Order of Man - External Validation, Liberals and Conservatives, and the Void in Leadership

00:00:00.000 I've seen so many men who complain about abdication of responsibility in other people and they

00:00:06.860 gripe and they moan about it when the proper attitude is to be grateful that other people

00:00:12.460 aren't doing it. Why? Because you have the opportunity to do it. We wouldn't be listening

00:00:18.080 to this podcast if I just bitched and moaned about it and didn't do anything about it. Somebody

00:00:22.540 else would have filled the void that I filled. I looked at it as an opportunity and this is why

00:00:26.520 Order A Man is on the map where it is today leading the men's movement is because I wasn't

00:00:31.960 upset about it. I was grateful that I acknowledged an opportunity and stepped into that path.

00:00:39.060 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path.

00:00:45.120 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time. You are not easily deterred

00:00:50.820 defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will

00:00:57.980 become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.

00:01:05.900 Kip, long time no see, man. Glad to be back with you through digital medium instead of face-to-face.

00:01:11.660 It's way better when I don't have to see you face-to-face. It's way better this way for me.

00:01:15.140 I don't have to interact with you quite as much.

00:01:16.600 Yeah, like once we're over, you can walk away and you don't have me like harassing you for the rest

00:01:21.660 of the day. Exactly. No, it's good. For those of you who don't know, Kip and I went on a hunt with

00:01:26.440 some other friends to Minnesota last week. You're two for two, man. On your first two bow hunts,

00:01:32.140 two kills, two for two. I'm proud of you, but also like it's not an easy thing. I think if you've

00:01:40.080 never been bow hunting, and even if you're a hunter and you've rifle hunted, nothing against that at all,

00:01:44.060 by the way, but even if you're a hunter, I think it's easy to overlook how difficult it is to

00:01:51.200 successfully harvest an animal with a bow. Yeah. And I was talking with Rick about this last week

00:01:57.980 and, and I said, I said to him, I was like, well, I was just lucky, right? I had things aligned and

00:02:05.440 the deer was there. It was a good shot. Anybody there could have easily made that shot. And then

00:02:10.700 he reminded me, he's like, yeah, but it's all the stuff leading up to the shot that we failed to

00:02:15.680 do. And it's keeping your eyes out on the horizon, seeing the deer way early. So you're prepped. So

00:02:23.480 you draw when they go behind the tree. It's all of that, that allows the shot to be available.

00:02:29.600 And, and those are the harder things to do, especially when you're sitting in a tree stand

00:02:33.120 for, you know, four hours. Yeah. It's, and it's cold and, and you're a new hunter and it's, it is,

00:02:39.820 it's really difficult. Yeah. There is a lot of prep that goes into it. I think, I think a person can

00:02:44.920 get lucky once, but you you're two for two. That's not luck and you'll get better. Rick. A lot of people

00:02:53.040 say Rick is really lucky. Rick is not lucky because he does it every single time. That's how, you know,

00:02:59.200 it's not luck. But to your point about making sure that you see deer early, I actually got caught.

00:03:05.780 I could have shot a really, a really nice buck, but he came in, I was looking right. Cause some

00:03:11.380 other deer had come in and he came in left and I had a lane there and I saw out of the corner of my

00:03:17.120 eye. I don't know if I was just slacking or what I was doing. I saw him out of the corner of my eye

00:03:21.300 and he, I didn't even see him until he got to my shooting lane and I tried to stop him. He stopped

00:03:26.120 just a little bit outside and past my shooting lane. And I missed a really good opportunity

00:03:30.900 because I didn't have my head on a swivel and I wasn't as prepared as I should have been or aware

00:03:35.980 that there was a deer. He was quiet. So anyways, really cool, man. It's exciting to go hunting with

00:03:40.940 you and be part of a small part of your, your hunting journey. So it's cool. It's, it's been

00:03:44.480 awesome. And thanks. Obviously I, I made a post the other day about just how grateful I am

00:03:49.240 and it's just like everything else in life, how, how willing people are to speak into,

00:03:55.820 speak into you, to help you, to coach you, to see you in. I think there's an abundance of that

00:04:01.560 in the world, but we have to be humble. We have to check our egos and be willing to ask,

00:04:07.600 you know, and, and you've obviously helped me and coach me a lot, you know, in this process,

00:04:13.640 even though I'm early on and I'm just grateful for it. Yeah. Well, and also for men,

00:04:18.280 it's really important to say yes. Now me and your wife kind of coaxed you into your first

00:04:24.580 bow hunt. So you didn't really have a choice on that one, but this, this one you said yes to

00:04:29.640 and I can't help, but think how many things that I've said no to or other people say no to. And then

00:04:36.060 in the very next breath, men like this will say, well, how come everybody else gets the opportunities?

00:04:40.940 How come everybody else does this? How come everybody else? It's because you're not capitalizing

00:04:45.700 on those opportunities and it's, it's unfortunate. I used to get frustrated by it, but it's not really

00:04:51.360 my life. I've just learned to say yes more often. Now there is a time and a place to say no, and you

00:04:58.160 have to exercise some discernment, but if you have these kinds of opportunities, then you just need to

00:05:03.000 say yes. I know it's not convenient. I know you didn't have all the gear. I know you didn't feel

00:05:08.360 completely adequately prepared necessarily or ready. Uh, I know that financially, you know,

00:05:14.420 there's a cost associated with it. There's all sorts of reasons to say, no, not this time,

00:05:18.680 but you said yes. And you created that little margin that helped you succeed in a new way.

00:05:23.760 And I wish more men would do that more often. Yeah, totally. Well, let's get to headlines. Um,

00:05:29.400 I've got obviously the big headline, you know, Trump wins the election. Uh, the, uh, GOP, uh,

00:05:37.260 has control of, of Congress, both Senate and the house. And I also noticed and saw that I think the

00:05:44.520 overwhelming majority of maybe not overwhelming, but the slight majority of governors in this

00:05:49.480 country are, are Republican governors. I mean, this was a big red wave and I was taken back and so much

00:05:57.240 so that I actually bet against Trump and I wanted him to win, but I bet Rick a hundred bucks a night or

00:06:03.760 two before that, that Kamala would win. And sure enough, Trump pulled it off. So I think this is

00:06:10.120 a great thing for the country. I know there's character flaws and character issues and people

00:06:15.160 say, well, he doesn't, he's done an alignment with your, your values. Right. I never said that he's,

00:06:20.700 I think on some things, yes, but he's not a hundred percent aligned with what we teach here.

00:06:25.720 And I don't want to say that's irrelevant. It's not, but it's a factor in the equation.

00:06:31.680 And there's so much more that goes into this. And so I started looking at some of the things that

00:06:36.420 Trump has talked about doing, uh, directly and indirectly on, on the first, you know,

00:06:41.540 few days, first few weeks of the job. And so I have a few things here, obviously enact some of

00:06:45.820 the remain in Mexico policies and close the border down. His new borders are, looks like a complete

00:06:52.340 bad day. And he is a no nonsense, pulling no punches kind of individual, which I think is great.

00:06:58.160 Obviously we've got anywhere between 10 and 11 million illegal immigrants in the country.

00:07:03.820 And, and the gentleman's name, I can't remember his name right offhand, but the new borders are,

00:07:07.900 is talking about making sure that we're actually removing these people from the country. Once we

00:07:13.160 shut the border down, that's interesting. Uh, another thing that I thought was interesting

00:07:17.300 is just bringing agitators and aggressor aggressors to the table. You know, upon news that Trump won the

00:07:23.460 election, all of a sudden Hamas is talking about, uh, negotiating a peace agreement. Uh,

00:07:29.240 Russia's coming to the table, talking about agreeing to negotiate with Ukraine. Even China

00:07:35.100 is talking about potentially opening up conversations about economic policies. So that's interesting. And

00:07:40.700 on the note of, of China in particular, Trump is talking about enacting tariffs. I don't know where I

00:07:46.800 sit to be honest on tariffs. There's a lot of pros and cons. You know, obviously the, the con to a

00:07:52.540 tariff is that that cost is then going to be consumed by the American consumer. And the way

00:07:59.800 that works just really briefly is if China is selling a widget to us for $10 and it's made and

00:08:09.220 manufactured and ready to be sold here in the U S for 15, obviously most consumers are going to buy

00:08:14.920 the Chinese product for 10, all things being equal. And now Trump is talking about enacting a tariff,

00:08:20.340 which makes the price for China's cost $15. And so it makes us more competitive, which I think

00:08:26.320 makes sense because China's stealing technology and intellectual property, and they're not paying

00:08:31.140 people wages and they have literally slave labor that they're relying on to build some of these

00:08:35.120 things. Uh, it incentivizes again, for us to build and manufacture things in America, but it will come

00:08:43.060 at a cost. And I think over time, those costs will be driven down, especially if this is something

00:08:48.160 that we can sustain long-term because we know if you take, for example, uh, Ford, uh, Henry Ford,

00:08:54.800 I can't remember the exact numbers, but what used to take days and weeks to put a car together,

00:09:00.220 he got done in every, you know, one, every six minutes eventually. So things become much more

00:09:06.020 effective and cost efficient over time, but that will take time. Um, cleaning up wasteful government

00:09:11.780 spending, obviously talking about having Elon Musk come in here and clean house. He fired 80% of Twitter

00:09:17.360 employees when he took over Twitter and, uh, the thing is actually making money now. And then this

00:09:22.780 was an interesting thing I heard over the weekend is reciprocity for concealed carry holders. So if you

00:09:28.440 get your concealed carry permit in Utah, which I don't think you actually need it in Utah, it's a

00:09:33.180 not anymore. It's a constitutional carry state two years ago. Yeah. Yeah. Maine is the same way

00:09:38.240 constitutional carry, but if you do have your concealed carry permit here, the idea is that it's going to

00:09:43.880 apply, uh, nationwide in any state, which I think obviously is a good idea, even more so to take it

00:09:51.760 even further. I would say that we just do away with needing a concealed carry permit at all because

00:09:57.040 we have a constitutional right to carry firearms, but it's a move in the right direction. The only,

00:10:02.300 the only issue that I take with it, not so much with concealed carry, but I am worried about Trump

00:10:09.500 and executive orders. I do not like executive orders. I get frustrated with it, whether it's

00:10:15.380 a Republican or a Democrat, you're usurping the will of the American people. We elect a Congress

00:10:21.780 to pass laws for a reason. And when a president takes executive action, it's bypassing the constitutional

00:10:31.320 system. So I don't like that. So when he's going in there and he's signing, signing executive orders,

00:10:36.640 I take issue with it, even though some of those orders, I think are a good idea.

00:10:41.480 It should be done through the Congress because you're just opening it up for abuse, misuse later

00:10:49.040 on down the road. So I definitely do not approve of that. And I wish we could go back to limiting

00:10:53.760 the president's power and put it back in the hands of Congress where it belongs and where it was set up

00:10:59.460 to be. Yeah, totally agree. Uh, dude, there's so much, uh, you know, I was talking with someone

00:11:06.340 last night about, you know, um, and this guy, and it goes into my headline that I wanted to share,

00:11:11.640 but of course, a lot of us are having conversations around the election and we have to remember,

00:11:18.920 right. We, we have a country that, that roughly, you know, maybe, I don't know what the numbers are

00:11:24.440 exactly, but what 20, 30 million people voted for potentially the other party. That is a lot of

00:11:31.220 people. And, and it's really easy for us to jump on the bandwagon and be lazy in our thinking and

00:11:40.240 move to judgment of, of, oh, these people are dumb and these people are this and, and put labels on

00:11:45.640 people. Um, and it goes both directions. And, and I couldn't help, but think of a quote by Carl

00:11:52.480 Young over the weekend that is, you know, and it said, and it goes as thinking is difficult. That's

00:11:58.160 why most people judge. And, and my reason for bringing that up is the, the judgment doesn't

00:12:05.700 help you. It doesn't help you. If I were a Democrat and right, we lost the worst thing you can do is

00:12:14.680 label as big orange, green guy, bad. That doesn't benefit you. What benefits you is understanding

00:12:21.860 why is it that the majority of the population leaned in that direction? What's the critical

00:12:27.460 thinking? Why do, why, why are people attracted? Why did put people vote for Harris? What is it that,

00:12:32.960 that they're, what, what is it in their logical minds makes them feel good about that? There's

00:12:38.480 value in us critically thinking and understanding humans. And, and I don't believe that half the country

00:12:45.800 are morons. I don't think half the country chose to make a bad decision. Most of us make decisions

00:12:51.500 based upon what some logical thinking to some extent, and we think it's the right thing.

00:12:56.600 And there's, and not that we have to agree with it. There's value in understanding why people do

00:13:02.640 what they do. And that just benefits us as individuals. It does allow us to have a little

00:13:07.640 bit more empathy, but it allows us to grow and understand the human condition and why people do

00:13:12.560 what people do. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I was looking at that as you were talking about this,

00:13:18.000 it's significantly higher than what you, what you initially said, but, and I don't know when these

00:13:22.620 numbers, I'm sure these are updated and probably somewhat different, but as of right now, it says

00:13:28.240 that he has, and this is from investigative posts, 73.6 million voters for Trump. He lost voters.

00:13:36.980 Uh, he had 74.2, four years ago. And then Harris received, uh, 69.3 million votes. Biden 81.3 million

00:13:46.720 votes. Yes. That there, you guys can decipher those numbers. That's so suspect. I, I, I'm sorry. I don't

00:13:52.480 care. Like anybody that like 20 million people didn't vote this time. What happened to those people?

00:13:59.860 Where did all those people go? Yeah. It blows my mind, but anyhow, whatever. But I mean,

00:14:04.120 that's pretty interesting though, you know, you've got 150 million people voting and it is interesting

00:14:09.420 that Trump won the popular vote as well, which was fascinating. That typically doesn't happen.

00:14:13.780 And how much of California he won. Well, there was a chart that I saw that actually showed a dynamic

00:14:21.740 chart that showed how much, how many areas moved red relative to how many areas moved blue from red.

00:14:28.840 Yeah. It was not even close. I mean, it was really, really fascinating. Yeah. Yeah. Well,

00:14:34.620 cool, man. Well, let's get into some questions today. Hopefully, um, my, you know, my, I'll say this

00:14:38.180 to you is my, my hope and prayer is that Trump does a good job, you know, that, that he, he leads well,

00:14:43.920 that he doesn't usurp the power of, of the constitution by just taking everything upon itself. Um, I think

00:14:50.300 there is a different dynamic in him. I see him surrounded by more capable people when he's willing to off

00:14:58.500 load some of that stuff, which is interesting than I think more than I've seen in the past,

00:15:02.940 but I'll say this too. If Kamala would have won, I would have had the same hope and prayer

00:15:06.920 and hope that she surrounded herself with knowledgeable, rational, level-headed people.

00:15:12.140 Um, I, I think historically that hasn't been the case, but I would hope and pray for that

00:15:17.020 because I want this country to win. So that's where I'm at. And by the way, if, if you don't agree

00:15:21.420 with what Ryan just said, then it's about what it's about you and your ego. You want them to fail

00:15:27.820 as a president so you can be right about him. Oh, your ego is more important than the country.

00:15:34.380 Are you joking? Like we should all your nose to spite your face, right? Yeah. I mean,

00:15:38.960 we should all be hoping that, that he doesn't screw it up. Yeah. Yeah. So we'll see. Time will

00:15:44.800 tell. I don't think you will, but we'll see. Yeah. All right, man. Let's get into some questions

00:15:48.020 today. Joe Gunter from the iron council. Now that the IC has been going for a while and battle teams

00:15:54.280 have been formed there, any thoughts and giving, uh, to the development of teams based upon regions

00:15:59.960 and States. We talked about these original chapters a little bit, but yeah. And we do

00:16:05.760 have regional channels and chapters. Some are more active than others. And what I would say

00:16:09.400 was a Joe, is that right? Joe. Yeah. What I would say to Joe is if you're in a region, by

00:16:14.800 the way, in the iron council, guys, if you're listening to this, we have a thousand men in

00:16:18.660 there all working together. And there's a segment in there called regional chapters where guys

00:16:23.740 can communicate, coordinate, create plans, get together, meet up, talk, discuss, whatever,

00:16:29.900 uh, in their, in their specific geographical area. So Joe, what I would say to you is go into

00:16:35.160 the regional channels, look for your region. If it's not there, then let us know and you can

00:16:42.060 create one. And also Joe, what you're doing right now, I hope you know, this is you're volunteering

00:16:46.520 to head it up because as men, we don't come to the table with problems or things that we

00:16:53.420 want without a clear solution. It may not be the best solution. It may not be the best

00:16:57.620 answer, but we come with answers. And if we recognize it as a problem, then I think we

00:17:03.020 have a moral imperative to take it upon our shoulders to address it. That doesn't mean we

00:17:08.080 need to do it all, but if you recognize it as a problem or a gap, then it means it's important

00:17:13.440 to you and you have a responsibility to address it. So if your regional channel is not there,

00:17:19.600 let it, let us know if it is there and it's not very active, take it upon yourself to build

00:17:25.100 that up so that you, and by the way, and I'm not saying Joe is doing this, but I've seen

00:17:30.700 so many men who complain about abdication of responsibility in other people. Oh, this guy's

00:17:38.020 not doing what he's supposed to be doing. This guy's not doing that. They're not doing this.

00:17:41.760 And they gripe and they moan about it when the proper attitude is to be grateful that

00:17:47.940 other people aren't doing it. Why? Because you have the opportunity to do it. We wouldn't

00:17:53.680 be listening to this podcast if I didn't recognize a problem and I, or I recognized a problem and

00:17:59.220 I just bitched and moaned about it. And again, I'm not saying Joe's doing that, but if I just

00:18:04.080 bitched and moaned about it and didn't do anything about it, somebody else would have filled the

00:18:07.120 void that I filled. I looked at it as an opportunity. And this is why order a man is

00:18:11.860 on the map where it is today. Leading the men's movement is because I wasn't upset about it. I was

00:18:18.600 grateful that I acknowledged an opportunity and stepped into that path. I love it, man. You know,

00:18:25.060 Zach Allen, uh, our next question here, it's actually not a question. It's a comment, but I want to get

00:18:29.860 your thoughts around this. Cause he, he points out something I think is really important when we talk

00:18:34.120 about the chain of command and, and who do we go to in the chain of command, uh, when there's an issue

00:18:41.860 and we can relate this to work, um, even in our homes, if you'd want to, and in other areas. So

00:18:46.880 his question, Zach Allen, this is more of a comment, but it's just in, um, uh, around how battle teams

00:18:53.340 work. Each one of us has a team lead. I would just encourage you to trust your team lead and take your

00:18:58.700 challenges to them. I've had a small challenge and my immediate thought was to have, to get help from

00:19:04.040 the top. Then it dawned on me to just go to Troy and it worked out perfectly fine. Yeah. Well,

00:19:10.760 first of all, Troy Fullerton is an incredible man. So outside of just the structure of the iron council,

00:19:18.540 he is one of the most solid human beings that I know. So yes, Troy is certainly going to help

00:19:23.100 address that. Uh, but yeah, the chain of command is crucial. I learned a lot of this in the military,

00:19:27.440 um, by the way, a couple of days ago, as of the recording of today, it's veterans day. And so just want

00:19:32.340 to thank all the men and women who have served and, and who put their lives on the line and do

00:19:37.360 difficult work and leave their families and suffer in order to protect our way of life. So I want to

00:19:41.780 say that, but I learned this when I was in the military, this idea of the chain of command, which

00:19:46.380 is that from the bottom up, if you have a problem, you go to your next echelon of leadership. You don't

00:19:51.320 skip people because it's not right. And it probably won't get addressed as efficiently as if you go through

00:19:57.660 the proper channels. So in this case, he went to Troy, who's his direct battle team leader. That's

00:20:02.740 exactly right. If the problem didn't get resolved or there was still questions, either Troy or he

00:20:07.880 would move up and that would be a battle team leader mentor. If the problem didn't get resolved

00:20:12.240 there, it would be Andrew as our battle team leader mentor coordinator. Uh, if it didn't get resolved

00:20:17.880 there, it would at, at that point, it would probably come to me at that point. And I'd make sure that

00:20:22.800 we address it. What this does is it allows an organization to run smoothly and effectively

00:20:29.640 and get problems solved quickly. There's little things that come up that I, as the founder of

00:20:35.040 the iron council don't need to totally be aware of and be involved with, because if you're waiting

00:20:40.080 on me, you're going to be waiting a lot longer than just a quick text or phone call to Troy to say,

00:20:44.460 Hey, here's my issue. And he resolves it. Like, like you said, very quickly. So it's really,

00:20:49.340 really important. We use the chain of command, but the place I want to take this question

00:20:53.500 is from the top down. And this is something I'm learning. It's really important, just as important

00:21:00.260 that if you're going to execute a chain of command in your organization, that you also honor it as the

00:21:05.940 head of the potential organization in going and working down the chain of command. So if I have an

00:21:11.860 issue with a member, let's say, let's say a member, two members are getting into it and they're

00:21:18.100 being inappropriate or they're just getting after each other, or they're creating some toxicity

00:21:21.940 inside of the council. I don't need to go directly to the members. I need to honor the system that

00:21:28.280 we're creating, which means that I need to go first to his battle team leader mentor and say, Hey,

00:21:35.060 Steven and Chuck are having this issue. Will you talk with their team leaders and give their team

00:21:42.960 leaders an opportunity? Because we don't want to usurp the team leaders opportunity to serve as

00:21:49.020 well. Because then what we're saying, even subconsciously and quietly is I don't trust you.

00:21:54.460 Yeah. I don't trust you to be able to handle this. And I do, I wouldn't have had them in that position

00:22:00.100 if I didn't trust them. And if I don't trust them, then I need to let them go and find somebody I do.

00:22:05.000 Yeah. So you got to go up the chain of command, but as leaders, we also have to go down the chain

00:22:09.740 of command. And I've been learning that in iron council because we haven't always had this in

00:22:13.320 place. So every once in a while, I'll skip a battle team leader mentor. I'll skip a battle team leader.

00:22:18.960 And fortunately we've enabled and empowered our guys to call me out when I do that. And so I've

00:22:24.080 had guys say, Hey Ryan, next time, like, let me handle it. I'm like, Oh yeah, that's actually the

00:22:30.320 right way to do it. And we just forget. Sometimes my motive is, is good, but execution leaves something

00:22:35.940 to be desired at times. Totally. And your authority sometimes undermines you. So in the, in the, in

00:22:42.500 that example, you know, in maybe even more so, even in the corporate world is an executive go

00:22:49.100 schedule a meeting with a frontline worker. And that frontline worker sees that someone from the

00:22:54.140 C-suite schedule a meeting with them for the next three days, anxiety and stress skyrocket. They're

00:23:00.460 like, what's going on. Right. Why? Because they don't have a relationship with you. You're in a

00:23:06.240 position of authority. Your intent could be, I just want to help these guys, but they may see it as, Oh,

00:23:12.960 Ryan, the founder is meeting. I must be in trouble. And they moved to fight and flight. So you're not in a

00:23:19.760 position of influence. You're just in a position of authority. And sometimes that, that hurts you.

00:23:26.300 Right. And so that, that chain of command, I used to always think it was about responsibility and it

00:23:31.160 is, but some of it is also who's the best person that is in a position who has an established

00:23:37.520 relationship to be able to serve and coach. And it's usually not someone up hired the chain of

00:23:43.800 command. It's usually their immediate manager or supervisor. Yeah. I, I think that's exactly,

00:23:51.880 you know, the other thing I was thinking too, is I've made a shift, I think over the past couple

00:23:57.860 of years in my own personal mindset of developing leadership and also the way that we execute it

00:24:04.600 inside of our organization. I say this a little bit tongue in cheek, but also a little bit of truth

00:24:10.700 to it. I actually don't want to do anything. Yeah. You're like, I, that's the noise. A lot of the

00:24:16.620 times, like, well, I say a lot of the times, like I'm lazy. I don't actually want to do anything.

00:24:20.260 And I'm not lazy because I bust my tail, but I, and I say it jokingly, but I think if we're

00:24:27.340 really to realize the potential that our organizations have, then I have to have that

00:24:34.800 mentality because if it was just me doing everything, not only is it not going to get

00:24:40.580 done, I'm not empowering anybody else to get better. You're not growing. I'll give you an

00:24:44.360 example. Yeah. Growing anybody. That's exactly right. So we had, we were gone last week and

00:24:50.240 we have calls throughout the week. And one of them is a leadership call with our team leaders

00:24:53.640 and Kevin Nickel, battle team Romulus, uh, on the previous week on that call, I asked him to lead

00:25:01.400 the call. And he was like, I don't know. Can I have my team leader do it? I said, no, I want you to do

00:25:06.000 it. I asked you to do it. And he texted me after and he's like, Hey, it went really well. This little

00:25:10.480 hiccup, he addressed it perfectly. Did a great job. And I told him, I said, look, I know initially you

00:25:18.140 didn't want to do it, but I asked you to do it specifically because I recognize leadership in

00:25:25.580 you. And I wanted to give you the opportunity to test a little bit, to push yourself, to do

00:25:31.260 something different and to be in a better position to help you develop your leadership skills.

00:25:36.540 We have to be it. Dude, I could have done it. A thousand other people could have done it. I actually

00:25:41.320 like to do it. I like the sound of my own voice. I think I do it pretty well, but I have to get out of

00:25:46.100 my way and I have to get out of people that I care about way so that they can learn and develop.

00:25:51.260 And you have to create a void because if you fill that all the time, there's nowhere for people to

00:25:58.440 go. And you're the bottleneck of your own organizations. You could look at that as a

00:26:02.540 father. Like if you're doing everything for your children, there's nowhere for them to go. They're

00:26:08.060 hitting the ceiling and then you're the problem. Get out of the way. Let them lead. If you're on a hike,

00:26:13.240 let them lead. If you have a family activity within reason, let them be involved in the planning

00:26:17.640 process. If you have an activity that you guys want to do Monday night, let the kids come up with

00:26:23.140 something every once in a while. You got to create a little bit of a vacuum, a little bit of a void

00:26:27.820 and allow other people to rise to the top. I love it, man. I'll share this quick story just because

00:26:33.560 it's important to me at least, right? So I'll share it. So when I was 18, I was getting ordained.

00:26:43.240 At church. And my dad has not been or was not a religious man. In fact, my entire life, I may

00:26:52.460 have seen him go to church like once. The entire time. Christmas or Easter or something like that.

00:26:57.200 Yeah, yeah. Something like that, right? Mom dragged him to church. Totally. And I was like,

00:27:02.220 what? He's in a suit? You know, like crazy. I didn't even know he owned one of those, right?

00:27:07.560 And anyhow, so I was getting, when I turned 18, I was going to get ordained. And my bishop

00:27:14.220 grasped me and says, who do you want to ordain you? And I said, oh, you. I'll just have you do it.

00:27:21.560 And he goes, aren't you going to ask your dad? And I go, ah, he, I mean, he doesn't go to church or

00:27:29.080 whatever. And he goes, hmm. He's like, think about it. Meanwhile, he gave me a scripture to read.

00:27:36.620 And so I went home, I read the scripture and I'll summarize. But in this story, this young man,

00:27:42.920 his dad was murmuring against the Lord and complaining and all this stuff. And, and this

00:27:48.220 young man went praying and the Lord told him to do something, but didn't give him all like all the

00:27:53.460 directions, you know, just kind of like helped him a little bit. And then he went back to his dad and

00:27:59.100 asked his dad what he should do. The, the, the dad that was murmuring, right. And complaining weeks

00:28:05.860 before. And, and I read that passage and I was like, what opportunity was I robbing from my father

00:28:16.020 by saying, oh, you know, he, he's not interested. He's not a, you know, he's not, uh, the priesthood

00:28:22.300 holder that he should be in all, you know, all these judgments. And I was just robbing him from

00:28:27.120 this opportunity of doing this important thing, you know, and, and, and this is relates, right.

00:28:34.420 Sometimes when we, we rob people from the opportunity, like you, like you mentioned,

00:28:38.880 delegating, it's, it's a form of service. And, and a lot of us just need someone to believe in us

00:28:45.440 sometimes. And we just need the rep and the opportunity for someone to say, Hey, I believe in

00:28:51.480 you. I, I intentionally asked you to lead that call because I see something in you that you may

00:28:57.120 not see. And man, that's super powerful when you have someone in your corner that, that C that sees

00:29:03.040 you that way. Yeah. What an incredible compliment. You know, the other thing that's interesting about

00:29:07.460 this Kip is hundreds of thousands of men are going to listen to this podcast. And I can, I can pretty

00:29:14.100 much guarantee that every single man who listens to this particular episode will nod their head in

00:29:19.700 approval. As I say this, don't you want to be valuable? Don't you want responsibility? Don't

00:29:28.160 you want to be in charge of some important work? Don't you want to lead other people? Don't you want

00:29:34.100 to be innovative? Every single one of you is going like this right now. Yep. Yeah. And so if you want

00:29:39.760 that, it's safe to say that your brothers want that. And if they want that, then it's on you to create

00:29:44.980 the opportunity for them to be valuable. Right. You, you, in that situation, did your dad do the,

00:29:51.480 the, he didn't do it? No, he didn't, but he came and he participated, which I didn't think he was

00:29:59.180 going to even do that part. But, and the beauty of it is in hindsight, I'm just grateful that he had

00:30:05.800 me ask him. Right. And just what a powerful thing. I mean, even think about your Bishop, he could have

00:30:13.160 said yes and he would have been flattered to do it. Totally. And yet he stepped out of the way. He's

00:30:17.660 like, no, think about it. Here's some things to think about. Yeah. He's adding value to your life.

00:30:23.240 You're adding value to your, to your dad's life. Even just the fact that you asked your dad was a

00:30:27.920 compliment. It made him feel valuable. Yeah. I wrote something else here too, is that when we're working

00:30:33.700 with other people, Kip, you and I often talk about minimum viable product. I wrote down here,

00:30:38.540 minimum viable assistance. So if you're working with somebody, it's always minimum viable assistance.

00:30:46.760 You know, if, um, the other day, yesterday I went, I took, uh, my kid shooting with my girlfriend and

00:30:52.940 her daughter and a friend. And so we went out and went shooting and I've got this little Ruger 22 that

00:30:57.980 Volkortzen firearms put together for me. It's got a little red dot on there. It's such an easy gun to

00:31:03.160 shoot. That's blast. Yeah. There's no kick. You know, it's not loud. It's just a 22. It's got that

00:31:09.460 little red. It's so easy for the kids to shoot. And, uh, my son, he's, he's eight, you know, so he's

00:31:16.320 small and he's, he's fine around firearms. We teach the firearm rules and everything else we shoot.

00:31:21.240 But when I was instructing him, I didn't teach him everything. I just taught him a few little things

00:31:27.740 like, Hey, here's how you need to do this. And here's, here's a way to hold it. And here's how to look at

00:31:31.440 it. He's like, okay. And then he kept missing the target. I'm like, okay, well, what do you,

00:31:36.460 what do you need to do? He's like, well, I don't know. Like, should I do this? I'm like, try it.

00:31:42.940 So he tried it. And then he started hitting the target. This is minimum viable assistance. You

00:31:47.900 don't need to solve everybody's problems. You just need to give them a little bit of a boost. Like if

00:31:52.320 you're on a climbing wall, cause I take the kids to climbing walls occasionally. I don't like push them

00:31:57.220 up the wall. If they need an extra thing, I put my hand right there and they step on my

00:32:01.420 hand and they find the next little thing to grab onto. Minimum viable assistance always,

00:32:07.380 whether it's in the family life, at work, wherever, let people work through their problems on their own

00:32:12.840 and get stronger. It's like at the gym. If you've got, let's say you've got two plates on your bar

00:32:18.880 and you're, you're, you know, cranking out and you're trying to get, I don't know, do it for reps

00:32:23.120 or whatever. And you get to eight and at nine, you're like struggling. You don't want somebody to

00:32:28.280 come in and just like take it and just rack it for you. You just want them to come and just put

00:32:32.540 their fingertips on the bar and just a little bit of pressure to help me get two more reps.

00:32:36.860 So maybe it wasn't exactly 225, but maybe it was 205. Cause you had somebody putting a little bit

00:32:42.100 of pressure on there for you. That's all just a little bit to help them work through. Cause that's

00:32:46.960 how people get stronger. Yeah. And that's how they learn. And that's how they build confidence.

00:32:52.840 You go rack it for them. They're like, good job, man. You're like, whatever. I wasn't good. I

00:32:58.280 needed 10. I got eight. Yeah. And you, you, you did the last rep for me, not me. Yeah. Right. And so

00:33:04.080 we robbed them right from that confidence too. Ah, it's good stuff, man. All right. Chase Kimball.

00:33:09.480 Do you think that seeking external validation can inherently be cured or is it like a drug addiction?

00:33:15.200 Do you believe that it can be more of a mindset shift once you achieve it, that it no longer

00:33:20.720 plagues you? Or is this something that you will always be in your shadow, something you hide away

00:33:25.060 and suppress? Well, that's an interesting question. I saw this one this morning. Let me, let me give you

00:33:30.480 a little bit of a way to, to a different way to think about it. And, and I'm just kind of working

00:33:36.560 it through my mind. So I'm not entirely sure this is the best way to explain it, but I'll, I'll say it

00:33:40.800 this way. Cause I want us to start thinking about things differently. Maybe the need for

00:33:45.700 external validation isn't entirely bad. Right? Because if you think about this from an evolutionary

00:33:53.420 perspective, my desire to be validated by the tribe is imperative to my survival. Totally.

00:34:01.160 I thought about this in, in high school sports. You know, if, if I was, I caught when I was in

00:34:06.740 high school in baseball and if I let a ball get past me and I looked around at my team and a run

00:34:13.880 scored and I looked around at my team and I saw the frustration and disappointment in their eyes,

00:34:17.740 that's, they're not validating me. And, but it was motivation for me to get better because I didn't

00:34:25.300 want to let the team down. And I had, if I made that unforced error. So I don't think if we look at it,

00:34:32.280 I don't think it's entirely bad. I think it's a matter of what kind of fuel it is for you.

00:34:36.740 So if you're seeking external validation to change who you are, to manipulate behavior,

00:34:43.060 to manipulate other people or an excuse to self-destruct or wallow in your own self-pity

00:34:48.820 because you're not getting what you think you need, then that's an issue. But if you're looking

00:34:54.360 for, and again, this is where the wording gets a little tricky for me. If you're, if you're wanting

00:34:59.940 some, I'll call it feedback, positive feedback from other people, I don't think that's entirely

00:35:08.180 beneficial. Yeah. Yeah. How do you know you're doing good sometimes? So Kip, if you said to me,

00:35:14.200 Hey Ryan, man, you were really on fire on the podcast today and you did a wonderful job. I mean,

00:35:18.040 I'm not telling you to say that Kip at the end, but you know, if you were to say that,

00:35:21.940 that's external validation, right? I don't need it. I'm going to do the podcast, whether you give

00:35:31.520 that to me or not, I'm going to show it fully, whether you give it to me or not, but it also

00:35:35.640 feels pretty good. And it forges a better bond between us because I like you more. Yeah.

00:35:42.240 So I don't think it's entirely bad. I just think, what are you using it for? So I don't know that

00:35:48.500 there's anything to be cured. What would need to be cured is you self-destructing, you wallowing in

00:35:57.500 your own self-pity, you manipulating your own behavior or other people in order to seek that

00:36:02.480 validation, but getting it from other people and being acknowledged and welcomed into the tribe,

00:36:08.900 I don't think is a bad thing. Yeah. The, the thing I'd add to it, or maybe clarity is

00:36:15.620 validation from who also matters, right? Especially in the world of social media, right? You can make

00:36:22.900 some posts and get tons of external validation from people that you don't even respect people,

00:36:28.320 people that you don't even know. And, and that's the level of validation that you seek. I mean,

00:36:33.600 that could be very dangerous, right? And, and we got to be careful of that, especially with our

00:36:37.500 children in regards to that level of validation. But the examples that you gave, they're people that

00:36:42.700 what are on our team, people that we value people that we have relationships with. Those are data

00:36:49.320 points that's beneficial to us. Absolutely. There's two questions that I ask when I'm confronted with

00:36:56.280 these situations, because I do get tempted to get drawn into what other people think of me,

00:37:01.500 just like we all do. Totally. But the two questions are this, are they right? And are they credible?

00:37:07.920 Yeah. Now, if a stranger is telling you, let's say, let's say I post a video of me doing deadlifts

00:37:15.260 and without fail, somebody is going to come in and say, you're on your back, your feet or whatever,

00:37:21.740 right? Yeah. Yeah. Is that all? Like people are just going to do that. So the first question is,

00:37:27.420 okay, well, is this even a credible person? Because if it's Joe Schmo and you look at his profile and

00:37:32.740 he's 400 pounds and he hasn't done a deadlift in his entire life, I don't really need to worry

00:37:38.720 about what that guy's telling me to do. But if it's Johnny Loretty and he's in the business and

00:37:45.440 he's professional and he's trained thousands and thousands of people to lift properly so they

00:37:50.120 don't hurt themselves and realize gains, even if I don't know Johnny, I might say, well, that's

00:37:55.380 interesting. That's a credible source of information. Is he right? And then you can measure

00:38:01.080 it against other credible sources and then you can make your decisions from there. So I don't think

00:38:04.860 you even need to know a person, but you do need to know whether they're credible and whether they're

00:38:08.840 right. And you can back that up typically through a little bit of research.

00:38:11.960 How do you relate this to, because I think this might be part of Chase's question as well,

00:38:17.600 or other guys might be considering this. And I'm just thinking when we go down and out, right? Like

00:38:22.580 I think divorce is highly difficult. Why? Because the one person, and I'm going to say in a very

00:38:29.380 harsh way, but the one person that's like committed to love you says life isn't worth going forward with

00:38:37.020 you. Like I, I, it's the ultimate burn of all time, right? Like I would rather be alone than with

00:38:44.680 you. And that's external, it's external feedback and that hurts. And, and you feel lonely. You,

00:38:54.300 you don't feel loved. Um, and, and we might have seasons, right? Where we feel very lonely in our

00:39:01.220 families or with our spouses, or we don't think we have friends that appreciate us. And there's,

00:39:07.020 an element of those times where our confidence in ourselves, hope, and understanding our divine

00:39:13.860 nature of who we are is super important. What, what, what, how do you, how do we balance that

00:39:20.660 need sometimes when that validation doesn't exist for us? Right. Well, I think the divinity of who we

00:39:26.560 are is crucial. You mentioned that knowing that you're a son of God and that you are divine and that

00:39:31.660 you're here for a reason is crucial. Yeah. That, because if you have that and you really have the

00:39:38.580 faith in that, you don't need anything from anybody else. So that's, that's the deepest sense of

00:39:45.000 validation. Yeah. I would say another source of validation is validating yourself. If, if you go to

00:39:52.960 the gym this morning, you're going to be able to feel more, you might not look the way you want to look

00:39:57.220 yet, but you're going to feel more validated about who you are now. And you're not going to need

00:40:01.800 somebody to come in and say, Hey, you're a really hard worker. You're doing a good job. You're fit.

00:40:05.800 Like you don't need it because you already know it. Yeah. Like I know I am now. You don't run around

00:40:10.220 and say that, but you inside you're like, yeah, I know I'm confident. Right. Yeah. You know, and even in a,

00:40:16.340 in a divorce, you know, I went through a divorce several years ago. And so what you're saying,

00:40:21.780 you know, obviously hits true. Anybody who's gone through that has had that feeling and that

00:40:26.380 experience, but I can say this with a hundred percent certainty that if at some point in the

00:40:31.980 future, I was ever dropped in the same scenario that I was several years ago, I would handle myself

00:40:38.100 the exact same way that I did through this. And although there's difficult times and moments,

00:40:45.360 and you know, a lot of those times are, are in the past now, you know, I'm, I'm in a better spot

00:40:49.600 because of the things I've done, but I can hold my head up high in spite of the things that I've

00:40:55.980 messed up with and feel good knowing that, Hey, if I was in that situation again, man, I, I feel like

00:41:02.860 deeply, I, I believe and feel like I handled myself like the man I want to be would handle himself.

00:41:09.820 And that's validating. I don't need somebody else to say, Hey, you did a good job. I already know I

00:41:14.360 did. Yeah. Um, the other thing I would say too, is that when people compliment you,

00:41:20.740 just learn to say, thank you guys. Don't, don't push it off. Don't do the false humility thing.

00:41:31.600 Don't be bashful about it. Kip, if you compliment me at the end of this podcast and say, man, Ryan,

00:41:36.200 you were really on fire today. My response is simply, Hey, thanks Kip. That means a lot to me.

00:41:43.220 I appreciate that. Thank you. That's it. Yeah. I'm not going to validate me if you excuse it.

00:41:48.460 Exactly. Yeah. Right. I'm not going to invalidate. You believe that whether it's true or not is

00:41:53.040 subjective, but you believe that. So who am I to say I wasn't, that's what you saw. Right. And,

00:41:58.940 and what I also say to that is don't put too much weight into other people's words. Totally.

00:42:07.300 So if you validate me in some way, Kip, I don't need to be on cloud nine the rest of the day.

00:42:12.740 Like it doesn't really mean it was a, it was a nice gesture. It was, Hey, you did a good job.

00:42:18.180 You acknowledge something that you saw. That's it. It doesn't mean I don't have to show up the

00:42:23.400 rest of the day. It doesn't mean I can just be in a good mood and like everything's great and I'm

00:42:26.780 amazing. No, you're putting too much weight into people's words. And by the way, the alternate is true.

00:42:31.740 If Kip, you came to me and said, Hey man, like you really, that was weak. Like you were distracted.

00:42:39.120 You didn't show up on time. You like, obviously you weren't ready to be here. You were in another

00:42:44.600 place mentally. And then I just carried all of that with me. And I wallowed in my own self pity for the

00:42:50.620 rest of the day. And woe is me. And I'm a bad podcaster and I shouldn't be doing this. That's too

00:42:56.580 much weight on another person's words. Just take it like, okay, you know what? That doesn't feel

00:43:03.680 good. But Kip, thanks for the feedback. You're right. I'm going to be better tomorrow when I show

00:43:07.480 up and that's it. Like don't read too much into it. Yeah. Kevin Nickel, what are your definitions

00:43:14.920 of being comfortable versus becoming complacent? That's a good question. Uh, I didn't actually see

00:43:25.600 this one before. I think complacency is apathy where you're just, you don't even really care.

00:43:34.820 The motivation is gone. The desire is gone. Maybe you're resting on your laurels and you think you

00:43:39.660 don't have to work hard anymore. Almost indifferent. Yeah. Versus comfort. I'm, I'm hesitant to even use

00:43:48.260 that word. I think that's what I was struggling with, but I'm just going to take it in the spirit in

00:43:51.440 which I think it was intended. Comfort is maybe a place of confidence and security. Like for example,

00:43:57.960 when I get on this podcast with you, I'm, I'm comfortable. I don't, I don't get butterflies.

00:44:04.860 I don't get nervous. I'm not like jittery about it. So I'm comfortable in what we're doing here,

00:44:11.920 but I also acknowledge there's room for improvement, room for improvement in the way we communicate and

00:44:18.120 articulate our message, room for improvement in technology, room for improvement in the way we

00:44:22.060 market our message to the people. So I would say I'm comfortable with the job that we're doing.

00:44:28.120 And that comes from a place of confidence, which is, which stems from competence. But I also know

00:44:35.100 that I want to get better and improve. And I would say that's what makes the difference.

00:44:40.100 Got it. All right. We're going to jump over to the gram, uh, to follow Ryan there. It's at,

00:44:45.120 at Ryan Mickler, uh, GRV leader. What would you, what would be a good book that you would recommend

00:44:52.100 for my 13 year old son to start reading? Hmm. I mean, that's pretty broad. I, I mean, I'm assume

00:45:00.020 it's in the realm of leadership and maybe self-development I would say, but, um, Jocko stuff's

00:45:06.740 pretty good. Like his kid stuff, way of the warrior kid 13 is maybe a little old for that,

00:45:11.180 but I still think it's pretty, I think it's still would be pretty applicable. Um, man, you know,

00:45:18.480 like there's other books, uh, hatchet is one that I loved when I was a kid. I still love that book.

00:45:24.980 And it gets to me, hatchet. If you haven't, have you, you've read that right?

00:45:28.720 Long time ago. That's a good book. And it gets kids, at least it does for me. It gets boys thinking

00:45:35.260 about what would I do in that situation? How would I survive? And it gets their wheels turning,

00:45:39.900 which I like. Yeah. What were you going to say? Well, I was just going to say, I don't know if I ever

00:45:44.400 like actually read the whole book, but I remember that being an assignment if I remember correctly

00:45:48.980 when we were kids and I was intrigued by it. Yeah. Um, I like that. The other one I like is

00:45:55.780 old man in the sea. That's a really good book. And these aren't like self-development books,

00:46:01.680 but there's so many lessons that you can talk with. Yeah. There's stories, but there's lessons

00:46:06.340 and morals in the story. And then you can talk with your kids so you could actually read it with them.

00:46:10.460 And then you could say, like, you don't give them the answer, right? Minimum viable assistance.

00:46:15.500 So it's questions. Hey, what'd you think about that? Would you have handled that way? And the

00:46:20.540 thing about old man in the sea is there's an old man and there's a young boy who's watching this old

00:46:26.100 man, this old fisher, and there's morals and lessons. I really, that's a good story. Hatchet's a good

00:46:31.960 story. Uh, way of the warrior kids, same thing, stories and morals. But what I would suggest is

00:46:37.660 something a little bit more covert than self-development. Yeah. Because if it's overtly

00:46:45.760 self-development, you might lose a 13 year old. So it's gotta be a story form. It's gotta be fun.

00:46:52.800 I would read the book with them and then discuss over dinner and talk about, well, what would you

00:46:57.140 do in that situation? Or how would you do this? Or how would you do that? And I know at least for

00:47:01.420 Hatchet, there's a movie based on the book. And so you guys could read the book together,

00:47:05.200 talk about it and then watch the movie at the end, you know, stuff like that is what I would do.

00:47:10.200 But I, I would stay away from the hardcore self-development stuff and just keep it to good

00:47:15.120 short stories, uh, that will help obviously their reading skill, but also their comprehension and

00:47:21.100 the way they think that are critical thinking skills, all of that kind of stuff.

00:47:25.060 Did you, did you hear that, uh, they're making a way of the warrior kid movie?

00:47:28.960 Did you hear that? Isn't, uh, Chris Pratt is, is involved somehow. I, I don't know. I think

00:47:35.380 he's uncle Jake. I think he's the uncle. I think he's the uncle. Yeah. That's Jocko should be the

00:47:40.320 uncle, but that's what I think too. I'm like, I mean, cause that's what I can get Jocko. I guess

00:47:45.660 Chris Pratt's a good pick too. Yeah. Chris Pratt's a horrible backup for Jocko, but you know,

00:47:52.740 it'll do. Oh man. Okay. Spark, uh, Sparky char 28. How can a former liberal navigate aligning with

00:48:02.680 a new party, a formal, uh, former liberal navigating aligning to a new party?

00:48:11.460 I think you just spend time around those individuals and you research it. You know,

00:48:15.620 I think, I think actually you probably have an advantage over somebody who's always been,

00:48:19.700 for example, a conservative, you know, we, we can get just as stuck in our ways as anybody else,

00:48:25.460 obviously. And we create echo chambers and we don't look for other information. And the news

00:48:32.100 sources that we gather are just reaffirming our previously held beliefs, but you're coming from

00:48:38.320 a place that was not only did not believe that, believed a lot of things that were antithetical to

00:48:45.000 what conservatives believe. So I think that gives you a great advantage because you can now come into

00:48:51.040 this with a level head and say, okay, well, let's, let's explore this policy, for example,

00:48:56.220 and let's play it out. Okay. It's in theory, it's really good. It makes sense, but here's the problems

00:49:02.540 and you're coming at it from a liberal side, a liberal perspective, and you might be able to round

00:49:06.760 out a thought process a little better, maybe the, even than I can. So I think if, if you approach it

00:49:12.320 with a level of humility, with a level of curiosity, then I think over time you'll, you'll, you'll see

00:49:21.460 and you'll start to formulate your own conclusions. And I don't know, I don't, I don't really know what

00:49:27.320 else I'd give you outside of that. What do you think? I think there's just, I mean, I, I get

00:49:33.400 triggered by the, like aligning to a new party, like F that. Yeah, of course. Right. Like don't align

00:49:38.480 to any party. What's your independent thought process and what works for you and, and stop the

00:49:47.620 having to align to a party. I, I hate it. I can't stand it. When I, and when I get a text message about

00:49:54.220 like donate to a GOP candidate or because I'm a Republic, I'm like, no, I'm not. I'm Kip Sorensen.

00:50:01.500 I have independent thoughts and feelings and I'm not going to outsource it to a tribal group so I can

00:50:08.400 be lazy in my thinking. I think that's well said. I think you're better off that way than,

00:50:15.700 than trying to align with anybody. Well, I think the key to here is, and I wish I would have said

00:50:21.000 what you said, cause it's, it's dead on. I mean, it's so accurate, but the key here is that you

00:50:26.120 acknowledge, this is one thing I think a lot of people with Trump do is they don't acknowledge his

00:50:32.520 flaws. Yeah. And you should like what you said about the executive order spot on. I watched that

00:50:38.180 video and he's like, I'm doing an expected executive order. I'm like, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa. Yeah. Like I

00:50:43.080 don't like that. Right. And we should have that level of critical thinking versus like, okay, well,

00:50:48.480 whatever the mega does, I'm good. It's like, no, that's stupid. The problem with that is that,

00:50:53.780 you know, and, and the liberals and the conservatives got into issues, liberals,

00:50:57.260 mostly when they started to do the filibuster stuff. And Mitch McConnell said, you guys are

00:51:00.660 going to regret this when the tables are turned. And sure enough, the tables turned and they regretted,

00:51:05.660 regretted those decisions. So you got to think about that. You know, if, if Trump comes in and does

00:51:10.140 all these executive orders over a four year period, and then I'm, I'm assuming JD Vance will be the next

00:51:15.900 nominee. It goes up against whoever the, the liberal nomination nomination is going to be.

00:51:21.580 And that person wins undo all that stuff. They, well, not only undo it. I mean, they, Trump sets

00:51:28.260 a precedent and now executive orders are getting passed that we don't agree with. And are we going

00:51:34.640 to be up in arms and pissed off about that? Probably. And yet some of these people were the

00:51:38.980 biggest advocates for the executive orders that Trump enacted. So I get that there's policy that

00:51:45.420 we like, but we have to do it the right way. Otherwise we're opening up a world of hurt

00:51:51.700 when somebody is in office that we don't like there's, there's checks and balances in place

00:51:58.240 for a reason. And to, to his point, this is, I think the point we're making here is you can align

00:52:04.460 with a candidate closely, but you're never going to align 100% with a candidate. And you shouldn't

00:52:10.800 because you should have your own thoughts and your own ideas and your own dreams and your own

00:52:15.060 ways that you look at it. And I think as a former liberal, like you're saying, you have a rounded

00:52:20.560 out perspective. I probably would not have agreed with any of the policies that you did, but you

00:52:25.380 have a rounded out perspective that maybe I don't have because I haven't been in that situation.

00:52:30.660 Yeah. And it says a lot about you too, to be like, Hey, how do I align? Like that, that is form

00:52:35.800 of independence, right? You're like, Hey, how do I pivot and adjust? And how do I evolve in my

00:52:40.960 thinking? It's, it's perfect. So that's great. Um, Kanellis, uh, Jr. What is your take on the

00:52:47.320 political left and, and not the like modern progressive woke, but just your take on the

00:52:52.240 political left? I don't know what he's more like classic, classical liberalism, I think is probably what

00:52:57.200 he's talking about. Yeah. I mean, sure. Uh, the, I heard this quote and I'm going to butcher it,

00:53:02.320 but it was, if, if you're a conservative before you're 20, you have no heart. If you're a liberal

00:53:10.160 after you're 20, you have no brain. I was like, that's actually pretty good. It's pretty, it's

00:53:17.560 pretty accurate actually. So I think if I were to play that out, I think there's some classic,

00:53:25.100 classic liberal policies that are very, they're based in empathy and kindness and compassion

00:53:32.820 towards humanity. Yeah. Yeah. But taken to the extreme. Now we have, Hey, let's, let's accept

00:53:40.980 people for the, who they are. Let's, let's help them. Let's, let's embrace them as, as Americans.

00:53:45.940 You know, that's the classic liberal thought process. And now it's like, let's let boys be girls

00:53:50.360 and then not only embrace them, let's pay for their gender surgeries and let's, you know,

00:53:55.400 indoctrinate everybody else to believe this. And so it's, it's that thought process taken to the

00:54:01.080 extreme. And I would say most conservatives, at least the conservatives I know, they don't,

00:54:07.640 they don't hate people who are transgender. They don't hate gay people. They're not afraid of those

00:54:14.960 people. That's the thing. Like when people say transphobia, I'm not afraid of it. I just don't agree

00:54:19.540 with it. I don't think it's helpful. I think it's dangerous to our children, even to the children

00:54:26.640 who are going through these gender reassignment surgeries and irreversible medication to stop

00:54:34.740 their, their growth and stop the natural development of, of hormones in their bodies. It's, it's not a good

00:54:40.280 thing, but I also have people in my life who are transgender, people who are non-binary as they would

00:54:49.320 refer to themselves as, I still love them. I still care about them. I want what's best for them,

00:54:54.380 but I don't think that path is going to serve them well. So I would say generally that classic

00:55:01.560 liberalism is more about, Hey, how do we embrace people? How do we try to understand who they are?

00:55:07.700 How do we support the disenfranchised? How do we help those who are in situations that are outside of

00:55:16.140 their own that maybe didn't have the same advantages that I maybe had, or somebody else listening didn't

00:55:20.440 have. And so let's try to help them in a reasonable way, but still allow them the responsibility to

00:55:27.180 manage their own life, but help. And now it's, Hey, we're not going to help. We're going to do

00:55:33.960 everything for them. We're going to validate their poor decision-making process. We're going to take

00:55:38.020 responsibility, the U S government that is for their wellbeing. It's just taken to the extreme. And that's

00:55:43.280 the issue, but conservative can conservatives can be just as extreme. You know, when we talk about

00:55:50.320 economic policy and we talk about, you know, what's, what's best for the entirety of, of the

00:55:56.920 country. And we talk about, uh, the, the religious perspective and we talk about, um, the importance of

00:56:03.040 our national sovereignty. All of those things are good and fine, but taken to the extreme, they can turn

00:56:08.920 into totally violence and they can turn into, um, you know, alienating people. So it's, it's a double

00:56:18.700 edged sword. I've, I've latched onto this concept, uh, within, from a leadership perspective and we

00:56:24.880 could see this, uh, from a social political perspective. You could see this as parenting. You

00:56:29.580 could see this in organizations. And, and what the, the biggest thing that we failed to realize is when

00:56:35.980 you rescue someone, you rob them of growth and the ability to build confidence. We use the analogy of

00:56:46.200 lifting weights earlier, right? Like, okay, all this last rep is really hard. And I just grabbed the bar

00:56:50.980 from you. And I'm like, Oh, I'll curl it for you. Well, okay. We helped them curl, but do they get the

00:56:56.860 benefit from those last reps of the curl? No. Who did? I did. So I robbed them from growth, from

00:57:03.900 development and from confidence that they could do it. And I just did it for them. And then tomorrow

00:57:09.620 when that rep gets hard, what do, who do they look for? The rescuer. And we robbed them again

00:57:16.400 and we robbed them again. And, and, and so it's not, it's not that we don't want to help people.

00:57:23.980 It's, we need to understand the human condition and what is really helping. It's not getting the fish

00:57:30.540 for them. It's pointing them to water. That is where you really help people. And, and it's a little

00:57:39.380 bit sick and I don't think we're all this way, but sometimes when we want to rescue people, we rescue

00:57:44.520 them because it's a form of validation for ourselves because we are needed. Look, look, look at me. I I'm

00:57:50.900 required here. Everyone needs my help. I have to be the one to save everybody all the time. And, and we get

00:57:57.000 wrapped up in our ego and we realize that we're not benefiting our, our children, our employees or

00:58:02.780 our society when we, when we jump in and save them too much. Yeah. I wrote this down as you were saying

00:58:08.780 that I think both sides of the aisle taken to the extreme become very arrogant and egotistical.

00:58:14.060 Yeah. And I think the left tends to manifest that through love. I know better than you. I can do this

00:58:21.020 because you can't do it for yourself. I'm God. Like I am the savior. Totally. And I think we're on the

00:58:28.520 conservative side of the aisle. It's arrogance, but it usually manifests itself. And look at me. I did

00:58:34.460 all of this by myself in spite of everything around me. I did everything. It's all me. I am God because

00:58:40.400 I did this for myself. Totally. So I think both sides have that ego complex. It just manifests in

00:58:46.240 different ways. Totally. Okay, man, we're up on time. Let's do one more. One more real quick.

00:58:52.020 Oh no, that's a bad question. Chris, I forgot what it was. I saw it. Yeah. It was like, how,

00:58:59.120 how did you let get you? Bad question. All right. Uh, Bodine Kendall, what's the best way to get

00:59:07.620 motivated to get back into the gym? If you've been out of it for a while, I just can't seem to get

00:59:13.600 myself there. Okay, cool. Yeah. Yeah. We'll talk about that. So with, with Chris though, that question

00:59:20.180 is such a loaded question. It's like, it's like asking somebody, why do you beat your wife? It's

00:59:24.060 like, what? Like, what makes you think Kip beat me? What are you talking about? How did you let

00:59:29.140 Kip beat you? What is he even talking about? Yeah. What are you talking about, Chris?

00:59:32.920 Um, all right, let's go to that motivation one. Yeah. Motivation is hard when you've been out of

00:59:38.380 it for a while, you get yourself into patterns and habits and loops that you're just so accustomed to.

00:59:42.940 So it can be a challenge. What I would say, and I think the old me would have said, you just do it.

00:59:49.520 Jocko. I don't think that's sustainable. Yeah. I mean, it look, but it has a time, you would,

00:59:56.520 right? Like sometimes people can't get past that. Like that's not enough. You know, it has a time

01:00:01.640 and a place, you know, like Kip, for example, you're disciplined, but let's say you went through

01:00:05.780 a dry spell or, you know, you're having a bad week. I'd be like, Kip, stop being a little bitch.

01:00:10.940 And like, it's time to get up and you just go back and do it. And that might actually really work for

01:00:16.240 you. Yep. But for other people, it might be disempowering. Yeah. If I said, stop being a

01:00:24.340 little bitch, like just go do it. They're like, I already feel like that. And you're just making

01:00:28.320 me feel worse now. So now I'm doubly not going to do what I should be doing and I'm going to dig in

01:00:33.240 my heels and be even worse about it. So for that person, what I would say is you have to make it fun.

01:00:42.100 If you're, I'm just, I just, after being alive for 43 years, if you don't enjoy it, you're not

01:00:48.940 going to do it. I don't do shit. I don't like to do. I might do it once. I might do it. If I have to,

01:00:54.620 somebody might like coerce me into doing something because I feel obligated or sorry or bad if I don't,

01:01:01.740 but it won't last for long. I promise you. And I think most people are probably the same.

01:01:07.560 So if you're hearing us and we're telling you go to the gym and go lift weights or go do jujitsu

01:01:13.360 and that doesn't sound appealing to you, I mean, you might do it for a day or a week,

01:01:20.080 but you're not going to sustain that. So what is it that you like? Do you like to walk your dog?

01:01:26.900 Do you like to hike? Do you like to swim? What sports did you play in high school? If you did at all,

01:01:32.580 what sports would you wish you would have played? If you played a sport and you can't now because of some

01:01:37.120 physical limitation, what's similar to that? What's close to that? Uh, you know, there's things

01:01:42.220 like, I, this is kind of funny, but like pickleball, you know, that's a big trend, a big movement. It

01:01:47.920 has been for years and people make fun of it. It's like the best way to describe it is like

01:01:52.700 miniature tennis for, for kids or something. And yet it's tennis for, uh, people that are not

01:01:58.640 athletic, right? Yeah. It's ping pong tennis is what it is. Yeah. So it's like, but it's fun.

01:02:06.620 And if it gets you outside and it gets some vitamin D for you and you're meeting other people

01:02:11.680 and you're competing and you're moving your body. The last time I played pickleball, I thought I

01:02:16.500 pulled my hamstring. So maybe that's that it's not that weak of a sport or maybe I'm just getting old.

01:02:22.760 Um, I swear it like snapped and I keeled over and just like balled up. But, uh, the point I'm making

01:02:29.420 here is do something you like and don't kill yourself just yet. So if you're like, you know,

01:02:36.880 no, I do like going to the gym. I do want to lift weights. I do see value in that. Great. You've been

01:02:42.740 off out of the gym and on the couch for 10 years. If you go balls to the wall and you do two a days

01:02:48.020 for the next week, you're burning yourself out. I promise you. All I'd want you to do today

01:02:53.000 is to get up and just go spend 20 minutes in the gym, pick three exercises, you know, maybe do

01:02:59.980 bench press, a shoulder exercise and some curls and that's it. And then go home. That's it. That's

01:03:06.960 all you need to do today. And then tomorrow you can do some, uh, you can even do machines if you

01:03:12.800 don't want to get into the heavyweights yet, but you can do some seated leg curls, leg extensions

01:03:17.320 and a hack squat. Yeah. And that's it. Yeah. Or if, is, is there, you know, Bodine, you, you like

01:03:23.540 football, you like basketball, figure out when that game is and you watch that game while walking on

01:03:28.620 the treadmill at the gym. Yeah. Done. Yep. Right. Like find a way, you know, it's, I, I'm going to take

01:03:35.960 a different angle on this a little bit of just kind of my takeaway to you answering Bodine's question

01:03:41.400 here, but I really feel like if I end up, you know, forming my own business again in the future.

01:03:47.660 Right. And I go working for myself. I really think that one of the values that are going to be

01:03:52.360 incorporated into that company is fun. Like we're all about getting after it and being successful

01:04:00.000 and having fun. And there's just something to be said for just loving what you do and having a good

01:04:07.000 time and probably not taking yourself as serious as you are, which is big for me to say, because my

01:04:13.040 default is just to always grind everything out and everything's serious and it's not fun. And I,

01:04:18.860 but I realized, man, life is too short and, and there's some, there's just joy when you, when you

01:04:25.180 can show up and enjoy whatever it is that you're doing, even if it's work. Yeah. Yeah. And it won't

01:04:30.740 feel as heavy, right? It won't feel like, I mean, I even think about like hunt camp last week.

01:04:35.260 Like if everything was so serious and just, we have to do this, we have, well, we all would

01:04:40.320 have been miserable because all of us failed in some way or another. Right. Yeah. And yet

01:04:44.160 think about, we were just teasing each other and making fun of each other and making fun

01:04:48.860 of ourselves and laughing and telling Joe, like it was just a fun environment and it makes

01:04:55.280 it enjoyable and it makes it something that you want to go do again. So yeah, I would, I would

01:04:59.220 in this case link you being motivated to you doing something that you just enjoy. You don't have

01:05:04.860 to like grind everything out. Yeah. I love that. That's good, man. Okay. Well, our calls

01:05:10.100 to action. I mean, I think a couple of things, I mean, the guys talked about, you know, we

01:05:14.680 had some IC questions around regional meetups and whatnot. And I, and I think maybe a call

01:05:19.900 to action for guys that aren't in the IC is one, you can learn more about it by going to

01:05:24.360 orderofman.com slash iron council. But if you haven't joined us in the Facebook group, you

01:05:28.840 know, sometimes those guys on the Facebook group, well, they'll do regional meetups.

01:05:32.300 They'll, they'll communicate those meetups within the Facebook group and you can get

01:05:36.880 connected with some of the guys of order of man and the iron council, uh, through that

01:05:43.140 membership. And that's facebook.com slash group slash order of man. And of course, connect

01:05:47.940 with Mr. Mickler on X and Instagram at Ryan Mickler.

01:05:51.880 Awesome. Appreciate you, Kip guys. Great questions today. Uh, hopefully, as I say, every week, we

01:05:56.680 gave you some things to consider as you were asking those questions, keep them coming. We've

01:05:59.980 got probably another half dozen or so questions that we'll get to. And if we didn't hit yours

01:06:04.340 and tackle yours today, we will next week. All right, guys, we will be back on Friday

01:06:09.100 until then go out there, take action and become the man you are meant to be.

01:06:16.140 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your

01:06:20.440 life and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at orderofman.com.

01:06:29.980 Thank you.

Order of Man - November 13, 2024

External Validation, Liberals and Conservatives, and the Void in Leadership ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING

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