Order of Man - Addressing Red Flags, Maintaining Targets, and Programming Discipline

00:00:00.000 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path.

00:00:06.020 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time.

00:00:10.480 You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong.

00:00:15.500 This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become.

00:00:19.760 At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.

00:00:25.120 Mr. Kip Sorensen, what is up, my brother?

00:00:27.960 Not much, man.

00:00:28.740 You ready for another AMA?

00:00:31.600 Another AMA, yeah. It's the best day of the week.

00:00:35.800 Because of the AMA or something else?

00:00:37.920 Yeah.

00:00:38.120 It's got to be something else.

00:00:39.600 Because I get to talk to you. It's the only time.

00:00:42.180 By the way, everyone assumes that we probably have consistent dialogue and we're having a conversation all the time.

00:00:47.500 Not really. This is the only time that I get to speak with the beard is during AMA.

00:00:52.180 That's right. We keep it really efficient around here.

00:00:55.900 Kip's on my schedule.

00:00:56.960 He's got to get a link for a calendar invite.

00:01:00.520 He doesn't have my personal cell phone.

00:01:02.520 Nothing like that.

00:01:03.620 This is business only.

00:01:05.080 Business only.

00:01:05.880 And I start asking questions like, oh, how are you doing?

00:01:08.280 He's like, hey, we're here to record a podcast.

00:01:10.620 We're not going down that route.

00:01:11.720 If you want to know how I'm doing, you put it in queue for a question just like the rest of the guys.

00:01:17.280 Just like everyone else.

00:01:18.720 That's right.

00:01:19.180 If I want to ask you a question, I have to add it to the AMA question.

00:01:22.100 That's right.

00:01:22.560 Well, guys, for those of you who are joining us, we are answering questions from the Facebook group, which I think just cracked 60,000 members.

00:01:34.160 Nice.

00:01:34.960 That's insane.

00:01:36.140 So check that out.

00:01:37.000 Facebook.com slash group slash Order of Man.

00:01:39.040 The Iron Council, which is our exclusive brotherhood at OrderofMan.com slash Iron Council.

00:01:43.820 And then I was also going to tell you, we just broke 50,000 YouTube subscribers.

00:01:49.540 And you can check that out at YouTube.com slash Order of Man.

00:01:53.960 And if you are on YouTube, my camera's being a little funky today with the in and out.

00:01:58.920 Maybe I'll close the blinds.

00:02:00.080 And then if you look right here behind me over my shoulder, you can see my TV.

00:02:04.360 And occasionally, depending on the lighting, you can catch that I still have some of the pink wallpaper up.

00:02:09.220 I've got most of it painted, but you'll catch reflection now and then.

00:02:13.260 And you'll see that there's still some pink wallpaper up in my office, which will be coming down soon.

00:02:17.500 And I do have some ideas for how I'm going to do this recording on video.

00:02:24.280 It's going to be slick.

00:02:25.240 I got some ideas.

00:02:26.160 I got some ideas.

00:02:27.060 I'm anxious to see it.

00:02:28.020 Stay tuned.

00:02:29.040 Okay.

00:02:29.460 Well, let's get right into the questions and see if we can get these guys some answers.

00:02:33.540 And if we can't, we'll make something up.

00:02:35.760 Yeah, we're good at that.

00:02:37.360 We'll tell you that we can't and tell you to go to qualified sources of information.

00:02:43.220 Yeah.

00:02:43.460 Well, and hopefully we have a gamut of qualified resources that we can point you to.

00:02:49.220 And most of them, to be frank, guys, are previous episodes of the podcast.

00:02:53.220 So half these questions or probably the majority of all these questions have been answered on the Tuesday interview or discussions that Ryan has done with someone.

00:03:03.800 The probability is really high.

00:03:05.940 Yeah.

00:03:06.160 Going on almost five years now, we've had thousands and thousands of conversations.

00:03:11.220 So we've likely covered it before, but hopefully we can give you a new perspective or insight that maybe you have not previously considered.

00:03:17.520 So I have one thing of business.

00:03:21.440 In previous episodes, someone asked the question, and it was an episode that you did solo on the AMA.

00:03:30.080 And I've been meaning to bring it up because it's a really pressing item, and I think it's a good discussion point.

00:03:35.540 Is someone asked you the way the toilet paper should be on the outside or on the backside?

00:03:42.720 And you said across the front coming from the top.

00:03:48.100 Right.

00:03:48.760 That's the officially sanctioned order of man way of putting toilet paper on the roll.

00:03:55.240 So my only challenge is...

00:03:57.300 No, there is no challenge to that.

00:03:59.600 With a toddler, that is horrible, right?

00:04:02.740 Because their ability to grab and pull...

00:04:05.040 Watch your kids.

00:04:06.340 Like, don't leave your kids unattended.

00:04:08.500 Like, that's an easy solution.

00:04:10.420 Be a good father.

00:04:11.560 Be a good father is not a problem.

00:04:15.980 That is true, though.

00:04:17.220 That is true.

00:04:18.200 They can access it more easily.

00:04:20.280 But you know what?

00:04:20.940 Any efficient toddler is going to get in there and have just as easy a time as pulling it from the other side as you would over the top or she over the top.

00:04:28.600 Well played.

00:04:29.560 Okay.

00:04:30.100 All right.

00:04:30.500 Fair enough.

00:04:31.000 Well, I tried, guys.

00:04:32.340 I tried.

00:04:33.300 Nobody's on your side.

00:04:34.380 Like, who are you trying to, like, tell them you tried?

00:04:36.860 Everybody knows.

00:04:37.700 Every man who's listening to this knows that it goes over the top.

00:04:41.780 What you don't realize is I've gotten ping saying, dude, Kip, you got to correct Ryan on that whole toilet paper thing, man.

00:04:46.960 Yeah, I'm sure.

00:04:47.780 Those are all the Kurt Brim guys as well, I'm sure.

00:04:52.020 Which is also another funny thing.

00:04:53.700 I'm sorry.

00:04:54.120 I keep getting, now that we've done a few of these videos on YouTube, I'm getting messages saying, dude, you totally don't think, you totally don't look like what I thought you would.

00:05:05.380 Yeah.

00:05:06.160 And I'm totally curious.

00:05:07.220 Who are you expecting?

00:05:08.300 I have no idea.

00:05:09.440 Oh, they don't tell you?

00:05:10.820 Well, I've asked a couple guys, but I don't want to ask everybody.

00:05:15.120 Yeah.

00:05:16.480 They didn't realize.

00:05:18.440 I don't know.

00:05:19.020 I don't know if they were expecting somebody, you know, more handsome or goofier or what.

00:05:24.020 Like that could go, that could go so many ways.

00:05:26.300 Well, and it's funny because I don't think my voice is that unique.

00:05:30.060 Like Echo, for instance, right?

00:05:31.980 On, on Jocko's podcast.

00:05:33.700 The first time I saw who Echo was, I was like, whoa, that threw me off because his voice does not align with.

00:05:42.140 Yeah.

00:05:42.480 That doesn't match up.

00:05:44.720 Right.

00:05:45.040 Unless, you know, Echo and then his personality and you're like, oh, got it.

00:05:48.880 Yeah.

00:05:49.300 That's true.

00:05:49.860 That's true.

00:05:50.760 That's true.

00:05:51.840 Huh?

00:05:52.440 Anyhow.

00:05:52.840 I digress.

00:05:54.180 So the questions today is, is fielded from Facebook.

00:05:57.700 We addressed some iron council questions, I believe last week and the week before.

00:06:01.780 And so these are some Facebook questions to join us there.

00:06:05.160 Go to facebook.com slash group slash order of man.

00:06:08.460 All right.

00:06:09.420 Our first question.

00:06:10.860 I'm jacking up my mic here.

00:06:12.520 Sorry.

00:06:13.100 I can see that.

00:06:13.680 I can hear it too.

00:06:14.700 I know.

00:06:15.300 I'm like super loud.

00:06:17.640 Okay.

00:06:18.580 Tomateo Rima.

00:06:19.460 As someone who is about to get engaged, what questions should my spouse and I be asking

00:06:25.360 ourselves as we move towards marriage?

00:06:27.540 What questions to ask to establish a code or value system for our marriage and relationship?

00:06:33.140 I don't know about specific questions, but topics that you definitely want to bring up

00:06:37.940 are children.

00:06:39.340 How many would you like to have?

00:06:40.920 What is your thought process around raising kids?

00:06:43.460 Where would you like to raise your kids?

00:06:45.100 Do you want to stay here?

00:06:46.740 Do you want to travel?

00:06:47.700 Do you want to be around family?

00:06:48.920 Do you not want to be around family?

00:06:50.200 How many children do you want to have?

00:06:52.200 Ideally, these are all very, very important things.

00:06:55.260 Disciplining children, I think is another very important topic along the same lines.

00:06:59.660 Also religion and spirituality, because that can create a lot of rift between people.

00:07:05.440 Anything that's going to create some sort of animosity or contention in the relationship.

00:07:09.340 Not that these things are necessarily deal breakers.

00:07:11.660 There might be.

00:07:12.500 You might find out that there's a deal breaker and you probably ought to want to figure that

00:07:17.000 out now and adjust accordingly.

00:07:20.500 I'm not saying that's an easy thing to do with somebody you've been with potentially

00:07:23.800 for years and love, but if it's a rough thing now and a deal breaker for you now and you

00:07:29.400 decide to proceed, then it's only going to be a deal breaker down the road.

00:07:33.520 But kids, disciplining kids, where you want to live.

00:07:37.340 With raising kids, I would also ask and really dive into whether your wife wants to stay at

00:07:44.620 home and raise the kids or if she wants to go out into the workforce and pursue a career

00:07:49.780 path and how the kids are going to be taken care of in that perspective.

00:07:53.220 I've known, for example, with my wife, she's a homemaker.

00:07:56.340 She has been a homemaker since we had our first son and has never worked outside of the

00:08:03.900 home after that.

00:08:05.840 That's something that we knew.

00:08:07.140 That wasn't a surprise or any guesswork for me.

00:08:09.360 That was just what the expectation was because we had those discussions.

00:08:13.020 Disciplining children, I may have already said.

00:08:16.120 Also, finances.

00:08:17.620 Finances is very, very important.

00:08:19.680 You need to have some serious discussions about debt.

00:08:23.140 I think people are getting married later in life, which means that there's probably some

00:08:27.460 more baggage there.

00:08:29.360 And when I say baggage, it could be previous relationships.

00:08:32.100 It could be children from another marriage.

00:08:34.360 It could be some emotional drama or baggage.

00:08:37.440 It also could be financial baggage in the form of debt.

00:08:40.340 But you need to figure this stuff out because when you marry, you're going to assume all

00:08:44.240 that.

00:08:44.620 If she's got 50, 75, $100,000 worth of consumer debt or student loan debt, again, maybe not

00:08:50.540 a deal breaker, but something you definitely need to be aware of and have a strategy and

00:08:54.720 a plan for that.

00:08:55.420 Is she a spender?

00:08:56.640 How does she deal with difficult situations?

00:09:00.540 Is she going to go out and spend a bunch of money and maybe complain to friends or family

00:09:06.820 members?

00:09:07.480 I'm kind of taking this as a negative approach and I don't mean it like that.

00:09:11.540 I'm just saying address all of the potential red flags.

00:09:14.920 Anticipate what you guys would potentially argue about or disagree about at least and

00:09:19.740 start talking about those things now before they come up.

00:09:23.720 Ryan, when I think about this question, the first thing that comes to mind is ensuring

00:09:28.500 that your spouse has a growth mindset.

00:09:30.960 100% and without that, there's no evolution of change and becoming better if they're too

00:09:37.740 much of a victim.

00:09:38.920 And I know that's not maybe necessarily the question that he's asking, but me looking back

00:09:44.320 at it, I think that's the first thing that I would validate is, is this person that I'm

00:09:47.920 engaging with and having a relationship with, do they have a growth mindset?

00:09:52.420 Are they open?

00:09:53.340 Are they humble enough?

00:09:54.400 Are they trying to become better physically, mentally, in every way?

00:09:59.620 If that's the foundation, then I really feel that almost anything else can be kind of dealt

00:10:04.320 with.

00:10:05.100 If they don't have that, I mean, there's not much you can do.

00:10:10.180 Yeah.

00:10:10.620 Would you agree?

00:10:11.400 I wholeheartedly agree.

00:10:13.080 And I can't tell you how often we hear from guys who say things like, I'm trying to grow.

00:10:18.480 I'm trying to get better.

00:10:19.260 I'm going to conferences.

00:10:20.060 I'm working out.

00:10:21.080 I'm doing all these things to improve myself.

00:10:22.580 And my wife doesn't appreciate it.

00:10:23.940 Or, you know, how do you get a wife who's not motivated on board?

00:10:27.020 I mean, what are you going to do?

00:10:28.640 Yeah.

00:10:29.080 You can lead by example.

00:10:30.360 You can prod a little bit.

00:10:31.580 You can try to tie it into something that she's engaged with or meaningful for her.

00:10:35.860 But ultimately, if she doesn't have this growth oriented mindset, maybe you have a dud.

00:10:42.740 I hate saying it like that, but you want to know now and you want to address it accordingly

00:10:47.920 before you get yourself into a marriage and then realize that five, seven, 10 years down

00:10:51.900 the road, when you guys have two and a half kids together and the white picket fence and

00:10:55.780 everything else, and then everything shatters and falls down around you because you built

00:11:00.340 it on this faulty foundation that wasn't mutually agreeable.

00:11:04.320 Yeah, totally.

00:11:05.620 You know, you said something I think is profound and it's, and it was around the space of if

00:11:11.180 it's difficult now, or if it's a red flag now, it's certainly going to be one later.

00:11:15.880 That is so true.

00:11:18.500 I've even heard from therapists who, and this is horrible, horrible, that recommend that

00:11:25.420 those who are having relationship problems, that they get married and that will fix things.

00:11:31.520 Marriage is hard.

00:11:33.380 It's hard work.

00:11:34.540 And there's a lot of guys that are listening that says, oh, marriage is stupid.

00:11:36.760 It's a broken institution.

00:11:37.760 I don't believe that.

00:11:39.260 It's for, to me, it's difficult, but it's worth fighting for.

00:11:42.820 It's worth the difficulty.

00:11:44.320 A hundred percent.

00:11:45.340 I mean, so it was going, going to the gym is difficult.

00:11:47.960 So should I not do it?

00:11:49.540 Having an uncomfortable conversation is difficult.

00:11:51.960 So should I not do it?

00:11:53.800 No, it's not why we do or don't do things.

00:11:57.120 It's the ultimate result.

00:11:58.820 So I've heard that advice, getting married.

00:12:01.240 I've also heard the advice of struggling marriages to have kids, have a kid that'll bring

00:12:05.860 you guys together.

00:12:06.680 Know that a child is quite literally a wedge between you and your partner.

00:12:11.540 And again, I'm not saying don't have kids.

00:12:13.540 I'm saying realize it's not easy.

00:12:16.580 It's a very difficult thing.

00:12:18.680 And you're not going to draw closer or fix something by having a child or rushing into

00:12:24.660 a marriage.

00:12:25.440 It's only going to get worse.

00:12:27.140 On the flip side of this, I'm curious if you agree with this because I, me personally,

00:12:31.800 I had this issue when I got married.

00:12:33.700 Um, I believed, or I thought that it should be like, I had this expectation that it was

00:12:41.140 going to be super easy.

00:12:42.780 And if it wasn't easy and perfect, then something was wrong.

00:12:47.020 And I remember I got in a fight, this is my like first couple of years of my marriage.

00:12:52.520 I got in this, uh, you know how it is.

00:12:54.740 Some fight that I don't even remember what it was.

00:12:57.140 It was over something probably stupid, who knows what.

00:12:59.760 And I remember I called my brother and I'm just ranting, right?

00:13:03.780 Man, and this and that, and I'm sharing my drama and all this, you know, how tough this

00:13:10.240 whole thing is.

00:13:11.160 And then he just starts laughing on the phone, just starts laughing.

00:13:14.980 He's like, Oh my gosh, this is so funny.

00:13:17.720 I'm like, what are you laughing about?

00:13:19.620 I was angry.

00:13:20.680 And he's like, welcome to marriage.

00:13:23.440 Yeah.

00:13:24.240 It's hard.

00:13:25.920 Like, don't accept it.

00:13:28.080 Like you always strive to make it better, but guess what?

00:13:31.280 It's not easy and, but I was approaching it from the perspective of, Oh, if it's hard,

00:13:37.640 then it's wrong.

00:13:38.800 Like I, it shouldn't be this way.

00:13:41.340 And I made a mistake almost from that perspective, not from the perspective of, okay, this is hard.

00:13:47.880 Let's deal with the circumstance and move on.

00:13:49.720 And by the way, this is somewhat normal.

00:13:51.740 So don't add too much meaning to the fact that it's hard.

00:13:54.600 That was a new concept to me.

00:13:56.780 And so through the years, whenever young couples of, of friends are getting married or whatever,

00:14:02.380 and we have to write a card, right?

00:14:05.720 Congratulations card.

00:14:06.560 I always write something in there.

00:14:08.720 Like, this is going to be the hardest thing that you will ever do.

00:14:12.720 And that's perfect.

00:14:14.640 Yeah.

00:14:14.900 That's what they need.

00:14:15.360 Stick with it, you know, push through, enjoy, try for an amazing marriage, make it amazing,

00:14:22.300 but just know it's not going to be easy.

00:14:24.580 Do you agree?

00:14:25.440 Yeah.

00:14:26.060 Yeah.

00:14:26.280 It's, it's not, I think that's a trap of modern times is that we believe that things

00:14:30.860 are supposed to be easy and comfortable and, and everything should just work and be smooth.

00:14:35.860 And if it doesn't, then maybe you're on the wrong path or you're pursuing the wrong career

00:14:39.520 or you don't have the right woman.

00:14:41.280 It doesn't mean the car in man.

00:14:43.220 Yeah.

00:14:43.960 Yeah.

00:14:44.220 Just trade the car in if it's not working.

00:14:45.960 Right.

00:14:46.440 It doesn't mean any of that.

00:14:48.000 It just means there's some character deficiencies and flaws between her and you.

00:14:52.060 Yeah.

00:14:52.980 And then you're going to need to figure it out.

00:14:55.080 If you want to maintain the relationship and the marriage.

00:14:58.360 Yeah.

00:14:59.200 All right.

00:14:59.800 Michael Johnson, how long after a serious relationship do you start dating again?

00:15:04.440 This gets into the should question.

00:15:07.860 Like what should I do or what's the right thing to do?

00:15:10.680 There's no answer to that.

00:15:11.940 I can't answer that.

00:15:12.660 There is no answer.

00:15:13.800 The only answer is when you feel like you're ready.

00:15:16.140 I should say this.

00:15:17.780 You feel like you're ready enough.

00:15:20.360 Yeah.

00:15:21.200 Cause you're probably not going to be a hundred percent ready.

00:15:24.040 It's always good.

00:15:24.680 I hated the dating scene, man.

00:15:26.400 I hated the dating scene and, and you're never going to be completely ready.

00:15:31.140 Uh, you're never going to be a hundred percent at ease if you're trying to get back into the

00:15:35.100 dating scene, but you might be ready enough.

00:15:38.520 So I can't answer that question for you.

00:15:41.380 Uh, I would say that you probably, unless this was something serious, like a serious marriage

00:15:47.360 and you were together for 20 years, you probably ought to jump into it at least casually quicker

00:15:52.920 than you would think.

00:15:55.500 I'm not saying you need to look for your next girlfriend or your next life partner, but

00:15:59.240 man, go have some fun with, with members of the opposite sex.

00:16:03.080 And, and don't, I would say don't lead her along, you know, don't, don't play it to something

00:16:07.160 it's not, but just go be around women.

00:16:10.360 It's, it's, I like being around women.

00:16:12.300 I like the presence of females.

00:16:14.100 And so you don't have to get married to the next woman that comes along, but if you're

00:16:18.460 young and it wasn't very serious, your previous relationship, then jump in, go have some

00:16:24.140 fun, keep the expectations low, get yourself back in the game and start learning what works

00:16:29.680 for you and what doesn't and, and whatnot.

00:16:32.140 I actually have a funny story about this.

00:16:34.400 So as most guys know, I, I got divorced.

00:16:37.120 I was in my late twenties, two kids dating, which was horrible that I can't imagine.

00:16:45.740 I'm just like, I can't, I couldn't handle it.

00:16:48.800 The girls I was dating were like, someone were like out of college.

00:16:52.240 And so they're like, Oh, I'm so full of stress.

00:16:54.400 I have this paper due.

00:16:55.500 I'm like, yeah, I just can't relate.

00:16:58.680 That was so long ago for me.

00:17:00.040 Like it was awkward.

00:17:02.000 But, but to, to Michael's question, what was funny is I was dating a few girls and it was

00:17:09.420 quasi getting serious.

00:17:10.860 And when you have kids, it's unfortunate because I played this game of like, I don't want them

00:17:16.260 around my kids too often until it's more serious.

00:17:19.860 And then they would use that as a measuring stick to see like, Oh, we're not that serious

00:17:25.120 because he hasn't introduced me to the boys yet.

00:17:27.180 And it was this weird dynamic, but, but regardless, I dated a couple of girls and they started

00:17:33.000 getting pretty serious.

00:17:33.940 And we started having those conversations and I didn't feel, I didn't feel ready.

00:17:38.440 Right.

00:17:39.120 And my default opinion was it's too soon.

00:17:42.840 Right.

00:17:43.120 I'm not ready yet.

00:17:44.340 I'm, I'm still damaged goods or whatever phrase that you want to use.

00:17:48.700 And then I met Asia and the next day I was like, I think I'm going to marry her.

00:17:55.880 Really?

00:17:56.400 That quick.

00:17:56.860 Which was, which was funny because apparently it had nothing to do with how long it's been

00:18:03.100 since I've been divorced.

00:18:04.040 I thought it was, but it wasn't, it just wasn't the right girl.

00:18:07.340 Once I met the right girl, I was like, Oh yeah, I'm ready.

00:18:11.240 And everything's been blissful and peaceful and, and it's been perfect ever since.

00:18:15.800 Yeah.

00:18:15.920 We don't argue or anything.

00:18:17.420 Yeah.

00:18:18.880 I actually think arguing is a good thing in a relationship to a degree.

00:18:25.680 Isn't that what you want?

00:18:26.920 Essentially out of a life partner, somebody who's going to challenge you and debate a little

00:18:31.240 bit.

00:18:31.720 Yeah.

00:18:31.940 Well, I don't, and I don't mean when I say challenge, that's right.

00:18:34.580 When I say challenge, I'm not saying just be a complete pain in the rear.

00:18:39.780 I'm saying somebody who's going to challenge you to step up, to level up.

00:18:44.480 My wife does that for me and, and, and I do it for her.

00:18:48.540 We challenge each other in positive and constructive ways.

00:18:51.560 And sometimes that's smooth.

00:18:53.500 And other times, you know, there's some resistance on one of our parts, but we challenge each other

00:18:57.900 to improve.

00:18:58.560 And part of that means that at times we're going to disagree and, and, and debate and

00:19:04.380 potentially get into arguments, but it's all done from a position of, Hey, I'm, I'm, I'm,

00:19:08.480 I'm vested in this thing.

00:19:09.820 I want this thing to work.

00:19:10.940 And it would be weird if you didn't argue to me.

00:19:14.780 I think if you didn't argue, you probably just don't care enough about the relationship

00:19:18.020 or her potentially or yourself.

00:19:20.120 Or you're not engaged on anything.

00:19:22.780 Right.

00:19:23.260 You're just both passive and letting them do whatever.

00:19:25.540 And, and I know some people like that and it's not, it's, it's, it seems okay on the

00:19:31.500 surface right now, but to me, it's, it's a volcano just brewing under the surface.

00:19:38.380 It looks docile and it looks dormant right now, but it's brewing.

00:19:42.800 It's down there.

00:19:43.820 And when the slightest little thing, the slightest little variable happens, a disagreement or

00:19:50.000 a misunderstanding or miscommunication or misperception, boom, the thing erupts and

00:19:56.340 it's all over.

00:19:57.540 Yeah.

00:19:57.860 And, and for, I like this, if you don't mind me suggesting this, because I think sometimes

00:20:03.240 guys in a relationship might see their, if their wife is not expressing those things,

00:20:08.520 right, or not challenging them in some unique way that they may assume that it's her choice.

00:20:15.400 Well, it's always her choice, but they'll assume that she's not doing that because she's

00:20:19.520 just choosing not to and take no ownership in that.

00:20:22.860 We got to be mindful sometimes that our spouses may not choose to express their feelings or what

00:20:29.940 is going on with them or their opinion, because you have bulldozed them in the past that she

00:20:37.140 has expressed something to you.

00:20:38.200 And then you're like, and you cut her off and you bulldoze her.

00:20:41.580 And then she probably has some internal dialogue of, well, I'm not going to share my head again.

00:20:46.400 Yeah.

00:20:47.060 So we got to be mindful if she is being somewhat passive with you and not communicating you,

00:20:52.560 the probability is you probably own a great portion of why that's not happening.

00:20:57.960 And if you do, I think your marriage is going to be better.

00:21:00.860 Yeah.

00:21:01.340 I already know.

00:21:02.160 I know we're going to get messages from guys like, well, you know, you're just making yourself

00:21:06.640 subservient to her and you're, you're, you're taking the burden of responsibility or blame.

00:21:12.720 No, you're not being unrealistic.

00:21:16.120 You're not, you're not saying that she doesn't have her part to play in it.

00:21:19.920 You're just accepting a part that you have control over.

00:21:25.660 That's it.

00:21:26.440 That's not, that's not subservient.

00:21:28.720 That's not unmanly.

00:21:30.640 It's just that you accept a burden of some of the responsibility and you correct the

00:21:36.040 behavior to the degree that you can.

00:21:38.320 Yeah.

00:21:38.500 And it's effective communication.

00:21:40.100 How often does that happen in the workplace or even, even on a more minor perspective,

00:21:45.140 like kids, like I think about that sometimes when I get riled up at our kids and I'm like,

00:21:50.300 Oh, I get frustrated.

00:21:51.740 And I think, wait a second, hold on.

00:21:53.300 I'm the adult and I can't manipulate my communication well enough to get that kid to listen to me.

00:21:58.960 That's not a good sign.

00:22:00.200 That's a great point.

00:22:01.980 And I love when people say, and when I say I love, I, I kind of get a kick out of it.

00:22:05.860 It's funny to me.

00:22:06.560 It's comical at this point when I hear guys say, well, that's just the way I am.

00:22:12.360 Take it or leave it.

00:22:13.600 It's just who I am.

00:22:14.500 I'm like, that is such an immature, incomplete thought.

00:22:17.540 That's what little boys say.

00:22:19.400 But men say, Oh, you know what?

00:22:21.340 I can adapt.

00:22:22.200 I can, I can, I can change.

00:22:23.940 I can utilize different tools.

00:22:25.300 I can implement different strategies in my communication to be more effective.

00:22:29.040 Because ultimately what you're trying to do is to get somebody to do something.

00:22:33.860 Another word for that is influence.

00:22:36.020 Yeah.

00:22:36.460 And, and that means that you're going to need to not change fundamentally who you are,

00:22:41.980 but change or adapt the strategy to elicit the correct response out of your partner

00:22:49.620 or your child or your employee or your team member or fill in the blank.

00:22:55.620 Yeah.

00:22:55.920 Teacher, boss.

00:22:56.800 I mean, we, we, whatever our teenage boys, we say this to them all the time.

00:23:00.000 He's always like, Oh, I don't like my teacher, blah, blah, blah, dude.

00:23:02.540 Play the game.

00:23:03.860 Yeah.

00:23:04.540 How do you get him to like you?

00:23:06.400 What would you need to do?

00:23:07.960 That's what you need to do to establish a positive relationship with someone.

00:23:11.040 It's, and it's not, and I don't think it's manipulation because it's rooted in trying

00:23:16.680 to be effective.

00:23:17.920 I think it's exactly manipulation.

00:23:20.000 I think that's exactly what it is.

00:23:21.340 We think that manipulation is negative.

00:23:25.280 It's not.

00:23:26.520 Yeah.

00:23:26.960 You know, if I'm like, for example, if, if I noticed that the audio on this podcast is

00:23:32.260 off, then I can adjust the microphone here and I can manipulate this arm so that the audio

00:23:38.720 is more clear, closer to me.

00:23:40.600 It sounds better.

00:23:41.820 Is that negative?

00:23:43.360 No, it's actually positive.

00:23:45.120 You're manipulating something in order to produce a positive and effective outcomes.

00:23:49.980 So I would be very, very careful of fixing a negative connotation to the word manipulation.

00:23:57.000 We're so afraid to use it.

00:23:58.200 Oh, heaven forbid.

00:23:59.040 We say influence or manipulate guys.

00:24:01.500 Words have meaning and what meaning we're attaching to them is what matters.

00:24:05.100 So I don't care if you want to use that word or something else, but ultimately you are trying

00:24:09.800 to get people to respond.

00:24:12.160 And if some, you know, sometimes I'm going to be more, more vocal or more commanding in

00:24:18.260 my delivery and other times I'm going to be more empathetic and try to be more understanding

00:24:22.220 because that type of response is what's going to elicit a change of behavior or thought

00:24:28.440 process in another human being that I have responsibility for.

00:24:32.120 I think it's negative because most people assume that you're out of integrity and you're

00:24:37.060 being a way that you're not, or you're being dishonest, which then the issue is being out

00:24:41.700 of integrity or being dishonest.

00:24:43.800 It's not actually in the minute manipulation itself.

00:24:46.340 That's, I agree with that.

00:24:47.900 It's, it's the intent behind it and the old adage of why you're doing it or how you do

00:24:54.920 it is just as important as what you're actually doing.

00:24:57.960 So a lot of people will say things, we've heard this as well, that the, um, the, what

00:25:04.460 has it go?

00:25:04.960 The outcome justifies the means, right?

00:25:07.680 No, it doesn't.

00:25:10.520 We, I agree in some levels, but I think probably more accurate, more or a higher percentage of

00:25:18.120 the time is that by doing the right things, the right way will naturally inevitably yield

00:25:27.460 a better result, a higher percentage of the time.

00:25:31.060 Totally.

00:25:31.540 So the outcomes don't justify the means.

00:25:34.060 If you're using that as a rationalization to do something unethical, illegal, or immoral.

00:25:39.880 But I think there's a lot of people that don't agree with that.

00:25:43.340 Yeah.

00:25:43.600 What, and what's the purpose of life to have?

00:25:47.420 Oh, outcome, outcome.

00:25:48.660 I got all what I wanted.

00:25:49.840 No, it's about how you show up in the kind of man you were, which is all about how you do

00:25:56.060 things, not necessarily the outcome or what we get from our actions.

00:26:00.020 The outcome handles itself.

00:26:02.280 Yeah.

00:26:02.640 You want to be fit, go to the gym and work out correctly.

00:26:05.760 Eat right.

00:26:07.380 You, you couldn't, if you did that, there's nothing you could do to deviate or alter the

00:26:15.740 result, right?

00:26:18.460 Like if you ate correctly and you consume the right nutrients, the right foods, and you exercise

00:26:23.640 correctly, there's nothing else you could do that would change that result.

00:26:29.000 So that's why in the battle plan, we talk about this so much is you need to have a vision.

00:26:34.080 You need to understand what you want.

00:26:35.980 You need to know what type of man you want to be.

00:26:39.040 You need to fixate your attention and your focus on some objective.

00:26:44.760 But once you have the target locked in, now you have to work backwards into the tactics

00:26:48.740 and then start focusing your time, energy, attention on the tactics rather than the result

00:26:54.180 they will yield because what guys will do is if they're so fixated on the target, they,

00:27:00.100 we have a tendency of being impatient.

00:27:02.620 I've talked a lot about that personally for myself.

00:27:04.600 And I realized that I'm not achieving the goal as fast as I'd like.

00:27:07.660 Let's take the gym, for example.

00:27:08.860 Okay.

00:27:09.100 If your goal is to lose 20 pounds and that's what you're fixated on, if you only lose half

00:27:15.860 a pound this week, you're going to be upset and you're going to start to deviate the course

00:27:20.840 when that would have worked, how you just maintained it because your attention wasn't

00:27:25.780 on the tactic.

00:27:26.360 It was on, it was overly and hyper-focused on the result rather than the tactic that's going

00:27:31.880 to yield the result.

00:27:32.680 And this is why having subject matter experts who are communicating with you and you're learning

00:27:39.800 from is very, very important is because what they'll do is they'll help you get over those

00:27:45.000 hurdles and keep you fixated on the activity.

00:27:48.580 That's why, for example, when it comes to working out, hiring a coach is a very important thing

00:27:53.640 to do, whether that's going into a CrossFit gym or, or even purchasing or, or subscribing to

00:27:59.080 some online course from credible and reputable experts, because they're going to help you

00:28:04.420 maintain the course of action when you can't fully see the target.

00:28:09.480 So in the, so I spent time in the military, I was in the national guard.

00:28:13.140 And then of course I did my active duty tour in Ramadi, Iraq, and we were an artillery unit.

00:28:18.660 So we were using, uh, howitzers, uh, particularly the paladin, um, and it's indirect fire as opposed

00:28:27.100 to direct fire.

00:28:28.040 So very, uh, I'm trying to simplify this, but direct fire is basically engaging with a target.

00:28:35.060 You can see, uh, indirect fire is engaging with a target that you can't see.

00:28:40.080 And is it to generate coverage or to distance, adjust them, maintain distance, those kinds of

00:28:48.480 things, maintain distance, maintain the element of surprise.

00:28:51.480 Uh, there's a lot of reasons that, that go into that, but of course, the further you can be from a

00:28:55.780 target and still engage, the safer you are.

00:28:58.000 Yeah.

00:28:58.500 So this indirect fire is more like life than direct fire in that there's so many other things

00:29:05.400 that get in the way that might cloud our ultimate objective that we may not see it, that it's very

00:29:10.960 easy to lose our way.

00:29:13.160 It's the same thing with, uh, land navigation.

00:29:16.640 You know, if you have a map in front of you and you see this mountain you're trying to get to,

00:29:20.400 and you notice that it's due East and I'm not a land nav expert.

00:29:23.220 So somebody correct me if I'm wrong, the concept will work.

00:29:26.800 It's due East and you start walking.

00:29:29.680 You're like, I'm just going to walk East.

00:29:31.320 So here's where I am.

00:29:32.680 There's that.

00:29:33.300 Okay.

00:29:33.560 I'm going to walk East.

00:29:35.220 You're going to get off course, right?

00:29:37.760 Because you have to navigate rocks and rivers and a mountain.

00:29:41.620 And, and then there's different forces at work that, that are taking you off path and

00:29:47.260 off course.

00:29:47.820 And then if you don't have a compass constantly checking your, your heading, if you're going

00:29:53.740 to get off course and you're not going to hit that ultimate objective because you, you

00:29:57.120 can't see it and you have nothing to measure your current path against.

00:30:00.200 What?

00:30:00.420 And if you, if you're not looking up to validate where East is and your head is down, right?

00:30:06.140 Saying I'm heading that way.

00:30:07.820 Right.

00:30:08.480 What is that?

00:30:09.080 You're going to eventually go north and who knows what?

00:30:11.160 Yeah, exactly.

00:30:11.780 So there's so many different scenarios why the battle plan works so well.

00:30:17.520 I have no idea how in the world we got to this conversation based on, but I think it's

00:30:27.660 all, all valuable stuff.

00:30:30.860 That's funny.

00:30:31.740 I don't even know how that translated a battle play.

00:30:35.000 Ryan was able to successfully tell you about the battle from someone asking about serious

00:30:41.000 relationships.

00:30:44.180 Well played.

00:30:45.180 Well played.

00:30:46.160 All right.

00:30:46.740 What do we got next?

00:30:48.420 Pedro Kapaner.

00:30:50.020 How does one kid keep a strong faith?

00:30:52.600 If at home, the parents act differently than at church.

00:30:57.360 Okay.

00:30:57.840 So here's something that we hear in our church culture quite a bit.

00:31:04.520 Kip, you'll agree with me on this.

00:31:05.780 Yeah.

00:31:06.300 Is that the church is perfect.

00:31:09.600 The people are not.

00:31:11.000 Right.

00:31:12.700 We hear that.

00:31:13.660 Yeah.

00:31:13.860 And I even take that with a grain of salt because even the establishment of the church,

00:31:18.600 and when I say the church, I'm talking about our church, LDS, right?

00:31:22.320 Even the establishment of the LDS church was established by men who were, you know what

00:31:29.520 I'm saying?

00:31:30.040 Right.

00:31:30.220 Not perfect.

00:31:31.140 Right.

00:31:31.400 So I even take that with a grain of salt.

00:31:32.900 But the adage and the idea is the same, is that people are imperfect.

00:31:38.780 You're judging your parents for being imperfect.

00:31:40.940 Guess what?

00:31:41.560 You're imperfect too.

00:31:42.360 So you don't need to judge what is true or what you believe to be true based on somebody

00:31:52.560 else's interpretation, behavior, actions, or words.

00:31:57.060 Because it actually has very little to do with that.

00:32:01.740 Like we hear it a lot.

00:32:02.620 It's like so many members of the church are hypocritical.

00:32:05.320 Yeah.

00:32:05.940 All of us are.

00:32:07.960 They happen to be members of the church, but they also happen to be human beings.

00:32:11.900 We all have character flaws.

00:32:15.040 So does that mean that the church that you are engaged with is wrong?

00:32:20.880 No, it just means somebody is a human being.

00:32:25.460 So I would be very, very careful of attaching people's behavior to a particular church.

00:32:33.460 Now, one thing I would be careful of is if somebody is using their church or their doctrine

00:32:39.840 or their scriptures to justify their behavior that you know is not correct or not moral,

00:32:45.520 that's something different.

00:32:46.540 That's not what I'm talking about here.

00:32:48.560 But look, we all have flaws.

00:32:50.660 We all have things that we're working on.

00:32:52.960 The way that they behave certainly might be hypocritical, not excusing them of that.

00:32:59.060 But it doesn't necessarily represent what your faith is about and what it represents.

00:33:05.780 Because isn't faith really just, to go back to the land nav thing, it's something to aim

00:33:13.400 for.

00:33:15.040 And we're all on the path, right?

00:33:17.820 Kip, you and I are on the path.

00:33:19.300 We have a similar objective because of our faith, but it's our faith that keeps us on the

00:33:23.920 path.

00:33:24.480 Now, we all got on that path at different points.

00:33:26.840 We're all in different starting points.

00:33:28.800 We've all been dealt a hand that we are going to have to navigate a little differently.

00:33:33.100 But ultimately, we're trying to get to the same place because of the shared faith that

00:33:37.880 we have, although our circumstances might be different.

00:33:40.660 So these individuals aren't perfect, your parents in this case, and you're not perfect.

00:33:45.500 They're trying to get there.

00:33:47.500 Afford them some grace, just like you hope that somebody would afford you some grace.

00:33:52.600 Yeah.

00:33:52.900 And when you think about them specifically, would you rather have them not go to church

00:33:59.520 because they're quote unquote hypocrites?

00:34:01.480 Mm-hmm.

00:34:02.700 No.

00:34:03.440 Yeah.

00:34:04.140 Right?

00:34:04.720 The guy sinning the night before, like I used to have this mentality when I was younger.

00:34:08.980 You know, you're in high school and you have certain kids that are like a certain way

00:34:12.720 in high school, right?

00:34:13.960 Probably not the best of kids.

00:34:15.480 And then they're at church and you're thinking, no, that guy's a hypocrite.

00:34:18.760 But a mature way of seeing that is good.

00:34:22.760 I'm glad they're there because now they have the opportunity to repent or hear a different

00:34:30.100 message and maybe that might benefit them.

00:34:32.320 Like if anything, any church for that matter should be full of sinners.

00:34:37.720 Like, and I don't care what their sins are.

00:34:40.420 They should all be there.

00:34:42.100 And by the way, and I'll say this, and you know this as well, is that when you and I are

00:34:46.380 in congregation, we are among those sinners.

00:34:48.540 Of course, totally, totally, without a doubt.

00:34:51.860 Yeah.

00:34:52.100 But we should never say, oh, they shouldn't be here because their sins are greater in

00:34:57.720 some unique way.

00:34:58.600 It's like, no, everyone should be there even if they just sin the night before.

00:35:01.920 I don't care.

00:35:03.260 It's a good place for them to be.

00:35:06.880 One thought for Pedro here is it's ironic how you perceive something will drastically change

00:35:16.720 your approach.

00:35:17.400 That same conversation about parents acting differently at church, I didn't have that

00:35:22.300 personally, but I had two parents that were, for all intents and purposes, during my high

00:35:27.340 school years were virtually inactive, right?

00:35:31.040 They never went to church and for their own reasons.

00:35:36.340 Now, I could have used that and said, oh, well, I'm not going to go because they're not going

00:35:42.220 to go, but I actually twisted that, turned it on its head, and I saw it as, oh, well,

00:35:47.420 this is even more important that I should go.

00:35:50.680 And it was even more of a driving factor that they weren't going that I should actually go.

00:35:55.860 So it's a lot about how we perceive things and use it to strengthen you.

00:36:01.000 Don't use it to weaken you.

00:36:03.500 And it's all about, I don't know, do you understand what I'm trying to say?

00:36:08.080 It's how we choose or the meaning that we want to add around it could really benefit

00:36:12.960 us or it could be a negative thing for us as well.

00:36:17.060 100%.

00:36:17.500 Yeah.

00:36:18.040 I would also add, in addition to that, I think you're spot on with that, is find other people

00:36:23.020 who are walking the path that you're choosing to walk through as well.

00:36:26.680 It's not enough to look at things negatively or see the faults in things and then just assume

00:36:30.920 because you see the faults, then you're going to navigate a different path.

00:36:35.600 You have to consciously make that decision as well.

00:36:37.740 That's part of the reason that I do this podcast.

00:36:40.080 When I started the Order of Men podcast in the spring of 2015, I just wanted to have some

00:36:46.100 conversations with men who inspired me.

00:36:48.040 Hmm.

00:36:49.600 Period.

00:36:50.320 That's it.

00:36:51.180 Yeah.

00:36:51.400 Now it's turned into something else.

00:36:53.180 Now, I wouldn't say something else entirely, but it's grown exponentially from that day and

00:36:58.120 it's become a lot more meaningful and significant than those early days.

00:37:04.000 But I was inspired by guys like Brett McKay with Art of Manliness, and I still am.

00:37:09.540 I was inspired by, gosh, too many men to even name and list.

00:37:14.380 And I just wanted to have good conversations with them because I believed that if I put

00:37:21.380 myself in the vicinity of them and had conversations, that I could learn something that would help

00:37:26.960 me on my own path.

00:37:28.160 And that's certainly been the case.

00:37:30.340 Yeah.

00:37:30.500 That's cool.

00:37:32.780 All right.

00:37:33.060 Chase Tilton, what role does therapy play in reconciling a marriage, keeping it strong,

00:37:40.540 fixing yourself when in a rut, and maintaining your own mental health?

00:37:44.260 Well, it's been a long time since I've been to either individual therapy or, I mean, I was

00:37:52.360 a kid.

00:37:52.800 I did some therapy.

00:37:53.640 My mom got me involved in therapy, and frankly, I hated it.

00:37:56.780 That was a bad experience.

00:37:58.160 That actually goes into our last question as to, does therapy work?

00:38:02.680 Depends on the therapist, right?

00:38:03.940 I believe it can, but it's the therapist that might have more to play at that than anything

00:38:11.280 else.

00:38:12.260 And the patient, for lack of a better term, too.

00:38:15.280 Like, if you go in there with a mindset, this is crap, and it's not going to help, and this

00:38:19.760 is a waste of time and stupid, then, yeah, it is a waste of time, and it's not going to

00:38:24.140 help, and it's stupid because you're going to self-manifest that.

00:38:27.940 But I went to some therapy when my wife and I went through our separation.

00:38:33.940 And having a mediator there to help us understand our own thought processes, to help us interpret

00:38:42.480 a lack of or an inability to communicate effectively on both my wife and my part was

00:38:50.900 extremely valuable, invaluable, I would say.

00:38:55.300 She was like a translator for us in a lot of ways because I didn't understand what was

00:39:01.620 going on with my wife.

00:39:02.580 I remember one exercise in particular.

00:39:05.260 Our therapist said, Ryan, what do you do to communicate your love for your wife?

00:39:14.360 And I said, well, I get up, and I go to work, and I provide, and I do everything I can to

00:39:20.440 grow this business.

00:39:21.400 And I feel like if I can provide for her financially and have a home, then I'm communicating love.

00:39:27.160 And my wife is like, well, all that I see is that you leave, and you don't want to be here,

00:39:33.420 and you aren't engaged with me.

00:39:35.340 You're more engaged with your work.

00:39:38.000 And then she asked my wife, she said, well, what do you do to help with this?

00:39:43.880 You see, so she interpreted that for us, and neither one of us saw what the other one saw.

00:39:50.880 It was lost in translation.

00:39:53.420 Yeah.

00:39:54.040 Well, and I wonder, and I wonder too, Ryan, is if you were clear on that, and then you

00:39:59.280 went to your wife and said, well, honey, I'm doing this, and this, and this, because I love

00:40:04.460 you, if she would have bought that, right?

00:40:07.300 Versus if it came from a third party, she was like, oh, okay.

00:40:11.060 Like, it's a little bit easier to accept certain things when it's coming from a third party as

00:40:16.360 well than just clarity from you, maybe.

00:40:19.620 I do hear what you're saying, but I don't think that's a mark of a good therapist.

00:40:23.200 I think the mark of a great therapist is to just interject periodically to help navigate

00:40:29.180 those waters.

00:40:30.120 So it wouldn't be like, see, this is what he meets, Tricia.

00:40:33.840 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:40:34.580 It's more like, okay, well, so Ryan, when you do that, that's communicating love.

00:40:40.420 Tricia, what does that communicate to you?

00:40:43.120 Okay.

00:40:43.820 Instead of that, what would communicate love?

00:40:47.380 Yeah.

00:40:47.980 And now Tricia comes back and she says, well, this, and this, and this actually means love.

00:40:51.780 Oh, I didn't realize that.

00:40:54.480 And, and to your point earlier about going to communicate that to Tricia is like, if I

00:40:58.680 go in there without a therapist or a third party and without recognizing, I'm going to go

00:41:02.020 in and say, well, I do this and this, and this, what's your problem?

00:41:05.420 Why don't you appreciate me?

00:41:07.900 Yeah.

00:41:08.900 I mean, how, come on.

00:41:10.700 Totally.

00:41:11.020 How many guys are listening to this that have either had that thought or literally said those

00:41:15.620 words?

00:41:16.060 Why don't you appreciate everything I'm doing for you?

00:41:18.920 Yeah.

00:41:20.280 Because it's not communicating it or you're not communicating or your actions aren't communicating

00:41:25.880 what she needs.

00:41:27.280 You, I'm not, I don't doubt that you mean it.

00:41:29.360 I just don't know if she's receiving it that way.

00:41:33.920 So, so to answer your question, what role does therapy play?

00:41:37.320 Look, it's been a long time.

00:41:38.260 It's been over 10 years since my wife and I went to therapy.

00:41:40.820 Would it serve us well?

00:41:42.140 Yeah, probably.

00:41:43.300 Uh, I, I tend to lean more towards that.

00:41:47.860 It's a good thing and it can be very, very valuable in, especially in a strained relationship,

00:41:54.220 but potentially even in a unstrained or a healthy relationship too.

00:41:57.840 So yeah, Asia and I, I think our marriage is going great.

00:42:02.080 We, once a month we go to a therapist.

00:42:04.700 You do once a month, we just have this reoccurring meeting and sometimes we go in there and we're

00:42:10.520 like, so what'd you talk about?

00:42:14.620 And we'll try to, you know, we'll think of something or, you know, we'll just drum up

00:42:19.340 some shit in the past.

00:42:20.600 And I just joking.

00:42:21.680 We don't do that.

00:42:23.840 Good.

00:42:24.360 Well, I mean, in a healthy way, I think it can be valuable, right?

00:42:27.780 No, but it's, it's really great.

00:42:29.540 Like the way we see it is kind of a proactive, I don't know.

00:42:34.680 We just think it's valuable.

00:42:36.320 So we've, we've done it in the past and we thought, you know, let's just go once a month

00:42:40.200 and just, if there's something pressing or perhaps there was a scenario between meetings

00:42:46.100 where I struggled with communicating something clearly or whatever, we'll kind of have an after

00:42:51.940 action review and go, okay, what worked?

00:42:55.300 What didn't work?

00:42:56.240 How could I have communicated that more effectively?

00:42:59.180 Or why did that bother me?

00:43:01.000 And sometimes let's be honest, like half the time, I just feel like I'm nerding out with

00:43:06.040 him.

00:43:06.200 It's super fun.

00:43:07.440 I'm like, okay, so what you're saying is this affects this.

00:43:10.180 And he's like, exactly.

00:43:11.400 And I just think it's a really fun conversation.

00:43:14.220 Like I would actually just take it on lunch and just pick his brain about all kinds of

00:43:18.200 stuff.

00:43:18.480 I think it's, I really enjoy that, but it's just effective and we use it as a proactive

00:43:24.300 way to just ensure everything's communicated clearly and that nothing goes untouched because

00:43:30.240 it does.

00:43:31.060 There's a tendency sometimes for us to go, I don't want to handle this right now.

00:43:34.940 I don't want to, I don't want to deal with this right now.

00:43:37.800 I'm going to put this under the rug and we'll talk about it later.

00:43:40.760 Right.

00:43:41.140 And that's one of the things that I've talked with him about is like, why are we slipping?

00:43:45.400 And he's like, you're slipping because in those moments you've pushed it off and said,

00:43:51.280 Hey, I'll talk about it later.

00:43:52.200 And you've done that too many times.

00:43:54.100 And now you're guys just communicate.

00:43:56.560 You're starting to have a communication breakdown.

00:43:58.400 You got to stay on top of it.

00:43:59.980 And so we've established rules.

00:44:01.340 Like if something's bothering you, you need to talk about it within a 24 hour period.

00:44:06.140 It's okay for me to go to her and say, now's not right.

00:44:08.920 Now's not a good time.

00:44:10.420 Let's talk about it later today, but it needs to be discussed.

00:44:13.520 There's no like, Oh, I'm, it doesn't bother me anymore.

00:44:16.800 So let's not talk about it.

00:44:18.100 Right.

00:44:18.240 That doesn't exist.

00:44:19.140 So I think, I think that's a valid point.

00:44:22.380 I mean, look, I don't do that, but I can see the value in it.

00:44:25.820 Take it in another context.

00:44:27.600 You know, you're, you take your car and they get the oil changed every 3000 to 5,000 miles.

00:44:33.840 If you're me, but your car's not, your indicator lights probably aren't on your car's not running

00:44:41.860 poorly.

00:44:42.240 Like it's, it's running well still, like it's getting you from point A to point B.

00:44:45.320 It's going as fast as it always did.

00:44:46.780 It's not overheating.

00:44:47.520 And yet you still take it in to get your oil changed.

00:44:50.400 It's just preventative maintenance.

00:44:52.080 I think in a lot of contexts that makes sense.

00:44:54.240 And this is one area that frankly, I haven't considered.

00:44:59.200 Yeah.

00:44:59.680 We like it.

00:45:00.740 All right.

00:45:01.420 Jake Bush.

00:45:04.140 What's Kip's story?

00:45:05.960 I've heard bits and pieces.

00:45:07.660 Granted, I've only been listening for about four months.

00:45:10.220 So that's problem number one, Jake, by the way, only four months.

00:45:13.320 Yeah.

00:45:13.520 Uh, where has his biggest life struggles and success been?

00:45:17.140 How has he dealt with them?

00:45:20.380 I'll let you answer the question.

00:45:21.980 Oh, you want me to answer?

00:45:23.240 What's Kip's story?

00:45:24.260 I don't know.

00:45:24.660 I'm still trying to figure it out.

00:45:25.900 Like he's, he's weaseled his way into the order of man organization and I'm trying to

00:45:29.280 figure out how it all happened.

00:45:30.760 Yeah.

00:45:31.340 Yeah.

00:45:31.520 This guy is so inauthentic.

00:45:33.100 We have no idea what's truth or anything else.

00:45:36.820 Um, well, I, I, I mean, just from my perspective, I think that you're somebody who, uh, has added

00:45:45.280 a lot of, a lot of value, of course, to what we've done.

00:45:47.920 You came into this organization with, I think a healthy dose of skepticism, especially up front

00:45:53.100 where you joined the Facebook group and you thought, what is this?

00:45:55.440 I ended up joining the, uh, the iron council, uh, then not long after the iron council, you

00:46:02.180 started leading team echo and did a phenomenal job.

00:46:05.560 I recognize that.

00:46:06.420 And so you started becoming, you were a team leader mentor and did a phenomenal job there.

00:46:11.120 And I recognize that.

00:46:12.020 And then you started to, you became more of the team leader liaison, which is helping

00:46:15.880 manage all of the teams and all of the team leaders.

00:46:18.920 Uh, and then with regards to the podcast, I just, I believe that you had a different

00:46:24.640 perspective, uh, that you brought a set of skills and ideas and thought processes that

00:46:31.240 I think were lacking that I didn't quite have and would make a great addition to the Wednesday

00:46:36.660 show.

00:46:37.040 So I approached you about doing an ask me anything.

00:46:38.960 And I thought having a co-host would be a lot of fun and, uh, give multiple perspectives

00:46:42.820 and angles for this.

00:46:43.640 And we've been doing that for, well, just a little over a year now, I think.

00:46:47.820 Yeah.

00:46:48.500 Yeah.

00:46:49.060 And it's been going really, really, really well.

00:46:50.920 So that's, that's what I, I don't know your personal story.

00:46:54.060 I'm not going to get into that.

00:46:55.240 You can do that if you want.

00:46:56.660 Yeah.

00:46:56.980 I queued, see, I queued that up, man.

00:46:58.640 I needed some affirmation of feeling good about myself.

00:47:01.680 So I just like, I hope I gave you enough better.

00:47:04.180 Yeah, that was good.

00:47:05.260 By the way, we're going to stop doing the AMAs.

00:47:07.580 Um, they haven't been doing that well.

00:47:09.020 So yeah.

00:47:10.880 Yep.

00:47:13.040 Uh, well, his one question is where has his biggest life struggles and success has been?

00:47:18.640 Um, it's, how's this?

00:47:22.280 I thought about this question and, and I, I'm not going to answer Jake's question specifically,

00:47:27.160 but I think it's an interesting concept.

00:47:30.420 When I read this, I was concerned about telling my story.

00:47:35.840 Does it make sense?

00:47:36.620 Like I have it all queued up about some sob story.

00:47:41.360 You think it's too polished or rehearsed?

00:47:44.140 Yeah.

00:47:44.340 Is that what you're saying?

00:47:45.180 Well, no, not so much that, but like, is that real?

00:47:49.380 My sob story?

00:47:50.920 You know what I mean?

00:47:51.300 I don't even like the concept of a story.

00:47:53.480 Like, what's the story?

00:47:55.260 It's like, the story is something that's really well thought out and it's your life.

00:48:01.800 It's your life.

00:48:02.640 Or, or it's my interpretation of some sob thing about to lift me up, to feel good about myself

00:48:08.720 so I can impress other people.

00:48:10.720 Like, do we really want to know that?

00:48:12.780 Is that really that valuable?

00:48:15.580 You know what I'm saying?

00:48:16.640 Yeah, I know what you're saying.

00:48:18.820 It's just interesting, right?

00:48:20.140 Because there's, because I've done this.

00:48:23.000 I've done this a lot of, a lot of my life.

00:48:26.440 I've had my story, right?

00:48:28.960 Everything from, and I'm downplaying it on purpose.

00:48:31.720 Everything from, uh, was youngest, youngest boy raised on a dairy farm.

00:48:37.220 First kid in my family to third kid out of nine to actually graduate high school.

00:48:43.080 First to ever go to college, right?

00:48:45.200 And, and I wear those as a badge, right?

00:48:47.540 Ooh, look at me.

00:48:48.560 I rised above my upbringing.

00:48:51.020 Yeah.

00:48:51.280 I went to college and it's like, okay.

00:48:53.960 Yeah.

00:48:55.160 Is it, is it that big of a deal?

00:48:57.040 Especially if I'm using it as a way to prop myself up and, or have people feel sorry for

00:49:03.860 me or the way I was born and raised.

00:49:06.160 Does it make sense?

00:49:07.360 Yes.

00:49:08.200 And I don't know.

00:49:08.880 Welcome to the world of social media.

00:49:11.680 Yeah.

00:49:12.800 I look, I do it too, but it is hard because sometimes you just want to say, I'm a guy

00:49:18.500 that gets a few things right that messes up some other things and I'm trying to be better.

00:49:23.280 Yeah, totally.

00:49:25.460 So, so Jake, there you go.

00:49:27.080 I'm on the AMA podcast.

00:49:28.920 I'm in the iron council.

00:49:30.160 Those are all the, the successes and struggles.

00:49:32.920 I think one thing that, that, that has been a good struggle for me is I was raised, um,

00:49:40.120 to be very independent, which has its pros and cons.

00:49:44.560 And I went through a divorce in my, in my early years during college.

00:49:50.640 And that struggle really forced my hand on my awareness of how I was showing up as a man.

00:50:01.580 I don't think that would have happened if I didn't get divorced.

00:50:05.100 Very similar to your story, Ryan, when you guys separated and it kind of shook, shook

00:50:10.500 your foundation a little bit that shook my foundation.

00:50:13.140 And it really forced me to evaluate how I was showing up, the kind of husband I was being,

00:50:19.060 the kind of dad I was being.

00:50:21.300 And it, and I, and it was like night and day mentality.

00:50:24.480 It was, I was a victim one day and the next day, um, I owned what the way my life turned

00:50:31.680 out and I took ownership over it.

00:50:33.840 And so that hand was forced.

00:50:35.420 It wasn't like my own enlightening.

00:50:37.840 Right.

00:50:38.280 But it was something that, uh, that I was kind of forced to learn and that, that obviously

00:50:41.940 put me on a different path in regards to how I saw life.

00:50:45.160 So I want to, I want to, I want to disagree with you on something here.

00:50:48.860 And I know it's gonna sound funny cause I'm, cause I'm disagreeing with my story.

00:50:53.640 Right.

00:50:53.960 Yeah.

00:50:54.600 No, I am.

00:50:55.220 I am going to disagree with something.

00:50:56.640 You said that your hand was forced.

00:51:00.080 And that's true.

00:51:01.840 And it wasn't forced.

00:51:03.100 And I, I want to pay you a compliment here and something that I've always respected

00:51:06.900 and admired about you.

00:51:07.920 One thing you talk a lot about is the meaning we attach to things, right?

00:51:12.940 And usually when you're talking about it, you're, you're saying don't attach negative

00:51:17.740 meaning to it, but we can just as easily interpret something as positive.

00:51:23.500 That's actually the same thing.

00:51:25.100 You're attaching positive meaning to it.

00:51:27.320 You've decided to be good.

00:51:28.400 Right.

00:51:29.580 So your hand was not forced.

00:51:32.500 You were in a difficult situation.

00:51:34.820 Part of it was your fault.

00:51:36.300 Part of it was not.

00:51:38.060 And you chose to attach the meaning that would serve you best.

00:51:44.460 And there's millions and millions of men out there who have chosen to attach the meaning

00:51:50.600 that would not serve them or anybody else.

00:51:53.520 And they wallow in their own self pity and they disengage from life and women and responsibility

00:51:59.340 altogether.

00:52:00.160 Uh, a lot of these guys are credit, uh, clinically or chronically depressed, potentially even suicidal

00:52:08.000 and barring mental health illness.

00:52:10.600 I would say a lot of these guys have chosen this path through the meaning that they've attached

00:52:15.200 where I've always admired and respected you is that you seem to be a man who is willing

00:52:20.760 to take, uh, what most would consider a negative situation.

00:52:24.340 And attach a positive spin to it so that you can improve yourself.

00:52:29.800 You're not forced to do that.

00:52:31.300 There's so many people who have it, but you've deliberately intentionally made yourself into

00:52:36.660 a more capable, well-rounded husband, father, leader in your community, consultant within

00:52:44.220 your business and a better man in general.

00:52:46.960 So I disagree with you, but in the same context, pay you that compliment that you weren't forced

00:52:54.040 that you chose that path.

00:52:55.440 Yeah, no.

00:52:56.700 And I think that's a good point.

00:52:57.960 And, and that's, that's probably a clarification I should, we should make more often.

00:53:02.680 Sometimes when we talk about adding meaning is add the right meaning or the most effective

00:53:06.920 meaning.

00:53:07.680 Yes.

00:53:08.520 Yeah.

00:53:09.180 Yeah.

00:53:09.380 I like that.

00:53:10.180 Cool.

00:53:10.400 All right.

00:53:12.100 Chase Tilton, in your opinion, why is jujitsu better or more enjoyable martial art than others

00:53:19.140 like karate, Muay Thai, and et cetera?

00:53:22.420 Better is a weird word to you.

00:53:24.500 I know that's a lot of meaning you're adding there, Chase.

00:53:27.800 I mean, is it, is it better if you're on the ground with an unarmed individual and, and

00:53:34.800 you guys are on the ground together?

00:53:36.360 I would probably say in my limited perception and knowledge that yes, it would be better

00:53:41.400 than another skill.

00:53:43.680 Is it better when you're faced with an active shooter and you're trying to keep people safe

00:53:49.280 and yourself out of danger than understanding some, some, uh, tactical skills with a firearm?

00:53:55.000 Of course not.

00:53:56.320 Yeah.

00:53:57.180 So the point is, is it not better?

00:54:00.280 Or it's just a tool that you might want to have at your disposal and then you can add

00:54:07.860 it to everything else you have at your disposal.

00:54:09.720 I'll let you answer that part in a second.

00:54:11.640 Cause I want to answer the second part of this question.

00:54:13.500 Why do you enjoy it more?

00:54:15.180 Again, I haven't tried every martial art.

00:54:17.540 This is just the one that I frankly fell into.

00:54:20.360 A lot of guys in my circle practice jujitsu and I decided I wanted to try it.

00:54:24.760 So yeah, maybe I would like something better or like something more, but I haven't tried

00:54:30.540 everything.

00:54:31.160 So I enjoy this.

00:54:32.220 Why do I like it?

00:54:33.300 Because it's hard.

00:54:35.740 Uh, I enjoy the physical nature of it.

00:54:38.140 This morning when I was, uh, training, I got need in the eye and it hurt actually really

00:54:45.300 bad.

00:54:46.200 Like the socket?

00:54:47.360 Yeah.

00:54:47.660 Just right dead center.

00:54:49.260 And I wanted to stop.

00:54:50.560 I couldn't see.

00:54:51.260 It was all teary eyed and stuff.

00:54:52.620 And I wanted to stop and I was on top and this guy's guard, Brody's guard.

00:54:58.320 And, uh, he's like, are you all right, man?

00:55:00.280 I'm like, yeah, I just, I can't see right now.

00:55:02.580 And he's like, oh, you want to stop?

00:55:03.760 I'm like, no, I want to keep going.

00:55:06.280 Cause in a fight, like, I'm not going to say, oh, timeout.

00:55:09.140 You're like, I can't see my eye or anything.

00:55:11.200 Yeah.

00:55:11.620 I poke.

00:55:12.140 I poke.

00:55:12.720 Yeah.

00:55:13.560 So I said, no, no, I want to keep going.

00:55:16.000 And so I, I rolled with my eyes closed until I got enough, you know, back in where I could,

00:55:21.680 where I could see.

00:55:22.220 Okay.

00:55:23.020 I liked it.

00:55:25.040 I liked that.

00:55:26.180 I liked the physical nature of it.

00:55:27.980 I like pushing myself physically.

00:55:30.120 I like being in uncomfortable situations.

00:55:33.500 Uh, I like getting physically stronger.

00:55:35.500 I like that.

00:55:36.400 I can actually see my progress.

00:55:38.180 I really enjoy experimenting with new techniques and strategy.

00:55:42.780 Uh, it's, I just like it.

00:55:44.940 I enjoy everything about it.

00:55:46.760 Um, after I'm done for it with a session, I, I'm stiff and sore everywhere.

00:55:52.820 And I get into my car painfully and slowly.

00:55:56.500 And I even like that.

00:55:59.140 Yeah.

00:55:59.880 I don't know what it is, but those are a few things that I enjoy.

00:56:04.220 Although most people probably hear that and think, what is this guy on?

00:56:08.560 What's he thinking about?

00:56:09.440 But if you practice, then you probably feel the same way.

00:56:13.400 Totally.

00:56:14.100 Totally.

00:56:14.760 And, and I don't want to get into the better mentality.

00:56:17.340 I, I think you live in Thailand and you do jujitsu.

00:56:21.260 You should probably learn Muay Thai because that would be better for you.

00:56:25.140 Right.

00:56:25.540 Or if you're in a Thai fight.

00:56:26.820 So it's, it's all, it all varies.

00:56:29.660 Um, enjoyable for me.

00:56:31.320 I don't know, man.

00:56:32.140 Like I, I do jujitsu obviously a lot.

00:56:35.260 Um, I did some standup for a while.

00:56:37.900 It's fun to punch.

00:56:39.900 It is super fun.

00:56:41.420 Um, so I really enjoy that too.

00:56:44.360 Um, but for me, I, I choose the one that I think would enjoy.

00:56:49.020 I had enjoyed the most.

00:56:51.280 Um, and that is probably the most effective for me personally.

00:56:54.240 And that happens to be jujitsu.

00:56:56.220 And for all the same, similar reasons, uh, it's the grind of it.

00:57:00.560 I, I love the practical point of it.

00:57:03.120 I was speaking with someone.

00:57:04.540 In fact, just last week, this is a good example of this.

00:57:07.140 Uh, this girl does, um, Krav Maga, which for you guys, Krav Maga is like the martial

00:57:13.200 art for Israeli military.

00:57:14.760 And it is like, just think of straight up dirty.

00:57:18.560 Like it's like, everything's about fish hooking, stomping the growing, eye gouge, like it's

00:57:26.460 craziness.

00:57:27.060 Right.

00:57:27.320 And it's so cool.

00:57:28.260 And it's fun.

00:57:29.140 The difference though, is it's hard to practice that like really honestly.

00:57:36.880 How do you gather somebody's eye in training?

00:57:39.780 Yeah.

00:57:40.000 There, and that's one benefit that jujitsu has is when I get a train with Ryan, if we

00:57:45.840 both decide or, and it's funny, we don't both don't need to decide if one person decides

00:57:50.340 to go a hundred percent, the other person will adjust, but you can go a hundred percent.

00:57:55.100 I could use every fiber of my being to do jujitsu with someone and we can walk away somewhat

00:58:03.760 probability of being uninjured.

00:58:06.120 We might be sore and exhausted, whatever, but I can practice that art to its full extent.

00:58:12.360 Right.

00:58:12.460 Right now our school is prepping for a, we have a tournament here in Utah, big tournament

00:58:16.420 and everyone's in tournament mode, right?

00:58:19.100 Everyone is just 100% balls to the wall.

00:58:23.680 And we can do that.

00:58:25.500 You can't do that in many martial arts.

00:58:28.160 You can't punch you in the face.

00:58:31.140 I can't punch you in the face a hundred percent all the time with Muay Thai.

00:58:34.280 We have to use, I could take it.

00:58:36.300 I could take it 100%.

00:58:37.760 I mean, the average man, maybe, but my fist couldn't handle punching your face is what

00:58:43.580 I meant.

00:58:44.520 But you guys say we, you can't practice those things a hundred percent.

00:58:47.840 And so that's one benefit of jujitsu.

00:58:49.860 That's really nice.

00:58:51.140 We could go a hundred percent with each other and the other aspect of it, and it's really

00:58:55.380 unique and I don't know if this exists in other martial arts.

00:58:57.840 I haven't found this in other martial arts, but the, and I, such a cliche thing to say

00:59:03.520 in the jujitsu community, but the human chess portion is amazing to me.

00:59:08.900 Your interview with the Deco, at one point you guys were talking about learning jujitsu.

00:59:14.980 He's been doing it for 30 years and, and, and he alluded to, and I don't remember exact

00:59:20.740 verbiage, but he alluded to this on the podcast that he's still learning.

00:59:24.260 Mm-hmm because jujitsu never stops.

00:59:27.700 There's no like set a hundred moves.

00:59:30.440 You learn them and you know it all because guess what?

00:59:32.420 By the time you learn those hundred moves, someone just invented something else or they

00:59:37.460 do a slightly different than the way you do it and you evolve it and it becomes your

00:59:41.460 own.

00:59:42.120 And, and, and so it's forever evolving and changing.

00:59:45.780 I've been doing jujitsu for consistently now for 12 years.

00:59:50.940 And it's not uncommon that I could even go to a white belt class and be listening to

00:59:56.600 instruction and go, Oh, I never saw that before.

00:59:59.680 And I'm like, really?

01:00:01.420 Like there's an aspect that I haven't seen yet in 12 years of training.

01:00:07.220 Like you would assume I saw it all by now.

01:00:09.820 No.

01:00:10.540 Yeah.

01:00:10.860 And it's because guys are innovating.

01:00:12.680 They're constantly innovating and coming up with new things.

01:00:15.300 So I love that aspect of it.

01:00:17.700 And I love the bait, the switch, the setup.

01:00:21.140 Oh, I'm going to do this.

01:00:22.360 He's going to attack my arm and then I'm going to do it.

01:00:24.320 I just, that aspect is super fun.

01:00:26.500 I know that happens in counters, but I don't think, I don't think they go as deep in the

01:00:31.620 world of jujitsu where my chess game is set up with five different options.

01:00:39.160 They choose option one.

01:00:41.000 Then I have these three options.

01:00:42.820 Like, I don't think that happens as much on counter punches when we talk about standup.

01:00:48.880 I don't, I know it does because there's counters, but I don't know if they go like three levels

01:00:52.980 deep.

01:00:54.060 Yeah.

01:00:54.200 So, no, I like, I like what you said.

01:00:56.420 You know, one of the things I was thinking about is this morning I was going with a buddy

01:00:59.440 of mine.

01:00:59.720 We were trying together in the mornings and we're both white belts.

01:01:02.480 So white belt warriors, like we go to battle and, and it's not pretty and it's probably really

01:01:08.100 inefficient and we're probably exposing ourselves to unnecessary risk, but it's, but it's good

01:01:13.740 too.

01:01:14.840 Uh, and we were training this morning.

01:01:16.680 He's like, yeah, I just don't know how hard to go.

01:01:18.380 Like, I don't know how to like go as hard as you can.

01:01:21.080 I'm like, I do the same.

01:01:22.180 I would, I do the same thing to you.

01:01:24.040 I'll put my forearm in your throat.

01:01:25.660 I have no problem with that.

01:01:27.000 And he's like, and he's like, I just, I don't know.

01:01:29.820 And I'm like, dude, I'll tap.

01:01:31.000 Like if you're going a hundred percent and I don't like something or, or it hurts or

01:01:37.140 whatever, I'll tap and no hard feelings.

01:01:39.700 Like that's the point.

01:01:41.000 The other day I was, I was, uh, rolling with this guy's name's Levi and he's this big, strong,

01:01:46.980 you rolled with him.

01:01:47.580 I think it immersion camp.

01:01:48.880 Yeah.

01:01:49.400 Uh, big, strong tree trunk, legged, barrel chested dude.

01:01:54.080 And he was on top of me and he was in side guard and I tapped to just pressure.

01:02:00.220 Cause the way he had me and I just didn't want to tap to it, dude, it would hurt and

01:02:06.740 hurt.

01:02:07.060 And he was going a hundred percent and I didn't ask him to go 90 or 80.

01:02:11.720 I said, okay, you're going to, I'm going to go a hundred percent too.

01:02:14.660 And then we, you tap and you, you start over and you do it again.

01:02:18.980 So it's, I like it.

01:02:22.400 That's funny.

01:02:23.280 All right.

01:02:24.120 Okay.

01:02:25.260 We could just, now we're all just reminiscing.

01:02:27.680 There you go.

01:02:27.940 Jiu-jitsu is better.

01:02:29.340 Yeah.

01:02:29.560 Just jiu-jitsu is better.

01:02:30.980 Hey, one other thing I'll say on that Kip is I think a lot of the times people will

01:02:35.420 say that and I'm not suggesting he is asking it for this reason, but it seems to me a lot

01:02:39.120 of people ask questions like that to debate, right?

01:02:42.580 It's like, well, I don't know because of this or whatever.

01:02:45.180 Look, we're not here to convince you.

01:02:48.780 I don't have to sell you jiu-jitsu.

01:02:51.440 I don't have to sell you on going to therapy.

01:02:54.060 I don't have to sell you on having a conversation with your future wife.

01:02:58.400 We're not here to convince you.

01:03:01.880 We're just here to share what we think works, what's worked well for us, what hasn't worked

01:03:06.840 for us.

01:03:07.260 And then ultimately you're a man, you're an individual.

01:03:10.360 You make your own decisions.

01:03:11.640 You're a big boy.

01:03:12.220 So take everything that we say with a grain of salt and make a decision like a man would

01:03:17.420 by taking advice, applying what you feel is relevant to you and disregarding what you

01:03:22.520 feel isn't and make your decisions and be satisfied with the decisions you're making.

01:03:29.980 Jack Collins, what are your strategies for remaining disciplined and committed when the

01:03:35.640 feelings of motivation are not present?

01:03:37.640 Well, that's the point.

01:03:39.980 That's the point of discipline.

01:03:41.940 That is discipline.

01:03:44.120 Discipline is what you do when the feeling of motivation and excitement and rah-rah has

01:03:49.940 worn off.

01:03:50.640 The emotion has worn off.

01:03:52.520 That is the point.

01:03:53.860 So what do you do?

01:03:55.140 Yeah.

01:03:55.340 Or what's reworded for him?

01:03:57.760 What strategies do you do when you're not feeling motivated and you want to continue to

01:04:04.860 take action and be committed to?

01:04:06.440 So before, it's hard to be specific because it's so broad.

01:04:11.200 Like, are you talking about exercise?

01:04:12.440 Are you talking about jujitsu?

01:04:13.460 Are you talking about dieting?

01:04:15.400 Are you talking about in my business?

01:04:17.120 Are you talking about managing my bank account?

01:04:19.720 So we have to talk in principles as opposed to like very practical approach.

01:04:25.480 But before the feeling of motivation wears off, you need to put the systems and processes

01:04:32.080 in place.

01:04:33.540 So for example, let's say that you have dubbed that you are not a quote unquote morning person.

01:04:41.000 That's what you've assigned yourself.

01:04:43.540 That's how you've identified.

01:04:44.640 I'm not a morning person.

01:04:45.400 And then you listen to something or you read something or you hear something and you think,

01:04:50.660 I'm going to start being a morning person.

01:04:53.280 And you're all hopped up because you're like, I'm going to get up two hours early before

01:04:57.620 everybody else.

01:04:58.380 And I'm going to get this done and I'm going to get that done.

01:05:00.400 And then I'm going to have all this energy throughout the day.

01:05:02.140 And it's going to be amazing because I saw this person do it.

01:05:04.620 And this guy was doing it and he's successful.

01:05:07.200 And that person's got this going on.

01:05:08.660 So I'm going to do that.

01:05:10.520 Hey, look, there's nothing wrong with being motivated.

01:05:14.480 There's nothing wrong with fostering some external excitement and channeling it into how

01:05:20.560 it might improve your own life.

01:05:22.580 But the very next step is, okay, what am I going to do to ensure that happens?

01:05:31.040 It's not enough.

01:05:31.820 Excitement is not enough because you know it's going to wear off.

01:05:35.240 So if we're talking about getting up earlier, because again, we don't have the context of

01:05:38.840 this question.

01:05:40.360 Well, what's kept you from getting up in the past?

01:05:44.340 Well, I'm tired because I only get five hours of sleep.

01:05:46.980 Check.

01:05:47.500 I need to go to bed earlier.

01:05:50.580 Well, you know, every time I wake up, I just hit the snooze button.

01:05:55.660 Got it.

01:05:56.420 Move your phone away from you because you're naturally going to want to hit the snooze button.

01:06:00.800 Uh, you know, I'd like to get up, but I don't want to, uh, I don't want to wake up my wife

01:06:07.180 or my kids.

01:06:08.020 Cool.

01:06:08.720 Go put all your clothes and everything else in the bathrooms when you wake up or another

01:06:12.800 guest room.

01:06:13.520 So when you wake up, you go in that room and you don't disturb or bother anybody.

01:06:17.840 Start thinking about all the reasons you haven't done what you want to do up to this point,

01:06:22.440 because I can guarantee you getting up early or you being more engaged with your wife or

01:06:27.720 you balancing your checkbook.

01:06:29.000 Are you starting to exercise?

01:06:30.180 Are you starting to eat right?

01:06:31.080 This isn't the first time you've ever thought about it.

01:06:34.340 Yeah.

01:06:35.480 So if that's the case, then why haven't you done it up to this point?

01:06:40.660 Once you identify why and all the reasons why you can start coming up with a plan to

01:06:47.020 ensure that those things don't deter you from doing what you want to do this time.

01:06:53.640 So just take a little negative framing, if you will, think about what's happened in the

01:06:57.100 past and why you haven't had success in this area and build all the little strategies and

01:07:01.320 plans in place that respond or answer or, or solve that problem or those problems.

01:07:09.940 Love it.

01:07:11.280 Okay.

01:07:11.920 Chris Babber, what's the story on the knife?

01:07:16.220 I told you I'd ask.

01:07:18.420 The knife?

01:07:19.500 Yeah.

01:07:20.140 I should have confirmed this question first.

01:07:22.540 Something about the story about the knife.

01:07:24.620 I'm assuming you made some mention.

01:07:27.100 Somewhere on Facebook or in a conversation.

01:07:29.900 Okay.

01:07:30.540 I, are these old questions?

01:07:33.440 Um, this is from three weeks.

01:07:36.560 Okay.

01:07:37.060 I think I know what he's referring to.

01:07:39.180 So a lot of the guys know we, we bought this property out in Maine.

01:07:43.240 We've been here for, I want to say we've been here now for three and a half months or so,

01:07:47.700 somewhere right in there.

01:07:48.580 Yeah.

01:07:49.060 Uh, and it has this beautiful, this big, beautiful barn attached to it.

01:07:53.820 And over the past, well, specifically when I got here, I took about a month to five weeks

01:07:59.020 and really renovated the bottom, the main, the main level of it because we had our event,

01:08:05.700 the main event.

01:08:06.480 And, and, and upstairs there's, uh, um, how, how would you call it?

01:08:13.700 Like a, like a deck or something or like a, yeah, yeah.

01:08:17.200 Kind of a deck.

01:08:18.400 Yeah.

01:08:18.760 I'd use that term.

01:08:19.640 Yeah.

01:08:20.300 It's basically, yeah.

01:08:21.980 It's like, it's like a deck on both sides of the, on the second floor, both sides of

01:08:25.520 the barn.

01:08:26.320 And as I'm walking up the stairs, it's got a bunch of junk.

01:08:29.460 So I got to clean all that out and I got to sweep up the bird poo and all that stuff.

01:08:32.200 Right.

01:08:32.380 So I'm, so I'm doing that and I, and I walked up the stairs and I look up and there's a,

01:08:37.520 a kitchen knife, like a, like a butcher's, not a butcher's knife, but like a, like a kitchen

01:08:43.660 knife, like a sharp, fairly big one.

01:08:45.880 Yes.

01:08:46.420 Not like a butter knife, but like a big meat knife, not like a cleaver, but you know what

01:08:51.800 I'm talking about.

01:08:52.320 Yeah.

01:08:52.480 Yeah.

01:08:53.160 And it's like at eye level and it's just stuck into the wood right there, just stuck into

01:08:58.980 the wood.

01:08:59.280 And it looks like it's freshly sharpened and it's just chilling right there.

01:09:03.580 No rhyme or reason.

01:09:04.240 There's no like target that somebody's throwing at.

01:09:06.900 There's no, there's no blood on it, which is good.

01:09:09.620 Um, it's just chilling in there.

01:09:11.560 And so I think I made a post on Instagram or Facebook and said, I don't know if this

01:09:17.920 knife at head level, when I come up the stairs is a real pleasing thing to think about.

01:09:23.500 I said something like that, you know, the guys were wondering what the story of the knife

01:09:27.460 was.

01:09:27.840 I don't know what the story of the knife was.

01:09:30.400 If I do, I would tell you guys, but I have no idea.

01:09:32.820 There's just a random sharpened kitchen knife, head level on the second floor pegged into the

01:09:38.520 wood.

01:09:39.720 And I just left it there.

01:09:41.560 You think Brecon or no, no, no, it was there before.

01:09:44.700 No.

01:09:45.420 Okay.

01:09:46.080 No, it was there before we got there.

01:09:48.520 Huh?

01:09:49.320 That's funny.

01:09:50.260 So there you go.

01:09:51.320 I was waiting for a huge buildup there.

01:09:54.760 There's no buildup.

01:09:55.820 I don't know.

01:09:56.720 I was just trying to keep you guys engaged.

01:09:58.920 I don't know what the story is.

01:10:00.760 All I know is that there's a kitchen knife stabbed into the side of my barn at head level

01:10:05.080 when you come up the stairs.

01:10:06.940 And I just, I left it there.

01:10:08.720 I'm like, well, some, some, somebody wanted it here for some reason.

01:10:11.280 So I'm not going to tempt the spirits by pulling it out of here.

01:10:14.360 So I'm leaving the knife in the barn.

01:10:16.440 The only time I'll take it out of there is when we have our legacy event, the father son

01:10:19.760 event, and we'll have kids running around.

01:10:22.100 Then I'll take the knife out and the kids can be terrorized by the ghost that wants the

01:10:25.980 knife in the barn.

01:10:26.820 And then when they leave, I'll put it back.

01:10:29.260 So the ghost goes and leaves me alone.

01:10:31.260 Yeah.

01:10:31.660 It just harass the boys when they show up.

01:10:33.700 Yeah.

01:10:36.540 All right.

01:10:37.100 Start that off.

01:10:37.800 We do it on questions.

01:10:38.680 Are we, uh, are we close to let's take a couple more if we have them today?

01:10:42.660 Yeah.

01:10:43.020 Let's do a couple more then.

01:10:44.540 Uh, Noah, John, what up and coming online business trend would you start today?

01:10:50.140 If you had the time, assuming startup capital and prior experience is not an issue.

01:10:56.640 I'm not thinking about anything else, but order of man.

01:10:59.380 Yeah.

01:10:59.980 And Noah, I don't know if I want to share my idea here on this podcast with a bunch of

01:11:03.500 guys listening to it.

01:11:05.160 Yeah.

01:11:05.520 Great point.

01:11:06.220 That's a hard one for me to answer because I'm so focused on order of man that I haven't

01:11:10.800 thought like, well, if I wasn't doing order of man, I would be doing this.

01:11:13.700 I don't know.

01:11:14.280 I haven't thought about that.

01:11:16.360 Um, I do believe, I will say this.

01:11:19.340 I do believe that as we delve deeper into the realm of technology and social media, that

01:11:28.340 there's a new found connection and an expanded connection across the planet, across the globe.

01:11:34.200 But there's also a disconnection from the people who are sitting at your kitchen table.

01:11:39.600 Yeah.

01:11:40.700 Or, or a neighbor across the street.

01:11:44.280 Or somebody you, you work with, that you share an office with.

01:11:47.560 So I think as we, as we continue to go down this technological route, that there will be

01:11:53.940 a need and a strong desire for face-to-face personal interaction.

01:11:59.560 And that I believe is a trend we will continue, continue to see go up.

01:12:04.420 Um, outside of that, AI is obviously huge.

01:12:08.460 Um, I mean, something is something I completely disagree with, but I imagine we'll,

01:12:14.280 really ramp up is, uh, robots, specifically sex robots.

01:12:18.440 Like, I'm not saying I would engage in that, but that's, that's going to be a trend.

01:12:22.560 Unfortunately.

01:12:23.820 Um, there's a lot of things that I think are maybe immoral that we will see a lot more of.

01:12:29.840 And so me, I choose to take hopefully a more, what I would consider moral route.

01:12:34.500 Again, uh, focusing on the face-to-face and human interaction side of things.

01:12:40.220 Cool.

01:12:41.100 Cool.

01:12:42.020 Did you have any thoughts on that?

01:12:43.800 Um, man, I mean, we, there's all kinds of trends from the tech side, right?

01:12:49.000 That I could talk.

01:12:50.000 I don't want to bore anybody.

01:12:51.500 Uh, there's, there's a few things that are, I feel like are kind of in the hopper that I'm

01:12:56.420 looking into.

01:12:57.540 Um, so I guess you're going to have to stay tuned.

01:13:00.440 Sex bots.

01:13:01.460 Yeah.

01:13:01.980 Yeah.

01:13:02.640 No, not that at all.

01:13:04.620 By the way, I was, I was on, I was in the kitchen and I thought, oh, I need my, my dose

01:13:10.020 of Friday field notes from order man podcast.

01:13:12.120 So I'm, we have an echo show right in the kitchen.

01:13:15.360 It's like an echo device.

01:13:16.780 Yeah.

01:13:17.180 Alexa device.

01:13:18.040 Yeah.

01:13:18.640 And I'm like, uh, echo play order man podcast.

01:13:22.320 And it says, you cannot listen to this podcast when you have explicit content blocked.

01:13:28.380 Oh, really?

01:13:29.340 That's funny.

01:13:30.880 I think YouTube is like demonetizes our program or something.

01:13:35.280 If we swear, like they'll take video.

01:13:37.760 If we swear, it's just certain swear words though.

01:13:40.080 It's not all of them.

01:13:40.980 It's just the ones they don't like.

01:13:42.480 So I think we can say hell and damn and maybe, but if we get any more vulgar than that,

01:13:49.240 then maybe monetize us.

01:13:51.360 Copy.

01:13:51.660 Well, we, we've done pretty good until just now.

01:13:54.700 And well, I just figured it looks, let's lump it all together and just get it out of

01:13:58.300 the way.

01:14:00.240 All right.

01:14:00.940 Last question.

01:14:01.780 Cody Allen Myers.

01:14:03.080 Couldn't think of a question, but I do want to say, I love what you're doing and I always

01:14:07.720 look forward to your posts and your podcasts.

01:14:10.380 Got a wife and two young toddlers.

01:14:12.260 And there's a lot of things in life that can be, that I can be better at.

01:14:15.840 My goal is to one day live on my own terms, be home and present and be more present, more

01:14:22.340 in my family's life.

01:14:23.820 A worthy goal.

01:14:25.860 Yeah.

01:14:26.480 I think that's what all of us want to a degree.

01:14:28.980 For sure.

01:14:29.460 And I think there's, I don't know, my, I know Cody's not asking for any feedback here,

01:14:36.800 but I'm going to give it to you anyway.

01:14:38.460 Um, and you have a lot of, a lot of that goal you can do today.

01:14:44.540 Agreed.

01:14:45.200 Right.

01:14:45.540 Live today on my own terms, be, be more present with my family at home.

01:14:50.320 Like I, that make, do it today.

01:14:52.680 Yeah.

01:14:53.200 Don't make that a goal.

01:14:54.180 Just be that way.

01:14:55.640 I don't know if I shared with you, you're, you're, you're exactly right.

01:14:59.200 Kip.

01:14:59.400 I, I, I may have shared this with you.

01:15:01.080 I was walking in my field.

01:15:03.220 Uh, this was probably a week or two ago and I don't know why, but I got started.

01:15:06.860 I started to think about my own mortality and I wasn't going to a dark place, but I

01:15:13.100 was just thinking to myself, you know, I'm getting older, 38 years old, not old.

01:15:17.500 I'm not young.

01:15:18.640 Yeah.

01:15:19.040 Uh, I'm almost 40.

01:15:20.820 That seems crazy.

01:15:22.880 Uh, my 20 year class reunion was, I think last month I didn't go to it, but it was last

01:15:28.280 month.

01:15:29.140 And I just thought, you know, I'm really starting to, starting to get up there in age a little

01:15:32.240 bit and it's going fast.

01:15:35.000 I was looking at my 11 year old son and thinking, you know, seven years, he's gone, man.

01:15:39.120 He's out of the house.

01:15:40.240 Yeah.

01:15:41.020 And then as I was thinking about this, I got thinking about how long it took me to get to

01:15:46.960 where I am today.

01:15:47.820 And I don't mean physically because physically I'm in a good spot.

01:15:52.120 We're in this home.

01:15:53.240 We're in a, we're in a beautiful area.

01:15:54.840 We have the property.

01:15:55.840 We have the financial means to be able to live this sort of lifestyle, but that's not what

01:16:00.020 I'm talking about.

01:16:00.800 I just feel fulfilled.

01:16:03.580 I feel like I'm, I'm pursuing something that's meaningful, that's engaging, that I'm deeply

01:16:08.900 committed to that resonates with me, that lights me up in a way that nothing else ever

01:16:14.200 has before.

01:16:16.580 And I wish I would have got here sooner.

01:16:19.640 Now, maybe I was incapable of getting here sooner.

01:16:23.160 And that's kind of the weird paradox is that there's a level of maturity required to get

01:16:30.640 to that point.

01:16:32.060 You know, could I have got here at 20?

01:16:34.120 Probably not because I wasn't focused on those things and I wasn't in the space to be able

01:16:38.240 to do it.

01:16:39.840 But it also reminds me that there's so many of us who have goals and have aspirations

01:16:45.580 and have things that we want.

01:16:47.040 And in the very next breath, after saying or thinking about these things, we start the

01:16:51.780 next sentence with, but, but I've got this and bottom this and but bad timing, everything,

01:16:59.560 but the timing's off, right?

01:17:00.860 Exactly.

01:17:01.500 All of this kind of thing.

01:17:02.880 And I think you are going to die.

01:17:06.740 You are going to die today, tomorrow, in 10 years, 20 years, 40 years, you are going to

01:17:15.560 die and man, if that doesn't put things in perspective, I don't know what else does.

01:17:26.100 I was walking around hunting with my boys over the past couple of days and I made a post on

01:17:31.300 Instagram yesterday and it said, you know, I don't have a motivational quote for you.

01:17:38.100 I don't have a picture of me with some well-known celebrity.

01:17:43.120 I'm not at some exotic location doing some crazy stunt or even anything, all that exciting.

01:17:52.740 All it is, is me and my two boys, their dog and a shotgun and me as a father, whose heart

01:17:59.300 is full.

01:18:01.360 And, uh, that that's where I'm at because I feel like I'm pursuing things that are meaningful

01:18:09.580 to me, not things that I'm told I should be pursuing, not following somebody else's dreams

01:18:14.880 or ambitions, but following my own, realizing that we live a very, very short life and I

01:18:21.880 want to capitalize it on it in a way that's significant to me.

01:18:26.040 Totally.

01:18:26.580 And I think at the root for most guys that might struggle with wanting to be in that same

01:18:32.780 space as you, Ryan, it's, it's the common pitfall that we think that our circumstances

01:18:39.920 determine how we show up.

01:18:43.640 Sure.

01:18:44.080 Yeah.

01:18:44.260 We think, oh, well, if my wife would do that, our marriage would be better.

01:18:48.380 Oh, if, if I had this money, then I would be this way.

01:18:51.240 Like we, we think circumstances dictate how we show up and who we choose to be.

01:18:56.820 Mm-hmm and, and the, and the irony is all that does is causes us to procrastinate the

01:19:05.200 fulfillment of who we can become as men.

01:19:08.880 And we wait for the stars to align for circumstances to work out.

01:19:13.380 So that way I can be more present to my family so I can be this way so I can show up a different

01:19:18.840 way.

01:19:19.740 And, and it's, and it's highly inaccurate.

01:19:24.340 Most of those things, none of us even have control over.

01:19:26.820 Right.

01:19:27.220 Sometimes you're not in control of your circumstances, but in spite of them, you can still be fulfilled

01:19:33.720 if you choose to be a certain way, regardless of your circumstances.

01:19:38.720 And I, and I think, I don't know, it's just so funny how that's such a human default human

01:19:43.680 behavior that we think it's the outside things that need to change for us to be that way.

01:19:47.900 Yeah.

01:19:48.220 And, and, and to your point, it's like, it doesn't matter what today is.

01:19:52.080 If you show up a certain way, you can be fulfilled today.

01:19:55.180 It's just a conscious choice that we all have to make.

01:19:58.400 Yeah.

01:19:58.500 There's a great book on the subject, um, by Viktor Frankl, man's search for me.

01:20:03.320 I mean, everything was taken from this man during the Holocaust and he was in Auschwitz,

01:20:07.060 I believe, uh, concentration, concentration camp for sure.

01:20:10.780 But I believe it was Auschwitz.

01:20:12.440 Yeah, it was.

01:20:12.940 Um, anyways, uh, really powerful read about finding meaning and clarity and purpose in

01:20:21.220 the most dire situation.

01:20:22.600 So go check that out.

01:20:24.280 Yeah.

01:20:24.420 That's a long answer on both of our parts for a guy who didn't even ask a question.

01:20:27.920 Oh, that's true.

01:20:30.420 Anyways, we appreciate the support.

01:20:31.900 We're glad you're with us.

01:20:32.840 I think maybe that's what you're looking for.

01:20:34.320 Yeah.

01:20:34.780 Yeah.

01:20:36.020 Thanks, Cody.

01:20:37.440 All right.

01:20:37.920 Um, that's it.

01:20:39.060 All right.

01:20:39.380 Great questions today, guys.

01:20:40.560 Really appreciate the thoughtful questions.

01:20:42.820 Hopefully we gave you some considerations that, uh, that will serve you well.

01:20:45.880 That's ultimately the goal.

01:20:46.840 We want to give you the tools and ideas and perspectives that are going to help you become

01:20:50.740 a more, a more capable man, whatever that looks like for you.

01:20:53.180 So, um, I'll turn it to you, Kip, to take us home and we'll, uh, we'll call it a day.

01:20:56.980 Okay.

01:20:57.360 Sounds good.

01:20:59.520 October 1st, Tribe Builder starts.

01:21:01.800 Uh, we originally, that spot, um, is going to fill up.

01:21:05.880 So you guys need to act immediately.

01:21:07.740 That's going to start next week.

01:21:09.700 Yeah.

01:21:10.020 So you have this week to get in there and get registered.

01:21:12.420 Uh, the Tribe Builder course, Ryan, I don't know if you want me to kind of give a summary,

01:21:15.960 but, but this is, uh, a month long, I think it's five weeks or four week long training around

01:21:22.000 how to build your, a tribe, whatever that tribe is.

01:21:26.500 And I would say not just a tribe, but a digital tribe, very similar to what we've been doing

01:21:32.760 here with Order of Man.

01:21:33.840 You're trying to create an online movement, uh, and you want to use Order of Man as the

01:21:38.740 framework, uh, or the foundation for what you want to create.

01:21:42.640 Then this would be the course for you.

01:21:44.300 Orderofman.com slash tribe builder.

01:21:46.800 Yep.

01:21:47.260 And taught by Ryan during that period of time.

01:21:49.820 Correct.

01:21:50.220 Um, our other event, which is probably sold out, uh, but I don't know if you're on a few

01:21:56.780 more spots for it.

01:21:58.420 Okay.

01:21:58.960 So if you're really pressing, um, May 29th through May 31st, 2020, that is the Order of

01:22:07.200 Man main event to learn more.

01:22:09.340 That's Orderofman.com slash main event.

01:22:11.820 And with, for our iron council members, there's a dinner the night of the 28th as part of that

01:22:16.820 event.

01:22:17.060 So if you're on the fence, you got to act, uh, go to that website URL and, and get registered

01:22:22.320 right away.

01:22:22.780 I would also say on that, Kip, that video that Will did for us, uh, highlighting the event

01:22:28.960 is absolutely phenomenal.

01:22:30.560 Uh, I just put it on YouTube last week.

01:22:33.000 I think we have close to 80,000 views on that video as of right now.

01:22:41.160 So if you want to see what it's all about, you can go to YouTube, youtube.com slash Order

01:22:45.880 of Man, and you can get a recap of, of the video it's called, uh, the world is starving

01:22:50.840 for men, uh, or you can go to order of man.com slash main event.

01:22:56.160 And the video is there on that page as well.

01:22:58.720 Cool.

01:22:58.940 And to receive other announcements of happenings of what's going on, uh, with the Order of

01:23:04.460 Man or the iron council, uh, or just to follow Ryan in general and what's happening in his

01:23:10.060 life.

01:23:10.320 You can follow him on Twitter and Instagram at Ryan Mickler.

01:23:14.360 Of course, to get your questions submitted to the Ask Me Anything episode, uh, you could

01:23:18.940 do so by joining us on Facebook.

01:23:20.620 You don't even have to submit a question, but you can join us on Facebook anyway, and

01:23:24.580 be part of the conversations that are happening there with 60K plus men.

01:23:29.280 That's facebook.com slash group slash Order of Man.

01:23:32.840 And of course, from time to time, we, we talked about it.

01:23:35.040 We didn't talk about it too much today.

01:23:36.960 We did talk about battle plans and the battle plan is, is really, um, think of it as kind

01:23:42.880 of our, uh, our guide and toolbox for effectiveness.

01:23:46.980 Uh, we think about it as the answer to everything.

01:23:50.140 The answer to everything is the battle plan.

01:23:52.940 Um, so if you want to get on the same court with a bunch of other men working on their

01:23:57.220 battle plans and leveling up to become better and more fulfilled in life, you can join us

01:24:02.480 in the iron council to learn more about the iron council.

01:24:05.100 That's order of man.com slash iron council.

01:24:07.480 And if you feel like going on your own and you want that battle plan, visit the store

01:24:12.380 that store.orderofman.com.

01:24:13.980 You can get a battle planner there.

01:24:15.620 You can get t-shirts, hats, swags, decal, things that kind of represent the order.

01:24:21.040 I cannot say how fun it is to wear an order of man swag.

01:24:26.540 And the only reason why is because I know when someone recognizes it, sometimes guys

01:24:32.800 will mention it.

01:24:33.800 You'll get like the, the, the look and the nod.

01:24:36.980 Yep.

01:24:37.260 Um, and then you go for the special handshake, you know, then the special handshake.

01:24:41.340 Yeah.

01:24:41.620 In fact, we need like a gang sign or something that we can maybe use.

01:24:45.540 Um, or what's even cool is, is jumping on social media.

01:24:50.340 I was like checking my, my Instagram feeds and, and, uh, uh, Josh, a cousin of mine,

01:24:56.760 you know, he's in New York and he has this order of man t-shirt on.

01:25:00.040 I'm like, sure.

01:25:01.240 Yeah.

01:25:01.660 So it's just fun to kind of see it out there.

01:25:04.720 So, yeah, if you, here's a cool thing we can do.

01:25:07.300 If you tag order of man on your post with your swag on Instagram, then each week we'll

01:25:13.560 pick one out and we'll do a shout out on the, on the AMA.

01:25:16.600 I like that.

01:25:17.360 All right.

01:25:17.580 We'll do that.

01:25:18.100 Just tag order of man, uh, tag me, tag Kip on Instagram, and then we'll take the entries.

01:25:24.300 We'll give you a shout out on, on this podcast.

01:25:27.540 All right.

01:25:27.760 You guys have now 37 things exactly to do after this podcast and 37 places to go.

01:25:34.460 So we'll, we'll call it a day with that.

01:25:36.680 Yep.

01:25:37.080 I appreciate you, brother guys.

01:25:38.380 Appreciate your questions.

01:25:39.780 And, uh, again, hopefully we've given you some, some value.

01:25:42.480 All right, guys, go out there, take action, become the man.

01:25:44.920 You are meant to be.

01:25:45.860 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

01:25:48.720 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

01:25:52.780 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

01:25:55.940 And, uh, yeah.

01:25:56.680 So, yeah.

01:25:58.200 All right.

01:26:01.440 Thanks you, God.

01:26:02.720 No, I see you.

01:26:02.860 Yeah.

01:26:03.580 You're welcome.

01:26:04.300 walk in, you're welcome.

01:26:05.060 Look?

01:26:05.120 , yeah.

01:26:06.020 I gotta be.

01:26:07.080 That's great.

01:26:07.560 Welcome back.

01:26:08.980 Dank.

01:26:09.340 Bye, back.

01:26:09.840 Bye, for listening.

01:26:10.140 Bye, bye.

01:26:10.560 Bye.

01:26:10.960 Bye.

01:26:11.480 Bye, bye.

01:26:12.720 Bye.

01:26:12.860 Bye.

01:26:13.820 Bye, bye.

01:26:15.720 Bye.

01:26:16.540 Bye, bye.

01:26:17.100 Bye, bye.

01:26:17.260 Bye, bye.

01:26:18.220 Bye.

01:26:18.360 Bye, bye.

01:26:19.200 Bye, bye.

01:26:19.360 Bye, bye.

01:26:19.940 Bye, bye.

01:26:20.900 Bye, bye.

01:26:21.080 Bye, bye.

01:26:21.260 Bye, bye.

01:26:21.900 Bye, bye.

Order of Man - September 25, 2019

Addressing Red Flags, Maintaining Targets, and Programming Discipline ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING

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