at

00:02:50.060 some of these other questions here,

00:02:51.940 which put this concern in my mind.

00:02:55.060 There's something about

00:02:55.880 the way I've spoken about COVID

00:02:58.940 and vaccines

00:03:01.320 and misinformation

00:03:03.500 that has conveyed the sense

00:03:07.440 that I'm completely in favor

00:03:09.520 of the most draconian measures

00:03:12.820 we've taken to achieve

00:03:15.640 zero COVID, right?

00:03:18.920 Which, apart from in the first month or so,

00:03:22.220 was never in the cards.

00:03:24.360 I take all those points.

00:03:26.140 I think it's almost impossible

00:03:27.460 to exaggerate the difference

00:03:29.380 between good and bad luck

00:03:31.140 with respect to

00:03:32.980 what one was doing

00:03:35.480 to earn a living,

00:03:37.040 in particular,

00:03:38.220 when the pandemic hit.

00:03:39.840 And this interacts with the variable of class,

00:03:42.200 but not entirely.

00:03:44.180 I mean, there were people who

00:03:45.200 were, in fact,

00:03:47.200 very well off

00:03:48.320 before the pandemic hit,

00:03:51.460 but happened to be in industries

00:03:53.700 that just could not survive

00:03:55.660 anything like a lockdown.

00:03:58.200 So, I mean,

00:03:58.700 think of people who owned

00:03:59.680 movie theater chains

00:04:00.920 or restaurants.

00:04:03.140 And no matter how successful,

00:04:05.380 unless you had a restaurant

00:04:06.400 that could pivot to delivery,

00:04:09.780 there were some great restaurants

00:04:11.280 that failed during the pandemic.

00:04:14.160 And all of this was just luck, right?

00:04:16.420 So, I take the point

00:04:17.920 that some people have been very lucky

00:04:19.920 and had it very easy, comparatively.

00:04:22.120 In fact, some people's businesses

00:04:23.980 grew during the pandemic.

00:04:26.480 And, of course,

00:04:27.260 this differed by country, too,

00:04:29.100 where there were some countries

00:04:29.920 that locked down much harder

00:04:32.120 and much more effectively

00:04:33.020 than we did in the U.S.

00:04:35.340 I think in the beginning,

00:04:37.500 locking down

00:04:38.300 and locking down harder

00:04:39.780 than we managed to do

00:04:41.020 made eminent sense, right?

00:04:44.080 We didn't know

00:04:44.560 what we were dealing with,

00:04:45.700 and there was the possibility

00:04:47.780 of achieving something

00:04:50.220 like zero COVID,

00:04:51.300 although our openness

00:04:54.000 to immigration and travel

00:04:55.900 would have always posed

00:04:57.220 a problem there, right?

00:04:58.480 We would have had to have

00:04:59.260 closed the borders.

00:05:00.860 But the rationale for locking down

00:05:02.920 then was not so much

00:05:05.040 achieving zero COVID.

00:05:06.880 It was to avoid crashing

00:05:08.200 our health care system.

00:05:09.940 And it made perfect sense.

00:05:11.740 And the people who were

00:05:12.680 complaining about it

00:05:13.700 at the time

00:05:14.700 had no leg to stand on.

00:05:17.140 And we spent

00:05:18.500 an enormous amount

00:05:19.260 of money

00:05:19.740 trying to ensure

00:05:21.380 that no one was

00:05:22.800 too badly damaged

00:05:23.840 by our efforts there.

00:05:26.060 But once we began

00:05:27.980 to understand

00:05:28.700 the scope of the disease

00:05:31.380 and how it was transmitted,

00:05:34.720 and needless to say,

00:05:36.460 once we got

00:05:37.140 effective vaccines,

00:05:39.320 yeah,

00:05:39.700 then our thinking about

00:05:41.220 what was saying

00:05:42.320 public policy

00:05:43.280 shifted

00:05:44.100 and had to shift.

00:05:45.480 And perhaps it should

00:05:46.260 have shifted more.

00:05:47.080 I think it's pretty clear

00:05:48.280 at this point

00:05:48.840 that the degree

00:05:50.180 to which

00:05:50.760 we closed the schools

00:05:52.480 and the length

00:05:53.580 of those closures

00:05:54.440 turned out to be

00:05:55.700 a very significant mistake.

00:05:58.500 Distance learning

00:05:59.280 didn't work

00:06:00.060 all that well.

00:06:01.720 And

00:06:02.100 once we got

00:06:03.260 to a position

00:06:03.800 where anyone

00:06:04.960 who wanted to get vaccinated

00:06:06.180 could get vaccinated,

00:06:07.920 then I think

00:06:08.600 the rationale

00:06:09.160 for closing schools

00:06:10.320 and frankly

00:06:12.020 even forcing kids

00:06:13.560 to wear masks

00:06:14.380 in schools,

00:06:16.120 generally speaking,

00:06:17.560 all of that

00:06:18.060 is at minimum

00:06:18.720 quite debatable.

00:06:20.260 And my mind

00:06:20.800 is not settled

00:06:21.460 on some of these points.

00:06:23.700 But many things

00:06:24.640 have changed.

00:06:25.940 Vaccines

00:06:26.500 are ubiquitous.

00:06:28.120 We have treatments

00:06:28.780 for COVID now

00:06:29.700 that we didn't have

00:06:30.920 even a few months ago.

00:06:33.080 And the latest variant,

00:06:34.800 Omicron,

00:06:36.040 which I think

00:06:36.560 has a 98% prevalence

00:06:39.300 now,

00:06:40.420 appears to be

00:06:41.440 far more mild,

00:06:42.960 especially if you've

00:06:44.000 been vaccinated.

00:06:45.320 And COVID,

00:06:46.060 as we know,

00:06:46.480 has always been

00:06:47.320 comparatively mild

00:06:48.320 in kids.

00:06:49.800 So as for lockdowns

00:06:51.240 and even mandates,

00:06:52.600 at this point

00:06:53.780 I am skeptical,

00:06:55.720 right?

00:06:56.060 I think

00:06:56.540 mandates

00:06:58.120 are probably

00:06:59.400 counterproductive

00:07:00.520 across the board.

00:07:02.200 My friend

00:07:02.900 Peter Atiyah

00:07:03.520 just wrote

00:07:03.920 a nice article

00:07:04.600 avidly supporting

00:07:06.080 vaccines

00:07:06.700 and just as

00:07:08.040 avidly

00:07:08.560 condemning

00:07:09.220 mandates.

00:07:10.680 You can look

00:07:11.400 that up

00:07:11.700 on his website.

00:07:12.940 And I think

00:07:13.300 I agree

00:07:13.660 with basically

00:07:14.540 every point

00:07:15.060 he makes.

00:07:16.620 The one thing

00:07:17.180 I would emphasize

00:07:17.700 though

00:07:18.200 is that

00:07:19.520 his argument

00:07:20.680 only makes

00:07:21.520 sense

00:07:21.940 in the presence

00:07:23.040 of a disease

00:07:24.800 that is

00:07:25.280 comparatively

00:07:25.880 benign.

00:07:27.320 And much

00:07:27.660 of my thinking

00:07:28.240 in the last

00:07:29.520 year or year

00:07:30.420 and a half

00:07:31.020 around COVID

00:07:32.520 has been

00:07:33.620 not so much

00:07:34.300 worrying about

00:07:35.360 COVID per se.

00:07:37.320 Again,

00:07:37.640 once we got

00:07:38.360 good vaccines,

00:07:40.360 things changed

00:07:41.380 a lot.

00:07:42.660 And now

00:07:43.020 in the presence

00:07:43.520 of good treatments,

00:07:45.240 things have

00:07:46.000 changed again.

00:07:47.180 What has worried

00:07:48.200 me most

00:07:48.920 is that

00:07:49.480 we seem

00:07:50.880 completely

00:07:52.060 unable

00:07:52.620 to depoliticize

00:07:54.940 a conversation

00:07:56.040 about basic

00:07:57.920 epidemiological

00:07:59.080 facts.

00:07:59.880 and this

00:08:01.080 is terrifying

00:08:01.700 if you

00:08:02.140 imagine

00:08:02.680 a much

00:08:03.780 more

00:08:03.980 lethal

00:08:04.400 pandemic.

00:08:05.880 Again,

00:08:06.520 it's possible

00:08:07.040 to imagine

00:08:07.660 that as you

00:08:08.860 turn the

00:08:09.260 lethality

00:08:09.840 dial up,

00:08:11.300 everyone's

00:08:11.980 politics will

00:08:13.080 magically

00:08:13.920 evaporate.

00:08:15.120 All the

00:08:15.540 conspiracy

00:08:15.940 thinking

00:08:16.460 will find

00:08:17.320 nowhere to

00:08:17.760 land.

00:08:18.620 Just the

00:08:19.460 sheer terror

00:08:20.200 of mortality

00:08:21.480 will clarify

00:08:22.920 everyone's

00:08:24.180 epistemology.

00:08:24.920 no one

00:08:26.240 will have

00:08:26.520 any time

00:08:27.020 for Alex

00:08:27.940 Jones

00:08:28.340 when they

00:08:28.680 see a

00:08:28.960 sufficient

00:08:29.240 number

00:08:29.520 of bodies

00:08:30.160 stacked

00:08:30.860 like

00:08:31.460 cordwood

00:08:31.960 in a

00:08:32.520 park.

00:08:33.340 But I'm

00:08:34.140 not so

00:08:34.460 sure.

00:08:35.300 I think

00:08:35.500 the fragmentation

00:08:36.360 of our

00:08:37.660 media

00:08:38.540 ecosystem,

00:08:40.280 I think

00:08:40.600 what's

00:08:40.840 happened

00:08:41.200 on podcasts

00:08:42.400 and in

00:08:43.180 newsletters

00:08:43.820 and in

00:08:44.500 right-wing

00:08:44.860 media,

00:08:45.960 I think

00:08:46.220 the ways

00:08:46.540 in which

00:08:46.860 Republicans

00:08:47.400 in particular

00:08:48.220 have tried

00:08:48.580 to leverage

00:08:49.280 an anti-vax

00:08:50.740 hysteria,

00:08:52.140 something like

00:08:52.720 this I

00:08:53.800 think is

00:08:54.120 quite possible

00:08:55.000 even in

00:08:56.260 the presence

00:08:56.740 of much

00:08:57.620 more serious

00:08:58.380 disease.

00:08:59.820 And if

00:09:00.280 that's the

00:09:00.640 case,

00:09:01.520 and we

00:09:01.840 were to

00:09:02.180 fail to

00:09:02.900 solve our

00:09:04.260 problems of

00:09:04.940 coordination

00:09:05.560 and cooperation

00:09:06.900 and basic

00:09:08.480 trust of

00:09:09.260 institutions

00:09:09.860 and public

00:09:11.100 health messaging

00:09:11.780 in the

00:09:12.700 presence of

00:09:13.140 something 10

00:09:14.460 or 20

00:09:15.000 or 30

00:09:15.520 times more

00:09:16.540 lethal,

00:09:17.240 that's what

00:09:18.420 I'm worried

00:09:18.740 about.

00:09:19.600 It has been

00:09:20.280 a very long

00:09:21.220 time since

00:09:22.600 I was

00:09:22.860 personally

00:09:23.520 worried

00:09:24.060 about

00:09:24.760 catching

00:09:25.260 COVID.

00:09:26.440 I haven't

00:09:26.980 caught it.

00:09:27.740 I still

00:09:28.120 do what

00:09:28.540 I can

00:09:29.040 to keep

00:09:29.900 myself

00:09:30.300 and my

00:09:30.940 family

00:09:31.340 safe.

00:09:32.760 Much of

00:09:33.340 my thinking

00:09:33.660 here is

00:09:34.200 still focused

00:09:34.800 on the

00:09:35.160 few members

00:09:35.600 of our

00:09:35.840 family who

00:09:36.440 have

00:09:36.980 significant

00:09:37.560 comorbidities

00:09:38.620 and for

00:09:39.600 whom

00:09:39.940 even a

00:09:40.780 vaccine

00:09:41.260 doesn't

00:09:41.860 seem like

00:09:42.280 a perfect

00:09:43.040 insurance

00:09:43.620 policy.

00:09:44.600 But

00:09:45.280 if you've

00:09:46.100 gotten the

00:09:46.440 idea

00:09:46.840 that

00:09:47.900 I think

00:09:48.840 we should

00:09:49.200 be responding

00:09:49.880 to COVID

00:09:51.140 itself

00:09:52.080 as though

00:09:53.220 it were

00:09:54.160 a terrifyingly

00:09:55.040 lethal

00:09:55.380 illness

00:09:55.960 at this

00:09:56.760 point,

00:09:57.260 that's not

00:09:58.280 what I've

00:09:58.620 meant to

00:09:58.900 convey.

00:09:59.580 What I've

00:10:00.060 meant to

00:10:00.280 convey is

00:10:00.920 my absolute

00:10:01.800 astonishment

00:10:02.960 and despair

00:10:03.780 in the face

00:10:05.260 of the

00:10:06.480 fragmentation

00:10:07.260 of our

00:10:08.440 society,

00:10:09.220 the total

00:10:10.440 loss of

00:10:11.140 trust

00:10:11.940 in institutions.

00:10:13.620 In fact,

00:10:14.080 the conviction

00:10:14.720 among so many

00:10:16.260 otherwise smart

00:10:16.900 people that

00:10:18.120 we don't

00:10:18.400 even need

00:10:18.960 institutions.

00:10:20.520 That's the

00:10:20.960 old way.

00:10:22.300 Now we're

00:10:22.700 going to

00:10:22.860 just run

00:10:23.280 this thing

00:10:23.760 by podcast

00:10:24.720 and newsletter

00:10:25.900 and Twitter

00:10:26.900 feed.

00:10:27.620 That's how

00:10:28.240 we're going

00:10:28.460 to deal

00:10:28.680 with all

00:10:28.920 the challenges

00:10:29.520 we face

00:10:30.560 in this

00:10:31.160 century.

00:10:32.940 Cybersecurity,

00:10:33.940 cyberterrorism,

00:10:35.280 the remaining

00:10:35.720 threat of

00:10:36.160 nuclear war,

00:10:37.920 climate change,

00:10:39.520 pandemics,

00:10:40.400 natural and

00:10:41.020 engineered,

00:10:42.440 the threat

00:10:42.820 of artificial

00:10:43.260 intelligence,

00:10:44.540 run amok,

00:10:45.060 the pressures

00:10:46.320 exerted on

00:10:46.960 our society

00:10:47.580 by wealth

00:10:48.360 and equality.

00:10:49.560 All we need

00:10:50.040 to do is

00:10:50.520 move fast

00:10:51.200 and break

00:10:51.640 things.

00:10:52.400 We just

00:10:52.740 need disruptors.

00:10:54.120 We're going

00:10:54.420 to run

00:10:54.620 this whole

00:10:55.000 thing like

00:10:55.460 it's a

00:10:55.740 new tech

00:10:56.900 startup.

00:10:58.180 That's how

00:10:58.500 we're going

00:10:58.700 to maintain

00:10:59.120 cruising altitude

00:10:59.900 into the

00:11:00.700 22nd century.

00:11:02.840 That's

00:11:03.400 completely

00:11:03.860 insane.

00:11:05.580 It feels

00:11:06.400 in some

00:11:06.720 sense like

00:11:07.120 the teenagers

00:11:07.720 have taken

00:11:08.520 over the

00:11:09.220 place.

00:11:10.020 There's no

00:11:10.720 expertise

00:11:11.180 that matters.

00:11:12.960 You can't

00:11:13.440 trust the

00:11:13.860 experts anymore.

00:11:15.060 know we're

00:11:16.640 all going

00:11:16.860 to get

00:11:17.020 online and

00:11:17.760 become

00:11:18.340 epidemiologists

00:11:20.160 and virologists

00:11:21.720 and immunologists

00:11:22.980 in a few

00:11:24.500 short weeks

00:11:25.140 by doing

00:11:26.400 a lot of

00:11:27.040 Google

00:11:27.840 searching

00:11:28.340 and YouTube.

00:11:31.720 Douglas

00:11:32.320 Murray told

00:11:33.120 me recently

00:11:33.780 that he

00:11:35.260 saw a tweet

00:11:35.900 where someone

00:11:37.460 said on

00:11:37.880 Twitter,

00:11:38.500 oh look,

00:11:39.140 all the people

00:11:39.700 who knew

00:11:40.020 everything about

00:11:40.600 COVID last

00:11:41.220 week now

00:11:41.880 know everything

00:11:42.300 about Afghanistan.

00:11:45.260 I mean,

00:11:46.020 that is the

00:11:46.600 spirit of

00:11:47.120 the time

00:11:47.580 and it's

00:11:49.900 not good

00:11:50.380 for us.

00:11:52.000 The truth

00:11:52.800 is I have

00:11:54.040 at no point

00:11:54.960 in this

00:11:56.040 pandemic

00:11:56.460 had a

00:11:57.720 strong opinion

00:11:58.720 about

00:11:59.960 COVID

00:12:00.800 or public

00:12:02.460 health measures.

00:12:03.400 Right?

00:12:03.980 I have just

00:12:04.900 had a strong

00:12:05.860 opinion

00:12:06.220 that it

00:12:08.600 makes no

00:12:09.140 sense for

00:12:10.400 unqualified

00:12:11.240 people to

00:12:12.480 have strong

00:12:13.080 opinions on

00:12:14.340 these matters

00:12:14.840 and that it's

00:12:16.020 dangerous when

00:12:17.380 you have

00:12:17.660 millions and

00:12:18.540 millions of

00:12:19.060 people deciding

00:12:20.620 that their

00:12:21.660 intuitions about

00:12:23.200 a brand new

00:12:23.920 pathogen and

00:12:25.280 the first

00:12:25.800 significant

00:12:26.320 pandemic in

00:12:27.120 anyone's

00:12:27.720 lifetime should

00:12:29.100 supersede the

00:12:30.600 product of

00:12:31.140 rational scientific

00:12:32.620 investigation by

00:12:34.400 those who are

00:12:35.000 most qualified

00:12:35.880 to perform

00:12:37.060 it.

00:12:37.980 And the

00:12:38.600 difference

00:12:39.120 between

00:12:39.740 dispassionate

00:12:41.020 scientific analysis

00:12:42.000 of COVID

00:12:43.480 or anything

00:12:43.940 else and

00:12:45.400 advocacy,

00:12:46.980 right,

00:12:47.280 there's a

00:12:47.700 difference there

00:12:48.540 that is

00:12:50.100 very difficult

00:12:51.600 to digest

00:12:53.300 and we are

00:12:54.760 clearly bad

00:12:55.820 at doing

00:12:56.760 this.

00:12:57.520 And we have

00:12:58.320 to get our

00:12:58.660 act together

00:12:59.120 because this

00:12:59.960 will not be

00:13:00.420 the last

00:13:00.860 pandemic.

00:13:01.340 In fact,

00:13:03.460 given how

00:13:04.320 disruptive

00:13:04.920 COVID has

00:13:05.940 been, I

00:13:07.040 would bet

00:13:07.340 that the

00:13:07.660 threat of

00:13:08.220 bioterrorism

00:13:09.180 has increased

00:13:10.440 significantly.

00:13:11.820 This is about

00:13:12.440 the easiest

00:13:12.980 way possible

00:13:14.580 to disrupt

00:13:15.800 a society.

00:13:17.020 And if

00:13:17.340 you're a

00:13:17.600 nihilist,

00:13:18.580 or you're

00:13:19.160 insane,

00:13:20.320 or you're

00:13:20.740 a jihadist,

00:13:22.080 or you're

00:13:22.460 a fanatic of

00:13:23.200 some other

00:13:23.680 stripe,

00:13:24.900 well then

00:13:25.400 bioterrorism

00:13:26.800 just got its

00:13:28.160 Super Bowl

00:13:28.900 commercial.

00:13:30.880 So,

00:13:31.500 getting better

00:13:32.020 at responding

00:13:32.700 to a

00:13:33.400 pandemic,

00:13:34.660 getting better

00:13:35.260 at producing

00:13:36.100 vaccines,

00:13:37.240 and getting

00:13:37.660 people to

00:13:38.160 actually take

00:13:38.820 them,

00:13:40.060 I consider

00:13:40.640 that one

00:13:41.020 of our

00:13:41.240 most important

00:13:42.080 tasks as

00:13:43.300 a society

00:13:43.940 at this

00:13:44.540 point.

00:13:46.140 Okay,

00:13:47.100 next question.

00:13:48.480 Hi Sam,

00:13:49.000 my name is

00:13:49.520 Andy and I

00:13:50.160 live in

00:13:50.440 Milwaukee,

00:13:50.960 Wisconsin.

00:13:52.300 My question

00:13:52.880 for you is

00:13:53.420 related to

00:13:54.040 mindfulness and

00:13:54.800 memories.

00:13:55.940 I've been

00:13:56.280 finding a lot

00:13:56.880 of value in

00:13:57.460 your guided

00:13:57.860 meditations on

00:13:58.720 the Waking

00:13:59.100 Up app,

00:14:00.040 and since

00:14:00.500 I've started

00:14:00.960 practicing I've

00:14:01.780 noticed an

00:14:02.320 improvement in

00:14:03.240 my ability to

00:14:04.000 recenter myself

00:14:04.840 in times of

00:14:05.500 stress,

00:14:06.540 especially when

00:14:07.280 confronted with

00:14:08.040 embarrassing or

00:14:08.820 regrettable memories.

00:14:10.720 Some people

00:14:11.260 suggest that

00:14:11.900 memories like

00:14:12.480 these resurface

00:14:13.380 now and then

00:14:13.940 because they

00:14:14.440 aren't fully

00:14:14.900 resolved.

00:14:16.460 Do you think

00:14:16.880 that these

00:14:17.260 memories need

00:14:17.960 a resolution,

00:14:19.180 or is

00:14:19.520 mindfulness the

00:14:20.180 best way to

00:14:20.660 manage them?

00:14:21.840 Thanks Sam.

00:14:23.080 Thank you for

00:14:23.760 the question Andy.

00:14:25.300 I don't have

00:14:25.700 much of a

00:14:26.200 psychodynamic

00:14:27.100 interest in

00:14:28.700 mulling over

00:14:30.160 the past.

00:14:31.680 It's not to

00:14:32.220 say that's

00:14:32.860 not ever

00:14:33.740 useful.

00:14:34.980 There are

00:14:35.180 certainly patterns

00:14:35.980 you can

00:14:36.500 discover,

00:14:37.480 and making

00:14:37.960 that discovery

00:14:38.620 can equip you

00:14:40.140 to live

00:14:40.960 differently,

00:14:41.740 right?

00:14:42.020 If you see

00:14:42.320 you keep

00:14:42.620 getting into

00:14:43.020 the same

00:14:43.400 situations and

00:14:44.420 suffering the

00:14:45.780 same kinds

00:14:46.520 of collisions

00:14:47.500 with other

00:14:49.200 people or

00:14:49.980 circumstances,

00:14:51.620 there may be

00:14:52.480 something to

00:14:52.980 resolve conceptually

00:14:55.220 about all

00:14:55.900 that, but

00:14:57.580 generally

00:14:58.980 speaking, the

00:15:00.520 fact that a

00:15:01.460 painful memory

00:15:02.720 or an

00:15:03.940 embarrassing

00:15:04.380 one surfaces

00:15:06.160 and that it

00:15:07.620 is painful or

00:15:09.100 embarrassing in

00:15:09.840 the present,

00:15:11.180 that doesn't

00:15:11.880 really suggest to

00:15:12.700 me that there's

00:15:13.180 something unresolved

00:15:15.080 about that.

00:15:17.340 It's just a

00:15:18.120 more general

00:15:18.560 symptom of

00:15:19.580 this feeling

00:15:21.160 of being a

00:15:22.560 self, right?

00:15:23.400 that's what's

00:15:24.380 unresolved for

00:15:25.700 everyone until

00:15:26.660 you can resolve

00:15:28.140 it, right?

00:15:29.240 I mean, it

00:15:29.560 just feels

00:15:30.500 lousy to

00:15:32.900 feel identified

00:15:34.860 with this

00:15:38.200 fictional center

00:15:40.280 of gravity,

00:15:41.640 especially in

00:15:42.720 the midst of

00:15:43.780 unpleasant thoughts

00:15:45.480 about one's

00:15:46.480 past or

00:15:47.280 future,

00:15:48.140 right?

00:15:48.980 So the

00:15:50.200 interesting

00:15:50.460 question is,

00:15:51.180 how is it

00:15:52.460 that in

00:15:53.940 the present

00:15:54.480 moment,

00:15:55.520 a memory

00:15:56.200 of something

00:15:57.560 that happened

00:15:58.200 even quite

00:15:59.640 long ago

00:16:00.280 can arise

00:16:01.700 in the

00:16:02.180 totally

00:16:02.880 evanescent

00:16:03.980 way that

00:16:04.720 any memory

00:16:05.680 does,

00:16:07.000 and yet

00:16:07.560 carry with

00:16:08.840 it a

00:16:09.720 fair tonnage

00:16:11.200 of misery,

00:16:13.160 right?

00:16:13.980 How does it

00:16:14.720 impose its

00:16:15.520 weight on

00:16:16.560 you in

00:16:17.680 this moment?

00:16:18.140 not why

00:16:20.180 does it,

00:16:21.120 right?

00:16:21.380 That's the

00:16:22.600 sort of

00:16:22.880 resolution

00:16:23.360 you're asking

00:16:24.420 about,

00:16:25.040 but how

00:16:25.940 does it?

00:16:27.340 What is

00:16:27.900 the mechanism?

00:16:29.180 How is it

00:16:29.660 possible for

00:16:31.180 something as

00:16:31.700 gossamer as

00:16:33.080 a thought to

00:16:34.740 make you

00:16:35.140 miserable in

00:16:36.540 this moment?

00:16:38.180 Well, the

00:16:39.100 discovery to be

00:16:39.940 made here is

00:16:40.900 that it is

00:16:41.400 something that

00:16:43.360 you're doing,

00:16:44.200 right?

00:16:44.660 There's a

00:16:44.960 contraction,

00:16:45.600 there's a

00:16:46.820 failure to

00:16:48.160 recognize

00:16:48.840 thought as

00:16:50.520 thought that

00:16:51.920 is the

00:16:52.180 proximate cause

00:16:53.080 of the

00:16:54.000 present

00:16:54.380 suffering,

00:16:55.480 and for

00:16:56.620 that,

00:16:57.000 mindfulness

00:16:57.400 really is

00:16:58.440 the antidote,

00:16:59.800 right?

00:16:59.980 A clear

00:17:00.480 scene of

00:17:01.800 the mechanics

00:17:02.300 here,

00:17:02.640 and the

00:17:04.280 freedom to

00:17:05.600 be felt is

00:17:06.800 the freedom

00:17:07.220 of just

00:17:08.020 watching this

00:17:09.820 otherwise

00:17:10.340 lethal thought

00:17:12.040 just pass

00:17:13.140 you by,

00:17:14.120 right, and

00:17:14.540 realize that

00:17:15.260 you as

00:17:16.680 the conscious

00:17:17.140 witness in

00:17:17.940 this moment

00:17:18.460 are truly

00:17:19.980 unimplicated.

00:17:21.640 The past

00:17:22.260 truly resolves

00:17:23.400 itself when

00:17:24.820 you can stand

00:17:25.420 free of it

00:17:26.060 in the

00:17:26.560 present.

00:17:27.780 Again, there

00:17:28.520 may be other

00:17:28.900 things that

00:17:29.460 are useful to

00:17:30.040 do conceptually.

00:17:32.440 Reframing

00:17:33.060 your thoughts

00:17:33.600 about the

00:17:34.100 past can

00:17:35.260 also help

00:17:36.380 in many

00:17:36.980 ways.

00:17:38.060 You can

00:17:38.260 view some

00:17:38.680 past trauma

00:17:39.840 or embarrassment

00:17:40.640 as the

00:17:42.640 very thing

00:17:43.360 that gave

00:17:44.280 you certain

00:17:45.500 skills or

00:17:46.780 feelings of

00:17:47.840 compassion

00:17:48.360 in the

00:17:49.700 present.

00:17:50.360 You might

00:17:51.000 be able to

00:17:51.340 draw a

00:17:51.720 direct line

00:17:52.460 from something

00:17:53.920 terrible that

00:17:54.600 happened a

00:17:55.960 decade ago

00:17:56.680 to your

00:17:58.200 ability to

00:17:58.920 help specific

00:18:00.500 people in

00:18:01.020 your life

00:18:01.520 with similar

00:18:03.060 challenges in

00:18:04.220 the present.

00:18:04.620 So there's

00:18:05.640 reframing

00:18:06.600 that is

00:18:08.060 available to

00:18:09.220 us much of

00:18:09.760 the time

00:18:10.180 that can be

00:18:11.160 very powerful.

00:18:12.820 But from

00:18:13.680 my point of

00:18:14.160 view, there

00:18:14.460 is no

00:18:15.160 real antidote

00:18:17.260 to the

00:18:18.260 most basic

00:18:18.960 mental

00:18:19.520 suffering that

00:18:21.000 is better

00:18:21.400 than insight

00:18:22.300 into the

00:18:23.560 illusoriness

00:18:24.260 of the

00:18:25.340 self around

00:18:26.760 which all

00:18:27.280 of our

00:18:27.560 suffering

00:18:28.000 appears to

00:18:28.920 be

00:18:29.160 constellated.

00:18:30.900 Anyway, hope

00:18:31.800 that helps,

00:18:32.240 Andy.

00:18:32.380 Hi, Sam.

00:18:34.480 My name is

00:18:35.000 Isabel and

00:18:35.660 I live in

00:18:36.100 New York.

00:18:37.160 My question

00:18:37.720 for you is

00:18:38.540 how can you

00:18:39.240 work through

00:18:39.620 a consequential

00:18:40.420 lie by a

00:18:41.540 close and

00:18:41.960 trusted person

00:18:42.660 in your

00:18:42.980 life?

00:18:43.860 How can you

00:18:44.620 forgive and

00:18:45.260 trust again?

00:18:46.440 Can you share

00:18:46.960 your own

00:18:47.340 experience on

00:18:48.100 how you've

00:18:48.560 dealt with

00:18:48.920 lying by

00:18:49.360 someone you

00:18:49.840 care about?

00:18:51.080 Thank you,

00:18:51.520 Sam.

00:18:52.740 Hey, Isabel.

00:18:53.440 Thanks for

00:18:53.800 the question.

00:18:54.920 Well, this

00:18:55.220 goes to the

00:18:56.100 topic of

00:18:57.140 forgiveness,

00:18:58.540 which is more

00:19:00.120 general than

00:19:00.980 the issue of

00:19:01.800 lying.

00:19:03.300 And there,

00:19:03.840 for me,

00:19:04.740 the crucial

00:19:05.740 variable in

00:19:07.760 whether or

00:19:08.100 not you can

00:19:08.480 forgive somebody,

00:19:10.100 whether or

00:19:10.340 not an

00:19:10.840 apology is

00:19:11.740 acceptable,

00:19:13.300 is if you

00:19:15.160 can see how

00:19:16.220 this person

00:19:17.120 has changed.

00:19:18.860 If you can

00:19:19.440 see how

00:19:20.080 they view

00:19:21.420 their past

00:19:22.340 action,

00:19:23.860 which you

00:19:24.260 find

00:19:24.680 reprehensible,

00:19:25.760 in this

00:19:26.160 case a lie,

00:19:27.240 in the same

00:19:28.240 way that you

00:19:28.640 do,

00:19:29.680 which is to

00:19:30.860 say they

00:19:31.140 disavow it,

00:19:32.000 and they

00:19:33.000 assure you

00:19:33.940 that it

00:19:34.220 won't happen

00:19:34.640 again.

00:19:35.640 To take your

00:19:36.480 question generically,

00:19:37.920 assuming we're

00:19:39.060 talking about a

00:19:39.780 significant betrayal

00:19:41.120 of trust,

00:19:42.600 the question for

00:19:43.240 you is,

00:19:44.500 well,

00:19:45.220 can I ever

00:19:46.240 trust this

00:19:46.820 person again?

00:19:48.200 And that

00:19:48.500 depends,

00:19:49.160 at least in

00:19:49.640 part,

00:19:50.000 on their

00:19:51.120 view of

00:19:52.020 what they

00:19:52.320 did.

00:19:53.280 Do they

00:19:53.680 regret

00:19:54.200 lying to

00:19:55.000 you?

00:19:55.720 Or do they

00:19:56.400 have some

00:19:56.940 defensive story

00:19:58.020 about why

00:19:58.660 it was

00:19:59.280 necessary?

00:20:00.280 So those

00:20:01.060 are the

00:20:01.300 kinds of

00:20:01.780 details that

00:20:02.460 matter.

00:20:03.260 I think to

00:20:03.780 forgive someone,

00:20:05.480 we need to

00:20:06.960 feel that

00:20:07.640 there's a

00:20:08.300 plausible path

00:20:09.300 that stretches

00:20:10.180 from who

00:20:10.980 they used

00:20:11.400 to be,

00:20:12.280 when they

00:20:13.100 intentionally

00:20:14.140 injured us,

00:20:15.380 to who they

00:20:16.420 purport to be

00:20:17.480 now,

00:20:18.180 someone who

00:20:19.520 can be

00:20:19.880 forgiven and

00:20:21.560 brought back

00:20:22.660 into the

00:20:23.000 fold.

00:20:23.320 but it's

00:20:26.140 also important

00:20:26.640 to acknowledge

00:20:27.160 that it

00:20:28.280 is often

00:20:29.000 hard for

00:20:30.040 people to

00:20:30.480 change,

00:20:31.620 right?

00:20:31.880 And if you

00:20:32.460 have someone

00:20:32.840 who's quite

00:20:34.120 habituated to

00:20:35.060 lying,

00:20:36.360 that's hard

00:20:38.200 to completely

00:20:39.040 reform,

00:20:40.560 unless the

00:20:41.000 person has

00:20:41.580 had some

00:20:42.000 real ethical

00:20:43.100 breakthrough.

00:20:44.680 So,

00:20:45.580 sometimes,

00:20:46.660 when you

00:20:47.380 catch someone

00:20:47.840 lying,

00:20:48.380 you understand

00:20:49.700 something about

00:20:51.020 who they're

00:20:52.020 likely to be

00:20:52.520 in the future,

00:20:53.320 and forgiveness

00:20:55.260 or apologies

00:20:56.540 aside,

00:20:57.560 it might not

00:20:58.860 be appropriate

00:20:59.800 to trust them

00:21:01.120 all that much

00:21:01.940 going forward,

00:21:02.800 depending on how

00:21:04.060 ingrained this

00:21:05.260 tendency is.

00:21:07.040 So,

00:21:07.600 there are many

00:21:08.180 variables that

00:21:08.980 are hopeless

00:21:09.640 to quantify

00:21:10.280 and really

00:21:11.760 must be judged

00:21:12.560 intuitively.

00:21:14.820 Anyway,

00:21:15.520 I hope that

00:21:15.980 helps.

00:21:16.860 Thanks for the

00:21:17.320 question.

00:21:18.780 Hi,

00:21:18.960 Sam.

00:21:19.360 My name is

00:21:19.900 Tim,

00:21:20.220 and I live

00:21:20.520 in Ontario,

00:21:21.240 Canada.

00:21:22.300 My question

00:21:22.800 for you is

00:21:23.340 regarding your

00:21:23.920 plans to

00:21:24.600 promote

00:21:24.960 effective

00:21:25.500 altruism

00:21:26.140 by awarding

00:21:27.520 NFTs to

00:21:29.240 certain

00:21:29.760 individuals who

00:21:30.760 donate sufficiently

00:21:31.780 large amounts

00:21:32.600 to certain

00:21:33.960 charitable

00:21:34.380 organizations.

00:21:35.740 I think it's a

00:21:36.680 great idea,

00:21:37.740 but I'm just

00:21:38.280 wondering if you

00:21:39.120 would consider

00:21:39.620 expanding the

00:21:40.400 scope to

00:21:41.540 include people

00:21:42.280 who may or may

00:21:43.060 not have a lot

00:21:43.680 of money to

00:21:44.100 give,

00:21:44.760 or who simply

00:21:45.580 give their time

00:21:46.220 and efforts in

00:21:46.820 a way that

00:21:47.800 also achieves

00:21:48.500 effective

00:21:48.920 altruism and

00:21:50.200 equals or exceeds

00:21:51.000 any good that

00:21:51.580 a monetary

00:21:52.040 donation to

00:21:53.340 a charitable

00:21:53.720 organization might

00:21:54.760 do.

00:21:56.020 Should such

00:21:56.540 people not

00:21:57.120 also be eligible

00:21:58.140 to receive the

00:21:59.300 recognition that

00:22:00.080 these NFTs

00:22:00.780 endow?

00:22:01.720 Thanks very much,

00:22:02.660 Sam.

00:22:03.540 Thanks for the

00:22:04.440 question,

00:22:04.800 Tim.

00:22:05.420 This gives me a

00:22:06.020 chance to clarify

00:22:06.700 something that

00:22:07.380 apparently was not

00:22:08.520 clear, although if

00:22:10.340 you get into the

00:22:11.140 fine print on the

00:22:12.360 giving what we can

00:22:13.700 pledge, it becomes

00:22:15.620 clear.

00:22:15.920 it's not about the

00:22:17.520 amount of money

00:22:18.560 that anyone would

00:22:19.700 give, it's the

00:22:21.180 percentage of

00:22:22.420 earnings, right?

00:22:23.620 So it doesn't

00:22:24.240 matter how much

00:22:24.800 money you make,

00:22:26.040 you could be

00:22:26.460 making $30,000 a

00:22:28.480 year, if you're

00:22:29.940 giving a minimum

00:22:31.080 of 10% of what

00:22:32.880 you make, you can

00:22:34.200 take that pledge.

00:22:35.900 Of course, there's

00:22:36.500 this added

00:22:37.160 consideration that

00:22:39.620 many people might

00:22:40.960 realize that the

00:22:41.740 best way they can

00:22:42.580 contribute to the

00:22:44.260 most urgent causes

00:22:45.260 is to simply make

00:22:47.300 a lot of money in

00:22:48.460 some unobjectionable

00:22:50.000 way and give a

00:22:52.120 lot of money each

00:22:53.140 year to those

00:22:53.760 causes, right?

00:22:54.860 Rather than

00:22:55.420 volunteer somewhere

00:22:57.180 or spend their

00:22:58.580 time in some way

00:22:59.260 that's explicitly

00:23:00.060 philanthropic.

00:23:01.920 And this is what

00:23:02.420 Will McCaskill and

00:23:03.400 the other effective

00:23:04.220 altruists call

00:23:05.180 earning to give.

00:23:07.300 And that's what

00:23:07.720 Sam Bankman-Fried

00:23:08.620 is up to over

00:23:09.920 there at FTX.

00:23:11.200 And of course,

00:23:12.060 10% is just the

00:23:13.120 minimum many

00:23:14.220 effective altruists

00:23:15.120 give much more

00:23:16.700 than that.

00:23:17.920 And some people

00:23:18.420 pledge to give

00:23:19.380 everything above

00:23:21.260 a certain amount.

00:23:22.340 They decide what

00:23:23.500 they want every

00:23:24.900 year to live on

00:23:25.620 and then give

00:23:28.000 100% beyond

00:23:29.660 that number.

00:23:31.680 And again, that

00:23:32.540 number can be

00:23:33.520 whatever you want

00:23:34.280 it to be, right?

00:23:35.140 I mean, I'm not

00:23:36.120 advocating that

00:23:37.760 people live

00:23:38.700 abstemious lives

00:23:40.620 and give everything

00:23:42.200 else to charity.

00:23:43.480 I mean, that's

00:23:44.100 amazing if you

00:23:45.820 want to live that

00:23:46.440 way, but I really

00:23:47.980 don't have a

00:23:48.740 negative conception

00:23:50.340 of wealth here,

00:23:51.960 right?

00:23:52.220 I don't think that...

00:23:54.420 I mean, you take

00:23:54.840 someone like Sam

00:23:55.500 Bankman-Fried,

00:23:56.420 right, who's making

00:23:57.180 billions of dollars

00:23:58.960 and will be giving

00:24:00.260 billions of dollars

00:24:01.300 to the most urgent

00:24:02.640 causes.

00:24:03.360 In my mind, it

00:24:04.400 really doesn't matter

00:24:05.280 how much money he

00:24:06.860 spends on himself,

00:24:08.000 right?

00:24:08.980 Because anything he

00:24:09.920 spends on himself

00:24:10.880 really is just a

00:24:12.520 rounding error on

00:24:14.040 the amount of money

00:24:14.800 he will ultimately

00:24:15.820 be giving away,

00:24:16.720 right?

00:24:16.900 The difference

00:24:17.360 between him living

00:24:18.220 in a studio apartment

00:24:19.260 and him having a

00:24:21.300 30,000 square foot

00:24:22.420 house in one of the

00:24:23.740 most expensive cities

00:24:24.740 on earth would be

00:24:25.940 almost impossible to

00:24:27.120 discern against his

00:24:29.600 actual wealth.

00:24:30.960 Obviously, he's an

00:24:31.840 outlier, but something

00:24:33.540 like that applies to

00:24:35.360 the rest of us.

00:24:36.140 I do think that if

00:24:37.540 we're going to solve

00:24:38.140 our problems

00:24:38.960 collectively, it's

00:24:41.480 not going to be a

00:24:42.140 matter of convincing

00:24:44.040 the most affluent

00:24:45.640 people and societies

00:24:47.600 to make significant

00:24:49.440 sacrifices.

00:24:50.660 I think we need to

00:24:51.600 improve technology,

00:24:53.000 we need to

00:24:53.700 increasingly produce

00:24:55.460 what we produce in

00:24:56.340 a carbon-neutral way,

00:24:57.660 and then we need to

00:24:58.880 prioritize helping

00:25:01.060 people and

00:25:02.760 safeguarding the

00:25:03.760 future.

00:25:04.720 And I really do

00:25:05.320 think we can

00:25:05.960 massively change

00:25:07.840 how we allocate

00:25:09.300 resources without

00:25:10.940 stigmatizing wealth.

00:25:13.580 And part of this

00:25:14.100 has to do with

00:25:15.040 creating virtuous

00:25:17.820 cycles that leverage

00:25:20.200 people's desire

00:25:22.400 for better things.

00:25:24.160 This has happened

00:25:25.100 with electric cars,

00:25:26.380 right?

00:25:26.580 Elon Musk started

00:25:28.200 building electric cars

00:25:30.080 that did not represent

00:25:32.220 a sacrifice for anyone,

00:25:34.140 right?

00:25:35.080 He made electric cars

00:25:36.400 some of the most

00:25:37.320 desirable cars

00:25:38.480 ever built.

00:25:40.120 I mean, you have to

00:25:40.680 spend something like

00:25:41.520 two million dollars

00:25:42.740 on a combustion

00:25:44.360 engine car

00:25:45.220 to have a car

00:25:46.560 that is faster

00:25:47.600 than the

00:25:48.900 current version

00:25:50.080 of the Model S.

00:25:51.640 So,

00:25:52.420 if you want a fast

00:25:53.760 car,

00:25:54.500 it's completely

00:25:55.400 rational to want

00:25:56.580 an electric one

00:25:57.480 at this point.

00:25:58.720 And I think

00:25:59.940 that's the path

00:26:00.700 forward on many

00:26:02.060 other fronts,

00:26:02.880 in particular

00:26:03.860 with the problem

00:26:05.080 of climate change.

00:26:06.440 I think we can

00:26:06.980 get there by

00:26:07.560 focusing on the

00:26:08.580 things we want,

00:26:09.940 right?

00:26:10.200 For climate change,

00:26:11.880 and now I'm

00:26:12.700 rambling,

00:26:13.820 for climate change,

00:26:14.920 we don't even have

00:26:15.720 to talk about

00:26:16.260 climate change.

00:26:17.360 We can just talk

00:26:18.220 about the virtues

00:26:18.820 of having clean air.

00:26:20.900 You just look at

00:26:21.580 the consequences

00:26:22.340 of particulate

00:26:23.120 pollution

00:26:23.560 and how much

00:26:24.780 nicer it is

00:26:25.740 to live in a city

00:26:27.080 that doesn't have any.

00:26:28.940 That solves for

00:26:29.640 climate change.

00:26:30.960 And there you're

00:26:31.360 just talking about

00:26:31.900 people not dying

00:26:32.880 from emphysema

00:26:34.020 and cardiac arrest

00:26:35.680 and everything else

00:26:36.980 that bad air

00:26:37.780 creates.

00:26:39.140 Literally millions

00:26:39.900 of people,

00:26:40.760 globally speaking,

00:26:41.780 die every year

00:26:42.580 because we use

00:26:44.200 dirty fuel

00:26:45.080 that puts

00:26:46.300 particulates

00:26:47.080 into the air.

00:26:48.720 So rather than

00:26:49.800 guilt trip people

00:26:50.700 over risks

00:26:52.720 that seem

00:26:53.880 merely hypothetical

00:26:54.820 to most of them,

00:26:56.580 why not

00:26:57.060 focus on

00:26:57.640 how much nicer

00:26:58.620 our world

00:26:59.180 could be

00:26:59.780 if we weren't

00:27:00.920 breathing bad air

00:27:02.080 everywhere.

00:27:03.720 Anyway,

00:27:04.360 there's just a few

00:27:04.840 thoughts,

00:27:05.640 but the short

00:27:06.680 answer is

00:27:07.280 at any level

00:27:08.700 of giving,

00:27:10.300 if you're going

00:27:10.800 to give a minimum

00:27:11.320 of 10% of your

00:27:12.520 pre-tax earnings

00:27:13.600 to some of the

00:27:14.800 most effective

00:27:15.320 charities,

00:27:16.060 that is not

00:27:17.180 to your alma mater

00:27:17.980 or to the local

00:27:19.280 symphony

00:27:19.880 or anything else

00:27:20.740 you might want

00:27:21.140 to support,

00:27:22.040 that's all good too,

00:27:23.080 but separate,

00:27:24.300 you can take

00:27:24.980 the giving what we can

00:27:26.280 pledge and

00:27:27.120 the waking up

00:27:27.980 pledge will be

00:27:28.560 structured along

00:27:29.700 those lines.

00:27:31.740 Hey Sam,

00:27:32.380 this is Clint

00:27:33.020 from Monument,

00:27:33.800 Colorado.

00:27:35.040 My question is this,

00:27:36.740 what are your views

00:27:37.760 on transgender

00:27:38.420 women in sports?

00:27:39.860 If you were asked

00:27:40.700 to advise policy

00:27:41.680 on this issue,

00:27:42.780 what would you

00:27:43.420 recommend?

00:27:44.640 Or philosophically,

00:27:45.760 how would you

00:27:46.180 approach this

00:27:46.960 complex and

00:27:47.700 sensitive topic?

00:27:48.440 Well, thank you

00:27:51.100 Clint for asking

00:27:51.860 the question

00:27:52.460 that gets

00:27:53.300 everyone

00:27:53.900 cancelled.

00:27:55.760 It is the very

00:27:56.760 essence of a

00:27:57.740 fringe issue,

00:27:59.600 but I do have

00:28:00.860 a few thoughts

00:28:01.620 about it.

00:28:03.060 First, it strikes

00:28:03.920 me that there's

00:28:04.380 a spectrum

00:28:04.940 of concerns here.

00:28:06.780 If you'd like

00:28:09.600 to continue

00:28:10.040 listening to this

00:28:10.640 conversation,

00:28:11.620 you'll need to

00:28:12.180 subscribe at

00:28:12.860 SamHarris.org.

00:28:14.360 Once you do,

00:28:15.080 you'll get access

00:28:15.580 to all full-length

00:28:16.480 episodes of the

00:28:17.120 Making Sense

00:28:17.520 podcast, along

00:28:18.760 with other

00:28:19.100 subscriber-only

00:28:19.840 content, including

00:28:21.180 bonus episodes and

00:28:22.640 AMAs and the

00:28:23.800 conversations I've

00:28:24.500 been having on

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Making Sense - Sam Harris - January 31, 2022

Vaccine Mandates, transgender athletes, billionaires… (AMA #19)

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