Order of Man - OoM 033： Why Men are Failing to Launch with Matthew Arrington

00:00:00.000 We all know a grown man who is stuck living on his parents' basement couch.

00:00:03.500 Maybe it's you, or maybe it's someone you know,

00:00:05.460 but the fact of the matter is that men are failing to launch more and more frequently.

00:00:09.100 My guest today, Mr. Matthew Arrington, is here to talk with us about why that is

00:00:12.400 and what we can do about it for ourselves, our friends, and our children.

00:00:16.440 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest.

00:00:19.380 Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path.

00:00:22.320 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time.

00:00:26.420 You are not easily deterred or defeated, rugged, resilient, strong.

00:00:31.840 This is your life. This is who you are.

00:00:34.360 This is who you will become at the end of the day,

00:00:37.040 and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.

00:00:41.640 Guys, welcome back to the Order of Man podcast.

00:00:43.840 My name is Ryan Michler. I am the host and the founder of Order of Man,

00:00:47.820 and as always, I'm glad that you're back here with us today.

00:00:50.800 Hope you had a great Halloween weekend.

00:00:52.380 You're probably back to it by now, and I've got a great show lined up for you

00:00:55.660 with a personal friend of mine who talks with us about why the failure to launch syndrome

00:01:00.360 is becoming more and more frequent in the young men that we see today.

00:01:05.280 Now, before I get into that show,

00:01:07.660 thanks a ton to those of you who have took the time out of your day to leave us a rating and review.

00:01:11.860 If you still haven't done that, there's time. There's always time.

00:01:14.720 Please head over to orderofman.com slash iTunes.

00:01:18.140 Leave your review, and we'll try to feature that on a future episode.

00:01:21.520 And also, as a quick reminder of the community that we're building in our Facebook group.

00:01:26.360 We are going to break 1,000 members. I'm stoked about that.

00:01:29.700 This week, we're going to break 1,000 members this week,

00:01:31.960 and I hope that you'll join us in the discussion that we're having about masculinity and manliness.

00:01:36.340 It's been a big help to me and all the guys that are over there.

00:01:38.300 Last week, we talked about how to handle the news of a first child,

00:01:42.220 great men of history to study, and my personal favorite, how to restore an old act.

00:01:47.700 So, we're having some cool conversations over there. Please join us.

00:01:50.200 If you're interested, again, you can go to facebook.com slash groups slash Order of Man,

00:01:55.220 and I hope to see you there.

00:01:56.360 Now, if you want the show notes and the links and the quotes

00:01:58.700 and all the information that we talk about in our episode today,

00:02:01.480 you can head to orderofman.com slash 033.

00:02:04.980 Now, let me introduce you to my guest, Matthew Arrington.

00:02:08.820 He's an entrepreneur and a lifestyle design coach

00:02:10.700 who has a passion for helping young adult men as they transition into manhood.

00:02:14.640 He's the co-founder of one of my favorite companies.

00:02:17.420 He's a good friend of mine, Forte Strong.

00:02:19.180 They specialize in helping young adult men who are dealing with social anxiety

00:02:23.380 and video game addictions and overall just failing to launch.

00:02:26.960 He's also a regular contributor to publications such as Entrepreneur, CEO.com, Salary.com,

00:02:32.440 The Business Journal, How Life Works,

00:02:33.900 and I know there's a lot more on there.

00:02:35.820 Now, this guy is a man's man. 0.62

00:02:37.640 He's an avid combat sport and firearm competitor and a trainer

00:02:40.860 and even worked as a civilian contractor for the military right out of high school.

00:02:45.600 He spends a lot of time outdoors where he perfects the art of things like tracking

00:02:49.200 and hunting and fishing and trapping and bushcraft,

00:02:52.460 and he's here to talk with us about failing to launch.

00:02:55.820 Matthew, thanks for joining us.

00:02:56.800 Glad you're here, man.

00:02:57.400 Yeah, thanks for having me.

00:02:58.920 Yeah, we've had some great conversations.

00:03:00.220 I know we went out to lunch a couple of weeks ago and we talked about a lot of the same

00:03:03.960 things that we address here on Order of Men, so I'm hoping we'll have a good conversation

00:03:08.140 today.

00:03:08.580 Yeah, absolutely.

00:03:09.840 So tell me a little bit about Forte Strong and some of the things that you're doing,

00:03:13.940 maybe even why you got into what it is you're doing now and helping men transition from

00:03:18.860 youth and adolescence into manhood, if you would.

00:03:21.780 Sure, absolutely.

00:03:22.580 So Forte Strong is kind of like a failure to launch company.

00:03:26.740 So I always ask people if they've seen that movie with Matthew McConaughey and Sarah Jessica

00:03:32.640 Parker.

00:03:33.360 That's kind of what we do.

00:03:35.120 In essence, we're working with young adult men who are adults, typically between the age

00:03:40.380 ranges of like 18 to 26, to become self-reliant and independent men.

00:03:45.880 And the reason that I got into this is because I grew up in a situation, and again, we talked

00:03:53.160 and kind of similar where I come from a broken family and my dad, he's a great guy, but wasn't

00:03:59.120 always around in the picture due to his, he did a lot of undercover work and so forth.

00:04:04.540 And really, the positive male mentors in my life will really kind of help me to get to

00:04:10.220 where I am today.

00:04:10.960 And as I started to grow up and as I graduated college and so forth, I saw a lot of guys who

00:04:16.780 were in that situation.

00:04:18.280 And then as I went out into the workforce, you know, and I did my internship at a graduate

00:04:23.240 school and all this other stuff, you know, I really, I really, it just wasn't really meaningful

00:04:27.900 for me, you know, and I found the opportunity working with some guys is kind of like a job

00:04:32.240 coach.

00:04:33.040 You know, I do have an undergrad degree in leadership and organizational management, and

00:04:36.500 I love how, you know, how skills can really help somebody evolve, you know, how, how using

00:04:42.780 leadership or other skills can really help them to become a more complete person.

00:04:46.760 And by doing that and being able to kind of give back and help, you know, some younger

00:04:51.060 guys to, you know, land a job and whatever, it really got the gears turning.

00:04:54.500 And I thought, you know what, this is a really big thing that I think our society needs.

00:04:58.060 I think there's a huge underserved population of young men who really need some help and assistance

00:05:03.580 in putting their best foot forward.

00:05:05.220 So, and so do you think that this, this, is this something as old as time or is this

00:05:09.680 a growing problem that you see trending upwards, if you will?

00:05:12.940 Well, I think, you know, it's definitely a growing problem, but, but the thing is, is

00:05:16.760 I think that all of us know somebody who fits in that category.

00:05:19.820 You know, it might be, it might be a next door neighbor or a brother or, you know, a son

00:05:24.140 or a cousin, but we know somebody, we know a young man who's an adult who's probably still

00:05:28.940 living at home in his parents' basement and not doing much, you know, all of us know

00:05:32.860 somebody like that.

00:05:33.640 Well, so why is that?

00:05:35.720 I mean, what, what are you seeing as being some of the culprits or the reasons why guys

00:05:40.220 aren't launching for lack of a better term?

00:05:42.360 Yeah, that's a great question.

00:05:43.680 And, and, you know, on a, on a broad sense, there are a lot of different reasons.

00:05:47.800 One thing that I would suggest to the people who are listening out here is to get the book

00:05:53.120 Boys Adrift by Dr. Leonard Sachs, who is a, he's a physician, but he's also, you know,

00:05:59.920 a PhD, he has a doctorate in psychology.

00:06:02.880 And in his book, he kind of addresses some key issues of why, you know, based on some research

00:06:07.860 and so forth, why he thinks, you know, that young men are failing to launch.

00:06:11.520 And there are a lot of different factors, you know, there are societal factors such as

00:06:15.480 education.

00:06:16.680 There are factors such as, you know, lack of just like in a family dynamic, lack of a positive

00:06:21.420 male role model.

00:06:22.980 And there are some also factors that are environmental.

00:06:25.680 Young men, for example, and there are tons of studies and we try to do a lot of research,

00:06:29.640 but, you know, young men, for example, at that stage where they're about 18 to 26 are producing

00:06:35.340 about half the level of testosterone that their grandfathers were, you know.

00:06:40.600 Yeah.

00:06:40.920 I've actually had that conversation with other guests.

00:06:43.260 So it's interesting you'd say that.

00:06:44.560 Absolutely.

00:06:45.180 And so all of these things combined really kind of contribute to this failure to launch

00:06:49.820 syndrome or this, you know, this problem.

00:06:54.340 And, you know, again, every single case is different.

00:06:57.040 Every, every one of the people that we work with at Forte Strong is different.

00:06:59.980 You know, some guys are, for example, like adopted and, you know, mom and dad are really

00:07:05.740 successful and they just don't have a lot of time to put the, you know, the parenting

00:07:10.000 to use there.

00:07:11.120 And so they're kind of left to their own devices, you know, and, and hopefully there's a cool

00:07:14.940 teacher or a good role model like an uncle or, or somebody else, a good neighbor who can

00:07:19.700 kind of show them the way, but it usually isn't the case because let's face it, the best

00:07:23.560 example occurs kind of in the home or with a consistent male role model involved.

00:07:28.220 Well, so how do you see guys that are successful?

00:07:31.100 I mean, you, you and I both had fathers that really weren't there and it sounds like it's

00:07:34.880 for different reasons.

00:07:36.020 Sure.

00:07:36.920 So I know I have my own personal story, but how were you able to get a lot of that?

00:07:41.880 So you didn't run into this failure to launch or this, this type of scenario and what are

00:07:45.260 guys doing who maybe are coming out of homes that are, are broken or don't have a father

00:07:51.120 figure?

00:07:51.880 How are they able to transition into that?

00:07:53.940 I think it really, really does come down to, um, to them finding their own.

00:07:59.880 And what I mean by that is either them through a process of personal self-discovery or being

00:08:05.220 shown what it means to be a man by somebody who's kind of been there and done that and,

00:08:09.940 and can, you know, preach the good word, so to speak.

00:08:12.700 Um, you know, I had a lot of positive male role models in my life, you know, besides my dad,

00:08:18.760 like I said, my, my dad, he's a great guy.

00:08:20.480 I love him to death, but you know, his work was, was very specific in what he did and,

00:08:24.260 and it didn't allow for a lot of family time.

00:08:26.260 Um, I had, you know, um, some uncles that were really great guys.

00:08:30.860 Um, I had a, a church leader, uh, you know, who worked with me, um, and a young men's group

00:08:36.880 who was really, really actually had a couple of, and he always made it a point to involve

00:08:40.960 me whenever his sons came to town to visit or whenever they were doing something manly,

00:08:45.300 camping trip or going to the beach or whatever it was.

00:08:48.060 Um, and, and that, that personally has kind of really helped me.

00:08:51.080 And then once I transferred over into the, the academic world, I was really quick to find

00:08:56.880 some male role models there as well.

00:08:59.520 You know, some, uh, professors in the college of business that I attended and so forth.

00:09:04.000 So, you know, whether it's sports or anywhere else, there are people out there who are willing

00:09:08.580 and, you know, wanting to help other young men, but the young men who are struggling really

00:09:14.400 need to go out and kind of find that on their own.

00:09:16.220 I know you've got, you do obviously with your programs and you have a lot going on.

00:09:20.220 Is it a matter of just simply throwing guys in with other men and working it out?

00:09:23.980 I mean, I'm sure it's much deeper than that, but is that cure, I guess, a lot of the, a

00:09:29.120 lot of the, the symptoms?

00:09:30.820 Yes and no.

00:09:31.580 I mean, the change obviously has to really occur within, you know, somebody has to take,

00:09:36.180 uh, initiative and really want to change and have a desire to, to move forward.

00:09:40.980 Now there are a lot of guys who do, you know, most of the, the young men that we work with

00:09:45.300 us, it's like, you know, Hey, I really want to be better.

00:09:47.460 I don't know how though.

00:09:48.640 I don't know how.

00:09:49.540 And it's kind of like, it's kind of like, you know, if somebody were just to come up

00:09:53.120 to a little kid, for example, like I've got a six year old son, if I were to come up

00:09:57.380 to him and put a toolbox in front of him, he'd be like, wow, cool tools.

00:10:01.380 But that doesn't mean he'd really be able to recognize, you know, know how to use them.

00:10:05.900 And, and so, so half the battle is having the tools.

00:10:09.280 And I think the other half of the battle is knowing how to use the appropriate tool for

00:10:13.100 the correct application.

00:10:14.280 And that's kind of what we do.

00:10:15.540 So yes, changing the environment is absolutely crucial.

00:10:19.000 It's absolutely essential because what we do is, you know, if you take a guy who's not

00:10:23.240 really doing well and he's in, you know, the same environment with the same people, um,

00:10:29.480 you know, the same resources and the same opportunities, he's going to continue to do

00:10:33.260 the same exact thing, right?

00:10:35.100 Sure.

00:10:35.280 It's kind of like that quote of like, you know, the definition of insanity is doing the same

00:10:38.820 thing over and over and expecting different results.

00:10:40.540 So if you take that same individual, put them in a new place with new people and new opportunities,

00:10:46.920 he has an opportunity to set the, or hit the reset button and really go, okay, this is

00:10:52.380 my time to take a step back, really assess who I am and who it is that I want to become.

00:10:57.220 You know, who's the type of man that I want, that I want to be.

00:10:59.940 So, so that's, that's definitely half the, half the, uh, the, the equation there.

00:11:04.160 And the other half I think is, is again, just putting them in an opportunity where they can

00:11:08.260 experience things.

00:11:09.420 So for example, one thing that boys are really, really great at is experiential learning.

00:11:14.600 Okay.

00:11:15.080 Instead of just sitting in a class, you know, girls conversely are very good at that, right? 0.99

00:11:19.880 I mean, they can sit in a, in a classroom all day long and look at a blackboard and, um,

00:11:24.440 theorize about certain concepts, but for boys, you, they need to be experiencing it, you know?

00:11:31.280 And I'll give you, I'll give you the perfect example.

00:11:34.200 Um, so, you know, sometimes we can try to read to our kids, right?

00:11:38.060 For bedtime and stuff.

00:11:39.140 And, and my, my, I've got a couple of daughters and I've got a son, I've got one son.

00:11:44.080 My daughters are really great at being like, Oh, look at the pretty colors on that, on that 1.00

00:11:47.640 bug.

00:11:48.040 You know, for example, we're looking at a book about insects, man, that, that lady bug's really 1.00

00:11:51.540 pretty, look at all these different colors and everything else.

00:11:53.440 And that's kind of what they focus on.

00:11:54.960 They focus on the beauty and the, you know, tell me about this.

00:11:58.020 Whereas my son, he's kind of like zoning off.

00:12:00.000 Right.

00:12:00.660 But if I say, Hey, you know, let's go out tomorrow.

00:12:02.860 Let's flip over some rocks.

00:12:04.180 Let's, let's look through some bushes.

00:12:05.820 Let's try to find some of these bugs.

00:12:07.120 I mean, how much more is he going to remember that, you know, he's going to be so much more

00:12:12.640 excited about going out and discovering and searching and holding a bug and let it crawl on his

00:12:16.900 fingers than he is just looking at the photo.

00:12:19.880 Yeah.

00:12:20.260 Yeah.

00:12:20.520 That makes total sense.

00:12:21.420 And I want to talk about that.

00:12:22.600 I want to get into that a little bit more, but before we do, I want to know what your

00:12:25.720 thought is it, how, how is this applicable to somebody who maybe isn't stuck in their

00:12:31.300 parents' basement, but they feel like they're stuck in life.

00:12:35.440 Maybe it's a relationship or their career.

00:12:38.040 And how is this applicable to some of those guys?

00:12:40.600 Yeah.

00:12:40.900 Great question.

00:12:41.960 Well, here's the thing that, you know, what we've come to find out is, is, you know, and

00:12:47.960 Tony Robbins talks about this too, is that we make decisions based on two different things.

00:12:53.140 Okay.

00:12:53.480 So Tony Robbins says we make, we make decisions based on pain or pleasure.

00:12:57.840 Okay.

00:12:58.700 Pleasure, you know, things that we want and pain to avoid things that we don't want.

00:13:02.660 We refer to it as, uh, inspiration or desperation.

00:13:05.980 So we'll make choices or decisions based on inspiration or desperation.

00:13:08.960 Now they both have their pros and cons, right?

00:13:11.160 But the bottom line is, is I think that in order to, to change, you need to feel uncomfortable.

00:13:16.680 Okay.

00:13:17.080 And, and if you're not uncomfortable, you're not going to want to change.

00:13:21.080 You're just, that's just how it works.

00:13:22.640 And so for, for guys who are maybe not at that, you know, level of, of needing help,

00:13:27.640 but, but still want to change something, I think they need to really define what it is

00:13:31.540 that they want to change.

00:13:33.340 And, and, you know, cause a lot of times we're struggling and we don't really, you know,

00:13:37.300 we can't put a price tag on what it is, you know?

00:13:40.320 And, and so by really kind of taking a deep look and say, what is it that I want to change?

00:13:45.000 Do I want to change my social life?

00:13:46.680 Do I want to change my financial life?

00:13:48.400 Do I want to change my, my health, you know, and identify what it is and then seek somebody

00:13:53.440 who can help you out.

00:13:54.600 I know that you're just because of the conversations that we've had, you're big into progression

00:13:58.840 and self-development.

00:14:00.040 How does, like, what are the questions that somebody needs to be asking themselves?

00:14:03.980 Like, what does that look like for you when you're reflecting on your own life and you're

00:14:07.540 wanting to improve or make it to that next level in an area of your life?

00:14:11.700 What is it that you're going through?

00:14:13.260 Is there a process?

00:14:13.820 Is there a series of questions?

00:14:15.240 What can we use to do that?

00:14:16.440 Yeah.

00:14:16.960 So I, I use a process, um, that I call OST and it's objective strategy and tactic.

00:14:22.880 Okay.

00:14:23.280 So it goes from kind of like the big level down to the details.

00:14:26.920 And, and the rough idea is I need to identify what it is that I want to change about my life.

00:14:32.540 So for example, order of man, you know, you've got a really great structure of these key concepts

00:14:37.800 of what it means, you know, to be a man.

00:14:39.540 So let's try to classify what it is that I want to work on first and foremost.

00:14:43.560 Okay.

00:14:43.960 And let's come up with an, with an objective.

00:14:46.440 So for an example, let's, let's say that it has to do with your health.

00:14:49.500 Right.

00:14:50.180 So I'll say, okay, I want to, you know, gain some muscle mass.

00:14:54.040 Right.

00:14:54.320 I'm using that as a personal experience because it's something that I usually struggled with

00:14:57.520 when I was young.

00:14:58.200 Right.

00:14:58.400 It's kind of a scrawny kid.

00:14:59.580 So, so I want to, I want to gain some weight.

00:15:01.680 That's the objective.

00:15:03.020 What's the strategy.

00:15:04.300 Okay.

00:15:04.560 So let's break it down a little bit more, more finitely here.

00:15:07.840 What's the strategy.

00:15:08.580 The strategy is that I'm going to, um, I'm going to eat more and I'm going to work out,

00:15:14.540 you know, I'm going to listen to some good ways.

00:15:16.100 Okay.

00:15:16.620 And then I need to get even more detailed and say, what's the tactic.

00:15:19.380 So I need to be really, really detailed in what that is.

00:15:22.160 Because if I just say, Hey, I want to be healthier and by eating more food and working out,

00:15:26.280 what does that look like?

00:15:27.000 What does that look like?

00:15:28.500 So the tactic would be, okay, I'm going to go, you know, running two days of the week.

00:15:32.620 I'm going to go running on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

00:15:35.280 And on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, I'm going to go to the gym and I'm going to do

00:15:38.920 some strength training with weights.

00:15:40.800 And then with my food component, the tactic is instead of eating three meals, I'm going

00:15:45.240 to eat maybe say five meals.

00:15:47.080 Okay.

00:15:47.580 In the morning, then I'm going to have a snack, then I'm going to have lunch and another

00:15:50.800 snack and then dinner.

00:15:51.760 That kind of protocol has really helped me to, you know, when I want to change something

00:15:56.020 or whatever to really give me some specifics and some attainable methodology for accomplishing

00:16:01.560 a specific goal.

00:16:02.640 Yeah, I really like that.

00:16:03.740 I think I've talked about this a lot.

00:16:05.480 And a lot of times men that I have on, even on the podcast will say, you need to reflect,

00:16:09.040 you need to ask yourself.

00:16:10.340 But at the end of the day, it's such a high level thing that I think a lot of guys skim

00:16:13.700 over that.

00:16:14.300 So to have, you know, have the strategy, the tactics, and then to have that working

00:16:18.680 roadmap, I guess, is going to be beneficial for a lot of guys.

00:16:21.960 So one of the things that I'm impressed with your program, I think this is right.

00:16:25.320 So correct me if I'm wrong, but 100% of the men who are coming into your program are coming

00:16:30.420 voluntarily, correct?

00:16:31.640 They are.

00:16:32.320 Correct.

00:16:32.820 And I know there's a lot of programs out there, especially for younger kids, I think,

00:16:36.820 who are, you know, in their early teens and still at home, still minors, I guess.

00:16:41.200 Because it's not always that way.

00:16:43.120 So what are some of the things that these guys are saying?

00:16:46.740 You're saying they're in desperation.

00:16:48.420 And why?

00:16:49.180 What are they telling themselves?

00:16:50.480 What are they experiencing?

00:16:51.740 And what's forcing them to be, to feel like they want to be in this situation?

00:16:55.300 Yeah.

00:16:55.920 So a lot of guys are, I'd say that the key issues that is contributing to the failure

00:17:01.980 to launch syndrome that these guys are experiencing are social anxiety, depression, process addiction,

00:17:09.240 which would be, you know, considered video games, pornography, or excessive social media,

00:17:15.240 and lack of motivation, you know.

00:17:18.120 And, you know, these are all things that obviously are really detrimental, you know, to somebody's

00:17:24.940 progress.

00:17:25.980 And when someone comes in, you know, they're saying, hey, look, you know, I was the kind

00:17:29.720 of guy who, you know, maybe I wasn't super confident in school.

00:17:33.600 Maybe I was really picked on.

00:17:35.540 And that just, you know, started a domino effect for the rest of my life, you know.

00:17:39.800 When I was picked on and bullied in school or, you know, people really didn't reach out to me,

00:17:44.700 it really diminished my self-esteem.

00:17:47.360 And now that I'm a man, how do I find that again?

00:17:49.900 How do I recover that self-esteem and recover that lost time of, you know, growing up?

00:17:55.900 And so that's typically what we see.

00:17:57.640 You know, we see a lot of guys which we refer to as boomerang kids.

00:18:01.320 And when I say kids, they're still adults, but they've left the nest.

00:18:04.640 You know, they've left mom and dad's house.

00:18:06.000 They've been to college.

00:18:07.180 And for one reason or another, they weren't successful.

00:18:10.020 Either it was, you know, they didn't know how to function in an academic setting at that level.

00:18:15.980 You know, there was too much responsibility.

00:18:17.720 It was overwhelming.

00:18:19.520 There was too many people.

00:18:21.080 I didn't fit in.

00:18:22.440 And for one reason or another, they just stopped going.

00:18:24.380 They went back to what's comfortable.

00:18:26.080 You know, they went back to video games.

00:18:27.380 They went back to, you know, to social media where they could connect with people without

00:18:30.900 putting a face to the name, you know, all those things.

00:18:34.460 That makes sense.

00:18:34.900 What are some of the skills that men learn who have no problem transitioning from boyhood

00:18:41.040 into manhood have learned that maybe some of these other guys have not learned?

00:18:45.680 Are there some specific skills that they need to work on or improve?

00:18:49.620 Yeah, great question.

00:18:50.900 I think there are.

00:18:52.100 I think some of the key skills would be, number one, communication, being able to, you

00:18:57.640 know, communicate your opinion, you know, just have your voice heard, whether it gets

00:19:02.280 accepted or not, but being able to converse with somebody.

00:19:04.980 And I don't mean being able to converse with somebody necessarily, you know, via email or

00:19:09.160 whatever, but face to face.

00:19:10.880 There is nothing in this world, no matter how technologically advanced we become as a world

00:19:16.180 as a society, there's nothing that can replace good old fashioned face to face interaction,

00:19:21.720 you know?

00:19:22.220 Right.

00:19:22.480 And a lot of that communication, most of it, in fact, is nonverbal, is nonverbal.

00:19:28.740 And what we find is because we're living in such a technologically advanced age where we

00:19:33.280 can communicate on our cell phones and on our computer and, you know, even through our

00:19:37.580 video game consoles is there's less of a need to practice that nonverbal communication,

00:19:43.280 those skills, you know?

00:19:44.860 Not necessarily just the inflection of your voice and the way you talk, but what about

00:19:47.940 your facial features?

00:19:49.140 What about the way that you use your hands, the way that you sit in an interview with somebody

00:19:53.360 that can help to demonstrate and exude a little bit of confidence or capability to that person

00:19:59.620 who's interviewing you?

00:20:00.320 So, okay.

00:20:02.160 So, number one is communication.

00:20:03.520 What other skills?

00:20:04.220 So, I think another skill would be, you know, because you have basically, you have some hard

00:20:09.460 skills and some soft skills, right?

00:20:10.860 The hard skills would be like something like a trade.

00:20:13.400 You know, can you work with your hands or are you proficient at doing anything like that?

00:20:17.820 You know, can you change the oil on your vehicle?

00:20:21.020 Can you, you know, I know that you're really great at working with wood, Ryan.

00:20:24.020 I've seen some of your work.

00:20:25.100 You know, do they have any skills like that?

00:20:27.860 Okay.

00:20:28.040 Um, and so, so communication is, it would be considered a soft skill.

00:20:32.040 And I think that that's really the type of skill set that these guys are lacking.

00:20:36.120 Okay.

00:20:36.820 Um, so communication would be one, um, motivation is another one, you know, it's another skill.

00:20:41.700 And let's, let's face it.

00:20:43.020 All of us at some point or another are unmotivated.

00:20:45.980 We really are.

00:20:47.240 But if you have a resolve to still go, you know what?

00:20:50.840 I might not be motivated today, but my overall goal is, for example, graduating from college.

00:20:55.960 So even though I don't want to go to class, I don't want to go to study group.

00:20:59.180 I don't want to do this.

00:21:00.180 I'm going to be motivated enough because I see the light at the end of the tunnel or there's a higher purpose for me to sacrifice, you know, what I'm feeling right now.

00:21:07.980 Um, I think, uh, another skill too would be not understanding your own emotions.

00:21:14.660 Okay.

00:21:15.380 And, and we're kind of getting, you know, we're starting to get again, really into the soft side

00:21:19.680 of things.

00:21:20.020 And, and as men, you know, we don't a lot of times talk about, uh, our emotions necessarily.

00:21:25.980 Right.

00:21:26.300 Yeah.

00:21:26.440 That's not manly.

00:21:27.080 Exactly.

00:21:27.600 But, but what I'm referring to is not necessarily talking about your emotions, but understanding

00:21:32.320 how it is that you're feeling.

00:21:33.880 We work with a clinical psychologist.

00:21:35.500 His name is Dan Sanderson, Dr. Dan Sanderson.

00:21:37.820 And he's amazing.

00:21:38.440 He's come up with a, with a, a model that we refer to, um, as the, uh, is it the developmental

00:21:44.360 vacation model?

00:21:45.660 And, and, you know, boys are really great at creating distractions for themselves and saying,

00:21:50.720 okay, ah, I'm going to play video games instead of doing something hard, you know, instead

00:21:54.100 of doing yard work or job application.

00:21:56.240 I'm going to distract myself from progressing in my adult life.

00:22:00.060 And, and he says, you know, I talked to a lot of parents and in his words, he says,

00:22:03.600 the biggest thing, if I can just get one thing across the parents and I talk to them, it's

00:22:08.780 control your own emotions.

00:22:10.560 Because if you can control your own emotions, you know, a lot of parents, you know, we fly

00:22:14.120 off the handle or we don't want to deal with the emotions.

00:22:16.200 And so we'll isolate ourselves and we won't deal with it.

00:22:18.480 We're not passing that onto our children.

00:22:20.620 And so as our boys grow up, they don't know how to recognize their emotions.

00:22:24.940 And what they do instead is they get confused or they'll act out or, or, or they'll just

00:22:30.660 isolate because they don't know how to recognize their own emotions.

00:22:33.700 So again, being able to recognize your emotions helps you, helps you as a person to self-assess

00:22:39.800 what to do, you know?

00:22:42.140 Um, cause, cause we've all got triggers and we all have suitors.

00:22:45.180 So triggers being those things that really set off a specific emotion in us, whether

00:22:49.600 it's a good emotion or whether it's, you know, a hard emotion to deal with.

00:22:53.600 And then we all have suitors, things that we go to that make us to feel more comfortable.

00:22:57.740 And so, you know, the guys who are failing to launch fall in that category of, I've got

00:23:02.660 a lot of triggers and my suitor is video games or my suitor is social media or my suitor is

00:23:08.740 just isolating, you know, and not, not talking to anybody.

00:23:12.240 Right.

00:23:12.900 Yeah.

00:23:13.260 It's interesting.

00:23:13.900 I can even catch myself, you know, driving on the road and somebody cuts me off and I

00:23:16.960 get road rage and then I, and then I react to that road rage and probably not a healthy

00:23:21.320 manner.

00:23:21.660 And then I catch my son doing it.

00:23:23.120 I'm like, Oh man, I need to be better at that because I know he's watching everything

00:23:26.440 that I do and he learned, learning from me.

00:23:28.160 Right.

00:23:28.760 Exactly.

00:23:29.320 Exactly.

00:23:29.760 How else can we instill some of these things, whether it's communication, motivation, those

00:23:34.300 emotional triggers and understanding your emotions in our children.

00:23:37.060 I know if we can address a lot of that beforehand, it may be that not as many men are going to

00:23:43.460 run into the situation of needing help in that transition.

00:23:47.400 How can we help our children in these areas?

00:23:49.440 Absolutely.

00:23:49.980 Absolutely.

00:23:50.420 Great question.

00:23:51.000 So, so again, I'm going to revert back to Dr. Dan Sanderson's methodology here because

00:23:55.820 he's, he's just way better at this than I am and he's done it a lot longer.

00:23:59.680 And so the approach, you know, we talk about what we refer to here, you know, in our industry

00:24:04.680 as the ego states.

00:24:06.020 Okay.

00:24:06.580 And, and in his developmental model, these ego states are, um, you know, you've got

00:24:11.380 nurturing parents and you've got critical parents and then you've got the adult ego

00:24:16.240 state.

00:24:16.660 So those are the three main ego states.

00:24:18.200 Okay.

00:24:18.500 So the nurturing parent is the type of parent that, um, that coddles, that helicopters and

00:24:24.160 says, Oh, you know, let me make everything better.

00:24:26.240 Or, you know, so, so for example, let's say that you're walking up in the grocery store

00:24:29.560 and you go to checkout and they've got all the candy there and you've got a four year

00:24:33.780 old who goes, you know, I want mommy, I want some daddy, I want some, you know, some candy.

00:24:37.860 Okay.

00:24:38.020 The nurturing parent will say, no, you can't have that.

00:24:41.320 And then what does the kid do?

00:24:42.360 The kid throws a fit, right?

00:24:43.820 Right.

00:24:44.040 Of course.

00:24:44.440 Yeah.

00:24:44.560 To avoid embarrassment or whatever, it's like, okay, okay, okay, here you go, here you go,

00:24:47.880 whatever.

00:24:48.140 Just, just be quiet.

00:24:49.000 I just need you to be okay.

00:24:50.400 Okay.

00:24:50.840 And that's, that's what the nurturing parent does.

00:24:52.560 Because the, uh, the critical parent on the other hand is, is the parent who's always

00:24:56.800 critical, right?

00:24:57.820 You know, it was very, very demanding, like, like your child, you know, they can never live

00:25:01.900 up to your expectations.

00:25:02.740 So, you know, you got an A minus on the test, well, why didn't you get an A?

00:25:07.020 Okay.

00:25:07.440 Yeah.

00:25:07.640 That's that kind of a parent.

00:25:08.900 And then there's the parent who's the adult and that's where you want to be.

00:25:12.140 That's, that's the really happy medium where I'm not going to enable my children, but

00:25:16.400 I'm also not going to be so critical that they can never live up to unrealistic expectations.

00:25:20.620 Okay.

00:25:21.620 And so an adult, somebody who's in the adult ego state, you know, as we're raising children

00:25:26.380 can, can not only manage their emotions, but show an effective model of how their children

00:25:31.220 could and should manage their emotions as well.

00:25:33.980 We're going back to the, uh, you know, the kid in the grocery store, um, you know, example.

00:25:38.460 So you, you've got a kid who's screaming and crying, you know, somebody who's in the adult

00:25:41.980 mindset or the adult ego state would say, son, you can't have this candy.

00:25:46.120 Okay.

00:25:46.460 I love you.

00:25:47.440 I love you, but you can't have this candy right now.

00:25:49.400 It's going to spoil your dinner.

00:25:50.620 Okay.

00:25:50.920 And being able to go, you know what?

00:25:52.520 I'm okay to feel uncomfortable with my kid crying because this is an important lesson

00:25:57.220 that I can teach them, right?

00:25:58.380 This is a learning moment.

00:26:00.200 And as we look for those learning opportunities throughout, uh, you know, throughout our life,

00:26:06.060 okay, we're able to really set a good, solid example of our, of our children, uh, of what

00:26:12.020 they should be like.

00:26:12.980 So if I can give one other example, this actually happened to me yesterday.

00:26:15.620 Okay.

00:26:16.060 So I was at church yesterday and, um, and the kids were doing a presentation to the

00:26:21.340 whole congregation.

00:26:22.100 Okay.

00:26:22.540 And my daughter, uh, bless her heart is nine.

00:26:25.060 She's really cute.

00:26:25.920 She's really great.

00:26:26.560 It's nice to do it.

00:26:28.200 Um, it came up for this part where she was singing a solo with all the other kids, all

00:26:32.340 the other kids sing this one verse and then it goes to her and they had a violin and they

00:26:35.840 had the piano and everything else going on.

00:26:37.680 Um, and she missed her cue to come in.

00:26:40.420 She missed her cue to come in and I'm, and there's seriously like, you know, 350 people

00:26:45.120 watching her.

00:26:46.080 Right.

00:26:46.320 And so she kind of looks around uncertainly, you know, and, and, and steps down.

00:26:50.840 And then, um, you know, one of the, one of the leader ladies says, you know, let's, you

00:26:54.680 know, do this again.

00:26:55.780 And so they stopped the music.

00:26:57.320 The girl stops the violin.

00:26:58.260 They stopped the piano.

00:26:59.320 Then they come in again and she steps back up and starts singing again.

00:27:03.700 Okay.

00:27:04.080 And she goes through her verse.

00:27:05.420 Now this was really, really embarrassing for her.

00:27:07.940 Right.

00:27:08.420 So I'm sure.

00:27:09.400 Yeah.

00:27:09.520 Afterwards she came down and she's just, and, and, you know, she found us in the congregation

00:27:13.360 and she started crying.

00:27:14.380 She started bawling, you know?

00:27:16.460 And I said, Hey, I said, Hey, you did a great job, you know?

00:27:20.080 And she says, no, but I missed it.

00:27:21.640 And I failed.

00:27:22.380 And I said, that's okay.

00:27:23.520 I said, that happens to all of us.

00:27:25.660 So normalizing things that should be normalized, you know, and not making it a big deal really helps

00:27:32.180 her to, you know, and that's a great experience.

00:27:33.660 I'm actually glad that it happened.

00:27:35.420 I'm glad that, you know, none of us want to see our children fail, but I'm glad that that

00:27:39.240 happened because it was a perfect learning opportunity for me to say, guess what?

00:27:43.200 We make mistakes in life and you're still a good person.

00:27:45.620 That does not diminish your value as a human being.

00:27:48.540 We're all, you know, and then, um, you know, of course other people come up to her afterwards.

00:27:52.200 And, and this is what I said, and this is really a key, a key moment where I think we,

00:27:56.140 as parents fail is we, we highlight the victory instead of the character attribute that's

00:28:02.920 associated with that victory.

00:28:04.600 Okay.

00:28:05.020 Oh, interesting.

00:28:05.880 Yeah.

00:28:06.060 And so what I said to her was, as I said, sweetheart, you know what I'm really proud of?

00:28:10.180 I'm proud that you got back up after missing it the first time and you went through and

00:28:14.900 you did it again.

00:28:15.540 And that's what I'm proud of, you know, and, and she's, she's wiping the tears and it just

00:28:19.840 made me really proud.

00:28:21.640 And those are the proud moments that we need to really kind of take as parents and go, that's

00:28:26.000 what it means to be an adult.

00:28:27.020 That's what it means to kind of take care of ourselves, you know?

00:28:29.220 And so, um, so yeah, we're going to make mistakes as human beings, but being able to

00:28:33.580 highlight the characteristic of, I'm glad that you stuck that through or whatever it is

00:28:38.440 instead of the objective.

00:28:39.860 Oh yeah, completely.

00:28:41.340 And the word that comes to mind for me is, is being assertive.

00:28:44.820 I read a book and I can't remember the book, I'll have to track this down, but they talk

00:28:47.800 about the four communication styles.

00:28:49.440 So they talk about, you can be aggressive, you can be passive, you can be passive aggressive,

00:28:54.940 which is the sarcastic person, right?

00:28:56.800 Sure, sure.

00:28:57.380 Or you can be an assertive communicator.

00:28:59.900 Correct.

00:29:00.160 And it sounds like that's what you're talking about here is understanding what's going on,

00:29:04.040 being aware of the situation and then using it in a controlled environment as a teaching

00:29:07.640 opportunity.

00:29:08.300 Exactly, exactly.

00:29:09.160 And in other words, we're not, we're not letting the emotions get the best of us.

00:29:12.000 We're able to kind of recognize the emotion and then put it on the shelf as saying, I

00:29:16.700 feel this emotion, that way I can categorize it.

00:29:19.360 Now I can think logically, you know, and see through this issue or whatever it is that

00:29:23.160 I'm dealing with.

00:29:24.180 Yeah.

00:29:24.480 And we talk a lot about that in, in the context of this, you know, masculine conversation

00:29:28.780 as stoicism, right?

00:29:30.320 Being stoic, being above your emotions.

00:29:32.440 So cool.

00:29:33.180 Yeah.

00:29:33.320 It makes total sense.

00:29:34.220 So tell me a little bit about the program.

00:29:36.120 So somebody comes in and they recognize that they've got, they've got an issue that they

00:29:40.540 need to work through and they voluntarily come through the program and then they leave and

00:29:43.500 they're successful.

00:29:44.180 What happens in between?

00:29:45.600 So in between, there's a lot of struggle.

00:29:47.480 Okay.

00:29:48.000 So, so basically as we transition from children into men, all right, we need to hit what we

00:29:54.560 refer to as developmental milestones.

00:29:57.160 Okay.

00:29:57.380 And what those developmental milestones are, is they're basically specific scenarios that

00:30:03.800 force us to confront our own emotions or a specific situation.

00:30:08.560 Okay.

00:30:09.320 And by experiencing the emotions that are associated with that situation is where we change and

00:30:16.500 develop and grow.

00:30:18.360 All right.

00:30:18.760 And, and so if we don't hit those developmental milestones by the time we reach adults, then

00:30:24.380 you have a person in an adult body who still has the mindset of, of somebody much younger,

00:30:28.980 like an adolescent.

00:30:30.380 And so through our program, we basically condense these developmental milestones and run our guys

00:30:36.960 through it, you know, and give them experiences and basically have them experience those emotions

00:30:42.500 and confront the emotions that are associated with those, uh, those decisions.

00:30:46.480 So are there some certain ones that you can share with us as far as a milestone that you

00:30:51.340 take men through where you see a lot of success?

00:30:53.240 Sure.

00:30:53.540 Sure.

00:30:53.900 Absolutely.

00:30:54.380 So one of those milestones is being financially responsible, you know, not, not going to mom

00:30:59.100 and dad every single time that I need some, some financial assistance.

00:31:03.700 So being able to, um, you know, get a job and, and whether you like it or not being confident

00:31:10.480 and being grateful that you're providing for yourself, that's a big one.

00:31:13.320 And then helping them manage those finances.

00:31:15.480 Right.

00:31:15.780 Because if you're in the, if you've got money and you're in the, the, you know, that child

00:31:19.680 mindset, you're still thinking like an adolescent, what are you going to do with that

00:31:22.440 money?

00:31:23.140 Right.

00:31:23.400 Right.

00:31:23.680 Right.

00:31:23.800 Yeah.

00:31:24.060 Yeah.

00:31:24.380 You're not going to, you know, video games or whatever else.

00:31:26.620 Right.

00:31:27.140 Of course.

00:31:27.740 And so, um, and so, but being able to say, Oh, you know, I really want to buy, you know,

00:31:31.660 that video game or whatever else it is.

00:31:33.640 But, you know, what I'm going to do instead is because I know I'm going to be responsible

00:31:37.580 for like my utilities.

00:31:39.160 I'm just going to pay for my utilities.

00:31:40.760 So basically there are kind of like three criteria, if you would, that are markers for

00:31:44.560 adulthood or being a man.

00:31:46.080 Okay.

00:31:46.320 And that's accepting responsibility for oneself.

00:31:49.480 Okay.

00:31:49.880 Making independent decisions and being financially independent.

00:31:54.400 And so those three things, if you can kind of take care of those things, then that those

00:31:59.420 are pretty much indicators that, that you're being able to function as a man.

00:32:02.760 Okay.

00:32:03.240 Am I accepting responsibility for the decisions I make, whether good or bad.

00:32:07.080 Okay.

00:32:07.540 And owning up to those.

00:32:08.720 Am I making autonomous decisions?

00:32:11.340 Okay.

00:32:11.580 Instead of other people, specifically mom and dad making those for me.

00:32:15.240 And am I financially taking care of myself?

00:32:17.820 And so those are the kind of the things that we run our guys through, um, you know, teach

00:32:22.240 them how to manage their finances, how to save, how to shop on a budget.

00:32:25.860 That's, that's a big thing too.

00:32:27.340 And that kind of falls under the financial category, making independent decisions.

00:32:31.080 So, um, you know, making a decision.

00:32:34.340 Okay.

00:32:34.820 So, so not just being completely stonewalled by uncertainty, but saying, Hey, I don't know

00:32:41.420 what's going to happen, but I'm going to make a decision and I'm going to learn from

00:32:44.020 it regardless of what the outcome is.

00:32:45.700 Now, obviously we want them to make, you know, their best informed decision as, and as

00:32:49.560 best they can as adults.

00:32:51.020 But if it doesn't turn out the way that they want it to, to kind of, you know, we do a

00:32:54.700 debrief and say, how did that go?

00:32:56.220 Ah, it really didn't work how I, how I thought it was going to go.

00:32:58.740 All right.

00:32:59.040 Let's talk about that and discuss it and discuss how we can learn from this and make

00:33:02.100 a better decision later on.

00:33:03.440 Okay.

00:33:04.020 And then obviously accepting responsibility.

00:33:06.140 So in other words, this is the point where you, when you transition to manhood, you are

00:33:10.280 a hundred percent taking responsibility for the decisions that you make.

00:33:13.220 You're not blaming mom and dad for anything that happened in the past anymore, regardless

00:33:18.180 of if it was your fault or not, you know, because a lot of guys fall into situations

00:33:22.220 where, you know, when you're a child, for example, and mom and dad are moving around

00:33:25.480 or they're getting divorced or whatever, that's right.

00:33:27.560 What can you do?

00:33:28.260 Exactly.

00:33:28.600 That's really not, that's not, it wasn't your fault.

00:33:30.620 But now that you're an adult now, okay, dwelling on a past, isn't going to do anything for

00:33:35.500 you at all.

00:33:36.600 So how can you take responsibility right now for your decisions instead of dwelling on

00:33:41.200 those past things or making excuses as to why something didn't work out based on something

00:33:45.660 that happened in the past?

00:33:46.580 So what are your thoughts on rites of passages?

00:33:49.320 I know we've talked a lot about that in previous podcasts and men going through that, but we

00:33:54.420 don't see those quote unquote rites of passages as much anymore.

00:33:58.300 I'd like to know your opinion on that.

00:33:59.740 Yeah, we don't, we don't, you know, and, and I think I really do think that it's essential

00:34:04.880 on a certain level for, for men to really feel like they belong to the brotherhood, to

00:34:10.480 the tribe or to the, you know, the clan of men, if you will, you know, you look at a

00:34:16.180 lot of different indigenous cultures and they all have it in different societies, they all

00:34:19.760 have it.

00:34:20.440 And, and we, you know, and you might have it really like in the United States, for example,

00:34:25.440 like that might look like, you know, a church group, for example, as, as a young man, you

00:34:29.560 know, rises through a specific group, he gets different responsibility until he's to the

00:34:33.640 point where, yeah, he's accepted by, you know, the congregation or whatever, or it might

00:34:38.300 be, it might be, um, sports related, you know, where you're working up your way as a young

00:34:43.300 man through specific sport things until, for example, you make that college team or you

00:34:47.420 get that black belt or whatever it is.

00:34:49.200 So it's still, it still exists.

00:34:51.320 We don't see it a lot.

00:34:52.620 I think it's a great thing.

00:34:53.860 I really do.

00:34:54.600 I think, I think having some sort of a rite of passage for our younger generation, whatever

00:34:59.040 that looks like, um, you know, can be extremely helpful in building confidence and not only

00:35:03.760 that, but helping them to feel included, right.

00:35:06.180 To help them feel like, uh, you know, I've made this important step so that now I can

00:35:11.340 continue on the rest of my life with, with a certain mantle, I guess, if that makes sense.

00:35:15.960 So, yeah, that makes total sense.

00:35:17.720 So how do you, how do you recommend somebody find that either for themselves or maybe they're

00:35:24.080 looking for rites of passages for their, their kids?

00:35:27.020 Yeah.

00:35:27.400 Yeah.

00:35:27.980 Well, you know, I, I would take a look at, you know, a lot of rites of passages occur within

00:35:32.720 families based on their traditions.

00:35:34.420 For example, in my family, you know, hunting was a pretty big thing, right.

00:35:38.480 And, and, you know, I saw your post on Facebook, you know, about, about the gun thing too,

00:35:43.220 you know, and that to, that for my family is a passage of, of, of manhood.

00:35:48.860 It really is.

00:35:49.640 So, you know, when you get your first rifle, when you go on your first hunt, when you have

00:35:55.140 your first kill, and I know this kind of, you know, this is, uh, this goes back to kind

00:35:59.280 of like the caveman thing, but that's, that's kind of a tradition that my family has.

00:36:02.440 You know, when we, when we go deer hunting or whatever, and we're, you know, and, and,

00:36:06.260 and we, you know, have that experience connecting because in my family, the girls really didn't 0.93

00:36:12.500 do hunting.

00:36:13.260 They just really didn't.

00:36:14.420 You know?

00:36:14.660 And I remember to this day, some of the fondest memories I have are when I was in junior high

00:36:19.420 school and my dad said, Hey, we're going to take off two days of school so you can go

00:36:23.380 hunting with me.

00:36:24.080 Like, it was that important that I was going to take off school and march around in the

00:36:28.460 woods with my dad in the mountain and get an animal.

00:36:32.220 Right.

00:36:32.840 And, you know, obviously this dates back to, you know, previous things and I don't know

00:36:36.240 specifically where it came from.

00:36:37.560 I know that, that my grandfather, for example, hunted for food for the fam, for his family

00:36:41.660 during the depression.

00:36:43.420 But, um, but you know, for, for my dad, like that was a passage of manhood, you know?

00:36:47.360 And, and after, you know, uh, you know, praying, having a prayer before we went out that, that,

00:36:52.920 that we'd be blessed that, you know, we could find, um, some game to provide food for our

00:36:57.060 family.

00:36:57.320 Cause we did, we, we ate it, you know, we use the animal and so forth.

00:37:00.220 And that, that was a big transition, you know, uh, to manhood for me and my confidence.

00:37:04.720 Now for other people, you know, maybe there are men out there who don't hunt and whatever.

00:37:08.100 That's great.

00:37:08.900 Maybe it looks like something else, but I would figure, you know, something out if I was a dad

00:37:13.420 and, and, and I, and there really wasn't a lot for me to go on or I didn't have a

00:37:16.520 history of what that would look like.

00:37:17.960 I developed some sort of a passage of manhood.

00:37:20.340 Maybe it's a trip.

00:37:21.320 You know, I, I've talked with other families and other men who it's like, when you graduate

00:37:25.100 high school or whatever, before you go on college, we'd go for a month on these big

00:37:29.280 camping expeditions or, you know, whatever that looks like, develop something.

00:37:33.940 We'll develop something and have it, have some meaning behind it.

00:37:37.400 Right.

00:37:37.700 Yeah.

00:37:38.180 No, all those are all great examples.

00:37:39.980 So I could go on about this stuff all day.

00:37:42.400 Obviously I could talk about this all day.

00:37:43.820 You could too.

00:37:44.260 It sounds like, but, uh, for sake of time, I want to ask you a couple additional questions.

00:37:49.680 So the first question I have for you is one that I ask every guest that I have on, and

00:37:53.080 that is what does it mean to be a man?

00:37:55.260 Yeah.

00:37:55.900 I love that question, Ryan.

00:37:57.100 And, and I love the insight that everybody else has from it as well.

00:38:00.620 To me, being a man means being strong.

00:38:04.000 And what I mean by being strong is being a man is somebody who is physically, mentally,

00:38:10.000 emotionally, and spiritually resolute, who has that strength that can see through, you know,

00:38:16.100 different hard hardships in their life.

00:38:18.020 A big thing that, that I went through personally, um, in my own family is we actually lost a son

00:38:23.140 in 2011, um, shortly after he was born.

00:38:26.280 And that was a, that was a really hard time for not only my wife and I, um, but for all of

00:38:31.820 our family, you know, on both sides and, you know, thankfully I had the upbringing, you

00:38:39.160 know, and, and, and, and the resolve and so did my wife and so did my family.

00:38:43.420 And I had the support where I was able to kind of see that through on all those different

00:38:47.700 levels, you know, on a spiritual level, on an emotional level, I was able to process

00:38:51.240 it mentally and, and use that, you know, as a catalyst to kind of help, to kind of help

00:38:56.660 us see us through that really difficult time.

00:38:58.340 And so, so to me, a man is somebody who, who is strong.

00:39:02.080 Such a great answer.

00:39:03.140 Yeah.

00:39:03.520 Yeah.

00:39:04.100 Perfect.

00:39:04.540 Appreciate it.

00:39:05.700 So if somebody wants to connect with you, they, they've liked what you have to say.

00:39:08.760 They want to know more about what you say, more about your program.

00:39:11.180 Matthew, how do we connect with you?

00:39:12.700 Yeah.

00:39:13.220 Uh, you can connect with me, um, on LinkedIn and my name is Matthew Arrington.

00:39:17.380 That's A-R-R-I-N-G-T-O-N. 1.00

00:39:19.280 Um, you can also, uh, go to 4kstrong.com and that's F-O-R-T-E strong.com.

00:39:25.800 And, uh, I'm also on Facebook too.

00:39:27.560 So reach out.

00:39:28.940 I'd love to help anybody that I can.

00:39:30.900 And I appreciate you again, Ryan, for having me on.

00:39:33.740 Yeah.

00:39:33.880 What we'll do is we'll make sure we put links in all the show notes so they can connect with

00:39:36.900 you and find you that way.

00:39:38.040 Matthew, it's been a pleasure.

00:39:39.200 I enjoy our conversations.

00:39:40.300 We've had them in the past and I'm, I'm really looking forward to continue to get to know

00:39:43.280 you and what you guys are doing for men that want to transition into, into manhood.

00:39:47.600 So thanks for being on the show today.

00:39:48.780 All right.

00:39:48.940 Thanks, Ryan.

00:39:50.080 Guys, there you have it.

00:39:50.980 Mr. Matthew Arrington.

00:39:52.040 I would ask that you forward this podcast along to anyone, you know, who might be interested

00:39:57.060 in what we talked about today.

00:39:58.860 If it's you, I hope you took some valuable insights and you took some notes and you're

00:40:02.560 ready to take the steps in the right direction.

00:40:04.300 If you're a father like I am, I've got three little kids with one more on the way.

00:40:07.740 Take this information to heart so that you are raising strong, independent men.

00:40:12.500 Now, again, if you enjoyed the show, if you learned something new, or if you just want

00:40:16.780 to say thank you to me and Matthew, head over to order of man.com slash iTunes, where you'll

00:40:21.480 be able to take two minutes and leave your rating review.

00:40:24.400 And remember guys, our Facebook group, we're going to hit a thousand members this week.

00:40:27.860 And I hope that you'll be one of them.

00:40:29.660 Facebook.com slash groups slash order of man.

00:40:32.320 Now next week, we're going to be talking with a man that needs no introduction.

00:40:35.740 I won't blow the surprise, but he hosts a podcast that is consistently ranked in the top

00:40:40.060 50 in the world, and he knows a ton about helping men become better men in the areas

00:40:44.100 of dating and business and personal development and style and so much more.

00:40:48.700 Trust me, guys, you're going to want to subscribe so you don't miss that episode.

00:40:52.540 Guys, I look forward to talking with you next week, but until then, take action and become

00:40:56.280 the man you were meant to be.

00:40:58.480 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

00:41:01.440 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

00:41:05.480 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

00:41:10.060 We'll be right back.

Order of Man - November 03, 2015

OoM 033： Why Men are Failing to Launch with Matthew Arrington

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