DAN CRENSHAW ｜ Politics vs. Policy
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Summary
In this episode, Congressman Dan Crenshaw joins me to talk about the key issues impacting culture and society today, including a healthy approach to reaching across the aisle, why it s important for conservatives to have a voice in what we would typically view as liberal issues, and the importance of humility and open-mindedness.
Transcript
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Anytime you mention the word politics, you know you're in for a charged and polarizing
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conversation, but it's crucial that we talk more about politics and the policy that comes
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with it because it literally impacts every facet of our lives.
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My guest today, Congressman Dan Crenshaw, joins me to talk about the key issues impacting
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culture and society today, including a healthy approach to reaching across the aisle, why
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it's important for conservatives to have a voice in what we would typically view as liberal
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issues, not only the far left, but also the far right, something he calls woke conservatism,
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the importance of humility and open-mindedness, and also distinguishing between politics and
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You live life to the fullest, embrace your fears, and boldly charge your own path.
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When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time.
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You are not easily deterred, defeated, rugged, resilient, strong.
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This is who you will become at the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you
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I'm the host and the founder of the Order of Man podcast and movement.
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What I want to do, if you're just joining us for the first time, is to let you know that
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this is a podcast designed to give you access to incredibly successful men, learn from them,
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distill their information, and then hopefully we can learn from their lessons, their failures,
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and their successes, and we can implement those things in our lives so we can create
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more success on the business front, on the personal and family front, and again, every
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It goes a very, very long way in promoting and boosting the visibility of the Order
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And also want to let you know, if you want to go deeper into what we're doing here with
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Order of Man, I would highly encourage you to check out the Iron Council.
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I'm going to talk about it a little bit more later in the episode, but we are open for enrollment
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So we're shutting this down very, very quickly.
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Again, if you head to orderofman.com slash ironcouncil, orderofman.com slash ironcouncil,
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you're going to learn more about what we're up to and what we're doing and how it will serve
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All right, guys, let me introduce you to my guest.
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He's a representative serving in the second congressional district in Texas.
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He's got over 10 years of service and over five deployments in some of the most hostile
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He was awarded two bronze stars, one with valor, I believe, the Purple Heart and the
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Navy Commendation Medal with valor, among others.
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Now, since leaving service, he's been working and serving Texans and Americans and currently
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sits on the House Energy and Commerce Committee, the Health Subcommittee, and also the Environment
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He believes there is no higher calling than service to the American people.
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I was looking at our previous podcast, which, believe it or not, was a year ago last week.
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So it's been a year since we had this conversation.
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And a lot has transpired in the past year, not for the better.
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I don't even remember what we talked about last time.
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My question is, how do you prioritize everything that's going on and everything that needs
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Because it seems like there's just so much that needs to be tackled.
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And how do you focus on where you should put your energy?
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So just generally speaking in politics, you've got a couple of buckets or lines of effort
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And obviously, there's a lot of overlap between the two.
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But your political campaign side, that's getting reelected.
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You can't do any of the policy stuff if you don't actually get reelected.
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And so there's a whole team that you hire separately with campaign funds that you raise
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And then on the official side, which is technically your real job, which, frankly, most politicians
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don't get to do a whole lot of because of the way our system is set up.
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We can get into that as much as you want, why that is necessarily.
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So every member of Congress should pick probably a couple of majors and a couple of minors.
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It's funny, there's a lot of university speak when you come up here.
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You come up here for freshman orientation, then you're in the sophomore class in the
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And like I said, you get separated into different committees, which is, for all intents and
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And that's not usually what people think it would be, but it is.
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I've sort of like triple, quadrupled, majored in many ways, because I do the energy stuff.
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That's really my committee work on energy and commerce.
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But I also do a lot of national security issues as well, especially border security,
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I mean, I've got ideas on education policy as well.
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And I have a shallow knowledge of, say, what financial services does on that committee.
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No one person can do it, Paul, nor should they, because then you just have a lot of people
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And so the way things generally work up here is you trust certain members, just based on
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their backgrounds, based on their philosophies, to work on the real hard details on a certain
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And you're giving them a lot of trust to a certain extent.
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And because of how complicated a lot of these issues are, that's sort of how you do it.
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And so I took energy and health care because those are important to my district.
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It's important for us to have better angles on that, better communication styles on those
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Yeah, I was looking at it because I wrote these down, your permittees, or excuse me,
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They're talking about permittees and sub-permittees.
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And then my son, my 14-year-old is my sub-permittee.
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And then as a subcommittee is environmental and climate change, which is interesting because
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You don't, I don't typically think about that when it comes to the conservative or Republican
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But I can see how it's so important since it seems to me the narrative is being driven
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by the left on a couple of these key issues that you're intimately familiar with and working
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I mean, you wouldn't believe how many dumb people on the right got mad at me because I
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go to, I went to this UN climate change conference last year and I'm going again this year.
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I'll go every year because you need a different perspective at these events.
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And there's a tendency, especially mostly on the far angry, like, you know, kind of young
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Like, you know, you're not even supposed to talk to Democrats.
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You're not, you're just, you're just, you're just supposed to really hate them and then
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These are all kind of meaningless phrases and words and soundbites, but it's also extremely
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And it also tells me that you don't really want to win.
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So you do have to be in their, in their playing field a little bit.
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Now, keep in mind too, the name of that subcommittee, the environmental policy and subcommittee
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and climate change subcommittee, we'll probably change the name.
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We won't, we won't call it when we take over, assuming we win the majority, we won't call
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it that, that, you know, climate change subcommittee because it's a, it's a very loaded word and
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it kind of annoys people, but it doesn't mean we're going to change how we talk about climate
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change, which is from a very reasonable perspective, right?
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I don't, I don't deny climate change is happening.
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So I, I, we can talk about energy and more depth if you want.
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But I basically take a rational environmentalist approach.
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And I think that's, I think that's a really catching on amongst Republican circles and
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certainly amongst independent circles, because independents are just going to form a more
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They don't believe AOC that we're going to die in 12 years.
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And we can offer them that without hurting our energy industry.
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I mean, I've, I've, I've thought about that even myself, you know, you're not supposed to,
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right, as a conservative and everybody knows that I am because I've, I've been outspoken
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But yeah, I mean, we can acknowledge that the climate is changing.
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We can acknowledge, I think about sustainable energy, for example, and renewable energy.
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I just want to make sure that it's, that it is actually renewable, that it is actually
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feasible and possible, and that's not going to create more harm than good.
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But why wouldn't we explore those options if they're there and try to create some better
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That doesn't seem like it should be a taboo in the conservative, in the conservative world.
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It shouldn't be, but look, this gets to a much bigger problem, Ryan, in the conservative
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world, which is rank contrarianism just for the sake of contrarianism.
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That's just, that's just driven by like, you know what?
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Most of the people are thinking this way, so I'm going to be the cool guy and think something
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different, but that's not driven by any sort of principle.
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It's not anchored in any kind of intellectual philosophy.
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This being one of them, don't agree with the left.
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Well, don't you, like, do you not understand anything about gamesmanship, about strategy?
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And what we can do on the energy question in particular is really suck them in because it's
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I accept everything the UN climate report says.
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You talk to any of the skeptics, like the people, everybody on the right loves, like Steve
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Coonan, who goes on Joe Rogan and kind of debunks all these climate change myths, Michael
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None of them say that the UN climate report is hogwash.
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And when you read it, it turns out it's just, it's, it's, it's actually decent science and
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And I think here's the, here's my favorite fact piece of data from it, which is probably
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the most important for policymakers, because the question is, what's the cost of climate
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And what costs are we willing to incur in order to mitigate that cost?
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And so when you look at the cost of climate change, there is a cost.
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It is largely manmade as, as according to them.
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It doesn't really matter, frankly, for our purposes, like who to blame.
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The point is, is there, there's an element of CO2 production in the atmosphere that does
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But the cost is like four and a half percent of global GDP.
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I don't mean four and a half percent lower than what we currently have.
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That would actually be pretty devastating if that were true.
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What I mean is in, in, by the year 2100, you'll have four and a half percent less global GDP
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It always is, you know, we're at a down spot right now, but it'll keep going up and up and
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up by the year 2100, you know, estimates are like 450% increase.
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So that's the average estimate increase with climate change.
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It's just a very small one compared to say what AOC is saying.
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So note that with that knowledge, and if that's the scientific consensus, fine.
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Now let's, let's attribute solutions accordingly that don't cost us more than that.
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And in terms of, especially in terms of human flourishing and that, and that's actually
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People in Africa can turn on their freaking stove instead of killing themselves indoors because
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they're burning wood and dung to heat their, to heat their land.
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So the UN is telling them that they need solar panels, which like just don't, they don't
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So, I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's really rational environmentalism is, is the conservative
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doctrine because it says like all of the above energy solar, where it makes sense, wind, where
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It doesn't make sense to, to overpopulate the grid with it, with unreliable energy to
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the detriment of investment in more reliable forms of energy, like gas and nuclear.
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That's where the rational environmentalism comes in.
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It seems to me that so many people just want to score these virtue points or signal to their
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constituents that, Hey, we're doing something about it.
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Isn't that the rallying cry is do something, do anything.
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Like we want to make sure that what you're proposing, although yes, is doing something
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is actually going to move the needle in the right direction.
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But I think that's why we elect people as we at the root is like, well, you know, if
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I elect Congressman Crenshaw, he's going to do something.
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And so they're probably going to vote or, or, or institute policy that's based on that
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And well, look, the, the, the action oriented governing philosophy is that's, that's a very
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Now there's a difference between right-wing and conservatism.
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Right-wing populism to my mind is very, very similar to liberalism in the sense that they're
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very action oriented, especially when it comes to domestic policy and kind of this industrial,
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Like sounds, it always sounds good at first, but when you kind of start to break apart the
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layers, it's hard to find examples of it working very well, but there's a temptation
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because people, people are naturally inclined left or right to, to believe in that action and
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Don't matter what the action is, um, the, the nature of conservatism, it's, it's, it's
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really the only proper governing philosophy because it says, look, we're not, well, conservatism
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So that's what, that's where a lot of people get wrong.
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Right-wingers have a list of outcomes they think we should have.
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Like they have no idea what the underlying philosophy is behind those outcomes.
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Um, it's, it's more, it's more about a team sport with a lot of these folks, especially
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again, especially young ones, especially online.
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Uh, I call them the woke right for a bunch of reasons.
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And yeah, because it, because it's all just feelings, it's all feelings.
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And, and it becomes these kinds of idiosyncratic loyalty tests where it's like, if you're not
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a hundred percent on this, that it's like, hold the hell on conservatism is about the
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And so we, we believe in, in limiting principles and in thinking through certain questions, like
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does this infringe overly on individual rights?
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Maybe it should be solved at a community level.
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Those are, those are really basic conservative questions.
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Um, you know, does our, does our tax and spend balance out?
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These are, these are the basic process oriented conservative questions.
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Now, now there's a very high likelihood that they do end up in certain outcomes that we
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I mean, that's, that's basically how we've seen conservatism develop over the course of decades.
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But the, what I, what I, what I fear is, is the people who didn't understand that history
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And, you know, the first word out of their mouth every five seconds is rhino because they're
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the most, because they're the most conservative, right?
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And there's this, and there's this just weird trend of like heretic hunting that is, that is
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And like, if we're all being honest, has nothing to do with what they care about as far as issues
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or policy, it has everything to do with how much attention you can get online.
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It's not, yeah, it's just, it's just attention.
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The other thing I've, I've wrestled with is this, even just the idea of government, so
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many people, and I don't, I don't know, this isn't necessarily new, but it seems to be
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a growing trend, believe that the government's job is outcome oriented.
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I think it's, Hey, the government serves its purpose by leveling the playing field and making
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sure that we're all operating with the pursuit of liberty, life, liberty, and the pursuit
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The outcome is what I put forth or how smart I am or how dumb I am or what decisions I make.
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But really it's not the government's place to secure the outcome, just level the playing
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And again, this gets to the divide on the right because you're, whatever they call themselves,
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I call them the woke right, but they might call themselves populist.
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They might call themselves nationalist conservatives.
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They'll say, okay, okay, Ryan, maybe, maybe I agreed with that at one point, but we've lost
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And I just can't imagine anything more dangerous because the things they're willing to do are
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extremely illiberal and also very left-wing, right?
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They just tend to have a lot of overlap with progressives when they start talking.
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They want to do things like get rid of the filibuster.
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Like if we can just take one slim majority and take our country back.
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Now, they always just, they say soundbites like that.
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If they'll, if they'll set dangerous precedents that can always come back and haunt you later,
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They want to, they want to, they want to do that right now.
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So that's, at least those are the kind of demands that they have.
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So they'll never have the actual responsibility of being in charge and implementing a lot of
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So it is, it is a bit disingenuous, those criticisms from my mind, but at this, but at the same
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time, I think, you know, this, this conversation has long been going on.
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I think lately it's gotten so toxic that I just dismiss it, but that doesn't mean that there,
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And so, and so I guess the best argument for, for that other side, that, that the government
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Um, you know, they, they would say that, uh, you know, one of the goals of government is to
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preserve liberty and prosperity and that it hasn't done that because it's grown so much.
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Like, I think that's a reasonable critique of, of, of this notion, but it's not even clear
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that we're disagreeing at that point, because maybe we would be in agreement that the government
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wasn't fulfilling its primary function in the first place, which was to, which was
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to create that, that, that, uh, a level playing field, as you say, that everyone can
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compete in within a meritocracy, engage in personal responsibility and, and achieve
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And so that, that, that, that is the, the rub, the, the, the other rub with conservatives
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is more on the religious side that we, that we've lost our, our Judeo-Christian roots, uh,
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And, and that government has to be there to, to take that back because I mean, our constitution
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is built upon those foundations, but there's an argument there.
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There, there, there's an argument there again, though, you, you, you, you tread into pretty
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dangerous territory, uh, depending on what your solution actually is, you know, depending
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on, on how far you're willing to go to use the hand of government to make what you want
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Uh, some good examples of this would be this abortion debate that we're having right now.
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So yeah, you could, you could have a, a, a, if, if let's say we took control right now
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and we just, and we eliminated abortion nationwide, um, it would be deeply foolish to think the Democrats
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aren't just going to reverse that as soon as they take over.
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So there is some, there is some benefit to this thing called the filibuster, uh, there
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is some benefit to how impossible it is to pass very, very sweeping and very controversial
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And, uh, you know, McConnell was getting all those calls back when we had, um, the Senate
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to do away with the filibuster in Trump's first two years.
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Uh, and for good reason, if he hadn't resisted it, we imagine where we'd be right now.
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I mean, it, it, it is last, there's last couple of years of like pieces of legislation coming out
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of the house that would then pass the Senate are devastating.
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I mean, I know obviously there's, you know, abortion and some of these bigger topics that,
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that are very forefront on people's mind, but what else?
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Um, you know, you, you'd have like, yeah, you'd have abortion on demand at all, at all
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Uh, you'd have HR one, which is a federal takeover of our elections.
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And basically the dismantling of all the rules surrounding our elections, I think is sometimes
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the best way to describe what HR one is, uh, you'd have HR three drug pricing bill, actually
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They got that one through in the reconciliation, unfortunately.
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Um, you know, you, you'd have, you'd have a lot of gun bills, uh, that I'm sure your
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audience doesn't like, uh, you'd have universal background checks.
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You'd probably have a gun registry, um, which is in a way kind of what a universal background
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So that's, that, that one's an interesting one to me because I mean, I've, I've purchased
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firearms and I've never not had a background check, I guess, uh, maybe some private sales
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But, uh, it's always interesting when you talk about these background checks, because
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I, I don't know, it seems like everybody I've ever talked to goes through a background
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What's the, what's the issue as long as it's done legally, but that's, that's kind of the
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It's like, okay, well, this is, are criminals going to do this legally?
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And it's because, because like, I, I, I do, there are sincere people who are like, I don't
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understand you, you go buy a gun from a gun store and you get a background check.
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Why can't, why can't, if, but you can go online and buy it from some other guy who builds
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ARs in his basement and you don't have to get a background check.
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Now there's a lot of complications to the law there.
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Uh, I, I believe if he's selling, if he's selling it as if it's a business, he does have
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Um, but the idea is that, you know, we're friends and you're like, oh, man, I, you know,
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And then, and then the second idea, obviously that you alluded to is what if we were criminals?
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Like there's, there's no, there's no teeth here.
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There's no incentive for us to actually go get a background check.
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And, you know, and if, and if a law is going to make us feel good, but not actually change
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anything for the better than, uh, and it will infringe on freedoms, then the net, oh my
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God, it's like, I just went through this conservative problem solving.
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So it's a perfect example because like conservative outcomes were like, now we're, we're against
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The problem is people don't understand why, because too many people haven't gone through
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And, uh, and again, I complain about this a lot.
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This is why so many people end up as right-wingers instead of conservatives.
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Men, let me hit the pause button on our conversation with Congressman Crenshaw very quickly.
00:23:00.940
Uh, I want to ask, do you have a band of brothers?
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Because most men don't, most men are doing life alone, but you don't have to.
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And frankly, you shouldn't, uh, men need to surround themselves with other high caliber
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men all working together to improve themselves, uh, hold each other accountable and really
00:23:17.700
do the work necessary to achieve at the highest levels in every facet of life.
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And that's where our exclusive brotherhood, the iron council comes into play.
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And the good news is that we're open for enrollment right now for a very, very short period of time.
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So if you've been on the fence or know that you need to band with other men to make the
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most of life, then join us before we shut this thing down.
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Uh, you can register at order of man.com slash iron council.
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Again, that's order of man.com slash iron council.
00:23:50.500
So I know a lot of people are, are critical of, and I want to get your take on this, this
00:23:57.040
And, and that's something that, um, well, I don't, I, I won't preface it with anything.
00:24:02.140
I, I'm very curious about your take on these types of policies, these types of procedures,
00:24:07.260
these red flag law type things that are proposed quite often, actually.
00:24:12.140
I mean, I think we talked about it last time and this, this is obviously a little boogeyman
00:24:14.960
that always follows me because people online like they use me as clickbait and it's, you
00:24:21.240
Um, but like I've, I, the only votes I've ever taken against red flag laws, I voted against
00:24:26.920
Um, that there's some claim that we all voted for red flag laws in a military spending bill
00:24:35.160
There was nothing, there was none of, nothing like that was going to be in the bill.
00:24:39.220
Um, so that was a bit of a disingenuous attack, but again, if it's clickbait, people will say
00:24:44.800
Well, we don't know any different, you know, as, as, as an average person, uh, we, we wouldn't
00:24:49.840
know any different because we're not going to go look into it.
00:24:52.180
We're not going to study and research for ourselves and we're just going to be force
00:24:54.840
fed and accept whatever media or other outlets decide to share with us.
00:25:00.360
And, and those outlets, um, more times than not.
00:25:03.940
And, and this is, this is true on the left and the right, those outlets are, their business
00:25:10.080
So, and you know, one thing I tell conservatives all the time is I want you to imagine whatever
00:25:14.980
kind of fringy website that you like, uh, and it lists, lists some headlines.
00:25:19.440
And headline number one is like Nancy Pelosi takes trip on taxpayer dime to Italy or something
00:25:25.100
And, um, you know, headline number two is, you know, Ilhan Omar again, talks about how
00:25:32.000
So that's number two, number three, five reasons why Dan Crenshaw is a globalist rhino.
00:25:36.440
You're like, which one are you going to click on?
00:25:41.140
Cause it's like, oh, he's supposed to be on our side.
00:25:48.420
Um, the number of conspiracies I've had to debunk about myself are really absurd at this
00:25:55.600
So, you know, they come, they come from the right wing again, the woke, right.
00:25:59.940
Um, and so anyway, back to red flag laws, the, the, the, the, the proper conservative
00:26:06.640
So you, you, you've got this idea where you don't want to infringe on everybody's rights
00:26:13.420
Um, so you, you take it on a case by case basis.
00:26:17.540
So again, this, this, this doesn't sound too bad at first, the problem becomes implementation,
00:26:22.080
which is ultimately why most conservatives say like, I'm not sure how to get here because
00:26:29.320
First of all, what, what behavior, um, what behavior reaches the point where a judge can
00:26:38.540
And, and we're assuming that behavior isn't illegal yet.
00:26:44.000
Is that, that's actually the key point because like, if it's already illegal, illegal, sure.
00:26:48.420
But if they've, you know, if they've, if, if they've engaged, if they can be charged
00:26:50.980
with harassment, if they can be charged with stalking, if they can, you know, now you're
00:26:55.320
Now, now, now you can say, well, if you've broken the law, now there's some, there's going
00:27:00.180
Um, the thing about red flag laws, the way they're written, nobody really knows what
00:27:04.300
exactly they're trying to enforce and where that standard is.
00:27:10.900
And that's ultimately why they probably won't do anything.
00:27:14.880
There's this idea that they're always being abused.
00:27:18.800
Uh, but they, I suppose they could be in theory.
00:27:21.920
Um, there's this other idea that, you know, an ex-girlfriend can just call a, call the police
00:27:26.660
That's the, that's usually the soundbite that you hear.
00:27:28.860
I see no evidence that that's really true either.
00:27:31.320
Again, the reason to be, if you're going to make a real argument against them, the argument
00:27:36.160
should be along the lines that I just said that you, you run into very murky legal territory
00:27:40.360
and, and an individual rights territory and due process territory about what, what constitutes,
00:27:46.480
uh, that broken law that deserves some form of punishment because confiscating property,
00:27:55.000
Um, like people are very sincere when they're, when they're for these things.
00:27:58.360
I mean, they're like, look, some people will say, look, I got a schizophrenic brother has
00:28:08.580
And it's, it's actually harder to answer from a policy perspective.
00:28:12.060
And I think many people would, would like to believe it is.
00:28:15.500
Yeah, I, I, well, it's, it's not convenient to be able to have to answer those questions
00:28:20.060
if you're an advocate for red flag laws, because that is a, that is a valid, those are, those
00:28:27.640
And then what ends up happening, I think, is you have precedent that's set through court
00:28:32.760
And that can be, as we know, very bad precedent.
00:28:35.760
And then everything is established on that bad precedent.
00:28:38.100
If it's not clearly outlined, what would constitute somebody having their property seized from
00:28:46.120
And, you know, I will say, I'll give you some like elements of good news.
00:28:50.160
So there was like a red flag law, um, grant program, not a law, but a grant program passed
00:28:57.800
in this, in that big gun bill, everybody was really mad about, um, you know, that 10 Republicans
00:29:03.080
If, if we're being honest about what that thing did, um, it's a grant program that actually
00:29:08.820
would force States with very lax red flag laws, lax in a bad way, like lax in a way
00:29:13.240
that second amendment members would not like, um, you know what I mean?
00:29:17.040
Like it doesn't, it doesn't have all the due process protections.
00:29:21.680
So, you know, and, and, and let's be honest, States that don't have red flag laws, they're
00:29:26.820
not just going to suddenly put red flag laws up because you can get extra couple million
00:29:30.700
It's just not going to, I don't see why that would happen.
00:29:33.020
It's not really a financial burden or decision.
00:29:37.200
So, you know, for viewers in Texas, there's zero evidence that there's going to be red
00:29:41.180
flag laws in Texas anytime soon because of that bill.
00:29:44.440
Um, and, uh, you know, in fact, I'm not sure what restrictions, if any, I have on my guns
00:29:53.800
That would be the, I mean, somebody could name me one, but well, you can't because I know
00:29:57.600
the bill pretty well, but, but it's, um, you know, I'm just saying like, there's more,
00:30:02.520
there's more good news than we would like to believe.
00:30:06.900
I still think it's, I still think, you know, I, I still fall into the category of, you know,
00:30:11.280
there's, there's, we don't want any action, um, that, that could potentially infringe
00:30:17.360
But it also took the political conversation right off the table.
00:30:22.060
I mean, they, they, they moved on, they moved on to a different agenda.
00:30:27.060
You know, we're trying, trying to make your listeners feel slightly happier over some of
00:30:32.480
Well, I, I, I think even just the way that you bring these subjects to light, uh, through,
00:30:42.000
I know you and I have even had some, I would say slight, maybe surface level disagreements.
00:30:46.040
And then we've hashed it out a little bit via, you know, Instagram.
00:30:50.640
I, I understand what you're saying now, but, but not everybody has that opportunity to
00:30:54.460
be able to hash through this, even the slightest degree how we have through messenger, for example.
00:30:59.340
And so we just, it's hard because everybody just takes everything at surface level.
00:31:06.400
And the, and even the far left is people just cling onto that because they want their side
00:31:13.000
And, and there's, there's no, there's no way for us to really get a lot of the nuance
00:31:18.900
that needs to be understood for the decisions that are being made on our behalf.
00:31:23.500
I mean, there is, you know, but it just takes work.
00:31:30.940
And, um, you know, all I, all I ask of people is like, take a step back.
00:31:36.760
Uh, the, the, the real problem is people just jump to conclusions that are highly irrational.
00:31:42.080
And like, if you don't, if you don't know about something, you don't know about something,
00:31:44.840
but you don't need to have a very strong opinion about something.
00:31:47.620
If you don't know about something, I would think, but a lot of people do, people have
00:31:51.280
very strong opinions over subject matter, which they, they know very little.
00:32:00.540
Um, you know, people can find like, like a few instances where legacy media lied to them.
00:32:08.680
And it certainly doesn't mean that your next step should be going down the deepest,
00:32:11.720
darkest corners of the internet to like, you know, red conspiracy elephant.com.
00:32:15.920
And like, this is all, finally, I found my, found my news on info wars.
00:32:21.900
And it's like, because, and there's this temptation by a lot of people to, especially men, you know,
00:32:28.480
Uh, to, to gravitate towards those deep, dark corners, like, like to believe that the most
00:32:34.040
sensational, uh, accusations and headlines are by, are by nature true.
00:32:39.540
And I'm not sure the psychology, I'm not sure about the psychology behind that and why that
00:32:45.440
And, um, whereas, whereas I would say where I see things like that and I immediately take
00:32:49.840
a step back and say like, that, that just doesn't sound right.
00:32:52.200
There are others who do the exact opposite and say like, finally, somebody saying,
00:32:58.940
I don't think that's, I don't think that's what they're doing.
00:33:02.120
I think that's what, you know, like this stuff isn't that complicated.
00:33:07.820
And, um, and it's, I mean, it helps, it makes my life difficult because within those
00:33:12.300
deep, dark, stupid websites, again, I I'm a globalist that works for the world economic
00:33:17.420
You're like, well, like what the hell are you people even talking about?
00:33:20.080
I mean, it's, it's complete nonsense, you know?
00:33:22.100
And it, and it, and it wastes a lot of our time politically wastes a ton of our time.
00:33:27.440
Um, you know, dealing with, dealing with some of these issues as opposed to dealing with
00:33:30.980
real issues like energy policy, pipeline permitting, things that will actually affect
00:33:40.880
I think the psychology behind it, and I don't know, I haven't really thought about it much,
00:33:44.200
but since you brought it up is almost a defense mechanism or some grasp at control.
00:33:50.860
If I think this is probably more accurate for men is that, Hey, we want to make sure
00:33:55.140
we know everything that's going on so we can control situations.
00:33:59.240
And so a lot of the times we just end up making things worse than they really are for some
00:34:05.200
semblance of control over something that we have very little control over.
00:34:11.360
In this case, the control would be information and just the general knowledge of your surrounding.
00:34:18.200
Um, and I don't know, I don't, I don't know how it happens.
00:34:23.460
Um, I, I think, I think we have a severe lack of critical thinking in this country.
00:34:33.880
Actually, it's the humility to know what you don't know.
00:34:37.840
Cause I've gotten into discussions and debates, even on this podcast with, with people that
00:34:49.780
Or, um, you know, I thought you meant something else, but actually you mean this.
00:34:53.760
And it's been very enlightening, but I've had to have an open mind about it, which admittedly
00:34:58.800
And there's some areas and instances where I still close, very close-minded about that
00:35:06.240
And that takes a sense of maturity and humility.
00:35:09.320
And if you're, if you're looking at people who are very, very active, young, active online,
00:35:14.160
politically oriented, uh, those two attributes are in very short supply humility.
00:35:20.680
It's very much about like the chest thumping name, calling, you know, soundbite type of
00:35:26.060
culture and I, I, I look, I think a lot of people just have fun with it to, to an extent.
00:35:32.420
I think that they're just like, they're, they just like being muckrakers and shit talkers
00:35:37.900
Um, I just wish everybody understood how badly it was destroying our politics and destroying
00:35:42.740
our national conversation and wasting people's time who, who actually have serious things
00:35:47.920
And that's what I wish everyone would understand that there, that there actually is some debt
00:35:52.060
it might be entertaining, but there is some negative consequences to turning our politics
00:35:57.680
If you're incentivizing, you know, idiots to come stalk me in person and just yell and
00:36:04.240
If you're incentivizing that with your attention and your clicks, you are, you are destroying
00:36:09.960
And I don't care if that person's coming from the left or the right.
00:36:13.800
It's destroying our political fabric because it turns our politics into the Jerry Springer
00:36:17.320
show instead of this, frankly, what should be a very boring, like process oriented, nitty
00:36:23.600
It should be so boring that nobody wants to pay attention to it.
00:36:26.140
That's what, that's what good politics would actually, or good policymaking, at least good
00:36:32.880
Um, and it's, uh, it's, it's, it's unfortunately not that way.
00:36:38.660
Well, and it doesn't just come from the, the people.
00:36:42.080
It also comes from our, our elected representatives who use social media as an opportunity to grandstand
00:36:50.700
and to entertain and say things like AOC is a great example to say things.
00:36:55.480
And I'm like, this woman cannot possibly believe the things that she's saying.
00:37:00.560
Like this, that just can't, I cannot fathom how that would be possible.
00:37:04.680
And to me, it's just a bunch of grandstanding and entertaining, as opposed to, like you said,
00:37:08.380
policymaking legislation, the things we actually elected you guys to do.
00:37:16.940
Like the politicians willing to take advantage of it or the trends that were, you know, happening
00:37:22.220
Um, but in any case, yeah, AOC opened the door, swung it wide open and quite a few others
00:37:28.080
The worst thing I hear on the right is we need, we need this girl to counter AOC.
00:37:33.260
So we just, we need another 25 year old with no work experience to count.
00:37:43.020
You know, and people like, I got a lot of trouble like a year ago, less than a year ago.
00:37:47.720
Cause I, I, I was talking about performance artists and then I used an example of, of,
00:37:55.380
Now they didn't really vote with Trump and people were super mad about that because people
00:38:03.320
I wasn't really talking about the freedom caucuses performance artists.
00:38:05.840
A couple are, but it's also important to note what we mean by performance artists and
00:38:10.720
political performance, political grandstanding and performance means dying on Hills that
00:38:16.520
Gaining attention for zero, for no purpose whatsoever.
00:38:19.780
That's the difference because it's one thing to like entertain.
00:38:24.240
I, I do do entertainment, but there's a reason I'm doing it.
00:38:27.960
I'm trying to bring you to a, to a better place.
00:38:30.160
I'm also trying to use that kind of entertainment because my, the kind of entertainment I do
00:38:35.900
And what I'm doing is I'm grabbing people who might disagree with us and bringing them
00:38:43.440
A lot of what worries me is, is newer politicians coming up and coming or, um, more inclined to
00:38:53.800
Whereas the, the end goal is actually just more followers.
00:38:56.500
The end goal is actually, is actually just that being that influencer online and doing
00:39:03.260
The, the, the, there are no other end goals related to say policy.
00:39:06.980
There's just not, you know, Marjorie Taylor Greene doesn't write any policy.
00:39:15.060
So, you know, and ask yourself if that is, maybe she'd make a fine activist, but she shouldn't
00:39:21.380
How do you change the public perception of that though?
00:39:24.320
Because it reminds me of a gladiator where he's like, are you not entertained?
00:39:32.520
So how do you actually educate people to the point where they think to themselves or start
00:39:39.520
And yes, there is a performative element of it because you're trying to influence people.
00:39:44.680
But, uh, how do we get the population to think more critically about this?
00:39:53.720
I mean, that's a, that's a really, that's a tough question.
00:39:56.800
Um, I, I try every day, you know, it's, it's part of, it's just part of, it's just explaining
00:40:04.880
I, this is why, this is why I tell people how I view something like the woke, right?
00:40:09.540
Uh, this is, this is why I explained the things the way I explained them so that people, uh,
00:40:15.460
so that some, so that a light goes on in someone's head and says, you know, I hadn't really thought
00:40:18.600
about that, that way and what they're doing and why they're doing it.
00:40:29.180
The thing is, is like, there's, there, there is a real problem in America with what is incentivized
00:40:34.060
And I would think again, cause, cause I'm like boring and I was always interested in
00:40:39.080
I was never interested in politics necessarily, but the policy.
00:40:42.560
And so if I'm looking at a potential member of Congress, I'm thinking, do they actually
00:40:48.740
And will they be smart people, uh, on the Capitol Hill when they talk about them?
00:40:55.740
Uh, that's just not what's necessarily rewarded because if they can't also do the entertaining
00:41:02.020
And, you know, how do you get people to care about that?
00:41:05.400
I mean, I, I'm not sure I'm not, I'm really not sure.
00:41:13.020
If, if we could answer that, I think things would change, but that's maybe why things won't
00:41:18.020
totally change or why it might take a very, very long time or a very painful and humbling
00:41:24.340
experience, uh, to, to change, which would be obviously unfortunate and dangerous.
00:41:29.840
There's this, this just been this trend towards like, we need a fighter, right?
00:41:38.680
Well, what does, what does that mean in terms of politics?
00:41:44.840
Maybe that, at least that's like the first step of, of fighting.
00:41:47.320
If you're going to get into a fight, your goal should be to win.
00:41:50.740
Um, a lot of people don't want to win because winning means responsibility after you've won
00:41:55.680
and you've actually, you've actually got to govern.
00:41:57.920
So some people kind of talk, talk, talk about how they, you know, that's why when people
00:42:01.820
are like, I don't even want to go vote because my vote doesn't count.
00:42:04.180
And, you know, it's because you don't want to win.
00:42:08.480
Victimhood has been, has been elevated as a, as a key attribute in American society.
00:42:12.140
And if we think that's just happening on the left, we're crazy.
00:42:17.720
And, and so, you know, winning should be the goal.
00:42:21.240
And in politics, you win by persuading others to agree with you.
00:42:24.280
And so that's that, maybe that's, maybe that's the best, like if I had to ask people one rhetorical
00:42:30.260
question that would get them to understand what I'm talking about here, it's, does the
00:42:34.660
person you like so much, uh, in politics, have they convinced anyone to see things your
00:42:41.480
Have they ever convinced a single person to see things your way?
00:42:46.660
And if the answer is no, then they're probably not a very good fighter for you.
00:42:50.560
They are good at fighting for your attention that they're perfect at, right?
00:42:54.800
They're great at fundraising off of your attention and tricking you into thinking that they're
00:42:59.320
a so-called fighter, but they're not because they've never made anyone believe things that
00:43:06.780
And that is the key metric to winning in politics.
00:43:09.740
So I think that's, that's the question you have to ask your representatives.
00:43:19.580
We can't obviously get to it all, but I really appreciate your work and what you're doing
00:43:23.160
and even our conversations that this and shorter ones that we've had, um, because they have
00:43:27.820
opened my eyes to seeing things a little differently.
00:43:29.560
Cause yeah, naturally I tend to look at what's posted on social media and gravitate towards,
00:43:37.720
But these nuances are so crucial and I appreciate your time explaining them to us and helping us understand.
00:43:45.560
I know we didn't get, it was mostly, uh, uh, about politics.
00:43:49.660
We didn't even get into a whole lot of interesting issues, but I think, I think it's stuff people
00:43:58.620
So if we ever want to do it again and get into some different politics, the actual politics
00:44:02.480
or policy, I should say, then we can certainly do that as well.
00:44:13.160
My conversation with the one and only Dan Crenshaw.
00:44:15.520
I hope that you enjoyed the conversation and walked away with a perspective that maybe you
00:44:19.820
have not yet considered before, or it opened your mind or horizons to what is possible and
00:44:24.880
what we should be looking at regarding politics, uh, reach out to Dan connect with him on the
00:44:30.300
socials, uh, connect with me, take a screenshot of this podcast and share it with somebody that
00:44:40.540
You can check out his book fortitude, wherever you get your copy of books.
00:44:44.480
Uh, we've got my book coming out later this week, uh, called the masculinity manifesto.
00:44:48.980
So make sure to pre-order that, uh, or purchase it depending on when you listen to this again,
00:44:55.000
And then the last thing is check out the iron council at order of man.com slash iron council
00:45:03.680
All right, guys, you've got your marching orders.
00:45:06.940
We'll be back tomorrow until then go out there, take action and become the man you are meant
00:45:12.660
Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.
00:45:15.120
You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.
00:45:18.980
We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.