164： A Man's Responsibility to Future Generations ｜ Matt Labrum
Episode Stats
Summary
In this episode of The O.M.A.TODAY'S episode, Ryan speaks with Matt Labrum, the former head football and baseball coach at his old high school. They talk about the power of letting kids fail, why competitive sports is so important in a young man's life, and why manliness is something that is much needed in society.
Transcript
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This one is special for me. As most of you know, I grew up without a permanent father figure in my
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life. I've mentioned in the past that there was a select group of men who helped mold and shape me
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into the man that I am today. I'm not sure there is another man in my young life who was as
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influential as my guest today. His name is Matt Labrum and he was my high school football and
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baseball coach. Today, we talk about his influence in my life and thousands of other young men's
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lives, the power of allowing kids to fail, including some failures of my own, why competitive
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sports are so valuable in a young man's life, why he cut his entire team from the football program a
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few years ago, and a man's responsibility to future generations. You're a man of action. You live life
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to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path. When life knocks you down, you get
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back up one more time. Every time. You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient.
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Strong. This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day,
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and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man. Gentlemen, what is going on today?
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My name is Ryan Mickler and I am the host and founder of this podcast, The Order of Man. Guys,
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this is a show about becoming a better man, and I have got one of my favorite, if not my favorite
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interview to date. Now, we've done over 160 episodes, and I haven't been more excited about
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releasing an episode than I am about this one. I mentioned a minute ago, this is my high school
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football and baseball coach. We're going to get to it in a minute, but if you are just joining us for
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the very first time today, again, want to welcome you to what at least I consider to be the best show
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available for men. We are interviewing the world's most successful men, men who are succeeding in big
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areas of their lives. We are asking them powerful questions, distilling that information into valuable,
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actionable items that you can take into your life and achieve big results. And I don't know what it
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is you're trying to achieve those big results with, whether it's growing a family, raising kids,
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building a business, building that bank account, getting your health and fitness in line. I don't know
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what that looks like for you, but I think we've got some solutions and we've got some frameworks and
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guidance and direction through the guests that we are bringing on to you. And of course, this one is
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no exception. So again, glad you're here. We need more men in this fight. It seems like every day
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I look and find a new article about the general dismissal of masculinity and how unimportant that it
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might be in society. And I believe that there's nothing further from the truth. Masculinity is alive
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and well. And manliness is something that is much needed in society. We talk a lot about that.
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Now, before we get into the conversation and along those same lines, I'm really excited to
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introduce you to our newest event. We've done some events in the past, two different events in the
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past, but we've got a third event lined up for September 20th through the 23rd of this year,
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This is an event unlike anything that I have ever seen, unlike anything that I have ever experienced,
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but here's the catch. We only have 20 spots and I just released this announcement the end of last
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at checkout for a 5% discount. All right, guys, those are the announcements for today. Order
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man legacy. And then of course, origin, main. Now I want to introduce you to my guest. I did
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this interview a little while ago and I've been anxiously awaiting the release. I had a couple
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other people in queue before I released this one. Every single one of us guys has some very
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influential people in our lives. And today I'm talking with probably the most influential man
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in mind, especially as a young boy learning how to become a man. He is a high school educator.
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He has been teaching for more than two decades. And in addition to that, he is a high school
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baseball coach. Now, when I was in school, he was the head of football, basketball, and
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baseball coach. And he gained some national attention several years ago. Some of you may
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have seen that after cutting his entire football team from the program for some grade and attendance
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issues and how his team was showing up in the community and at school. This is a man that
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I admire and respect as he shaped a lot of who I was as a young man and who I'm still becoming.
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He never took it easy on me. We talk about two experiences in particular during this conversation,
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but I never doubted how much he cared about my progress and the progress of the boys under his
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care. Gentlemen, listen in as I have a conversation with, again, one of the most influential men in my
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life, Mr. Matt Labrum. Coach Labrum, thanks for joining me on the show today.
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I got to be honest. And we were talking about this. I've had some amazing, amazing men on the
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show and just some incredible conversations. And I don't usually get nervous, but knowing that you
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are coming on the show, I've been a little nervous and a little bit antsy this morning. And it sounds
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like you have too. So we're both there. Yeah, I think we're both there. I'm very nervous. I'm
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excited to be here and I just appreciate all the good things that you're doing. So.
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Well, it's cool to be able to have this conversation because it's been, and I was,
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I was thinking about this and I was talking with you over the weekend and your father.
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I mean, it's been nearly 20 years since we were able to sit down and have an in-depth
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conversation like we will today. Yeah. Just amazing how time goes by so fast. And so you
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got to take those moments when you can. So. Yeah, definitely. So you had a big win,
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four big wins actually, right? Four games this weekend. We did. Yeah. That's awesome. So your son,
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did he pitch a no-hitter on what, Saturday? He did actually. Yes. That's awesome.
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Saturday night. Yeah. How was he feeling about that?
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I think he was pretty excited because he's usually doesn't have much emotion. And if you see the
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video at the very end, you see him jumping around into his teammates and it was a lot of fun. It was
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very humbling as a father watching him, but you know, as a coach to be a part of it too. So it was a
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lot of fun. Yeah. I remember meeting him. I think it was what, two, three weeks ago. And he, he is just
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like you. I'm sure nobody has said that to you before. I've heard that a few times. I, I don't see it.
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I have a lot say that. You don't really? I don't. I really don't. So. Oh my goodness. Yeah. You guys,
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he's a mini me except for he's not, he's not mini. He's a big kid. Yeah. Yeah. He surpassed me in
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height already and he's trying to catch me in weight too. So he's, he's working hard. So you guys won
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the tournament. How do you feel about the weekend? It was a great experience for us and for our program
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and the growth of our program, we've really been striving to become better baseball players,
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but more character and, and more with growing as a group and as a team, being happy for each other,
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finding ways that way. And I witnessed a lot of growth this weekend because we won different types
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of games this weekend. And so that was a huge step for our program. When you say different types of
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games, you mean blowouts and then very, I mean, this last game was what one to zero. Yeah. So our very
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first game was a three to one game, well-pitched game, you know, just a well-played game. So real
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tight, low scoring game. The next game we played was a 12 to six game. I think we came out and gave
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up some runs, had to come back, you know, figure out a way to score more runs than them. Our third
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game, we were up nine to four. They got back into it. They capitalized on a couple of our errors and
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ended up winning nine to eight. This last game, they didn't have any hits. We only had four hits. We
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scored one run in the fifth inning, uh, you know, had to play, you know, good solid game to win that.
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Yeah. That's incredible. When you talked about game two, where you were behind, I remember in
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high school, one of the things that you'd say, and I always say these things, like when you said
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them, I used to roll my eyes, like, Oh, shut up. Like here's another one of the things that coach is
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saying. And now I find myself telling these same things to my boys. And I remember one of the things
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that really stands out that you had said to us when we were behind is that winners find a way.
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So I imagine you said something along those lines in game two. Yeah. Same thing. We use
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that a lot. What I like about baseball is that normally there's no time limit in these tournaments
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there are, but normally there's no time limit. So as long as you have a swing, you have a chance.
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And so, uh, you know, that's something that we always talk about also. Yeah. Well, I really liked,
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and I want to hit on this thread, what you had said earlier about, yeah, I mean the sport itself
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is important, but I think even more so than that, specifically for the young men that you're coaching
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and you've coached, I was just thinking about this. I mean, you've coached thousands of, of boys at
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this point. And I think it goes so much further than getting good at baseball or basketball or
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football or whatever. And that's important. That development's important, but talk to me about
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how much deeper it goes for you and why you have decided to dedicate your life up to this point to
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coaching. I'm grateful for the coaches that spent their time for me and helped mold me into a young
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man. And then into the man I am, you know, I'm thankful for a father who did that. You know,
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I just try to use sports as an avenue to help young people grow. You know, you've talked quite a bit
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about, you know, allowing kids to fail, but then giving them a chance to come back and find a different
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way or find a way to, to get through hard times. And that's something that's very important to me.
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Sports was huge in my life. I think, uh, had I not had sports, I don't know where I had gone.
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And so I'm thankful for the men that gave up their time to help to mold me and gave me opportunities
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to grow and to fail. And so my whole goal is to try to repay that back. And, you know, there's a
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payments like this, you know, watching what you're doing and, and seeing the young men that I've had
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the opportunity to coach and see that they're going on and they're doing great things and bettering
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their themselves, their families and their communities. And that's just a, gives me chills to
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watch what's going on. I know to a small degree because I coach my boys' teams at this point,
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what that experience is like. And I really liked that you talk about the idea of competition and
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allowing kids to fail, because I think society in general is trying to shift away from this.
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Like we don't want our kids to feel bad. And, but what I noticed, especially in high school,
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when I was playing under you is you're supposed to feel bad when you lose, you're not supposed to
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dwell on it and let it beat you up, but it's not supposed to be a pleasurable experience.
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You're supposed to feel bad so you can understand what that experience is like and then come back
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more resilient, tougher, stronger, better, and improve moving forward. Do you notice that trend
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of let's not compete? Let's not keep score. Is that something you see?
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Yeah, for sure, Ryan. And you know what? I think sometimes even in my career at times,
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I think I've fallen into that a little bit, you know, just trying to make everybody be happy,
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make all the parents feel good, make sure every kid feels good about themselves,
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you know, those types of things. Sometimes I've even fallen prey to that concept. And
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if I reevaluate, you know, the keys are exactly what you said, you know, you feel bad when something
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doesn't go your way. Well, then now what do I do? How am I going to get through that? Or what am I
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going to change so that doesn't happen again? And through that, we have growth. If we don't have
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growth, then we're going to stay the same. So I just think we're so worried that our kids won't
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recover from a loss or heartache or a tragedy. And that's just not the case. I mean, human beings
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are resilient. So rather than sheltering them from that stuff, let's expose them to it in controlled
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environments so that when the real stuff happens in real world, because let's be honest, losing a
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baseball game, as much as a coach like yourself doesn't want to lose, it's not the end of the world.
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Like it's not going to define your life unless you let it, I guess, but there are more important
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issues that you will face. And unless you have adequately prepared to handle those situations
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and prepared our young men to handle those situations, it's going to destroy them.
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Yes. We're definitely doing a disservice to the young people by not allowing them to fail and for
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coddling them and making sure they feel okay when something doesn't go their way or make an excuse
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for them. It's a total disservice. Also, on the other hand, we got to figure out how to not make
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winning and losing life or death. I think we have both ends of the spectrum and we need to
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understand what the game is all about, what it's there for and how we can grow and develop from
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that. How do you find the balance between being tough on the boys that you're coaching, but then
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also being, and I don't know if it's compassion or just, or, or, or empathy and understanding that
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this is a part of the bigger picture. Like how do you find and strike that balance for your team?
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I think the biggest thing you have to do, Ryan, is you, you have to have something in
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the deposit. You got to have something in the bank with these young people that, that you're with.
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And so if you can deposit and you can go and you can see them in different things, I try to go to,
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you know, if they're in a play or they're in a musical or they're in band or, or I try to see
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them in different areas and I try to go up and tell them, you know, Hey, great job. You know,
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that was fun to watch it be a part of that. It's fun to see in a different realm.
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I think if you can put things in the bank, then you can withdraw, you know, there's times where
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you can get down and get after them, but they still know that you really truly love them and
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you want them to be better, but you have to be able to put stuff in the bank first before you
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withdraw. And you're so good at that. Like I, I remember just this weekend you had called me up
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and you said you were going to be in our hometown and I took one of my sons to watch the game. He was
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around and he wanted to check it out. And I think he lasted for about two innings before he found
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some friends and it was just me watching the game because that's how it goes. I was watching
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you knowing that we were going to have this conversation. And of course, knowing that you
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were my coach for four years in baseball and football, and you caught me from the basketball
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team when I was a sophomore. We can talk about that later. And that was a good thing. We'll talk
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about that here in a minute. I watched you and how you interacted with the kids. And I remember,
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and I can't remember what inning it was, but one of the kids struck out looking. And I know
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that's like the ultimate no, no in baseball, right? You just don't do it.
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And I was really curious how you would handle that. And it was pretty inspiring to watch you
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talk with who that was and say, Hey man, it happens, but here's how we got to improve moving
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forward. Here's what we got to do differently. And I really saw this a toughness, but in a way that was
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supportive because you understand what he needed to see and what he needed to, to hear and experience.
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But I imagine that just comes with your experience as well. I mean, you've been doing it for a long
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Well, yeah, I've definitely grown. You got me in my way early years and I'm thinking.
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Okay. Yeah. So you were, yeah, I didn't realize that at the time.
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I was just a little bit older than you guys, you know? And so you, you got me way in my early years
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and you know, I have lots of regrets as I look back. I'm like, holy smokes, I got away with some
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stuff. But you guys, the way that you responded to me and we were able to understand each other
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and you let me grow with you guys. And so I think that was very important. But again,
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the biggest thing I think is no one wants to be embarrassed. There's times where I've embarrassed
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kids and I, you know, by screaming at them across the field or something like that. And I think if
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you can do it on a one-on-one, they're much more responsive and I've learned to be better at that
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I mean, it's so hard because I imagine as a coach and one of the things that I'm finding,
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it's really difficult is when I see my boys that aren't performing to the level I know they're
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capable of. And as a coach, you can't do anything about it as a player. You can, because you can get
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in there and play harder or do something different, but as a coach, you're relying upon what you've
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taught them up to this point. And there's not a dang thing you can do about it at that point.
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The biggest thing I had to learn was that I think when I was over with you guys, I would try to get
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in and play with you. Now I stay completely out of that because I'll hurt myself or, or embarrass
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myself. I can't tell stories if I can't do it anymore. But yeah, your dad said when I was
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talking to him this weekend, he said that you had to bring in some good coaches because you can't
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Yeah. We try to bring in younger coaches to keep the momentum up and, and, you know,
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keep these kids motivated from us old guys. So yeah, we've brought in a little bit of that.
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And I think that's the key to anything in life. You know, you got to find where your weaknesses
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are and then try to find people that can fill in and hopefully you impact each other and impact
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those around you. That's what this life's all about is being able to evaluate every instance
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that you're at because nothing stays the same. Everything changes all the time. What are you
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The other thing I thought was really impressive is there was a really close play at home and
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the umpire called them out, which I think was actually from where I was standing, a pretty
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good call. It could have gone either way. And I was also impressed with just your level of
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calmness and clarity. And I'm not sure what you said to him. You went and talked to him,
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but I'm sure you asked for clarification or something. And I thought that was a really
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important moment, not only from like my perspective watching that, but the boys see you too. Like how,
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how is coach Labrum going to interact with this umpire? Is he going to lose his mind or is he going
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to remain calm and keep his head in the game? I think that's really, really valuable.
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Yeah. And I can remember that play. What has happened is I'd sent that guy home. So I'd moved
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my eyes to the next runner that was coming my direction and I was now coaching him. And so when
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I went up and talked to the umpire, I just asked him, I said, how close was the play? I didn't see
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it because I'd already moved to the other runner. I just wanted to know, did I send him at the right
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time? I was trying to check and see, you know, did it, was it a close play? Did I, should I have kept
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him there? Or I was actually checking myself and just kind of building a relationship with him that
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way? And, and, and asking, you know, was it a close play? Should I have sent him? And he said,
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yeah, it was a bang, bang play. So the kid made the throw a kid made the tag and your dad was right
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there. And I thought he was out. So. Yeah. Yeah. So would you have done it differently knowing that
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or do you think you still would have sent him? Um, no, I would have still sent him. Yeah. So,
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and that's what the umpire said. Yeah. The umpire said, yeah, you should have sent him. So, you know,
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I, I felt good about it. I was just, you know, just kind of asking him that because I didn't see
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what happened. Yeah. No, that makes sense. All right. So I want to go back to a couple of points,
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not to relive any past memories or, or to call you out on any of this stuff, certainly. But yeah.
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So when I was a sophomore, you cut me from the basketball team, you know, that was a hard pill to
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swallow because all my buddies were playing basketball. And frankly, I sucked at basketball. I wasn't good. I
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I had no right to be on the basketball court, but I, I think that, that parents and boys can probably
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take that in one of two ways. They can either use it as an opportunity to complain and play the victim
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card and coach Labrum's playing politics, which I'm sure you get all the time. Or my mom was always
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good about saying, Hey, look, like, what can you learn from it? How can you grow? How can you get
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better? And we had a similar experience when I was a, a senior in high school. I remember you pulled me
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out of a game. I was catching at the time and you pulled me out of game and replaced me with,
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with a junior, which was hard. But again, she was like, Hey, look, you can learn from it. You can
00:20:27.000
grow from it. And, and again, we're coming back to this resilience thing. Like kids are so resilient
00:20:31.240
yet. We're scared to do, I think what's in their best interest over the longterm.
00:20:35.620
And Ryan, the reason you were able to learn those lessons, because what you just said is you had a
00:20:40.180
parent that tried to help you understand the lesson and, you know, didn't come to your defense.
00:20:45.580
And you're lucky to have that because most kids don't have that. And I'm not saying that I'm always
00:20:50.740
writing, cutting people or those types of things, but there is always something that can, can be
00:20:55.780
learned. And if the parent will parent instead of be the defender, I think there's some great things
00:21:02.460
that can happen. And I've had multiple experiences with that, you know, as, as a coach and, and it gets
00:21:08.420
hard, especially in, you know, in small communities and things where you're seeing people at church and in the
00:21:13.920
grocery store and, you know, wherever you might go, sometimes they think that you have it out for
00:21:18.860
them. And sometimes you're just, you know, you're just trying to make the best decision for what you
00:21:23.680
think the team needs. You know, if I was to keep anybody that I like, then obviously it would have
00:21:28.820
been you. One of my favorite guys I've ever coached, because I think you've, you've done a lot and
00:21:33.320
learned a lot, uh, you know, in the time and I've learned a lot from you. So.
00:21:38.480
Yeah. I mean, I, I appreciate that. And, and, you know, you said too, what's best for the team.
00:21:42.560
And I think that's true. I believe that's what you were after and what you were going for. But
00:21:46.160
not only that, it was also what was best for me because during the basketball season, I was able
00:21:50.300
to wrestle that year, which made me a better football player, which is what I really wanted
00:21:53.680
to do. And when it came to, to baseball, I mean, we still had a great team and I was able to step up
00:21:59.560
and help him be a better catcher with what I knew. So I think it was in the best interest of the team,
00:22:05.160
but I think it was also in the best interest of me individually.
00:22:08.260
You made it become a positive thing. Just like you said, instead of sulking about playing
00:22:13.440
basketball, you went and wrestled because you know, your, your number one that you liked was
00:22:17.920
football. And that was something that could help you become a football player, a better football
00:22:21.940
player. And also you could have, you know, taken during baseball when, when that happened,
00:22:26.980
we brought in the younger catcher, you could have tried everything you could have to not let him be
00:22:32.420
successful. But in turn, you took your knowledge and you taught him. And in turn, I see where you're
00:22:38.560
at now, you know, the things that you're doing and how you're helping so many people in the world,
00:22:43.540
you know, look at themselves and evaluate and find positive ways to be a positive influence in the
00:22:49.600
Yeah. I mean, that was really an opportunity for me. I mean, I remember this 20 years ago
00:22:54.020
to exercise some, some self-restraint, to look at the bigger picture, to look beyond myself
00:22:59.660
and really try to identify like what, what's more important in the grand scheme of things.
00:23:04.680
Was it that I wasn't catching or was it that we were playing games and we were winning? And I
00:23:09.420
recognize that that's what I wanted, but I think that came a lot from the coaching and the things
00:23:16.400
You know, I appreciate that. And I will say this, if the parents and the coach are on the same page,
00:23:22.240
we can help raise young men and young women. Uh, when there's one that's opposite, then that,
00:23:29.420
that person, that young person is going to go to that and they know that they have that crutch
00:23:35.960
Well, it's really interesting too, because one of the things I hear a lot, and I'm sure you hear
00:23:40.120
this more than I do is this, Oh, coaches playing politics. Now, from my perspective, I realized that
00:23:46.080
that might be the case in a small number of instances, but from my perspective, I think coaches want
00:23:52.200
to win games. That's why they're the coach. And so it's really fascinating to hear a parent say,
00:23:57.340
Hey, you're not playing little Timmy because you're politics. I'm like, no, you're not playing
00:24:00.580
little Timmy because he's not great at baseball or whatever it is. How often do you hear this
00:24:05.100
politics or you have it out for my son or anything like that?
00:24:09.900
It's quite often way more than I heard it probably during your time. It just continues to,
00:24:16.680
to get worse, it seems. And to be honest with you, it's even harder now because I have my own
00:24:21.560
son on the team. And so there's things there that I worry about that I shouldn't have to worry about,
00:24:26.780
but I do as a coach and as a father trying to make the best decisions for the team and making sure.
00:24:32.640
But that's something that I've talked with him since he was about eight years old.
00:24:35.920
I talked to him and I said, I'm thinking that when you get in high school, I'm probably not going to
00:24:40.500
coach anymore so that you can have your own thing. I don't want you to have to deal with stuff.
00:24:44.200
And so you can have your own thing. And he says, dad, I want you to coach.
00:24:47.160
Well, if that's, what's going to happen, I said, then you don't have to be the best player,
00:24:51.720
but you have to be the hardest worker. Cause if you're the hardest worker, I can find a place for
00:24:56.440
you. So, um, you know, he's known that and he, he knows that he has that on his back and he knows
00:25:01.700
what he has to do, but that's because it's been taught and we've talked about it quite a bit and
00:25:06.040
he knows what, what is expected. Do you think you're harder on him because of that?
00:25:11.060
Yeah, that most definitely. My coaches will get after me once in a while. And so I tried to let my
00:25:16.720
other coaches coach him and I try to coach the rest just so I don't get my personal feelings in
00:25:22.800
when I'm coaching him. And I think I am harder. There are times though, that I've told him, I said,
00:25:27.860
I'm going to come down on you. If, if the team needs it, I'm going to come down on you to,
00:25:32.320
to make sure that the lesson is learned. So you have to be ready for that.
00:25:36.920
This, uh, this last game over the weekend, his championship game where he threw that no hitter,
00:25:40.680
did he have some dicey moments? Did he have some moments where he got in his own head or kind of
00:25:44.900
freaked out a little bit that he had to be talked out of that with the team or you?
00:25:48.440
There was an instance, I can't remember if it was a second or third inning. I think he walked
00:25:52.100
the first two guys or maybe got an out and then walked two guys. So, you know, there was first and
00:25:57.600
second zero, zero. Um, and I didn't actually go out there. He, his teammates went to him and called
00:26:04.280
time when talked to him and got him settled down and, you know, and then he came out of it and did
00:26:09.120
quite well. So yeah, there was a couple of little times where his teammates came to his rescue and came and
00:26:14.020
talked to him and made plays. And so that's what I was talking about. The special moments of the
00:26:17.740
weekend. There was a lot of things that are happening that haven't been happening that we've
00:26:21.600
been trying to teach and preach. And now they're starting to happen. It's really cool to be able
00:26:26.960
to like, just take a step back for a minute and not have to be involved and just say, whoa, whoa,
00:26:31.000
whoa, wait a second. Like let, let these boys work it out themselves because in the next two to
00:26:36.080
three years, they're going to be out on their own and they're going to be having to work these things
00:26:40.780
out on, on their own. They're not, they're not going to have adults or coaches or parents there.
00:26:44.920
And again, I mean, we've got to give them the opportunity to fix it amongst themselves.
00:26:49.340
Yeah, exactly. You know, I remember, you know, heading off to school, my first year of school.
00:26:54.200
Oh man, that was great. I didn't have any parents or anything. Nobody woke me up to go to school or go
00:26:58.440
to class and, and my grades reflected that. And then I needed to, you know, make some changes in my
00:27:03.800
life. I had to grow up and decide that, do I want to do this or am I going to be something
00:27:07.760
different and hopefully through extracurricular activities and through the education and through
00:27:13.980
going through school and being around other people, these young people are given the opportunities
00:27:18.760
to learn and grow and the tools to succeed in life.
00:27:24.500
Guys, part of the reason team sports are so valuable in a young man's life is the band of
00:27:29.280
brothers that he's able to build. He's able to learn and grow with other boys who want to succeed at
00:27:34.560
the same level he does. But for most of us, that team camaraderie and brotherhood, it goes
00:27:39.520
away, just goes away after high school. But that doesn't mean that it isn't still as important
00:27:44.460
as it once was. It just means that we get busy with life and forget to build a new band of
00:27:50.320
brothers. And this is why I created the iron council. This is a brotherhood of men working
00:27:55.060
together to achieve big results in their lives. You're going to band with other men who are
00:27:59.700
succeeding and some who are still trying to find their way. But if you're missing your
00:28:03.780
tribe, a group of men who will push you and motivate you and inspire you to do bigger and
00:28:09.040
better things with your life, I'd encourage you to join us inside of the iron council.
00:28:13.540
Head to orderofman.com slash iron council to learn more about what we're up to and get the
00:28:18.660
details. And then of course, claim your seat at the table. Again, orderofman.com slash iron
00:28:23.440
council. In the meantime, let's finish up the conversation with Matt Labrum.
00:28:28.340
One of the things I want to go back to is you were talking about coaching the boys. And then of
00:28:32.500
course, you've got the parents involved. And I think there's probably an element of coaching as
00:28:37.080
well to the parents because you want to have the kids and the parents on the same page. Like,
00:28:41.440
are you involving their parents in the process? How much are they involved? What does that actually
00:28:45.280
look like? I try to subtly talk to the parents. Sometimes I have to be pretty abrupt, but most of
00:28:52.760
the time I try to go through the boys to the parents. I try to give them that avenue to talk to
00:28:57.100
their parents about what our expectations are so that the boy is making that accountability and
00:29:03.780
that responsibility of this is what our program does and this is what we expect. Sometimes I go
00:29:08.620
to the parents. Ryan, to be honest with you, most of the parents are really good, but they're usually
00:29:13.200
the quiet ones. You know, they don't say too much. It's the few that are the loud ones that cause the
00:29:18.740
commotion. And sometimes you have to address it right up front. And you have to be able to separate
00:29:23.480
what the parent's saying and be able to coach the kid at the same time and let that kid know that
00:29:28.940
you're on their side. Most of the time, if the parent's that far, it's hard to keep the kid on
00:29:33.140
your side. They're getting mixed signals and they're going to, I think a child who gets mixed
00:29:37.520
signals is going to take the one that seems easiest now. And quite honestly, that's the victim
00:29:42.100
card. It's the excuses like, Oh, coach isn't playing you because of politics or, or because Lincoln's
00:29:47.520
playing, that's why you're not playing. And that's easier than saying you're not as good as you need to
00:29:52.160
be. Why don't you work on improving yourself and see if that changes the situation. And if
00:29:55.840
parents are confirming that for the kid, they're always going to go that route.
00:29:58.880
I've seen all aspects, different sides, the parents that just support their kid, whether
00:30:03.500
they're playing or not, they want to be there. They want a part of that team. And they know that
00:30:07.480
there's a, there's a bigger picture that their, their son or daughter's learning from
00:30:11.300
versus the parent that thinks their kid's a college athlete. And, you know, I'm not giving
00:30:16.200
them justice. And that if I wouldn't have screwed them over, they would have a college
00:30:19.660
scholarship and be playing on TV and, and, you know, all this other stuff. And the ones
00:30:24.600
that understand the process, what it takes to go and do, and you got to understand it's
00:30:29.760
not just during that season anymore. You know, you're in the weight room, you're doing stuff
00:30:34.180
pretty much year round to try to get yourself in shape, get ready. And it's the daily decisions.
00:30:39.140
Are you making those decisions to make yourself better?
00:30:42.640
How does a kid find balance in this? Because I think the game, not just baseball, football,
00:30:46.900
just, just sports in general, competitive sports in general has completely changed over
00:30:52.020
the past 20 years. And you're right. I mean, these kids have to be involved all the time,
00:30:57.000
a hundred percent. They're on travel teams. They're doing the thing all year round. They're
00:31:00.580
in the gym. That just wasn't to the same degree when we were in high school as it is now.
00:31:05.740
How does a kid strike a balance? Is that even healthy? Like where is it unhealthy for these
00:31:09.700
children? I think if they're playing multiple, then I think they're okay. If they're playing
00:31:14.560
one, I struggle with that, but I also struggle the demand on their time. I think there has
00:31:20.120
to be time away. They, they have to be able to, you know, go on family vacations that doesn't
00:31:25.280
involve going to some tournament or, or something like that. You also have to sacrifice a little
00:31:31.220
bit if that's what you want. That's just where it is now. And you're exactly right. It was
00:31:35.400
way different when you were, uh, when I was coaching you and it's way different from when
00:31:39.640
I played, if you want to be able to compete, you do have to sacrifice some things. And,
00:31:44.580
and I've actually had that, uh, in a, in a parent meeting, you know, I had some parents
00:31:48.760
raise their hand and say, man, well, you're requiring a lot of them. You know, we'd like
00:31:52.880
to be able to do some stuff. I said, you know what? I understand that. And I said, I have
00:31:57.080
a family of my own too, and I would rather be with them too. But if we want to be successful,
00:32:01.620
these are the things we have to be able to do. And if you can't commit to that, there's other
00:32:05.720
things that you can do. That's a good point. I mean, life is about making choices and sometimes
00:32:10.900
you have two great opportunities and you have to pick one. You just have to pick one and it's not
00:32:15.280
awesome. And it's not the best thing in the world, but the reality is if you try to chase more than
00:32:20.080
one thing, you're, you're not going to catch either one of those things. That's a great point. And too
00:32:24.120
often we want our kids to be able to be involved in everything and be great at everything. Well,
00:32:29.140
you're exactly right. That's not going to happen. And sometimes you have to choose
00:32:32.380
between two really good things and make a decision and go with that.
00:32:37.340
I have the opportunity to spend some time with some young men in our community through the young
00:32:42.320
men's program. And I, of course, coaching my, my boys as teams, it's really hard. You know,
00:32:47.440
my oldest, he's, he's 10. I realized like, I really only have about four, maybe on a stretch,
00:32:54.840
five years before I become a lower priority in his life. You know, he's going to have sports and
00:33:01.920
he's going to have jobs and he's going to be chasing around girls. And so like,
00:33:06.260
it's a little disheartening, but it's a little exciting at the same time. It's a tough struggle
00:33:09.200
for me. And going back to your original question, why I chose to do the things that I have and stay
00:33:14.840
coaching is I hope to be that bridge between that father or maybe the single mother or whatever
00:33:22.100
that I can help raise their son because they're going to be spending more time with me than they are
00:33:27.840
at home during their high school years. If they're playing high school athletics, that's kind
00:33:32.400
of my goal is to help with that and make sure that I can bridge that gap because it does come
00:33:38.360
and they are spending a lot more time. And I hope that I'm worthy of that opportunity and that I can
00:33:44.600
have a positive influence on those young men or young women that I come in contact with during that
00:33:51.160
time when they're away from their parents. Yeah. I mean, you were certainly that for me,
00:33:55.320
I remember, I think it was probably the end of football or baseball or last game. And I remember
00:34:00.540
you would come around to each one of us at the end of that game on the bus and sit down and talk
00:34:05.840
with us. And I remember telling you like, Hey, sports aside, I really look at you as a, as a quasi
00:34:10.580
father figure. I mean, you've been really instrumental in helping me develop and learn the
00:34:14.120
things I needed to learn. And I didn't have that. I mean, you know that I didn't have that growing up
00:34:17.680
and, and a friend of mine and someone, of course, you know, very well as well as Wayne McIntosh.
00:34:22.060
And he's told me the same thing. He's like, I, man, you, you were like that father figure. And
00:34:26.640
it's so important that if we have the capacity and ability to step up in our children's lives,
00:34:31.580
even if it's not our biological children, then I think as men, we have an obligation,
00:34:36.040
responsibility to do that. I totally agree. And I'm grateful that I could do that and that you
00:34:41.140
guys remember only the positive things that I said to you. So I remember the negatives too.
00:34:45.720
I'm just not going to talk about it. No, I'm just kidding. No, I can't, I can't remember other than
00:34:50.560
just being pissed off. Cause I wasn't getting my way or whatever. I can't remember anything where I
00:34:54.680
thought, you know, that was, I do remember the stare. We talked about that, you know,
00:34:58.960
where I just got this glare. I remember that vividly, but outside of that, I never thought
00:35:03.400
anything was like negative or off at all. I never thought that. That's my goal. And, and you guys
00:35:09.620
were easy to like and be around that makes it fun for me as an old guy. And as a coaches, you know,
00:35:16.280
I thought of you guys as my sons and that's what I wanted. My first three children were daughters.
00:35:21.240
And I wasn't sure if I was going to have any sons or anything. And I do have some sons now,
00:35:26.040
but still, as I coach, I want to treat them as I would want my son to be treated. And so as I'm
00:35:31.620
coaching, I have my young kids are in little leagues and different things. And my whole,
00:35:36.240
my prayers and my thoughts are, I'm hoping that they're getting coaching that somebody's picking
00:35:41.120
that up for me where I can't be there to coach their little league and to do those types of
00:35:45.640
things. And so I hope in return, uh, the same things happening. Yeah. Yeah. Well, let's shift
00:35:52.380
gears. One of the things I really wanted to talk with you about today was I think it was four or five
00:35:57.000
years ago. You received some national attention in a positive way because you basically cut the entire
00:36:04.320
football team. Just walk me through that circumstance and then we'll work backwards
00:36:08.140
into the why and how that all played out. I believe it was our second year here at Union
00:36:13.700
High School. Things were happening around the school and fingers were being pointed towards
00:36:18.280
the football team. And we were kind of doing some investigating. We had a few kids that were
00:36:22.520
sloughing classes and, and being disrespectful to teachers. And, and there was some bullying going on
00:36:29.340
and some cyber bullying stuff. Some, I can't even remember the app that it was, but we're, you know,
00:36:34.960
those anonymous apps where people were telling kids, you know, you should kill yourself. Nobody
00:36:40.000
likes you. And the fingers were kind of getting pointed towards the football team. That's crazy.
00:36:43.800
Yeah. It's, it, it was, it was pretty scary. We just met as a coaching staff. Uh, and we, we just said,
00:36:51.780
you know what, this isn't where we want our program to be. This isn't what we want to be
00:36:55.640
teaching. We need to make sure that there's some kind of understanding going on of where,
00:37:00.660
how we're going to act and what our expectations are. And as a coaching staff, we came to the
00:37:05.120
agreement that, you know what, we need to suspend the football team and, and we need to learn some
00:37:10.060
other things because football, you can learn some life lessons, but it isn't life. And we need to learn
00:37:15.340
some life lessons. And so we suspended the team. We had a Friday night home game. I pulled them all
00:37:20.800
into our room. If you saw my room, it's not a very big room, but we had the football team in there
00:37:26.260
and we had them turn their jerseys in that night. Actually had to take them off their pads and turn
00:37:30.880
them in. And there was a lot of tears and there was a lot of things going on. There was a lot of
00:37:34.800
emotion, but we explained why and what our expectation was and that what we were going to
00:37:39.160
be doing for the next week. And so the next week we set up service projects. We had a study
00:37:44.600
centers and we just kind of went out and said, you know, this, this is what it is. We don't play
00:37:50.560
football because it's owed to us. We get to play sports because it's a privilege and we need to learn
00:37:57.200
that it is a privilege. And we did not expect any national media. We thought maybe a couple of parents
00:38:03.620
might get after us, but we'd run it through our administration and, and let them know what we were
00:38:08.240
doing. And so they were on board. So we had everybody on board. We didn't, there was no surprises
00:38:12.840
or anything that way. I think there was some great lessons learned. It wasn't, we didn't do it to
00:38:17.780
gain national media attention. We'd never even thought about that. You know, it was to gain
00:38:22.940
attention of the young men in our community and that, you know what, we support the education
00:38:27.920
program and that we're students first and athletes second, and that it is a privilege and an honor to
00:38:33.660
be able to put on your school's jersey each week. And I think the overwhelming majority of those boys
00:38:39.160
understood that I imagine they engaged fully in what you had them engaged. And we'll talk about
00:38:43.520
that. Did you have any pushback from the boys specifically who said, no, screw that. I'm not
00:38:48.140
going to do that. And just quit the team. We didn't have anybody quit. We put down some requirements that
00:38:53.020
they had to fulfill throughout the week in order to get their jersey back, to be able to play in that
00:38:57.900
week's game. And we had a couple that didn't fulfill those requirements, but they were able to
00:39:02.760
fulfill them the next week so that they could get their jersey, but we didn't have anybody quit.
00:39:06.280
And I'm sure, like you've said, you know, man, this coach, he's crazy. He doesn't know what he's
00:39:10.920
doing. I'm sure that, but nothing came back, you know, to us. Everybody stayed with it, worked. And
00:39:16.680
the lessons were learned by the athletes that had the parents that helped them learn the lessons.
00:39:22.480
You know, if it's the parents saying, oh my gosh, you know, just go through your steps and do that.
00:39:27.620
And you'll get your jersey and do that. Well, then that's what they learned. But if the parent says,
00:39:31.440
well, why are we doing this? And let's figure out and let's make the best of this and let's not let
00:39:36.760
this happen again. There were some great lessons learned. Did you have any pushback from any of
00:39:41.180
the parents? All the parents that I heard verbally were positive. So I didn't hear any negative
00:39:47.000
things that way. All the comments that I saw or heard were positive. So what did you have these
00:39:53.960
boys doing that week? Because you were still getting together as a team, but you weren't practicing
00:39:58.480
and playing football. We'd have a study hall scheduled. We had a service project up at the
00:40:04.600
junior high, cleaning up around the junior high. We had a service project at the Villa,
00:40:09.240
a senior citizen center where we went and cleaned windows and hopefully got to see what this community
00:40:15.000
is all about and see other people and how lucky we are and how fortunate we are. They had to have
00:40:20.280
their grades all caught up and taken care of in order to get their jersey back. Those are things I can
00:40:27.020
remember off the top of my head. I remember when that happened and I was proud. I was like,
00:40:31.440
yeah, that was my old coach. I was so proud that you would make that call. And as difficult as it
00:40:36.340
must have been for the boys, obviously, and you, of course, I just felt like that was just the right
00:40:41.680
call. Absolutely. A hundred percent. It was very humbling and it might've been the longest week of my
00:40:47.020
entire life trying to go through and all the national media exposure and the different interviews that
00:40:52.380
they wanted and, and all the things that were going on almost pulled it to a distraction of what we
00:40:58.000
were trying to do. And so it was hard to try to balance all the things that were happening. But I
00:41:02.980
mean, I remember waking up that week. So we did, we suspended them Friday night and I answered my
00:41:08.520
phone or no, I had a message on my phone. It was Monday morning from CNN wanting an interview of what
00:41:15.960
we were doing. And I was like, Oh boy, this is going to be crazy. Yeah. So they did an article
00:41:22.400
in, was it people magazine? It was people or yeah. People magazine. Yeah. CNN. I mean, you had all the
00:41:28.780
big, all the big outlets, I'm sure reaching out to you and interviews and all that stuff as well.
00:41:33.480
It was crazy. And it almost brought it to a point where it was making it look like I was trying to
00:41:38.840
project myself above the boys. And this is what I did. And that was totally what I, I felt real uneasy
00:41:44.340
about it, but I also talked to my admin and they wanted me to do those things and follow through
00:41:49.780
and, and talk about the situations. And so it was a tough week, but it, I felt like it was something
00:41:55.540
that we, we needed to do. And I'm thankful, you know, for a supportive community and a supportive
00:42:00.500
family and the things that we were able to try to get across. Now, are we perfect? No, we still make
00:42:05.940
mistakes. And I still hear, remember when you did that, see, that didn't work. I said, what do you mean
00:42:10.420
it didn't work? It's not going to, it's not a magic fix. It's something that, that they're going
00:42:14.520
to have to understand, but this is where we, the expectation is, and we're going to make mistakes,
00:42:19.440
but we're going to work towards this. So. Yeah. I mean, it's really interesting to hear
00:42:24.040
the naysayers and the critics who will say, you know, this, this one thing that you happen to do
00:42:28.080
this one week out of all the weeks that they'll have in their life didn't work the way you thought
00:42:32.380
it would. And it's like, well, that's not a reason we shouldn't have moved forward with that
00:42:35.540
decision. Yeah, exactly. Oh, at the end of the year, we had some kids go off and do some stuff
00:42:40.480
again, you know, and there's like, see, that didn't even work. It was just, it was just you
00:42:44.540
trying to get on like, no, it did work because they know what's going to happen. And they first
00:42:49.460
reported back to me and they, they knew they'd screwed up and they knew that they were done playing
00:42:53.020
football for that year. And so there are consequences to our decisions. And I think we're, we're learning
00:42:58.900
those. Well, and I think the other thing it does too, is it sets a new precedent because what
00:43:03.820
happens if you don't do it, then it's allowable, it's excusable. And you're basically saying and
00:43:08.900
giving permission to continue the behavior versus Nope, we're going to set a new precedent that says
00:43:13.860
this is not acceptable behavior. And I think we carry those lessons with us our entire lives.
00:43:19.080
Yeah. Whatever we allow, that's what we're teaching. So sometimes it's really hard decisions
00:43:25.040
and sometimes they're, they're pretty easy, but whatever we allow, then we're going to let the
00:43:29.900
youth decide that, Oh, well, I guess this is okay. So we've talked about the boys and how they're
00:43:36.120
being served and how they're growing and how I've grown. I mean, we talked about a lot, but I'm
00:43:39.820
really curious how you feel. This has been advantageous for you because this is a, this is
00:43:44.800
a win-win. I imagine you get just as much out of this. I'm sure as these boys do what's in it for
00:43:49.340
you and what do you feel like you've gained over the past 20 plus years of coaching?
00:43:53.600
Wow. That's a, that's a great question. I think you're going to make me get emotional actually,
00:43:57.680
right? Uh, that was, that was the goal, the whole goal of the, of the podcast.
00:44:02.140
I'm glad it's not video then you can't see, but you'll hear it in my voice. But you know,
00:44:05.980
just, I wanted to still compete. When I first headed off to school, I was going to go into
00:44:12.020
business. I wanted to come back and run my dad's dealership. And you know, that was kind of my idea
00:44:17.120
being a teacher and a coach never even crossed my mind. And then as I went to school, I went through
00:44:23.180
and business classes weren't great for me. And I just felt like I didn't know where I fit in. And
00:44:27.800
I started, you know, looking at some coaching options and then I finally went into education
00:44:32.320
and you can ask my old high school teachers if they ever thought I was going to be a high school
00:44:37.300
educator. You know, they'd say no way they'd bet a million dollars that I would never do that.
00:44:42.920
It's just goes back to what I said earlier. I've had great men in my life, including my father
00:44:49.420
that have influenced me. And I want to give back to that and help the young wayward man.
00:44:55.640
When I wouldn't listen to my father, I had coaches and I had other men that would step in and help.
00:45:01.280
And I would listen to at that time. I always heard my father, but I don't know that I always listened,
00:45:06.340
you know, and I hope to be that hope to be a positive influence. And then to see what's going on,
00:45:12.140
sitting here talking to you and, and you talked about Wayne, I had the opportunity to go to dinner with
00:45:16.860
him over the weekend and Taylor Smith over the weekend. And, and I, I don't want to mention
00:45:22.100
names because then I'm going to leave somebody out. You know, it's just, man, what a, what a cool
00:45:27.300
thing to watch and see all these young men that I've had the opportunity to be around who have
00:45:33.560
influenced me in my life and to watch you guys go on and do great things. And my heart's full as I,
00:45:40.640
whenever I stop and think about all the young boys that I was able to coach and be around and see
00:45:45.880
the men that they are now and the families that they have and the good that they're doing.
00:45:51.060
It's just an honor and a privilege. And you guys helped raise me also. I'm a better dad.
00:45:56.700
I'm a better father. I'm a better coach because of my interactions with you.
00:46:02.460
Well, I really like what you said before you even hit record on this podcast. You said,
00:46:05.820
I don't want to be famous. And I think there's this, there's this trend in society through social
00:46:10.700
media and even what I do, obviously to a degree, it's like, you've, you've got to be out there.
00:46:14.340
You've got to put your information out there. You've got to be well-known, but I think it's a
00:46:18.160
little bit of a dangerous game to solely be driven by your desire to be well-known. And what I see from
00:46:25.440
you is that you may not be famous, right? You may not have this huge reach, but the impact that you
00:46:32.440
do have on the scale that you have literally has the ability to change the world. Because if you just
00:46:38.320
change one of these boys and give them a new perspective, and then they go influence their brothers and
00:46:43.620
their siblings and their guys they play with and, and then their kids, like it transforms the entire
00:46:48.420
world. So I think you have a bigger impact than you give yourself credit for. Like I said, that's
00:46:52.820
not the whole reason I came in is for that. I did come in to have an impact. That is the positive
00:46:58.340
thing. I wanted to have a positive impact and I wanted sports to be a positive impact in, in the
00:47:05.200
young men's lives that I had the opportunity to be around and hopefully teach them how they can use
00:47:10.540
sports in the rest of their life, even though they might not be doing it for, you know, a profession
00:47:14.880
and earning money that way. But how do those things help you in your life to get through your
00:47:19.840
daily decisions? Well, I know you got to get back to class here. So I want to wrap things up, but I
00:47:25.420
want to ask you a couple of questions as we wind down. And that first question is, what does it mean
00:47:29.200
to be a man? Because I actually listened to your book this, this weekend. And I heard you say that,
00:47:33.340
you know, every one I ask, I, so I had lots of things going through my mind as that question was
00:47:38.320
coming up. But I think the biggest thing to me is that you take responsibility and your
00:47:43.440
responsibility for something you have, you're responsible for yourself first. If you're married,
00:47:48.000
you're responsible for your wife and you're responsible for your children as you had, have
00:47:51.740
children. And then as that progresses, Ryan, I think you're responsible in your community.
00:47:57.620
I think we've talked a lot about, you know, men not stepping up and they're too busy to be
00:48:04.200
part of their children's lives. They'd rather just pay money to let somebody else coach their
00:48:08.900
children or take them to some camp or clinic. And, and I've learned, and I've watched through
00:48:14.280
my 23 years of coaching, when there's been dads that take groups of boys to play games and do that,
00:48:21.780
that's when we've been able to have our most success in high school. As dads have, you know,
00:48:26.840
said, Hey, we're going to take this group and this is what I want to do. And we're going to help
00:48:30.300
them. And we're going to teach them and not only teach them to be good ball players, but more
00:48:34.740
importantly, teach them how to be men and how to be honest and, and lose with honor and win with
00:48:39.920
honor and, and be humble. That's what a man is. That's powerful. That's powerful. And, and I've
00:48:45.260
got to tell you is wind things down. Like I tell every one of my guests how much I appreciate them
00:48:49.920
and they've been impactful in my life. But when I say it to you, I mean, you, out of all the guests
00:48:54.020
I've had, you've had a longer impact on me than any other guests I've had and probably been the
00:49:00.900
single greatest male influence as a boy growing up. So I can't even begin to describe how much I
00:49:08.800
appreciate you, how much I respect you and how much you've done for me. So coach, I, I really
00:49:13.480
appreciate you and I'm glad you're able to join me on the show today. Ryan, it's my pleasure. And I
00:49:17.620
want you to know that I love you with all my heart and I'm grateful for us being able to cross paths
00:49:23.400
because you've had a tremendous influence on me also. And, and I appreciate your kind words and
00:49:28.560
I appreciate the good things that you're doing. And I'm your number one fan.
00:49:33.460
Gentlemen, there it is. My conversation with Matt Labrum, like I had mentioned before,
00:49:37.560
and I think you could probably hear it in the conversation, one of the most influential men
00:49:42.280
in my life. And I know even just after having this conversation, I learned some new things and
00:49:47.040
it was inspired to have this conversation. And of course, inspired to go out into my community and do
00:49:52.540
a better job, just a better job than I have in the past of stepping up for not only my children,
00:49:57.560
but also other boys in the community who I think need us probably now more than ever. You know,
00:50:03.780
you've heard me talk a lot about the dismissal of masculinity. And I think the school system,
00:50:08.340
quite frankly, is stacked against our boys. And I feel like it's our job as men who know better,
00:50:15.000
who know the way, who have seen the way, who have seen the path to be able to turn around
00:50:19.480
and encourage those who are still trying to find their way, the young boys in our lives.
00:50:24.400
And of course, our communities, showing them how to succeed, how to thrive and how to be
00:50:29.400
men of value. And that's what we're all about here. And I know that I got a ton from this
00:50:33.760
conversation and I hope that you did as well. I hope you're walking away with some new information,
00:50:39.160
a new perspective as our responsibility as men in the communities in which we serve.
00:50:44.180
So guys, there it is. What a great and powerful show. I hope you enjoyed it. A couple of announcements
00:50:50.120
as I wind things down, I mentioned the legacy event. And I think this actually ties in really
00:50:54.820
nicely with the conversation that we had today. I mean, if you've got sons again, between the ages
00:51:00.120
of eight and 15, whether you're struggling with raising those boys or not, I always think that it's
00:51:06.020
powerful to gain some new perspective, to gain some new insight and a new framework in how you can
00:51:11.960
potentially more adequately raise those boys. I know it's a challenge for me. I've got
00:51:16.580
three boys and a little girl and man, it's challenging. And this event is going to be
00:51:21.520
unlike any other. I mean, you're going to band with your son. You're going to forge a new and
00:51:25.660
more powerful connection. You're going to be able to walk away with some physical skill sets and he as
00:51:31.000
well, that will help both of you succeed as men. And then really just giving you the framework and the
00:51:37.300
foundation for continuing to establish the relationship that you have and continue to lead
00:51:43.100
your boy into the future so that he can go out and lead his family and his community at some point
00:51:49.040
in his life. So go check it out. Orderofman.com slash legacy. Orderofman.com slash legacy. Guys,
00:51:55.540
with that said, I'm going to sign out for today. I appreciate you being on this journey. Quite frankly,
00:52:00.760
we just couldn't do it without you. I mean, without you listening in, without you sharing this
00:52:04.980
information, this movement, and it is a movement. I mean, it spanned the entire globe and without you
00:52:10.940
tuning in each and every week and sharing what we're doing here, we just wouldn't experience the
00:52:15.620
same results. And then of course, have the same impact. And that's what it's all about. We want
00:52:19.480
impact. So if you haven't done this already, make sure you subscribe, leave us a review that goes a
00:52:24.120
long way. And then of course, share this, share this with a brother, a friend, a colleague, a coworker,
00:52:27.940
your father, your cousin, whoever it may be, another man who needs to hear what we're doing inside
00:52:32.380
the order of men. Until next week, guys, take action and become the man you are meant to be.
00:52:38.580
Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life
00:52:43.180
and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at orderofman.com.