In this episode, Dr. E. Michael Jones joins us to discuss his life and career as a Catholic priest and philosopher. Dr. Jones shares his thoughts on the patron saint of firemen, Zankt Florian, and the role of religion as a tool of political control.
00:02:42.280And joining us this week for a special interview is an honored and esteemed guest, Dr. E. Michael Jones. It's a pleasure to have you on.
00:02:52.820Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Pleasure to be here.
00:02:55.780I know I can speak for myself, but for many of our listeners, we've been profoundly influenced by your works. And I know my spiritual father is Matthew Raphael Johnson. And I know for him as well, you were a huge intellectual influence. So I think I can certainly speak for my co-host when I want to just thank you personally for the excellent, excellent scholarship that you've done. It's been very, very influential in me as well.
00:03:56.280I know that some of you are interested in donating to this podcast. I suggest that you take your money and donate to this cause instead.
00:04:02.280I know that somebody's made a donation in my name already, so I would like to thank them. I don't have it in front of me, but I appreciate that big time you honor me and flatter me.
00:05:58.280It's like about the black band of Florian Geyer.
00:06:01.280And I didn't speak German at the time, but I carried it over to this, this Nom de Guerre.
00:06:07.280And, but it turns out that the actual Florian Geyer that the song is named after was a Protestant hedge knight in the peasant wars in Germany.
00:06:18.280And it was a quite, quite anti-Catholic, quite anti-high church, which of course, you know, Catholic at the time.
00:06:43.280So when we were drafting our notes for this week, we, there was so many different topics that we wanted to speak to you about, and we have limited time.
00:06:50.280So we have many different things that likely we won't get to discuss with you particularly on this episode, although we might discuss them after you leave.
00:06:56.280But we kind of isolated two that we think are important to discuss.
00:07:00.280The first one we wanted to discuss was usury, and the second we wanted to discuss was libido dominandi and sexuality as a tool of political control.
00:07:13.280To begin with usury, I would just ask you the question, you know, what is usury?
00:07:18.280Because most people are not, don't really know what the definition is, and has the definition changed or shifted over time in common parlance?
00:07:29.280Because it's a sin, it cannot change over time, because human nature cannot change.
00:07:34.280Defined in its broadest sense, usury occurs whenever the stronger party in an economic exchange takes advantage of the weaker party.
00:07:43.280The most common instance of usury is the loan or the lending money.
00:07:50.280This is an injustice because in this transaction, the stronger party, the creditor, invariably takes advantage of the weaker party or the debtor because the weaker party agrees to pay back something that he did not borrow, namely interest, compound interest on the loan.
00:08:11.280This is invariably ruinous to anyone who gets involved in these contracts.
00:08:16.280Sometimes you can escape it, but over the long haul, it is ruinous and has proven ruinous throughout human history.
00:08:23.280The best example I can give is the one I gave in Barren Metal, The History of Capitalism as the Conflict Between Labor and Usury.
00:08:33.280The Habsburg family borrowed their first loan from the Fugger family, the Augsburg banking family in 1492.
00:08:52.280This is two years after the United States, after Spain discovered the New World.
00:08:58.280Over the period of the next 50 years, all of the gold and silver that were in Spanish colonies in the New World flowed into the coffers of the Habsburg family, and all of that money could not prevent them from going bankrupt, which they did 70 years later.
00:09:17.380This shows you the incredibly destructive power of compound interest because a floating loan after 70 years is simply unrepayable, cannot be repaid.
00:09:28.980Okay, the Catholic Church took cognizance of this fact, the injustice involved in usury, at the beginning of the money economy, which is the late Middle Ages in places like Italy, where people suddenly started to need money, whereas before they did not, and condemned it forthrightly for 100 years.
00:09:48.960They tried to come up with an alternative, the Monte de Pietà, which was basically pawn shops for the poor.
00:09:57.220There was a huge amount of controversy, whether 5% was usurious or whether it could be used as a fee, and so on and so forth.
00:10:04.240Finally, in 1745, Pope Benedict XIV wrote his encyclical, Vicks Perveni, in which he gave the definitive statement of the Catholic Church's teaching, namely that any loan, any compound interest loan is immoral.
00:10:21.620He said at that point that the financial situation has become so complex that I can't deal with every single instance in this encyclical, so therefore I'm referring this issue to the private forum.
00:10:39.120That means you have to go to your confessor and talk to him about it to see if you're committing the sin of usury.
00:10:44.140This did not mean, unlike what some people say, that the church changed its teaching on usury.
00:10:50.860The church cannot and has not and can never change its teaching on usury anymore than it can change its teaching on adultery or murder.
00:11:00.580Yeah, there is another thing that's very important as well, and that's the results that it gives, right?
00:11:54.720And so what they're going through is the charade of relending money, which goes right through Greece and back into the bank that lent it in the first place.
00:12:03.540And in the meantime, the usurers are now plundering the Grecian economy, demanding austerity, in quotes, and demanding the resources of Greece to pay off what is ultimately an unrepayable loan.
00:12:18.280So it's continued all the way to the present.
00:12:20.720Nothing is ever going to change in this regard.
00:12:22.440It's fascinating to me, and this is something I've never heard before, but usury in principle is not directly tied to if we're charging interest, how much interest we're charging.
00:12:40.140There's a fundamental principle at play of justice rather than the actual creation of money out of nothing, which is the language I've usually heard to describe what usury is.
00:12:57.780So I think that's an important point that bears repeating.
00:13:04.860And one of the, I think, conspicuous issues when we deal with usury is that there are not – this is the stated position of the Catholic Church, and I know that traditionally this was near universally.
00:13:16.880The Christian position was firmly anti-usurious.
00:13:20.780But what has occurred that the Christian teachings no longer hold sway in the social and economic forum?
00:13:29.400Why has the Western world and its Christian denominations become so schizophrenic with their application of this teaching?
00:13:39.140I know that there was – during the Reformation, John Calvin wrote a very famous letter called Dei-usuris where he changed – he basically legitimized some forms of usury.
00:14:01.480In England, there was absolutely no other possibility other than calling it a looting operation.
00:14:07.780Basically, the princes at this point in history realized that the church owned enormous amounts of property, and they coveted the property, and they basically used the Reformation as an excuse to steal that property.
00:14:21.020In Germany, the same situation applied.
00:14:24.480The difference was that you had a theologian, a monk, who gave some type of theological justification to it.
00:14:56.420England became the foremost promoter of international usury, and that is basically known now as capitalism.
00:15:05.020Capitalism, according to Heinrich Pesce, is state-sponsored usury.
00:15:09.820And that's the main reason why the church can no longer – the church lost its police power once you had the rise of these Protestant countries.
00:16:02.960I have a correspondent now in India who's writing articles now for Culture Wars who talked about basically what was the basis of the caste system in India.
00:16:16.860And when usury gets totally entrenched in a culture, you'll find some type of religious sanction or justification given for it, and that's basically Hinduism.
00:16:27.200In other words, the creditor class became the Brahmins.
00:16:33.700That's in the midst, lost in the midst of time.
00:16:35.800But basically, what I said about Europe is basically it meant the rise of the Reformation.
00:16:42.380The Reformation led to the rise of countries trading empires like the English and the Dutch, who basically ended up fighting with each other, a turf battle, which the English won.
00:16:51.960But these became places where the church simply could not enforce the law.
00:16:58.280And once they could not enforce the law, then these countries had an advantage, okay, because the creditor always has an advantage.
00:17:06.160And so what you saw in the New World was, let's say, the battle between England and France and Canada, okay?
00:17:14.220Well, the English had the advantage because they were more ruthless than the French, because the habit of usury had become so ingrained in them.
00:17:25.520The habit of ruthless trade in combination with the Jews in the New World just made them more ruthless and therefore better able to conquer the English.
00:17:38.000I'm sorry, the French, and take over Canada.
00:17:42.880Just an instance here, an instance that I know personally, there's a Fort Michimilly-Mackinac on the Straits of Mackinac between the Upper and Lower Peninsula.
00:17:56.400The fort has been turned into a museum by the state of Michigan.
00:18:33.520Next video, they're playing lacrosse or something outside the fort.
00:18:38.040They flip the ball over, ask to come in.
00:18:40.480They open the English, open the gates, and the Indians come in and slaughter everyone, okay?
00:18:45.900This is what we're talking about here.
00:18:48.440This, what could have been a Catholic colonization under the benign Jesuits in Quebec and in Paraguay and South America was strangled in its cradle by a free Masonic conspiracy, and the result was this ruthless capitalism that has now spread throughout the entire world.
00:19:29.420You know, I mean, I'm a Canadian, Dr. Jones, so, you know, I can speak to this, right, on a personal level, is that this country doesn't have any, you know, cultural or ethnic or even imperial identity that solidifies it.
00:19:54.380And that's, anyway, we could go off into the weeds there, but I think we're going to have to sort of stay focused.
00:20:00.180So what seems to me the overwhelming motivation towards, oh, please go ahead, Savage.
00:20:06.120Would there be any justice in looking at the Renaissance and the rise of the Italian merchant princes as being the sort of the source of the infection that would later cover Europe?
00:20:27.440The source of the infection was the Medici family.
00:20:30.700In particular, Cosimo hosted the Council of Florence when the Orthodox came to try and resolve their issues with the Roman Catholic Church.
00:20:44.880They did resolve those issues, but Cosimo used this as an example to smuggle Neoplatonism into Europe for the first time.
00:20:53.880Neoplatonism is another word for magic.
00:20:55.920The man who did this is a man by the name of George Gamistos.
00:21:00.680He gave the hermetic text to Cosimo, who gave them to Ficino, who was then to translate them into Latin, which he did.
00:21:09.940This is the entry of magic, Neoplatonic magic, into Europe.
00:21:18.300Is this also when the Freemasons kind of started to?
00:21:27.480Freemasonry does not become significant until 1721, when the Whigs take over the Masonic lodges and turn them into covert warfare against the Bourbon monarchy in France.
00:22:42.680But basically, the chapter, Newton resurrected Empedocles, who said that the universe was basically the function of two forces, love and strife.
00:22:55.320Those two forces became gravity and inertia.
00:22:57.940And under Newton and then under Smith, they became competition and self-interest.
00:23:05.960This circular motion was the basis for laissez-faire economics, which basically prohibited any moral intervention into the economy, which led to the disaster which we have today.
00:23:19.340OK, because economics is fundamentally a moral science.
00:23:24.000It is a part of how we achieve the good.
00:24:17.160Yes, we've talked about the the hermetic and Western esoteric origins of the empirical science system and the Royal Society before on this program.
00:25:28.480Let's put that that that philosophy, which was basically the entry of Logos into human history, beginning with Anaxagoras, died.
00:25:38.580It simply collapsed and it was replaced by the time of Yamblichus or, let's say, Julian, the apostate, who tried to resurrect it as the religion of the Roman Empire.
00:26:30.300I think also we're talking about one of the greatest turning points in human history, which is basically the turning point of human history, the arrival of Jesus Christ, God incarnate.
00:26:41.820And the decision on the part of the evangelists like St. John to write their gospel in Greek, which meant that the incorporation of Greek philosophy into the Catholic Church.
00:26:53.740But what is even more important, that meant that the church became the vehicle for Logos, for the entire world and for the rest of human history.
00:27:02.020So when the Greeks failed, the Greek philosophers failed, the church came in and picked up the ball and carried it forward.
00:27:10.960The beginning of the Gospel of St. John is a metaphysical treatise that is one of the most profound documents of all of human history.
00:27:18.720And if I ever get back to Iran, to Mashhad, to talk to the Islamic scholars, I'd like to discuss the third sentence, which is basically a Kai Logos en Theos.
00:27:33.140That's an incredibly profound statement.
00:27:35.120I think that's something we need to meditate.
00:27:36.740We've talked about it extensively, extensively on the show.
00:27:39.640The concept of Logos is central to our worldview and how we dissect things.
00:27:43.700And so I think we're exactly on the same page.
00:27:46.380In fact, I wrote a theology paper about this as a final.
00:27:49.900The context of Greek philosophical thought in the Mediterranean before St. John wrote his gospel.
00:27:57.720And it's even with figures like Philo of Alexandria, we can see that there's an incredible, incredible degree of Hellenization of this Old Testament thought existed before Christ was incarnate.
00:29:26.600I, unfortunately, I'm under the gun here right now and I got to get out of here and get something done here.
00:29:32.060But, I mean, I'm enjoying this conversation and I would like to continue it at some other time, especially on the topic of Libido Dominandi, which is an incredibly relevant issue right now.
00:30:13.200So, hopefully our listeners enjoyed that, you know, that segment, unfortunately, as you are all aware, he was only available to speak for us, with us for 30 minutes today.
00:30:23.520So, hopefully we should be able to get back on and give the full treatment to the topics discussed.
00:30:28.640I mean, speaking of usual again, I mean, this is essentially what Spengler has been saying all along, really.
00:30:33.720If you read all his works and study what he's saying, of course, right, as a society gets more and more institutionalized, right, the economic power gets more and more influence, right?
00:31:56.460You know, anybody who pays attention to the budget that was just passed in the United States.
00:32:01.320I mean, this is, you know, a trillion dollars, something like this.
00:32:05.220You know, the budgets are extraordinary.
00:32:08.440The whole economy could not be – could not remain liquid, could not continue to run unless the – they were backed by, you know, infinite amounts of usurious capital.
00:32:18.640So, you know, I think, Doc, I don't know if you know the number.
00:32:24.360It was like two or three trillion dollars were spent in Iraq on that war.
00:32:57.620And this is the – and so this is the thing.
00:32:59.560The only other thing in ancient times especially, but in modern times as well, is infrastructure projects are usually very, very expensive.
00:33:09.160And the nature of the mechanization of warfare, the application of technology to fighting, is that it has gotten more and more unpersonal and more and more efficient.
00:33:19.200So death tolls have been rising and in war the majority of deaths come to indirect artillery fire from planes or from static gun positions.
00:33:28.820And so what has occurred – Evola talks about this in his Metaphysics of War.
00:33:31.900What has occurred is that as the mechanization of society has increased, the focus on the organic interaction between persons and their own worth has decreased commensurately.
00:33:42.120And so it's no longer the cult of the hero who has personal skill with arms becomes less important than the mass identity of the fighting force.
00:34:52.380At least these millions of people died for freedom, freedom to die, freedom to turn yourself into ashes on the pile of fires of your own hedonism.
00:35:08.580I mean even this is the – but I think to bring it back to your point, Greva, what you're expressing is that, yeah,
00:35:15.300when you get this mechanization of life, when you get the construction of a machine that acts as an instrument of power magnification, you naturally –
00:35:27.400Because it's more and more and more in the further and further degrees of separation.
00:35:31.640Yeah, I mean last episode we said like that the essence of death is separation of soul and body, right?
00:35:37.400And if you're just like this, this mindless drone operating machine all day, right, then unless you go like full Ernst Jünger anarch, then you are – you're essentially dead, right?
00:35:56.740It's interesting to note that if what we call usury, if economic modernity, capitalism, compound interest, if all of that derives ultimately from Neoplatonism, from classical antiquities, forms of magic,
00:36:20.760I think it's interesting to note that the gods of the temples were machines in the classical antique world.
00:37:06.140You're transmuting the properties into gold, right?
00:37:08.800You're making the property a part of the liquid market because you allow yourself to think about the property in terms of liquid gold, right?
00:37:17.340And then there is more demand for gold, for money, for shekels, and therefore you can create more shekels, even if it's just fiat money, right?
00:37:24.320So, you're transmuting everything that has organically grown up into shekels, right?
00:37:39.060And to get kind of more precise with it, what's going on is if you've listened to our episode on Freemasonry and the Kabbalah with Dr. Raphael Johnson, we discuss in greater detail what goes on here.
00:37:50.560But he talks about how alchemy was meant to be applied to humans, is that it was a spiritualization of the human energies and forces.
00:38:00.260And so what occurs is the philosophy, the theology behind this is that through usury, you're able to extract gold from lead.
00:38:10.880Because the process of usury, compound interest, is your demanding repayment of money of capital that did not exist in the first place when you loaned it out, either in liquid currency or in real capital.
00:38:25.660And it's important to note that when we say liquid currency, for the ancient Germanics, the rune that depicted liquid currency was the same rune as the cow, right?
00:38:35.400Liquid currency means movable capital, and capital – a real capital, not some sort of constructed thing – has to do with goods and services that are actually substantially of value.
00:38:47.480So cows are, of course, a great – or slaves are another fantastic example – are great denominators of wealth.
00:38:55.100And in fact, in the decadent ages of the – decadent days of the Roman Republic, the great oligarchs and landed magnates kept most of their liquid currency in slaves because it was surplus labor.
00:39:08.780So usury is, in a sense, this alchemical, shadowy, esoteric process by which you're able to generate this money out of nowhere.
00:39:18.860Where does the – like, think about it like this.
00:39:20.820I mean, just very basically, if you put money in a savings account and you're generating interest on it, where is that money coming from?
00:39:30.300You know, the bank is not giving you back the money that it's used to reinvest, the profit and the reinvestment.
00:39:36.740It's not allocating you a share of that.
00:39:41.240You know, the bank – with fractional reserve banking, right, the amount of loans that they give out is not commensurate to the amount of, you know, money that they actually have in the bank account to begin with.
00:39:48.780So it's literally just created it out of thin air, right, is my point.
00:39:51.420Florian, you're being too nice to the banks because the inflation is higher than interest in a way.
00:39:57.900So they're basically sifting away that as well.
00:40:05.520I reserve myself that the slaves were used only because they were workers because I think it's more morbid than that.
00:40:11.500I mean, Spengler, again, Spengler, I know I talk a lot about Spengler, but he was even more morbid about when it comes to the ancient slaves in Rome and stuff.
00:40:21.760Because the Romans had this mentality of everything must be a body, right?
00:42:08.100We will turn this society into heaven on earth and la-di-da-di-da-di-da-di-da.
00:42:14.340And we can see the same thing really on the right as well.
00:42:17.780I want to be serious for more now, and I don't want you to interrupt me, even though I've spoken for quite a while and interrupted you a couple of times today.
00:42:26.400I mean, if you start to idolize ideology, even if that ideology is, I don't know, fascism, national socialism or whatever, right?
00:42:32.540If you start to idolize the ideology, you're losing God, right?
00:42:37.280You're like Abraham who refused to go to the mountain, just leaving Isaac running around all day, and then Isaac died out of cancer or something a week later.
00:42:47.640That goes too far as to say that we must realize that everything we get now in terms of migration and essentially civilization of death right now is something we deserve and we should embrace it.
00:43:00.740Not in the sense of the black will play, that everything is lost and da-di-da-di-da.
00:43:07.560We should embrace it and realize that what we have right now in terms of civilization, in terms of culture, in terms of even nationality, even in terms of, I suppose, race.
00:43:17.820By the way, I'm not saying we should race mates.
00:43:20.680I'm saying that we should essentially go to the mountain and sacrifice Isaac.
00:43:25.660We should stop caring about, put the primary care on preserving our civilization and rather to accept our punishment, to go to the police officer, like Raskolko did after he murdered that woman, right?
00:43:42.180Maybe you won't even be wiped out because I think that in order to find God, we need to accept the punishment, right?
00:43:47.880And we need to realize that we deserve the punishment.
00:43:49.660And then you can't get warped up in ideologies and constantly chant, 1488, da-da!
00:43:56.720Because, I mean, while it's a healthy reaction, it is, and I'm not going to sit here and, like, pretentious to sip red wine.
00:44:03.700My point is that if you put ideology before God, then you're essentially killing yourself.
00:44:08.360Well, yeah, and I think that, Grieva, I think that you're correct in the essence is that ideology is a manifestation of something beyond itself.
00:44:21.500Ideology is the political instantiation.
00:44:23.240Yeah, ideology is the man trying to define good rather than God.
00:45:06.440So here we have a degraded form of ideology, which is just as much an abstract mental idol, as Grieva says.
00:45:14.380And there is an ideal, an elevated form of ideology, as Florian describes it, which is a particular image of the universal logos for a particular racial, ethnic spirit.
00:45:33.080Both ways are properly so-called ideologies, but we're talking about very different things.
00:45:41.260In the same way that, you know, you can have a degenerate empire of moneylenders like America, or you can have a holy empire under a holy king who is an icon for his people and a father for his people.
00:46:02.620And these are not the same thing, but they're both properly called empire.
00:46:10.380Let's say you have the holy empire, so to speak, the holy Roman empire, whatever.
00:46:16.000I mean, even here, the king is a man, his vassal is a man, and nothing like that.
00:46:22.460So you're not going to have a perfect utopia.
00:46:24.720And what I see the problem is, is that you have this sort of ideological utopianism.
00:46:28.780Oh, if we do this, we will have a perfect utopia.
00:46:29.700Grieva, I think he's agreeing with you, and I think that you're arguing around yourself, basically.
00:46:35.980I think that, obviously, I agree with you 100%, and I also agree with you, Grieva Hans, to make things clear and not trip up over ourselves.
00:46:44.340The issue is that, yes, obviously, ideology and the ideal is the instantiation of the cosmic order into the political, but human beings are corrupted, and so that's never perfect.
00:47:57.620You must accept these immigrants, because you do have a duty to defend your kinsmen, even if you and your kinsmen also have a blood debt that must be paid off.
00:48:10.480Yes, I agree, Doc, but here's the thing, though.
00:49:00.460And God exists because he is punishing Sweden.
00:49:04.740Greva, I don't think that anybody is challenging that point.
00:49:06.980You know, without getting too much more into the muck, I think that the takeaway here for our listeners is that you can worship your politics, essentially.
00:49:24.040And, you know, your political positions become, in a sense, the core and center of your identity and frame everything else about your life.
00:49:37.480You're supposed to be filled by religion, essentially.
00:49:40.520Your religious beliefs that you act out with, you know, serious ethics, metaphysics, ritual, right?
00:49:46.160These are the things that are supposed to inform your worldview and every, you know, the smallest details of your action, the framework of your life.
00:49:54.060But if you basically, yeah, if you put politics there instead of God, who is, you know, obviously Jesus Christ is God, he is himself, order.
00:50:06.260If you put politics there, you become guilty of idolatry because you place what is worldly above what is godly.
00:50:12.780And I think that that's what Greva is saying, and that what we're doing is that when our nations are guilty of transgressing God's law,
00:50:19.560and we're getting bad results because of it, natural law is acting against us because we're stupid.
00:50:26.060And we have to understand that and accept it.
00:50:28.260Just know that this is a manifestation of, you know, justice because we're stupid.
00:51:00.220Because, right, politics, right now, our nation has decided to bash its head against the brick wall of Christ, right?
00:51:07.960So what would political action really do?
00:51:09.800It would just be, in my perspective, it would be, in my perspective, it would be like cursing God as we're smite down into the abyss, right?
00:51:17.880Because they all are free will, right?
00:51:20.200And they are created with free will, and they are created with a free will to go to hell if they so desire, right?
00:51:25.060But, I mean, I would argue that the way you would save Sweden, the way you would save America, the way you would save any European nation, isn't at all for political action.
00:51:34.640I think political action is in and of itself a trap.
00:51:36.780I think the way you would save a nation is to convert to Christianity.
00:52:09.460Okay, because you can enforce the cosmic order whether you are a Christian or not.
00:52:13.560So somebody who, you know, like if somebody murders somebody else in China and the Chinese state hangs him, that's just whether, you know, they're fulfilling Christ's will whether they worship him or not.
00:52:26.040But the point is that what is political, okay?
00:52:30.600Politics has to do with the governance of men in the social realm, okay?
00:52:36.340The way we regulate our conduct, the way we regulate our conduct is always going to have political implications because of that.
00:52:43.560And so my point is just that, like, obviously convert to Christianity, yes.
00:54:03.400Well, anyway, hopefully our listeners comprehend what we're trying to get across.
00:54:08.280So we've got 10 more minutes before the break.
00:54:11.320So I think there's a couple more things that I wanted to discuss with you, Siri.
00:54:15.020So, yeah, before we got into that big kind of tangent, what – and what also happens is that with currency,
00:54:23.340when currency moves from being a precious metal, which has value because it's a commodity that's in demand, right?
00:54:31.500But it's not – in it itself, it does not have utility, aside from a spiritual significance, you could say.
00:54:40.760You move to further levels of abstraction with banknotes, right?
00:54:45.000And so we get – in the modern system where we have not just – it's not just banknotes, which are representations of money, gold-backed currency.
00:54:52.160It's fiat currency, so it just is supposed to be a stand-in token for labor, right, of the exertion of human beings to produce goods and services and things which facilitate that action.
00:55:05.320And so this is what occurs over time is as the financial system gets more complicated, more detached from natural law, the sort of wizard's tower builds himself up, to use that metaphor.
00:55:19.960You see these further levels of abstraction from real capital.
00:55:24.780That's not to say that this is inherently a bad thing.
00:55:27.060Paper money can be a good thing if it's applied for the cosmic order.
00:55:31.420But the problem is that's obviously not – never been the motivation for its creation.
00:55:35.020That's really never been how it's been employed outside of a few instances like Germany in the 30s and so on.
00:55:42.520And this is – it's actually a good point to make here that this – the – when Hitler broke Germany away from international finance, this is one of the big reasons why World War II occurred.
00:55:57.220Russia did something similar in World War I, although through stroke of a chance, Russia ended up in an alliance with Great Britain and so rather bled itself to death and succumbed to revolution through warfare with Germany rather than the usurers themselves.
00:56:27.540So, you know, and I think that that's basically what's going on is that, you know, the more – the financial magic and the technological magic, so to speak, as they both get more complicated, you get depersonalization.
00:57:00.080They lose their inherent human dignity.
00:57:01.340And this is one of the central messages of Christianity that sets it apart from, like, paganism or other religions is that it makes the kind of – a fairly radical claim that human beings, qua-human beings, are in the image and likeness of God.
00:57:16.420That there is some sort of core human dignity, you know, that one cannot transgress around, so to speak.
00:57:25.640Yeah, I mean, yeah, but there's a tiny difference between the two.
00:57:29.100I mean, being in the image of God is innate to being a human, right?
00:57:34.560You don't stop being in the image of God even when you turn into a godless atheist sodomite.
00:57:40.440You're not – you don't have the likeness, though.
00:58:00.340You have a mind, a rational mind and all these things.
00:58:03.360You know, but you can either choose to conform that to the highest good or you can not do that, which is what we all do all the time, just to varying degrees.
00:58:14.100And, yeah, I mean, this is the – I mean, so this is the thing.
00:58:18.880So the gospel of Christianity is that Christ has died on the cross and has defeated death.
00:58:25.240And because of his death and resurrection, by entering into the Christian mysteries, baptism, and the Eucharist, we can obtain eternal life and become sons of God like Christ was.
00:58:36.140And just like Christ, by being sons of God, we will be resurrected when we die.
00:58:43.000And what's more, after we're resurrected, we will become as Christ was in everything.
00:58:46.940We will become divinized, glorified with the divine energies, filled with the heavenly light, the grace of the Holy Spirit.
00:58:57.600And so on earth, we're corrupted, right?
00:59:01.380So we have to deal with the effects of Adam's original sin.
00:59:03.780But we're called to act upon these things, instantiate them as we exist now to whatever extent that we can.
00:59:10.240And so obviously we're sinful, but we have to try and perfect ourselves.
00:59:13.100And so the reason why this is important is because this perfection, if we're being serious Christians where our whole life is informed by our worldview, it affects every area of our life.
00:59:24.920And so politics and economics and these different issues, we don't stop being a Christian when we engage in these actions.
00:59:32.880We don't have to stop thinking about these things in terms of Christ.
00:59:37.820And what's more is that these things ought to become divinized if we're at all able to do so.
00:59:43.100You know, I think everything can be summed up with we just need more common sense.
00:59:49.480We don't need fancy economic theories.
00:59:51.520We don't need some fancy Third Reich economic theory.
01:00:04.420And one thing I do want to add on the question of usury is that one of – it strikes me that we need to stop thinking of money, qual money as wealth.
01:00:21.740And that – for a long time, that's always bothered me.
01:00:25.620What money is, is a means of exchange.
01:01:48.500It depends on how much money I suppose.
01:01:50.300But I mean, so, the black magic comes into play when, you know, like the magician glamorizes, entrances you with the money instead of the thing that you wanted.
01:05:24.440We should focus on ignoring politics and focus on the church.
01:05:27.440Well, I think that it's not that we should ignore politics or we should focus on it, but rather that we should be Christians and the political should be a manifestation of that.
01:05:38.740Yeah, we'll be stuck here for 20 minutes talking probably semantics, and I won't be alert enough to realize if it's semantics.
01:05:45.080It's a good time to get a break, perhaps, anyway.
01:07:29.380Небесческая сила, несите по честь всех светов.
01:07:41.560Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, честнейшая, Малычице всем Небесных Твоих.
01:08:00.220Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, всем бравоцер надежду, пророков, Исну не нет.
01:08:19.620Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:08:38.860Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:08:58.860Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:09:17.860Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:09:47.840Бравуйся, Небесну и Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:17.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:19.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:21.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:23.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:25.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:27.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:29.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:33.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:37.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:10:39.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:11:09.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:11:39.820Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:12:09.800Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:12:11.800Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:12:14.800Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи.
01:12:16.800Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:12:18.800Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:12:22.800Бравуйся, Небесная, в мудрой сердце помощи, не будьте Бога слова.
01:12:24.800So we're going to talk about a few more selected points on usury, and then we're going to discuss Christianity and its implications in your worldview and your lifestyle and that kind of thing, and how that affects political action.
01:12:39.940We touched on that a little bit before the break.
01:12:41.640So one of the things about usury and debt in general is that with the – in our modern age, there has been a total normalization of the debt economy, that it's not – nobody bats an eye that – I'll give you a good example.
01:13:00.160When Justin Trudeau was first elected in Canada, we went from having a mostly balanced budget under Harper – that is to say that we were in debt, but we were not borrowing money actively in order to fund the government – to having a $600 million deficit in the first month.
01:13:19.040One month. I'm not joking. $600 million.
01:13:23.960$600 million. That means you're borrowing $600 million a month in order to pay for the government, taking on that much –
01:13:28.680Right, I mean, to be honest, we're doing that right now here in Sweden with immigration rights, because, I mean, it's so huge expenses, right, that we take per capita in most in entire Europe rights, probably because we deserve it.
01:13:39.320We deserve this because we are so degenerates. We deserve all this. It's a slap in the face from God.
01:13:45.260But the point is, it's a scornical, really. I mean, they are essentially enslaving my generation to debt slavery to try to pay back this huge debt, right?
01:13:59.740That is, assuming the system survives, while at the same time trying to create this sort of mix of the Orientals and, you know, the Europeans that would kind of make Alexander the Great kind of proud, right?
01:14:14.160I mean, it's essentially what they're doing right here.
01:14:17.040And, I mean, they are, like, giving money from the Swedes, right, that work, and give it to Bobo, who doesn't work, right?
01:14:24.160So, they kind of equalize, you know, the two parts, right? So, they can just get by, right? They can manage, yeah?
01:14:33.140They don't need to save up money, da-da-da, that's what loans are for.
01:14:37.500And that's another thing, right? I mean, if you look at, well, if you look at house prices, right?
01:14:43.380I mean, unless you're rich, you won't be able to buy a house, right?
01:14:46.940You won't be able to build a house with cash.
01:14:50.000You're going to have to loan that money, really.
01:14:59.460I mean, rents, I really think rents is, in many ways, another part of you, because I know for a fact that a rent my family paid when I was younger was enough that if we combined the years we lived in that apartment, we could probably buy the apartment itself for that money.
01:15:26.400Exactly. I mean, that's the term rent. I mean, in economics means, you know, money extracted for no services. That's what it means.
01:15:34.880Obviously, in, you know, you have use, the service is the use of the apartment. But in many of these places, it's, the prices are absurd in Sweden, as I know that that's the case.
01:15:44.480And this is the thing I want to do, but I want to do, my point is, it's good that we kind of got on the tangent back to the main point, is that, you know, this idea that it's acceptable.
01:15:51.840It's perfectly acceptable to borrow hundreds of millions, billions, trillions, trillions of dollars to fund government operation, you know, enterprise, infrastructure.
01:16:01.680Like, you know, we don't have to worry about paying it back.
01:16:07.580Exactly. Well, you know, we're investing in the future and, you know, it doesn't really matter. There's no adverse effects will occur.
01:16:13.280I mean, just common sense, basic common sense.
01:16:17.280It's not a... And this is the thing that's shocking, is that people just, they don't...
01:16:20.920It's the status quo is so firmly entrenched that it doesn't register to people, to bureaucrats, to politicians, to political people, that it's wrong to run a government in this fashion.
01:16:31.680That this economy is unsustainable by definition.
01:17:15.920Yeah, it's really distressing how normal this financialization of everything has become.
01:17:23.300To the point where normal people can't live their lives without partaking in the financialization of everything.
01:17:33.800You can barely buy a house or even normal tools to do your normal working class job without taking out a loan or buying on credit or somehow participating in the financialization of everything.
01:17:54.480The other issue is that because of industrialization and inflation, the costs of living has gone up so much.
01:18:08.620You know, it's so palpable compared to our ancestors, right?
01:18:13.220You know, like the real wages in the United States have been decreasing, have been decreasing and have been stagnant since the 1970s while inflation has been increasing dramatically.
01:18:26.820Exactly. And so the – and this is the height of irony that, you know, in order to like to raise a family, you need all of this money for this expensive, you know, property and infrastructure and so on.
01:18:37.120The irony is that this mechanization was supposed to make this cheaper because labor was supposed to be more efficient.
01:18:43.880That was meant, you know – and in some ways it does, obviously.
01:19:03.200And, I mean, another thing which I think is really, really absurd and frightening is how you can attach a shekel tag to essentially everything right now.
01:19:12.580I mean, just look at those Japanese hug cafes, right?
01:19:17.000You're paying for some sort of human contact with another person.
01:19:20.440And this is getting more and more absurd.
01:19:22.000I mean, maybe, maybe I'm – maybe I'm – I won't be surprised if the whole escort service being distinct from just a normal prostitute is relatively new-ish as well.
01:19:36.540It's probably not, but I think that it's becoming more common because in that sense you would still have – I mean, you would at that point kind of have the vague idea of a relationship that's not based on money, right?
01:19:49.160But, yeah, I mean, you're trying to kid yourself that's not what it is.
01:19:52.540Whereas in a prostitute it's kind of more obvious, right?
01:20:19.060Let me just say one more thing, actually.
01:20:23.280In Sweden there's some feminists screaming about how women should be paid by their husbands for, like, cleaning the home and that kind of stuff.
01:21:27.080Well, it's weird because – yeah, I mean the – I was saying this to somebody else that like if I lived in Europe, I feel like I would be even more radical.
01:21:41.160I mean because – well, that's the thing.
01:21:43.140I mean in North America, we have this sort of – we have this massivity of the space, and it was settled fairly recently, most of it.
01:21:49.820And there's a level of alienation where we need – there is an existential threat, right?
01:21:56.420But it's like if we lose parts of the United States to non-white people, that's not – game over, right?
01:22:03.120It's not even close to it because it's a continent.
01:22:33.400I mean I think when you lose Christ and everything which that means, then you get the stuff.
01:22:40.220Maybe you shouldn't whine that you get the Muslims.
01:22:41.840I think – I mean I think it's not a coincidence that countries like – yeah, countries like Bulgaria, you know, Romania, da-da-da.
01:22:50.780I mean these countries do not get the huge migration wave that a country like Sweden has.
01:22:55.640A country that is the most atomized, the most mechanized, the most socialized, and the most atheist country probably in Europe at this point.
01:23:03.960And if they're not atheists, then they're heretics and loony-toony Pentecostals or whatever.
01:23:49.380But I mean this to say that, you know, like to a certain degree, you know, Russia is more Christian than most countries, and the Orthodox Church is thriving.
01:23:56.780But Russia is not a Christian country these days.
01:23:58.660You know, I know quite a few Russians, people who come from there, and that's not how it is.
01:24:05.380Most people, you know, the church is not a huge part of their lives.
01:24:15.800I don't know, maybe it's more big city Russians, so maybe I just have a roast in the view of Russians.
01:24:23.900But I think the rural Russians are pretty sane compared to rural countries.
01:24:28.300Yeah, but Russia is a very urbanized place after the fall of the Soviet Union.
01:24:33.320It was purposefully urban after the communism.
01:24:34.920One of the interesting developments in Russia is I know the government, I think Putin in particular,
01:24:51.900have been trying to get the old calendar expats who have been living abroad for a long time to move back to Russia
01:25:04.520and specifically to settle the rural areas that have been abandoned since the great collectivizations and mechanizations of the Soviet Union.
01:25:12.780Yeah, well, this is the interesting thing because before World War I, Tsar Nicholas was poised to mass-settle Siberia.
01:25:20.760There had been considerable expansion there beforehand.
01:25:24.760But because of the huge loss of life in World War I and II, this was cut short.
01:25:28.920So if the Tsarist regime had not been overthrown and World War I ended nominally with a truce,
01:25:34.700you know, Siberia would be like industrial Russia is right now.
01:25:39.580Russia would have, you know, like double the population.
01:25:43.780Russia would be, you know, the biggest superpower in the world.
01:26:41.280Anyway, getting into the weeds, getting into the weeds.
01:26:44.580This is the thing that, back to the normalization, you know, and it's just think about if your personal, you know, household finances were run like this.
01:26:52.620Think about, you know, just like, oh, well, you know, I mean, I'm going to take out loans that are 50 times the amount of money I make a year, right?
01:27:00.460Like, I'm not going to have to worry about it.
01:27:02.380I'll just pass down this debt to my children, you know.
01:27:34.300Well, that's one of the interesting things about the immediate post-revolutionary period in the United States in the form of colonies.
01:27:44.280It was one of the very first law reforms, so-called, that swept the, at that time, actual states, actual independent states, was to do away with the old inheritance laws.
01:28:02.880There's the English common law inheritance system that comes to us from the Middle Ages, wherein the eldest son would be presumed to inherit the entire estate.
01:28:29.100You had to pass it on to the eldest son.
01:28:32.880And that this was considered a good reform to rationalize property ownership and just, you know, it's a good thing that we can break up these inheritances.
01:28:46.760Well, you know, here's a funny thing, because this is like libertarians having self-defeating logic even back in the day.
01:28:54.540Because I bet you this type of people that would have pushed for this reform were Thomas Jefferson classical liberal types because they thought that it would free up capital.
01:29:00.860But the great irony is Thomas Jefferson acknowledges himself that the yeoman is the core of the republic and that you cannot be free and engaged in a society of free men unless you have farmland because you don't produce capital if you don't do that.
01:29:16.480And so the very irony is that this disperses intergenerational farming capital and makes the people less free and makes the system itself untenable.
01:29:28.480I mean, this is the thing, but these ideas were kind of dumb from the beginning, you know, because you don't get to have both.
01:29:35.620You know, I'm not saying that societies of free men, yeomanry are bad.
01:29:40.760No, these are profoundly good things, profoundly positive parts of our heritage, constitutionalism, separation of powers, you know, a clearly articulated form of government.
01:29:51.500These are good political developments that exist specifically to Anglo-Saxons and those who inherit their political tradition.
01:30:13.520So there are two streams of thought that go into this American system.
01:30:22.700One is an organic system of thought that goes back to the charters of rights, the most famous, of course, being the Magna Carta, the Great Charter.
01:30:45.660You know, it was an organic tradition of Anglo-Saxon kingship that when a king is acclaimed by his thanes, that he would say,
01:30:57.240OK, here is the charter by which my reign will run.
01:31:01.400And usually it's just reaffirming the charter of the preceding king and the king before him with very slight tweaks to account for present-day circumstances.
01:31:13.180And so that is essentially how the constitution, small c, worked until we had this enlightenment idea that instead of having an organic constitution that was living in a real sense,
01:31:32.420we would mechanize the constitution and turn it into an instrument of law and write it down.
01:31:40.920But the problem is that the – I was speaking about this with Masonius Rufus the other day.
01:31:46.940And the problem is that under the ideal Anglo-Saxon common law system, law was something that existed in the world.
01:31:54.680And the job of the courtroom and the grand jury was to go out and discover and apply it.
01:31:59.780And then based on the precedent of that investigation, which determined the truth, law would be formed because, well, we've done the investigation.
01:32:09.180We know the facts of the case and the circumstance.
01:32:13.160The presumption there is that law is real and exists in the universe and that man is equipped with reasonable faculty which he can discover it.
01:32:22.980This is the meaning of what Paul says in Scripture, that the law is written in our hearts.
01:32:28.680The whole presupposition for this system is a social, traditional, Christian orthodoxy essentially.
01:32:36.980That's what the situation – that's what this post-Roman, right, you know, Western Christian legal system comes out of, that society.
01:32:48.920We want that kind of society again, right?
01:32:51.820We need to be like those people as Christian, organize ourselves in those ways.
01:32:55.740And then the idea is that we can formalize this and turn it, you know, liberate it from the chains of inherited tradition, inherited meaning, inherited language.
01:33:14.080And it's like a great divorce, to use the C.S. Lewis term.
01:33:18.960Then you get so many laws, you don't even know if the laws are valid a little more.
01:33:25.740Well, yeah, I mean, it's actually a term now in American jurisprudence to speak of legal pollution.
01:36:21.560Somebody was mocking the progressive medievalists the other day because it's – you know, you like the Middle Ages but you hate everything that created it.
01:36:28.720You hate everything that it stood for, right?
01:43:46.340And this is what we mean when we say misdirected passions.
01:43:48.820So, look, the sexual faculty is being drawn into this filth.
01:43:56.220You know, we should just go ahead, I guess, and give the pretentious analysis.
01:44:00.620I mean, basically, what's going on here is, you know, you're turning, you know, the vagina, right, into death, into an organ of death, basically.
01:44:09.800Instead of, right, having, like, actual physical copulation with somebody who's living, you're taking the symbolic remains of their death, right?
01:44:17.760And you're copulating with an artificial, you know, phylactery of this remain.
01:48:06.060DARPA is planning to hack the human brain.
01:48:09.740Uh, uh, a very, very disturbing article.
01:48:16.140Uh, from futurism.com, DARPA is planning to hack the human brain to let us upload skills.
01:48:24.680Uh, in March 2016, DARPA, the U.S. military's mad science branch, announced their targeted neuroplasticity training program, or TNT.
01:48:33.700The TNT program aims to explore the various safe neurostimulization methods for activating synaptic plasticity, which is the brain's ability to alter the connecting points between neurons, a requirement for learning.
01:48:47.420DARPA hopes that building up that ability by subjecting the nervous system to a kind of workout regimen will enable the brain to learn more quickly.
01:48:53.720The ideal end benefit for this kind of breakthrough would be downloadable learning.
01:48:59.620Rather than needing to learn, for example, a new language through rigorous study and practice over a long period of time, we could basically download the knowledge after putting our minds into a highly receptive neuroplastic state.
01:49:10.720Clearly, this kind of research would benefit anyone, but urgent military missions can succeed or fail based on the training.
01:49:17.160So, in these situations, a faster rate of trained personnel would be a tremendous boom.
01:49:24.980Now, this is kind of funny, because, I mean, okay, first and foremost, let's have the pretentious analysis.
01:49:31.640I will put all my Evola on, and we can discuss this a bit.
01:49:34.980I mean, it's like Gnostics trying to dissolve everything and rebuild it, right?
01:49:39.160It's the same thing we see right here.
01:49:40.700Plus, I mean, who would be so stupid so they would allow a program, literally called TNT, to blow up their brain?
01:50:37.080Like, this is what's going on here, is that the U.S. military, the tool of Zog, so to speak, right, tool of international finance, the regime, capital R, has basically, they, instead of just having to hire mercenaries, they can literally construct their own purpose-built Golems with specific skills and abilities and specific loyalties.
01:51:00.760This is what, like, for those of you who aren't familiar with the ritual, what the rabbi does in order, it's a Kabbalistic ritual, so what the rabbi does in order to create a Golem is he builds a man out of clay.
01:51:12.700And in the mouth of the man, he inserts a scroll written with the secret name of God, and what this does is this animates the Golem, and he gains power over it, and it becomes loyal to him.
01:51:25.460And many people think that this is an allegory for the Goyim, right?
01:51:32.220And so that this is the classic through the use of, you know, knowledge, techne, secret knowledge, right, financial, you know, esoteric, occult, magical, right, technological, or otherwise.
01:51:46.160Like, we've demonstrated on the show that they're all interconnected.
01:51:49.980Yes, let me just continue to turn your thoughts a bit, Florian.
01:54:37.520Well, you know, these people aren't going to turn their guns on their families, but this turns that article of faith on its head completely.
01:55:14.280This is what they want, you know, and they want to destroy the human person.
01:55:18.520And this is why we're insistent upon this, and you heard Jones cite human anthropology as the reason for why the definition of usury can't change.
01:55:26.740Humans have a real spiritual reality with unchanging properties.
02:05:39.520Amish, father of 12, faces 68 years in jail.
02:05:44.280In the wake of anti-Christian, anti-white discrimination that we face all over the Western world, even America, attacks on the Amish, who are a traditionally living, Christian, large family-having white people, have really amped up in recent years.
02:05:57.620Many cities have begun passing laws which essentially outlaw many Amish practices.
02:06:02.600And, of course, the federal government is also coming down hard on these simple Christian folk.
02:06:06.420Now, an Amish father of 12 is facing 68 years in prison for making and selling an herbal product.
02:06:21.400He is an Amish farmer who makes a homeopathic salve.
02:06:24.400He was recently arrested by the United States government for simply making these salves without FDA labeling approval, even though it is primarily only Amish people that purchase and use this product.
02:06:49.860If I say that you should, um, jump up and down and scream as if you are a retard, you will jump up and down and scream like you're a retard.
02:07:43.700That's, that's, it goes back to what I was talking about with legal pollution.
02:07:46.720Because Congress has gotten so, so lazy that they just passed these enabling acts that grant these, uh, executive branch agencies with wide-sweeping powers to regulate how they see fit.
02:08:02.840And, uh, those regulations then are treated as if they're black-letter law in federal code.
02:15:05.560He's trying to remake himself into this abstract ideal, this idol he has created in his mind.
02:15:13.000He's literally just reducing himself to nothing, literally nothing, because he's not even trying to reduce himself to, like, an andragonous human.
02:15:20.920He's trying to reduce himself to an andragonous non-human.
02:15:24.280So he's not even, he's not even, it's like he doesn't even want to be a person.
02:15:28.660He just wants to be some sort of primitive and dragon and prima materia or something.
02:15:33.000Well, we actually covered somebody who was doing something similar from Los Angeles, a gook, who wanted to be, like, a genderless alien.
02:15:40.500I don't know if you remember that story.