Order of Man - Dealing with a Culture of Mediocrity, Avoiding Job Burnout, and How to Approach Life in a New Industry

00:00:00.000 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart

00:00:04.980 your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time.

00:00:10.420 You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong. This is your life. This is who

00:00:17.160 you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done,

00:00:22.720 you can call yourself a man. All right guys, what's up? This one's a little different because

00:00:27.680 Kip Sorensen, my typical and usual co-host is on a little family business right now. So

00:00:34.740 we called in our designated hitter, Mr. Sean Villalobos. What's up, brother? Good to see you.

00:00:39.880 Yeah. Good to be here. It's always fun. I don't think you and I actually have done

00:00:44.400 an AMA together. You've done probably half a dozen or maybe even more with Kip,

00:00:48.440 but I don't think you and I have done one. Have we? I think we've done one. I think so.

00:00:52.800 Have we? All right. Well, who knows? Man, at this point, it all blends together.

00:00:57.680 I've been traveling so much and man, I've got so much on my plate. I just got back from

00:01:02.520 Western Hunt Expo, which was really cool. Have you ever been to that, by the way?

00:01:06.800 I haven't. No, never.

00:01:08.840 Yeah. It's a really cool event. I try not to miss it. We missed last year only because they

00:01:13.560 didn't hold it last year, but outside of that, we've hit, I think this is either our fourth or

00:01:19.080 fifth year. And it's, like I said, it's a great show. And I took my two oldest boys and they were

00:01:24.960 asking me, you know, dad, what's, what's going to be your favorite part. I'm like, you know,

00:01:27.960 all the hunt stuff's cool. Like I geek out on some of that stuff, but more than anything,

00:01:32.240 it's just to be able to see old friends and have cool conversations and connect with people you

00:01:36.060 haven't connected with for a year or longer. So we had a good time, man. How about you?

00:01:39.800 What's going on with you?

00:01:40.640 That's great. Oh my gosh. This last week was crazy. I, in the last eight days, bought a house,

00:01:49.100 had my 20th wedding anniversary and, uh, and then took my boys to the Superbowl yesterday.

00:01:57.960 So, uh, yeah, how was that? It was hectic. It was fun. You know, it was interesting because

00:02:05.140 you go to something like that and then people find out obviously. And I got all these messages

00:02:11.460 from people like, Oh man, I don't like the NFL. I don't like watching it. It's overpriced players.

00:02:16.960 It's all this stuff. You know, you get so many messages like that. You also get good ones like,

00:02:21.980 Oh, to have fun and all that stuff. But, you know, for me, it's just about, I wouldn't have

00:02:26.300 gone. I've never, I've been, I've actually turned down going to the Superbowl a few times

00:02:29.760 because just haven't been interested, but it's my boy's favorite team and they both love playing

00:02:36.680 football and they're right here in LA. Right. While we still live in LA. And it's like,

00:02:41.820 why wouldn't I go and have that experience? Was it in LA? Yeah. It was at SoFi stadium.

00:02:46.840 Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I don't even know. Somebody asked, I just, I yesterday found out who was

00:02:52.220 playing in the Superbowl. I actually, no, I take that back. I did know the Rams were playing,

00:02:57.240 but I didn't know they were playing the Bengals and I don't even, who won? I don't even know who won.

00:03:01.160 The Rams won. Yeah. The Rams won. Okay. Well, there you go.

00:03:03.640 In the last minute of the game too, it was a phenomenal experience for my boys to be there

00:03:10.680 and everything. It was like everything you hope for, you're going to do something like that with

00:03:13.300 your family. It was really cool, but I'm usually in the same boat as you. I usually don't know who's

00:03:19.080 in, where the game's being played, all that. It's like, it's me too, but yeah. That's an interesting

00:03:27.400 topic though, because you look at so many people look at, you know, kind of the, the league and all

00:03:33.700 that stuff. Like, I don't, I don't wear someone's name on my back. You know, I'm not into jerseys and

00:03:39.340 into, you know, kind of like idolizing the players, but I do love winning and I love greatness and I

00:03:46.360 love being able to watch that and experience that. And then to be there with my boys and be able to teach

00:03:51.540 that to them, you know, that's what I did it for. Not because I'm involved in wanting to celebrate

00:03:57.140 someone else's win, if that makes sense. No, I get it. I think in moderation, it makes,

00:04:02.400 it makes total sense. And like you said, with the boys, you know, I've taken my kids to baseball

00:04:06.000 games. I grew up in Southern California until I was about 14. So I used to watch the angels play

00:04:11.800 all the time. So my oldest son and I last year had the opportunity to go see an angels game. And when I

00:04:17.440 was a kid, you know, we didn't have any money. So if we went and watched a game, I was in the

00:04:23.040 nosebleeds. And I remember sitting in the nosebleed section, always thinking, man, wouldn't

00:04:27.340 it be awesome to sit behind the plate? And so when Brecken and I went last year, we were looking

00:04:33.500 at tickets and I'm like, screw this. Like I've always wanted to sit behind the plate. And we sat,

00:04:39.400 I think five or seven rows up right behind the plate. It was an awesome experience, man. And like

00:04:45.300 you said, if you're doing it for your kids and you can teach them about greatness, I think that's

00:04:49.220 important. The part I have a problem with is crybabies complaining about how hard their life

00:04:54.580 is when, you know, they're making millions of dollars. Uh, they're, they're idolized, they're

00:04:59.660 worshiped, uh, they're playing a game. Yes. There's a level of greatness with that, but I, I just,

00:05:06.580 I don't want to be political at all anymore. I just want those guys to play, play great, do great,

00:05:13.400 succeed, teach us about greatness. And then not to say they can't have a political opinion. Of

00:05:19.080 course they can. And they should, I hope they would, but I don't want to hear about it.

00:05:23.400 I'm not there to hear about it. If I want to follow you on Twitter or somewhere else. Yeah.

00:05:27.500 I'll hear about your politics. Cause that's what I'm signing up for. But outside of that,

00:05:30.820 I just want you to play the damn game and, and do what you're paid to do. Period. Bottom line.

00:05:37.180 I agree. Just like at any other job, like I wouldn't go to the gas station and hope that the gas

00:05:42.440 station attendant or, or, or the gal at the convenience store would tell me, tell me about all

00:05:46.960 our political leanings. I just want to buy my Coke and get on with my day. You know, that that's what

00:05:51.900 I get frustrated about more than anything else. Yeah, I agree. Well, at the end of the day,

00:05:56.820 they're entertainers, right? Yeah. And they're, I'm not taking away the top level of their athleticism

00:06:02.980 in saying that, but that's what games are. They're entertainment. Right. And, and if you're

00:06:09.280 entertaining people, I think you should focus on the positive in that that's kind of your job,

00:06:14.800 in my opinion. And you know, any of the stuff that's going to, I guess you could say, kind of

00:06:21.080 polarize things and, and make people angry. It's cool. If you voice your opinion, but let's not do

00:06:26.400 it on the field. Let's not do it during the show. Right. Right. Well, and I don't, and I don't even

00:06:32.220 discount. I don't think you were, but I think a lot of people tend to lean towards, oh, they're just

00:06:37.240 entertainers. It's like, well, I'm not discounting that. Like I'm an entertainer, right? We're here

00:06:41.600 entertaining, educating, informing the gal at the convenience store is doing her job.

00:06:47.020 The banker at the bank that you bank with is doing his or her job. Like everybody's doing their job

00:06:52.420 and not that one is more important or less important. The guy picks up my trash. The

00:06:56.240 school teacher teaches our kids like not that one is more or less important than the other.

00:07:02.060 It's just that when I go to the convenience store, I just want you to ring up my Coke. If I go to the gas

00:07:09.260 station, I just want you to ring up my gas or at the grocery store, the food. If I go to the bank,

00:07:16.380 I just want you to give me the money that I'm taking out of my account. I don't need any of

00:07:20.240 that other bullshit. That's the problem I have. Well, that's what I'd like is that there's plenty

00:07:25.600 of guys, you know, if we're talking about the NFL, yeah, you have the crybabies, but there's also

00:07:30.820 plenty of guys that have, for me, the character that I want my boys to know and understand, right?

00:07:37.940 Like, like the MVP last night was a guy named Cooper cup. Who's the best receiver in the league

00:07:42.960 and he plays for the Rams and the dude is just one of those straight up. Is he a receiver? Is he a

00:07:48.640 tight end? I, I saw something about, I don't know. I honestly don't know. Yeah, no, he's a wide receiver.

00:07:53.240 He's the best receiver in the league. The guy's amazing. Okay. Um, cause he blocks, I saw something

00:07:57.100 about how hard he blocks. So he was selling those blocks and would go out for fades. And yeah, I saw him

00:08:02.140 catch a touchdown yesterday while I was sitting in the airport or something. I can't remember, but

00:08:05.580 yeah, he does everything hard. They had a fourth and one in the last drive and, uh, they're running

00:08:12.640 back. Wasn't doing anything the whole game. He was just getting stuffed and they ran a play as a run

00:08:19.720 for him. So he went in motion and they handed the ball off to him and he, he got like eight yards for

00:08:25.780 the first down. And he, that last drive was all him and the quarterback, you know, but he's just,

00:08:31.160 it's, he's just one of those dudes. Great guy loves the game, works his butt off. That's all he

00:08:36.800 cares about to do his job, you know, nothing else. And you know, those traits, that's the stuff I

00:08:43.260 talked to my boys about. Right. And they, they like that in him. They like, you know, his positivity.

00:08:49.360 They like his gratitude. They, you know, all those things. And you know, that's what I like about it.

00:08:54.380 Well, and then the other thing you, you should be doing is you should be curating who you're

00:08:58.900 paying attention to. So I bring this up because like this guy, I don't, I don't know him. I don't

00:09:03.240 follow him or know who he is, but, um, one, one person that's, that comes to mind is somebody that

00:09:09.020 I've been talking with for a bit. And then you introduced, reintroduced us just a couple of weeks

00:09:13.560 ago. And that's Justin Wren. So as of, as of the release of this, this today's podcast,

00:09:21.020 uh, we just released his podcast yesterday. And this is a guy who has fight fought at the top

00:09:30.160 echelons of mixed martial arts between Bellator and UFC. And yet it's not his performance in the

00:09:38.060 octagon that I'm most impressed with. It's his performance outside of it that I am. And so now

00:09:43.740 you start to curate. This is the problem I have when people complain about Facebook. It's like, well,

00:09:48.240 yeah, I know Facebook's doing some, some shady stuff. Trust me. I know more than most people,

00:09:52.920 what, what they do to manipulate what you see in the data. Okay. I know more than most of you

00:09:58.280 listening about it, but also you have a responsibility in curating that. And when you

00:10:03.320 find a professional athlete like Justin Wren, who, yeah, incredible athlete, incredible performer,

00:10:09.540 but what he's doing outside of the ring, those are the types of individuals that we ought to latch

00:10:14.000 on to and learn from and grow from. Yes. And he is the crazy thing with Justin. He is

00:10:20.600 inexplainably one of the best humans you'll ever meet in your life. No doubt. He's phenomenal.

00:10:26.520 Yeah. Yeah. So I appreciate you syncing us back up because we had talked a bit and then I don't

00:10:31.620 know what happened. It like, again, life's so busy, but you had messaged. I'm like, all right,

00:10:35.160 let's make this happen. So I reached out to Justin and yeah, we made it happen. We had a great

00:10:38.740 conversation. So if you guys haven't listened, go like, I'm looking forward to that podcast.

00:10:42.520 Yeah. All right, man. Well, uh, let's get into some questions today. These ones are coming from

00:10:46.680 Facebook, so I'll let you fill in for Kip and, uh, you'll ask the questions and we'll riff on them.

00:10:52.220 All right. First one is from Patrick Wagner. I wonder how Kip would have pronounced that.

00:10:59.040 Yeah. Weg, Wagner. All right. Patrick Wagner. Kip, we love you, brother. We're thinking about you.

00:11:06.240 How do you stay the course and perform in a culture where it's typical to do just enough to

00:11:11.740 complete a job? Oh, that's the best place to do it. If, if, if you're in a culture that's

00:11:17.800 underperforming and you're in a culture that celebrates and fosters and encourages mediocrity,

00:11:23.580 and then all of a sudden you come in, look, there's going to be people who don't like you.

00:11:27.280 Let's, let's just take the job environment. Uh, the, the people who were being mediocre,

00:11:32.640 they're going to hate you because you're going to show everybody else what's possible. And you're

00:11:39.100 going to do one of two things. Well, you're going to piss them off. There's no doubt about that.

00:11:43.460 Those are the underperformers, but the ones who actually have potential, you're going to actually

00:11:48.880 elevate them and show them what's possible and shine as a beacon for their own performance.

00:11:54.500 And both are good. If you have underperformers who are pissed off at you because you're exceeding

00:11:59.720 expectations, good. You don't want them in your organization. You have a powerful opportunity to

00:12:04.180 recreate culture right here. And a lot of people say, well, you know, what can one person do?

00:12:08.540 One person turns into two, two turn into four, four turn into eight. And before you know it,

00:12:13.360 all those weak ass guys hanging around, mooching off the system leave because they can't handle what

00:12:19.200 you're doing. And the ones who didn't have an example of what could be done are inspired by what

00:12:26.100 you're doing. So you're in the best place to be, which is a culture that's broken,

00:12:32.460 potentially degenerate, celebrates mediocrity. Good. Rise above and set yourself apart from the

00:12:38.640 pack. This is the best place to do it. But also one other thing on that is that requires you finding

00:12:45.840 your own energy because you're not going to get it from your crew. Like we're, we're surrounded,

00:12:50.320 Sean. I know what you do with your line of work. You're surrounded by high performers. I'm surrounded

00:12:55.100 by high performers deliberately and intentionally. We've, we've culture, we've, we've cultivated that,

00:13:00.080 that environment. You're probably not going to get it. So you need to create it for yourself,

00:13:06.100 which is challenging at times because it gets frustrating. I get that. But what you're going

00:13:11.300 to have to do is you're going to have to go outside of your work environment and find good friends,

00:13:16.820 high caliber people, people that are doing work, getting it done, going to conferences, going to

00:13:22.200 events. So what you need to do is find some of that outside of your culture until you can create it

00:13:29.000 where you currently are. Yeah. I was, I was going to say that. And, you know, I had the thought when

00:13:36.000 I saw the question that if you can't change your culture, change your culture, which is one of two

00:13:40.860 things that you were either going to do what you said, or if it just doesn't catch, maybe you push and

00:13:47.740 you push for a year, two years, three years, and it's just not kind of catching. Then you,

00:13:53.560 then you move, right. You move on, you go somewhere else, you find, you know, but, um, you know, I also

00:13:59.880 want to say like, and, and with what I do, actually the majority of time, you're not dealing with high

00:14:08.300 performers. You know, you're actually, for me, I'm, I'm most of my time spent is trying to lift up and

00:14:16.620 teach and train and, you know, find leaders. And so, you know, to build them up to basically

00:14:24.380 kind of replace me. Right. And that's always consistently happening. And so, but I have to

00:14:30.740 place myself in an environment, which is what you said to be around high performers, to keep me on my

00:14:36.620 game, right. To keep me on point. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's, that's, that's a, that's a valid point.

00:14:43.280 And you want, you know, one thing I would also say about where you, you talked about changing your

00:14:47.360 culture or environment is a lot of guys think the grass is greener on the other side, right? Like,

00:14:52.840 oh, well, my place sucks. So I'm going over there. You actually might be right. It's not always not

00:14:57.360 exclusively, but in this case, you might be right. It might be better somewhere else, but I'll tell

00:15:01.060 you what, you're going to perform better on that side of the fence where the grass is greener.

00:15:05.660 If you decide to perform better today, right? Like if you bitch and you moan and you cry and you

00:15:11.120 complain and you settle like all these other people around you are, don't, don't you for one

00:15:16.660 second, believe that that's going to change on the other side of the fence, just because you happen

00:15:20.100 to go over there. If you start to improve yourself here, where you currently are by developing the

00:15:26.100 skillsets you need, by surrounding yourself with the right people, by trying to inspire those around

00:15:30.740 you, the grass on the other side of the fence, if you end up going over there is going to be

00:15:35.680 infinitely better because you've made yourself better where you are today. So don't think that

00:15:40.240 it's only the external that's going to change. The internal has to change as well. And that will

00:15:45.340 put you leaps and bounds ahead of those people who are just chasing the green grass, wherever they go.

00:15:51.140 Well, and you also, if you don't try to give it your everything and move that needle where you're at,

00:15:56.520 you're not going to learn enough to know what to look for in the next place to make sure it's a better

00:16:03.020 place. Well, yeah. I mean, it might create opportunities for you too, right? Because if

00:16:08.680 you're out there performing and excelling and exceeding, guess who else is doing that? Or at

00:16:12.740 least interested in that. There might be somebody in your organization. Maybe it's a C-level executive

00:16:18.100 or something like that. Or even the owner. I mean, maybe even the owner acknowledges and recognizes

00:16:23.080 what's going on, but he sees you as the one guy who's kicking ass, man, that's going to create a ton

00:16:28.160 of opportunities that aren't going to be available for anybody else. Absolutely. All right, man. Next

00:16:33.660 question. Next question is from Christopher Benjamin, man. I'm getting a softball. It's

00:16:41.140 going to be like, those are easy. Of course you could pronounce those right. Those are easy names.

00:16:48.000 I've led men's groups of varying sizes since 2013. Recently, I found that my circle isn't challenging me or

00:16:56.780 holding me accountable to the goals I'm striving for. To that end, I've gone through the process of

00:17:02.040 reaching out and gathering a group of high achievers that I admire and look up to, established

00:17:06.940 a mission statement, and have clear stated expectations for this group. What else can I do

00:17:12.160 to make sure this group gets off on the right foot? Well, look, I mean, this ties into what we were

00:17:18.840 talking about earlier with going out and creating that culture. So first and foremost, I commend you for

00:17:23.860 doing that. Most people won't do that, by the way. They'll sit around and they'll wait for somebody

00:17:28.580 else to do it. Order of man shouldn't even be a business. It shouldn't be a movement because all

00:17:36.380 of you should be doing it, but not all of you are. And so I did. And so we create this thing and people

00:17:41.740 are like, oh man, you're so lucky. Oh, no, I just went out and did what you wanted and what you were

00:17:48.680 unwilling to do for yourself, which I'm happy with. I'm good. I'm good with that. And that's

00:17:54.420 why we've talked about in the past of, you know, look for the ability to lead where the void of

00:18:01.540 leadership exists, right? If there's a void, don't complain about that. Be grateful that something's

00:18:08.820 missing because that gives you an opportunity to do it. So the only thing I would say that you should

00:18:14.200 do, you've created the mission statement, clear objectives, expectations, all that kind of stuff.

00:18:18.940 What I would say is make sure there's a level of challenge built into it. I don't know what

00:18:25.280 specifically that looks like. I don't know what kind of organization it is. I don't know if it's

00:18:29.900 revolving around faith and church, for example, or entrepreneurship. I don't know those details,

00:18:37.060 but I'll tell you what I think men, especially high achieving men thrive best under challenge. I mean,

00:18:43.320 that's why we're talking about the Superbowl. That's a challenge, right? Those guys are pitting

00:18:46.700 themselves against another team, pinnacle athletes, you know, the pinnacle of their achievement.

00:18:52.940 They're trying to improve. They're trying to get better. They're trying to dominate on the field

00:18:56.320 and high achievers always rise to a challenge. We do that inside the Iron Council. We offer

00:19:03.380 assignments. We offer weekly challenges. We're holding each other accountable. Of the 50 plus teams

00:19:10.100 that we have in play right now, I know that the team leaders who challenge and confront their team

00:19:17.680 members are typically and generally performing much better than those team leaders who don't do

00:19:24.100 that at all. So look for ways to challenge each other in meaningful and significant ways, not just

00:19:29.840 a challenge, but it has to be directed towards something meaningful. And I think you're going to call

00:19:34.560 a lot of, uh, excellence out of these guys and even out of yourself.

00:19:40.900 Yeah. And I think you nailed it in the beginning when you mentioned how people say, Oh, you're so lucky.

00:19:47.240 And it's so funny how often you hear that. Um, but that's after not seeing the, maybe it's five years,

00:19:57.140 10 years, 15 years of blood, sweat, tears that you putting yourself into positions to have the

00:20:05.000 associations and, you know, the, the environment and the culture that you're in and that you've

00:20:11.640 surrounded yourself by and all the work that's involved in that. And so I think you're spot on

00:20:16.320 and he's, he's taking all the right steps in my opinion. Yeah. The other thing I would say is,

00:20:22.820 um, we get these kinds of questions quite a bit where like, what else can I be doing type questions?

00:20:29.860 And I like the question because it, it, to me, it communicates desire to improve and get better.

00:20:36.660 Right. So it's a good question. The challenge is, is that sometimes you're doing the right thing

00:20:43.240 and it just takes time to see the progress. Lifting weights is a great example. You know,

00:20:50.600 you hire a trainer, somebody who's well-qualified, somebody who has lots of experience and they start

00:20:55.780 training you and you see a little result immediately. And then it kind of plateaus

00:20:59.520 and then maybe a little more and then it plateaus, but your, your growth isn't as quickly as you'd

00:21:04.180 like to see it. And a lot of men will throw in the towel and, or their last question's like,

00:21:09.700 well, what, what else can I be doing? And they'll mess everything up when really all they had to do

00:21:14.860 was just be what Andy for Silla says is aggressively patient. Meaning you're still

00:21:21.140 working the system. You're still working the plan. You're still doing the action steps

00:21:24.880 and you're being patient in that, you know, the results will take care of themselves as you do.

00:21:29.760 So never use the, again, I know where this question's coming from. It's coming from a good place,

00:21:35.000 but never use it as an opportunity or a gap or an opening that leads you into throwing in the towel.

00:21:42.980 Like it's not happening fast enough. So it must not be working. So like I'm done.

00:21:46.860 It's like, no, sometimes it takes you six months or a year or five years. In the case of order of man,

00:21:52.720 we've been going at this for almost seven years now. You know, people will say, oh, Ryan,

00:21:58.120 I can't believe this person. Yeah. Oh, you did that. Yeah. You did. Yes. Seven years of doing the work.

00:22:05.160 So don't discount it just because you're not experiencing it as quickly as you would like.

00:22:09.940 That's the word of caution on that one.

00:22:11.620 Yeah. I would say that it's if he's looking for what else he's obviously excited about what he's

00:22:16.640 doing, then I would say what else you need to do is stay excited. And that's where most people lose

00:22:23.520 is, or that's where they plateau is the excitement level wears off. It becomes monotonous. It becomes

00:22:30.300 a quote unquote grind. And they, again, that's the work though. That's the, that's the necessary

00:22:37.560 steps and actions that you need to take to get those A plus results, but you have to be excited

00:22:43.900 about. And if he's excited about it, then that's the, what else in my opinion is, and stay excited.

00:22:50.460 Well, so here's another thought. So when I started podcasting, I had,

00:22:54.580 you know, a little old computer on a broken desk that was my wife's grandfather's. In fact,

00:23:01.360 it's the desk is still over there in the corner, still use it in a spare bedroom in, in our house

00:23:07.780 in Southern Utah. I think I was recording on a $60 microphone or something like that.

00:23:12.840 And I had that thought of like, okay, well, what else, what else should I be doing? What else,

00:23:17.340 what else? And instead of going out in a thousand different directions, what I decided to do instead

00:23:23.740 was to, for my, what else question was to improve what I was currently doing. So I didn't go out and

00:23:31.140 do a bunch of other things. I'm like, okay, well now I need a video camera. Okay. Now I need a better

00:23:35.900 microphone. Okay. I need to learn how to ask better questions. I need to figure out how to get better,

00:23:40.760 more high caliber guys on the podcast. So I didn't go out in a thousand different directions. That to

00:23:46.680 me is a mistake that a lot of people make instead double down on what you're doing. If you're still

00:23:53.000 finding interest in it, don't be reckless with it, but if you're still finding interest with it

00:23:56.380 and you are producing some results, double down. I've got a guy coming out next month who is a

00:24:02.320 professional video and audio engineer, and we're going to rework this entire studio to make sure that

00:24:08.060 we have the right camera equipment, the audio is what it needs to be doing. We've got the boards,

00:24:12.500 we've got the setup, we've got the angles, we've got the lighting. It's not what else, it's how can I

00:24:17.620 make this even better than it is right now? Yeah. And you know, that's, as you've said that,

00:24:26.640 it's, I think most people don't do what you just said, kind of the exterior things that fine tuning

00:24:32.960 to make it better. You know, and you talked about the audio and video and everything else. It's also

00:24:37.360 internally your energy, right? The increase of energy, the increase of voice, the listening to

00:24:44.620 what you're producing on the front end over and over and over again. So you can say, oh man, I had

00:24:49.780 too many filler words. I had this, I lowered my energy. I didn't increase my voice. You know, all the

00:24:56.260 things that maybe don't come naturally to you. You know, I think just in doing this right now,

00:25:01.340 naturally I'm pretty soft-spoken. I don't, you know, say tons and tons and I'm not loud at all

00:25:07.240 when I speak to people naturally. But I know when I'm in an environment where I'm trying to get some

00:25:13.760 sort of a result, I have to step up that energy. I have to step up my game. So even right now talking

00:25:19.100 to you, I almost feel like I'm yelling into this microphone and that's not the natural way that I

00:25:23.880 generally communicate with people, but I know that to get good results or to be at my best,

00:25:29.520 that's what I need to bring. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good call. I wrote down here as you're doing that

00:25:34.920 because a lot of people won't do that. They won't break apart or break down their own performance,

00:25:40.440 whether you're speaking on stage, like I know you do, or speaking behind a microphone, which is what

00:25:44.700 I tend to do more of. They won't look at it because they're embarrassed or they don't want to hear

00:25:48.780 themselves. Like you got to get over that. And it's the worst. I hate hearing my own voice.

00:25:53.660 I mean, there's, there's world-class actors who, you know, I've heard they won't go watch their

00:26:01.080 movie. It's like, well, what, like, why would I get why you don't, I get that. So I'm asking that

00:26:06.400 a bit rhetorically, but you ought to critique it. And so there's a word choice that I, that I would

00:26:13.000 suggest that you use that you change. I used to say, well, you know, you need to be critical of your

00:26:17.960 own performance. I actually don't think that's entirely accurate. I think the better choice of

00:26:23.300 words is analytical of your performance. So when you're saying critical, it's like, okay,

00:26:28.700 I'm going to look for everything that's wrong. Okay. That was wrong. And that was bad. And this

00:26:31.740 was wrong. And I didn't do this good. It's like, okay, that's not going to go anywhere, but instead

00:26:36.340 analytical, right? So, Hey, you know what? My inflection was off a little bit. So I need to tweak

00:26:41.800 that. My tempo, I was a little too hurried. That's my default. I go through things really,

00:26:46.960 really quickly. So I need to slow the tempo down. You personally might need to speed it up a bit,

00:26:52.720 right? But now it's more analytical. And so you're not attaching any sort of weird

00:26:57.360 meaning to your performance. You're just being very analytical about what's working,

00:27:04.400 what isn't working and objectively what needs to improve, but you don't attach it to your self-worth

00:27:09.840 or how good of a person or how bad of a person you are. It's just an objective analytical look

00:27:15.300 into your performance and how you can improve. I like it. What's next?

00:27:20.960 All right. Next question is from Michael Cooper. I love these guys.

00:27:25.160 Easy. Get the T-ball. T-ball questions or names right here.

00:27:30.040 And a short question. How do you deal with the job burnout?

00:27:35.400 You know, I think we hit on it actually. Yeah, I agree.

00:27:38.260 You know, that last one is, well, think about my day. A lot of you guys may not obviously be

00:27:46.440 familiar with the way that my day goes, but let me just tell you generally, you know, I wake up,

00:27:50.320 I do my workout or my jujitsu, whatever the day calls for. And then I get in here about the same

00:27:56.440 time, eight, nine o'clock every single morning, depending on how the morning goes with the kids

00:28:00.940 and my training and all that. And then I'm immediately on emails, like immediately checking

00:28:06.800 emails, sending emails, checking up. I do my planning. You know, I've always got my planner

00:28:10.760 right here in hand. I've got my planning done, checking emails. And then midday is usually I'll

00:28:17.720 be podcasting. Either somebody's coming on the podcast or you and I are recording or I'm going

00:28:23.580 on somebody else's podcast. And then, you know, I wrap up my day with my planner again, and that starts

00:28:29.560 all over Monday through Friday without fail. Okay. That gets boring and monotonous. You know,

00:28:38.320 how many times I've been on a podcast where they've asked me the same damn question over and over again.

00:28:43.820 And I'm not saying that to be critical of the questions that are being asked. I'm saying like,

00:28:47.980 I've answered that question literally 2000 times at this point. So how do you, how do you not burn

00:28:54.620 out on that? Well, I think you got to mix it up, right? And you got to challenge yourself

00:28:59.560 to improve. So instead of being butthurt that somebody asked me the same damn question over

00:29:05.140 again, and I've answered it 2000 times, maybe I can answer it in a different way. Maybe I can

00:29:11.180 experiment with the way that I'm addressing that question or that conversation or looking at the way

00:29:17.240 that I'm asking questions of myself or my guests and thinking about how I can improve in those

00:29:22.460 circumstances or looking at my current activities and not going completely AWOL on those activities,

00:29:31.220 because you still need to get them done, but looking at what little branches that you can spin

00:29:35.760 off of, you know, so a podcast, great example. We started the interview podcast in March of 2015.

00:29:43.620 I love doing that. I still do that, but I was interested in more and different. So what did we do?

00:29:47.920 We did the Friday field notes. Okay. Completely different format, same podcast platform,

00:29:54.540 same network, but it's the Friday field notes. Okay, good. Got the interview, got the Friday field

00:29:58.740 notes. What else can we be doing? Oh, you know what? It'd be really cool to answer listener questions

00:30:03.980 every week. And so now we have the ask me anything episode that comes out every Wednesday. So we're still

00:30:09.680 in the same vein. That's the thing. Don't deviate so far that you lose focus of your primary

00:30:15.020 activities, but just look for those little ancillary veins that you can kind of deviate

00:30:20.960 from that keep you on the same main path, but just little, little sidetracks, right? That get you back

00:30:26.940 onto the path, but keep things interesting and unique and give you a new perspective. That's what

00:30:30.840 I've done anyways. Yeah. Well, two thoughts, as you say that the first one is that it, from most

00:30:36.720 outside looking in perspective, what you're doing looks and seems glamorous, you know, and it,

00:30:44.020 and it looks, it seems glamorous now because there's an audience. And so people think, Oh,

00:30:50.040 that'd be cool to travel and to go around and to be in these conversations with these guys and,

00:30:55.940 you know, all of that stuff, but it's, it's not as glamorous as you think, um, when you're in it,

00:31:01.280 when you're doing it. Um, and then at the end of the day, you figure out they're just conversations.

00:31:05.580 These are just men, you know, they're like you and me. They're just, you know, they're,

00:31:10.260 they're willing to do something significant for a long enough amount of time to get the results that

00:31:16.860 they get. And that's, that's my, you know, the one thing, but the second thing that I think of is

00:31:22.920 that, you know, I was taught a long time ago, like in my business, our presentations and the stuff that

00:31:28.360 we teach our people. And it's the same presentation. It's, it's turnkey. It's literally

00:31:32.880 like a two page flip chart thing, like that we go through and that we say to every single person.

00:31:37.880 And so I've said the same thing, tens of thousands of times. But one thing that one of my mentors taught

00:31:44.620 me a long time ago is that the, yeah, it's the same thing over and over again, but you know,

00:31:49.120 it's not the same, the audience, the people, the listener, the people that you're in front of.

00:31:53.980 Right. And so like when you said, yeah, I might need to change up my answer sometimes,

00:32:00.800 you know what, maybe you don't need to change up the answers, right? Maybe you answered that

00:32:04.520 question three months ago, but now there's an, there's an extra thousand or 2000, or maybe it's

00:32:11.080 only 50 new people listening to what you're saying that needed to hear it that same way again. And so

00:32:16.940 we can't get sick of our message when our message is effective. Right. That's a good call. Yeah.

00:32:21.980 It's a, it's that. And then, and then the second main thought I thought of he says, how do you deal

00:32:27.920 with job burnout? I've experienced job burnout and it led me into my business. So have you,

00:32:32.780 and it led you into this business, right? So you didn't like your job in financial planning.

00:32:37.580 And so you started pursuing something outside of that on the side, you didn't just jump ship,

00:32:43.880 but you started trying to find your niche, your, what you could be excited about, what you could

00:32:48.800 be passionate about. You know, we were talking about that excitement. So did I, I hated my other job.

00:32:53.460 So it, it made me start looking because I hated it. Now I'm grateful that I hated that job because

00:33:00.120 I wouldn't have been looking when I found what I do now. Right. And so maybe you need to do that.

00:33:06.420 Yeah. I think that's a good point. I will take a bit of a counter on that. Not that I think you're

00:33:11.720 wrong. I think you're dead. Right. Because obviously it's, it's worked for me. But I want to give the,

00:33:16.520 the other perspective of this, which is you need to be careful of that though.

00:33:19.840 Yeah. Because maybe that's the alternative, right? It's not the thing you should do.

00:33:25.800 It's not. Yeah. Well, excitement is an emotion, right? Like you're excited that that's all that

00:33:32.160 is. You're excited because of a, some sort of stimulus. And so excitement is the response,

00:33:36.480 right? Or, or at least could lead you to the response. It's the reaction I should say. And

00:33:41.180 then you have a response from there. Um, so yeah, we all get burnt. Like you're excited about your

00:33:46.700 work, Sean. And I think that's amazing. I'm excited about my work. Not always, you know,

00:33:52.260 like this morning I was like, damn, I got a bunch of, cause I was gone the end of last week.

00:33:56.680 And I had, you know, my email stack up and whatever. And I'm looking through emails. I'm

00:34:00.020 like, Oh, I don't want to do this, but you know what? I did it because that's what needs to be done.

00:34:04.660 And so I'm not excited. I'm not excited about it, but I also know that it's leading me to the thing I am

00:34:10.000 excited about, which is serving more men, saving more families, helping serve our communities. And

00:34:15.540 basically at the end of it all, saving society, frankly, through the work of masculinity.

00:34:22.640 Yeah. And if that means I got to send out 200 emails today, trust me, I don't want to sit here

00:34:28.340 sending, I can hear my kids downstairs playing right now. I know they're going to go out and play

00:34:32.260 in the snow. I know I just got back and I missed my wife and I want to be with her. Like there's other

00:34:37.020 things I want to be doing than sending 200 emails today, but that's the work that needs to be done

00:34:42.180 because I'm not excited in the temporary moment. I'm excited by what this long-term vision I have

00:34:48.420 is, is going to create. So let's not base our decisions solely off excitement, but if you start

00:34:54.400 to notice trends, okay. Like if I'm not excited about sending emails, got it. Check who is that's

00:35:00.460 weird if you are. Yeah. But if I show up every day for two weeks and I'm miserable, okay. That's now

00:35:07.520 becoming a trend and something needs to be addressed there. But it's always interesting.

00:35:13.400 You know, I know you're in financial services. The gentleman I sold my business to about six years

00:35:19.160 ago, a good friend of mine, Greg Black. It's so interesting to talk to him and to talk to you

00:35:28.360 about how excited you are about what you're doing and how passionate you are about it.

00:35:34.140 And I hear it and I'm like, Oh, that sounds miserable, but simultaneous. I'm like, but I'm

00:35:41.160 really glad for you that you're passionate about it. And, and so it's, it's always so interesting to

00:35:47.060 me to hear people talk about things. And I'm like, Oh, get glossy eyes. I'm like, Oh, shoot me.

00:35:53.700 But what that just goes to show you is that it's out there. You have to discover it. You have to find

00:36:00.120 it. You don't have to follow my path. You don't have to follow Sean or Kip or Greg or whoever else.

00:36:04.140 Like it's there. And there is something you can be genuinely passionate about.

00:36:09.100 Yeah. And, and, and there's, there's two levels. You hit on the macro level of the difference you're

00:36:16.300 making in people's lives, right? That's why I'm excited about my business is because I'm changing

00:36:21.160 people's lives and that's how I look at it. That's how I approach it. And that keeps me motivated.

00:36:26.240 But then there's also the micro level of what you hit on too, which maybe most guys didn't catch

00:36:32.540 is the time spent with your family. You're going to give up some of that, but it's also going to

00:36:37.680 afford you the time freedom to be able to do things like you just did with your boys, right?

00:36:42.900 Going to the hunt expo and then exposing them to that environment, to those people, to those

00:36:48.660 conversations and, and those things that's, that's motivation too. Like I'll be sometimes in moments of,

00:36:54.840 yeah, I don't want to do this, but then I'll think, you know what? And then I'll attach myself

00:36:59.220 to those experiences I've been able to have with my family, with my kids, you know, whatever it is,

00:37:05.020 that's important to me on a micro level. And that pushes me also. Right. So the combination of both

00:37:10.340 is super powerful. You know, there's one other thing I've been kind of riffing on in my brain over

00:37:15.180 the past couple of weeks. So not this trip, but the one before I left and my daughter said before I

00:37:20.840 left, I don't want you to go, which I think is common. Right. And so it's hard because, you know,

00:37:28.560 you do want to go do the things that you want to do. And also you want to stay home. There's a

00:37:32.600 dichotomy, you know, and you have to find that balance, but there is something I've been thinking

00:37:36.820 about that. I think a lot of us will often overlook. And that is that your children need

00:37:42.840 to see you pursuing something meaningful. Yes. They have to see it. And so I told my daughter,

00:37:48.400 look, hon, I know you don't want me to go. I want to be here with you. I would, if I could

00:37:53.340 all day long, every day, all the time, but there's also other things that are really important.

00:37:58.340 And you know what I do and we've had conversations and it's important for me to go do this because

00:38:03.840 fill in the blank with whatever it is for you. And I want you to see what it's like for somebody

00:38:09.900 who's pursuing something and excited about something and something meaningful. So I'm going to miss you.

00:38:14.580 I'm going to take your picture. She always gives me a, like a picture of her or the family. And

00:38:19.380 she's like, here, will you take this? And I always put it right on my keyboard and said, yep, I'll put

00:38:22.320 it right here. I'm going to take that picture. I'm going to think about you. I'm going to call you,

00:38:25.640 but also you got to know that I'm pursuing something that's meaningful, important to me.

00:38:29.680 And I want you to see what that looks like. Don't overlook that either. Cause your kids need to

00:38:34.180 see a great example of you going and doing something powerful in your life.

00:38:38.000 Yeah. I mean, you mentioned growing up broke and you had that similar experience to me. I grew up with

00:38:42.560 single mom, three kids, you know, I was the oldest and she wasn't at anything. Um, you know,

00:38:49.700 and, and, and not because she didn't want to be at baseball games or any of that stuff. And I,

00:38:53.780 I'm coaching my little guy. I went from coaching my oldest to now my little guy at six years old in

00:38:59.280 baseball, hurting cats again. So funny. And, uh, and, and one of the kids on, on the team is parents

00:39:06.380 own a restaurant. And, um, and I had to take him home after practice. And, and at the end of

00:39:12.100 practice, he was behind a tree crying. And I'm like, Hey, Nico, are you upset? Because I have to

00:39:17.120 take you home and mom's not here. And he's like, he's like, no. And I'm like, well, what's wrong,

00:39:21.480 buddy? You want to talk to me about it? I'm like, do you want to tell me, you know, do you not? And he

00:39:25.120 goes, yeah. And he goes, yeah, I'm just sad because mom wasn't here to see my hit that I got

00:39:31.340 today. Right. And practice. And he was, and he was like crying. And I'm like, look, dude, let me tell

00:39:36.660 you that happened to me when I was a kid and my parents weren't able to go to anything, but it's,

00:39:42.120 you know, why it's because they're working, you know, and because they are providing you with things

00:39:47.080 and nice things, you know, that baseball bat, you have that glove, your ability to play baseball and

00:39:51.840 all those things. And I don't know if he's going to catch any of it. Right. But it's,

00:39:55.920 it's, I wanted to support his parents, help him know what they're doing and why they're doing it.

00:39:59.960 And, but then also tell him, you know what, but it also makes you stronger. And then my son,

00:40:05.400 my oldest was helping me that day. He was able to witness that. And we're driving in the, in the truck

00:40:12.260 later that day. And he goes, man, that was so sad earlier. And I'm like, what are you talking about?

00:40:17.020 And he's like, when, when Nicholas was crying about his mom, that was so sad. And

00:40:21.780 I'm like, yeah, but didn't it make you grateful that you're in a position that your parents are at

00:40:28.460 stuff that I'm coaching you, that I'm able to do this, that we've worked so hard to be able to have

00:40:33.100 the, you know, what you have. And he's like, yeah, it really did. You know, it really, for him was an

00:40:38.740 eye opener at, at, you know, 13 years old is great for him to be able to see that and appreciate it and

00:40:44.520 understand it. And then from my level, growing up with parents that weren't at anything, I'm not mad at

00:40:51.400 that at all. As a matter of fact, it, what it taught me was that if you want something better

00:40:56.240 for your life, or if you just want anything at all, you got to get out and work for it,

00:41:00.520 you know? And yeah, there's going to be some sacrifice. You know, I don't, I don't look back

00:41:05.800 on my experience with my mom and working all the time, just trying to put food on the table for us.

00:41:12.240 And now having kids of my own, just, it's mind blowing to me how awesome she was in being able

00:41:18.740 to do that. And, um, you know, I'm grateful for it. And so it's, it's the, I totally agree. Your

00:41:25.500 kids need to see those efforts and, and know why. Right. But I think it's also our job to communicate

00:41:32.400 that to them. You have to, because what a lot of guys will do is like, they'll understand,

00:41:36.800 they'll get it. They may not vocalize that, but they'll say that to themselves. Oh, my kids understand.

00:41:40.460 Do they, are you sure? Cause they probably don't. They're probably missing. Even if you explained

00:41:46.600 it to the T, they would misinterpret it. They're going to look at it through their little eyes

00:41:51.160 and they're going to misinterpret what you're saying and what you're doing. So you better be

00:41:54.900 clear about why it is. And you better remind them often so they can formulate those connections.

00:42:00.020 Yeah. We do that with our wives too. Right. Totally. She gets it. She understands.

00:42:05.120 Really? I love her. Yeah. But then also you better balance it out with other

00:42:10.100 acts that, that prove to it, to, to them that you are. Cause I think what a lot of guys do,

00:42:15.500 I know I do is like, well, I'm providing for my family. That means I love them. Yes. I agree. I,

00:42:20.180 I, I agree with that. I think the overwhelming majority of the time, the men who are out

00:42:25.080 in the workforce, busting their ass day in and day out are doing it out of love because I know for a

00:42:32.220 fact that what some of these guys are doing, they despise, they hate, they would not do that in a

00:42:37.560 million years. If it weren't for the family that are trying to provide for. So that's,

00:42:41.640 I would say that's the large majority of, I would say that's the large majority of people,

00:42:45.440 right? Of men. Yes. It's an, it's an act of love. So you might believe that because you're

00:42:51.620 doing an act of love that what's the problem. She should get it. Okay. Maybe she should,

00:42:56.960 maybe she, yes, she should be appreciative of that. Your kids should, but also you should find a

00:43:03.040 way to communicate in a way that's meaningful to them too, which is being around, right? Your kids

00:43:08.500 don't care about what you're doing. That's not love to them. It's being around them. It's being

00:43:12.780 engaged. It's coaching their little league team. Like you're doing it's, it's, you know, wrestling

00:43:16.780 at night or just having a conversation on a drive and turning the music off and talking and listening

00:43:22.680 and asking about their day. My daughter comes up to me this morning. She's like, Hey dad, can I get

00:43:27.040 you a piece of gum? No, I don't want a piece of gum, but I take the piece of gum because I know

00:43:31.080 that's how she's communicating love to me. And I want to accept that. I want to accept that gift.

00:43:38.180 You have to give those gifts to them in a way that's meaningful to them. Not just what you think

00:43:42.240 you're doing is right. Absolutely. All right. Brian dubs Taylor. Here's a question I'm dealing

00:43:51.720 with directly. I'm a white belt with about nine months of BJJ training, and I love the training and

00:43:56.960 camaraderie, but I messed up my arm bad live rolling Friday and have to have an MRI. How does

00:44:02.980 one stay in the sport without completely sitting out for months? If you're injured?

00:44:08.160 I look, I don't know the extent of your injury, but I, I hurt my knee a couple of weeks ago. Um,

00:44:13.980 and I probably shouldn't have trained, but I did anyways, and I just wore a brace and I just,

00:44:19.240 I trained. Uh, and the other thing I did is I told my training partners what I was dealing with.

00:44:26.160 And I didn't, I didn't roll with any spazes. Like that's that I changed. Like there was a couple

00:44:30.900 of people. I said, I'm not going to roll with them for the next two weeks. And I was very deliberate.

00:44:36.460 Well, hard is fine. Hard is one thing. I don't mind that, but spaz, like, like spaz-tastic about it.

00:44:42.440 You know, they just, they're like, I'm not doing drop into, into a routine with all their weight

00:44:47.380 and stuff. Right. Like, yeah. Right. Yeah. So I, I chose my training partners wisely. And then

00:44:54.120 it goes back to communication. I told them, so like, Sean, if you and I were training, I'd be like,

00:44:58.780 Hey man, just so you know, I'm nursing a left knee problem. If you start tweaking it or whatever,

00:45:04.020 I'm just going to tap. Yeah. I'm not going to get you in a heel hook. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right.

00:45:08.740 And, and most guys are going to, what most guys will do is like, Oh, okay. I just won't,

00:45:13.340 I'll leave your leg alone. You know, if I was training with somebody and they're like, Hey man,

00:45:16.780 my right shoulder's hurting. Cool. I'll leave your right shoulder alone. And I won't even,

00:45:20.500 I'm not even going to attack. That's good for me anyways. Cause then I got to learn to attack

00:45:23.480 something else. Uh, and so the other day I was rolling and one of the guys I was rolling with,

00:45:29.080 he, uh, he grabbed my ankle and sat back for, you know, uh, an ankle lock and I just tapped like quick,

00:45:35.560 like, Hey, and he's like, Oh, did that hurt? I'm like, no, I just don't want it to.

00:45:38.740 Cause I don't want you. I don't want anything messing with my leg. So I dropped the ego and I'm

00:45:43.300 like, Hey, tap, you got me. And he's like, Oh, I didn't even like, did that hurt? I'm like, no,

00:45:47.720 but I know you had it. You were going to sink it in. I'm not interested in dealing with this.

00:45:52.540 And he's like, Oh, cool. Yeah. No problem. Like just drop the ego. It's, it's cool. So I don't

00:45:58.480 know the extent of your injury. Don't make it worse. Okay. So listen to your doctor, like within reason,

00:46:04.180 cause every doctor on earth is going to tell you not to train jujitsu at all. Chiropractors are not

00:46:10.060 actually chiropractors probably like jujitsu players, but, um, job security, right? Keeps

00:46:16.020 them in business. Yeah, exactly. Just, just be smart. Okay. Tape it up, put, put, you know, put a,

00:46:23.020 uh, uh, whatever bandage or a brace around it. Talk to your guys, be careful who you're rolling with.

00:46:29.640 And just, just, you can still go if you can. I don't, again, I don't know the extent of your

00:46:34.000 injury, but I think that'll mitigate a lot of the risk. Yeah. I agree. The only thing I would add

00:46:39.440 is, you know, uh, and I don't even know what the dummies are called, but you know, those dummies

00:46:43.600 that kind of have like the no legs, uh, you know what I'm talking about with the arm. Yeah. The bag,

00:46:49.880 the heavy bag dummies with the arms and the head and the, you know, whatever that you can roll around

00:46:54.280 with, um, roll with that. Learned how to, how to keep your pressure, apply your chest and your head

00:46:59.960 pressure and those types of things, you know, spinning around the dummy, just whatever you

00:47:04.160 can do. There's always things you can do. Um, and ask your instructor, right? That's your,

00:47:09.160 your instructors are going to know plenty of drills and things that you can do to continue to drink,

00:47:14.320 train. Yeah. Yeah. And that's a good point. You know, there's other training, even outside of

00:47:19.020 jujitsu. I mean, look, maybe you got to take a couple of weeks off and you're, you know,

00:47:23.380 you're really going to focus on building up your core and you're going to work your core.

00:47:27.760 You're going to start to build some shoulder strength or you're going to get into, you know,

00:47:31.160 look, here might be a great opportunity for you to get into some stretching routines and exercises

00:47:36.680 or even yoga, which admittedly I don't do myself, but I know my game would improve if I got better at

00:47:42.880 stretching and yoga and the flexibility. You might have an opportunity out of this that will help you

00:47:48.400 come back into the game better than, you know, when you left it, except for the timing and things like

00:47:52.160 that. So there's, there's other things you can do for sure. Yeah. I like it. All right. Christopher

00:47:57.960 Campbell. All of these are super easy, dude. Come on now. Give them a hard one guys.

00:48:07.520 Christopher Campbell. All right. What do we got?

00:48:09.920 I'm 31 and traveling alone to my first workshop slash seminar in two weeks to learn about my trade

00:48:16.420 and hone skills. Can you give some advice on how to network with other men as a business owner in your

00:48:21.600 industry when you're still very new to it? It almost feels like imposter syndromes kicking in

00:48:26.580 because I know I'll be around industry leaders and people have been doing it much longer than me.

00:48:31.760 It was a good question. Okay. That is. I like this question. So I'm reminded of a story that I heard

00:48:36.320 about. I think it's Benjamin Franklin and obviously a very wise person, you know, very intelligent

00:48:42.800 individual. And he had this theory about people that he either disliked or those people who disliked

00:48:50.440 him. And one of the theories that he tried was he asked to borrow something from them. So, so for

00:48:58.300 example, if Sean, you didn't like me for whatever reason, then I would go to you and I would say,

00:49:03.860 Hey, Sean, um, you know, I'm trying to read up on X, Y, and Z, and I know you're into it. And could I,

00:49:09.520 do you have any books that I might be able to borrow for a week or two on the subject?

00:49:13.440 And then you lend me that book and I read it and then I return it back. And that was his theory that

00:49:19.400 if he had people, he didn't like, he would borrow something and then give it back to him. What he

00:49:23.560 found is that that immediately improved the relationship, like instantaneously it made all

00:49:30.220 of that kind of dissipate. And, and so it was very, very interesting concept, but I, I think you can do

00:49:37.100 the same thing here. And it's not like these people don't like you. That's not what I'm saying.

00:49:40.800 But if you go with an open heart and an open mind, and let's say I go to this industry trade show and

00:49:46.400 you're there and I go to you and I say, Hey, you know what? I'm brand new to this industry. I've never

00:49:52.900 been in this before. This is my, in fact, this is my first conference in this industry. And I came by

00:49:59.640 myself because it's important. I don't know anybody here, man. Uh, do you have like a word or two

00:50:06.420 of advice for me? I guarantee without exception that you will be embraced and welcomed with open

00:50:15.520 arms. I guarantee that you, if this is the scenario we're using would say, Oh yeah, you know, here's

00:50:20.440 some great ideas. Oh, and by the way, five of us are going to dinner tonight. If you want to join us

00:50:24.040 for dinner, it's just down the road after the conference is over. I guarantee it, but all it takes

00:50:29.960 is some balls and some humility. You're the reason you're dealing with imposter syndrome

00:50:37.160 is because you want to go there and you want to be impressive to people. Yes. By exerting yourself

00:50:44.300 and telling everybody how great you are and how wonderful and all the, instead, what you ought to

00:50:50.000 do is go there with a humble heart and just tell people, Hey, I'm brand new to this. I'm Ryan. Like,

00:50:56.780 what's your name? How long have you been doing this? Oh, 30 years, man. That's awesome.

00:51:00.920 What would you, what do you wish you would have known when you started? That's going to be more

00:51:04.800 impressive than you walking around like you're King shit and you know everything because everybody's

00:51:09.760 going to see right through it. And also you're trying to fool yourself and you can't. So just be open,

00:51:14.700 be humble, exhibit a little courage to ask those questions and you'll be embraced. I guarantee you will.

00:51:20.640 Yeah. I took on the, the mantra, I guess you could say a long, long time ago of doing two things when

00:51:30.400 I'm in a new environment is always saying, I don't know. And asking questions. And those are the two

00:51:38.060 things, you know, it's basically what you just said. It's, it's too many guys are not, you're going

00:51:42.580 to feel like an imposter if you're faking it. And the guys you're being one, we all know those guys

00:51:48.660 like, and they stand out like a sore thumb. Like, you know, when someone's full of crap,

00:51:53.580 you know, it's automatic, especially if they're trying to talk about something that, you know,

00:51:59.780 at a high level, it's very obvious, you know, but on the other end of that, if you're a high

00:52:05.980 performer in whatever industry it is, you also appreciate the guys that want to be sponges

00:52:13.220 that want to be molded, that want to learn, that want to grow, that want to be better.

00:52:19.340 And that are willing to do whatever they need to do to do that, because it reminds you of how you

00:52:24.920 were. And so you want to work with people like that. And you would think that's everybody.

00:52:29.260 If you're that guy, it's not, there's very few that will come up that will not only have the balls

00:52:36.220 to ask the question, but then they'll receive it well, that they'll, if they're not clear on

00:52:43.160 something, say they're not, you know, ask more questions, start the conversation. And if they're

00:52:48.300 good guys, you know, it makes you want to help them more. And so if you're genuine and you're true to

00:52:55.680 that, it's, that's where you're going to build your network most effectively.

00:53:01.120 And then there's one other thing I would say, and I think you, you alluded to it,

00:53:04.420 you kind of hit on it is, so again, we'll just role play this out a little. I, I go to the

00:53:09.220 conference, Sean, I meet you there. You give me some pointers. Here's a power. Here's how to,

00:53:14.440 to put your results on hyperdrive. Take, so what I'm going to do in this scenario is I'm going to

00:53:20.360 take what you told me and I'm going to implement it. Okay. Like I'm actually going to do it.

00:53:27.120 And then he, like that should go without saying that you actually do it, but here's what most people

00:53:31.880 miss. I'm going to reach back out to you, Sean. And I'm going to say, Hey, Sean, I don't know if

00:53:38.080 you remember me. We went to that conference a couple of months ago and you said to do XYZ as a

00:53:42.080 new guy. And one of the things you told me is to go out and take this course or read this book or

00:53:46.480 whatever. And just want to let you know and follow up. I bought that book or I took that course and I

00:53:52.040 learned these three things that I've been implementing for the company I'm working with. And man, we're

00:53:56.500 knocking out of the park and I have you to thank for that. So thank you very much. Hope all's well.

00:54:02.400 Hope we can catch up next year at the conference. Like that's going to put your results on hyperdrive

00:54:08.820 because everybody is looking to add. Well, here's how I should say the best way to be memorable and

00:54:16.140 to build out a network is to add value to people's lives. But as a newbie, you don't feel like you have

00:54:21.540 anything to add. Okay. So Sean, you're the veteran. I'm the newbie. What could I possibly

00:54:26.080 have to add? You know what I just did right there? I added value to your life because I made you feel

00:54:32.680 important and valued and like you actually had something to share and you made somebody's life

00:54:40.880 better. And I provided that opportunity to you by being humble, by being courageous and having

00:54:47.680 follow through on it. That's a great way to be valuable when you don't think you have any other

00:54:51.940 value to add. Yeah. And it's so easy now, you know, I think of when I started my business 23 years ago,

00:54:59.960 it was like, you know, you had email people, you know, generally wouldn't want to give you their

00:55:05.800 cell phone number or something like that in most cases. And so I would ask for business cards and now

00:55:12.600 you have an email, you have their address of their office or whatever, just a way to contact them,

00:55:18.120 like you said, and I would do exactly what you said, you know, thank you. I appreciate you, whatever

00:55:23.080 it is. Any way you could find value, add value before you get there, you know, it is something

00:55:31.660 that's valuable too. You know, I, as you were talking, I thought of kind of like what you mentioned

00:55:36.740 the beginning, the connection with Justin Ren and you, you know, I gave him the gift of your book

00:55:43.100 sovereignty. And, and, you know, wrote a little note and stuff like that. And he's like, Oh man,

00:55:49.340 you know, I love this guy. I've been talking to Ryan and I want to get on his podcast and I'd like

00:55:53.300 to have him on mine. And, you know, he just, he said that. And so I remembered it, it didn't go

00:55:57.900 further than that in the conversation, you know? And then, so I told him later on, Hey, you know,

00:56:03.160 I'd love to connect you and Ryan, whatever else I think it'd be awesome. You know, just let me know.

00:56:09.940 And he didn't get back to me on it or anything else, but then, you know what it it's then you

00:56:15.300 reached out, right? He's like, yeah, I do whatever. And then you mentioned it. And same thing when I

00:56:20.140 was with him, I mentioned it to you. Like, Hey, Justin said he wants to be on the podcast, right?

00:56:24.480 It's just, so it's just connecting those things, helping you guys connect that just, it's just a normal,

00:56:30.420 natural thing of what I do now, but it came from, you know, 22 years ago, 23 years ago,

00:56:36.300 when I was trying to network and get into better environments with, with guys, I learned to do

00:56:42.260 that. I learned to try and find value, what I could add. And then more than that, finding the guys that

00:56:48.860 maybe could feel things that they needed and making those connections. And back then it was to, it was,

00:56:55.600 if I'm being totally honest, self-serving to put myself in a better position to, to kind of

00:57:01.880 build the relationship with them. Um, not wrong. There's nothing wrong. Not at all. That's why I'm

00:57:07.520 saying it, right. That's why I'm willing to say it, but then it became a natural habit. And now I don't

00:57:13.300 think of it that way. It's just what I do. Right. And it, and it serves everybody. Yeah. Well,

00:57:19.840 there's one other thing I want to share with you and it might, it might sound a little disingenuous

00:57:23.080 because I'm sharing this with you and it's about you, but I want to share it because it

00:57:28.600 will help people who are listening, especially, especially this guy, when he's talking about

00:57:32.040 networking and getting around other people. So yesterday on the podcast, um, when Justin and

00:57:37.440 I talked, I went out of my way to ensure that we talked about you and that you, yeah, bat all bad

00:57:46.600 stuff. And that's it. That's the lesson. Just share all the, everybody else's dirty laundry.

00:57:52.640 No, I went out of my way to, to thank you publicly to say, Hey man, I'm, I'm grateful

00:57:59.800 that Sean connected us here. Here's what I, here's how I know Sean. Here's what I think

00:58:04.040 of Sean. He did that. Okay. I know it sounds a little disingenuous because I'm telling you

00:58:07.740 this and it's about you, but the point that I'm making here is that you need to make sure

00:58:13.220 that you're thanking the people who do these things for you too. Right. Like you're the one

00:58:18.140 that set that up. Like, what if I just got on there and I didn't express, express any gratitude

00:58:23.300 for you? It would have been fine. It would have, I wouldn't care. Yeah. I wouldn't care. Like,

00:58:29.140 I just want that. I just want that connection to happen. Right. And you know that about me.

00:58:33.200 Yeah, totally. So it would have been fine, but what a missed opportunity to make somebody else feel

00:58:39.420 better to uplift and edify somebody else to help somebody else in some small way. And those

00:58:45.780 opportunities exist everywhere. If you're looking for them. Well, and it also serves you in, in a way

00:58:52.200 that people see that. And then it also sets the tone and example for other people, the more,

00:58:57.280 and especially in a men's movement, the more men hear each other, lifting each other up and,

00:59:02.900 and giving credit and, and recognizing, encouraging, praising each other for the things that they're doing,

00:59:09.080 right. The more that that's going to spread. Right. And that serves us way more than talking

00:59:15.440 about that stuff. People aren't doing right. Yeah, definitely. Cool. All right. What else?

00:59:22.200 Okay. Give a hard name, guys. Come on. Steve Gerard. That one is a little, there's a lot of,

00:59:28.720 there's a lot of syllables in there in the Gerard. Okay. So Gerard, right. I think it's a,

00:59:35.740 it's a O U A R D. Okay. So there, Oh, okay. A little different. It kind of threw me a little

00:59:42.060 loop there, right? All right. We'll count it. We'll count it. I recently started reading a book

00:59:48.400 on grit and determination for whatever reason. I didn't connect with the book at the halfway point.

00:59:54.260 Would you battle through finishing the book or cut bait and move on to the next book on my list?

00:59:59.700 And then there's kind of in a parentheses, I chose to finish reading the book.

01:00:06.020 Uh, so this is an ironic question that you're talking about grit and determination about a book

01:00:11.800 about grit and determination. And you're like, I don't want to finish this book. Um, it's funny

01:00:16.460 question. Uh, no, I wouldn't finish the book. It would be my response. Like how many books do you

01:00:22.560 think have ever been written? Billions. Okay. How many, how many, how many books do you feel like

01:00:29.820 you should absolutely read? Like if it were up to me, if I were to take just a random shot in the

01:00:34.180 dark, I would, I don't think it would be any more than a thousand. Okay. But a thousand, still a lot of

01:00:39.860 books. Yeah. Like a hundred's a lot of books. I don't have time to read books that don't resonate

01:00:46.780 with me and they don't have to. And, and so like forcing, forcing myself to read a book is the last

01:00:54.620 thing I'm going to do. Like, I'm just not going to do that. If I pick up a book and it doesn't

01:00:58.020 resonate for whatever reason, I'm closing it. Maybe I gift it. Hey, you know, like here's a,

01:01:02.800 it's a good book. I didn't really resonate with me, but you might be interested in it and you gift it.

01:01:07.320 And then you pick up another book. Cause like, if you hate it and you're just forcing yourself to do it,

01:01:13.060 you're not really going to take anything from that book. And isn't that the point of reading?

01:01:16.780 To get new information that you can apply in your life. So guys, you have my permission as if you

01:01:22.760 needed it to close the book that you don't like, give it to somebody else, give it to the light,

01:01:29.420 give it to the library, donate it to your, your, your thrift store, like do something good with it.

01:01:34.560 And then just find a different book. That's it. Easy. Well, and as an industry standard in writing,

01:01:41.820 you're taught, and I'm sure you've learned this. We're learning this right now, as we just did the

01:01:45.760 final edit of my wife's book that you need your best stuff in the first couple of chapters

01:01:50.980 upfront. Yeah. And most people think they need to close strong or whatever. Right. But when you're

01:01:55.680 writing, it's the opposite, you have to open strong. So if you're not getting the best stuff

01:01:59.440 on the front end, most likely you're not going to get anything good on the backend. Right. And so

01:02:05.420 the amount of people that read an entire book has got to be so small. It's very small. Yeah. Almost

01:02:11.660 nobody finishes any book. Right. Yeah. And these are people who like, even a book you like, there's

01:02:16.920 books I love. And I'm like, God, I got 30 of them on my nightstand and I love all those books. And yet

01:02:20.960 I haven't finished them. So yeah, just, just put the book away, find a different book.

01:02:24.320 Yeah. Yeah. Agree. All right. Sean Bressler initiating the conversation about birds and

01:02:31.640 bees and sex with the daughter, where to start, what to say, is it different than talking about

01:02:36.920 it with the son? I mean, yeah, I think you could be a little more crude, probably a little more

01:02:43.380 direct with a boy and then maybe you would with a daughter. I don't know. I haven't had the birds

01:02:46.980 and the bees talk. I tell you, we, you know, she's, she spent a lot of, a lot of time on the,

01:02:51.220 on the ranch that helps because now we can always relate it back to, Hey, remember that

01:02:55.440 situation? That's what, that's what they're doing or, Oh, those goats are playing. I'm like,

01:03:00.600 they're not playing actually. Here's what they're doing. You know? So yeah. I'm making other goats.

01:03:06.300 That's right. So yeah, I think it's probably going to be different than a boy. It's for me anyways,

01:03:11.960 it was pretty direct and, and, and I don't, I don't actually like the concept of the birds and the

01:03:19.160 bees talk because it makes it sound like one day they hit this magical age where you sit them down

01:03:26.760 and you talk with them for an hour about everything you could possibly think about when it comes to

01:03:31.680 procreation. I don't like that idea. I think instead you're always looking for opportunities to

01:03:39.280 inject some of your thoughts and some of the things they need to learn just on a daily basis. You know,

01:03:44.360 maybe your daughter says something about a boy she likes, and that gives you an opportunity to talk

01:03:50.420 about, you know, what's appropriate about kissing or holding hands or as she gets older, taking it

01:03:56.040 further, you know, so it's not a talk it's, it's little opportunities. And then I think what that

01:04:01.980 does is that when there needs to be a talk about it and there does, you know, like maybe before a

01:04:07.860 first date, what's appropriate, those kinds of things where you need to reiterate some of this

01:04:11.280 stuff, you can draw back on past conversations and experiences that you've had over, you know,

01:04:18.960 14, 15, 16, 18 years. But that said, I don't have a daughter old enough to have that, you know,

01:04:25.580 that talk, but we have had conversations about it. Yeah. I have a little different take because my

01:04:31.140 oldest is my daughter and you know, with three boys younger than her. And we, I shouldn't say we,

01:04:39.380 because my wife came up with the idea, but we have a book that she found that explains it.

01:04:46.460 And it explains like the normal, it gives all the real terms, you know, shows a couple little like

01:04:52.760 cartoony type pictures. So they're mild, but they're also what it is. Right. And so they all,

01:05:01.680 we've done that so far with three of our kids, we do it. We've done it with all of them at eight

01:05:06.520 years old. And at eight, that's, we took them on like a little date, my wife and I, we go to a

01:05:15.360 restaurant, then we go to like a park or something together. We go through the book, we teach them

01:05:19.740 all these things. We have a conversation about it and they, sometimes they're uncomfortable or they

01:05:25.140 gig on parts and whatever else, but you explain what all the parts are, right? This is a penis is

01:05:31.280 the vagina. And also the funny thing is like, when we told my daughter, the word vagina, right? She's

01:05:37.440 like, she starts cracking up. She's like, ah, the vagina from China. Right. And it was like, so it was

01:05:44.940 just like this funny outburst that she had. Right. And we were cracking up. We were just dying. Right.

01:05:52.180 And so it was like, it was funny and all this stuff. And then it was a little uncomfortable

01:05:57.380 in parts, but then it was done. Right. And then down. And then we told her, and then the important

01:06:03.420 part was explaining to her the value of her body and these body parts and what they're used for and

01:06:11.160 how they're used for procreation, how they're used for when you fall in love and you get married with

01:06:15.220 somebody, you're going to, this is how you're going to build babies. Right. And, and show your

01:06:21.600 extra love and appreciation for that special person in your life. And so the conversation,

01:06:26.660 you know, never has to be about what the act itself actually is and more about the value in

01:06:33.440 it. Right. And so then all of the conversations moving forward are about that, about her value

01:06:39.840 as a young woman, right. As she's growing at first as a little girl and then into a young woman and then

01:06:47.160 into womanhood. And now my daughter being 16, you know, moving quickly into 17. Um, she values her

01:06:55.260 body more because we've had so many conversations and discussions about it in that way, instead of

01:07:01.220 it being a surprise or a topic that came up or, you know, any of those things. And so we've been

01:07:05.940 very proactive instead of reactive in that process. What's a, do you know the name of the book?

01:07:12.920 I I'll grab it. If it's in my safe, just, no, just, uh, just put it in the, um, in the, uh,

01:07:23.460 as a response to his question in the Facebook. Okay. Yeah. I'll do that. Do that. Maybe after

01:07:27.900 that. Yeah. Yeah. No, I think that's, and the funny thing is it's in the safe, right? It's in the

01:07:31.260 safe so that they don't have it to like throw around, but that also that we have it and we know

01:07:35.620 where it is for, you know, for our youngest. Yeah. No, that's cool. You know, there's one other

01:07:41.920 thing. I like that, but there's one other thing I was thinking of, and this goes for those of you

01:07:45.600 who don't have kids yet. Uh, maybe you're not seeing, seeing a woman or you're, or you're not

01:07:51.460 married or you're dating somebody is we really need to do a better job societally in ensuring that our

01:07:59.020 children have both a mother and father in the home, because the conversations around these topics

01:08:06.500 are going to be different coming from a father than they would coming from a mother. And neither

01:08:12.620 one is less or more important. They're both needed. You know, my, my wife has talked with our two oldest

01:08:18.940 about some of these topics and it's different than the way I say it. And they need to hear it from both

01:08:24.480 her and me, right? It needs to be, they need both. And, and so if you, if you haven't got married yet,

01:08:34.120 like be very selective in who you're marrying, be very, very selective in who you're deciding to

01:08:39.940 partner with and ensure to the best of your ability. And I know it doesn't always work out

01:08:43.480 that this is going to be somebody that you can be with forever that you can raise children with,

01:08:48.720 and you can walk hand in hand through life. If you're dating somebody don't have kids with them

01:08:54.880 thinking that maybe that's going to get you guys closer together, or this is going to be the next step

01:08:59.940 of your relationship and really figure out if whatever, no, don't have kids. If you aren't in

01:09:06.700 a committed lifelong relationship. And I'll say it that way. Cause I know there's a lot of guys

01:09:11.380 who are like, well, I don't think I should get married. I think you should. But, but for the sake

01:09:14.920 of argument, a lifelong committed relationship and a girlfriend that you've been together with for six

01:09:19.880 months is not a lifelong committed relationship yet. A woman that maybe you've been with for 10 years,

01:09:25.400 and maybe you have some, some qualms about marriage. Okay. That's different. That's not

01:09:29.620 what I'm saying. Okay. What I'm saying is lifelong committed relationship to give the best possible

01:09:36.540 chance of your children having both a mother and father in the home. Yeah. I love it. Totally agree.

01:09:44.720 All right. Let's take a, let's take one or two more. All right. Corey brick. Can spouses reconcile

01:09:52.000 if only one of the people in the relationship is choosing to take extreme ownership of their

01:09:57.060 faults. I've been through several separations with my wife with the most recent separation being the

01:10:02.160 longest over one year. I can say with a clean conscience that I have my own faults. I am

01:10:07.720 consistently striving to improve myself in every facet of my life, knowing that I have a long road

01:10:12.640 ahead of me and that I'll never achieve perfection in this life. My spouse believes that I'm a hundred

01:10:18.700 percent at fault for our problems. And only if she sees sustained change over a long period of time,

01:10:23.960 then, and only then will she be open to say any sort of mutual effort towards reconciliation.

01:10:29.980 I know I can only control myself and at best influence others. What if the other, my wife

01:10:34.940 does not believe in taking extreme ownership in our conflict?

01:10:38.820 Look, the answer is not, it's not the answer you want to hear, but the answer is 100%. Yes. Okay.

01:10:46.040 You can definitely reconcile, but it's contingent on you being her whipping boy for the rest of your

01:10:52.580 life. That's the answer. Yes. You can. She said, you said it in your thing. As long as you take

01:10:59.740 ownership and you do it for a long period of time, then she'll be open to reconciliation. So the answer

01:11:03.620 is yes, you can reconcile. The real question is, do you want to? Should I? Do I want to be with a

01:11:13.500 woman who's unwilling to take ownership of her own problems? Am I willing to change everything about

01:11:19.720 who I am and shoulder 100% of the burden of our problems in our marriage and be expected to solve

01:11:27.280 all the problems without any of her ability or desire to do the same? That's the question. Do you

01:11:32.980 want to be with that kind of woman? I can't, I can't envision wanting to be with that kind of woman

01:11:38.660 for a long, look, I get that you might be in love. I get that there's attachment. I get that

01:11:42.720 there's memories and there's, there's a lot going on, but if you strip all that away, like, you know,

01:11:48.700 you don't want to be with a woman like that. No man wants to be a woman like that. So the answer

01:11:54.540 to your question is yes, but that's probably not the best question to be asking. The best question

01:11:59.940 to be asking is, should I even be involved with a woman who's not willing to take ownership? Cause let's,

01:12:05.080 let's say this, let's, let's, let's go through this scenario. So you said it yourself. You've

01:12:08.160 been through a couple of separations. This one being the longest, let's say you reconcile

01:12:12.260 because you're her whipping boy and you do all the things that the, like a good little puppy that

01:12:16.380 she tells you to do. And then she comes back. And then what's going to happen in four years

01:12:21.600 when you make a mistake, because you're a human, is she going to be upset? Is she going to,

01:12:26.720 and she's not changing anything about who she is. And she, you're not expecting her to,

01:12:30.180 you're going to be walking around on eggshells. This Corey is a recipe for disaster.

01:12:35.660 It's a, it's a, it might not happen today, but it's going to happen. It's a recipe for disaster.

01:12:41.400 And now you're going to waste another five years of your life chasing around this woman

01:12:44.320 who isn't willing to take care of herself. That's my thought.

01:12:48.440 My thought is you say that, Ryan, I have no personal experience with this, but, but you do,

01:12:52.400 right. You went through a separation with Trish and with you. And my question would be with you and

01:12:56.940 Trish, as you're saying this, it almost seems like he has a list from her and she's not willing to

01:13:03.320 accept the list, right. From him. And I don't know if they've done something like that or not,

01:13:07.980 or if there's things that are like the majors, but how'd that work with you and Trish? Did you

01:13:11.840 have like a, was she like, you know what, I'd like to see improvement in this and this and this. And

01:13:16.440 you, did she have things that you expected for her to do? Cause I, I've only really heard you say

01:13:22.100 that you worked on you and you getting better. So what was like the expectation was, did you guys

01:13:27.900 have that conversation of like, I'd like you to do this and you to do this. And was there a mutual

01:13:31.800 thing there? Like, I think that would be important context to bring.

01:13:35.100 Yeah. No, I'm glad you brought that up. I, when you said you've only heard me say that

01:13:38.340 that's probably pretty true is because that's what I can focus on. Right. I can only focus on

01:13:42.700 improving myself. Mostly majority. It's not the only thing, but that's the large majority of what

01:13:47.180 you go to. Right. Well, you can influence other people, but you can't directly change other

01:13:51.940 people's behavior. Right. So you can influence by asking or by changing your own behavior and hoping

01:13:57.340 that rubs off. There's a lot of things you can do to influence somebody else. Um, one of the things

01:14:02.580 that we did, and this was very helpful is that she had to agree with me that we would both go to

01:14:07.980 therapy. We would, we would both go see a therapist individually. And that way, because

01:14:13.380 there's things that I wanted to tell that she may not have been open and receptive to hearing,

01:14:17.700 especially in the contention that we had in our relationship, but coming from a third party.

01:14:22.940 Did you do together and separately? Yeah. I'll get to that in a second. So I went by myself to talk

01:14:30.040 with a third party. Who's not emotionally vested in the decisions or in the relationship. And then my wife

01:14:35.640 also went and did that. And then we also did that together. And then there was some real heated

01:14:41.620 exchanges in the conversations and having that third party there. Right. Of course. Yeah. Of

01:14:48.340 course. But having that third party there to say, Hey, that's what you're doing is, is this,

01:14:54.380 and that's not going to work. It's not going to help you. And she said that to me. And she said that to

01:14:58.760 my wife in moments and through learning some of these ways to communicate more effectively,

01:15:04.340 you were, we were able to reconcile, but yeah, if my wife was on the podcast with you right here,

01:15:08.720 she would say the same thing. She would say, Oh yeah. I, yeah. He had definitely had things to

01:15:12.960 work on and he was doing that. And I had things to work on and I was doing that. So both of us were

01:15:17.840 not initially, I will say that not, she was out, she was done. But over time, we both began to work

01:15:25.600 on and improve ourselves. It just wouldn't have worked any other way. There's no way it would have

01:15:30.560 worked. Yeah. I think that that's valuable though, to bring in that third party. And so many people

01:15:35.760 are not willing to do that until it's too late. Right. The, the, the, the only thing I would add

01:15:42.980 to that, and this is for all the other guys who aren't going through separation or any of that is

01:15:47.960 that if things start, if there's little things that start, you know, maybe you even consider doing

01:15:53.480 the therapy now, you know, before it gets real bad, you know, and, or if you're, if you're saying,

01:16:00.600 man, I don't like this and I don't like this, this is getting worse. You do it before it comes a major

01:16:05.340 problem too. And I don't think enough couples do that for the willingness of that. I think when we

01:16:12.420 say the word therapy, we think, especially as men, it's because we're broken or that we're it's messed

01:16:18.780 up or, you know, whatever else, but some, in my opinion, the best therapy is utilized before it's

01:16:26.600 broken. Right. It's, is that you get, well, it's like going to a gym, you know, no, nobody says I'm

01:16:33.360 going to go to the gym because, you know, my body's broken. Like they go to the gym to improve

01:16:38.540 themselves. You know, they might be fat. Things might be banged up a little bit, but it's not,

01:16:42.860 that's not over, you know, but you go to the gym because that's how you take care of yourself.

01:16:48.860 You know, and you don't just go once and you're like, okay, got it. Like my health check. No,

01:16:54.520 like it's a lifelong thing and you slip and you fall and you get better and you're up and down,

01:16:58.880 at least if you're like me, but your emotional and mental health is very much the same way.

01:17:02.780 There is, there is definitely a stigma around it specifically for men, not exclusively, but

01:17:08.120 specifically for men. But that, that, that would be like having a stigma attached to going to the

01:17:13.660 gym. Oh, what? You think you need to get strong? You think you need to be healthy?

01:17:17.700 You would have loser. Like nobody would say that, you know, but we have this feeling about that when

01:17:23.740 it comes to, you know, our mental and emotional health, even our spiritual health, you know,

01:17:28.200 there's, there's something to be said for that as well. You see dwindling numbers in, in, in church

01:17:32.940 membership for, for men. And I think a lot of that is because churches have been overly feminized.

01:17:40.020 And so guys, you know, don't, don't want to partake, obviously that's a whole other conversation,

01:17:44.460 but yeah, we need to take care of the entire picture of health, not just your physical. Like

01:17:49.220 we all know you got to be strong and healthy. Like nobody would debate that physical, mental,

01:17:55.460 emotional, emotional, and spiritual, all crucial. Yeah. And it's a, it can be preventative medicine,

01:18:01.140 right? So like, you're not going to not take the, the, you know, joint warfare when you have the

01:18:07.660 achy joints, right? Like you're going to decide not to take it because you haven't blown apart your

01:18:13.480 elbow or knee yet. Right. Or whatever. It's just, it doesn't make sense. It's a supplement.

01:18:18.100 I think therapy is a supplement to a good, what a good relationship even, right? It's,

01:18:25.540 you don't have to blow apart the relationship before you get it. Well, again, it goes back to

01:18:30.260 physical health. I know you're, you're, you're, you're very healthy physically. Does that mean

01:18:34.440 that you don't have to take care of yourself anymore? Cause you're like, good. I get, yeah,

01:18:37.540 I got, I checked off. I'm good. No, you have to keep doing it and you can do it in different ways.

01:18:42.260 You know, there's, there's different ways. So like, like therapy, for example, one, one way is to

01:18:47.900 see a therapist. Another way is to have a really good circle of friends of high caliber men in your

01:18:54.500 corner who you can talk with and compete with and, you know, joke with. And like, there's,

01:19:00.880 there's different levels and layers to it. So you can, you can build all of this out for an entire

01:19:04.980 health plan, if you will. And you should be utilizing all the tools at your disposal.

01:19:09.620 It doesn't make you weak to learn how to use a tool to get yourself stronger. Like, in fact,

01:19:14.660 I think you'll be weaker if you don't utilize all the tools at your disposal to make yourself

01:19:19.340 stronger, you'll be weaker than you could otherwise be. And that's not manly.

01:19:23.620 Yeah. I like it. Okay. All right, man. It's a good last one.

01:19:28.120 Yeah. Uh, yeah. Let's wrap that. Did you say last one or is that a good last one?

01:19:32.340 No. Do you want it? There's the next one looks like a good last one.

01:19:35.580 Oh yeah. Good. Yep. Go for it.

01:19:37.520 Okay. And it's because the Valentine's question today happens to be Valentine's as we're recording this.

01:19:43.060 Okay. That's why you have the red on. I was wondering,

01:19:46.460 you know, Valentine doubt today. I didn't even notice.

01:19:55.800 Hey, this is a man. Most men listen to this, man. Make sure you take care of your

01:19:59.580 Valentine's day, which was yesterday when this comes out. Right. That's right. Yeah. No,

01:20:04.760 or a couple of days ago, a couple of days ago. Yeah. Okay. How much importance this is from James

01:20:09.840 Leigh? How much importance do you put on Valentine's day and other Hallmark created

01:20:14.820 holidays and what is appropriate? So you're, you're asking the wrong guy on this one because

01:20:21.960 my wife is an anomaly on this. And, and I'm not, I know everybody says that, Oh, my wife doesn't like

01:20:28.780 down. I know everybody says that I'm telling you like, genuinely, my wife is like, I don't do

01:20:34.920 Valentine's. She's just not interested. In fact, last night I'm like, Hey, so you want to go out

01:20:39.520 tomorrow night? She's like, no, why? I'm like, well, it's like Valentine's day. She's like, nah,

01:20:43.260 I don't want to go. It's like too busy. Like we won't even be able to sit down. I want to go do that.

01:20:47.140 Like my wife is an anomaly, but you know, what I would say is just read, read the room. All right.

01:20:54.940 Read the room. If she's into it, be into it. You know, if, if, if it's a, if it's a simple gesture,

01:21:01.720 if it's something that she likes a little bit more extravagant, just read the room and cater it

01:21:06.600 towards, you know, the person you love. And that's, I think that's the best thing you can do. So like,

01:21:11.140 I don't buy into fake holidays. Valentine's a fake holiday. I don't care who you ask or, or what they

01:21:15.840 say. Like we all know Valentine's is a fake holiday. I don't like it. My wife doesn't like it.

01:21:21.000 It works out pretty well, but I also try to do my best to take care of her throughout the year as

01:21:25.400 well. Yeah. It's a, mine's a little different because I'm not married to an anomaly and yes,

01:21:32.900 not that she loves Valentine's day, but I, we have our wedding anniversary and Valentine's day a week

01:21:41.700 apart. Right. So the seventh every year is our anniversary and then Valentine's on the 14th. And so

01:21:48.140 all my wife, she doesn't care as much about the holiday as much as the effort. And so what we do

01:21:56.420 every year is we say, okay, what are you doing this year? Are you doing anniversary? You're doing

01:22:01.040 Valentine's day and we split it. And one of us puts in the effort for the anniversary. One of us puts

01:22:06.520 in the effort for Valentine's day. Right. And so this year, as an example, our anniversary got messed up

01:22:14.080 because last minute we had to fly to Tennessee, look at our house, do all that stuff. And that

01:22:17.940 landed on our anniversary day. Right. So we were on a plane for our anniversary and all my plans I

01:22:24.260 wanted to do got screwed up. Okay. But I was taking that one and I'll tell you, I was going to have,

01:22:30.080 like, I literally go to a marching band that was practicing locally. And I was going to have them do

01:22:35.700 a whole marching band. Like it gave them practice. They can put on their uniforms, like happy 20th

01:22:40.980 anniversary balloons, like all this stuff. Right. And it was like, next to nothing,

01:22:45.120 you make a small donation to them. Right. And it, but that effort and my, my, I don't even know

01:22:49.780 she would like that, but I know she'd appreciate the effort. Does that make sense? And, and then

01:22:53.980 going to where we proposed and they were closed on Valentine's day or on our anniversary day. Cause

01:22:59.640 it was a Monday. So I couldn't do that. And I was, you know, trying to figure it out. It got messed up

01:23:04.200 anyways. Right. So I couldn't do any of that. So now it's Valentine's day and I'm going to take

01:23:09.660 her to that, where we proposed because they're open Valentine's day. Right. And so I'm going to

01:23:14.280 do that. I'm putting together a thing. I I've spent hours going into our storage and finding old

01:23:18.900 pictures and doing that stuff. You know, like when we met, when we first started dating, where we,

01:23:24.580 you know, when we lived with her mom and slept on this little bed with no bed frame and this tiny room

01:23:30.920 and, and, you know, like when we were broke and struggling and those pictures and, you know,

01:23:36.080 the day that I proposed to her and I found all these pictures and I'm going to put it in a little

01:23:39.880 book and, you know, remember this and when we did this and I'm stringing all together. Right. And so

01:23:45.440 like, that is not important to me. Right. And, and, and it's actually kind of fun to go through it,

01:23:52.180 but I know that that effort is like, that's her love language, right? It's, it's not the finished

01:24:00.300 product as much as she knows that it took time and effort and those things. And whether she loves it

01:24:06.960 or not, she loves the effort. So it's not about the day it's about my wife. Right. So what I care

01:24:14.780 about is not that it's Valentine's day. I care about her. And because I care about her, I'm, I'm willing,

01:24:22.280 not even, not, I don't even like using the word willing. I, I want to put in the effort because

01:24:29.120 that's, what's going to make our relationship better and stronger. So there you go. It's

01:24:35.540 somewhere between what Sean does and what I do is the answer. One end of the spectrum. I'm just

01:24:42.060 wondering if I can be your Valentine with all that you do to go out of the way here. So it's go all

01:24:47.000 out, get a marching band, do the scrapbooking. And we don't, but that's our 20th. Right. I mean,

01:24:51.820 it's not like I do that with everything, you know, but she, I'll be honest, like it, it just buying,

01:24:58.700 like a flower and a card. If that's all I did, I think she'd be disappointed. Does that make sense?

01:25:03.980 And it doesn't have to be that much extra, but something that's beyond like it, that's going

01:25:09.040 to take me five minutes. If she knew it took me an hour or two just to put it together,

01:25:13.700 that means more to her. Right. That's it. Totally. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's reading the room.

01:25:20.260 It's exactly what you said. That's what it is. Reading the room. Yep. All right, guys. Great

01:25:24.660 questions today, Sean. Thanks for visiting and helping out with this. Um, I want to close this

01:25:28.980 out because we've got something, uh, coming up and it's open and available right now. Uh, we're

01:25:34.760 doing a big, big giveaway for iTunes ratings and reviews for the podcast. So all you need to do is

01:25:42.000 leave an iTunes rating and review, take a screenshot of that, and then email brandy

01:25:48.040 at order of man.com. So again, iTunes rating and review screenshot, email that to brandy

01:25:55.820 at order of man.com. Then on the 28th of February, uh, we are going to draw one winner

01:26:02.900 and they're going to receive a signed hardback cover of sovereignty. They're going to receive

01:26:09.980 a brand new pair of origin boots and origin heavy hoodie. They're also going to receive Montana

01:26:17.560 knife companies, brand new, uh, magna cut stainless steel speed goat knife. It's incredible. Got

01:26:25.600 it right over there on the desk and they're going to win. In addition to that, uh, a pair

01:26:31.660 of 50 pounds center mass bells from Sorenex. Wow. So you're getting the book, the boots, the

01:26:38.380 hoodie, the knife, and their center mass bells. And, uh, one lucky person will win all of

01:26:44.220 that. So again, rating review, iTunes rating review, screenshot it brandy at order of man.com.

01:26:50.840 You're entered. We'll draw that winner on the 28th. So we've got. I love it. Thanks for having

01:26:55.700 you guys. Sean. Thanks a lot, man. Appreciate you guys. We will be back on Friday until then

01:27:02.300 go out there, take action and become the man you are meant to be. Thank you for listening

01:27:06.200 to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the

01:27:10.820 man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

Order of Man - February 16, 2022

Dealing with a Culture of Mediocrity, Avoiding Job Burnout, and How to Approach Life in a New Industry ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING

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