Order of Man


Don't Be a Flaccid Jellyfish, Learning to Validate Yourself, and Minding Your Tongue ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING


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People

Also mentioned:
Matt Jenkins Kiyabe Okipono Hunter Locke Murray Dixon Scott Pono Greg Cleaver Rick Donovan Joe Mercola Stacey Boyer Dex Reese Valentine Kiff Nice

Harmful content

Misogyny

20

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Toxicity

10

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Hate speech

8

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Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

On today's episode, the brother and sister duo of the sit down and talk about birthdays, birthdays and the culture of men. We also talk about the death of his father and the impact that has had on his life.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart
00:00:04.900 your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time.
00:00:10.280 You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong. This is your life. This is who
00:00:16.880 you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done,
00:00:22.320 you can call yourself a man. Kiff, what's up brother? Great to be back with you for our
00:00:27.520 asking me anything today. Yeah, it's good to be here, man. What's your weakness on your eye here?
00:00:33.680 Is that a shiner? A little bit of a shiner? Yeah, it's birthday rolls.
00:00:38.780 Birthday rolls. When was your birthday? Yesterday. Oh, bro. I'm horrible. I'm a horrible human being.
00:00:44.980 I know. I stayed up all night waiting for a message, a private message from Mickler. Tell me.
00:00:51.300 You know, the crazy thing is, is remembering birthdays and these sorts of things is like what
00:00:57.460 I'm really, really good at. So how could I, how could I forget? Man, I'm sorry. It's fine.
00:01:03.540 So how old are you now? 44.
00:01:06.600 44. Nice.
00:01:08.340 Yeah. And it's funny because I, I joked around with my wife, like, Hey, on my birthday, I don't
00:01:14.340 want to just leave me alone. And it's the anniversary of my dad's death. Right. And so I,
00:01:18.500 I felt like I might wake up and just drive down to Sevier County and you know what I mean? Just
00:01:24.140 remove myself kind of for the day. Um, ironically enough, I didn't, to be honest with you for my
00:01:30.440 family, cause they want to celebrate my day, you know? So there's that dichotomy of like,
00:01:35.300 it's what I want to do versus what is what's best for my family. And what was best is probably for
00:01:40.860 me not to fully check out. But, but it was funny because she knows a good day for me is a good day
00:01:47.280 is going to the gym, you know, getting some jujitsu in what she doesn't know is going to jujitsu on
00:01:54.180 your birthday is just ask, asking for a beating, right? Because I don't know about you, but like
00:02:00.860 whenever it's someone's birthday, everyone goes, Oh, we get to beat you up. Like we're going to all
00:02:06.100 roll extra hard. Right. Because it's your birthday. Right. And it's like, it's the one day you kind of
00:02:11.520 don't want to go to the gym is on your birthday. It's the culture of men. A lot of people won't
00:02:15.500 ever understand that, but it's the culture of men. Yeah, that's cool. No, that's good that you got
00:02:20.260 at least some training. And it's, it's, it's always interesting when people ask about holidays,
00:02:24.200 especially fake holidays, like Valentine's, which is coming up and president's day and like these
00:02:30.720 fake holidays. I even say like veterans day, Memorial day. I know I'm going to get reamed for
00:02:35.980 that. I'm a veteran, you know, and it's like, it's good to honor our veterans. It's good to honor our,
00:02:40.880 our, our fallen. I'm not dismissing or mocking that side of things. It's like, but do we need a
00:02:47.000 day dedicated to that where it's just about, uh, you know, the biggest sale, your favorite company has
00:02:53.280 like, it's crazy. It's like, if you were going to really celebrate those days, it would be a day
00:03:00.540 of reflection and focus on whatever that holiday was for, but no one does that. That's right. So
00:03:06.080 it's now it's just, yeah, a day to go shopping. But I, I always, I always get a kick out of it.
00:03:11.940 You know, labor day is another one. What are you going to do today? I'm going to do the same thing
00:03:15.080 I did yesterday. It's what are you going to do for your birthday? The same thing I did every day for
00:03:21.260 the last, you know, two years before. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Which is exactly how it should be.
00:03:26.060 So we're good. Well, happy belated birthday. Proud to know you. Honored to call you a friend.
00:03:30.780 And of course, you know, I remember having a conversation with you when your father passed
00:03:35.440 away and, um, my condolences on that. I, I, uh, I too know what that's like and that's a hard thing.
00:03:42.020 Yeah. Yeah, it is. Um, but so it was life, right? And, and, and ironically enough,
00:03:48.180 even on the mats before we even started training yesterday, we ended up talking for probably about
00:03:53.680 30 minutes, just about death. You know, one of the guys that was training with, you know, he,
00:03:58.560 he lost his daughter when she was 13 and, and we're just talking through the grieving process and,
00:04:03.280 and how unfortunate that we've removed ourselves so much from the uncomfortable aspects of death
00:04:09.620 that, that it, we've lost its importance of it being on our minds, right? It's the one thing that
00:04:16.480 we all share in common, but yet it's the very thing that we all avoid talking about and, and
00:04:22.100 preparing for, and to be frank, we should be preparing for it. You know? So it was a good day.
00:04:28.340 It's a good day of reflection for me. Yeah. At least having it on our minds so that we know what
00:04:33.160 we do right now matters. You know, is this conversation, the one I want to be having,
00:04:36.960 if I know that I'm going to die in five minutes might be, might be worth evaluating. And it is
00:04:42.300 because I think the work we're doing here is crucial and it's valuable. It's important,
00:04:45.960 not only death, but also suffering. A friend of mine who, who, you know, asked me the other day,
00:04:53.140 he says, what's, what's brought you joy in your life lately? And I just, I posted this on Instagram.
00:04:57.780 Sometimes it's weird to post these things on Instagram because it feels like I'm trying to get,
00:05:01.460 I don't know, uh, empathy. You don't want people thinking that you're looking for pity. Yeah.
00:05:07.960 Yeah. And it's, it's not that it will actually my, my Facebook and Instagram and Twitter accounts,
00:05:13.580 they're, they're more of, um, more of like a, a journal for me. It helps me work through concepts
00:05:21.860 and ideas. So that's part of it. I can go through and I can flesh out ideas or if I'm feeling a
00:05:27.220 particular way, I can share something about it. And that's actually therapeutic for me. Uh, but
00:05:32.240 also I feel like as men, it's our job to serve, right? We're, we're supposed to, as men to be
00:05:37.420 serving other people. And it really doesn't do me any good or other men, any good to be feeling a
00:05:45.980 certain way or have access to information or have a tool or a resource, or maybe just a snippet of,
00:05:52.400 of advice or input to have something and then to hoard it and keep it to ourselves.
00:06:00.100 If you have access to something that could serve somebody else, then I feel like we have a moral
00:06:04.700 responsibility to share that in a way that will impact other people. And that's why I do share
00:06:10.040 on social media. So when I'm on Instagram posting about this particular question, my friend asked me,
00:06:16.500 it's again, for me to work through it and get it out of my head, but also to serve others.
00:06:20.940 But he asked me what brings joy to your life lately. And I really thought about lying,
00:06:27.700 you know, coming up with all the textbook answers about, you know, my family and my health and
00:06:32.580 our, our wealth and, you know, my relationship with God and like the textbook answers. And they're
00:06:37.600 not necessarily wrong. My family of course brings me joy. You know, that my relationship with God is,
00:06:42.480 is one of joy. Uh, so it's not wrong, but it's not the entirety of the truth.
00:06:48.560 The truth is that the last several months have not been what I would call joyous.
00:06:55.320 It would be the opposite of that. And I got thinking a lot about suffering, how it is just
00:07:01.840 part of life. And in modern times, we spend an inordinate amount of time and attention and energy
00:07:09.780 and resources into tools and technology and mind numbing substances and activities to detach us
00:07:20.260 from the suffering that we will inevitably experience. And what a shame because we don't ever
00:07:28.960 really address the root of the issue, which is that there might be some areas of our life where we're
00:07:34.060 weak or we're deficient and we need to work on and we need to improve. And the suffering that we
00:07:41.020 experienced, although very painful and has some real world consequences is crucial to our own
00:07:50.320 development. And so I wrote down here a couple of things that, and I just wanted to share this
00:07:55.000 before we get into too many questions. Cause again, I think it'll help people.
00:07:58.180 And I don't want to just cover these and, and not really get into like the meat of it. But here's
00:08:07.080 what I said. Um, number one, I've talked honestly with my male friends about my struggles.
00:08:14.560 That is so crucial. And that is lacking from men today. They just don't have male friends.
00:08:19.280 Uh, number two is I work out six days per week and I've locked in my nutrition.
00:08:23.240 Number three, I journal every day about what I'm feeling and experiencing right now in the moment.
00:08:29.380 Uh, number four, I've gone back to church and I'm working to build my relationship with God.
00:08:33.060 Number five, I have focused on serving the people I love most in meaningful and caring ways.
00:08:39.380 So I know those sound like the textbook answers for fixing yourself and overcoming, overcoming
00:08:46.280 suffering, but there's a reason everybody shares those things is because they work.
00:08:50.940 So as we were talking about death and suffering, if you guys are feeling that, if you're going
00:08:55.660 through that yourself, mental, emotional, physical, spiritual suffering, struggle, work
00:09:01.100 on building your male friendships, train your body, get familiar with your stories by journaling,
00:09:07.040 develop a relationship with God and work to serve others. I'm telling you, I'm not sure where
00:09:12.420 I would be over the past five or six months. If I didn't have these tools and these frameworks
00:09:16.800 in place that fortunately we've developed over eight years, I think life would look drastically
00:09:22.320 different and significantly worse. So if you're struggling, I feel you. I think those things
00:09:28.720 will help you work on those five things every day.
00:09:32.380 Cool. Yeah. And if you're doing that, I was just going to say, maybe another call to action
00:09:37.880 is like, you know, make sure that you're staying connected to your, your group of guys as well.
00:09:42.660 You know, that first one's a tough one. It's probably one of the things that most of us don't
00:09:47.860 do. Um, and us reaching out, you know, and checking in on people is exactly what's needed,
00:09:55.640 you know, and they might just need someone to reach out to them, you know, to get the conversation
00:10:01.320 going. And so, you know, if you guys know guys, or you get that prompting or that gut feeling,
00:10:06.740 like, Hey, you know what? I should probably give Clint a call, act on it. Right. Don't,
00:10:12.540 don't avoid that prompting, you know, to reach out to someone. So, yeah, for sure. Well, there was
00:10:18.100 one other question that came in, uh, and I got this as an email. So I thought I'd read it. I'm
00:10:22.920 just going to say his first name because I'm not sure that he was submitting it for an ask me anything
00:10:27.060 as much as for me personally. So I don't want to blast that out there without his permission.
00:10:31.020 Disclosure. Yeah. But this, in fact, I'll change his name just for the sake of it is,
00:10:35.020 we'll just go by Jim. He says, like you, I refuse to identify as an alcoholic forever.
00:10:40.980 When I tried AA once, I felt pressured thinking I needed to openly identify as that if I wanted to
00:10:47.000 go, how do you handle this? For example, when you introduce yourself or when talking with others
00:10:52.040 in AA about this topic, not knowing how to resolve this issue has kept me from not going back.
00:10:57.860 Well, I think that's a problem. You're not going back because there's an expectation
00:11:02.140 or at least a perceived expectation about the way that you should show up and behave.
00:11:07.100 And you know what? Get over it. You're a man. You don't owe anybody anything. And so if you want
00:11:12.840 to go to AA and not introduce yourself in the standard, I am so-and-so I'm an alcoholic,
00:11:17.060 then you should not do that. Period. End of story. That's it. You don't need to explain it to anybody.
00:11:22.460 You don't need to feel bad for not saying that. You don't need to acquiesce and do that.
00:11:29.760 When I go, I don't say that because I'm not going to wrap up my identity around
00:11:36.960 being susceptible to alcohol. So if somebody else has an issue with it, so what? That's their own
00:11:43.940 personal journey. My own personal journey is something different. And maybe I've developed that
00:11:49.260 over years and years of doing this podcast and sharing my opinion and getting all sorts of
00:11:53.860 positive and negative feedback where I just don't care what you say anymore. I really don't.
00:11:59.860 I'll take what you say, positive and negative into consideration, but it's not going to impact me
00:12:04.920 in any meaningful and significant way because I know who I am. I know what I believe and I don't
00:12:11.360 make any apologies about it. That's where we need to get to. We need to get to that point. But I think
00:12:16.400 what a lot of men are missing, this goes well beyond the alcohol conversation, what a lot of
00:12:22.060 men are missing is who are you truly? How much time have you spent in thinking about these issues?
00:12:28.900 So for example, if Jim is saying, I don't identify as that. I don't feel like I am an alcoholic. I
00:12:36.100 don't want to use that verbiage. Then you should really explore why that's the case. And once you
00:12:41.200 really figure out why you feel that way, it becomes a whole lot easier. Exactly. You have
00:12:46.800 conviction, but you know, we're conditioned to do things, to behave a certain way, to say certain
00:12:52.880 things, to not say other things. And we've never really spent any time thinking about why we should
00:12:57.980 or should not do or say the things that society at large tells us to do and say. I'll tell you,
00:13:03.420 a convicted man is a man who knows who he is. He knows what he believes. He's poured over,
00:13:09.100 he's examined it, and he's put it to the test through action and realized that the way he sees
00:13:14.820 that world or the way he performs in this particular way is good for him. The fruit is
00:13:20.380 good. So he knows that the thought is good behind it. That's a man who's powerful. That's a man who
00:13:26.880 has confidence. That's a man who has conviction. I can't tell you how often I hear from guys who are
00:13:31.140 like, Hey, Ryan, man, I really appreciate your message. What you put out there, what you share
00:13:35.540 has helped strengthen me. Good. That's what we're trying to do. I want you to have a backbone. I
00:13:40.460 don't want you to be a flaccid little jellyfish floating in the ocean based on what the currents
00:13:46.440 and the tides are doing in the water. I want you to have a spine. I want you to have a backbone.
00:13:51.660 I want you to be able to navigate difficult conditions. I want you to go out and be a
00:13:55.400 predator and chase what you're after. I want that for you, but that requires thought and it requires
00:14:00.920 putting those thoughts to the test to really figure out, is this what I truly believe? And is
00:14:05.140 this the kind of man I'm going to be? So that's it. If you want to go to AA, go to AA and don't
00:14:12.980 introduce yourself like that. And that's okay. And if somebody asks you about it first, you don't owe
00:14:17.540 them an explanation. So if you're not interested in giving them an explanation, say this works better
00:14:21.820 for me on my journey. But if you are interested in sharing, then share exactly that. Hey, I don't share
00:14:27.520 that because I don't feel like I'm going to wrap up my identity in that. I consider myself susceptible
00:14:32.760 to alcohol abuse and that's what works for me. No apologies. I like it. All right. So we're going
00:14:43.520 to fill the questions from our iron council, from the foundry to learn more about the iron council,
00:14:49.140 go to orderofman.com slash iron council. Before we get into that and before we hit record, I asked Ryan
00:14:54.460 if we could cover a question that we actually covered last week with Sean from Matt Jenkins
00:14:59.940 around maintaining a masculine frame. I'll be fully authentic here. I didn't felt like I gave this
00:15:08.100 answer justice for Matt. And I thought it was such an important conversation. And Ryan, I think you
00:15:14.740 actually did a Friday field notes on this roughly about a year ago around maintaining masculine frame.
00:15:19.920 And so if you guys want kind of more detail, probably above and beyond what we're talking
00:15:24.240 about here, I can look up that episode, Ryan, if you want, as you, as you answer this question,
00:15:29.140 but you know, use that as a resource as well. But, but Matt's specific question was how to maintain
00:15:34.240 frame with a masculine frame with our spouse, but at the same time being humble, patient, and kind.
00:15:39.680 And so how do we, and I, I read a lot into this from like kind of a no more Mr. Nice guy mentality,
00:15:46.200 that struggle of being nice, but it going against our, our, our masculine ways. Right. And how do we
00:15:56.860 maintain that frame in a way that we're not undermining ourselves perhaps? Well, let's take
00:16:02.640 the terms you used humility, patience, and kindness. I don't really think those are odds with maintaining
00:16:08.860 your frame. I think those are probably something that will help you maintain your frame. Let's
00:16:13.440 talk about humility. Humility is realizing that you're not as good as you think you are. You don't
00:16:19.220 have everything figured out that there's other people around you who might have information or
00:16:23.680 ideas that can serve you or help others that people have something to contribute above and beyond what
00:16:29.400 you are contributing and that you're weak and flawed in some ways that actually is required for
00:16:34.980 maintaining frame. So for the reason I, I did that podcast whenever I did it was a while back was
00:16:41.500 because of the concept of maintaining your frame in jujitsu. You know, you don't, there's, there's
00:16:46.980 space in jujitsu. It's a game of space, right? You can probably speak more to this on it, on it than I
00:16:51.940 can, but it's a game of space. It's managing distance and managing the gaps in that distance.
00:16:57.540 So for example, if I want to get you off of me, you're mounted on top of me and I want to get you
00:17:04.440 off of me, a hip bump, you know, thrusting your hips up in the air might be enough to get you to 1.00
00:17:11.580 move up, but that's not where the space is created. The space is created when you go back down and in
00:17:17.700 that split second of you going up and me going down, there's a little bit of space. And what do we do
00:17:25.340 with that space? We have to fill it. And what do we fill it with? Well, we fill it with an elbow
00:17:30.320 or you fill it with your, if you can slide your knee out or your foot, you know, something you're
00:17:35.040 trying to block that space so you can maintain frame and keep that guy from advancing his position.
00:17:40.760 And it's the same thing in life. You want to maintain that frame. You don't want anything
00:17:45.640 to come in and derail you from your goals and your objectives. But in order to maintain frame,
00:17:52.300 you need to realize where the threat is. And one of the threats might be that you are deficient
00:17:58.140 in a particular thing. Maybe you're impatient. Matt used patience. Maybe you're impatient. So
00:18:05.000 humility is realizing that you're an impatient person. And now you start to uncover where that
00:18:10.700 impatience is coming from. For me, I can tell you exactly what it is. Mismanagement of my time and
00:18:16.320 schedule. That's when I get impatient. And I'm impatient. But I've noticed that when I schedule
00:18:22.880 my time and my day appropriately, patience isn't an issue. Because even as things come up, it's like,
00:18:31.040 yeah, I figured that would come up. And I created a little bit of gap here in my schedule. So I have
00:18:35.840 time to deal with that and address that. It's when I'm stacked up to my eyeballs and tasks and
00:18:40.640 projects and everything's coming at me a million miles an hour. And I didn't plan out my day
00:18:45.040 effectively. And the first thing I did is I hit snooze on my alarm instead of getting up and going
00:18:49.780 to the gym. And now I'm 30 minutes late from the gym because I got out of bed 30 minutes late.
00:18:55.480 You see how this happens? Mismanagement of time. So humility and maintaining a frame now is, okay,
00:19:02.860 I realized that if I don't get out of bed, I lose a half an hour a day. And that translates to
00:19:07.480 everything else. And then guess who I take it out on? My wife and my kids. That's what every man does.
00:19:12.360 So instead, I'm going to be humble enough to realize that I need to actually get out of bed
00:19:17.720 on time and stick to my schedule and stick to my commitments so that I can serve people without
00:19:25.700 being impatient. It might also mean that you need to say no to some things. Or when you have a deadline
00:19:32.880 and somebody calls you, here's a simple one. Let's say you have an appointment at noon and you know
00:19:40.360 you're about to get on this call and somebody calls you on the phone and you're like, oh,
00:19:44.340 I'll just take this really quick. You know better. You know better. You know that conversation is going
00:19:50.900 to take 15 minutes or longer. And so what's that going to do to your other appointment? It's going
00:19:55.740 to jack up your schedule. And it's not fair to that person who actually set the schedule with you.
00:20:00.480 So what you do is you hit decline. That's it. You know, if you want to send a custom message that
00:20:08.520 says, hey, I got to call it at noon, I'll call you back at one o'clock. Fine, whatever. But don't
00:20:14.260 take the call. You know, set those boundaries. That's maintaining your frame. Set those boundaries
00:20:19.640 up. Now people will say, oh man, I just feel bad about doing that. Right. Because you're being weak.
00:20:25.140 This goes back to what we were saying before. You haven't thought about what you value. Which to me
00:20:31.340 is being a man who's respectable, who honors his commitments. And if I'm late and it happens,
00:20:36.880 I was late to this call, Kip. If I'm late, it does happen. But you don't make it a regular thing.
00:20:44.080 It should be an anomaly. So I don't really think that being humble and patient and kind. Well,
00:20:52.320 here's an interesting on kindness. So let's take that scenario. Well, I'll feel bad if I don't take
00:20:57.800 this call. I've, you know, I've got this other call and I'll feel bad about this. So I'm not being
00:21:01.700 very kind. Well, no, by taking it, you're actually not being kind to the person who was intelligent
00:21:06.540 enough to schedule a meeting with you three, four days earlier. What about that person? You're
00:21:11.280 disrespecting that person. So why does the guy who needs, needs you right now, take precedent over the
00:21:16.220 guy who said, hey, let's set something up. He was, at least he respected you enough to set something up.
00:21:21.040 Yeah. So there's trade-offs here. And when you're, you're saying, well, you know,
00:21:27.020 we're, we talk about this in the iron council, you know, is, is it kind to see one of our brothers 0.99
00:21:32.560 struggling and then, you know, rub his balls and make him feel bad about, or excuse me, better about 0.98
00:21:38.540 his deficiencies. Like, is that kind? No, it's the antithesis of that. You know, what's kind 1.00
00:21:45.300 getting in his face, you know, depending on the situation saying you can do better.
00:21:50.280 And I know you can, because I've seen you do better. How can I support you?
00:21:55.260 People say, oh, that's harsh. That's mean. I can't believe, oh, it's contentious. Yeah. Well,
00:22:00.300 maybe that's exactly what that person needs. Maybe that guy needs some accountability.
00:22:04.780 Maybe no one's ever gotten his face. You know, when I started talking to go back to alcoholism,
00:22:08.820 when I started talking about this with some friends, you know what? I had a couple of friends
00:22:12.140 were like, oh yeah, I knew. I knew. What? And you didn't say anything? Well, I didn't,
00:22:20.620 I didn't know how to bring it up and I didn't want to encroach. You know what all of that is?
00:22:24.420 And, you know, bless my friends. I don't want to throw them under the bus too much,
00:22:27.760 but you know what that is? That's, that's selfishness. That's what that is.
00:22:35.240 They're avoiding the conflict with the uncomfortableness of having the conversation
00:22:38.880 is what they're avoiding. It has nothing to do with me. If you cared more about me than you
00:22:45.060 cared about you in that situation, you would have said what needed to be said. Now I'm not blaming
00:22:50.700 them for my choices. So let's not misconstrue that. My choices are my choices, but those friends have
00:22:56.900 their choices too. And if you care about somebody, you better do what needs to be done. So at least
00:23:03.360 at a minimum, you can look yourself in the eye and you can say, hey, you know what? He didn't take my
00:23:07.720 advice, but I gave it to him because he needed it. But it's selfish to look at another man struggling
00:23:13.760 and say, ah, I don't want to bring it up. Ah, it's awkward. What if this, what if that? What if
00:23:18.440 you don't say anything? And the next time that guy goes and gets drunk, he decides to drive down
00:23:23.620 the road and he kills himself or somebody else. What then? And are you culpable in that? I mean,
00:23:29.600 it's not your fault, but I would say that would be something that would tear me up if I was in that
00:23:36.400 situation. Yeah. And would you say at the root of taking action in the, in that example is being
00:23:44.660 clear on what you stand for? That and love. Like you're, you're talking about somebody talking to
00:23:56.840 another friend. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Overcoming that natural tendency, that and love being clear on
00:24:03.280 what's valuable to you and, and really loving someone. Yeah. Because if you don't know what
00:24:07.220 you stand for, then any behavior is acceptable. Yeah. Right. So Kip, and I'm not saying this is you
00:24:13.040 by any means, but if I know that you're having some fidelity issues in your marriage, I don't stand for
00:24:19.280 that. That's personally, that's not okay with me. And I know it's not okay with you either. Okay. So that,
00:24:25.640 that has been maintained. Now I love you. I care about you. I want you to win. So it's my
00:24:32.020 responsibility to bring it up. Now, if you blow up and you explode, look, your reaction is your reaction.
00:24:37.660 It doesn't matter on me. That's on you. Right. And if, you know what, if, if I lose my friendship with
00:24:43.920 you, because I bring that up to you, that to me is worth the trade-off. It really is. Your friendship
00:24:53.800 is, I'll say it this way. My care for you is more important than our so-called friendship.
00:25:02.860 Yeah. Yeah. It's deeper than that. Yeah. I like this, Ryan. One thing that, yeah,
00:25:08.860 in some leadership training I do for our employees is around accountability conversations. And one
00:25:14.540 thing that I've stole from that training that I think is profound is we often don't have the
00:25:21.480 uncomfortable conversations because we've jumped to the conclusion of what will probably happen
00:25:27.780 versus pausing and saying, should something be said? Yes or no. Period. If the answer is yes,
00:25:36.440 then tactically determine, all right, I know I have to say something period end of sentence. Now,
00:25:43.500 how do I do it in a manner that's effective? But we don't do that. We immediately go, well,
00:25:48.260 I don't want to say something to Ryan. Why? Because he'll blah, blah, blah. Like, oh, stop.
00:25:52.100 Should you say something? Yes or no? Yep. And if the answer is yes, then your job is to figure it out.
00:25:58.960 Right. Right. And how do you do it effectively?
00:26:01.360 I actually had this scenario, this exact scenario happen when I wanted to tell guys in the iron council
00:26:08.580 about me overcoming this alcohol issue. And I thought long and hard about it. You know,
00:26:15.440 if I tell these guys, you know, I'm going to have a mass exodus, I'm going to lose trust,
00:26:19.900 just like you're saying. But I came to the conclusion that in order for me to get back
00:26:24.880 in integrity with myself and other people, that it had to be said. And the result didn't actually
00:26:32.040 matter. I mean, it matters. I'm not saying, but it's not a factor as to whether or not I should
00:26:39.240 have said it, which is why I made the decision to say it. Yeah. I like it. What are your thoughts
00:26:45.540 around that people will fight against this? Right. Like when I think, when I think about the typical
00:26:54.540 conversation around maintaining like your frame, like you're going to get pushback even from your
00:27:01.840 spouse and your kids and friends around standing behind the things that you know are important and
00:27:09.860 that you value, um, any thoughts around that? Like how do we, how do we navigate those waters or
00:27:16.220 any strategies there? Yeah. You just prepare people for it. Uh, so let's go back to our jujitsu
00:27:21.980 analogy. If, um, so I'm trying to maintain frame, establish a frame, keep you away from getting a better
00:27:27.880 position on me. Uh, if I do that with you, Kip, it's because there's an understanding of this is
00:27:33.820 how the game is played. I'm going to try to advance. Ryan's going to try to keep me from
00:27:37.000 advancing. He's going to try to advance. I'm going to try to keep him from advancing. The rules are
00:27:41.680 well-established. Yeah. But if a new guy comes into the gym and he's never trained before, and I throw
00:27:51.220 him around like a rag doll because I'm trying to maintain frame and, and win and submit, I'm strangling
00:27:56.140 him and choking him and doing all these things, but he doesn't know the rules. That's not fair.
00:28:01.680 That's not right. And so how does that translate over into a relationship? For example, well, if
00:28:06.260 you've established rules, but you haven't communicated the rules to your wife, and then you
00:28:10.580 just start abiding by them and hoping that she will abide by them. That's not fair to her. That's
00:28:16.040 not proper. That's not what a good husband would do. Same thing with your children. If on the other
00:28:19.820 hand, you have some things that you want in place, like here's how I expect to be treated.
00:28:24.760 Here's how we will communicate. Here's how we will talk to each other. Here are the consequences.
00:28:29.640 If we don't do that and you articulate the rules, now the decision is theirs.
00:28:35.920 If you want to engage with me, you have to abide by these rules. If you do not abide by these rules,
00:28:41.320 you do not engage with me. It's very simple. I'm no longer making the choice. The other party's
00:28:47.560 deciding, but you actually have to stick with it too. And that's the most challenging thing
00:28:51.360 is that once the people know the expectation, they've agreed to it,
00:28:55.640 then once they break or even get up to that line, fire a warning shot if you need to.
00:29:02.460 But if they cross that line, you have to abide by that rule and that consequence of that rule.
00:29:08.400 Yeah.
00:29:08.460 So be careful of consequences you're making too. If you say, for example, yeah, Ryan, I'm going to set
00:29:13.720 up boundaries. My wife has really been talking to me poorly and I won't have it anymore. If she does, 0.99
00:29:17.800 then I'm going to get a divorce. It's like, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa. Like if you say that the odds
00:29:24.100 of her mistreating you are pretty high, because that's what we do to each other in marriages at 0.98
00:29:28.140 times. So the first time she calls you a name or says something or does something you don't like
00:29:34.680 towards you, you're going to get a divorce. Like, so what does that do? Number one, that's a bad,
00:29:39.220 that's a bad rule. It's not appropriate. And number two, it sets you up for failure because now
00:29:45.040 you have to, you have to retreat on your boundary. And then she knows it's not a boundary.
00:29:51.480 Totally. Well, and, and I was reading a, I was reading a book around parenting and how critical
00:29:57.160 it is that trustworthiness is super critical, right? For kids literally from a stability and,
00:30:03.260 and safety perspective that you're consistent as parents. And it's ironic is because I've always
00:30:08.440 felt that like, Oh, we will, you need to be consistent with like good things. No, we need to be
00:30:13.860 consistent even with the negative consequences to, to maintain your integrity. You have to keep those
00:30:21.760 boundaries and you have to see them through, even if they're negative, because what, what,
00:30:26.380 what are you then establishing the really quick, quick, quick, quick story. You remember Hunter
00:30:30.980 Locke? I see old school, I see guy, captain Locke. I remember we had a hard rule on echo.
00:30:37.540 You're on, you're on every call Tuesday. And I, and when I took over, it's like everyone committed,
00:30:44.660 you will be on these calls every Tuesday. And the commitment was yes. Right. And we had some
00:30:48.840 conversations for guys that struggle with that commitment. I remember I get a text on Tuesday
00:30:53.520 earlier in the day from Hunter saying, Hey, can't get on kit. Uh, me and the wife been fighting,
00:30:59.700 uh, we're resolving it. We're going to go on date night tonight. And I replied back to him. I said,
00:31:05.600 Hey, you made your commitment that you'd be on the call at seven. I hope you'll honor your
00:31:11.320 commitments. And I just love it as that he was on the call. And, and, and, and if you asked him why
00:31:18.540 he's on the call, he was like, this is part of the problem. Yeah. This is part of the problem with
00:31:24.460 his wife is that he's not honoring his commitments. And what is he teaching his wife? When, when he
00:31:31.540 goes, eh, you know what? Let me, let me undermine this commitment for you right now. Let me not be
00:31:37.140 a man of integrity. Let me, which was the very thing that they're arguing over. Yeah. I can already
00:31:43.640 hear people. Oh, well, he's trying to date us. We should let him go on a date. I can already hear
00:31:48.260 people making excuses. And this is why we're so pathetic and weak, especially among men. I think that 1.00
00:31:53.840 doesn't happen. And what area of society does a man say that? Like, Hey, we, you made a commitment
00:31:59.020 to seven. I'll help you be there. Just doesn't happen, man. And that's why we're so pathetic.
00:32:04.440 You know, the one thing I like that story, another story that I'm guilty of is we'll be driving on a 0.98
00:32:10.160 vacation. For example, you know, we're, we're heading down to Costa Rica, like we did a couple of
00:32:13.820 months ago or a month ago. And, uh, and, you know, the kids will get out of line and be like, Hey,
00:32:19.220 you don't shape up. We're not even going on vacation. Come on now. Yeah. That's one of those
00:32:27.120 bad rules. Cause you don't, those little kids have call you out on that shit. You're not going to 1.00
00:32:32.660 cancel. So, uh, mind your tongue. I would say, be very aware of what you're saying. Even if it's a
00:32:42.260 threat like that, let's find out, let's find out if that's real. And then they're going to test it.
00:32:46.580 And of course it's not real. And they're going to call your bluff. And then you just undermined
00:32:51.380 yourself. Yep. All right. Let's drive on that one. All right. Murray Dixon. I've been working
00:32:58.700 in the same field of a bicycle mechanic and retail for almost 10 years with my family,
00:33:03.980 growing two kids and a third due soon. Congratulations, Murray. I need to earn more
00:33:08.460 while I still find joy in work. I, I like how he said that I've looked to entrepreneurship in this
00:33:13.920 area to move forward in my career, but the opportunities have not been too great. My next
00:33:18.780 option is to make a pivot and change career. I'm meeting with a company this weekend to potentially
00:33:22.940 start an apprenticeship in farm equipment and diesel mechanics, which one qualified would open up
00:33:28.760 opportunities, but means me moving to rural, to a rural town. Do you have advice on starting over
00:33:35.000 and being the best employee I can be in a completely different field and on moving a young family to a
00:33:40.580 rural spot where you have only a few contacts? My family and I have been taking great confidence
00:33:45.320 from yours and others example about moving to rural areas and taking the let's find out mentality over
00:33:51.620 the what if I'm sick of saying what if. Yeah. So, I mean, Hey, first take some balls to start
00:34:00.960 considering that option. And I don't want to congratulate you right now because you haven't
00:34:04.940 done anything, but you're moving the needle towards doing some things. And that's pretty cool. And I'm
00:34:10.800 excited to see how that turns out because most people are like, ah, I can't do that. And then they just
00:34:15.100 barely scrape by with their finances, living where they're living because things are comfortable and
00:34:18.800 easy, at least somewhat. So, I commend you on, on at least moving the needle in that direction.
00:34:25.600 As far as the work and starting over. Yeah. I think, you know, what we've said before is be humble,
00:34:31.200 be receptive, be curious. That's a concept I love. Just, just a level of curiosity about the
00:34:38.980 business and what's going on. I would also say pursue excellence. This is something I've been
00:34:44.560 thinking a lot about as well. You know, when you're at the gym in the morning, do you hurry
00:34:48.220 and do your deadlifts or you do, you do them with excellence. We all know what that means.
00:34:53.200 You wear the proper attire. You've got your, your hydration or your pre-workout, like whatever your
00:35:00.020 routine is. You're in there. You're, you've stretched, you're ready to go. You step up to the
00:35:05.180 bar. You look for all of your cues on the proper lift. You do it correctly. If your form breaks down,
00:35:11.900 you'd maybe take a little bit of weight off. I know that's hard to do, but you do that because
00:35:15.860 you're pursuing excellence. And I think if you're pursuing excellence in your job or in your marriage
00:35:23.240 or in your fitness or in your spiritual journey, it's going to be hard for you to not succeed.
00:35:30.020 I mean, it truly is. So look for excellence. I think about that when I get into people's cars,
00:35:36.960 sometimes, you know, they're thrashed and they got garbage and trash everywhere. And it's just chaotic.
00:35:43.520 And I can't help, but wonder is this person reaching their full potential and other avenues
00:35:48.800 of their life. I can probably, I don't know, we should do a scientific experiment, but I could
00:35:53.360 probably tell you by spending 30 seconds in your car about how you're performing in the rest of your
00:35:58.660 life. If your car is kind of dirty, you know, but not a whole lot, just kind of dirty, but you know,
00:36:03.880 you can tell you kind of maybe take care of it, do maintenance on it, you know, but it's probably
00:36:07.400 30 or 60 days after your life's probably mediocre. If your car is impeccable and it's vacuumed and
00:36:15.740 it's clean and the tank is full and you open the glove box and it's got, you know, just it's all
00:36:21.420 ordered and there's no trash in the center console, it's either new or your life. The rest of your life
00:36:27.400 is excellent. Yeah. If you got, if you got Burger King, Big Mac Whopper trash lying all over everything
00:36:37.140 and, you know, gum on the carpet and gunk and stuff like soda sprayed up and on the ceiling. And
00:36:44.760 I mean, I'm pretty certain that's translating to other avenues of your life. So I'd be really curious
00:36:50.920 on that. But I think if we pursue excellence,
00:36:55.820 you can't help, but when I'm looking at it right now, like see this light right here,
00:37:01.140 this light, it doesn't usually look like that because it's dangling down. That's not excellent.
00:37:09.000 I need to fix that because if we're talking about pursuing excellence,
00:37:13.360 that's what that means. Excellent. And the more you can do that, the better off you are.
00:37:18.060 Now, as far as the second part of the question, which was advice for moving into a new town.
00:37:23.900 Yeah. Support system is going to be huge. I mean, immerse yourself into the culture.
00:37:29.980 That means finding a church. That means going to the gym or maybe training jujitsu.
00:37:36.320 Maybe there's a woman's group and that usually can be found through church, through exercise. 1.00
00:37:41.860 That's the easiest way. That's how we've met your neighbors. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good
00:37:46.660 one. Like go out and actually, you know how you hope people would welcome you to the neighborhood.
00:37:51.320 You go do that. Like maybe bake a plate of cookies and say, Hey, like I'm, I just moved in. I'm your
00:37:57.620 next door neighbor. Thought we'd bring this over and then invite, if they're a family, you know,
00:38:01.940 invite husband, wife, and kids over to the house, like take the initiative to immerse yourself,
00:38:07.520 to assimilate as they would call it into the environment and not expect and hope that people
00:38:12.860 would do that. I mean, you can, but why have that fault, faulty expectation? You go out and take the
00:38:18.840 initiative to immerse yourself and create the network, create the community that will really help.
00:38:23.180 Hmm. Greg Cleaver, as a man, I'm a firm believer in being vulnerable and completely transparent with
00:38:31.040 myself for the purpose of self-discovery and growth. When it comes to what I choose to share
00:38:36.200 with my girlfriend, I'm finding it doesn't always seem to be beneficial to share my deepest fears,
00:38:42.480 insecurities, and struggles. I find when I do this, it often results in a lack of confidence on the part
00:38:48.360 of my partner in my masculinity and strength. Are there things you would advocate not sharing with
00:38:54.640 your intimate partner? Uh, not what I would share, but how I would share it. Yeah. Uh, timing is
00:39:07.260 important. The way that you communicate it is important, but I do think it is important that
00:39:13.120 you open up to your spouse. And I used to believe that, you know, you should burden her with your
00:39:20.240 feelings and what you're struggling with. And I don't, I don't actually don't think that's true.
00:39:25.180 That's something that's changed for me. I don't think it's a burden for you to explain how you feel
00:39:30.700 about things. I think she probably wants to hear about that. I think she wants to be connected that way,
00:39:35.820 but she also doesn't want to bumbling buffoon as a husband who can't get over himself and work 0.94
00:39:41.700 towards solving his problems. So I think sharing is a crucial part of any relationship, but I would
00:39:50.820 ask myself a couple of questions. Number one, why am I sharing this? If it's so that she'll, you know,
00:40:01.180 make you feel better about yourself, that's probably not a great motive for being quote
00:40:05.880 unquote vulnerable with your spouse. Cause it's really not her job to make you feel good about
00:40:09.800 yourself. And what you are doing when you do that is you're putting a lot of responsibility or the
00:40:14.860 burden, like you said, on her to do work. Yeah. So a good reason would be so that she understands
00:40:22.460 why you might be off the last several weeks, because if you don't share these things with her,
00:40:29.200 she's going to see that you're off assumptions. Yeah. Yeah. And she's like, is, does he love me?
00:40:33.900 Is he cheating on me? Like, what's he doing? What's the problem? And she's going to start 1.00
00:40:38.520 filling in those blanks with things that are probably not accurate. So I think a healthy
00:40:43.760 exercise would be to, Hey hon, I've know I've been off the last couple of months or last couple of
00:40:48.820 weeks. And I want to share with you why that's the case and what I'm experiencing so that, you know,
00:40:54.380 where I'm coming from. Um, so that's the why there's the how to, which is you don't just complain.
00:41:03.280 Like we don't, men don't vent at least they shouldn't. I don't think entirely just vent
00:41:10.640 on their spouses. I think we can do that with other men a little bit more than we can with our
00:41:15.900 spouses, which is why it's important. You build up a male relationship, um, relationships with males. 0.94
00:41:21.180 Uh, but I think when you're talking with your wife about the issues is it would be more something
00:41:28.940 like this. Hey, on, I know I've been off for the last couple of weeks. And the reason is,
00:41:33.780 is because work has been very stressful. Uh, we're about to hit this deadline. Um, our boss is not
00:41:40.260 very happy with things right now and how it's going. And to be honest, I'm a little scared and
00:41:44.540 worried that we're going to make the deadline or that even if we do, this is going to be an effective
00:41:48.480 project. So I just want to let you know, that's where I'm at, but let me tell you, uh, I'm going
00:41:55.600 to put in, uh, two nights a week, a little bit of extra work just so we make sure we hit the deadline.
00:42:01.380 Um, I've communicated with my boss about my expectations as this project has developed.
00:42:07.080 And, uh, we're, we've brought in a couple of other advisors or their team members to shore this up.
00:42:12.300 So we're working on it, but I just want to let you know where I'm coming from. Like how much more
00:42:17.120 powerful is that for a woman to hear than I've been scared and I don't know what's going to happen
00:42:22.380 in the world's going to be over as opposed to I'm scared. I'm a little nervous and here's what we're
00:42:27.140 doing to resolve it. Right. Yeah. So I would say be more inclined to do that than just dump it all over
00:42:34.460 her. Yeah. I like it. Rick Donovan described the difference between today's Ryan versus six months
00:42:42.760 ago, Ryan. So you're a personal growth in the last six months. Yeah. I'm leaner. I'm sober. Focus is
00:42:50.780 there. Uh, clarity is there. I've been doing a lot of work about, you know, where do my, where do my
00:42:56.680 stories and the narrative of my life and the way that I think about life and the way that I show up for
00:43:02.400 people, like, where does that stem from? That's those have been powerful exercises because they
00:43:07.860 happen whether you're aware of it or not. The way that I respond to you is happening. I just may or
00:43:16.300 may not be aware of why it's happening the way that it is. So these types of exercises have been very
00:43:20.900 powerful. Um, I'm trying to get more in, in line with how I feel about things. Uh, and again, where does
00:43:28.640 that stem from? Cause my, my feelings is, these are things that I have not really explored all that
00:43:34.540 much in my life. And I've been thinking, you know, sadness or sorrow or anger or frustration. Are these,
00:43:40.900 are these things okay to feel and experience? Yeah, they are, but we should know why we're experiencing
00:43:46.100 them and where they're coming from so that we have some feedback on the way that we can improve
00:43:52.200 ourselves and our lives moving forward. That's been helpful. Um, a little bit more clear on my
00:43:58.640 priorities, you know, on making sure that my schedule aligns with my priorities and also a lot more
00:44:04.840 forward thinking about what kind of person I need to be, uh, when I'm presented with, uh, an option of
00:44:12.020 how I behave or how I show up or what I do, which is literally hundreds of times a day. I try to ask
00:44:17.220 myself, what would the man that I want to be do in this situation? So a lot more conscious and aware
00:44:23.900 of that. And yeah, all of those things have given me a level of, of clarity and focus. And in the
00:44:29.180 midst of really challenging times in my life over the past several months, I just can't help but think,
00:44:34.780 where would I be if I didn't do this? Where would I be if I didn't have these tools? It would be
00:44:39.820 really, really dire situation. And fortunately I'm not there because I have the tools and because
00:44:47.780 I'm exercising the tools that I've failed to exercise in the past. Yeah. You know, one thing
00:44:53.960 I've noticed that I think is a by-product of you kind of doing that more deeper work in regards to
00:45:01.040 understanding, you know, your stories is, and maybe I'm just picking this up. I don't know, but
00:45:06.380 your level of empathy and understanding has changed as well. And I think it's because the
00:45:14.940 more we understand ourselves, the more we're capable of understanding others and their actions.
00:45:20.700 And I, and I think that is, I don't know for whatever, I don't have evidence of why I feel
00:45:26.060 that way, but I, I, I see that in, in your language or in our conversations more as well.
00:45:31.440 Well, I know, I know I'm not as angry. I was very angry and it was slipping out. Like it was,
00:45:40.000 it was slipping out in weird ways, you know, even on social media and the way that I would respond
00:45:45.300 to people on social media and just how I felt there was like frustration and contention and
00:45:50.100 anger. And a lot of that might've been the alcoholism or the results of the alcohol. Like
00:45:54.940 it was just angry. And I'm not, I'm not, I'm not angry. Um, but I also see,
00:46:00.560 you know, over these past six months or so with what I've, what I've experienced.
00:46:09.960 Sometimes I don't want to talk about it. Like I just want to, I just want to deal with it on my own,
00:46:14.800 which I think we should be capable of dealing with things to some degree on our own.
00:46:19.240 But then I got thinking, man, this is of course how everybody else feels. And there are so many
00:46:27.000 men out there who are struggling with substance abuse, pornography, drug addiction, guilt-ridden
00:46:37.700 past that they can't get over, fidelity issues, medical challenges, financial struggles,
00:46:46.380 being cut off spiritually from, from having that, that spiritual component of their life.
00:46:52.820 And all of us are doing it alone. And so when I look at, when I look at you or somebody else who
00:46:59.500 maybe says something to me that I don't like, or does something that, you know, rubs me the wrong way.
00:47:05.280 I really am trying to say, you know what, I don't know what's going on in that guy's life.
00:47:10.440 Like, I don't, I don't know what he's dealing with right now. And maybe the way that he's
00:47:14.560 communicating with me is a by-product of what he might be suffering from. And there are a lot of
00:47:20.580 guys suffering. So I don't know. I feel like giving guys the benefit of the doubt, at least trying to
00:47:26.580 do that. There's, it's two, twofold. Number one, I think it's better for them that we're not so harsh
00:47:33.700 and critical, the judgmental. Uh, and number two, it's just made me more pleasant person.
00:47:41.960 You know, like, so here's a, here's an example. I took my boys, uh, to South Carolina for Sorenx
00:47:48.180 outdoors winter strong with this last weekend. And we got on the plane yesterday and the ticketing
00:47:55.100 agent, as I was getting on board, she says, here's your ticket. We moved it around. So you can have an
00:47:58.700 aisle seat. You can sit next to your boys, but nobody's going to be sitting next to you. They're going to be
00:48:02.420 sitting across the aisle and you'll be sitting on the other side of the aisle. I said, Oh, great.
00:48:05.880 Thanks for doing that. And she said, nobody's going to be sitting next to you. And I'm sitting
00:48:10.920 there and they were getting close to boarding the, finishing boarding the plane. And this woman comes
00:48:14.880 in and she's, she's heavy, she's obese. And she comes in, she's like, Hey, I'm sitting in that seat, 0.97
00:48:19.880 which was the window seat. I'm like, you know, and she, she was, she was significantly obese so much so
00:48:26.820 that the aisle, the armrest thing, could it lower all the way? Cause it was like resting on
00:48:33.620 the fat on her hips or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. So it wouldn't even lower all the way. So it was like, 1.00
00:48:38.900 it was snug. And six months ago I would have been put out. I would have been so judgmental about it.
00:48:48.680 I would have been, you know, mocking her not to her face, of course, but you know,
00:48:52.840 in your mind, Jim, in my mind, or even in my boys, you know, or I, and then I would just be
00:48:58.460 kind of miserable on the plane. And you know, what's like, now, do I think that's a healthy
00:49:05.220 lifestyle? No, but I don't know what she's dealing with. I don't, I don't know. I maybe,
00:49:10.420 maybe her mom just died. And, and so she's, you know, she's let herself go or maybe she just lost
00:49:17.760 her husband. I really, I have no idea. And it's not really my place to judge that. I have to say
00:49:25.760 that I personally don't want to live my life like that. And I don't think other people should live
00:49:29.920 their life like that. I think we should be healthy. I don't know what's going on with her
00:49:33.560 and she's a human being. And you know what? She was sitting there and she was crocheting
00:49:38.320 and she, like, I talked to her for a little bit. The blanket she was making was beautiful.
00:49:43.580 She was a really pleasant lady. And like, that's it. And so I had to suffer a little bit
00:49:49.760 because the armrest wasn't all the way down between us. Like what a silly thing that we
00:49:55.120 would get worked up about in the past. So I appreciate you saying that. And I certainly
00:49:58.780 feel more patient, more empathetic. Um, and I'm just not miserable. I don't want to be miserable
00:50:04.200 and I'm not. So I feel good about that. Cool. I like it, man. Good job. Good work. All right.
00:50:11.600 Joe Mercado. I've been working for a replacement window company for five years. I put in long hours
00:50:17.280 and dedicated myself to learning to be better leader and manager for myself, employees in the
00:50:22.520 company. What do you do when your two managers don't communicate with you unless there is a
00:50:28.460 problem and that every idea that you pitch to them is always answered with a no. Um, our company
00:50:35.560 culture is built by growing others and taking, uh, and take your place someday. But these two
00:50:40.200 managers aren't helping me grow. I'm starting to see that no matter how great my side of the
00:50:45.380 operation is, the only feedback I'm getting is when I do, uh, when I didn't do as well as I did on the
00:50:51.000 previous month. I love the company and the people I lead and I want to stay, but this relationship with
00:50:55.620 my managers isn't motivating. And if it wasn't doing well, I would already be replaced, but I
00:51:00.960 continue to do my best. So they know, so they know have no reason to note last year. I, I, I won the
00:51:09.420 leadership award, which was voted by the people of the operations. Thanks. Yeah. So I'll go back to
00:51:16.260 the empathy thing. Uh, and I'll just speak from personal experience as a leader. It's easy not to
00:51:26.360 focus on the people who are doing really good. Probably super easy. Like Kip, you're doing a
00:51:32.820 great job. Default behavior. You're doing a great job. Like I don't need to worry about this. Like
00:51:38.040 everything's fine. And then as a leader, we focus our energy and attention on the people who are
00:51:42.960 struggling or the areas or departments in your case that might be struggling. And that's unfortunate.
00:51:48.920 And that's the fallout of, of being good at things. You're not going to get praise. You're
00:51:58.180 not going to get accolades. You're not going to get attention and energy. You're not going to get
00:52:03.200 people's time and resources. You're just not because you're good at your job and you have to come to that
00:52:11.180 realization and then ask yourself, am I doing this because I want the praise and the accolades and the
00:52:17.680 admiration and the attention and the rewards and the whatever, or am I doing this because it's who
00:52:23.600 I am? It's intrinsically internally the way that I work and you can do it regardless of if you're
00:52:30.760 getting attention or not. And I don't know what that is for you. I'm just telling you that maybe
00:52:38.740 you're running up against that. Now, how can we, how can we assert ourselves in the situation a little
00:52:43.980 bit more? Try to see it from your boss's perspective. You know, what other departments
00:52:51.420 are they struggling with? And is that getting a lot of their time and attention and energy? If it is,
00:52:57.240 then maybe you have a reason as to why that's the case. I'm not saying it makes it okay. I'm just
00:53:01.140 saying now, you know, at least what's going on and you have some context around why you're not getting
00:53:05.960 the attention you'd like to have. Um, also it might create some opportunities for you to see
00:53:12.360 things that will actually help them. So instead of saying, Oh man, like I just want them to
00:53:18.780 acknowledge and see what I'm doing. Maybe in their, in their briefings or their discussions
00:53:25.120 or their communications with you, you can actually see problems and challenges that you can begin to
00:53:30.380 shore up that they're not even really communicating with you. That now is an opportunity for you to serve
00:53:37.120 and help in a way that would actually be beneficial for them. That might be something you can do.
00:53:43.480 And the third thing I'll say on this is doing the right thing. Just like we were saying earlier,
00:53:49.040 being excellent is always the right thing to do. And you know, what's going to happen by you being
00:53:55.860 excellent. Either you're going to continue to advance and get promoted, or you're going to find
00:54:01.700 other work. Like it's just, it's inevitable. But if you start slacking and you start speaking ill of
00:54:09.940 your managers and you start not taking your job seriously, cause maybe they don't, then you will
00:54:15.420 not get the same level of opportunity and growth that you would if you did it with excellence. So keep
00:54:21.360 doing it with excellence. Keep networking. That's huge. Too many men under network. It's just an
00:54:28.120 underutilized skill that, that we could develop all a little bit more. Keep networking, build your
00:54:34.840 connection, work with your clients, get introductions, make introductions. And that's actually what's going
00:54:39.740 to create opportunities for you inside and outside of the business. Yeah. The only thought I had is
00:54:47.860 we try to promote a culture where people are self-directed, not motivated, self-directed.
00:54:56.200 They, they, they know what winning looks like and they execute and they win. If I'm a manager
00:55:03.120 and I have an employee, it's like, oh man, I, I'm not motivated. I need more motivation from you.
00:55:10.720 That's a, that's a problem. So be careful that, cause that was in your language. I think you said
00:55:15.280 something like, I'm not motivated by them or whatever. Did you back to kind of what Ryan said
00:55:20.100 earlier, you got to be self-directed. Why are you doing this? Because you care because you care
00:55:25.440 about the quality of work. Cause it's an outward representation of who you are as a man. That's
00:55:30.200 why you care. Right. And you're going to get after it and you're going to do amazing work because
00:55:33.700 that's how you show up in the world. Not because you're motivated to do so. And that's, and, and,
00:55:40.740 and that's less stress, right? Let's be frank. And I agree. I don't do this very well either. I'm
00:55:46.700 really bad at telling my employees that they're doing good, right? Like I, it's only usually when
00:55:51.900 there's a problem that I give feedback and I need to work on that. And that's not an excuse,
00:55:56.180 but most managers and leaders, there's, there's time issues, right? There's time management problems
00:56:03.480 and they don't have a lot of time. Right. And so the more time you require to be a good employee
00:56:10.640 from me, the less effective employee you are in my mind. Cause now I got to constantly motivate you.
00:56:17.260 I got to baby you. I got to, man, you got it. You got to jump in. Like you're the owner of the
00:56:21.980 company, be self-directed and execute, keep them informed. And then there's some opportunity here to
00:56:27.760 maybe have some open communication and ask, have some asks, you know, can I get, I get a follow-up
00:56:35.760 with you once a month or in our one-on-ones, you know, I'd like to understand what am I doing well?
00:56:41.660 What areas am I doing good at? So I can make sure I continue to do those things. Like
00:56:45.540 ask, you know, and have that conversation with them. If you're not getting the proper feedback,
00:56:51.400 ask for the proper feedback and make that part of the process, but make it clear. Hey, by getting
00:56:55.680 the proper feedback from you, Ryan, if I'm, if, if you let me know where I'm killing it and what
00:56:59.800 I'm doing well, I need, I need to know that personally. So I can keep doing those things
00:57:04.320 because sometimes I'll question like, Oh, was that a good approach? Was that not good? Most people
00:57:09.800 be like, Oh yeah, definitely. I I'll do that. That's fair. Right. It makes sense to them. So
00:57:14.720 you know, bring that to the table as well. 100%. Um, I wrote down something here that I think is
00:57:21.560 really important is that, that all of us, I think as men can do better on, and that's validating
00:57:26.020 ourselves. You know, if you can validate yourself, that's significantly more potent than needing
00:57:32.540 validation from somebody else. So for example, if you're trying to get into shape, uh, and you know,
00:57:39.060 you notice you've lost five, 10, 20 pounds, you know, the muscles are getting bigger. The abs are
00:57:43.800 starting to show you've got more energy. You really shouldn't have to go to somebody else and
00:57:48.920 say, Hey, how do I look like that? I mean, it's nice. You know, it's nice. If somebody notices or
00:57:55.700 your wife says, Hey, you feel good. Like those are nice things, but you shouldn't have to go out and
00:58:01.300 seek that from other people. You should look in the mirror and say, you know what? I look good.
00:58:06.400 I feel good. You know, if we're, if we're striving for this validation from other people,
00:58:13.820 then I think that's a deficiency in our confidence and our own ability to be, to validate ourselves.
00:58:19.300 And you should be able to do that. You should be, you should be able to look at the guy in the mirror
00:58:22.880 and say, you know, I'm proud of myself today. Like I accomplished everything on my to-do list and
00:58:28.180 that's enough. You know, that's not, that's all that I need to feel good about myself. Or, you know,
00:58:33.640 I went to the gym and I didn't want to, and I worked out and I trained and it was hard,
00:58:37.860 but I did every rep. I didn't even slack on a rep. Nobody was there and I could have,
00:58:41.540 but I didn't. You should feel proud about that and you should feel accomplished. And then you
00:58:46.140 should look the guy in the mirror or in journaling or whatever and say, you know, I'm proud because I
00:58:50.920 did this thing and that should be enough because you will always have yourself, but you won't always
00:58:55.560 have other people. Yeah. I like it. Um, let's do a rapid, a couple of rapid fire ones. I think
00:59:02.120 we can get, we can get these good answers in here. So Dex Reese, uh, how to brainstorm and come up with
00:59:09.160 a business name and should one name, uh, should one name it before trademarking it?
00:59:15.360 Well, you have to have a name in order to trademark something to do a trademark. Yeah. So,
00:59:19.740 okay. You have to have some brainstorming coming up with a company name. Uh, so number one is make
00:59:27.220 the thesaurus your best friend and just start writing down words. So when I, when it was order
00:59:34.840 of man for me, I think I looked at things like group, which turned into brotherhood, which turned
00:59:42.760 into fraternity. And eventually I came across order. I'm like order. Okay. Well, there's a double
00:59:48.680 meaning of that, right? Order as in a collection of us, a group of us, but order as in setting
00:59:53.960 things straight, it's a double meaning. It sounds really cool. And it has that meaning and purpose
00:59:57.740 behind it. So make the thesaurus your best friend, um, write down the values, right? Just write down
01:00:03.280 a bunch of words that explain what you're doing and why you're doing it and how it will serve other
01:00:08.060 people. Um, I like, I like names that I don't like being so cryptic in names that people don't know
01:00:17.280 what in the world it is. People say, well, what does? Yeah. People say, well, what about Google?
01:00:21.260 Well, you're not Google. All right. Like you don't have billions of dollars. It took a lot of
01:00:25.400 marketing to make that work. Yeah, exactly. So let's not do that. A better thing would be
01:00:30.940 the best search engine.com. I mean, right. Like, so you, but you also don't need to be so blatantly
01:00:38.860 obvious to on the nose that it's not even interesting. So there, there's some of that that you need to
01:00:43.800 take into consideration. Um, I think another important consideration is that if you do come
01:00:49.200 up with some names that you start looking at the social media handles, if they're available
01:00:53.460 because of our, and website, because none of it is available, I probably would, I would probably
01:00:59.320 pick a different name. Um, but yeah, make the thesaurus your best friend, know what's going to
01:01:02.960 take time and just jot down words. When you think of words, just write them down and then go through
01:01:08.360 this thesaurus and you'll come up with some stuff pretty quickly. I think.
01:01:11.020 Yeah. And you might want to test it out a little bit. You know, I, super funny story. I'll share
01:01:17.500 it super fast. So I was doing some military work. Um, I started my company after Asian, I got, 0.95
01:01:23.280 got married and Kiyabe's middle name. Uh, he's Hawaii, obviously Asia's Hawaiian and Kiyabe's a 0.53
01:01:29.320 Hawaiian name. And his full name is Kiyabe Okipono. And Pono means great in Hawaiian. I really liked
01:01:38.040 that. Like I was just like Pono. I like, I don't know. I, I, I, I latched onto it. And, uh, so I
01:01:45.080 use that company name. Right. And it was like Pono innovations or something like that. I, if I
01:01:50.380 remember correctly. And I was, I was in, in the office with a bunch of military guys, we're working
01:01:55.820 and a guy's like, Hey, you know, what's your email? I'll shoot you over that email or whatever.
01:02:00.720 And I'm like, you know, Kip at Pono innovations.com. He goes, but what'd he just say? I'm
01:02:06.580 like Pono. And he's like, Oh shit. I thought you said porno. And I was like, Oh yeah. Okay. Yep. 0.99
01:02:13.380 Changing the company name, right? Like it wasn't going to work. Right. And to your point who no one
01:02:18.720 knows what that is. It doesn't mean anything unless my, my primary audience is Hawaiians. Right. It's
01:02:24.100 going to get lost on everybody. Right. So it, but it was really funny because I was like, ah,
01:02:28.700 didn't even consider that. These guys. And then there's guys like, man, I heard you say that a
01:02:35.140 couple of times. I thought what a horrible company name. I was like, Oh man, that's funny.
01:02:40.460 I even get it with at times because people, I, one of the first people I introduced it to said,
01:02:46.420 what order a man? Like, no, no, no, no, not order a man order of man. So yeah, you have to take that
01:02:52.940 into consideration for sure. Future business venture, by the way, I've had so many women, 1.00
01:02:57.620 like, I'm not joking, by the way, I've had single women talk to me about, Hey, how do I get 1.00
01:03:04.280 introductions to the guys inside of the order of man? That's funny. Because they had this idea,
01:03:11.060 right? Like, Hey, these are stellar guys. Do you have a bunch of single guys? And I was like,
01:03:16.060 I actually have some ideas for that. And I'm not joking. I actually have some ideas for that
01:03:22.000 because if we can connect single people who are motivated, then that's awesome.
01:03:29.160 Yeah. So Ryan's thinking of a business idea of, of borderline being a pimp and pimping out the
01:03:34.920 members of the iron council, but you know, not even borderline just blatantly. Obviously that's
01:03:40.100 exactly what I'm going to be doing. Right. The pimp Mickler. That's right. Yeah. That's right. I like
01:03:44.720 it. All right. Stacy Bauer. I've had two employees leave the company last week. One, I just read the
01:03:51.840 email tonight. How do you not take things personal and how do you make sure more don't follow mainly
01:03:58.600 as you're trying to grow your business every day and every year? So the way that I, so here's a
01:04:05.380 little exercise that I do not to take things personally is I imagine that it happened to, to
01:04:12.100 something or somebody else. So, so for example, if somebody leaves the iron council, which I usually
01:04:17.860 told you that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, not like, no, no. What I'm saying is I just try to take myself out
01:04:26.740 of the equation and objectify the situation. So if somebody leaves the iron council, it's, it's like,
01:04:33.140 did they leave me? No, they left the iron council. Why? I don't know if I was giving advice to somebody
01:04:38.420 else. Maybe it's because they had their own issues. You know, maybe they didn't like the
01:04:42.760 organization. Is that a reflection on me? I mean, kind of, but also if it's this separate entity,
01:04:47.340 not really. And then you just look for feedback, you know, okay, well, what, why did they leave?
01:04:54.280 And you just decide not to take it personal. You have no idea what we talked about this a minute ago.
01:05:01.180 You have no idea what's going on in that person's life. You don't, you have what they've told you,
01:05:07.220 which very rarely is a hundred percent accurate. So you are filling in the blanks with all sorts of
01:05:14.220 stuff that may or may not be relevant or may or may not be true. And it's just best not,
01:05:20.940 not to try to go down that rabbit hole. And how do you do it? You just decide not to do it.
01:05:25.800 And you tell yourself, Hey, you know what? That person left frustrating, but I'm going to do better.
01:05:30.100 I've had guys, I've had guy, I had one guy in the iron council. This was years ago,
01:05:34.960 become, it was almost like a mutiny. He was one of our team leaders and got very toxic towards me
01:05:43.020 and what we were doing in the iron council. Started calling me a Nazi.
01:05:47.500 Even after he left, I think.
01:05:49.460 Yeah. And he ended up taking his entire team down with him. And I took that one very personally.
01:05:56.180 And it was personal. It absolutely was personal because he was making personal
01:06:01.800 claims about me. And then I just made a decision that, you know what? Like,
01:06:08.240 I don't know what's going on with him. I don't know what he's dealing with. I don't know.
01:06:13.180 Not only do I know, not know what entirely what's going on in his life. I don't know what
01:06:18.000 lens he's viewing life. I know none of that. So instead of worrying about it being so personal,
01:06:24.540 I need to ensure it doesn't happen again. So I asked myself, what can be learned from this?
01:06:31.000 What can be learned from this little mutiny that happened? And how can I avoid this happening again?
01:06:36.100 And so it was a matter of better communication, staying in touch with our, our team leaders and
01:06:42.720 our team members looking for standards. So we're all operating very similarly with on teams. And I
01:06:48.820 learned a lot and it actually served me really well over time. It's very hard not to take things like
01:06:53.160 that personal. Yeah. So his second question, you know, making sure that employees, more employees
01:07:02.640 don't leave. That's it. Well, I, I think, I think one thing just learning. Well, learning. Yeah. But
01:07:11.060 also communication. Cause again, we're talking about a lot of assumptions here. So what ends up
01:07:15.060 happening is people will leave and then everybody's going to know Bob's not there anymore. And if you
01:07:22.160 don't address it, people are going to start jumping to conclusions. Oh, you know what? I heard you want
01:07:30.120 to communicate and Bob were having a bad time and, and there was some animosity and, you know,
01:07:36.460 there's all this rumors and hearsay. And then, Oh, this is a toxic environment. Now all of a sudden
01:07:41.940 another person leaves. So I think the best thing you could do is bring it up. Now I'm not suggesting
01:07:48.380 that you make it a bigger deal than it is. You don't want to do that because there might be things
01:07:52.820 that just aren't a big deal, but it might just be simply, maybe it's in one of your morning briefings,
01:07:57.500 or maybe it's an email and you're going to speak kindly about Bob regardless of the way that it
01:08:04.680 went down. Yeah. And just from an HR perspective, don't go down that path, right? That's going to
01:08:09.780 set you up for trouble. Yeah. Good point. But it might be, it might be a company-wide email and it
01:08:14.800 says, Hey guys, just want to give you the heads up. Unfortunately, Bob's decided to move on. We really
01:08:19.080 wish him the best. Uh, we had, we had some good times here and I just wanted to let you know that Bob's
01:08:25.740 presence will be, will be noted or absence will be noted. And if you have any questions,
01:08:31.180 you know, feel free to let me know. But in the meantime, again, this goes back to how to talk
01:08:35.480 with women. That was the problem. Now the solution in the meantime, we're interviewing for a brand new 1.00
01:08:41.840 CEO. Uh, if you're interested in the position and you're qualified, please let us know through the
01:08:47.140 appropriate channels. Or if you know of anybody who might be interested, then please let us know.
01:08:52.440 And we can talk about that. Man, you get out ahead of it. You let people know what's
01:08:55.720 going on. You don't make a big deal of it. And then you talk about how you're moving forward.
01:09:00.160 Yeah. I like it. I like it. One thing that, um, that I, that part of my, uh, one-on-ones and quarterly
01:09:07.460 plans is a conversation around commitment level. And, and I, this is something that we bring up to
01:09:13.360 every employee all the time. Are you all in? And, and maybe another way of saying it, where's your job
01:09:20.680 love? Are you loving it? Are you still excited? Are you loving what you're doing? Like how you
01:09:26.040 feeling? Or do you have any barriers? And you want to have the dialogue where the employee is willing
01:09:30.780 to go and tell you like, Hey, you know what? I feel undervalued. Why? Oh man, I'm not getting
01:09:36.880 enough feedback from my boss that I'm actually succeeding. Or, you know, I think I'm underpaid
01:09:42.040 or whatever. Like we, for, for us, for us to have fully committed embodied employees, you need to be
01:09:49.000 having the conversation of like, where are they? And then your job is to eliminate barriers and help
01:09:55.460 them get back on the path of being excited about where they're working at. And when they're, when
01:09:59.740 they show up in that kind of way, employees are, they, they're bringing their best foot to the table.
01:10:05.500 They're excited. They bring some passion to the work. You don't want an employee that's checked out.
01:10:10.060 So they're there nine to five, bare minimum doing just enough not to get fired. No, no, no.
01:10:15.140 We're going for like, you love your job, right? No, there's some things I don't. Okay. Let's address
01:10:20.560 those. And let's talk about it. And how do we pivot? Oh, I don't know what the future looks like
01:10:25.680 here. Awesome. Let's talk about it. What do you think the future could be? And, and address those
01:10:31.280 things because eventually an employee will not, an employee will leave due to a lack of commitment and
01:10:39.900 buy-in to what you're doing as an organization. And those intrinsic motivators that keep them around
01:10:44.740 are everything from sense of team belonging and future with the company, not feeling appreciated,
01:10:52.120 not being heard. Like, and guess what? Those are different for Ryan and they're different for me
01:10:58.260 and they're different from the, for the guy across the hall. So you got to know your people
01:11:02.420 to understand what makes them tick and what gives them high level of job love. If you want to use
01:11:08.460 that term, otherwise you're going to lose them. So address that. Yep. Absolutely. Cool. Should we take
01:11:14.920 one more? Uh, yeah. Uh, let's see. Okay. Scott, uh, uh, Jared. Sorry, Scott. I've noticed that often guys
01:11:24.980 are looking for a girlfriend. That's like a bro. Is this a sign of immaturity? And are these guys missing
01:11:31.220 out on what a woman really is by looking for another bro in her? I don't know what you mean by
01:11:37.300 like guys are looking for a girl, like a bro. Um, yeah. Is it just like somebody like a, yeah. And
01:11:44.740 that's not what I guess that's, I don't feel that way. So it's hard for me to fathom why you'd want
01:11:51.520 a bro as a, as a partner. But I think what you should be looking for in a woman is somebody who 0.99
01:11:58.460 challenges you who in, in, in the right ways, not just to be confrontational, but challenges you to
01:12:04.740 improve and to get better and to be excellent. Uh, somebody who couldn't be the mother of your
01:12:10.600 children, who is empathetic and kind and nurturing and caring, uh, somebody whose vision is aligned
01:12:19.740 with yours from their spiritual path and journey to the way they feel about money and politics. I think
01:12:27.320 these are all little things that could splinter a relationship very, very easily. So you should
01:12:31.780 be aligned in some of those key fundamental issues. Uh, and then ultimately somebody that you can
01:12:38.320 serve really that you are there to challenge them in the right ways and then to support and guide and
01:12:45.740 edify and uplift. And that doesn't sound like a bro necessarily. Uh, so what's the, what,
01:12:52.860 what was the question about why do you guys do this? Um, yeah. Is it a sign? Is it a sign of
01:13:00.780 immaturity? Well, I think it's a sign of, yeah, I think immaturity is probably a good one for it.
01:13:07.680 Yeah. And what are they missing out? I guess, what are they missing out when they,
01:13:11.300 when they approach a relationship with a woman that way? I just think the people that I'm around
01:13:16.860 don't, don't think that that's why I'm struggling with this question. And so maybe I'll change the
01:13:21.080 people that you're around. Like the guys that I'm around, they don't think that way of their wives.
01:13:25.880 They think so highly of their wives. Um, they honor them. Uh, they cherish them. They, they support
01:13:33.400 them. Like I said earlier, they edify and uplift those individuals. Yeah. And what you're missing
01:13:38.540 out on is a life of fulfillment. Truly. I mean, that's what it is when you're that to a woman and 1.00
01:13:44.960 she is that to you, you're both fulfilled and there's joy in your life. And you know,
01:13:50.140 there's still challenges and struggles, but you're able to get through it together.
01:13:53.980 That's a beautiful, beautiful thing. So, I mean, look, if guys are looking for a buddy or they
01:14:00.100 just think the sex is good, you know, that's, that's going to be fleeting. And in many ways,
01:14:05.100 I think that's probably going to diminish the way that you feel about the opposite sex. You know,
01:14:10.340 if women are just looking for a sex partner or a man's just looking for somebody to get laid with, 0.81
01:14:14.340 I think that's going to diminish and undermine the way you look at women or the way that women look at men 0.88
01:14:18.920 and ultimately do yourself some damage. So it's unfortunate, I guess some people do, but that's
01:14:25.340 an inferior way of looking at the opposite sex. Yeah. Okay. All right. So a couple of call to
01:14:32.140 actions here, guys, if you haven't connected with us, please do so via social media. You can connect
01:14:37.580 with Mr. Mickler on Instagram and Twitter at Ryan Mickler. And if you're not, if you haven't joined us
01:14:43.240 on our Facebook group, you can join us there by going to facebook.com slash group slash order of
01:14:47.900 man. And of course we're going to be opening up the iron council, uh, pretty soon. Um, so be prepared
01:14:54.560 for that. And to learn more about the iron council, you can go to order of man.com slash iron council.
01:15:00.440 Are you still doing the, the discount on the 50% off in the store right now? Just trying to clear out
01:15:07.640 some inventory. So if you use the code five zero at checkout, you'll get 50% off. Hey, I got to say
01:15:12.600 one more thing about this. I was just thinking about, as you were saying that with this relationship
01:15:16.580 with women. Um, and, and I started to think about why a man would, would not commit to a woman fully
01:15:25.180 or talk about it in the way that we just did. And I think there's two primary reasons for that.
01:15:29.760 Number one, it's, it's hard. It's really difficult to do that. It takes time and attention and energy
01:15:36.800 and focus and stamina and care and kindness. It's really hard. Like, uh, the other thing
01:15:44.280 is that there is a, a really dangerous precedent in society being set that. And I think it started
01:15:53.200 with, with feminism, especially as we moved into this third wave of feminism, where they began to 0.99
01:15:58.440 look at men as, uh, as, as this tyrannical patriarchy, if you will. And they were the victims
01:16:06.320 of manliness and masculinity when clearly that's not the case. But then in the aftermath of that,
01:16:13.540 you have this overreaction from these feminists to men and the way that they show up and the way 1.00
01:16:20.220 they serve. And men, uh, women have, these women have felt like they've been at the, at the mercy of
01:16:25.560 these, these dominant controlling power hungry men. And the response was bitterness and hostility
01:16:31.760 and anger towards men. And now we're seeing a pendulum switch switch shift. And now we're seeing
01:16:39.240 little factions of, of men who are now doing the same thing, but to women, well, women are victimizing 0.99
01:16:48.160 us. Women are evil. Women are bitches. They're out to get our money. They're out. And there's some 1.00
01:16:52.500 things that, you know, you should be aware of for sure. The family court system, for example,
01:16:56.760 is one that's a dangerous, dangerous thing. But both of those things, the fact that it's hard
01:17:01.980 and the fact that there's a growing group of men who believe themselves to be victims to women
01:17:09.260 or in cells, if you will, uh, it's laziness. It's just laziness. You know, it's lazy to say,
01:17:17.980 well, I'm not going to do that. Cause that takes so much work. That's lazy. It's lazy to say, well,
01:17:22.320 all women are bitches and, and they, you know, they're just out to get us and they're going to 1.00
01:17:26.320 screw us over. That's not generally true. And it's a lazy, it's a lazy argument. And that's what I 1.00
01:17:34.420 think anyways. That's why it's easier to be lazy for sure than it is to work hard and be diligent and
01:17:39.460 put your head down towards something meaningful. All right, guys. Well, cool. Well, Kip, appreciate you
01:17:44.080 guys. Thanks for the great questions today. We'll keep recording as long as you keep having questions and
01:17:48.440 we'll try to give you the best answers we can, but until then go out there, take action and become
01:17:52.940 the man you are meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're
01:17:57.660 ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join
01:18:02.360 the order at order of man.com.