Order of Man - Blind Tribalism, Passive Income, and Holding onto Anger ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING

00:00:00.000 Have zero expectations of others and high standards for yourself.

00:00:05.160 Enough of this idea that everybody just gets to decide and just be happy and make yourself happy and go out and get yours.

00:00:14.080 That's the problem.

00:00:15.520 Because if my happiness is the sole objective of my life, then I can morally screw anyone else over as long as I'm happy and I got mine.

00:00:28.040 And I don't agree with that.

00:00:30.800 Kip, what's up, man?

00:00:31.760 So great to see you.

00:00:32.740 We are starting the year off right and strong.

00:00:35.760 So glad to have you here, man, to do this Ask Me Anything.

00:00:38.900 Amen to that, brother.

00:00:40.100 I'm feeling great.

00:00:41.180 How are you feeling?

00:00:42.360 You ready for Q1?

00:00:45.160 Yeah, I'm good.

00:00:46.000 I mean, I had a good weekend.

00:00:46.960 I'm a little banged up and sore because I have this reoccurring thought that I can actually keep up with my oldest son in athletics and feel okay about it.

00:00:56.320 So, you know, I can hold my own when it comes to performance, but man, my body feels it after.

00:01:04.280 So last week he challenged me to a pit.

00:01:09.320 He just came over one day and he's like, dad, let's go play pickleball.

00:01:11.860 I can beat you.

00:01:13.520 And I'm like, you can't beat me at pickleball.

00:01:16.220 He's like, no, I absolutely can't have been practicing.

00:01:18.600 I'm like, no.

00:01:19.980 He's like, when's the last time you played?

00:01:21.420 I'm like, I don't know, four or five months ago when we played.

00:01:24.140 He's like, oh, I'll smoke you.

00:01:25.300 I'm like, all right, bring it on.

00:01:27.380 And we went and my neighbor's got an indoor pickleball court.

00:01:30.640 So he lets us use it.

00:01:31.620 So we went over there and I smoked him three to zero.

00:01:35.400 And he's like, what?

00:01:37.860 How's this happening?

00:01:39.120 I'm like, I'm just more athletic than you.

00:01:40.940 Like, I can just get off the couch and do it.

00:01:42.980 And he's like, no, no, no.

00:01:45.520 And so this weekend he wanted to challenge me to a lacrosse competition.

00:01:49.700 And I'm like, are you sure that's your sport?

00:01:52.120 Like, you don't want to lose in your own sport to me.

00:01:54.300 Are you sure about that?

00:01:56.060 And he's like, yeah, I'll beat you.

00:01:57.060 I promise I'll beat you.

00:01:58.000 I'm like, all right.

00:01:58.680 So we went and we did three competitions.

00:02:02.420 So we did precision accuracy on shots, long range shots, and then face-offs.

00:02:08.120 And he won the precision accuracy and I won the long shots.

00:02:12.460 So we did the face-off and we went two to two. 0.96

00:02:16.240 And he won the last one and made me look really foolish on the last one.

00:02:20.020 And so he won the lacrosse tournament yesterday. 0.77

00:02:23.020 But my hip.

00:02:23.500 Yeah, but you're paying.

00:02:25.080 I was going to say you're paying the price today.

00:02:27.080 Oh, my gosh.

00:02:29.000 Yeah, my hip and back are just banged up.

00:02:32.020 Just brutal.

00:02:33.740 So, yeah, this week is going to – we're going to do 12 competitions for over the next 12 weeks.

00:02:45.340 So 10 more weeks.

00:02:46.500 And whoever picked the last one, the next person picks the – so we'll do upper body strength training this week.

00:02:52.220 And I should be able to have that one pretty handedly.

00:02:55.620 But we'll see.

00:02:56.040 He's getting big and strong.

00:02:56.900 So we'll see how it goes.

00:02:59.360 I love it.

00:03:00.200 Well, we got some questions from Facebook.

00:03:02.840 Facebook.com slash group slash order of man.

00:03:05.780 You good if we jump into these?

00:03:08.200 Yeah, let's get right to it, man.

00:03:09.960 All right, man.

00:03:10.600 Bryce Beattie, what tips and tricks do you recommend for a leader who struggles with asking questions instead of making demands and statements?

00:03:21.200 What recommendations do you have for asking better questions without them seeming leading or like gotcha questions?

00:03:28.420 Do you think that Bryce is talking about him being a leader or wanting another leader to be that way instead of more authoritarian in his approach?

00:03:39.240 No, I think he's talking about him.

00:03:41.720 Like how does he have these questions where he doesn't come across like he's leading them or these are gotchas, right? 0.87

00:03:48.320 Well, yeah, it's a good question.

00:03:50.380 When you're leading or using these gotcha questions, it usually comes from a place of you already knowing the answer.

00:04:01.100 Yeah.

00:04:01.200 So if I'm leading you towards something, it's because I already have a predetermined outcome in my mind that I want you to adhere to, but I want to manipulate and massage you into a way of quote unquote coming up with it yourself.

00:04:15.420 And that's the problem.

00:04:16.820 It's not the questioning.

00:04:17.980 It's the motive behind the questioning.

00:04:20.620 It's the baseline behind the questioning.

00:04:22.940 That's why energy is so important.

00:04:24.900 And I'm not talking about your physical capacity, that type of energy.

00:04:28.000 I'm talking about the energy that you bring into interpersonal dynamics.

00:04:33.240 So if you're on a date, for example, and you're desperate, you could say the exact same things as to the exact same woman as a man who's not desperate.

00:04:44.140 And she will feed off that energy and know that, oh, this guy is just reeks of desperation.

00:04:50.260 That's the energy.

00:04:52.180 If you go into an employee-employer situation or a manager-subordinate situation and your energy is, I know the answer, I'm going to manipulate these guys to come up with a solution themselves, they're going to read that energy.

00:05:08.100 So what is the solution?

00:05:10.220 Very simply, change your energy, and it will automatically change the questions.

00:05:15.220 What's the energy?

00:05:16.680 Curiosity.

00:05:17.320 You have to actually be curious about what they think.

00:05:23.300 You have to actually be open to the idea that maybe they have a solution that you haven't considered before.

00:05:31.220 And the more that you do that, the more they're going to feel valued.

00:05:36.560 They're going to feel appreciated.

00:05:38.920 They're going to want to follow you because you're humble in the way that you approach leadership.

00:05:45.500 And look, sometimes you're just going to have to give directives.

00:05:49.100 Hey, guys, we're doing this, this way, for this reason.

00:05:52.460 And what's the best way do you guys think about implementing this?

00:05:55.680 So you can still ask questions.

00:05:58.360 But that's how I would do it.

00:05:59.660 And that's how I have done it.

00:06:00.960 And I have practice every day because of the podcast where I just, I'm a curious individual by nature.

00:06:05.500 But also, I've practiced and honed the skill set of being curious.

00:06:11.520 And questions will generally and naturally get better when you really are curious about a person.

00:06:18.360 Yeah.

00:06:18.960 And a lot of curiosity is rooted in humility.

00:06:21.980 If I have a strong ego around a way that I believe someone should show up, then I'm not going to be curious.

00:06:27.780 Because you have to get kind of humble a little bit and go, hey, you know what?

00:06:32.060 I don't know.

00:06:33.640 I think this, but maybe I'm wrong.

00:06:36.300 And the mindset that I'm bringing into this is one of curiosity and humility.

00:06:41.700 I think when we're overly arrogant, we have this strong opinion of I know best, they don't, me versus them.

00:06:48.680 And then it's all manipulation.

00:06:49.840 This is why, Ryan, I hate so much leadership, development, and books.

00:06:58.000 Because most of them focus on the tactics.

00:07:00.820 They go, oh, you want someone to trust you?

00:07:03.980 Oh, do these tactics.

00:07:06.260 Manipulate.

00:07:07.100 Course.

00:07:08.420 More or less, be honest.

00:07:10.540 Do these things and people will.

00:07:12.240 And it's like, or you know what you could do is just be trustworthy.

00:07:15.880 What you could do is actually just believe in people and shift your mindset and be rooted with proper intent.

00:07:23.600 And then the tactics aren't tactics of manipulation.

00:07:26.840 They're just tactics to help clarify how you already feel.

00:07:31.460 But to your point, if our intentions are off and we're trying to do one thing that's out of alignment with the intentions that we have, people sniff it out.

00:07:39.320 We know those people that are not authentic, that are lying to some extent, or they're manipulating, and there's alternative motives.

00:07:48.640 It's horrible.

00:07:49.600 It's yucky, and most people feel it.

00:07:52.600 Yeah.

00:07:53.080 Yep.

00:07:53.500 I fully agree.

00:07:55.280 You know, and it is, I really like the idea of focusing on tactics.

00:07:59.980 This is what, and again, it's easy to see in so many aspects of life, whether it's professional or in the dating space.

00:08:05.420 You see that in the dating space, too, is you have these pickup artists, and they're like, well, just say these things.

00:08:10.660 It's like, bro, if you say those things and you don't have the right energy, you're going to sound creepy.

00:08:18.420 But if you say the exact same things with the right energy, you're going to sound flirtatious and funny.

00:08:22.340 So, I think the real question is, how do you get to, maybe the better question is, how do you get to that stage of curiosity and humility?

00:08:33.020 I don't know the answer to that, actually.

00:08:35.220 I think other than knowing that, like having faith and belief in people, I think is a big one.

00:08:40.640 There's a lot of pessimists out there where they just, you know, if you want it done right, you have to do it yourself.

00:08:46.200 And I can't find good employees, and millennials are this, and Gen X is that. 1.00

00:08:51.280 And we just have been so conditioned to be pessimistic through these little devices that we carry around every day. 0.97

00:08:57.680 And so, everything looks like a crap show. 1.00

00:09:01.220 Every employee looks like a piece of trash. 1.00

00:09:03.420 Every person out there looks like an oversensitive little crybaby. 1.00

00:09:06.760 And it's not the case.

00:09:07.840 We just see it.

00:09:09.080 But if you go interact in the real world, go to the grocery store, walking down your neighborhood, wherever, out at the ballpark at a game, the overwhelming majority of people that you come in contact with are good, decent, hardworking people.

00:09:27.140 They want to make a living.

00:09:28.400 They want to provide for their family.

00:09:29.740 They want to have a few experiences, and they want to be fulfilled in life, period.

00:09:33.820 That's what the overwhelming majority of people want.

00:09:36.160 And if you start to embrace that idea instead of looking at everything as they're just out to get me or they're only going to work as hard as their income, and you start believing that people are good and decent and have experience and have knowledge and have ideas, then I think we're more likely to not be so directive in the way we lead and more inquisitive and curious about what they might bring to the equation.

00:09:57.940 A quote that comes to mind is, most critical thinking is difficult.

00:10:05.320 That's why most people judge.

00:10:08.060 It's a form of lazy thinking.

00:10:10.800 You want to get humble and not lose your humanity in someone?

00:10:16.200 Critically think.

00:10:17.660 Humans do things for a reason.

00:10:21.180 What's the root cause of it?

00:10:22.760 What's driving the behaviors?

00:10:25.460 It's way more complex than you realize.

00:10:27.560 And I think, actually, to be honest with you, Ryan, is I feel often we're overly critical of people because we're overly critical with ourselves.

00:10:36.760 If you're not self-aware enough to understand the elements by which drives your behavior, you're not going to have that level of empathy and open-mindedness towards others.

00:10:48.040 Yeah.

00:10:48.240 So maybe that's an area of practice.

00:10:50.160 It's like, what's driving this behavior?

00:10:51.660 Why am I upset?

00:10:52.680 That drives self-awareness.

00:10:55.200 And that gives us some grace, I think, when we start looking at other people, understanding the human condition.

00:11:00.280 That there's a lot of things and a lot of variables that go into what people do or why they don't do things.

00:11:06.700 Yeah.

00:11:07.820 Yeah, I think that's true.

00:11:08.980 I just watched a video on Instagram this morning.

00:11:10.960 It was actually pretty funny.

00:11:12.140 It was a man ice fishing in what looked like a blizzard.

00:11:16.060 And it must have been northern Minnesota, northern Maine, or somewhere in Canada, probably Canada.

00:11:21.480 Yeah.

00:11:21.820 And the guy's got a warm jacket on, no beanie or toke, I think they call it in Canada.

00:11:27.720 No gloves.

00:11:28.940 And there's a guy on, it must have been a dirt bike with studded tires.

00:11:33.160 It didn't show, but I'm sure it was a dirt bike with studded tires.

00:11:35.620 And he's just ripping around this lake, on the lake, on the ice.

00:11:39.900 Yeah.

00:11:40.400 And he turns around and he comes over and he's like, he's like, hey.

00:11:44.460 And the guy who's ice fishing is like, hey, man, do you think that's bringing the fish in?

00:11:49.620 And the guy on the dirt bike was like, oh, you want me to F off?

00:11:52.780 And the guy fishing said, yeah, would you?

00:11:55.320 And he's like, oh, sorry.

00:11:57.160 And he said, no, it's cool, brother.

00:11:58.760 Like, it's a cool bike.

00:12:00.040 Like, it's really rad.

00:12:01.640 Are those studded tires?

00:12:03.000 What tire pressure do you have?

00:12:04.340 And the guy started asking questions.

00:12:06.820 And the guy's like, hey, I'm sorry.

00:12:08.400 I'll just go ahead and leave you alone.

00:12:09.500 He's like, I love your bike.

00:12:11.220 I think it's awesome, but it's not bringing the fish in.

00:12:14.040 And the guy went back to fishing.

00:12:15.460 And the other guy went and found somewhere else to rip around the lake.

00:12:18.940 And it was such a cool example of just being normal.

00:12:23.800 And just having a little grace, not trying to be upset or bothered by anything.

00:12:30.280 And just live and let live, let people do their thing, be decent and kind to each other, and just let yourself roll with the punches.

00:12:40.240 And I think that goes to what you were saying about not only affording other people grace, because the guy who was ice fishing did afford that guy grace.

00:12:47.820 And the guy who was dirt biking afforded the other guy grace.

00:12:52.300 And I thought it was just a great example of how men could resolve minor issues that could turn catastrophic very quickly.

00:13:01.340 Yeah.

00:13:01.640 Talking about cold weather, do you see the hoodie scenario with origin?

00:13:06.460 Oh, yeah.

00:13:07.220 Super hilarious.

00:13:07.720 I actually sent Pete a message.

00:13:09.500 Well, I thought it was AI at first.

00:13:12.260 And I think I liked it, but I just scrolled through it because I thought it was funny.

00:13:16.460 So if you guys don't know what we're talking about, Nicolas Maduro, when he was captured, somebody must have thrown that hoodie on.

00:13:23.500 That hoodie on.

00:13:25.440 Yeah.

00:13:25.960 I'm assuming it's one of the guys that captured him.

00:13:28.260 It's their hoods.

00:13:28.820 I'm sure.

00:13:29.180 And they threw one of their hoodies on him.

00:13:31.220 Yeah.

00:13:32.160 And so Pete, the founder of origin, made this post.

00:13:36.000 And I'm like, oh, that's funny.

00:13:37.580 And then Brecken told me, my oldest son told me, he's like, hey, did you see that thing with him wearing the origin hoodie?

00:13:43.360 I'm like, that was fake.

00:13:44.180 He's like, no, it was real.

00:13:46.640 And I went back and I started looking at it and looking through all the comments.

00:13:50.580 And yeah, 100% real.

00:13:52.580 That hoodie is not even released.

00:13:53.880 So I don't know how he got it.

00:13:55.540 But I sent Pete a message.

00:13:57.200 I'm like, whoever put that hoodie on that guy, get him on payroll in the marketing department ASAP.

00:14:02.920 And he just laughed.

00:14:03.880 Yeah, totally.

00:14:04.660 That's crazy.

00:14:05.500 Yeah.

00:14:06.320 Yeah, it's crazy.

00:14:07.620 All right.

00:14:07.940 Roger Byers, what quality in yourself are you most proud of?

00:14:12.560 I'm relentless.

00:14:15.720 That's it.

00:14:17.000 I don't know how to quit.

00:14:19.280 I don't know how to stop.

00:14:20.280 It gets me in trouble sometimes.

00:14:21.480 I'm not saying that.

00:14:22.480 Yeah.

00:14:22.640 But there's a phrase in Latin, and I don't know how to say it in Latin, but it's, I will either find a way or make one.

00:14:30.400 And if there's one way to sum up my operating system of life, whether it's personally or professionally, it's that.

00:14:38.440 I will find a way or make one.

00:14:40.580 And I'm undefeated.

00:14:42.280 So not to say I haven't lost a few matches or bouts here or there, but in the grand scheme of things, I'm here.

00:14:49.900 So I think that's what I'm most proud of.

00:14:52.080 But, again, I want to say that if I'm not careful, it's like an unbridled Mustang out on the range running himself right off the cliff because he doesn't know how to hit the brakes.

00:15:03.060 And I need to be careful of that sometimes.

00:15:05.140 I need to be more aware of when should I not be relentless?

00:15:10.660 When should I stop pursuing?

00:15:12.440 When should I pivot or switch gears?

00:15:14.960 Or how can I acknowledge red flags and potential threats sooner and not just go balls to the wall and maybe ease off the throttle a little bit when appropriate?

00:15:26.920 And then I can press back on the throttle when I'm in a different position.

00:15:31.880 So my greatest strength is probably also my greatest weakness.

00:15:35.880 Yeah.

00:15:36.420 Isn't that true?

00:15:37.480 I mean, I think it's true for all of us.

00:15:39.740 You know, we did some 2026 planning.

00:15:42.440 We're talking about, you know, our strengths in 2025 and bad habits.

00:15:48.280 And I can't help but see the correlation constantly between the two things.

00:15:51.300 In fact, I was even having this conversation with the wife around, you know, the pivot that I've made recently from an employment perspective.

00:15:58.040 And she's like, I don't know why it took you so long.

00:16:00.400 And I'm like, well, babe, as much as that's annoying to you that it took me a while to pivot, that's also my quality.

00:16:07.900 I kind of grind.

00:16:09.060 I make sure I don't give up when it gets hard.

00:16:13.200 Now, same breath.

00:16:14.660 I might grind out too long and I should have pivoted much quicker than I should have.

00:16:20.140 Right.

00:16:20.840 But, you know, but it's so true.

00:16:24.020 Your dynamic is so interesting to me, yours and your wife's, because you're aligned, of course.

00:16:30.940 You know, you wouldn't be together and have the successful marriage that you do without being aligned.

00:16:35.420 But your personalities are so different to me based on what I see.

00:16:41.040 And I'm sure there's some similarities.

00:16:42.880 But with what I see, I'm like, how do these two deal with each other?

00:16:47.120 Like, how do they love each other?

00:16:49.800 How do they when their personalities are so different?

00:16:52.500 It's hilarious to me, actually.

00:16:54.440 Totally.

00:16:55.180 Well, you know, and what's fascinating about it, Ryan, is in the earlier years, I hated it.

00:17:00.260 It bothered me.

00:17:01.440 It really bothered me.

00:17:02.500 It was a form of contention until I saw the blessing of it and thought, you know what?

00:17:08.120 The fact that I have a wife that has what's zero stability in life and wants to just have fun is the very thing I need to have fun.

00:17:20.080 And the grind and the stability that I bring to leadership is what she needs so she's not homeless.

00:17:26.620 And instead of demonizing each other, right, instead of demonizing each other for those traits, we love it instead.

00:17:33.280 And I say, I love that about it.

00:17:35.980 And she's, oh, and I love that about you.

00:17:38.300 And we realize that there's a balance.

00:17:40.880 And it's the yin and yang of the relationship.

00:17:43.100 And it's honestly, it's like my favorite part about a relationship now is those differences.

00:17:48.260 It's fascinating.

00:17:49.120 No, it's really cool.

00:17:49.820 Like I, you know, I'm, I'm an observer of people and dynamics and I like to see what makes people tick.

00:17:56.920 And I like to see if I can identify what makes a person successful or unsuccessful or what makes them operate the way they do.

00:18:04.120 And I watch you in Asia and I just, I love the dynamic between you two, but it just cracks me up.

00:18:08.760 I smile every time I see you two together.

00:18:10.400 Cause I'm like, this is crazy.

00:18:12.340 Like this is, I don't know how this works, but it works and bless both of them.

00:18:17.120 Cause I'm sure you guys infuriate each other at times.

00:18:20.100 All right.

00:18:20.760 Eddie Salkido, what ways to earn an income that's passive?

00:18:25.860 What ways to have different streams of income? 0.84

00:18:28.320 Maybe some, I don't know, ideas.

00:18:30.320 Oh man.

00:18:31.620 Well, like, okay.

00:18:32.640 So I don't want to be overly critical here, but again, the power of questions, right?

00:18:36.100 Ask general questions, get broad, general answers, ask specific questions, get better, more specific answers.

00:18:42.100 But, you know, I think anything in technology, actually, you know, what I would say is just look at the things that you have an affinity for, you know, just, just look at the things that you have an affinity for and try to figure out how to streamline them.

00:18:53.720 So, you know, obviously you could say stocks, real estate, that sort of thing.

00:18:58.220 Sure.

00:18:58.360 That works.

00:18:59.520 But what I think a lot of people overlook, and I'm going to give you three questions here to ask yourself in a minute, is that you can take anything that you do and you can turn it into passive income.

00:19:07.760 And, um, so here's the three questions I'd ask.

00:19:13.160 Um, number one, what are you doing when time moves the fastest?

00:19:19.040 What are you doing when time moves the fastest?

00:19:22.300 Number two, what are people asking you for advice for repeatedly?

00:19:28.180 And number three is what would you do with your time if money were not an issue?

00:19:35.240 And you can't say sit around on the beach and like, no, like, give me a real answer.

00:19:40.540 You could do that for a weekend, but, and then you get bored.

00:19:44.060 What, what would you do with your time?

00:19:46.340 Would you travel the world?

00:19:48.280 Would you go to try to see every major league baseball park in the country?

00:19:53.240 Would you, uh, get, get good at shooting firearms or jujitsu?

00:19:58.580 Would you learn how to paint?

00:20:00.060 What, what would you do?

00:20:02.320 And when you start asking yourself questions like that, you'll find some correlations between the three, the answers to the three questions.

00:20:11.040 And when you find that merging point, then you're onto something that you might not even acknowledge in yourself that you're good at.

00:20:19.160 And this is what, this is how you often know you're overlooking some natural talent.

00:20:27.020 When you discount what you do, when somebody gives you a compliment.

00:20:31.480 So let's say, let's say, um, to me, uh, Kip, you said, Ryan, you know, you're, you're so good at design, man.

00:20:40.400 Everything that you put out there.

00:20:41.860 I know.

00:20:42.460 Can we choose something that's a little bit more, I don't know.

00:20:45.280 Yeah.

00:20:46.300 You're so good at growing a beer.

00:20:48.360 Like your beer growing skills are amazing.

00:20:51.680 No, you're actually great at marketing.

00:20:53.620 Full disclosure.

00:20:54.480 Yeah.

00:20:54.720 But you, you have a great marketing eye.

00:20:57.060 Absolutely.

00:20:57.620 So, so let's take that.

00:20:59.660 And my natural inclination might be to dismiss that and say, Oh no, man, it's, it's nothing.

00:21:05.880 Like everybody's like, nah, thank you.

00:21:08.200 But no, I don't, I don't really feel that way, but I appreciate it.

00:21:10.620 You know, you might just be trying to be humble, but I think most of the time you're discounting what you don't think is talent because you have it.

00:21:21.960 You naturally, you have it.

00:21:24.040 And so if people, right.

00:21:26.160 And it can be developed and articulated, but if people are telling you, Oh my, I love to watch you build.

00:21:31.960 I love to see what you build and you're just really great at woodworking.

00:21:36.480 Don't discount that.

00:21:38.280 Embrace that fully and ask yourself, maybe I actually am good at this.

00:21:44.100 Maybe I do know a thing or two, or maybe I, I do have an art or an eye for art or marketing, or I do have the aptitude for martial arts or whatever.

00:21:53.960 But if you start discounting, then, you know, you're probably overlooking a God-given talent that you should lean into a little more than you currently are.

00:22:02.180 Now, how do you make this passive?

00:22:03.960 You teach other people how to do the thing.

00:22:07.960 So if you're a great, if you're really good at martial arts and that's how you'd spend your time and people are asking for advice, well, you can either turn that into one-on-one coaching, group coaching, open a gym, but that's not really passive yet.

00:22:20.820 You can make that passive by building the gym, having another coach come in and train.

00:22:26.660 And now you're earning income when other coaches are training your students or the Gracie's are really good at this is they put together a video course on the basics of jujitsu.

00:22:38.880 And so him and his brother, uh, I can't remember who it is.

00:22:43.460 Who is it?

00:22:45.820 Are you talking about who you're talking about?

00:22:48.000 Henner?

00:22:48.840 Henner and, and what's his brother's name?

00:22:50.240 Henner and Horian.

00:22:51.680 Horian. 0.63

00:22:52.240 I'm probably pronouncing it wrong, but close.

00:22:54.500 Yeah.

00:22:54.760 At least.

00:22:55.200 Yeah.

00:22:55.420 Whatever it is.

00:22:56.180 So those two, they're really, uh, they're really good marketers, really good marketers.

00:23:02.340 And they put together a, I don't know, an eight week course or a 12 week course on the basics of jujitsu and they sell it as a course.

00:23:09.460 They're not there.

00:23:10.480 They recorded the videos, but they're not there doing it.

00:23:12.460 And it just became passive.

00:23:14.680 If you're really good at woodworking, put together a video course on the basics of woodworking and what tool, how to set up your tools and what tools you need to get started.

00:23:25.260 And what's the best tools for the job and how to build your first bench and how to use a router.

00:23:31.780 And I only say that cause I messed some crap up on my boat with a router the other day.

00:23:35.480 And like, make a video, start posting on social media, what you're doing now.

00:23:40.860 There's nothing that's truly passive.

00:23:43.020 And I, I don't want the, I want you to get that out of your head.

00:23:46.020 There's not a button that you can go press and you're like passive income, bing, because if that button were there, everybody would have already pressed it and it would be meaningless at this point.

00:23:55.400 Yeah.

00:23:55.860 It's still investment upfront for it to be passive later of some sort.

00:23:59.620 Right.

00:24:00.400 So get ready to bust your tail.

00:24:02.540 I mean, I did that with order of man.

00:24:04.220 I had to bust my tail upfront in order to create a profitable business.

00:24:08.280 And now this movement, but, um, hopefully that gets you pointed and oriented in the right direction.

00:24:14.300 I mean, I, I see people have done crazy stuff.

00:24:16.640 Uh, one guy that comes to mind, it's not that crazy, but it comes to mind is John Dudley.

00:24:20.420 He's a world-class archer and bow hunter, and he's got incredible courses on for free.

00:24:27.280 A lot of them for free called one's called the school of knock on how to begin to get into archery and bow hunting.

00:24:34.200 Um, he has his own merchandise now that's somewhat passive.

00:24:39.100 Uh, he's got arrows and, um, he does custom bows all because, so he used to be, he used to go around and coach people on archery around the world and travel around the world and work with Olympians and world-class archers, how to improve their archery game.

00:24:57.600 And instead of doing that so much now, he turned it more into an online business, way more efficient, way more practical, and doesn't have to travel the way that he did before, which is free does time up to bow hunt.

00:25:09.480 So you could do with anything.

00:25:11.820 You just have to be a little bit smart about it and you have to be diligent in getting it set up.

00:25:17.500 Um, yeah, yeah, it's fascinating.

00:25:20.500 I've, you know, I've done consulting the majority of my career and I've been exposed to, let me say, a consultant is really good at identifying solutions to problems.

00:25:31.980 And I have seen so many problems that are fascinating to me, like just fascinating.

00:25:38.180 I remember early on in my career, I was a software developer.

00:25:41.600 I ran a software development team for a firm in Phoenix.

00:25:45.000 We had a client that literally built a business model on creating a blacklist of agents.

00:25:53.660 Like if an agent owed money back to their previous employer, they would blacklist them.

00:26:01.520 This individual would maintain the list and sell the list to other firms.

00:26:08.180 That's all he did.

00:26:09.420 He made a naughty list and people were paying massive amount of money to check the naughty list before they bought be like, literally they had clients like Prudential.

00:26:19.080 They would go buy another firm and they would check their naughty list against agents as part of the purchasing, the due diligence of purchasing an insurance company.

00:26:30.100 Just fascinating to me.

00:26:32.320 Yeah.

00:26:32.640 Isn't it amazing?

00:26:34.600 Yeah.

00:26:34.960 Find a problem, you know, like, and that's, that's always what I do is like, and maybe that's a little bit one-sided to this, but problems need solutions.

00:26:43.920 Sometimes people dream and they're like solution.

00:26:46.400 And it's like, but it's not a big enough problem.

00:26:49.640 Right.

00:26:50.120 And so I always like to say, identify a gap that, that excites you and then put some effort towards addressing the gap.

00:26:58.180 Right.

00:26:59.760 Yep.

00:27:00.220 Exactly.

00:27:01.380 Exactly.

00:27:02.340 All right.

00:27:03.280 Matthew Yant.

00:27:05.180 I'm a man of faith, family, and pursuit of a life with honor.

00:27:08.740 I wholeheartedly believe in the mission of order of man and the values and principles of this group, but with so much in recent, recent years coming to light about government deception, media lies, and even churches who fall away from their convictions in the name of inclusion or to prevent members from leaving faith as men.

00:27:28.300 Again, what outside of our core principles can we still hold on to as certainties?

00:27:34.000 We see narratives spun to distract or influence action or inaction, and I struggle to find anything or anyone that is without reproach.

00:27:43.040 Again, outside of our principles as good men, what can we still hold on to that is true?

00:27:48.740 Well, what was the last part you said, Kip?

00:27:52.920 As men, what can we still hold on to as true?

00:27:56.020 Oh, as true.

00:27:57.640 Yeah.

00:27:58.580 Well, I mean, depending on where you're coming from, you have to ask yourself, you know, you said you're a man of faith, so that's true.

00:28:05.980 But I think you're, for you, right?

00:28:09.240 It's subjectively true.

00:28:11.800 Now, I think you would say it's objectively true, but now that's talking about an appeal to a higher authority, so you can't say it's truth with a capital T.

00:28:22.020 But it might be to you, and that's good.

00:28:25.200 But you could lean on that.

00:28:27.060 The Bible.

00:28:27.700 I don't think the Bible is 100% accurate.

00:28:30.860 It was translated and written by men.

00:28:34.700 Now, some people say it's written by God.

00:28:36.040 No, men wrote those words.

00:28:37.940 Like, I know it was divine inspiration.

00:28:39.940 I believe in that.

00:28:40.820 But a lot of the stories and lessons from the Bible are historical accounts, and we know as human beings how accurate we are when we recall events that happened two days ago, let alone 200 years ago.

00:28:53.740 So there's inaccuracies, but I'm probably going to get really tore up for that one, but it is what it is.

00:29:01.560 That's the reality of it.

00:29:32.660 And we laugh at times, and we lash out.

00:29:34.280 We make bad decisions, but we're human beings.

00:29:39.240 We're human beings with our own desires, selfish at times, and our own temptations, also selfish.

00:29:47.540 And I wonder what life would look like for you if you just stopped setting the bar so high on other people.

00:29:55.180 And you just decided that these core principles, kindness, empathy, love, honor, integrity, whatever your principles are, are true.

00:30:08.720 And you fall short of them every day, and so does everybody else.

00:30:12.700 And now, look, I'm not telling you that if somebody falls short on one of those virtues that you're obligated to maintain a relationship with that person.

00:30:24.240 That's not what I'm saying.

00:30:26.840 But I do think if you learn to see the humanity in things, you won't put so much stock in human beings.

00:30:33.800 I think humans are incredible.

00:30:36.480 We're inventive.

00:30:38.580 We're protective.

00:30:40.880 We want to find solutions.

00:30:44.180 We want to build buildings.

00:30:45.860 We want to go to space.

00:30:47.400 We want to help overcome medical ailments.

00:30:51.600 I mean, human beings are incredible creatures.

00:30:55.140 And we're also horrible at the same time.

00:30:57.840 I think this goes back to what we were saying earlier.

00:30:59.760 Our greatest strength, the desire for advancement, for example, I think is one of our greatest strengths as a species.

00:31:06.120 It's also our greatest weakness because it causes us to leave a wake of collateral damage in our path sometimes, to take advantage of people, to cheat the system, to get ahead.

00:31:20.020 And so those are temptations we need to fight.

00:31:23.060 So figure out what your truth is, what it is for you, and then find the people who align to that as closely as possible and within reason afford them grace and dignity when they mess up the same as you.

00:31:36.160 And stop expecting human beings to be perfect.

00:31:39.580 They're just not.

00:31:43.820 So I'm trying to balance that with making sure that you protect yourself and the people around you.

00:31:49.280 You don't want to expose yourself to any unnecessary risk.

00:31:53.580 But I think it's okay just, well, let me say it this way.

00:31:57.640 I'll paraphrase this in one quick sentence.

00:31:59.760 Have zero expectations of others and high standards for yourself.

00:32:09.800 And that's it.

00:32:11.140 So when your church, let's say you're Catholic, when your church fails you, I have zero expectations of the way that those leaders within the church show up.

00:32:24.380 But I have high standards for myself, so I'm going to keep working the way that I think is fit.

00:32:29.760 Yeah, well said.

00:32:33.780 Ness Sojo, people's lack of self-control overall.

00:32:38.160 Wide spectrum, a larger growing number of people are showing their inner child with content for others, sometimes even with a, I don't even know that word, with a bad attitude.

00:32:49.940 Seemingly, as we're regressing as a society, there is less actual adults or just mature individuals.

00:32:57.820 Maybe it's just a thought.

00:32:59.020 I don't know what the question is.

00:33:00.380 Yeah, I mean, I agree with some of that.

00:33:05.460 I think we are living in very degenerate times because, to go back to the question with Matthew, there is no personal standard for anyone.

00:33:17.080 Everything is subjective.

00:33:19.400 Literally everything.

00:33:20.120 This is where that idea of moral relativism comes in, where morality is just relatively based on what, who's in power, who's saying what, who's the loudest, who has the most social media followers.

00:33:31.320 If morality is relative, who gets to decide?

00:33:35.060 And if that's the case, let's say, for example, you believe that morality is relative and it's dictated by the government through laws enacted by our representatives.

00:33:50.300 Well, then are you willing to acknowledge that if there is a law enacted that you don't agree with, that it is too moral?

00:33:59.640 Well, I don't think you would say that.

00:34:03.100 I think you'd say that's immoral because your morality comes from a different place.

00:34:09.620 It's derived from God.

00:34:10.840 And the institutions of objective morality are being dismantled piece by piece deliberately by the enemy and by the tools of the enemy, the government, academia, just culture, the entertainment industry, the medical community, piece by piece being completely dismantled.

00:34:32.580 Because if everybody disagrees on what is moral, then who's right and who's wrong and what actually is, and that's a problem.

00:34:42.520 We need to get back to the institutions like church, like neighborhoods.

00:34:48.860 I saw this.

00:34:49.540 I saw this picture.

00:34:50.700 It was I don't know if it was AI or not.

00:34:53.520 It's getting harder and harder to tell, but it was a family in a cul-de-sac.

00:34:56.360 It looked really real.

00:34:57.260 It was a family in a cul-de-sac and all the neighbors were out and they put picnic benches in the cul-de-sac.

00:35:03.740 And this is probably in like the 70s or something.

00:35:05.980 And all the kids were playing and they were having a barbecue and everybody brought food.

00:35:12.020 Like when was the last time you did that, Kip?

00:35:15.460 Last year.

00:35:16.020 You know, maybe we do it all the time.

00:35:18.040 And that's good.

00:35:18.740 We set up the screen.

00:35:19.320 We watch TV out there, but that's not normal, right?

00:35:22.520 It's not a common thing.

00:35:23.900 We're intentionally doing that.

00:35:25.440 Yeah.

00:35:25.900 Yeah.

00:35:27.260 Um, you know, maybe some people do that through their church congregation or they meet with

00:35:32.520 rotary or chamber of commerce or some other civic organization and they get together,

00:35:38.080 even just friendships.

00:35:39.680 I mean, the amount of men that have even a single friend they could call in a time of

00:35:44.500 need is abysmal.

00:35:46.560 And the, even the military up until the last, you know, six months to, to, to a year, the

00:35:52.980 military was like, come into the army or come into the Marine Corps and find yourself.

00:35:59.240 It's like, what?

00:36:01.040 That's not, no, you don't go into the military to find yourself.

00:36:06.440 You go into the military to be part of a bigger system than yourself.

00:36:12.400 You're just one of many people and you're to assimilate to that organization.

00:36:18.940 And then even assimilation, you take immigration in general.

00:36:23.460 You know, you, you, we, we, we heard these clever little platitudes of diversity of strength,

00:36:28.260 diversity of strength, diversity of strength.

00:36:29.940 No, it's not.

00:36:32.700 Diversity of thought could be strength.

00:36:34.680 Diversity of thought, by the way, not immutable characteristics like your skin color, but diversity

00:36:40.040 of thought could be a strength as long as you're all going in the same direction.

00:36:43.620 But why would we continue to bring people into this country who hate the ideals of this country?

00:36:50.380 You're telling me that just because they happen to look different or have a different skin

00:36:54.240 color or speak a different language, that even though they are going in a different direction,

00:36:59.600 that that diversity makes us stronger. 0.97

00:37:01.540 What a ridiculous sentiment. 0.63

00:37:04.300 We need to begin to congregate in organizations like order of man, church congregations, community 0.94

00:37:10.080 congregations, where you're all getting together and you're deciding that we're going to work

00:37:13.940 together towards this set of principles.

00:37:16.380 And this is who we are.

00:37:18.000 And we're going to hold each other accountable to these principles.

00:37:20.840 Enough of this idea that everybody just gets to decide and just be happy and make yourself

00:37:27.800 happy and go out and get yours.

00:37:29.860 That's the problem.

00:37:32.380 Because if my happiness is the sole objective of my life, then I can morally screw anything.

00:37:40.080 Anyone else over as long as I'm happy and I got mine.

00:37:45.140 And I don't agree with that.

00:37:46.860 And I also don't agree with complete collectivism. 1.00

00:37:49.860 I believe in rugged individualism, meaning you're capable of taking care of your shit. 0.98

00:37:55.600 But I also believe in the community. 0.98

00:37:58.100 I believe in neighborhoods.

00:37:59.520 I believe in congregations.

00:38:00.880 I believe in tribes.

00:38:02.880 We're supposed to operate that way.

00:38:04.760 And the more that that gets dismissed and dismantled, the worse it's going to get for all

00:38:08.740 of us because we're all doing our own thing without a care in the world about how it might

00:38:12.500 impact other people.

00:38:14.540 Yeah.

00:38:15.080 I mean, I think we're using tribes.

00:38:17.140 That's not changing.

00:38:18.480 The question is, is like, are we intentional with the tribe that we're selecting?

00:38:22.160 I mean, most people that are part of a tribe, they're part of a political party and whatever

00:38:26.360 that party says they're good with.

00:38:28.280 Or they're part of, people have even given over their moral direction over to their employer.

00:38:34.400 Oh, I'm going to work for Google.

00:38:35.900 Why?

00:38:36.280 Oh, because they take on these social issues.

00:38:38.040 And now I'm just part of that religious group, right?

00:38:41.720 Like they're, they're attaching themselves.

00:38:44.040 They're doing tribalization, right? 0.70

00:38:45.740 They're, they're being part of community, but they're not being intentional about it.

00:38:50.940 Right.

00:38:51.220 And is that group centered on principles or is it wavering just based upon political power

00:38:56.480 or some other driving factor?

00:39:00.280 I agree to an extent, but I think more and more what we're seeing is we're seeing coalitions

00:39:05.100 of tribes then, you know, so for example, you take the LGBTQ thing agenda and it's like

00:39:12.460 how many more people fit into that category and just lump together because they happen to

00:39:16.800 agree on other aspects, but they think so individually, even within the community, they can't agree

00:39:22.900 on what is a woman? 0.98

00:39:24.600 What is a man?

00:39:25.740 What pronouns do we use?

00:39:27.240 How do we describe her?

00:39:28.140 So how do we not?

00:39:28.960 Right.

00:39:29.160 And, and what they would say is, well, we're all unique individuals.

00:39:32.140 No, you're not.

00:39:33.900 You're not all that special.

00:39:36.380 I'm not all that special.

00:39:37.600 I have special things to offer the world, but I'm not uniquely special.

00:39:43.160 There's nothing inherently just amazing and special about me other than I'm a

00:39:46.760 son of God, as is every other man.

00:39:51.220 And every other woman is a daughter of God.

00:39:54.180 But so I think it's these coalitions to push an agenda or to even break things up even

00:39:59.920 further.

00:40:00.520 And then you'll notice infighting and that's an indicator that they weren't aligned.

00:40:05.960 They just aligned forces to push an agenda forward.

00:40:09.060 It's served their best interest.

00:40:10.340 So, I mean, I kind of agree with you and I also see that I see the distinction.

00:40:15.420 Yeah, I see that distinction.

00:40:17.380 All right.

00:40:17.620 Joe Gunter, what is the vision behind the baseline physical aptitude test revamp?

00:40:23.080 And what does this new workout plan and program look like?

00:40:26.140 Drop some details.

00:40:28.360 So, okay.

00:40:28.720 So the baseline physical aptitude is something that we do inside the Iron Council.

00:40:32.200 And we just released the version, the new version 2.0.

00:40:35.540 And it is amazing.

00:40:36.860 Johnny Loretty, he's my nutritionist and fitness coach.

00:40:39.500 He's also a member of the Iron Council and he's on my battle team, put together this incredible,

00:40:44.220 incredible program for helping men get fit and strong in the first quarter of 2026.

00:40:50.440 The way it was before is we had 11 metrics from bench press to pull-ups to farmer's walks to broad jump to sprint to mile run to squats to deadlifts.

00:41:01.100 And there might be one or two other things I was missing in there.

00:41:03.860 And the goal was to complete those tasks to a standard.

00:41:08.720 And that was all it was, is just figure it out and do it.

00:41:12.460 This iteration has a 12-week course attached to it, which gives workouts about how to train and exercise in a way that makes you holistically fit and strong.

00:41:23.300 Again, conditioning, cardio, stamina, strength, flexibility, agility, explosiveness.

00:41:32.800 So it's got everything in there.

00:41:34.760 And the goal with that is to get as many men into treating their bodies like the tool and weapon they're meant to be. 1.00

00:41:45.880 That's, that's the vision.

00:41:47.200 How do you take this sack of meat that we all have and make it as effective and efficient as possible?

00:41:57.900 Now, I might have said, well, it's to get as many people to complete the thing as possible.

00:42:01.300 That's not the mission.

00:42:02.620 That's not the vision.

00:42:04.000 The vision is a bunch of men who are capable, who are fit, who are strong, who have the energy and stamina and strength to lead and to protect and provide and take care of their families and love themselves

00:42:15.340 and be fulfilled in life and chase meaningful things and overcome some temptations that maybe they've had with food choices or substance abuse

00:42:23.020 and really start to become the men that they're meant to be.

00:42:27.000 And this is just one metric of it.

00:42:28.660 You know, I have guys who are like, well, physical fitness isn't the only thing.

00:42:31.340 No, I'm not saying that.

00:42:32.840 Of course not.

00:42:33.500 But it's a thing.

00:42:34.940 It's part of the thing.

00:42:36.620 And I think it's something worth addressing.

00:42:38.920 So that's what that is.

00:42:39.940 I'm very excited about it.

00:42:40.900 And it's open right now.

00:42:41.960 You get access to it if you're in the Iron Council.

00:42:44.600 So if you go to orderofman.com slash ironcouncil, you'll be able to see what the 12-week baseline physical aptitude challenge is.

00:42:53.200 And you'll be able to get started right away with us.

00:42:55.580 Very excited to get going.

00:42:57.520 Excellent.

00:42:59.140 Patrick Frere, how do you let go of an emotion holding you back?

00:43:07.080 I've been holding on to anger over an incident that happened months ago.

00:43:10.620 Not able to forgive.

00:43:12.360 Locked in a cycle of anger prevents forgiveness.

00:43:15.320 But not being able to release that anger because of every time I think of forgiving, I get angered again.

00:43:23.200 Yeah, it's a vicious cycle.

00:43:26.020 I think my advice to you would be quite a bit different than the way that most people would describe it.

00:43:33.080 I don't think it's wrong to be angry.

00:43:37.020 I don't know what happened, but you probably have some level of legitimacy to your frustrations and anger.

00:43:44.940 Whatever happened, there's probably something about it where you deserve – you're justified, I should say.

00:43:50.560 You're justified in your anger.

00:43:51.900 And I think most people would say, well, you don't want to be angry because, no, you can be angry.

00:43:57.360 You should be angry.

00:43:58.260 There's things to be angry about.

00:43:59.460 There's things to be sad about.

00:44:00.720 I've been sad the last week or two.

00:44:02.820 I have some things in my personal life that I'm sad about.

00:44:04.880 I'm like, I don't want to be sad.

00:44:05.940 Well, I don't want to be, but I am.

00:44:08.420 And that's the reality of it.

00:44:10.540 Be present with it, yeah.

00:44:12.320 It just is.

00:44:14.000 And our emotions are never the problem.

00:44:16.980 Our reactions to our emotions are the problem.

00:44:19.740 So if you're angry and you're lashing out and you're being aggressive or yelling or shouting or being short or being violent even, that is not an appropriate justification for your behavior, your anger.

00:44:35.260 But if you use it to maybe be a little bit more aware of red flags with people in the future, to address problems when you see them and not wait too long before they actually become a problem,

00:44:50.720 or put yourself, excuse me, avoid putting yourself in unnecessarily risky compromising situations with characters that are less than scrupulous,

00:45:03.560 then I would say that your response to your anger is actually a pretty worthy thing and a good thing.

00:45:14.040 Now, regarding moving on, when you talked about forgiveness, I still think you might be wrapped up in the idea that if I forgive a person, it's to release that other person of the burden of what they did.

00:45:27.280 And here's the reality of it.

00:45:28.880 They may not even think they did anything wrong.

00:45:30.820 They may not even know why you're angry or why you're so angry or if you're still angry.

00:45:39.160 The, when you forgive somebody, it's for yourself.

00:45:45.020 It's to release yourself of the burden of continuing to worry about that.

00:45:49.860 And what you're doing is you're saying, I'm deciding that I'm going to move on.

00:45:53.920 And that's one of the things that makes us so incredible as human beings.

00:45:56.260 I can just decide today who I want to be just because it's today.

00:46:02.700 Like no other reason I could decide right now and say, you know what, this afternoon, I'm going to be this kind of person.

00:46:09.080 And then you start doing what those types of people do.

00:46:14.320 I had a, an interesting scenario where on, can't remember if it was December 30th or December 31st,

00:46:22.000 I owed somebody an apology for some behavior and I messaged this person.

00:46:27.120 I haven't talked to them for gosh, probably close to two years.

00:46:32.400 And I said, I'm paraphrasing, but I said, Hey, I've been holding on to this apology for way too long. 0.98

00:46:37.980 And I acted like an idiot. 0.97

00:46:40.580 I was not there for you when you were there for me. 0.76

00:46:44.440 And I just wanted to tell you, I'm really sorry about that.

00:46:47.380 You did not deserve that.

00:46:49.080 You did not deserve that behavior from me.

00:46:50.960 You deserved better.

00:46:53.820 And I was really hoping that this person wouldn't respond actually.

00:46:58.000 Cause I didn't want to like face anymore.

00:46:59.980 I washed my hands and said, I've done what I can do.

00:47:02.260 And I really didn't want them to respond, but they did.

00:47:06.240 And I got a text and I saw it.

00:47:09.020 I'm like, Oh, my heart sank a little.

00:47:10.580 I'm like, Oh man, what is this going to be?

00:47:12.580 And this person said, Hey, you know, I was really upset with you for a long time, but I think you're holding onto something that I forgave you of a really long time ago.

00:47:27.760 Uh, and they had told me about some experiences that they, that we had that were good and some, the, and the way they felt and we're very grateful.

00:47:39.280 They said, Hey, thank you for reaching out.

00:47:41.340 I hope you have an amazing new year.

00:47:43.660 I forgive you, but it means a lot to me that you would reach out and say that that was really great of you.

00:47:51.840 And even if that response would have went poorly, I still would have been released.

00:47:57.080 And I know that's shoes on the other foot with Patrick here, but that person was able to move on with their life because they forgave me even without me doing anything else for years.

00:48:09.700 I hadn't apologized and they forgave me that releases you that unshackles you.

00:48:18.800 It lets you go out into the world and make new relationships and create new experiences and start new businesses and be better at the things that you're currently doing.

00:48:29.900 The question is, do you want to be angry all the time?

00:48:34.180 And I hope the answer is no.

00:48:36.980 And if the answer is no, then you need to let go of it.

00:48:41.720 And you do that by forgiving somebody.

00:48:44.260 Again, we go back to the humanity of the conversation we were having earlier.

00:48:47.160 Yeah, that person messed up royally, screwed you in a big way, probably.

00:48:52.940 Is being angry hurting them or getting them back?

00:48:56.080 You're not even on their mind.

00:48:58.360 No, it's only hurting you.

00:49:00.800 So figure out a way to move forward with the forgiveness for yourself.

00:49:05.540 Release yourself.

00:49:07.160 It's the shackle.

00:49:08.080 It's the key to your shackles, not theirs. 0.99

00:49:10.980 Yeah.

00:49:11.660 And Patrick, as you look, you know, as I read those questions, you know, the cycle prevents me to forgive.

00:49:17.160 Why?

00:49:17.520 Why do you want to forgive?

00:49:20.960 Because you're just supposed to, right?

00:49:22.700 Like get present to, you know, why you're seeking that.

00:49:26.320 And then I'm a huge believer that most upsets are actually not in the circumstance.

00:49:32.660 It's in the interpretation of it.

00:49:34.580 And I can't count how many times I've had a conversation with someone where they're like, I'm irate.

00:49:40.840 I'm pissed off.

00:49:41.700 They said this.

00:49:42.920 And I'm like, what they said and what you made it mean are two drastic different things. 1.00

00:49:50.000 They didn't say that you're a worthless crap of, you know, pile of crap. 1.00

00:49:55.660 They didn't say that. 1.00

00:49:56.840 They just said, I don't want to go.

00:50:00.100 You created the upset.

00:50:01.620 You created the interpretation of that you're so angry about.

00:50:05.080 Now, obviously, we don't know the nuance here for Patrick.

00:50:07.680 In some cases, it could be black and white.

00:50:09.660 But in most cases, most of our upset is not the circumstance.

00:50:14.380 It's what we made it mean.

00:50:16.900 And so you want to get, you know, as a tip, how do you forgive?

00:50:20.380 Get present to the facts.

00:50:22.440 Deal in reality.

00:50:23.640 X happened.

00:50:24.620 What did you make it mean?

00:50:25.820 Or what was your interpretation of it?

00:50:27.780 It's this. 1.00

00:50:28.740 Holy shit. 1.00

00:50:29.320 I'm mad. 1.00

00:50:29.880 Why?

00:50:30.300 Because I'm choosing to be.

00:50:31.680 Because I made up half that story.

00:50:33.880 That wasn't even their intent.

00:50:36.460 Right?

00:50:36.720 I got screwed over as a byproduct of someone being overly stressed out about something else.

00:50:42.740 And it really had nothing to do with me.

00:50:45.260 And it's ironic.

00:50:46.320 Like, I don't know.

00:50:47.460 It's just so much of our upset, so much of what drives us to do what we do day to day

00:50:53.080 is rooted in what people think.

00:50:55.320 And guess what?

00:50:56.020 Most people aren't thinking about you.

00:50:58.780 They're really not.

00:51:00.100 They're so self-absorbed and worried about themselves.

00:51:02.780 And they're accidentally, there's collateral damage often.

00:51:07.560 And sometimes we get hurt by others, not because they intended to.

00:51:11.600 It's just because it was a byproduct of them being self-centered or worried about something

00:51:16.540 else or their interpretation of what you did and et cetera, et cetera.

00:51:21.040 So you want the superpower of letting go of forgiveness is get clear on what happened

00:51:27.360 and what you made it mean.

00:51:29.020 And usually the upset is in the interpretation, not actually what happened.

00:51:34.860 Well, so, you know, I'm also fascinated too, Kip, with why we want to be sad or mad.

00:51:42.160 Have you ever, have you ever felt that?

00:51:43.720 Like you want to be.

00:51:44.700 Oh yeah.

00:51:45.740 Yeah, totally.

00:51:46.640 It's so weird.

00:51:47.840 We'll sulk around and we'll be mad or we'll be angry or we'll be sad.

00:51:53.820 And on one hand, we're like, I don't want to feel this way.

00:51:56.300 And on the other, you're like, no, I do like, I'm going to, but I'm going to keep doing the

00:51:59.580 things that make me feel this way.

00:52:00.940 I'm going to keep revisiting the stories.

00:52:02.540 I'm going to, why do we do that?

00:52:04.160 I think part of it is it justifies our behavior.

00:52:07.600 It paints us as a victim, which means that something happened to me.

00:52:14.480 I did not create this myself.

00:52:17.600 And it often gets the attention of other people like, oh, Ryan, oh, you're so sad.

00:52:24.000 Or you're so mad.

00:52:24.680 Like, oh, and you get attention from it.

00:52:26.900 And I think it's that, it's that trifecta that makes us just want to wallow in it.

00:52:36.440 Even though you don't have to be that way, you could make different choices.

00:52:40.040 You could write a different story.

00:52:42.140 You could craft a different narrative about what did or did not happen.

00:52:45.500 Not, not an out of touch one, but something that maybe serves you better.

00:52:49.800 Totally.

00:52:50.460 And I, the only thing I'd add to your trifecta is the desire to be right.

00:52:55.160 We would rather be right and live into the narrative of being a victim than be happy.

00:53:05.760 We, we, we, we content with being miserable.

00:53:08.780 If it means I's my way of showing up in the world and I can be right.

00:53:13.860 It's actually quite, it's, it's fascinating to me that we do this.

00:53:17.940 And I, we, as an, all of us, I, I've done it.

00:53:21.060 Yeah.

00:53:21.920 It feeds into my narrative.

00:53:23.540 If woe is me, I victim, I don't have to take responsibility and then people get to feel sorry for me.

00:53:29.320 Yeah.

00:53:29.940 Be careful.

00:53:31.760 Yeah.

00:53:32.300 Wild.

00:53:33.100 Cool.

00:53:33.340 What's next?

00:53:34.600 Uh, Brendan Bagden, what are some strategies or how do you manage yourself and others when people

00:53:40.760 who are responsible for tasks and projects that impact your life repeatedly drop the ball,

00:53:45.740 leaving you to hold the bag?

00:53:48.060 This has been a reoccurring issue for me and better managing my response in Q1 connection

00:53:54.460 quadrant goal.

00:53:56.500 It really depends on if it's professional or personal, you know, if it, if it's professional,

00:54:01.520 it's, you're going to be more limited on what you can do if, but I still think you can be

00:54:08.020 assertive Kip, if you and I are, are peers and you drop the ball on something, I think

00:54:14.520 it's completely appropriate to say, Hey, Kip, can I talk with you about something?

00:54:17.920 You know, we had this project and I was going to do this and you were going to do that.

00:54:21.980 And man, I really, this might go back to our inquisitiveness.

00:54:26.020 I really want to figure if everything's okay.

00:54:28.180 Like, are you good?

00:54:29.400 Cause this isn't like you and you, you did, if I'm being honest, drop the ball on it, which

00:54:33.880 caused a delay in the entire process, not just for me, but the company.

00:54:38.600 But I mean, more, we'll get to that.

00:54:40.340 Let's table that for a second.

00:54:41.440 More important.

00:54:42.000 Are you okay?

00:54:44.560 Right.

00:54:44.960 And you might say, well, no, I'm, I'm not actually, um, you know, I had, I had a death

00:54:49.680 in the family or I'm dealing with an issue with one of my kids, or I had, I had a breakup

00:54:54.540 or my wife and I got in a fight or like whatever. 1.00

00:54:56.700 It's like, Oh shit. 1.00

00:54:57.900 Don't lose your humanity. 1.00

00:54:59.260 Yeah.

00:54:59.760 Right.

00:55:00.620 Well, Kip, here's what I would say to that.

00:55:03.440 Well, Kip, first, I'm sorry to hear that.

00:55:06.460 Um, is there anything I can help with?

00:55:08.320 You want to go out after, after work and, you know, go grab a bite or go catch the game

00:55:13.220 or something, you know, like if you're close, you could do something like that.

00:55:15.360 And that's part of the reason you want to be close to people is so that you can have

00:55:18.680 these types of conversations.

00:55:19.860 And then that gets addressed and you say, well, look, Kip, the reality is our work still

00:55:25.860 needs to get done.

00:55:26.840 So can I take something off your plate right now?

00:55:31.060 And, and I would do that, but if it continues to happen over and over and over again, then

00:55:37.060 I think it's, I think after you've talked with that person, it's probably fair to say

00:55:41.640 at some point, you're going to need to make sure the bosses know about what's going on.

00:55:46.400 And, and that's the reality of it.

00:55:48.860 Cause as a, as an employer, they would want to know if somebody's dropping the ball and

00:55:53.420 you're not tattletailing, you're just being honest about where the hiccups are with the

00:55:57.380 process.

00:55:57.760 And it happens over and over and over again on a professional level.

00:56:03.000 You just stop giving them your time, attention, and energy.

00:56:08.260 It's as simple as that.

00:56:09.540 It's not easy to do, especially if this person's close, but if, and I don't care if this is your

00:56:13.560 own mom, if somebody keeps dropping the ball, when they say they're going to do things,

00:56:17.860 then you create a bigger and bigger boundary between you and them.

00:56:21.660 You know, you thicken that wall up a little bit.

00:56:23.580 And so maybe it's less time, less access, less resources, less attention.

00:56:27.720 And gradually over time.

00:56:29.040 Now, if they start coming around and they start pulling their weight and doing what they

00:56:33.840 need to be doing, and then you haven't cut them off completely yet, we'll take a brick

00:56:37.000 down and another one and another one and another one, but they don't get unfettered access

00:56:41.100 just because they got something right when they spent decades doing it wrong.

00:56:45.560 And guys, that's good for you to know too, because if you and your wife are having a big

00:56:50.620 relational issue and you're like, what's the problem?

00:56:53.700 I've changed.

00:56:54.400 It's like, bro, slow down.

00:56:55.920 You've changed for 30 days.

00:56:59.080 She's used to 12 years of you not doing it.

00:57:02.360 It's going to take a little time before she pulls those bricks down brick by brick. 1.00

00:57:06.620 But yeah, you just, you just cut off access slowly, gradually, and then eventually no

00:57:12.200 access at all.

00:57:13.660 That's what I would say.

00:57:14.980 Brendan, Brendan, I have a few thoughts for you.

00:57:17.180 The first off is last year, I did some accountability coaching for a group of probably about 20

00:57:24.020 leaders out of that 20.

00:57:26.480 There's probably two, two out of the 20 that could actually have an accountability conversation.

00:57:33.240 The other 18 couldn't.

00:57:36.420 Why?

00:57:37.100 Because expectations were not clear.

00:57:40.960 We teach people how to deal with us, right?

00:57:43.680 So Ryan and I are working together.

00:57:45.720 And by the way, group accountability diminishes personal responsibility.

00:57:50.300 The minute Ryan swoops in and saves me a couple of times, I start going, oh, got it.

00:57:56.660 I'll do some of my part.

00:57:58.160 Ryan will swoop in, finish it off.

00:57:59.520 And if we're not clear, this isn't going to work, right?

00:58:04.200 So you got to be, well, you got to be hyper clear with people.

00:58:07.620 What are you responsible for?

00:58:09.320 What are you doing versus what I'm doing?

00:58:11.460 And it's not until you have that conversation.

00:58:13.400 Can you really have a conversation with someone that, hey, you're dropping the ball because

00:58:17.240 it's like, it's unclear.

00:58:18.820 It's all covert contract.

00:58:20.380 It's in your head.

00:58:21.160 We, we never clarified roles and responsibilities.

00:58:23.180 And we do this all the time in marriages.

00:58:24.800 In fact, I would argue probably one of the key things that we never do in a marriage.

00:58:29.820 Most of us that we should do is define roles.

00:58:33.500 Who's doing what, who's responsible for what outcomes, but instead we don't do that because

00:58:38.580 that sounds rigid or whatever.

00:58:40.640 So we'll all be responsible.

00:58:42.500 Well, guess what?

00:58:43.520 Once again, group accountability diminishes personal responsibility.

00:58:47.200 No one's responsible then if we're all doing it.

00:58:49.920 And there might be an element of that, at least from a work perspective.

00:58:56.080 Tough one.

00:58:56.960 It's hard, man.

00:58:57.820 It's, it's hard when you have humans that you want in your life.

00:59:02.100 Yeah, we are. 0.99

00:59:03.080 You know, it sucks. 1.00

00:59:04.440 It sucks, man. 0.99

00:59:05.300 I've had really close people in my life who I just don't really have a great relationship 0.96

00:59:10.320 with anymore.

00:59:11.480 I would love to.

00:59:12.540 And the door is open by the way too, but you can only drop the ball so often before.

00:59:17.960 Again, this goes back to our expectations conversation.

00:59:20.840 I don't have expectations of others, but I also don't have to put myself in their path

00:59:26.420 if they're not living to a standard that I need to see in my life.

00:59:33.340 Totally.

00:59:34.180 And can I actually, I have one more thought really quick, if you don't mind me just throwing

00:59:37.420 this in for Brendan.

00:59:38.280 Um, you know, I had an employee once that was just constantly dropping the ball, right?

00:59:45.020 Laid on getting back to the client, laid on proposals, beating out, you know, timelines

00:59:51.080 pushed out constantly.

00:59:53.340 And I set the expectations.

00:59:55.340 I had it really clear.

00:59:56.900 And then the next step in the conversation was the, the, the importance of not dropping

01:00:04.860 the ball, right?

01:00:05.520 Like I got really present to what we're both aligned with.

01:00:08.720 Like, I want to be really clear because here's, we're dealing with human behavior, right?

01:00:13.240 People that are late all the time, they've been late way before they ever got into relationship

01:00:18.740 with you, right?

01:00:20.060 You're, you're dealing with habits, all kinds of stuff.

01:00:22.820 And so in this particular instance with this employee, I'm like, I got to be really, really

01:00:27.160 clear when we're late in that statement of work, when we're late getting back to the client,

01:00:33.060 when we're late on these timelines, this isn't me razzing you for some ridge, rigid process

01:00:39.700 for the sake of being rigid.

01:00:41.640 It affects trust your team members.

01:00:45.740 Guess what?

01:00:46.380 They're going to stop giving you work because you don't honor the commitment.

01:00:51.280 People are going to stop inviting you.

01:00:54.340 Clients are going to stop coming here.

01:00:57.020 Like that's how critical this is.

01:00:58.860 And then Ryan, you, you said something that I said to him in this particular instance is

01:01:03.720 I would rather have you do half the work and be on time on the other half.

01:01:11.020 Then you say yes to everything that you're doing.

01:01:13.320 So what can I take off your plate?

01:01:15.700 What can I take off your plate?

01:01:17.240 So you can be a hundred percent committed to what I've given you and let's do that first

01:01:22.880 and show that you can do that.

01:01:24.560 And then I'll give you more.

01:01:25.640 Right.

01:01:26.180 And then I transfer more ownership over time.

01:01:28.560 But sometimes we're dealing with humans, mental blocks.

01:01:32.300 Oh, it's not a big deal.

01:01:33.220 They've been telling themselves that ever since they're 12.

01:01:36.180 And all of a sudden, just because they have a job with you, they're going to be now all

01:01:40.700 of a sudden on time and they see how it affects the relationships.

01:01:44.040 They're probably showing up that way at home with friends, with multiple areas of their

01:01:48.940 life.

01:01:49.740 And so it's a lot more complex than you just saying, Hey, you got to honor this.

01:01:55.140 Sometimes we need to help them understand the impact and the cost of their actions on

01:02:00.200 the team.

01:02:00.680 And now eventually, right, we don't, we don't just let it slide.

01:02:04.340 Right.

01:02:04.600 Eventually it's like, Hey, the impact of this is too much.

01:02:07.860 I got to let you go.

01:02:09.260 Right.

01:02:09.680 Right.

01:02:09.920 But yeah.

01:02:11.560 Sweet.

01:02:12.180 Good stuff.

01:02:13.400 Well, Kip, I appreciate you.

01:02:14.340 That's all our questions today.

01:02:15.820 Yeah.

01:02:16.180 Guys, right now we're open.

01:02:17.480 We've got a preview call tonight, January 7th at 8 PM.

01:02:21.980 Eastern, the iron council.com slash preview.

01:02:24.420 Make sure you check that out.

01:02:25.640 I would love to have you there.

01:02:26.620 If you're on the fence about joining us in the iron council, if you want more information,

01:02:31.080 join us, the iron council.com slash preview.

01:02:33.140 We'd love to see you there.

01:02:33.780 You get the baseline physical aptitude, as well as the accountability and the coaching

01:02:37.860 and the mentoring and the systems that we use.

01:02:39.880 So it's really going to ramp your success up in 2026.

01:02:44.000 Kip, I appreciate you guys.

01:02:45.360 Great questions today.

01:02:46.500 Go out there, take action and become the man you are meant to be.

01:02:50.040 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

01:02:52.900 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

01:02:56.680 We invite you to join the order at orderofman.com.

01:03:00.680 Thank you.

01:03:05.180 You

Order of Man - January 07, 2026

Blind Tribalism, Passive Income, and Holding onto Anger ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING

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