Order of Man - JIM SHOCKEY ｜ Live a Life of Meaning and Significance

00:00:00.000 All of us are interested in finding meaning, purpose, and significance in our lives, and yet that all seems to be so elusive for so many.

00:00:08.300 Why is it that some men seem to find their passions early on in life, while others seemingly struggle for decades, if not their entire lives, to find the satisfaction they so desperately crave?

00:00:18.380 My guest today, Jim Shockey, is a man who knows the answer.

00:00:21.000 For decades, he's followed his passions from journalism, becoming a world-class athlete, building an empire as the quote-unquote first family of hunting, and now best-selling novelist.

00:00:32.320 Today, Jim and I talk about dealing with events outside our control, why a man must have a vision that he's working towards, the concept of self-worth and earned respect, the humility and strength of dealing with loss, and the true meaning of legacy, and also how to create it.

00:00:48.100 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest, embrace your fears, and boldly chart your own path.

00:00:53.940 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time.

00:00:58.340 You are not easily deterred or defeated, rugged, resilient, strong.

00:01:03.400 This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become.

00:01:07.600 At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.

00:01:12.880 Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is Ryan Michler. I'm your host and the founder of the Order of Man podcast.

00:01:18.720 And this movement that is literally spanning the entire globe.

00:01:21.980 I want to let you know real quick, first and foremost, let me thank you for sharing the message, for living it.

00:01:28.840 I mean, really, that's it. Just living the message of reclaiming and restoring masculinity.

00:01:33.840 Our motto, of course, if you've been with us for any amount of time, you know is protect, provide, preside.

00:01:39.200 Men is about, being a man is about being a protector, a provider, and a presider, synonymous with leadership.

00:01:44.940 So, guys, I want to thank you for your example.

00:01:49.560 I want to thank you for stepping up for your families and your businesses and your communities because this is what the world needs.

00:01:55.480 Some of the biggest problems from global conflicts to issues that we're dealing with on a national scale, public education, confusion around gender, ideology,

00:02:09.080 the dismantling of families and the tearing down of institutions that have served us is going to be solved by having men step up and become the protectors, providers, and presiders that we're meant to be.

00:02:21.720 So, thank you for joining us and thank you for banding with this mission.

00:02:25.480 I've got a good one with Jim Shockey today.

00:02:27.320 I've really, really been looking forward to this one.

00:02:29.340 And there's some time in this conversation where he talks about his late wife that I think was probably one of my favorite moments of podcasting over the past eight years.

00:02:42.120 You're going to hear him talk about his beautiful bride, and I want you to listen to that one.

00:02:47.500 I want you to listen to that part of it because the way that he honors and cherishes her is very inspiring.

00:02:52.300 So, there's a lot of great information in here, but that really stood out to me.

00:02:55.720 Now, before I get into the conversation, I do want to mention my good friends and show sponsors over at Montana Knife Company.

00:03:02.500 Guys, hunting season has descended upon us, finally.

00:03:06.460 I'm so excited about hunting this year, and hopefully we'll be able to kill some animals and put some more meat in the freezer.

00:03:14.280 But I also hope that I get to break out my Montana Knife Company knives.

00:03:19.160 These are knives that are 100% made in America.

00:03:22.940 In Montana, actually, I've been out to their facility, and it's an incredible operation.

00:03:27.860 They're hiring good people.

00:03:29.140 They're doing good work.

00:03:30.420 And again, it's 100% made in America.

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00:03:45.140 And then make sure you use the code ORDEROFMAN.

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00:03:57.120 All right, guys.

00:03:57.740 Let's get to my introduction of our guest today.

00:04:00.120 Jim Shockey is an award-winning outdoor writer.

00:04:03.120 He's a wildlife photographer, videographer.

00:04:05.420 He's a hunter, a naturalist, a wilderness guide, an outfitter.

00:04:09.060 And then you can just go ahead and throw down author of his newest book, Call Me Hunter.

00:04:14.280 He owns several exclusive outfitting territories in Canada's wild lands, including the famed 12,000 square mile Rogue River outfitting in the Yukon Territory.

00:04:24.980 His television shows have earned countless awards, and his family has affectionately been dubbed the first family of hunting.

00:04:31.880 He also opened, and he talks very fondly of this, opened the Hand of Man Museum of Natural Arts and Conservation on Vancouver Island, which is funded entirely through voluntary donations.

00:04:42.880 And again, now add novelist with his newest book, Call Me Hunter.

00:04:45.620 And you'll begin to catch a glimpse into all this man has accomplished in his incredible life, and he's here to share that story with us.

00:04:54.700 Jim, so great to have you on the podcast.

00:04:56.420 Thanks for joining me today.

00:04:57.280 That's my pleasure.

00:05:00.080 I was going to let you know I was really excited.

00:05:02.740 I got your book unannounced in the mail, and your team had reached out and said, hey, we're interested in coming on the podcast.

00:05:09.220 And I get a lot of solicitation for coming on the podcast, but this is one of the conversations that I have been really, really excited about that a team came out and reached out to me.

00:05:18.580 Oh, well, that's, I'm just as honored, so I'm looking forward to it.

00:05:25.100 I can't wait to hear what questions you have for me.

00:05:27.700 That was nothing, nothing about what's coming, so.

00:05:30.380 Oh, we'll see how we can do.

00:05:32.260 Well, look, I've got a, we've got a big audience of men.

00:05:34.820 A lot of them are in the hunting world.

00:05:36.640 I've been hunting for the past eight years, so I haven't hunted a long, very long.

00:05:41.440 Um, but I know that there's a lot of guys interested in what you do, and I think one of the most fascinating things with you is that you're well known for, for hunting, for your outdoor shows.

00:05:52.400 But there's so much more about you, you know, as, as you get to dive a little deeper into your life and figure out how things started from journalism to being a world-class athlete to being in the military, Canadian military.

00:06:05.220 Uh, it's pretty incredible what you've been able to do, and I'm always curious when a guy like you is, is a bit of a, a renaissance man, I would say, like, what is it that drives you towards certain hobbies, activities, and interests, and how you decide which ones to go with?

00:06:19.060 You know, a long, long time ago, well, I mean, I, I grew up in a trailer park, right?

00:06:25.080 My parents didn't have a lot of money, and, and, uh, when they finally did, you know, managed to scrape together enough to buy a little house.

00:06:32.620 It was the conversation every night from when I was 10 years old to when I was 17, I, I left home, uh, the conversation was whether dad would get laid off, and whether, you know, the Jack Evans, the fellow that owned the company, was going to give him a raise, and whether he'd get any holidays, which was never anyway.

00:06:51.020 Um, and I realized at the age of 10, literally 10 was kind of that, you know, it was grade five, that was the, the, the time of epiphany for me, that you get one life.

00:07:03.300 It's, it's one life.

00:07:04.680 We don't get a, we don't get a do-over on this, and if you're, if it's your life, why, why wouldn't you live it doing the things that you love to do, that, that you're passionate about?

00:07:14.560 So, and, and never let somebody else have, uh, their claws into you so you're, you know, they can dictate to you what, what, the joy of your family makes no sense to me.

00:07:25.200 It made no sense at that age, and I, I, um, so I, I determined in my life to, whatever I was going to do, I was going to be passionate about, and whatever I was passionate about, I was going to, to do my best at it.

00:07:38.360 Whatever, whatever that was, but, you know, and to be fair, I picked, you know, I didn't pick things, I didn't want to be an NBA center, you know, I'm 6'3", I'm not tall enough, you know, so I, I, I didn't pick things that were outside the, you know, outside of the possibility, the realm of possibility, but, um, but yeah, so, so it was just a determination to live my life with absolutely no regrets when I got to the age I'm today, 65 years old.

00:08:08.840 There's none.

00:08:10.180 I was asked the other day by somebody, do you have any regrets?

00:08:13.260 And, you know, they, they were implying that I should have, but everybody does.

00:08:16.740 And I said, no, there's not one single choice I've made in my life that I regret making that choice because every choice I made, I made with intent to, to live my life.

00:08:28.680 So whatever amount of knowledge, it doesn't mean every choice was right in terms of, you know, should you invest in the stock market this week or next week?

00:08:35.640 You know, I mean, you're right or wrong, you, you, you, uh, make your decision based on the knowledge you have, but you can't have regrets on that when you, when it turns out, you know, serendipity doesn't work out.

00:08:45.720 So I have, I have zero regrets and that's, that's how I lived my life.

00:08:50.080 Uh, everything I'm passionate about, I, I went all in on it to the best of my abilities with keeping family is the number one overriding factor in all of that.

00:09:01.740 Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I know you to be a family, man, and I don't, I don't know you personally, but from what I've seen, you know, your daughter was in here talking with us just a minute ago.

00:09:09.800 And it's pretty, it's pretty amazing when you can bring your children and your, your wife into what you're doing and you can build this life together as a family unit.

00:09:18.700 Cause I think that's an increasing rarity.

00:09:20.300 Yeah. You know, if, if you're living your life and it's not like I go to a job every day where I have to leave my wife and kids at home and I come home and I, that's my time with them.

00:09:33.680 My life is, is my job is my work is my avocation, my vocation.

00:09:40.460 So it's, it's whatever I'm doing with, if it's with family, then it's with family.

00:09:44.260 So it worked out for us.

00:09:45.700 I mean, we took our son when he was 18 months old, Bramland to Australia, New Zealand, and we hitchhiked when we literally got off in Brisbane and I just went, where are we going?

00:09:58.020 And North, I know North Australia is pretty cool.

00:10:02.060 And, and I mean, literally with my, my poor, long suffering Louise, my soulmate and an 18 month old baby, we were hitchhiking, got a ride with a truck to go North.

00:10:12.260 I mean, it's not expensive. Getting there was expensive, but after that, it's not that expensive.

00:10:17.400 People will say, you know, they're limited by funds and say, well, you know, are you really, or is it because you want to go five-star resorts the whole time?

00:10:28.560 You know, you save money to be able to do something, which you have, you know, it takes money to get there.

00:10:34.840 But once you're in these places, you can, you can just go.

00:10:37.440 So we did, we lived our life like that. We brought our children into whatever we were doing and it was a pretty natural progression for them as they got older, went to, you know, went to school, went to university to, to, you know, and then they went off on their own, did their own things.

00:10:52.700 Eva, not so much, she came right into the company, but, but they took their own parts of this business and went off on their own, but still related to what we're doing.

00:11:04.020 I mean, it's, uh, and I think it's because it's such a wonderful lifestyle field to table living is, is, is, I mean, I, I, I wouldn't want to live any other way.

00:11:13.140 And, and, uh, when you look at all the possibilities, they've settled on a, on a similar type of lifestyle, which means doing similar things to what, you know, Louise and I did.

00:11:22.340 Yeah. I think people are fascinated with your family and your story because it's something that I think deep down, a lot of people strive to have in their own life with regards to family, that field to table lifestyle, being out and hunting.

00:11:35.080 And, um, you know, but you, you built your empire for lack of a different term when social media really wasn't, really wasn't a thing.

00:11:45.480 Uh, you know, you were doing, uh, channels and shows on an outdoor, uh, things before this was really a thing.

00:11:54.660 How did, how did you guys break into that, into that market and really make a name for yourselves as a family and as an avid outdoorsman and, and, and hunter?

00:12:05.080 You know, part of it was timing and part of it was keeping my eyes open and, and just having a very clear perspective, not being caught.

00:12:13.520 And I wasn't golden, golden handcuffed to something that made me go a certain direction.

00:12:17.680 I was, you know, I could just watch and make decisions.

00:12:20.420 And, and, uh, when I first started, I was, I was right.

00:12:25.300 I mean, that's not true.

00:12:26.720 I came out of university and, and I also thought I'd be a real estate developer because that seemed like a good, quick way to make a lot of money.

00:12:33.580 And, uh, and, and, and I, I think I got it, I worked as a project manager, took all kinds of courses to learn how to build.

00:12:40.800 And, you know, started as a labor on a, with a, with a, um, developer and worked my way up to project manager and then started on my own.

00:12:49.800 I had 10 houses going in three apartment buildings in 1980, which probably you're too young to remember, but it was interest rate.

00:12:58.220 One year, one year, one year too young.

00:13:00.660 Yeah.

00:13:00.920 A little, yeah, the, the interest rates went up to 23%, uh, 23%, you know, so everybody got their money back on my, you know, real estate development career.

00:13:12.040 But I realized, okay, you know, there's things, there's world events that are out of your control.

00:13:18.160 You can be as good as you can possibly be at something, but especially when you're starting out, you better pick something that, uh, you have a little bit more control over.

00:13:25.780 So I walked away with my dog and my car and my stereo and, uh, and, uh, started doing, I loved antiques too.

00:13:33.800 So I started going to garage sales and buying something for $50, selling it for a hundred dollars.

00:13:38.340 And, and then my, uh, the economy started coming back and I, I, that real estate developer that I'd been originally working for offered me a job with lots of money.

00:13:48.680 And, uh, you know, cause I was good at it.

00:13:50.920 Uh, and, uh, I phoned my dad and I said, what should I do, dad?

00:13:54.760 Uh, you know, what do you think?

00:13:56.560 And, and he said, uh, he said, you better take that job.

00:14:00.700 You know, it's a job as a job.

00:14:02.660 And, and I said, thanks a lot for the advice, dad.

00:14:05.040 And I hung up and I phoned the developers and ain't no way, you know, there's not enough money in the world that you're going to get to work for you.

00:14:12.160 I mean, you're just, you're just, it's not going to happen.

00:14:14.440 And I told dad, I'm going to, I'm going to write for hunting magazines, 1984.

00:14:19.160 I'm going to start writing.

00:14:20.440 He said, and he told me, he said, everybody wants to do that.

00:14:23.380 That's the hardest thing you could possibly choose.

00:14:25.500 You know, Jim Zalbo was already a star, Carmichael, all these guys, Jack O'Connor was just really done at that point.

00:14:31.860 But, um, but you know, it was, it, everybody wanted to do it.

00:14:36.240 If you can write and go around and hunt, I mean, it's kind of a wonderful world, but, um,

00:14:41.500 that's what I decided to do.

00:14:43.520 And if I have any talent, it's, it's writing, you know, I'm not bragging.

00:14:47.100 I'm just saying that that's, it's a skill that somewhere, it never got me more than a C plus in every single writing,

00:14:53.920 creative writing class or literature class of my life in university.

00:14:57.420 But, um, you know, I could write.

00:15:00.020 So I started writing stories in 1984 for hunting magazines.

00:15:02.980 And this is answering your question now a little more directly, um, about the same time video cameras,

00:15:10.460 you know, ones that you could actually hold, you know, that weren't these big giant monster things.

00:15:15.340 And they, they're pretty low res, but, but I, you know, I looked at that and said, okay, that's kind of cool.

00:15:19.920 So I, the first ones that came out, I was, you know, I was into them.

00:15:23.900 The eight millimeter was the first ones and then high eight and then super eight.

00:15:29.120 And, uh, you know, VHS was the very first ones, but I learned how to edit.

00:15:33.340 But, and I think, and I was writing by then.

00:15:36.120 So by 1990, I published, I don't know, maybe five or 600 hunting articles or adventure travel articles.

00:15:44.640 I even wrote for magazines like Western Living Magazine, you know, which is, which is a, not a hunting at all.

00:15:50.440 It's, it's kind of a fashion lifestyle magazine on the West Coast.

00:15:53.700 Um, but I, I, you know, to me, it seemed like you could tell the same story with a video camera.

00:16:01.080 And I was already, uh, you know, using still cameras for my articles said, well, I can just tell the same story without writing a thousand words.

00:16:08.160 You know, I can just tell the story.

00:16:10.920 Um, and at that same time, cable vision networks were coming on board.

00:16:15.560 So there was three networks, CBC or CBS, NBC, and ABC.

00:16:20.600 And that was it when I grew up, that was it.

00:16:22.580 In Canada, we had CBC.

00:16:24.580 So when the cable networks came on, it's like streaming video now.

00:16:28.560 There was no content.

00:16:29.900 So there's all these channels and they didn't have anything to, to show.

00:16:33.560 So by then I'd been writing enough to get sponsors, commercial partners that were paying, you know, use our, whatever binoculars, use our clothes, whatever it was.

00:16:44.260 Sure.

00:16:44.620 So, so I went to the network and I said, I just want to buy some airtime.

00:16:49.060 They said, well, no, we'll buy your TV show.

00:16:50.900 And I said, no, I want to buy some airtime and I'll, I get all the commercial space.

00:16:54.700 And they said, well, we'll keep some of the commercial space.

00:16:56.480 You know, you're not going to be selling into my own, my own show.

00:17:00.740 I want all the commercial space.

00:17:02.680 And, and so that's what I did from day one.

00:17:04.540 I went right to my sponsors and, uh, and I said, you know, you want to do TV shows.

00:17:09.880 Everybody wanted to do TV at that time.

00:17:11.460 And that's about the year 2000 because I was doing videos before that VHS.

00:17:16.700 And I was on Bill Jordan's Realtree Outdoors on TNN, was on ESPN on North American Hunter, you know, back in the day.

00:17:24.580 And that, you know, that would be back 91 or so.

00:17:27.260 But by the year 2000, I was ready to do my own show and have my own airtime and sold all the commercial space.

00:17:34.000 And then just kept telling stories.

00:17:36.880 And they said it would never work because it wasn't, my intention wasn't to sell whitetails or turkey stories.

00:17:44.780 You know, that's, I mean, I have whitetails, but that's not going to be just whitetails, not just turkeys.

00:17:50.340 It's going to be adventure wherever I could go with this crazy moose and caribou in the high, you know, far north, the high Arctic for polar bears.

00:17:58.240 And, you know, whatever's up there, muskox.

00:18:01.080 And they said it wouldn't work.

00:18:03.080 And I said, no, you know, hunters, it doesn't matter what you're going after.

00:18:08.100 When you understand what you're under, when you have access to your ancestral soul, it doesn't matter what someone's showing you or you're hunting.

00:18:20.400 You get it.

00:18:21.740 You understand it.

00:18:22.540 We speak the same language all over the world.

00:18:24.860 We're kindred spirits.

00:18:25.760 It doesn't matter what color we are or what we eat, what language we speak of.

00:18:31.680 It's hunters for hunters.

00:18:33.600 And that's what I believed in.

00:18:35.380 And I just kept going from there and making it one-hour shows.

00:18:39.600 I think we have three shows going right now, Shock Therapy and two on the Aboriginal People's Television Network up in Canada, Yukon Harvest and Coastal Carvers.

00:18:50.780 And then I started taking people on outfitting adventures.

00:18:55.040 Basically, I reinvested and reinvested and reinvested into what I love doing.

00:18:59.680 So, I mean, to me, it seemed pretty easy.

00:19:01.460 It wasn't even a – I could see 10 years in advance.

00:19:05.380 So now it's a little harder to see 10 years in advance.

00:19:08.660 Things change quickly now.

00:19:11.060 But in those days, yeah, there was nothing on the horizon for 10 years.

00:19:14.480 And this is the way it's going to be.

00:19:16.420 So, yeah, it was – you do what you love.

00:19:21.400 And I guess what I say is if you drive in one direction for half a century, you end up somewhere.

00:19:28.340 So I just never let myself be sidetracked on anything I wanted to do.

00:19:32.080 It was always focused on living this one life and, you know, family number one.

00:19:38.040 And making sure that I had no regrets at the end of that one life.

00:19:42.760 So, yeah.

00:19:43.580 You seem like, too, in addition to that, somebody who knows what he wants, willing to take risks.

00:19:49.840 This is what I'm gathering from what you shared.

00:19:51.560 And then also being bold.

00:19:54.280 Going to a cable company, for example, and telling them, no, I'm going to be the one to sell the ads.

00:20:01.520 Which is really probably different because I think most people would look at that payday and think, well, you know, we've made it.

00:20:07.380 This cable network bought our show and we've made it.

00:20:10.780 Now they're going to sell ads.

00:20:11.800 And that's where the revenue comes from, from them selling the ads.

00:20:14.340 But it sounds like you had enough insight to say, no, we're going to do this on my terms.

00:20:18.100 And I realize that this is where the income is going to be generated from.

00:20:20.580 So, that's pretty intelligent ahead of time and something I don't think a lot of people would do.

00:20:26.020 Yeah.

00:20:28.420 The reason people fail at it is because they go in with the wrong intention.

00:20:34.660 They want to be able to sign hats.

00:20:36.360 They want to be able to be recognized at an airport.

00:20:38.700 They want the celebrity and the acclaim, the recognition.

00:20:45.480 But that's like a drug.

00:20:47.360 And there's no return on that investment at all.

00:20:50.580 All it is, I guess, makes you feel, I don't know, worthy.

00:20:55.840 It's a stroke of the ego, for sure.

00:20:57.720 Yeah, but it's not, why would you do that?

00:21:00.540 If it doesn't, there has to be a back end on whatever you're doing for television, in my mind.

00:21:08.220 If you're going to turn yourself into celebrity, what's the back end on it?

00:21:11.620 What are you actually getting out of it?

00:21:12.920 Because celebrity is hollow.

00:21:15.700 There's no, there's no, there's no, I don't even consider myself a celebrity.

00:21:19.420 I could care less.

00:21:20.580 I think it's wonderful when people come up, we talk and we visit and we, you know, that's wonderful.

00:21:26.560 And I appreciate every single time.

00:21:28.860 But that should never be your goal.

00:21:30.920 That's a byproduct of doing your, whatever you're doing in your life well.

00:21:35.480 Well, recognition comes because you're the best at something.

00:21:39.520 It's pretty simple.

00:21:40.860 You know, you can be the best plumber and you'll be recognized in your community.

00:21:46.960 Absolutely.

00:21:47.700 You just, whatever you're doing, if you're the best at that, that's where, that's where the celebrity comes.

00:21:52.460 You know, and it's local or international or maybe it's national, provincial, statewide, depending on what you're doing.

00:21:59.700 But that should never be your goal.

00:22:02.260 That's the byproduct of doing whatever you're doing well.

00:22:06.600 And so for me, that was, it would have made zero sense to do it any other way.

00:22:14.720 Because what was I accomplishing?

00:22:17.360 Nothing, you know, other than signing hats.

00:22:20.320 And, you know, that's sure, that's fun, but it's not, that doesn't pay the mortgage.

00:22:24.420 And I've seen guys, you know, there's that classic case, how do you become a millionaire making television shows on outdoor hunting and lifestyle?

00:22:32.940 Well, easy, you start with 2 million.

00:22:35.600 Yeah, right.

00:22:37.160 I've seen guys do it.

00:22:38.420 I've seen them do it for, you know, three, four years, just fritter away $500,000 a year on doing their productions.

00:22:46.400 And then they're gone.

00:22:48.060 They used up all their money and it was just so that they could, you know, get that fix of somebody recognize them.

00:22:54.420 I never needed that.

00:22:55.520 I don't, I know who I am.

00:22:57.440 I don't need someone else to tell me who I am or, you know, but it's nice.

00:23:01.860 Don't get me wrong.

00:23:02.820 It's, you know, I love it.

00:23:03.920 Don't want everybody to think I'm arrogant.

00:23:05.400 I'm not.

00:23:06.240 It's just, you know, that's their appreciation of letting me know that I'm doing my job well, which in many cases is educating, conservation, you know,

00:23:17.920 talking about family, cultures, adventure, humor, camaraderie, all these kinds of things.

00:23:23.240 And, you know, and because it's hunting shows, there's, you know, animals involved as well.

00:23:29.220 But all those other things are, I think are more important than, than just what size the animal is.

00:23:34.580 To me, it is anyway.

00:23:35.460 What would you say if, if you were to surmise everything that you've done, what, because you're talking about the intent of doing something, which wasn't for notoriety or celebrity, which of course now you've, you've received and read the benefits of that as a byproduct, as you say.

00:23:49.180 But what would be your, I don't know if you want to call it your life's purpose or, or your mission in this world.

00:23:55.660 I don't know how you would frame it, but that's how other people have explained it is, do you have something like that, that drives your decision, decision-making process?

00:24:01.980 I, there's somebody, somebody that's, you know, a wise philosopher, somebody, I'm not sure, said that it's not what you accomplish when you're alive.

00:24:12.200 It's what people remember you for after you're gone.

00:24:15.800 We all remember Fred Bear.

00:24:17.800 You know, Fred Bear was legend.

00:24:20.100 Why?

00:24:20.460 Why do we remember him?

00:24:21.460 Because, because of what he stood for.

00:24:23.440 You know, it wasn't because he hunted X amount of animals or did whatever.

00:24:28.800 It's because of what he stood for.

00:24:31.220 You know, so yes, he accomplished a lot of things in archery, but it's, that's not his legacy.

00:24:35.660 That's not what people remember him for.

00:24:37.800 It's, you know, I don't think there's anybody listening right now who can tell me what was the biggest deer he ever got or, or how many, you know, moose.

00:24:44.680 I mean, we probably remember the bear on the beach, you know, if we remember anything, that old footage.

00:24:49.140 But, but I think it's important, you know, when, when we're here, to me, it is, you work towards leaving a legacy that people will remember after you're gone.

00:25:03.080 So, so for instance, you know, our Hand of Man Museum of Natural History, Cultural Arts and Conservation up on Vancouver Island, you know, it's 17,000 square feet.

00:25:14.120 And it's, it's filled with, with cultural artifacts from around the world, costumes that, you know, they've worn or, or ethnic garb, the, you know, there's dinosaur skeletons, woolly mammoth skeletons, woolly rhinos, narwhal skeletons, mounted animals from all over the world, full body mounts, no shoulder mounts.

00:25:32.500 And, and, and, and, and, you know, a whole room of just different skulls from crazy animals from all over the world.

00:25:39.260 But also the majority of it is cultural artifacts, totem poles, and, and there's Amish quilts, dukebor rugs.

00:25:49.720 So it's, I put that together, Louise and I did over the years.

00:25:53.460 Now, I started it when I was 10 years old with, with that exact place and filled with those objects in mind, because we had no money to go to the, I could go to the library and get National Geographic.

00:26:05.680 And at that age, I already decided I wasn't going to get a job and work like my dad did.

00:26:09.880 So I was going to do whatever I wanted to do.

00:26:11.700 And that meant putting this museum together.

00:26:14.560 My wife and I, from the beginning, have known that we are going to donate it all.

00:26:20.140 So it'll be here, we're donating the land, the building, the contents, and it's, you know, 17,000 square foot building, beautiful property, you know, two blocks from the ocean, all treed and this huge facility filled with artifacts.

00:26:37.680 We're donating the land, the building, the contents, and giving it an endowment to cover expenses for the next 40 years.

00:26:45.340 Wow.

00:26:45.380 Now, right now, it's donation only right now, because I couldn't afford it to go in when I was young.

00:26:50.820 One dollar cover charge precluded me from going in.

00:26:53.940 But for donation, I could have brought a grasshopper or a pretty rock or a seashell, you know, and I'd have been the curator's nightmare.

00:27:01.620 And, you know, there's, there's, there's kids that come in.

00:27:04.080 Someone brought a moose tooth the other day, a moose tooth.

00:27:06.520 Oh, is that right?

00:27:07.240 Yeah, and it's a young little boy, you know, on the family, they can't afford it, but they can because it's donation.

00:27:12.860 And so that building, all those artifacts, and there's, they cannot, I'll make sure the board of directors is handcuffed so they can never make it politically correct, whichever way the winds of social, you know, what's acceptable, whatever way they're blowing.

00:27:30.080 And, you know, museums that are trying, like our Royal British Columbia Museum up in BC is trying to decolonize.

00:27:37.340 They're erasing all the history of, like Captain Cook.

00:27:40.780 He came, he came, you can't, you cannot, you know, the, the, the diseases were there.

00:27:46.180 You can't, you can't erase what we did by, by whitewashing it, sanitizing history.

00:27:52.840 And then you have a museum that's not a museum anymore.

00:27:54.600 So this museum will stay the way it is for the next 40 years after I'm gone and, and I'll control it, you know, from the grave.

00:28:02.460 So there's, going back to your question, what, what is, you know, why do all this?

00:28:07.960 Because if you can, you should, you know, I can, you know, Mallory's, why do you climb that mountain?

00:28:13.280 Because it's there, you know, actually I shouldn't probably quote Karl Marx, but, you know, from those according to their ability to those according to their need.

00:28:22.840 He, that's one thing out of everything that he got right, or the only thing he got right, really.

00:28:27.520 But, but that's, it is true.

00:28:29.240 People come into that museum and if they have lots of money, they give lots of donation.

00:28:34.440 And that covers the cost of the people that don't have a lot of money.

00:28:38.360 And, and, you know, us, I can do this.

00:28:40.940 I was, whatever gifts I've been given in this one life we're allowed to live, that's one thing I can do.

00:28:46.800 I can give everything away.

00:28:48.080 I can't take it with me.

00:28:48.960 A giant garage sale, that makes no sense either.

00:28:52.320 It'll never be put back together, a collection like that.

00:28:54.540 And until you actually see it, you know, anybody that's listening, Google, hand to man, you'll see the, the, the Google responses and the, also the short videos when it's all over the place.

00:29:07.000 It, it's, people love it.

00:29:10.100 People love it.

00:29:10.980 And we're giving, I can give it, my wife and I can give this to the community.

00:29:15.620 So there, there's, you know, why I do all this so I can give it all away.

00:29:19.400 And we should all be thinking that way, you know, giving it, you know, to Eva, you know, like she's doing fine.

00:29:26.160 You know, so, and there, you know, there'll be heirlooms and things that are important that actually have intrinsic value rather than just money.

00:29:35.400 You know, so, so in my mind, we should give everything away when we, when we reach that age and let the next generation, they, you know, help them.

00:29:44.360 But make them stand on their own two feet, allow them to realize their own potential, you know, or lack of, if they, if they don't have it, you know, that's, that's okay too.

00:29:54.760 There's nothing, that's not failure.

00:29:56.200 That's just realizing who you're, who you're capable of being.

00:30:00.020 This sounds harsh, but it's, you know, that's nature.

00:30:03.200 So, so I, I could, so I did, you know, I could, so I should.

00:30:08.820 And, you know, I, I have, and, and I will continue to do that, leave this for everybody, future generations, and hopefully inspire people along the way to say, hey, I can do that too.

00:30:21.520 You know, someone might be listening right now that could be the next president of the United States.

00:30:26.040 You know, in just this conversation, you get one life, they'll change their direction off where they start to go, yeah, I can, I can realize my own potential.

00:30:34.340 I can do what I'm capable of.

00:30:36.720 I just have to do it.

00:30:38.460 It's, it's not hard.

00:30:39.980 It's really not hard.

00:30:42.480 Man, let me step away from this conversation.

00:30:44.540 I'm going to get right back to it.

00:30:45.740 I promise you, but I want to talk with you about something.

00:30:48.220 In fact, I want to ask you a question.

00:30:49.840 Are you exactly where you want to be in life?

00:30:52.960 Now, the answer is probably no, but the better question is why not?

00:30:57.900 Because as challenging as that question can be, once you answer it, you'll finally give yourself the information you need to build the life that you've dreamed of.

00:31:06.260 Uh, and that is where our free battle ready program comes in.

00:31:10.280 Again, it's called 30 days to battle ready.

00:31:12.340 Uh, when you join the battle ready program, you're going to get an email immediately, right?

00:31:16.460 As soon as you sign up, it's going to explain how you're going to create a powerfully compelling vision for yourself.

00:31:21.780 We talk a little bit about that in this conversation with Jim, uh, work that vision into daily tactics that will absolutely produce the results you desire.

00:31:30.640 And also identify checkpoints along the way to ensure that you're on the right track and not just banging your head against the wall, which I'm very, very familiar with.

00:31:39.620 I don't enjoy doing that.

00:31:40.800 And I'm sure you don't either.

00:31:41.540 So I would encourage you to join the thousands of men who have gone through this program and get your life on the right track with a scientifically proven method of goal achievement.

00:31:53.260 You can band with us and join the free program at order of man.com slash battle ready.

00:31:58.240 Again, that's order of man.com slash battle ready.

00:32:00.900 Do that right after the conversation for now.

00:32:03.340 Let's get back to it with Jim.

00:32:04.620 I want to shift gears a little bit because you've mentioned your wife and I know, and, and I'm sorry to hear about your loss that she's passed away, uh, relatively recently.

00:32:15.820 In fact, we had a podcast, I think maybe a day or two, we've scheduled a day or two before she passed, I believe.

00:32:22.400 And, uh, the way I've seen you handle it is with so much grace and class.

00:32:27.220 Like I can't imagine being in the situation you are, you talk so highly of her.

00:32:31.260 Um, do you think part of the way that you've been able to handle that is because the projects and the things that you've done together and what would you say is, is her legacy that she left?

00:32:42.840 Well, I mean, I could never have accomplished what I accomplished, you know, accomplish when you look from the outside accomplishments without Louise's support.

00:32:53.920 She was my soulmate and that's, you know, we were perfect for each other.

00:33:00.440 You know, 39 years, 113 days and 14 and a half hours.

00:33:06.980 I, I was, I was blessed.

00:33:10.040 I mean, beyond blessed.

00:33:11.260 And we were total opposites, lady, triumph, beauty beast.

00:33:15.420 I, you know, I, I was, I was, uh, you know, organized hoarder.

00:33:19.320 She was a minimalist.

00:33:20.520 I mean, every single thing, but the, the one thing that we both were 100% all in on was family.

00:33:27.020 And, and that was important to her.

00:33:29.940 She was an actress, you know, everybody knew her, her, the, the, the people that were after Louisiana in those days are like the who's who of Hollywood.

00:33:38.620 You're like the, you know, and, and prime minister of Canada, you know, like that level of people were, she, she just had an aura that if she walked in a room, everybody, and not because she was just beautiful.

00:33:51.440 She is obviously, but, you know, there's many pretty ladies out there, but, you know, there was something very, very special about Louisiana and her and I, I knew it from our first date.

00:34:03.260 It wasn't even a date.

00:34:03.980 She wouldn't go on a date with me.

00:34:05.100 She said, she said, no, when I asked her out, I met her at a dance class.

00:34:10.560 I've said this before on podcasts, but I, you know, I was 26 and I was thinking, where am I going to find somebody that, you know, I'm going to spend my life with.

00:34:17.700 I'm 26.

00:34:18.420 I better, and this is how my brain works.

00:34:20.180 I, I better start getting serious about this now.

00:34:22.920 And I dated all the models in Vancouver and, you know, whatever.

00:34:25.980 Um, and I was thinking, okay, I want someone pretty, you know, which is fast all.

00:34:30.660 I know.

00:34:30.840 I'm sorry.

00:34:31.860 Uh, I want someone that's athletic, nice body, you know, I'm sorry, fast all again, but it's not, it's, it's, I know what I needed to keep me, you know, straight on my whole life.

00:34:43.260 Sure.

00:34:43.840 Yeah.

00:34:44.140 Sure.

00:34:44.700 It is a challenge, whatever it is.

00:34:46.600 And, and also someone with great family values.

00:34:49.120 So I was sitting there and it was like an epiphany, uh, dance class.

00:34:53.000 There's gotta be girls at dance class like that.

00:34:55.040 So I looked at the yellow pages and, and I found the biggest ad and it was a place called Terps recorded and phone them up to have dance classes.

00:35:02.920 And they said, yes, that's what we do.

00:35:04.840 And I said, well, what, what about tonight?

00:35:06.400 Five o'clock.

00:35:07.040 And they said, we have advanced ballet jazz with Louise.

00:35:11.180 So, you know, I didn't know who that was.

00:35:13.420 I walked in and there's 30 women, one, one other guy and, uh, and me, and I, you know, 1984, we're talking the tidiest, tidiest shorts you can ever imagine.

00:35:24.780 And like really short.

00:35:26.540 And I had some good odds for you there too.

00:35:28.740 It was, I looked at it as advertising.

00:35:31.840 And, and, uh, so I went in with a little muscle shirt in those days.

00:35:35.880 It was okay.

00:35:36.380 And I walked in and they were West side story, three quarters or two thirds of the way through the choreography.

00:35:41.620 And they've been working on it for weeks.

00:35:43.300 And that's advanced ballet jazz.

00:35:45.380 I didn't even know what a ballet was or a jazz.

00:35:47.900 And so I walked in, you know, doing jetes and pas d'oeuvres or whatever they are, you know, position one, two, three, all these.

00:35:55.660 I had no idea.

00:35:56.700 I was a total idiot.

00:35:58.060 But, uh, but the teacher, the teacher, Louise was absolutely stunning, gorgeous.

00:36:04.760 And I knew who she was from seeing her on television.

00:36:07.160 I mean, I'd watch, I'd watch TV at night just to see her in the exercise commercial she used to do.

00:36:13.180 And I was like, oh, you know, I was, so I asked her out and she said, like, just blew me off.

00:36:20.300 And I said, well, it'll be the biggest mistake of your life.

00:36:23.400 I can guarantee you that.

00:36:25.060 And she just kind of looked at me and, you know, she tells it, or she did tell it that it was, uh, you son of a gun, you know, cause she wasn't used to a guy actually kind of take, this is the truth that you're just, the guy is just groveling.

00:36:39.700 And so she said, okay, I won't go on a date, but I'll go for a walk on a beach.

00:36:43.300 So we went for a walk on a beach and, and, uh, I, and I, you know, she was pretty obviously.

00:36:48.340 And there's, but pretty girls, you know, that's okay, you know, but it doesn't mean that they have the rest of the story.

00:36:55.140 So I, um, I basically grilled her.

00:36:57.700 I asked her questions about family, about where she wanted to live.

00:37:00.480 And by the end of the walk on the beach, I knew I'd marry her.

00:37:03.080 I called my parents, told them I found the girl I'm going to marry my sister.

00:37:06.740 I called her and my, uh, all my buddies.

00:37:09.460 I called them.

00:37:10.080 I went to my little black book and got rid of all the dates.

00:37:12.420 I canceled every date.

00:37:14.140 Did you really?

00:37:15.220 Yeah.

00:37:15.680 Yeah.

00:37:15.880 June 1st, 1984.

00:37:17.660 1984 and, and, uh, canceled everything.

00:37:20.320 Cause I said, I'm done.

00:37:21.400 Sorry.

00:37:21.740 All my buddies, I'm not finished.

00:37:23.860 Don't even call me anymore.

00:37:25.300 It took Louise six more days.

00:37:28.420 So it was always a bone of contention saying, you got, you mean I canceled all my dates and

00:37:33.060 you had like six more days to be free and do whatever you want.

00:37:37.720 But, um, but yeah, I, you know, there's nothing I could have accomplished without, uh, Louise.

00:37:43.720 She, she, she was my soulmate, but that's all part of the, you know, no regrets.

00:37:48.380 If you marry someone for the wrong reasons and you don't very clearly look at who you're

00:37:53.800 marrying and, and understand that, yes, they may be pretty.

00:37:57.500 Yes.

00:37:57.760 They may whatever, have every money or whatever it is.

00:38:01.500 Louise always said, if you marry for money, you're going to work for every penny you're

00:38:05.180 going to get out and I, you know, it's very true.

00:38:09.200 So I, I knew in my life, I, I just, I knew where I was headed.

00:38:14.400 I knew what I had to do.

00:38:15.700 I had, I had to choose a soulmate that that would work with, because if I did chose one

00:38:23.440 of these other girls, it never would have worked.

00:38:25.220 I could never, yes, I may have been able to stay married, but that doesn't, you can't

00:38:30.680 realize your own potential if you're constantly either being downtrodden or, or you're, you

00:38:37.420 know, not happy with what's going on in your own life.

00:38:41.560 So, so, yeah, Louise and I, we were soulmates.

00:38:46.800 It was truly, well, she came from heaven.

00:38:49.740 She had to, she had to, she was an angel and went back and she's touched so many people

00:38:54.460 who, um, you know, when she passed, there was tens of thousands of people on social media,

00:39:00.320 which, you know, people denigrate social media, but there's some good about it, you

00:39:04.640 know, if it's used properly, it's, it's a wonderful, wonderful way to reach out and

00:39:09.080 people to reach out and to have influence around the world.

00:39:12.820 Uh, she, she touched so many people's lives.

00:39:15.320 So, you know, the things I accomplished, you know, no regrets, but a big, big, big part

00:39:22.420 of it, like I say, family was number one to me and it was to Louisey too, is who you choose

00:39:27.360 as a soulmate?

00:39:27.960 That's your first and your biggest decision in your life.

00:39:31.300 Your career is nothing compared to that.

00:39:33.480 Nothing.

00:39:34.020 It doesn't even compare.

00:39:35.300 I'm going to go to university.

00:39:36.480 Where am I going to live?

00:39:37.580 What kind of car am I going to drive?

00:39:39.400 That, you know, that's all fluff.

00:39:42.420 Your, your major decision is who are you going to spend the rest of your life with and, and

00:39:49.840 have children with.

00:39:51.280 And, and a lot of people don't look at that, they don't, they don't look at that question

00:39:57.140 as responsibly as they should.

00:40:00.220 And they end up with people that they don't get along, they get divorced and it can happen.

00:40:04.860 But, but why did it happen?

00:40:07.060 Because you settled, you settled, but you didn't, you didn't wait, weren't patient, weren't

00:40:13.320 looking, you know, caught up partying with your buddies or whatever, watching football

00:40:18.200 games or, or doing whatever you're doing, but don't, don't go crying to anybody later

00:40:23.860 on when you just say, oh, let's get married.

00:40:26.460 And, you know, it's your, it's your life.

00:40:29.140 Again, it comes back to the choices you make in your life.

00:40:31.620 It's your life.

00:40:32.740 And if you want to have a family and have a family that, you know, is well adjusted and

00:40:39.680 not dysfunctional, and then, then it all comes down to that one major decision in your

00:40:45.880 life, who's your soulmate?

00:40:48.900 Who's your soulmate?

00:40:50.320 And then you, you know, like I say, that, that was the most important decision that I've

00:40:54.820 ever made in my life.

00:40:55.940 And, and it was the right one for me, but no one ever gives you a guarantee that it's

00:41:02.800 forever, you know, and, you know, you asked me about, you know, you said that the way I'm

00:41:07.540 dealing with it.

00:41:08.280 And even right now, I'm, you know, I'm not going to break down in tears, feeling sorry

00:41:12.800 for myself.

00:41:13.920 You know, I had 39 years, 113 days, 14 and a half hours with an angel, my soulmate.

00:41:21.740 And, and to, to, you know, throw a tantrum on the ground or scream and cry.

00:41:29.180 And that's, that would, that would be not honoring what we had together.

00:41:34.820 Every single second we lived consciously and, and every minute was precious together.

00:41:42.220 And when we were apart, even, you know, my, the books I've written over the years are

00:41:46.480 dedicated to the wheezy.

00:41:48.220 You know, we have shared the moon.

00:41:49.940 You know, we did, you know, there's no mountain as high, no river, you know, as fast and nothing

00:41:57.960 hurts.

00:41:59.140 Nothing can challenge me like trying to deal with the time away from you.

00:42:03.080 And, you know, these are, this is how I felt.

00:42:05.760 I phoned her every single day.

00:42:07.100 If it wasn't for satellite telephones, I probably never could have done the real far away remote

00:42:12.000 things because I couldn't reach out to her.

00:42:14.360 But it was satellite phone.

00:42:15.600 We could always be in contact at least once a day, always.

00:42:18.700 How's it going?

00:42:19.340 We talked, you know, I'd be out in the middle of the Arctic, you know, freezing.

00:42:24.480 I'd knock into the wheezy.

00:42:25.520 I'd keep the batteries in a pocket right against my skin.

00:42:28.400 Like that was just so I'd made sure that the batteries on that satellite telephone would

00:42:32.760 never go cold and die because I had to talk to Louise.

00:42:36.500 We were, you know, we were, we were like that.

00:42:40.500 So, so now, you know, it was the 21st of September that she passed away.

00:42:46.180 And, you know, so it's almost three weeks now.

00:42:49.120 So, and, you know, there's a, there's a sadness because, you know, I, I, I go to reach.

00:42:58.100 I want to call her.

00:42:59.000 Hey, I'm getting on the airplane.

00:43:00.140 I'll, you know, I love you.

00:43:01.160 I love you.

00:43:01.540 I love you in case something happens, but I can't call her now, you know, when I land

00:43:05.840 safely, kind of reach for the phone, you know, like, cause we, we loved each other, you

00:43:10.180 know, so, so that, that's gone.

00:43:12.760 But the love that we had, that's no one can ever take that away.

00:43:16.820 It existed.

00:43:17.580 It existed.

00:43:18.860 And I, you know, I look at it as, as another gift.

00:43:23.180 I mean, how many people, how many people in this world get to, to be there at such and

00:43:33.500 feel such loss and such deep sorrow, you know, children, a child would be way worse.

00:43:39.740 That would be way worse.

00:43:40.640 Louise and I talked about, we had two years from her diagnosis to when she passed away

00:43:44.840 a year and 11 months.

00:43:45.880 And, and we, you know, we both, a child is just beyond the pale.

00:43:52.220 Nobody, I can't imagine it and nobody can, unless they go through it.

00:43:55.960 Nobody can imagine what I went through unless they've gone through it.

00:43:58.420 Because sorrow, that, that powerful force of sorrow that you feel, imagination doesn't live where

00:44:09.460 that exists.

00:44:10.580 It's just the abyss that's in the blackness that imagination, human imagination cannot exist

00:44:17.100 down at those levels.

00:44:18.100 So no one can imagine what, what it feels like.

00:44:20.840 So I've been gifted that, you know, I mean, I, I, you know, I felt I've been honored to

00:44:27.000 have as great a love as anybody could ever have.

00:44:30.440 I'm not saying that there's not, you know, others out there that are, that have that type

00:44:34.800 of a love.

00:44:35.380 There is.

00:44:35.820 And I've, I've also, I know now what it feels like to have that and have that taken away.

00:44:42.280 And, and that, you know, that, that gives you a certain, I guess, if it's a lesson, if

00:44:51.340 it gives you a certain strength.

00:44:53.900 And so I, you know, I won't, I won't ever dishonor her memory by, by falling apart.

00:45:03.240 She would never expect it.

00:45:04.720 She would never want it.

00:45:06.080 And it's not who we were.

00:45:07.580 We were, you know, every second we lived and there's no regrets.

00:45:11.320 Regrets, no regrets.

00:45:13.220 So, so, you know, I, I guess if I have anything to share, I'll, I'll share it with, with the

00:45:18.720 world and let them know, hey, this is, this is how I feel.

00:45:21.340 I could probably write a book on it right now.

00:45:22.800 In fact, I wrote a book while Louise was going through this, 56 stories of our child, her

00:45:32.640 childhood, my childhood.

00:45:33.800 And she wasn't feeling well a lot of times.

00:45:36.080 So, you know, I try and have to coax the stories out of her to, to be able to write them,

00:45:40.340 but I'll, I'll, I'll publish that because I think it'll give an insight.

00:45:44.460 There's many, so many people love Louise that this will, this book, when it comes out, will,

00:45:49.940 will give a true insight into how fiercely independent she was, as well as being, you

00:45:57.300 know, the most wonderful mother and spouse and daughter.

00:46:02.140 I mean, she just, there was, she, there was no crack in that.

00:46:04.380 That's who she was.

00:46:05.060 She was just, she was just beautiful and an angel.

00:46:07.380 So I'm never going to, you know, I was lucky.

00:46:10.080 I was lucky to have that time I had, you know, and it is beyond luck.

00:46:15.600 So what am I going to do now?

00:46:17.740 You know, cry and, and feel remorse.

00:46:22.380 I was gifted that time with her.

00:46:25.340 I was very lucky.

00:46:26.260 So, you know, and I also have the, the good fortune.

00:46:30.740 I mean, you, you really have to do a spin on it to make it look like that, but I, you

00:46:34.820 know, the good fortune to know what it means to lose love like that.

00:46:38.360 You know, that's, yeah, I think it makes, you know, it's making, it's challenging me to

00:46:47.180 the very, you know, very nth degree, but we'll see.

00:46:53.480 Talk to me in 10 years and let's, let's see how I, how I did.

00:46:56.840 But right now I honor every single second I had with her and the memory of those seconds

00:47:02.160 rather than feeling sorry for myself.

00:47:04.120 Cause that's what it really is, is me missing her.

00:47:06.900 And I mean, today I got a pang of, came to Eva's house here.

00:47:11.680 And, you know, that's why the crappy background instead of a really cool background, like I

00:47:15.800 normally have for a podcast.

00:47:18.080 But, you know, I came here and Louie can't see this, you know, so I regret that.

00:47:22.340 But Louie isn't here to see this.

00:47:24.220 So it's not, it was never an option.

00:47:26.120 She's, she's in a better place.

00:47:28.300 You know, she, she believed, she believed in God.

00:47:32.400 And, and I have no doubt that she, you know, she was an angel and somehow, somewhere there

00:47:39.380 was a mistake and she was sent to earth for, for that time period.

00:47:42.840 And, and now she's back in heaven where she came from.

00:47:47.120 So, yeah, it's, it's sad, but it's also the memories are beautiful.

00:47:56.200 And that's, that's where I'd rather spend my time rather than thinking about what was

00:48:02.080 me right now.

00:48:02.700 So it's pretty special to hear you talk about her that way to hear how much you cherished

00:48:07.280 her and the relationship that you had, because I just, unfortunately, I don't think that's

00:48:11.240 as common as it used to be, you know, as, and as you're saying this, one thing I'm really

00:48:15.000 impressed by is your, your level for long-term vision, whether that's one day into a walk

00:48:22.540 on the beach with her or talking with a cable network, you know, a company about your show

00:48:29.280 or even writing your, your newest book.

00:48:32.460 I think I read somewhere or saw something that you started writing this in 1997.

00:48:36.680 And you knew that this was going to be something that you were going to create over that timeframe

00:48:40.320 and put out to the world.

00:48:41.940 I'm really curious about your vision.

00:48:43.860 Is that something that you've always inherently had?

00:48:47.000 Is it something that you've needed to work on and develop, but how do you see things so

00:48:50.900 far ahead and then stick with the design or the vision or the goal that you have over

00:48:55.700 the long-term?

00:48:57.300 You know, I think it's, I think it's a sense of self-worth, you know, so, so, so I, I think

00:49:06.180 and, and also not, not, I believe you have to attain respect, you know, you have to, you

00:49:15.660 have to earn respect.

00:49:17.600 And so, so I, you know, there's a, there's a bunch of factors that come into that.

00:49:22.680 At a very early age, I had a very clear vision of, of my capabilities, whatever it was, I

00:49:28.480 knew I wouldn't do what my dad was doing.

00:49:30.780 I actually felt bad for my parents, you know, at 10.

00:49:34.200 And that was a terrible feeling, you know, because I, I'm not talking shame because my

00:49:39.420 dad was a really well-respected road construction superintendent, but, but I just felt that they

00:49:46.820 were, they could have done so much more if they would have just, and that was the age

00:49:50.480 of 10.

00:49:51.240 So, so I, that's it.

00:49:53.740 That was the first time I envisioned the museum and I knew that I would have a museum.

00:49:59.160 I would spend my lifetime doing that.

00:50:01.200 That's a lot of what I've done is for that, but also to write a novel.

00:50:04.960 I started my first novel when I was 10 and at the same time I was reading voraciously

00:50:09.660 at that time and at a, you know, the high level, um, I spent so much time in detentions

00:50:15.600 because I wouldn't, I wasn't listening to the, whatever they were doing.

00:50:18.920 I was, I was reading, and I say it, J.A.

00:50:21.620 Hunter wrote the book Hunter back in those days.

00:50:24.860 And I was in Kenya, you know, looking after the, the rhino problems and elephants and Cape

00:50:30.260 Buffalo.

00:50:30.580 So that's where I spent my grade 10 or grade when I was 10 years old, grade five.

00:50:36.280 So, so I, you know, and I have, I hadn't, I have never had a problem setting a goal.

00:50:41.760 That's going to take a lifetime to attain.

00:50:44.520 Why, why not?

00:50:45.540 You have one lifetime.

00:50:46.580 So why not use it to do that goal?

00:50:49.960 But, but I think it was 93.

00:50:51.540 I penned the first words of, of Call Me Hunter, the novel.

00:50:55.900 Um, and, you know, Zhivago was dead.

00:50:58.980 I hunted him down and I killed him.

00:51:01.220 The, I penned those words and the whole first, you know, that first second person perspective

00:51:05.340 opening stanza.

00:51:07.720 And I, but then I realized I hadn't lived life enough at that point to, to, to finish the novel.

00:51:14.440 I really had, I didn't have enough experience.

00:51:16.220 And I've said this before, you, you can write a novel, you can go to university and be a

00:51:22.020 great creative writer, get A's and come out of university at 21 years of age, 22, whatever

00:51:27.620 it is, and, and sit down and write a novel.

00:51:31.560 Right.

00:51:32.180 But, but what are you writing about?

00:51:34.260 You know, what, what have you experienced in your life at 21?

00:51:37.420 You know, the high school sweetheart dumped you or whatever, what are you going to talk

00:51:43.240 about?

00:51:43.940 So that was, for me, again, I believe you have to earn respect.

00:51:50.640 And, and if you haven't lived, how can you write about living?

00:51:54.680 So, so I, at 93, I felt I hadn't lived enough yet, you know, and I was in my thirties by then.

00:52:01.520 And so, so I spent another literally 30 years, uh, well, not 30 years now that it's out, but

00:52:09.160 another 25 years before I sat down again, 2019, November, um, I sat down and picked up those

00:52:16.240 same words, your bag was dead.

00:52:17.540 I hunted him down and I killed him.

00:52:19.380 And I told the rest of the story because now I've lived enough to actually have a story

00:52:24.100 to tell.

00:52:25.000 So, so I, you know, for me, the long-term goals, who cares if it takes a lifetime?

00:52:30.560 And beautiful, what a great, wonderful goal that is, you know, you, you know, and especially

00:52:36.240 when your goal is to, to live life, you're not just breathe and exist, but to live this

00:52:42.420 one life, to live it, you know, that, that's, uh, I mean, you know, that's really the goal

00:52:49.400 is not, uh, and the other, all the other bits and pieces, you know, I've, I've dabbled

00:52:54.800 in music and dabbled, like you say, in the armed forces, although everybody listening and

00:52:59.820 you particularly, I mean, thank you for your service.

00:53:02.820 I was, I had the rank bestowed upon me of honorary lieutenant colonel.

00:53:06.900 So up here in Canada, we're on the British system.

00:53:09.040 So they can pick the, the, the troops can pick a commanding officer that this kind of

00:53:14.340 works in parallel with the actual commanding officer has come up through the ranks.

00:53:18.700 And I think they did it originally hundreds of years ago that way, because the troops wanted

00:53:24.060 to get paid.

00:53:25.320 And so if you had the right Duke, you know, you'd make him, you know, a colonel or.

00:53:30.200 Yeah.

00:53:30.720 Makes sense.

00:53:31.900 Yeah.

00:53:32.340 He didn't have to come up through the ranks, but he got, you know, right on the horse with

00:53:35.300 the epaulets and, you know, look how cool I am, but he would pay them.

00:53:39.060 And so I think that's why they did it.

00:53:41.120 And it's, you know, so I, I was chosen by a four Canadian range of patrol group up in

00:53:46.260 Canada to, to be there.

00:53:48.820 I don't want to say titular commanding officer, but because I had full, full uniform, full rank,

00:53:55.060 except in the field of battle, then I would have had to defer to the commanding officer.

00:53:59.380 So don't anybody think that I, you know, I actually earned that.

00:54:02.980 I did not.

00:54:03.560 It was bestowed.

00:54:04.260 You earned it, you earned it in other ways through, like you said, respect and trust.

00:54:10.160 And so there is a level of earning to that as well.

00:54:12.840 Yeah.

00:54:13.160 Well, yeah, thank you.

00:54:16.160 But, but I, and yes, I agree, but you guys, what you guys do in the armed forces, I mean,

00:54:21.260 I didn't know about it in Canada.

00:54:22.840 It wasn't a thing when I, when I grew up, I would have been in there.

00:54:27.260 Are you kidding me?

00:54:28.500 That's like serve your country.

00:54:31.000 You do, I mean, it would have been lock stock and lockstep with what I want to do with

00:54:35.140 my life, but it wasn't an option for me.

00:54:37.840 I didn't know it was an option, but, but yeah, so, so I, yeah, I've always done, you know,

00:54:46.560 what I wanted to do and do it well with, and if it was a side, you know, like music or it's,

00:54:52.580 it was all part of this writing the novel, writing a novel was to tell my story.

00:54:57.080 You know, that's what I say on, you know, that's what I say on the preface, this is

00:55:00.680 my story, you know, is it, you know, is it truth or is it fiction?

00:55:05.740 You know, it would be up to everybody to decide, but there's a lot of, a lot of truth.

00:55:09.960 There's a lot of the life I lived in Call Me Hunter.

00:55:13.660 I like, I like novels like that.

00:55:15.280 I don't, I don't know if this is a new phenomenon, but it seems like there's more and more novelists.

00:55:19.720 You know, Dan Brown comes to mind, who's obviously well-researched when it comes to the, the fictional

00:55:26.560 work.

00:55:27.040 It's like, is this, is this fiction or is this historical accuracy?

00:55:32.720 Another one that comes to mind is a friend.

00:55:34.820 I'm sure he's a friend of yours as well as Jack Carr.

00:55:37.080 You know, you read, you read his books and there is a lot of real world scenarios infused

00:55:42.820 into books like that because he's lived it.

00:55:45.680 He's experienced it.

00:55:46.540 He's lived it.

00:55:47.160 Uh, you were talking about rhinoceros conservation.

00:55:49.880 I've seen him go and do safaris to learn more about this and research so he can put things

00:55:53.880 into his book and you're doing the same thing with Call Me Hunter.

00:55:56.620 Yeah, it's the same.

00:55:57.600 Yeah.

00:55:57.720 Jack is great.

00:55:59.020 Yeah.

00:55:59.240 I've known, I was standing with him.

00:56:01.240 I was standing with him when he got the, the cell phone call from Chris Pratt saying that,

00:56:07.360 yes, he's going to option his terminal list.

00:56:11.240 Yeah.

00:56:11.760 So, and John Dubin and I were standing there with him and, you know, he got into Chris Pratt and

00:56:16.840 so he took the call and then it was, yes, yes.

00:56:19.560 And yeah, we had a big party that night.

00:56:21.560 So, uh, yeah, he's, he's a, he's a great, great author.

00:56:25.160 And I told him at that time, I, you know, I said, you know, I've got a novel.

00:56:28.900 I just have to get it out of my head.

00:56:30.500 When it gets done, I'll send it to you.

00:56:32.440 And, and yeah, he endorsed the book, didn't he?

00:56:35.280 Yeah.

00:56:35.620 Yeah.

00:56:35.780 He gave a beautiful, he, he was, he was, you know, he's a cool guy because in the writing

00:56:42.440 world, I found that it's very few, if any, it's kind of taboo for a writer who's already

00:56:50.100 established writer and, you know, recognized to, to recommend another writer's manuscript

00:56:56.460 that's not recognized.

00:56:57.840 There's risk in that.

00:56:58.740 There's risk because you're going to waste eight hours of either your agent's time or

00:57:03.720 10 hours or the publisher's time, you know, and they get a thousand manuscripts a week at

00:57:08.980 Simon & Schuster.

00:57:10.120 So a thousand, and those are vetted manuscripts from, from agents.

00:57:14.440 My agent gets a thousand a month and she vets it down to three that she'll, you know, present

00:57:19.360 anywhere.

00:57:19.740 But, you know, these have been vetted.

00:57:22.280 And, and so for the, what are the odds, what are the odds that, you know, that a writer

00:57:27.260 knows, happens to know another person that's writing at that caliber, you know, really,

00:57:32.440 really slim.

00:57:33.060 So they just, why even take the chance?

00:57:36.040 Because you catch the, you give it to your publisher on a bad day and they don't like

00:57:40.720 to start whatever done.

00:57:42.040 You know, it just, it looks, you know, they frown upon it in the industry, but Jack, when

00:57:48.360 I sent him my, and I told him that day, you know, when I was talking, I said, yeah, you,

00:57:52.100 what you're doing is what I believe.

00:57:54.140 You live life first and then you write, you know, that you have a story to tell and you're

00:57:57.460 telling it with terminalists.

00:57:59.060 And I said, I'm, you know, I'll get my story, you know, 2019.

00:58:02.640 That's when I'll sit down and write it and I'll send it to you.

00:58:05.920 And he said, oh yeah, yeah.

00:58:06.640 You know, at the time he was, you know, he was starting out.

00:58:09.800 And when I finally got mine done and sent it to him, yeah, I mean, that's all he needed.

00:58:15.520 It was this manuscript like that thick coming in the, in the mail to him.

00:58:19.780 And, uh, but he read it, he read it and he had me on his podcast, the, the Danger Close.

00:58:27.820 Danger Close.

00:58:28.920 Yeah.

00:58:29.280 And, uh, and he was just so enthusiastic.

00:58:32.520 He said, this belongs on, you know, he said, there's a shelf of special books.

00:58:36.060 He said, this is belongs on this shelf.

00:58:37.800 Here's the generic, you know, but this is where there's, he was, you know, for me, it was

00:58:42.700 like, holy cow, he's, he's like a real writer.

00:58:46.200 And he is the one that got it into Emily Bessler, who's like the rock star of editing in New

00:58:52.740 York city.

00:58:53.440 She's discovered many of the modern bestselling authors.

00:58:57.680 That's her, that's her stock in trade.

00:58:59.800 That's what she's known as discovering new talent.

00:59:02.860 And he gave it to her and she read it and loved it and wanted, she personally edited this

00:59:08.300 with me.

00:59:08.980 So, so, you know, but that was Jack and this, so I say that that speaks volumes.

00:59:14.780 It's actually when you, when you get a chance to read the acknowledgements at the end, you

00:59:18.820 know, he's one of the very first ones, like just thank you because without him, it never

00:59:23.700 would have gone to the next step.

00:59:25.000 And he took a huge risk, especially, you know, that was, you know, it's not now he's

00:59:29.500 got six, you know, number one bestsellers in New York times.

00:59:32.460 I mean, you know, he, he's the big dog now, but this was before he was, you know, so, so,

00:59:38.740 you know, he, he took a huge risk handing that off, but he believed in it, you know?

00:59:42.900 So, and again, it's, you know, back to what you were saying, he lived his life and then

00:59:48.360 wrote about it.

00:59:49.360 You know, I lived my life and then wrote about it as opposed to the other way around, just

00:59:52.800 writing about whatever and then living life.

00:59:56.140 You know, it's, it's a big difference to me.

00:59:58.580 It doesn't mean it's not right to do it that way too.

01:00:01.280 It's just, I could never have done it that way.

01:00:04.220 I didn't have a story to tell.

01:00:06.100 You know, how I knew Jack was the real deal is I actually went and I asked to do a podcast

01:00:11.240 and he invited me to his home in Northern Utah.

01:00:14.960 They hadn't met me before, but invited me into his house.

01:00:17.140 We went and did the podcast and it took a couple hours, you know, to get through.

01:00:20.940 And right before I was leaving, he's like, Hey, hold on, I've got something for you.

01:00:24.620 And he went out to his, his freezer in his garage and he pulled out some elk meat from him

01:00:29.780 and his daughter.

01:00:30.340 I think that his daughter had shot and he said, here, take this with you.

01:00:33.760 And I knew right then I'm like, all right, this guy's, there's something special about this guy.

01:00:38.620 If he's going to, you know, he's going to invite me to his house.

01:00:41.080 I don't know him.

01:00:42.040 Then he's going to send me with something that is, you know, food, but also very sentimental

01:00:46.520 and important to him.

01:00:47.440 Cause it was his daughter's first elk hunt.

01:00:48.920 I think, um, you know, that's when I knew like, this is, this is the real deal right here.

01:00:53.300 Yeah.

01:00:53.900 And that, you know, that's field of table lifestyle.

01:00:57.280 The people that live like that are good people.

01:00:59.940 You know, they believe there.

01:01:02.400 They, they believe in all of those building blocks that made our nation so great in this world.

01:01:09.540 You know, honor, respect, chivalry, tradition, family there.

01:01:14.960 And that's, that's who he is.

01:01:16.840 Um, yeah.

01:01:17.780 Wonderful, wonderful guy.

01:01:20.300 He's him and I are actually doing, he's coming to one of my book signings.

01:01:23.620 I think they juggled those around.

01:01:25.240 Yeah.

01:01:25.380 So he'll, he'll show up.

01:01:26.960 So for sure there'll be a lot of people there on that book.

01:01:30.300 It's actually for you or him to be determined.

01:01:34.400 Well, because it's at a bookstore, they'll be there for him.

01:01:37.300 And, you know, it's, uh, the, um, I, when they were setting up my, my, uh, tour for call me hundred starts right away here.

01:01:46.920 Um, I, you know, they were going to have bookstores.

01:01:49.640 I said, why would you do that?

01:01:50.520 Let's, let's do my Cabela's and basketball shops around people, you know, that live that field of table lifestyle.

01:01:57.440 They don't necessarily go down to the bookstore every week, but they go to Cabela's.

01:02:00.880 Right.

01:02:01.240 And people that, people that don't live the, uh, field of table lifestyle, they go to bookstores.

01:02:06.020 But do they go into Cabela's?

01:02:07.580 I think there's higher odds.

01:02:09.300 So I said, let's, let's try and bring the book readers that read novels that maybe don't live the field of table lifestyle.

01:02:15.440 Let's bring them to the Cabela stores and the Bastro shop stores.

01:02:18.580 And all our people will come there that, you know, live our lifestyle.

01:02:21.860 So they'll come anyway.

01:02:23.060 So, so I kind of hedged my bets on, on how many people would show up by, uh, having the location at Bastro and Cabela stores.

01:02:30.640 This will be the first for, you know, where, where there's the New York people, Simon and Schuster people are kind of scratching their head going, Cabela's and Bastro.

01:02:40.900 Who does book signings at Cabela's and Bastro?

01:02:42.720 So it's, it's been a, uh, it's been an interesting, you know, melding of, of, you know, of people that never the twain shall meet, you know, because when would Simon and Schuster, I mean, they didn't have a clue who I was.

01:02:57.640 So, you know, it's, uh, it'll, it'll be interesting to see how it goes.

01:03:01.380 I'm hoping that, you know, Call Me Hunter doesn't, you know, just end up in the hands of us.

01:03:06.140 You know, I think it's important because of the messages in this book.

01:03:10.660 I've flipped the stereotypes.

01:03:12.780 Um, and I think it could be a catalyst.

01:03:14.980 It's well-written.

01:03:16.220 You know, I tried to actually get it, uh, published in, in, um, with literary public, like publishers of literature, you know, real kind of, and, and, uh, they wouldn't do it.

01:03:26.240 They wouldn't even read it.

01:03:27.000 They said, no, it's, it's too, uh, they Googled me and they basically said, you can't possibly write literature.

01:03:33.920 So go away, you know, it's, uh, yeah, you know, I mean, not a down and out depressive professor, you know, who has had everything gone wrong in their life.

01:03:43.640 I guess that's what you have to be to write a literature, but, um, yeah, so I, but I do hope, I, I think, I believe that you've got to, you, you've got to find common ground.

01:03:56.780 You know, the, the world nowadays, our, our society is so divided, you know, like they're just like that and the opposites and there's no, you're stupid, you're stupid, you're stupid, you're stupid, you know, and it's not, they're not stupid people on either side.

01:04:10.400 I mean, there is, but the majority aren't, but they really believe something and they will not talk to the other side.

01:04:16.040 So I think you have to reach out and give them something that they recognize in their world and, and have respect for, well, writers, novelists, you know, that's respected and, you know, other outside of our hunting world, outdoor.

01:04:32.720 Different circles.

01:04:33.180 Lifestyle.

01:04:34.160 Yeah.

01:04:34.760 Different circles.

01:04:35.580 So they, so I, I wrote something that I think is good enough for them to actually go, oh, okay.

01:04:42.220 You know, I like this, but I flipped the stereotypes.

01:04:44.840 So if they like it, that means they're kind of also condoning the, you know, the, the evil villain in this book is an animal rights extremist.

01:04:55.680 You know, so they're, you know, I flipped it instead of the hunter being the horrible, you know, whatever lion king kind of killer.

01:05:03.180 Bambi killer, whatever.

01:05:04.600 And I, you know, made the anti-hero.

01:05:07.080 He's the hunter, you know, the, the protagonist is a young lady.

01:05:10.920 So, and I don't want to give it away, but it, I flipped it all around.

01:05:14.820 So now if they like that, it means they're kind of also liking this idea, which changes the stereotype that mainstream media has been painting us as, you know, and I've said it before, as, as louts with no higher sensibilities that spit on the floor.

01:05:31.000 And, you know, you, you can't take them into a fancy restaurant.

01:05:35.600 I mean, this is what you're going to get if I walk in a fancy restaurant anyway, but, you know, just because it's not a Gucci suit doesn't mean I'm not capable of holding a conversation with somebody in a Gucci suit.

01:05:46.740 And we all are, you know, we all are both sides.

01:05:49.700 We just, we just don't get a chance to, to converse anymore.

01:05:52.940 So this, this book is like throwing a line out there and saying, Hey, if you hold onto that line, you know, maybe we can pull each other a little bit closer together.

01:06:03.080 And hopefully it'll open up more doors for more writers like this, more, maybe even television, like Jack's done it.

01:06:10.040 His character is a hunter, right?

01:06:12.000 His character is a hunter.

01:06:13.700 So that's, he's already, and look at, look at how popular it is, you know, like.

01:06:18.940 Mainstream at this point.

01:06:20.620 Yeah.

01:06:21.040 And this means that those guys in the big ivory towers with the money are looking at that and going, Oh, maybe there is a market for this.

01:06:28.640 You know, A, number one, money talks.

01:06:31.140 So if, if they've been told, told, told, told, told, told that, you know, those guys don't read, those guys don't read, those, you know, they don't, those people don't read that, you know, okay, well, we won't publish any for them then.

01:06:41.600 But now that they are, with Jack's books alone, you know, they're finding out, Oh, no, there's a, there's a huge demand.

01:06:49.040 There's a market here.

01:06:50.420 Yeah, there's a market and money talks.

01:06:52.480 So again, you know, I'm hoping that this book will, will garner some respect.

01:06:57.640 I mean, there's people that aren't going to like it because I flipped the, the, you know, just, it's cognitive dissonance with their, with their ideologies, you know, just, I'm not going to read this garbage because it's, you know, that's, hunters are bad, period, period.

01:07:13.040 Which is, again, part of this problem, you know, the intolerance of the world that's keeping us apart.

01:07:17.560 But, so, so I'm hoping that this book does more than just, you know, I mean, I, yeah, I, I, it's not about the money.

01:07:25.600 I was kind of joking the other day, I probably, it's about $1.50 an hour for me on the amount of effort that's good at this.

01:07:33.100 I bet over, over 20 plus years, I bet it equates to not very much at all.

01:07:38.480 Yeah, you're talking pennies per hour.

01:07:41.300 So, so it's, you know, so it's not about the money.

01:07:43.580 And like I said earlier, I'm giving, we, Louise and I are giving everything away anyway.

01:07:48.500 So, you know, it's not about the money.

01:07:51.480 Whatever money I make for this is going to get given away anyway.

01:07:54.220 It will.

01:07:54.620 So, so yeah, it's, but I'm hoping that it, it, um, get reaches outside our market.

01:08:00.440 And the book tour, I kind of hedge, hedge my bets.

01:08:03.520 As I said, I put them in Cabela's and basketball, but that one Jack will be coming to in Arizona.

01:08:09.300 So I'm really looking forward to that.

01:08:11.320 I actually, last time I was at a shot show was maybe three years ago and maybe four years ago even.

01:08:17.600 But, um, I was walking down the aisle.

01:08:20.540 You've obviously been a shot show and there's like gazillions of people.

01:08:23.400 And, and there was this lineup that was like way around the corner.

01:08:27.100 And I walked along like a little professional jealousy.

01:08:29.960 Like, who's got such a big lineup at shot show?

01:08:32.840 And there, there it is.

01:08:34.180 There he is signing.

01:08:35.740 So I go, oh, so I, I, I just couldn't make myself stand in this line.

01:08:41.300 So I went up behind him and think, hey, but it was kind of cute because, you know,

01:08:46.740 the people in the lineup knew who I was too.

01:08:48.360 So it was, you get, you get a pass in that case.

01:08:51.240 As long as you shake all their hands too and get pictures.

01:08:53.640 That's right.

01:08:54.260 That's right.

01:08:54.820 Yeah.

01:08:55.360 So Jack and I will be, this one will be together.

01:08:57.960 So it'll, it'll be really fun.

01:08:59.300 I mean, he's, he's the biggest, he's the biggest right now.

01:09:02.700 So that's, uh, he's, he's obviously letting a little bit of his sunshine fall down on me.

01:09:08.860 So I'm, uh, it'll, it'll be fun.

01:09:12.460 Well, I'll, uh, I'll do my part as well.

01:09:14.380 I know the guys listening are going to be interested, not only in, in the book, call me

01:09:17.960 Hunter, but they're also going to be interested in your lifestyle.

01:09:20.460 And it's been, it's been inspiring to me.

01:09:23.500 You know, this conversation is a highlight of the conversations I've had to be able to

01:09:26.780 talk with you.

01:09:27.300 I've seen you walking around at shot show.

01:09:28.580 I've wanted to come introduce myself, but I couldn't bring myself to stand in any of those

01:09:32.200 lines either.

01:09:32.700 So I'm glad we got to do this on a one-on-one basis for an hour or so.

01:09:36.420 Yeah.

01:09:36.840 Yeah.

01:09:37.160 Just, just tap me on the shoulder.

01:09:39.180 I mean, that's, I will next time.

01:09:40.640 Yeah.

01:09:41.400 It's a professional courtesy that we all extend to each other.

01:09:44.720 I mean, what you're doing is reaching out and you're, you're promulgating this, you

01:09:50.520 know, the hour lifestyle, you're telling the world about it.

01:09:53.720 And that, that gives you a pass when any line up.

01:09:56.700 So you make sure that you just, I appreciate that.

01:09:59.640 Yeah.

01:10:00.220 Tap me on the shoulder.

01:10:01.280 Cause that's, uh, yeah.

01:10:03.560 Will you, uh, will you tell the guys where to connect with you?

01:10:06.080 Obviously they can pick up a copy of the book.

01:10:07.760 This interview is going to be released the day that the book comes out, October 17th,

01:10:11.700 correct?

01:10:12.560 Correct.

01:10:12.920 Yeah.

01:10:13.520 So the book is available now.

01:10:15.160 Um, you can get it anywhere books are available, but how do the guys connect with you if they

01:10:18.360 want to learn more about what you're doing in any of the realms that you're operating in?

01:10:23.160 You know, a social media is, uh, originally you'd asked about that, which I never really quite

01:10:28.220 got around to was the social media.

01:10:29.780 How, you know, how do we, how did I end up being?

01:10:32.680 You know, social, I'm old to be on social media.

01:10:35.440 Um, uh, just before I answer your direct question, I'll answer your original one.

01:10:39.920 Uh, Eva was working for us at that time.

01:10:43.020 She was my personal assistant, but, but, uh, you know, I mean, she, she's great at her job,

01:10:50.780 but it, you know, there's no way she's going to stay as her daddy's professional assistant.

01:10:55.020 So she, um, the, something called social media was starting to, you know, it kept hearing it,

01:11:01.020 social media, social media, but it didn't really exist.

01:11:03.560 And I told Eva, go figure it out.

01:11:06.020 You know, you, I give you six months, you know, I had to, I was traveling a lot.

01:11:09.360 I said, six months, I want you to come back and report to me what, what this new thing is,

01:11:14.400 social media.

01:11:15.080 And she did, and she researched it and she figured it out.

01:11:18.880 You know, she was right at the, right at the leading edge of all that social media stuff.

01:11:22.420 And it was Facebook at the time.

01:11:24.840 And, uh, when I came back, she, uh, there was even another one before that, uh, or at the

01:11:30.000 same time they were competing, but she came back and said this, she said, look, dad, this

01:11:33.920 is what it is.

01:11:34.500 And she explained it all to me.

01:11:35.660 And she said, oh, by the way, you know, you have like 3,000 followers.

01:11:39.940 I have 6,000 followers.

01:11:41.680 And she hadn't even done anything.

01:11:43.240 Like, it's like, are you kidding me?

01:11:44.980 Like, so that's when you realize too, that this is a new age, you know, that, that it

01:11:49.520 doesn't matter what I'd accomplished for some reason she had, well, besides she was cute.

01:11:54.280 She, you know, she's also articulate.

01:11:56.200 She, she, you know, they were, she had twice as many as I did for all the work I'd done in

01:12:02.060 my life, you know, for all the recognition I thought I deserved.

01:12:05.060 And, you know, so, so this is where I realized, wow, this social media, there's more to it,

01:12:09.520 you know, cause this is going to be the future.

01:12:11.500 These, this, they don't have to, yeah, they don't have to compete in my world.

01:12:15.940 They, I have to compete in their world.

01:12:17.980 So, so I said, okay, let's a hundred percent all in on whatever the social media thing is.

01:12:24.100 And, and I need to absolutely someday catch up to you.

01:12:29.160 Still, still not a chance.

01:12:31.480 No, no, no.

01:12:33.040 And she makes it, she lets me know every single day.

01:12:36.380 Yeah.

01:12:36.560 I says, oh, dad, you know, here, you know, I have 2 million followers or whatever, but,

01:12:40.260 but, but anybody can follow me on our social platforms.

01:12:44.660 And I, I truly live, you know, out what's going on is what I say.

01:12:49.340 You know, there's, it's my honest truth.

01:12:51.040 There's no, I do the posts or, you know, I do the whatever pictures.

01:12:55.380 Um, and, and so we're on Facebook and Instagram and also on Twitter, although Twitter, you know,

01:13:03.660 it's not, I don't, I don't even go on Twitter myself, but I do post on it.

01:13:08.080 Um, you can go to our website, jimshockey.com.

01:13:12.020 You can go to our hand of man, um, as well that, that I think we're, they, you know,

01:13:18.040 there's social platform there too, and websites and Rogue River Outfitters is ours as well.

01:13:22.480 That's growing like crazy right now.

01:13:24.520 Um, you know, because that's more on the, the pure hunting side are, are outfitting operations.

01:13:29.460 It's part of the empire you referred to earlier.

01:13:32.380 I've got 12 million square acres up in the Yukon that is my favorite place in the world.

01:13:37.440 It's not a single road, like not, not a house, just our cabins on lakes and rivers, all airplane access.

01:13:46.240 Yeah, it's so beautiful.

01:13:47.320 I love it.

01:13:48.180 Our late season caribou are going on right now.

01:13:50.420 When you're, this podcast comes out, it'll be on the, uh, probably the third hunt set at that point.

01:13:55.800 And, but, um, but yeah, they, you know, you can, I'm pretty hard not to, if you want to find me, you can find me.

01:14:02.760 Now you can check you down.

01:14:04.400 Yeah.

01:14:04.860 Call me Hunter.

01:14:05.660 We'll be, you can Google that too and end up somehow finding me, but, but our Instagram, and I don't know all that hashtag stuff, but it's, or handles or whatever they call it.

01:14:15.000 But it's jimshockey official.

01:14:16.480 I think I don't know.

01:14:19.360 Joe Rogan has on his podcast.

01:14:22.000 I don't know, maybe seven years ago.

01:14:24.000 And he asked me that, so what's your Instagram hashtag or something?

01:14:27.660 And I go, Hey, I had no idea what it was.

01:14:32.080 That's funny.

01:14:33.260 Yeah.

01:14:33.540 Well, it's pretty easy to find you now.

01:14:35.320 So that, that shouldn't be an issue.

01:14:36.640 If guys want to track you down and learn more about what you're up to.

01:14:39.480 Yeah, no, no.

01:14:40.300 And I, I'll say that like it is, this is what's going on in my life right now.

01:14:44.420 And, you know, Louise, all through that was, you know, people followed that and if it helped people, and I know it did, you know, that then I know Louise right now will be, you know, she'll, she'll be not proud because it was never her.

01:15:00.120 She would be honored, you know, that that's, that she helped people.

01:15:04.220 That's what her whole life was about.

01:15:05.900 So, so everything that's going on in our family, it's all there.

01:15:08.860 My dog, you know, you'll hear, if I'm eating my can of beans and, and three wieners, you know, I'll post that, you know, but it's, but always with some humor, entertainment, you know, because I think it's, it's the same.

01:15:20.060 It's storytelling.

01:15:21.520 So it's, and anybody now can go online and find our, wherever my appearances are for book signings over this next three weeks, I'll be all over the place, all over the state.

01:15:32.980 So as many places as I could get to that they organized and anybody out there that hears this and says, you're not coming here.

01:15:40.720 Well, I didn't make the final choices.

01:15:42.900 It was, that was above my pay grade.

01:15:45.300 So I, yeah, I could only do so much.

01:15:47.040 So, but yeah, easy to find on any of those platforms.

01:15:51.980 Good.

01:15:52.060 Well, we'll sync it all up again.

01:15:53.240 I want to tell you, thank you.

01:15:54.200 Thank you to you.

01:15:54.740 Thank you to your family and really appreciate the work you're doing.

01:15:57.900 Oh, thank you very much.

01:15:59.100 Thank you for having me on and giving me a voice.

01:16:03.260 All right, man.

01:16:03.940 I hope you enjoyed that one.

01:16:05.180 I told you early on that moment where he talked about his, his wonderful late wife was very, very powerful for me.

01:16:12.980 Very touching for me.

01:16:14.240 I hope that you got something from that as well.

01:16:16.260 Just the whole conversation.

01:16:17.600 I hope that you walk away from this one, wanting to live your life just a little bit differently, maybe than you have up to this point.

01:16:24.320 And that's the whole point of this podcast is to give you information and inspiration and motivation and resources and guidance and direction to help you live a more fulfilled, more rewarding, more profitable, better life.

01:16:38.440 So please make sure you connect with Jim.

01:16:41.080 Take a screenshot real quick before you close this one down, uh, posted on social media, post on Instagram, Twitter X, and let people know what you're listening to.

01:16:49.820 If you have good information to share, I encourage you to share with other people because somebody will be served because you are willing to take just a few seconds and share it.

01:16:57.560 It's also a great way to say thank you.

01:16:59.380 If you enjoy what we're doing here, it's a very, uh, casual, easy, free way to say thank you for hopefully the information that we're giving you.

01:17:07.020 That's helping you in your life.

01:17:08.620 Last couple of things, make sure you check out the battle ready program at order of man.com slash battle ready.

01:17:13.740 And then as always support my good friends, if you need a good high quality knife for this year's hunt trips that you have planned, and you can do that at Montana knife company.com.

01:17:22.920 Use the code order of man.

01:17:24.580 All right, guys, those are your marching orders.

01:17:27.820 We'll be back tomorrow for our asking anything until then go out there, take action and become the man you are meant to be.

01:17:34.240 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

01:17:37.200 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

01:17:41.200 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

Order of Man - October 17, 2023

JIM SHOCKEY ｜ Live a Life of Meaning and Significance

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