Nephilim Death Squad - The Trojan Horse w⧸ Zach Killey

00:00:00.400 We're here with one of Planet Fitness' Black Card members.

00:00:03.300 How are you feeling?

00:00:04.440 Pretty wiped, but I've got my eye on the Hydra massage beds.

00:00:08.100 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:00:09.820 Bringing a guest to every workout? Game changer.

00:00:12.600 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

00:00:14.580 Two big ones. Worldwide access and red light technology.

00:00:17.780 Wow, this place really has it all.

00:00:19.720 Back to you in the studio.

00:00:21.220 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

00:00:23.340 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

00:00:26.140 Deal ends March 13th. $49 annual fee applies.

00:00:30.000 Disgusting. Top Lobson Productions.

00:01:00.000 Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to another episode of Nephilim Death Squad.

00:01:27.180 I am David Lee Corbo, a.k.a. The Raven.

00:01:29.440 That is Top Lobson, the father of disinformation.

00:01:31.340 We are joined by Matthew Hepper.

00:01:32.780 Hepper, Heppner, Heppner.

00:01:34.880 Merchant of Brown Water. 0.93

00:01:36.500 And he looks like a criminal.

00:01:37.820 Yeah, don't do that.

00:01:38.500 You guys kicked me off the show.

00:01:39.980 Did you tell everybody yet?

00:01:40.820 Is that what this is?

00:01:41.640 Yeah, you guys kicked me off the show.

00:01:43.540 Oh, you're going on your own channel now.

00:01:45.420 You can't be on our channel.

00:01:46.220 This is the hood of somber.

00:01:47.500 Does everybody know?

00:01:49.060 Somberness, somber.

00:01:50.080 Well, I guess if you want to really plug your stuff, they could know.

00:01:52.800 Oh, that's true.

00:01:54.460 Also, the host of Straight Bible, which is now on its own channel.

00:01:57.340 You guys can go and find that and subscribe to it.

00:01:59.080 You guys remember when he was like, I don't want to plug.

00:02:00.960 I hate plugs.

00:02:01.700 Plugs are for me.

00:02:02.180 I don't want to plug.

00:02:03.120 I just want to be on the same team.

00:02:04.580 You guys are like, no, you got to go on your own channel now.

00:02:06.640 Hey, let me ask you something.

00:02:07.700 I cut these meats and cheeses, and you ate an incredible amount of them, and you got

00:02:10.740 your hood up and everything.

00:02:11.600 And I just feel like there's a lot of disrespect going on.

00:02:13.840 I'm hurt.

00:02:15.240 That's what this is about?

00:02:16.220 You're eating your feelings.

00:02:17.340 Can we just introduce the guest?

00:02:18.320 No, we have to get through plugs.

00:02:19.860 Don't rush the plugs.

00:02:20.700 It's an art form.

00:02:21.220 Guys, patreon.com forward slash Nephilim Death Squad.

00:02:23.240 Sign up there and gain early access to episodes.

00:02:26.160 Add free viewing experiences.

00:02:27.560 Also, unedited versions.

00:02:28.880 Very important.

00:02:29.680 You also get something.

00:02:32.540 What do you get?

00:02:33.360 Early dibs.

00:02:33.960 The tickets to Prohemian Grove, which we just found out that the venue won $16,000.

00:02:37.620 And I don't know how.

00:02:40.820 We have no venues.

00:02:42.180 To be determined when the venue is going to happen.

00:02:44.420 $16,000.

00:02:45.680 What the?

00:02:45.840 Anyway, when they do drop, they'll be there.

00:02:47.960 Also, discount codes off merchandise from TopLobstead.com.

00:02:50.060 Well, David, I mean, if you don't want to compete with Blurry Creatures, we could just 0.99

00:02:52.860 do it.

00:02:52.920 I know.

00:02:53.380 That's the thing.

00:02:54.080 Small.

00:02:54.540 We don't have that Aaron Rodgers money.

00:02:57.220 And I don't know how the hell we're going to pull this off.

00:02:59.200 It's a criminal.

00:02:59.800 Today, we have a great guest.

00:03:00.720 Take that hood down.

00:03:01.520 You disrespectful.

00:03:02.160 Zach is on the show.

00:03:03.420 Relax.

00:03:03.860 Returning to the show.

00:03:05.440 Pastor Zach Kelly.

00:03:06.340 Hi, Zach.

00:03:07.520 What's up, guys?

00:03:08.920 Good to be here.

00:03:09.520 Before we get into it, let's remind everybody who you is, what you do, where they find you.

00:03:14.240 Yeah.

00:03:14.560 So, I mean, I'm a pastor.

00:03:17.680 I've had a podcast for, like, four years now that's really been on the back burner for

00:03:22.020 some months.

00:03:22.940 And these guys kind of talked me back into getting back at it.

00:03:27.860 So, we're going to be starting up a new podcast here soon.

00:03:31.100 Was called Salty Saints.

00:03:32.480 We're going to be calling this one The Berean Files.

00:03:35.740 Oh, I like that.

00:03:36.680 Say The Berean Files?

00:03:37.720 Berean Files.

00:03:38.760 That's heavy, bro.

00:03:39.620 I'm sorry.

00:03:39.940 Greg.

00:03:41.160 What's the Berean Files?

00:03:42.760 Come on.

00:03:42.980 Do you know who the Bereans are? 1.00

00:03:44.820 No, I'm an idiot. 1.00

00:03:45.680 Please. 1.00

00:03:46.100 Okay.

00:03:46.440 So, in the Bible, Paul's talking to this group of people called the Bereans, and he commends

00:03:50.900 them because they don't just take anything he says at face value.

00:03:54.060 They take everything he says, and they take it back to Scripture, and they test it.

00:03:57.380 And then they come back, and they say, okay, we accept what you said.

00:04:00.180 And then they accept him.

00:04:01.100 And so, it's sort of this idea of, like, you know, let's get into the weird.

00:04:04.440 Let's get into the conspiracies.

00:04:05.740 Let's talk about, you know, the nooks and crannies of the world, but let's do it through

00:04:08.840 a biblical filter.

00:04:09.960 Let's take it all back to Scripture.

00:04:11.460 Let's not just get swept up in, you know, every given thing going on on Instagram, every

00:04:18.120 trend, right?

00:04:18.720 So, like, let's test it.

00:04:21.020 Let's talk about the weird stuff.

00:04:22.960 Really, we're just stealing your guy's show.

00:04:24.400 I hope that sounds okay.

00:04:25.580 No, it sounds like straight Bible, but better.

00:04:27.920 Yeah, I didn't even think about how that relates to our show.

00:04:30.760 I was just going, I like that, dude.

00:04:32.980 That's a banger.

00:04:33.820 Now I understand why I like it.

00:04:34.940 Like, that focuses on what the Bible says, but with a personality that's more likable.

00:04:39.060 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:04:39.980 That isn't, like, sort of eaten away by the acid of coffee.

00:04:45.440 Coffee's really acidic.

00:04:46.460 I don't know if you know this.

00:04:47.200 Coffee is highly acidic. 0.99

00:04:48.480 You guys are nasty. 0.99

00:04:49.320 You threw me off the channel, dude. 0.99

00:04:50.820 I'm a little hurt.

00:04:51.160 We didn't throw you off the channel.

00:04:52.480 Yes, you did, dude.

00:04:52.940 Well, maybe if you didn't act like, you know, you own the place.

00:04:57.520 Oh, man, that was so good.

00:04:59.420 Anyway, that's it.

00:05:01.340 All right, so one more time for the audience.

00:05:02.620 What's it called?

00:05:03.620 It's going to be called The Berean Files.

00:05:05.380 If you want to kind of stay in the loop on how that's coming along, I'd say it'll be up

00:05:08.900 in the next, like, within the month or so.

00:05:11.220 Like, I don't know, give it a few weeks.

00:05:13.260 We're waiting on some new stuff to come in, setting up a new kind of podcast area.

00:05:17.720 But follow us at Salty Saints Podcast.

00:05:21.120 Be careful.

00:05:21.880 Don't do the YouTube one.

00:05:22.900 That's Mormon. 0.99

00:05:23.620 That's not us.

00:05:24.320 And I keep getting all their mail, and I'm real over it.

00:05:27.680 But, yeah, follow us there.

00:05:30.020 We'll keep you in the loop.

00:05:31.080 Or you can contact us at SaltySaintsPodcast.com.

00:05:33.480 You know, something mildly interesting about the Mormons is that, for whatever reason, Epstein

00:05:36.220 was, like, obsessed with their blood.

00:05:37.400 I don't know if he's drinking it or what he's doing.

00:05:38.720 But something about the Mormon bloodline.

00:05:40.520 I think we're actually going to be talking to Heidi Love about that soon.

00:05:43.500 So that should be interesting.

00:05:45.840 All right.

00:05:46.360 So good to have you back, Zach.

00:05:48.320 What are we talking about, dude?

00:05:50.520 Okay.

00:05:50.760 So last time I was on, we talked about the church.

00:05:54.940 I know in that, for, like, just briefly, I mentioned the Enneagram.

00:06:04.120 Uh-oh.

00:06:05.480 Uh-oh, yeah.

00:06:06.160 You froze.

00:06:06.520 Ah, we're back.

00:06:07.240 We're back.

00:06:07.680 We're back.

00:06:08.120 We're back.

00:06:08.380 Okay.

00:06:08.660 You mentioned the Enneagram.

00:06:10.400 Yeah.

00:06:10.780 Did you guys did or didn't know what that was?

00:06:13.860 I knew what it was.

00:06:15.060 I don't know what it is.

00:06:16.360 It's the Enneagram, bro.

00:06:17.400 So it's like when church kids come in, they're like, I'm a number four.

00:06:20.180 I'm a number seven.

00:06:21.180 I'm a number three.

00:06:22.020 What is it?

00:06:22.520 Numerology for the church?

00:06:23.500 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:06:24.260 It's like their identity.

00:06:25.500 Their identity is not in Christ.

00:06:26.840 It's in some number system that somebody made up.

00:06:29.620 Dude.

00:06:29.840 And, of course, the kids are like, no, a pastor did this.

00:06:32.880 A pastor made up the Enneagram.

00:06:34.660 And each personality goes with a number. 1.00

00:06:37.480 And I'm like, yeah, that's super stupid. 0.99

00:06:38.960 They're like, oh, you're a number two. 1.00

00:06:40.640 Dude, that's.

00:06:41.120 Or, like, whichever number it is that's, like, is the one that's like, yeah, I'm not going to take part in this.

00:06:45.560 They're like, oh, you're that number.

00:06:47.240 Okay, wait, wait.

00:06:47.780 So this is fascinating because there's numerology, which shout out to Gary the numbers guy.

00:06:52.320 I've been praying for my enemies, all right?

00:06:54.000 And I think that that's a good thing.

00:06:56.380 And he's my enemy. 1.00

00:06:58.060 And he's a fat retard. 1.00

00:06:59.160 So I've been praying for him. 0.99

00:07:00.340 Hey.

00:07:00.840 And, oh, okay, that's interesting.

00:07:02.480 Oh, I don't like that symbology.

00:07:03.700 Yeah, come on. 0.77

00:07:04.300 What is this?

00:07:04.740 The cabalism.

00:07:05.560 So he has, you know, within – he doesn't have anything.

00:07:08.980 But within numerology, it's the same thing.

00:07:10.540 They attribute a number, and that number has, like, a pre-determined set of attributes for a personality.

00:07:16.960 What I will say is that it's so accurate – not completely accurate, but it's accurate enough that it makes me wonder if it's just part of, like –

00:07:27.020 Like, for a while, I speculated, is this part of God's system?

00:07:30.160 Is this the tools that he uses because God knows you and he forms you with a very unique personality?

00:07:35.800 I believe that.

00:07:36.300 I don't think that –

00:07:37.860 These people got six million tests taken this year.

00:07:40.380 Whoa, six million?

00:07:41.080 That seems a little high.

00:07:41.920 Sounds a little high.

00:07:42.820 But I think that, you know, that nature versus nurture conversation, let's say, where, like, some people believe that if you were born as another person and had all the same experiences that they had, that you would be exactly like them.

00:07:56.440 I actually disagree with that.

00:07:57.680 I think that it's pretty observable, especially when you have children, young children.

00:08:01.560 You'll be like, they're so drastically different from one another.

00:08:04.700 They're so uniquely their own personality that it seems like God formed them that way.

00:08:10.100 And so a lot of these mystery schools seem to be focused on these systems rather than the creator of these systems if these systems really are observable and do exist, whether it's numerology, astrology, or otherwise.

00:08:23.100 Now, I do think that the problem is once you start believing this, then these things can sort of manipulate you and tell you – if they can curse you, for example, like you're reading an astrology thing and it's like, this month you're just not going to be good with money.

00:08:39.840 And you come into agreement with that spirit.

00:08:42.100 Next thing you know, you're bad with money that month.

00:08:44.340 So I think it's a slippery slope, but it does seem to be real.

00:08:47.140 So what do we – I mean, what do you think about all this?

00:08:50.900 So like where you're at right now, like you guys have all kind of touched on the same idea.

00:08:55.760 I think like if we're talking to this thing high level – and I would like to get down into like the history of this thing because I think it's going to just totally overturn any preconceived notions people have about it.

00:09:08.580 But like talking where you're at, any kind of personality test, if you go, here, I'm going to let this thing dictate who I am, then that means you've just removed Christ from the picture, right?

00:09:20.680 Like if we're made in the image of God, we're to look to God, right, like as looking into a mirror and see how perfect he is and how fallen we are and to see like the only thing bridging that gap between me and God is Christ, right?

00:09:35.900 And so it's through his word that I find out who I am and how I should be and reflecting on that.

00:09:41.300 But the problem is this comes in or any of these personality tests, if you let them or astrology or tarot, like any of the – anything archetypal is going to – like archetypes aren't bad.

00:09:54.080 Like archetypes are like – they're real.

00:09:56.320 They're not like totally make-believe.

00:09:57.980 There's something to them and you can learn from that because it's part of observing creation.

00:10:02.680 But when you start to go, I'm going to let this thing tell me who I am, now you're totally missing the point.

00:10:10.320 Everything's got to come back to scripture.

00:10:12.480 It's about your identity in Christ, right?

00:10:14.580 It's not your identity in numerology or your identity in any of these things.

00:10:18.240 I think that's why a lot of people have a hard time when they don't have like sort of Christ at the center of the foundation of what they're building if their identity is, let's say, in like girl bossing, right, or your identity is like your – I don't know, highly obsessed with your career or any number of things.

00:10:34.760 Because I feel like this typically falls apart for you and because it's not built on a firm foundation.

00:10:40.240 And at some point it's just embarrassing.

00:10:41.780 It's just another embarrassment of the modern 501c3 system that like, yeah, I'm going to get my identity in this minigram, this thing that's made up.

00:10:49.460 It's a number.

00:10:50.180 It's anything other than Christ.

00:10:51.620 I'm going to get my identity in anything other than Christ.

00:10:53.840 Well, I'm curious as to hear – I'm curious to hear how did this work its way into the church?

00:11:00.080 Are they saying that it has like biblical foundations?

00:11:02.700 Like how are they justifying it among the youth or the people in the church?

00:11:06.320 Yeah.

00:11:06.760 So, I mean, essentially what you've got here is – can I kind of explain what brought this up, like why I contacted you about this?

00:11:17.280 So, I was listening to your guys' episode with Red Panda Koala and Piccabra.

00:11:24.200 And you guys in that episode –

00:11:26.040 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

00:11:29.780 How are you feeling?

00:11:30.720 Oh, pretty wiped.

00:11:32.040 But I've got my eye on the Hydra massage beds.

00:11:34.600 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:11:36.200 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

00:11:38.100 Game changer.

00:11:39.100 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

00:11:41.080 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

00:11:44.280 Wow.

00:11:44.800 This place really has it all.

00:11:46.220 Back to you in the studio.

00:11:47.760 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

00:11:49.840 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

00:11:52.660 Deal ends March 13th.

00:11:53.660 $49 annual fee applies.

00:11:57.160 That connect here.

00:11:58.940 And I was like, oh, that's interesting.

00:12:01.300 But like a day or two before that episode, my intern from this last year, she texts me and she's like, hey, I'm going to be interning at this megachurch down in Georgia and we'll give her some grace because she knows how I feel about that in the first place.

00:12:15.800 But she's she's going down to this megachurch and they want her to take the Enneagram before they can even decide if she's someone they want.

00:12:23.440 So you got that.

00:12:27.580 And so I give her like the my quick rundown of like, yeah, here are the sketchy points of it.

00:12:32.620 But that kind of sends me a little deeper down the rabbit hole going like, you know, is there more that I'm missing here?

00:12:38.460 So I kind of crawl down it a little further.

00:12:42.480 I'm at the gym like the next day with a couple of guys that I'm, you know, kind of discipling and we get talking and I was like, yeah, you guys know much about this.

00:12:50.540 And one of these guys is like, yeah, I'm in Christian counseling and he wants me to take the Enneagram.

00:12:57.860 It's not a week ago.

00:12:59.580 I get an email from a buddy of mine who is a Christian counselor.

00:13:03.100 And he's like, hey, I was wondering if you could just email some pastors in the area if there's anything they're like, you know, not super comfortable dealing with or anything that they would prefer a counselor deal with.

00:13:15.480 Give them my number.

00:13:16.140 I'd love to do that.

00:13:16.760 I said, yeah, I can do that, man.

00:13:17.620 Could you give me a website?

00:13:19.560 So he gives me the website.

00:13:20.940 I get on and the Enneagram is one of the tools they use.

00:13:23.900 It just keeps coming up.

00:13:25.420 There's like three or four other situations like that where I'm like, okay, this thing's obviously still prevalent.

00:13:33.220 And this is something I actually talked about on my podcast years ago with Marsha Montenegro.

00:13:38.780 So I jumped back in her book.

00:13:40.560 She wrote a book with a guy named Don Vino and his wife.

00:13:43.280 I think it's Joy or Joyce Vino.

00:13:44.920 They wrote a book called Richard Rohr and the Enneagram Secret, and it dives into a lot of this stuff.

00:13:50.800 So if you want a good overview, that book's a great overview.

00:13:53.640 But we're also going to go some places outside of that.

00:13:56.040 If you ask any given Christian today, what is the Enneagram, like a Christian that is dealing with the Enneagram, they're going to say, oh, it's a personality test. 0.85

00:14:04.880 It tells you how God wired you.

00:14:06.660 There's nine different personality types.

00:14:08.780 And basically, by observing these nine points, this nine-pointed star, and we'll get there, you see these nine types.

00:14:21.960 And it's not just like you're this type and that's it.

00:14:24.960 It's like you're this type and then you're like adjacent to this type.

00:14:28.220 And it might be a weakness of yours or something.

00:14:30.980 But this is the path God has for you is the whole idea.

00:14:35.200 The problem is it's claimed as this ancient Christian practice, and it's not.

00:14:40.200 It's a Trojan horse into – no, I'm serious, man. 0.54

00:14:43.680 It's a train wreck, and it's bad.

00:14:45.560 Like it's all over the place bad.

00:14:46.980 We're going to be jumping around a lot.

00:14:48.680 So wait up, Zach.

00:14:49.360 You're familiar with the show.

00:14:52.200 You've seen the episodes with John Lenhart?

00:14:55.600 Maybe.

00:14:56.180 Can you give me a refresher?

00:14:57.180 It's Ed Mabry's friend.

00:14:59.040 He's the guy that has the course.

00:15:03.400 I don't know that I know him.

00:15:04.980 It's a personality test as well, which is like – I think that maybe there is something to these personality tests because they seem to resonate with people and they seem to like –

00:15:16.260 I don't think they would have much of a longstanding if they weren't somewhat accurate.

00:15:21.840 But, yeah, it is – I think to boil people down to just nine types is –

00:15:26.820 They used to do that to me in rehab, bro.

00:15:28.540 When I lived in the rehab, like anything you said about yourself, they were like, oh, you're that type of addict.

00:15:33.840 And I was like, no, no, I'm Matt.

00:15:35.480 Like I'm Matt.

00:15:36.000 I'm a human.

00:15:36.720 So this guy has this thing called Flosest.

00:15:40.040 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:15:40.480 I actually think it's kind of accurate.

00:15:41.980 You can take the test, and it'll tell you your uniqueness, your personality type, and it kind of goes down to understanding your brain.

00:15:50.620 And then he – yeah, it's an interesting thing.

00:15:53.480 You have to do this at work.

00:15:54.720 Like we had to do this at Trinity.

00:15:56.000 Yeah.

00:15:56.160 You have to do this in business.

00:15:57.500 You have to do this in the world system.

00:15:59.020 It's just when the church adopts it, it's just like a little interesting.

00:16:03.080 Well, this is the thing about this.

00:16:04.200 It's like it's been adopted by this guy, and it is a very like corporate kind of workflow idea where you could figure out where your strengths and weaknesses are.

00:16:14.140 But it's incorporated with his book that's called Modeling God, which I think makes some decent points about like trying to understand the nature of God.

00:16:22.600 But I'm not going to lie.

00:16:23.980 I like John, but it has given me pause.

00:16:26.580 Like he's given me pause a bunch of places.

00:16:29.360 And like one of the last interactions that we had with him was an interview with him and somebody that he's working with that is a Buddhist.

00:16:37.440 Yeah, that was a –

00:16:38.700 I listened to that one.

00:16:40.160 One of the other few contentious episodes we've ever had.

00:16:43.180 Jason Dentrock.

00:16:43.800 And it wasn't – like I wasn't trying to be contentious, but I was trying to understand –

00:16:47.240 Maybe a little nasty.

00:16:48.440 No, I was just trying to understand where they were coming from because I like all the guys.

00:16:53.140 I like the people who suggested them.

00:16:54.620 And I was just kind of confused about the conflation between Buddha and Jesus Christ.

00:17:02.140 I was like, I don't really see any of that there.

00:17:03.740 And really my question was like, what does Buddhism do about repentance, sin, forgiveness, redemption?

00:17:10.680 And the answer was basically nothing.

00:17:12.580 But it's like a weird – isn't it a strange slippery slope?

00:17:15.140 Because, I mean, I think that these things are true, but I think that you can also go to a tarot reader and you can get a lot of truths from that.

00:17:21.680 Like we were just covering David's story. 0.59

00:17:23.480 I don't know if you listened to it again, but like before we started it – shut up, Matt. 0.99

00:17:27.760 Your face. 0.96

00:17:28.560 What was our face doing the thing?

00:17:30.160 You see it?

00:17:30.840 It was heavy.

00:17:32.000 It was heavy.

00:17:32.500 David's thing was heavy.

00:17:33.420 You didn't listen to it.

00:17:34.380 Yes, I did, bro.

00:17:34.520 You listened to the first 20 minutes of it.

00:17:35.960 No, dude.

00:17:36.580 The silverware drawer, that was heavy, bro.

00:17:38.360 Okay.

00:17:38.700 It was a heavy drawer.

00:17:39.460 That's why he dropped it.

00:17:39.900 That's why I dropped it.

00:17:41.040 No, he goes – right before we started the show, I think the same day.

00:17:44.480 I'm not exactly sure.

00:17:45.280 Almost the same.

00:17:45.840 It might have been the same day, if not the same like two days or three days.

00:17:49.260 He goes on the strip in New Orleans.

00:17:50.960 They're taking a vacation. 0.99

00:17:53.280 He sees a tarot reader because he's retarded. 0.99

00:17:55.480 Yes. 0.83

00:17:55.800 The guy tells him the thing that you're doing now for pleasure, you're going to be doing

00:17:59.580 for – as a profession, you're going to be traveling a lot.

00:18:01.840 A lot of people are going to hate you.

00:18:03.040 Lo and behold, here we are about two years later, all completely accurate.

00:18:07.340 Yeah.

00:18:08.380 But I think that you had some issues probably.

00:18:11.080 You had a lot of poltergeist issues probably because of that.

00:18:12.540 Well, yeah, there was a lot of like demonic spirits directly like – wasn't like a conflation.

00:18:18.080 It was like, oh, okay, this is a real – it was almost like I jumped into like this

00:18:21.980 weird spiritual warfare thing.

00:18:23.940 But I think that –

00:18:24.660 Well, you opened up a door in order to see something that I think was true.

00:18:28.040 It's not that the guy put a blessing on you.

00:18:29.600 He's just telling you.

00:18:30.360 He's like, yo, this is kind of what you're doing.

00:18:31.160 But that's how they get you. 0.98

00:18:32.320 I think if I went back and they started telling me other shit, I would have been like, well, 0.99

00:18:36.820 that other shit was real, right? 0.99

00:18:38.240 So now I'm going to start to agree. 0.99

00:18:39.760 I'm going to nod my head yes. 0.99

00:18:41.460 So let's say I go back to the tarot card thing and they start telling me all kinds of shit 0.99

00:18:45.320 that's bad for me. 0.99

00:18:46.300 And I'm going to go, well, the other shit was true. 0.97

00:18:48.580 So this must be – and by that time, those spiritual entities already got you. 0.98

00:18:52.140 They gave you something that was true so that you'd come back.

00:18:54.440 They play a long, sneaky game.

00:18:56.060 So like, yeah, I've opened up a spiritual doorway to allow these things access to my life.

00:18:59.820 But now should I feel the compulsion to go back to this place, they got me on the hook,

00:19:03.680 dude.

00:19:03.760 They can tell me whatever and I'm going to come into agreement with it.

00:19:05.900 Just to like kind of tie up my point, I like John Lenhart.

00:19:09.140 I think this flow test thing, there's something actually accurate about it when you do take

00:19:13.120 this test if you're honest with the questions that you're answering.

00:19:16.140 But I'm super skeptical of going down and continuing to believe this route.

00:19:22.580 Like I'm not going to go and dig any further and I'm not going to attribute whatever this

00:19:27.340 test told me about.

00:19:28.300 I was like, okay, cool, interesting.

00:19:29.620 And I put it to the side.

00:19:30.720 But there is something about it that like you go down that road and we ended up, like I

00:19:37.140 said with the last episode, we're talking about like, oh, the overlaps of Buddhism and Christianity.

00:19:40.600 And I'm like, therefore, what are we extrapolating from that?

00:19:43.140 Like so Buddhism is the same as Christianity because now we're getting slippery. 0.99

00:19:47.500 You know what I mean?

00:19:47.800 So I mean, you guys had Izzy Griffin on the show, right?

00:19:52.060 Yeah, yeah.

00:19:52.900 Yeah.

00:19:53.220 So I mean, have you heard, I think he might have even done a rundown on like his thoughts

00:19:56.840 on like archetypes on here.

00:19:58.440 Is that right?

00:19:58.860 Yes.

00:19:59.760 Yeah. 0.96

00:20:00.080 So I mean, he's got some pretty good shows on that, but like he talks about the fool card 0.82

00:20:03.560 a lot. 0.98

00:20:04.380 And like he recognizes that he sees himself in the fool card. 0.93

00:20:07.720 And I don't think that's necessarily wrong. 0.99

00:20:09.660 Like the fool card, it makes sense. 0.82

00:20:11.500 When you're at the bottom of the barrel, you have, you have nothing but a possibility 0.99

00:20:15.820 before you.

00:20:16.940 That makes sense.

00:20:18.120 Like that in itself is not wrong.

00:20:20.000 But when you shuffle the deck and you go, show me who I am, that's wrong.

00:20:24.600 Yeah.

00:20:24.800 You know, and it's like, it's like when you make this thing an idol, when you make this

00:20:29.120 thing an idol, that's where the problems come in.

00:20:31.580 Or when you make any of these things idols and it at their core, all these things are

00:20:36.520 kind of like tarot decks.

00:20:37.760 Like anytime you're going to take a personality test and say, show me who I am, you're putting

00:20:43.620 an idol before you in a lot of ways.

00:20:45.420 Like you're, you're letting it dictate you.

00:20:48.320 That's where, so in that numerology thing that I was talking about earlier, this guy,

00:20:52.740 he combines like numerology with Chinese astrology, I think, or Chinese, the Chinese, whatever,

00:21:00.600 like new year, whatever animal you are.

00:21:02.320 And what ends up happening is you get like this really, very like seemingly accurate upon

00:21:09.800 multiple levels.

00:21:10.680 Like it's, it's one of the more in-depth ones I ever saw.

00:21:12.960 I saw that and it was like, this is, you know, what you're like as a person.

00:21:18.240 And I was like, ah, I can, a lot of those things.

00:21:21.440 And then what happens is it's like, okay, now, and this is what he does.

00:21:25.300 He goes, now, if you start doing things on like certain days, you know, you know, like

00:21:31.140 certain dates, you can kind of get this thing to bend to your will.

00:21:34.140 And like, if you start placing bets, or if you start pricing things out at a certain

00:21:40.140 price, you can kind of trick this system into funneling.

00:21:44.160 And I'm like, oh, okay.

00:21:45.580 So now what you're doing is you're telling me that I can bend God's creation to my will

00:21:51.200 by manipulating these things that seem to have some fundamental root in the nature of

00:21:55.400 reality. 0.99

00:21:55.760 And like, that's where immediately shit gets slippery. 0.99

00:21:58.020 So if you're going to show me like, hey, check this out. 0.99

00:22:00.840 Doesn't this remind you of you?

00:22:02.220 And I'm going to go like, oh, that's fascinating.

00:22:04.140 Then I might speculate like, okay, maybe there's something about that, that, that is

00:22:07.660 maybe the system God uses to create a unique individual, but am I going to go in and mess

00:22:12.680 with that thing, turn it into an idol, start using it to try to bend, you know, reality

00:22:16.620 to my will.

00:22:17.200 I think that's a real bad idea.

00:22:19.400 I'll be honest.

00:22:19.860 I have reservations about introducing it at all because like, like we talk about with

00:22:25.300 psychedelics on the show.

00:22:27.120 Yeah.

00:22:27.600 People like, oh, you are, you're anti-mushroom.

00:22:29.260 It's like, in a way.

00:22:30.260 Yeah.

00:22:30.580 I just don't want to introduce that to you because I don't know where you're at and I don't

00:22:33.340 know what you're going to do with it.

00:22:34.540 Like, that's just a reality.

00:22:36.380 And it's, I don't know, we kind of have introduced this thing in a sense.

00:22:39.700 And I'm like, yeah, it's a little, it's a little strange.

00:22:43.800 Yeah.

00:22:44.140 Yeah, it is.

00:22:44.700 Well, in all fairness, man, I mean, like you look at kind of the fruit something reaps,

00:22:49.760 like how many people that take mushrooms go come back and tell you they talk to God,

00:22:53.640 they've got the whole universe figured out now.

00:22:55.140 You know, like some people go take psychedelics and then they're like, I've got it all figured

00:22:59.080 out now, bro.

00:22:59.720 And it's like, I don't think that's good.

00:23:01.620 I don't think you're supposed to have it all figured out now.

00:23:04.020 I think that's a slow drip through reading scripture, you know.

00:23:08.300 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

00:23:11.160 How are you feeling?

00:23:12.100 Oh, pretty wiped.

00:23:13.400 But I've got my eye on the hydro massage beds.

00:23:15.960 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:23:17.640 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

00:23:19.520 Game changer.

00:23:20.460 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

00:23:22.340 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

00:23:25.660 Wow.

00:23:26.160 This place really has it all.

00:23:27.560 Back to you in the studio.

00:23:29.120 Get your first month free with a PF lock card.

00:23:31.220 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

00:23:34.020 Deal ends March 13th.

00:23:35.020 $49 annual fee applies.

00:23:38.720 But I think if we, are you guys cool kind of digging into the history on this thing and

00:23:43.320 just kind of showing its roots?

00:23:45.140 Yeah, I was already looking into it a little bit.

00:23:46.780 I'm like, did this guy channel to get this idea?

00:23:49.160 Because it's like every, but it doesn't seem to be the case.

00:23:51.560 But over and over again, it's like each time somebody has access to some system, it's

00:23:55.380 like they got it through channeling.

00:23:56.920 You know how that's how chiropractic happened?

00:23:59.180 Really?

00:23:59.760 Yeah.

00:24:00.780 Isn't that interesting? 0.99

00:24:02.100 Damn it. 0.98

00:24:02.380 The problem with this one is it's not just like one person channeling. 0.99

00:24:05.560 It's like a lot of people channeling.

00:24:07.520 That's what we're going to find out.

00:24:08.720 Like it's a train wreck, man.

00:24:10.000 That's why I like the Trojan horse analogy with this thing, because it isn't really just

00:24:14.600 one thing.

00:24:15.940 To me, it feels like a big kind of blank slate Trojan horse that they have shoved full of 0.76

00:24:21.940 every kind of occultism and backdoored it in the church and said, this is Christian accepted.

00:24:27.000 And on the surface, it's this personality test.

00:24:31.640 But if you start digging, it's going to lead you to every form of occultism.

00:24:35.920 That's the problem.

00:24:37.900 It starts, like I said, they say it's an ancient Christian practice.

00:24:41.980 The thing is, if you actually trace this back to where it started, it starts with a guy named

00:24:46.700 George Gurdjieff back in the early 1900s.

00:24:50.180 And he's this Russian dude.

00:24:53.160 It would be modern day Armenia. 0.91

00:24:55.400 But he develops this shape, right?

00:24:57.580 And it's just the nine pointed star.

00:24:59.740 But you'll notice it's like not a complete star.

00:25:01.740 It's like missing that bottom portion for whatever reason.

00:25:04.400 Yeah, it's open.

00:25:04.720 Yeah, and I don't know that there's any reason for that.

00:25:07.940 That's just what he draws, right?

00:25:10.160 There are no personality types connected to it at that time.

00:25:13.720 But this Gurdjieff dude, his dad is a he's a bard. 1.00

00:25:17.980 And so Gurdjieff, at a really young age, is exposed to all forms of mysticism by all these

00:25:25.060 people that are kind of coming through his dad's trade posts and all this he's talking

00:25:28.240 to, gets super intrigued.

00:25:30.460 And for 20 years, he starts traveling the world.

00:25:32.960 He ends up going to Egypt, Central Asia, India.

00:25:37.460 And he learns from dervishes.

00:25:40.680 He learns from Fakirs. 1.00

00:25:42.920 And he learns from what he says are the descendants.

00:25:46.280 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:25:47.420 Yeah, I got to be careful with that one, right?

00:25:50.380 Yeah.

00:25:50.580 So basically, like these holy men of different religions, like Muslim holy men, Sufi holy

00:25:55.240 men.

00:25:55.800 And then he claims he learns from the Essenes, descendants of the Essenes, like biblical times.

00:26:00.860 Is this guy, he's working with Oscar Echazo?

00:26:07.520 No, Echazo comes later.

00:26:09.840 Echazo is going to pick up the teachings.

00:26:12.280 So I don't want to interrupt, but right here, it's just fascinating that he ends up in the

00:26:17.620 church because what he just said, right, where it's like it's an amalgamation of all

00:26:21.200 these different mystic teachings.

00:26:23.140 The idea that this is in the church is insane because later on he's saying that Oscar comes

00:26:27.360 in and Oscar encompass classical philosophy, psychology, medicine, law, yada, yada, but

00:26:34.820 Buddhism, Sufism, and Kabbalah.

00:26:39.080 So yeah, it's like that's the root of this thing, Zach, and this is what's in the church?

00:26:43.240 Well, so here's the other problem, right, that we're going to run into.

00:26:47.240 So like everything I just told you about Gurdjieff is pretty speculative because it's

00:26:51.720 all just kind of coming from his lips.

00:26:53.220 So he's claiming these things happen, but there's no documentation of anything.

00:26:56.860 These things happen.

00:26:58.220 And then all of his students start kind of building out the story more.

00:27:03.080 So he has this dude named Uspinski that kind of takes it.

00:27:07.040 I'm sorry, that's like their official symbol for the mini-gram?

00:27:10.240 It is.

00:27:10.700 It's like on the page and stuff?

00:27:11.960 That's what's outside your cans.

00:27:13.080 So Christians are looking at that and they're going like, yeah, man, what's the problem here? 0.96

00:27:16.160 They look at that and they go, amen.

00:27:18.440 Spiritually, it's not spiritually dead, but like if you're not understanding the symbology

00:27:23.200 that they're showing you because they have to, you're lost.

00:27:24.840 I've never seen that.

00:27:25.780 It's just the minute kids came in talking about it, I was like, guys, guys, this has nothing

00:27:29.060 to do with Christ.

00:27:29.640 This guy also, keep in mind, he's got a Kabbalah energy drink in the fridge right there.

00:27:34.160 I know, he's got the Kabbalah energy drink in there.

00:27:36.020 We didn't know until we told him. 1.00

00:27:37.560 We walked in and said, get that shit out of here. 1.00

00:27:39.000 Yeah. 1.00

00:27:39.460 Because we're the boys.

00:27:40.340 We own the place.

00:27:41.060 That's right.

00:27:41.940 Kabbalah definitely comes into this.

00:27:43.520 Yeah, I mean, I can see that already, right?

00:27:46.080 It's just wild that, I mean, we're already off to a really bad start.

00:27:49.620 26 minutes in and this thing's origins have nothing to do with Christianity.

00:27:54.300 Oh, no.

00:27:54.680 This is the vetting process that these people are using?

00:27:58.220 Madness.

00:27:58.500 They have no vetting process.

00:28:00.740 That's my main complaint is we've got pastors, literally Sandals Church, did an entire sermon

00:28:07.060 series on this telling you how good it is and how Christian it is and how beneficial

00:28:11.680 it is and it's like, did you even look into it for five minutes?

00:28:15.860 Like, you don't even have to dig that deep before you're like, oh, this is awful.

00:28:20.320 Like, it's immediately awful.

00:28:21.120 It's all about the God of self.

00:28:22.880 It's not like, it takes five seconds.

00:28:24.620 The kids start telling me about him like, this all, it revolves around you and your identity

00:28:28.600 and you want this.

00:28:29.960 It's just like the love language is like, I want to be treated like this.

00:28:33.240 I want to, guys, this is the love of self.

00:28:34.780 You just need to be born again.

00:28:35.760 That's all.

00:28:36.260 Stop it.

00:28:36.540 Be born again. 0.99

00:28:37.220 You'll die to self.

00:28:38.640 You'll come alive to God and none of this will matter anymore.

00:28:41.520 Why is he like this?

00:28:42.600 I don't know.

00:28:42.940 I can't try it. 0.99

00:28:43.520 It's just so foolish. 1.00

00:28:44.460 When you see in the church, it's so foolish, man. 1.00

00:28:46.880 It's sad. 1.00

00:28:47.700 It's really sad.

00:28:50.020 But like, basically what Gurdjieff does is he takes all these teachings, like Raven,

00:28:54.300 what you just brought up, like it's Buddhism, Sufism, Neoplatonism, and he claims to be an

00:29:00.540 Eastern Orthodox Christian, but he brands his own version of it called esoteric Christianity.

00:29:06.620 And it's just this mixture of all these things.

00:29:08.700 So really, it's the new age is what it is.

00:29:11.600 And so he starts using this shape because Gurdjieff believes that all the secrets of the

00:29:16.400 universe are found within the Enneagram, which is like the craziest statement ever.

00:29:22.600 But he starts developing these meditative dances.

00:29:26.400 He starts developing music because he uses it as a scale within music to create songs.

00:29:32.900 And then he develops a following.

00:29:36.100 And so what you see is the Spinsky kind of deems all this stuff Gurdjieff does as this

00:29:41.340 thing called the fourth way.

00:29:42.740 And that's sort of the teachings of Gurdjieff.

00:29:44.800 But then this thing just goes silent for like decades.

00:29:47.860 And then Raven, what you were saying, Oscar Echazo is that really the next big player we see pick it up.

00:29:55.320 Are you familiar with Echazo?

00:29:57.180 No, I'm not.

00:29:58.220 I was just doing it because I had this feeling that that channeling was involved.

00:30:01.980 It's fascinating that turning it into a musical scale now frequency is involved. 0.99

00:30:06.240 So it's just like we're just getting deeper and deeper into all of the wrong shit. 0.95

00:30:11.240 And not to say there's anything inherently wrong with frequency or manipulation. 0.98

00:30:14.400 We talk about that when it comes to worship music and whether or not you're altering, I guess,

00:30:20.720 basically the frequency that a person's brain is tuned into.

00:30:23.700 If you're going to feed them scripture, if you're going to feed them the word after you create that state,

00:30:28.540 there's nothing inherently wrong with that.

00:30:29.880 But it's fascinating because we're getting into this manipulation.

00:30:34.340 We talked about manipulating like the building blocks of this reality.

00:30:37.680 I mean, this guy is doing dances.

00:30:39.260 He's doing frequency work.

00:30:40.700 He's, you know, pulling stuff from different mystic teachings.

00:30:44.400 And, you know, Oscar came up.

00:30:46.160 But, no, I don't know much about him.

00:30:47.840 So you're not familiar with Oscar?

00:30:49.460 No.

00:30:49.840 Are you familiar with Oscar Meyer?

00:30:51.440 Stop it.

00:30:51.960 Don't be.

00:30:52.440 You're stealing people's jokes in the chat.

00:30:54.100 I didn't see it in the chat.

00:30:55.120 Stop reading the chat.

00:30:56.160 So you're on the chat.

00:30:57.300 I knew it.

00:30:57.820 No, but see, when I look at the chat, I observe them.

00:31:00.240 I go, yes, very nice hot dog jokes.

00:31:01.980 And then I continue listening.

00:31:03.200 You become fixated.

00:31:04.340 OK, sorry.

00:31:05.160 Don't do it anymore.

00:31:06.100 Sorry about that.

00:31:06.760 That's a great joke, whoever put that in there.

00:31:08.680 Yeah, go.

00:31:09.280 See, now you can't just steal somebody's joke and not attribute it to it.

00:31:11.860 Whatever.

00:31:12.280 Fine.

00:31:12.480 You can go ahead and do that.

00:31:13.460 So, no, I'm not familiar.

00:31:15.320 I am familiar with Oscar Meyer, not with Oscar Ichazo.

00:31:18.580 So Ichazo, he picks up Gurdjieff's teachings.

00:31:23.540 He practices a lot of this stuff.

00:31:26.020 He actually starts his own occult school in Arrica, Chile, in 1968.

00:31:34.680 This is where it gets crazy.

00:31:37.680 He goes into this thing that he refers to as a seven-day divine coma.

00:31:42.300 What?

00:31:42.540 And so in this seven-day divine coma, he is visited by the archangel Metatron.

00:31:51.060 Yo, OK, come on, dude.

00:31:53.360 Dude, like, it's insane.

00:31:55.420 So I was just talking about this.

00:31:56.940 My cousin is like, I'm trying to get into music, but you're into conspiracies.

00:32:01.140 Can you tell me a little bit about it?

00:32:02.420 Metatron comes up, obviously, as being the angel that this guy channels, Carlos Santana.

00:32:10.760 So, I mean, if you're making musical chords out of these – oh, yep, and there's the star of Metatron.

00:32:18.140 Oh, brother.

00:32:19.620 Have you – you guys have done this already, the star of Metatron?

00:32:22.300 I mean, no, we've – it comes up occasionally, but not –

00:32:25.920 Pull it back up. Pull it back up. 0.99

00:32:27.360 It's the star of –

00:32:28.600 By the way, this is your drinks outside, your Kabbalah drinks.

00:32:31.020 Yeah, this is your Kabbalah drink.

00:32:33.060 Yeah, it's the star of David.

00:32:34.140 It's also the Saturn storm hexagram, all the fun things.

00:32:39.900 And a lot of people attribute this to being at the center of the tree of life in Kabbalah.

00:32:44.720 Yeah, which is why we call your drinks the Kabbalah drinks.

00:32:47.840 Oh, got it, got it.

00:32:49.520 So, yep, so Metatron is – we'll come back around to Kabbalah if that's cool.

00:32:54.380 Yeah.

00:32:54.560 But essentially, Metatron tells him about the 108 Enneagons, and that's where we see the personality types enter, because these Enneagons are what they use to determine your personality type.

00:33:08.840 The other spirit he encounters in this Divine Nekoma is named Green Qutub, which is apparently a Sufi spirit.

00:33:19.320 He gives him more information about these personality types, whatever.

00:33:25.060 He starts piecing this together, and he sort of – he is the first person to be attributed with coming up with the nine personality types.

00:33:33.840 Now, Ichazo develops out this teaching, I guess you would say, and so he's got students at this school in Chile, right?

00:33:43.180 Once they ascend to a certain level, many of them report also coming in contact with Green Qutub. 0.98

00:33:50.640 And so these spirits are not just visiting Ichazo, but also his students along the way.

00:33:56.080 Green Qutub?

00:33:57.060 Yeah, it's Green, and then it's Q-U-T-U-B. 1.00

00:34:05.680 What a stupid name for an entity. 1.00

00:34:07.300 It is a pretty stupid name. 1.00

00:34:08.700 I'm going to give you that. 0.99

00:34:09.760 I just wondered if anybody had tried to create an artist's rendition of this thing, but it appears to be – to not be the case.

00:34:18.660 We're here with one of Planet Fitness' Black Card members.

00:34:22.520 How are you feeling?

00:34:23.440 Oh, pretty wiped, but I've got my eye on the Hydra massage beds.

00:34:27.320 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:34:29.000 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

00:34:30.820 Game changer.

00:34:31.840 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

00:34:33.800 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

00:34:37.000 Wow, this place really has it all.

00:34:38.940 Back to you in the studio.

00:34:40.420 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

00:34:42.420 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

00:34:45.380 Deal ends March 13th.

00:34:46.380 $49 annual fee applies.

00:34:49.620 So, you already brought up the whole Kabbalah concept.

00:34:55.160 This might actually be a good time to touch on it because you see – like, within Kabbalah, you've got the Tree of Life.

00:35:04.140 Like, that's the whole central figure of the Kabbalah, right?

00:35:08.500 With the Sephiroth, the ten emanations of God. 0.93

00:35:12.700 If you guys didn't catch it, I don't know if you've ever heard Taylor Welch's podcast, The Deep End.

00:35:17.940 He just had a guy on – went through the whole Kabbalah, did a really good overview of it.

00:35:21.780 It was actually pretty interesting.

00:35:23.500 That's actually bizarre because I've never heard of the guy until I saw somebody in a chat today mention him peripherally.

00:35:31.960 I just, like, looked at my notifications and it said somebody was on the deep end.

00:35:37.060 That guy's, like, huge apparently.

00:35:38.540 And that's a good show.

00:35:40.460 And I was like, I never heard of that.

00:35:41.600 And now all of a sudden you're mentioning it.

00:35:42.600 Very interesting.

00:35:42.900 It's an interesting episode.

00:35:44.180 It helped me out with understanding some of the Kabbalah connections to this.

00:35:47.320 But essentially you've got, like, at the top, you've got the place closest to God is what they believe.

00:35:54.940 Because the Kabbalah believes in an untouchable God, an unknowable God. 0.75

00:35:59.300 But they believe, like, at the top of the Tree of Life, that's the closest place to God.

00:36:03.780 And at the bottom of the Tree, that's us, like, having not ascended through the Tree at all.

00:36:09.660 And then you've got the four ascending Sephiroth on each side of the Tree.

00:36:16.060 And you're trying to ascend up through the Tree to this place where God is.

00:36:20.960 And you've got, like, the...

00:36:21.820 This is the same thing that Masons do with Jacob's Ladder. 0.98

00:36:25.900 So each rung representing an advancement in, like, spiritual knowledge or occulted knowledge. 0.99

00:36:32.820 So, you know, when people try to separate these things, whether it's Kabbalah or, you know, Freemasonry, it's, like, it's the same shit. 0.99

00:36:41.840 It's the same... 0.98

00:36:42.540 And then you even have, like, the pillars, the left pillar, the right pillar, and, you know, all this crap in Freemasonry. 0.88

00:36:48.120 It's the same exact thing.

00:36:49.800 Well, question about that.

00:36:51.220 Do you know much about the pillars?

00:36:52.940 Is one male and one female?

00:36:54.640 Yeah, one is male and one is female.

00:36:56.260 People suspect that that's what the whole 9-11 thing was about.

00:36:59.040 You know, there are multiple things that it was about.

00:37:01.980 But they are male and female, and then it's destroyed, and what's resurrected is one tower, meaning a unification, just like the Star of David is this unification of male and female, among other things. 0.99

00:37:14.340 It's, like, a really dense symbol that means a bunch of shit. 0.94

00:37:17.500 Star of Remfan. 0.99

00:37:18.300 Star of Remfan, my fault.

00:37:19.480 Well, so that's the exact same thing in the Kabbalah.

00:37:21.800 One side is male and one side is female.

00:37:23.900 Yes.

00:37:24.600 Yeah.

00:37:24.880 And so, yeah, that's interesting.

00:37:26.080 I didn't know that.

00:37:26.660 It's the same thing. 0.99

00:37:27.920 They just, they change it up a little bit, and then they say, oh, Freemasonry has nothing to do with that, or at least people that are in the lower rungs of Freemasonry who have no idea what their shit is actually about. 0.95

00:37:37.680 That's what all the obelisks and domes are about and everything. 0.93

00:37:40.260 Yeah.

00:37:40.580 Yeah.

00:37:41.100 Wieners.

00:37:41.440 Well, the reason that's so sketchy, too, is, like, Kabbalah promotes this idea of non-dualistic thinking, right?

00:37:47.380 Like, all things are contained within God, and so they believe in this breakdown of the binary, and so it's like there is no male, there is no female, there's only one, there is, which you got to be careful because Jesus teaches something that could be twisted up to sound similar.

00:38:02.980 The problem is Kabbalah totally gets rid of Jesus from the equation. 0.65

00:38:06.120 Um, so it's, it's, it's sketchy.

00:38:09.120 Is this the idea where Jesus is, like, you know, being one in Christ, there is no male and female? 0.61

00:38:13.540 That, that's what I'm saying.

00:38:14.620 Like, so you got to, you got to be careful where you could see how, like, a New Ager or a Kabbalist could try to make the bridge there. 0.99

00:38:22.020 But Jesus is getting at a different point.

00:38:24.460 Um, so the reason I bring that up is because you've got Metatron, this, the Kabbalistic deity, right?

00:38:31.920 Like, like, he's literally called in Kabbalah the little Yahweh, and they believe that he's going to be the Messiah figure that comes at the end of time.

00:38:41.340 Um, and so Kabbalah is trying to get everybody to kind of accept some form of Kabbalistic thinking to bring this Messiah.

00:38:49.100 So you got Metatron over here, sketchy dude.

00:38:52.880 Yeah.

00:38:53.000 You've got Green Ketub over here, Sufi character, Sufi spirit.

00:38:56.820 The Sufis, uh, there's a version of Sufism called Ismaili, I believe it's called.

00:39:02.160 And they've got the nine intellects of God.

00:39:05.640 And so you got God at the top, humanity at the bottom, and then you've got the stairs stepping down, the intellects.

00:39:10.480 And depending on who you ask, they might even refer to those as, like, thinking intellects, as in, like, possibly angelic intellects.

00:39:19.520 Mm-hmm.

00:39:19.680 Um, independent and sentient makes a greater thing, but is still individual?

00:39:24.220 It, it depends who you ask.

00:39:26.120 I mean, I, I've seen it written both ways.

00:39:28.260 Some will say it's not, some will say it is.

00:39:30.280 Um, but that's interesting to me because, not to show my hand, but this stuff is going to trickle into the Ennead as well, into the nine.

00:39:38.660 Yeah, which makes sense because they're, it's just such a similar word.

00:39:41.680 Right.

00:39:42.100 Oh, exactly.

00:39:43.620 Uh, Ennea being nine, right?

00:39:45.840 Mm-hmm.

00:39:46.060 Um, and so you've got all that with Echazo. 0.99

00:39:50.920 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

00:39:53.800 How are you feeling?

00:39:54.760 Oh, pretty wiped.

00:39:56.060 But I've got my eye on the Hydra massage beds.

00:39:58.620 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:40:00.280 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

00:40:02.120 Game changer.

00:40:03.120 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

00:40:05.100 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

00:40:08.300 Wow, this place really has it all.

00:40:10.240 Back to you in the studio.

00:40:11.720 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

00:40:13.720 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

00:40:16.680 Deal ends March 13th.

00:40:17.700 $49 annual fee applies.

00:40:20.740 He's got another dude.

00:40:22.480 I, I think that, uh, Naranjo, Claudio Naranjo is studying under Oscar Echazo.

00:40:27.980 Um, but he's a psychiatrist.

00:40:30.280 And so he's kind of the guy that takes this and he takes it out of like the philosophical

00:40:33.920 and he kind of makes it more psychiatric and he develops this out into like a quote unquote

00:40:38.820 science.

00:40:39.560 The problem is all the actual science, uh, scientists in this field look at it and say,

00:40:45.020 there hasn't been like proper scientific scrutiny under this to even call it a science.

00:40:50.080 This is pseudoscience.

00:40:51.560 Oh, this guy's not even, uh, that old.

00:40:54.700 I mean, like he's old, he's dead, but, um, but he was operating very recently.

00:40:59.640 This is on the sixties and seventies.

00:41:01.880 Yeah.

00:41:02.280 But he, he died in 2019 and you could see he was doing the circuit still while he was

00:41:07.140 old and great.

00:41:08.280 He's doing podcasts.

00:41:08.860 He's doing podcasts.

00:41:08.880 He looks like he's doing Ted talks actually.

00:41:10.940 Okay.

00:41:12.060 Yeah.

00:41:12.340 I mean, listen, why not?

00:41:13.420 Why does all this stuff have to be like in antiquity?

00:41:15.460 They're still doing stuff now.

00:41:16.480 What was the correlation between Pujaric and Chile?

00:41:19.920 Uh, it was Brazil, Brazil.

00:41:21.540 Okay.

00:41:22.120 Okay.

00:41:23.380 Um, Naranjo puts a, puts his hand to paper and through the process of automatic writing,

00:41:30.660 asking spirits to write through his hand.

00:41:32.820 There you go.

00:41:33.340 He develops out more information around the Enneagram.

00:41:36.300 And so that's where he comes up with a lot of the, you know, quote unquote, psychiatric

00:41:40.180 side of things is through spirit writing is automatic writing.

00:41:43.840 Um, so more occult BS.

00:41:46.480 Here's where it gets extra fun.

00:41:49.340 Naranjo takes all of his findings to the Esalen Institute.

00:41:58.520 Did I break up there?

00:41:59.600 I'm sorry.

00:42:00.040 No, no, no, no, no.

00:42:00.900 Okay.

00:42:01.560 Um, so he takes it to the Esalen Institute.

00:42:04.540 Uh, you guys are familiar with Esalen, right?

00:42:06.500 It's, it's familiar, but I can't put my finger on it right now.

00:42:09.180 So this is what, uh, Tupacabra and, uh, Red Panda turned me onto.

00:42:14.880 I wasn't totally aware of this.

00:42:16.140 I was reading through the book on the Enneagram and I see the word Esalen.

00:42:19.760 I'm listening to your podcast like a day later and then boom, Esalen.

00:42:24.380 And I'm like, wait, what's this about?

00:42:25.460 They were talking about like how sky watchers, I think is what it's called.

00:42:28.280 That's right.

00:42:28.920 Yeah.

00:42:29.120 Are out of Esalen.

00:42:30.740 Um, so that's super sketchy, but these guys, uh, Esalen is how the Enneagram kind of makes

00:42:38.140 its way out to the Jesuits and we'll get there.

00:42:40.940 But basically if you look at Puharic, Puharic, um, when he did his original seance to contact

00:42:50.860 the nine, that was at some farmhouse, like a couple of decades earlier.

00:42:55.080 But eventually what happens, Esalen becomes the main headquarters for where they contact

00:43:00.520 the Ennead.

00:43:01.500 Yep.

00:43:01.680 And these are the guys putting out the Enneagram.

00:43:05.260 When we were, when we were looking, when I was looking this up as Red Panda Koala was

00:43:08.620 telling me about it.

00:43:09.380 Yeah.

00:43:09.560 This is, this is exactly what this was.

00:43:11.680 Very interesting.

00:43:12.640 So this is where DG Vinod is, uh, is kind of operating out of this dude's like a mystic.

00:43:17.420 Okay.

00:43:17.820 I don't know much about that.

00:43:18.820 By the way, Uri Geller is like making the rounds now having to do with disclosure.

00:43:24.040 And I think even pushing back against like aliens or demonic.

00:43:27.680 Of course.

00:43:28.480 That's fascinating.

00:43:29.580 It's just another guy that's, uh, that's associated with these guys.

00:43:32.720 Um, I know Geller, um, cause he did the, like he did the spoon thing on like the talk shows

00:43:38.820 and whatnot.

00:43:39.320 Right.

00:43:39.620 And he got exposed as like a fraud and I don't know exactly what that looked like.

00:43:43.640 Um, but yeah, this is a guy that Puharic was, was fascinated with, I guess, because he

00:43:48.140 was doing the little sort of, uh, professor X collecting all the, the psychic X-Men.

00:43:54.440 Um, and, and so Geller comes up on his radar and he goes and checks them out.

00:43:58.240 But yeah, this is, um, very interesting.

00:44:02.040 I see that these people, what's the name of this organization?

00:44:05.480 Uh, the Esalen Institute.

00:44:08.060 Um, it's a giant hippie coalition is what it is.

00:44:11.660 It's a bunch of new age hippies.

00:44:13.020 Always banging drums naked.

00:44:14.300 So spiritual exploration, psychotherapy, uh, meditation, the study of consciousness.

00:44:21.340 Yeah.

00:44:22.000 Yeah.

00:44:22.160 Yeah.

00:44:22.360 Yeah.

00:44:22.500 Yep.

00:44:23.640 Um, so like at Esalen, uh, you've got a lady named Helen Palmer, uh, who is a psychic and 0.87

00:44:29.560 an intuitive, and she then is introduced to the Enneagram and she sees this as a way to

00:44:36.300 teach other people how to tap into their psychic and intuitive abilities as well.

00:44:41.100 So now you've got this, not just being used as a personality tool, but as this means of

00:44:47.180 tapping into whatever powers they believe in from Esalen.

00:44:52.860 I, I guess like if I were to break this down into like a structure thus far, you've kind

00:44:57.000 of got this thing sort of underground and it's sort of this hush, hush, random, weird new

00:45:02.060 age practice.

00:45:02.840 The Enneagram, it then gets to Esalen and that's where it seems to break out into the

00:45:08.800 new age community.

00:45:10.580 Uh, that's the point where Bob Ox, who is a Jesuit priest, he learns about the Enneagram

00:45:17.480 and he takes that to a seminary in Chicago and he starts teaching other Catholics how to

00:45:23.940 use this thing.

00:45:24.880 Uh, another guy that, uh, came alongside Ox, his name is Mitch Pacwa.

00:45:29.780 I don't know if you're familiar with him.

00:45:31.800 Um, James White debated Mitch Pacwa a few years ago and it was a pretty big debate.

00:45:36.360 This is like 20 years ago, probably.

00:45:38.440 Um, and, uh, Pacwa about, I think it's like 10 or 15 years after he kind of accepts the Enneagram

00:45:47.700 as this good teaching.

00:45:48.780 He comes out and he writes a book about it, uh, or, uh, I don't know if it was a book or

00:45:52.760 an article, but the book is called new age.

00:45:56.920 Uh, the Catholics in the new age, how good people are being drawn into Jungian psychology, 0.99

00:46:03.380 the Enneagram and the age of Aquarius.

00:46:05.960 Okay.

00:46:06.380 So he's saying, he's saying this is a negative thing.

00:46:10.020 We're here with one of planet fitness's black card members. 0.99

00:46:12.760 How are you feeling?

00:46:13.840 Oh, pretty wiped, but I've got my eye on the hydro massage beds.

00:46:17.720 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:46:19.420 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout game changer.

00:46:22.200 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

00:46:24.140 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

00:46:27.440 Wow.

00:46:27.960 This place really has it all.

00:46:29.340 Back to you in the studio.

00:46:30.900 Get your first month free with a PF lock card.

00:46:33.000 Get started for $1 enrollment, then $29.99 a month.

00:46:35.780 Deal ends March 13th, $49 annual fee applies.

00:46:40.680 He, he changes his mind.

00:46:42.260 He's initially on board and then he recognizes this thing is bad news.

00:46:46.180 Oh yeah.

00:46:46.600 1992, I could see a lot of his stuff afterwards is, is much more, I guess, Catholic aligned.

00:46:57.240 Yes.

00:46:57.800 But this one, 1992, a big deviation from, from what his future works appear to be about.

00:47:04.680 Oh yeah.

00:47:07.100 So Bob Ox, when he takes this to Chicago, he starts teaching it in the seminaries.

00:47:12.500 That's when you've got Richard Rohr, who is, I believe, a Franciscan priest.

00:47:17.640 And that name's probably a big one to remember.

00:47:21.040 He is like, he's the poster child for the Enneagram.

00:47:23.740 All these people that want to talk about it, they're going to point you back to Richard,

00:47:28.180 Richard Rohr as being like the godfather of this thing, because he's the one that makes

00:47:32.600 the push that gets it, um, accepted into the church at large, whether you're Catholic

00:47:38.020 or you are evangelical, whatever.

00:47:41.120 Uh, from everything I've read, it seems like anytime something gets big in the Catholic circles

00:47:46.080 at like a convention level, if it's broad enough, it's going to make its way into the

00:47:51.380 evangelical church as well.

00:47:53.280 Uh, I've, I've seen that with like, you know, high church liturgy stuff, kind of drifting

00:47:57.940 over from the Catholic church into more evangelical churches as like, Hey, let's practice more

00:48:02.880 like, you know, meditative thinking on God's word and things like that.

00:48:06.620 A lot of that comes from the Catholics and then we pick it up later.

00:48:10.160 That's how the Enneagram makes its way into the evangelical church.

00:48:14.500 Rohr has this group of students under him.

00:48:18.240 Um, they eventually write a bunch of books and those are the books that get picked up

00:48:23.400 by the church at large.

00:48:25.560 Um, anyone listening to this that has gotten into the Enneagram in the past, you've probably

00:48:29.880 read Ian Cron and Susan Stabile's, uh, The Road Back to You, an Enneagram journey to self

00:48:35.700 discovery, or you've read Christopher Hortz's book.

00:48:39.720 Um, and it is called The Sacred Enneagram.

00:48:42.800 Here's what's sketchy about that.

00:48:44.220 Both of those books are put out by major Christian publishing companies.

00:48:50.160 The Sacred Enneagram came out in 2017.

00:48:53.160 Zondervan Press put it out.

00:48:55.060 Zondervan is a trusted publishing company within the Christian church.

00:48:59.480 Shocky.

00:49:00.020 So for the, the other one is IVP.

00:49:02.840 IVP put out The Road Back to You.

00:49:05.280 Both of those are relatively trusted sources within the church.

00:49:08.640 And so to be like, these guys are saying, this is fine.

00:49:11.480 This is okay.

00:49:12.160 This is Christian.

00:49:13.580 My last podcast, uh, the, we were part of a podcast network.

00:49:17.580 We were part of Life Audio.

00:49:19.200 Life Audio had an Enneagram channel.

00:49:21.280 It was totally dedicated to the Enneagram.

00:49:23.600 Wow.

00:49:24.140 This thing's everywhere, man.

00:49:25.560 And like, it was funny.

00:49:26.420 Cause like, while we were on their, uh, on their network, we were also putting out episodes

00:49:30.860 talking about how terrible the Enneagram is.

00:49:32.760 So it was just, it was kind of funny, but it feels like Zach, it feels like it hijacks,

00:49:37.280 um, mankind's natural desire to find this identity, but we're supposed to find this identity

00:49:43.040 in Christ.

00:49:43.800 But it's the reason that we all have this like lingering, who am I right?

00:49:48.460 And, and what this thing does is it hijacks this thing.

00:49:51.360 I don't think that it means to say that desire within you and your, in your own nature to find

00:49:56.940 out who you are is inherently bad.

00:50:00.100 It's just being hijacked by any number of things at any given time.

00:50:04.220 You bite the apple.

00:50:05.220 Yeah, exactly.

00:50:06.040 Bite the apple.

00:50:06.620 Yeah.

00:50:07.100 But the offensive thing is that you've been saved and called with a holy calling in Christ

00:50:11.100 Jesus before the world began.

00:50:13.220 It's, it's unique to you.

00:50:14.800 Like you, like there's only, I'm the only one with the fingertips like this, man.

00:50:18.840 Like there's no other people with the fingertips.

00:50:20.060 Yeah.

00:50:20.220 Cause you bite your nails down to the stubs.

00:50:22.440 Okay.

00:50:22.500 But for whatever reason, dude, like God is, does a very big deal to make individuals,

00:50:27.360 individuals.

00:50:27.880 And so to group people together, maybe it's just cause I was always like seeing a counselor

00:50:32.180 or in therapy or rehab and stuff.

00:50:33.780 Like when I was young and they were always trying to group us in these groups.

00:50:37.340 And I was always like, no, I'm a human.

00:50:39.540 I'm mad.

00:50:40.140 I'm not like a number nine or a number four or a number two.

00:50:43.460 And it's like, I like at some point, like you have all this history and stuff and it's

00:50:48.940 from the occult.

00:50:49.860 But at some point, like the first time the kid came in talking about it in the coffee shop

00:50:53.620 was when I first heard of the mini round. 1.00

00:50:54.840 I'm like, that's stupid. 0.99

00:50:56.260 I don't need to know anything else. 1.00

00:50:57.720 You got to say the real thing so that people can contract.

00:51:00.420 Yeah.

00:51:00.580 What is the actual, is it, do they call it the mini gram?

00:51:03.440 No, I don't.

00:51:04.240 I forget what they, but I called it, I always called it the mini gram to make fun of it.

00:51:07.260 Just to be clear.

00:51:07.860 Like, I don't care about this thing you guys are talking about.

00:51:10.000 This is the mini gram. 1.00

00:51:11.080 It's very stupid. 1.00

00:51:12.500 And you should find your identity in Christ and make, no, no pastors like it. 1.00

00:51:16.560 Christians like it.

00:51:17.360 And they'd send me stuff.

00:51:18.200 And I'd say, just show me in the Bible where it says you're supposed to figure out what number

00:51:20.960 you are.

00:51:21.340 What are they doing though?

00:51:22.100 They're using it to determine like what your position in the church might be.

00:51:25.180 Like you would be a good, uh, I think they're just trying to hijack your, your destiny.

00:51:30.200 All of these things that are making you a certain thing of a certain group.

00:51:35.280 They're just trying to hijack your destiny in Christ.

00:51:37.680 Right.

00:51:37.840 But what do they, what do they think they're doing, Zach?

00:51:39.800 Are they, they're using it as a selection process for occupation?

00:51:42.920 The people who like it, you're saying?

00:51:44.500 Your name's not Zach.

00:51:45.340 It's just making them feel important.

00:51:47.960 It seems, it seems to me like it's more, it's more about trying to understand your wiring.

00:51:53.780 But like we already said, there's nothing psychological about this thing.

00:51:57.200 Like, and so like, it's not like if you really want to do that, go take Myers-Briggs, which

00:52:01.420 is actually psychologically tested.

00:52:03.420 And I'm going to tell you to be aware of that as well, because it's all based on Jungian

00:52:06.540 philosophy.

00:52:07.440 But at the same time, at least that one has some psychological grounding.

00:52:11.620 This one doesn't even have that.

00:52:13.180 So the big argument you hear when you start telling people, hey, this is a cultic, this

00:52:17.700 is BS, they're going to go, well, Jesus can, he can make anything new.

00:52:21.840 And it's like, well, can Jesus make a Ouija board, you know, usable for church service?

00:52:28.440 Can Jesus make shuffling the tarot deck usable for church service?

00:52:32.320 And so it's like, you know, of course people are going to be like, well, no, we can't use

00:52:35.320 Ouija boards, you know, but, but we can use this one.

00:52:38.100 And it's like, well, why though?

00:52:39.440 How is this different?

00:52:40.900 Is the.

00:52:41.680 Yeah.

00:52:42.040 Um, and so like that, that's the big complaint there.

00:52:45.600 I think the, the thing about this though, like when people start pointing back to people

00:52:50.500 and going like, well, Richard Rohr is a priest.

00:52:53.260 He's really not.

00:52:54.680 Um, he got the okay by, I believe, but I don't like rake me over the coals for getting this

00:53:00.220 wrong.

00:53:00.460 But if I recall, uh, Pope Francis kind of signed off on Roark, like kind of accepted

00:53:06.900 him, gave him the okay.

00:53:07.840 We're here with one of planet fitness's black card members. 0.99

00:53:11.400 How are you feeling?

00:53:12.400 Oh, pretty wiped, but I've got my eye on the hydro massage beds.

00:53:16.300 It felt like a real team effort out there.

00:53:17.940 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout game changer.

00:53:20.760 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about two big ones, worldwide access and red

00:53:24.860 light technology.

00:53:25.940 Wow.

00:53:26.280 This place really has it all.

00:53:27.880 Back to you in the studio.

00:53:29.440 Get your first month free with a PF lock card.

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00:53:38.280 The problem is when you start looking into Rohr's theology, he's a perennialist and he's a panentheist.

00:53:44.420 And so when you start breaking down what he believes, you're going to find quotes like, um, it's not about, um, Christ the person.

00:53:56.580 It's about the Christ consciousness.

00:53:58.180 Oh boy.

00:53:59.360 And it's about, he literally says, think of the Christ consciousness like a kite flying above a tree line.

00:54:06.320 It doesn't matter who's holding the kite.

00:54:08.460 So it doesn't matter if you, you know, get to the Christ consciousness through Christ or Gandhi or Muhammad or Buddha, as long as you see the Christ consciousness.

00:54:19.240 He says things like, there are no sins.

00:54:21.820 The only sin is to think that God does not already dwell in you.

00:54:26.380 It's kind of aggravates me because I should go fly, okay, man.

00:54:30.060 Almost like what Jacob Israel is trying to scream at me on Twitter.

00:54:33.480 If I paid attention and cared enough to read what he's saying.

00:54:35.360 This is also what, this is also what that episode about Buddhism was.

00:54:39.400 And it's like, it's this weird thing to slip something in that doesn't fit.

00:54:44.540 Yeah.

00:54:44.900 And if we were, I guess a little bit more agreeable, we would have let it go without any kind of pushback.

00:54:50.940 But it was just kind of like, I don't like, I don't like any of this.

00:54:53.160 Yeah.

00:54:53.600 Yeah.

00:54:53.880 Yeah.

00:54:54.000 I don't like any of that.

00:54:54.580 It'd be nice if the creator of the universe would have gave us some kind of messaging system so we could always see through all this bullshit, like right away, like immediately. 0.73

00:55:01.640 If only.

00:55:02.240 It would be so rad if we had like that, you know.

00:55:04.700 Yeah, I'd call it like a Bible.

00:55:06.360 Oh, yeah.

00:55:06.720 Like if you made it, yeah.

00:55:07.960 Oh, this thing, let me just line up in here.

00:55:10.120 Okay, this has nothing to do with this.

00:55:11.900 Yeah.

00:55:12.140 Oh, but it's cool.

00:55:12.980 It has nothing to do with this.

00:55:14.240 So don't call a Christian.

00:55:15.580 Call it playtime or fun if you like to do that because you want to know more and more about yourself because everything revolves around you and who you are.

00:55:21.900 See, but that's the thing that was like.

00:55:23.140 Right on, do it, but it has nothing to do with Christ.

00:55:24.680 Over and over again, it just seems like there are systems that are, you know, they permeate this reality.

00:55:32.600 Well, you know, if God used them as building blocks for this reality, then, you know, so be it.

00:55:38.160 But throughout antiquity, you have all these instances of either lowercase g gods or spirit guides, something that was channeled one way or another, revealing some fundamental nature of the realm that we inhabit and then telling you like what to do with it.

00:55:57.440 And it's like, I think it's in its rudimentary form.

00:56:01.460 It's absolute power corrupts.

00:56:02.960 Absolutely.

00:56:03.300 Like we're not we're like children.

00:56:04.760 We're not made to have access to these systems that are super complicated that God used to build this entire realm that we inhabit. 0.99

00:56:13.100 And as soon as we get any piece of the puzzle at all, we're going to do a bunch of super dumb shit with it. 0.99

00:56:18.080 We're going to corrupt ourselves. 0.99

00:56:18.960 And that's what happens over and over again.

00:56:21.260 Yeah, I think you're right.

00:56:22.720 I don't you guys cool if I rattle off like it's not a long quote, but it's I think it's like the ultimate nail in Richard Rohr's coffin.

00:56:33.140 Like if anybody here is like, well, maybe he is a Christian. 0.70

00:56:36.800 Like, I don't think you can come to that after this.

00:56:40.460 He writes contemplative prayer remaining silently and openly in God's presence rewires our brains to think non dually with compassion.

00:56:50.960 So get rid of duality or dualistic thinking kindness and a lack of attachment to the ego's preferences in contemplative prayer.

00:56:59.220 We move beyond language to experience God as mystery.

00:57:02.380 We let go of our need to judge defend and evaluate plugging into the mind of Christ, which welcomes paradox and knows its true identity in God during contemplation.

00:57:12.860 We come to know that there is no separation between sacred and secular.

00:57:16.920 We're all is one with divine reality.

00:57:20.840 It's just universalism.

00:57:22.840 Like, it's just, yeah, everybody's in God.

00:57:25.600 You don't need Christ.

00:57:26.800 You don't like it's not Christianity. 0.99

00:57:29.300 And so, like, we're running into this issue with all these people again.

00:57:34.840 But I will say Jacob from Cult of Conspiracy.

00:57:39.060 No, not Jacob.

00:57:39.780 The other dude.

00:57:40.420 Jonathan.

00:57:41.100 Correct.

00:57:41.700 Timothy Albarino.

00:57:42.400 You know, it's like we're being asked to not differentiate.

00:57:47.080 You know?

00:57:47.880 Stop it.

00:57:48.280 Don't worry about it.

00:57:48.880 I say that.

00:57:49.700 We're being asked to just, like, kind of take it at face value in a way.

00:57:54.000 Like, we just, that comment that we received from the dude, he's like, he's like, why are you looking so far into this?

00:57:57.920 A lot of it is, like, why are you labeling things demonic?

00:58:01.560 Like, they'll call it, like, an infantile reductive view of the universe.

00:58:05.620 And it's like, well, ultimately, because I do believe that if you're not with Jesus Christ and you're against Jesus Christ, and the way that I see it is, if you're against Jesus Christ, that makes you demonic.

00:58:16.820 And my functioning definition of it is against the kingdom of God.

00:58:22.500 What is he laughing about?

00:58:23.600 I have no idea what he's laughing about.

00:58:24.840 He's just laughing.

00:58:25.480 I don't know.

00:58:25.760 He must be reading the chat against the kingdom of God or against humanity.

00:58:29.960 The constant call, and what is he laughing about?

00:58:32.780 I have no idea.

00:58:33.420 The constant call is to ask us to, it's like, open up your mind because these possibilities, like, everything is possible.

00:58:40.600 Yeah.

00:58:41.280 And in a weird contradictory sense, I'm like, no, no, no, my mind is closed because I am, he's dying laughing.

00:58:48.000 I don't know what's the matter with it.

00:58:49.180 Because I am like, I am focused on one thing.

00:58:53.160 And this one thing that I'm focused on doesn't allow for these externalities.

00:58:57.480 But they want you to pay attention to them so badly so that way they could wipe away the one thing that you're focused on, which should be God.

00:59:03.240 It is really clever, too, because the argument that's used to open yourself up to these things is a leveraging of your own misunderstanding.

00:59:13.660 Like, the idea is that you can't understand the complexities of this thing, so stop protecting yourself against it.

00:59:23.920 In so many words, that's what's happening there, right?

00:59:26.040 The universe is complex beyond understanding.

00:59:30.000 All these systems are complex beyond understanding.

00:59:32.880 You look at a thing and you blanketly call it demonic. 0.99

00:59:34.920 I'm sorry, what the fuck are you doing? 1.00

00:59:37.720 We have to go. 0.99

00:59:38.780 Yeah, what the?

00:59:41.920 What happened?

00:59:42.860 I have no idea what's the matter with him.

00:59:44.940 No, nothing.

00:59:46.220 Would you like to let the class know what's so funny?

00:59:49.020 Yeah, please.

00:59:49.480 Yeah, go ahead and tell the class it's so funny. 0.99

00:59:51.220 He has, like, the dumbest stuff on his. 0.99

00:59:53.940 I can't do this. 0.99

00:59:54.700 On my laptop, I'm looking up all these things.

00:59:57.420 Oscar, Ichazo, Andréja Pujaraj.

01:00:00.280 I don't understand what's the matter with them.

01:00:00.980 Are you laughing at a Google search, sir?

01:00:02.560 But that is, you know, it's a slippery slope because as soon as you tell me, well, you

01:00:07.880 don't understand these things, and so you lack the ability to categorize them as demonic.

01:00:12.160 It's like, kind of true.

01:00:15.260 I don't understand these things, right?

01:00:17.180 There's so much that I'm not going to understand.

01:00:18.760 The complexities of the universe, the complexities of these systems, if you want to defend numerology

01:00:23.120 or tarot cards or channeling spirits or any of these things, Metatron, you name it.

01:00:28.440 But, yeah, sure, I don't understand the, I don't know, the complexities of these things

01:00:34.620 to a degree where I can define them.

01:00:37.320 It's the same thing, though, with the grandma maxing.

01:00:39.560 Isn't that what you call it with the alien?

01:00:40.640 I mean, that's what I call it, yeah, grandma maxing.

01:00:41.680 Yeah, it's the same thing, dude.

01:00:42.880 Like, the mini-gram comes in.

01:00:44.100 I don't know all the history of it.

01:00:45.620 I just know it's bogus. 0.98

01:00:46.640 Yeah, I know it's gay. 1.00

01:00:47.720 That's it. 0.73

01:00:47.920 I would give one, like, caveat to the grandma maxing thing, because I agree with it, but 0.95

01:00:52.940 I do think there's, like, a little bit of a spin that I hadn't considered until, like,

01:00:56.700 I don't know, a week ago.

01:00:57.700 I was thinking about this, and it's like, well, it is safe for that grandma.

01:01:01.440 She is safe to go.

01:01:02.720 But she's not making disciples of men.

01:01:05.180 She can't help anybody else if she doesn't know more.

01:01:08.220 And so, like, that's, like, you need to know a little.

01:01:10.880 You don't need to be all the way down the rabbit hole.

01:01:12.780 You know, like, that's okay to not be.

01:01:14.520 But to know enough to walk somebody else off the ledge is also incredibly beneficial.

01:01:21.060 So, like, it's both, you know?

01:01:22.480 Yeah.

01:01:22.960 That's why, so it's a hypothetical where it's, like, I always pose that character, that grandma

01:01:27.140 character, as being safe from the deception.

01:01:30.560 But we're not called to play it safe.

01:01:32.120 We're not called to hide, right?

01:01:34.240 We're called to make disciples of men.

01:01:35.760 And sometimes in order to do that, you need to be, you know, wise as serpents and gentle

01:01:40.300 as doves.

01:01:40.740 You need to be able to guide people out of it.

01:01:41.980 We're walking in the deep waters, for sure.

01:01:43.760 But, like, at my heart, at my core, I am grandma maxing, meaning I'm, like, there is

01:01:49.480 an immovable anchor from where I believe.

01:01:55.060 That's as far as I'm willing to go.

01:01:57.040 If you don't have that grandma maxing anchor, you're going to end up in Peru somewhere.

01:02:02.860 Yeah.

01:02:03.140 Think about Paul, right?

01:02:04.500 Like, Paul is, Paul's grounded in the faith.

01:02:07.680 Paul gets it, right?

01:02:08.600 Paul knows Jesus.

01:02:09.320 And at the same time, Paul goes to Mars Hill, and he knows enough about their make-believe

01:02:14.140 religion, their gods.

01:02:16.240 Great point.

01:02:16.640 That he can start drawing connections to the unknown god and go, no, that's the god I worship,

01:02:22.060 and he's the god that made all these other gods, and he's the true god.

01:02:25.020 And, you know, and so, like, he knows enough to reorient them back.

01:02:30.740 I had a great conversation.

01:02:32.320 I might have said this last time.

01:02:33.440 I don't know.

01:02:33.700 I've said it a million times.

01:02:35.120 But, like, I was at a bar.

01:02:35.920 David does it all the time.

01:02:36.860 Go ahead.

01:02:37.080 I do it constantly. 1.00

01:02:37.740 Every single episode, I say the same shit. 1.00

01:02:40.940 Yeah. 0.99

01:02:41.160 So, basically, what I was going to say is, like, all, everything is just theater at the

01:02:46.040 highest regard.

01:02:46.820 No, I'm just kidding.

01:02:49.920 How dare you?

01:02:53.040 I'm sorry.

01:02:53.740 I'm sorry.

01:02:54.180 Very good.

01:02:54.440 I'm sorry.

01:02:54.940 I'm sorry.

01:02:55.400 I'm sorry.

01:02:55.860 I'm sorry.

01:02:56.180 That was perfect.

01:02:58.000 I was at a bar, and I was playing a show with my band some years ago.

01:03:02.440 This was, like, right after my, like, come to Jesus moment.

01:03:04.740 And I'm sitting there, and I'm talking with this dude, and somehow Christianity got brought 0.84

01:03:10.520 up, and he said, oh, you probably don't want to talk to me.

01:03:12.260 And I said, well, why not?

01:03:13.640 And he said, well, I'm a Nordic deist.

01:03:15.180 And he said, and I've done rituals, and I've prayed to Odin and Thor and all these guys,

01:03:18.920 and I have seen things happen.

01:03:20.660 And I said, I believe you.

01:03:22.900 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

01:03:25.760 How are you feeling?

01:03:26.700 Oh, pretty wiped.

01:03:28.000 But I've got my eye on the Hydra massage beds.

01:03:30.560 It felt like a real team effort out there.

01:03:32.240 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

01:03:34.060 Game changer.

01:03:35.080 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

01:03:37.040 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

01:03:40.240 Wow.

01:03:40.780 This place really has it all.

01:03:42.180 Back to you in the studio.

01:03:43.020 Get your first month free with a PF lock card.

01:03:45.840 Get started for $1 enrollment, then $29.99 a month.

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01:03:52.680 And he was like, what?

01:03:54.180 Because that dude's been shut down by every Christian he's ever told that to. 1.00

01:03:57.520 They probably just went, well, you're nuts. 0.99

01:03:59.040 And it's like, no, I believe you talk to something. 0.99

01:04:01.100 It's not God.

01:04:02.360 It's a fallen son of God.

01:04:04.320 And it's duping you.

01:04:05.360 And it made for a good conversation.

01:04:07.740 But it's like, one foot in the thing helps you pull the other person out.

01:04:12.840 Dude, I had that yesterday.

01:04:15.180 You better be in Raven's MO.

01:04:16.460 You better be anchored.

01:04:17.800 You better be anchored, man.

01:04:18.900 Because this is my big thing with Albarina.

01:04:21.480 I say this guy's name too much on the show.

01:04:23.080 But we've watched him for 15, 20 years be good.

01:04:27.340 And then get pulled a little too deep in a certain direction.

01:04:31.720 And now the guy's writing four words about what's happening on Mars.

01:04:34.940 And we're like, dude, you've spun out of control here.

01:04:40.680 Find your anchor.

01:04:41.580 Find your center point again.

01:04:42.860 I was talking to a guy just yesterday where I make this post about the demonic nature of aliens that the government hopes to disclose to us.

01:04:51.900 And he reads it as like, oh, this is a Christian calling everything demonic.

01:04:56.700 And then he goes something to the effect of like, easy to say until you're face to face with these things.

01:05:04.600 And your body is in a state of paralysis.

01:05:06.440 And there's all these different things happening.

01:05:08.360 And your perception is such and such.

01:05:10.160 And he just like starts hitting me with these walls of text.

01:05:12.960 And I'm reading it. 0.97

01:05:14.380 And I'm going like, whoa, this is fascinating crap. 0.99

01:05:16.500 And then at the end of it, he's just like, I'm sure you're thinking that I'm, you know, bullshitting you or whatever. 0.98

01:05:23.240 But once again, easy to think that when it's not happening to you.

01:05:26.940 And I said, who says you're bullshitting, Doug?

01:05:29.740 Yeah.

01:05:29.980 Like you just hit me with everything.

01:05:31.800 And all the patterns just ticked off.

01:05:34.580 I was able to hit all the check marks.

01:05:35.900 This guy experienced this pattern and that pattern and that pattern.

01:05:38.380 Like this is a real experiencer here, in my opinion.

01:05:41.200 And as soon as I said that, he was like, dude, everybody shuts me down.

01:05:44.740 And everybody shuts me down.

01:05:46.840 And I'm sorry that I came at you with all this. 0.99

01:05:50.320 And just imagine that you were in a position where you thought it was going to be bullshit. 0.95

01:05:54.140 And then we had this really crazy conversation, you know, where this guy's just sharing. 0.78

01:05:58.380 I told him to write in, actually, because it was like this guy remembers a lot to the extent where he's able to struggle during these events.

01:06:05.340 He said he's punched the wall, like the inner wall of the craft.

01:06:08.360 He said he's trying to punch the entities, but it's never really worked out because he feels like he's moving in, you know, some sort of like pseudo paralysis state.

01:06:16.140 But, yeah, man, no, it's I think that's, you know, one of those things that I always whenever I think of wise as serpents and gentle as doves.

01:06:26.100 It's like, yeah, you have to understand a thing like the same thing that you said.

01:06:30.060 I don't doubt that you're interacting with pagan gods of any variety.

01:06:34.280 If you're if you're into the Norse thing, which, by the way, I think it gets big because, you know, you got Thor and you got white people looking for an identity because they've kind of been under the heel of culture over the last like decade or something.

01:06:49.760 You know, it's like white people don't have any culture is kind of the thing.

01:06:53.580 And so I think that sends people looking for it.

01:06:56.380 And Christianity has been reduced to a caricature in the West.

01:07:00.180 So they go looking elsewhere.

01:07:01.320 And then you have like the popular shows like Vikings, which which crushed.

01:07:05.800 And so, yeah, all of a sudden you find your your identity in that.

01:07:09.320 And it's about I think it's about like getting going all the way over there.

01:07:12.260 But don't be persuaded by and I've done this in like the political realm in a sense, like Matt's friend that I was talking to at your house a while back.

01:07:20.640 He's deeply in the I guess the on the left side of the political realm.

01:07:24.680 Yeah. At my house.

01:07:25.840 Yeah. But I was a lefty at my house.

01:07:28.220 Yeah, we did. All right.

01:07:29.240 And I was able to talk with him.

01:07:30.340 Wait, who was it?

01:07:31.320 Oh, we're not going to talk about it.

01:07:32.460 We're going to be rude.

01:07:33.600 But I was able to talk to him on his terms using the language that he's using, even though I vehemently disagree.

01:07:39.800 Right.

01:07:40.240 With what he what he thinks.

01:07:42.260 I'm familiar with it and I'm able to talk to him.

01:07:45.180 And we had a good conversation.

01:07:46.280 I like I like this guy.

01:07:47.520 OK, now I remember.

01:07:48.380 You know, it was a great conversation.

01:07:49.900 Yeah. But I had to just change it.

01:07:52.120 But I had to I had to understand all the tenants of his arguments, not disrespect him.

01:07:59.120 Right. No, I remember that you were saying a lot of compassionate people get sucked into the left because they're compassionate people.

01:08:05.960 Yeah. It's hijacking your capacity for empathy and such.

01:08:09.420 And but you also tell us, he's like, don't get so involved with all this stuff.

01:08:12.260 You're going to go crazy looking.

01:08:13.180 And I'm like, you're 100 percent right.

01:08:14.300 We're going to go crazy looking at it.

01:08:15.520 But I got to know if I'm different.

01:08:17.980 I'm not built different.

01:08:18.880 I've gone crazy.

01:08:19.800 Look at me.

01:08:20.220 Yeah. But if I'm if I'm going to talk to those people, I have to know I got to know their arguments in and out.

01:08:26.300 But it's almost like that world structure, that world system is run by Satan.

01:08:29.920 And they do these testing for the personalities and stuff.

01:08:33.360 Somehow they get America.

01:08:34.500 They narrowed it down to two.

01:08:36.000 They're right.

01:08:36.580 The Republican and the Democrat.

01:08:38.100 Somehow they did all this minigram testing for this personality, this person.

01:08:42.240 They say, all right, well, the one through five, they're on the red team.

01:08:45.180 And then the six, seven, eight, nine, they're on the blue team.

01:08:48.100 And now we've got like this perfect, like somebody had to create that system.

01:08:52.380 Look at this.

01:08:52.900 Number nine.

01:08:53.600 So I'll pull this up and I'll tell you where they belong.

01:08:56.200 Number nine.

01:08:57.260 That's on the left.

01:08:58.560 Strict perfectionist is on the right.

01:09:00.820 Considerate helper.

01:09:01.540 That's on the left.

01:09:02.300 Yeah.

01:09:02.840 Competitive achiever.

01:09:03.580 Oh, you think these really are the one that says like considerate helper.

01:09:06.920 Like, what do you think that really is?

01:09:07.960 That's a bottom.

01:09:08.560 Intensive creative.

01:09:09.540 That's on the on the left.

01:09:11.080 Quiet specialist.

01:09:12.720 That could go either way.

01:09:13.860 Yeah.

01:09:14.360 Loyal, loyal, skeptic on the right for sure.

01:09:16.920 Yeah, yeah.

01:09:18.320 Enthusiastic visionary on the left.

01:09:20.060 Yeah.

01:09:20.440 Active controller on the right.

01:09:21.900 Are you saying, yeah, this is all.

01:09:23.500 No, he's, he's nailing it.

01:09:24.700 This is madness, bro.

01:09:25.260 He's nailing it.

01:09:25.660 It's madness.

01:09:26.340 Who's looking at that and saying that has anything to do with Christ?

01:09:28.520 You mean to tell me that somebody's looking at this and going.

01:09:30.720 Nothing to do with Christ.

01:09:31.620 But when I look at, when I look at somebody and they tell me, number one, you tell me your political

01:09:35.780 spectrum, boom.

01:09:36.780 I've just put you in this, in this chart here.

01:09:38.640 And I've numbered, I've, I've, I have effectively narrowed down the numbers in which you can fall

01:09:43.680 under.

01:09:44.000 And then I let you talk and you'll tell me the rest.

01:09:46.240 And it's simple as that.

01:09:47.220 This stuff is true.

01:09:48.580 And people fall under these archetypes.

01:09:50.360 I think you, you have to have an open mind to this stuff, but also know all these things

01:09:54.520 so you can break.

01:09:55.160 It's like, okay.

01:09:55.740 But at what point is it brainwash that makes them become one of those?

01:09:59.160 It is a hundred percent, but I think here's what, here's what I think.

01:10:02.280 And this is a crazy thing, but it's like what you were talking about, Zach, where the grandma

01:10:06.900 maxing is not sufficient.

01:10:08.780 Grandma maxing is safe, but you've got to go further.

01:10:11.340 You've got to learn all the rules.

01:10:12.580 Like in music, you learn all the music.

01:10:14.500 You learn exactly how to play and exactly why.

01:10:17.180 And then, and only then can you break the rules and create something that is actually

01:10:22.320 you.

01:10:23.040 So you've got to learn this stuff.

01:10:24.460 Like you've got to understand what this is. 0.99

01:10:26.140 And you know, for a time, maybe you're dressing like fucking Jack Sparrow. 0.98

01:10:29.160 And maybe you're acting like Dane Cook for a time. 0.98

01:10:32.140 That was me.

01:10:33.080 But you realize, oh no, this is an archetype, but I kind of had to go into that.

01:10:36.460 And now I'm going to break that.

01:10:37.460 Cause I've learned, I've learned of all these things and like, but none of them were me.

01:10:41.300 You know what I mean?

01:10:41.900 People are going to naturally fall into that stuff.

01:10:43.860 Yeah. 0.97

01:10:44.020 Damn right. 0.97

01:10:44.520 I'm cooking. 0.98

01:10:45.100 Stop it.

01:10:45.620 Don't look at the chat.

01:10:46.900 Cooking boy.

01:10:48.080 I think, I think there's kind of, well, I think there's kind of another way too.

01:10:51.720 Um, cause I, I do agree with all that, but like, are you guys familiar with Walter Martin?

01:10:56.260 No, who did a book, uh, wrote a book called kingdom of the cults, kingdom of the occult.

01:11:00.560 I think we have that book out on the shelf, not in the library, but out in the coffee shop.

01:11:04.660 Yeah.

01:11:05.040 Yeah.

01:11:05.700 It's a big one.

01:11:06.280 It's about, yeah, it's like a bunch of cults, including even like JWs and Mormons, all kinds

01:11:13.420 of stuff.

01:11:13.980 Okay, guys, I'm so sorry.

01:11:15.860 I am going to have to hit refresh because all of your voices just jumped up like an octave

01:11:20.580 and it's crazy.

01:11:22.360 Oh, no, we're back.

01:11:23.200 We're back.

01:11:23.560 We're back.

01:11:23.880 We're back.

01:11:24.320 No, we're good.

01:11:24.880 We're good.

01:11:25.220 It fixed it.

01:11:25.880 Yeah.

01:11:26.100 I fixed it.

01:11:26.620 Yeah.

01:11:26.980 That was wild.

01:11:28.460 It's doing a thing where your audio for some reason, every time it's clicking and I'm switching

01:11:32.540 a setting behind the scenes that makes it stop clicking for just a few minutes and then

01:11:36.260 it happens again.

01:11:37.460 Sorry, people.

01:11:38.100 There's really not much I can do here, but it's still, it's, it's a listenable conversation,

01:11:42.480 but go ahead.

01:11:42.940 I'm sorry, man.

01:11:43.700 We're good.

01:11:44.640 We, we hit all the, all the, uh, technical difficulties today.

01:11:48.340 Yeah.

01:11:48.660 Every single one.

01:11:49.640 Every single one.

01:11:50.900 It'll be better next time.

01:11:52.100 I promise.

01:11:53.000 Um, the Walter Martin says people who work with money, I believe it's Walter Martin that

01:11:59.820 says this, like people who work with money.

01:12:01.320 Um, they don't learn every type of counterfeit bill.

01:12:05.420 They know money, the real money so well that when they encounter a counterfeit, they know

01:12:09.960 it immediately.

01:12:10.760 Well, I think that's true, but also like, I think like there's a difference between like

01:12:19.720 running from the money altogether.

01:12:21.740 And I feel like there's that, that is what some people are doing.

01:12:25.180 And so like, I think when you come up with a specialized issue where it's like, okay, I

01:12:30.300 don't know how to speak into this person's life.

01:12:32.220 I need to learn more.

01:12:33.260 So I can, like, I think you got to do that too.

01:12:36.140 But I also think you can become Alex Jones and just become manic and hate your life because

01:12:41.820 you live in it.

01:12:43.020 And it's like, like you can do that.

01:12:45.360 I think it's a better example of that is I think top.

01:12:48.720 No, um, Alex Jones has fun from time to time.

01:12:52.020 David Icke looks like he's never having fun.

01:12:54.280 The English guy.

01:12:55.540 I've actually tried to book, uh, maybe you could help me.

01:12:58.240 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

01:13:01.160 How are you feeling?

01:13:02.060 Oh, pretty wiped.

01:13:03.380 But I've got my eye on the Hydra massage beds.

01:13:05.940 It felt like a real team effort out there.

01:13:07.620 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

01:13:09.500 Game changer.

01:13:10.460 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

01:13:12.440 Two big ones.

01:13:13.220 Worldwide access and red light technology.

01:13:15.620 Wow.

01:13:16.160 This place really has it all.

01:13:17.280 Back to you in the studio.

01:13:19.120 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

01:13:21.200 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

01:13:24.000 Deal ends March 13th.

01:13:25.000 $49 annual fee applies.

01:13:28.240 Steven Mahmood.

01:13:29.740 He's the guy.

01:13:30.440 Mahmood? 0.91

01:13:30.760 Mahmood.

01:13:31.080 You've got to call him the right name first.

01:13:32.380 Mahmood? 0.91

01:13:32.580 I can help.

01:13:33.220 I texted him.

01:13:34.520 He's a guy that is, uh, he's a Christian now, but he's a former Muslim.

01:13:38.740 And his whole, his whole thing is that he, he'll teach you how to speak with Muslims

01:13:42.860 about Christianity or maybe just about anything.

01:13:45.760 Because you have to really understand their theology and their culture in order to reach

01:13:50.300 them.

01:13:50.480 Otherwise, it's just falling on deaf ears.

01:13:52.060 That's the same thing as conspiracy theorists.

01:13:53.560 You've got to speak their language in order to evangelize.

01:13:56.380 Same thing with politics.

01:13:56.760 Same thing with junkies, dude.

01:13:57.720 You're going to talk to a junkie.

01:13:58.720 You've got to smoke meth with them.

01:13:59.140 You've got to know what it's like to be a junkie.

01:14:00.600 Yeah.

01:14:01.600 Right.

01:14:02.260 Like, but if, but I mean, like, that's why when you convert somebody to Christianity,

01:14:06.380 that person becomes the best type of apologist to their own people because they know the

01:14:11.480 culture already.

01:14:12.140 Right.

01:14:12.900 And so like, there's, there's a big piece of that as well.

01:14:15.940 Um, it's what we've been struggling with a bit here as well, Zach, because you've seen,

01:14:21.100 shut up, Matt.

01:14:22.820 Why do you like this? 1.00

01:14:23.440 Don't be like this.

01:14:24.120 We've come out of, we've come out of the, uh, the comedy realm and, and the being real,

01:14:28.340 real nasty.

01:14:29.060 Matt.

01:14:29.360 Well, I don't know if we're not finished with it.

01:14:31.880 We've come out of it a lot.

01:14:32.820 We came out of it.

01:14:33.440 We can, now we're back in it because we have to deal with some cat.

01:14:36.520 And, uh, then, then it, it puts into question.

01:14:39.960 You're like people like, oh, well you're saying this.

01:14:41.660 And then you're talking about Jesus.

01:14:42.660 And you're like the way you're, you're acting is, and I'm like, but like, this is for the

01:14:47.280 audience that I'm reaching, this is how they hear it.

01:14:51.100 And you don't like it, but I'm not reaching you.

01:14:53.420 Yeah.

01:14:53.780 And then it's like, well, if I water down my message or not my message, but if I'm like,

01:14:57.420 if I'm not speaking how I actually think or feel, who am I talking to?

01:15:02.720 What are these guys looking at over there?

01:15:04.140 It's not, it's Matt. 0.98

01:15:06.040 You guys are the worst.

01:15:08.280 I'm, I'm, I'm giving a heartfelt message here. 0.88

01:15:10.580 And these guys are, these guys are laughing.

01:15:15.020 Zach, are you seeing this?

01:15:18.640 They're, they're okay.

01:15:19.940 It's not breaking my heart.

01:15:21.120 I'm all right.

01:15:21.640 It's, I get laughed at all the time.

01:15:23.340 It's fine.

01:15:23.800 I can't get off the screen.

01:15:25.840 What are you looking at?

01:15:28.720 I'm sorry.

01:15:29.580 This is.

01:15:35.320 What is that?

01:15:36.600 It's a bug, man.

01:15:39.640 Oh, my God.

01:15:41.640 No.

01:15:42.360 Zach, I'm sorry about that.

01:15:44.880 No, you're kidding.

01:15:46.120 I wanted to hear what Top was saying.

01:15:48.320 Same.

01:15:48.880 I don't know why he's gone.

01:15:50.100 I know what he was saying.

01:15:50.880 Be a professional.

01:15:51.560 What was I saying then, David?

01:15:52.700 You were saying that people get upset when you try to evangelize to people that speak

01:15:57.380 the same language as you.

01:15:58.640 But unfortunately, the people that speak the same language as us are in, they're in comedy 0.99

01:16:03.360 and they're in, they're in a conspiracy.

01:16:05.920 Yeah.

01:16:06.160 And, you know, if we haven't talked the same language as them.

01:16:09.660 They're like, I came from the 501c3.

01:16:11.500 You should say, be blessed.

01:16:12.580 Let's go to Chick-fil-A.

01:16:13.320 And then they disown us.

01:16:14.360 And then they say that we're not.

01:16:15.840 Yeah.

01:16:16.020 They say we're not Christians.

01:16:17.360 The thing is, I can talk to the 501c3 people and not, and effectively not, not offend them.

01:16:22.500 Because I'm like, okay, I get it.

01:16:23.520 And I respect that.

01:16:24.300 Like, if you don't want to hear this stuff, that's cool.

01:16:25.900 If we're like in a personal setting.

01:16:27.540 But you're coming to, like, my place, right?

01:16:31.580 They're looking at the bugs again.

01:16:34.940 Every time Matt laughs, it just sends me.

01:16:40.220 Can you stop laughing at me?

01:16:42.620 Zach, next time you're going to, you can come to the studio and do this.

01:16:46.820 Because these guys are.

01:16:47.420 Just keep talking.

01:16:48.260 I get you.

01:16:50.380 Now, I hear you, though.

01:16:52.300 You got to meet people where they're at, man.

01:16:54.380 I mean, like, because here's the deal.

01:16:55.820 Like, there are people I'm never going to reach.

01:16:58.420 I think of my dad.

01:16:59.920 Like, my dad was a believer, right?

01:17:02.640 But he also had some pretty outlandish statements, he would say.

01:17:07.620 And I'd be like, dude, what are you doing?

01:17:08.980 You can't do that.

01:17:10.000 And he'd be like, yes, I can't.

01:17:11.120 I remember he used a.

01:17:13.560 What would he say?

01:17:14.260 He can't repeat.

01:17:15.300 I'd have to cuss, man. 0.91

01:17:16.940 He used a very derogatory term for AOC.

01:17:21.220 And I was like, hey, man, you don't need to do that.

01:17:23.500 And he's like, no, but she is.

01:17:24.880 And I was like, yeah, but you don't need to do that.

01:17:27.020 He literally got me and my pastor, our pastor, to sit down together.

01:17:32.140 And I'm just sitting there.

01:17:33.600 And he's like, why are we meeting?

01:17:34.600 And I was like, no, go ahead.

01:17:35.880 Tell him, Dad.

01:17:36.400 Tell him the thing you said that you're defending right now.

01:17:39.220 And then, you know, our pastor's like, yeah, you can't say that.

01:17:41.680 And he's like, oh, yeah, you're right.

01:17:43.280 No.

01:17:43.560 No.

01:17:44.200 Stop that.

01:17:45.240 Did he say spick went back?

01:17:46.580 No.

01:17:47.100 I don't think it was racial.

01:17:47.940 I think it was something.

01:17:48.760 He said the B word.

01:17:49.120 It was, no, it was just a B word.

01:17:50.840 Oh, so what?

01:17:51.580 I'll defend your dad.

01:17:54.060 I will.

01:17:55.220 Don't do this, Tom.

01:17:56.320 That's not why we're here.

01:17:57.660 That's not why we're here. 1.00

01:17:59.100 Was she acting like a bitch? 1.00

01:18:00.180 Don't shout ass. 1.00

01:18:01.140 Of course she was. 1.00

01:18:02.080 So then it's like, then say it.

01:18:03.760 No.

01:18:04.140 Well, it depends on who you're around.

01:18:05.980 What's the difference between, all right.

01:18:08.520 If you see a woman and you look at her. 0.97

01:18:11.580 Yeah.

01:18:12.080 And you lust.

01:18:13.300 Oh, no.

01:18:13.720 You've already sinned, right?

01:18:15.160 If you look at her in this way.

01:18:16.420 I mean, the Bible says this, right?

01:18:17.580 Right.

01:18:18.080 Okay.

01:18:18.680 So if I see.

01:18:19.340 It doesn't mean continue down that path.

01:18:21.000 Is that what you're saying? 1.00

01:18:21.820 No, but I'm saying if I see a bitch. 1.00

01:18:23.380 No. 1.00

01:18:23.700 I think.

01:18:24.060 Okay.

01:18:24.460 Hear me out.

01:18:25.060 What's the difference if I'm thinking it?

01:18:27.220 Foz, I don't think it's so much that he said it.

01:18:29.580 I think it's that he doubled down on it.

01:18:31.660 I think it's when you double down on the sin and go, no, this is fine.

01:18:36.020 That's when we have to talk about this.

01:18:37.680 No, it's not when we double down.

01:18:39.360 We got to get back to the Enneagram.

01:18:40.800 We got to get back to that.

01:18:41.480 Unbelievable.

01:18:41.740 We're back to the Enneagram.

01:18:43.100 Well, okay.

01:18:43.680 I want to circle back to something Dave said, though.

01:18:46.640 So you brought up how everybody's trying to say, like, you just don't need to look into

01:18:51.820 these things.

01:18:52.380 You just don't understand them, whatever.

01:18:54.360 When we really think about the whole, like, non-dualistic contemplative thinking, that's

01:19:01.160 really what they're trying to get you to fall into, is it not?

01:19:04.640 Mm-hmm.

01:19:05.480 Like, in what sense?

01:19:07.180 Well, like, the whole idea of, like, none of this matters.

01:19:09.520 Like, it's just be nice.

01:19:10.860 Just everybody get along.

01:19:12.520 Right.

01:19:12.860 It doesn't matter what they're doing.

01:19:14.280 I mean, it's like the progressive ideology.

01:19:16.520 It's the whole, like, anything goes.

01:19:18.880 And, like, really, that is getting back to that whole Kabbalistic idea of, like, they

01:19:24.220 want you to feel that way.

01:19:25.820 They want you to accept this idea of everything is permissible, all things are okay.

01:19:32.580 And it's like, you see what I'm saying?

01:19:35.520 Yeah.

01:19:35.700 Well, yeah.

01:19:36.300 Right.

01:19:36.600 And, I mean, there's satanic ties here as well.

01:19:39.720 So, um, but if we, um, I don't know, man, like, I mean, essentially that's, that's the

01:19:49.000 gist of, like, who these people are, who the books are, all the stuff that's come out,

01:19:53.180 like, all the things the Christian circles are reading into with this.

01:19:57.940 But what this all kind of prompted me to do was I started then going, where else does this

01:20:04.560 connect because, like, it's got the nine, like, I just, I, the reason I even stumbled

01:20:11.380 on that was you guys are always mentioning how Andrew Gipuhar seems to be at the center

01:20:16.440 of, like, half these conspiracies.

01:20:18.540 So, I was like, I'm, I'm curious how this dude intersects.

01:20:21.580 Well, it turns out he does.

01:20:22.720 Like, it's the Esalen Institute thing, right?

01:20:25.460 So, another big one is Michael Aquino.

01:20:29.220 Michael Aquino seems to have his hand in everything, right? 0.87

01:20:31.600 Yeah, eyebrows and the hairline, man, the crazy one.

01:20:33.900 And so, like, I, I Google, um, like, does Michael Aquino have any ties to the Enneagram?

01:20:42.700 And I stumble across this concept called infernal geometry.

01:20:47.140 Infernal geometry.

01:20:48.780 Yeah.

01:20:49.640 So, it turns out that, um, there's this thing called the ceremony of the nine angles.

01:20:57.020 Yeah.

01:20:58.440 And.

01:20:59.600 It's like the order of the nine angles that we were looking into.

01:21:02.720 But, so, it's not that.

01:21:04.480 They are connected.

01:21:05.920 But, but this is before that.

01:21:07.800 Um, they adopt that.

01:21:09.060 O9A adopts that.

01:21:10.780 Um, ceremony of the nine angles is actually a practice in the satanic church.

01:21:14.520 And they use it in their magic rituals.

01:21:16.620 Now, I think you guys have done a little bit of deep dive stuff on Aquino.

01:21:21.300 Like, that he broke away from the church of Satan because it basically wasn't hardcore enough for him.

01:21:26.520 They weren't actually worshiping Satan.

01:21:28.300 So, he's like, well, let's go over here and we'll actually worship Satan.

01:21:30.640 Yeah.

01:21:30.800 And it's funny that he ends up in military intelligence.

01:21:32.880 He's like, now this is, this is the place.

01:21:35.760 Yeah.

01:21:35.940 The, the whole psyop to mind war thing.

01:21:38.640 Um, but he makes this ceremony of nine angles for LeVay and Satanism.

01:21:44.240 He's the one that makes it.

01:21:46.260 And there's a book that he is, he writes like a foreword for it, or he's like a co-author.

01:21:52.600 I don't remember the deals, uh, like what, uh, what he actually had to do with the book, but he was part of the making of this book.

01:22:00.080 And they literally admit that this whole concept of the ceremony of the nine angles is just like the Enneagram.

01:22:09.320 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

01:22:12.240 How are you feeling?

01:22:13.200 Oh, pretty wiped.

01:22:14.240 But I've got my eye on the Hydra Massage Beds.

01:22:17.060 It felt like a real team effort out there.

01:22:18.740 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

01:22:20.560 Game changer.

01:22:21.560 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

01:22:23.540 Two big ones.

01:22:24.320 Worldwide access and red light technology.

01:22:26.740 Wow.

01:22:27.300 This place really has it all.

01:22:28.680 Back to you in the studio.

01:22:30.220 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

01:22:32.300 Get started for $1 enrollment and $29.99 a month.

01:22:35.100 Deal ends March 13th.

01:22:36.120 $49 annual fee applies.

01:22:39.120 The whole idea is it can be used for practically anything.

01:22:42.860 But it's this meditative thing that you can do magic through.

01:22:48.280 You can come to know yourself.

01:22:50.100 You can come to know the secrets of the universe.

01:22:52.560 Funny enough, it's literally the same thing that H.P. Lovecraft writes into his stories.

01:22:57.560 It's how they summon the deities.

01:22:59.120 It's how they summon Cthulhu and Yogg-Sagoth or whatever, all these dark gods.

01:23:04.540 The nine globes of Yogg-Sagoth.

01:23:08.000 Probably.

01:23:09.000 I think that's exactly what it is.

01:23:10.700 And it's interesting because that concept actually is present within the musical industry.

01:23:15.500 I believe it's nine globes.

01:23:17.180 The nine globes of Yogg-Sagoth.

01:23:19.360 Let me look that up real quick.

01:23:20.500 Because even though it's Lovecraftian, the language appears in the entities that Rihanna, Jay-Z, and Eminem mess with.

01:23:35.720 Like Rain Man.

01:23:36.380 Rain Man is one of the globes of Yogg-Sagoth, which is very strange.

01:23:42.740 Because most people look at, you know, Lovecraft is just a fictional, yep, nine globes.

01:23:52.900 Yeah. 1.00

01:23:53.540 Son of a bitch. 1.00

01:23:54.600 I mean, there seems to be reason to believe that Lovecraft actually kind of knew what he was talking about. 1.00

01:23:58.820 Yeah.

01:23:58.960 Right?

01:23:59.240 Like, maybe like a, oh man, who wrote 1984?

01:24:04.120 Orwell.

01:24:05.040 Orwell, yeah.

01:24:06.100 Like, Orwell seemed to be kind of an inside man.

01:24:08.420 And, you know, you see different writers that seem to have, be tipping a hat to, like, elite philosophy.

01:24:15.540 Maybe that's what's going on here on an occult level.

01:24:18.900 So you got that, Ty.

01:24:20.700 You've then got O9A, like you mentioned, which is essentially neo-Nazi Satanism.

01:24:25.600 And they believe in their dark gods and all this business.

01:24:28.420 And so they use the Enneagram as well, the nine angle rituals.

01:24:32.140 I'm listening to, I think it was your guy's show with Tim Constantine, the last one you did.

01:24:41.800 And he brought up the seven and eight pointed stars because he was talking about Lilith and then he was talking about Ashtaroth, all these, like, you know, Asherah, all these, like, names.

01:24:54.280 But it's really just the divine feminine thing, right?

01:24:56.340 And so I was like, you know what?

01:24:58.720 I wonder what a nine pointed star means.

01:25:01.820 And so I Google it.

01:25:02.880 And I'm like, what God does this, you know, point to?

01:25:05.140 What does this practice mean?

01:25:07.580 Everything, everything points back to the Baha'i faith. 1.00

01:25:12.180 The what?

01:25:13.160 Baha'i. 1.00

01:25:14.440 Type in, type in.

01:25:15.660 Baha'i blessed?

01:25:16.560 Yeah, Baha'i blessed.

01:25:18.280 That'd be a great shirt, by the way.

01:25:19.640 But you've got, yeah, if you, if you look at this star, dude, all they did is they took the Enneagram and they completed the circuit.

01:25:29.220 Yeah.

01:25:29.740 The Enneagram's missing the bottom.

01:25:31.980 This is just a completed star.

01:25:33.480 It's the same figure.

01:25:35.820 So I'm like, okay, well, what's the Baha'i faith, believe?

01:25:39.920 The Baha'i faith is, it comes about in, like, the late 1800s, mid-1800s, 1852.

01:25:47.820 You've got this guy named Baha'u'ala, okay?

01:25:53.840 And he is part of this religion called the Babis. 1.00

01:25:58.360 And there's this guy named the Bab, and they, he's executed.

01:26:02.480 And when he's executed, they take all these other people in this movement, this Baha'u'ala guy, and they put him in this place in Tehran called the Black Pit. 0.86

01:26:10.660 And he's, he's persecuted, he's imprisoned there.

01:26:14.780 And during that time, he encounters a figure that he calls the Maiden of Heaven, or the Divine Maiden.

01:26:22.480 Yep.

01:26:22.860 And he believes that she's the Holy Spirit.

01:26:26.840 Mm-hmm.

01:26:27.760 And she comes and she tells him that he is her prophet, that she's going to send out.

01:26:34.720 Tells him that all religions come from the same God, that all religions are true, they all point to one truth.

01:26:39.980 That humanity must be unified under Baha'i, and they promote this universalist message. 0.98

01:26:47.060 It's just back to the same Kabbalah BS. 0.99

01:26:49.760 It's the same thing.

01:26:51.220 Do you happen to be aware of any, like, prophetic warnings?

01:26:53.880 Things, humanity has to unite under this, or there's a thing coming?

01:26:59.100 I didn't catch anything like that.

01:27:02.080 It seems to be more, well, here's the other kicker, though.

01:27:04.880 You remember how we said, like, Kabbalah wants everybody to kind of accept Kabbalah?

01:27:09.260 Baha'i wants everybody to accept Baha'i. 0.98

01:27:12.600 Huh.

01:27:12.980 And so it's just rebranded. 1.00

01:27:14.600 It's the same Divine Feminine garbage. 1.00

01:27:16.520 Yeah, they're saying that they believe that all the messengers from the prophets throughout their religions are all messengers from God. 1.00

01:27:25.860 Yep.

01:27:26.280 Different manifestations, and it's to form a one religion.

01:27:29.660 And this is likely the form that, like, this Antichrist figure will come, because it'll be like...

01:27:35.400 Something like this.

01:27:36.220 Yeah, like, oh, yeah, yeah, Jesus was real.

01:27:39.620 So you guys are like, it's okay, Christians, right? 0.99

01:27:41.580 It's okay, Catholics, like, Jesus was real. 0.97

01:27:43.580 But, like, you just misunderstand a little bit.

01:27:45.520 But that's okay, it's not, you know... 0.99

01:27:46.680 How do you not call people like this, uh, bitches? 1.00

01:27:49.180 Right. 1.00

01:27:50.320 Just asking.

01:27:50.900 That's true.

01:27:51.500 You know.

01:27:52.520 Okay, like, if a fine feminine kind of character descends from this guy and then goes, like, Jesus wasn't real.

01:28:01.460 Can I call her, uh...

01:28:03.200 I don't know.

01:28:03.920 Can I call her...

01:28:04.500 I struggle.

01:28:05.620 I struggle with it.

01:28:07.100 Huh.

01:28:07.280 That is interesting, though, because it sounds... 1.00

01:28:08.960 You're a nasty man, Top. 0.98

01:28:09.600 It sounds exactly like so many other things. 0.99

01:28:12.660 Well, that just reminded me of the Chris Bledsoe thing.

01:28:14.580 Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off.

01:28:15.440 That's exactly what I was going to say.

01:28:16.620 Yeah, Chris Bledsoe.

01:28:17.720 And we were talking about it in the last episode because we were listing all the New Age thought leaders who looked at this time and said that there was going to be...

01:28:26.440 Basically, I'm paraphrasing.

01:28:27.980 We looked at four in particular.

01:28:29.520 It was, like, Rudolph Steiner, Alice Bailey, Alistair Crowley, and a fourth one.

01:28:36.720 And I forgot who the heck it was.

01:28:40.180 But they all...

01:28:41.580 Those are just kind of, like, the big figureheads.

01:28:43.360 They all predicted that this time there was going to be a rebranding.

01:28:45.720 Oh, a Manly P. Hall.

01:28:46.720 Manly P. Hall.

01:28:47.620 That there was going to be a rebranding of these spiritual entities.

01:28:51.000 Now, Rudolph Steiner, at least, had the good sense to determine that these entities were demonic and that they were going to be rebranded as, like, Cosmic Teachers or some crap like that.

01:29:01.200 But they were all looking at this and saying that, and the reason that that connected to the Bledsoe's is because the lady wants Chris Bledsoe to go out and convince people that this is not demonic, which is fascinating.

01:29:19.420 That's a fascinating angle to be taking.

01:29:21.680 In fact, I actually have to, if I wasn't blocked, I would remind Timothy Alvarino that even though he said that the divine feminine is bull when we brought it up on this show...

01:29:30.680 I thought he unblocked you.

01:29:31.860 He unblocked me, then he blocked me again.

01:29:34.420 That his narrative is actually perfectly in line with the lady or Hathor or Ishtar.

01:29:41.980 But, you know, I'm sure...

01:29:42.880 And Epstein's correspondence with Lawrence Krauss.

01:29:45.580 Well, you know, that's not...

01:29:47.800 And then when I bring that to his attention, he just goes, they're trying to connect me to the Epstein files.

01:29:52.800 Like, no, I know this is a complicated concept for you to try to wrap your midwit brain around. 0.98

01:29:56.660 I'm just saying that the narrative you're espousing comes from somebody who maybe that, you know, that person should give you pause.

01:30:04.960 You should look at that and be like, wait, wait, wait.

01:30:06.880 Why is Epstein doing the same thing that I'm doing?

01:30:08.380 He's giving me pause, but he's also giving me dollars.

01:30:11.020 Yeah, exactly.

01:30:12.320 Or somebody...

01:30:12.580 How can that be bad?

01:30:14.180 But, yeah, it's fascinating.

01:30:16.600 It's fascinating because that...

01:30:18.560 Despite the fact that he thought it was an insignificant thing and he wanted to defend Jake Barber,

01:30:23.420 I do think this divine feminine aspect is going to be huge going forward.

01:30:28.040 It's like...

01:30:28.800 I mean, I think you guys have mentioned this, but it's Katy Perry stepping off of the rocket. 0.98

01:30:32.820 I mean, like, it's all...

01:30:34.980 They're all entranced in this divine feminine chunk. 0.74

01:30:38.960 And isn't there some kind of tie with that in, like, the Age of Aquarius as well or something?

01:30:43.620 Yeah, so I believe that the...

01:30:48.280 Well, actually, no, no.

01:30:49.020 I'm conflating that with Jack Parsons and L. Ron Hubbard.

01:30:52.760 That entity was Babylon.

01:30:53.200 That might be it.

01:30:54.360 Yeah, that entity was Babylon.

01:30:55.920 But it wasn't just like, you know, this entity was supposed to herald in this time of the divine feminine.

01:31:02.880 And it was supposed to be a time of, you know, liberation for women and all these different things.

01:31:08.400 Culturally speaking, if you look back at that, it seems that there were some fruits to their labor, although I would argue that they were rotten.

01:31:16.380 Have you guys read into...

01:31:19.540 Have you ever read Michael Aquino's conversation he has with Satan?

01:31:24.840 No, that's a fascinating thing.

01:31:26.540 It's the same.

01:31:28.020 It's the same as all this stuff we're talking about.

01:31:30.700 Is Satan take on a feminine... 0.71

01:31:33.280 No.

01:31:35.320 He's set.

01:31:36.760 He's the Egyptian god set, right? 0.98

01:31:38.840 Which is funny because that's back to the Ennead again.

01:31:42.460 But he...

01:31:43.780 It's called The Way of Coming Forth by Night.

01:31:46.720 Michael Aquino writes this book.

01:31:48.120 He writes about his conversation he has with Satan.

01:31:50.820 And in it, Satan essentially tells him, I'm tired of you calling me Satan because I'm not an adversary.

01:31:55.640 And that's what Satan means.

01:31:56.660 I'm your friend.

01:31:58.120 And I'm the only true god.

01:31:59.280 My name's Set.

01:31:59.920 And, you know, before you, I sent...

01:32:03.020 I appeared to Alistair Crowley as Hathor...

01:32:06.640 Not Hathor, but there's like...

01:32:08.980 It's something similar to Hathor.

01:32:10.820 It's A-Wass, Lamb, and there was another entity that appeared to Crowley.

01:32:15.460 I forgot what the hell it was. 0.95

01:32:17.600 But he basically says Crowley drops the ball because of his appetite for sex and money and power and whatever. 0.84

01:32:23.920 And then LeVay picks it up.

01:32:25.420 And he says, LeVay was my beloved prophet or whatever.

01:32:29.180 But, you know, he has, you know, run his course.

01:32:31.540 So now it's you.

01:32:32.420 And basically, I want to help humanity ascend.

01:32:35.800 And when you tie that to the fact that you've got Michael Aquino writing Mind War about controlling your thoughts via propaganda at every level of media, it's pretty freaking scary.

01:32:47.920 Like, it makes sense why people buy onto this stuff when they're inundated with it constantly.

01:32:53.560 See, and that's that thing right there where you said, like, he wants humanity to ascend.

01:32:57.060 So people get upset with me because they're like, why do you think aliens are inherently demonic?

01:33:01.840 It's like, right now, it's happening in tandem with what?

01:33:05.120 The Epstein files.

01:33:06.100 And what was Epstein doing?

01:33:07.140 He was sacrificing and, you know, worshipping these entities.

01:33:10.880 It's like this.

01:33:12.280 And what message do the aliens have?

01:33:14.180 They want us to ascend. 1.00

01:33:15.700 It's the same shit. 1.00

01:33:16.640 The good aliens. 1.00

01:33:17.180 The good aliens want us to ascend. 1.00

01:33:18.860 So I suspect that the aliens that are going to be disclosed are the same shit that these guys are sacrificing to. 0.99

01:33:26.660 They're not aliens. 0.99

01:33:27.940 And that's the thing that everybody gets hung up on.

01:33:29.880 They're fighting with me in the comments section.

01:33:31.480 Like, well, the universe is incredibly vast.

01:33:33.420 So, you know, aliens, therefore, could be a multitude of things.

01:33:37.140 Good ones, bad ones, neutral ones.

01:33:39.020 And I'm like, number one, you're dealing with a word that I want to throw it out.

01:33:43.280 Aliens is a terrible word.

01:33:45.600 Because in its fundamental definition, it just means foreign.

01:33:49.420 But that is not what we're talking about when we say aliens.

01:33:53.040 You know, if everything is alien to me, it's foreign to me.

01:33:55.360 This is not foreign to me.

01:33:56.920 This is a thing with a skinny limbs, big head, giant eyeballs, little mouth. 0.99

01:34:01.160 Like, that's what an alien is.

01:34:03.260 Let's take Albarino's kind of perspective here and just put it up against Scripture.

01:34:08.200 Okay?

01:34:08.640 He's immediately assuming that some of these might be nice.

01:34:12.140 Right?

01:34:12.480 And he's basically saying, like, you should just stop assuming that they're all bad.

01:34:17.440 Scripture literally tells us to assume all spirits that come to us are bad until proven otherwise.

01:34:24.400 Like, if an angel comes to you and it's preaching a message separate from God's word,

01:34:29.760 then it's not from God.

01:34:32.480 And so it's like...

01:34:33.200 Well, you know what the workaround is, Zach?

01:34:34.660 The workaround is these aren't spiritual beings.

01:34:38.100 These are physical beings. 0.96

01:34:40.220 You know, divine, spiritual, all that other crap. 1.00

01:34:42.840 That's exactly why we had to get stuck on that spiritual realm shit. 1.00

01:34:45.580 Yeah. 0.98

01:34:45.720 Because if you're there, that's like the preface to the entire argument.

01:34:49.880 Yep.

01:34:50.100 So if you can reclassify and redefine stuff, then everybody's kind of confused and then the conversation can continue.

01:34:57.940 Yeah.

01:34:58.500 Well, he kind of messed up, though, because he sort of outright denied a spiritual realm.

01:35:03.820 And so then it's like, well, what do you even do with passages like that now?

01:35:08.360 Like, I don't know.

01:35:09.960 It's...

01:35:10.360 Yeah, well, that is a great question, right?

01:35:13.140 If you are getting hung up on the definition of a spiritual realm and the Bible tells us to test all spirits,

01:35:19.320 if I can't even apparently engage in that until I lay out these definitions, how the hell am I going to test the spirits?

01:35:24.580 I think that's what we talked about, like, a little bit after that was like, it's more about defining a spirit.

01:35:29.240 Because he's talking about how they have physical properties.

01:35:31.880 It's like, okay, yeah, stuff in the spirit realm has physical properties.

01:35:34.960 So we're just going to get into this thing of defining spirit, right?

01:35:37.760 Like, Jesus walks through a wall, but then he can have his feet on the floor and have his hand on food and eat food, right?

01:35:45.480 So there's physicality and there's the ability to, like, defy physicality as well.

01:35:50.580 That was a glorified body, to be fair, when Jesus did it.

01:35:53.840 But, like, there's other stories like this about stuff from the spirit realm having physicality, but it's like it's still another realm.

01:36:01.040 Yeah.

01:36:01.420 I think that's why the unseen realm is an easier phrase.

01:36:05.700 But, like, if spirits live there, God definitely lives there.

01:36:10.440 God definitely has these interactions with other spirits, even, like, when he wants to send Ahab off to war.

01:36:17.020 And then he has this council of spirits and says, how are we going to trick them?

01:36:20.420 And then a spirit comes before him and says, I'll go be in the ear of his prophets a lying spirit.

01:36:27.060 And God says, okay, go ahead and do that.

01:36:29.020 Well, all those spirits, including God, were all there talking somewhere.

01:36:32.860 I have no problem calling that the spirit realm.

01:36:34.740 Right.

01:36:35.000 Like, what are we talking about?

01:36:35.480 Well, he also, I mean, it essentially denies all of Heiser's work, right?

01:36:41.880 Well, he kind of flat out did that.

01:36:44.060 Did he?

01:36:44.780 Because, like, my issue is, like, well, the word God literally means spirit being.

01:36:49.940 Otherwise, when you read, like, when the witch of Endor, like, when Saul goes to the witch of Endor and wants her to resurrect the spirit of Samuel, she does.

01:36:59.460 And it works.

01:37:00.480 And when he's coming up out of the ground, she says, I see a God coming up out of the ground.

01:37:05.260 Well, why did she just make a differentiator between human Samuel and what this is now being considered a God?

01:37:13.700 Because he's in the spirit.

01:37:15.620 He's a spirit being.

01:37:17.120 And she is calling it a God.

01:37:19.300 Like, little g, obviously. 0.81

01:37:21.280 But I'm saying, like, that verse doesn't even make sense if everything is physical.

01:37:26.640 Like, there would be no differential language there.

01:37:30.480 Right.

01:37:30.560 Good point.

01:37:30.920 Well, what he would have said was that was symbolic.

01:37:34.020 Or, no, I think he was just saying, calling it the astral realm instead of the spirit.

01:37:37.080 No, he wasn't.

01:37:37.600 He wasn't even doing that.

01:37:38.660 But, you know, but once again, though, that goes back to that Zach referenced it a moment ago, that conversation between Epstein and Lawrence Krauss,

01:37:46.220 where Lawrence is made to formulate a debate that Epstein can use.

01:37:51.380 Epstein promises not to attribute his name to the article, but he needs an article written that debunks the connection between aliens, ghosts,

01:37:59.580 which ghosts, in my opinion, are demonic entities masquerading as dead loved ones, and out-of-body experiences.

01:38:05.960 Now, out-of-body experiences includes near-death experience, includes astral projection, but it includes the spiritual realm as well.

01:38:13.560 And so my suspicion here is that Albarino is running a narrative that he is not, like I said, overconfident midwit.

01:38:22.720 He is not aware of the origins of this narrative, but he should be, you know, he should have some pause here.

01:38:28.760 He should be like, wait a second.

01:38:30.120 That's fascinating.

01:38:30.900 Why would Epstein be concerned with doing that?

01:38:33.120 That's a lot of, like, where my research, because I think that's a lot of how this cognitive infiltration works.

01:38:37.900 It's not like you're always planting an individual to steer a narrative.

01:38:42.900 You are planting a narrative, and that narrative might parallel the truth in many, many ways, but it might have some fundamental lies,

01:38:49.660 which is what we talk about in the show all the time.

01:38:51.440 And then to find out that the lady is telling Chris Bledsoe it's imperative that you go forth and spread the word that this is not demonic

01:38:58.640 is, like, layers upon layers upon layers of alarms.

01:39:02.560 And then you look at these New Age practitioners, and they're all saying there's a rebranding coming in the year 2025 and 26 of these entities that were formerly known as demons

01:39:13.440 or, as Manly P. Hall puts it, gods, angels, and teachers, and they will be rebranded as, like, cosmic entities.

01:39:25.560 That's what he says, cosmic entities, meaning from the cosmos, entities from the cosmos.

01:39:29.200 What was previously identified as angels, which he never added the caveat fallen, gods, in a lowercase g, and teachers,

01:39:38.240 which they taught mystery school teachings and, you know, agriculture, metallurgy, you name it.

01:39:43.620 Manly P. Hall was kind of right over the target.

01:39:45.340 He just wasn't grounded in Christ.

01:39:47.180 So it's like all these things are pointing towards this, and this overconfident midwit has no abilities of discernment whatsoever 0.99

01:39:53.820 to detach from the narrative that is in his, you know, book that's making him a lot of money

01:39:57.900 and go, wait a second, did I put out something that's fundamentally incorrect and rooted in something that I don't understand?

01:40:02.660 Well, it's like, I think we should be, maybe we should adjust our view of Albarino. 0.99

01:40:06.860 I'll slap him in the mouth. 0.98

01:40:08.020 Yeah, after we do that. 1.00

01:40:08.940 Okay.

01:40:09.640 Of somebody that we don't particularly like because of, like, his personality and his face and his appearance.

01:40:15.560 But as somebody that you could very well become, because it's like, we were talking about in the very beginning of the show,

01:40:24.980 we're talking about the idea of grandma maxing, and it's not, that's not quite correct either,

01:40:30.100 but it's the safer option, and he's just a great example of when you just go too far.

01:40:35.540 Like, the guy has discovered it, and then he's gone to a place where it's like sci-fi, fantasy, nonsense,

01:40:43.300 and it becomes almost like a circle jerk where you have to, like, collect the information you want to see

01:40:48.240 to confirm your information, and then look at how far it's spiraled.

01:40:53.820 Like, you went from doing documentaries with Steve Quayle to writing the foreword

01:40:58.980 to a book about space things and technology going on on Mars.

01:41:03.800 His outward visage betrays his love for fictional films.

01:41:10.940 Betrays? Or is it in direct alignment with?

01:41:12.120 Or he is betrayed, rather, by his outward visage, which clearly defines his love for fictional films.

01:41:18.160 I don't know. I just never want to get there where it's like, like, you can keep on searching.

01:41:23.080 Like, you can get to Christ and then keep going.

01:41:25.360 Yeah, you can walk way past it.

01:41:26.960 Well, then you're at Christ Plus, right?

01:41:28.640 Then it's like you're adding on to Jesus, and that's where it all falls apart.

01:41:32.420 Like, if you're adding on to Jesus, then his work wasn't sufficient.

01:41:36.580 Right.

01:41:37.440 And so it's like there's no room for that.

01:41:39.880 But, like, to the point you guys are making, to me, like, you were saying how there's a narrative being pushed,

01:41:47.600 and the way I see it is there's, like, a million narratives being pushed.

01:41:51.680 It feels like Satan's Hail Mary, like, for lack of a better term.

01:41:56.000 But it's like when you look at the, like, Madame Blavatskis of the world with, like, the Theosophical Society.

01:42:02.540 Have you ever seen the emblem for the Theosophical Society?

01:42:07.420 Maybe I have.

01:42:08.300 Yeah, let's pull it up.

01:42:08.940 Like, it's kind of crazy, man.

01:42:11.500 Like, because these occultists, like these Crowleys and these Blavatskis and these, it's like they see the interconnection points.

01:42:20.340 Like, you look at this symbol, and you've got, like, this Star of David, Star of Metatron thing at the center.

01:42:26.040 You've got an Ankh in the middle of that. 0.99

01:42:27.920 You've got a swastika above that.

01:42:30.560 You've got an Ouroboros.

01:42:32.400 You've got the Om symbol with the Hindus. 1.00

01:42:35.020 You've got an Ouroboros, which ties back to Kabbalah.

01:42:38.320 And so, like, she's looking at this and going, look, it's all one truth.

01:42:42.580 The Baha'is are going, look, it's all one truth. 1.00

01:42:45.220 Crowley goes, we call them, you know, gods now.

01:42:48.420 We'll call them something eventually different later.

01:42:50.820 You did the Manly Sea Hall, or Manly P-Hall, Sea Hall?

01:42:54.940 Yeah, P-Hall.

01:42:55.880 P-Hall.

01:42:56.820 Saying the same thing.

01:42:58.200 Like, they see it.

01:42:59.800 That's what all these guys believe, though, by the way, Zach.

01:43:01.100 They all believe that it's going to be a falling away and then a conglomeration of all the religions under one banner.

01:43:06.640 So it makes sense that you would have, as a, you know, a symbol that represents your belief system, this amalgamation of a symbol from each belief system.

01:43:15.100 You know, because that's what they think.

01:43:16.080 They're all going to be under one umbrella.

01:43:18.220 And it's going to be specifically under the umbrella of these entities.

01:43:21.480 It's a reference to a Rihanna song.

01:43:23.320 But that's what's so crazy about this.

01:43:25.960 It's because, like, when you just get back to, like, the simple message of Scripture, you've got the way of Christ, and then you've got the way of the world.

01:43:35.000 And really what we're talking about here is the way of the world unifying under a banner.

01:43:40.200 They've been operating.

01:43:41.380 They've all been saying the same things.

01:43:43.520 They've just been doing it under different names.

01:43:45.920 So it would make sense the next move is let's unify.

01:43:49.260 And I think that's what's probably happening in Revelation.

01:43:51.680 But, yeah, I mean, it's just, like, the Bible calls all this out.

01:43:58.180 You know, it's so simple.

01:43:59.420 It's so easy to see once you've seen, like, Scripture just says, yeah, there's two ways.

01:44:04.260 There's only two ways.

01:44:05.560 There's the way of Christ, and then there's everything else.

01:44:09.280 So, in short, I think the Enneagram drags you from the church to all of this if you let it.

01:44:19.100 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

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01:44:23.940 Oh, pretty wiped.

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01:44:27.800 It felt like a real team effort out there.

01:44:29.480 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

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01:44:34.280 Two big ones, worldwide access and red light technology.

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01:44:39.340 Back to you in the studio.

01:44:40.900 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

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01:44:46.880 $49 annual fee applies.

01:44:50.100 And that's the danger I want to warn people away from with this thing.

01:44:54.980 Well, I mean, it makes sense that something like this would infiltrate the church.

01:44:58.140 That's why people, you know, ultimately when people bash the church, it would have been – it's a good target, right? 0.60

01:45:07.460 I mean, you have a place that proclaims to be the house of the Lord.

01:45:11.380 You have real believers gathering together to, you know, interact with the word and to engage in fellowship.

01:45:19.920 Of course, that would be a place that would be endlessly infiltrated, endlessly attacked.

01:45:24.780 I don't think there has to be like this naivety in the church almost of like you have people coming there to figure out life. 0.80

01:45:33.540 Like the church is a place for sick people, spiritually sick, so they don't know. 0.99

01:45:37.880 That's where they go to learn.

01:45:38.960 And so it is the perfect place for subversion or for distraction or that slight one-degree angle change, which I think – I don't even know if this is a slight change.

01:45:48.080 The Enneagram, that seems like an entire departure.

01:45:52.280 Yeah.

01:45:52.620 And it's being instituted in the governmental and like the working aspect of churches.

01:45:59.220 But it just shows – it's just a symptom of something deeper.

01:46:04.380 It just exposes the sickness in the church.

01:46:06.540 That it can be – that it can get in there.

01:46:08.640 It's like the people always thought like that and didn't know the word of God and didn't know God himself enough to not get duped by that.

01:46:15.240 But it's just once that comes along, it exposes that.

01:46:18.640 And you realize like, wow, dude, like a majority of the church is just into this shenanigans that has nothing to do with Christ.

01:46:26.280 But that was always there.

01:46:27.460 It's just a thing like the Enneagram just exposes it.

01:46:30.400 I don't know if it was on this show or another, but talking about the golden calves recently.

01:46:38.380 And like the reason the people wanted the golden calf is because like God was up there on top of the mountain.

01:46:44.840 And that's scary.

01:46:45.820 It's scary to go to God.

01:46:47.080 It's scary to get close to God.

01:46:48.620 We're down here and we're not hearing from him and we're not seeing enough happening right now.

01:46:52.420 And when we don't see results from God, we turn to other things to give us those results.

01:46:58.180 And that's why they made the calves. 0.99

01:47:00.760 And so it's like, is this not just a golden calf?

01:47:04.200 Yeah.

01:47:04.320 Well, and I don't know exactly what it looked like when God came down in that event.

01:47:10.800 But if you look at Ezekiel's event and there are like living creatures that do have the face of a calf.

01:47:19.960 Like, is it possible that God approached and they saw a calf like when God approached at that time?

01:47:26.840 And it was like, oh, something of God.

01:47:29.680 There was an element of that.

01:47:31.220 Oh, meaning like a cherubim has like the face of an oxen or something like that?

01:47:34.160 Yeah, and they were like, this isn't like this other thing.

01:47:36.240 It's one of the things.

01:47:37.940 Trying to bail out the Jews? 1.00

01:47:39.040 No, I think these Jews knew. 0.77

01:47:41.120 They knew and they were familiar with the angels.

01:47:44.100 And one of the angels probably would depict itself as having the head of a calf.

01:47:48.760 Like the, like the seraphim, they'll have the four different faces that they could show at the same time.

01:47:52.440 I'm just saying that like sometimes like the blessings of God or the things of God or like good things, they're still not God.

01:48:01.560 But people are like, oh yeah, this is okay because it's good.

01:48:04.360 It's okay, great, but it's not God.

01:48:06.100 This goes back to that, that discussion about like, well, are aliens demons?

01:48:10.620 They're angels.

01:48:11.820 They're angels.

01:48:12.600 Yeah.

01:48:12.740 Are some of them bad?

01:48:14.100 Yeah.

01:48:14.520 And I think they're going to look the same as some good angels because they are probably of the same classification.

01:48:19.700 How do you determine?

01:48:20.820 We can test them.

01:48:21.960 There's like a legalistic realm in which we can test them.

01:48:24.640 Right.

01:48:24.780 And it seems like they have to be truthful to some capacity.

01:48:27.840 I don't, I don't know the exact legal spiritual law, but it seems like, yeah, when you ask them certain questions, they must answer because there are rules in the spiritual realm.

01:48:37.300 The same way that that's how they get your consent.

01:48:39.560 There has to be some form of truth telling here.

01:48:42.120 So, but I do think those people knew.

01:48:44.440 They directed Aaron to do, to build this exact thing. 0.98

01:48:47.820 And I think he knew as well because I knew he was in deep shit when Moses came down. 0.98

01:48:52.120 He started blaming everybody else. 0.99

01:48:53.480 They know what they were doing.

01:48:54.760 It wasn't because we thought.

01:48:56.060 Isn't that just Adam, though?

01:48:58.060 Like, it's the woman you gave me.

01:48:59.620 She did it.

01:49:00.380 You know?

01:49:00.700 That's what we were talking about, right?

01:49:01.660 Yeah.

01:49:03.660 And then, you know, he says, oh, yeah, man, there's gold in there and the fire and a calf came out.

01:49:08.140 Yeah, yeah.

01:49:09.140 Yeah, exactly.

01:49:10.000 But it's just so sad because it's the gold that God gave them through the Egyptians, man.

01:49:14.660 It was like this blessing of God that he was like, hey, I'm going to provide for you.

01:49:18.320 Like, the same way Jesus got gold, frankincense, and myrrh at his birth and then he had to go into Egypt to survive.

01:49:24.660 Like, it was good that they got gold so Joseph and Mary could survive in Egypt.

01:49:28.280 They had some money now.

01:49:29.280 It was the opposite.

01:49:30.300 Like, he was calling his child out of Egypt, gave them the money of the Egyptians, and they turn around and make an idol out of it.

01:49:35.900 It was probably way more potent than gold they would have had otherwise.

01:49:39.720 Yeah, but I'm just saying, like, we should not think that we're not doing that.

01:49:43.240 We should read those stories and we shouldn't go, oh, the Jews. 1.00

01:49:47.120 We should read those and go, God, where am I doing that?

01:49:49.540 Like, what are the things that, like, you're giving me and I'm, like, using it for something against you?

01:49:55.000 Like, I should be mindful of that.

01:49:56.880 True.

01:49:57.060 Well, it goes to show, though, how deceived and how uneducated people are on the Word of God when they can run into something like the Enneagram where, you know,

01:50:05.340 they're talking about the face of God, right?

01:50:06.820 Like, talking about, oh, they saw something that sort of resembled God, maybe, and that's what led them astray.

01:50:11.900 You've got Richard Rohr on quote saying, the whole Enneagram is called the face of God.

01:50:17.960 If you could look at it reality from nine pairs of eyes and honor all of them, you would look at reality through the eyes of God.

01:50:23.720 He says that.

01:50:25.160 Somebody reads that and goes, yeah, this is a Christian book, you know?

01:50:29.380 And it's like, so there's just a level of uneducation happening, too, right?

01:50:34.460 Like, that cannot jive with Christianity. 0.79

01:50:38.420 And at the same time, I do believe that what he's saying is probably true.

01:50:44.540 Like, these nine entities that were telling him this stuff, where he's getting this download from, they're probably being sort of accurate.

01:50:51.520 Like, they're looking at this world through their eyes, however they – because it seems like they are one, but then they're also nine.

01:50:58.460 Like, as Puharich was – when he's channeling this entity, it comes as one, but then it distinguishes itself as nine, eventually, as they continue to channel this.

01:51:08.380 So it's like – it does have this sort of – I don't know how to explain it.

01:51:12.880 Well, it's interesting because – what was the name of that school before?

01:51:15.740 Oh, the – well, the Esalen Institute?

01:51:20.060 Esalen Institute, yeah.

01:51:21.580 There was one guy that came out of there in particular who was responsible for something called gestalt psychology.

01:51:29.900 And gestalt psychology – gestalt means an organized whole that is perceived as more than the sum of its parts.

01:51:38.500 So meaning these parts come together to make something else.

01:51:41.060 So these nine entities –

01:51:41.460 It's hydra.

01:51:42.500 It's hail hydra.

01:51:43.260 Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

01:51:45.100 But it's also – it's an inversion of the trinity, right? 0.94

01:51:47.440 So, like, if you are these entities and you see, like, oh, damn, there's three in one right there.

01:51:51.420 Like, they could probably – maybe they have these similar properties.

01:51:53.740 Well, obviously, it's not the same thing.

01:51:55.240 But when people deny the trinity or, like, or don't understand it, it's like, yeah, we're not going to understand this.

01:51:59.980 These guys are doing some other weird stuff because there clearly are nine of them.

01:52:03.140 But then they're telling you that they're seeing the world when they all come together through one perspective.

01:52:07.260 So there is something happening here.

01:52:09.120 And I think they're, like, a multitude of things.

01:52:10.240 Like, they're not just – so it's, like, there's nine personality types, right?

01:52:13.140 But there's also these nine entities.

01:52:14.560 But there's also these nine realms, right?

01:52:16.360 If you go to, like, all these different – what's the belief system?

01:52:22.240 Norse mythology has nine different realms.

01:52:24.900 So it's, like, there's something about this – these entities and their ability to present as a multitude of things, not just an individual thing but also, like, a conceptual thing.

01:52:34.900 And also to – what's the word?

01:52:37.060 Collectivize into one.

01:52:38.280 Yeah.

01:52:39.040 And that's the big one, the collectivization.

01:52:41.520 Like, we see the devil in that through politics, modern politics, or even modern thinking.

01:52:47.440 It's interesting.

01:52:48.620 It's interesting.

01:52:49.140 Yeah.

01:52:49.160 I think it's one of those things that, you know, we just can't – if you existed within a higher realm, right?

01:52:54.580 If there's a third dimension and that's what we exist in, fourth dimension being time, fifth, sixth, et cetera, you know, these entities supposedly exist in these higher dimensions.

01:53:04.680 It's a concept that we don't have –

01:53:07.300 Again, not to, like, glam them up and make them more than they are. 0.91

01:53:11.220 No, they're still gay. 0.99

01:53:12.200 They're super gay. 1.00

01:53:13.200 But it's just like, okay, this is a characteristic of what they do, and we don't understand it, and that's fine. 0.98

01:53:17.860 Yeah.

01:53:18.820 Yeah.

01:53:19.060 There is one – there's one school of thought that would kind of confuse that a little bit, and that would be, like, Gary Wayne's take, where he kind of sees it as, like, warring mob bosses.

01:53:30.160 Yeah.

01:53:30.340 And I'm going to be honest, that view makes a lot of sense to me, too, because it's, like, if I'm the bad guy, I have no morals.

01:53:36.360 So why – why would I hold true to the greater thing?

01:53:41.040 You know what I'm saying?

01:53:41.960 Like, the greater collective –

01:53:43.340 There's the beast, and then the beast ultimately turns on her and eats her.

01:53:46.080 Like, the demons can't get along either.

01:53:47.880 Yeah.

01:53:48.160 They can't get along with each other.

01:53:49.280 They don't just hate us.

01:53:50.180 They hate everything.

01:53:50.220 The only reason you might do that is because it's probably not all the time, but if you can do that for a time, you become very powerful as a unit.

01:53:58.680 So, like, just in the pursuit of power, you might occasionally get together and high-five in a group of nine.

01:54:04.800 It's like the five families in The Godfather.

01:54:07.260 Right, right, exactly.

01:54:08.340 Like, are you separate until a common enemy appears or something like that, so –

01:54:12.520 I like the idea of this Hydra just, you know, one head just biting the other one off as it's connected to its own body, and it's bleeding.

01:54:20.360 It's funny because that's how it acts.

01:54:21.520 Yeah, that's how it acts even in cartoons.

01:54:23.220 They're always taking bites of each other.

01:54:24.840 Yeah.

01:54:26.660 Well, listen, Zach, I want to bring it in for a landing here.

01:54:29.680 Is there anything else that you wanted to touch on before we wrap it up?

01:54:32.200 No, that's it.

01:54:33.060 We have to talk to you about Indiana at some point.

01:54:35.140 Oh, my God.

01:54:35.860 Yeah, I mean, I don't know how fleshed out of an episode that will be.

01:54:40.700 It's going to be a lot of speculation, but I don't even like – even my – you know, the story that you guys gave me such a hard time for that you don't remember.

01:54:49.180 It has a lot to do with Indiana.

01:54:52.560 Well, a little bit to do with Indiana, but I don't know, man.

01:54:54.920 We can talk about it.

01:54:55.780 I don't know how deep we could go, but it would be fun.

01:54:58.280 Well, you're welcome back anytime.

01:55:00.120 Just hit us up, and we'll figure out something.

01:55:01.800 Before we get out of here, though, where can people find your work, Zach?

01:55:05.120 Let's remind them.

01:55:07.260 SaltySaintsPodcast.com.

01:55:08.360 You can reach me there.

01:55:09.780 Salty Saints on Spotify, whatever.

01:55:12.960 It's a little anchor symbol.

01:55:14.520 Once again, we're not the Mormons.

01:55:17.640 Also, if you are Mormon and you're listening to this and you think I'm the Mormon, stop sending me your emails.

01:55:22.900 And, yeah, I mean, I think that's it.

01:55:27.860 What's the project that you're working on that people need to look forward to?

01:55:30.280 Bereans. 0.89

01:55:30.900 The Berean Files, which was kind of a nod to the X-Files, but now it's the Epstein stuff coming out.

01:55:36.780 Oh, interesting.

01:55:38.060 I think it's a great name, though.

01:55:39.360 It's a great concept, great name.

01:55:41.280 You should be in it before more Mormons take it. 0.99

01:55:43.080 Where is that going to be coming out?

01:55:44.120 Is that going to be YouTube, Apple Podcasts, all that?

01:55:47.040 Yeah, I mean, I think to start – well, I need to talk to you guys about that because I need some tips.

01:55:51.700 But I'm thinking in the beginning we're probably not going to have enough of a push to have any kind of paywall or anything like that.

01:55:57.080 So it's probably just going to be out on YouTube live, and then it will be on Spotify and all that after the fact.

01:56:03.380 All right.

01:56:04.060 Well, let us know.

01:56:04.720 We'll help you out.

01:56:05.680 Yeah, that'd be great.

01:56:06.960 Zach, thanks to talk to you again.

01:56:08.240 We'll talk soon.

01:56:09.620 I'll text you.

01:56:10.160 Absolutely.

01:56:10.960 I won't have a jank set up next time.

01:56:14.640 We'll have to figure it out, though.

01:56:16.300 Yeah, we figured it out.

01:56:17.140 We'll – step by step.

01:56:18.800 Yeah.

01:56:19.220 We're getting better.

01:56:20.080 But until next time, guys, don't forget to obey, submit, and comply.

01:56:23.900 We'll see you later.

01:56:24.460 They're bred with daughters of men, and they will do it again. 1.00

01:56:34.560 The end is written in the book, in the pages they foreseen.

01:56:42.560 That's fun.

01:56:46.100 Death Squad. 0.87

01:56:50.740 Death Squad. 0.91

01:56:53.900 Death Squad. 0.78

01:57:01.060 Ah, ah, ah. 0.70

01:57:03.020 Devil of Death Squad.

01:57:05.520 When the last trumpet sounds.

01:57:08.140 And the heavens –

01:57:08.980 We're here with one of Planet Fitness's Black Card members.

01:57:13.100 How are you feeling?

01:57:14.020 Oh, pretty wiped.

01:57:15.360 But I've got my eye on the Hydra Massage Beds.

01:57:17.920 It felt like a real team effort out there.

01:57:19.580 Oh, bringing a guest to every workout?

01:57:21.400 Game changer.

01:57:22.420 Any other perks you want to tell the nation about?

01:57:24.380 Two big ones.

01:57:25.180 Worldwide access and red light technology.

01:57:27.600 Wow.

01:57:28.120 This place really has it all.

01:57:29.540 Back to you in the studio.

01:57:30.940 Get your first month free with a PF Lock Card.

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Nephilim Death Squad - March 05, 2026

The Trojan Horse w⧸ Zach Killey

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