094： Tim Kennedy ｜ Becoming the Sheepdog
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Summary
In this episode, Army Green Beret and UFC middleweight fighter Tim Kennedy talks with us about how to overcome fear, how to get up and learn from losses, and how to become the "Sheepdog" in life.
Transcript
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There are three types of people in this world. The wolf, the sheep, and the sheepdog. The wolf is
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violent, the sheep is passive, and the sheepdog is there to protect one from the other. My guest
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today, Army Green Beret and UFC-ranked middleweight fighter Tim Kennedy, talks with us about how to
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overcome fear, how to get up and learn from losses, how to recognize strengths and weaknesses,
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and how to become the sheepdog. You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace
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your fears and boldly chart your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more
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time. Every time, you are not easily deterred, defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is
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your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all
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is said and done, you can call yourself a man. Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is
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Ryan Michler, and I am the host and the founder of Order of Man. Now, whether you've been listening
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to us since the beginning, or you've just stumbled across us, you guys are listening to the manliest
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show available. We're all about teaching you how to become a better man, a better protector,
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better provider, and a better presider, a leader over yourself, your family, your business,
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your community, every area of life that is important to you. So each and every week, we
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bring you the world's smartest, the toughest, the successful, the most talented men on the
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planet. We extract their hard-fought wisdom, and then we share it with you guys. And of course,
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today's show is no different. We've got an Army Green Beret, UFC-ranked middleweight fighter
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Tim Kennedy on the show, and we're talking about becoming the sheepdog. Guys, I can say that
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this is probably, if not, the best show to date. So before I introduce you to him and get into the
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show, I do want to let you know that you can get the show notes for this show at orderofman.com
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slash 094. And then also make sure if you have not done this already, that you join our Facebook
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group. I think we're almost at 15,000 men now, and we are having some great discussions about what it
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means to be a man and how you can be a better one. So you can do that at facebook.com slash groups
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slash orderofman. And third, and this is the big one. If you haven't already done so,
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check out our elite mastermind, the Iron Council. This is a group of men who are working every single
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day on becoming that protector and that provider and that presider that I was telling you about.
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I'm going to give you some more details during the break, but I just want you to know the Iron
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Council is all about giving you guidance, the tools, the direction, the resources, everything
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that you need to achieve at high levels. And you can learn more at orderofman.com slash Iron
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Council. Now I want to introduce you to my guest today. His name is Tim Kennedy, and I'm sure you're
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already familiar with him and his work. This is a man I've been following for a long time.
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And someone that I hold in extremely high regard because of the way that this gentleman shows up
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in the world and how he approaches his life. And not to mention, Tim is arguably one of the
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baddest men on the planet. This guy is an army green beret. He's a UFC middleweight MMA fighter,
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and he's one of only a few who fight professionally and also serve in the armed forces simultaneously.
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So what's great about this show is Tim's approach to being a sheepdog, which if you've been following
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us for any amount of time, know that being a protector, and I've mentioned this already twice in
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the show is one of the core tenets of being a man. And I'm not sure that there's anybody out there
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better than Tim Kennedy to talk with us about this. He's been serving this nation as a warrior for
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14 years. He's been fighting for 16 years. He's earned a bronze star for valor. But Tim and I get
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real about his current UFC loss, what his father taught him about being a man and a sheepdog,
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how he faces his own fear, and the formula for being the man others will at some point rely on us to be.
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Tim, what's going on, brother? Thanks for joining me on the show today.
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Yeah, I've been following you for some time. Excited to have this conversation. I know with
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your fight schedule and things like that, and obviously you're a busy man, we've had a little
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bit of a difficult time getting together. But today's the day, and excited to talk with you
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and this whole notion and idea and concept of what it means to be a sheepdog. And I want to ask you
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first and foremost, just so we can get some context for the conversation today, when you talk about being a
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sheepdog, what does that mean? What does that look like, and why that term?
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Yeah, so the term is coined phrase by a beautiful, brilliant author, a friend that has very generously
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let other people use it, as long as they kind of stay within the theme of what it is. It's this idea
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that there's three groups of people. There's the sheep, there's the wolves, and then there's the
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sheepdog. The sheep just live their life, people wanting to do what they do. There's nothing wrong
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with being a sheep. It's a fantastic thing, your blissful existence. You eat grass, you make little
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sheep, and you relax in the sun, maybe lay down occasionally in the grass. That's a pretty good
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way to live. And then you get the wolves. They prey in every way on the sheep, whether that's
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in real terms, economically, sexually, physically, radical fanatics. There's a lot of different ways
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that sheep can exist and can hurt the wolves. And then lastly is the sheepdog. And that's the
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creature that genetically is more similar to the wolf than the sheep. It has canines. It eats meat.
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That's what, you know, it has instinctually all the predatory desires that the wolf does. The
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difference is that the sheep trust the sheepdog, and the sheepdog loves the wolf, and it appreciates it,
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and it protects it most importantly. So when the wolf comes around and wants to take advantage,
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hurt, kill, eat the sheep, the sheepdog is there to protect. And that kind of little parallel that
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hopefully is accurate to the people that we train, that what we aspire to be is the sheepdog. You know,
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it's something that is prepared both physically and mentally to be in a fight with the most vicious
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creature that wants to hurt what we love. So in human terms, the sheepdog is the first responder.
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It's the guy that takes care of his family. It's the person that is not going to stand by and watch
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bad things happen, let evil triumph. You know, it's that, the guy that wears green, you know,
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the uniform, military, you know, it's the firefighter, it's the ambulance, it's the traffic
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guard. It's the, sometimes it's the person at the PTA meeting. You know, there's a lot of
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different ways that you can fill that role and be a productive member that can contribute and take
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care of the sheep. You know, for me, that's going to be a gun carrying, terrorist killing, poaching,
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imprisoning, human trafficking, murdering, barrel-chested, freedom-fighting American. That is not
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necessarily the way it has to be for everybody else. There's lots of sheepdogs out there that
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never will carry a gun and never want to touch a gun, but they are prepared in a heartbeat to take
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care of their kids that are ready to take a tourniquet and throw it on somebody's leg or slap
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an IV into somebody. So we really try to instill both the instinctual desire to be a sheepdog and
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then how prepared you are to actually act on that once that moment comes where you really need to
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do something to protect the flock. Right. Is this something that you turn on and off or are you
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always kind of a sheepdog or a sheep or a wolf? Uh, that's a complicated philosophical question.
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Even, um, my brother who is a, you know, an EOD narcotics deputy here in California, he and I just
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had this conversation. I was like, man, you know, cause he's dealing with cartel guys and, and
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people smuggling stuff into the, into the Valley and trying to get it to the coast up from Mexico and,
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and the similarities between that dirt bag and the terrorist dirt bag or the gun smuggling dirt bag
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or the human trapped dirt bag there. Yeah. They're like culturally different, but they're very,
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very, very similar in how they act and what they do and the nastiness that of evil that exists in
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their life. So to answer a part of your question, like if you're, if you are a wolf, are you just a
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wolf? Right. And I think that more often than not is the case. I think sheep can do all sorts of
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things. You know, they, they, they can transform, you know, like metamorphosis of, of becoming more
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sheepdog like, or maybe even lose their way and become wolf, you know, and like lead other
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lambs to the slaughter. But a sheepdog, it's kind of like a, the wizard lodge, right? You pull back the
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curtain and you see behind the smoke and the mirrors and you see the wizard back there.
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Right. And it's just, it's this frail old man that's just kind of pulling the strings.
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Right. And once you see what that wolf really looks like, that's not this big, tough,
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muscly tattooed prison felon. The image we always have, right?
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Right. Yeah. It's, it's a slimy coward that is, is too impotent and pathetic to do anything else
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productive and constructive in their life. And they then resorted to this. You see that and you're
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like, no, no, no, I'm not going to let that affect my family. You know, I'm not going to be a victim
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or something, maybe something bad has happened. And then you, you finally bravely, courageously
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enough step up and you say, no, no, never again. I'm going to make changes necessary to ensure that
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my family will never have somebody break into my home again. Right. Will never mug me. Will never
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carjack me. Will never hurt my wife. Will never scare my kids. And then I think from that
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point on, you're kind of always, you know, it's not something to turn on or off. You just are
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a sheepdog. Sure. Yeah. And then you just behave and respond accordingly, depending on the situation
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it sounds. Have you always been and considered yourself a sheepdog, even though you may not have
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used that term when you were younger? Is this something that you've always been, or is this
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something you've developed personally over, over your lifetime? Man, I was raised this way. My dad
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was a narcotics officer. I mean, there were times when I was like eight, my brother was 10,
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would pull into a parking garage. He's like, Oh, Hey, go up one floor. And there's a blue Corvette
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up there. I need you to get me the license plate and tell me if there's anything inside. You know,
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this is an eight year old. Yeah. So it was like, this was very normal to me, you know, and we're,
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we're at the shopping mall and we're in the parking lot and we see a guy hit a girl. And my dad
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just very calmly unbuckles himself, says, stay in the car, gets out, puts the guy up against the back of
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the car and puts cuffs on him. So like those are, those are memories that formed kind of who I was
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as a kid, you know, like prepubescent stuff, like watching my heroic, heroic, brave father do the
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right thing, understand what justice, what right and wrong is, and not let something ever happen in
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front of us or him that was unjust and just let it happen. Yeah. And then, and is this where your
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desire to then join the military came from is, is this desire to fulfill maybe this idea and this
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vision that you had of your father and how, how he raised you guys? Yeah. You know, it's funny.
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I hate the term sheepdog. I think it's, it's corny, but it's so accurate that, that, that is what we
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use. But yes, um, I knew I wanted to do something, you know, I didn't want to follow my father's
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footsteps. I went to the police academy, but I, my intent was to be like clearing starling from
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silence of the lambs. Sure. We had a serial killer in, in San Luis Obispo. And I grew up when I was in
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college, Rex Krebs, and he killed a handful of girls, half a dozen or more, um, in, in
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really horrific, horrendous ways. And that's, you know, that's when I was a freshman, I think
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freshman or sophomore in college. And that, that, that really drove me to, that's also when
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like science, the lambs was coming out and I was like, no, no, I'm going to go find people like
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that. I mean, that is the real embodiment of evil. You know, that, that guy that can, can pray on
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the weak and the innocent and then take them and hurt them sexually and physically. And finally,
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you know, ultimately kill them. Um, and then derive pleasure from that, you know? So I was
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like, no, I'm going to find people like that. That's what I wanted to do. Is this what you're
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talking about now? I, and I'm maybe just jumped into conclusions here is so the reason maybe you
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didn't join the FBI or go that route is because you wanted to actively pursue this. Am I understand
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that correctly? No, I was, I was going to school to then go to the FBI. And I was a, I was a second
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year grad student when nine 11 happened. Okay. And that changed, you know, it's not next to
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central moment, but it's a, it's a clear perspective of a different kind of evil, of the evil that I
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think most Americans, uh, were unaware of, you know, like we, we knew about, uh, you know, terrorism.
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We saw from Gulf storm one, the things that Saddam did, uh, we knew that radical Islam, you know,
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but that's way over there in that middle East and the sand area. You know, that's not something
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that's going to affect us or our lives. Right. Right. It's not, it's not personal. It's not
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intimate at this point. Yeah. Serial killers though. You know, we, we had Charlie Manson,
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you know, we, we had Davis and you know, we had, Oh my goodness. Like we really need to take care of
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this. So that was seen much more real, um, at your doorstep type thing until you watch,
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watch those towers fall, you know, until you saw Americans jumping out of windows to plummet to their
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death because their options were burn alive, suffocate or fall. Right. I mean, what must have been
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going through their mind and actually physically to, to make that decision. Right. Yeah. Yeah.
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It just made my blood boil. I watched the sec, you know, like most people did. Um, I watched that
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second building fall live and, uh, seen, you know, the planes crash and into the Pentagon. And then,
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you know, in the fields where we find out it was just a few Americans on a plane that said, no,
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I know what's happened to these other planes. It's not going to happen to this one. And it crashes into a,
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you know, a field, maybe ultimately saving the white house. Right.
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So, uh, we, we, we learned a new version of courage. We learned what a new version of a hero
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could be like. Then we also found a new villain and, uh, one that to this day is probably the most
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prevalent and perhaps most dangerous. I guess what's the, what is the difference between somebody
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who looks at an event like this or another event that might be similar and tuck tails and runs versus
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steps up to the plate and actually does something about it. Like you have.
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I think everybody has that, uh, that fight flight or freeze thing in them. And it's not something
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that's always going to be, uh, the same, you know, like I don't, I don't think that somebody
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that, that freezes in a situation will always freeze. Somebody that runs from a situation will
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always run or somebody that runs towards gunfire will always run towards gunfire. I definitely,
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unfortunately, am one of those people that I'm going to always run towards gunfire.
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There's that, that, that is the only option for me. If I'm a 14 year old kid and I watch
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somebody push my 12 year old sister, I'm going to end up in the principal's office with bloody
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knuckles. Cause that's just how it works. Yeah. How do you, how do you overcome this sense of fear?
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Cause I'm, I'm going to assume that the fear is still there. It still resides within you. How do
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you personally overcome it? Everybody has fear. You know, like there, there is no way to get rid of
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fear. And anybody says, anybody that says that, uh, they're not scared is a liar or a psychopath.
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Right. Or sociopath. Every, every guy I've ever served with everybody that's ever jumped out of
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a plane, anybody that's walked into the octagon to fight anybody that's been shot at, they're scared.
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You know, they're scared to get hit in the face. They're scared. Their parachute won't open.
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They're scared that they're going to die, you know, or they're going to be, be permanently
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dismembered or, you know, they're going to get blown up. For me, it's always knowing that
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the push is worth is a squeeze, you know, that I'm doing the right thing. And if I die doing the
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right thing, if I get hurt doing the right thing, that is the best and only way for, for maybe me
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and in my life to, to exist, to live. Um, I, I can't live with myself by not doing the right thing.
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So I can either live in regret of letting something bad happen, or I can live with my head held high
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an example to my children, you know, um, a proud husband to my wife, you know, hopefully a heroic
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son, my father, you know, and all, all the things that I can be proud of who I am because I never
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turned a blind eye towards the bad things that have happened or are happening.
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How do you overcome a moment in your life or a situation in your life where you either have
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either let yourself down or let others down? And then how do you overcome that and then keep
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driving forward and start making the right decisions moving forward? You know, I can't
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count the mistakes I've made, the fights that I've lost, the shots that I've missed, but the,
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the thing that defines us is our desire and our choice to then improve and get back up.
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Right. So you fail, you get knocked down, you know, you lose a fight. What do you do after that
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moment? I think that's really who defines us. You know, are you going to get back up? Are you going
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to get better and stronger? Are you going to improve? Are you going to shift and go around
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the problem intelligently? You know, instead of being a hard ranger, be a smart ranger that
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for me, I think really will then put on display who and what that man is.
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Yeah. And I mean, this is a perfect example. I mean, I, I watched, watched your last UFC fight
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and the way that you responded to that was, well, that sucks. And I'm assuming, you know,
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not having a necessarily a personal connection with you that you just go back to the drawing
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board and you just get back to what you need to get back to. And you learn, you adapt from it.
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How did you handle, how did you handle that last fight?
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Oh, it was like a horrible fight. You know, I, I did everything wrong that night. I, uh,
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I had a fight camp that went too long and a body that was broken down a hamstring that tore in the
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first round and, you know, and then stood there as a punching bag for the next two and a half
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rounds. And not only do you just go back to the drawing boards, I think you have to take a step
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back and reevaluate everything that I did. You know, for me, it's, it's me taking a step back
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and looking, okay, how many different ways did I go wrong here? Was it the choice just to postpone
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the fight instead of just canceling it in general? You're like, so was, was that a strategic failure on
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my part? You know, in the training department, what could I have as a 37 year old man been able to
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add an additional five weeks onto what was already a two and a half month long fight camp, right?
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Some of those are strategic decisions and some of them are just understanding the assets and
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liabilities of me as a human, what I'm capable of. Um, ultimately I, obviously I made the wrong
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decisions. I, I, I shouldn't have extended my fight camp for another five weeks. Maybe I could
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have done that when I was 25, sure, sure. You know, but not 37. And when you're, when you're
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actually fighting and you're, it's as if you're looking at yourself from a third person perspective
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and you're moving like in a nightmare as if you're like moving in slow motion, like you're
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crawling through mud or water, you know, like why is everything else around me is happening
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faster? You know, it's almost like what those, what that night was like. So it's clear, you
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know, crystal clear, um, how many different ways I messed up. And for me, it's just going to
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be about getting better, you know, whether or not I ever even fight again, you're like, I am
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going to be better, bigger. I am going to be faster and I'm going to be stronger than I was
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that night. Men, the new year is finally upon us. I'll be frank with you here, guys. I am not a
00:18:54.020
new year's resolutions guy. I don't need a new year to give me permission to start working on the
00:18:57.300
objectives I've identified in life. The objectives I've already identified. A lot of you are probably
00:19:01.960
the same way. I know the men inside the iron council, our elite mastermind feel the same way as
00:19:07.380
you regardless of how you feel about resolutions, whether you wait until January 1st to start,
00:19:11.220
or you're thinking about them year round. We have got the tools guys inside the iron council to help
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you succeed and accomplish big things in your life. We're going to help you identify objectives
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in four key domains of your life. The tactics that are going to ensure you achieve them,
00:19:24.540
the system for tracking to make sure you stay on point and the accountability you need to stay the
00:19:28.980
course. You can learn more at order of man.com slash iron council. All of us inside of the iron
00:19:33.680
council hope to see you there. Now let's get back to my interview with Tim. Yeah. I mean,
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I love this approach and this actually leads me into one of the discussions that I wanted to have
00:19:43.380
with you today, which is, and I don't know necessarily what you call this, but you talk
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about these four words, which is awareness assessment, action analysis. And I think what
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you're talking about now is analysis and maybe we're working backwards into this, but I'd love to
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talk about this because I think there's a lot of men out there who don't really understand these
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four components, not just in their daily life, but even if they're facing a threat or in a fight,
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like you've been, whatever it may be. So I want to talk about each of these areas. Uh,
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when you talk about awareness, I mean, how does somebody become even more aware? I think a lot
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of the times we get placed in these boxes, whether we've created the box or society has created it
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for us. And it's hard for us to become aware of this box. How do you suggest somebody actually do
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that? Man, the, that first a, the aware. So, you know, those, those, those four A's are like
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kind of pillar, the tenants of the things that we try to impart on somebody that, that wants to
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be a better sheepdog. Um, the first is aware. It's not just aware of your surroundings. It's
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also aware of yourself. You know, like this is like soon zoo art of war stuff. Like know yourself,
00:20:46.540
understand what assets and liabilities you have. You know, let's just be honest about me for a
00:20:50.400
second. Okay. I'm 37. I had knee surgery on my right leg. I have a little bit of bicep tendonitis
00:20:55.080
of my left arm, right? I've been a fighter for 16 years. I've been in special forces for 14 years.
00:21:01.940
I don't know how many airplanes I've jumped out of. I don't know how many gunfights I've been in. I
00:21:05.580
don't know how many deployments I've been on. Um, so what kind of wear and tear do we have on me
00:21:09.980
physically? Let's talk about my brain. Like how many fights have I been on? How many training
00:21:14.340
sessions, sparring sessions? What level of TBI CTE do I have from being blown up? Um, having
00:21:20.220
grenades go off using flash bangs, being in shoot houses, um, breathing in lead. Okay. I don't know,
00:21:25.440
but I really do my best to understand all of those things about myself. Uh, then let's talk about
00:21:29.780
assets. Um, I'm strong. I'm fast, very intelligent, you know, very well educated, multilingual. You know,
00:21:35.420
I've pretty good shots, decent fighter, decent grappler. So like, I, I know a lot about myself.
00:21:41.100
I know what my capabilities are. I know how long I can run flat out. You know, like I know
00:21:44.960
that last night, my, my son has a cough and he didn't sleep for two and a half hours and I was
00:21:50.300
up rocking him. I was walking. I realized that mentally I'm a little bit more diminished today
00:21:54.020
than I was yesterday morning. Right. You know, like, so that is an ongoing assessment of awareness of
00:22:00.400
who you are and how capable you are. And then there's the X that is just in looking at you
00:22:06.000
internally. And then as the external perspective of what biometrically atmospherically is happening
00:22:12.520
around us, where I am, why I'm there, who's around me, should they be there, what they're wearing,
00:22:19.120
how they smell, how they're dressed, um, where their tattoos are, where their track marks on their
00:22:24.560
arm are. If they're packing, how much money they have, where their shoes are, where their car is parked,
00:22:28.680
where I parked, where their exit is. If I'm, if I'm a, if I know where the bathroom is, where's the
00:22:33.440
cook, um, where's the closest weapon, what, you know, like all of that stuff that is just a constant
00:22:38.940
ongoing situational awareness, right? You're just, that is a nonstop forever going leading into the
00:22:47.700
assessment. Before I get into the assessment, Tim, I want to talk with you about like, is this just a
00:22:52.820
matter of practicing when you're out and about, when you're doing your thing, looking around,
00:22:55.980
having this stuff. And then what is it that you actually should be prioritizing to be aware of?
00:23:00.940
Cause you, I'm assuming, and maybe I'm wrong here. So this is going to be enlightening for me
00:23:04.500
that there comes a point when maybe you're bombarded or overwhelmed with too much stuff.
00:23:10.260
Is that even possible? Oh yeah. A hundred percent. It depends on where you are. You kind of have to
00:23:15.000
triage what kind of information, let's just say you're a computer, right? And you're feeding yourself
00:23:19.200
information, how efficient you are at taking that information and putting it and applying it where,
00:23:25.480
to where it needs to go. The more programs you have, the faster memory you have, the more you
00:23:30.180
can do, right? So me as, as a green beret, special forces sniper, a ranger, I can process a lot more
00:23:36.880
information than somebody that's just learning how to do this. And we also, I practice this. I rehearse
00:23:41.600
this. Me and my friends, when we're sitting at lunch, we know, okay, who's sitting where and why
00:23:46.440
they're sitting there, you know, where are we parked, why are we parked there? So some of those things
00:23:50.260
that you do habitually, then you don't have to worry about, can, you can shuffle that to the
00:23:54.800
less important area of your brain and then be in the moment. So yeah, you're aware of yourself,
00:23:59.220
but then you're looking at your surroundings. You know, like if I'm at a restaurant, what kind
00:24:03.860
of restaurant am I at? What area of town am I in? Who should be there? If somebody came in that kind
00:24:09.840
of doesn't fit the stereotype of the people that should be, you know, eating there or should be a
00:24:13.920
patron of there, you know, if they're, they're acting weird, if they're, if there's weird biometrics
00:24:17.840
between them and the rest of the people, then they don't fit the atmosphere except something's
00:24:21.820
off, you know? So then you kind of prioritize where you're in that awareness, where that amount
00:24:28.300
of focus goes and you get better at it. You know, we even sometimes like even my friends like Shane
00:24:33.880
Steiner, we'll be sitting there and at lunch, you know, in Austin, Texas getting tacos, which is
00:24:39.540
a great thing to do. And we make assumptions, you know, we're profiling people, you know, we see
00:24:47.500
somebody come in and, uh, you know, with, with her boyfriend or husband. And then we realized
00:24:51.520
that neither of them are wearing rings. Okay. Going to jump to a possibility that they're not
00:24:56.500
married, the boyfriend, girlfriend, we're going to go off the biometrics of the distance that
00:24:59.900
they're having from each other and the, and the connectivity that they have and how they're
00:25:02.840
interacting and how they're talking. You know, then we see that he didn't hold the door for
00:25:06.300
her, that he didn't hold the chair for her. Now we're going to make another assumption
00:25:08.700
about them. Then we're going to see some tattoos, you know? So like you just get better at it
00:25:13.420
the more that you do it. And the more that you do it, the better at it you get, the more
00:25:18.200
efficient you are at doing it. And the more accurate you are. Um, during the sheepdog
00:25:22.540
course, we take, we take a little walk through some parking lots, you know, whether it's like
00:25:26.340
a Walmart and I say, Hey, you know, like I bet you there's a gun in there. And sometimes
00:25:30.880
I'll like, like, it's been fun. Like while we're walking through the parking lots, like
00:25:34.040
a group of 20 people, cause we break off into a few different groups and we go do different
00:25:38.240
things with different instructors. I've had like people walk out and they're walking to
00:25:42.100
their car. I'm like, Hey man. And I just start talking to him, totally disarm them. You know,
00:25:45.700
as I'm interacting with them, it was like, Oh, so, and ultimately we end up and I find
00:25:49.520
out everything about that person. Interesting. The assumptions that I made about that person
00:25:55.300
just off their vehicle in front of the whole entire class is right. You know, they're like,
00:26:00.380
Oh, this is what you do for a living. This is the area of town that you live in. This is
00:26:04.180
the, you know, this is the, the, the access code to get into your apartment complex. Uh, this
00:26:10.400
is where your kids go to school. This is like all off of their car and that, you know, that's
00:26:15.020
just awareness. And the more you do it, the better you are. Right. Right. It's frightening
00:26:18.880
how good you can get at it. No, it sounds like, it sounds like, like Jason Bourne type
00:26:22.160
stuff, right? Yeah. I mean, they, they obviously Hollywood it up, but the, the, the purpose is
00:26:28.060
just for awareness, right? You're going to know the best escape route. You're going to know
00:26:33.520
the best place to go to, to get sanctuary. You're going to know the best, the, the most
00:26:39.700
worrisome threat in the room. Like these, you're going to know who can handle themselves. You're
00:26:43.160
going to know where to get a gun. You're going to know where to get some drugs. You're going
00:26:45.460
to know, you know, you're going to know what the concerns are. Like these are, these are
00:26:48.340
things that you should know. You know, if you're going to, if you're going to be truly consider
00:26:51.920
yourself a sheepdog, you should probably, uh, at least be able to be aware of your surroundings
00:26:57.940
Well, and I, then I think the point of, of being aware of this is then to move into that next
00:27:01.820
step, right? Which is, okay, now I have this information. What do I actually do with it?
00:27:05.080
So talk to me about this assessment area that we're, we're going to address here.
00:27:08.660
So you're not only assessing what you're going to do. So as you're aware that awareness starts
00:27:15.400
focusing on a singularity, uh, uh, one individual thing that then you're assessing, right? So we
00:27:24.020
call that threat assessment, threat assessment, right? So what I'm aware of everything, that's
00:27:27.840
just a common normal state of being, right? That's the homeostasis. That's, that's like
00:27:32.540
how things always are. And then when something comes in that doesn't fit, that concerns me,
00:27:39.680
my focus goes from being aware and it starts leaving things that are less important, you know,
00:27:45.640
like the cook and what he was talking about in Spanish in the kitchen, which ironically was
00:27:49.920
where they're going to, you know, buy their marijuana at to the more important thing is this
00:27:54.580
thing that just walked into the room. Right. And so now my assessment is I'm looking at that
00:27:59.720
person as a threat. I'm assessing that person as a threat. And then the assessment is what I'm going
00:28:05.240
to do is what is the best course of action. If he does this, am I going to do this? Or am I even,
00:28:11.060
am I going to even wait and let him dictate anything? Or I'm just going to take the initiative and,
00:28:15.420
you know, get the drop on him and stand up and start moving as if I'm leaving, getting behind him.
00:28:19.600
So if he does walk up to the counter, pull a gun and try to rob him, I'm ready to, you know,
00:28:24.000
come up from a six and put them on the ground. So at this point, you're really just running
00:28:28.020
through scenarios. Like what would happen if this, what would I do? If this, if this were to escalate
00:28:32.640
or move here, how would I handle myself and respond to that situation? Am I understanding
00:28:36.000
this correctly? Yeah, that, that, yeah, that's a part of it. You know, the, in the assessment,
00:28:40.380
the threat assessment of an individual, and then back to you internally, what am I going to do?
00:28:46.440
What, what, what, what is my course in that action? You know, we'll sometimes, uh, we, you know,
00:28:50.520
we talk about a decision-making process. This, you know, like MDMP is, is a military decision-making
00:28:56.580
process, uh, which has a lot of great things. You know, you kind of create this mental matrix of
00:29:00.740
if I not, not if the, if game of, if I do that, then this will happen. But like more of violence is
00:29:08.100
action and violence of action. Let's figure out what is the best course of action, the most likely
00:29:14.820
course of action and the worst course of action. All right. Yeah. And, and then kind of being
00:29:21.260
prepared. So what is the most likely thing that's going to happen? What is the best outcome of that?
00:29:25.920
Or what is the worst outcome of that? And then understanding what the worst course of action
00:29:30.080
is. Well then maybe change what I'm going to do in the most likely course of action or the best
00:29:35.440
course of action. This almost sounds like really similar to the, uh, the OODA loop. Is that right?
00:29:40.380
Like observe, orient, decide, act. Is that what we're looking at here? Absolutely. Yeah. This
00:29:45.640
makes sense. And then, okay. So now you've, you've been aware, you've assessed the situation. You kind
00:29:50.100
of know what's going on and think you have an idea. How do you get off of the fence? Because I think we
00:29:55.700
all understand what act means, but I think there's a lot of people who would say, Oh, I just hope this
00:29:59.140
passes me by, or maybe I'll just plead ignorance or I'll close my eyes and everything will go away.
00:30:03.200
You know, I like, I watch my, my three-year-old daughter and she'll cover her eyes and think because she
00:30:07.500
covers her eyes, the thing's going to go away. And obviously it doesn't. How do you then, you know,
00:30:11.740
get the balls, I guess, for lack of better term to now take action and do something about this?
00:30:16.300
Uh, being prepared and being trained period. That's it. There's not, there's not like this
00:30:21.100
Freudian brilliant jump to, you need to do this, or you need to mentally prepare in this.
00:30:26.960
You train for that moment. You train with calloused hands, you know, sweating your eyes,
00:30:33.280
sand in your ass, you know, hurting, bleeding pain. So that when that moment comes,
00:30:38.780
you're perfectly prepared for that moment. And this is where your, your, your phrase,
00:30:44.320
which I love by the way, is that you become the hardest person somebody ever tries to kill, right?
00:30:50.320
Absolutely. You know, when you are the hardest person somebody ever tries to kill,
00:30:53.220
it doesn't matter what's going to happen, right? You're prepared for it. Not that you're,
00:30:57.040
you're hoping that it happens. Uh, even though sometimes I'm just like, come on, man, just,
00:31:01.180
just give it a whirl, you know, like, just give it a try. Cause it would make me really happy.
00:31:05.580
Cause I'm totally prepared and you're not, right. Um, there's a degree of that pride,
00:31:12.680
self-confidence that gives you a founded courage that is rooted in the training, right? The cornerstone
00:31:22.560
of everything that you've done, um, from the awareness to the assessment is because you've trained.
00:31:26.760
And, and, and so when that moment to take action finally comes, you're 100% mentally and physically
00:31:33.740
ready. Yeah. I mean, I'd love that you're talking about this because one of the questions I get all
00:31:38.100
the time, every single day without fail is how do I build more confidence? And I think you're
00:31:42.340
answering the question right now, which is you train, you prepare, you do the thing that you're
00:31:46.440
not confident about that way. When the situation really matters, you have the ability, the desire,
00:31:52.280
the courage to move forward, even though you might still be facing that fear.
00:31:57.220
Yeah, man, a hundred percent. Yeah. The, uh, and that goes to everything. You're like the dad bods,
00:32:03.280
you know, the, the, the body's kind of 14, 18, 20% body fat guys, you know, that have gotten lazy and
00:32:09.680
just let themselves go. And then they end up to the beach with their kids and they're leaving their
00:32:13.160
t-shirts on. Okay. I don't care what I look like. Um, but there's a degree of confidence with me
00:32:18.840
because I train so hard all the time. Like I don't care. And I'm, I'm just there for my kids
00:32:23.660
to have a good time. Like yeah, shirts coming off. I'm going to be throwing sand. I'm going to be
00:32:26.620
throwing a football. I'm going to be jumping in the water. And I never, never even think about
00:32:30.660
anything, any degree of self-consciousness. And that is like the most ethnocentric, narcissistic
00:32:36.580
version of confidence. Right. And then going all the way up to, I'm about to get in a gunfight
00:32:41.140
with a guy that's about to rob someplace that me and my family are eating at. And I don't have a
00:32:45.460
care or concern or worry because I know I'm totally prepared and I have the confidence
00:32:50.900
that I'm going to do the right thing. So, I mean, that's a huge spectrum and that's a,
00:32:54.820
that's, that is the diversity, the, the space, the void between those two things is vast,
00:32:59.800
but ultimately it comes down to self-confidence. And the thing that gives you that is training
00:33:06.220
and being prepared. Well, and I think from the outside looking in, I mean, obviously you've got a
00:33:10.800
lot of this, right. But I see it as, okay, Tim's actually adopted this as a lifestyle. Like you're
00:33:16.180
not going to train for 30 days or 90 days for a fight. Like you're always ready to some degree
00:33:20.940
for that fight. You're always ready. You're always prepared. You're always training. Uh, and it's not
00:33:25.860
just, Hey, let's do a quick 30 day or 60 day, whatever, so that we can go on the cruise or get
00:33:31.620
into this fight or whatever it may be. No. Yeah. This is a lifestyle. It's, it's a, it's a fulfilling,
00:33:36.880
wonderful lifestyle. It's one that when you understand what hard work is, what individual
00:33:42.700
responsibility means, um, the reward of, of calloused hands and sweat in your eyes and that
00:33:49.040
the benefits to your family, both financially and physically is tenfold, you know, like that,
00:33:54.900
that the reward on the far side of work is so much more satisfying than anything else you could
00:34:00.100
ever get. It is, it is permanently a lifestyle change. You know, like you, this, this is who you
00:34:06.100
are and that is who you always will be. Let's talk about this last, uh, this last step, which
00:34:11.140
is the analysis. I think this is what a lot of people miss. Cause I think there is a lot of people
00:34:15.400
who would just take even blind action without being prepared or being aware or even assessing a
00:34:20.000
situation. But one of the things that I think very few men actually do is now go back, whether it's a
00:34:25.620
situation or their day or an experience and actually analyze what happened, what didn't happen,
00:34:31.420
how do I improve? So talk to me about what this looks like for you. Yeah. The analysis is massive.
00:34:36.100
It's, it is, how do you get better? Right. You know, we, we started the conversation with like,
00:34:41.120
sometimes that is even who defines what, what, what a human is, what a man is, is what is you,
00:34:47.780
what do you do after you've been knocked down? What do you do after you've failed? You know,
00:34:51.920
if you, if you look at the greats from the tech giants to the actors or even the medal of honor
00:34:58.940
recipients, what you see reoccurring in all of them is there was failure after failure after failure.
00:35:05.460
You know, there was Babe Ruth striking out, you know, hundreds of times, you know, and then of
00:35:10.980
course hitting hundreds of home runs. Right. Like that, that, that is the thing that, that most
00:35:16.340
commonly defines who they are is the fact that they went back and tried and that even when they failed,
00:35:22.620
they took a step back and they analyzed what they did wrong and they came back better in the
00:35:28.020
hall of fields. I don't want to use, you know, fighting as example, but even us after 9-11, after
00:35:34.480
Pearl Harbor, you know, leading the Stalingrad, like we, we knew what we did wrong in, in battles. And we
00:35:41.240
said, hell no, not going to happen again. This is how I'm going to get better. And it's a con, you know,
00:35:45.940
like the, from infantrymen's perspective, like the first thing they show you is always improve your
00:35:51.400
fighting position. Well, your body is your fighting position. You know, then your home is
00:35:56.700
your fighting position. And then your property is your fighting position, your property, your place
00:36:01.340
of work, your car. And that just keeps expanding. And how do you continually improve that? You know,
00:36:06.420
first it's, it's you as a person, how do you improve that? And that analysis thing is every
00:36:10.380
time that you do something right, how, what did I do right? So I can sustain it. And then looking for
00:36:15.760
improves. Okay. What did I do wrong so I can do it better? And that is always, always happening.
00:36:21.400
Right. We talk about this all the time is, and the term we use is the after action review,
00:36:25.120
which is obviously a military term as well. So yeah, I mean, I'm completely on board with what
00:36:29.480
you're saying. This makes a ton of sense right here. If you don't do it, you know, then you are
00:36:33.120
like, what is the definition of insanity? You know, it's, it's doing the same thing,
00:36:37.740
hoping for a different result, right? Why would you ever do the same thing? Especially when that thing
00:36:43.260
that you just did was failure. Why don't you step back and analyze yourself or your actions or your
00:36:50.280
assessment or your awareness and say, man, this is what I should have done. Or this is what I'm
00:36:55.680
going to do to be more prepared for that moment. Well, Tim, obviously we're, we're scratching the
00:37:00.200
surface on some of this stuff. And I want to give you an opportunity to talk about some of the things
00:37:04.020
that you're doing, because I think the guys listening to this are going to want to know about
00:37:06.660
this. And obviously we're going to be able to get deeper into this and some of the training that
00:37:09.660
you're doing. Talk to me a little bit about some of maybe that I know you've got some
00:37:14.000
sheepdog response training coming up. Talk to me about when that is. So we just can let the guys
00:37:18.020
know and make that available for them. For first responders, military law enforcement,
00:37:22.700
firefighter, paramedics, we do a military first responder law enforcement only class once a month.
00:37:28.900
And then we do a civilian, an open to civilian course once a quarter. The next one that we're
00:37:34.880
doing is going to be at the end of January. It's going to be in Houston, Texas. Beautiful range,
00:37:39.100
fantastic gym. We have some of the best instructors, not some of, we have the best instructors in the
00:37:44.580
world that are going to be there. If you go to our website, sheepdogresponse.com, start reading
00:37:49.460
the bios of the people that teach at this course, you know, from grandmaster shooters, IPSC IDPA guys
00:37:54.940
to doctors that specialize in emergency medicine that were former special forces guys, green berets that
00:38:00.840
then went to medical school during 9-11, then went to JSOC and then came back. Like those are the
00:38:04.840
people that teach for us. Black belts in this, world champions in that. These are the people
00:38:10.520
that are humbly putting themselves out there to create more sheepdogs because they believe in this
00:38:16.000
idea. So end of January, if you go to our Facebook page, Sheepdog Response, you can reserve your slot.
00:38:22.520
The next one is going to be in the Washington DC area, and that will be in March. And then law
00:38:27.940
enforcement, military ones, you can just go to the Facebook page or the website and look at different
00:38:33.020
dates for where we're having the ones for law enforcement, military only.
00:38:37.980
Right on. Yeah. And we'll make sure as, as we make this available, that all the guys have the
00:38:41.860
links on the show notes so they can check all this out and get registered if that's what they want to
00:38:45.000
do. Tim, I've got to ask you a question as we wind down. And that question I did prep you a little
00:38:49.720
bit for, and I think you've answered this question, but I want to make sure we wrap this up this way is
00:38:55.700
It's different for a lot of different men. For me, it's what are you going to do when you fail?
00:39:00.240
What are you going to do to improve who you are and what you did? How are you going to improve to
00:39:06.680
provide for your family, to be a productive contributing member of society? Those are the,
00:39:12.480
what are you going to do? How are you going to get back up? That's what defines a man.
00:39:17.340
Yeah. Powerful stuff. And obviously something that you've been able to do, and I've seen you
00:39:20.960
and some of the things that you're doing, and I appreciate that of you watching you as somebody who I
00:39:26.320
look up to, you know, and want to emulate some of the things that you're doing. So
00:39:30.240
I appreciate that. I appreciate that response. Also, you've got a couple other things I wanted
00:39:34.060
to mention. You've got the season finale, right? Of Hunting Hitler. We want to talk about that real
00:39:38.540
quick. And then the, make sure you mention also the Sheepdog Survival Fund, because I think there's
00:39:43.140
some guys listening that are going to be interested in knowing more about what that is.
00:39:45.800
Uh, so it's coming Tuesday, January 3rd, we have, uh, the season finale of season two of
00:39:52.540
Hunting Hitler. Back to the Sheepdog thing, uh, not letting evil just exist. A bunch of nasty Nazis
00:39:59.540
escaped the war, you know, dudes that did horrific, horrendous, horrible, unimaginable things,
00:40:05.500
you know, escaped South America. And we tracked those dudes down and we go in the last episode to
00:40:11.640
a place called Colonia Dignidad. Google it. It'll scare, it'll scare you dead. Don't Google it before
00:40:17.700
you go to bed. It is frightening. Really? Okay. And it's current day. It's real, it's real world
00:40:22.720
happening still today. Powerful Nazis worth hundreds of millions of dollars. And the season finale is next
00:40:29.660
Tuesday on History Channel. It's pretty cool. The Sheepdog Survival Fund. So the Sheepdog Response,
00:40:36.200
those are the courses that we teach. While we've been teaching those, we have found there's a void.
00:40:41.140
There's, there's, uh, there's soldiers, law enforcement officers, deputies that don't have
00:40:46.200
the training and don't have the equipment that they need to do the job. You know, we have guys
00:40:50.200
showed up our course, you know, it's a mid range, mid distance carbine course, and they're trying to
00:40:56.320
shoot with iron sights because it's the only thing that a department could afford. And that limits them
00:41:02.020
to 300 meters. Like, you know, like we said, mid distance, this is a, to me, that's like four or 500
00:41:08.260
meters. You can't even see that far. Right. You know, guys that didn't even have tourniquets that
00:41:12.420
didn't even know how to put on a tourniquet. So we give those guys, whether it's a scholarship to
00:41:18.140
attend one of our courses, or we just buy that department, the equipment that they need, you know,
00:41:23.440
every single cent goes towards doing that. You know, we have nobody in the fund, in the nonprofit
00:41:29.660
that gets paid. Nobody's writing checks to fly anywhere. Every cent goes to helping military
00:41:37.080
law enforcement first responders. Yeah. Well, we'll make sure all of that stuff gets linked up.
00:41:41.620
So the guys can go check that out. Tim, I've got to tell you, man, I appreciate you. I appreciate
00:41:44.700
you coming on the show and imparting some of your wisdom. Also, I appreciate your, your service and
00:41:48.920
how you show up. Obviously I've, I've followed you and watch what you do and try to live my life in
00:41:54.880
some of the same manner that you do as well. And so I want to thank you again for coming on the show
00:41:58.340
and sharing what you have to share with us today. It was my privilege. Thank you for taking the time
00:42:02.740
to talk to me, Ryan. Appreciate it. There it is, man. Mr. Tim Kennedy, sharing some of what it takes
00:42:07.760
to be a sheepdog, something again, we should all be striving to be more of in our lives. Obviously
00:42:12.020
we're just scratching the surface. So I do encourage you to check out what Tim is up to. Again, I just
00:42:16.300
want to remind you about the iron council. This is our elite mastermind designed to get you to the next
00:42:19.960
level in your relationships, your finance, your health, your fitness, your life. So join us now,
00:42:25.840
get the tools, the resources, the skills, the accountability you need to make the changes
00:42:30.200
you want to make this year. You can learn more and sign up at order of man.com slash iron council.
00:42:35.020
I'm going to look forward to talking with you on Friday for our Friday field notes, but until then
00:42:38.240
take action and become the man you were meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order of man
00:42:42.760
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00:42:47.520
We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.