Order of Man - August 10, 2022


Developing Emotional Intelligence, Rebuilding Intimacy, and Serving People Effectively ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING


Episode Stats

Length

1 hour and 2 minutes

Words per Minute

174.5485

Word Count

10,860

Sentence Count

803

Misogynist Sentences

10

Hate Speech Sentences

6


Summary

In this episode of the Orderman Podcast, the guys are back from their summer break and ready to answer some of your questions! This week's questions include: How much more should a family strive to earn per year? What is the worst thing a family can complain about in regards to inflation and cost of living?


Transcript

00:00:00.000 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path.
00:00:06.020 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time.
00:00:10.460 You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong.
00:00:15.500 This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become.
00:00:19.720 At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.
00:00:24.960 Kemp, what's up man? It's good to see you. I've been on a bit of a hiatus over the past couple of weeks,
00:00:29.720 so I didn't do the AMA. I think it was last week.
00:00:32.460 I actually haven't been on social media actually either, so it's been kind of refreshing and nice, frankly.
00:00:41.060 I'm in a much better mood when I'm always on social media.
00:00:48.760 I'll casually start bringing that back in within reason. It's good to be back though.
00:00:54.020 Good, man. Good. Well, glad to have you back.
00:00:57.040 It's always fun to do a recording with Sean, but he's not you, Ryan.
00:01:03.280 He's no Ryan Mickler, but he's a very close – I was going to say second, but then that would put you behind him.
00:01:09.980 So we'll say a very close third.
00:01:11.340 It's okay. It was already assumed that he was two, so I've accepted it.
00:01:20.120 Yeah.
00:01:20.400 Well, you guys always do a great job and you serve the guys well, so I appreciate you stepping up in my absence.
00:01:27.040 So let's get into some questions today.
00:01:28.720 Yeah, sounds good.
00:01:29.460 So we're going to fill questions really from two locations, from the Iron Council.
00:01:34.720 To learn more about the Iron Council, go to orderman.com slash Iron Council.
00:01:38.200 It's closed.
00:01:40.200 However, we're going to open that up next quarter, and so kind of stay tuned and we'll let you know when we open.
00:01:44.720 It's not even next quarter.
00:01:46.720 Just to give you the heads up on it, it will be –
00:01:49.080 Yeah.
00:01:49.220 Let me just do the math here in my head.
00:01:52.160 It will be September 15th-ish, so a little more than a month.
00:01:59.140 You've got about five weeks and we're going to open it back up.
00:02:01.320 So definitely go to orderman.com slash Iron Council and sign up to be notified when we open up because we're open for a very short window.
00:02:10.020 And of course, that doesn't bind you into signing up for the Iron Council.
00:02:13.740 It just gives you the opportunity when we go live in about five weeks.
00:02:16.800 Yeah, so you're notified appropriately is what you're saying.
00:02:20.300 That's right.
00:02:21.060 Got it.
00:02:21.640 And then we'll also be filled to some questions from Facebook.
00:02:25.500 To join us on that Facebook group, go to facebook.com slash group slash orderman.
00:02:30.460 All right.
00:02:31.120 Yeah, let's hop into it.
00:02:32.400 So Drew, what's up, guys?
00:02:34.980 How much more than the cost of living per year should a family strive to earn?
00:02:40.460 I'm working to build my business to both take care of my family needs today.
00:02:44.260 I'm working to build out my vision for the short and long-term future.
00:02:48.720 Yeah, it's a good question.
00:02:50.320 It's an interesting question.
00:02:51.640 You know, I do appreciate the fact that he's thinking about cost of living because I've seen a lot of people out there who assume that just because they make good money now,
00:03:00.300 that in the next five or 10 or 20 or 30 years, that if they just keep their current income, that they'll be fine and you won't because of the eroding power of inflation.
00:03:13.520 It's very hard to see.
00:03:15.620 It's almost as an invisible tax.
00:03:18.240 It's very, very hard to see and quantify.
00:03:21.300 But if you look at the math, and it's a little hazy because I haven't talked about it for a long time, but if you have just a 3% inflation rate, and we're going to talk about that in a minute.
00:03:29.780 So we'll swing back on that one.
00:03:32.400 But if you had just a 3% inflation rate over, I believe, 20 or 30 years, it erodes your spending power by half, which means that if you're making, for easy math, $200,000 per year today at a 3% inflation rate over, and I can't remember if it's 20 or 30 years,
00:03:48.320 then that $200,000 is going to spend like $100,000, which means that if the milk is now $8 instead of $4, you can see how much of a problem that's going to be if your income just stays the same.
00:04:07.100 Now, to go back to what I was saying with inflation and cost of living, we hear all sorts of numbers.
00:04:12.700 We've heard that it's as high now as it's been in the last 40 years, which statistically is accurate.
00:04:17.400 The interesting thing about the way the government calculates inflation and cost of living is they take out some of your everyday expenses that you would need, like food, like fuel for your vehicle.
00:04:30.300 And what is impacted most currently by inflation?
00:04:34.640 Well, food costs and fuel costs.
00:04:38.500 So the government plays with that data.
00:04:41.140 So even though it's high right now, it's actually higher than what is being reported.
00:04:47.360 Now, when you say, what should we make above and beyond inflation?
00:04:52.360 I don't know.
00:04:53.320 I don't know that there's a hard and fast rule, but I think there are things that you can control.
00:04:57.860 Number one is you can control your spending.
00:05:00.460 So being very careful about how you spend, when you spend.
00:05:04.140 I know a lot of people who, when the going's good, they just spend, spend, spend, spend, and spend everything.
00:05:09.500 And then when it's tough, they sell off everything they just bought over the past two to five years.
00:05:13.840 It's not a great way to live because of the depreciating nature of cars and trailers and boats and all this other stuff that people buy.
00:05:22.020 But if you can manage your spending and then also be smart when it comes to purchases.
00:05:29.360 So one thing that I've seen a lot of people do is they'll go in and they want to buy a new house and they'll go in and they'll talk with a mortgage lender.
00:05:36.880 And then that mortgage lender is going to give them about what they can qualify, right?
00:05:42.060 People go in and pre-qualify.
00:05:44.340 Well, they want to sell homes.
00:05:47.620 Real estate agents want to sell homes.
00:05:49.220 Lenders want to lend money so they can collect interest.
00:05:51.740 So they're going to make sure that you're on the red line of what is possible.
00:05:56.440 Not over because then that puts them at risk, but not under.
00:05:59.500 They want you to buy the biggest home possible.
00:06:01.680 And so I see people's income to debt ratio, specifically as it relates to their mortgage, be as high as like 40 and 50%.
00:06:10.700 So if you're making 10 grand a month and you're paying five grand in mortgage payments, that's ridiculous.
00:06:19.360 I would suggest that you pay no more than about 15%.
00:06:23.540 And lenders and real estate agents are scoffing at me right now.
00:06:27.580 That's because they have a conflict of interest.
00:06:30.000 But you should not be spending more than 15% of your monthly income on your mortgage payment.
00:06:36.740 It's just a ridiculous, ridiculous thing.
00:06:38.780 Another way to look at that is two times your annual income.
00:06:42.540 So if your income is a couple hundred thousand a year, $400,000, $450,000 home would be pretty appropriate and keep you at the right amount.
00:06:53.440 So again, depending on interest rates, which are now increasing, it's just we are in a very, very difficult financial time right now.
00:07:02.260 And we're just not experiencing the full ramification or weight of what we will over the coming months.
00:07:07.720 So let's be very smart.
00:07:09.480 The only other thing I would say to that, Kip, and I'd love to hear what you have to add, is you want to make sure that you're putting away anywhere from 15% to 20% of your income.
00:07:18.140 That you're investing it, that it's being put aside, that you're saving, that you're doing all the right things and all the smart things with it.
00:07:26.000 And then that will help you realize how much above cost of living and that sort of thing that you need to plan for.
00:07:32.900 So there's no hard and fast rule, but there are some hard and fast rules that I live by that indirectly answer your question.
00:07:40.440 Regarding inflation, are there particular investments or recommendations that you'd have, Ryan, that are inflation proof?
00:07:48.940 Well, nothing's inflation proof because we don't really know how an investment is going to perform.
00:07:56.920 If we did, then the interest rate would be significantly lower than it could potentially be.
00:08:01.700 So let me give you an example.
00:08:03.460 If you were to get a new bank account, a checking account, you're going to get, if any interest at all, you're going to get 0.001 interest.
00:08:11.980 On a savings account, you might get half a percent, maybe, if you're lucky.
00:08:17.940 On a CD, you might start getting into 2% to 3%.
00:08:20.980 Bonds might be 4% to 5%.
00:08:23.180 But if you look at what the market has done historically, typically that's going to outpace inflation.
00:08:28.900 And the reason that it's going to outpace inflation, I'm talking about the stock market in particular,
00:08:33.780 is because those are the businesses and organizations that are creating new products, new goods, new services,
00:08:43.380 trying to figure out a more efficient, effective way of doing things.
00:08:46.580 So it drives down the cost and you get to participate in the market that you actually aren't a partner with in those businesses.
00:08:55.820 So I do like the stock market, but you have to do it smart.
00:08:59.560 So many people play the market and they think they can beat inflation or beat the going rate.
00:09:05.500 But my philosophy in the market is you put your money into vehicles, you dollar cost average.
00:09:10.860 I'm not going to get into all of that right now, but let's just suffice it to say today that you put money in on a monthly or a frequent basis.
00:09:19.840 And that's going to drive over time the cost of your purchases for those stocks lower.
00:09:24.840 That's called dollar cost averaging.
00:09:26.160 And so the market is a great way to do that.
00:09:30.100 And when I say market, real estate market, stock market, there's probably other markets, whether it's exotic vehicles, paint and artwork.
00:09:41.760 Those types of things are going to typically beat inflation.
00:09:46.340 Commodities, gold, silver, that sort of thing are going to typically hedge against inflation.
00:09:50.980 But there's no guarantees.
00:09:52.220 If there's a guarantee, then your interest rates, your potential interest rate declines and you may not keep up with inflation.
00:09:58.820 Yeah, got it.
00:10:01.440 Tony Erzy.
00:10:02.860 Also, one other thing, Kip on that.
00:10:04.500 Sorry.
00:10:05.500 When it comes to keeping up with inflation, also your own business.
00:10:11.900 So people say, hey, Ryan, if you had $50,000 or $100,000, what would you do with it?
00:10:16.840 I'd invest it in my business because I'm in control of my business.
00:10:21.400 And I know what my business can do.
00:10:23.460 And that might help me unlock or take the throttle off my business to really go that much further.
00:10:29.820 Yeah.
00:10:29.980 Increase cash flow or whatever else.
00:10:32.460 I might dump $100,000 into marketing and make $500,000, $600,000 on that $100,000.
00:10:39.700 That's a pretty good rate of return.
00:10:41.840 And that would turn around quick too.
00:10:43.040 As a business owner, I'm curious if you ran into this through the years as well.
00:10:50.800 I always had a hard time with investments and savings and things like this because whenever
00:10:58.660 I'd have a conversation with the wife about investing in something, I would always default
00:11:05.340 to like, or we can just increase our cash flow, right?
00:11:09.800 Because as a business owner, you're just like all these different ways to increase cash flow.
00:11:14.080 So like I was always fixated on cash flow constantly.
00:11:18.480 I'm like, well, we could buy that and we have the slower return or I can increase cash flow.
00:11:23.920 And it's almost to the extent that I would almost be blinded.
00:11:27.380 And that was just the answer to everything.
00:11:29.640 Now, it obviously worked out to some extent.
00:11:32.900 And so it's not necessarily a bad thing, but did you ever run into that constantly where
00:11:37.520 you're just like, cash flow is king.
00:11:39.500 Who cares about all this other stuff?
00:11:40.980 Uh, yeah, I, I do, but I also see the value of diversifying my, my portfolio.
00:11:47.780 And I realized that there might be things that would drive my business into the ground that
00:11:53.660 I'm not aware of.
00:11:54.680 And if that's the case, then that faucet turns off cash flow.
00:11:58.640 Yeah.
00:11:58.840 Right.
00:11:59.380 So I, I hear what you're saying and I do that.
00:12:02.820 And I also invest in other things.
00:12:05.300 Yeah.
00:12:06.180 Yeah.
00:12:07.340 All right.
00:12:07.920 Tony Erzy, how would each of you define emotional intelligence and how can we increase it?
00:12:13.920 Thanks for all you guys do.
00:12:15.780 You want to lead off on that one, Kip?
00:12:18.640 Sure.
00:12:19.020 Um, so the way I would define emotional intelligence is really in owning and being aware of where
00:12:29.560 your emotions are coming from and the, and the story behind them.
00:12:35.840 I, I, I find that emotional intelligence.
00:12:38.260 I think it's okay to be emotional.
00:12:41.200 I, I, I think it's, um, it can serve you.
00:12:44.480 It's, it's good to be present to those things.
00:12:46.660 But when I think about emotional intelligence is once again, and I'm just kind of repeating
00:12:50.580 myself here is if I'm mad, if I'm happy, if I'm frustrated, if I'm jealous, where's
00:12:57.800 that coming from?
00:12:59.540 And then being able to put the pause button and having the evaluation of, does this serve
00:13:05.800 me in understanding where those emotions are coming from?
00:13:09.160 So I can act appropriately agnostic of the emotion.
00:13:14.440 Yeah.
00:13:14.980 I, I would, I would tend to agree with, with just about all of that.
00:13:18.700 I think that's accurate.
00:13:19.940 Uh, if I, if I were to sum it up, it's, it's very similar.
00:13:22.500 It's, it's not suppression of emotion.
00:13:24.480 It's not hiding from emotion or not experiencing emotion, but really striving to understand where
00:13:30.760 that emotion is coming from and what it's trying to teach you.
00:13:34.320 I don't, I don't really think there's any negative emotion.
00:13:38.600 I don't think anger is a negative emotion.
00:13:41.160 Now, I think the way that we might express anger can be negative, but the emotion in and
00:13:46.300 of itself is amoral.
00:13:48.280 Actually, it's not even amoral.
00:13:49.440 I think it's actually helpful.
00:13:50.780 We as human beings, whether you believe we're created or have evolved to where we are, would
00:13:54.740 not be experiencing this broad array of emotions.
00:13:57.240 If they weren't somehow here to serve us and help in some, in some way.
00:14:02.380 So when you're angry, instead of not wanting to be angry, maybe we ought to do a better job
00:14:08.880 of figuring out why it is we're angry and then addressing the root cause of the issue.
00:14:12.940 If we're sad, if we're mad, if we're glad, if we're happy, figure out why that's the case
00:14:17.580 and then either strive to address it or eliminate it.
00:14:20.940 Or if you're happy and glad and joyful and fulfilled and, and, and proud, then figure out
00:14:26.960 what's causing you to experience those emotions and work more towards that.
00:14:31.020 And that, that to me is emotional intelligence.
00:14:33.800 Now, Tony's second part of the question is how do you develop more of it?
00:14:37.540 Well, you, you act on it and you listen to it and you give yourself time to experience
00:14:41.280 it.
00:14:42.760 So how many of us spend time during the day thinking about how we feel as men?
00:14:49.600 It almost, you almost cringe when you say that, but really think about how am I feeling
00:14:54.380 right now?
00:14:54.820 Well, today for me personally, I'm feeling hopeful, hopeful.
00:14:58.780 I'm feeling optimistic.
00:15:00.640 I'm feeling actually pretty proud with what I've been able to accomplish.
00:15:03.740 Even this morning, I've got some projects done around the house and spend some time with
00:15:07.520 the kids and I feel pretty dang good.
00:15:10.240 And I don't just leave it there.
00:15:12.900 Now I'm thinking, well, why is that the case?
00:15:15.200 Why do I feel good?
00:15:16.180 Well, I went and ran errands with my, two of my boys today, this morning and had a good
00:15:21.340 conversation with my wife and I was pretty productive with business meetings and I know
00:15:27.320 what I'm going to do the rest of the day and my days all mapped out.
00:15:29.800 So I'm feeling really good right now.
00:15:33.120 And therefore that's the work I need to continue to do.
00:15:36.320 So I'm going to, I'm going to do that again this afternoon and do it tomorrow.
00:15:38.980 And that's emotional intelligence, but it just takes you carving out some time periodically
00:15:43.880 throughout the day to think about how you're feeling in any given moment.
00:15:46.540 And then asking yourself, how did you get to that point?
00:15:49.520 And then striving to create more of it in your life.
00:15:53.720 There are two principles.
00:15:55.860 When I think about Tony's second question, how do we increase it?
00:15:58.920 There's two things that I've latched onto in my past and I continue to kind of come back
00:16:03.680 to them.
00:16:04.180 And I realized that a little bit of a play on words, but they resonate with me and kind
00:16:09.040 of get me in the right mindset.
00:16:10.100 The first one is that we look at life through goggles and it's like when you go snowboarding,
00:16:17.960 you used to snowboard back in the day.
00:16:19.520 I'm not sure if you snowboard anymore, but you know how you'd put those, the orange goggles
00:16:23.860 on, you'd be riding all day.
00:16:25.260 And then all of a sudden you lift them up and you're like, oh my gosh, it's right.
00:16:28.240 You forgot what reality looked like.
00:16:30.740 You, you evolved to the goggles that you had on.
00:16:33.000 And so the reminder that we all look at the world through a different colored lens and
00:16:39.860 that there's a difference between perception and reality, that's concept number one, that
00:16:44.020 really resonates well with me.
00:16:45.520 The second one, which is maybe a little bit more controversial is that there's no right
00:16:51.420 and wrong.
00:16:52.880 Those are judgments.
00:16:55.460 And I, and I, that really helps me because typically when I'm emotionally driven and I'm
00:17:00.620 maybe reacting at a negative way, it's because I believe that something is wrong, that should
00:17:06.560 be a particular way versus dealing in reality of, well, it's not right or wrong.
00:17:11.620 It's just what's so.
00:17:13.060 And that concept and the idea that we constantly judge all things as what shouldn't be, or it
00:17:19.320 should be this way all the time blocks us from having more intellectual and critical
00:17:26.580 thinking and looking beyond the judgment and saying, well, but why is it that way?
00:17:33.580 What's the more detailed scenario of why it's that way versus just stopping of like, it shouldn't
00:17:37.920 be this way.
00:17:38.560 And now I'm just emotional about it.
00:17:40.980 And so just holding on to perception of reality, not always aligned.
00:17:45.840 And then second, that it's the human nature of us to always label everything as right and
00:17:51.120 wrong.
00:17:51.500 And sometimes it's more powerful to realize that it's not right or wrong, it's just what
00:17:56.400 is so, and then have some critical thinking around the current circumstance, regardless
00:18:03.820 of my expectations of it.
00:18:06.380 Yeah.
00:18:06.960 I mean, you're much better at that than I am because I do place those expectations, but
00:18:11.980 I do also try to, when I am angry, I say, for example, well, I shouldn't be feeling angry,
00:18:18.740 but that is actually true.
00:18:20.400 I shouldn't be angry.
00:18:22.020 So why am I?
00:18:23.280 So I don't stop it there and put a period at the end.
00:18:25.180 Well, I just shouldn't.
00:18:26.000 And then I force myself not to.
00:18:27.500 Yeah.
00:18:27.880 I'm like, no, I don't think people should be perpetually angry.
00:18:31.380 If you're angry all the time, something's wrong.
00:18:34.040 So what's wrong, you know, which drives to the point that you're making.
00:18:37.960 So I think we're very much in agreement with that.
00:18:40.560 Yeah.
00:18:41.540 All right.
00:18:42.120 Hopefully that helps Tony.
00:18:44.760 Tony's such a stud.
00:18:45.800 Can I just say, I appreciate Tony.
00:18:48.260 Yeah.
00:18:48.620 I mean, Tony, he's such a great person.
00:18:50.940 Such a great person.
00:18:51.800 Such a great guy.
00:18:52.780 Yeah.
00:18:53.500 All right.
00:18:54.080 Brandon Ballard.
00:18:55.360 My wife's parents have a tendency to guilt her into doing things she has already said
00:19:00.260 she can't do.
00:19:02.040 Small example from yesterday.
00:19:03.680 Her mother asked my wife to sing in church choir in place of her mother.
00:19:08.160 Our son doesn't feel well and asked to stay home from church that day, but her mother
00:19:13.240 called and bugged her about it until she caved.
00:19:16.280 I was running, I was running sound for our church and was unable to stay home with our
00:19:21.520 son.
00:19:22.020 So we had to bring him and keep him away from everyone else.
00:19:24.940 How do I encourage my wife to have a hard conversation with her family without stepping
00:19:30.520 in and creating unwanted tension between myself and her parents?
00:19:34.120 If I had to guess, I would assume that your wife is a people pleaser.
00:19:39.840 So, and her parents know that because that's their daughter.
00:19:45.740 So they can take advantage of her.
00:19:47.660 And I don't think they're, I don't, I imagine they're not doing it out of spite or to get
00:19:51.500 her.
00:19:51.880 There's no devious intent behind it, but they are doing it all the same.
00:19:56.600 So I don't know, I don't know what you do as a husband to help her other than communicate
00:20:05.020 that to her and give her some tools to be able to say no or, or help.
00:20:08.880 Because if you become the shield, then that's a problem because your wife never deals with
00:20:13.180 it and it's going to create tension and animosity between you and your in-laws.
00:20:18.360 Immediately what comes to mind to me is, would your wife be open to therapy?
00:20:24.040 And that actually might be a really valuable tool for her so that she can learn to express
00:20:30.000 herself and stand up for herself.
00:20:32.260 And it's coming from a third party.
00:20:34.140 It's not coming from you.
00:20:35.620 So it's not going to create any tension and animosity between you and your wife.
00:20:38.940 And it's not going to create any tension and animosity between your wife, or excuse me,
00:20:43.500 your in-laws and you, because you're not the mediator between them and you're not that
00:20:48.000 wall and the go-between.
00:20:49.340 And it's this third party, this qualified, reputable third party over here, teaching
00:20:54.980 your wife how to have pride in herself, how to say no, how to protect her time and her
00:21:01.040 attention and energy.
00:21:02.940 And she'll get better at it and she'll be able to communicate herself better.
00:21:08.440 And you don't have to get in between anything and create problems that aren't actually there
00:21:14.240 right now.
00:21:14.720 I don't know if I, I don't, well, I think what you said is I totally agree with another
00:21:24.020 thing to ask, or maybe have a conversation with her about is walk through kind of the
00:21:31.660 emotional state of why does she cave in?
00:21:34.760 Well, it's because I don't want to let my mom down.
00:21:37.540 Okay.
00:21:37.740 Well, and maybe walk through the way that she could have that conversation with her mother
00:21:44.100 and express to her how much that she wants to help and step in, but this is a higher
00:21:50.680 priority and that her son's a higher priority and, and address the concern that she has that
00:21:56.460 typically causes her to cave into the situation and, and address it in a way that's powerful.
00:22:02.780 Yeah.
00:22:03.220 That's the only thing I'd add.
00:22:05.120 I agree with that.
00:22:05.740 I, I just, I would say, be careful.
00:22:08.520 I know my own personality and I push hard and then that creates tension and friction and
00:22:15.700 other stressful points for my wife that aren't already existing.
00:22:21.180 They don't already, they don't exist.
00:22:23.060 And so I do it and it creates more problems than, so in my, it's like, it's like COVID the,
00:22:30.820 the, the, the cure is worse than the ailment.
00:22:34.200 So you, you, you go to your wife and you're like, well, let me help you.
00:22:37.060 And no, you do this and do all the, this, fix this.
00:22:40.260 And then now she's mad at you because you're being the way that you are.
00:22:44.700 I'm just speaking from experience.
00:22:46.280 And the issue that I was really trying to solve is really on the back burner to the new
00:22:52.780 issue that I created.
00:22:55.880 So be careful.
00:22:57.560 Totally.
00:22:58.100 Tread lightly.
00:22:58.620 Yeah.
00:22:59.400 Meanwhile, meanwhile, mom and dad are trying to stretch their daughter and get her to share
00:23:04.880 talents and do things that she's so amazing at.
00:23:08.140 And that's the only reason why they're bulldozing her a little bit.
00:23:11.580 Could be.
00:23:12.140 Yeah.
00:23:12.500 Very, very good point.
00:23:13.960 Very good point.
00:23:15.600 All right.
00:23:16.380 Daniel Castleberry, my wife and I are making a budget and attempting to live beneath our means
00:23:21.520 and make good investments to retire early.
00:23:23.740 What things do you believe people are overspending on and or what should people be cutting out of
00:23:29.940 their lives to save more money?
00:23:32.000 Oh, man.
00:23:33.240 Well, it's usually, it's usually entertainment and technology is usually what it is.
00:23:39.000 It's, you know, you're, you're buying all the phones and all the gadgets and all the
00:23:42.660 gizmos and the new technology, or even if you're a hunter, you know, you're doing the same thing.
00:23:48.000 You're like, oh, well, there's a brand new, there's a brand new bow that just came out.
00:23:51.880 And I need this bow because the one that I have last year is the outdated model.
00:23:55.540 Is it worse or better?
00:23:56.640 No, it's the same.
00:23:57.440 It's just not the new color.
00:23:59.020 So it's always technology and entertainment.
00:24:02.920 How many, you said subscriptions, that's entertainment typically.
00:24:07.160 It's Netflix, it's Disney Plus, it's all these little things on your phone that you have,
00:24:12.900 that you're subscribed to.
00:24:14.920 That's, it's always what it is.
00:24:16.540 When I was looking at budgets for a living, that's what it was.
00:24:20.560 It was technology and entertainment.
00:24:22.240 And usually technology is a form of entertainment, right?
00:24:24.800 We, we, we want to be entertained.
00:24:26.680 And so there's this new phone that does better pictures than the last one.
00:24:30.740 Well, are you a professional photographer?
00:24:32.060 Oh no, I just like it.
00:24:33.380 Well, okay.
00:24:34.300 You know, maybe when your current phone dies, you can get the new one, but do you really
00:24:37.740 need that one now?
00:24:38.720 Probably not.
00:24:39.960 So that, that's what I think most people are spending their money on unnecessarily.
00:24:44.620 It's, it's not food.
00:24:46.520 It's not fuel.
00:24:48.820 It's entertainment and technology always.
00:24:53.020 Well, it's ironic, the worthless things that we don't need.
00:24:57.780 Yeah.
00:24:58.300 I mean, we do need, well, we do need it, right?
00:25:00.780 That's the problem.
00:25:02.140 So you need to be entertained.
00:25:04.140 Of course we, we, as human beings, I mean, think about there's little wood carvings that
00:25:10.140 they found little dolls that they found that they believe that children played with, you
00:25:16.140 know, a thousand years ago.
00:25:18.020 That's a form of entertainment.
00:25:19.300 It's also a form of teaching.
00:25:21.300 And so I look at my daughter when she plays with her dolls and I think, well, that's entertainment.
00:25:25.340 Yes.
00:25:25.600 But it's also, she's also learning how to be a nurturer.
00:25:29.220 So I'm not saying entertainment's wrong.
00:25:32.140 My wife and I went and saw a movie last week.
00:25:34.920 And so what, am I not supposed to go to the movies with my wife because I should cut out
00:25:39.300 entertainment?
00:25:39.660 No, like we need that.
00:25:40.900 We had a good time.
00:25:41.780 We saw a movie.
00:25:42.780 We enjoyed each other's company.
00:25:44.720 That's a, that's a good thing.
00:25:47.040 So I'm not a technology.
00:25:48.680 We're, we're, we're using technology right now.
00:25:50.720 I'm dealing with some technological issues with my phone and my, my computer.
00:25:54.340 Oh, I need it for my business.
00:25:56.060 That's the catch is that we actually do need those things.
00:26:00.500 And so we can convince ourselves that we need all of the things instead of just the necessities.
00:26:06.580 Yeah.
00:26:07.240 Good call.
00:26:08.160 Good call.
00:26:09.420 All right.
00:26:10.080 Kelby Jones.
00:26:11.160 When will I see you guys at one of Tim Kennedy's sheepdog response courses?
00:26:16.340 I'm heading back to protector to August 19th through the 20th and Austin.
00:26:21.960 Yeah, I would like to go to that, but frankly, I'm not right now.
00:26:25.400 Uh, just with everything else that I have going on, uh, I've, I've really made a conscious
00:26:31.520 effort, especially with the book coming out to not take on new tasks, not take on new
00:26:36.640 assignments and be very thoughtful about how I'm spending my time and resources and energy.
00:26:43.400 So yeah, I'm not going to be doing that period.
00:26:49.060 Yeah.
00:26:49.240 I mean, I, I, I've actually had conversations with people that I admire and respect and trust
00:26:54.620 and like, and they've asked about certain projects they wanted to implement and do and how I
00:26:58.900 could help and how I can partner.
00:27:00.180 And I just, I, I've actually probably not hurt some feelings, but disappointed some people
00:27:04.900 because I've said no.
00:27:05.780 And I feel bad that I've disappointed people, but I also feel pretty good that I know what
00:27:14.360 my priorities are and I'm sticking to them as best I can.
00:27:21.060 See, I have no priorities and Kelby, I've, I've been wanting to go to one of those for a while
00:27:25.840 as a complaint.
00:27:27.780 I, they do sheepdog response here in Utah and I always like find out the day before
00:27:33.600 and I'm super annoyed.
00:27:35.020 Like, Oh really?
00:27:35.680 Like, yeah.
00:27:36.920 Like I always find out about it super late, but it's something on my radar for sure that
00:27:41.360 I've been wanting to check out.
00:27:42.720 So it's not that you don't have priority.
00:27:45.160 It's just your priorities are different.
00:27:47.120 You know, it's like, yeah, that's, that is a priority of yours.
00:27:49.900 Or I might have some time for that.
00:27:51.480 Yeah.
00:27:51.940 Right.
00:27:52.220 And that's cool.
00:27:52.840 I would like to make time for that.
00:27:53.500 Yeah.
00:27:53.760 I think people, we, we should do a better job at that.
00:27:56.520 And, and I struggle with this is we see what everybody else is doing and we're like, well,
00:28:00.940 I want to do that.
00:28:01.580 And I want to learn how to shoot a bow and I want to train jujitsu and I want to go to
00:28:04.620 that event and I want to be at this thing and I want to be included on this panel or,
00:28:08.800 or in this presentation.
00:28:12.340 Okay.
00:28:12.680 Well, is that really what you want?
00:28:14.340 If you really drill down and think about the course of your life, is that what you want?
00:28:19.300 Or do you just want the notoriety or the sense of inclusion, uh, or the feeling that comes
00:28:26.460 from it?
00:28:27.840 Or is that really what you want?
00:28:30.560 And I, and many other men should really think about what we're engaged in and ask ourselves,
00:28:36.400 is this really what I want?
00:28:38.220 Or is this the cool thing that everybody else seems to want?
00:28:42.280 Yeah.
00:28:43.240 Good call.
00:28:44.100 Ryan Gant, you and Ryan have talked about allowing and encouraging other men to step
00:28:51.180 into your children's lives, to be able to coach and raise them more effectively in areas that
00:28:55.640 you cannot.
00:28:56.980 How much does a man enable and encourage this in a relationship with his wife without relinquishing
00:29:02.880 sovereignty?
00:29:04.080 To be clear, I'm not suggesting a man not seek to be comprehensive in his relationships.
00:29:09.440 Just interested in hearing your thoughts on this dichotomy.
00:29:12.580 I don't quite understand with his wife, letting other men into his wife's life.
00:29:19.760 I don't quite get that part of it.
00:29:22.520 Yeah.
00:29:22.760 How much does a man enable and encourage this in a relationship with his wife without relinquishing
00:29:28.140 sovereignty?
00:29:30.780 So if I'm understanding correctly, Ryan believes that if he lets other people, other men into
00:29:37.340 his children's lives, that he feels like he's relinquishing some of his sovereignty as a,
00:29:43.380 as a father and husband, that's what I understand.
00:29:47.780 I think so.
00:29:49.000 But I, but I'm also kind of confused because he says in a relationship with his wife.
00:29:54.080 Yeah.
00:29:54.580 So how does that, let me just address what the wife, like, you don't let other men into
00:29:58.100 your wife's life.
00:29:58.920 Like that's, I've never suggested that.
00:30:02.500 So that's, that's, is that what you're thinking?
00:30:05.720 He's, I don't know.
00:30:06.640 I don't know what he's asking.
00:30:07.840 I'm just saying if with his wife, I don't know what you mean now with regards to your
00:30:14.180 sovereignty.
00:30:14.680 Now, I think what he's saying is that he's wondering if his wife will think he has less
00:30:21.780 sovereignty or authority within his home, if he's letting other men help his children,
00:30:27.980 but that's kind of ridiculous.
00:30:30.880 That's like, you're not relinquishing control of your home or your position within the home
00:30:37.020 by letting a coach coach your son's football team.
00:30:42.120 Like, I don't, I just, I don't understand.
00:30:44.820 I don't, it's a really hard question for me to compute.
00:30:47.700 Cause I don't, I've never once thought that because my sons, my two oldest sons have a
00:30:53.320 powerlifting coach that I'm not their father or I'm, I'm less than.
00:30:59.420 I don't, and if you, and if you do feel that way, Ryan, you would say that's ego coming into
00:31:05.380 play, not necessarily what's best for your children.
00:31:09.020 Yeah.
00:31:09.340 And I have felt like my sons might talk about their powerlifting coach, Sean Moore, and I
00:31:16.060 might say, Oh my gosh, I have to hear about this guy again.
00:31:18.960 And that's ego, but I've never thought, well, I'm, I'm losing my children and I'm, I'm not,
00:31:24.220 I don't have sovereignty over it.
00:31:25.940 I've never, that doesn't even cross my mind.
00:31:29.900 Why wouldn't I want them to be with other people?
00:31:32.620 Like I realized other people know stuff that I don't, they're more talented, more gifted.
00:31:38.100 Maybe they have a set of skills that I don't possess.
00:31:40.140 Like I know, I know all of that.
00:31:44.100 So it doesn't, it doesn't bother me now.
00:31:47.860 If they're raising my children, that's different, you know, but no, having other people help
00:31:55.220 your children in meaningful and constructive ways that are credible and moving them towards
00:31:59.680 a mission and desire they have.
00:32:01.340 No, that's, that's actually what you should be doing.
00:32:03.620 And you should feel proud that you're in the position.
00:32:06.040 Like I'm proud that we're in a position where we can hire a coach for my two sons to help
00:32:11.640 them with powerlifting.
00:32:12.740 We're in that position.
00:32:14.060 My wife and I created that.
00:32:15.560 We're proud of that.
00:32:16.660 Yeah.
00:32:16.980 I don't think less of myself because they're doing that.
00:32:20.340 I think we're doing a pretty dang good job in that department.
00:32:23.680 Right.
00:32:24.520 Let's just assume though, that, that it bothers you.
00:32:28.320 To the extent that, that you're reacting in a way that you don't want your son to do powerlifting
00:32:35.740 or you don't want these relationships.
00:32:38.280 Maybe what's, let's talk about that a little bit.
00:32:40.700 What are some tactics or how do you get past feeling that you're being replaced or that you're
00:32:48.560 not actively doing your role and these other men maybe are.
00:32:53.180 Just get over yourself.
00:32:54.520 I don't, I don't, again, I don't think there needs to be a tactic.
00:33:00.260 Just get over yourself.
00:33:01.440 You're putting your, yourself ahead of your kids.
00:33:04.120 That's what you're doing.
00:33:05.660 Yeah.
00:33:06.300 You're like, my ego is more important than them developing into powerlifting.
00:33:10.880 And what's best for them.
00:33:12.300 Yeah.
00:33:12.900 That doesn't that sound ridiculous because it is ridiculous.
00:33:17.460 So how do you deal with it?
00:33:19.260 Like, what are the tactics?
00:33:20.320 Just get over it and start putting your kids ahead of your own selfish desire for authority
00:33:28.420 or this position of power or the title and realize that your job is to render yourself
00:33:35.080 obsolete.
00:33:35.880 I've said that before.
00:33:37.120 Your job is to put yourself out of work.
00:33:40.140 So to my, to myself, I'm like, well, cool.
00:33:41.820 The sooner I can do, nah, that's not right.
00:33:43.720 I was going to say the sooner I can do this, the better.
00:33:45.360 That's not right.
00:33:45.860 And it's not really how I feel anyways, but the more effectively I can do this, the better.
00:33:51.580 And what that means is that I need them to have other influences because I couldn't, I
00:33:55.920 can teach them some fundamentals about deadlifting.
00:33:59.260 I can't teach them how to be expert power lifters because I don't, I don't know.
00:34:03.720 I'm not, I don't know.
00:34:04.760 I'm not credible.
00:34:06.000 So I get over myself and get somebody in who's better.
00:34:09.980 And that might, part of that might be that you're not doing anything that's hard, right?
00:34:15.860 Or look confidence in regards to how you're showing up as a father.
00:34:21.520 Well, what I'm saying is you're, you're doing well enough in every department that you think
00:34:27.680 you have it all figured out.
00:34:30.460 That's part of the reason I like jujitsu so much as I go in there and it's, it hurts.
00:34:34.260 It's painful mentally, emotionally when you get beat up, but also I'm like, that's right.
00:34:40.380 I don't every day I go in, I'm reminded.
00:34:42.520 Oh yeah.
00:34:42.840 You're not as good as you think you are.
00:34:44.000 And so the question then becomes, what in your life are you doing?
00:34:49.660 That's challenging you and pushing you and making you feel less than, because that feeling
00:34:53.680 is not bad.
00:34:55.920 Society would have you think it's bad.
00:34:59.540 Culture wants you to think it's bad.
00:35:01.440 Just eat, drink, and be merry, indulge in everything.
00:35:04.620 Be as fat as you want.
00:35:06.240 Be as lazy as you want.
00:35:08.240 If you get laid off, it wasn't your fault.
00:35:09.900 It was your employer, it was the economy, it was the evil other side of the political
00:35:15.380 aisle.
00:35:16.720 It's the, it's, you know, whatever.
00:35:18.500 It's everything but you.
00:35:22.320 And I feel like too often that we aren't doing enough to really feel the sting and weight
00:35:30.080 of discomfort and then doing something about it.
00:35:33.360 So maybe our egos are a, are a result of being pretty good.
00:35:40.980 You know, I think that with the podcast and with the order of man movement, it does pretty
00:35:45.180 well.
00:35:45.620 So am I God's gift to entrepreneurship?
00:35:50.900 No.
00:35:52.380 Although sometimes I might feel like it or that I'm invincible, especially when I get
00:35:58.160 emails all day that are thanking me for the wonderful things I've done to save everybody's
00:36:03.320 marriages and health and all this other stuff.
00:36:06.000 And then something happens in my own personal life.
00:36:08.420 And I'm like, oh yeah, yep.
00:36:11.160 I'm not God's gift to fill in the blank.
00:36:14.640 Okay.
00:36:15.620 Yeah.
00:36:18.480 Chase Kimball, I'm going through a separation right now.
00:36:22.060 And my wife and I had our first marriage counseling session.
00:36:26.420 One of the questions our counselor asked was, what does intimacy mean to you?
00:36:32.500 I initiate, initiated the separation due to this very issue.
00:36:36.100 It made me really think about what it means to me.
00:36:39.340 I wanted to relay this question to you guys.
00:36:41.680 So what does intimacy with your wives look like?
00:36:44.660 What does it mean to you?
00:36:46.320 Um, I will answer that question.
00:36:52.360 I'm it's, he said he's, he initiated the separation because of this issue.
00:36:58.340 I'm wondering, yeah.
00:36:59.540 I'm wondering if his wife wasn't being intimate with him.
00:37:01.640 It sounds like that's kind of how I read that.
00:37:04.160 Uh, you know, for me, yeah, obviously there's the physical component.
00:37:07.180 And I, and I think generally speaking, we as men are, are more physical in nature.
00:37:10.920 And so being physically intimate, having sex is, is, is, you know, the thing that drives us from an intimacy level.
00:37:17.540 And we tend to look at it and think that if she's having sex with me, that means she loves me.
00:37:22.000 Yeah.
00:37:22.400 Uh, and I, I think obviously there's an element of truth to that.
00:37:25.400 Right.
00:37:25.700 Uh, but there's other, there's other connections that I think go into intimacy.
00:37:30.240 Um, and these are things that I'm trying to work on and trying to focus on and, and be receptive to in, in her, my wife.
00:37:36.600 Uh, and, and, and that's being able to sit down and have a serious conversation or to sit down and actually hear what it is she's saying.
00:37:48.120 You know, sometimes we, we, we hear our spouse, but how often are we listening to what they're actually saying and internalizing it without trying to come up with a solution or trying to fix what we perceive as their shortcomings.
00:38:04.820 And just actually listen.
00:38:06.740 And what a great way to, to connect with her different than sex.
00:38:12.360 Uh, so I think intimacy is about connection and that's not just one connection.
00:38:18.400 That's an infinite number of connections, but it's physical, it's mental, it's emotional.
00:38:24.400 It's also spiritual.
00:38:26.500 There's a covenant there.
00:38:27.920 It's a spiritual connection as well.
00:38:30.420 So that's how I view it.
00:38:32.260 Um, I see it the same way.
00:38:36.760 The one thought that I'd add to the conversation is, and maybe this is just chase me sharing.
00:38:44.760 So you can relate to some extent.
00:38:48.960 Um, this is important.
00:38:50.480 Even the physical aspect of it.
00:38:52.100 If, if I don't feel a level of connection and intimacy with my wife, I feel alone.
00:38:59.660 I, I feel that I'm on my own.
00:39:05.040 Uh, I feel a lack of like love and caring of what's happening in my life.
00:39:11.720 And if that lack, and ironically enough, there could be a physical element, but if there's
00:39:18.640 intimacy lacking in the physical element, then it almost feels like disingenuous or even,
00:39:26.020 even, I don't even know the word like dirty or not pure in it, in its nature.
00:39:33.860 Like that was just sex.
00:39:35.140 And so the level of connection is really important to me.
00:39:39.660 And I'm probably, I assume I'm a little bit different than most guys.
00:39:43.020 Like where most guys are like, wham, bam, thank you, ma'am.
00:39:45.140 I'm good.
00:39:45.920 I'm like, oh, hell no.
00:39:47.380 Right.
00:39:47.660 Like I, it's gotta be, it has to have that connection to it.
00:39:52.560 Otherwise I just feel like I'm just having sex with someone and, and I have no desire to
00:39:58.500 just randomly have sex.
00:40:00.740 Like I, it, I, it, that connection kind of needs to be there as part of the process for
00:40:05.540 me anyway.
00:40:06.500 I don't, I don't actually believe that that's different than most guys.
00:40:11.320 Now, look, there's a lot of guys who are promiscuous, right.
00:40:14.200 Who will, who will go out and behave like that for sure, because it feels good to get off.
00:40:20.560 Right.
00:40:20.940 That's the bottom line.
00:40:22.440 Yeah.
00:40:23.520 But I don't think, I think that's detrimental to a man.
00:40:27.880 You don't think most guys are that way?
00:40:29.780 I don't.
00:40:30.420 It feels like most guys are that way.
00:40:31.920 I think they, I think they act like that.
00:40:33.140 Maybe I'm more emotional.
00:40:34.480 No.
00:40:34.800 Yeah.
00:40:34.960 More emotional than most guys.
00:40:35.840 I'm actually very, I'm very much like you.
00:40:37.900 I want to feel the, the, the, the emotional, spiritual connection to it as well.
00:40:42.860 It's more meaningful.
00:40:43.940 It feels better.
00:40:44.720 It's, it's, it's better.
00:40:47.160 And yeah, I think a lot of guys act like that, but I, I do believe that.
00:40:50.560 I believe that it's detrimental and it, and it eats at you.
00:40:53.180 And over time, if you engage in that enough, you're, you're really going to run into some
00:40:57.020 serious problems.
00:40:58.880 So, yeah.
00:41:00.800 Yeah.
00:41:02.720 That's what I think on intimacy.
00:41:05.940 Yeah.
00:41:07.720 Last thought.
00:41:09.040 What does intimacy mean to you?
00:41:11.660 I just, I just, that's a powerful question because it causes us to evaluate that we're adding meaning to it and, and the communication around it.
00:41:24.900 And the fact that just your meaning doesn't necessarily mean that's hers and, and, and, you know, five love languages.
00:41:33.860 That's obviously what we have a tendency to express love in the way that we would like to receive it.
00:41:40.560 And sometimes it's not the same for your spouse.
00:41:44.280 And so just be mindful of the meaning that she might have.
00:41:48.520 And if it's different than yours, that's necessarily not right or wrong back to kind of what we're talking about earlier.
00:41:54.100 It's just that way.
00:41:56.000 Right.
00:41:56.500 And, and that's, that's the importance of the conversation.
00:41:59.600 Right.
00:42:00.220 Yeah.
00:42:00.520 Agreed.
00:42:00.940 All right.
00:42:02.460 Brian Davis.
00:42:03.380 I come from a family that tends to make excuses instead of needing life changes.
00:42:08.920 I'm a fairly high performer and I feel driven to help and encourage them, especially my brothers to do more with themselves.
00:42:15.880 This causes strife in these relationships, but I don't want to give up on them.
00:42:21.380 What would you do?
00:42:25.280 These are really good questions.
00:42:26.940 And I feel a bit at a loss for some of these questions as far as what can I share?
00:42:32.500 Because I see it in myself too.
00:42:35.020 I know.
00:42:36.020 I was totally relating to Brian.
00:42:37.680 I'm like, I feel like this all the time.
00:42:40.440 I mean, that's the thing, right?
00:42:41.600 Is that what we do.
00:42:43.180 Okay.
00:42:43.440 Here's what I would say.
00:42:45.160 The way that we respond in these situations, when we see somebody we care about, who's not performing to the degree that we think they're capable of.
00:42:54.000 Is an indicator of our love for them, right?
00:43:00.860 Like don't make yourself wrong for feeling this way.
00:43:03.960 I'm not even going to say that because you could be wrong.
00:43:06.300 And I'll tell you why you actually could be wrong.
00:43:08.660 Okay.
00:43:09.260 You could be wrong because you might be undermining yourself and the people you're trying to serve.
00:43:14.020 But I still believe that if you do it and you're pushing a little too hard as a man, it doesn't mean that you, it means that you love them.
00:43:23.440 That's what that means.
00:43:25.180 You're just expressing it incorrectly.
00:43:28.060 And it is unequivocally wrong.
00:43:30.240 Why?
00:43:31.020 Because it's not producing the results that you desire.
00:43:34.300 So that's how we measure performance.
00:43:37.320 We don't measure performance by our intentions.
00:43:39.560 We've all heard the phrase, the path to hell is paved with good intentions.
00:43:44.400 So we don't measure, or at least we should not measure our performance by our intentions, but by how it's received and the performance that takes place after, whether it's for ourselves or for the people that we care about.
00:43:58.740 So for example, if you browbeat your kid or your wife, then because you love her or, or him and they're withdrawing because of it, or they're upset because of it, and maybe they quit the team or something or their activity because of it.
00:44:22.740 Well, you, you completely undermined yourself.
00:44:25.540 That wasn't your intention.
00:44:26.820 Your intention was to bring out the best in them.
00:44:28.740 So you did it wrong.
00:44:30.320 You actually did it.
00:44:31.840 So when you say, well, don't make yourself wrong.
00:44:33.880 No, actually ask yourself if you're wrong, because you might be the problem and I've been the problem.
00:44:41.080 So then we need to evaluate it and look and see, oh, you know what?
00:44:44.200 That's actually not what I want for my wife.
00:44:46.220 That's not what I want for my children.
00:44:47.720 So what can I change about my own behavior to then elicit a better response and performance in them for their own benefit, not for mine, but for their own benefit.
00:44:59.000 I can't necessarily tell you what it is because these are things I struggle with as well.
00:45:03.860 But I think it's a good evaluation process that you might be the problem, not because your intentions are wrong, but because the way you're trying to facilitate it is.
00:45:14.420 So maybe try to be a bit more understanding.
00:45:16.940 Maybe try to be a bit more open.
00:45:18.560 Maybe ask some questions.
00:45:20.880 Maybe we could all do a better job acknowledging when the people in our lives do actually perform instead of critiquing and nitpicking every little thing about every little detail and say, you know, that was awesome.
00:45:31.980 And if they don't want to do it to 100%, fine.
00:45:36.840 So what?
00:45:38.980 Maybe they're good at 80.
00:45:41.120 Is it your job to get them to 100?
00:45:43.060 No.
00:45:44.680 It's your job to be there and present and available and teach and offer and instruct and guide and all these things.
00:45:49.760 And then it's their job to take it to where they want to go.
00:45:52.400 So just, it's okay.
00:45:54.660 It's okay.
00:45:56.560 And if they're not doing anything and they're wrecking their lives, okay, then you come in and you offer them.
00:46:01.980 Offer what you can offer, whether that's a shoulder to cry on or a sounding board, or maybe you come across a resource and you share it and then you evaluate.
00:46:10.980 Okay.
00:46:11.160 Were they receptive to that?
00:46:12.140 Yes, they were.
00:46:12.820 Cool.
00:46:13.060 You're on the right track.
00:46:13.900 No, they were totally closed off that.
00:46:15.920 Well, don't do that again.
00:46:17.640 Try something else.
00:46:18.540 Experiment with something else.
00:46:19.700 And if they reject it altogether in every shape and form, okay, like what more can you do?
00:46:28.000 There's nothing more you can do.
00:46:29.560 So don't just, just change, just adjust.
00:46:33.460 We can change.
00:46:34.280 I've gotten super present to the idea that the most effective growth for anybody is for them to come to that conclusion on their own.
00:46:48.240 And to be committed to what they're doing versus doing it out of pure pressure, coercion, micromanagement, or authority.
00:46:58.420 And so from an employment perspective, I ask my team, where's their commitment level to what we're doing as an organization and what we're doing as a team?
00:47:09.360 When we have conversations with new battle team leaders, the conversation I'm really looking for is, are they all in?
00:47:18.580 Are they committed to what the Iron Council is about?
00:47:21.860 Are they committed to what Order Man is about?
00:47:24.460 If they're committed to it, they will find a way.
00:47:29.600 There's a big difference between someone that does something because they're bought in and they're fully committed versus why I did it because Ryan wants me to.
00:47:37.860 But I didn't really, I'm not really bought into the idea, but I'll do it anyway because he's my boss.
00:47:43.860 And when I hit a roadblock in that example, I throw my hands up and I go, you know, freak, I knew it.
00:47:49.220 I knew this wasn't going to work because blah, blah, blah, or whatever.
00:47:52.780 But when I'm bought into what we're doing, when I'm fully committed, I find a way.
00:47:58.680 And so me convincing a kid, me convincing an employee, me convincing a friend or whatever into trying to show up the powerful way is not the way.
00:48:09.080 It is my job to create the art of the possible or a possibility of being and to be able to coach and guide them.
00:48:18.120 But it's got to be their call.
00:48:20.580 It's got to be their idea.
00:48:23.360 And once again, it's like the lighthouse mentality, right?
00:48:27.020 We show up in a very powerful way and we show them a way of being and we can coach and help, but it's got to be their decision.
00:48:34.980 And so kind of, and I'm just resonating and maybe saying it a slightly different way, Ryan, than what you're saying is we can't course people into showing up a particular way.
00:48:43.720 And there's ways that we can show up and communicate to them for them to make that decision on their own.
00:48:49.840 And so I think I would just really focus on how do we don't take away their sovereignty, don't take away their agency and create possibility for them to make those decisions.
00:49:00.800 And that is going to be a way more powerful approach to change and growth than any other, like, you know, riding them hard or bulldozing them into doing something.
00:49:12.300 And I'm not necessarily saying that's what he's doing, but just a word, I guess, a warning that I fall into because I think that I should, you know, force people to change because I know better.
00:49:24.580 Right, right.
00:49:25.880 Yeah, I agree.
00:49:26.600 All right, Jeffrey Young, what's the best way to deal with lying from our teenage step-sons, for example, saying they did chores and didn't, stealing food or money from the family?
00:49:40.940 So dealing with lying, and we might just say lying kids, but step-sons adds obviously a dynamic to it.
00:49:48.960 But how do we deal with our kids that are lying to us?
00:49:52.420 Yeah, I think the first thing you do is communicate the expectation, like, hey, if you're going to do chores, like, you're going to do the chores, and you're not going to be able to participate in the things that you want to participate until I've gone in and checked them off.
00:50:05.040 That's an easy thing to do, right?
00:50:07.360 Hey, go clean your room, all right?
00:50:09.220 Yeah.
00:50:09.620 Then, hey, can I go to the party or the movies with my friends tonight?
00:50:13.820 Well, let's go look at your room.
00:50:15.100 So you do that five or six times, and by the way, when it's not done, you actually have to hold your guns and say, no, you can't go do that because you made the decision that you didn't want to go.
00:50:27.880 I didn't make the decision.
00:50:28.880 You made that decision.
00:50:31.080 Or if you don't want to be as heavy-handed, well, look, you can go when you finish your room.
00:50:36.840 Well, dad, they're going right now, and my room's going to take me an hour.
00:50:39.020 Or, okay, and I told you this morning, you had 12 hours to do it.
00:50:45.640 That's on you.
00:50:46.580 That's not on me.
00:50:47.980 So just a little bit of accountability is going to go an extremely long way.
00:50:55.160 When money comes up missing, accountability.
00:50:59.100 Hey, son, you know, I had $40 in my wallet, and it's gone, and I didn't spend it, and mom didn't spend it.
00:51:06.580 So I'm going to need you to answer as to where this went, and if you aren't willing to come clean on that, there's going to be consequences.
00:51:17.380 There has to be consequences.
00:51:19.240 That's the thing that people don't implement, and I don't know whether you do or not, but there's got to be consequences to these things.
00:51:25.420 And then I think through those consequences, they're going to learn that, yeah, you can steal, but there's a risk to it.
00:51:30.400 You can not do your stuff, but there's a risk to it here.
00:51:33.340 There also might be some reasons that your child is lashing out or not listening.
00:51:39.520 Maybe they want your attention.
00:51:40.840 Maybe they're not getting attention, so they do it so they can get attention, even though it's not constructive.
00:51:45.960 That might be an issue, so that's something worth considering.
00:51:49.620 Maybe there's some baggage or trauma in their life that hasn't been dealt with, especially as a stepchild.
00:51:54.660 You don't know what their father's like.
00:51:58.820 I mean, you've heard about it, probably, but you don't entirely know the situation.
00:52:03.800 Were they abused?
00:52:04.580 Were they neglected?
00:52:05.540 Were they hit?
00:52:06.260 What happened?
00:52:08.420 And is some of that stemming and pouring over into the new family dynamic?
00:52:12.900 It could be.
00:52:14.200 And so, again, I go back, well, that might be some therapy.
00:52:16.540 That might be some good, long conversations with your current wife about why it is the way it is and what happened.
00:52:25.040 There might be some real reasons why this is the case, and I think you'd do well to figure out what that is.
00:52:32.120 Yeah.
00:52:32.920 It kind of goes back to Tony's question earlier about increasing our emotional intelligence and trying to understand their emotional intelligence.
00:52:41.960 It's they might steal money from you because they have a problem with you, something that hasn't been addressed.
00:52:47.560 They haven't communicated it.
00:52:49.240 And then before we kind of close that up and go, well, you know, they shouldn't have a problem with me.
00:52:53.660 Well, how are we showing up where they're unable or unwilling to communicate with us?
00:52:59.220 Is it because the last thing they tried that you lashed back out and you weren't open to the communication?
00:53:05.360 So I really, like we always preach, right, take some extreme ownership and look for how you're showing up in the relationship.
00:53:14.180 People will react with you often based upon what you allow.
00:53:19.060 And so assess yourself from that perspective.
00:53:22.940 Two thoughts that crossed my mind.
00:53:24.620 The first is one of my favorite books of all time is Outward Mindset.
00:53:30.840 And this idea that we're in zero position of correction if we don't have an established relationship first, because it's not about caring.
00:53:39.700 It's about you fixing them, which doesn't feel like caring.
00:53:43.560 And so focus on where's your relationship with them?
00:53:47.820 Are you even spending time with them or do you understand them?
00:53:51.120 Are you having those conversations?
00:53:53.120 And is that baseline established before you're in a position of correcting?
00:53:57.280 We often approach this wrong.
00:53:58.760 I approach this wrong with my stepson, Kiyabe, where I was like, hey, we can have a better relationship once you're not a shit.
00:54:05.980 And you need to change first.
00:54:08.580 And then we can hang out.
00:54:11.280 Which is so disingenuous and comes across like a complete prick from my perspective, because I'm not seeing him as a human, as a person that's amazing and has an amazing possibility.
00:54:22.920 I see him as something that needs to be fixed and changed before I'm willing to love him.
00:54:27.440 Are you kidding?
00:54:29.940 So establish relationship first before we're in a position of correction.
00:54:34.280 The second thing that's just been really on my mind, it's ironic.
00:54:37.180 I was thinking about this just yesterday when I was mowing the lawn of what happens when I say, hey, you need to have your room clean and, you know, and we don't enforce it.
00:54:46.980 And then they go.
00:54:48.080 So not just did we not like create consistency on on consequences.
00:54:53.960 I eroded trust.
00:54:58.100 Trust in me.
00:54:59.300 Literally, I said X and I didn't withhold.
00:55:02.580 I didn't hold my part of the bargain, even in a negative scenario.
00:55:07.940 And trust gets destroyed.
00:55:10.000 Right.
00:55:10.460 We have to be consistent and we have to honor our word, good and bad consequences, because trust is at what's at stake.
00:55:20.000 And that shows up in the positive side.
00:55:23.560 If you can't trust me, Ryan, to hold you accountable, then you're also not going to trust me to help you when you need my help, because I become untrustworthy.
00:55:33.400 Right.
00:55:33.800 I can't be counted on.
00:55:35.500 Well, not to mention, you're not going to trust yourself either.
00:55:39.100 And that's an issue.
00:55:40.720 Right.
00:55:41.100 If you can't trust yourself to keep your word, you're going to be you're going to have guilt.
00:55:45.580 You're going to have sorrow.
00:55:46.720 You're going to have remorse.
00:55:47.560 You're going to have anger.
00:55:48.460 And that might be directed at the people that you love because you're the problem.
00:55:52.520 You're the guy that's out of integrity.
00:55:54.120 So you get yourself an integrity, even though it's it's the uncomfortable things that that really matter.
00:56:01.440 You know, the comfortable things are good.
00:56:03.480 They matter, too.
00:56:04.160 And you need to follow through on those.
00:56:08.360 But it's actually when it's uncomfortable that you're actually tested as to whether or not you're you're the guy.
00:56:15.700 Right.
00:56:16.000 You're you're you're the man, if you will.
00:56:18.080 And you can get there and you can rebuild it if you haven't been there.
00:56:23.080 But it takes some time and it takes a lot of personal and personal effort and work on yourself before anybody else.
00:56:31.800 Let's take one more.
00:56:34.160 Joseph Ryan.
00:56:36.060 I've heard that there is a phrase, a phase in a marriage that many go through.
00:56:40.420 Not all the failing out the fall failing.
00:56:44.080 She's the falling out of love phase.
00:56:47.580 If either of you have dealt with this phase, how did you deal with it or how would you deal with it growing apart or versus growing together?
00:56:57.380 I actually go questions today.
00:56:58.920 They are like tough.
00:57:00.240 They are good.
00:57:00.900 They're tough.
00:57:01.400 Yeah.
00:57:01.540 I go back to that intimacy question.
00:57:06.060 And I think people can fall back in love.
00:57:08.660 You know, I think a lot of the times there is still love there.
00:57:11.140 And, you know, we've heard the phrase, I love you, but I'm not in love with you.
00:57:14.860 I think we can fall out of love.
00:57:16.700 I think we can fall back in love, especially if there's a level of commitment to each other and a desire to try to make the situation better.
00:57:24.840 So, I don't think all is lost, but I think it comes back to that intimacy.
00:57:29.580 And that's the connection.
00:57:31.100 That's the connection that we're talking about in the four realms, if you will.
00:57:34.780 So, again, mental, emotional, spiritual, and physical.
00:57:38.480 And a lot of the times we as men will go straight to the physical because it's easy.
00:57:42.620 It feels good.
00:57:43.340 And it's like the end result.
00:57:44.760 Like that's what we want, right?
00:57:46.480 But it's those others that are going to be much harder for us, that mental, that emotional, that spiritual.
00:57:51.280 And that will ultimately lead to other forms of connection, like physical, if those are there.
00:57:57.860 But I think if you can work on listening to her, you can work on maybe it's going back to church.
00:58:05.160 If you've fallen out of church for a while, maybe it's carving out every week a date night.
00:58:11.860 Maybe it's, you know, your own personal work on becoming somebody who's attractive, even physically, mentally, emotionally.
00:58:18.640 Maybe you're not right now.
00:58:19.600 So, what can you do to make yourself more appealing and more attractive that she's interested and enticed by that?
00:58:26.400 These are all things that you can do.
00:58:28.100 But, yeah, I think that happens.
00:58:30.580 I don't know if it's a phase or if it happens on a cycle or anything like that.
00:58:34.000 But I think that does happen in marriages.
00:58:35.620 I know of plenty of people who have and are currently going through that.
00:58:39.580 And I've seen a lot of people, man, work through it.
00:58:42.360 And it's hard.
00:58:43.340 And it's worth it.
00:58:44.540 It's so worth it.
00:58:47.620 Yeah.
00:58:47.780 Yeah, just without a doubt, it can show up.
00:58:53.580 I mean, I think it's just like any other relationship.
00:58:56.000 You know, Ryan, you and I, our relationship could go south easily just by not investing in it.
00:59:02.500 Yeah.
00:59:03.140 Yeah, exactly.
00:59:03.740 I don't think marriages are any different, right?
00:59:05.780 Or our relationship with our kids.
00:59:07.640 Our biological children that we have, like, an amazing love for, those relationships can go south if we're not fostering them.
00:59:16.080 Right.
00:59:16.240 If we're not investing time in them.
00:59:18.340 And so I think it's no different for a marriage, ironically enough.
00:59:22.200 And for me, just to give you context, Joseph, as a consideration, it's usually conversation.
00:59:28.820 My wife keeps signing up for damn, like, half marathons and races.
00:59:35.340 You know why?
00:59:37.040 It's because she wants us to run together.
00:59:40.320 And the reason why is when we run together, what do we do for an hour and a half?
00:59:44.420 We talk.
00:59:46.880 It's her favorite part of doing the race is being stuck with me on a trail running.
00:59:52.540 Because we're talking and there's, and I'm sharing how my day was.
00:59:58.960 I'm sharing what's working, what I'm stressed out about, things that are bothering me.
01:00:04.340 She's sharing the same thing.
01:00:05.860 And we feel better connected with one another because we're having those conversations.
01:00:10.920 So for us, it's like something as simple as that.
01:00:13.880 Just the constant communication and the touch base of what we're doing, what we're working on, what we're stressed out about, what's our concerns.
01:00:21.460 And being able to have those conversations with one another.
01:00:25.780 Yeah, absolutely.
01:00:27.640 Well, cool.
01:00:28.120 Like I said, great questions today.
01:00:29.780 We'll call it a wrap.
01:00:31.220 I think we have more that we'll get to next week.
01:00:33.340 We want to make sure we get all of your questions answered.
01:00:36.040 So we'll get to those next week.
01:00:37.660 But Kip, why don't you bring it home for us?
01:00:40.860 Yeah, I mean, I think the main call to action, guys, to get notified when we open up the Iron Council mid-September.
01:00:48.540 So go to orderman.com slash Iron Council, sign up, get part of the newsletter.
01:00:54.380 So that way you're being notified of what's going on and when that opens so you're reminded.
01:00:59.360 The other way to stay connected to us is connect with Mr. Mickler on socials, at Ryan Mickler for both Twitter and Instagram.
01:01:07.060 And then connect with us also on YouTube.
01:01:08.740 We don't talk about that too much, but subscribe to the YouTube channel.
01:01:12.100 And it's a really easy way to share the message and different episodes with people.
01:01:17.800 Once again, it's about being that lighthouse and sharing the message and letting people come to that conclusion on their own.
01:01:24.880 And a good way to do that is share these episodes and different posts that Ryan makes on Twitter and Instagram.
01:01:32.220 I love it.
01:01:32.700 I love it.
01:01:33.140 Well, good.
01:01:33.720 You guys have your marching orders.
01:01:35.200 So, man, make sure you get out there.
01:01:37.300 We got a lot of things to work on.
01:01:38.560 Keep working on those things.
01:01:39.800 Check out the Iron Council.
01:01:41.020 Kip, as always, appreciate you, brother.
01:01:43.160 Guys, we'll be back on Friday.
01:01:44.360 Until then, go out there, take action, and become the man you are meant to be.
01:01:48.620 Thank you for listening to the Order of Man podcast.
01:01:51.520 If you're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be,
01:01:55.540 we invite you to join the Order at orderofman.com.
01:01:58.680 We'll be right back.