00:07:05.560So he has, you know, within – he doesn't have anything.
00:07:08.980But within numerology, it's the same thing.
00:07:10.540They attribute a number, and that number has, like, a pre-determined set of attributes for a personality.
00:07:16.960What I will say is that it's so accurate – not completely accurate, but it's accurate enough that it makes me wonder if it's just part of, like –
00:07:27.020Like, for a while, I speculated, is this part of God's system?
00:07:30.160Is this the tools that he uses because God knows you and he forms you with a very unique personality?
00:07:42.820But I think that, you know, that nature versus nurture conversation, let's say, where, like, some people believe that if you were born as another person and had all the same experiences that they had, that you would be exactly like them.
00:07:57.680I think that it's pretty observable, especially when you have children, young children.
00:08:01.560You'll be like, they're so drastically different from one another.
00:08:04.700They're so uniquely their own personality that it seems like God formed them that way.
00:08:10.100And so a lot of these mystery schools seem to be focused on these systems rather than the creator of these systems if these systems really are observable and do exist, whether it's numerology, astrology, or otherwise.
00:08:23.100Now, I do think that the problem is once you start believing this, then these things can sort of manipulate you and tell you – if they can curse you, for example, like you're reading an astrology thing and it's like, this month you're just not going to be good with money.
00:08:39.840And you come into agreement with that spirit.
00:08:42.100Next thing you know, you're bad with money that month.
00:08:44.340So I think it's a slippery slope, but it does seem to be real.
00:08:47.140So what do we – I mean, what do you think about all this?
00:08:50.900So like where you're at right now, like you guys have all kind of touched on the same idea.
00:08:55.760I think like if we're talking to this thing high level – and I would like to get down into like the history of this thing because I think it's going to just totally overturn any preconceived notions people have about it.
00:09:08.580But like talking where you're at, any kind of personality test, if you go, here, I'm going to let this thing dictate who I am, then that means you've just removed Christ from the picture, right?
00:09:20.680Like if we're made in the image of God, we're to look to God, right, like as looking into a mirror and see how perfect he is and how fallen we are and to see like the only thing bridging that gap between me and God is Christ, right?
00:09:35.900And so it's through his word that I find out who I am and how I should be and reflecting on that.
00:09:41.300But the problem is this comes in or any of these personality tests, if you let them or astrology or tarot, like any of the – anything archetypal is going to – like archetypes aren't bad.
00:09:54.080Like archetypes are like – they're real.
00:09:56.320They're not like totally make-believe.
00:09:57.980There's something to them and you can learn from that because it's part of observing creation.
00:10:02.680But when you start to go, I'm going to let this thing tell me who I am, now you're totally missing the point.
00:10:10.320Everything's got to come back to scripture.
00:10:12.480It's about your identity in Christ, right?
00:10:14.580It's not your identity in numerology or your identity in any of these things.
00:10:18.240I think that's why a lot of people have a hard time when they don't have like sort of Christ at the center of the foundation of what they're building if their identity is, let's say, in like girl bossing, right, or your identity is like your – I don't know, highly obsessed with your career or any number of things.
00:10:34.760Because I feel like this typically falls apart for you and because it's not built on a firm foundation.
00:10:40.240And at some point it's just embarrassing.
00:10:41.780It's just another embarrassment of the modern 501c3 system that like, yeah, I'm going to get my identity in this minigram, this thing that's made up.
00:11:58.940And I was like, oh, that's interesting.
00:12:01.300But like a day or two before that episode, my intern from this last year, she texts me and she's like, hey, I'm going to be interning at this megachurch down in Georgia and we'll give her some grace because she knows how I feel about that in the first place.
00:12:15.800But she's she's going down to this megachurch and they want her to take the Enneagram before they can even decide if she's someone they want.
00:12:27.580And so I give her like the my quick rundown of like, yeah, here are the sketchy points of it.
00:12:32.620But that kind of sends me a little deeper down the rabbit hole going like, you know, is there more that I'm missing here?
00:12:38.460So I kind of crawl down it a little further.
00:12:42.480I'm at the gym like the next day with a couple of guys that I'm, you know, kind of discipling and we get talking and I was like, yeah, you guys know much about this.
00:12:50.540And one of these guys is like, yeah, I'm in Christian counseling and he wants me to take the Enneagram.
00:12:59.580I get an email from a buddy of mine who is a Christian counselor.
00:13:03.100And he's like, hey, I was wondering if you could just email some pastors in the area if there's anything they're like, you know, not super comfortable dealing with or anything that they would prefer a counselor deal with.
00:13:44.920They wrote a book called Richard Rohr and the Enneagram Secret, and it dives into a lot of this stuff.
00:13:50.800So if you want a good overview, that book's a great overview.
00:13:53.640But we're also going to go some places outside of that.
00:13:56.040If you ask any given Christian today, what is the Enneagram, like a Christian that is dealing with the Enneagram, they're going to say, oh, it's a personality test.
00:15:04.980It's a personality test as well, which is like – I think that maybe there is something to these personality tests because they seem to resonate with people and they seem to like –
00:15:16.260I don't think they would have much of a longstanding if they weren't somewhat accurate.
00:15:21.840But, yeah, it is – I think to boil people down to just nine types is –
00:15:26.820They used to do that to me in rehab, bro.
00:15:28.540When I lived in the rehab, like anything you said about yourself, they were like, oh, you're that type of addict.
00:16:04.200It's like it's been adopted by this guy, and it is a very like corporate kind of workflow idea where you could figure out where your strengths and weaknesses are.
00:16:14.140But it's incorporated with his book that's called Modeling God, which I think makes some decent points about like trying to understand the nature of God.
00:16:23.980I like John, but it has given me pause.
00:16:26.580Like he's given me pause a bunch of places.
00:16:29.360And like one of the last interactions that we had with him was an interview with him and somebody that he's working with that is a Buddhist.
00:17:12.580But it's like a weird – isn't it a strange slippery slope?
00:17:15.140Because, I mean, I think that these things are true, but I think that you can also go to a tarot reader and you can get a lot of truths from that.
00:17:21.680Like we were just covering David's story.
00:17:23.480I don't know if you listened to it again, but like before we started it – shut up, Matt.
00:32:54.560But essentially, Metatron tells him about the 108 Enneagons, and that's where we see the personality types enter, because these Enneagons are what they use to determine your personality type.
00:33:08.840The other spirit he encounters in this Divine Nekoma is named Green Qutub, which is apparently a Sufi spirit.
00:33:19.320He gives him more information about these personality types, whatever.
00:33:25.060He starts piecing this together, and he sort of – he is the first person to be attributed with coming up with the nine personality types.
00:33:33.840Now, Ichazo develops out this teaching, I guess you would say, and so he's got students at this school in Chile, right?
00:33:43.180Once they ascend to a certain level, many of them report also coming in contact with Green Qutub.
00:33:50.640And so these spirits are not just visiting Ichazo, but also his students along the way.
00:36:56.260People suspect that that's what the whole 9-11 thing was about.
00:36:59.040You know, there are multiple things that it was about.
00:37:01.980But they are male and female, and then it's destroyed, and what's resurrected is one tower, meaning a unification, just like the Star of David is this unification of male and female, among other things.
00:37:14.340It's, like, a really dense symbol that means a bunch of shit.
00:37:27.920They just, they change it up a little bit, and then they say, oh, Freemasonry has nothing to do with that, or at least people that are in the lower rungs of Freemasonry who have no idea what their shit is actually about.
00:37:37.680That's what all the obelisks and domes are about and everything.
00:37:41.440Well, the reason that's so sketchy, too, is, like, Kabbalah promotes this idea of non-dualistic thinking, right?
00:37:47.380Like, all things are contained within God, and so they believe in this breakdown of the binary, and so it's like there is no male, there is no female, there's only one, there is, which you got to be careful because Jesus teaches something that could be twisted up to sound similar.
00:38:02.980The problem is Kabbalah totally gets rid of Jesus from the equation.
00:38:14.620Like, so you got to, you got to be careful where you could see how, like, a New Ager or a Kabbalist could try to make the bridge there.
00:38:22.020But Jesus is getting at a different point.
00:38:24.460Um, so the reason I bring that up is because you've got Metatron, this, the Kabbalistic deity, right?
00:38:31.920Like, like, he's literally called in Kabbalah the little Yahweh, and they believe that he's going to be the Messiah figure that comes at the end of time.
00:38:41.340Um, and so Kabbalah is trying to get everybody to kind of accept some form of Kabbalistic thinking to bring this Messiah.
00:38:49.100So you got Metatron over here, sketchy dude.
00:53:59.360And it's about, he literally says, think of the Christ consciousness like a kite flying above a tree line.
00:54:06.320It doesn't matter who's holding the kite.
00:54:08.460So it doesn't matter if you, you know, get to the Christ consciousness through Christ or Gandhi or Muhammad or Buddha, as long as you see the Christ consciousness.
00:54:19.240He says things like, there are no sins.
00:54:21.820The only sin is to think that God does not already dwell in you.
00:54:26.380It's kind of aggravates me because I should go fly, okay, man.
00:54:30.060Almost like what Jacob Israel is trying to scream at me on Twitter.
00:54:33.480If I paid attention and cared enough to read what he's saying.
00:54:35.360This is also what, this is also what that episode about Buddhism was.
00:54:39.400And it's like, it's this weird thing to slip something in that doesn't fit.
00:54:54.580It'd be nice if the creator of the universe would have gave us some kind of messaging system so we could always see through all this bullshit, like right away, like immediately.
00:55:15.580Call it playtime or fun if you like to do that because you want to know more and more about yourself because everything revolves around you and who you are.
00:55:21.900See, but that's the thing that was like.
00:55:23.140Right on, do it, but it has nothing to do with Christ.
00:55:24.680Over and over again, it just seems like there are systems that are, you know, they permeate this reality.
00:55:32.600Well, you know, if God used them as building blocks for this reality, then, you know, so be it.
00:55:38.160But throughout antiquity, you have all these instances of either lowercase g gods or spirit guides, something that was channeled one way or another, revealing some fundamental nature of the realm that we inhabit and then telling you like what to do with it.
00:55:57.440And it's like, I think it's in its rudimentary form.
00:56:22.720I don't you guys cool if I rattle off like it's not a long quote, but it's I think it's like the ultimate nail in Richard Rohr's coffin.
00:56:33.140Like if anybody here is like, well, maybe he is a Christian.
00:56:36.800Like, I don't think you can come to that after this.
00:56:40.460He writes contemplative prayer remaining silently and openly in God's presence rewires our brains to think non dually with compassion.
00:56:50.960So get rid of duality or dualistic thinking kindness and a lack of attachment to the ego's preferences in contemplative prayer.
00:56:59.220We move beyond language to experience God as mystery.
00:57:02.380We let go of our need to judge defend and evaluate plugging into the mind of Christ, which welcomes paradox and knows its true identity in God during contemplation.
00:57:12.860We come to know that there is no separation between sacred and secular.
00:57:49.700We're being asked to just, like, kind of take it at face value in a way.
00:57:54.000Like, we just, that comment that we received from the dude, he's like, he's like, why are you looking so far into this?
00:57:57.920A lot of it is, like, why are you labeling things demonic?
00:58:01.560Like, they'll call it, like, an infantile reductive view of the universe.
00:58:05.620And it's like, well, ultimately, because I do believe that if you're not with Jesus Christ and you're against Jesus Christ, and the way that I see it is, if you're against Jesus Christ, that makes you demonic.
00:58:16.820And my functioning definition of it is against the kingdom of God.
00:58:41.280And in a weird contradictory sense, I'm like, no, no, no, my mind is closed because I am, he's dying laughing.
00:58:48.000I don't know what's the matter with it.
00:58:49.180Because I am like, I am focused on one thing.
00:58:53.160And this one thing that I'm focused on doesn't allow for these externalities.
00:58:57.480But they want you to pay attention to them so badly so that way they could wipe away the one thing that you're focused on, which should be God.
00:59:03.240It is really clever, too, because the argument that's used to open yourself up to these things is a leveraging of your own misunderstanding.
00:59:13.660Like, the idea is that you can't understand the complexities of this thing, so stop protecting yourself against it.
00:59:23.920In so many words, that's what's happening there, right?
00:59:26.040The universe is complex beyond understanding.
00:59:30.000All these systems are complex beyond understanding.
00:59:32.880You look at a thing and you blanketly call it demonic.
00:59:34.920I'm sorry, what the fuck are you doing?
01:04:42.860I was talking to a guy just yesterday where I make this post about the demonic nature of aliens that the government hopes to disclose to us.
01:04:51.900And he reads it as like, oh, this is a Christian calling everything demonic.
01:04:56.700And then he goes something to the effect of like, easy to say until you're face to face with these things.
01:05:04.600And your body is in a state of paralysis.
01:05:06.440And there's all these different things happening.
01:05:46.840And I'm sorry that I came at you with all this.
01:05:50.320And just imagine that you were in a position where you thought it was going to be bullshit.
01:05:54.140And then we had this really crazy conversation, you know, where this guy's just sharing.
01:05:58.380I told him to write in, actually, because it was like this guy remembers a lot to the extent where he's able to struggle during these events.
01:06:05.340He said he's punched the wall, like the inner wall of the craft.
01:06:08.360He said he's trying to punch the entities, but it's never really worked out because he feels like he's moving in, you know, some sort of like pseudo paralysis state.
01:06:16.140But, yeah, man, no, it's I think that's, you know, one of those things that I always whenever I think of wise as serpents and gentle as doves.
01:06:26.100It's like, yeah, you have to understand a thing like the same thing that you said.
01:06:30.060I don't doubt that you're interacting with pagan gods of any variety.
01:06:34.280If you're if you're into the Norse thing, which, by the way, I think it gets big because, you know, you got Thor and you got white people looking for an identity because they've kind of been under the heel of culture over the last like decade or something.
01:06:49.760You know, it's like white people don't have any culture is kind of the thing.
01:06:53.580And so I think that sends people looking for it.
01:06:56.380And Christianity has been reduced to a caricature in the West.
01:07:01.320And then you have like the popular shows like Vikings, which which crushed.
01:07:05.800And so, yeah, all of a sudden you find your your identity in that.
01:07:09.320And it's about I think it's about like getting going all the way over there.
01:07:12.260But don't be persuaded by and I've done this in like the political realm in a sense, like Matt's friend that I was talking to at your house a while back.
01:07:20.640He's deeply in the I guess the on the left side of the political realm.
01:24:20.700You've then got O9A, like you mentioned, which is essentially neo-Nazi Satanism.
01:24:25.600And they believe in their dark gods and all this business.
01:24:28.420And so they use the Enneagram as well, the nine angle rituals.
01:24:32.140I'm listening to, I think it was your guy's show with Tim Constantine, the last one you did.
01:24:41.800And he brought up the seven and eight pointed stars because he was talking about Lilith and then he was talking about Ashtaroth, all these, like, you know, Asherah, all these, like, names.
01:24:54.280But it's really just the divine feminine thing, right?
01:25:35.820So I'm like, okay, well, what's the Baha'i faith, believe?
01:25:39.920The Baha'i faith is, it comes about in, like, the late 1800s, mid-1800s, 1852.
01:25:47.820You've got this guy named Baha'u'ala, okay?
01:25:53.840And he is part of this religion called the Babis.
01:25:58.360And there's this guy named the Bab, and they, he's executed.
01:26:02.480And when he's executed, they take all these other people in this movement, this Baha'u'ala guy, and they put him in this place in Tehran called the Black Pit.
01:28:17.720And we were talking about it in the last episode because we were listing all the New Age thought leaders who looked at this time and said that there was going to be...
01:28:47.620That there was going to be a rebranding of these spiritual entities.
01:28:51.000Now, Rudolph Steiner, at least, had the good sense to determine that these entities were demonic and that they were going to be rebranded as, like, Cosmic Teachers or some crap like that.
01:29:01.200But they were all looking at this and saying that, and the reason that that connected to the Bledsoe's is because the lady wants Chris Bledsoe to go out and convince people that this is not demonic, which is fascinating.
01:29:19.420That's a fascinating angle to be taking.
01:29:21.680In fact, I actually have to, if I wasn't blocked, I would remind Timothy Alvarino that even though he said that the divine feminine is bull when we brought it up on this show...
01:30:55.920But it wasn't just like, you know, this entity was supposed to herald in this time of the divine feminine.
01:31:02.880And it was supposed to be a time of, you know, liberation for women and all these different things.
01:31:08.400Culturally speaking, if you look back at that, it seems that there were some fruits to their labor, although I would argue that they were rotten.
01:32:32.420And basically, I want to help humanity ascend.
01:32:35.800And when you tie that to the fact that you've got Michael Aquino writing Mind War about controlling your thoughts via propaganda at every level of media, it's pretty freaking scary.
01:32:47.920Like, it makes sense why people buy onto this stuff when they're inundated with it constantly.
01:32:53.560See, and that's that thing right there where you said, like, he wants humanity to ascend.
01:32:57.060So people get upset with me because they're like, why do you think aliens are inherently demonic?
01:33:01.840It's like, right now, it's happening in tandem with what?
01:36:44.780Because, like, my issue is, like, well, the word God literally means spirit being.
01:36:49.940Otherwise, when you read, like, when the witch of Endor, like, when Saul goes to the witch of Endor and wants her to resurrect the spirit of Samuel, she does.
01:37:38.660But, you know, but once again, though, that goes back to that Zach referenced it a moment ago, that conversation between Epstein and Lawrence Krauss,
01:37:46.220where Lawrence is made to formulate a debate that Epstein can use.
01:37:51.380Epstein promises not to attribute his name to the article, but he needs an article written that debunks the connection between aliens, ghosts,
01:37:59.580which ghosts, in my opinion, are demonic entities masquerading as dead loved ones, and out-of-body experiences.
01:38:05.960Now, out-of-body experiences includes near-death experience, includes astral projection, but it includes the spiritual realm as well.
01:38:13.560And so my suspicion here is that Albarino is running a narrative that he is not, like I said, overconfident midwit.
01:38:22.720He is not aware of the origins of this narrative, but he should be, you know, he should have some pause here.
01:38:30.900Why would Epstein be concerned with doing that?
01:38:33.120That's a lot of, like, where my research, because I think that's a lot of how this cognitive infiltration works.
01:38:37.900It's not like you're always planting an individual to steer a narrative.
01:38:42.900You are planting a narrative, and that narrative might parallel the truth in many, many ways, but it might have some fundamental lies,
01:38:49.660which is what we talk about in the show all the time.
01:38:51.440And then to find out that the lady is telling Chris Bledsoe it's imperative that you go forth and spread the word that this is not demonic
01:38:58.640is, like, layers upon layers upon layers of alarms.
01:39:02.560And then you look at these New Age practitioners, and they're all saying there's a rebranding coming in the year 2025 and 26 of these entities that were formerly known as demons
01:39:13.440or, as Manly P. Hall puts it, gods, angels, and teachers, and they will be rebranded as, like, cosmic entities.
01:39:25.560That's what he says, cosmic entities, meaning from the cosmos, entities from the cosmos.
01:39:29.200What was previously identified as angels, which he never added the caveat fallen, gods, in a lowercase g, and teachers,
01:39:38.240which they taught mystery school teachings and, you know, agriculture, metallurgy, you name it.
01:39:43.620Manly P. Hall was kind of right over the target.
01:42:59.800That's what all these guys believe, though, by the way, Zach.
01:43:01.100They all believe that it's going to be a falling away and then a conglomeration of all the religions under one banner.
01:43:06.640So it makes sense that you would have, as a, you know, a symbol that represents your belief system, this amalgamation of a symbol from each belief system.
01:43:15.100You know, because that's what they think.
01:43:16.080They're all going to be under one umbrella.
01:43:18.220And it's going to be specifically under the umbrella of these entities.
01:43:23.320But that's what's so crazy about this.
01:43:25.960It's because, like, when you just get back to, like, the simple message of Scripture, you've got the way of Christ, and then you've got the way of the world.
01:43:35.000And really what we're talking about here is the way of the world unifying under a banner.
01:45:38.960And so it is the perfect place for subversion or for distraction or that slight one-degree angle change, which I think – I don't even know if this is a slight change.
01:45:48.080The Enneagram, that seems like an entire departure.
01:48:24.780And it seems like they have to be truthful to some capacity.
01:48:27.840I don't, I don't know the exact legal spiritual law, but it seems like, yeah, when you ask them certain questions, they must answer because there are rules in the spiritual realm.
01:48:37.300The same way that that's how they get your consent.
01:48:39.560There has to be some form of truth telling here.
01:49:57.060Well, it goes to show, though, how deceived and how uneducated people are on the Word of God when they can run into something like the Enneagram where, you know,
01:50:05.340they're talking about the face of God, right?
01:50:06.820Like, talking about, oh, they saw something that sort of resembled God, maybe, and that's what led them astray.
01:50:11.900You've got Richard Rohr on quote saying, the whole Enneagram is called the face of God.
01:50:17.960If you could look at it reality from nine pairs of eyes and honor all of them, you would look at reality through the eyes of God.
01:50:25.160Somebody reads that and goes, yeah, this is a Christian book, you know?
01:50:29.380And it's like, so there's just a level of uneducation happening, too, right?
01:50:34.460Like, that cannot jive with Christianity.
01:50:38.420And at the same time, I do believe that what he's saying is probably true.
01:50:44.540Like, these nine entities that were telling him this stuff, where he's getting this download from, they're probably being sort of accurate.
01:50:51.520Like, they're looking at this world through their eyes, however they – because it seems like they are one, but then they're also nine.
01:50:58.460Like, as Puharich was – when he's channeling this entity, it comes as one, but then it distinguishes itself as nine, eventually, as they continue to channel this.
01:51:08.380So it's like – it does have this sort of – I don't know how to explain it.
01:51:12.880Well, it's interesting because – what was the name of that school before?
01:51:15.740Oh, the – well, the Esalen Institute?
01:52:14.560But there's also these nine realms, right?
01:52:16.360If you go to, like, all these different – what's the belief system?
01:52:22.240Norse mythology has nine different realms.
01:52:24.900So it's, like, there's something about this – these entities and their ability to present as a multitude of things, not just an individual thing but also, like, a conceptual thing.
01:52:49.160I think it's one of those things that, you know, we just can't – if you existed within a higher realm, right?
01:52:54.580If there's a third dimension and that's what we exist in, fourth dimension being time, fifth, sixth, et cetera, you know, these entities supposedly exist in these higher dimensions.
01:53:19.060There is one – there's one school of thought that would kind of confuse that a little bit, and that would be, like, Gary Wayne's take, where he kind of sees it as, like, warring mob bosses.
01:53:50.220The only reason you might do that is because it's probably not all the time, but if you can do that for a time, you become very powerful as a unit.
01:53:58.680So, like, just in the pursuit of power, you might occasionally get together and high-five in a group of nine.
01:54:04.800It's like the five families in The Godfather.
01:54:35.860Yeah, I mean, I don't know how fleshed out of an episode that will be.
01:54:40.700It's going to be a lot of speculation, but I don't even like – even my – you know, the story that you guys gave me such a hard time for that you don't remember.