Order of Man - Master Your Testosterone Levels ｜ CHRISTOPHER WALKER

00:00:00.000 We all know that testosterone is one of the key hormones that drives much of our masculine

00:00:04.100 behavior. What you may not know is that testosterone levels are trending downward

00:00:08.400 for men of all ages. And while those who see lower testosterone levels in themselves are

00:00:14.020 racing towards replacement therapy, there are many natural ways to address T levels.

00:00:18.720 Today, I'm joined by neuroscientist Christopher Walker to talk about testosterone levels,

00:00:23.640 the importance of micronutrients in our diet, the role of the thyroid and pituitary gland

00:00:29.200 in regulating hormonal levels, training, supplementation, and ultimately how to master

00:00:34.080 your testosterone levels. You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears

00:00:39.420 and boldly chart your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every

00:00:45.140 time you are not easily deterred, defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is your life. This is who

00:00:52.680 you are. This is who you will become at the end of the day. And after all is said and done,

00:00:57.860 you can call yourself a man.

00:01:00.460 Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is Ryan Mickler and I am the host and the founder

00:01:04.220 of this podcast and the movement that is Order of Man. I want to welcome you today. If you're

00:01:08.780 brand new, I want to welcome you. If you've been with us for any amount of time, this is an incredible

00:01:13.880 revolution. It's a return back to a time when men were masculine, we were strong, we were committed,

00:01:20.160 we were dedicated, we were driven and motivated and ambitious. And everything else you'd probably

00:01:25.280 consider your grandpa, quite frankly, to be like, this is a call to return back to a time

00:01:30.800 when we were that way. And I'm so honored that so many of you are in this journey and

00:01:35.660 in this battle with me. I certainly couldn't do it without you. And my ultimate goal is

00:01:40.120 to bring you the tools and the conversations and guidance and direction and resources that

00:01:44.800 you need in order to step more fully into your role as a father, a husband, a business

00:01:49.840 owner, a community leader, and every other area of life that you're showing up. So we

00:01:54.340 have conversations on this podcast. I've got a great one lined up for you today with Christopher

00:01:57.900 Walker. We've also had guys like David Goggins, Jocko Willing, Grant Cardone, Andy Frisilla,

00:02:03.800 TJ Dillashaw, Tim Kennedy. I mean, the list goes on and on with the incredible, incredible

00:02:08.260 and inspiring men that we've had on this podcast. And it's only going to get better as you continue

00:02:13.160 to join us in this battle and also share. And I would ask that you do please share this

00:02:18.280 movement, share this podcast, leave a rating and review. Those are two very easy ways that

00:02:23.780 you can let others know what we're doing here. So I'm going to get into the show here in just

00:02:28.400 a second. But one of the things I wanted to make a mention of is my friends and our show

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00:02:38.040 getting an uptick in emails from potential podcast sponsors all wanting to hawk their products

00:02:44.180 and their wares and everything else. And guys, you won't find that here because I think

00:02:47.920 it's disingenuous. It's not our model. Frankly, I'm not interested in just talking a bunch of

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00:03:29.360 better man. It certainly has helped me. So if you're interested in what these guys are doing,

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00:03:38.960 state Maine, originMaine.com and use the code order, O-R-D-E-R at checkout for a discount. Again,

00:03:45.860 originMaine.com and the code order at checkout. All right, guys, with that said, I want to introduce

00:03:51.420 you to my guest. I think a lot of you probably know who this is. His name is Christopher Walker.

00:03:55.720 He is a neuroscientist who has been independently studying health and fitness and testosterone for

00:04:03.080 over a decade. He's the author of Master Your Tea, which I think, and I'm looking at it right now,

00:04:08.820 is probably the definitive guide to increasing and boosting your testosterone levels in a natural

00:04:15.880 and safe way. Him and I met years ago and I've been following his work and implementing his programs

00:04:21.140 in my life ever since. And I've seen drastic improvements in my health and fitness and nutrition.

00:04:26.540 And I think he's arguably one of the foremost authorities on how hormonal levels impact men.

00:04:31.460 And today he's here to talk with us about how that happens and how we can improve our tea levels

00:04:36.900 naturally and safely. Christopher, what's up, man? Glad to have you back on. I had a conversation

00:04:44.280 with you two weeks ago and we decided we needed to redo the whole thing, right? Yep. Yep. Got to

00:04:49.080 make sure the quality is good. Yeah. I mean, that's the biggest thing is we want to make sure that the

00:04:53.320 guys who are listening get the most out of it. And the conversation that we talked about a couple of

00:04:57.120 weeks ago was so powerful that I just want to make sure we painted it in the best light

00:05:01.340 possible for the guys. Yeah. I'm happy to keep riffing on it, get back into it and make this

00:05:09.060 episode even better. Yeah. And it's so important. I mean, it's something that I think inherently a lot

00:05:13.480 of guys know when we're talking about the effects and the power of testosterone in our lives. And yet

00:05:18.320 I see so many guys rush to, I don't want to say quick fix, but rush towards, you know, like testosterone

00:05:24.220 replacement therapy. And although I believe there's probably a time and a place for that, I think the

00:05:29.160 lower hanging fruit is just to do this right and do it naturally. Yeah. I think you see that really

00:05:33.600 with any, um, anything in general, if you have, if there's like a gap between your own understanding

00:05:40.260 and, um, the reality, then, uh, it's, it's common for people to want to just take something at face

00:05:47.540 value of like, Oh, some authority told me this or that. And, um, I'll just go with this, this quick

00:05:53.200 thing, um, without fully understanding what the actual ramifications of that really are.

00:05:59.140 Uh, that that's probably just a basic human behavior. Well, and it's a fine line too, because

00:06:05.840 in a lot of ways we should be turning to experts and authorities and those who maybe have things

00:06:11.440 figured out, but that doesn't absolve us of the responsibility we have to understand some of

00:06:16.940 these things for ourselves, especially when we're talking about messing with our biology and our hormones

00:06:21.920 and these critically important systems that our bodies use to operate in life.

00:06:27.660 Yeah, absolutely. I mean, yeah. Anything like mess around with your biology is, it has far more,

00:06:33.420 more far reaching ramifications than any of us know. Um, they, they, uh, everything is connected

00:06:40.340 in your body. So in the, in the law of compensation will always take effect, especially in your body.

00:06:46.920 Explain that to me. The law, would you say compensation?

00:06:49.380 Compensation. Yeah. Like if you, uh, um, I mean, one way to think about is the Newtonian way of

00:06:56.320 thinking about of like every action has equal and opposite reaction or opposite force. Uh,

00:07:02.440 yeah, sure. The other, the other idea is like, um, a pendulum swinging. So especially with,

00:07:09.460 with health and, um, dieting and everything like that, that's a good, a good metaphor for it. If a lot

00:07:15.460 of people with their health, they'll go to extremes, right? So they'll take things to one end.

00:07:20.200 And, and the way I view it in my mind is like, if you're basically just pulling, if you picture an

00:07:25.220 old, old timey, old timey clock, like grandfather clock kind of thing, um, you're pulling that pendulum

00:07:31.800 to one side and just unnaturally holding it there. When, when it's natural thing is to want to be in

00:07:37.420 this rhythm. Um, and you're just holding it to one side and what's happening is it's going to swing

00:07:43.160 no matter what, like eventually the, the, uh, compensation will happen. It's just the farther

00:07:48.980 you pull that pendulum to one side, the farther it's going to swing to the other end. And, um,

00:07:54.340 especially with biology, there's all these compensatory mechanisms in the body that a lot

00:07:59.620 of us don't even really truly understand. Like even, even people that devote their lives to

00:08:03.500 uncovering the truth about the human body and, uh, the brain and that sort of thing. It's just,

00:08:08.520 it's just all like this new stuff. So there's such a lack of understanding that, um, to play with fire

00:08:14.020 in the way that a lot of people do with pharmaceuticals is, uh, I definitely wouldn't

00:08:18.740 advise it to say the least. Yeah. I mean, and the other thing too, though, is truth is such an

00:08:24.180 interesting word because when we hear it, I think what we obviously think of objective truth and yet

00:08:31.540 it seems to me in the health industry and just about any facet of life is it's so hard to actually

00:08:37.700 get to the truth. And, and is there really an absolute truth maybe with certain things, but

00:08:42.820 I mean, it's such a complicated system, the body. Yeah. It's hard to know what is objectively accurate.

00:08:50.920 Yeah. It's a, or is it, maybe it's not West. I think it's a quest. I think it's a never ending

00:08:55.220 journey, which makes it more fun. Um, you just keep unlocking and learning new layers of

00:09:01.500 of what you would, the way you would frame what is true. I mean, there's a, like a specific way to

00:09:07.780 look at certain things. Like a lot of people look at, especially with health, they'll look at things

00:09:13.080 through the lens of weight loss, um, which does not equal health. And no, no. And what we do is we

00:09:19.760 get on the scale and think if I lost five pounds, well, I'm healthier than I was a week ago, which

00:09:24.260 that's one metric, but certainly not the most accurate metric. Yeah. Right. Right. Sure. Yeah.

00:09:31.280 Um, it's, or maybe not accurate, but the most significant maybe would be the better way to say

00:09:35.860 it. Yes. Um, yeah. A lot of people don't even define health. That's one thing that I, I kind

00:09:43.340 of blew my mind when I realized it because, uh, cause I started to think about it myself. I was

00:09:47.860 like, how would I define what's healthy? Cause I think there's just this huge divergence in like

00:09:52.240 the way that I'm thinking about things. And there are people thinking about things the same way as I

00:09:56.400 am, but not very many. And then there's a lot of other people that there's just like this chaos in,

00:10:02.320 in health, in medicine. And that chaos is, is a, a void for, uh, predators to prey on people.

00:10:13.160 And, um, you know, maybe the chaos is designed that way, but it made me think about the, the,

00:10:19.500 the definition of what, what is healthy. And then I realized like, no one really takes the time to,

00:10:24.840 to think about that or define it. It's very rare that you've run on like, what is healthy? I mean,

00:10:30.340 what, like, what do you think would be healthy off top of your head? Like what is, again, I don't

00:10:35.100 know if I could objectively say it, but I would say that you're specifically for a man is that you're

00:10:42.800 lean, that you're strong, that your hormones are balanced properly, uh, and that you are,

00:10:54.180 capable, I guess you'd say. I mean, I don't know. It's, it's a good question. I really haven't

00:10:59.400 thought about how to define health. Yeah. I think we all see somebody and we assume,

00:11:04.340 oh, that individual is healthy, but I don't know if we have an objective definition of it.

00:11:09.500 Maybe, maybe you can enlighten me as to what you, you think it is.

00:11:12.460 Yeah. I've got my own, my own view about it. And, um, in my opinion, the, from what I've seen,

00:11:19.000 and that's the only thing I can speak from is that health for the human body is, uh, hormonally

00:11:26.920 balanced, like, like you mentioned, and then, uh, no micronutrient deficiencies. And, um, we talked

00:11:34.220 about that on the last time we were recording of just, they are the raw materials. So when I say

00:11:38.520 micronutrients, I say, uh, I'm talking about vitamins, minerals, and amino acids and gases also

00:11:44.660 would fall into that, like gas exchange stuff. Um, but if you, if you think about leverage curves,

00:11:50.860 if you were to eliminate all your deficiencies and those things, which all of us, everyone listening

00:11:56.260 to the show, all of us have deficiencies at any moment. And it's like a kind of a never ending

00:12:00.920 process to tweak and figure out and measure just this self-experimentation process and, uh, correcting

00:12:07.580 those deficiencies will bring your body back into a state of balance and bring you closer back to that

00:12:11.480 state of health that where, where you have that vitality and the vibrance and the, the hormonal

00:12:17.440 balancing is, uh, almost, it's almost a natural, uh, uh, byproduct of, of correcting the deficiencies,

00:12:25.460 but it's also some, a very high leverage thing that people like to look at. And it's very helpful

00:12:29.320 to look at, uh, because there's certain hormones that are indicative of a, of a stressed state or a

00:12:35.440 stressed metabolism. And then there are certain hormones that are indicative of a protective state or a

00:12:41.280 healthy reproductive state. And, um, those are, if you combine those, those two tenants, then I think

00:12:48.940 that's a good worldview for health. Um, and you know, what's wild is that, can I stop you right

00:12:54.320 there? Because maybe it's just inherently built into it, but you didn't talk much about

00:13:00.400 physical strength or stamina or is that, are you considering that as just the result of having

00:13:08.360 your health by your definition in check and in order? Yeah. I mean, I think the, in order to,

00:13:14.580 um, balance your hormones, for example, you should be focusing on specific types of training

00:13:21.400 and not on other types of training and specifically, so it's almost like the next level of, or it's like

00:13:29.160 the how of how you would achieve. It's one of the pieces of the how. Um, so in training, you mean,

00:13:35.160 yes. So with strength, it would be like a certain type of training. Uh, for example,

00:13:39.520 if you're out, um, running endurance races, it is naturally going to, especially if it's like a

00:13:46.840 heavy training load and you're actually doing it seriously, um, it's going to chronically elevate

00:13:52.600 cortisol levels. Right. And that's just the way it is. Cortisol is a catabolic hormone. Um,

00:13:58.800 it's a stress hormone and it will lead to less strength, less muscular strength and, um, less

00:14:05.560 muscular power and, and, uh, a potential breakdown of muscle tissue. And then, so when you compare that

00:14:12.740 to a specific way of training to, uh, use like power-based resistance training to actually, uh,

00:14:19.960 intentionally elevate anabolic hormones like testosterone growth hormone, that sort of thing,

00:14:25.560 the, the, the result, the natural result of that, it ends up being, you have more muscular strength,

00:14:32.880 the more muscular power. So that's kind of how I view it of like, those are the details of how you

00:14:38.700 would achieve that, that goal. How do you, how do you strike the balance? Because conditioning is

00:14:44.860 important. And I know you can get some conditioning built into anabolic training and resistance training,

00:14:50.060 but it seems to me that running isn't necessarily a bad thing. It can be if done incorrectly or not

00:14:55.980 in proportion to what else you're doing. How do you begin to find that balance?

00:14:59.640 Uh, I guess it depends on what your goal is, right? Like if it's sports specific,

00:15:04.580 conditioning in a lot of sports is really relevant and sure. Right. But it's a different goal

00:15:10.660 than being hormonally balanced. So you, you're like kind of take boxing, for example. Um, you can't

00:15:18.920 go a full, uh, boxing match against an opponent without being highly conditioned, preferably more

00:15:26.240 conditioned than the other guy. Right. Cause that's one of the most in wrestling and MMA, like those are

00:15:31.400 the most brutal sports for that sort of thing. And, um, at the same time you have to be powerful.

00:15:37.920 You have to be strong. The issue is, is that it doesn't necessarily mean that their hormones are

00:15:43.420 going to be balanced, especially because it's such a, uh, uh, period, uh, there's a lot of

00:15:48.240 periodization involved in the training and there's like these, uh, potentially seasons or periods where

00:15:53.520 people are training up to one competition or a series of competitions and then, uh, taking an off

00:15:59.840 season. Um, the, it doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to have as high of testosterone as

00:16:05.780 they, they would want or as high of growth hormone or as low of cortisol. Uh, it's going to be a

00:16:12.860 balance to strike, to try and beat that one opponent. And hopefully you're better than he is

00:16:17.360 at the, at that moment. Right. Yeah. I mean, I think about the majority of guys listening to this

00:16:22.580 aren't going to, you know, they're not competitive boxers or they aren't running, you know, 20 marathons

00:16:30.360 in a year or whatever it is. Right. But, but what I think most guys here are dealing with is that they

00:16:36.620 want to have enough energy at work and they want to have enough, uh, stamina when it comes to the

00:16:42.840 bedroom and they want to be able to defend themselves in a 60 second to 122 second altercation. 1.00

00:16:50.040 And so I think that requires a different level of training or a different type of training,

00:16:56.360 more practical maybe than focusing on one specific event against one specific opponent for a very

00:17:03.840 short period of time. Yeah. And, and so what I would say for somebody listening, so like for a guy,

00:17:11.260 if you're looking to find that balance in your own body, uh, first off measuring always helps.

00:17:15.880 So if you take blood tests, I know that's also not, uh, it, it's realistic for some, it's more

00:17:21.920 realistic for some people than it is for others specifically financially. Um, so the end time

00:17:29.100 wise, it takes some time and take some level of expertise to even read tests sometimes. So,

00:17:34.500 so for, for most guys, I would pay attention to actually, um, some indicators on your, in,

00:17:39.700 in your body and, um, uh, in your energy levels and that sort of thing, sleep habits and so forth.

00:17:46.600 So what I'm talking about is, uh, physique wise, the, um, there's, there's some interesting things.

00:17:54.380 So you're naturally there's, there's, uh, your body's naturally going to have more, uh, capacity

00:18:00.280 to store body fat in, in, uh, your, for most guys in like the belly area. And, um, it's also,

00:18:08.380 that's also that, that fat specifically is, is, uh, great for estrogen storage. And also the more

00:18:15.580 estrogen that's, that's in your body, typically it'll, it'll tend to be stored in certain areas,

00:18:19.820 uh, specifically there and in, uh, the pec region for a lot of guys. So that's where a lot of guys

00:18:25.760 will have like gynecomastia issues. Sure. And, um, so if you're dealing with those sorts of issues,

00:18:31.440 that's potentially indicative of higher than, uh, you would like estrogen levels and cortisol levels.

00:18:38.380 So, um, that's one thing. So like if you're training a specific way and you, you're not necessarily

00:18:43.900 happy with certain like stubborn fat, that's kind of clinging on. And, uh, especially if like, 0.76

00:18:49.840 I hear a lot of, a lot of stories of guys that they're like, Hey, I've got this, this stubborn

00:18:53.500 fat around my belly or whatever, or, or, uh, on my pecs that I'm like doing everything that I can

00:19:00.240 in terms of diet. And they're trying to eat everything correctly and they're not overeating

00:19:04.740 and so forth. Um, which would, if that's true, that would be indicative of more of like, well,

00:19:10.660 let's look at your training as well and see what you're doing. And if, if they're, say they're like

00:19:14.620 out running five miles a day or whatever, um, I would recommend that they switch to something like

00:19:20.120 sprinting instead of that and sprint twice a week, not every day and see, see what happens in terms of

00:19:26.600 the difference. And it's, it's interesting coming back to the, the idea of like, um, the capacity for

00:19:33.880 certain tissue to store hormones, uh, or, or have risk more receptors for hormones than other tissue

00:19:40.840 because, um, and I talked about it in my book in Thor. So it's like a resistance training specifically

00:19:48.000 for anabolic, um, optimization and hormone. And so I talked about something that's, it's just an

00:19:54.860 observation. I have no, uh, uh, like kind of evolutionary anthropological evidence for this,

00:20:02.320 but it's really strange that, or it's cool that you actually have guys have more androgen receptors.

00:20:09.440 So things that would bind testosterone, for example, in a certain muscle tissue than others.

00:20:15.380 And, uh, those are specifically, there are high amounts, obviously in your legs. And you hear that

00:20:19.860 quite a bit, especially on bodybuilding websites, but there's actually a high amount of androgen receptors

00:20:24.940 in your traps, your shoulders, your upper chest, in your upper back. And, um, the cool thing,

00:20:32.320 the cool thing about those receptors, those receptor sites is that you can actually increase

00:20:37.120 the amount of androgen receptor sites in that muscle tissue in your upper body. And, um, that's

00:20:43.000 really interesting. You can't, uh, from what I've read in the research, you can't increase the amount

00:20:47.820 of receptor sites in your legs, even though your legs do have the, the muscle in your legs have a lot

00:20:52.860 of receptor sites naturally, but you can increase the amounts in the upper body. And so if you look at

00:20:57.820 the, the idea of like a powerful masculine physique and just kind of picture that in your

00:21:04.880 mind of like, what's kind of the most, most like yoked hench dude that you've ever seen?

00:21:09.620 Like what, what's that kind of guy? You know, there's, there's that picture of that, that one

00:21:13.160 dude who's, who's, uh, got like this big beard and some like massive traps. He's like got an ax

00:21:19.440 over his shoulder or something. Sure. You know, there's some, some picture like that I've seen a

00:21:23.680 million times on the internet and, uh, a picture of something like that. Like that's a really

00:21:27.900 masculine look. But if you look at hormone distribution and receptor site distribution,

00:21:31.760 that dude is actually has maximized. And I don't know if he's on some sort of juice or not,

00:21:38.340 but he's maximized the, the, uh, the amount of receptor sites available to bind more circulating

00:21:46.040 testosterone in that upper body tissue. So he's got,

00:21:49.860 is this just outside of resistance training those areas or is that what's actually building

00:21:55.520 up these androgen receptors? Uh, yeah. Training those areas will build it up. It's, uh, it's one

00:22:00.360 of those positive feedback loops. Yeah. Um, so it's pretty cool. Cause if you start to picture it,

00:22:06.360 it's like, yeah, that a guy like that has like no belly fat, right? It's very low estrogen and low

00:22:13.340 cortisol potentially too. And, um, the, but those, those areas, the traps, shoulders, everything are

00:22:20.300 big. Like they're, and they're not unnaturally big. It looks naturally big, like the right size,

00:22:25.780 the proportion. Right. It looks like it should. Yeah. And you can tell like when some certain

00:22:30.040 people, a lot of guys are using some sort of drugs because it's, it's actually like a reiteration of

00:22:35.360 the truth of what I'm saying right now about those areas is that like if someone hops on the juice,

00:22:40.040 um, those, those areas are the ones that blow up the fastest, uh, because there's more receptor

00:22:45.780 sites available and you, and if you're training correctly, they're going to increase the amount

00:22:49.420 of receptor sites. I'm just trying to wrap my head around this is so will you, cause you talk about

00:22:54.920 this, this feedback loop. So testosterone will in those specific areas, I know it does generally in

00:23:00.700 the body, but in those specific areas will then enhance your capacity to build muscle in those areas.

00:23:06.880 So if, yes, if there's, if you're training those areas, they're going to have a, a, a higher amount

00:23:14.320 of androgen receptors available. And if your testosterone levels are either adequate or

00:23:19.900 increasing, they're going to have more areas, the, the testosterone molecule will have more

00:23:24.320 sites to bind to. And so the androgen receptor, that is the binding factor. That's what actually

00:23:31.320 binds the testosterone or that molecule. Kind of like a locking key type of deal.

00:23:35.100 Interesting. Okay. Yeah. I didn't know this.

00:23:37.360 And then, so when that molecule is bound though, on those receptor sites, it initiates a cascade

00:23:42.960 of events, chemical events essentially. So, um, it's going to trigger more muscle growth

00:23:48.520 in that area.

00:23:49.980 What are, what are some of the chemical reactions going on in, in that process then?

00:23:55.600 Um, basically a lot of protein synthesis, a lot of anything involved in, in tissue building.

00:24:00.940 Um, so like, and that's what they mean by anabolic in terms of growth. Um, yeah, it's, I don't

00:24:09.000 know if we need to get into like all the super details, but.

00:24:11.880 Yeah. Well, I, I mean, we, we don't need to get super specific cause you've written this

00:24:16.380 book, Master Your Tea, which it goes into depth on all of this stuff, but I am very curious

00:24:21.400 about the process of how this actually works.

00:24:23.340 Yeah. I mean, I mean, as far as I know, it's, it's like just any, any sort of growth cascade.

00:24:31.760 Yeah. So how did you get into this? Because your background is, is basically neuroscience,

00:24:38.200 which you really wouldn't necessarily make that connection, but you've got this medical

00:24:44.880 training that's given you a huge advantage when it comes to how all this stuff works.

00:24:48.240 Yeah. I mean the, so, um, based on my, like my personal story, when I was 19, I had, I was

00:24:54.960 diagnosed with a tumor in my pituitary gland in the brain and the pituitary, uh, controls your

00:25:02.020 hormones. So like the, the secretion of kind of the conversation of the hormones, uh, from the

00:25:09.120 brain toward to the body. So the gonads and adrenal glands, so forth. Um, so I studied

00:25:18.220 neuroscience to try and figure out and solve my own problem naturally. And that was the,

00:25:23.320 the impetus, but it was in the context of hormones. And, um, as a young guy, my, I mean,

00:25:30.280 my testosterone was 11 nanograms per deciliter at that time. And I don't, give us a frame of

00:25:35.880 reference. I don't know. I don't know the benchmarks. Okay. Yeah. It's, it's pretty much

00:25:39.400 zero there. There was like pretty much no production. And so the, the, what, what the lab, um,

00:25:45.440 uh, reference ranges would consider to be, um, normal, like a normal reference range is,

00:25:51.540 is they'll say like somewhere around 400 to a thousand. Uh, I think 400 is pretty low.

00:25:57.840 Yeah. But that's, that seems like that's what I've heard. Like, it seems like you should be up.

00:26:01.860 If I understand the numbers correctly up in the 800s or so, is that, does that sound right?

00:26:06.040 Yeah. 800 is very healthy. Um, 800 to a thousand is very good. Uh, okay. Yeah. And then,

00:26:12.040 but anywhere like above 650, uh, that, that kind of turns into like, you're in, you're in a decent

00:26:18.000 zone. Uh, you can get it higher, obviously. Like I've seen people at 1500 naturally. Uh, that's

00:26:24.100 pretty cool. But the highest I got was 1192. Um, generally just stick in the 800 to 1100. Um,

00:26:32.300 it also fluctuates quite a bit. I would love to do a, uh, like a testing protocol and, um,

00:26:37.800 be able to measure it over a period of 12 weeks, like a couple of times a day, you know,

00:26:42.900 that would be awesome. But financially,

00:26:44.480 Will it change that much in that period of time? Just like a couple of times a day?

00:26:48.000 Uh, it could swing potentially a hundred points here and there. Yeah. I mean,

00:26:51.820 the interesting, so yeah, in the morning, uh, your cortisol is going to be higher than it was at night.

00:26:55.980 And, um, that can impact it because cortisol is, it acts antithetically to testosterone,

00:27:01.840 not in a perfect one-to-one, but like it's suppressed. The higher cortisol is,

00:27:06.120 the lower your testosterone is going to be. You were going to use the word suppress. Is

00:27:09.980 that actually what's happening? Is that when there's cortisol creation, it doesn't have,

00:27:13.640 the body doesn't have the ability then to create testosterone? Uh, what, what I think

00:27:19.540 there is, is it's like a hierarchical thing. Um, the cortisol is indicative of like more of a

00:27:25.460 survival state, less or less of a, uh, reproductive state. And that's kind of how I think that it works.

00:27:33.740 Um, at the most basic, like kind of layman way of thinking about it, I guess.

00:27:39.800 Which is good for me. That's what I need. That's the layman explanation.

00:27:43.580 Well, it's funny because you've got all the training and everything else. And I think that's

00:27:47.700 actually, it's good. It's good. You have all this training and you have all this knowledge behind it,

00:27:51.520 but you know, for, for us regular guys, it's like, how do you bridge that gap between all of the

00:27:57.720 medical training and terminology and everything that's going on in the background? And then just

00:28:02.200 knowing what you need to know to, to apply it and make it work in your life.

00:28:06.040 Yeah. Yeah. I mean, cause really what, I mean, when it comes down to it, a lot of this stuff is

00:28:09.740 very simple. Uh, it's, it's easy for people to, uh, get caught up in like all this complicated stuff,

00:28:16.280 uh, involved with, you know, all these, these, uh, processes and, um, a lot for a lot of people,

00:28:22.780 it's fun to figure out. It's like this puzzle to figure out. But, um, for, for most people,

00:28:29.140 I think understanding the simplicity behind it, uh, in terms of action is what's most important

00:28:35.440 and things that they can do, things they shouldn't do, uh, you know, if they want to

00:28:40.760 achieve this certain goal and it's probably true of anything. Like, um, what, what's that? There's

00:28:47.420 a Da Vinci quote, I think about like simplicity being the ultimate sophistication. Yeah, sure.

00:28:52.800 Sure. Yeah. So that's, so, well, let's break that down. Let's talk about some of the shoulds and

00:28:56.680 shouldn'ts, because I think that'd be useful for the guys listening. What, what are some things

00:29:00.000 that, well, let's do the shouldn'ts first, some things that maybe you should avoid, uh, when it

00:29:05.460 comes to building up levels of testosterone and in turn building up muscle and all the other benefits

00:29:11.400 that come from it. Yeah. So, um, in the Mastery T book, I have this pyramid and I think we could use

00:29:17.480 that as a reference here. It's a pyramid based on the base of the pyramid is the foundation and it's

00:29:24.440 the most important part. And then you work your way up to the top of the pyramid and it's an easy

00:29:28.700 way to classify things and, and, uh, a metaphor to think about essentially, uh, in terms of what

00:29:34.140 you should focus on with the most leverage versus the least leverage. Uh, they're all important to

00:29:38.260 form the actual shape, but, uh, we could start just, uh, we, we already mentioned a lot about like

00:29:43.460 the, the micronutrients, uh, the book goes into a lot of detail about pretty much all the important

00:29:48.980 ones. And, um, it, the idea of being deficient in a micronutrient is, is, um, it's a matter of

00:29:55.200 your body doesn't have the raw material it needs to actually fulfill certain processes, whether,

00:30:00.360 whether it's like, um, uh, you know, on the cellular level or, uh, the vitamin working as a

00:30:06.640 cofactor in some enzyme cascade or, um, the mineral that's needed for, uh, for some hormonal

00:30:15.100 triggering like, like zinc, for example, very common deficiency, uh, in guys, uh, but also very

00:30:21.920 essential for the production of testosterone. So if you're deficient in zinc, it's going to be very

00:30:26.440 difficult to have a normal or a high testosterone level. The same thing with magnesium and just fixing

00:30:34.000 a lot of these deficiencies, there's research showing that, uh, if, if the hormonal problem is

00:30:38.860 caused by a specific deficiency, fixing the deficiency will naturally correct that hormonal problem.

00:30:44.660 So there's probably a large cohort of guys out there with, with low testosterone or, or lower

00:30:51.400 testosterone that is caused by a simple deficiency or a handful of simple ones that they could fix

00:30:57.080 pretty easily. Uh, and this makes sense because a lot of times what you'll hear is, well, just lift

00:31:02.000 more or something, you know, and it's like, okay, well, if you don't have these fundamental building

00:31:07.300 blocks in place, then your lifting isn't going to be as level. Will it work? Probably, but it won't be

00:31:12.140 to your, your phrase earlier is it won't be as leveraged as if you had these micronutrients in

00:31:18.060 place. Well, and you won't really have a clear understanding of what the problem is. Uh, it's

00:31:23.580 just a bandaid. Yeah. A lot of people can have, like, you could have the same symptom. You, me,

00:31:29.520 10 other guys have the same symptom, all caused by different things. And so, so by prescribing the same,

00:31:36.400 um, you know, do this one task to like lift, lift more weight, something that's not actually

00:31:42.140 trying to figure out what, what that, what the cause was. Um, then it's, it's not necessarily

00:31:47.700 going to serve everyone. Maybe two people out of the group are like, oh yeah, okay. No, I just

00:31:51.760 wasn't lifting heavy. Um, but for the most part, it's going to be caused by these, these basic things.

00:31:57.020 And that's why in the beginning of the conversation, talking about the definition of health

00:32:00.780 is super important because nothing matters without a reference point. So that being the

00:32:06.740 barometer basically against which we're going to measure things, that's the natural place to start,

00:32:11.200 uh, looking for the, the deficiencies that are potentially causing the issue. Now, if you're

00:32:16.860 not deficient in anything, which is highly unlikely, but you still have a persistent low testosterone

00:32:22.780 problem, then, um, you move on to other things and to try and deduce what was going on.

00:32:29.860 Yeah. Before we get into those, I, if I remember correctly from our last conversation,

00:32:34.360 you said that there was a resource or a company that you were using to test your micronutrient

00:32:42.000 levels. If I remember correctly, is that sound right? Yeah. Yep. So it's, uh, that one's called

00:32:46.500 reset yourself and they just send you a kit. That's an in-home kit, right? Yeah. It's easy.

00:32:51.960 You just, uh, it's like a mail order kit and they just shoot it to you in the mail. Uh, it's got

00:32:56.460 instructions in a little booklet and you take out, uh, you cut a piece of scalp hair or a few

00:33:02.520 pieces, a little chunk, um, or hair close to your scalp and, uh, send it back to them. And a couple

00:33:08.800 weeks later, they, they hit you up as a test, you, uh, test results, you log into the dashboard and

00:33:13.320 they'd show you just in a very easy graphic way, um, what you're deficient in or what you have an

00:33:20.000 excess in. It's, it's also possible to have excess. Is, is how often are you doing that?

00:33:26.460 Uh, I, I'm trying to do that quarterly. I got to send my, my next one in, but yeah.

00:33:31.040 Do, do you find for yourself that you are perpetually deficient and in certain minerals?

00:33:41.240 Like is, for example, is, is, is the body just like my body, for example, could it just naturally

00:33:46.780 be low in zinc just all the time? And so that's something I have to be constantly aware of,

00:33:50.740 or is this something, once you kind of level it out, it should maintain itself pretty well?

00:33:55.060 Yeah, there's a good question. The certain ones are, are more, uh, you can become more easily

00:34:00.840 deficient in them and those are the, uh, electrolytes. So, um, magnesium, potassium,

00:34:07.440 sodium, and calcium.

00:34:09.980 Would this have anything to do with, uh, like dehydration or cramping?

00:34:13.840 Yeah. That's interesting. Cause that's actually one thing that I experienced quite a bit

00:34:18.060 specifically when I'm running.

00:34:20.300 Yeah. The, uh, yeah, your electrolyte, you probably have, I mean, that usually cramping

00:34:25.200 is tied to potassium. Um, but they're, I mean, they fluctuate so much because they're heavily

00:34:31.300 used in the body and, uh, and then it can come down to just like your daily consumption

00:34:36.800 of, of those minerals. Uh, it's that, that's, that one can fluctuate quite a bit and there's

00:34:42.160 patterns. Actually, it's interesting of, of like, um, different, uh, I think I mentioned

00:34:47.620 this last time we were talking of, of, uh, like sympathetic dominance, uh, pattern where

00:34:52.220 you have a high calcium level and low, uh, magnesium, sodium, potassium. And it, it tends

00:34:58.940 to kind of form this, this downward curve, uh, if you had the potassium in the, in the front

00:35:04.100 and it's indicative of high adrenaline and high cortisol levels. And it's interesting

00:35:10.760 because like when hormones exhibit a certain pattern or a neurotransmitter, it'll, it'll

00:35:16.020 use up these electrolytes in different ways. Uh, I think, you know, down to that compensatory

00:35:23.580 concept of, of like, Oh my, I'm in a very stressed state right now. I'm using these to, to compensate

00:35:30.580 for it. Like I need to use more of this or more of that, more sodium, more potassium,

00:35:33.920 more magnesium to, to try and reach homeostasis because the body's always going to fight back

00:35:38.680 toward it. Uh, it's not always successful, especially because our minds are typically

00:35:43.360 much better at keeping our body away from it than we probably should be. Um, it also just

00:35:50.300 because a lot of people just don't know, and it's hard to know all the time what you're

00:35:53.740 doing, but what I mean by that is kind of, or the impact of it. Yeah. Or the impact.

00:35:57.780 Yeah. Like, I mean, a lot of people don't know that it's not healthy to, to like be

00:36:02.120 doing marathons. Right. How did, but how do you, how do you keep yourself out of these

00:36:07.620 stressful levels? Cause I mean, it's just natural, it's inevitable. You're going to

00:36:11.820 be stressed out at work. You're going to have a relationship, a conversation in your

00:36:15.060 relationship with your kids or your wife, you're going to be working out or running

00:36:18.880 or any number of things that I would probably assume that, that they're healthy levels of

00:36:24.520 stress and actually good for the body. Yeah. It's so the concept of hormesis, like you

00:36:30.020 stress, um, there's certain things that are helpful in terms of stress and rebuilding,

00:36:37.700 but the rebuilding aspect is the key. When you're talking about rebuilding, you're

00:36:43.300 talking about recuperation, recovery from these events. Is that right? Yeah. Or something

00:36:48.460 else entirely. Well, like for example, I guess on the physical level, uh, a you stress

00:36:53.460 would be training and, uh, like physical training. Say you're hitting the, hitting the

00:36:58.760 weights, right. Um, you need to be able to recover from that obviously. So after training,

00:37:03.620 your body's naturally going to trigger a response, uh, by recruiting more anabolic hormone production 0.80

00:37:10.640 and so forth to try and rebuild that muscle tissue so that you can be stronger the next time

00:37:14.780 you hit the gym. And that's, uh, just evidenced by the fact that we do get stronger. We do

00:37:19.860 build muscle, uh, in certain training situations, most training situations. Uh, the, the, uh,

00:37:26.860 psychological idea I think comes down to like a worldview thing. Uh, you know, if you, you

00:37:33.700 get into a fight with your significant other, uh, you have problems at work, that sort of thing.

00:37:39.480 Um, the psychology of it's probably the most important thing, like the way you see it,

00:37:45.040 uh, because the, that, that'll dictate like whether somebody takes it down one road or the

00:37:51.400 other. And that's the response. Sure. Yeah. Like they could say, Oh, woe is me. I'm, I'm like,

00:37:56.860 everyone's out to get me. I'm this victim. And that's one way to do it. The other way is to,

00:38:01.720 to take it in stride and say, all right, I'm going to make this a, a you stress. Like,

00:38:05.580 yeah, I got in a fight because I was being an asshole. And what can I learn from it? 0.99

00:38:10.400 What can I learn from it? Yes. And, and so it's more of a productive way of thinking about it.

00:38:14.240 So it's both, you could have the same exact response and two different people respond or

00:38:18.840 same exact conflict and two people respond differently to it. Uh, and that's, that comes

00:38:23.420 down to choice and that choice is typically based on the way they see the world. Uh, so that,

00:38:28.800 yeah, that I, I love thinking about that kind of thing. Um, and that, that's like a huge element to

00:38:34.360 this is mindset for sure. Um, outside of the biological stuff.

00:38:39.360 Well, and, and it is biological, right? I mean, it's just, it's just a series of synapses of the

00:38:44.520 brain. So it's all biological anyways, even if it is just mindset.

00:38:48.300 There's a biological basis of all behavior. Yeah.

00:38:51.100 What, what would be the other, you say it's a basis. What else would come into play then?

00:38:55.100 The, well, that's a big conversation. Cause the, it's still something like you can just get down

00:39:00.620 a consciousness. When I say biological basis, I mean like exactly what you're saying. There's a,

00:39:05.200 there is a, a measurable, um, uh, either origin in terms of like electricity and chemicals to any

00:39:16.240 behavior or something that can be proven. I mean, I mean, essentially if I'm understanding you

00:39:20.980 correctly, we're talking about science and perhaps even, uh, uh, the spirituality.

00:39:26.260 Yeah. Yeah. Or the, like the idea of consciousness too. Um, if we get down to that level,

00:39:31.660 cause the, the, uh, the measurability of a lot of, of, uh, this stuff is, is a bit overblown.

00:39:39.180 I think at least from what I've seen and being like at a research institution, um, there's a lot

00:39:44.760 of stuff we don't know. And a lot of the ways that we measure, uh, the body are based on just like,

00:39:50.900 um, uh, oxygen usage or, or certain gas usage or blood flow, that sort of thing. And they're like,

00:39:57.560 oh, it lit up over here, lit up over there that correlates to this or this, but that's not exactly

00:40:03.080 accurate information. It doesn't tell you exactly everything you need to know. Um,

00:40:07.880 Is too, is it too simplified? Is that what you're suggesting?

00:40:10.300 Yeah. Yeah. We don't know enough yet about a lot of this stuff. I mean, a lot of people are making

00:40:14.400 measures or making a lot of headway into it, but it, it's, uh, it's hard to say, um, to pinpoint,

00:40:20.180 like, oh, this response was caused by, uh, this chemical fired here or there, you know,

00:40:27.540 and I don't think it's that simple. They may be correlated, but they aren't necessarily

00:40:31.920 causing one, one thing to happen. Yeah. And that's why the, I took a really interesting

00:40:36.540 class called, it was, uh, an AI class on like AI theory. And so they're trying to, there's

00:40:44.660 a lot of cool stuff in AI because obviously they're trying to recreate people. And,

00:40:50.180 neural networks, um, just the decision-making and the, and mixing consciousness was the main

00:40:57.060 topic in the whole thing, uh, because that is what they call the hard problem. And it's the,

00:41:02.680 like that missing piece that a lot of people have theories on it, but it's kind of this,

00:41:07.800 like there's a void between our understanding and whatever that is. So it's, it's pretty cool.

00:41:14.440 Gents, let me hit the pause button here real quick and introduce you to a resource that has,

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00:41:46.660 to bandwidth go further, they slip less. Uh, and it seems to me they accomplished more than those

00:41:52.220 who don't. I know that's certainly been true in my life. So if you're ready to be pushed and

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00:42:17.760 slash iron council. Do that after the show guys for now, we'll finish up the conversation with

00:42:23.100 Christopher. It is, it's fascinating stuff to me. I mean, it really is. And I can definitely see

00:42:30.040 why they would call it a hard problem. That is the, uh, understatement of the year right there.

00:42:35.300 I, I, I've got so much to talk about. I, we kind of went off on a tangent here. So we were talking

00:42:39.520 about, uh, the shoulds and the shouldn'ts, and you were talking about, uh, the micronutrients and

00:42:44.820 getting that right. And then you said, okay, from there we'd move on to what, what would be the next

00:42:49.600 step or the next consideration? Yeah. The next, uh, the next step in the pyramid is the nutrition.

00:42:54.780 So, um, lots of interesting stuff in nutrition. Uh, the, the easiest way to think about nutrition

00:43:02.180 is, is first off, uh, are you eating the types of foods that are easy to digest compatible with

00:43:07.900 your, your gut? Uh, and which means basically you can absorb the nutrients in them and the,

00:43:14.120 the micronutrients that are, that are in that, that's in that food, uh, is what you need,

00:43:19.500 right? And, uh, you'll get a lot of clarity after that first step of the, the micronutrient

00:43:24.160 step, especially if someone measures it. And then the, uh, the nutrition aspect though,

00:43:28.900 there's a lot, a lot to it. And some of it's a bit counterintuitive. Um, in terms of, we could

00:43:35.920 just kind of go down. So carbs, fats, and proteins, like the simplest way to think about stuff, um,

00:43:40.860 the macronutrients. So, uh, there was an interesting study that, uh, was specifically with like,

00:43:47.300 it was in like semi-trained individuals. Uh, so probably most guys that are listening to this,

00:43:52.600 right. Go to the gym a couple of times a week. And, um, it measured, uh, testosterone output,

00:43:59.580 testosterone production and testosterone levels, serum testosterone levels, um, based on certain

00:44:05.560 macronutrient profiles that these groups were eating. And, um, they were trying different ratios

00:44:10.520 and that sort of thing. And it was, it was pretty telling. So, um, protein based on that study was the

00:44:15.300 least important. Really? That's, that's like, like you said, counterintuitive. Yeah. Yeah. It was,

00:44:21.220 it was the one where the high, the, the guys that were on the high protein diet at the sacrifice of,

00:44:26.940 and obviously they were controlling caloric intake too. Right. So it's like, yeah, that's the other

00:44:31.500 measurement is, is if, um, you know, let's say they were all, I don't remember the exact calorie

00:44:37.240 number, but let's just say they're all somewhere in like mid, mid two thousands, probably 2,500.

00:44:41.460 That's usually kind of the, the, the per day you're saying calories per day, per day. Yeah. It's

00:44:45.940 usually like a range kind of where they put things. So, um, say they were all eating the same amount

00:44:51.100 of calories, but the guys who were on the, on the, uh, high protein diet at the, at the expense

00:44:57.160 of, because any of these, these macronutrients have calories in them. They, at the expense of

00:45:03.060 the other ones, um, they actually had the lowest testosterone levels. So like the expensive fats

00:45:08.500 and carbs. So they were replacing fats and carbs with proteins that would have an impact

00:45:13.560 on testosterone. Yes. Okay. So they're at these high protein levels. What would you say as far

00:45:19.380 as like a ratio would be? What, what would that ratio be? Um, in the high protein ratio? Yeah.

00:45:25.960 Um, I think for most guys, that's kind of like, if you have protein, uh, over 55, up 60% of the diet.

00:45:35.880 Then that's high. Then you would consider that high. Yep. Okay. And, um, yeah, that's pretty high.

00:45:41.780 That's where, for like average size guys going up into that range and above, uh, you're getting like

00:45:46.700 220 grams of protein a day and above. Um, so then the, the other findings were cool too.

00:45:55.860 They found that, that the ratios with carbs and fats indicated, um, and it kind of debunks the

00:46:03.140 whole idea that you see on both sides of like, oh, carbs are better for testosterone or, oh,

00:46:07.360 fats are better for testosterone. They had similar results on both groups. Uh, that, so people that

00:46:12.440 did higher fat, people that did higher carb, similar results. And, um, the, but, but really

00:46:20.200 what it indicated to everyone was that it, it, uh, the carbs and the fats are the most important

00:46:24.620 thing. And what they did is they went back in and, and you have to have a, uh, obviously

00:46:28.860 a baseline level of protein, um, to support, uh, the level of training and recovery that you

00:46:35.280 need.

00:46:35.440 Right. You can't have no protein.

00:46:37.660 Yeah. Yeah. But you can have a lot less than you think. Um, so the, it's, it's pretty cool,

00:46:43.480 especially if you're maximizing your anabolic hormones at the same time.

00:46:47.280 Well, I've seen some of these guys, there's a guy I follow on Instagram. I can't remember his

00:46:50.000 name right off hand. He's a vegetarian and the guy's jacked. Like he's, he's a big dude. So he's, 0.95

00:46:55.300 I mean, I'm sure he's replacing protein with something else, but I can't imagine it's somebody

00:46:59.120 that's on like the carnivore diet.

00:47:01.000 Yeah. Yeah. That they're definitely different. The, and the levels of protein. Um, and, and,

00:47:09.120 uh, yeah, I don't know. I don't know what to think about a lot of the vegetarian, like a lot of these 1.00

00:47:13.900 Instagram guys. I don't know what to think about them.

00:47:16.680 Well, and it's hard, you know, you, you, you can see something on the outside and a story can be

00:47:21.140 told that can't be verified. And there's a lot of other little moving parts that you're not really

00:47:25.360 familiar with. So, yeah, I mean, I'm not saying we need to take that as, as doctrine necessarily,

00:47:29.700 but it's just a, just an interesting perspective, I guess.

00:47:33.420 Yeah. There, there's actually a lot of people thinking this way now, um, with moving back

00:47:38.300 toward lower protein intakes. And I think a lot of the protein dogma that's been around the last

00:47:43.900 20 years has been mostly just like really good marketing from supplement companies.

00:47:49.660 Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, everything's marketing for sure.

00:47:52.480 Yeah. And, um, well with, uh, with the fats though, it's pretty interesting. So in this,

00:48:00.500 this study like led me down a freaking rabbit hole for the next eight years since I read it.

00:48:05.420 And with, with regards to the fats, because what they did is they broke down the fats and they

00:48:11.180 looked at different types of fatty acid, um, makeup and, uh, they measured that against testosterone

00:48:16.920 levels. So, um, saturated fats were the best for supporting testosterone levels and mono and

00:48:24.940 saturated fats, uh, came in second and mono and saturated would be something like you get from

00:48:30.640 olives or avocados. Okay.

00:48:33.240 Um, polyunsaturated fats were the worst and polyunsaturated fats, um, are basically, uh, very

00:48:42.440 weak, uh, bonds and they're easily denatured, easily can go rancid, uh, with light and heat.

00:48:49.140 And so it's, you know, it makes sense. Like if you have a rancid oil in your body or rancid

00:48:54.060 substance of some kind in your body, uh, that it would negatively affect your hormones.

00:48:59.060 I think you were talking about this with even like deep frying things. If I remember right,

00:49:03.300 when we had talked initially that, that, that actually causes these, um, these, what are they

00:49:08.560 polyunsaturated fats to, to break down and go rancid, like you were saying?

00:49:11.740 Yes. Yeah. The, the, and that's kind of the shame is that most people use these types of

00:49:16.340 oils for frying or just use in restaurants for cooking.

00:49:19.960 It's like vegetable oil, right?

00:49:22.420 Yeah. Vegetable oils. So it's interesting cause it's called vegetable oils too. And then the,

00:49:28.120 it's not even like they're made mostly, most of them are from seeds, uh, which is, I don't know

00:49:32.940 why they call it vegetable oils. I was looking up kind of the whole story behind all that and it's

00:49:36.360 probably marketing like you were saying earlier.

00:49:37.980 Yeah. I think it's more, it's a lot of propaganda.

00:49:40.120 Yeah. Um, the, that story is wild. It's the, it's basically just a quick aside of, of like,

00:49:48.340 why, why these oils are in our food supply right now is the, uh, in the early 1900s,

00:49:55.260 there was a excess of cotton seed oil and, uh, it was used in industrial use for paint mostly.

00:50:01.860 Okay. And, uh, there was an excess of it. And, uh, the, there's, there've always been,

00:50:07.480 and there were, especially at this time, a lot of these groups, like the coalition for this or the,

00:50:11.960 uh, aluminum group, you know, what, what was that? Alcoa or whatever, like got fluoride in our

00:50:17.280 water, water supply. Um, there, there was all these groups back then and they're, I'm sure they're

00:50:22.460 still around. Um, but there is likely a group that facilitated. This is like, we have an excess of

00:50:28.980 this industrial material. Uh, we need to find something to do with it. Make, makes sense.

00:50:34.160 Right. So, um, there were three companies specifically that started to introduce this,

00:50:39.280 uh, type of oil into food products. It was, uh, JM Smucker, Wesson and Procter and Gamble.

00:50:47.420 Hmm. And, um, and this was like early 1900s and, uh, they, they basically started marketing as a,

00:50:56.260 um, uh, butter replacement or a tallow or a lard replacement, that sort of thing.

00:51:02.040 And using, and that's, you know, margarine came around the Wesson cooking oils, Crisco,

00:51:07.640 all that stuff came out of this. And, um, they're basically these, these easily rancidized fats

00:51:14.760 that, especially with heat that you should never, you should never consume because they,

00:51:20.400 they, uh, not only damage your reproductive hormone functioning, but they also damage

00:51:24.040 your thyroid. And that's where I started. The more I started reading about, uh, these types of

00:51:28.640 fatty acids, I was like, Dan, this stuff is bad. And the thyroid, is that, is that responsible for

00:51:33.880 regulating these hormones as well? Uh, it, it plays a part in the whole system. Yes. And, but it's,

00:51:39.760 it's, uh, uh, chiefly responsible for, uh, metabolism and the thyroid hormones help regulate

00:51:45.460 your metabolism. Okay. So, um, the, now what gets really interesting is the, um, what happened

00:51:53.440 after that, there was a guy, uh, had a lab, uh, George Burr. And he came up with, he had this theory

00:52:01.840 about, I think it was like a purely a scientific theory before it was a bit compromised, um, about

00:52:08.480 essential fatty acid deficiency. And, um, he had this, he was doing experiments in his lab

00:52:15.080 about trying to prove that it seems like it was more from what I've read, it was more trying to

00:52:20.700 prove instead of disprove, um, that this was real. And the, uh, the guys, um, well, actually he'd been

00:52:29.540 running some experiments on rats and he noticed that they were like, uh, respirating a lot. So there

00:52:34.020 was a lot of, uh, escape from oxygen of escape of oxygen from the body of these rats. When he,

00:52:39.560 when he was, uh, he made these like very carefully devised diets that were higher in sugar,

00:52:43.760 had zero fatty acids in them. Um, so there's no, no fat at all, uh, especially none of these, uh,

00:52:50.360 types of polyunsaturated fats. And, um, they were mostly just eating different types of sugar,

00:52:56.160 including, uh, lactose was one of the sugars. So it was like, it was like a mixture of,

00:53:00.260 of, uh, sucrose, fructose, glucose, lactose, and something else. And, um, galactose maybe.

00:53:09.820 And, and what he found was like, they were actually just, uh, um, there was a lot of oxygen

00:53:16.460 being produced by these rats. And, um, he thought that was potentially, that was a bad thing.

00:53:22.240 It actually happened to be a good thing because the, the, uh, respiratory quotient is, which was

00:53:28.540 what they were measuring is a indicator of a healthy thyroid and a high metabolism,

00:53:33.360 which I guess he didn't know that. Which is what, how much the body, how much oxygen

00:53:38.460 the body is consuming or, or. Yeah. Let me, let me look it up. I was just looking up the actual

00:53:45.040 like direct definition of this. Yeah. The, uh, yeah, the respiratory, respiratory quotient. So there,

00:53:51.480 there's this, like you want to shoot for, apparently you want to shoot for like a 1.0. So, um,

00:53:57.160 let's see respiratory quotient. Okay. Here, here's, uh, one thing like, so I think it's basically

00:54:06.420 just the amount of oxygen that you're using. Um, so what, but one thing that like what he found

00:54:13.580 with it was the, uh, the, the, one of the guys in his lab, one of the, um, research assistants

00:54:21.260 or whatever, or grad students or whoever it was, he actually tried it on himself. So it was a human

00:54:26.340 trial. And it was, it was interesting. He had this like really good experience having no,

00:54:32.780 no fatty acids. Um, he went through a six month trial, his body weight went from 152 pounds down to,

00:54:41.080 um, 138 pounds where his metabolic rate was measured at both instances at the beginning and the end.

00:54:47.700 And it was at the beginning, it was 12% below normal. And at the end it was just 2% below normal.

00:54:53.360 So it went up, uh, almost completely normalized. Uh, he ate 250 or 2, uh, 2,500 calories per day,

00:55:00.640 mostly from these sugars. And, um, that was like his body weight went down, metabolism normalized.

00:55:07.780 And you wouldn't think that for, especially for that weight of a guy that 2,500 calories per day

00:55:12.840 of sugar. Um, that's interesting. And he had these, uh, psychological effects too. Like he,

00:55:18.520 he said that he had massive energy throughout the work days. Like he used to kind of be done at the

00:55:23.680 end of the day or like in the afternoon, kind of that slump that everyone has. And he said that

00:55:27.720 his fatigue completely disappeared on the diet. His migraines went away in like two weeks or three

00:55:32.580 weeks. And he had mild, he had migraines, no, six weeks. His migraines, uh, he'd have migraines

00:55:39.180 since he was a kid and is with the respiratory quotient. It basically, uh, was above, it stayed

00:55:45.380 above 1.0 and it hit as high as 1.14 during month six. Uh, whereas a type two diabetic has a

00:55:52.400 respiratory quotient in the 0.7 range. Oh, wow. Yeah. So, so what kind of foods was he eating

00:56:00.480 that? I mean, that's cause you talk about these, these sugars, but what specifically kind of foods

00:56:04.280 are we talking about here? Um, I think a lot of what they were doing was using juices,

00:56:08.020 um, and like mixtures of the, of the starch and the, and the sugars into like a liquid.

00:56:15.040 So basically what, what I'm understanding or what I'm hearing is that the, the, the proteins

00:56:19.260 aren't as significant as maybe as we once thought. Yeah. The proteins aren't, and the fats definitely

00:56:23.740 aren't in terms of unsaturated fats. Um, and that, uh, and that a high sugar diet is not necessarily,

00:56:31.400 um, as bad as people would think. And, um, it says, actually it says here,

00:56:37.300 he was also taking baking soda. So, uh, mineral oil, salt, vitamin D3, vitamin A, and iron along.

00:56:46.340 So he was getting a lot of these micronutrients then that you're, you're referring to as well.

00:56:51.100 Interesting. Yep. Yep. And then the, the rest of it was just from like, I guess,

00:56:54.920 liquid mixtures of glucose, fructose, lactose, sucrose, and potato starch.

00:56:59.040 Interesting. So, so, all right. So we've got, we've covered micronutrients, um, nutrition. So

00:57:04.600 these are more of your macros then, then, then what else is into consideration?

00:57:09.380 Yep. So, uh, yeah, sorry. I went off on a little tangent. I just thought that was an interesting

00:57:13.560 story. The, um, because that, that got picked up by the, the propaganda machine of the 1900s

00:57:20.700 in terms of the essential fatty acid deficiency thing. But yeah, so, so, uh, next up the, um,

00:57:27.700 my opinion about carbohydrates from what I've seen are that you want, um, like fructose is very

00:57:35.280 protective and, uh, fructose is very good for your thyroid, uh, getting fruit in its natural form from,

00:57:41.960 from fruits, like a, a real fruit and just eat it. It's got the natural amount of fiber that you're

00:57:46.900 going to want in it. And, uh, it, it will, uh, it's, it will also be very easy to digest and it

00:57:52.720 has a lot of prebiotic fibers. Right. So you want to eat a banana, not like banana pudding.

00:57:57.560 Yeah. Yeah. Gotcha. Banana cream pie. That's right. Which is delicious. Yeah. You could,

00:58:03.800 you could say that and say, well, I got my, my fruits for the day, right? Yeah. I mean, eating,

00:58:07.880 eating fruits is awesome. They're, they're, they're a lot of nutrients in the fruits and they're very

00:58:12.300 easy to digest. Um, starches that, that don't contain, uh, mineral chelators like, um, uh, like

00:58:21.800 potatoes and squash, uh, sweet potatoes, white rice. Um, those are preferable, especially people 1.00

00:58:29.080 that are training. Um, and yeah, it's just, it's a very simple way of eating. Uh, and it, it maximizes

00:58:37.880 mineral, vitamin and mineral absorption and minimizes any chelation and the idea of like

00:58:43.580 binding prematurely binding those minerals because they're all charged and they need to

00:58:48.200 be in the ionic form to be able to be absorbed by the, the intestine and, uh, certain mineral

00:58:55.160 chelators like you'd find in, um, grains, uh, beans, nuts, seeds. Uh, they contain these things

00:59:03.020 that will potentially bind those minerals that you want from you and they will keep it from

00:59:07.780 being absorbed. So those will just pass, those just pass through you then. Is that what you're

00:59:11.340 saying? Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Yep. Yeah. This makes sense that there, there's so many little

00:59:17.760 moving parts here, but it makes sense when you, when you address it this way and really the simplicity

00:59:21.540 of it. Cool. Yeah. Good. Yeah. I'm just trying to like figure out a system, a framework to think

00:59:27.480 within for people. Well, I think the biggest framework is, is moving from the scientific names

00:59:32.780 to, okay, what food should people actually be consuming? Like that, that's what somebody

00:59:37.640 like myself or, you know, the average person listening would, would probably say, okay,

00:59:40.860 I got that. But like, what food should I be eating that contain these things?

00:59:46.040 Yeah. I mean, the, so, uh, like the simplest way to think about it is a friend of mine put

00:59:51.340 it this way when I was explaining it to him and he's like the world's biggest skeptic and,

00:59:56.080 uh, he loves being a skeptic. And, uh, I was explaining this, the whole philosophy to him and,

01:00:01.880 um, he ended up getting super into it, which was a really good sign. And the way that he

01:00:05.300 explained it was fruits and roots for the, the main carb source. Um, so they're not,

01:00:11.860 it's, it's not necessarily vegetables. It's, it's the roots. So they're, you know, you know,

01:00:16.020 the, it's tubers, it's potatoes, sweet potatoes, uh, radishes, carrots, that sort of thing.

01:00:22.940 Onions. Yeah. Because last time we were talking, you had talked about the, the, like you shouldn't

01:00:28.140 be consuming the leafs. Is that right? Yeah. I, I think basically I, what I say is that

01:00:33.940 there's unnecessary and there it's something you shouldn't consume in high quality, high

01:00:39.000 quantities, uh, because especially raw, which most people consume leaves raw, uh, because

01:00:45.680 there's just indicate like they contain things that are called goitrogens that, um, that will

01:00:51.320 block iodine uptake in your thyroid gland. And a lot of people just don't realize that. I mean,

01:00:58.280 it's, it's one of those just things that we've heard forever since we're little kids, eat your

01:01:02.120 salad or eat your broccoli or whatever. Um, that it's not necessarily, it's not necessary to be

01:01:09.600 healthy, to eat these things. And especially if you eat them in high quantities, which some people

01:01:15.120 do, um, it might be something that you want to reconsider and, uh, opt for something that's not

01:01:20.820 going to be blocking that iodine uptake or have these kind of these like natural responses. If you

01:01:26.080 think about the evolutionary logic of, um, eating plants, certain plants, uh, the, the roots themselves

01:01:35.020 are going to naturally have, they're going to contain a lot of the nutrients that the plant

01:01:38.960 needs to grow healthy. Well, I mean, that's where it's, it's consuming it from the dirt. So like,

01:01:42.880 that's the closest access or source to the nutrient. Exactly. Yeah. It's good. And especially if

01:01:48.300 you're growing your plants in great dirt, you know, you got rich soil and you're going to get a ton of

01:01:53.160 these minerals in the plant and then they're stored in the roots and they basically come up through the

01:01:59.280 stock. Usually then the leaves are, are the, the energy producers of the plant. Right. So, um, they

01:02:06.140 need to protect themselves. They need to evolve to protect themselves against predators and, uh,

01:02:11.880 against like the long-term consumption of that plant because it, you know, say if people got like

01:02:16.400 super into eating a plant and they had no real sustainable way of growing it, they would eat it out

01:02:20.180 of existence or, or same with animals. You can, you can hunt things out of existence. And, uh, it makes

01:02:26.380 sense that the, the plants would naturally evolve these, these mechanisms to defend against long-term

01:02:31.540 consumption or making it like a habit to consume for generations of, of, you know, one thing just for

01:02:37.920 their own survival. Right. Which then you're consuming that. Yeah. Well, and then if, but if you look at

01:02:42.220 fruits, for example, too, so fruits have to be in order to spread the fruit of a plant is what contains

01:02:49.060 the seed. Sure. And in order for that plant to continue, um, the fruit needs to either be eaten

01:02:57.280 and the seeds, the seeds can't be digested. So they get shat out basically. Right. And that goes

01:03:02.860 somewhere in the ground. Right. And then the, especially if you're looking at like not, not

01:03:07.320 having a sewage system or something, but it's actually just a little bit going on the ground.

01:03:10.980 And, uh, the other alternative for the, for the fruit is to just rot and fall off the tree.

01:03:16.280 Right. And, and then it'll be on the ground again. So, and then maybe a bird picks it up or does

01:03:21.560 something. It just, you know, they spread the, that the nature of the fruit is that it needs to

01:03:26.560 be eaten or it rots and the seeds needs, the seed needs to spread somewhere. Um, so that makes total

01:03:32.160 sense that it would be so easy to digest. It would be so healthy and rich in minerals, uh, for the

01:03:38.080 animals that are consuming it. So we've talked a lot about, uh, a lot. Um, we've talked about

01:03:43.060 micronutrients, uh, macronutrients. We've talked about, uh, training. Is there any other

01:03:48.760 considerations that we ought to, we ought to consider as we try to boost our testosterone

01:03:54.620 levels and balance ourselves out hormonally?

01:03:57.780 Yeah. There's a, there are a lot of lifestyle factors, which I think are, they're fun to think

01:04:02.200 about, fun to talk about. Um, things like sleep, sex, uh, uh, meditation, even, um, being

01:04:10.940 in nature. Like these are things I call activators. I like to classify things as like a activator

01:04:17.440 or a blocker. Okay. And a lot of these lifestyle elements, I mean, the activator blocker thing

01:04:22.320 can also be training and food and so forth. But with the lifestyle elements, it's, it's

01:04:28.740 a good way to think about is like, is this habit that I have, or is this thing that I'm

01:04:32.140 doing, is this actively bringing me closer to my goal or is it bringing me farther away

01:04:37.700 from my goal? Um, so the, uh, uh, sleep, for example, that's pretty obvious one. That's,

01:04:43.600 that's a big one for a lot of people. Right. Um, yeah. I mean, I think most people are just

01:04:49.300 are, are under sleeping. Yeah. And even when they are sleeping, it's not, it's not great

01:04:55.220 sleep. Yeah. And there are ways to fix that, uh, that you don't need to use a lot of these

01:05:02.380 drugs that people are going towards for it. And, um, you can get, just work with your body

01:05:07.780 to naturally get toward that state where you fall asleep quickly and you stay asleep all

01:05:13.040 night. Um, one of the most effective things that I've found for this is glycine and it's,

01:05:20.420 uh, it's an amino acid and it's considered a protective amino acid. It's an anti-stress amino

01:05:25.120 acid. So it's going to help to rebalance your, your, uh, hormones and rebound and, and

01:05:31.440 especially like put you to sleep. It's kind of a relaxant type of thing. If you consume

01:05:35.560 it in high enough quantities, um, do you, do you take this in and not in, in like a pill

01:05:40.900 form or, uh, you can, you can take it in a pill form or, but to get the amount that you

01:05:46.340 would want for sleep, um, the, uh, a powder would be best. Um, we actually made a supplement

01:05:54.120 for Umzu called total sleep and it's, it's got a ton of glycine. I think it's like three grams

01:06:00.360 per little scoop. And, um, I take two scoops of that every night. It tastes like a, like

01:06:06.260 a little lemon tea. We've got some lemon, lemon balm in there as well and some magnesium

01:06:09.200 and yeah, I mean, just puts you out, but you don't have a sleep hangover in the morning

01:06:14.860 either. You feel better. You feel great. And glycine is actually a key element of growth

01:06:19.740 hormone secretion, especially at night. Um, there was a study that was really cool. It

01:06:25.740 found that there was a, they did a mixture of, uh, of glycine, glutamine and niacin. And,

01:06:32.320 um, it basically, uh, increased, uh, growth hormone production in the subjects by 70%,

01:06:38.740 which is definitely, that's almost doubling.

01:06:41.820 Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah. So I, I love recommending glycine cause I think it's, it's like underrated.

01:06:48.940 Most people don't, haven't heard about it, but you got to take it in the right quantity and,

01:06:52.220 and, uh, it can work wonders. Yeah. I think that's a good, that's a good place to, um,

01:06:58.720 to, to really focus again. Cause I think it's something that a lot of people don't focus on.

01:07:02.440 Although I think we inherently all know this, or at least moving towards knowing some of these things,

01:07:06.760 right? Like, cause I think the common thought is, well, I'll just sleep when I'm dead.

01:07:11.780 I got things to do so I can't sleep versus, Hey, this is actually part of the recovery process and

01:07:16.940 something that will actually help you perform better as a man.

01:07:19.080 Yeah. I mean, it's, um, it's a crucial aspect. The, the, if you get a good night's sleep,

01:07:25.780 you can kind of do whatever you want. Like you can do that whole, I found that the better I sleep,

01:07:30.360 I get more into that zone of, of like the idea of time collapsing or like controlling my time

01:07:35.280 throughout the day. So I'm less reactive. I feel more in tune with just the, my daily actions. And,

01:07:41.480 and, uh, I don't really react to a lot of what people are doing, but if I'm, if I'm like

01:07:47.620 deprived of sleep and I, I'm a bit on edge, then it's a lot easier to just react to people.

01:07:53.580 And there's plenty of studies also showing like large drops in testosterone levels. Uh, there was

01:07:58.720 one where if, if people had as little, I can't remember the exact hours, I think it was like

01:08:03.100 two hour deprivation over a course of a certain period of time. Um, it cut their testosterone

01:08:08.000 levels in half. So it's, it doesn't take much of a continued, uh, drop in the sleep quality.

01:08:14.700 And that's why sleep I think is one of these high leverage things. I think it's, it's something

01:08:18.340 if, if you have low T, uh, you want to pick probably a few things that you can handle that

01:08:23.740 you think you want to focus on that are high leverage, maybe one in each category. Like,

01:08:27.960 all right, I, even without measuring, like maybe I'm deficient in this thing or that thing.

01:08:33.380 Um, looking at some, cause you can find that stuff online and in the book too, we talk about

01:08:37.420 like signs of these deficiencies and, um, submit you, I pick that thing. You might say, okay,

01:08:41.900 I'm, I'm eating a lot of polyunsaturated fats. I should probably just try, let me just cut them

01:08:46.040 out of my diet for a month and see how I feel. Next up, I'm going to pick a lifestyle factor.

01:08:51.580 I'm going to focus on my sleep and I'm going to work on, uh, getting a full, you know, eight hours

01:08:57.340 of sleep per night. Maybe you're only getting four and a half or five or six, try and, try and get

01:09:01.760 eight. And then, uh, focusing on, you know, I'm going to try one, like I'm going to try a

01:09:07.320 supplement that's been proven in a ton of studies to increase my testosterone. So you might try using

01:09:13.080 something like ashwagandha and use that for a month. I think that's a good way to think about

01:09:18.580 it. Probably for a lot of guys listening is just like pick one thing in each area and do these

01:09:23.660 self experiments for a month, start to figure out what's going to work for you. And then it's,

01:09:29.360 it's a, it's a manageable thing too, because you might see, see the book and see, it's like,

01:09:34.400 you're 500 pages, right? It's like a medical reference. You're like, I don't know if I'm

01:09:38.540 going to go through this whole thing. Yeah. It's more of a reference book and it should be that

01:09:42.020 way. And, but it could be overwhelming if you're like, damn, I got to do all this stuff at once.

01:09:47.780 Yeah. So maybe it's a good way to think about it. Just like pick these things and sleep for sure is 0.92

01:09:52.580 a massive leverage thing. Um, because of that stuff, like if you're sleeping really well and, uh,

01:09:58.360 that sleep cycle app is really great to, to measure the quality because it kind of gamifies it.

01:10:03.240 Have you ever used that app? No sleep cycle is what it's called. Sleep cycle. Yeah. It's pretty

01:10:07.240 cool app. You just kind of set the phone, uh, you got to plug it in and you just kind of set it on the

01:10:11.500 side of, uh, of the bed so that I don't, I don't know exactly how it does it, but it like listens

01:10:16.380 to your movements throughout the night. Oh, really? Yeah. And it can, it uses that like nighttime

01:10:21.340 activity, I guess, to measure and kind of calibrate like how good of quality of sleep you're having.

01:10:27.300 It's kind of, kind of wild when you see these graphs in the morning, you're like, Whoa,

01:10:30.380 what the heck? Cause it shows you like the deep, deep sleep. It shows you more restless sleep and

01:10:36.680 it fluctuates throughout the night and then it gives you a score. So that's nice. Cause then you

01:10:42.720 have something to like a benchmark where you're always constantly trying to improve against,

01:10:45.840 right? Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. So if you start maximizing your sleep, maybe take a month and

01:10:50.600 like focus on that. And then you start hitting above 90% every night and you're like, okay,

01:10:54.900 I got this dialed in. I'm getting pretty good at it. And then you could pick something else,

01:10:57.940 move on to something else. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I like it. Well, Christopher, this has been

01:11:01.580 fascinating, man. I know we could talk about more, but for the sake of time and everything

01:11:04.940 else that you've already got available and out there, um, we'll, we'll begin to wind things

01:11:08.320 down. I do want to ask you some questions. Uh, the first one is what does it mean to be a man?

01:11:12.760 Yeah. So the, I think it, it means what it means to be a man is to, uh, realize that you're not

01:11:19.260 entitled to anything and to take that approach in life. I think it's very masculine approach to,

01:11:25.720 uh, realize that you need to work for everything that you, um, that you want to reap essentially.

01:11:34.560 So what you want to reap. And I told the story last time we recorded about my dad telling me that when

01:11:40.100 I was a little kid and I was complaining about, we were raking the woods, which I still think is

01:11:45.680 kind of nuts, but we were out in the woods, raking the woods and we were bagging up all the leaves in

01:11:50.120 the woods behind the house. And I was like, why the heck are we doing this? And, uh, and he just

01:11:57.100 turns to me and he's like, he's like, you're entitled to nothing. You need to work harder.

01:12:00.340 You need to always remember that and work harder. Um, like you don't deserve to, to not do this

01:12:06.620 pretty much. Right. Um, and of everything you said, I think that thing that stuck with me the most.

01:12:13.320 And I was like that, the more you think about it, I'm like, you know, that's very, um, very

01:12:17.240 masculine thing. That's a very, um, masculine ideal. And, uh, it's, it's really helped me a lot

01:12:23.740 in my life since then to, I always revert back anytime I want to complain. I'm like, man, fuck, 0.99

01:12:29.160 no, I'm, I'm not entitled to this. Right. Right. It's a powerful way, uh, to, to think. And then it 1.00

01:12:34.700 causes of course that, that growth and you putting in the effort required to, to succeed.

01:12:39.240 Yeah. I think that's probably a big difference between just anyone who's successful at anything

01:12:43.680 and anyone who's not is doing that work and having that sort of mindset, um, continually

01:12:50.380 working on something, not, not stopping. Yeah. Right on. Well, cool. How do we connect

01:12:55.560 with you and learn about, uh, more about what you're doing and, uh, and, and just connect?

01:12:59.860 Uh, yeah, probably the best, best place to connect, um, personally is just on Instagram.

01:13:04.520 It's, uh, at underscore Christopher Walker. Um, I, I check my DMS or I try to check them

01:13:11.300 often, um, answer any questions people have. Yeah. And then on YouTube, it's just Christopher

01:13:17.180 Walker on YouTube. Um, I've got a lot, if, if any of you are specifically seeking like a lot

01:13:21.360 of detailed information, there are, uh, hundreds of videos there and I'll continue to be doing

01:13:26.380 more. So there's a lot, a lot to learn over there if you're interested in this sort of thing.

01:13:30.200 Yeah. Your videos are great. I really like your videos, so I can't recommend those highly

01:13:33.400 enough. Oh, cool. Thank you. Cool. Put a lot of work into those things.

01:13:37.680 You can tell you do a great job and it's really valuable information. So I get a lot from them.

01:13:42.300 Thank you. Appreciate it. Right on. Well, we'll sync everything up. So the guys know where to go

01:13:45.840 and know where to connect. Christopher, I appreciate you for doing another round since,

01:13:48.880 uh, we didn't get the first one, right. But, um, I guess this has been so valuable. I know the

01:13:52.600 guys are getting a lot from this and I really appreciate you imparting some wisdom upon us.

01:13:58.260 There it is, gents, my conversation with Christopher Walker. I hope that that was enlightening to you.

01:14:02.520 I know we talked about a lot. I know it went in a couple of different places, but I think all of

01:14:07.260 this is important in the grand scheme of how we increase our testosterone levels, which will

01:14:11.760 inevitably help us perform better. It helped us perform better with our spouses, with our

01:14:17.440 interactions with them, of course, sexually as well, our sexual performance. Um, it'll also help

01:14:22.060 with our children. It'll help with the way that we show up in the gym and our physical fitness.

01:14:26.440 It'll help in our business and the drive and the motivation and discipline and action towards

01:14:31.340 those, those goals that we have in our business. It'll help in every facet of life. So if you are

01:14:37.080 someone who wants to learn how to more adequately up your testosterone levels, then I would highly, 0.88

01:14:44.460 highly suggest that you consider picking up a copy of Christopher's book, master your tea. Again,

01:14:50.040 it's a pretty in-depth book here, but I think it's really going to shed some light on how we do this

01:14:53.940 safely and naturally. Uh, also connect with us on Instagram. I know Christopher's very,

01:14:58.400 very active on Instagram as am I connect with us there or on Twitter or Facebook, wherever you're

01:15:03.340 doing the social media thing. And as I said before, if you would make sure you leave a rating and

01:15:07.880 review, I think we're up to, I want to say 2,500 ratings and reviews, but, uh, it'd be good to get

01:15:13.840 that up to about 3000. So that means 500 ratings or reviews. If we really push this hard, I think we

01:15:20.100 can. And ultimately it's not about the ratings and reviews. It's about the visibility. It's about

01:15:24.160 promoting this to other men in your life. Fathers, brothers, colleagues, coworkers, friends who need

01:15:30.120 the information that we're sharing because they have a desire to be more fully the men that are

01:15:35.300 capable of being as well. So guys, I want to say thank you as we sign out for today. Couldn't do

01:15:40.480 this without you honored to be standing shoulder to shoulder in the battle to reclaim and restore

01:15:44.800 masculinity. I'll let you get going until tomorrow for our ask me anything, but until then take action

01:15:51.080 and become the man you are meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

01:15:56.640 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

01:16:00.660 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

Order of Man - April 16, 2019

Master Your Testosterone Levels ｜ CHRISTOPHER WALKER

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