Order of Man - OoM 058： How Men Can Resist Average with Tommy Baker

00:00:00.120 Boring, average, complacent, mediocre. These are all terms we'd like to think don't describe us,

00:00:05.060 but the reality is most of us live our entire lives this way. We don't ever break out of this

00:00:09.700 ordinary, and even if we wanted to, it's difficult for us to know exactly how to do it. My friend

00:00:14.800 and guest today, Mr. Tommy Baker, shares with us how to push the boundaries, make rapid and

00:00:19.460 lasting changes in life, and resist the average that tries to take hold of us all. You're a man

00:00:24.940 of action. You live life to the fullest, embrace your fears, and boldly chart your own path. When

00:00:30.300 life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time. You are not easily deterred or

00:00:36.060 defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will

00:00:43.040 become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.

00:00:49.540 Man, what's going on today? My name is Ryan Michler, and I am the host and founder of Order

00:00:53.960 of Man. I'm glad you're tuning in today. If you haven't heard this podcast yet, and you're new

00:00:58.320 here, we talk about living manfully. Living manfully is about a lot of things, but at the end of the day,

00:01:03.440 each and every man needs physical strength, mental fortitude, and emotional stability. We talk about

00:01:09.200 those topics and so much more. Now, if you're not familiar with it yet, we do have an elite mastermind

00:01:14.800 available for a select few of you, the men who want to take this type of information to the next level.

00:01:20.880 It's called the Iron Council, and my goal is to stretch you and push you outside of your comfort

00:01:25.760 zone so you can step more fully into the relationships you have with your wife and your

00:01:29.760 kids. You can build the type of wealth you deserve in your life. Get into the best shape possible so

00:01:34.260 you can do all the things you want to do. And lastly, you can become the best version of yourself.

00:01:39.540 So if you find yourself struggling in your marriage and you want to fix it, if you're finding yourself

00:01:44.600 hitting a plateau with your money and you want to build massive amounts of wealth in your life,

00:01:48.060 if you're tired, lazy, fat, out of shape, and you want to gain all the energy back that comes from

00:01:53.600 having your health in order, and if you know that you're not living to your full potential,

00:01:58.140 this is the answer. So get the details, join the rest of the brothers inside the Iron Council

00:02:03.200 at orderofman.com slash ironcouncil. Now let's just jump right into the show today. Remember,

00:02:09.360 as always, you can find the links and the resources for this show at orderofman.com slash 058,

00:02:14.760 and join in the conversation we're having with over 3,000 men in our Facebook group

00:02:19.680 at facebook.com slash groups slash order of man. Now my guest today is Tommy Baker. Tommy grew up in

00:02:26.280 South America and the Northeast United States, and he moved back and forth while growing up playing

00:02:30.800 sports. And what he noticed is that there's a lot of differences between the performance of

00:02:35.180 certain athletes. And this led him to investigate ways to train the human body more efficiently.

00:02:40.540 So optimizing training, nutrition, and recovery became his focus. And in turn, he experimented

00:02:46.020 with many types of each on himself, as well as prescribing them to his clients. Tommy's mentored

00:02:52.020 and worked under the best coaches in all disciplines of strength and conditioning. And what he does is he

00:02:56.520 blends this program according to his individual clients. Now he's got a whole slew of credentials,

00:03:02.160 which I won't get into here. You can check those out on his website if you feel so inclined.

00:03:05.980 But at the end of the day, Tommy's goal is to inspire, motivate, and create powerful results

00:03:11.440 with people's physical body so they can use that as a catalyst to improve all other areas of life.

00:03:19.040 Tommy, what's up, man? Thanks for joining us on the show today.

00:03:21.220 Ryan, appreciate you having me on and excited to be on Order of Man finally.

00:03:26.020 We are going to have a great conversation. This is part two because we had our conversation

00:03:29.120 about a month ago. I came on your show. And I told you this before, and I got to let the guys know

00:03:33.340 listening to this. You are a great podcaster. I don't know if you know that or to what degree

00:03:38.780 you know that, but you're just getting started. You're amazing at podcasting.

00:03:41.980 And man, I want to say how much I appreciate that because I remember you telling me that at the end

00:03:45.180 of our episode and really taking a moment to take that compliment in because I talk about this

00:03:52.180 sometimes that a lot of people aren't that good at the skill of taking a compliment. So when you told

00:03:56.660 me that, I really internalized it. And it meant a lot to me coming from you.

00:04:02.600 But I also believed it to be true. So it was a great moment. And I want to thank you for that.

00:04:07.380 That's good. And you know what I like about your answer to that is the level of confidence.

00:04:11.500 I wish more guys had that. And that's actually what we talk a lot about on the podcast is

00:04:14.800 developing and building confidence. Because when you talk about compliments, for example,

00:04:18.960 like you said, it's very easy to deflect those. And you're actually almost insulting somebody if

00:04:22.820 you're not willing to accept their genuine compliment and their feedback. And to have the

00:04:27.240 confidence that you do to say thank you is something that's actually kind of rare.

00:04:31.280 Yeah, that's it, right? To really take a compliment, all you have to say is those two

00:04:36.180 magic words. And I saw this a lot in the fitness industry with my own clients. I'd say,

00:04:40.080 hey, Susan, hey, Karen, you're doing a fantastic job. You're inspiring me. I mean, this was so

00:04:45.180 authentic and it was true. But they would find ways to minimize themselves and say, oh, I'm not

00:04:50.400 actually doing that great. Oh, this is nothing. And I'm like, no, own it. Own that. Because I'm seeing

00:04:56.360 it happen. And if you don't own it, then your belief in yourself is going to be less. And we

00:05:00.880 all know what happens after that. So appreciate that, man. Well, there's another side to this,

00:05:05.040 too. And we talk a lot about men being influential. This the fact that people can accept a compliment,

00:05:10.120 we're going down a rabbit hole here, but it's important to talk about the fact that people can

00:05:14.180 accept a compliment means they're not used to getting them. So if you want to be more influential,

00:05:18.260 just recognize great things that people are doing and be willing to speak up about it.

00:05:21.780 A hundred percent, man. And when you come from authenticity, that just raises the game. And I

00:05:26.040 also encourage people, if you're not used to giving a lot of compliments, you know, go out

00:05:30.080 there and maybe set a goal for, hey, for this next week, you know, today's Monday. So for this next

00:05:34.880 week, I'm going to give one person an authentic compliment for the rest of the week and just see

00:05:39.440 how that shifts, how that pushes people up further, but also what that does for you, right?

00:05:45.940 Yes. Yes, exactly. Well, cool. Well, let's talk about this. The name of your podcast is

00:05:50.700 Resist Average Academy. And I think the, uh, the first question, maybe the first one or two

00:05:54.780 questions that you ask every guest and you asked me was what comes to mind when you hear the phrase

00:05:59.260 resist average. So I want to hear your answer to what comes to mind when, when I say resist

00:06:04.320 average, what does that look like for you? I love it. Turning the tables and you're the second

00:06:07.800 person to do this. Uh, so I love answering this question, but basically resist average to me

00:06:13.120 is a daily mindset and a daily practice on how you see the world and the actions you take in

00:06:18.420 accordance to that. So, you know, I like to tell people that every day where we're reborn after

00:06:22.520 we separate, you know, six to 10 hours, whatever that may be. And we have to, you know, the way

00:06:27.220 that the slate has been wiped clean. So who we are today is not who we are yesterday. Even if we

00:06:31.780 experienced massive success yesterday, or if we experienced what we call failure, um, which to me

00:06:36.740 is just feedback. But at the end of the day, resist average is what's in between the ears and kind of

00:06:41.080 how you see the world and your place in it. And also what you're, what you believe your potential

00:06:46.260 is. Cause I, I do believe that, you know, human beings potential is nearly limitless and that's,

00:06:52.560 you know, the resist average is, you know, how hard can I push the envelope on my own personal

00:06:56.780 potential? Yeah. Yeah. And I really like what you said about, I mean, obviously everybody knows they

00:07:02.240 kind of fall back when they're fearful or something's gone wrong or they've had a failure

00:07:06.320 and we've all heard that. But the other side of it is when people have done something great,

00:07:10.400 we don't talk about this a whole lot, but I think we as humans have a tendency to kind of rest

00:07:14.400 on our laurels and just ride the fact that maybe we had a success last week, but that doesn't

00:07:19.840 necessarily mean that we're going to have and continue that success this week. Exactly. And

00:07:24.120 just like a practical example, you know, just because I meditated seven days last week for,

00:07:28.440 for 20 to 30 minutes that today I'm going to wake up with clear headspace, right?

00:07:32.580 Sure. Right. That whole wiping the slate clean is like, like it's going to take, it's going to take

00:07:38.580 daily work. And, and, and that's, you know, that's kind of the message that, that I like to share

00:07:42.620 with people on a daily basis. Yeah. We actually had, when I was in Iraq,

00:07:45.940 I went to Iraq in 2005, 2005 and 2006. And we had this big sign as we were leaving the gate and

00:07:51.900 the sign said complacency kills. And that's what it was all about is that you, if you get into a

00:07:57.080 routine, you get boring, you let your guard down in that situation, you will literally have the risk,

00:08:02.400 the higher potential of, of dying, of being killed. But I think there's a lot to be said about

00:08:07.160 that in what I call quote unquote real life as well, that, uh, we do get too complacent. So my

00:08:12.940 question is, how do you maintain consistency? It's easy to get down on yourself and, and, and

00:08:18.380 think that what you're doing is not right. And then it's easy to see a success and then just

00:08:22.020 kind of rest on that. How do you maintain consistent action every single day for the next

00:08:26.200 20 or 30 or 50 years? It's an awesome question. Awesome question about achieving a balanced

00:08:32.040 emotional state. And, um, to me, that simply means that, you know, no matter what I did yesterday,

00:08:36.900 if I experienced massive successes, you know, not getting to that lace, you know, that, that

00:08:41.600 elation that is so, um, that I identify that, that, that becomes part of me and then I can get

00:08:47.020 complacent. And also if I experienced failure, not letting that pull me down either. So, you know,

00:08:51.600 the answer to your question to me is, is consistently balancing our emotional state and also just putting

00:08:56.660 ourselves in a, in a state where we're going to take action, right? Like that, that to me is,

00:09:00.060 is really the longterm value of fitness. It's, it's not necessarily taking your shirt off at the

00:09:06.720 beach barbecue and looking great, which is, which is awesome. Like that, that is, that is part of it.

00:09:10.580 Right. But it's the emotional state. Cause when you're, when you're in a balanced and positive

00:09:14.540 emotional state, you follow through on things, right? But when you're not, you know, think of the

00:09:19.500 last time that you were in traffic and you were, you know, on your phone and you were scattered and

00:09:23.260 you were stressed, you're not open to do anything in that, in that state of mind. Right. And so clearing

00:09:28.340 that on a daily basis and, uh, having a morning routine and all that, that, that you do, no matter

00:09:33.180 how you feel, what moods you're going through is super crucial. So what does that look like for you?

00:09:38.000 Because I look at you from the outside looking in, I'm like, man, Tommy's always upbeat. He's always

00:09:42.000 positive. He's always got high energy, but I'm sure that's not always the case. So what does this

00:09:46.840 process actually look like for you when you get down or discouraged or have a setback?

00:09:52.340 Totally, man. And you know, I I'd say I'm that way about 80% of the time. So, which is

00:09:57.080 pretty damn awesome. Right. Cause there's some people who are rarely there, but of course I have,

00:10:02.100 I have days where, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm spent and I'm stressed or like the traffic example that

00:10:07.020 happens to me, just like everybody else. And, you know, chaos hits, but it's, it's about having,

00:10:12.380 um, a system to again, balance that emotional state. And my system has always been fitness. That's just

00:10:18.720 the thing that gets me to a place where I can be most present, most focused. And, uh, to be honest,

00:10:24.900 I feel like with my own fitness, I experienced what Steven Kotler calls a flow state. And that's,

00:10:30.900 that's a place where, you know, you're, you're hyper-focused and you're creative. And, um, so if

00:10:36.120 I'm, if I'm down, no matter how much, uh, you know, I may, uh, you know, tell myself that I don't

00:10:41.480 want to go, don't want to do it. I will push myself physically. And for me, it's, it's intensity is,

00:10:46.100 uh, in line with that flow state. Like that's a, that's a prereq, uh, for a flow state for me.

00:10:51.660 And just being intense in the current moment, or tell me a little bit about that, because I know,

00:10:55.200 I, like, I see guys, for example, athletes, we're talking about health in this case that are in the

00:10:59.120 quote unquote, they're in the zone, right? I'm, I'm assuming that's what you're talking about as well.

00:11:03.700 You talk about flow states. So what does that look like? Not only from a health perspective,

00:11:07.780 but you know, from a business or even a relationship perspective.

00:11:11.680 Sure. So, so you're talking about like, um, you're taking it out of the context,

00:11:16.100 of the actual fitness training and replicating that somewhere else.

00:11:19.720 Yeah. Yeah, definitely.

00:11:20.880 Totally, man. Well, you know, I, I use, um, you know, I, the reason physical,

00:11:25.260 the reason I use, uh, physical training, um, to get in the best state possible is because

00:11:30.620 to me it is the foundation and, you know, Maslow would, Maslow's Hacker would agree to that.

00:11:35.000 Right. So for me, it's like getting into that state with my fitness allows me to be more creative

00:11:41.380 with my business, right? Because if I don't take care of myself first, take care of my body. And

00:11:46.540 you know, you could go down to the basics, man. And most people are dehydrated, you know, 85 to 90%

00:11:50.640 of people are dehydrated, but you know, the hydration, uh, fueling sleep, all this stuff.

00:11:56.180 If I'm not like, those are, those are controllables that we can, we can control. Like no matter how much

00:12:01.180 we say we don't have enough time, those are things that we can control. So when I show up in a

00:12:06.000 relationship on a date and I'm rested and I've trained and I've done meditation and I've had,

00:12:12.240 uh, you know, a breakthrough with a creative business idea, well, I'm going to be in a way

00:12:16.100 better and present and focused state. And that's what it's about. And, you know, um, as, as a lot

00:12:21.400 of people on your show have said, you know, how you do anything is how you do everything.

00:12:24.880 Sure. Well, how do you do this? I mean, how do you, how do you stay focused? Cause that's,

00:12:27.980 that's the hardest part. You know, I look around and I think about all the things I've got to do.

00:12:31.140 I've got two businesses that I'm running. I've got three kids, one more on the way. I've literally got,

00:12:35.640 three nights of the week are consumed with baseball practices for my boys. So how do you

00:12:41.040 stay present when you have so much going on around you? Totally, man. And you know, I would,

00:12:45.320 I would say, um, for someone who's in that situation, which is quite common, of course,

00:12:49.960 is, or for anyone really, cause you know, these days, anybody can, uh, everybody's busier, right?

00:12:55.780 It would be to find time, uh, to find time. And this is usually going to be in the morning of

00:13:02.360 undistracted work. And I placed a heavy, heavy emphasis on the word undistracted. And Kyle

00:13:09.180 Newport has a great book out there called deep work. And, you know, he really, he really analyzed

00:13:13.680 anyone who's ever done anything awesome to athletes, to anything in between and found out that they had

00:13:19.020 a time in the morning, uh, that was undistracted, but completely to themselves. And so I teach the

00:13:25.140 same thing in my programs, right? Cause you know, I coach a lot of dads, you know, families and

00:13:29.280 businesses and all this stuff that you just mentioned. And, you know, they're not going to

00:13:32.680 get, uh, undistracted work at 7 PM. That's going to be in the morning. So, um, for me, it's, it's

00:13:37.560 setting that time in the morning, attacking that following through with that. And then that creates

00:13:42.700 the amazing, uh, spark of momentum that leads to the rest of your day.

00:13:48.000 Yeah, I can see how that's valuable. And in fact, in the military, their big claim to fame was,

00:13:52.560 you know, we get done more in before the sun comes up than what most people get done all day.

00:13:57.480 And I think that's a testament to the power of doing things when there are no distractions,

00:14:02.600 getting up, getting right to it. I know that in the morning from 5 AM to seven

00:14:07.200 o'clock in the morning, I'm able to accomplish so much more so in those couple hours than I can get

00:14:12.240 done eight hours in the afternoon, for example. Totally. I mean, those two hours you can do more.

00:14:17.340 So let's say maybe you're in a traditional corporate job right now in those two hours,

00:14:22.020 if you focus on, on you and that, that could be anything. That could be business wise. It could be

00:14:25.400 something else. But if you focus on you, you're almost guaranteed, like you just said,

00:14:29.480 to be more productive than those other eight hours, it's going to set the tone for your day.

00:14:34.080 And you're just going to have a different spring in your step. Like when you can,

00:14:37.300 you know, go out in the world and it's 10 AM and you know that you've accomplished so many things

00:14:42.160 and kind of fought what, you know, Seth Godin and all those other people call resistance.

00:14:46.260 That's a powerful feeling.

00:14:48.400 Right, right. Yeah, I can see that. So you talk about coaching. I know you're in the fitness and

00:14:52.180 health world. Tell me a little bit about what your role is and how you're helping people get to where

00:14:57.160 they want to be with regards to their health goals. Sure, man. I mean, long story short,

00:15:00.660 I grew up in two cultures. I grew up in South America and Bogota, Colombia, and I grew up

00:15:04.700 in the Northeast of the U S and we moved back and forth a lot. And I saw, you know, it was,

00:15:08.760 it was very interesting to, to, you know, to, to see the physical culture in both places. Now

00:15:13.780 the U S was, was always very interesting to me because I saw elite athleticism, but I also saw

00:15:18.720 the other spectrum, which was, you know, the highest rate of, um, you know, uh, you know,

00:15:23.080 controllable environmental, uh, disease as related to our physical bodies. Now in Colombia,

00:15:27.680 you didn't see the spectrum of elite athleticism, but you also didn't see the other spectrum. People

00:15:32.200 were just healthier in general. Um, so growing up in those two cultures, I had a lot of light bulb

00:15:37.240 moments where I was like, I really want to, um, create a dent in this industry. So long story short,

00:15:43.040 I spent a decade, uh, traveling, uh, the world, mainly the U S though. And, and, and, and just

00:15:48.540 immersing myself in everything from power lifting to functional fitness, athletic training, um,

00:15:54.320 testing all that stuff. And, uh, ended up opening up two gyms. One was a private kind of transformation

00:15:59.720 studio where it was all in. And then the other one was a functional fitness studio. And anyway,

00:16:04.180 long story short, I ended up selling those and then, uh, moving out here to Arizona where I do

00:16:09.880 a hundred percent virtual online coaching. Right on. Yeah. And you just moved out. What,

00:16:14.440 what'd you say? Like five, six months ago, you moved out. Yeah. Six months ago, six months ago.

00:16:18.120 And I know we had been talking, um, prior to that. And, you know, a lot of people are like,

00:16:21.420 you know, why would you move somewhere that you don't know a soul? And, you know, it's, it's,

00:16:24.860 it's very funny to me. It's like, that's an awesome challenge, right? That's a really cool

00:16:28.640 challenge to do something like that. And, uh, I felt there was time and, you know, in life. And when we

00:16:33.200 talked about this earlier is like, you, you can have your own pivots that come to you, um,

00:16:38.160 not by choice or you can create your own pivots. And I felt for me, it was time to pivot. So,

00:16:42.240 um, that's why I made it happen. And, uh, you know, by taking action, I I'm, I'm very excited

00:16:46.680 about where I am today. And you just released a video a couple of days ago, or maybe even yesterday

00:16:51.380 on Facebook about curiosity, which I think is exactly what you're talking about here is just

00:16:56.140 exploring new interests, doing something different, having this challenge and, and just being genuinely

00:17:00.740 curious about what's out there. Yeah, man. And it's, it's, you know, I remember you, uh, you know,

00:17:05.760 giving the example of your kids running around on a playground and, you know, making friends so

00:17:10.900 easily and stuff. Yeah. As we grow, we just build these layers and, um, curiosity is such a powerful

00:17:16.600 force. You know, I remember so many nights, you know, uh, growing up with my sister, just looking

00:17:21.600 up at the stars and kind of painting the vision for our life and, you know, no phones and no TV and all

00:17:27.020 that stuff. And, um, as we go on, we, we lose that sense of curiosity and you can be like insanely

00:17:32.240 curious about anything at any time. Um, it just goes back to something we spoke about earlier,

00:17:36.400 which is presence. So, um, if you could just find one moment of your day where you can harness

00:17:41.460 curiosity, um, it's going to change the way you see and show up in the world. Yeah. It's really

00:17:46.920 interesting. A lot of the men I talk with on a daily basis have this underlying theme of knowing

00:17:51.880 that there's something more to life, but feeling stuck or trapped and not really feeling like they're

00:17:58.360 living to their full potential. And so I'll get a lot of questions along the lines of,

00:18:02.240 how do I find passion? How do I find excitement in life, maybe in work or relationships? And I

00:18:07.200 think the answer is simple as go do something different. Just try something different, mix

00:18:11.900 something up, be unique, change your schedule, change the way you drive to work. Just do something

00:18:16.300 different, right? A hundred percent. I was thinking that same exact thing. And in that video on Facebook

00:18:20.780 the other day, I gave the, uh, you know, kind of like the metaphor of, you know, we all have this

00:18:25.940 flame, right? There's like adventure spirit flame, explorers of curiosity flame. That's very

00:18:30.900 intense when we're young. Right. And it's, it's like a wildfire, uh, wildfire. And as we grow up,

00:18:37.360 quote unquote, grow up, which I don't think anyone ever should fully, um, we start to really minimize

00:18:42.260 that flame. And, but it's always, it's always got a little bit left, right? It's never going to

00:18:46.640 totally extinguish. So exactly what you said, like go take an improv class, like put yourself out there

00:18:52.820 or go, you know, uh, um, you know, just learn a new skill, just, just the art of learning a new

00:18:58.300 skill, like you said, or changing your route to work, or instead of putting your head down the

00:19:02.520 next time you see a stranger, look up and smile and say, I like those small things will start to

00:19:07.080 expand your world and you become truly curious. Well, okay. So I want to go back to what you said

00:19:11.760 a minute ago about the health stuff. You said that, that the people of Columbia are, are overall and

00:19:17.120 generally more healthy, not so much extremes, but just healthier. Why, why do you see that?

00:19:21.780 Well, what's the, what's going on there? You know, it's, it's, it's, it's, uh, in that context,

00:19:26.060 it's very, uh, very, very cultural based on, um, how and how they think in their mindfulness regarding

00:19:33.360 food. And even though this, this may sound weird, one of the, one of the things that I saw down there,

00:19:39.560 which is huge in my family down there as well, is that everybody eats their meals together all the

00:19:46.300 time. You do not see any TV dinners ever. I mean, maybe now, uh, in some parts, but that is such a

00:19:54.180 fabric of their culture. And I think something like that, just seeing food as, as nourishment and not

00:20:01.140 something that's this, you know, recyclable fast process commodity, you know, that we can just get

00:20:06.980 at a drive through. I think that's one of the biggest reasons why. So I've always been into kind

00:20:11.660 of the mindset of food, the mindset of fitness and how that translates for long-term fulfillment.

00:20:18.820 Yeah, I think, and that's the, that conversation I want to have today. And I want to tailor it

00:20:22.280 towards the mindset because I think it's really easy for people to get consumed and what's the

00:20:26.780 right type of workout and how many squats at what percent of my one rep max should I do when in all

00:20:32.580 reality, if they get the mindset, right, a lot of it probably falls into place. Am I right?

00:20:37.720 A hundred percent, man. A hundred percent. It all comes down to mindset. And like at the end of the

00:20:41.580 day, you know, this is something that I shot a video on. It's, it's not really what you do.

00:20:47.660 It's how you do it. Right. So like if I just trained three times a week and all I did was body

00:20:52.240 weight stuff, I could get in ridiculous shape, right? If I'm focused, if I'm doing my pushups

00:20:57.000 with, you know, extreme focus, perfect technique, right? Like that's, that's what matters. It's not

00:21:02.180 necessarily this, you know, you know, this, uh, program, this perfect program that everyone's

00:21:07.380 searching for. First of all, just first get started and then do everything with presence

00:21:12.500 and focus and see what happens. Man. I just want to pause here really quickly to share with you

00:21:18.040 another resource and introduce you to my friends over at the art of charm. Now I know you're a podcast

00:21:22.700 listener. Otherwise you wouldn't be listening to this one. And rather than spending hours scrolling

00:21:27.080 through thousands and thousands of podcasts, trying to find a keeper, you can take my advice to

00:21:32.040 heart. When I tell you the art of charm needs to be on your list right next to the order of man,

00:21:37.640 Jordan, AJ and Jason, they're all knowledgeable. They have an incredible screening process for their

00:21:42.420 potential guests. I know because I just went through it myself and they bring amazing value.

00:21:48.000 Each episode, the premise for the show is that these guys go out on the world. They test an idea

00:21:51.980 or concept on social dynamics, productivity, leadership, relationships, business, and then they bring

00:21:56.880 the results back to you. So it's easy to say certain things work, but it's entirely different to test it.

00:22:01.800 And get the results delivered directly to you. So go check them out after you listen to this show at

00:22:06.720 theartofcharm.com slash podcast, or you can find them in iTunes or Stitcher, wherever it is you get

00:22:11.580 your fix of podcasts. It's all about leveling up your life, your relationships, your wealth,

00:22:15.080 your fitness, your business. You will walk away with a ton of great information. You deserve an

00:22:19.360 extraordinary life. Go to theartofcharm.com slash podcast, or find theartofcharm in iTunes or Stitcher

00:22:24.260 and start taking your life to the next level. We really enjoy this show and we think you will as well.

00:22:29.020 Now back to my interview with Tommy.

00:22:31.800 Yeah. And so let's talk about this a little bit more. Let's talk about the mindset piece. When

00:22:35.660 somebody's either getting started or maybe they feel like they've reached a plateau when it comes

00:22:40.640 to their health, for example, what type of mindset do they need to have? What are some things they need

00:22:47.220 to learn and develop so that they can push past the things that they're dealing with?

00:22:51.300 Totally, man. Totally. And it depends how deep you want to go. But with my clients, I actually start

00:22:55.560 from the inside out because I see, you know, while I was running my gyms and traveling the country,

00:23:00.420 I saw everybody working from the outside in. When I say that is that they were trying to change

00:23:04.980 all these habits all at once, you know, go from the couch, a decade on the couch to five times a week

00:23:10.640 training, change their nutrition. Like that is not sustainable. I don't care who you are without

00:23:16.440 ever addressing the inner work. So for me, it's very interesting. My first couple of weeks with a

00:23:21.960 client, they get kind of antsy because they're like, dude, when are we going to start training?

00:23:25.580 And I'm like, listen, like we're changing some of your beliefs in regards to fitness,

00:23:29.620 because if your belief is I am, you know, I've never been an athlete. I am big boned.

00:23:35.280 My genetics are poor. All these beliefs. Well, guess what? It doesn't matter what program you do,

00:23:40.320 how intensive it is. If I send you the biggest loser, like it doesn't matter what happens.

00:23:44.640 Your results are always going to go back to your beliefs. So that's the first thing we do. Like,

00:23:49.000 what is the core belief that's holding you back? And for many people, it's I'm a failure when it

00:23:53.140 comes to health and fitness. Why? Because they've experienced quote unquote failure. And maybe it

00:23:57.800 started in high school. They had, you know, guilt and shame for how they felt about their bodies and

00:24:01.800 then all this stuff. So it's, it's breaking that down and then starting to build what Keith Ferrazzi

00:24:07.680 from, from a green light and never eat alone says, um, are called high return practices. So it's just

00:24:12.700 like two or three things that seem, you know, keystone happy, kind of like keystone habits where it's

00:24:18.120 like, okay, if I get eight hours of sleep a night, what trickle down effect is that going to have on

00:24:23.560 the rest of my life and what other habits are going to come as part of that? So, uh, to keep it

00:24:28.700 short, just, you know, changing your beliefs and then keeping it simple early on. Yeah. And I, and

00:24:34.760 it's funny that you would actually talk about the fact that, that people are getting antsy with the

00:24:40.200 fact that they want to get back into health. I'm a financial advisor. I've been for about nine years

00:24:43.880 now. And it's really funny because a lot of people will come to me and they'll say, Hey Ryan,

00:24:48.100 where's the best place to invest my money? I want to get this bet, this rate of return, or I want to

00:24:52.040 see, you know, me, me get this, this, uh, this amount of money back, whatever it may be. And so

00:24:56.400 my next question is, okay, great. How much are you saving? What are you investing? How much are you

00:24:59.740 willing to invest? And their answer is more often than not, well, I'm not doing anything right now.

00:25:03.840 That's why I'm asking you. And it's like, well, it doesn't really matter what you do then. I mean,

00:25:07.860 you, you got to start, right? That's the first key. You got to start. And then you can worry about

00:25:12.420 exactly what's the right place to invest or in your case, what's the, you know, the, the exact

00:25:17.720 perfect workout to do. So how do you change your core beliefs? Because I think if, if, if you're

00:25:23.640 talking with somebody who's literally believed that they're not a healthy person and they felt

00:25:28.180 that way for 30 or 40 years, how do you begin to change their beliefs and how do we do it for

00:25:33.400 ourselves? Totally, man. I mean, I have a system, but you know, it, it just, just, just being super

00:25:38.220 simple. I mean, it starts with awareness, right? Because a lot of times people aren't even aware

00:25:41.820 that they have this belief, right? No, you know, nobody ever like sits down and

00:25:45.540 analyzes like what their beliefs are and where they came from. So, you know, I prompt people

00:25:49.900 to write down all their beliefs associated with health, fitness, and food. And that could

00:25:53.780 be like, simply like, you know, for the next week, write down every time that you have a

00:25:58.760 thought about food or fitness and what comes out of that. Right. And I've had clients do this

00:26:03.760 and the amount of negativity that, that like in these thoughts, I mean, these are toxic thoughts,

00:26:09.000 right? These are not things that are going to help us move forward at all. And then from there,

00:26:12.840 I'm going to extract really one core belief. I'm going to write that down and then we're going to

00:26:18.380 craft a new belief. And that's, you also have to have, it's funny, it's paradox, but you have to

00:26:23.700 have the belief that you can change your beliefs as weird as that sound, right? Because a lot of times

00:26:29.440 our identities is wrapped around the belief. But anyways, once, once we pick that new belief,

00:26:34.940 then guess what? We have to change our behaviors to go in line with that belief. If not, it's never

00:26:40.120 going to stick. So once I have that core belief, we're going to set out a, uh, basically a 45 day

00:26:45.860 plan, because I feel like that's kind of the sweet spot for, uh, changing a belief and building new

00:26:49.920 habits and what kind of habits and, you know, who, who, who's the person that you would have to be

00:26:55.840 like, how does that person act? That's going to start believing that, you know, for example,

00:26:59.780 the new belief is, you know, I am a powerful and successful, uh, in regards to my physical body,

00:27:04.940 or I show up with energy and vitality, stuff like that. It sounds kind of new agey affirmations,

00:27:09.340 but at your core, you believe that your behaviors are going to be in line with that. And then the

00:27:14.780 results that are going to come from that are going to be like 10 X any other system, right?

00:27:20.020 Sure. Yeah, that makes sense. So, so what comes first then? I mean, cause this is something that I

00:27:23.960 hear a lot is how do you build confidence? And for me, the way that you build confidence is you do

00:27:27.520 hard things and then you build your confidence. So what comes first, the belief or the action that

00:27:33.280 helps you solidify the belief that you are trying to implement in your life? Yeah, that's a fantastic

00:27:39.440 question. And, and, you know, I think I'll give the cop out answer that, you know, doing both

00:27:44.000 simultaneously is, is, is really like what, what, what the requirement is, right? Because if you,

00:27:50.880 I mean, you can, you can, um, you can analyze beliefs and talk about beliefs all day. But again,

00:27:55.400 like you said, if you're not taking action, then that's not going to do anything right now,

00:27:58.860 if you're taking mindless action and your beliefs are still messed up, you're going to be limited in

00:28:02.580 your capacity to grow. So I think there, it's, it's something like, I look at a kind of like a

00:28:07.280 music equalizer where we're raising all boats at once in regards to beliefs and actions. What

00:28:12.220 you're saying with like, you just started doing like a seal fit, right? Like that's a big journey.

00:28:17.420 Obviously you experienced, uh, you know, 50 pounds of weight loss or whatever it was, which was

00:28:20.800 awesome. And now you're kind of going into this upper echelon of training. Um, but you've done

00:28:25.600 it both ways, right? By taking action and doing these tough events, it fuels you beliefs and then

00:28:31.540 vice versa. So it's all super connected. And, uh, yeah, that's, that's what it's about, man.

00:28:36.640 No, that's interesting. And it, and it echoes my thought of that. You cannot make

00:28:40.000 a decision or a movement in a vacuum because the way you do one thing or, or whatever it is,

00:28:45.300 is always going to spill over into other areas of your life. So that makes total sense.

00:28:49.300 Now you talk about 45 day program that you have. It's funny. I just did an interview with Dan

00:28:54.060 Miller, 48 days to the work you love. Uh, he talked a little bit about why 48 days you talk

00:28:58.500 about 45 days. So tell me the reasoning. Is there, is there a reasoning behind a 45 day

00:29:03.180 program and not a 60 day program or a 30 day program? Yeah. I just found, you know, in the

00:29:07.840 fitness industry, it's so common to see these, you know, these kinds of 21 day challenges and

00:29:12.820 all that stuff. Right. Um, through my own guinea pig analysis of myself and a lot of my

00:29:18.180 clients and doing some really intense high level programs, uh, with people, I found that

00:29:23.800 that was the sweet spot to, to, to create behavior change, but also it was close enough where it

00:29:29.200 didn't seem too far away. Right. Because we've all been that person that, you know, they want

00:29:33.060 to, you know, climb a mountain, you know, Kilimanjaro in one year. And that sounds amazing.

00:29:37.420 And they might even put a picture on their vision board of it, but a year is a long time. So how can

00:29:42.400 we take that end goal, which is awesome and put it so close to six inches in front of our face,

00:29:47.880 where we're going to see it every day and take consistent action with it? Because a lot of

00:29:50.960 people have these really big goals, which are exciting and awesome. But then three months into

00:29:55.500 it, they totally derail themselves because they didn't keep it close enough. So I like 45 days

00:30:01.740 and then I'm kind of like a nerd. So I've studied a lot of, uh, stuff like power of the book, power of

00:30:06.260 habit and all the references that came with that. And that just seems to be a really great sweet spot.

00:30:10.680 And the reason why I think a lot of people can't stick to their new year's resolutions,

00:30:14.520 because they're saying things like, I'm going to do this for the entire year, for the next 365 days,

00:30:20.680 even though I've been doing something else completely opposite for the last 2000 days,

00:30:24.760 I can maintain this, this level of intensity when it comes to, uh, an improved health or,

00:30:30.320 or money or relationships. And it just doesn't work out and they end up fizzling out.

00:30:34.660 Yeah. And what we don't understand is that everything we do is, is, you know, it becomes a habit.

00:30:40.140 So we have so many habits that take us in the wrong direction. You're absolutely right. So like

00:30:44.460 if someone came off a decade of poor nutrition, you know, that is, that, that is deeply a part of

00:30:51.660 how they operate. Right. Um, so it's, it, it, it, there's not the two week program or, you know,

00:30:58.060 a new year's resolution that is going to cause a real dent in that. Like that's going to, that's

00:31:02.540 going to require a lot of work. Now, the amazing thing about our physical bodies is that I've trained

00:31:07.500 people who, you know, lived a rockstar lifestyle, let's say for a decade, um, really treated their

00:31:14.800 bodies in some of the most poor, horrible ways possible. And it only took about a year or so,

00:31:21.900 um, to get them right back on track and see unbelievable transformation. So in that sense,

00:31:27.120 like our pod, I think we kind of forget how powerful and amazing our bodies are. And even

00:31:32.040 though we treat them poorly, you can always make a change and get, get back on the path.

00:31:37.120 Extremely resilient, right?

00:31:38.340 Yeah. It's unbelievable. I mean, it's on by the, the, the transformations that I saw from some people.

00:31:43.020 I mean, I'm talking like a decade of almost daily alcohol consumption and God knows what else in poor

00:31:48.520 sleep and, you know, horrible hormone levels. And then one year, man, one year to get into almost

00:31:54.620 optimal performances. To me, that's mind blowing.

00:31:56.720 Right. So how do you do that for somebody? Because that seems like a pretty tall order

00:32:00.760 and a thing that most, probably 90% of people can't do. So what separates the people that

00:32:06.360 are able to make those quick transformations that way?

00:32:09.900 It sounds quick when you put it in, you know, when you, when you take 10 years and, and, and,

00:32:14.180 uh, you know, counter that with one year, but you know, one year of, and I'm talking one year of

00:32:19.380 like hard, consistent work. I mean, four to five training sessions, uh, but also all the nutrition

00:32:24.880 stuff and lifestyle stuff that comes with it. So in that year there is, you know, I mean,

00:32:29.340 that's, that's a challenge and a lot of people have trouble with that. But for me, the way that,

00:32:33.920 you know, someone comes to mind right now, one of my, one of my biggest success stories

00:32:37.080 and his, he started to lose, he was about 45. Um, he had like three or four really big, uh, people

00:32:45.420 in his social circle, either pass or have like a traumatic kind of heart attack type experience.

00:32:50.540 Right. Yeah. And, and he was looking at his kids, four amazing kids and that just woke him up and

00:32:56.160 was like, dude, I, I, I can't, I cannot keep doing this. And he was, uh, you know, he was in kind of

00:33:02.400 an entertainment industry. So, you know, going out and doing all this stuff was part of his,

00:33:06.460 his job and his career, but he started to make changes and prioritize his health. And so sometimes

00:33:11.900 it does take either a wake up call, which we kind of want to avoid or just a deep rooted,

00:33:18.340 why like your kids. And, you know, I'm sure for you, you have three or four kids. I know you have

00:33:22.660 one on the way being as, as present and you know, your fitness, I know in some sense is, is directly

00:33:29.780 tied to your relationship with them and your ability to be around them as your fullest self

00:33:34.300 for as long as possible. Oh, for sure. I mean, I even just think about what we did yesterday is,

00:33:39.040 you know, we walked down to the park and we were able to play baseball and we were able to run around

00:33:42.520 a little bit three years ago. I couldn't have done what I did yesterday. Imagine that though. Imagine

00:33:46.060 missing out on those experiences because you neglected your physical body, right? Or,

00:33:51.680 you know, being, you know, being a grandparent and being unable to, you know, travel to, I mean,

00:33:57.820 it just, you're going to miss out on some unbelievable connections. And that to me was

00:34:03.440 something that's so controllable can be a very sad place. Well, and not only that, to me, I almost got

00:34:09.580 to this point of thinking, you know, I'm, I'm a little bit of a scam. Like how can I be a great

00:34:14.300 business owner and be disciplined and committed to my clients and take care of them and be fully

00:34:18.920 invested in them and fully invest in my business and be completely fat and overweight and out of

00:34:24.500 shape and lazy and, and non-energetic. It wasn't congruent. And so I had to decide all in with

00:34:31.180 everything or all out and do nothing. I love that, man. Black or white, right?

00:34:36.220 Well, yeah. I mean, I think that's how we, we actually make change in our lives is we stop

00:34:41.160 riding the fence and we, we make a bold decision. A hundred percent, man. That's awesome.

00:34:45.440 So what keeps people from reverting back? Because let's say somebody has been a decade of living a

00:34:51.560 poor life when it comes to their health. And all of a sudden a year into this thing, they're doing

00:34:57.000 well. And then they have this moment of whatever, and they revert back to the way things were. How do

00:35:04.360 you keep that from happening? Totally, man. That's why you see stuff like biggest loser, this,

00:35:08.820 this, these really intense, immersive experiences, um, have a shelf life. And to me, it comes down to

00:35:14.920 just two core factors and that's accountability and environment, right? So, um, accountability is

00:35:20.640 obviously having to report back to someone, whether that's a coach or, you know, there's two levels of

00:35:25.020 accountability. It's peer to peer and also a expert level, which would be a coach. So that, you know,

00:35:30.160 accountability, I don't care who you are, you know, the world's greatest athletes, the greatest

00:35:34.740 trainers. It doesn't matter who they all have their own accountability system. And then environment at

00:35:40.140 the end of the day, you know, I can take a super positive, energetic, engaged person and put them

00:35:44.340 in a room with 99, you know, super downbeat people. And yeah, they're going to last, you know, first

00:35:49.240 week they might make it second week. They might make it. You can put that person in there for 12

00:35:53.760 months. I guarantee when they come out, they're going to be different. They're not going to be as

00:35:57.420 upbeat, right? So environment matters. It doesn't, you know, you can't supersede it no matter what.

00:36:02.720 And in fitness, that's just as true. So making sure that, uh, my clients found people that,

00:36:08.800 you know, and found environments that were conducive to what they were doing long-term

00:36:13.380 was super crucial. And to me, honestly, the most exciting thing was like, uh, taking someone from

00:36:18.700 a decade off the couch. And then, you know, then I'm just finding like a new passion within fitness,

00:36:24.060 whether that was like, they started, we could do all those Spartan races, or maybe it was seal fit,

00:36:28.220 or maybe they, uh, competed at something. I don't care what it was, but once they found that extra

00:36:34.240 spark, then it was like, no, no turning back. So accountability environment, you'll never look

00:36:39.240 back. Awesome. Awesome. I love it. Well, Tommy, we're winding down on time. I ask a question to all

00:36:45.120 of my guests. I prepared you for this question and I want to hear it from you. What does it mean to be a

00:36:48.980 man? That's an awesome question. And to me, it means to show up as your most powerful self, uh,

00:36:57.900 in every area of life. And, and, and, and also knowing that, you know, it's not always going to

00:37:04.100 be sunshine and roses, but if I had to sum up what it means to be a man is, is that full effort means

00:37:10.280 full victory. And just putting yourself out there, uh, to be your best self on a daily basis is, uh,

00:37:16.620 what it means to be a man. Excellent. Tommy, how do we connect with you? Find out more about the

00:37:21.340 work. We're listening to you. We like what you have to say and we want to reach out and connect

00:37:24.120 with you. How do we do it? Of course, man, just, uh, www.tommybakerfitness.com. You can find my

00:37:29.440 blog, which is pretty active. And of course my podcast and any other coaching programs and

00:37:33.600 information on there. Awesome. Tommy, I appreciate you as always. I love our conversations because

00:37:38.080 they're high energy and I get a ton out of them. And so I just want to say, keep going because

00:37:42.540 you're doing awesome. And I can't wait to see what the next a hundred episodes hold for you in

00:37:46.340 your own podcast. I appreciate you being on the show today. I appreciate you right back,

00:37:49.460 man. People, people had some great feedback for our episode. They're like, dude, you guys are such

00:37:52.820 high energy. You're like blowing up the room. And that's, that's what I always want to do, man. So,

00:37:56.480 um, I would acknowledge you too. I love what you're doing with order, man. It's super important and,

00:38:00.260 uh, keep pushing. I'm excited, uh, for what the future holds. Thanks brother. Anytime.

00:38:05.260 There you have it guys. Mr. Tommy Baker, bringing the energy and showing us how to resist average in our

00:38:10.720 lives. Guys, life is not meant to be average. If you find yourself living in mediocrity,

00:38:16.060 and you're frustrated, you're not alone. I talk to guys every day who are facing the same types of

00:38:21.360 things that you are. And this is why you need to check out the iron council, join an elite group

00:38:26.500 of brothers inside of the council. They're going to push you. They're going to question you. They're

00:38:30.440 going to test you and they're going to hold your feet to the fire. And that's exactly what it takes

00:38:34.940 to shake you out of the life you've currently find yourself in and put yourself into a different

00:38:39.920 position. So head to order a man.com slash iron council and join all of us right now. Again,

00:38:45.200 all the details of the show can be found at order of man.com slash zero five eight. And you can join

00:38:49.820 in the conversation we're having about masculinity in our Facebook group at facebook.com slash groups

00:38:53.600 slash order of man guys. I look forward to talking with you next week, but until then take action and

00:38:59.040 become the man you were meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're

00:39:04.240 ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join

00:39:08.980 the order at order of man.com.

Order of Man - April 26, 2016

OoM 058： How Men Can Resist Average with Tommy Baker

Episode Stats

Length

Words per Minute

Word Count

Sentence Count

Hate Speech Sentences

Summary

Transcript