Order of Man - 094： Tim Kennedy ｜ Becoming the Sheepdog

00:00:00.000 There are three types of people in this world. The wolf, the sheep, and the sheepdog. The wolf is

00:00:04.360 violent, the sheep is passive, and the sheepdog is there to protect one from the other. My guest

00:00:08.720 today, Army Green Beret and UFC-ranked middleweight fighter Tim Kennedy, talks with us about how to

00:00:13.180 overcome fear, how to get up and learn from losses, how to recognize strengths and weaknesses,

00:00:17.920 and how to become the sheepdog. You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace

00:00:23.200 your fears and boldly chart your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more

00:00:28.580 time. Every time, you are not easily deterred, defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is

00:00:35.640 your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all

00:00:41.340 is said and done, you can call yourself a man. Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is

00:00:46.460 Ryan Michler, and I am the host and the founder of Order of Man. Now, whether you've been listening

00:00:50.100 to us since the beginning, or you've just stumbled across us, you guys are listening to the manliest

00:00:55.440 show available. We're all about teaching you how to become a better man, a better protector,

00:01:00.320 better provider, and a better presider, a leader over yourself, your family, your business,

00:01:05.040 your community, every area of life that is important to you. So each and every week, we

00:01:08.480 bring you the world's smartest, the toughest, the successful, the most talented men on the

00:01:13.040 planet. We extract their hard-fought wisdom, and then we share it with you guys. And of course,

00:01:16.660 today's show is no different. We've got an Army Green Beret, UFC-ranked middleweight fighter

00:01:20.360 Tim Kennedy on the show, and we're talking about becoming the sheepdog. Guys, I can say that

00:01:24.780 this is probably, if not, the best show to date. So before I introduce you to him and get into the

00:01:30.080 show, I do want to let you know that you can get the show notes for this show at orderofman.com

00:01:34.100 slash 094. And then also make sure if you have not done this already, that you join our Facebook

00:01:38.940 group. I think we're almost at 15,000 men now, and we are having some great discussions about what it

00:01:45.440 means to be a man and how you can be a better one. So you can do that at facebook.com slash groups

00:01:49.220 slash orderofman. And third, and this is the big one. If you haven't already done so,

00:01:53.100 check out our elite mastermind, the Iron Council. This is a group of men who are working every single

00:01:57.340 day on becoming that protector and that provider and that presider that I was telling you about.

00:02:01.940 I'm going to give you some more details during the break, but I just want you to know the Iron

00:02:05.660 Council is all about giving you guidance, the tools, the direction, the resources, everything

00:02:10.380 that you need to achieve at high levels. And you can learn more at orderofman.com slash Iron

00:02:15.180 Council. Now I want to introduce you to my guest today. His name is Tim Kennedy, and I'm sure you're

00:02:18.900 already familiar with him and his work. This is a man I've been following for a long time.

00:02:22.400 And someone that I hold in extremely high regard because of the way that this gentleman shows up

00:02:27.360 in the world and how he approaches his life. And not to mention, Tim is arguably one of the

00:02:32.000 baddest men on the planet. This guy is an army green beret. He's a UFC middleweight MMA fighter,

00:02:36.000 and he's one of only a few who fight professionally and also serve in the armed forces simultaneously.

00:02:41.140 So what's great about this show is Tim's approach to being a sheepdog, which if you've been following

00:02:46.740 us for any amount of time, know that being a protector, and I've mentioned this already twice in

00:02:50.840 the show is one of the core tenets of being a man. And I'm not sure that there's anybody out there

00:02:55.540 better than Tim Kennedy to talk with us about this. He's been serving this nation as a warrior for

00:03:00.020 14 years. He's been fighting for 16 years. He's earned a bronze star for valor. But Tim and I get

00:03:05.320 real about his current UFC loss, what his father taught him about being a man and a sheepdog,

00:03:10.280 how he faces his own fear, and the formula for being the man others will at some point rely on us to be.

00:03:15.920 Tim, what's going on, brother? Thanks for joining me on the show today.

00:03:19.820 It is my privilege. Thanks for having me.

00:03:22.020 Yeah, I've been following you for some time. Excited to have this conversation. I know with

00:03:25.420 your fight schedule and things like that, and obviously you're a busy man, we've had a little

00:03:29.000 bit of a difficult time getting together. But today's the day, and excited to talk with you

00:03:33.100 and this whole notion and idea and concept of what it means to be a sheepdog. And I want to ask you

00:03:38.740 first and foremost, just so we can get some context for the conversation today, when you talk about being a

00:03:43.000 sheepdog, what does that mean? What does that look like, and why that term?

00:03:47.700 Yeah, so the term is coined phrase by a beautiful, brilliant author, a friend that has very generously

00:03:56.360 let other people use it, as long as they kind of stay within the theme of what it is. It's this idea

00:04:02.400 that there's three groups of people. There's the sheep, there's the wolves, and then there's the

00:04:08.280 sheepdog. The sheep just live their life, people wanting to do what they do. There's nothing wrong

00:04:12.620 with being a sheep. It's a fantastic thing, your blissful existence. You eat grass, you make little

00:04:18.020 sheep, and you relax in the sun, maybe lay down occasionally in the grass. That's a pretty good

00:04:23.940 way to live. And then you get the wolves. They prey in every way on the sheep, whether that's

00:04:28.980 in real terms, economically, sexually, physically, radical fanatics. There's a lot of different ways

00:04:37.900 that sheep can exist and can hurt the wolves. And then lastly is the sheepdog. And that's the

00:04:45.860 creature that genetically is more similar to the wolf than the sheep. It has canines. It eats meat.

00:04:52.220 That's what, you know, it has instinctually all the predatory desires that the wolf does. The

00:04:58.880 difference is that the sheep trust the sheepdog, and the sheepdog loves the wolf, and it appreciates it,

00:05:05.360 and it protects it most importantly. So when the wolf comes around and wants to take advantage,

00:05:11.800 hurt, kill, eat the sheep, the sheepdog is there to protect. And that kind of little parallel that

00:05:18.880 hopefully is accurate to the people that we train, that what we aspire to be is the sheepdog. You know,

00:05:27.340 it's something that is prepared both physically and mentally to be in a fight with the most vicious

00:05:34.000 creature that wants to hurt what we love. So in human terms, the sheepdog is the first responder.

00:05:40.340 It's the guy that takes care of his family. It's the person that is not going to stand by and watch

00:05:46.340 bad things happen, let evil triumph. You know, it's that, the guy that wears green, you know,

00:05:52.220 the uniform, military, you know, it's the firefighter, it's the ambulance, it's the traffic

00:05:56.920 guard. It's the, sometimes it's the person at the PTA meeting. You know, there's a lot of

00:06:02.100 different ways that you can fill that role and be a productive member that can contribute and take

00:06:07.760 care of the sheep. You know, for me, that's going to be a gun carrying, terrorist killing, poaching,

00:06:14.200 imprisoning, human trafficking, murdering, barrel-chested, freedom-fighting American. That is not

00:06:20.080 necessarily the way it has to be for everybody else. There's lots of sheepdogs out there that

00:06:25.060 never will carry a gun and never want to touch a gun, but they are prepared in a heartbeat to take

00:06:29.600 care of their kids that are ready to take a tourniquet and throw it on somebody's leg or slap

00:06:34.280 an IV into somebody. So we really try to instill both the instinctual desire to be a sheepdog and

00:06:44.960 then how prepared you are to actually act on that once that moment comes where you really need to

00:06:50.660 do something to protect the flock. Right. Is this something that you turn on and off or are you

00:06:55.680 always kind of a sheepdog or a sheep or a wolf? Uh, that's a complicated philosophical question.

00:07:03.340 Even, um, my brother who is a, you know, an EOD narcotics deputy here in California, he and I just

00:07:09.720 had this conversation. I was like, man, you know, cause he's dealing with cartel guys and, and

00:07:14.200 people smuggling stuff into the, into the Valley and trying to get it to the coast up from Mexico and,

00:07:21.520 and the similarities between that dirt bag and the terrorist dirt bag or the gun smuggling dirt bag

00:07:28.400 or the human trapped dirt bag there. Yeah. They're like culturally different, but they're very,

00:07:34.640 very, very similar in how they act and what they do and the nastiness that of evil that exists in

00:07:40.420 their life. So to answer a part of your question, like if you're, if you are a wolf, are you just a

00:07:45.940 wolf? Right. And I think that more often than not is the case. I think sheep can do all sorts of

00:07:53.520 things. You know, they, they, they can transform, you know, like metamorphosis of, of becoming more

00:07:58.840 sheepdog like, or maybe even lose their way and become wolf, you know, and like lead other

00:08:05.020 lambs to the slaughter. But a sheepdog, it's kind of like a, the wizard lodge, right? You pull back the

00:08:11.660 curtain and you see behind the smoke and the mirrors and you see the wizard back there.

00:08:16.320 Right. And it's just, it's this frail old man that's just kind of pulling the strings.

00:08:20.340 Right. And once you see what that wolf really looks like, that's not this big, tough,

00:08:25.040 muscly tattooed prison felon. The image we always have, right?

00:08:31.760 Right. Yeah. It's, it's a slimy coward that is, is too impotent and pathetic to do anything else

00:08:37.500 productive and constructive in their life. And they then resorted to this. You see that and you're 1.00

00:08:42.180 like, no, no, no, I'm not going to let that affect my family. You know, I'm not going to be a victim

00:08:47.040 or something, maybe something bad has happened. And then you, you finally bravely, courageously

00:08:51.780 enough step up and you say, no, no, never again. I'm going to make changes necessary to ensure that

00:08:56.860 my family will never have somebody break into my home again. Right. Will never mug me. Will never

00:09:01.760 carjack me. Will never hurt my wife. Will never scare my kids. And then I think from that

00:09:07.260 point on, you're kind of always, you know, it's not something to turn on or off. You just are

00:09:11.900 a sheepdog. Sure. Yeah. And then you just behave and respond accordingly, depending on the situation 1.00

00:09:16.480 it sounds. Have you always been and considered yourself a sheepdog, even though you may not have

00:09:20.780 used that term when you were younger? Is this something that you've always been, or is this

00:09:24.540 something you've developed personally over, over your lifetime? Man, I was raised this way. My dad

00:09:30.600 was a narcotics officer. I mean, there were times when I was like eight, my brother was 10,

00:09:34.720 would pull into a parking garage. He's like, Oh, Hey, go up one floor. And there's a blue Corvette

00:09:39.280 up there. I need you to get me the license plate and tell me if there's anything inside. You know,

00:09:43.160 this is an eight year old. Yeah. So it was like, this was very normal to me, you know, and we're,

00:09:48.480 we're at the shopping mall and we're in the parking lot and we see a guy hit a girl. And my dad

00:09:55.720 just very calmly unbuckles himself, says, stay in the car, gets out, puts the guy up against the back of

00:10:02.540 the car and puts cuffs on him. So like those are, those are memories that formed kind of who I was

00:10:07.460 as a kid, you know, like prepubescent stuff, like watching my heroic, heroic, brave father do the

00:10:13.600 right thing, understand what justice, what right and wrong is, and not let something ever happen in

00:10:19.600 front of us or him that was unjust and just let it happen. Yeah. And then, and is this where your

00:10:24.860 desire to then join the military came from is, is this desire to fulfill maybe this idea and this

00:10:30.820 vision that you had of your father and how, how he raised you guys? Yeah. You know, it's funny.

00:10:36.320 I hate the term sheepdog. I think it's, it's corny, but it's so accurate that, that, that is what we 1.00

00:10:41.720 use. But yes, um, I knew I wanted to do something, you know, I didn't want to follow my father's

00:10:45.940 footsteps. I went to the police academy, but I, my intent was to be like clearing starling from

00:10:50.500 silence of the lambs. Sure. We had a serial killer in, in San Luis Obispo. And I grew up when I was in

00:10:55.740 college, Rex Krebs, and he killed a handful of girls, half a dozen or more, um, in, in 0.99

00:11:01.440 really horrific, horrendous ways. And that's, you know, that's when I was a freshman, I think

00:11:05.400 freshman or sophomore in college. And that, that, that really drove me to, that's also when

00:11:10.360 like science, the lambs was coming out and I was like, no, no, I'm going to go find people like

00:11:14.040 that. I mean, that is the real embodiment of evil. You know, that, that guy that can, can pray on

00:11:19.600 the weak and the innocent and then take them and hurt them sexually and physically. And finally, 0.94

00:11:24.500 you know, ultimately kill them. Um, and then derive pleasure from that, you know? So I was 1.00

00:11:29.440 like, no, I'm going to find people like that. That's what I wanted to do. Is this what you're

00:11:34.060 talking about now? I, and I'm maybe just jumped into conclusions here is so the reason maybe you

00:11:38.800 didn't join the FBI or go that route is because you wanted to actively pursue this. Am I understand

00:11:43.480 that correctly? No, I was, I was going to school to then go to the FBI. And I was a, I was a second

00:11:49.620 year grad student when nine 11 happened. Okay. And that changed, you know, it's not next to

00:11:55.900 central moment, but it's a, it's a clear perspective of a different kind of evil, of the evil that I

00:12:01.260 think most Americans, uh, were unaware of, you know, like we, we knew about, uh, you know, terrorism.

00:12:07.140 We saw from Gulf storm one, the things that Saddam did, uh, we knew that radical Islam, you know, 0.99

00:12:13.460 but that's way over there in that middle East and the sand area. You know, that's not something

00:12:17.360 that's going to affect us or our lives. Right. Right. It's not, it's not personal. It's not

00:12:21.220 intimate at this point. Yeah. Serial killers though. You know, we, we had Charlie Manson,

00:12:25.640 you know, we, we had Davis and you know, we had, Oh my goodness. Like we really need to take care of

00:12:30.180 this. So that was seen much more real, um, at your doorstep type thing until you watch,

00:12:35.560 watch those towers fall, you know, until you saw Americans jumping out of windows to plummet to their

00:12:40.500 death because their options were burn alive, suffocate or fall. Right. I mean, what must have been

00:12:45.520 going through their mind and actually physically to, to make that decision. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

00:12:50.540 It just made my blood boil. I watched the sec, you know, like most people did. Um, I watched that

00:12:56.080 second building fall live and, uh, seen, you know, the planes crash and into the Pentagon. And then,

00:13:02.800 you know, in the fields where we find out it was just a few Americans on a plane that said, no,

00:13:07.460 I know what's happened to these other planes. It's not going to happen to this one. And it crashes into a,

00:13:11.500 you know, a field, maybe ultimately saving the white house. Right. 0.62

00:13:15.520 So, uh, we, we, we learned a new version of courage. We learned what a new version of a hero

00:13:20.900 could be like. Then we also found a new villain and, uh, one that to this day is probably the most

00:13:26.680 prevalent and perhaps most dangerous. I guess what's the, what is the difference between somebody

00:13:32.300 who looks at an event like this or another event that might be similar and tuck tails and runs versus

00:13:39.160 steps up to the plate and actually does something about it. Like you have.

00:13:42.700 I think everybody has that, uh, that fight flight or freeze thing in them. And it's not something

00:13:50.300 that's always going to be, uh, the same, you know, like I don't, I don't think that somebody

00:13:55.360 that, that freezes in a situation will always freeze. Somebody that runs from a situation will

00:13:59.820 always run or somebody that runs towards gunfire will always run towards gunfire. I definitely,

00:14:05.780 unfortunately, am one of those people that I'm going to always run towards gunfire.

00:14:10.000 There's that, that, that is the only option for me. If I'm a 14 year old kid and I watch

00:14:15.520 somebody push my 12 year old sister, I'm going to end up in the principal's office with bloody 0.92

00:14:19.360 knuckles. Cause that's just how it works. Yeah. How do you, how do you overcome this sense of fear?

00:14:24.500 Cause I'm, I'm going to assume that the fear is still there. It still resides within you. How do

00:14:28.740 you personally overcome it? Everybody has fear. You know, like there, there is no way to get rid of

00:14:34.520 fear. And anybody says, anybody that says that, uh, they're not scared is a liar or a psychopath.

00:14:40.260 Right. Or sociopath. Every, every guy I've ever served with everybody that's ever jumped out of 0.99

00:14:45.180 a plane, anybody that's walked into the octagon to fight anybody that's been shot at, they're scared.

00:14:50.520 You know, they're scared to get hit in the face. They're scared. Their parachute won't open.

00:14:54.200 They're scared that they're going to die, you know, or they're going to be, be permanently

00:14:58.260 dismembered or, you know, they're going to get blown up. For me, it's always knowing that

00:15:02.940 the push is worth is a squeeze, you know, that I'm doing the right thing. And if I die doing the

00:15:08.960 right thing, if I get hurt doing the right thing, that is the best and only way for, for maybe me

00:15:15.240 and in my life to, to exist, to live. Um, I, I can't live with myself by not doing the right thing.

00:15:22.500 So I can either live in regret of letting something bad happen, or I can live with my head held high

00:15:31.480 an example to my children, you know, um, a proud husband to my wife, you know, hopefully a heroic

00:15:37.340 son, my father, you know, and all, all the things that I can be proud of who I am because I never

00:15:43.060 turned a blind eye towards the bad things that have happened or are happening.

00:15:47.900 How do you overcome a moment in your life or a situation in your life where you either have

00:15:53.600 either let yourself down or let others down? And then how do you overcome that and then keep

00:15:58.840 driving forward and start making the right decisions moving forward? You know, I can't

00:16:03.180 count the mistakes I've made, the fights that I've lost, the shots that I've missed, but the,

00:16:09.220 the thing that defines us is our desire and our choice to then improve and get back up.

00:16:16.060 Right. So you fail, you get knocked down, you know, you lose a fight. What do you do after that

00:16:22.320 moment? I think that's really who defines us. You know, are you going to get back up? Are you going

00:16:27.080 to get better and stronger? Are you going to improve? Are you going to shift and go around

00:16:31.400 the problem intelligently? You know, instead of being a hard ranger, be a smart ranger that

00:16:35.500 for me, I think really will then put on display who and what that man is.

00:16:42.720 Yeah. And I mean, this is a perfect example. I mean, I, I watched, watched your last UFC fight

00:16:47.720 and the way that you responded to that was, well, that sucks. And I'm assuming, you know, 0.94

00:16:53.020 not having a necessarily a personal connection with you that you just go back to the drawing

00:16:56.740 board and you just get back to what you need to get back to. And you learn, you adapt from it.

00:17:00.000 How did you handle, how did you handle that last fight?

00:17:03.020 Oh, it was like a horrible fight. You know, I, I did everything wrong that night. I, uh,

00:17:08.320 I had a fight camp that went too long and a body that was broken down a hamstring that tore in the

00:17:14.220 first round and, you know, and then stood there as a punching bag for the next two and a half

00:17:19.380 rounds. And not only do you just go back to the drawing boards, I think you have to take a step

00:17:25.880 back and reevaluate everything that I did. You know, for me, it's, it's me taking a step back

00:17:30.580 and looking, okay, how many different ways did I go wrong here? Was it the choice just to postpone

00:17:35.920 the fight instead of just canceling it in general? You're like, so was, was that a strategic failure on

00:17:40.540 my part? You know, in the training department, what could I have as a 37 year old man been able to

00:17:48.240 add an additional five weeks onto what was already a two and a half month long fight camp, right?

00:17:53.500 Some of those are strategic decisions and some of them are just understanding the assets and

00:17:58.840 liabilities of me as a human, what I'm capable of. Um, ultimately I, obviously I made the wrong

00:18:04.220 decisions. I, I, I shouldn't have extended my fight camp for another five weeks. Maybe I could

00:18:09.440 have done that when I was 25, sure, sure. You know, but not 37. And when you're, when you're

00:18:16.540 actually fighting and you're, it's as if you're looking at yourself from a third person perspective

00:18:21.220 and you're moving like in a nightmare as if you're like moving in slow motion, like you're

00:18:25.540 crawling through mud or water, you know, like why is everything else around me is happening

00:18:29.240 faster? You know, it's almost like what those, what that night was like. So it's clear, you

00:18:34.240 know, crystal clear, um, how many different ways I messed up. And for me, it's just going to

00:18:40.540 be about getting better, you know, whether or not I ever even fight again, you're like, I am

00:18:45.160 going to be better, bigger. I am going to be faster and I'm going to be stronger than I was

00:18:48.640 that night. Men, the new year is finally upon us. I'll be frank with you here, guys. I am not a

00:18:54.020 new year's resolutions guy. I don't need a new year to give me permission to start working on the

00:18:57.300 objectives I've identified in life. The objectives I've already identified. A lot of you are probably

00:19:01.960 the same way. I know the men inside the iron council, our elite mastermind feel the same way as

00:19:07.380 you regardless of how you feel about resolutions, whether you wait until January 1st to start,

00:19:11.220 or you're thinking about them year round. We have got the tools guys inside the iron council to help

00:19:15.940 you succeed and accomplish big things in your life. We're going to help you identify objectives

00:19:20.280 in four key domains of your life. The tactics that are going to ensure you achieve them,

00:19:24.540 the system for tracking to make sure you stay on point and the accountability you need to stay the

00:19:28.980 course. You can learn more at order of man.com slash iron council. All of us inside of the iron

00:19:33.680 council hope to see you there. Now let's get back to my interview with Tim. Yeah. I mean,

00:19:38.880 I love this approach and this actually leads me into one of the discussions that I wanted to have

00:19:43.380 with you today, which is, and I don't know necessarily what you call this, but you talk

00:19:47.460 about these four words, which is awareness assessment, action analysis. And I think what

00:19:52.700 you're talking about now is analysis and maybe we're working backwards into this, but I'd love to

00:19:57.140 talk about this because I think there's a lot of men out there who don't really understand these

00:20:02.600 four components, not just in their daily life, but even if they're facing a threat or in a fight,

00:20:07.240 like you've been, whatever it may be. So I want to talk about each of these areas. Uh,

00:20:11.620 when you talk about awareness, I mean, how does somebody become even more aware? I think a lot

00:20:16.240 of the times we get placed in these boxes, whether we've created the box or society has created it

00:20:20.620 for us. And it's hard for us to become aware of this box. How do you suggest somebody actually do

00:20:25.020 that? Man, the, that first a, the aware. So, you know, those, those, those four A's are like

00:20:31.900 kind of pillar, the tenants of the things that we try to impart on somebody that, that wants to

00:20:36.660 be a better sheepdog. Um, the first is aware. It's not just aware of your surroundings. It's

00:20:41.220 also aware of yourself. You know, like this is like soon zoo art of war stuff. Like know yourself,

00:20:46.540 understand what assets and liabilities you have. You know, let's just be honest about me for a

00:20:50.400 second. Okay. I'm 37. I had knee surgery on my right leg. I have a little bit of bicep tendonitis

00:20:55.080 of my left arm, right? I've been a fighter for 16 years. I've been in special forces for 14 years.

00:21:01.940 I don't know how many airplanes I've jumped out of. I don't know how many gunfights I've been in. I

00:21:05.580 don't know how many deployments I've been on. Um, so what kind of wear and tear do we have on me

00:21:09.980 physically? Let's talk about my brain. Like how many fights have I been on? How many training

00:21:14.340 sessions, sparring sessions? What level of TBI CTE do I have from being blown up? Um, having

00:21:20.220 grenades go off using flash bangs, being in shoot houses, um, breathing in lead. Okay. I don't know,

00:21:25.440 but I really do my best to understand all of those things about myself. Uh, then let's talk about

00:21:29.780 assets. Um, I'm strong. I'm fast, very intelligent, you know, very well educated, multilingual. You know,

00:21:35.420 I've pretty good shots, decent fighter, decent grappler. So like, I, I know a lot about myself.

00:21:41.100 I know what my capabilities are. I know how long I can run flat out. You know, like I know

00:21:44.960 that last night, my, my son has a cough and he didn't sleep for two and a half hours and I was

00:21:50.300 up rocking him. I was walking. I realized that mentally I'm a little bit more diminished today

00:21:54.020 than I was yesterday morning. Right. You know, like, so that is an ongoing assessment of awareness of

00:22:00.400 who you are and how capable you are. And then there's the X that is just in looking at you

00:22:06.000 internally. And then as the external perspective of what biometrically atmospherically is happening

00:22:12.520 around us, where I am, why I'm there, who's around me, should they be there, what they're wearing,

00:22:19.120 how they smell, how they're dressed, um, where their tattoos are, where their track marks on their

00:22:24.560 arm are. If they're packing, how much money they have, where their shoes are, where their car is parked,

00:22:28.680 where I parked, where their exit is. If I'm, if I'm a, if I know where the bathroom is, where's the

00:22:33.440 cook, um, where's the closest weapon, what, you know, like all of that stuff that is just a constant

00:22:38.940 ongoing situational awareness, right? You're just, that is a nonstop forever going leading into the

00:22:47.700 assessment. Before I get into the assessment, Tim, I want to talk with you about like, is this just a

00:22:52.820 matter of practicing when you're out and about, when you're doing your thing, looking around,

00:22:55.980 having this stuff. And then what is it that you actually should be prioritizing to be aware of?

00:23:00.940 Cause you, I'm assuming, and maybe I'm wrong here. So this is going to be enlightening for me

00:23:04.500 that there comes a point when maybe you're bombarded or overwhelmed with too much stuff.

00:23:10.260 Is that even possible? Oh yeah. A hundred percent. It depends on where you are. You kind of have to

00:23:15.000 triage what kind of information, let's just say you're a computer, right? And you're feeding yourself

00:23:19.200 information, how efficient you are at taking that information and putting it and applying it where,

00:23:25.480 to where it needs to go. The more programs you have, the faster memory you have, the more you

00:23:30.180 can do, right? So me as, as a green beret, special forces sniper, a ranger, I can process a lot more

00:23:36.880 information than somebody that's just learning how to do this. And we also, I practice this. I rehearse

00:23:41.600 this. Me and my friends, when we're sitting at lunch, we know, okay, who's sitting where and why

00:23:46.440 they're sitting there, you know, where are we parked, why are we parked there? So some of those things

00:23:50.260 that you do habitually, then you don't have to worry about, can, you can shuffle that to the

00:23:54.800 less important area of your brain and then be in the moment. So yeah, you're aware of yourself,

00:23:59.220 but then you're looking at your surroundings. You know, like if I'm at a restaurant, what kind

00:24:03.860 of restaurant am I at? What area of town am I in? Who should be there? If somebody came in that kind

00:24:09.840 of doesn't fit the stereotype of the people that should be, you know, eating there or should be a

00:24:13.920 patron of there, you know, if they're, they're acting weird, if they're, if there's weird biometrics

00:24:17.840 between them and the rest of the people, then they don't fit the atmosphere except something's

00:24:21.820 off, you know? So then you kind of prioritize where you're in that awareness, where that amount

00:24:28.300 of focus goes and you get better at it. You know, we even sometimes like even my friends like Shane

00:24:33.880 Steiner, we'll be sitting there and at lunch, you know, in Austin, Texas getting tacos, which is

00:24:39.540 a great thing to do. And we make assumptions, you know, we're profiling people, you know, we see

00:24:47.500 somebody come in and, uh, you know, with, with her boyfriend or husband. And then we realized

00:24:51.520 that neither of them are wearing rings. Okay. Going to jump to a possibility that they're not

00:24:56.500 married, the boyfriend, girlfriend, we're going to go off the biometrics of the distance that

00:24:59.900 they're having from each other and the, and the connectivity that they have and how they're

00:25:02.840 interacting and how they're talking. You know, then we see that he didn't hold the door for

00:25:06.300 her, that he didn't hold the chair for her. Now we're going to make another assumption

00:25:08.700 about them. Then we're going to see some tattoos, you know? So like you just get better at it

00:25:13.420 the more that you do it. And the more that you do it, the better at it you get, the more

00:25:18.200 efficient you are at doing it. And the more accurate you are. Um, during the sheepdog

00:25:22.540 course, we take, we take a little walk through some parking lots, you know, whether it's like

00:25:26.340 a Walmart and I say, Hey, you know, like I bet you there's a gun in there. And sometimes

00:25:30.880 I'll like, like, it's been fun. Like while we're walking through the parking lots, like

00:25:34.040 a group of 20 people, cause we break off into a few different groups and we go do different

00:25:38.240 things with different instructors. I've had like people walk out and they're walking to

00:25:42.100 their car. I'm like, Hey man. And I just start talking to him, totally disarm them. You know,

00:25:45.700 as I'm interacting with them, it was like, Oh, so, and ultimately we end up and I find

00:25:49.520 out everything about that person. Interesting. The assumptions that I made about that person

00:25:55.300 just off their vehicle in front of the whole entire class is right. You know, they're like,

00:26:00.380 Oh, this is what you do for a living. This is the area of town that you live in. This is

00:26:04.180 the, you know, this is the, the, the access code to get into your apartment complex. Uh, this

00:26:10.400 is where your kids go to school. This is like all off of their car and that, you know, that's

00:26:15.020 just awareness. And the more you do it, the better you are. Right. Right. It's frightening

00:26:18.880 how good you can get at it. No, it sounds like, it sounds like, like Jason Bourne type

00:26:22.160 stuff, right? Yeah. I mean, they, they obviously Hollywood it up, but the, the, the purpose is

00:26:28.060 just for awareness, right? You're going to know the best escape route. You're going to know

00:26:33.520 the best place to go to, to get sanctuary. You're going to know the best, the, the most

00:26:39.700 worrisome threat in the room. Like these, you're going to know who can handle themselves. You're

00:26:43.160 going to know where to get a gun. You're going to know where to get some drugs. You're going

00:26:45.460 to know, you know, you're going to know what the concerns are. Like these are, these are

00:26:48.340 things that you should know. You know, if you're going to, if you're going to be truly consider

00:26:51.920 yourself a sheepdog, you should probably, uh, at least be able to be aware of your surroundings

00:26:56.220 and aware of yourself.

00:26:57.940 Well, and I, then I think the point of, of being aware of this is then to move into that next

00:27:01.820 step, right? Which is, okay, now I have this information. What do I actually do with it?

00:27:05.080 So talk to me about this assessment area that we're, we're going to address here.

00:27:08.660 So you're not only assessing what you're going to do. So as you're aware that awareness starts

00:27:15.400 focusing on a singularity, uh, uh, one individual thing that then you're assessing, right? So we

00:27:24.020 call that threat assessment, threat assessment, right? So what I'm aware of everything, that's

00:27:27.840 just a common normal state of being, right? That's the homeostasis. That's, that's like

00:27:32.540 how things always are. And then when something comes in that doesn't fit, that concerns me,

00:27:39.680 my focus goes from being aware and it starts leaving things that are less important, you know,

00:27:45.640 like the cook and what he was talking about in Spanish in the kitchen, which ironically was

00:27:49.920 where they're going to, you know, buy their marijuana at to the more important thing is this

00:27:54.580 thing that just walked into the room. Right. And so now my assessment is I'm looking at that

00:27:59.720 person as a threat. I'm assessing that person as a threat. And then the assessment is what I'm going

00:28:05.240 to do is what is the best course of action. If he does this, am I going to do this? Or am I even,

00:28:11.060 am I going to even wait and let him dictate anything? Or I'm just going to take the initiative and,

00:28:15.420 you know, get the drop on him and stand up and start moving as if I'm leaving, getting behind him.

00:28:19.600 So if he does walk up to the counter, pull a gun and try to rob him, I'm ready to, you know, 0.88

00:28:24.000 come up from a six and put them on the ground. So at this point, you're really just running

00:28:28.020 through scenarios. Like what would happen if this, what would I do? If this, if this were to escalate

00:28:32.640 or move here, how would I handle myself and respond to that situation? Am I understanding

00:28:36.000 this correctly? Yeah, that, that, yeah, that's a part of it. You know, the, in the assessment,

00:28:40.380 the threat assessment of an individual, and then back to you internally, what am I going to do?

00:28:46.440 What, what, what, what is my course in that action? You know, we'll sometimes, uh, we, you know,

00:28:50.520 we talk about a decision-making process. This, you know, like MDMP is, is a military decision-making

00:28:56.580 process, uh, which has a lot of great things. You know, you kind of create this mental matrix of

00:29:00.740 if I not, not if the, if game of, if I do that, then this will happen. But like more of violence is

00:29:08.100 action and violence of action. Let's figure out what is the best course of action, the most likely

00:29:14.820 course of action and the worst course of action. All right. Yeah. And, and then kind of being

00:29:21.260 prepared. So what is the most likely thing that's going to happen? What is the best outcome of that?

00:29:25.920 Or what is the worst outcome of that? And then understanding what the worst course of action

00:29:30.080 is. Well then maybe change what I'm going to do in the most likely course of action or the best

00:29:35.440 course of action. This almost sounds like really similar to the, uh, the OODA loop. Is that right?

00:29:40.380 Like observe, orient, decide, act. Is that what we're looking at here? Absolutely. Yeah. This

00:29:45.640 makes sense. And then, okay. So now you've, you've been aware, you've assessed the situation. You kind

00:29:50.100 of know what's going on and think you have an idea. How do you get off of the fence? Because I think we

00:29:55.700 all understand what act means, but I think there's a lot of people who would say, Oh, I just hope this

00:29:59.140 passes me by, or maybe I'll just plead ignorance or I'll close my eyes and everything will go away.

00:30:03.200 You know, I like, I watch my, my three-year-old daughter and she'll cover her eyes and think because she

00:30:07.500 covers her eyes, the thing's going to go away. And obviously it doesn't. How do you then, you know,

00:30:11.740 get the balls, I guess, for lack of better term to now take action and do something about this? 0.90

00:30:16.300 Uh, being prepared and being trained period. That's it. There's not, there's not like this 0.99

00:30:21.100 Freudian brilliant jump to, you need to do this, or you need to mentally prepare in this.

00:30:26.960 You train for that moment. You train with calloused hands, you know, sweating your eyes,

00:30:33.280 sand in your ass, you know, hurting, bleeding pain. So that when that moment comes, 0.99

00:30:38.780 you're perfectly prepared for that moment. And this is where your, your, your phrase,

00:30:44.320 which I love by the way, is that you become the hardest person somebody ever tries to kill, right?

00:30:50.320 Absolutely. You know, when you are the hardest person somebody ever tries to kill,

00:30:53.220 it doesn't matter what's going to happen, right? You're prepared for it. Not that you're,

00:30:57.040 you're hoping that it happens. Uh, even though sometimes I'm just like, come on, man, just,

00:31:01.180 just give it a whirl, you know, like, just give it a try. Cause it would make me really happy.

00:31:05.580 Cause I'm totally prepared and you're not, right. Um, there's a degree of that pride,

00:31:12.680 self-confidence that gives you a founded courage that is rooted in the training, right? The cornerstone

00:31:22.560 of everything that you've done, um, from the awareness to the assessment is because you've trained.

00:31:26.760 And, and, and so when that moment to take action finally comes, you're 100% mentally and physically

00:31:33.740 ready. Yeah. I mean, I'd love that you're talking about this because one of the questions I get all

00:31:38.100 the time, every single day without fail is how do I build more confidence? And I think you're

00:31:42.340 answering the question right now, which is you train, you prepare, you do the thing that you're

00:31:46.440 not confident about that way. When the situation really matters, you have the ability, the desire,

00:31:52.280 the courage to move forward, even though you might still be facing that fear.

00:31:57.220 Yeah, man, a hundred percent. Yeah. The, uh, and that goes to everything. You're like the dad bods,

00:32:03.280 you know, the, the, the body's kind of 14, 18, 20% body fat guys, you know, that have gotten lazy and

00:32:09.680 just let themselves go. And then they end up to the beach with their kids and they're leaving their

00:32:13.160 t-shirts on. Okay. I don't care what I look like. Um, but there's a degree of confidence with me

00:32:18.840 because I train so hard all the time. Like I don't care. And I'm, I'm just there for my kids

00:32:23.660 to have a good time. Like yeah, shirts coming off. I'm going to be throwing sand. I'm going to be

00:32:26.620 throwing a football. I'm going to be jumping in the water. And I never, never even think about

00:32:30.660 anything, any degree of self-consciousness. And that is like the most ethnocentric, narcissistic 0.75

00:32:36.580 version of confidence. Right. And then going all the way up to, I'm about to get in a gunfight

00:32:41.140 with a guy that's about to rob someplace that me and my family are eating at. And I don't have a

00:32:45.460 care or concern or worry because I know I'm totally prepared and I have the confidence

00:32:50.900 that I'm going to do the right thing. So, I mean, that's a huge spectrum and that's a,

00:32:54.820 that's, that is the diversity, the, the space, the void between those two things is vast,

00:32:59.800 but ultimately it comes down to self-confidence. And the thing that gives you that is training

00:33:06.220 and being prepared. Well, and I think from the outside looking in, I mean, obviously you've got a

00:33:10.800 lot of this, right. But I see it as, okay, Tim's actually adopted this as a lifestyle. Like you're

00:33:16.180 not going to train for 30 days or 90 days for a fight. Like you're always ready to some degree

00:33:20.940 for that fight. You're always ready. You're always prepared. You're always training. Uh, and it's not

00:33:25.860 just, Hey, let's do a quick 30 day or 60 day, whatever, so that we can go on the cruise or get

00:33:31.620 into this fight or whatever it may be. No. Yeah. This is a lifestyle. It's, it's a, it's a fulfilling,

00:33:36.880 wonderful lifestyle. It's one that when you understand what hard work is, what individual

00:33:42.700 responsibility means, um, the reward of, of calloused hands and sweat in your eyes and that

00:33:49.040 the benefits to your family, both financially and physically is tenfold, you know, like that,

00:33:54.900 that the reward on the far side of work is so much more satisfying than anything else you could

00:34:00.100 ever get. It is, it is permanently a lifestyle change. You know, like you, this, this is who you

00:34:06.100 are and that is who you always will be. Let's talk about this last, uh, this last step, which

00:34:11.140 is the analysis. I think this is what a lot of people miss. Cause I think there is a lot of people

00:34:15.400 who would just take even blind action without being prepared or being aware or even assessing a

00:34:20.000 situation. But one of the things that I think very few men actually do is now go back, whether it's a

00:34:25.620 situation or their day or an experience and actually analyze what happened, what didn't happen,

00:34:31.420 how do I improve? So talk to me about what this looks like for you. Yeah. The analysis is massive.

00:34:36.100 It's, it is, how do you get better? Right. You know, we, we started the conversation with like,

00:34:41.120 sometimes that is even who defines what, what, what a human is, what a man is, is what is you,

00:34:47.780 what do you do after you've been knocked down? What do you do after you've failed? You know,

00:34:51.920 if you, if you look at the greats from the tech giants to the actors or even the medal of honor

00:34:58.940 recipients, what you see reoccurring in all of them is there was failure after failure after failure.

00:35:05.460 You know, there was Babe Ruth striking out, you know, hundreds of times, you know, and then of

00:35:10.980 course hitting hundreds of home runs. Right. Like that, that, that is the thing that, that most

00:35:16.340 commonly defines who they are is the fact that they went back and tried and that even when they failed,

00:35:22.620 they took a step back and they analyzed what they did wrong and they came back better in the

00:35:28.020 hall of fields. I don't want to use, you know, fighting as example, but even us after 9-11, after

00:35:34.480 Pearl Harbor, you know, leading the Stalingrad, like we, we knew what we did wrong in, in battles. And we

00:35:41.240 said, hell no, not going to happen again. This is how I'm going to get better. And it's a con, you know,

00:35:45.940 like the, from infantrymen's perspective, like the first thing they show you is always improve your

00:35:51.400 fighting position. Well, your body is your fighting position. You know, then your home is

00:35:56.700 your fighting position. And then your property is your fighting position, your property, your place

00:36:01.340 of work, your car. And that just keeps expanding. And how do you continually improve that? You know,

00:36:06.420 first it's, it's you as a person, how do you improve that? And that analysis thing is every

00:36:10.380 time that you do something right, how, what did I do right? So I can sustain it. And then looking for

00:36:15.760 improves. Okay. What did I do wrong so I can do it better? And that is always, always happening.

00:36:21.400 Right. We talk about this all the time is, and the term we use is the after action review,

00:36:25.120 which is obviously a military term as well. So yeah, I mean, I'm completely on board with what

00:36:29.480 you're saying. This makes a ton of sense right here. If you don't do it, you know, then you are

00:36:33.120 like, what is the definition of insanity? You know, it's, it's doing the same thing,

00:36:37.740 hoping for a different result, right? Why would you ever do the same thing? Especially when that thing

00:36:43.260 that you just did was failure. Why don't you step back and analyze yourself or your actions or your

00:36:50.280 assessment or your awareness and say, man, this is what I should have done. Or this is what I'm

00:36:55.680 going to do to be more prepared for that moment. Well, Tim, obviously we're, we're scratching the

00:37:00.200 surface on some of this stuff. And I want to give you an opportunity to talk about some of the things

00:37:04.020 that you're doing, because I think the guys listening to this are going to want to know about

00:37:06.660 this. And obviously we're going to be able to get deeper into this and some of the training that

00:37:09.660 you're doing. Talk to me a little bit about some of maybe that I know you've got some

00:37:14.000 sheepdog response training coming up. Talk to me about when that is. So we just can let the guys

00:37:18.020 know and make that available for them. For first responders, military law enforcement,

00:37:22.700 firefighter, paramedics, we do a military first responder law enforcement only class once a month.

00:37:28.900 And then we do a civilian, an open to civilian course once a quarter. The next one that we're

00:37:34.880 doing is going to be at the end of January. It's going to be in Houston, Texas. Beautiful range,

00:37:39.100 fantastic gym. We have some of the best instructors, not some of, we have the best instructors in the

00:37:44.580 world that are going to be there. If you go to our website, sheepdogresponse.com, start reading

00:37:49.460 the bios of the people that teach at this course, you know, from grandmaster shooters, IPSC IDPA guys

00:37:54.940 to doctors that specialize in emergency medicine that were former special forces guys, green berets that

00:38:00.840 then went to medical school during 9-11, then went to JSOC and then came back. Like those are the

00:38:04.840 people that teach for us. Black belts in this, world champions in that. These are the people

00:38:10.520 that are humbly putting themselves out there to create more sheepdogs because they believe in this

00:38:16.000 idea. So end of January, if you go to our Facebook page, Sheepdog Response, you can reserve your slot.

00:38:22.520 The next one is going to be in the Washington DC area, and that will be in March. And then law

00:38:27.940 enforcement, military ones, you can just go to the Facebook page or the website and look at different

00:38:33.020 dates for where we're having the ones for law enforcement, military only.

00:38:37.980 Right on. Yeah. And we'll make sure as, as we make this available, that all the guys have the

00:38:41.860 links on the show notes so they can check all this out and get registered if that's what they want to

00:38:45.000 do. Tim, I've got to ask you a question as we wind down. And that question I did prep you a little

00:38:49.720 bit for, and I think you've answered this question, but I want to make sure we wrap this up this way is

00:38:53.920 what does it mean to be a man?

00:38:55.700 It's different for a lot of different men. For me, it's what are you going to do when you fail?

00:39:00.240 What are you going to do to improve who you are and what you did? How are you going to improve to

00:39:06.680 provide for your family, to be a productive contributing member of society? Those are the,

00:39:12.480 what are you going to do? How are you going to get back up? That's what defines a man.

00:39:17.340 Yeah. Powerful stuff. And obviously something that you've been able to do, and I've seen you

00:39:20.960 and some of the things that you're doing, and I appreciate that of you watching you as somebody who I

00:39:26.320 look up to, you know, and want to emulate some of the things that you're doing. So

00:39:30.240 I appreciate that. I appreciate that response. Also, you've got a couple other things I wanted

00:39:34.060 to mention. You've got the season finale, right? Of Hunting Hitler. We want to talk about that real 0.86

00:39:38.540 quick. And then the, make sure you mention also the Sheepdog Survival Fund, because I think there's

00:39:43.140 some guys listening that are going to be interested in knowing more about what that is.

00:39:45.800 Uh, so it's coming Tuesday, January 3rd, we have, uh, the season finale of season two of

00:39:52.540 Hunting Hitler. Back to the Sheepdog thing, uh, not letting evil just exist. A bunch of nasty Nazis 0.61

00:39:59.540 escaped the war, you know, dudes that did horrific, horrendous, horrible, unimaginable things, 0.96

00:40:05.500 you know, escaped South America. And we tracked those dudes down and we go in the last episode to

00:40:11.640 a place called Colonia Dignidad. Google it. It'll scare, it'll scare you dead. Don't Google it before

00:40:17.700 you go to bed. It is frightening. Really? Okay. And it's current day. It's real, it's real world

00:40:22.720 happening still today. Powerful Nazis worth hundreds of millions of dollars. And the season finale is next

00:40:29.660 Tuesday on History Channel. It's pretty cool. The Sheepdog Survival Fund. So the Sheepdog Response, 0.54

00:40:36.200 those are the courses that we teach. While we've been teaching those, we have found there's a void.

00:40:41.140 There's, there's, uh, there's soldiers, law enforcement officers, deputies that don't have

00:40:46.200 the training and don't have the equipment that they need to do the job. You know, we have guys

00:40:50.200 showed up our course, you know, it's a mid range, mid distance carbine course, and they're trying to

00:40:56.320 shoot with iron sights because it's the only thing that a department could afford. And that limits them

00:41:02.020 to 300 meters. Like, you know, like we said, mid distance, this is a, to me, that's like four or 500

00:41:08.260 meters. You can't even see that far. Right. You know, guys that didn't even have tourniquets that

00:41:12.420 didn't even know how to put on a tourniquet. So we give those guys, whether it's a scholarship to

00:41:18.140 attend one of our courses, or we just buy that department, the equipment that they need, you know,

00:41:23.440 every single cent goes towards doing that. You know, we have nobody in the fund, in the nonprofit

00:41:29.660 that gets paid. Nobody's writing checks to fly anywhere. Every cent goes to helping military

00:41:37.080 law enforcement first responders. Yeah. Well, we'll make sure all of that stuff gets linked up.

00:41:41.620 So the guys can go check that out. Tim, I've got to tell you, man, I appreciate you. I appreciate

00:41:44.700 you coming on the show and imparting some of your wisdom. Also, I appreciate your, your service and

00:41:48.920 how you show up. Obviously I've, I've followed you and watch what you do and try to live my life in

00:41:54.880 some of the same manner that you do as well. And so I want to thank you again for coming on the show

00:41:58.340 and sharing what you have to share with us today. It was my privilege. Thank you for taking the time

00:42:02.740 to talk to me, Ryan. Appreciate it. There it is, man. Mr. Tim Kennedy, sharing some of what it takes

00:42:07.760 to be a sheepdog, something again, we should all be striving to be more of in our lives. Obviously

00:42:12.020 we're just scratching the surface. So I do encourage you to check out what Tim is up to. Again, I just

00:42:16.300 want to remind you about the iron council. This is our elite mastermind designed to get you to the next

00:42:19.960 level in your relationships, your finance, your health, your fitness, your life. So join us now,

00:42:25.840 get the tools, the resources, the skills, the accountability you need to make the changes

00:42:30.200 you want to make this year. You can learn more and sign up at order of man.com slash iron council.

00:42:35.020 I'm going to look forward to talking with you on Friday for our Friday field notes, but until then

00:42:38.240 take action and become the man you were meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order of man

00:42:42.760 podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

00:42:47.520 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

00:42:55.840 Thank you.

00:43:01.700 Thank you.

00:43:03.900 Thank you.

Order of Man - January 03, 2017

094： Tim Kennedy ｜ Becoming the Sheepdog

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