Order of Man - MAT FRASER ｜ Hard Work Pays Off

00:00:00.000 The path to personal progress and growth can be a frustrating road. Change is often so incremental

00:00:05.980 or barely even noticeable. And because so, a lot of men choose to throw in the towel way too soon

00:00:12.380 before they even give themselves a fighting chance to change the trajectory of their lives.

00:00:17.020 Today, I'm joined by five-time fittest man on earth, Matt Fraser, to talk about the path of

00:00:22.480 hard work. We cover tiny progressions along the way, looking for and being ready to capitalize

00:00:28.620 on opportunities, the dangers in tying your identity to performance, also the pros and cons

00:00:35.240 of self-criticism, what he refers to as the rubber band theory, and other psychological strategies

00:00:42.360 that he employed on his way to becoming the most dominant CrossFit athlete in its history.

00:00:47.800 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart your

00:00:52.800 own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time. You are not

00:00:58.460 easily deterred, defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is your life. This is who you

00:01:04.920 are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done,

00:01:10.280 you can call yourself a man.

00:01:12.480 Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is Ryan Mickler. I'm your host and also the founder

00:01:16.640 of the Order of Man podcast and movement. It is incredible to see what we've been able

00:01:21.280 to accomplish over the past, well, nearly seven years now. And I said the other day on Instagram

00:01:28.900 or Facebook posts, somewhere on socials, I said, you know, I might be the voice in the

00:01:33.320 face behind what we're doing here, but you guys are the engine. And before we get into

00:01:37.100 the conversation today, I just wanted to thank you for the work that you've done. Thank you

00:01:42.540 for sharing the podcast, leaving ratings and reviews, sharing episodes and conversations

00:01:48.480 with other people, reading the book, sending it to friends. Like I said, you guys are the

00:01:53.320 engine and I would be remiss if I didn't say thank you for all the work that you've done

00:01:58.480 on helping me myself become a better man. So guys, we've got a great conversation with

00:02:03.780 the one and only Matt Fraser today. Before we get into it, I just want to also extend a thank

00:02:08.380 you to our show sponsors and my friends over at origin USA. This is an organization, a company

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00:02:21.400 sourced and made in America, which I think is a very important component of business, especially

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00:02:53.600 then check out originusa.com. And when you do use the code order, O-R-D-E-R at checkout,

00:03:02.680 and you're going to save a little money. So you'll save some money. You'll support an organization,

00:03:06.700 a company that makes everything in America, 100% made and sourced here. And you'll look good in

00:03:12.240 the process. Again, originusa.com. Use the code order at checkout. All right, guys, with all that

00:03:20.100 said and done, I want to introduce you as if you needed an introduction to Matt Fraser. He's back on

00:03:25.820 the podcast. This is the second time we've had a conversation on this podcast to talk about his

00:03:29.980 latest book and the physical and mental and psychological training and strategy that went

00:03:36.600 into making him one of the greatest CrossFit athletes in its history. He's a five-time CrossFit

00:03:41.860 champion and fittest man on earth. And he's also the author of his newest book, Hard Work Pays Off.

00:03:47.520 I really enjoy my conversations, not just here, but even offline with Matt, because despite his

00:03:53.720 incredible success, he remains as humble as ever. And I personally always walk away with a ton of new

00:03:58.840 information to implement in my own life. Enjoy. Matt, what's up, brother? Great to have you back

00:04:04.640 on the podcast. How you doing, man? Good to see you again. I think I was thinking about, I'm like,

00:04:09.620 when's the last time I talked to you? And I think it was, I sent you a text or a message and we were

00:04:14.420 joking about Black Rifles, a place in San Antonio. You remember that? Yeah. I'm staying here at this

00:04:20.940 place. You're like, that place is creepy. Oh yeah. Oh my God. Yeah. I think, yeah, that,

00:04:28.160 that place, if you're there with a group of friends, it's like, it's an adult playground when

00:04:33.420 you're there by yourself and you've never seen it in the daylight. Creepiest place I've ever slept.

00:04:39.640 It was wild. And you said, you said you got there like late at night or there was like you and

00:04:43.320 somebody, one other person or something like that. I can't remember. Yeah. So Sammy and I,

00:04:48.020 so, I mean, it was a whole long story, but yeah. So talking to Evan, one of the owners and like,

00:04:55.040 every time I go, go to town, I stay at Matt's house and I was like, Oh, I don't want to be,

00:04:59.780 uh, you know, treating Matt's place like an Airbnb for myself. So I, I hit up Evan. I was like, Hey,

00:05:05.220 like, you mind if I crash with you for a couple of days? And he was like, yeah, yeah. Come on out.

00:05:10.180 He never told me that he moved to Utah. Like he, he didn't even live in Texas and he was not there.

00:05:16.480 Right. Yeah. And so he was referring to this place like, Oh yeah, you stay, stay at our place.

00:05:21.000 And I'm like, all right. So I'm thinking I'm going to his house. And then he gave me the

00:05:25.640 address. And then one of his employees, like, you can't send someone out there. That's never

00:05:29.180 been there before. It's so hard to get out there. You need to go off-roading. You need to go through

00:05:33.320 multiple gates. You're going to, if you think you're in the right place, you are not in the

00:05:37.260 right place. Um, and so one of the employees met us at a grocery store, took us out there and yeah,

00:05:44.820 we got out there like 10 or 11 PM. And it's like, for anyone listening, it's like a 40,000 square foot

00:05:50.240 basically like motel that like froze in the sixties or seventies. And it was like the hunting

00:05:58.600 camp for all the like original astronauts. So there's NASA guys like Buzz Aldrin on the wall

00:06:04.740 at this camp. And yeah, it, it smelt like it was the seventies and it was, it was a wild experience.

00:06:12.860 And I remember staying there and being like, there's so many points of entry, like, Oh yeah.

00:06:17.360 And the guy who dropped us off was like, Hey, and it's so safe. We don't lock any doors. Like I'm

00:06:22.140 like, dude, there's 104 doors. Like this is the start of a horror movie. Get me the fuck out of

00:06:31.280 here. We, yeah. Like the, the bathroom attached to our bedroom was like all mirrors. It was like

00:06:39.000 in the seventies, it was hot. It was cool. But yeah, Sam and I, we, we did that. And then I think the

00:06:44.340 next morning I hit up Matt and I was like, I'm coming over. Can I come to your place? Yeah.

00:06:47.940 Yeah. No, it was cool. I went out there and, um, they put in a, uh, they put in a three archery

00:06:54.660 course for adaptive athletes, um, for yeah. Yeah. Was that, did they have that when you were out

00:07:01.100 there? I think they were either starting it. I remember. Okay. So it was the next morning. Uh,

00:07:08.620 one of my buddies that worked for black rifle came out like unannounced. And, uh, and I just like

00:07:15.080 happened to like be going outside. Cause like they leave a Hummer and a four wheeler there.

00:07:18.780 Right. And I was like, Hey, you know how to drive a Hummer. Right. And I was like, no. And so I'm

00:07:23.920 exploring the property. I'm going around on a four wheeler and like stumble across some zebras.

00:07:29.060 Like they're just zebras on the property. But when I came back, my buddy Richard was there and,

00:07:34.500 and he, he brought out some guns. He's like, Hey, you want to do some shooting? I was like,

00:07:38.180 yeah, absolutely. And he brought out like his slow-mo camera, a 50 Cal and a 20 millimeter.

00:07:45.400 And so we just had an afternoon. Sounds about right. Yeah. Shooting some videos of it at like

00:07:50.540 a million frames a second. It was wild. Yeah. They, those guys are crazy, man. I love them to

00:07:56.180 death. We've, we've had some good times out there, but it is always a wild time when you're hanging out

00:08:00.740 with the black rifle guys. Yeah. You don't know what, what's coming. It's going to be good. You

00:08:05.340 just don't know what it's going to be. Last time I was with them, Evan, Evan hit me up and was like,

00:08:11.220 Hey, do you want to come down to Tampa and do offshore boat racing? And I was like, yeah,

00:08:17.260 absolutely. And then like, he gave me some of the details and something like gave me the inclination

00:08:24.380 that like, does he think I have a background in racing? And, and I said to, I was like, Hey,

00:08:30.260 you know, I've never raced a boat. Right. And he was like, Oh, I'm fucking well aware. He's like,

00:08:36.060 this is going to be wild. And, and it was a straight up, like the boats that you see on TV,

00:08:42.260 like a 40 foot cigar boat where it's like the windshield is eight inches. You have like this,

00:08:48.380 like 600 cubic inch motor. You're at a five point harness, a helmet with a scuba regulator in case

00:08:54.720 you crash. And, and we raced like aggressively top speed, wild, fully, fully ready. And like prepare

00:09:04.460 of like, you can't give someone with this little amount of training or experience, this type of

00:09:12.180 responsibility. And it was great. Like 93 miles an hour. Wait, did you drive the boat? Yeah.

00:09:18.700 Oh dang. It was terrifying. Oh, I bet. And it was like type of thing. Like you're in a five point

00:09:25.100 harness. And if the boat flips, you have to wait until it sinks to get out because it's an escape

00:09:32.700 hatch. You need to wait until everything equalizes. So you need to wait until your cab fills up with water

00:09:38.920 regulator before you can open the hatch. So if you flip, you need to throw in a scuba regulator

00:09:43.300 and like something as simple as like starting out, planing out like three, two, one, go. And you

00:09:49.680 floor it. And then it's just like, as soon as the nose lifts up like six inches, you can't see over it.

00:09:54.440 Right. And so you just point into a dirt, you just point into a direction that you don't think anyone

00:09:58.520 is you floor it. And it takes like 30, 40 seconds for it to plane out. And then really, so by the time

00:10:05.440 you see where you're going, you're doing 90 miles an hour, plus you're in full chop and like you're

00:10:11.440 going airborne and then you have to take a turn and I'm driving. And then my throttle man is like,

00:10:17.740 there's pylons out in the middle of the ocean. That's your racetrack. And he's like, hit the

00:10:22.540 fucking pylon. I'm like, no. Oh my gosh. What is the, so the throttle man is, is he controlling the

00:10:28.960 speed of it? Is that what he's doing? And you're steering basically all you, all you do is steer and he

00:10:34.220 runs the throttle. Yeah. Yeah. So it was a whole black rifle team. Um, so like Evan was one of the

00:10:41.200 drivers, Marcus, the trail was on the team. Uh, and then there's another seal guy and then myself.

00:10:47.340 And it was like, it's already the sketchiest thing that you can do. And then I think it was

00:10:54.780 Marcus drove right before me. And when he came in, he was, they were like, Hey, the transom's blowing.

00:10:59.460 So they had to like hoist, hoist the boat out of the water, replace the transom and then plop it

00:11:06.460 back in. And then they, before I get in, they go, Hey, so we had to find a replacement, uh,

00:11:12.780 transom from somebody else. Um, it's not the same one that we had before. This one is an inch

00:11:19.880 shallower. And so they're like, your top speed is going to increase five miles an hour. And it's,

00:11:25.780 it's going to be way wobblier and already perfect. That's exactly already the scariest thing. Like

00:11:32.900 how wobbly this boat is at top speed going in a straight line. And now I'm like, now it's faster

00:11:38.120 and more unstable. Fantastic. And yeah, my first or second lap, I went airborne and twisted in the air.

00:11:46.440 And when I landed, I blew out the power steering pump and then finished off the race. It was,

00:11:51.460 it was wild. Did anybody crash while you were out there?

00:11:56.040 No, I think I was the closest one to crashing. Cause I started like, I don't even know what you

00:12:01.660 call it, but like the boat, uh, the boat started like walking. And so like it would boom, boom,

00:12:07.200 boom. And just got more and more drastic. And my throttleman didn't say anything. So I was like,

00:12:12.080 all right, that's normal. This is normal. Yeah. And then it happened again. And I'm, I'm like,

00:12:16.860 oh, we're going to like disintegrate the boat. And, uh, and then I asked my throttle, I'm like,

00:12:21.600 yo, like, what do I do? And like, do I steer into it? Do I steer out of it? And he's like,

00:12:26.180 oh yeah, you can steer into it. Like, why didn't you say that the first time? Like

00:12:31.240 that's wild. The fact that we were left unsupervised with these boats was just crazy.

00:12:40.080 Did you, did you ever think you'd have like these incredible opportunities, you know,

00:12:46.260 to fuck? No. Oh my God. Like so many. And there's so many things like this, that, that I've,

00:12:53.040 I've just kind of fallen into my lap that in the moment, like Sam, like I'm always with Sammy when

00:12:59.760 these things happen and Sam and I will just kind of look at it. Like, how the fuck did we get here?

00:13:04.960 Yeah. Like, how was this our life? Like this was not supposed to be my reality. Um, you know,

00:13:11.180 like, and it obviously happens in little tiny progressions over time. So you don't, it's not

00:13:16.840 like you just plopped them in this new life. It's little, little tiny bit by bit. But if I look at it

00:13:22.640 objectively of like where I was 10 years ago, verse what we're doing now, it's so opposite. Like 10 years

00:13:30.420 ago, I worked the desk job in a cubicle, in a suit doing contracts with the government for an

00:13:36.260 aerospace company. That alone is weird to think of. I can't, I can't imagine you doing that. Like,

00:13:41.080 it just seems so foreign to me. I'm like, wait, what sitting behind a desk.

00:13:45.560 Right. Like dude. And like, and literally the reason I hated that job was because I had to wear

00:13:50.360 a collared shirt. And I like, at the time I was like finding a shirt that fits around my neck,

00:13:55.340 that isn't like a balloon around my waist and arms is not possible. It was just so uncomfortable

00:14:01.180 all the time. It was just like slightly getting choked for nine hours a day. Um, but I remember

00:14:06.940 the first time, first time Sam and I had that moment, we were in Australia and we were at a

00:14:11.280 friend's like winter home and it was on an Island. And there was only, I think six or 10 houses on this

00:14:17.960 Island. Island was six miles long and we're there midweek. So nobody's there. And, and our buddy was

00:14:24.780 like, Oh, if we go to the South side of the Island, we'll probably see some, some whales

00:14:29.660 there. They're migrating right now. Okay. And so Sam and I, Sam and I walked there on our way there.

00:14:35.420 We saw a kangaroo and it's like, Oh, that's pretty cool. But then we plopped down to this beach

00:14:38.300 six miles long, not a soul inside with no one else on this Island. And then we're watching a mother

00:14:44.920 and a baby whale breaching, just like just playing. And I remember sitting there with Sammy and like

00:14:51.160 audibly saying the words, like, how the fuck did we get here? Like, how is this our life?

00:14:55.300 How are we, how do we have these opportunities? And, you know, they, they come up bit by bit,

00:15:01.800 you know? Um, and so it's like, they gradually get more and more extreme over time. Um, and I just

00:15:08.780 try to do my best to make sure to say yes to him as even, even things that like, I know in the moment,

00:15:14.560 I'm not going to enjoy it. Um, but I know it's going to make a damn good story down the road.

00:15:18.800 So I'm like, dude, I'm in, let's go. Yeah. That's, I mean, look, well, I'll go back to

00:15:23.880 something you said, you said, you know, it just kind of fell on my lap, but I don't know if that

00:15:27.680 entirely does it justice either. You know, I mean, your mantra is hard work pays off. Right.

00:15:32.740 Yeah. And I think it's probably just a manifestation, not just, I think it is a

00:15:36.260 manifestation of that. Yeah. Oh yeah. Like once I look, look at it, like, you know, the connections,

00:15:42.920 you know, and it's so much just about who, you know, um, you know, getting connected with other

00:15:47.580 like-minded people that, you know, work hard, they revolve their lives around it. They do what

00:15:52.620 they have to do before they do the things that they want to do. But then when it's time to do

00:15:56.520 some shit that you want to do, they take advantage of it. Um, so once you get a group of friends like

00:16:01.740 that, holy shit, it, it, it makes for a good, but a dangerous time. So, you know, like Evan asked me,

00:16:07.860 like, Hey, you want a boat? You want to race a boat? I'm like, yeah, fuck. Yeah. The whole time.

00:16:12.260 Like, I remember being in the boat and thinking of like, I just want this to end. Like I just,

00:16:17.200 like, I'm like, I think when I did the boat race, I was like, I had either just announced

00:16:24.080 my retirement or I was just about to. And I was like, this is like a perfectly terrible story of

00:16:32.020 like, you know, I worked hard all this time and you know, I just retired. I'm just about to start

00:16:37.960 living out the fun years of my life and like something, something's going to go wrong and

00:16:42.940 like, Oh fuck. But it's like, all right, let's have fun with this. Fingers crossed. I'll take

00:16:48.600 every, every precaution I can to make sure that I'm safe. Um, but like, let's, let's get scared a

00:16:55.480 little bit. Yeah. And I think safe within reason too, right? Like everybody, it seems like more and

00:17:01.260 more people are so concerned with being safe that they don't, they won't go do anything. They won't

00:17:06.380 live their life at all. And that's a problem. Well, who, who was it? They said a quote, um,

00:17:12.500 that I related to very, very like, I was like, Oh, that, that put my thoughts into words and I

00:17:17.460 didn't know the right combination of words, but it, ah, fuck. I don't remember his name,

00:17:22.460 but he was saying like for kids to do dangerous things carefully. Like Jordan Peterson probably said

00:17:29.940 that's it. That's it. Um, like I, I like a lot of the stuff he says of, um, you know,

00:17:36.080 like, this is how kids learn, do dangerous things carefully, like think them through,

00:17:42.080 have supervision, take what precautions you can. Um, but I'm like, I look back at my childhood

00:17:48.180 and I'm like, Oh my God, I was fucking reckless. Um, but it's like, you don't just jump into doing

00:17:55.620 something dangerous. Like you take the steps all the way up to it. And like, so like with the boat

00:18:00.320 race, just cause it's like the one example that we're going off right now is like, like before we got

00:18:05.100 in the boat, we had to do a dunk tank. So you're in a simulated cockpit that they dunk and flip over

00:18:11.640 and you have to practice, you have to go through the steps, the order of operation of like pull the

00:18:16.960 regulator, clear the regulator, start breathing through that, break apart your, your five point

00:18:21.960 harness, grab the hatch, coordinate with your partner who goes out the hatch first. Like, and,

00:18:27.600 and a lot of guys were just like not paying attention. They didn't care. They're like, nah,

00:18:33.100 I'm good for me. I'm like, no, this is a very, very real possibility. I have no idea what I'm

00:18:37.940 doing with this boat. Like I've driven boats, but not a 40 foot cigar boat going 90. Um, and so I was

00:18:45.120 like really, really practicing and paying attention, watching other people get out. And like, so I'm

00:18:50.960 going to do dangerous shit, but I'm going, I'm going to like try to educate myself as much as possible

00:18:56.660 so I can mitigate as much damage as possible. If the worst comes.

00:19:01.500 No, I think that's, I think you're dead on with that. It's like, I can't remember the quote right

00:19:04.880 off hand. Um, you know, most people die, you know, they live, live till they're 70, but you know,

00:19:11.180 die at 40 or whatever. They die much earlier because they're not taking advantage of,

00:19:15.500 of their life and going out and embracing these things. Do you ever worry like to the level that

00:19:20.900 you've accomplished in your life? Do you ever worry that some of this stuff will shut off and

00:19:28.140 that it will go away? Are there concerns and fears about opportunities that may present themselves,

00:19:32.860 especially as your life changes over, over the last couple of years?

00:19:35.540 Like what will shut off? Like, like the opportunities or me actually seizing the opportunities?

00:19:40.220 No, I think you'll probably, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I imagine you're the kind

00:19:43.660 of guy who will always seize those as they come up. But I'm talking about just the opportunities in

00:19:47.420 general and that things will just dry up. Yeah. I mean, I think about that all the time.

00:19:53.900 It's never really a concern for me. Um, you know, like there's, there's changes that I know

00:20:00.980 like years ago that changes that I knew were coming and, and I was ready for them or I was excited for

00:20:08.660 them. And then even still, like, I'm a fool to think that my life is going to be the exact same in

00:20:14.520 five years. Like if my life is the exact same as it is right now, five years, I'll be pissed. Um,

00:20:20.060 but you know, even stuff as simple as traveling, when I first started competing, um, you know,

00:20:30.220 if there was an opportunity to travel somewhere, I took it. Like, it didn't matter what day of the

00:20:34.320 week. It didn't matter what time my flight was. I didn't fucking care. I'm like, this is an

00:20:38.840 incredible opportunity and I'm going to take it. And so like some, some, I went through stretches

00:20:45.860 where I was in school full-time and I would, I would fly out midnight, Thursday night. You know,

00:20:53.120 I would skip Friday of school. I'd have to bring all my books with me. I would compete. I would travel,

00:20:57.720 do whatever, catch the red eye back Sunday night to Monday morning. And I would get picked up at the

00:21:02.720 airport and dropped off on, on campus. And like, I was miserable. I was dying inside. Cause I was so

00:21:08.000 tired. I was so like, everything was fucked. Um, but I wasn't willing to pass up that opportunity.

00:21:14.720 Now I try to travel as little as possible. I'm like, no, I've built a life for myself. Um,

00:21:22.360 that I intentionally, I didn't want to, I didn't want to take vacations when I got old.

00:21:27.080 Like, I don't, I don't want to have to look forward to my two week trip in Mexico every year.

00:21:32.380 So I want my, I want my, my time home to be so enjoyable that I never want to leave.

00:21:38.400 And I was joking with a buddy about this the other day. Uh, God, where were we? I,

00:21:44.540 Oh, I was down, I was down in Miami. Um, there was competition going on. So I had a bunch of stuff,

00:21:49.300 a lot of involvement there. And so I, I went down and I text my buddy and I knew his girlfriend was

00:21:54.440 going to be there. I was like, Hey, you coming? And he was like, no, no. Like, you know, I have so

00:21:58.720 much travel coming up. I'm trying to spend as much time at home. And I, I texted him back and I was

00:22:03.860 like, yep. Being home is the new vacation. And when, when my work requires me to travel so much,

00:22:10.760 when, you know, I have so many people coming in, in and out of town to spend time with me,

00:22:15.360 it's like, no, when I have a chance to stay home, that's, that's my decompression. That's where I get

00:22:21.000 to like, I set up a home life that like, I look forward to it. Um, so, you know, the,

00:22:28.300 the travel opportunities, like they're there. Um, but it also, it's also changed that like,

00:22:32.460 I'm not reliant on somebody asking me to, Hey, come coach a seminar at my CrossFit gym.

00:22:36.500 If I want to go down to Costa Rica, I can go, I have the freedom to do that. Um, but I'm sure

00:22:42.600 it's only a matter of time before people stop asking me to do that stuff. Um, and I planned on that.

00:22:49.840 Like that was, uh, I was trying to set up a life that I'm not trying to collect as much money as I

00:22:56.240 can. I'm trying to collect as much freedom as I can, that I don't have to answer to anyone. I don't

00:23:00.860 have to, you know, my actions are determined by someone else's permission. Um, and so, yeah, I mean,

00:23:08.600 I realized it was coming. I hoped it was coming. Um, and I'm prepared, but, but I'm sure, I'm sure

00:23:16.060 opportunities are going to dry up at some point who knows. But at the same time, I hope, I hope I

00:23:24.160 have less of an interest in that. Like, I hope that the day I have a child, I'm not looking to

00:23:29.380 run away for a week in Europe to do something crazy. It's like, no, I hope I genuinely hope my,

00:23:35.560 uh, my priorities change a little bit when, when I go into that next stage of life. Um,

00:23:42.240 but who knows? Yeah, no, it's cool. I mean, you sound super grounded in that. I, I bring that up

00:23:48.080 because I, I sometimes look at people who are in the public eye, the public space. I mean, obviously,

00:23:53.900 you know, you've got a lot of people who, who follow you, uh, who know what you do or connected,

00:24:00.540 they're inspired by you. And then I, I wonder with people in, in your shoes, you know, when that goes

00:24:07.400 away, if they've built their whole identity around Instagram clicks or being acknowledged and validated

00:24:16.780 by a bunch of strangers, like I think about that with actors, you know, like at some point they're

00:24:22.300 not going to do any more movies and then they're not really an actor. And so is there much more depth

00:24:27.240 behind it? You know what I mean? Oh, I am. I've done so much of this, like this type of self-analysis,

00:24:36.080 um, and surprisingly early on in my career, you know, like I, I came to, uh, like a fork in the

00:24:44.860 road of like, you know, do I want to continue doing what I'm doing? How do I want to continue it? If I

00:24:50.780 choose, you know, all that type of stuff. And there's, I've seen, I grew up with it, um, you

00:24:57.100 know, through living at the training center, uh, living at the Olympic education center, then getting

00:25:02.040 into the sport of CrossFit, um, seeing people around that, uh, you know, their entire life's

00:25:12.960 identity was in this one thing. Right. And, and you're a fool to think that as you get older,

00:25:20.420 as time goes on, that you can continue performing at the level that you were. And, and so, especially

00:25:26.740 at the Olympic training center, I remember seeing just one too many, um, former athletes still

00:25:34.080 trying to make it still trying to have one more go or one more good, one more good competition,

00:25:39.900 one more good match to go out on a bang or, you know, and, and they, they put so much of their life

00:25:46.100 on hold to do that. And so, and sometimes it works out. Sometimes there is the fairytale story.

00:25:51.800 Um, but I remember seeing one too many, you know, late thirties, early forties, still trying to make,

00:26:00.560 make it happen. And then, but they, they also set themselves up so they didn't have an option.

00:26:06.620 You know, they, they put their education on hold. So now they're working some,

00:26:10.060 some minimum wage job, taking one college class a semester. And it's like, yep, by 50, I'll have my,

00:26:16.860 my degree and that I can get a good job. And so, you know, I, and, and then also my,

00:26:23.580 my number one example of people going from a professional sports career into regular life

00:26:29.160 is my parents, you know, like both anyone doesn't know, like both my parents are, they were a pair

00:26:35.640 in freestyle figure skating. They, um, I think they were four-time world champions, Olympic team

00:26:41.820 members, um, in 76. And so growing, growing up, um, other than seeing my parents put a pair of skates

00:26:50.360 on to play like pond hockey with all the cousins, I've never seen my parents skate. I've never seen

00:26:56.340 them compete. I've never seen them coat nothing. Um, and you know, like through their teenage years

00:27:03.060 and through all of their twenties, they toured the world, they, they went pro, they went to the

00:27:07.340 Olympics, big fucking deal growing up, growing up. It was never really a topic. Um, like there was

00:27:19.020 never any like figure skating pictures hanging around the house. There was never like too much

00:27:23.480 talk, nothing, you know? And, uh, like we, we knew that they skated. And like, I remember finding

00:27:29.900 the trophies when I was probably four years old, like rifling through the basement. I thought I

00:27:34.540 found treasure. Cause I found these like three foot tall, big gold goblets. And I was like,

00:27:39.980 oh my God, like I found treasure in my basement. Um, but it was like, it was very important thing

00:27:46.580 to them in the moment. But then as soon as they decided like, okay, skating careers over, it's time

00:27:51.660 to, my mom went to medical school. She became a physician. My dad was Mr. Mom. They had kids.

00:27:57.320 Um, you know, they're obviously very, very proud and worked very, very hard for those

00:28:01.920 accomplishments. But when they moved on, they're not hanging around a rink reminiscing about the

00:28:07.060 glory days. Um, all the stories that I heard from my dad about his skating days were about

00:28:13.980 the relationships, about the travel, the relationships, the time spent with my mom, all

00:28:18.560 these things. Um, and so there was a couple of parts of that. Like one, I, I remember being

00:28:25.720 young and thinking like, how am I going to create those stories for myself? How, how am I going to

00:28:30.320 be able to give myself the opportunity to travel the world and make friends everywhere? Um, and then

00:28:37.660 two, how do I, how do I do that with my wife? Um, like, I hope I meet my wife early enough that she

00:28:45.080 can come with me on these things. Cause it was all those stories from my dad that, you know, I just,

00:28:49.520 I, you know, I, I wanted those so badly for myself, but then, but then seeing that like, okay, you know,

00:28:59.080 like it ends at some point, like, so don't have your only identity as CrossFit games champion or

00:29:09.240 the best CrossFitter, whatever it was like, like, even for myself, like right now, like I have,

00:29:16.560 I have the claim, the title to the fittest man in history. I'm the, I'm the only dude. That's one

00:29:22.320 five every year. It's a coin flip. If, if I get to keep that record or not, um, it's, you know,

00:29:29.200 like I have, I have that title or that award for minimum five years. Um, but after that, it's just

00:29:36.260 a coin flip every year of either somebody who's going to beat her, somebody doesn't. Um, and so I,

00:29:42.000 I better not put my whole identity into, I'm the fittest man in history because what, what,

00:29:49.960 what happens the day that somebody beats that record? Like it's the whole goal, people getting

00:29:55.440 better, the sport growing more people coming into it. We want to see a new dominant force. Um,

00:30:01.640 and so I better not be crying in my mouth when the day comes. Like, I hope that when that day comes,

00:30:06.780 I can be happy for the person. Cause like I did what I did in my career. I took what I,

00:30:11.080 I took what I wanted. I did what I did. I got everything out of it that I wanted. And it's

00:30:14.280 like, all right, cool. Like even just being the fittest man in the world, that's not my title

00:30:20.940 anymore. I won it five times. I did it by the largest margin. I'm the first dude to do it five

00:30:25.440 times. Like there's a lot of things I'm proud of, but I was at the games. And when Justin,

00:30:30.260 when Justin won, so now he's the fittest man in history. I'm in the, I'm in the booth up top

00:30:37.140 crying. Cause I know I'm like, I'm so proud of this kid. I'm so happy for him.

00:30:41.080 The life, the opportunities he just opened up. This is phenomenal. It's not for me. I stepped

00:30:47.760 away from, I don't want it anymore. You know? So I'm looking for that life change. Um, but if,

00:30:52.960 but if my identity was being the fittest man on earth, that day would have been fucking bad.

00:30:58.760 Yeah. It's inevitable. Sure. Yeah. That's a good point is like, it would have been bad

00:31:03.800 and it's inevitable. It's not like, it's not going to sometime happen. It will definitely happen at some

00:31:09.820 point. Yeah. It's, it's only a matter of time. There's only two options every year at a competition,

00:31:15.000 either somebody is going to beat that record or somebody is not. And it's only a matter of time

00:31:19.380 before the amount of coin flips that somebody does. And, and so, you know, I'm, I'm excited to

00:31:24.920 see who that is. Um, you know, same, same as Justin, like, like I've, I've helped him in any

00:31:31.100 way possible. I'm like, dude, if there's ever a question, like, I'm not trying to hinder your career.

00:31:35.760 I want to try to better your career. Like I got my 10, like, if you win six, it doesn't take away

00:31:41.040 from my five makes no difference to me. I'm done. Like just like yours doesn't take away from what

00:31:46.660 rich did for the sport. It's exactly. Um, and so, you know, like Justin, it's like, I was in contact

00:31:52.700 with him as soon as my last games were done. I was like, anything I can help with, let me know.

00:31:56.880 He's been up to the house to train a couple of times, you know, like, um, and it's because my,

00:32:02.240 my personal identity isn't tied up in that. Um, you know, like there's so much more going on that

00:32:08.540 I'm like, go like someone else. Take it, take the reins, do your thing. Um, and I'm trying to grow

00:32:15.360 it because when I'm 60, people aren't going to give a shit who I am or what I do. So I'm trying

00:32:19.960 to grow, grow businesses outside. So I can, so I have something to fall back on. I mean, it's,

00:32:25.840 it's obviously a healthy way to approach it. Do you, what does, what does retirement look like for you?

00:32:30.180 You know, where your folks hung up the skates and didn't really talk much about it and moved

00:32:34.600 on to different careers and different aspirations. Like how much involvement will you have with

00:32:39.840 CrossFit and how much of your life will be centered around health and fitness as opposed to something

00:32:45.300 entirely different? Uh, so, so a lot more, a lot more involved than I was expecting. Um, you know,

00:32:52.820 so even something as simple as programming, um, when, when I did it, uh, so I, I signed with a

00:33:01.680 company and like, I was, it's basically like, I give them a spreadsheet of programming and then they

00:33:06.300 post it. Um, so they handle everything on the backend and I signed, signed a one-year contract

00:33:11.480 with them. Um, because I genuinely didn't know if I would like it or not. Um, had nothing to do with

00:33:18.480 anything else. I was like, you know, if I, if I hate this, if I hate programming, I've committed

00:33:26.100 myself to one year in the grand scheme of things, nothing. So I'll do it for one year and then I'll

00:33:31.420 reevaluate after. And then almost immediately I was like, Oh shit, I really enjoy this. Um,

00:33:38.560 and so I just doubled down on it. You know, we opened up some more tracks because the original,

00:33:43.180 the original program we released half or, you know, a quarter of the people like this is not nearly

00:33:47.600 enough volume. You talk to the other quarter of the people and they're like, this is so much

00:33:52.300 fucking too much. And so I'm like, okay, like neither of you are wrong. You just have different

00:33:57.560 opinions. Um, and so that expanding, right. Exactly. Um, and so like expanding, branching out,

00:34:04.840 doing more tracks, taking on personal athletes that I'm coaching one-on-one going to competitions,

00:34:09.720 doing community workouts, you know, all that type of stuff, um, ended up loving it. So I was like,

00:34:15.100 okay, I'm going to double down on this. We, we launched, we launched a supplement brand podium.

00:34:20.860 That was type of thing. Like my last couple of years in the space, there just weren't,

00:34:25.200 weren't any supplement sponsors that I like really clicked with or really enjoyed or,

00:34:31.240 you know, whatever it was. Um, and so, so I went through the last couple of years of my career with,

00:34:36.700 without a supplement sponsor, which is, you know, it's a tough move for, for competitive athlete,

00:34:43.540 especially in the CrossFit space. Um, and so I was just like, okay, like there's nothing out there

00:34:49.420 that, that is what I want it to be. So fuck it. I'll make one. Um, so, you know, got, got some good,

00:34:58.020 good partners that, uh, you know, we're, we're each experts in our own little, uh, Avenue. And, uh,

00:35:06.540 so, you know, that blew up has been a huge success. Um, yeah, so we got programming,

00:35:12.520 coaching podium, you know, started getting into some real estate stuff. Uh, so in the last

00:35:18.440 six months, picked up three, three income properties, three, three units that were running

00:35:26.080 and, and like something like that, that's, that's more of a long-term play. Obviously,

00:35:30.300 like if you're in the rental game, it's not like crazy profitable in the beginning, but,

00:35:38.480 but it's not for today. It's for 15, 15 to 30 years from now. So like when I, when I'm older,

00:35:44.200 hopefully I can thank myself and, you know, but looking to add to that a little bit year by year,

00:35:49.900 but also with that, like the last, last duplex that we picked up, I went, went 50, 50 with my buddy.

00:35:55.760 Um, and so, you know, it's something that we can work on together. It's a project that we can work on.

00:35:59.600 So it's like when we took possession of that, there was tenants in one side, not on the other.

00:36:04.440 So he and I use it as an opportunity. We took two weeks and just like completely renovated the place.

00:36:09.400 Um, but it was how lucky of an opportunity is it for me that a, my buddy and I are both in

00:36:15.140 positions where we can put down a full down payment to get the lowest interest rate.

00:36:19.060 Right. But then I get, I get to work shoulder to shoulder with my best friend for two weeks,

00:36:23.520 uninterrupted, like he's self-employed, I'm self-employed. So if we want to take two weeks to work on a

00:36:28.140 project, we can do your thing. Sure. And then it's just the two of us in this unit for a couple of

00:36:33.280 days at a time, just again, to be goofballs with your best friend and you're doing something that's

00:36:38.540 productive and you're going to thank yourself down the road for, you know? All right, man,

00:36:43.960 I'm stepping away from the conversation very quickly to tell you about something. Uh, you know,

00:36:47.920 one of the biggest challenges men have when they join our exclusive brotherhood,

00:36:51.920 the iron council is that it's a bit like drinking from a fire hose. You know, we don't,

00:36:57.420 we don't intend to overwhelm our new members, but there are so many tools and resources available

00:37:02.580 and we want to get them to use as soon as we possibly can. So if you've ever been interested

00:37:09.000 in joining us inside the iron council, I would suggest that you go through our battle ready program

00:37:14.700 prior to joining, because when you sign up for our free course, again, battle ready, uh, you'll unlock a

00:37:21.060 series of emails that will get you up to speed, uh, on how to implement a planning system that will

00:37:28.100 quite literally change your life. And then when we open up the iron council again in March, uh, on

00:37:34.040 March 1st of this year, then you're going to be ready to crush it. And you're going to have a huge

00:37:37.820 advantage relative to the men who haven't gone through the battle ready program. So if you're

00:37:42.940 interested in doing that, you can get registered for free at order of man.com slash battle ready again,

00:37:49.980 order of man.com slash battle ready. And then when we open up the iron council on March 1st,

00:37:55.000 you'll be ready to hit the ground running. All right, guys, we'll see you inside for now. Let's

00:37:59.840 get back to it with Matt. How's the, how's the book process been for you? Dude, it was, it was pretty

00:38:07.060 wild. It was super, super intensive. And then, and then like, once I handed it off, it was like,

00:38:14.300 it's out of my hands. And you know, like you get update emails every once in a while, like, Hey,

00:38:17.980 this is where it's at with the publisher. This is going to print a, it's delayed, you know,

00:38:21.540 all these different things. Um, but yeah, you know, the book came out, uh, and the, the feedback

00:38:29.000 has been phenomenal. It was literally one of those things that like, um, I don't want to say I have

00:38:36.500 low self-esteem, but I'm like crazy, crazy critical of myself. And so like when the idea got pitched of

00:38:44.120 like, Hey, write a book, my first thought is like, who the fuck wants to hear me, you know,

00:38:49.540 about anything. Um, not about you necessarily. I get that about myself even. So yeah, like I'm just

00:38:55.120 super, super critical of myself. And like, I never want to, you know, think I'm important or think

00:39:00.700 that. And, and so, you know, when, when the idea got pitched, my first, my first take was like,

00:39:05.120 really, you want me to write a book. Um, but then, you know, and then like the crazy,

00:39:13.620 crazy fear of like your worst nightmare of like you launch it or it's like up for presale and you

00:39:20.200 find there's two copies sold. And then you look at the name, but it's like your parents and your

00:39:24.620 parents' names or something. You're like, Oh, right. Um, but you know, it, it went gangbusters.

00:39:32.120 Um, and it was so cool. Um, you know, people got their pre-orders right before Waterpalooza.

00:39:38.580 So the big event down in Miami. So, you know, I set up, set up like a book signing, um, while I was

00:39:44.580 there and it's just like endless lines of people coming in. And like a lot of the like, dude, I got

00:39:50.380 the book like the day before I came down here. So for the five hour plane ride, I, I just read the

00:39:57.120 entire time. And you know, like depending on who you are, what your past experiences or what you're

00:40:03.180 looking for, everyone's going to get a different snippet of information or something that they

00:40:06.820 apply into their own life. Cause we covered so many topics, topics in the book. Um, you know,

00:40:13.420 anything from like mindset when I was training mindset, when I was competing, how I approached it.

00:40:18.680 Um, and then even stuff like home life, uh, food that Sammy prepared for me. So a bunch

00:40:26.340 of Sammy's recipes are in the book, um, different, like he interviewed different coaches that I had

00:40:31.020 worked with over the years. Um, so, you know, there's just such a wide variety of information

00:40:36.240 that I'm excited to let a little more time pass, see what the demand is, like what part of it

00:40:43.980 people were most interested in. And now that I've gone through the process once I'm like,

00:40:48.920 Oh, I could fill, you know, 500 pages on any one of these topics. So I'm very excited.

00:40:54.740 What are people most interested in? Um, the comments I'm getting a lot about are people

00:41:01.020 didn't realize how, how much attention I paid to the little things and, and little things that

00:41:08.140 99% of the time did not have an effect. Um, but when, when they did have an example,

00:41:16.480 so something as simple as, and I don't think this, this went into the book, but like kind of an

00:41:21.720 example was, um, like, uh, remembering like while I'm competing, remembering what, what ankle my chip

00:41:29.760 timers on, because there's a lot of times you get to the finish line and everyone's just focused on

00:41:34.660 diving, getting across the finish line first. That doesn't fucking matter. It's your left ankle.

00:41:40.800 Like whose left ankle gets over the finish line first. So like at my last games, there was a foot

00:41:45.620 race that, uh, Samuel Quant and I were neck and neck the entire way. And my last, my last sprint to the

00:41:53.800 finish line, I I'm just left foot, left foot, left foot, left foot. And then we literally hit the

00:41:59.340 finish line, like at identical times, but he dove his right foot. I don't my left foot. So did

00:42:04.580 it, did it make a difference in the grand scheme? No, didn't like, but if, if we were tight on

00:42:11.180 points, that would be a deciding factor. I've had competitions where that's that type of stuff

00:42:15.160 was a deciding factor. Um, little things like, um, I don't even want to call them mind games,

00:42:23.140 but like psychologically, how different body language will affect your competitors, um, when

00:42:30.120 you're going. So like the, the one that was most prominent through my whole career was like the,

00:42:34.420 the rubber band theory. Um, and so if you're running, running in a pack, um, and you're

00:42:41.420 immediately, if you're in second place and you're right behind first place, you're thinking, stay

00:42:47.120 with him, stay with him, stay with him. Like, like just stay behind first place. Don't worry about

00:42:52.740 anyone else. As soon as that first place guy breaks the rubber band. So he pulls far enough

00:42:58.820 away that he's no longer like pulling you mentally. You're no longer concerned with stay close to him.

00:43:05.000 You're worried about stay ahead of them. So your, your attention just switched from first place to

00:43:10.720 everyone else behind you. Like first place is now unobtainable. I'm let, I'm going to let him go.

00:43:16.060 And I'm going to concern myself with staying ahead of everyone else. And so I would look,

00:43:21.420 I would look at the competition floor layout. Um, so if we were outside and like, um, you know,

00:43:28.780 it's came up a couple of times, but the very prominent one was, um, I think it was 2018,

00:43:35.480 2019 something, but it was like, there was cuts on the, and we had a competition floor and then we

00:43:40.680 had to leave the stadium to do a running lap. And as soon as you left the stadium, it was a blind

00:43:46.880 corner. And, uh, and so, you know, another competitor and I were neck and neck the whole

00:43:52.440 way. And, and like every run we would, he would just, we would be together. And so on one of the

00:43:59.420 last runs, when I left the stadium, I knew I was like 10 seconds or 15 seconds ahead of him. As soon

00:44:06.180 as I turned the blind corner, I sprinted just like as hard as I could knowing that like, this is going

00:44:11.200 to slow down my overall time. That's going to be a hindrance to me, but it's going to play a mental

00:44:15.600 game with him mentally. As soon as he comes around the corner, I'm, I'm looking over my shoulder to

00:44:20.920 see when he reappears. And as soon as he does, I'm going to throttle way back. Um, but that way,

00:44:26.160 when he turns the blind corner and sees that I'm no longer 10 yards ahead, I'm a hundred. He's going

00:44:32.760 to go, Oh fuck. He's on his own. Like I can't catch him into that rubber band theory about

00:44:36.820 hanging out with the rest of the crew. So that, that rubber band just broke. And now he's no

00:44:41.640 longer concerned about trying to win the workout. He's trying to being concerned about holding on to

00:44:45.600 second. Um, and you know, I did, did a lot of shit like that through my career and I never said

00:44:51.540 boo about it. And I let, I let commentators for years and years think I was a dumb competitor or

00:44:56.760 not approaching things correctly. That's stupid. Yeah. Yeah. And like criticizing strategy and like

00:45:02.580 another story that, you know, I heard and I related to it so well, because like, I didn't,

00:45:07.580 I couldn't figure out how to put the words together for it, but like a story of like this kid, like he

00:45:12.860 gets bullied every day after school because they think he's so dumb. And, uh, and the bully every

00:45:19.460 day after school wants to show his friends how dumb this kid is. And so he holds out a dime and a nickel

00:45:24.520 and goes, which one's worth more? And the kid picks up the nickel and goes, this one, it's bigger.

00:45:29.640 And then he goes home. All the bullies are like, Oh, look how dumb that kid is. Bah,

00:45:34.260 bah, bah. The kid gets home and his dad goes, Hey, like, you know, the dime's worth more, right?

00:45:39.480 Like, why, why do you, why are you doing this? Like, tell them that, you know, the dime's worth

00:45:44.740 more. And he goes, but if I tell them the dime's worth more, I won't get a nickel every day.

00:45:50.140 And so he knew, he knew that everyone thought he was dumb or picking on him or whatever it was,

00:45:56.220 but he's like, no, I'm going to let you think I'm stupid. I'm going to keep taking your

00:45:59.340 nickel every single day. That's interesting. Yeah. And so there's so much, every event that

00:46:04.520 happened, like these commentators don't know what the fuck they're talking about. They're just

00:46:10.140 filling, filling void air. And, uh, and so, you know, I would hear them talk about like how

00:46:16.240 I made mistakes or this. And I'm like, no, like, but I, I wouldn't publicly correct them. Cause I'm

00:46:24.100 like, no, let, let you think, let, let you continue this narrative that I'm making all

00:46:28.440 these mistakes. I don't want people to know my intent of why I'm doing these things.

00:46:33.400 Sure. Yeah. How did you not let your ego get in the way in, in those instances though? Cause

00:46:38.220 I'm sure you contended with that. You were like, no, I want to prove these guys right. Like

00:46:42.180 wrong, but that would undermine your strategy. Yeah. I mean, I, I'd be lying to you if I said I

00:46:50.200 didn't like every once in a while, you know, the ego, the pride, they boil up. Um, I would,

00:46:57.820 I don't think I ever publicly said anything, but like, I've definitely had some, some phone calls

00:47:02.880 or text messages that were, um, you know, correcting them. Right. Right. Um, to put it mildly.

00:47:12.460 Yeah. But broad strokes and, and even still like a lot of the stuff, um, you know, there's a lot of,

00:47:18.900 a lot of things that I hear about myself that float around and, you know, I, I like, I'm at a

00:47:23.980 point now where I can take the time and think like, do I want to correct this? Like what, what's the

00:47:27.940 silver lining of this narrative for this false information out there? But I mean, for me,

00:47:33.920 you know, I always try to find the silver lining in any situation. So, you know, if I hear the

00:47:39.860 narrative of, uh, you know, Oh, he hit that workout incorrectly, but I'm like, well, first off I won

00:47:47.200 the workout. So like it couldn't have been too bad. Um, but I looked at it like, good. Like the,

00:47:55.080 the dumber you think I am, uh, it's like the less you're going to prepare to be my competition.

00:48:02.680 Right. Right. And, you know, relating back a lot to, um, what, what I set my goals up to be

00:48:10.780 when, when I competed. Um, and you know, they, I know they're a lot different than, than most. Um,

00:48:16.700 but it was just like sticking to, to that and what my goals were of, you know, I want to win

00:48:25.060 the games. I don't care about being known as, you know, competing frequently. So I'm in the public eye

00:48:29.940 more and more. I don't care about people thinking I'm a nice guy when I'm at a competition. No,

00:48:34.560 I'm, I'm here for one fucking task and that's to win. Um, and I'm, I only care about winning the

00:48:39.680 games. Like that's it. Um, so all, all these other little things, you know, just, ah, fuck them.

00:48:45.240 Like whatever they say, let them, let them say it. And, you know, it definitely took a lot of

00:48:50.460 practice. And, you know, I have some role models in my life that were phenomenal at it, where I'm,

00:48:56.080 I would hear, see something. I'm like, I'm buying a plane ticket and I'm going to their house right

00:49:00.620 now. Like we are going to have this conversation. I'm going to correct them because you know,

00:49:05.360 the typical like keyboard warriors saying something and I'm like, I'm like, dude, I know who you are.

00:49:10.340 Like guarantee you wouldn't say that stuff. If we were face to face, no, it's just like,

00:49:16.380 there's this disc, there's this disconnect on online, Instagram, social, whatever it is,

00:49:20.620 where people just like say some outrageous shit because you can't get punched through,

00:49:27.420 through a computer screen. And, uh,

00:49:30.020 That would actually be a good invention for some people. It's some sort of like fist that just

00:49:34.560 comes out and says, shut the hell up. It just like punches them in the face.

00:49:38.960 And like, like, especially early on, you know, I would get hot under the collar and just like,

00:49:43.380 I bet just get upset over someone discrediting you or just saying like incredibly mean things.

00:49:49.640 And, uh, you know, my, one of my best friends, Matt O'Keefe, he was so calm,

00:49:54.060 cool and collected and just like, basically like reinforced, like, go ahead, write the letter

00:49:59.380 and then put it in a drawer. If you still feel that way in a week, then you can send it. Um,

00:50:04.860 and you know, just, and just putting that into daily practice. And now it's like, dude,

00:50:11.920 I don't get phased. I've had people do some of the most outrageous shit to intentionally try to like

00:50:18.640 derail my careers, hinder me all these things. And I couldn't tell you the last time that it like,

00:50:25.280 it got to me. I was just like, okay, I see what you're doing. Like, that's a mistake one. Um,

00:50:32.820 because I know for myself, I'm like, oh, I have done way more off way less of a resentment. And

00:50:39.280 you just lit a fire under my ass that like, you go ahead, take, take your win today, but you just

00:50:45.840 hurt yourself. Cause you gave me a motivation to do even better. Um, you know, it's just,

00:50:51.320 Do you use that a lot? Do you use that as that, that, I don't know if you'd call it a negative

00:50:55.740 factor or, or the criticism? I mean, we, we talked about this last time of like resentment.

00:51:01.100 Resentment is a good fuel, but it is a hot fuel. Yeah. Good point. I remember that. Now you say that.

00:51:06.760 Yeah. I mean, I, I'd be lying if I said I didn't use it. Um, I mean, perfect example is like when I

00:51:12.200 launched programming, you know, a lot of people were very excited for it. Um, you know, it was a big step

00:51:17.240 for me, you know, it was something stuff that I played so close to my chest for so long. And then

00:51:22.060 I remember seeing people that like, like people, people that I knew, like basically trashing it of

00:51:30.500 like, they hadn't seen the programming, but they're, they're saying like, Hey, just remember, like he

00:51:36.080 was an athlete. He wasn't a coach. He doesn't have the knowledge base behind this of how to coach

00:51:40.760 like all these things. And, and I remember, I remember the one guy that did it.

00:51:47.540 Um, he was saying, he's like, I've had a bunch of my, my clients come to me with these talking

00:51:53.300 about this. And, and he basically just went like created this narrative of why I wouldn't

00:51:58.020 be a good coach. And, and I had to look, step back and look at it objectively of like, cause

00:52:04.400 I take criticism as coaching of like, okay, let's see if it's, if it's really bothering me,

00:52:11.000 there's probably some truth to it. That's probably why it's bothering me. Um, and so let's look

00:52:15.640 at, all right, what's the truth that is bothering me and is it justified? Can I fix it? Can I work

00:52:20.720 on it? Can I be better? Like all these things. And, um, and, and I had to look at it, take emotion

00:52:27.620 out of it. And I was like, okay, one, he's probably upset that his clients are coming to him talking

00:52:32.700 about another program and he's worried about losing his clients. Um, and then two, like he,

00:52:40.040 he's projecting that I'm just some dumb lug that was just naturally gifted at what I did.

00:52:45.380 So I had instant success without having to try for it. Um, which couldn't be further from the truth.

00:52:50.320 Like, like it took me a long time. It took, it took me probably longer than most to learn a lot

00:52:57.580 of things in, in the space. And, and so I look at that, I'm like, no, that makes me a better coach.

00:53:02.720 Like I don't, I don't have, I never had one problem, tried one thing and then got the result

00:53:09.660 I wanted. I had a problem and I had to try 20 different things and then found one that worked.

00:53:14.860 But now I have this whole background of, okay, someone, someone's having trouble with a muscle

00:53:20.320 up. All right, try this. All right. That didn't work. Try this. That didn't work. Try that.

00:53:24.320 Like, so I have this whole arsenal of tools to attack these different problems. Um,

00:53:30.040 but I remember screenshotting, I remember this, this guy went on social media campaign,

00:53:35.220 screenshot of it, and I sent it, uh, sent it to O'Keefe. And I was like, I was, you believe this

00:53:40.240 shit? Like, I was like, dude, he hasn't even, I haven't even released programming yet. And I'm

00:53:44.220 already getting criticized on it. Like how? And O'Keefe was like, oh, he's just insecure. Like,

00:53:49.580 and I was like, okay, true, true. Okay. I see that now. Um, and then O'Keefe goes, you know who that

00:53:55.520 is, right? Like, you know him. I was like, oh shit, I do know him. Yeah. And so it was, I'm,

00:54:00.720 I'm buddies with this, this guy's brother. And so I sent, uh, like I sent my buddy a message and I was

00:54:07.480 like, Hey, tell your brother. Thank you. Because like, I've never succeeded at anything without a good

00:54:12.960 resentment. And your brother just made that for me. And he, he, he chuckled and he said, he's like,

00:54:18.540 dude, I'm sitting across my brother. Like he said, yeah. And I was like, I was like, oh, of course,

00:54:24.280 like a social media. Once again, there's no repercussions. No one can say anything. And then

00:54:28.920 as soon as there was a contact, like a direct contact between like his brother, he was like,

00:54:33.520 oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm like, nope, too late. But like, that's fine. But I found the silver

00:54:38.380 lining of it of like, okay, there's, I'm sure a lot of people have that truth. What can I do to

00:54:44.040 a, make sure that's not the truth. B make sure that people know, right. And it's holding myself

00:54:51.400 even more accountable because I want to make sure that that never comes up, that somebody just says

00:54:56.880 like, oh, you don't know how to coach. You don't, you're, you just work good at it. And it's like,

00:55:01.000 no, that's opposite other way around, bud. Um, but yeah, find it like taking those criticisms and like,

00:55:07.480 okay, let's use this as coaching cues. Let's see what they're saying I'm bad at. And how do I make

00:55:12.160 sure I'm not bad at those things? I like that, man. Cause I, like, I know even for myself personally,

00:55:17.420 you know, I get criticism like anybody else who puts themselves out there would,

00:55:20.900 and it's really easy just to say, oh, that guy's an idiot. And he doesn't know what he's talking

00:55:24.960 about. But then you kind of, if you think about it for a minute, I mean, he can still be an idiot

00:55:29.260 that, that actually can still be true, but it, but it can also be true that maybe he got something

00:55:34.700 right. And there's some truth in there. You need to really unpack if you can get over your ego long

00:55:39.080 enough to do it. Yeah. And I think too, there's, um, you know, if you never want to be criticized,

00:55:45.300 do nothing, right? Do fucking nothing, never be heard, never be seen. It does not matter what you

00:55:51.600 do. If you start walking with your left foot first, there will be someone that swears that right foot

00:55:56.120 first is the only way to do it. Um, like you're, you're going to get criticized no matter what you do.

00:56:03.040 Um, and then, and then I think too, like some, some of the greatest minds in the space

00:56:10.220 said some stuff and then got proved wrong and then they learned from it. And it's like, okay,

00:56:16.380 like, you know, I'm, yeah, I, I look at stuff I did. Oh, I've been wrong so many times,

00:56:23.120 but it's only a bad thing if you don't learn from that experience. You know, I've trained certain

00:56:28.020 ways and then thought I was doing great and then had terrible results. I was like, Oh, that ain't it.

00:56:33.040 You know, let me try again. Um, but I, I use people's criticisms, like basically as

00:56:39.080 like watching game tape and I'm using, I now have 10,000 sets of eyes telling me what I can do

00:56:48.000 better. And there's going to be some that I'm like, Oh no, you're just wrong. Like I'm going

00:56:52.600 to ignore that. But then being brutally honest with myself of like, when someone's like, Oh,

00:56:57.360 he was slow back to the bar, he sucks at barbell cycling. I'm like, Oh, me. I didn't realize that

00:57:03.080 was a weakness. Maybe there's something to that. And then like looking at it from that point of view

00:57:08.040 and, you know, using other people's criticisms as notes on how to get better, um, or things to get

00:57:13.300 better at. Um, and it was kind of funny. Uh, like the idea that you're going to be perfect

00:57:22.980 is so crazy. And I know it's like, like, I know for myself, it's always strive for perfection.

00:57:31.500 You're always striving for it, but never reaching it. And even that, like, it sets up this narrative

00:57:36.200 that like, you're going to be right 95% of the time and then have a little blunder here and there.

00:57:40.640 Like, fuck no, you are going to mess up so many times. Um, and do you, do you know, uh,

00:57:49.480 Brian Callen? Yeah. I just released a podcast with him as of this recording, it goes out tomorrow. So

00:57:56.020 Oh, no shit. If guys are listening to this, it came out last week. I just went down to LA and talked

00:58:01.640 with him. Oh, no way. So, so my buddies just did a video with them. Okay. Yeah. And, and they,

00:58:10.000 they did a CrossFit workout with them. They had met them, uh, through some other mutual friends

00:58:14.300 a couple months back and then they linked up with him again. And they were like, dude, he's one of

00:58:18.160 the coolest guys. Um, but so I watched, I watched their YouTube video. Um, it was the, the buttery

00:58:24.040 bro. So Marston and Heber did, uh, Fran with, with him. And, uh, and I, I literally called Marston

00:58:32.160 and I was like, Hey, can you chop out this one piece of the video for me? Like, I love that.

00:58:37.820 And I want it on my phone so I can watch it whenever I want it. And, um, and he was talking

00:58:42.740 about, he goes, he was like, he's been doing standup for 25 years. And he is like, I've been,

00:58:50.540 I've been, he's like, I've been famous. He's been famous for a little while, but not 25 years.

00:58:55.280 And he goes, my best analogy for it is if, if I threw a stone at every bird I'd ever seen in the

00:59:04.280 sky, I've probably hit a couple. Um, and he goes, and if I took those birds, got them stuffed and

00:59:11.660 hung them on my wall, I would probably have a hundred birds. And like the birds are like analogies

00:59:17.360 for like an opportunity. And, and he goes, if, if somebody walks into my house and sees a hundred

00:59:23.640 birds and I tell them every, like, I hit them out of the sky with a stone, they'd be, holy shit.

00:59:30.060 You must be, you must be amazing at throwing stones. And he goes, yeah, I'm awesome at throwing

00:59:35.380 stones. And, and he goes, and they like, what's your secret? How'd you do it? And he goes, I threw

00:59:41.200 a stone at every bird I've seen for the last 25 years. And it's like, when you look at it in that

00:59:46.500 perspective, like, Oh, you've hit this tiny little sliver of the percentages. But when you look at it

00:59:52.900 objectively, like not at in the process, but just like in the moment, how many of those opportunities

00:59:58.660 have you seen? And it's like this wall of achievements. And, you know, it's, it's the

01:00:04.020 same as me of like, if somebody looks at my last year objectively, and it's a, holy shit, you're

01:00:10.120 killing it. You're doing all these things. Like you, you released a book, uh, you're, you're making a

01:00:15.840 movie. You moved like to your dream house. You bought three income properties. You've launched

01:00:21.340 HWPO training. You're taking on these athletes. It's crazy what you see on paper on a day-to-day

01:00:28.660 basis. I feel like I'm not doing shit because I'm like it, because it's, it doesn't just come

01:00:34.560 in these big lump sums. It's little tiny things every single day that just add up to this cool

01:00:43.100 end result. Um, and yeah, so I mean, yeah, I was going to say like, I have that video,

01:00:50.560 Brian on my phone. That's cool. I'll have to watch that video. And so Sam and I literally like just

01:00:56.820 hanging around the house, like we'll be working on something that doesn't have a material and result,

01:01:02.740 but it's hopefully we do like a thousand times of that work and we will have something to show.

01:01:10.300 We will have something as an end product. And like, we'll finish these little things that,

01:01:14.880 you know, you work all day on. And then it's like this little tiny blip on, on a website or

01:01:19.400 something. And I say to Sammy every day and I'm like, yo, we're wicked fucking good at throwing

01:01:24.800 stones. That's like our, that's like our new motto around the house. That's cool. Yeah. You know,

01:01:32.120 the other challenge with that too, is when people come into the house and they see all the birds

01:01:36.620 on the wall, like you're talking about, and they think how, you know, how good you are at throwing

01:01:40.780 stones. I think what, what it does is it sets them up for failure because when they go out and they

01:01:48.040 try to throw a hundred stones and they don't hit a single bird, they're like, I suck at this.

01:01:53.060 And they throw in the towel. Like, I'm not going to do that anymore. When all they really needed to

01:01:57.160 know was that the people that like yourself and other incredibly successful, talented men I've

01:02:04.440 had on the podcast, they didn't, they're not just inherently good at things. Like they're good at

01:02:10.360 doing it long enough where they become exceptional. Yeah. Yeah. Like, uh, I forget who it came from.

01:02:18.140 I want to say it was a soccer player, but they said it took me 17 years, six months and three days

01:02:24.240 to become an overnight success. Right. Right. It's like, yeah, people, people see the, the game

01:02:31.360 winning NFL touchdown, the goal scored in the world cup or someone to cross in the finish line.

01:02:38.520 Like, wow. Like they did it like, Oh, I can never do that. And it's like, he didn't just show up and

01:02:44.320 do that one day. Right. And like, it's, it's not even about a single training session and it's like

01:02:50.560 nothing they're doing is unobtainable, but it's just like, they're constantly pointing in that

01:02:55.960 one direction. They never, they're never taking a day where they're stepping backwards or they're

01:02:59.920 putting things on pause. It's like continuously chipping away. And yeah, like I look at something

01:03:08.400 as simple as like my whole CrossFit career. Like there was never one big defining moment of like,

01:03:12.800 well, I mean, there was, but it wasn't what people think, you know, my big defining moment that

01:03:17.580 led to my dominant career was, was fucking losing in front of everyone. And it was like

01:03:23.280 a 10,000 person outdoor stadium. That's iconic. The energy is wild. And I fucking failed. Um,

01:03:32.460 and you know, it was that moment of soaking in and seeing this whole crowd cheering for someone else.

01:03:37.040 And like, I'm this huge letdown and it's like, okay, I'm going to make sure that doesn't happen

01:03:41.340 again. Right. My training, my training didn't change drastically. Like my sleep schedule changed

01:03:47.780 a little bit. My diet changed a little bit. My training changed a little bit, but like all these

01:03:51.580 little things and they just compounded compounded. Like if, and this, this is a big reason why I set

01:03:58.440 up like almost daily goals. It's not like, uh, like January one, what's your goal this year? Well,

01:04:05.340 my goal is to win the CrossFit games. And then January 2nd comes, comes and goes and say, Hey,

01:04:10.860 did you accomplish your goal today? No. Oh, you're a fucking loser. You know, you didn't

01:04:15.300 accomplish your goal. Like you failed. And that that's literally how I looked at it. That's how

01:04:19.580 I felt. Um, so often I'm like, what is my overarching goal? Well, if I'm looking at it, I want, I want,

01:04:25.680 I want to have a family. I want to have my dream house. I want to have financial freedom. I want to

01:04:30.680 be liked by, I want to have all the best friend, all the shit. Well, if I look at that every single

01:04:36.400 day, well, every single day is going to be a failure because I don't have it yet. And so do

01:04:40.840 you have it today? Nope. Failure. And so that's why like going into every CrossFit season is what's

01:04:46.080 your goal. All right. Well, my overarching goal is to, to do the best I can. I hope that means that

01:04:51.420 I win the games. Um, but then breaking it down of like, all right, where am I right now? And where do

01:04:56.480 I want to be in a year? What do I have? What, and how, how many times can I break up that goal

01:05:02.520 into these little tiny fucking baby steps, um, to get me there? So every day I'm not laying my head

01:05:08.480 on the pillow going, Oh, I didn't accomplish my goal. I'm a failure. It's like, all right, well,

01:05:14.960 I want to win the CrossFit games to do that. I need to shave five seconds off my 2k row. What did I do

01:05:21.080 today to shave five seconds off my 2k row a year from now? Oh, I did. I did 5,000 meters worth of

01:05:27.160 rowing intervals. Oh, I want to shave two seconds off my mile time. Did I do that today? No. But

01:05:31.600 you know what I did do? I took the steps to get there in a year. Um, does it ever feel like when

01:05:36.720 you break it down like that, where, you know, you want to shave five seconds, for example, and you're

01:05:40.820 like, no, I didn't shave five seconds, but you know, I rode and I did X, Y, and Z. Do you ever get

01:05:46.220 into moments where it's like, well, that's not enough? Like, and you get discouraged because

01:05:50.400 it's not moving the needle as fast as you would like. And maybe that causes you not to do it at

01:05:55.180 all. Or what, how, what's your mentality in that? Yeah. I mean, I want everything yesterday,

01:05:59.520 right? Right. Right. Sure. High achievers. Of course. Yeah. I think that's everyone. I don't

01:06:05.440 think there's anyone that's like, Oh, I want to fulfill my dream in 10 years. Yeah. Yeah. Like fair

01:06:11.380 enough. Sure. Like, you know, like something as simple as like some of the stuff I'm doing,

01:06:16.200 like with real estate, it's like, no, I want to own like a lot of income properties. Like I,

01:06:21.700 I like that type of work. I think it's a great play long-term. That's what I want. Well, I can't

01:06:28.660 just go out and just buy up every fucking thing on the market right now. Like, no, it's not a good

01:06:33.880 business move. So I'm like, I'm picking at it slowly. And it's like, yeah, at some point I would love

01:06:38.020 to have 50 units, a hundred units all paid in full, but it would be counterintuitive to,

01:06:44.940 to do that, to do it all immediately, to pay them all off, do it that way. And it's like, no, like,

01:06:51.180 all right, we're going to buy two units a year for the next 10 years and see where it puts us,

01:06:55.960 you know? Right. Right. And, and I think a lot of this too comes like this, this is where the saying

01:07:03.580 of trust the process comes from, but I think it, that term gets, gets overused and it's people just,

01:07:11.260 you know, I don't even, I don't even know what, I think it's used as an excuse not to like work hard

01:07:18.000 today. I've just like, Oh no, trust the process. Like whatever I want, it'll be there down the road.

01:07:24.080 It's like, well, no, you still have to work your fucking ass off for it.

01:07:28.020 Um, I feel that way when people say things like it's God's will, like it'll have, if it's got,

01:07:33.460 if it, if it's meant to be, it'll happen. I'm like, no, that's, that's not actually how it works.

01:07:38.400 Like you do have to work for it in order for it to happen. It's just not out of, completely out of

01:07:45.500 your hands. I am, I am not, I am not a religious man. So like, but I'm my interpretation of like that

01:07:53.720 saying is like, is it's not like God's going to make it happen for you. God's giving you the ability

01:08:01.960 to go work towards it. That's my interpretation. That's mine too. And you and I are right. How about

01:08:09.900 that? But yeah, I think, I think that's like, you know, my, my biggest fear in life is wasting my

01:08:17.400 potential. And like, you know, I'm, I'm in a phenomenal opportunity right now with where I'm

01:08:24.540 at in life, where I'm at with everything. So it's like, I'm going to try to fucking seize every

01:08:28.960 little thing I can. And I'm in a great spot now where like when I was training, it's like,

01:08:34.000 I ran out of energy every day. Like I was finished at 6 PM and I'm just like a potato just plopped on the

01:08:40.500 couch. I don't have the energy to do anything. Now do I run out of time every day? Like I have

01:08:47.260 all the energy in the world. You can send emails, make phone calls until the cows come home.

01:08:51.980 Right. But now I'm running out of time. And so I just really try to try to make sure I'm not

01:08:57.040 wasting it. I don't want to, I don't want to be 60 and think of like, oh man, woulda, coulda,

01:09:02.820 shoulda. You know, it's always striving for those baby steps every single day. If you're hitting one

01:09:09.360 of those steps before, you know, it, you look back and you're, holy shit. I've come a long way.

01:09:13.280 Did you use, you said something on Instagram the other day you were talking about, I think you

01:09:18.980 referenced like dry January and you said something like, you know, when, when you're 13 years sober,

01:09:24.480 every January is dry. Did you use, which I thought was really cool that you, that you talk about that

01:09:30.260 stuff, you know, cause I think there's people who are dealing with some stuff that they need to

01:09:34.820 figure out how, and they look at people like you and other people they admire and they just assume

01:09:39.340 they have it all figured out. But when somebody like you says, Hey, no, this is something I was

01:09:43.400 dealing with. It gives them hope. Did you use that same sort of strategy when it came to, uh, being

01:09:50.480 sober, like getting like, uh, the, the chipping away at a daily wins, that sort of thing.

01:09:56.700 Um, I don't know. Like I was, I was pretty young when, when I got, when I got sober and quit

01:10:04.100 drinking. Um, so I, I was 17, 17 when I, when I quit drinking and like, I, I know I, I have a

01:10:11.740 willpower. Like if I set my mind to something, it doesn't matter how miserable I am. It's never

01:10:15.880 like, I never give up because it's something that's not enjoyable. It's like, sure. Um, and so

01:10:21.040 when I first got sober, I just white knackled it. Like I didn't talk to anyone. I didn't get any help.

01:10:25.300 I didn't use any resources. Um, but I just knew like, I don't like where my life is going. So I'm just

01:10:31.760 going to halt it. Like, I'm just going to stop making the one thing that I know is a problem.

01:10:36.580 Um, and it's like with that too, it's like drinking isn't the, the, for myself, I looked at

01:10:45.140 like the reason drinking is the problem is it's the one thing that I do that has a negative reaction.

01:10:52.920 Like, I'm not just an alcoholic. I am, I am a holic. Like everything I do, I do to excess.

01:11:01.760 Um, so, you know, like when, when I did weightlifting, it was like my life revolved around

01:11:06.140 it. I made it my full-time gig. I lived at the Olympic training center, trained two, three times

01:11:10.280 a day, six days a week. Um, when I went to school, I was like, I'm going for mechanical engineering.

01:11:15.820 Oh yeah. You can see him right here. I was like, if one degree is good, two is better. And if two

01:11:22.000 degrees is good, two minors is pretty cool too. So I did a double major, double minor in college,

01:11:26.980 when I started competing in CrossFit, I went all fucking in. Like I made it my life. Um,

01:11:33.380 no, nobody's coming to me and saying like, Hey, you're a little bit too obsessed with school.

01:11:38.880 You're doing it seven days a week. And you know, we're worried about you. Um, nobody's coming to

01:11:43.660 me and going, Hey, you're pursuing this Olympic dream a little too heavily. No one's coming to me

01:11:46.900 and saying, Hey, this CrossFit thing, I think you're investing a little bit too much

01:11:50.060 because the end result is something positive. Sure. Um, but with drinking, when, when I would

01:11:56.640 get blackout drunk and try to fight someone and get arrested, people aren't so thrilled about those

01:12:02.000 end results. And they're not so thrilled about me being obsessed about that thing. Um, so, so when

01:12:09.640 it came, when it comes to me doing anything, I do nothing in moderation. Everything's in excess.

01:12:15.120 I want, when I get hooked on something, I'm, I'm like all in, I want to make it in my career. Um,

01:12:21.540 and so, so early on, I realized like, all right, with being an alcoholic, the blessing and the curse

01:12:27.360 one, I can never drink normally. I can like, there's no, I've never once ever had a beer.

01:12:33.980 It's like, if I have one, I'm like, Oh, we're going hard. Um, and so, you know, that,

01:12:43.700 that's the downside. I can't drink normally. Um, the upside, I have a fucking work ethic that is

01:12:51.080 unmatched, untouched. Like if I, if I get obsessed with something, I have a work ethic and I am

01:12:57.760 obsessive over these things. So let's try to find something that has a positive end result that I can

01:13:03.440 put this addiction towards. And so, so like, I, I didn't have phenomenal grades out of high school.

01:13:10.040 I didn't get into college right away out of high school. Um, by the time I was done,

01:13:14.840 I was at university of Vermont, which had an incredible, uh, incredible engineering department.

01:13:22.140 When I originally, when I applied to, to UVM, I didn't get in. I had to go to a commute. Yeah.

01:13:29.020 And my mom worked there. Like, it's basically like, if you're one of your parents,

01:13:33.260 if one of your parents works at the college, you're supposed to just get in.

01:13:38.780 And I, I got, I got the night admission. I had to go to community college for a year,

01:13:42.600 then go to a lesser school. UVM was actually my fourth college. And it's a very, very top ranked

01:13:50.140 college. And I did a double major, double minor. I was on the Dean's list for like three years straight.

01:13:55.040 And this is while I'm competing in CrossFit. Um, when it, you know, anything I do, when it comes

01:14:01.660 to finances, learning how to invest, I, I seek out professionals, I read books, I watch videos,

01:14:07.120 I'm taking notes, and then I'm trying to execute the best I can. Um, you know, so I'm always trying

01:14:12.580 to find things to get obsessive over and addicted over that have a positive end result. Whereas like,

01:14:19.340 I'm like, okay, I don't drink. Once you change a couple people, placing the things like, yeah,

01:14:25.000 I'm not hanging out at parties. I'm not going to bars at night. So it's really a non-issue for me.

01:14:30.280 Like I'm never, it's something that I think about very, very rarely at this point. Um, but I realized

01:14:36.800 very early on, like, oh, I have this incredibly addictive personality. Let's put this to use.

01:14:41.220 Let's find the silver lining here and try to crush.

01:14:45.460 So you didn't change the personality as much as you changed just the behavior, the outlet

01:14:51.580 and directed at someone else.

01:14:53.580 I mean, like I'm, I'm, I'm simplifying, like getting, getting sober. Like once I got linked

01:14:57.380 up with people in a 12 step program, I had, I had a sponsor. I still am actively, uh, involved

01:15:05.420 in the sober community. Um, you know, there was a lot more that went into it. It wasn't just like,

01:15:10.680 I got sober and I was like, oh, I can apply this to other things. It's like, no,

01:15:14.540 there was a lot of hard times. Um, and there was like the big thing of like, all right,

01:15:19.600 what was causing me to drink? Like, oh, I have some resentments that, you know, I was just

01:15:24.520 whirling around in my head and drinking, make some go away. So it's like, let's go make amends

01:15:28.860 to everyone that I have a resentment against. Um, you know, go, going through, going through

01:15:33.760 the 12 steps in full. Um, you know, it, it helps, uh, it helps your day to day. And even, even people that

01:15:44.540 that don't have a substance abuse problem, most of the steps are just applicable for living a good

01:15:51.460 life. Like very few of them actually revolve around alcohol or drugs. Um, you know, like

01:15:57.300 what, one, one of them is like, when you're wrong, promptly admit it. And it's like, think about how

01:16:01.620 many, how many resentments and arguments you have or dislikes for somebody you have throughout the day,

01:16:06.060 because they did something, they were wrong. It affected you. And then they wouldn't say,

01:16:11.020 sorry. Right. Like that, that'll, that'll end, that'll end a relationship. But how many times have,

01:16:17.520 has somebody done something drastic, like somebody hits your car. And if they get out, if, if they get

01:16:23.840 out and they're like, you son of a bitch, you were like, you somewhere you weren't supposed to be,

01:16:28.460 well, you're going to get defensive. And then if they get out and they're like, holy shit,

01:16:32.220 I am so sorry. Like I hit a patch of ice, odds are you're not going to be mad at them. It's the

01:16:37.760 exact same result, but it's like the intent of going into a, someone like coming at you aggressively,

01:16:42.680 putting the blame on you or someone just being like, dude, I fucked up. I'm sorry. And so I really

01:16:48.340 try. That's probably the biggest thing that I take on a day-to-day basis of like, oh, I'm, I'm wrong

01:16:52.920 frequently. There's no way around it. Like I'm a human. Um, and I'm doing, dealing with situations I've

01:16:58.120 never dealt with before. So I'm going to make mistakes. And so like, when I do don't let my

01:17:02.620 pride, don't let my ego get in the way, even if it's somebody that's employee and I'm their boss,

01:17:06.560 you know, it's telling them right away. I'm like, man, I fucked that one up. I'm sorry. Like,

01:17:11.840 how can I, how can I fix it? How can I make it better? Um, and it's very rare that you make a

01:17:16.740 mistake, you sincerely apologize and someone's still mad at you. Um, and it's all just on the intent of

01:17:22.780 it. So, you know, stuff like that, carrying that over into your day-to-day life is probably a good

01:17:28.420 thing. Making a list of all the people you have resentments against and making amends to them.

01:17:33.260 You know, that's not a bad life practice to have. And you don't have to be, you don't have to be

01:17:38.100 involved in a 12 step program to do that. It's a good life practice. Yeah. It's powerful stuff,

01:17:44.160 powerful stuff, man. I always appreciate our conversations because we get into some real

01:17:48.060 issues and some real things, man. This is all stuff people need to hear. Who knows, you know,

01:17:51.780 like it's powerful stuff to me because it relates. I mean, someone else may be listening to this and

01:17:55.600 be able to listen to this Yahoo. No, not at all. I mean, yeah, sure. You're going to probably have

01:18:00.120 a couple of guys who always, you know, cause that's the nature of it. Yeah. You have criticism

01:18:04.120 no matter what you're doing. Yeah. But based on our last conversation and this one, man, I know this

01:18:10.060 is really going to serve the guys. So tell, uh, tell people where to connect with you. If you have

01:18:14.440 anything new coming out and going on, obviously you've got the book. I got my copy right there.

01:18:19.000 There it is. Um, so guys need to pick up a copy of it, but, uh, what else, where else would you have

01:18:24.260 them go if they want to learn more about what you're doing, man? Yeah. So, so the book, um,

01:18:28.800 it's in, uh, online, Amazon, pretty sure it's in Barnes and Noble as well. Um, I mean, for,

01:18:36.220 for myself, uh, you know, the place I'm most active is just Instagram and it's at Matthew Fraz,

01:18:41.940 M-A-T-H-E-W-F-R-A-S. Um, uh, yeah, you know, we, we, we, we got some stuff going on that,

01:18:51.080 uh, you know, we're working towards right now. We can't announce anything right now because it's

01:18:56.340 still in the early works, but yeah, more, more stuff coming. Super excited. Like I'm just over

01:19:01.420 here throwing stones every day, man. Try to try to hit a bird. That's the biggest takeaway from that.

01:19:05.700 Hey, look, when you do come out with anything, whether it's new course program, you're talking

01:19:10.480 about tracks with, um, so is, is it HWPO app? Is that, is that what it is for your program?

01:19:17.220 Yeah. So right now, right now we're, uh, through the hybrid app. So, um,

01:19:22.240 Oh, got it. Okay. Yeah. And, and so we have, uh, the HWPO we've coined it the flagship, which is just

01:19:29.480 like, uh, uh, regular, like if you're looking to get, like, get better in your lifts, um, and like

01:19:37.200 maybe doing like a weekend competition, the programming has, if you want to do everything

01:19:41.440 in there, probably about an hour, 45 to two hours worth of workout, uh, every day. Um, we have the

01:19:47.640 HWPO 60, which is the same thing. All the big bang for the buck pieces, but it's set on time intervals.

01:19:52.560 So you're in and out of the gym, warmup workout, weightlifting, cardio all in 60 minutes. And then we

01:19:58.760 have the pro track right now that is like, uh, you're, you're training for the games. This is

01:20:03.340 your full-time gig. Um, you're all in. Um, yeah. So, I mean, we're, we're looking at expanding, um,

01:20:12.320 because we saw that there was enough of a demand. Like when I launched, I didn't know. I was like,

01:20:16.140 people may not give a shit about what I think is a good workout plan ends up, uh, you know,

01:20:22.800 there's enough traction there that, uh, you know, hiring on employees, trying to grow,

01:20:27.860 trying to figure out what the demand is. Um, and the best way to go about it too. So we don't have

01:20:32.580 a hundred different tracks that are confusing people. You know, we want very cut and dry. Like

01:20:37.720 if these are your priorities, this is where you go. Um, so yeah, I mean, we're just always trying

01:20:43.700 to grow, make it better. Um, you know, still traveling a ton because we're doing community

01:20:49.760 workouts at competitions, podiums at a lot of competitions. So, uh, yeah, we're, we're busy,

01:20:55.960 but, uh, no, it's, it's good. I love it, man. Well, we'll sync it all up for the guys. And then

01:21:01.500 anytime you have anything new or you want to make sure guys, people are aware of it. Let me know,

01:21:05.700 man, I got your back. So I'm in your corner. Thanks, Matt. Appreciate you doing it, man.

01:21:11.380 Yeah. Thank you so much.

01:21:14.580 All right, gentlemen, there you go. My conversation with the one and only Matt Fraser. I hope you

01:21:18.840 enjoyed it. Um, I, like I said, I always enjoy my conversations with Matt, very humble, very down

01:21:24.220 to earth, enjoyable to talk with has obviously a ton of information from physical fitness to mental

01:21:30.620 fitness, to the psychological strategies that he discussed. And he is an incredible, incredible

01:21:36.960 athlete competitor and man in general. So make sure if you would, please go connect with him

01:21:42.940 on Instagram is where he's most active connect with me on Instagram and also pick up a copy of

01:21:49.520 his book, which I think you'll enjoy. Hard work pays off outside of that, leave the ratings and

01:21:53.860 reviews that goes a very long way in bumping and promoting our show. We just hit 19 in the business

01:21:58.740 category of iTunes. That's a huge, huge accomplishment and the highest that we've been in seven years.

01:22:03.720 We're going to crack that top 10 very, very quickly. All I need you to do now is leave that

01:22:08.160 rating and review and stay connected with us. Outside of that, go check out the battle ready

01:22:12.160 program at order of man.com slash battle ready. All right, guys, that's all I've got for you today.

01:22:19.220 We'll be back tomorrow until then go out there, take action and become a man. You are meant to be.

01:22:25.280 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life

01:22:29.640 and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

Order of Man - February 08, 2022

MAT FRASER ｜ Hard Work Pays Off

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