Order of Man - MARK MATSON ｜ Is the American Dream Dead or Alive？

00:00:00.000 Many men believe the American dream is dead.

00:00:02.700 Just take a look at the upcoming presidential election

00:00:04.880 and you'll often hear how many will

00:00:06.760 in utter surrender and defeat say,

00:00:09.220 well, my vote doesn't count anyway, so why do it?

00:00:12.080 Or take a look at how many men will throw up their hands

00:00:14.720 and exclaim there's nothing they can do

00:00:16.740 about their marriage, the economy,

00:00:19.220 their job, or their circumstances.

00:00:21.640 And while there is much outside of our control,

00:00:24.160 there is still much within it.

00:00:26.200 My guest today, Mark Mattson, founder of Mattson Money,

00:00:28.400 is here to tell us why experiencing the American dream

00:00:31.600 is not out of reach for those

00:00:33.680 who may previously have thought so.

00:00:35.940 We talk about how to invest your time, money,

00:00:38.120 and energy wisely, an academic approach

00:00:40.600 to intelligent investing,

00:00:42.420 taking into consideration human brain science,

00:00:45.200 discovering a whole new way to see the world,

00:00:47.700 the forces standing between you and the American dream,

00:00:50.420 and most importantly, how to overcome them,

00:00:52.840 and the crucial importance of developing

00:00:54.760 what he calls your future view.

00:00:56.720 You're a man of action.

00:00:58.840 You live life to the fullest, embrace your fears,

00:01:01.460 and boldly chart your own path.

00:01:03.220 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time,

00:01:06.580 every time.

00:01:07.680 You are not easily deterred or defeated,

00:01:09.920 rugged, resilient, strong.

00:01:12.740 This is your life.

00:01:13.820 This is who you are.

00:01:15.260 This is who you will become.

00:01:16.960 At the end of the day, and after all is said and done,

00:01:20.000 you can call yourself a man.

00:01:22.440 Gentlemen, welcome to the Order of Man podcast.

00:01:24.600 My name is Ryan Michler.

00:01:25.600 You might hear a little bit of raspiness in my voice.

00:01:28.460 I hope I'm not losing my voice,

00:01:30.040 but something's going on here,

00:01:31.920 so we'll bear down and get through this one.

00:01:34.720 Really glad that you're tuning in today.

00:01:36.240 Got a really, really powerful conversation

00:01:38.240 with an early coach and mentor.

00:01:40.720 You guys often ask me,

00:01:41.800 who mentors me, who coaches me?

00:01:43.720 This is a man who coached me directly and indirectly

00:01:46.760 about 11, 12 years ago

00:01:48.300 when I had my financial planning practice,

00:01:49.940 so I'm really, really looking forward

00:01:52.220 to sharing his knowledge and information with you guys.

00:01:56.560 Before we do, just want to mention my friends

00:01:58.280 over at Montana Knife Company.

00:02:00.000 I've been talking about them for probably, gosh,

00:02:02.060 six months at this point,

00:02:03.540 and they are doing incredible, incredible things

00:02:06.220 in American manufacturing,

00:02:07.740 and specifically making knives.

00:02:10.060 Knives for the field,

00:02:11.440 knives for your everyday carry,

00:02:12.940 knives in the kitchen,

00:02:14.380 all things knives.

00:02:15.660 So if you need a new blade

00:02:16.940 and you want to have a tool

00:02:18.480 that I think every man ought to carry around on him,

00:02:20.860 then look no further than Montana Knife Company

00:02:23.500 and use the code ORDEROFMAN at checkout.

00:02:26.120 ORDEROFMAN, all one word,

00:02:27.280 at montananifecompany.com.

00:02:30.720 All right, guys, with that said,

00:02:31.980 let me get to my guest.

00:02:33.100 He is the founder of Mattson Money.

00:02:34.740 His name is Mark Mattson.

00:02:36.560 And as I said, he happens to be a very early coach

00:02:39.260 to me back in the days

00:02:40.640 of running my financial planning practice.

00:02:42.720 He's an American entrepreneur, an author,

00:02:45.660 he's also an innovator

00:02:47.040 in the fields of investing science

00:02:48.620 and financial education.

00:02:50.360 He's created educational experiences,

00:02:52.980 platforms, tools that make

00:02:54.700 Nobel Prize winning investment research

00:02:57.140 accessible to everyday investors like you and me.

00:03:00.840 Most notably, he's the creator

00:03:02.180 of the American Dream Experience

00:03:03.480 and the Mattson Method.

00:03:04.820 In fact, as of November, 2023,

00:03:06.780 and he did give me some new numbers

00:03:08.320 in our conversation,

00:03:10.380 his firm manages nearly 10 billion,

00:03:13.340 I believe he said 11 billion now

00:03:15.020 with over 35,000 investors

00:03:17.400 and more than 500 financial advisors.

00:03:20.480 He's a regular contributor

00:03:21.640 and commentator on CNBC, Bloomberg,

00:03:25.180 Yahoo Finance, Fox,

00:03:26.740 and he's in the Wall Street Journal,

00:03:28.260 Investment News.

00:03:29.140 He's all over the place

00:03:30.380 because of his knowledge and expertise

00:03:32.160 in the field of investing.

00:03:33.660 He's also the author of Main Street Money

00:03:35.280 and his newest and upcoming book,

00:03:37.480 Experiencing the American Dream.

00:03:39.880 Mark, great to see you.

00:03:42.780 We were talking before I hit record.

00:03:44.580 It's been over 10 years

00:03:46.120 since we had any sort of conversation.

00:03:48.580 Pretty wild.

00:03:49.900 It's been crazy.

00:03:50.760 Time flies for sure.

00:03:52.720 Yeah.

00:03:53.200 I remember when I came out

00:03:55.080 to your guys' place,

00:03:57.080 you guys were in Ohio though.

00:03:59.180 Before you were in Arizona,

00:04:01.380 I went out there and saw your offices

00:04:03.220 and that was actually a pivotal moment

00:04:04.760 for me in my financial planning practice.

00:04:06.360 A lot changed when I hired your firm

00:04:07.980 and had you as a coach.

00:04:10.140 So I have to thank you

00:04:10.680 first and foremost for that.

00:04:12.500 You're welcome.

00:04:13.320 My honor.

00:04:15.200 So you've got a new book out

00:04:17.240 and it's called

00:04:17.980 Experiencing the American Dream.

00:04:19.640 I really want to talk about this

00:04:21.280 because I think there's a lot of people,

00:04:23.700 especially during an election cycle,

00:04:25.240 who are so passive and concerned

00:04:28.560 about where America is headed

00:04:30.480 and what it looks like

00:04:31.540 that a lot of men,

00:04:32.620 at least in my experience,

00:04:33.640 kind of seem to throw up their hands

00:04:35.080 and assume there's not much

00:04:37.180 they can do about it.

00:04:38.060 So tell me a little bit

00:04:39.080 about your perception

00:04:39.840 of the American Dream

00:04:41.000 and where you think

00:04:41.660 that's heading for people.

00:04:43.440 Yeah, that's exactly,

00:04:44.520 you know, why I wrote the book.

00:04:46.840 I've done a lot of deep thinking

00:04:48.260 about the American Dream

00:04:49.240 over my life.

00:04:50.620 When I was a little boy,

00:04:52.740 my dad,

00:04:53.820 I was born in West Virginia

00:04:55.420 and my parents were raised there

00:04:57.580 and they got us out

00:04:59.940 out of West Virginia, Cincinnati.

00:05:01.940 Uh, and then every summer

00:05:04.360 we'd drive back to West Virginia

00:05:06.100 to visit relatives.

00:05:07.240 And when we went back there,

00:05:08.740 I'd see all the massive poverty

00:05:10.560 and you'd see the shacks

00:05:12.980 and you'd see, uh,

00:05:14.660 not just poverty,

00:05:15.520 but destitute poverty

00:05:16.880 with trash in the yards

00:05:18.300 and, you know, uh,

00:05:20.300 refrigerators thrown in the creeks.

00:05:22.480 And, you know,

00:05:23.140 so it's a beautiful land

00:05:24.420 and really people

00:05:25.400 with really great hearts.

00:05:26.640 So they, they take off the shirt

00:05:28.040 of their back to give it to you.

00:05:29.640 But it was like something,

00:05:31.400 some like invisible,

00:05:32.700 invisible force

00:05:33.740 was just keeping them stuck.

00:05:35.460 Uh, like they were in prison.

00:05:37.760 And my dad got us out of there

00:05:40.020 and started teaching me

00:05:41.100 the values of the American Dream.

00:05:43.120 Uh, the ideals of freedom,

00:05:44.580 the ideas of hard work,

00:05:45.720 the ideas of personal responsibility,

00:05:47.500 uh, the ideals that

00:05:49.500 no one owes you anything,

00:05:51.180 except that he didn't say anything.

00:05:52.480 He said the S word.

00:05:53.920 Uh, and he said,

00:05:54.780 you have to earn it yourself.

00:05:56.000 Uh, and don't ever expect anything

00:05:58.260 without, without you first

00:05:59.720 providing value to other people.

00:06:01.920 And my grandfather

00:06:03.080 was kind of the opposite.

00:06:05.320 He believed people were entitled.

00:06:07.120 He believed he was doomed.

00:06:08.840 He believed that he would never escape.

00:06:11.680 Um, and he and my father

00:06:13.860 always had a lot of conflict

00:06:15.040 through their life.

00:06:16.960 Uh, so my dad talked,

00:06:18.880 I asked him when I was

00:06:19.820 about 10 years old,

00:06:20.600 how did you get out of the poverty?

00:06:21.920 How did you go from destitute poverty

00:06:23.800 was so bad that rats

00:06:25.840 would come into the house

00:06:27.180 where their little shack

00:06:28.520 by the railroad that they lived in.

00:06:30.240 And he would cut off the tops

00:06:31.800 of instant carnation milk cans

00:06:33.340 and nail them to the bottom

00:06:34.540 of the baseboard.

00:06:35.900 So the rats couldn't get in.

00:06:37.800 Uh, and that's how,

00:06:38.920 how, I mean, there's a real poverty.

00:06:41.200 Uh, and he said, look,

00:06:43.420 it's all about asking

00:06:44.440 the right questions,

00:06:45.380 which to me at 10 years old

00:06:46.920 sounded like something

00:06:47.720 Yoda would say.

00:06:49.280 I'm like, well, what,

00:06:50.520 what does that mean?

00:06:51.780 He said, well, if I asked myself

00:06:53.940 why I was doomed

00:06:55.040 to live in destitute poverty

00:06:56.780 for the rest of my life,

00:06:57.980 like your grandpa,

00:07:00.000 my life would have turned out one way.

00:07:02.120 Instead, I asked myself,

00:07:03.440 how can I create value

00:07:04.800 and opportunity for other people

00:07:06.680 and lift myself out of this poverty

00:07:08.940 as so many other people

00:07:10.000 have done in their life?

00:07:11.560 Uh, so the question,

00:07:13.100 the key, you know,

00:07:13.760 the key question that drove him

00:07:15.140 to get out of there,

00:07:16.020 uh, and to create

00:07:17.160 the American dream for his family,

00:07:18.660 uh, uh, was something that,

00:07:20.780 that, that led me

00:07:22.080 to be an entrepreneur.

00:07:23.820 Um, and so I taught,

00:07:26.780 I taught to people

00:07:27.440 that the American dream

00:07:28.420 is not dead.

00:07:29.440 Yes, we have problems.

00:07:30.720 Yes, there's,

00:07:31.320 there's terrible conflict.

00:07:32.620 Yes, social media makes it worse.

00:07:34.720 Um, and there's definitely

00:07:36.480 Marxism and socialism

00:07:38.120 out there in the world

00:07:39.860 and in, in America, politics.

00:07:42.380 Uh, but the American dream

00:07:43.580 isn't dead.

00:07:44.140 And, and, and men,

00:07:45.620 men are going to need

00:07:46.480 to fight for it,

00:07:47.400 fight for their families,

00:07:48.400 uh, and fight to keep

00:07:49.980 the ideals of the American dream alive.

00:07:52.380 I, I want to talk about

00:07:53.740 what that fighting for it

00:07:54.900 looks like in practicality.

00:07:56.200 But before I do,

00:07:57.080 when you talk about your dad

00:07:58.420 having those,

00:07:59.080 that mindset of asking

00:08:00.440 the right questions,

00:08:01.360 which I think is an amazing,

00:08:02.700 uh, amazing mindset to have.

00:08:05.060 Where did he pick that up though?

00:08:06.500 Because clearly his father

00:08:07.840 didn't have that mindset.

00:08:09.120 He was probably surrounded

00:08:10.640 by other people,

00:08:11.600 uh, based on their current

00:08:13.300 circumstances that did not

00:08:14.580 have that mindset.

00:08:15.280 Was he just fortunate or

00:08:16.880 was he introduced to

00:08:18.760 some of these concepts

00:08:19.860 by a mentor or somebody

00:08:20.980 in his inner circle?

00:08:23.040 He, he, you know,

00:08:24.040 I, I, I, I, I,

00:08:25.300 I ponder this and I actually

00:08:27.040 asked him, I said,

00:08:28.980 how did you get that,

00:08:30.800 that, that view?

00:08:32.740 Yeah.

00:08:33.120 Right.

00:08:33.640 While everybody else was stuck.

00:08:35.340 I mean, it was so bad,

00:08:36.340 Ryan.

00:08:36.580 It was so bad.

00:08:37.620 My grandpa only came to

00:08:38.860 visit us one time in Cincinnati

00:08:40.240 and he, he visited us.

00:08:42.700 He, and we, we weren't rich.

00:08:43.980 We had like an 1800 square

00:08:45.720 foot home and it was been,

00:08:46.820 it was really well kept

00:08:48.200 and very beautiful.

00:08:49.500 And, uh, and he walked in

00:08:52.000 the house and he said,

00:08:53.080 how many people did you rip

00:08:54.600 off to get this house?

00:08:56.420 And my dad was like,

00:08:57.980 George, I'm an entrepreneur.

00:08:59.600 Mary Lou and I work really

00:09:00.860 hard for, you know,

00:09:02.060 protect for our boys and

00:09:03.600 provide for our family.

00:09:05.220 Uh, not everybody that has

00:09:06.640 money is a crook, you know,

00:09:08.340 small business people work

00:09:09.640 really hard to be of service.

00:09:11.560 And, um, he said, well,

00:09:12.980 I guess you're big shot.

00:09:14.720 And then he left, he got,

00:09:16.040 he stormed out of the house.

00:09:17.100 He never came back.

00:09:18.160 And three months later,

00:09:19.280 he died alone in his, uh,

00:09:20.720 in his small house and, uh,

00:09:22.780 in West Virginia.

00:09:23.560 Uh, so he really, he actually

00:09:26.080 died to keep his beliefs in,

00:09:28.200 in, uh, tact, uh, because he

00:09:31.460 would, and they offered him

00:09:32.600 raises when he worked at

00:09:34.020 Union Carbide, the chemical

00:09:35.200 company, but he wouldn't take

00:09:36.340 them because he said he didn't

00:09:37.560 want to work for the man.

00:09:38.840 Uh, and so how did my dad

00:09:41.980 get it?

00:09:42.780 I pondered that and I'm not

00:09:45.840 sure how he did it, but it

00:09:48.840 had a little bit to do.

00:09:50.220 It's not PC, but he actually

00:09:53.600 was angry and pissed off at his

00:09:58.580 situation.

00:09:59.140 He was really a little guy and

00:10:00.500 they had, um, uh, socks.

00:10:03.920 He only had one pair of shoes a

00:10:05.340 year.

00:10:05.560 So when he went to gym, he

00:10:06.580 had socks and the bigger boys

00:10:08.560 would get these big rubber

00:10:09.700 balls.

00:10:10.140 You remember we used to have

00:10:11.060 in gym class.

00:10:11.880 Oh yeah.

00:10:12.280 You could hear, hear those

00:10:13.780 things right now.

00:10:14.940 And they blew them up.

00:10:17.460 Uh, he would walk home with

00:10:19.240 the shame and anger of the

00:10:21.440 poverty and just, you know, uh,

00:10:24.440 made a solemn vow to himself

00:10:25.860 that he would escape.

00:10:27.120 So I don't know.

00:10:28.160 I don't really know why when

00:10:29.360 so many people, uh, are

00:10:32.940 crushed by that kind of soul

00:10:34.340 crushing poverty.

00:10:35.200 I think it's kind of taught

00:10:36.520 to them to stay in it.

00:10:38.400 Um, and then, and my father

00:10:40.340 escaped.

00:10:40.980 I think that, but my advice

00:10:43.700 for, for men is that you can

00:10:46.880 choose your screen.

00:10:48.360 You can see the screen.

00:10:50.840 We call them terministic

00:10:51.760 screens in the book of where

00:10:53.640 you are right now.

00:10:54.620 The questions you ask, the

00:10:55.740 way you see the world.

00:10:57.200 And then you can look at a

00:10:58.500 different screen and say,

00:11:00.380 which screen serves me

00:11:01.540 better.

00:11:01.940 And you can exchange one

00:11:04.160 screen or way of looking for

00:11:05.540 the, at the world for another

00:11:07.300 screen.

00:11:08.480 And based on those screens,

00:11:09.880 that's going to determine

00:11:10.720 what's possible for your life

00:11:12.060 and what actions you're going

00:11:12.960 to take.

00:11:13.840 Uh, they're invisible to

00:11:15.320 people, uh, and they think

00:11:17.200 they see the world, but they

00:11:18.260 don't really see the world.

00:11:19.260 They only allow them.

00:11:20.280 They're only able to see what

00:11:21.260 the screen allows them to see.

00:11:22.640 Um, yeah, that's an

00:11:25.100 interesting concept when you

00:11:27.580 are so adamant and so sure

00:11:30.280 about the way life is.

00:11:32.900 And then something is

00:11:34.240 introduced into your life,

00:11:35.600 some outside circumstance,

00:11:37.600 some tragic event, some new

00:11:39.860 knowledge or information that

00:11:41.340 gets you thinking.

00:11:42.380 And then for me, I've wondered

00:11:43.900 how long have I had it wrong

00:11:46.560 and how much have I missed?

00:11:48.940 How many opportunities have I

00:11:50.500 missed?

00:11:50.920 Because I see this one little

00:11:52.800 piece of my life that's

00:11:53.820 changed now.

00:11:55.580 I had, uh, you know, I

00:11:57.860 started my business.

00:11:59.160 Uh, I had, I had, I only had

00:12:01.660 three things.

00:12:02.500 I had a yellow pad and overhead

00:12:03.720 projector and $30,000 in debt.

00:12:06.100 And now we have $11 billion

00:12:07.880 and, uh, you know, 35,000

00:12:11.020 families all over the country.

00:12:12.500 And, uh, I've been very

00:12:14.280 blessed.

00:12:15.060 Uh, but I had a view of, uh,

00:12:18.120 actual, uh, a way of seeing

00:12:20.280 the world that you can't

00:12:22.100 trust employees.

00:12:23.260 They won't work hard.

00:12:25.200 Uh, I'm not a good manager.

00:12:27.740 Um, and that, uh, I might as

00:12:30.300 well just do things myself.

00:12:31.500 Well, I had to come to terms

00:12:34.380 with that was just a screen or

00:12:36.720 why'd I call a money demon

00:12:38.000 that actually prohibited me.

00:12:40.700 I was never going to be

00:12:41.380 successful.

00:12:41.840 I was never going to have a

00:12:42.700 company.

00:12:43.020 I'd never be able to spread the

00:12:44.860 news.

00:12:45.140 So I had to do violence.

00:12:46.760 You actually have to do

00:12:47.600 violence to the old belief.

00:12:49.400 You have to actually kill it

00:12:51.160 off.

00:12:52.480 Uh, and it couldn't be that

00:12:54.380 there are no good employees

00:12:55.760 because some companies have

00:12:56.740 10,000 people and it couldn't

00:12:58.900 be that I wasn't a good

00:13:00.680 manager.

00:13:01.100 I just had to have really

00:13:01.980 honest conversations with

00:13:03.180 people and have boundaries

00:13:04.980 and set, but help them set

00:13:06.120 goals.

00:13:07.080 So I had to drive a truck

00:13:09.320 through those two demon

00:13:10.620 beliefs, those mindsets, just

00:13:12.500 like George had my, my, uh,

00:13:14.420 grandfather about money.

00:13:17.080 Uh, and then after that I

00:13:18.900 was able to go out, I was

00:13:19.860 able to find great people.

00:13:21.020 I was able to train them.

00:13:22.240 I was able to hire them, you

00:13:23.880 know, and today we have, uh,

00:13:25.300 over 60 employees, uh, in

00:13:27.700 Cincinnati and, uh, Scottsdale.

00:13:31.760 Um, but it's easy once you,

00:13:33.780 once and my, but my biggest

00:13:36.220 one of all Ryan was I spent

00:13:37.680 most of my life not believing

00:13:39.920 in God.

00:13:40.540 Uh, and when I, when I went

00:13:43.020 through divorce and I was

00:13:44.480 feeling like a terrible father

00:13:46.240 and feeling like a failure

00:13:47.820 feeling like, uh, like my

00:13:50.200 whole life had just had just

00:13:51.600 led to destruction, me

00:13:53.520 trying to run my own life.

00:13:55.440 Uh, a friend of mine said,

00:13:57.260 well, are you ready?

00:13:58.180 And I said, ready for what?

00:13:59.160 He said, ready to stop trying

00:14:00.680 to run your own life.

00:14:02.260 And I said, yeah, I kind of

00:14:04.000 ran it into a brick wall.

00:14:05.420 It's not working very well.

00:14:07.340 It's not working.

00:14:08.640 Me being in control.

00:14:10.540 Uh, and I hit my knees and I

00:14:11.880 prayed my first honest prayer

00:14:13.120 for God to come into my life.

00:14:15.020 And, uh, that's, that's the

00:14:16.680 power of changing one screen

00:14:18.020 to another.

00:14:20.080 I, uh, was introduced to the

00:14:21.780 concept you briefly mentioned

00:14:23.060 a minute ago called money

00:14:24.200 demons by you about 11 or so

00:14:26.640 years ago.

00:14:27.340 And one of the exercises that

00:14:29.980 I'll never forget, we were

00:14:31.060 sitting in one of your

00:14:31.880 conference rooms and you said

00:14:33.940 something to the effect of

00:14:35.100 fill in the blank, rich people

00:14:36.880 are blank.

00:14:39.460 And so as you know, rich people

00:14:41.140 are greedy, rich people are

00:14:42.480 crooks, rich people are

00:14:43.580 assholes.

00:14:44.160 And there's just a plethora of

00:14:46.020 negativity around this word

00:14:47.960 rich.

00:14:48.820 And those are a pretty good

00:14:50.140 indicator that you've got some

00:14:51.300 demons that you need to work

00:14:52.260 through regarding.

00:14:53.360 Look, if you think rich people

00:14:55.000 are evil, then you're never

00:14:57.820 going to be rich because you

00:14:58.960 don't want to be an evil

00:14:59.780 person.

00:15:00.280 So you'll sabotage yourself

00:15:01.860 even subconsciously.

00:15:03.800 Right on.

00:15:05.120 Yeah.

00:15:05.800 Or even if, yeah, even if you

00:15:08.480 just think they're lucky, uh,

00:15:10.840 that, that their money was a

00:15:12.720 folk, just a function of they

00:15:14.160 were lucky.

00:15:15.180 Uh, then I'm not going to

00:15:16.280 really work hard to achieve it,

00:15:17.680 but you're absolutely right.

00:15:18.960 Man, if you, if you got it

00:15:20.160 like they're evil or they're

00:15:21.240 greedy or they're, uh,

00:15:23.000 mean to other people or

00:15:24.420 they're, you know, whatever

00:15:25.700 it is, you're right.

00:15:27.200 You'll never, you'll never

00:15:28.300 aspire to it and you never

00:15:29.500 create it.

00:15:30.300 And that is another form of a

00:15:31.800 money demon for sure.

00:15:33.600 What do you, what do you

00:15:34.940 think of the phrase, uh,

00:15:36.660 money isn't the most

00:15:38.280 important thing.

00:15:39.080 And, you know, clearly

00:15:40.860 that's the case.

00:15:41.740 There's some truth to that,

00:15:42.960 of course, but there's always

00:15:44.860 an underlying toxicity and

00:15:47.460 a negative connotation to a

00:15:49.080 phrase like that.

00:15:49.860 What are your, what are your

00:15:50.700 thoughts on that?

00:15:51.360 Yeah, that's a good one.

00:15:53.900 So money, money definitely

00:15:55.740 isn't everything.

00:15:57.020 Uh, in the book, I talk

00:15:58.700 about the idea that money

00:15:59.980 can't make you happy.

00:16:01.680 Uh, I've seen people with

00:16:03.300 tens of millions of dollars,

00:16:04.920 uh, you know, in the, uh,

00:16:07.980 in history, it's rife with

00:16:10.320 people like Elvis or Marilyn

00:16:11.720 Monroe or Howard Hughes,

00:16:12.940 people that had massive

00:16:14.340 amounts of money and fame,

00:16:16.000 uh, and it did them no good.

00:16:18.080 It actually made them more

00:16:19.120 miserable, uh, money, money

00:16:21.400 by itself can't make you

00:16:22.740 happy, no amount of money.

00:16:24.540 So the default position for

00:16:26.160 most people though is, is

00:16:27.600 gambling and speculating

00:16:28.700 with their money, trying to

00:16:30.100 get more and more and more

00:16:31.020 of it, but it never actually

00:16:32.560 bringing happiness or

00:16:33.620 fulfillment.

00:16:34.660 So in the book, I talk about

00:16:36.220 purpose and the idea that if

00:16:38.700 you have a purpose for your

00:16:39.860 money and for your life,

00:16:41.100 that's greater than money, uh,

00:16:43.700 then you can actually have a

00:16:45.180 compass and studies show

00:16:47.800 that people with the true

00:16:48.920 purpose, they wake up in the

00:16:50.000 morning and they have it in

00:16:51.100 their heart.

00:16:51.620 They live longer.

00:16:52.700 They have better relationships.

00:16:53.980 They're better fathers.

00:16:55.320 They're better parents.

00:16:56.480 Uh, they, they are healthier.

00:16:58.100 They take care of their

00:16:58.740 bodies better.

00:16:59.580 They re they respond to being

00:17:01.260 happier.

00:17:02.300 Uh, they didn't, they tend to

00:17:04.200 create more wealth.

00:17:05.380 Uh, but it's not for money's

00:17:07.280 sake.

00:17:07.560 It's from their purpose in

00:17:09.100 life.

00:17:09.980 Uh, so we talk a lot about

00:17:11.460 purpose and we talk a lot about

00:17:12.800 how to create a purpose, uh,

00:17:14.900 that drives you.

00:17:15.840 And the great thing about

00:17:16.600 purpose is if you have a

00:17:18.400 really strong purpose, then

00:17:19.640 almost any amount of money

00:17:20.800 will do.

00:17:21.720 So even if I'm extremely, even

00:17:23.480 if I'm at the poverty level,

00:17:24.620 like in my true purpose, let's

00:17:26.220 say what's love.

00:17:26.840 I can make a card and I can

00:17:28.280 take it to a friend.

00:17:29.580 I can sit within the hospital.

00:17:30.860 I can hold their hand.

00:17:32.740 Um, and I can express love for

00:17:35.040 people, uh, whether I have, you

00:17:37.980 know, a hundred dollars or a

00:17:39.260 hundred million.

00:17:40.520 So, so purpose really is the

00:17:42.420 key, uh, that allows you to

00:17:44.520 get out of the, and look,

00:17:46.840 we're all, all a little

00:17:48.160 greedy and we're all a little

00:17:49.280 selfish and we're all, it's

00:17:50.680 part of humanity.

00:17:52.160 Uh, and we all tend to gamble

00:17:53.820 and want to get rich quick.

00:17:55.480 Uh, but that's very

00:17:56.520 destructive.

00:17:57.040 And if you have a very

00:17:58.040 powerful purpose, it'll help

00:18:00.160 offset that.

00:18:01.780 Yeah.

00:18:02.220 It's, it's, it's a bit

00:18:03.400 ironic and a bit cruel also,

00:18:05.900 you know, that you have to

00:18:08.080 find that purpose.

00:18:08.860 I actually, when I was

00:18:10.200 introduced to that concept

00:18:11.580 by, by you and your team, I

00:18:14.200 actually didn't believe it.

00:18:16.140 I was like, I mean, a true

00:18:17.360 purpose, you know, I don't, I

00:18:19.520 can go out and I can be a

00:18:20.360 great financial advisor.

00:18:21.460 I can collect a lot of assets.

00:18:23.160 I can help people in a

00:18:24.540 positive way and I can make a

00:18:25.940 boatload of money doing it.

00:18:27.140 But, um, a mutual friend of

00:18:29.460 mine, Greg black, I don't know

00:18:31.320 if you know, yeah.

00:18:33.780 So he's the one who ended up

00:18:35.480 buying my practice, but he can

00:18:37.500 attest to this.

00:18:39.040 I knew I wasn't going to be in

00:18:40.660 this business forever.

00:18:41.920 I knew that.

00:18:43.580 And I was doing fairly well and

00:18:45.540 making ends meet.

00:18:47.220 But the minute I left and I

00:18:49.420 started doing this with order

00:18:50.880 of man, which more closely

00:18:52.460 aligns with my true purpose.

00:18:54.180 Yeah.

00:18:55.020 Ironically, I wasn't chasing

00:18:56.600 the money, but the money just

00:18:58.280 followed.

00:18:58.660 And I did significantly better

00:19:00.660 financially, not to mention

00:19:02.660 the value and the satisfaction

00:19:04.860 derived from it than I ever did

00:19:06.760 as a financial advisor.

00:19:08.920 That is so cool, dude.

00:19:10.680 I love that story.

00:19:12.180 Uh, I think for men, especially,

00:19:15.120 uh, I did an American dream

00:19:16.580 experience, uh, last week,

00:19:18.160 Thursday and Friday, uh, which

00:19:20.100 is a two day workshop about the

00:19:21.800 American dream and how to invest

00:19:23.160 for your purpose.

00:19:23.880 Um, I think men think purpose is

00:19:28.260 soft, like, well, you know, it's

00:19:31.380 touchy feely and it's, you know,

00:19:33.760 have a purpose and, you know, it's

00:19:36.460 not hard science.

00:19:38.120 It's, I want to see the numbers and

00:19:40.140 the math and to build the portfolio

00:19:41.860 and like that.

00:19:43.680 And I tell people in the, the class

00:19:46.440 that nothing could be further from

00:19:47.700 the truth.

00:19:48.180 Uh, anyone that's ever done anything

00:19:51.340 great in the world has had a

00:19:54.680 powerful purpose.

00:19:55.860 You know, whether that was Winston

00:19:57.320 Churchill or the Wright brothers or,

00:19:59.160 or Elon Musk or, you know, uh, Steve

00:20:03.020 Jobs, uh, and, and purpose people,

00:20:06.680 people, I was reading John, uh, to my

00:20:09.320 kids, uh, the gospel of John last, uh,

00:20:12.440 yesterday to my kids, you know, people

00:20:15.440 die for their purpose, people, you

00:20:18.880 know, Martin Luther King died for his

00:20:20.700 purpose.

00:20:21.620 There's nothing soft or touchy feely

00:20:23.920 about purpose.

00:20:24.920 And I think if we're talking about

00:20:26.780 masculinity, I don't think there's

00:20:28.060 anything more masculine than having a

00:20:30.240 purpose for you and your family and

00:20:32.740 your community and the world that

00:20:34.780 you're willing to go to fight for.

00:20:36.880 Um, it's, uh, and it's a noble, I

00:20:39.400 think, honorable and courageous thing

00:20:40.900 to do.

00:20:41.480 I think a lot of people don't want it

00:20:43.260 to have a purpose because they know

00:20:46.280 subconsciously, they know if I have a

00:20:48.980 purpose, I'm going to have to do

00:20:50.600 something about it.

00:20:51.960 I'm going to have to get an action.

00:20:54.020 I can't just sit here on the couch and

00:20:55.920 be soft.

00:20:56.740 I got to go up to out there in world

00:20:58.560 and be a warrior.

00:20:59.720 And I think that's why I

00:21:00.840 subconsciously, a lot of people don't

00:21:02.440 want to have one, but congratulations

00:21:04.480 on your podcast and putting your purpose

00:21:06.200 in action, bro.

00:21:06.940 It's so awesome.

00:21:08.280 Yeah, no, I really appreciate it.

00:21:09.580 And a lot of that came from the things

00:21:11.000 that I, I mean, obviously I'm still

00:21:12.220 talking about him here, 10, 11, 12

00:21:13.840 years later.

00:21:14.740 How do you suggest, I mean, I know

00:21:16.380 it's not a one-time exercise.

00:21:17.620 I know no one's going to walk away

00:21:19.740 from this podcast with a few ideas

00:21:21.340 and miraculously they're going to

00:21:23.040 find their purpose.

00:21:23.740 They're going to help a bunch of

00:21:24.760 people.

00:21:25.060 They're going to make great money

00:21:26.060 and all of their wildest dreams

00:21:27.320 are going to come true.

00:21:28.700 But how do you suggest a man who

00:21:30.800 agrees with you?

00:21:31.940 Hey, I do need a purpose.

00:21:33.900 Begin to develop and articulate what

00:21:36.120 his might be.

00:21:37.500 Yeah.

00:21:38.340 Well, as a same, a shameless self

00:21:40.300 promotion, you go to Amazon and grab

00:21:42.700 the book, uh, experiencing the

00:21:44.600 American dream.

00:21:45.460 I, there's actually seven different

00:21:47.320 strategies in there.

00:21:48.980 Uh, one of them is to create a

00:21:50.540 purpose for money.

00:21:51.960 Um, I, I think the thing about the

00:21:55.860 purpose and, and it's an, actually an

00:21:57.720 exercise.

00:21:58.120 It takes about an hour to go through.

00:22:00.160 Uh, once you have your purpose, then

00:22:03.120 you have to be willing to look at your

00:22:04.520 life and then you have to eliminate

00:22:07.000 those things that are not in alignment

00:22:08.860 with your purpose and then to start

00:22:12.140 doing more things that actually align

00:22:14.120 with your purpose.

00:22:15.800 Um, and so, you know, my true purpose is

00:22:19.140 to help save the American dream and

00:22:21.040 help people discover their purpose.

00:22:23.640 Um, and the magic thing about that, when

00:22:26.840 you really go in through and start to

00:22:28.700 apply it, it's not that hard because

00:22:31.600 subconsciously it's probably already in

00:22:33.200 there.

00:22:33.340 Um, you just have to flesh it out and

00:22:36.100 brainstorm or write some stuff down.

00:22:37.720 And there's a process to doing it.

00:22:40.640 Um, and then once you have it, then you

00:22:43.460 can start aligning the rest of the

00:22:45.200 strategies around it.

00:22:46.860 Um, and the, the American dream itself

00:22:51.300 is a screen.

00:22:53.480 It's like the, it's a way that I see the

00:22:55.600 world.

00:22:56.920 And if I didn't see the world, the way it

00:22:59.260 is a screen allows you to do things other

00:23:02.040 people wouldn't do and eliminate things

00:23:04.800 that other people wouldn't eliminate.

00:23:06.460 So having that screen of the American

00:23:08.500 dream versus the opposite, which is

00:23:12.820 victimhood and entitlement, uh, that's

00:23:17.040 the complete, uh, opposite realm and the

00:23:21.720 purpose and the belief in the American

00:23:23.660 dream and taking care of your family and

00:23:25.500 working hard, I think is the part of the

00:23:28.000 foundation of being a man, uh, a real man

00:23:30.920 and taking care of your family.

00:23:34.220 Gentlemen, let me, uh, step back from the

00:23:36.100 conversation very quickly.

00:23:37.580 We're talking about the American dream.

00:23:39.440 Uh, no one experiences or expects to

00:23:42.200 experience, I should say a divorce and a

00:23:45.000 divorce can have a real impact on your

00:23:47.520 pursuit of your American dream.

00:23:49.480 It's one of the darkest times a man can

00:23:51.720 ever face, but it really doesn't have to

00:23:53.860 be that way.

00:23:54.420 Or at least that darkness does not have to

00:23:56.900 last as long as it does for so many.

00:23:59.060 But unless you have a way to navigate the

00:24:01.600 early stages of divorce in an efficient

00:24:03.340 way, a man can easily find himself

00:24:06.020 drowning in a sea of sorrow and shame,

00:24:08.940 isolation, and even financial ruin.

00:24:11.620 That's why we've decided to create the

00:24:13.100 course Divorce Not Death to help those

00:24:15.200 men going through the first 12 months of

00:24:17.900 this very challenging time.

00:24:19.240 Now we launched the course in October,

00:24:21.140 but you can get signed up right now to

00:24:23.660 start receiving notifications and resources

00:24:25.540 from experts in the field of law, finance,

00:24:29.220 physical fitness, mental health, and even

00:24:31.280 dating.

00:24:32.040 So regardless of where you are in your

00:24:34.380 process, we will get you everything you

00:24:36.680 need to overcome the challenges and hurdles

00:24:39.340 you've found yourself confronting.

00:24:41.820 To learn more and to get signed up for

00:24:43.360 those notifications and when we go live in

00:24:45.080 October, head to DivorceNotDeath.com.

00:24:48.020 That's DivorceNotDeath.com.

00:24:50.760 Do that after the show.

00:24:51.960 For now, I'll get back to it with Mark.

00:24:53.360 I think in my experience, what I've seen a

00:24:56.680 lot of guys do when they start thinking

00:24:58.300 about something that maybe even just fires

00:25:00.420 them up a little bit, is they'll begin to

00:25:03.380 disqualify it.

00:25:04.740 You know, they'll say, hey, I'd really like

00:25:06.200 to pursue this hobby.

00:25:09.000 And they'll say, ah, but I'm busy.

00:25:10.660 Ah, but it's expensive.

00:25:11.880 Oh, but I'm tired.

00:25:12.900 Oh, but I have responsibility.

00:25:14.840 And they do that with every little thing that

00:25:16.800 could possibly mean something significant in

00:25:19.140 their lives.

00:25:20.200 And a lot of times I've also found that

00:25:21.820 your purpose isn't going to, you know,

00:25:24.080 the clouds aren't going to part.

00:25:25.380 The angels aren't going to sing with their

00:25:26.680 trumpets from on high and say, this is what

00:25:29.040 you're meant to do.

00:25:30.400 There'll be subtle signs that you have to

00:25:32.660 follow before.

00:25:34.180 And I, and I'm, I'm a believer as well,

00:25:36.220 but there'll be subtle signs that you have

00:25:38.040 to follow to test your faith before you're

00:25:40.880 given something a little bit bigger and a

00:25:43.240 little bit bigger and a little bit bigger.

00:25:44.760 And you do that enough over five years,

00:25:47.280 10 years, 20 years.

00:25:48.560 Because it's your life's unrecognizable.

00:25:51.960 For sure.

00:25:52.900 I think that if you ask yourself, when you're

00:25:54.880 thinking about purpose, if I lived my life like

00:25:58.760 this, with this purpose, would I be inspired by

00:26:03.020 my own life?

00:26:05.020 If I live my life like this, would I be

00:26:08.020 inspired by my own life?

00:26:10.440 If I took the actions and had the views, uh,

00:26:14.120 based on this purpose, would I be inspired?

00:26:17.420 And then the other thing to know is that, look,

00:26:20.300 when, when you define it, uh, it won't be just

00:26:24.460 like a walk in the park and soft.

00:26:27.260 It'll be like, people will come, come at you.

00:26:30.960 There, there will be people who don't want you

00:26:32.940 to be strong.

00:26:33.620 There are people that don't want you to fulfill

00:26:35.300 on your purpose.

00:26:36.020 There are people, and that's a, that's a good

00:26:38.280 sign that you actually have a good purpose.

00:26:39.940 Uh, um, if it, the, the fact that you have

00:26:44.340 detractors or people that might, um, you know,

00:26:47.680 especially on social media and such, uh, people

00:26:50.420 that come after you, uh, that's probably a good

00:26:53.140 sign that you're heading in the right direction.

00:26:55.560 Yeah, it is.

00:26:56.460 It is pretty tell.

00:26:58.280 And also the other thing I think it's important

00:27:00.360 to know is no one's going to believe in you when

00:27:03.700 you start doing these things.

00:27:04.960 And if I was in their shoes, I wouldn't either.

00:27:08.840 And I think a lot of guys are just waiting for

00:27:11.360 validation or approval or, uh, a little bit of

00:27:15.320 support.

00:27:16.020 I just don't think you're going to get it.

00:27:17.720 At least when you start, you might from your mom

00:27:20.060 or from your wife, but you're not going to get

00:27:22.160 the kind of support that you think you want before

00:27:24.320 you can pursue these, these endeavors.

00:27:28.080 Yeah.

00:27:28.460 When, when you, when you pursue them, um, my dad

00:27:32.320 always used to say, most people support your

00:27:35.260 success in theory only, uh, human nature is

00:27:41.420 rife with jealousy.

00:27:43.240 Uh, I've seen more business deals go bad over

00:27:45.860 jealousy and resentment, uh, than I have anything.

00:27:49.280 Uh, it's a killer for businesses and for

00:27:51.780 partnerships and for, um, any kind of endeavor

00:27:54.900 for that matter.

00:27:55.640 Uh, the human condition, uh, of jealousy can

00:27:58.820 really rip things apart.

00:27:59.960 Uh, and the more successful you get, uh, the

00:28:03.920 more you'd have to have to tend to deal with

00:28:06.120 that.

00:28:06.960 Uh, but, but not to let it back you down

00:28:09.820 because it will, it will show up for sure.

00:28:14.380 You spend a good amount of time in the book.

00:28:16.720 And I've also heard you talk about the things

00:28:18.520 that stand in the way of your American dream.

00:28:20.960 Can you share with us what some of those things

00:28:23.020 are?

00:28:23.320 Because obviously as you set out on this path,

00:28:26.880 you're going to run into obstacles and knowing

00:28:28.820 what they might be will help you address those

00:28:30.780 as they come up and maybe even squash them

00:28:32.860 before they do.

00:28:34.540 Yeah, that's a good point.

00:28:35.940 Uh, I, I, I think for the American dream,

00:28:41.040 the first thing to get straight about the

00:28:43.780 American dream is what the ideals of the

00:28:45.720 American dream are.

00:28:46.660 And then have those become part of your screen

00:28:49.780 of how you see the world.

00:28:51.480 So this, the American dream, number one,

00:28:53.920 that takes freedom.

00:28:55.340 I have to have freedom of thought.

00:28:56.940 I have to have freedom of, uh, religion.

00:28:59.460 I have to have freedom of communication, speech,

00:29:02.620 um, freedom to own property because you might

00:29:07.120 be an entrepreneur or you might own your own

00:29:09.320 house.

00:29:10.280 Uh, you're going to, you're going to own

00:29:12.120 something and then also then the rule of law

00:29:16.360 to protect your ownership and to protect your

00:29:19.240 rights, uh, and to value and be appreciative

00:29:22.520 for the brave men and women that have died for

00:29:24.580 your freedoms, uh, and, and to be a part of

00:29:27.580 this great country.

00:29:29.140 Um, I always tell people you can either create

00:29:31.480 or you can complain and it's a lot easier to

00:29:34.560 complain than it is, than it is to build

00:29:37.520 something up.

00:29:38.200 Uh, and then, then if you have those ideals

00:29:41.940 and then I tell people, don't be afraid to

00:29:46.860 start at the bottom.

00:29:48.700 Uh, everybody wants to go, go, you know, get

00:29:51.420 a degree, you know, get $200,000 in debt and

00:29:54.020 then stop, start as the CEO of a company.

00:29:56.420 That's not what I was taught.

00:29:57.940 I was taught if you have to start at the bottom,

00:30:01.160 uh, even if you have to work for free as an

00:30:03.560 intern, uh, I worked a lot of places free

00:30:06.120 before I started this company.

00:30:08.200 Um, especially summer jobs and things like

00:30:10.960 that, but hard work.

00:30:13.680 I mean, I, my first job was a carpet cleaner.

00:30:17.160 I'm in fact, I moved the, I moved the

00:30:19.380 furniture for the guy that cleaned the

00:30:21.080 carpet, uh, you know, 95% humidity, 95

00:30:24.460 degree temperature.

00:30:26.240 You know, I cleaned dog kennels.

00:30:28.860 Uh, you know, I, I mean, it was, it was

00:30:31.180 some rough, rough and taught me.

00:30:32.900 I didn't want to do that for a living.

00:30:34.160 Um, and that, that, that, but that hard

00:30:36.520 work, hard work builds a man up.

00:30:42.220 Uh, it's, you feel good about it.

00:30:44.240 You can feel it lifts your self-esteem.

00:30:46.680 It's a matter of fulfillment.

00:30:48.440 You can look at a job well done.

00:30:50.440 And then people around you and companies

00:30:52.520 aren't always going to be looking for the

00:30:53.740 hardest working person because the hardest

00:30:55.840 working person is going to get raises.

00:30:57.320 They're going to get opportunities.

00:30:58.300 They're going to get additional training.

00:30:59.700 They're going to get elevated, uh, or

00:31:02.160 eventually own their own company.

00:31:04.040 Um, so that idea of hard work and grit, uh,

00:31:08.220 is part of it.

00:31:09.780 Um, and never, ever being entitled and

00:31:13.880 never, ever playing the martyr or the

00:31:17.220 victim, um, and finding other people

00:31:21.180 like, like you talk about in, in order of

00:31:24.000 a man, uh, finding other people that are

00:31:26.880 like-minded that share a similar purpose.

00:31:29.700 That can support each other.

00:31:31.820 Uh, uh, Napoleon Hill called it a

00:31:34.660 mastermind.

00:31:35.720 Right.

00:31:36.380 And I started reading that when I was 10

00:31:38.460 years old, my dad gave me, uh, but

00:31:40.340 having a good mastermind around you,

00:31:42.020 people are like-minded that want to

00:31:43.540 achieve similar things.

00:31:44.580 I think it's crucial for you to fight

00:31:46.620 for the American dream.

00:31:49.140 When did you start, uh, Matts and

00:31:51.340 Money?

00:31:51.640 What, what year was that?

00:31:53.380 I started Matts and Money in 1991.

00:31:56.420 Okay.

00:31:56.860 Uh, I had 34 years now and, um, headed

00:32:01.860 into that and it was a result of just

00:32:04.620 watching how dirty and nasty the

00:32:06.420 financial industry was being a financial

00:32:08.260 planner, you know, being people doing

00:32:12.440 stock picking and market timing and track

00:32:14.200 record investing and just a lot of pain

00:32:16.700 and suffering and, and going to broker

00:32:19.100 dealer conventions and hearing all the

00:32:21.580 sales pitches and hearing them program

00:32:23.400 everybody and brainwashed everybody.

00:32:25.180 And, uh, it's a very dirty industry.

00:32:27.920 And quite frankly, you know, uh, Ryan

00:32:31.280 many years ago, probably when I mean, but

00:32:32.800 I thought that this, that it would get

00:32:34.720 figured out that people would study

00:32:37.300 academics, study the research, stop

00:32:39.640 speculating and gambling, but it's worse

00:32:42.360 now than it's ever been.

00:32:43.720 It's more stock picking, more gambling,

00:32:45.760 and then more exotic things, you know,

00:32:48.740 Bitcoin and, uh, ETFs that no one should

00:32:51.800 own cause they're just so speculative and

00:32:53.600 destructive.

00:32:54.060 And, and then of course you got Robin

00:32:56.580 hood in your pocket right next to

00:32:57.960 draft Kings.

00:32:58.540 It's, it's really a disgusting industry

00:33:00.780 right now.

00:33:01.280 And it's just ripe with destruction.

00:33:03.920 That's interesting.

00:33:04.660 I never thought about that Robin hood

00:33:06.220 right next to draft Kings.

00:33:07.400 I mean, that makes sense.

00:33:08.360 It's got the same software.

00:33:09.760 It's using the same technology.

00:33:11.380 It's designed to get you in there and

00:33:13.660 get you addicted.

00:33:14.680 Uh, I've heard it said never mistake

00:33:17.240 action for prudence, but that's what

00:33:19.040 you see a lot in investing is people

00:33:20.720 think, oh, well I'm doing something.

00:33:22.800 So I'm being prudent.

00:33:23.740 You're actually doing the opposite.

00:33:25.680 Probably if you look at the actual

00:33:27.020 data, uh, and research as well as you

00:33:29.400 have behind it.

00:33:31.160 Well, there's, yeah, that's exactly

00:33:32.460 right.

00:33:32.820 People, when they're trading, they feel

00:33:35.080 like they're in control.

00:33:37.240 Uh, but there's some things, the more

00:33:38.840 activity you do, the more out of

00:33:40.420 control, the more drink you drink, the

00:33:42.060 more out of control you become, the

00:33:43.860 more you go to Vegas and pull that slot

00:33:46.120 or hit that button on the slot machine

00:33:47.660 or play blackjack, the more activity, the

00:33:50.380 more out of control.

00:33:51.480 So there's a lot of behaviors in life

00:33:53.580 that, you know, the more I sit down and

00:33:55.840 eat my, you know, third, you know, plate

00:33:58.500 of food, uh, the more out of control I

00:34:01.040 am.

00:34:01.180 I am.

00:34:01.640 Right.

00:34:02.320 So, uh, some activities are destructive.

00:34:06.200 They might feel like you're in control at

00:34:07.900 the time, but you're really not.

00:34:09.700 Well, I want to get into a little bit more

00:34:11.560 investing, but before I do, the reason I

00:34:13.460 asked you when you started mats and money

00:34:14.960 is because, you know, someone might hear

00:34:17.160 what you said earlier about $11 billion

00:34:19.180 of assets under management, 35,000

00:34:22.120 families you're serving.

00:34:23.780 Uh, I think I may have read that you have,

00:34:25.740 uh, upwards of 500 advisors that you're

00:34:29.000 working with 60 employees, two separate

00:34:31.360 offices across the country.

00:34:33.340 And people are thinking, oh man, this

00:34:35.120 guy's got it figured out.

00:34:36.160 Well, I hope you've been doing it for

00:34:37.980 34 years.

00:34:39.600 And that's the story that most men don't

00:34:42.160 hear.

00:34:43.040 Same with me to a lesser degree.

00:34:44.560 After 10 years, they think, oh man, look

00:34:46.420 at this incredible podcast.

00:34:47.660 Yeah, it's pretty good right now.

00:34:50.020 But 11 years ago, when I made that bold

00:34:51.900 decision to sell my practice to Greg and

00:34:54.240 do this and not make any money doing it, it

00:34:57.080 was a completely different story.

00:34:59.440 Oh, dude.

00:35:00.520 Talk about courage and purpose and, uh, and,

00:35:04.580 and entrepreneurism.

00:35:06.680 Yeah.

00:35:07.280 I mean, nobody thought it was in, in

00:35:10.840 retrospect, it looks, oh yeah, of course

00:35:12.720 that worked.

00:35:13.180 No, in retrospect, you know, there was

00:35:16.720 no evidence, none, zero evidence that

00:35:19.160 this business model would work because

00:35:21.180 there was no business model at the time

00:35:23.080 like it.

00:35:24.140 Um, to the idea that you could actually

00:35:26.580 educate people about academic investing

00:35:28.900 principles and then help them stay

00:35:30.940 disciplined through a lifetime and then

00:35:33.180 coach advisors to be coaches.

00:35:34.800 And, uh, there was no evidence for that

00:35:37.800 zero.

00:35:39.000 It was a brand new field.

00:35:41.160 Uh, and it, there were so many times

00:35:45.400 where as an entrepreneur, you can abandon

00:35:48.600 your core values and chase, you know, the

00:35:51.220 little shiny thing out there, uh, that

00:35:54.360 looks good.

00:35:55.000 That can make three theoretically can make

00:35:57.260 you rich overnight.

00:35:57.960 And I, it's just not my experience.

00:36:01.000 My experience is, it's just hard work.

00:36:03.120 It's hard work.

00:36:04.180 It's long hours.

00:36:05.020 It's taking risks.

00:36:06.620 Uh, it's, it's putting your whole heart

00:36:08.600 and soul into it.

00:36:09.740 It's never backing down on what you

00:36:11.720 believe and, and what you're going to

00:36:13.420 create, uh, to be an entrepreneur takes

00:36:16.220 amazing amount of discipline, uh, and an

00:36:20.200 amazing amount of consistency, you know,

00:36:23.320 like lifting it, like working out at the

00:36:25.040 gym.

00:36:25.260 Uh, you're not going to get ripped in a

00:36:27.260 week.

00:36:27.560 It's not going to happen.

00:36:29.100 Uh, and so it takes persistency over

00:36:32.600 time towards your values and, and more

00:36:36.140 than anything else, how am I going to

00:36:38.720 create value for other people?

00:36:40.200 I always, as an entrepreneur have to be

00:36:42.560 focused on the user of the services or

00:36:45.580 products and how I can create value for

00:36:48.200 them.

00:36:49.120 That's unimaginable.

00:36:50.780 This is the, the, in business school,

00:36:53.400 they say, you know, find a need in me.

00:36:55.260 Well, that's not how it really works.

00:36:57.200 What you do is you imagine something

00:36:59.400 people can't even imagine need it.

00:37:02.120 And then you create something that, that

00:37:04.980 transforms their life.

00:37:06.920 And that's a much bigger deal because you

00:37:10.040 have to use your imagination and courage.

00:37:12.880 Uh, when Walt Disney created, I mean, he

00:37:15.140 created a lot of amazing things.

00:37:16.840 And when he finally came up with Disneyland,

00:37:19.020 uh, his wife and his business partners were

00:37:22.440 like, dude, you just, you've gone too far

00:37:24.760 now.

00:37:25.120 No, this is insane.

00:37:26.140 What, what you're doing now is it never,

00:37:27.820 never go to work.

00:37:29.320 And I remember when Steve jobs came out with

00:37:31.200 a smart phone.

00:37:31.880 I'm like, yeah, no, nobody needs that.

00:37:34.300 I'm like, I got a flip phone.

00:37:36.020 I, I'm fine.

00:37:37.100 I don't remember similar thoughts myself.

00:37:39.900 I don't know.

00:37:40.840 I got, you know, my family has probably five

00:37:43.240 of them.

00:37:43.800 Um, my immediate family.

00:37:46.680 So, but it takes guts and courage to, to

00:37:49.320 do it and hard work and perseverance.

00:37:52.200 Where did the, uh, the belief that you had,

00:37:54.520 especially in those early days come from?

00:37:56.200 Um, I think now you can probably build upon

00:37:58.640 the wins that you've had.

00:38:00.020 And even though I'm sure there's times that

00:38:02.480 the business goes South for whatever reason,

00:38:04.700 you can lean on your confidence and your

00:38:09.020 ability to have this type of, of company.

00:38:12.040 But where did that come from when you started

00:38:14.160 when that didn't exist?

00:38:17.240 I think, I think I was just, I was 27 years

00:38:20.520 old when I started the company.

00:38:21.920 I'm, I'm 60 now.

00:38:23.760 Uh, I think I was just kind of probably a

00:38:25.820 little arrogant.

00:38:27.460 Uh, if I, if I'd known how hard it was

00:38:30.640 going to be, I don't know.

00:38:32.100 Uh, I hope I do it over.

00:38:34.260 Uh, but I was stubborn and I, and I, like

00:38:37.220 my dad and his, his, um, I think you can

00:38:41.020 use your emotions, even ones that seem

00:38:43.240 bad.

00:38:43.640 I, I was very angry when I found out that

00:38:46.820 people were getting hurt and, and, and I

00:38:49.920 was, and I hurt in my soul that I had

00:38:52.900 fallen for the, the lies that the broker

00:38:55.540 dealer had told me that I had worked out

00:38:57.240 at the time.

00:38:58.360 And then I eventually discovered that I

00:39:01.280 was speculating and gambling with my

00:39:03.200 client's money under the advice of my

00:39:05.120 broker dealer.

00:39:06.600 And when I, and I, I knew it wasn't

00:39:08.640 working, but then I saw the science,

00:39:11.560 efficient market theory, three factor

00:39:13.100 model, uh, uh, modern portfolio theory,

00:39:16.320 these academic theories that had won Nobel

00:39:18.380 prizes.

00:39:18.880 And I saw that and I was just disgusted

00:39:22.920 with myself, uh, angry with the industry,

00:39:27.140 uh, and on a, um, a mission to, to right

00:39:33.040 the wrongs, uh, that this evil industry had,

00:39:36.680 had, uh, foisted on the American public.

00:39:39.160 And at the time, my goal was to revolutionize

00:39:43.100 the industry, the whole industry, uh, as

00:39:48.300 a 60 year old, I can tell you that's

00:39:49.720 never going to happen because you're not

00:39:51.940 going to get Morgan Stanley to change.

00:39:53.520 You're not going to get Wells Fargo to

00:39:54.780 change.

00:39:55.060 You're not going to get bank of America

00:39:56.220 to change.

00:39:57.040 You're not going to get these people to

00:39:58.280 stop speculating and gambling for people's

00:40:00.240 money.

00:40:01.400 Uh, because it's just too profitable.

00:40:03.660 That'd be like trying to look at it for

00:40:05.280 them.

00:40:05.820 Yeah.

00:40:06.240 You're not going to erase Vegas.

00:40:07.540 That's not going to happen.

00:40:09.360 Uh, so my goal now is to save as many

00:40:13.060 people as I can, you know, everybody,

00:40:15.920 yeah, everybody needs it to prudently

00:40:18.540 invest for their dreams.

00:40:20.280 Uh, but some people, but my goal is to

00:40:22.580 help the advisors and the clients that

00:40:24.340 want it, that want to have a purpose in

00:40:26.700 life, that don't want to speculate and

00:40:28.120 gamble, that want to use academic

00:40:29.480 investing principles that want to focus

00:40:31.960 on, you know, for men, this is for men.

00:40:35.120 I mean, look, it's tough in our society.

00:40:38.720 Men are, men are berated a lot of times.

00:40:41.420 Masculinity is criticized.

00:40:42.860 Toxic masculinity, uh, it's called.

00:40:45.700 So look, fighting for your family, being

00:40:48.420 there for your wife, taking care of your

00:40:50.120 children, working hard, teaching them

00:40:52.440 values, uh, while the, while the rest of

00:40:55.580 society is trying to tear down many of the

00:40:57.720 values that you're trying to teach.

00:41:00.240 Uh, this is, this is like spiritual warfare

00:41:02.900 and it's, it's a huge battle for a man, uh,

00:41:07.280 working hard to take care of their family.

00:41:09.960 Um, and I think having the American dream

00:41:12.980 and having those values firmly in place

00:41:15.040 and willing to fight for them, whether it's

00:41:17.320 creating a business or, you know, working

00:41:19.840 hard as a mechanic, uh, the commonality is, is

00:41:25.820 taking care of your family and being there

00:41:27.460 for them.

00:41:27.900 Mark, you've said, you know, you've got to

00:41:31.240 fight for these things quite a few times

00:41:32.720 throughout our conversation.

00:41:33.700 And I, and I said, I'd come back to that

00:41:35.440 from our earlier, uh, discussion about what

00:41:38.380 does that look like in practicality?

00:41:39.960 I think you said one, start a business.

00:41:41.700 I'm not sure many people would consider that

00:41:43.780 fighting.

00:41:44.680 I do.

00:41:45.240 I believe it is because you're creating

00:41:48.060 important products and services.

00:41:50.040 You're employing people, you're building

00:41:52.900 wealth, you're contributing to the tax base.

00:41:55.540 Like there's a lot that goes on that, that

00:41:57.720 I consider fighting when you grow a

00:41:59.680 business.

00:41:59.980 Are there other things that men can do

00:42:01.480 from where you sit to fight for these

00:42:03.980 beliefs, fight for their families and fight

00:42:05.680 for the values that this country has

00:42:07.160 historically espoused?

00:42:09.780 Yeah.

00:42:10.680 Um, you know, one thing politicians, when

00:42:13.320 they say, you know, I created this many

00:42:15.240 jobs, most politicians have never signed a

00:42:17.700 paycheck in their life.

00:42:19.360 Uh, politicians don't create jobs, uh,

00:42:22.440 entrepreneurs and innovators create jobs.

00:42:24.560 Uh, there are, uh, approximately 9 million

00:42:28.840 jobs that are unclaimed right now.

00:42:32.420 Uh, unemployment sets at about three, three

00:42:35.300 and a half percent right now.

00:42:36.880 Uh, the problem is not unemployment.

00:42:40.000 The problem is the participation rate.

00:42:42.480 There's not enough people willing to work.

00:42:45.000 You know, you've got 30 year old men in

00:42:47.140 mom's basement playing, you know, playing

00:42:49.940 video games and eating chips.

00:42:51.740 I mean, this, this, this can't work.

00:42:53.600 It's not sustainable.

00:42:55.220 People have to go to work and, and either

00:42:57.220 whether or not you go to work for somebody

00:42:58.960 else, I, I call it the entrepreneurial

00:43:02.700 spirit, whether I go out and I create my

00:43:05.600 own business, which I think is very

00:43:07.060 admirable.

00:43:08.680 45% of all employees don't work for large

00:43:11.940 fortune 500 companies.

00:43:13.040 They work for small businesses, uh, whether

00:43:15.920 or not I create the business or I work in

00:43:18.380 the business, but I think entrepreneurially

00:43:20.560 meaning that I'm asking what value can I

00:43:23.320 create for this company?

00:43:24.300 What can I innovate?

00:43:25.260 What can I tell our, I tell our advisors, you

00:43:28.560 got to innovate every three years and make

00:43:30.340 your old business model outdated.

00:43:32.300 And if you don't, someone else is going to

00:43:33.880 do it to you.

00:43:35.300 Capitalism has two works, two ways.

00:43:37.660 You can, if you work hard, you'd be very

00:43:39.620 successful, but if you stop swimming upstream,

00:43:42.740 you'll go downstream and other capitalists

00:43:45.280 under, under competition, we'll, we'll eat

00:43:47.780 your lunch and destroy you.

00:43:49.100 And that's as it should be.

00:43:51.120 So many of you start, stop creating value

00:43:53.200 for other people is the minute you should

00:43:54.780 be punished by the economy.

00:43:56.480 And that's your, that's your wake up call

00:43:58.820 to say, Hey, I got to change and I got to

00:44:01.300 up my skillset.

00:44:02.460 I have to up my value to other people.

00:44:04.820 Uh, but it's a great time to be alive.

00:44:06.800 You can start a business with relatively

00:44:08.600 nothing.

00:44:10.120 Um, you know, a hundred years ago, you, if

00:44:12.520 you were going to be Carnegie and make a

00:44:14.300 steel factory, you didn't need millions of

00:44:16.620 dollars to open it.

00:44:18.000 Uh, you know, you, you can open a business

00:44:20.160 right now with very little capital and you

00:44:22.740 see shows like a shark tank and all these

00:44:26.760 other shows, you know, where, and I, and

00:44:29.080 young people do want to be entrepreneurs.

00:44:30.960 They do want to open their own business.

00:44:32.620 So I see entrepreneurism as a, a form of

00:44:35.760 expression, uh, a form of creativity, uh, as a

00:44:41.260 factor of risk-taking, uh, and I, I think

00:44:44.500 you, for business people, I think that it's

00:44:47.140 a great, it's a great, uh, example, a role

00:44:50.860 model for their children, uh, how to think

00:44:53.580 about the world.

00:44:55.040 And I think if you believe in the American

00:44:56.720 dream, you would have to think that owning a

00:44:59.700 business would be a great opportunity to

00:45:01.720 fulfill on that dream.

00:45:03.580 Yeah.

00:45:03.960 I mean, it really is.

00:45:04.720 It's, it's hard work and a lot of, a lot of

00:45:07.480 hours, a lot of sleepless nights, a lot of

00:45:09.420 doubts and fear and uncertainty creep in.

00:45:11.720 Sometimes you get paid.

00:45:12.880 Sometimes you don't like it's, it is a

00:45:15.280 wild, wild roller coaster.

00:45:17.040 And, you know, just when you think you're

00:45:18.920 doing really, really well, all of a sudden

00:45:20.780 something happens and you're like, oh, well,

00:45:23.380 I didn't expect that, you know, and you

00:45:25.000 have to rebuild and it's just a crazy, fun,

00:45:28.560 exciting ride.

00:45:30.440 And it's a tough time right now.

00:45:32.700 I mean, you have two wars as of this

00:45:35.160 taping, you have the war in the

00:45:36.940 Mideast, you have the war in Ukraine.

00:45:38.980 You have terrorism, Hamas, and Hezbollah.

00:45:45.440 You have inflation.

00:45:48.600 Even though it slowed, it was massive over

00:45:50.700 the last three and a half years.

00:45:52.400 You have fears of recession.

00:45:57.580 You have fears of market crashes.

00:45:59.760 I mean, people are dealing with a lot right

00:46:01.640 now.

00:46:03.160 And there's a lot of fear and anxiety.

00:46:05.080 There's a lot of animosity and a lot of

00:46:07.320 divisiveness between the clinical parties,

00:46:10.020 no matter which side you're on.

00:46:12.540 I think social media exacerbates that, makes

00:46:15.240 it worse.

00:46:16.980 You know, Ronald Reagan, when he ran a second

00:46:19.620 time, 49 out of 50 states voted for him.

00:46:22.500 The country was very united and we're very

00:46:26.300 divided right now.

00:46:27.420 Uh, so it makes it tough for people to

00:46:30.440 navigate for their families.

00:46:32.840 Um, but fear destroys, panic destroys.

00:46:36.000 And even the 24 seven news cycle on, you know, uh,

00:46:40.620 cable, you know, they have to keep you afraid.

00:46:43.420 That's how they keep you turning back, turning

00:46:45.680 them on, you know, at night.

00:46:48.260 I love it when they make you scared, scared as

00:46:50.460 heck before you go to bed and then they try to

00:46:52.020 sell you relax them to get you to go to sleep.

00:46:55.240 Uh, it is clever.

00:46:59.240 Then sell you the solution, right?

00:47:01.180 Yep.

00:47:01.460 It is clever.

00:47:02.300 We'll say that.

00:47:03.520 What's your take on, um, a man or even yourself

00:47:07.040 entering the political arena?

00:47:11.140 Well, wow, Ryan, that's, um, look, you know,

00:47:15.600 running, running a company with so many different

00:47:18.020 diverse clients and advisors, I've really tried

00:47:21.680 to moderate, um, my political views.

00:47:26.660 However, I'm running a money management company

00:47:28.880 and, uh, economics are part of understanding how

00:47:33.200 money works.

00:47:34.320 Now, if politicians would stop talking about

00:47:36.940 economics, I could start, stop talking about

00:47:39.200 politics.

00:47:40.440 Uh, that's a good point.

00:47:43.920 They're very interwoven, uh, together and

00:47:48.200 policies matter because it'll, it affects your

00:47:51.060 family and it affects the economy at large and

00:47:54.260 it can be very detrimental.

00:47:55.640 And right now, you know, I watched my daughter

00:48:00.580 texted me on the day that, that Trump

00:48:03.380 assassination attempt happened.

00:48:06.140 And she said, did you see, did you see what's

00:48:08.400 going on?

00:48:08.820 I said, no, she's turned on TV and my, it was

00:48:11.580 my son, my two sons, uh, the little one still

00:48:15.460 at home, 11 and nine and my wife, and we were

00:48:17.940 watching the chosen, uh, great, great series on

00:48:21.380 Netflix.

00:48:21.700 And so we turned over, you know, and my 11

00:48:25.400 year old and nine year old watch president

00:48:27.820 Trump go down.

00:48:29.100 They saw the bleeding, they saw him get up.

00:48:32.200 Uh, and when he stood up and my little, my

00:48:35.220 little son was shaking in my arms and said,

00:48:37.960 daddy, is this going to be okay?

00:48:39.340 Uh, and, and, and quite frankly, I felt, um, a

00:48:45.720 deep chagrin that I hadn't been more vocal

00:48:47.660 on what I really believe.

00:48:49.280 Hmm.

00:48:50.480 Uh, and what I really believe is that our

00:48:53.280 freedoms are under attack and that we have a

00:48:55.900 form of Marxism, woke Marxism, that's trying to

00:49:00.660 take over the political system.

00:49:03.080 Uh, cap, uh, capitalism is required for the

00:49:06.660 American dream.

00:49:07.400 It's not an option and socialism and

00:49:10.780 communism will destroy the American dream

00:49:12.720 faster than anything else.

00:49:15.540 And at mats and money, we hire people based, you

00:49:18.040 know, people ask me, well, how do you ensure

00:49:19.680 diversity?

00:49:20.360 I said, I'll tell you how we hire the absolute

00:49:23.560 best people that we can find.

00:49:25.660 And if you hire the best people you can find, you're

00:49:29.000 going to have a very diverse, uh, group of people

00:49:31.960 working together.

00:49:33.400 Uh, and I told our employees the other day at a

00:49:35.660 company meeting, I said, you're all here because

00:49:37.840 you're the absolute best I could find.

00:49:39.960 And not because you check off a random box.

00:49:43.560 Uh, and people like to know that they're there for

00:49:45.880 a right reason and not because it's a handout.

00:49:47.920 Um, so, you know, I, I, I did a post.

00:49:53.600 I said, you know, I, I, I wanted, I wanted to

00:49:56.980 formally endorse president Trump, uh, for his

00:50:01.040 reelection.

00:50:02.260 Uh, I, I do believe in capitalism.

00:50:04.360 I do believe in free markets.

00:50:05.840 I do believe in protecting his country.

00:50:08.860 Uh, I believe a lot of the wars and a lot of things

00:50:11.220 going on right now wouldn't be happening if we had a

00:50:13.900 stronger leader at the helm.

00:50:17.340 And I think that's the, probably our biggest

00:50:19.180 threat is, is war from our enemies.

00:50:21.960 In world war II, you had Italy, you, you had

00:50:25.080 Germany and you had Japan.

00:50:27.720 And now we have China, Russia, and Iran and

00:50:31.040 North Korea.

00:50:32.360 Uh, and those are an existential threat to

00:50:34.700 capitalism and to Western democracy and the way

00:50:37.080 of life.

00:50:37.740 And I think we have to be very careful.

00:50:39.580 And as men, you know, in your podcast, we have

00:50:43.580 to stand up for what is right and what creates the

00:50:47.900 greatest amount of freedom.

00:50:49.200 And I think we're all countries also in attack from

00:50:52.360 the Southern border.

00:50:54.280 Uh, and this is what happened to Rome as big in a, as

00:51:00.180 they were, they, they got soft, they got weak, they

00:51:03.580 stopped protecting the borders.

00:51:05.880 People came in and they destroyed it from the

00:51:08.860 inside out.

00:51:10.340 So, uh, the American dream has to be protected and

00:51:14.120 has to be fought for.

00:51:15.220 And the rule of law has to work because if the

00:51:17.540 rule of law doesn't work, capitalism doesn't

00:51:20.100 work.

00:51:20.460 And if capitalism doesn't work, the American

00:51:22.640 dream dies.

00:51:24.560 So I'm reluctantly talking about that.

00:51:29.580 Yeah.

00:51:30.080 Well, it's, you are an interesting position where

00:51:33.140 you've got 35,000 families, like we talked about

00:51:36.360 that are relying on you for something that's very, obviously

00:51:40.500 very, very important.

00:51:41.620 They're financial prosperity.

00:51:44.000 So, uh, of those 35,000, there's going to be a broad array

00:51:48.880 of people who believe in different things, but I, you

00:51:52.900 know, I commend you for that.

00:51:53.840 And that's a hard decision to make, but those are the types

00:51:56.300 of decisions that I think are important and crucial.

00:51:58.800 You know, one thing I was impressed with and correct me if

00:52:01.300 I'm wrong, if I remember correctly, you, with your

00:52:05.240 portfolios, you, you only invested in countries that, uh,

00:52:10.920 believed in democracy and free markets.

00:52:12.780 If I, if I remember correctly, is that right?

00:52:15.720 Yeah.

00:52:15.960 Well, you know, on the political scale, they, they

00:52:18.320 vary.

00:52:18.760 We, we, we invest in countries that have a commitment to

00:52:23.100 free markets and, and, and capitalism.

00:52:25.200 Now they vary on a scale for sure.

00:52:27.840 And there's been countries that have been in the

00:52:29.660 portfolio that, that no longer are in the portfolio at one

00:52:33.360 time, China, uh, not a lot, like less than one half of

00:52:36.900 1%, uh, or Russia.

00:52:39.640 Uh, so these were some countries that, you know, when all

00:52:43.080 this went down, you know, we closed down investing there.

00:52:47.080 Um, and, but the, but you can't, and number one, you can't

00:52:52.600 believe in the American dream without believing in

00:52:54.220 capitalism and diversification and spreading.

00:52:56.700 We believe in spreading the ideals of freedom.

00:52:58.920 And we believe the American dream, isn't just good in

00:53:01.340 America, that the American dream is good for the world.

00:53:04.580 You know, that human beings long for freedom.

00:53:08.140 That's part of how we were created.

00:53:10.880 Um, and that we believe that freedom should be spread

00:53:14.540 worldwide.

00:53:15.960 Uh, but yeah, there are, you know, there are countries that

00:53:18.620 no longer believe in free markets.

00:53:21.040 Uh, they have stock markets, but we're not putting money in

00:53:24.920 them.

00:53:25.120 Uh, yeah.

00:53:27.380 Well, I think that's a good example of just standing by your

00:53:30.320 convictions.

00:53:30.780 Cause it would be easy not to get political.

00:53:32.880 It'd be easier not to, uh, limit certain sectors or certain

00:53:37.980 countries from your portfolio.

00:53:39.740 It's probably very tempting at times or other people are advising

00:53:43.380 you to.

00:53:43.860 And so to me, that's, you are a man who's standing by his

00:53:47.100 convictions and that's something to be respected regardless of

00:53:50.600 where you sit on the political spectrum.

00:53:52.960 Yeah.

00:53:53.440 And then, you know, Ryan and, and, and the, even inside the U S there's

00:53:57.320 environmental and social governance, ESG funds say that they only invest

00:54:03.900 in green companies or they only invest in this or that type of company.

00:54:07.620 Uh, and they promote a social agenda, uh, and we don't do that.

00:54:14.080 Um, you know, we, I was inspired by the courage of Elon Musk actually, uh,

00:54:21.000 recently and, um, Dana White, uh, and other entrepreneurs who, you know,

00:54:27.640 from provide services to a diverse group.

00:54:30.240 Um, and I always tell, I always tell people we, we stand for the American

00:54:33.740 dream for everybody, regardless of race, religion, political affiliation.

00:54:39.020 Um, and, and it should be available to everybody, but we're going to fight

00:54:43.040 for the ideals of it, whether people understand them or not and fight for

00:54:46.940 their right to have it.

00:54:48.740 Um, and, and, and you have to be, I, I tell people, look, I would never, if I,

00:54:57.920 well, I had last, last summer, I had my, um, having a, I had my, uh, my aorta,

00:55:04.760 which is the main artery that comes off of the heart, um, had a condition where

00:55:09.300 it was expanding, not the heart, the heart was just the aorta on top of it.

00:55:14.440 And I had to have it replaced.

00:55:16.000 They went in, they cracked open my chest, they cut out about an inch and a half

00:55:20.600 part of it, and they literally put in a hose and I'm a hundred percent now

00:55:25.140 better than new. Uh, but I didn't ask the doctor what his political affiliation

00:55:29.760 was, right? I, I didn't, I didn't care if he had a good sense of humor.

00:55:34.940 I didn't care if he was my friend. I didn't care if he, you know, was liberal

00:55:39.400 or conservative or his, or his religious beliefs. I wanted the best person I could

00:55:44.740 have to fix my heart so I could live. And I was, I was, I was technically, they

00:55:50.400 actually froze me down to 65 degrees and my, my heart was stopped and my lungs

00:55:55.160 were stopped for 16 minutes, uh, as he put that piece in. Uh, and I always tell

00:56:01.780 people, look, if it's your money and your family, uh, don't go on charm, don't go on

00:56:06.440 charisma, don't go on friendship, don't go on politics, invest with the person

00:56:10.920 who's committed to you will help you grow your wealth and prosperity. Uh, that's

00:56:15.200 competent. Uh, I think that's good advice, whether it's a doctor or anybody else

00:56:19.720 that you're working with. Yeah. Well, Mark, I, I really appreciate you taking

00:56:24.760 time with me today. Um, this is important stuff and we need good men in every

00:56:30.740 single facet and area of life. The area and arena and you operate is an area that I

00:56:35.620 decided to get out of 10, 11 years ago. And, but we need men in all of the

00:56:41.180 different areas of life. And I really, really appreciate your work and would

00:56:44.960 highly encourage people to go check out, uh, your organization, your company. Um, and

00:56:49.680 then also follow along and pick up a copy of the book. Why don't you tell the

00:56:52.380 guys where to connect with you, learn a little bit more about what you're doing

00:56:54.960 and of course get the book on Amazon or maybe there's somewhere else you want to

00:56:58.140 send them. Yeah, you can, uh, you can go to amazon.com. It's experiencing the

00:57:03.000 American dream. Uh, I've, I've had great, I've had great, uh, support. Uh, Rob Lowe, uh,

00:57:10.500 a buddy of mine wrote the introduction over the forward. Um, uh, Dr. Art Laffer who

00:57:16.000 helped engineer the Reagan recovery, uh, uh, economist. He wrote the epilogue, uh, Arnold

00:57:23.680 Schwarzenegger, uh, supported it. Steve Moore, Steve Forbes, um, two Nobel prize winners.

00:57:30.560 Uh, so I've had, I had a lot of great support and help with the book. Gary Sinise wrote a

00:57:35.180 section in the American dream section. Uh, it's been a great, it's been a group project.

00:57:40.280 It's been absolutely amazing. You can get on it on amazon.com, uh, experiencing the

00:57:45.880 American dream, uh, Barnes and Noble, good reads. It's out there. Uh, if you're traveling,

00:57:52.420 you might see it in an airport bookstore, grab it there. Uh, but it's, uh, uh, we're

00:57:56.960 really excited about it. Uh, we've already sold enough to make it a New York, uh, excuse

00:58:01.840 me, a national bestseller. Um, so we're excited about that and just want to get the

00:58:07.120 message out to more, more families that the American dream is alive and worth fighting

00:58:11.600 for. Awesome. Well, we'll do our part and get the word out. I appreciate you. Uh, thank

00:58:17.000 you for all your mentoring and coaching direct and indirect over the years. I actually really

00:58:21.420 attribute a lot of my success with order of man to some of the things that you've shared

00:58:25.220 with me over the years and the things that I've seen. So I want to make sure you know

00:58:29.220 that I'm grateful for you and how you show up. Um, I'm, I'm deeply honored. I'm so, so

00:58:34.480 psyched for your success, uh, and what you're doing makes a huge difference for, for men

00:58:39.360 and their families and for people they love and even for the world. Uh, so congratulations

00:58:44.560 on a great project and a great company. Thanks, Mark. Appreciate you, man. There you go. Mr.

00:58:51.300 Mark Mattson. I hope you guys enjoyed that one. Like I said, a very early mentor for me and

00:58:55.200 as a real honor to be able to have this conversation and bring it to you guys, make sure you connect

00:59:00.020 with Mark on the gram, me as well at Ryan Mickler and pick up a copy of Mark's new book,

00:59:04.900 experiencing the American dream. Uh, you will not be disappointed with the information. And

00:59:10.220 I think it's going to help you fight as he said in the conversation for our rights, our

00:59:16.100 freedoms and our opportunities. We owe that to ourselves. We owe that to our families and

00:59:20.940 our countrymen. So it's time all of us get in the fight and he's got some real practical

00:59:25.100 information on how to do that. So connect with him, connect with me. And as a parting

00:59:29.040 little word or ask, please make sure to leave a rating and review on Apple podcasts and Spotify

00:59:35.720 or wherever else you might be listening. That helps bump up the show, which gives more visibility

00:59:41.460 to what we're doing and ultimately helps more men in their lives. All right, guys, that's all

00:59:47.740 I've got for you. We will be back tomorrow for our ask me anything until then go out there,

00:59:52.320 take action and become the man you are meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order

00:59:59.040 of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were

01:00:03.680 meant to be. We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

Order of Man - July 30, 2024

MARK MATSON ｜ Is the American Dream Dead or Alive？

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