Order of Man


JOSHUA BROOME ｜ The Lies That Will Ruin a Man's Life


Episode Stats

Misogynist Sentences

8

Hate Speech Sentences

12


Summary

Joshua Broom is a former porn star turned preacher. He is a public speaker and shares his personal battles with depression, suicidal thoughts, and overcoming emotional scars. He is an outspoken advocate against pornography and the destructive role it plays in men s lives.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 With so many false narratives, it's easy to get caught up in deceit, deception, and ultimately
00:00:05.820 destruction. Now, we don't intentionally go out seeking those thoughts, ideas, and concepts that
00:00:10.700 will do damage, but they have a way of creeping into our lives all the same. That's why it's
00:00:16.740 crucial that we remain diligent and steadfast in seeking the truth about the way we operate as men.
00:00:23.180 Today, I'm joined by former porn star turned preacher, Joshua Broom, to talk about these
00:00:28.300 lies and most importantly, how to protect ourselves and our loved ones against them. We talk about the
00:00:34.460 dangers in objectifying others, learning to be comfortable in our own skin, why money and fame
00:00:40.260 won't satisfy your soul, getting over the false approval of others, and why only you can be you
00:00:46.060 and why that's a huge advantage. You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your
00:00:51.780 fears and boldly chart your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time,
00:00:57.400 every time. You are not easily deterred or defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is
00:01:04.040 your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all
00:01:09.740 is said and done, you can call yourself a man. Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is
00:01:15.240 Ryan Mickler. I'm your host and the founder of the Order of Man podcast and movement. Welcome here today.
00:01:20.980 I've got a very exciting one with a repeat guest, Mr. Joshua Broom. Very excited for this conversation,
00:01:27.400 one that I think you guys will find a lot of value in as well. Now, if you are new, what we do is we
00:01:33.080 interview incredible men, have great conversations, deep, meaningful, significant, powerful conversations
00:01:38.560 with men like Joshua Broom and Dave Ramsey and Terry Cruz and Matthew McConaughey and Tim Tebow and the
00:01:46.280 lineup of men that have joined us and banded with us is absolutely phenomenal. And that's a testament to
00:01:51.280 the work that we're doing here. And the fact that you as a man want to improve, want to get better
00:01:56.880 and want to forge deep connections and bonds and learn new information from other guys who are
00:02:02.820 successful. So that's what we do here. Uh, before I get into the conversation, just want to mention
00:02:08.020 real quick, I just had a huge, huge, uh, inventory update in our order of man store. So if you go to
00:02:14.760 store.orderofman.com store.orderofman.com, we have eight shirts that have all been restocked. We have,
00:02:22.800 I believe three new, uh, shirts available and I'm really excited to finally get the store back up and
00:02:29.880 running. I've had so many questions about when I'm going to get inventory. And so we're going to see a
00:02:33.380 lot more things come in over the next two to three months. It's a great way to support what we're doing
00:02:37.740 here. Again, you can check it out at store.orderofman.com. All right, guys, with that said,
00:02:43.060 let me introduce you to Joshua. He is a former adult film star. I think he's done something like
00:02:48.580 over a thousand, uh, movies. Uh, he has embarked on a life changing journey to fill the void in his
00:02:56.580 heart. Uh, but despite his fame and success early on, he found emptiness and he's sharing his journey
00:03:03.080 in his latest book, seven lies that will ruin your life, uh, battling depression and thoughts of
00:03:09.420 self-harm. He discovered the transformative power of Jesus. Uh, he's become an outspoken advocate
00:03:14.920 against pornography and the destructive role it plays in men's lives. And he's also a public speaker
00:03:20.540 and shares his message across the world of his personal battles with depression, suicidal thoughts,
00:03:25.540 and overcoming emotional scars. Enjoy this one, gents. Josh, what's up, brother? So great to see you
00:03:33.420 again. Glad to have you back on the podcast. Yes, sir. So, uh, so appreciative of you and man,
00:03:39.260 uh, you've got, uh, a pretty sticky community there. So I, I, uh, I got so many people encouraging me
00:03:46.240 from your community, from the podcast that we did, uh, what year and a half, year and a half ago,
00:03:52.560 maybe longer. Has it been that long? Um, yeah, yeah, it's, it's crazy. Time flies. Yeah. Time goes
00:03:59.040 really quick. Yeah. You know, it's an interesting discussion when you're talking about pornography
00:04:02.840 because there is this big group of, of men who know that it's destructive, know the ramifications
00:04:10.720 and the consequences of engaging in pornography. Um, a lot of them are, are, are not a lot of them
00:04:16.660 would like to be free from pornography, but then there's also this, this other group of men and it's
00:04:21.660 larger than you would think. And you're probably intimately familiar with this who don't think it's
00:04:26.740 bad. Like they don't, they don't see anything wrong with it. Yeah. I would say that, that, uh,
00:04:33.060 regarding, you know, Western culture, like those two things that you mentioned are the most problematic
00:04:38.540 thing. It's, um, a group of people that are okay with objectifying people and then it diminishes their
00:04:47.020 quality of life. And I think, um, I'd love to dive into how it completely strickened your inability to be,
00:04:53.540 um, an effective man and even an effective friend. Like you can't, you can't understand
00:05:00.140 and pour what you need to out, um, into the life of another man when it talks about friendship,
00:05:06.520 because you lack integrity. You lack, um, you know, an understanding of a relationship is not
00:05:11.860 indicative of what can I extract regarding value from you. And when I need you, I'm not going to show
00:05:17.560 up because our relationship's transactional. And that's what consuming pornography teaches.
00:05:22.980 And then, you know, you got that other spectrum of, uh, maybe you're a follower of Jesus and you
00:05:30.660 say, Hey, I love Jesus. I believe the Bible is true, but what I struggle with is consuming pornography.
00:05:37.180 And I get 2000 plus emails and DMS of people that fall under that category. And what it does is it,
00:05:45.180 it limits your effectiveness. It minimizes your capacity. Um, because if you're called to live a
00:05:51.500 life that is bold and courageous, you can't do that while you're living in shame, because, um, best
00:05:58.380 case scenario, you can put on face and pretend like you're okay when you're not, but the probability of
00:06:03.840 you stepping out and being bold and being the man that you're called to be is pretty much impossible.
00:06:08.940 So what, so what were, what were you telling yourself when you were in the industry? Obviously,
00:06:16.640 uh, very, very famous, you know, doing a lot within the industry, receiving awards and things like
00:06:23.540 this. But I think based on our previous conversation, you knew deep inside that there, there wasn't
00:06:29.880 anything to this to put it mildly and that it was destructive to your own wellbeing. But what were
00:06:35.340 the lies that you were telling yourself? Because I think other people are probably saying that to
00:06:40.100 themselves. Yeah. I would say the thing that I hear most, I mean, cause you know, I've done, uh,
00:06:46.220 almost 75 men's conferences in the last three years. And the most, um, you know, the, the thing that I
00:06:52.540 hear the most, uh, a close second behind people struggling with pornography is this, um, you know,
00:07:00.760 the aspect of my story that they resonate with is the fatherlessness aspect. And for me, um, I grew up
00:07:07.160 without a dad and never having a dad in my life, it caused me not to have what I needed regarding,
00:07:13.140 you know, teaching me what it meant to be a man, but also I didn't have in my home, an example of
00:07:19.780 a demonstration of what it looked like to see a man and a woman interact in a normative way regarding
00:07:28.340 intimacy, regarding interaction, respect, honor, any of those things. And that inadequacy in my life
00:07:36.000 caused me to seek to the world. And I saw pornography for the first time when I was 13.
00:07:41.780 So you've got this, um, you know, this, this real inadequacy within myself where I'm trying to prove
00:07:48.020 myself that I'm worth something because I feel rejected. And I've got this fictitious, um, variation
00:07:54.440 of reality regarding sex and intimacy, teaching me what it meant to, um, interact with women. So
00:08:00.740 I've got, you know, uh, an empty soul and, uh, a lie that's driving how I live my life. And,
00:08:09.340 you know, a large part about the book that I wrote, it's, it's really, um, if you believe a lie to be
00:08:14.560 true, you live as if that lie was truth. And I believed I was inadequate. I was not valuable. So I had
00:08:23.400 to prove myself to be valuable through accomplishment. And I was seeking, um, any and every
00:08:29.980 way I could to, to replace the good job son that I wanted to hear. So I got, you know, high fives and
00:08:38.660 pats on the back and awards and accomplishments and money and things like that. And that led me,
00:08:44.160 you know, to, to hope that that would fill the void that I had in my life, but it didn't work.
00:08:49.740 And when, you know, you strive to be famous or you strive to be rich or you strive to be whatever
00:08:56.000 it is that you think will satisfy your soul when you get it and it doesn't work, then what,
00:09:02.980 you know, if you, you make the money, you get the job, you get the truck, you get the woman,
00:09:06.980 you get whatever, um, you got, you know, a generation, uh, 54% of the divorces that happen
00:09:13.320 in America are linked to infidelity that are, that is tied to pornography. Either pornography
00:09:19.360 was the main catalyst or it led to an in-person interaction. So in a real way, pornography is
00:09:27.940 stripping the man from the home and kids are growing up without father figures. Even if they're
00:09:34.260 in the home, if they're struggling with pornography or they're, you know, living in compromise, um,
00:09:40.320 are they being the man that they're called to be? So you, you're getting this minimized,
00:09:45.480 you know, experience when you, you need all of your dad. And, um, I think in a real way
00:09:52.520 that caused me to strive for acceptance, approval, and all these things. And when I made millions of
00:10:01.660 dollars and I had all the success and tons of people knew who I was, um, it didn't matter.
00:10:07.780 At the end of the day, I still felt like garbage. I still felt worthless. And that led to me wanting
00:10:13.620 to take my life. So the lie that I was telling myself was, um, if I became enough, I would feel
00:10:19.840 like I was enough, but nothing in the world could mitigate the wound that I had in my heart.
00:10:28.560 What was it like? I imagine that in public, you probably got approached or recognized by,
00:10:35.720 by other men, I imagine. Yeah. We're celebrating you and cheering you on. What, what is that like?
00:10:41.760 Cause you know, they're celebrating you because they've seen you naked having sex with other
00:10:45.820 women. So yeah. What is that like? Yeah. I mean, honestly, I was so tied up in that world.
00:10:53.560 It was somewhat normative. So I didn't really, you know, see it for what it was, but in retrospect,
00:11:00.040 super strange, you know, um, it looking at it in retrospect, but, you know, just the fact that,
00:11:06.620 you know, I would, you know, every time there was like a convention or I had a new movie coming out,
00:11:11.920 um, I would, you know, sign headshots, sign autographs and stuff like that. And, um, it was
00:11:17.800 because like, really, you know, you look, looking back, it's like, man, I was their hero because I was
00:11:25.280 living the life that, you know, maybe if they could, they could live my life vicariously through
00:11:30.600 watching pornography, they thought that there was experiencing the happiness that I was experiencing,
00:11:35.420 but, um, it was all a facade, you know, it, it, it was, uh, it's, it's like walking up to Dean Cain,
00:11:42.760 expecting him to be Spider-Man. Uh, it's, you know, it's, it's a, it's a mask. And in the same way
00:11:50.240 people thought, well, if, if, uh, money and sex equates to happiness and he's having that,
00:11:56.780 um, I want to be him or he must be happy, or I would love to have his life.
00:12:01.960 And what I would say is I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy.
00:12:07.300 Yeah. It's really interesting, especially through the rise of social media,
00:12:10.500 where so many more people can put on a persona, can put on a face, can pretend that their life
00:12:17.160 is something different than it is. But the reality is even though you might see somebody who looks
00:12:23.180 successful looking in, they've got their own demons and those demons are likely the same ones
00:12:28.440 that you and I are wrestling with. They're, they're very common, but people don't talk about these
00:12:32.260 things. And I would say those things are even more amplified. And I think in this culture,
00:12:37.240 we're seeing that, you know, this is the most connected generation regarding digitally in the
00:12:42.340 history of time while simultaneously being the most disconnected generation in the history of
00:12:47.380 time. And the evidence is the mental health crisis that we're in. And you're seeing people who look as
00:12:54.860 if they've got it made. Um, I think like the, the, the example that really jumped off the page to me
00:13:01.600 was when, um, this former Miss America, I think she was like 24, 25 years old. Um, she just signed a
00:13:08.660 deal. She had, you know, she had her own TV show. She had won Miss America. Um, she was, you know,
00:13:14.660 she was, uh, on the rise regarding, uh, pursuing a career in media and she took her own life. And I
00:13:21.560 think it, it really points to, um, people pretend like they're okay when they're not, because in this
00:13:29.480 day and time, we are more concerned with managing the perception other people have of us, even strangers,
00:13:37.500 than dealing with the wound and the struggle that we have within our own lives. And I think that,
00:13:43.680 um, that's the way that Satan is, is moving most aggressively in this day and time. Because if you
00:13:49.880 can convince a person to pretend like they're okay when they're not, um, you'll never ask for help
00:13:56.540 because that's the thing that makes you look the weakest. And that's actually the thing that will set
00:14:01.880 you free. That's, that's interesting. I, I, I saw a post the other day, a guy had recorded a,
00:14:09.960 it looked like a hotel employee that was kind of having a, frankly, a mental breakdown. And I said
00:14:15.920 something about there clearly being some mental instability going on here. That's not to say we
00:14:20.620 can't be empathetic. We should, but there's something going on here deeper than he had an
00:14:24.680 issue with his client or whatever. And somebody said as a response, somebody said, well, you know,
00:14:31.100 the, the, the mental, the mental instability is going on with a person recording, uh, everything
00:14:36.040 going on with that employee. He's mentally healthy. I'm like, okay, we need to stop. Like,
00:14:42.880 sure. There's a problem with the way this guy's recording. He shouldn't be doing that. He,
00:14:46.860 he should be more empathetic. We could all do better myself included. But if we're going to lie
00:14:52.300 and say, there isn't some sort of mental instability going on with this employee in the video,
00:14:56.580 that's a problem because it's going to keep him from getting the help that he actually needs.
00:15:01.020 Maybe it's chronic. Maybe he's on the spectrum. Maybe he's just dealing with so much. And finally,
00:15:06.520 it was the straw that broke the camel's back, but let's not pretend that everything's fine. It isn't
00:15:11.960 fine. And we need to make sure we address it clearly and truthfully. Yeah. I mean, I think, um,
00:15:17.260 what, what I'm going to say could be potentially controversial. So, um, cut it out if you, if you want.
00:15:22.620 No, we'll leave it. We're going to leave it. Whatever it is, we're leaving it.
00:15:26.700 My, uh, so my wife and I, we were watching the voice and there was this woman that had struggled
00:15:34.120 with feeling socially awkward most of her life. And she found out later in life that she was autistic.
00:15:40.560 And that was actually a beautiful thing because she, she could now put her finger on, um, what made
00:15:46.680 her feel awkward in certain moments. But I think it's so important because while that diagnosis was
00:15:55.300 an opportunity for her to lean into aspects of her personality and needs that she might have
00:16:01.140 individually, um, I think some of the lies that she believed about being different than the other
00:16:08.440 people that she saw, she thought like, okay, you know, I, I'm, I'm, I'm this masculine, uh, woman.
00:16:15.380 And now I'm, you know, she was married and she left her husband because of the way she felt. And now
00:16:21.120 she's married to this woman. And, you know, it's, it's a story on the voice, but it was, you know,
00:16:26.200 and it was almost like she was trying so hard to convince herself that she was normal in the skin
00:16:32.140 that she was living in. But it was this most, it was almost like this, um, this cognitive dissidence,
00:16:37.260 right. Where this, these two ideas were living simultaneously, where she believed that, okay,
00:16:43.960 now I understand why I feel the way I feel. But at the same time, she had found comfort in, uh, this
00:16:51.320 new identity that she created. So she had a hard time letting go of what had become comfortable to
00:16:58.140 her. And at the same time saying like, she had so much regret, um, for, you know, hurting the man that
00:17:05.300 she was married to leaving that marriage. And I think we live in a, in a society where we're so
00:17:09.960 scared of telling people the truth. And man, uh, like the, like the Bible, the Bible is the most
00:17:16.560 reliable document in the history of time. And like, you see stuff like John 14, 15, it's like,
00:17:21.580 if you obey my commandments, you know, if you love me, you'll obey my commandments. And if you think
00:17:26.100 that God is this mean dictator saying, I'm going to withhold my love from you. If you don't do what I say,
00:17:32.620 or I'm going to crush you, if you don't do what I say, actually, I love you enough to tell you the
00:17:38.160 truth, protect you from yourself because you're an idiot. And, um, I actually know what's best for
00:17:45.240 you. And in the same way, I tell my kids not to touch the stove and they don't touch the stove
00:17:49.860 because they trust their dad. So they don't know that the stove is hot because they've touched it
00:17:55.060 and gotten burned. They trust me. So you can understand the tone of God better. If you understand
00:18:01.700 the character of God in the same way, um, my kids understand my communication because the way that
00:18:06.880 I love them. And if I tell them something, I'm trying to protect them. And I think in just in a
00:18:11.800 real way, just in this culture, um, this is just who I am. This is just the way that it is, man. If,
00:18:18.420 if I believe that I would be dead because I was going to take my life because I thought my identity
00:18:23.740 was grafted into and defined by my feelings of rejection in the evidence that my worst mistakes are
00:18:31.340 are seared into the internet probably forever. So I could either allow those things to define me
00:18:37.240 or I can, I can seek a foundational truth that is greater than the reality that the world tells me.
00:18:44.360 I can either allow the internet be the dictator of how I live my life or the God that created me.
00:18:51.860 And, um, I'm so grateful that, uh, I found people that love me enough to meet me where I was,
00:18:59.320 to tell me the truth and to love me enough to not leave me as I was.
00:19:05.360 It's powerful. What about that story with the woman you said, what do you feel about that would
00:19:10.380 be controversial? Cause I, I didn't hear anything controversial in there, but yeah, I mean, I just
00:19:14.480 think, you know, just, just, yeah, I mean, I, for, for me, it's like, you know, I, I think it was,
00:19:21.540 it was beautiful in that the fact that she figured out that she did have, um, some type of mental
00:19:27.920 health issue that she could point to. And it's like, you know, the, my feelings that I can't
00:19:33.360 understand that there, there is some just cause behind that. So that no, nothing controversial
00:19:38.500 there, but, um, the fact that she had, uh, created an identity as living as, um, a woman
00:19:46.640 that's attracted to women because she felt like she was different. So she needed to live different.
00:19:50.820 And that is actually in conflict of what is true. Um, because her feelings couldn't be trusted
00:19:57.620 because of the way that she was feeling because she was seeking comfort for leaning into the, uh,
00:20:04.460 you know, the data that she was processing in the wrong way. It's like, you know, if, you know,
00:20:09.340 if, if I drive in the wrong direction and I believe that I know where I'm going, but I get to the wrong
00:20:15.080 place and I get to a place that I don't need to be, uh, you know, if someone's like, okay, you know,
00:20:20.180 you're, you're, you're where you need to be in, in where I'm not, uh, that's not love, you know,
00:20:26.580 that that's not truth. So I think in this world where people need to know, Hey, um, you, you may
00:20:33.800 have felt like there was a time in your life where those decisions were leading you to live a life that
00:20:40.720 was different than you had lived prior and you found comfort in that chaos, but you actually
00:20:46.320 were just uncomfortable in your own skin and you needed to process that with someone and that's
00:20:51.380 okay. But living this alternate life is not the place where you're going to find freedom because
00:20:57.780 what you've done is you put on another mask thinking that this facade is going to fix my feelings when
00:21:03.280 my feelings are actually factual. I just need to process them with trusted people.
00:21:07.320 Hmm. Yeah. I see this a lot in the transgenderism discussion. You know, it's, it's like a woman,
00:21:14.200 for example, who believes herself to be a man and says, I'm, I'm a man. And then you ask, well,
00:21:18.820 what, what is a man? Well, it's just how I feel. Well, you, you don't know what a man feels like
00:21:23.900 because you're not a man. So this is circular logic. Help me understand how you think that you are
00:21:30.100 something that you aren't, but you feel that way, even though you've never been that thing. I think
00:21:35.660 about this with my own children. I've got four children, three boys and a girl. If one of them
00:21:39.940 came to me and said, Hey, I think my boys said, I think I'm a woman. The answer is, well, you're
00:21:44.120 not right. Let's figure out why you're feeling here. It's like, yeah. So same here. It's like,
00:21:49.100 I got, I got four boys and it's like, if, and I think what happens is, is like in the, in today's
00:21:56.620 time, it's like, you know, you're, you're a son could come to you. And it's like, it's
00:22:01.580 like for my kids, uh, they went through a season where they thought like sky was the coolest
00:22:06.240 Paw Patroller and they wanted like sky stuff. And, uh, that was all fine and good. But at
00:22:12.460 the same time, it's like understanding like sky is a girl, but like I, they're, they're not
00:22:18.460 going to want girly things because they know the difference between being a man and being a
00:22:23.100 woman. And I think sometimes when people say, Oh, well, my kid likes, uh, something
00:22:28.160 that's associated with feminism, they, they, they must have this feminine identity. And
00:22:34.140 all of a sudden let's go get, uh, them some, you know, some, some hormones and, and chop
00:22:39.240 some stuff off. And it's, it's such a drastic thing to say, like, gosh, you know, uh, that
00:22:44.700 they liked the female character in Paw Patrol because, uh, she, she drove a helicopter and it was
00:22:49.720 pretty cool, you know? Um, so it's, it's, it's just crazy how, uh, how the world is. Um,
00:22:57.780 but man, and I think in the same way, uh, you know, I, I gave a talk recently around, um,
00:23:04.340 how, uh, I, I think clearly how pornography and abortion is tied together and, you know,
00:23:10.580 the, the biblical narrative, you, you see this meta narrative from Genesis to Revelation.
00:23:15.040 Every time there's an uprising in sexual immorality, it's always tied to child sacrifice and anything
00:23:20.600 that God creates Satan counterfeits. And he does the same thing time and time again. And
00:23:25.420 in the same way, if there's a culture where pornography is being consumed, um, to the extent
00:23:31.540 where 33% of all the data transferred on the internet is pornography, three out of the
00:23:36.160 top 10 websites that are searched in the world is pornography, pornography, making more
00:23:42.280 money than the NBA, major league baseball, and NFL all combined. So those things being true,
00:23:48.640 that many people watching it because you know, all that revenue is based on viewership and that
00:23:53.140 monetization strategy that, um, exists on Instagram and YouTube and all those places that came from
00:23:59.760 Pornhub. And, uh, so that many people watching it, what's happening is people are objectifying people
00:24:07.820 and thinking that my life is about me. And then you get to the rationale that in the same way, Jesus
00:24:14.240 sacrificed his life for you. I've, you know, a counterfeit to that would be, well, I need to
00:24:20.480 sacrifice this child for me because my life is going to be less than if I have a child and just denying
00:24:28.280 the, the, the evidence of, well, if I have sex with someone of the opposite gender, the, the byproduct
00:24:37.680 of that is a possibility of creating human life. And if I disassociate my, you know, if, if I think,
00:24:46.160 okay, people are products and sex is transactional, well, this, um, you know, this meaningless act is going
00:24:52.660 to equate to this meaningless life. And it's just an inconvenience to me. So of course I just want to
00:24:58.860 get rid of it because I believe that, um, what I did doesn't matter. And that, that child doesn't
00:25:05.180 matter. So I'm going to try to call it something else, but I'll, I'll bring it back to this main
00:25:09.200 point. I think it's just hilarious that we call porn adult content. Like how counterintuitive is that
00:25:19.100 we're saying that this is for adults. Is it? Because it's, it's a depiction of a completely
00:25:29.440 different thing than sex actually is. So we're saying that this is the way that, that adults act.
00:25:36.460 And, um, I just think in the same, like you, you name it, it's like, because of you changing what you
00:25:43.680 call something, you normalize it and you take away the, you know, how important the reality is.
00:25:52.920 That's why like so many things are normalized that should be catastrophic.
00:25:58.800 Well, I mean, we, we, we do that. We play these mental gymnastics and we have these euphemisms.
00:26:03.520 Adult entertainment industry is a euphemism for watching another dude have sex with a woman.
00:26:10.680 I mean, that's, that's what it is. You know, I also wonder, that's interesting. I never really
00:26:15.200 considered the abortion conversation, but there are consequences to our decisions. You know, if you
00:26:20.620 decide to go engage in sex with another woman, one of the potential outcomes is a baby. Like you said,
00:26:28.460 I also wonder what, what that does from the perspective of, you know, STDs and STIs where,
00:26:35.780 you know, you see a guy having sex with hundreds of women, you don't really see what the ramification
00:26:41.420 is of that. And then you just believe that you can go engage in the same behavior. And, you know,
00:26:47.180 maybe you find yourself with, uh, an STI, STD, HIV, any of these others, because you really didn't
00:26:54.020 consider the consequence of the decisions and the actions you were taking.
00:26:57.380 Men, let me just step away from this conversation very quickly, a little off topic, but I wanted to
00:27:04.700 share something new with you. Uh, when I started hunting eight years ago, I found something that
00:27:10.240 has become an integral part of my life. Uh, so many of my greatest memories have been formed in the
00:27:16.040 mountains and deserts and forests of the hunts that I've been on. And not to mention, I found so many
00:27:21.660 similar men and forge deep bonds and connections with them. And that's why I joined and helped launch
00:27:28.000 M42 adventures, uh, to build an organization and a movement dedicated to introducing others to the
00:27:34.160 world of hunting and the outdoors. Uh, we've got an African hunt coming up in July and August, two
00:27:40.320 different dates with not only hunting, but a helicopter tour, an African safari, uh, a five-star
00:27:46.760 facility to enjoy this out of, and a trip to an orphanage there where we're going to be hosting
00:27:53.700 our event, uh, so that we can give back to the community that we'll be in. Uh, if you're interested
00:27:58.540 in joining me in Africa for a hunt, or even if you're not a hunter and you want to just go enjoy
00:28:02.840 Africa the way it's meant to be enjoyed and spend that time with me and other powerful men, uh, then I
00:28:09.440 would encourage you to head to M42 adventures.com M42 adventures.com. You can learn about that African
00:28:16.600 trip and you can learn about other experiences that we offer again, that's M42 adventures.com. All right,
00:28:22.960 guys, let me get back to it with Joshua. Yeah. I mean, like even in an industry that I was in, it's
00:28:30.620 like, you know, like part of being in the industry is, uh, you, you've got, um, so at, at the most
00:28:38.500 lenient, uh, you got a 30 day window. Um, most organ, like most companies would require either a 21
00:28:46.340 day or a 14 day test. Um, some, uh, some performers that work exclusively with one company require a
00:28:55.020 three day test. And what I mean by that is, um, essentially your work visa, um, in the, in the
00:29:01.100 porn industry is you have to have a full panel, um, STD and HIV tests. So you go in, do your analysis,
00:29:08.880 do blood work, and then you get that test back. And that's, you know, if you have a clean bill of
00:29:13.220 health, that gives you access to work and that, and that's not a perfect, um, you know, that's,
00:29:18.680 that obviously that doesn't work. Cause like there were a ton of STDs, um, that are going around the
00:29:23.660 industry just because the copious amounts of sex you were having with, with, with the, with a multitude
00:29:27.560 of partners, um, and then you don't, and you can't, and you, and you can't factor in, um, what's
00:29:33.900 happening because what you do off camera, you know, there, there's no, yeah, you don't know if
00:29:37.820 you slept with someone the night before. Yeah. So it's, it's not a perfect process, but yeah,
00:29:43.860 like in the same way, it's like, it's just so crazy. It's like, you know, um, you know, I, I don't know
00:29:49.040 what the, the most recent data is regarding general herpes, but you know, like they're, they're saying,
00:29:55.340 you know, if anyone is sexually active, you know, 18, uh, like 18 to 30, it's like 70% plus people
00:30:04.480 have, um, that like, even if they haven't had an outbreak, it's in their system. Um, and that's
00:30:11.340 just something that, you know, 20 years ago would have been outlandish, you know, um, now it's just
00:30:17.060 like, oh, well, you know, that's just, you know, how it is. Yeah. I mean, it's like, basically you
00:30:22.660 hear people say, well, that's just like having a cold sore, right? I mean, because it's the same
00:30:26.460 family, uh, a virus. So it's as common as somebody having a cold sore when they get stressed or when they
00:30:32.440 get sick or during the season. Yeah. And it's just, it's just a wild, it's just a wild time to be
00:30:39.580 alive. And I was talking to someone recently and I was like, can you imagine if you had, uh, like
00:30:46.900 woken up from a coma? Like you'd been a, you know, you've been just like completely disconnected for 10
00:30:52.100 years and you woke up today. You'd be like, what in the crap is going on? Like, who is our president?
00:30:59.440 What is going on in this world? Uh, you know, it's, it's just nuts. It's just absolutely nuts.
00:31:07.220 But I think, um, man, uh, just, just one of the things that I appreciate what you do so much is,
00:31:12.980 um, you know, you, you just, uh, you, you tell men the truth and you, you galvanize men to, uh,
00:31:20.540 help them be better. And I think like, I mean, that that's a huge problem like in the world,
00:31:25.900 like it's, it's a massive problem. It's, it's one of the things that I'm most passionate about
00:31:29.440 because, um, for me personally, um, it was intense discipleship because yeah, I've, I've been
00:31:35.900 out of the porn industry for 11 years, been following Jesus for nine. And, you know, today
00:31:41.020 being, you know, a father of four boys married for eight years, um, you know, I, I'm, you know,
00:31:46.780 at the, the, the front lines of, you know, seeing, uh, you know, legislation passed and being
00:31:52.580 in the state of Texas, you know, to the point where legislation was passed, it wasn't implemented,
00:31:57.880 uh, was, it was not implemented in the way it was supposed to. And now there was a lawsuit filed
00:32:02.420 in the, in the state of Texas one against Pornhub, like huge. And just seeing the data. So,
00:32:09.500 you know, age, the, the age verification, um, legislation that was passed, um, the, the byproduct
00:32:15.300 of that is 65% less people were watching pornography because, you know, it's for protecting kids. But
00:32:23.940 what it does is, Hey, do you really want to leave that data footprint that you had been on this site?
00:32:31.060 Because you have to, you know, you have to, you know, essentially same thing, uh, that you have
00:32:35.780 to do to buy a plane ticket. You have to do to log onto one of these porn sites. You know, you gotta
00:32:40.500 put your, you gotta put your name in, you gotta put your address, you gotta put your birthday in,
00:32:45.420 um, and then, and then, you know, data that's associated with a government issued ID.
00:32:49.860 So it's like, you know, and then there's, there's argument there where it's like, um, you know,
00:32:56.460 you know, uh, some kind of infringement in your, uh, your, your freedom of, of speech and free,
00:33:02.140 you know, all these rights and stuff. And it's like, man, um, no, like this is, this is about
00:33:08.500 protecting kids, but also like protecting people from themselves. Because if you look at
00:33:12.420 what the pornography industry is attached to, it's attached to children being abused. It's attached
00:33:19.140 to, um, rape cultures, you know, 94% of pornography has, um, physical abuse in it. Um, it's tied to so
00:33:27.780 many things. And then here's the most astronomical stats. So I, I, if anyone's listening to this,
00:33:33.300 if you want to know, like, if you want to nerd out hard on some data, um, I did a podcast
00:33:38.140 called Unmentionable and it's an eight part documentary style podcast. And, um, it, you
00:33:45.060 know, so it's, it's chronologically tracking my story at the same time as tracking the growth
00:33:49.220 of the porn industry. So from, you know, just print to silent films, to the growth of what
00:33:55.120 it is today. And the most outlandish thing that I heard, and it made me cringe to the point
00:34:01.380 where I had to, had to pull over my car when I, when I heard it live. Um, but in the 80th percentile
00:34:09.080 of sexual abuse cases, um, in the U S and in Australia, um, there's this critical care nurse
00:34:17.600 that was providing this data. Her name's Heidi Olson, phenomenal speaker. Um, the average age
00:34:25.420 of the perpetrator and 80 plus percent of the sexual abuse that happens in America is 12 or
00:34:35.160 under. Wow. Because what's happening is what's happening is, is kids are watching pornography
00:34:40.840 and then they're acting it out on their siblings. And it's like that data is not shared too broadly
00:34:50.980 because they're trying to protect the kids that are doing it. Um, but it's, I mean, that's,
00:34:56.920 that's, that's, that's sad, dude. Um, it's sad. And, and, and what's, you know, and I think
00:35:05.240 that number is somewhat not as accurate to the full picture of what's going on because, you
00:35:12.760 know, I've had multiple meetings with people where, um, there's, there's so much like stuff
00:35:19.400 around like child pornography, abuse, like all this stuff. There's so much of it. Like they're
00:35:26.120 only addressing like 2% of it. Like whatever's the absolute worst is where there, there's people,
00:35:33.120 you know, uh, outside of sting operations. They're like, these are people we're actually going after
00:35:37.620 and seizing their computers and stuff. It's just like crazy time to, to be alive. Um, but I'll just
00:35:44.640 say like, like to our earlier question, um, is, is porn just not a big deal? Is it, um, is it a moral,
00:35:54.600 uh, good or bad thing in this world? It's like, man, uh, I think it is the primary catalyst for the
00:36:02.940 destruction of our home and the harm of women and children, not even just in America, but in this
00:36:10.040 world. And why would you want to consume something that is literally destroying homes, harming
00:36:18.940 children and contributing to the destruction of the lives of the real people? You know, I guess,
00:36:27.500 I guess the question is for those people who say this is not, not bad or not immoral or not a problem.
00:36:33.560 What is the positive benefit of it other than getting off and feeling good for a minute?
00:36:37.800 Yeah. I mean, there, there, there isn't, I mean, there isn't one because I mean,
00:36:43.380 yeah, it only makes your life worse. Um, it only makes your life worse and it harms other people.
00:36:53.380 And I mean, and you got, you know, uh, you got 18 to 24 year olds struggling with ED because
00:37:01.040 they've, you know, they, they formulated a relationship with their hand in their iPhone
00:37:07.380 and then they are sitting in front of a real woman and the, the things that they seen, they,
00:37:13.160 that those things don't exist or, uh, a normal woman's not going to let you do them. And, uh,
00:37:19.740 you've developed these, these fetishes and, you know, it's like, well, I, I can't, uh, you know,
00:37:26.900 I can't maintain interaction or I can't be intimate with, uh, my spouse because they don't meet my
00:37:33.340 prerequisite, you know, my, my presuppositions regarding like what sex is supposed to be or
00:37:38.980 ought to be. And it's just crazy. Like people who believe purity is, you know, restraining
00:37:45.300 themselves from having sex with actual people, but they're addicted to pornography and they're
00:37:49.420 having, and then they get married because they think that if I get married that my porn addiction
00:37:53.840 will go away and I just actually need to have sex. And if I get married, I can have sex. And then
00:37:57.820 all of a sudden I'm in this broken marriage and I had this horrible sex life. And now I start,
00:38:02.880 you know, cheating on my spouse and I'm doing all this stuff and I'm still consuming pornography.
00:38:06.980 And my life is just a mess. And then we have kids and those, and then there's the, and they divorce
00:38:11.020 and my life is just a disaster. And now I've hurt, uh, you know, a woman and I have these kids that I
00:38:16.640 don't have this relationship with that I should. And like, that's not a one-time thing that I'm sharing
00:38:23.180 that's happening with a scary regularity. Yeah. I mean, I talk with hundreds, if not thousands
00:38:30.700 of men and also hear from women who the guys don't, they don't even want to have sex with
00:38:36.420 their spouses. And what, what a, what a tragic set of circumstances. You don't want to be physically
00:38:42.460 intimate. Forget about the feeling of, of just the physical feeling that comes from engaging in that,
00:38:48.740 but the, the connection, the emotional and mental connection between and solidify, uh,
00:38:56.020 solidifying the relationship between a husband and a wife, people who are committed to each other
00:39:00.720 through the act of sex that they're not even engaging with because it's easier just to go on
00:39:05.980 your, your phone and pull up your pornography of choice and get after it. Yeah. I mean, I think you,
00:39:12.560 you, you pointed to a really like the, the biggest problem is, is we are so disconnected
00:39:18.620 from reality that we don't understand what intimacy is. And when we are confronted with
00:39:24.000 real intimacy, we don't want, we don't know what to do because we have objectified people
00:39:30.800 and we've replaced, I mean, I'm not even talking about sex. I'm talking about like,
00:39:35.720 how do I be a friend? Like, how can I be a good friend to you? Um, how can I be a good coworker?
00:39:42.180 Like how, how can we do life together? And it's like, it, like reality, your reality is so warped
00:39:48.840 because if 90% of your interactions happen digitally, and then all of a sudden when you're in,
00:39:55.820 you know, face on face life with someone, you don't know what to say. You know, all, all you know,
00:40:02.220 is a small talk and, uh, whatever else. And all of a sudden you, you find yourself not knowing how to
00:40:09.240 connect or be intimate because you don't even know what intimacy is. Yeah. Yeah. It's a real danger
00:40:15.580 for people. You wrote a book called seven lies that will ruin your life. Uh, there's probably a lot
00:40:21.260 more than seven. How did you narrow it down? And what are a few of your favorites that you can,
00:40:28.440 you can touch on? Yeah, I think so. Like the chapter one, I think is the most like common lie
00:40:35.320 where it's this, um, false approval where, um, believing that I can, um, earn the approval of
00:40:43.460 other people through doing things where I hear good job, or I can find the approval in life from
00:40:52.100 obtaining enough things or becoming, um, enough. You know, if I become rich enough, if I become famous
00:40:58.820 enough, if enough people know my name, if I have a blue check mark by my name on social media, if I have
00:41:03.440 enough followers, if I have enough money, if I have the right car, um, just believing this westernized,
00:41:09.020 um, depiction of what success is, is going to bring me happiness. It just doesn't work. Um,
00:41:17.120 you know, the most miserable people in the world are the people that have the most things, um, because
00:41:22.640 it's, it's not what life is about. So that's, that's what chapter one is about. And for me, you know,
00:41:29.060 I, I found true satisfaction in the person of Jesus and we're coming up on Easter. I'm not sure
00:41:34.220 when this will be released, but you know, we're, we're, we're coming up on Easter, um, as we, as we
00:41:39.180 record this and just thinking about, man, um, you know, 2024 years ago, um, there's, uh, a man that
00:41:47.660 came into this world born of a virgin that lived a perfect life that faced the same temptations and
00:41:53.320 struggles that we do, but he didn't succumb to them. He was, he was perfect in every way. And he went to the
00:41:58.520 cross and he died on our behalf and he didn't stay dead. On the third day, he rose and he's seated on the
00:42:04.620 right hand of God and he's, uh, the King of the world and he's ruling and reigning. And if you put your
00:42:09.420 faith in him and your trust in him, uh, that is where we can find approval. And if we operate from the
00:42:16.340 fact that we are approved because of what Jesus has done on our behalf, not striving for something
00:42:23.320 that we think is going to make us feel a certain way, there is a foundation that's bigger than
00:42:27.260 ourselves. And if we, if we come to understand that our life is not about us, that's actually
00:42:33.040 the most freeing thing we could ever learn. Um, and then, uh, you know, the, the, I say,
00:42:39.420 Can I ask you a question on that before we move on? Sure. Yeah. So one thing I've wrestled with just
00:42:44.660 in faith alone is, you know, you hear that and I've, and I've, and I believe that I do. I believe
00:42:49.140 that at my core, that there's just intrinsic worth as a son of God. That's something I believe,
00:42:54.780 but also something I wrestle with is that if there's so many people, you know, billions,
00:43:01.420 billions and billions and billions of people, how is one person really all that important in
00:43:07.400 the grand scheme of things? And I'm talking about from a spiritual perspective, what's your take on
00:43:11.380 that? Yeah. When you say one person, do you mean Jesus? No, I mean me. Like how can one person,
00:43:17.780 yeah, not Jesus. Yes. How can me, one person or any guy listening to this feel like, Hey,
00:43:23.400 there's tens, if not hundreds of billions of people that, that have lived and will live.
00:43:29.980 Yeah. What's special about me? Yeah. Because what's special about you is so there's, uh,
00:43:35.040 there's 2.5 billion people on earth that say that they are a follower of Jesus. And there's 5.5
00:43:40.900 billion people on earth that say they're not. And what you have that no one else has is you have
00:43:47.540 relational equity with people in your circle. Um, you only, you live where you live only, you know,
00:43:54.300 um, the people that, you know, and you only have the, the, the certain, you know, personality, charisma,
00:44:01.900 um, gifts, talents. Like while we are, we are broadly called to be a follower of Jesus,
00:44:08.860 what that looks like for you on an individual basis is you, Ryan can, you know, if you, uh,
00:44:16.180 trust that only you can be you, uh, which is true, like just you are you, um, you have the ability
00:44:24.280 to speak into people's lives in your, in your circle, where you live, um, where you are in a way
00:44:31.960 that no one else does. So if our, you know, it's, it's like when people get saved, they get caught up
00:44:38.040 in, you know, second Corinthians 517, where it's like, you're, you're a new creation. The old is gone
00:44:41.960 and now you're new. Uh, if you keep reading, guess what? You're not only saved from something,
00:44:46.400 you're saved for something. And what you're saved for is to be an ambassador for Christ and to
00:44:50.740 understand what ambassadorship means is, well, uh, when people see me, they see Jesus. And if,
00:44:57.180 if I'm a carrier of this word of reconciliation, my very essence, my very purpose in life is the
00:45:04.760 person that I have the most equity with in my life. I now have a responsibility to share with them
00:45:10.460 that I know the antidote for death. So if I have the antidote for death, that it is my purpose in
00:45:20.020 life to share it with them. And there's people in your life that will listen to you that would never
00:45:25.240 listen to me. So I would say it is, uh, as simple as that is, it's the most important thing in the
00:45:32.060 world. Yeah, it's really powerful. Well, Josh, I want to be respectful of your time. I know you've got
00:45:37.080 a tight schedule. Um, can you let the guys know where to connect with you? And of course,
00:45:40.900 pick up a copy. The book's out right now. I think it came out earlier in March. Yeah. Yeah. It's been
00:45:44.440 out for, yeah. So it's been out for almost two weeks. Um, so yeah, so seven lies that'll ruin your
00:45:50.300 life. Uh, you can grab it at, um, Amazon, Barnes and Noble, books, a million target, Walmart, all those,
00:45:56.640 all those, uh, all those good places. But if you order it, Amazon helps your boy out the most because
00:46:02.640 of the, the list and all that good stuff. So, uh, order at Amazon. I think you'll actually get the
00:46:07.420 best price on Amazon, but because we did hard, hard cover only. So Christmas of next year, uh,
00:46:14.980 we'll do, uh, well, Christmas of this year, we'll do paperback. But so as of right now, hardback only.
00:46:19.700 So a little pricier than paperbacks, but you'll get the best price on, um, Amazon. And yeah, so if you,
00:46:27.040 if you want to follow me and just see some of the stuff that we're doing. So my website is
00:46:31.660 joshuabroom.me. Um, so there's an E on my last name. So joshuabroom.me is my website and my social
00:46:41.220 media across the board is I am Joshua Broom. Awesome. We'll sync everything up. Uh, you've got
00:46:47.920 a big, uh, exciting meeting. It sounds like this afternoon. So I wish you the best on that. And,
00:46:54.060 uh, we'll keep sharing, man. This is an important message and I love having you on. I'm excited that
00:46:58.420 you're sharing the message that you're putting your work out there. I'm sure you get,
00:47:01.660 you're more than your fair share of criticism with regards to what you're talking about,
00:47:05.920 but keep fighting the good fight. I appreciate you what you do. Yeah, man. I would love to do it.
00:47:10.080 I would love to do an, a men's event with you, man. I'd love to like me, me, you, and you know,
00:47:14.460 a few other people, uh, just get some men together and just call them out and call them up. And
00:47:19.520 because that's, that's the thing that changed my life. Like someone that loved me enough to meet me
00:47:23.760 where I was, but like speaking to my life, because I think, um, even, even in the space,
00:47:29.680 there's so many people that like love the rehabilitation space where they're like, okay,
00:47:34.560 you know, stop doing this, get out of this environment, do this, do this, do this. Okay.
00:47:39.900 And, but I think that the, the, the question that keeps me up at night is the, okay, what now?
00:47:47.280 I'm not watching porn anymore. You know, I'm not, I'm not in sex work anymore. I'm not addicted to
00:47:52.820 drugs anymore. I'm not doing this. I'm not living here. You know, I I'm doing it. I'm,
00:47:56.860 I've removed myself from the toxic environment and the toxic things and the toxic people. But all
00:48:02.920 of a sudden, um, you know, I'm, I'm now ready to take a step in the next direction. What is that
00:48:09.040 step? What do I do? You know, I mean, I think, uh, just holding people's hand and, um, sitting with
00:48:16.680 them and helping them take that first next step is so important because for me in my life,
00:48:23.520 I wanted to take my life because the things that mattered most to me, I thought I disqualified
00:48:29.380 myself from and the things that I was most passionate about, I didn't think I had access
00:48:34.260 to ever again. But all of a sudden, when someone sat with me and said, Hey, um, it might, it might
00:48:40.160 take a ton of work, but you can actually still obtain that thing that's on your heart. And then
00:48:46.960 they helped me take a next step. And all of a sudden, when I took that next step towards that
00:48:51.760 thing that I thought would never be impossible, what was birthed in me was hope. And I thought I was
00:48:58.160 hopeless and I would never have hope again. And when you give that person a taste of hope, when they
00:49:04.740 thought it had died, you will find the most relentless, dedicated person that you'll ever meet. And that's
00:49:12.120 the person that I want to partner with. And if we can set the world on fire with, uh, broken people
00:49:18.540 restored into, uh, a right standing with God and moving in the right direction for the right reason, um, that's
00:49:25.840 the way the world changes.
00:49:27.180 That's powerful. Well, we've got an event coming up in the fall that I haven't released details on. Uh, you and I
00:49:32.300 I'll talk offline about that. Cause I'd love to have you involved in some capacity so we can see what
00:49:36.420 we can do there. Sweet, man. All right, brother. Sounds good. Good luck with everything. Thank you.
00:49:41.320 Thank you so much.
00:49:43.920 There you go, gentlemen, my conversation with Joshua broom. He is obviously a repeat guest. Many of you
00:49:49.240 gave me a lot of good feedback when he first joined. And I hope that this conversation was
00:49:54.160 as powerful, if not more so than the first one that we had, please make sure to pick up a copy of his
00:50:00.140 book, seven lies that will ruin your life. Uh, check out M 42 adventures at M 42 adventures.com
00:50:07.120 and check out the store store.order of man.com. You've got a lot to do. Uh, in the meantime,
00:50:12.240 I would ask that you just take a screenshot, uh, of, of your phone or take a picture of the radio or
00:50:19.100 whatever you're listening to and just post it up very easy, very quick. Just post it up on Instagram,
00:50:24.240 Twitter, Facebook, and tag me, tag Joshua broom in there. I am Joshua broom. I'm at Ryan Mickler
00:50:30.660 and let people know what you're listening to and what you're enjoying and what you're finding value
00:50:34.380 in. I think that's how we spread this word. We're a grassroots movement. We've done very well and
00:50:39.200 we're going to continue to grow, but we need your help and support in doing that. So please post that
00:50:43.480 up guys. We'll be back tomorrow for our, ask me anything until then go out there, take action
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