Overcoming Past Mistakes, the Power of Words, and Getting Your Wife on Board ｜ ASK ME ANYTHING
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 14 minutes
Words per Minute
201.71635
Summary
In this episode of the Ask Me Anything podcast, I sit down with Kip and Ryan to answer some of the most popular questions sent in by the men of the Iron Men Order. We talk about the importance of being a man of action, how to improve as a man, and how to become a better version of yourself.
Transcript
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You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path.
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When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time.
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You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong.
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This is your life. This is who you are. This is who you will become.
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At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.
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Kip, what's up, brother? Glad to be joining you here again on the Ask Me Anything for the week.
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It's good to be here. I've browsed through some of these questions this morning and super excited about them.
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Yeah. Well, it's going to be a great conversation.
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I think so. I think so, too. I mean, the questions that we get seem to be improving every week,
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and maybe we're just doing a good job filtering, or maybe the guys are just asking deeper, more profound, more significant questions.
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Yeah. And what a lot of people may not realize is I'm just rewording all the questions and then just using their names.
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So you're just making up your own stuff and just dropping their names in there.
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So this is just for you. It's not for anybody else. It's just for Kip.
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It's one of the things I've always wanted to know, and I've just never had a chance, so I've just bypassed the entire process.
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Yeah. Well, that's the benefit of being my co-host, right?
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If you guys don't like it, then you should have vied for the position.
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Did you see that we hit 10 million downloads? I think it was Sunday night. We hit 10 million downloads.
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10 million times our show has been listened to. That is just – that's staggering. That's mind-blowing to me.
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That is so – it's almost strange. It is. It's just strange.
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I made a post on Instagram today. It's like a lot of the times I just don't feel adequate to be able to share this message.
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If the guys knew all the ways that I messed up and half of the shit I've done to sabotage myself, I don't think anybody would listen.
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But man, I guess I'm glad they don't know that stuff. But man, I think that's a bit of imposter syndrome, right?
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Where you start to feel like unworthy of being able to do what it is you're doing.
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And I think that's actually healthy in a lot of ways because it keeps you humble.
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But then I think it also can play to your detriment if you take it to the extreme as well.
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Yeah. But it's a testament to the conversation that's happening and really the mission of the order and what this is really about.
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And it resonates with people. I mean that's really what it comes down to.
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Well, and I think – and I guess one of the things that I feel like differentiates us between some of these other organizations out there, whether they're exclusively for men or not, is that I just feel there's a lot more realness to what we're doing here.
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Yeah. I just think there is. I just think there's a lot of ego out there.
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I think a lot of these guys are driven by their need to feel superior to other people, to really prop themselves up.
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And that drive that's ego-driven is – gosh, it's disingenuous and it's frankly a turnoff.
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And I think people will wake up to that a little bit and realize, you know what? I want somebody that's real.
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And I think if anything, you and I bring that, you know, all of our flaws and our mess-ups and the things that we might be struggling with.
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And I think that's probably why we have the growth that we do because we're not trying to fool anybody to – into thinking that we're, you know, something that we're not.
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Yeah. I think a good example of that, Ryan, is the post that you had this morning on Instagram.
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You posted a picture. It looks like a bunch of guys that were in a CrossFit gym.
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And they're circled around sitting on like boxes, jump boxes or whatever, and chairs.
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And they're having a conversation and you mentioned, you know, that these guys are reviewing your book, Sovereignty.
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And they're discussing different topics and how to improve as men.
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It's men coming together, banding together, rubbing shoulders together, and looking for opportunities to serve one another but also to level up personally.
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I love it when I see someone wear an Order of Man t-shirt or, you know, we had talked about this in the past where you make eye contact with a guy and you get a little nod because you know.
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And you know where the other person is and what kind of path that they're on.
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It was interesting because I was in – I was in the gas station yesterday and I'm standing there in line and a guy walks in and he makes like eye contact with me.
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Like I could tell it was one of those things you're talking about.
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You know, like that's what's weird to me is like I think to myself, why?
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Like I don't have everything figured out, but it's just really humbling.
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And he's like, hey, man, can I get a picture with you?
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And then he had like checked his pockets, but he didn't have his phone.
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And like I said, it's really flattering, really humbling, certainly strokes the ego.
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So, uh, but at the same time, it was just, I just feel like I have a, uh, a, a large weight
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on my shoulders, a responsibility to continue to bring this mission forward and then strive
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to live my life worthy of that admiration and that level of respect from people who frankly
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just, they don't know me, but they're inspired by what we're doing here.
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Well, I, I kind of jumped in, you know, a little bit and contribute, but I just think it's awesome.
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Should we get into this enough, uh, time wasting here?
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We're, we're getting better instead of 10 minutes.
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So we're going to jump right into the Facebook group, uh, for you guys that want to submit
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Uh, of course, if you're in the iron council, you know how to do it.
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Um, if you want to join us on Facebook and our, um, uh, secured Facebook group for the
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order of man, you can go to facebook.com slash groups slash order of man.
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So I'm totally going to say forward slash later.
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Join us on Facebook if you guys want to submit these questions.
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So our first question, Robert FH, how do you transition from being who you are now to being
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I suffer from a real lack of social confidence, Mr. Nice guy syndrome, and at times a grumpy
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Since my change is based on how I present to others, how do I make the change from me now
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And, and I read it specifically exactly how he wrote it, because I think there's a little
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I think that last sentence, since my changes based on how I present to others, how do I
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I'm glad you reiterated that because it is a thing that we do a lot.
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One of the things I did when I went through my separation with my wife, which was about 10
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years ago now, is initially when we were going through that separation, my whole objective
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You know, like if I, and frankly, even before I got to that point, I think that's an elevated
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Even before I got to that point, it was to try to change her.
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And if she sees this, then I'll get what I want.
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It's like, if I change, it's a manipulative tactic.
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If I change for this reason, if this is my motive for changing, then she'll change.
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So I'm just, again, I'm just, it's, it's a, it's a sophisticated way of changing somebody
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So the next step that you have to get to is changing for what I consider the right reason,
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which is for yourself, because you want to improve because you want to feel good because
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you want to excel, because you want to experience the, the rewards and the blessings of being
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a good man and also being a capable man, which are two different things.
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I think Robert's already getting to this point because Robert, what you're saying is
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I hesitant to, I hesitate to tell you the answer, or at least my, my perception of the answer,
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because I've said it so often that it might feel like it's coming across as a cop-out,
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Guys, when you get to that position where you're like, I have to change for the right
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I feel a lack, a sense of uneasiness or a lack of, of growth and progress in my life.
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If you're experiencing this, then you have to get to the battle plan.
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So Robert says, I need to change and not be this grumpy guy that I used to be.
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What type of man are you going to show up to be now?
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When people interact with you, how do, how do those interactions work out when people view
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And Brian, if you don't mind me throwing in there, what is the probable future, Robert?
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If you don't change, if you want a little bit of motivation, like, Hey, if I don't get
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on this path and I don't come up with this vision, right?
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That you're talking about, what's going to be the probable future?
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I mean, that's, that's ultimately what it is, but you bring up a good point.
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I think it's, I think it's worth weighing that, right?
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Cause that helps you realize, Oh, if I stay down on this path, I'm going to produce these
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What, what specifically do you want to accomplish?
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I don't think it's enough to say, I want to make more money.
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I don't think it's enough to say, I want to be healthier.
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I don't think it's enough to say, I want to participate in this hobby or whatever.
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I think most people, if I said, what is it that you want?
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If I asked a hundred men, what do you want out of life?
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And we all want that, but very rarely is that going to actually produce the results that
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I want to be wealthier, but how much wealthier you make a hundred thousand right now?
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And what does, and then what does that look like?
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Cause, and, and I, you bring up a great point there too, as well, because I think a lot
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of guys, they will get to this objective point and they'll say, okay, well, I'm making
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Well, if you don't have any vision to tie that to the, the, the means by which you accomplish
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that could be compromised because there's no vision.
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Like if you lie, cheat and steal to get to that point is, does that tie into your vision
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So having it tied to a deeply emotional, deeply connected vision will help you stay
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on the right path and do this the right way because the way that we win matters.
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And I told this to a group of teenagers, a baseball team.
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In fact, as I, as I presented them, I said, guys, winning is important.
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You're past the point of like, Hey, we're just here to have fun and let's try our hardest.
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The point of this game is to win and it's to improve ourselves.
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But the way in which we win matters, it's not the scoreboard is not enough itself.
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It is one metric of how we perform, but the way that we go about doing that matters.
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So I'm being long-winded here, but ultimately it's the, it's the vision, it's the objectives.
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And I would say, come up with, you know, two to two to four objectives that you want to
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So if you want to lose 30 pounds, because it's tied into the vision you have for, for
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a healthy male, then what are you going to do on a daily basis?
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For me, it's, I'm going to work out every single day.
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And in fact, five days a week, I work out twice.
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There's a lot that goes to it, but there's tactics that I complete every single day that
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I have a spreadsheet that I use and I literally check that off and say, yes, I accomplished
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Or it goes unchecked and no, I didn't accomplish that.
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And when it, when it shows that I didn't accomplish it, it shows that on the spreadsheet
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itself, like, oh yeah, you didn't accomplish this.
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And if you miss enough, then it goes into the red.
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You're like, oh, I really failed this week in my objectives.
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So it's a long-winded answer, but ultimately it's the battle plan.
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You can find it in the back of my book, Sovereignty.
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Uh, you can join us inside of our exclusive brotherhood, the iron council and, and do your
00:13:16.280
We're coming up with a new one here in the next, what?
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10 days, nine days, I think now, and you get the tracker and everything else that goes
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How do you keep yourself from falling into a rut when your wife and family have been radiating
00:13:37.160
Well, I mean, we kind of fall into what Robert, I think was saying, like, who are you doing
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You know, if you, if you're doing it for your wife or your family and ultimately you should,
00:14:00.580
But if you're not willing to take care of yourself for the right reasons, then these
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outside influences, and yes, even your family's an external factor are going to play a larger
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It's going to be a, a heavier weighted variable than if you were just to do it for the right
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reason, which is I want to be a good and capable man for myself.
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And the benefit of that is I'm more capable of serving other people.
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So how do you, how do you get out of the rut, do the battle plan, man, get it done, get
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your battle plans done, execute, find other men who you can work with and communicate with
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open the lines of communication with your family.
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Maybe there's some breakdown in communication or a barrier there that you need to make sure
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that you address, maybe improving the family dynamic and the family relationship is one
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of the things that you actually put into your battle plan itself and try to figure out
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Is it some animosity or contention between you and your wife or you and your kids?
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And then come up with a plan to address it, find other positive people in your life, find
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people who are going to hold you accountable and hold your feet to the fire, do the same
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As a way of motivation to Wade, it's taught to change culture within a company and even within
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a family, and you can't do it by being mediocre.
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Like you have to be on your a game and just be utterly inspiring to those around you.
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I don't want to deter you saying, you know, it's not possible.
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It's just you, you have your work made out for you and don't approach it from a mediocre
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And I have a lot of guys who will say things like, how do you get your wife to trust you?
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You know, like my wife, I want to start this new business.
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This new business is my wife doesn't believe in me.
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Most of the guys that say this, if I say, give me one good reason why she should, all
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Because you failed and you've dropped the ball and you've been out of integrity and you've
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let things slip and you haven't been a man of your word and so many other things that
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So when guys, because occasionally what my wife and I will do is we'll kick, kick you
00:16:28.600
Um, but I'll bring her in and, and we have, we have a great relationship, a very good
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We still fight and we got into a fight on Sunday.
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Uh, and guys will say, man, how she, she really seems like she trusts you with your business
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There was a point in time where she wouldn't trust a word that came out of my mouth and
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I think that was pretty warranted because there was no track record of me being an
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But now I do to the best of my ability, everything that I can in order to fulfill my commitments
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to her and fulfill my commitments to you guys as the listeners and Kip, you and my kids.
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So she sees all these little micro wins, all these little micro acts of integrity.
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I believe the noises that come out of Ryan's mouth, because every time he says that he
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So being a man of your word and being an integrity and getting the things done that
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you say you will, when you say you'll do them is the single greatest tactic.
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It's the greatest single act that you can do over a long and sustained period of time
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to prove to your wife or your kids or your employees or your employer that you are a
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I, I, cause I looked over some of these questions earlier.
00:18:01.980
Um, and I, we're already seeing evidence of it from the question from Robert and this
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other question from Wade about kind of the tugboat versus lighthouse mentality.
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Do you want to touch base on that briefly and the power of that?
00:18:16.100
And then, and I think that will serve us as we go over some of, some of these other questions
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I mean, I think a lot of guys listening to this know the tugboat, tugboat versus the
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You know, the, the lighthouse is the, they both serve the same purpose, right?
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Which is to warn ships from danger and help them navigate safely to shore.
00:18:34.320
Um, but ultimately the lighthouse is, is the fixture that's, that's, that's permanent.
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It's there shining its light and being an example, regardless of the conditions or the
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weather or any other factor that may come up and it stands and it shines to as many people
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On the other hand, you've got the tugboat, which gets down into the, into the harbor, into
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the bay and it's crashed upon by the waves and it's getting beat up and it's pushing
00:19:03.380
and, and, and pulling and manipulating this, this, this boat or another individual, if we're
00:19:09.060
using the analogy and it's, it's getting banged up and beat up and, and it's not able to serve
00:19:14.580
necessarily more than one people or a person or boat in this case.
00:19:18.600
So really the whole concept is that if we can be a lighthouse, we can shine, we can stay
00:19:23.760
above the waves and the friction and really keep ourselves in an, I want, I don't want
00:19:30.920
to say elevated position, but a stronghold, if you will, then we have the capability of
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serving more people in a greater capacity for a longer period of time.
00:19:39.620
So really ultimately, you know, you've got to take care of yourself.
00:19:42.480
You've got to keep yourself above the fray and above the noise and above the nonsense that
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you can serve the people that you want to serve.
00:19:49.500
And you know what, inevitably you might lose a ship or two, but sometimes you kind of have
00:19:56.220
Because these people aren't ready for your message or aren't willing to attempt to rescue
00:20:02.500
Now the, the analogy falls short in a lot of ways, but I think everybody understands the
00:20:07.220
concept that we're trying to make or the point that we're trying to make here.
00:20:10.400
And to relate it to Wade's question is as a lighthouse, you're not going out in the water,
00:20:21.520
And so, you know, in, in Wade's quest, right, to become, you know, remove that negative energy
00:20:26.580
within his household by doing it as a lighthouse, you, you create an opportunity for them to
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see the light, for them to come to that way of being and you don't force it upon them.
00:20:37.480
And, and as we've learned, uh, rarely do we ever successively forcibly change people.
00:20:44.780
Well, and even if you do, it's temporary on their own.
00:20:48.340
If they're not ready, it's just a temporary change.
00:20:52.300
Chris Morrison, Ryan, what has been your biggest challenge in leading other men on a large scale,
00:21:03.840
Kip for you, as you lead battle teams on a smaller, more intimate level, how did you approach
00:21:15.060
Um, I, I, you know, I get disheart, disheartened a little bit when I really pour my heart and
00:21:19.540
soul and energy and everything I have and can into this movement or into another individual
00:21:24.040
and they decide to maintain their current path.
00:21:27.780
You know, they'll tell me, Hey, I want to change or I want to improve the relationship
00:21:30.500
or I want to get fit or I want to make more money.
00:21:32.260
And I, and I clearly lay out a plan for them to be able to do that through, again, the battle
00:21:36.800
I'm going to keep hitting that home and they just don't do anything with it.
00:21:41.240
And that's what I've learned to go back to this lighthouse concept is I can't get down
00:21:45.440
in it with people because a lot of them aren't just aren't ready for it.
00:21:52.460
And, but man, if you're going to, if, if you're going to talk about being ready for
00:21:56.460
improvement and change, like then don't just pay a lip service, like be willing
00:22:00.360
to invest time and energy and resources and commitment and dedication and sacrifice into
00:22:10.060
And because it's discouraging, I sometimes lose my cool or lose my patience with those
00:22:16.780
And then I think what that ends up doing is diminishing or undermining my credibility
00:22:22.420
and authority with those who do really want to improve.
00:22:27.440
And so I have to be, in fact, I did it in the iron council the other day.
00:22:31.260
I don't know if you saw that or not, but I got frustrated with the team leaders because
00:22:35.580
I didn't feel like they were doing what was in the best interest of the iron council and
00:22:41.320
And I let that slip in a way that I don't think was effective, an effective way to address
00:22:47.000
And I think I apologize, you know, I made that post or whatever in the afternoon and that
00:22:50.560
in that evening, I apologized and said, Hey man, here's, here's where I was guys.
00:22:56.020
I still believe what I said, but I could have handled that more tactfully.
00:23:01.200
So I took ownership of that, but I do lose my patients very, very quickly.
00:23:05.660
And it's just, man, it's just something that I, that I have to deal with and recognize that,
00:23:09.440
you know, people are looking to me as an example of, of how to lead in their own lives.
00:23:13.260
And if I let that kind of stuff get to me, I'm not serving them in the best way possible.
00:23:21.520
And, you know, the other thing that, that I run into is guys thinking that, and again,
00:23:26.300
this goes back to the patient's thing that their situations are unique, you know, it's
00:23:30.160
like, Oh, I'm dealing with a situation with my wife.
00:23:32.900
I'm like, well, I'm like, well, I clearly show other guys who have gone through that
00:23:37.960
and, and, and what they've been doing and they're like, well, my, my situation is different.
00:23:41.900
And then it leads me to say, well, screw off then, you know, like if you're not interested
00:23:46.080
in learning or growing from these other experiences that people have had, but again,
00:23:51.440
I realized that I look at my own life differently than Kip, I would look at yours.
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Like, it's really easy for me to say, Oh, your, your life is easy, Kip.
00:24:00.260
And then look at my life and, and filter it through a different, a different lens or whatever.
00:24:05.780
So ultimately it's just being patient and understanding and empathetic, which is not my strong suit.
00:24:14.920
I think as I, you know, I have, I have, as I have worked with some of the battle teams
00:24:19.960
and in, even in my job here at journey team, I think one of the challenges that I, that
00:24:25.040
I've struggled with, and it's not a, it's a, it's a, it's, it's, well, it's Jocko's book
00:24:30.960
It's one of those dichotomies that I have to constantly, um, work on and it's not putting
00:24:37.840
team members before the mission, um, of the team.
00:24:40.800
Um, I've struggled with that in the past, probably six months or so, uh, within echo.
00:24:45.960
I've seen it even, um, with my team here where I have to make sure that I put the mission
00:24:51.240
first, uh, cause I have a tendency to, to want to rescue, right?
00:24:55.520
A single team member or, um, focus on the individual some too much.
00:25:00.460
And sometimes I lose sight of, of the actual mission, uh, and, and what we're doing.
00:25:05.900
So that's, that's been a, not an Achilles heel, but something that I have to be mindful
00:25:13.640
I like, and I'll, I'm trying to look at this objectively.
00:25:16.860
I like the, both of us really tried to take that upon ourselves, like not what is the problem
00:25:22.020
Although maybe I did that a little bit, but ultimately how can I improve myself, right?
00:25:27.480
So it's recognizing that I have an inability to be patient and then fixing that and then
00:25:33.680
seeing how that improves the relationship I have with the guys.
00:25:36.320
And of course you're doing the same thing as well.
00:25:38.060
So it's good that we recognize it and try to improve what we can, which is ultimately
00:25:46.700
John Reiners, Ryan and Kip, any tips for letting go of past mistakes you've made?
00:25:52.000
I'm curious if you still struggle with regrets from your past history and how you've dealt with
00:26:04.460
Guys, if you haven't done a battle plan, I don't even care if you use mine.
00:26:07.860
That's not, that's not even what I'm telling you.
00:26:09.260
I'm just saying, if you don't have some sort of planning tool for your life that you can
00:26:14.000
learn from mistakes, you can evaluate mistakes, you can evaluate what you want, and then come
00:26:19.340
up with a plan and a strategy and the actions towards improving yourself, you're, you're
00:26:26.660
So I think number one, when we're talking specifically about past mistakes is doing an
00:26:34.740
An after action review is not an opportunity to throw yourself into the mix and get down
00:26:41.000
in the mud like a tugboat would and really beat yourself up and tell yourself how sad or
00:26:46.640
It's, it's an objective analysis and that's difficult because you're doing it yourself, but
00:26:52.160
it is an objective analysis on the circumstance.
00:27:07.580
And like you always say, Kip, don't attach meaning to it.
00:27:11.440
So when you're doing the after action review, for example, when my wife and I got into that
00:27:15.600
argument on Sunday, actually, I do know what it was about.
00:27:20.940
I remember when I said I lost my patience with the, or lost my cool with the iron council
00:27:26.040
I let that spill over into the relationship with my wife and kids.
00:27:30.840
And so I was upset and then I felt like she was nagging me about something, but looking
00:27:37.440
It was just that I perceived it to be that way because I was in the middle of something
00:27:42.200
So I looked at the situation and realized, oh, that was my fault, right?
00:27:53.940
I didn't communicate to her that I was trying to work and I couldn't be involved with whatever
00:27:59.740
There's a lot of different things I could have done, but I looked at that objectively.
00:28:02.320
And now I know, right now I know I, I arm myself with the information and the tools
00:28:07.060
and the plan of action moving forward that when this comes up, I know what I'll do.
00:28:11.420
And so do I feel bad that I snapped at her and the kids?
00:28:19.460
All I can do now is do it differently next time that set of circumstances comes up and
00:28:24.560
it will inevitably, it's going to come up again.
00:28:26.960
So how do my hand, how do I handle myself next time?
00:28:31.820
What I'm hearing, what you're saying, Ryan is, and, and that I think it's in the case
00:28:35.620
of these small arguments or where we might lash out at our families or our spouses.
00:28:40.520
To even the more extreme things of, you know, craziness, right?
00:28:45.960
I got divorced as a complete asshole or, you know what I mean?
00:28:52.880
And, and at the root of all that, and we've talked about this in the past, we've made this
00:28:57.300
distinction in the past is how do you ensure that you don't have regret?
00:29:02.740
If you don't grow and learn from your mistakes, you will regret them, but it's, but it's ironic.
00:29:08.400
Like for instance, I would never condone getting divorced without a doubt.
00:29:13.100
And even when I look at my past and why we quote unquote got divorced from my ex-wife,
00:29:19.580
I would still say that it wasn't warranted and we, and it shouldn't have happened.
00:29:37.340
And I met an amazing woman because of it, because I put myself on a path of, of being
00:29:44.000
And so it's really hard for me to look at the past and go, I regret that happening.
00:29:48.140
Because I grew and it was part of my path of, of becoming who I am today.
00:29:52.800
And so one, I think one of the strongest things that we can do to ensure that we don't
00:29:58.940
Don't waste the pain and the suffering and, and all the, the hardship that you went
00:30:07.040
And, and to what you're saying, Ryan, what I'm hearing is one of the ways you learn and
00:30:21.580
I mean, that's absolutely, you got to reframe it, right?
00:30:23.960
I mean, I think it's, it's hard to do in the moment when you're quote unquote failing,
00:30:33.180
Maybe this is just one little learning opportunity and reframe it from failure to, okay, what
00:30:38.980
did I learn and how am I going to improve moving forward?
00:30:45.520
Uh, Sasha Flammer, uh, flame, Flammer's burger.
00:30:54.740
Remember, if we don't know, we just say alphabet.
00:30:57.700
How would you comment on German tendencies to have parliament equally filled with men
00:31:09.320
I don't know enough about German government to make a, uh, educated statement on how their
00:31:19.480
So, but let's just, let's just talk about the principle of it.
00:31:23.580
Cause, and we, and we can relate to this principle to.
00:31:30.300
Colleges, Congress, workforce, all the, all these scenarios.
00:31:36.120
When here, so here's my, here's my thoughts from a principled standpoint.
00:31:42.080
When you force organizations or companies or teams or societies to quote unquote equalize
00:31:55.460
the playing field, you diminish, well, I should say it this way.
00:32:00.020
You potentially diminish the validity and the effectiveness and the efficiency of that
00:32:07.340
organization, because what you're doing by default is you're not measuring based on who
00:32:12.360
is the best performer you're measuring off of other factors like race or gender or sexual
00:32:23.180
And those are not determined or, or, or, or a factor when it comes to who is most capable
00:32:32.600
So from a principled standpoint, it's stupid and it actually undermines the organization
00:32:38.740
to mandate that you take into consideration anything other than performance.
00:32:44.780
That's why meritocracies will always outperform other organizations, other governments and, and,
00:32:51.760
and, and teams that operate in, in a different capacity is because they promote those who
00:32:57.720
warrant the promotion and they will always outpace those who don't and measure on different
00:33:12.220
Organization and let's say they're being sexist, right?
00:33:17.520
And they're not interviewing women and they're only hiring men.
00:33:20.300
Explain to me how you, a company purposely choosing only to hire women is any different.
00:33:33.060
The only difference is we've, we've grouped one as a minority.
00:33:40.700
It's, it's quite honestly, Kip, it's when, when we do these types of things, whether it's
00:33:45.120
in German governments or here in the States, or even just private entities that say, I have
00:33:49.980
to have a certain amount of minorities or a certain amount of women on my board or whatever.
00:33:53.940
Um, it's, well, frankly, it's un-American that first, and it's just, it's just, I don't
00:33:59.960
know how else to say it other than it's a ridiculous, ridiculous sexist or racist assertion and an
00:34:07.540
attempt to control something that can never fully be controlled.
00:34:11.400
So if you want to win, that's the funny thing is like, this is coming from people who say
00:34:16.880
they don't want to be sexist or they don't want to be racist.
00:34:19.180
And yet they're engaged in the exact behavior that they're pretending to defend against.
00:34:25.720
And they're perpetuating that sex is like, or, or it's a hand-me-out that's insulting.
00:34:34.000
I would be insulted if my company hired me because I'm a white male.
00:34:41.720
So let me hire you because you're a white male.
00:34:45.520
And people should actually be insulted by that mentality as well.
00:34:48.960
Well, they're not because, and I'll tell you why it's because it's a race to the bottom.
00:34:52.940
Like whoever's the most victimized, whoever is the most oppressed, whoever is the most
00:34:57.440
downtrodden, then those people are the ones who get attention.
00:35:04.000
They, they're, they're dubbed as courageous simply because they, there's some perceived
00:35:12.440
And I'm not interested in racing to the bottom.
00:35:16.020
And if a woman in my organization is going to help me get to that point, by all means,
00:35:20.220
So if it's going to be a man or somebody who's black or somebody who's African-American or
00:35:25.200
somebody who's Asian or Indian or whatever, then fine.
00:35:31.420
So I'm going to bring people on who are going to help me win period.
00:35:41.300
Because again, that, that idea of the victim, the victim hood and the victim mentality and
00:35:47.140
the downtrodden thing is just permeating every fabric of society.
00:35:53.180
And instead of feeding it, that's what we're doing.
00:35:55.880
Instead of feeding it, we ought to just trample it under our feet.
00:36:01.040
We encourage, we destroy it, but we encourage those who are downtrodden.
00:36:06.580
There are people who don't have the same opportunities as us.
00:36:11.680
So how do we overcome this victim hood mentality?
00:36:20.000
We give them a hand up when we can, and we encourage them to face the consequences of
00:36:24.700
their decisions and everything else that you and I, and the majority of people listening
00:36:30.720
You don't do people favors by pandering and, and, and, and making them the victim and playing
00:36:37.520
So for a good resource on this, uh, for you guys, your, Ryan's conversation with Goggins
00:36:48.440
You know, I don't know you, the podcast history and find that episode, but that conversation
00:36:52.480
that you and David had was, was just excellent from this perspective.
00:36:56.100
I mean, that was a great conversation anyways, but that point where he was talking about
00:37:02.040
And he's like, no, man, there was like two racist people in his entire town.
00:37:05.320
And he let that taint what he felt about white people.
00:37:10.020
And he was like, man, if I would have been awake, you know, if I would have really been
00:37:13.020
aware of this, I would have realized that it was two guys.
00:37:19.120
So it was, it was a really powerful moment in that podcast for sure.
00:37:25.960
I know much of your message is about making a decision to move forward and change bad habits
00:37:30.780
or poor decisions making, uh, making by taking action.
00:37:34.560
But how do you recommend best breaking down and using mistakes, bad choices, and et cetera
00:37:39.740
from the past to make an amends with people you've hurt and learn lessons from your mistakes
00:37:46.400
I actually think it's a really good idea to make amends, even if that's a simple apology
00:37:51.920
But the one reason I want to share in this context is that it is very, very humiliating
00:38:00.020
And because it's humiliating to have to do it, you can take that one of two ways.
00:38:03.820
Number one is I'm never going to apologize for anything I ever do again.
00:38:07.140
I think most people, rational people would think that's unhealthy.
00:38:11.140
Number two is to say, I'm not going to make that decision or that mistake again.
00:38:14.720
So I don't have to apologize for the very thing I'm doing right now.
00:38:19.060
So what I said earlier about living with the consequences of our choices, we as parents
00:38:24.660
and employers and friends and just society in general are trying to strip away all of
00:38:33.440
And we think that we're helping people, you know, when we don't let our kid, like, for
00:38:38.400
example, if our kid is bullying somebody at school and we come in and we, we rescue our
00:38:44.160
child and we say, well, and we defend him and we come up with all the reasons why he
00:38:50.740
What we're doing is we're saying that behavior is okay.
00:38:53.280
In fact, I encourage it because I'll just come in and rescue next time.
00:38:56.440
If on the other hand, you come in and say, you know what?
00:39:00.280
Yes, my kid's going to have some disciplinary action at home.
00:39:03.580
He's going to have some disciplinary action here.
00:39:05.340
I support you as a school with what you're doing within reason, of course.
00:39:09.440
And you let the child feel the full weight of their decisions.
00:39:13.520
That is actually very empowering because with a healthy perspective that you give them, which
00:39:19.940
is not, I'm just going to discipline you and not explain why, but I'm going to discipline
00:39:22.940
you and explain why this is so important we don't behave in this manner, then you're actually
00:39:27.500
empowering your children not to behave and not to make those same stupid mistakes that
00:39:39.200
I think you should try to rectify any situations that you may have messed up.
00:39:43.960
And I don't feel like you can fully move forward until you've made an attempt to do so.
00:39:49.060
And I say attempt because let's say that Kip, let's say, for example, that you stole from
00:39:59.180
You stole money from me and you apologized about it and you paid me that money back.
00:40:10.100
And that's what sucks is that Kip, you could try to make full amends and rectify the situation,
00:40:14.380
apologize, pay it back with interest, even do whatever you needed to do to make it right.
00:40:21.320
So the best that you can do as a human is to apologize, fix it to the best of your ability
00:40:27.960
and let the chips fall where they may, because it's nobody's responsibility to accept that
00:40:33.100
It's so ironic that I was just having this conversation with my boys last night and the conversation
00:40:40.600
And I actually think it's, and I told him, I'm like, guys, throw religion out the window.
00:40:51.900
You come into the realizations that you've made a mistake.
00:40:58.260
You ask for forgiveness and then you re and then you commit not to do it again.
00:41:01.940
And to your point, Ryan, what was, I think is profound is if I come to you and apologize
00:41:08.380
And I try to resolve the problem the best I can.
00:41:10.660
If I'm doing it, so you trust me again, then I'm doing it for the wrong reason, right?
00:41:16.060
If I'm going to you and correcting the problem, because that is the right thing to do.
00:41:21.140
And because I'm committed to change and not being that way anymore, guess what?
00:41:25.460
It doesn't matter if you forgive me or not, because I've made the amends the best I can.
00:41:32.620
And, and there's, and that's why repentance is so powerful.
00:41:39.040
If you're unable, you have so much ego and you're unable to look at your circumstance
00:41:45.840
I did this wrong and have a, you know, after action review and realize what you did wrong
00:41:54.200
And, and that's, that's the power of this conversation, right?
00:41:59.520
From a religious standpoint or just really from this.
00:42:04.060
So while you were talking here, Kip, I actually pulled up the repentance process specifically
00:42:09.320
for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, because I'm, I'm LDS.
00:42:21.400
So number one, you must recognize your sin, or you can fill in the blank with mistake or
00:42:26.980
transgression or whatever term you want to use, but you have to recognize it.
00:42:30.020
Number one, if you don't recognize it, there's no repentance.
00:42:37.260
And not recognizing it is also blaming someone else.
00:42:48.600
So maybe you recognize that it was wrong, but if you don't feel sorry about what you did,
00:42:54.380
So there has to be some sort of sorrow for your, your mistake or your sin.
00:43:01.400
So we have to commit to ourselves that we aren't going to do that anymore.
00:43:05.160
Does that mean we're going to be perfect forever?
00:43:06.740
No, but it means that we are making an honest effort, a concerted effort to forsake that mistake,
00:43:17.820
So in the context of here, we're talking about confession to the Lord.
00:43:20.680
Um, but I also think that there's an element of confessing to ourselves, making amends,
00:43:26.380
uh, confessing to other people that maybe we wronged.
00:43:34.440
So wherever you can, you have to make it right.
00:43:36.780
You have to make that other individual that you may have wronged whole again.
00:43:40.400
And that might take some creative problem solving.
00:43:43.820
Um, and, and you may not be able to do it to the best of your ability or, or do it fully,
00:43:48.820
Uh, number six, this one's actually really important.
00:43:52.360
We must forgive other people of their sins, or again, fill in the blank with mistakes.
00:43:58.340
Like if you make mistakes and you want to go through the repentance process and you want
00:44:02.280
to fix this process, but you're not willing to acknowledge that other people make mistakes.
00:44:06.700
This is why I feel like I'm very, very quick to a say, sorry, and very, very quick B to accept
00:44:13.700
Because I feel like if I want to be forgiven or, or, or, or, or yeah, I guess that's the
00:44:20.220
best word forgiven for my mistakes and my sins, then I have to be willing to do the same for
00:44:25.420
And then the last, and this is in the context of religion and spirituality is that keeping
00:44:30.980
But I also think this can translate into living to the other principles that you've committed
00:44:37.400
So it's not enough just to isolate this one element of your life and say, well, I'm not
00:44:41.880
I think it's important that you expand and you broaden your definition and say, well, I'm
00:44:46.200
going to live a principled life, not just this principle, but all the other principles
00:44:51.940
I like to, that last step, I like to like think of that as honor.
00:45:00.760
And I'm like, all right, I'm committed not to do that again, but you know, I'm going to
00:45:07.940
Or something completely different that might not have to do with theft at all.
00:45:10.880
It's like, you can't compartmentalize being a moral person.
00:45:15.140
Like you have your set of morals and principles.
00:45:17.700
You don't get to adhere to like one of 10 and say that you're a principled human being.
00:45:23.940
If you're a principled human being, then that means you adhere to all the
00:45:52.220
I look, if you're asking the question, two things here.
00:45:55.220
If you're asking the question, you're probably getting to that point already.
00:45:58.020
And, or you're not putting a plan in place that will help you be maybe a better employee.
00:46:06.380
And I'm not saying that it's your fault, but it could, there could be an element of it.
00:46:11.360
I mean, he could approach this scenario like, Hey, I'm going to see this as a game.
00:46:20.620
So I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and say that if you've already done that,
00:46:23.480
then you need to formulate a plan to, in fact, if you listen to, I think it was last
00:46:29.040
week's Friday field notes, 10 steps to crushing your career.
00:46:32.300
I think there's five or six of those things in there that will help in this exact situation,
00:46:36.060
which will help you be a, a better employee now while you're transitioning or making a plan
00:46:43.260
or working the plan to be an employer, a business owner somewhere else, you don't have to burn the
00:46:47.820
bridges and burn the ships, but you should start formulating a plan. Like, I don't, I don't think
00:46:54.060
that there should ever be a situation where you couldn't find a job. I'll give you an example.
00:47:00.060
If for whatever reason, order of man didn't work out, I didn't like doing it anymore. Everybody
00:47:05.920
like a mass exodus from order of man. I, I would have new employment within 24 hours and I don't
00:47:13.120
want to put that to the test. I don't want that to happen, but if it happened, I'd have new
00:47:17.540
employment within 24 hours. There's not a single doubt in my mind that that would be the case.
00:47:21.520
Why? Because I'm very well connected. I add value to as many people as I possibly can.
00:47:28.540
And I strive to serve those individuals. And because of that, I've got job security.
00:47:35.620
It's when we don't do those things, when we don't network and connect ourselves,
00:47:39.460
we're not adding value to our employer, our current employer's life, our teammates,
00:47:43.820
our coworkers lives and other people's lives that we really could find ourselves in hot water.
00:47:48.340
Should we lose employment? So you really got to formulate a plan. Go back, listen to that Friday
00:47:52.160
field notes, formulate a plan. And then also I think the 10th step is to find meaning and purpose
00:47:57.560
and being a good employee where you are right now and seeing if that actually changes the scenario for
00:48:01.760
you. Love it. Good reference to Friday field notes. Stephen Estill, any thoughts on how your
00:48:08.520
personal verbiage that you use day in and day out affect you? The saying, whether you say you can
00:48:13.960
or you say you cannot, you're right. I mean, it's huge. It's huge. It's funny because I was
00:48:19.700
having this conversation with, I can't remember, John Roman, front row factor, front row dads. I
00:48:26.320
think he's coming out with a front row moms now too. Anyways, he came into town a couple of weeks ago
00:48:30.880
and we went and hiked in Zion national park and everything was a lot of fun. And we were talking about
00:48:35.560
language and it was really funny because I think it was this, uh, this Russian couple that walked
00:48:42.080
past us. Cause he knows some Russian. He's like, Oh, they're speaking Russian. And I started thinking,
00:48:46.080
I'm like, it's really funny because they're speaking a language that I don't understand.
00:48:50.080
I had no idea what they were saying. They understood it. John understood some of it.
00:48:54.740
And I thought, isn't that funny? Because all that is, is noises that our body makes.
00:49:00.680
And then we manipulate the air that's coming into our lungs and then leaving our lungs through our
00:49:05.960
vocal cords. And we change the shape of our mouth and change the position of our tongue to
00:49:10.920
manipulate a sound. And the only reason that that sound actually means anything is because we
00:49:19.300
collectively have decided that that particular sound means fill in the blank. Right? So we have
00:49:26.580
attached meaning to certain sounds that are coming from our body. That's such a strange thing to me.
00:49:32.220
It's the same things with, uh, with written language. Cause if you like, I'm taking notes as we do this
00:49:37.460
podcast, somebody could take these notes and know exactly what I mean, which is interesting because all
00:49:44.440
it is, is these little scribbles and these series of lines and people look and say, well, that's a V
00:49:51.180
and that's an H and that's a D and that sound makes that. And those letters make this word,
00:49:56.820
which means fill in the blank. Right? But they're just lines on a piece of paper. But the only reason
00:50:01.560
they have meaning is because we've attached meaning to them. Yeah. So now that that's a, that's a long
00:50:06.840
lead up. The point I'm making here is that words are powerful because we've given them meaning.
00:50:13.140
And so if you're telling yourself things and you're saying to yourself things out loud,
00:50:19.480
or whether it's in your head or writing these things down, you've attached meaning to these
00:50:24.020
words, whether you realize it or not, every sound that you utter has a meaning. And when you say
00:50:32.660
those words or write those words, you are telling your brain that this is how it operates. This is how
00:50:39.900
it thinks. This is how it behaves. This is how we respond. And all of those are very, very real.
00:50:47.540
So if you're telling yourself positive and uplifting and encouraging things,
00:50:51.960
then the meaning is positivity, encouragement, uplifting. If you're saying to yourself destructive,
00:51:00.160
harmful, hurtful words, then the meaning is that you're shitty or you're not a good human being,
00:51:07.600
or you're not deserving or fill in the blank with whatever destructive thoughts that you have.
00:51:13.760
So long story short, guys, words are very, very powerful, very powerful. And if you can
00:51:21.680
learn to use language in a way that will help you, that will serve you, I think you're going to be
00:51:28.120
better off. It's just a tool. And a tool is only as effective as your ability to use it effectively.
00:51:34.760
Cool. Kevin Miller, I'm struggling with regaining the strength to train again after a previous place
00:51:43.960
of employment caused injury. I've gained weight and it's basically like I have to start over again
00:51:49.540
with these added elements. How would it be best to approach working out after injury to yourself?
00:51:55.580
Example, tennis elbow, cracking wrist, pelvic pain, et cetera.
00:51:58.860
But the beauty is you are starting over. You got a clean slate, man. It's awesome.
00:52:02.540
So you go into the gym and let's say you're going to do, and I'm not, I'm not a, I'm not an expert on
00:52:07.720
this stuff. Okay. So I'm not telling you to do specific lifts because I don't know the extent of
00:52:11.140
your injuries and I don't know what will actually exacerbate the problem. Okay. But what I'm saying
00:52:15.100
is that hypothetically, let's say that you wanted to go in and start working on your bench press.
00:52:19.940
And because of that elbow injury, you really couldn't do much weight. And so you can only bench the
00:52:24.360
bar 45 pounds. Okay. Well, maybe before you could do 200 pounds. So you think, well, I've fallen 200
00:52:32.420
pounds. Well, yeah, but what's done is done. All right. It's already done. It's cleared. So now you
00:52:37.140
can do 45 pounds. Forget about everything else that came before it. The goal is the next time you do 55
00:52:44.120
pounds, the next time you do 65 pounds, the next time you do 85 pounds, the next time you do 135 pounds,
00:52:51.260
the goal is to get better than you are today. That's the goal. And so right now the past,
00:52:59.320
let it go, man. It's already happened. What are you going to do about it? You're going to rewind time
00:53:03.200
and, and not injure yourself or not have to deal with that problem. No, you can't do that.
00:53:08.000
So this is why I don't like questions. Not, not this question, but why I don't like questions where
00:53:12.340
they say, if you could go back in time, what would be one thing you could change? Dude, I can't go back
00:53:17.420
in time, but I'll tell you what I can do now. I'll tell you what I learned from that. I'll tell
00:53:24.120
you how I'm going to continue to grow and develop and expand. So what's this guy's name?
00:53:29.020
Kevin. So Kevin, make yourself the project, man. You've got a clean slate. Go in there and get a
00:53:33.680
baseline with whatever you want to do. Maybe it's jujitsu. Maybe it's powerlifting. Maybe it's
00:53:38.900
CrossFit. Maybe it's a combination of who knows what, maybe it's hit training. Go in there today
00:53:44.980
and get your baseline. And your baseline is it's it. The only reason your baseline is relevant is so
00:53:51.980
that you can improve tomorrow on it. It's not to measure against who you were prior to your injury.
00:53:56.680
It's not to beat yourself up and to say, look how far you've fallen. It's only to give yourself the
00:54:02.380
foundational basis and benchmark for who you're going to be tomorrow and do all your lifts,
00:54:09.760
do a deadlift, do a squat, do a bench press, do a push press, do a pull up. If you can do,
00:54:14.900
whatever you can. And again, I'm not the exercise specialist here, so don't hurt yourself,
00:54:19.280
but do whatever you can to establish the benchmark. And then tomorrow, when you go in,
00:54:24.940
improve the next day, improve the next day, improve, make yourself the project.
00:54:30.080
Love it. Cody Reed Westnich, leadership advice. If you had someone that was your manager,
00:54:36.900
but they were 10 all the way up to 30 years younger than you, what would you want to see out of that
00:54:42.560
leader? Um, definitely initiative would be huge. The ability to communicate a vision. So I guess
00:54:53.740
that's two is that they would have vision and that they would be able to communicate it effectively.
00:54:57.820
And somebody who is a self-starter, somebody who doesn't need instruction necessarily to get going,
00:55:08.000
um, but can see something that needs to be accomplished and then come up with it and formulate
00:55:13.040
a plan and rally the troops around it. That's what I'd look for. That's great.
00:55:19.420
All right. How about you? Would you add anything to that? Um, no, I, I think when I think of young,
00:55:26.640
I'm stereotyping, right? When I think of guys that are 10 to 30 years younger than I am,
00:55:30.420
and they're in a leadership position, uh, they have a tendency to be arrogant.
00:55:34.480
So I think humility would be important. Um, and, and let's be honest in any leadership
00:55:39.880
position, if you're coming across like an arrogant ass, right? Like people aren't going to rally
00:55:45.240
around you. So I think there's some humility and, um, you know, we've talked about this in the iron
00:55:50.620
council, but like celebrating the wins of your team, making it about the team that wins, not you,
00:55:56.140
right? Be really careful in your language. I mean, I've had that conversation even in the iron council
00:55:59.860
where I was coaching one of the battle team leaders and, and he would always talk, he'd always
00:56:04.880
use the verbiage, my team, my team, well, my team. And I said, and I, and I suggested to him,
00:56:09.960
I'm like, don't use that. I wouldn't use that. I would say the team, right? I would say echo,
00:56:14.840
our team, Epsilon, that way you're saying we did it. They did it. Not. I did it. Right. Yeah.
00:56:22.840
That's one thing I'm actually very, very aware of is that I don't ever want to say I, my, me, mine,
00:56:31.400
try to be very, very inclusive to those that you're working to serve.
00:56:36.820
Totally. Yeah. Celebrate those wins. People know that you report to you. They know,
00:56:42.020
you know what I mean? The job that you're doing, you don't need to verbally communicate it. You
00:56:46.140
know what I mean? Yeah. It helps the team. Yep. Yeah. Andrew Swope, you have mentioned several
00:56:51.520
times to do what it takes to get business up and running, but at what point do you decide to cut
00:56:56.500
your losses and do something else? I have a repair shop that I advertise and all of my customers are
00:57:02.220
happy, but I can't get enough business to make it work. Um, I think that the point you consider
00:57:08.660
throwing in the towel is when you become indifferent to it. I've thought a lot about
00:57:12.600
this. Um, I, I would have not motivated by it anymore. Yeah. I mean, motivation is one
00:57:17.360
thing. I mean, there's days I wake up quite frankly, I love order of man, obviously, but
00:57:21.280
there's days I wake up and I'm not motivated. That doesn't mean I should throw in the towel
00:57:24.160
because I'm unmotivated for the day. Yeah. But I think it's, it's different. There's an
00:57:28.460
indifference. Like I just don't give a shit anymore about this or what happens today. And
00:57:33.220
I'll tell you, I felt, I started to feel like that with my financial planning practice. You know,
00:57:37.040
I'd have clients, they'd call me up and they're like, Hey Ryan, we need to change our investment
00:57:40.740
portfolio or investment strategy. I would literally see people calling on my caller ID
00:57:44.560
and I'd be like, Oh, I don't want to do this anymore. And it was a pattern. It wasn't like
00:57:51.100
one day I was having a bad day. Cause that happens. It was a pattern that every time like, Oh,
00:57:56.000
I don't want to rebalance this person's portfolio. I don't want to open a new 401k. I don't want to,
00:58:01.420
I didn't even want to do things that would, that would improve the, improve the organization,
00:58:06.960
improve the practice. I was like, so indifferent to my clients and learning. Like there'd be events
00:58:14.340
that I could go to in seminars. I'm like, I don't care about that anymore. And that level of
00:58:19.240
indifference was a great signifier to me that it just wasn't there anymore. And I had to do what was
00:58:26.240
in the best interest of my clients because I was a fiduciary, which means I had an obligation to put
00:58:30.800
their interest first and, and, and my best interest is very much aligned in this case.
00:58:36.760
So what's this guy's name? Andrew. So with Andrew, it doesn't sound like there's a level of
00:58:42.680
indifference. There might be a level of frustration. Yeah. Sounds like you love it. Sounds like you still
00:58:47.900
enjoy it. It's just not going as well as you'd like. So I would say in that case that you need
00:58:53.460
to consider hiring a coach. You need to consider trying something new and something different.
00:58:58.240
Even go to your clients and say, Hey, how can I improve my service or what
00:59:01.740
other values or, or, or products or services can I offer to you? But it sounds like it's time to mix
00:59:07.820
things up and gain a new and fresh perspective, not necessarily throw in the towel because it's
00:59:12.580
not quite working. Yeah. Cool. Chase Saxton, Ryan and Kip, what has been y'all's favorite
00:59:20.860
interview podcast episode on order of man? Hmm. I didn't really come prepared for that one. I
00:59:27.940
didn't know this was a question, but I would say that, um, you know, it's easy, it's easy to say
00:59:33.240
like, Oh, my wife came on and those things are fun. Of course. Uh, but my favorite, I really liked,
00:59:41.640
I love sitting down with Goggins. That conversation was amazing to me. So good to sit down with an
00:59:47.600
individual who's that intense. Uh, it just, it's just opens up a new perspective that you haven't
00:59:53.200
really thought about before, especially, I mean, everybody knows he's an intense dude, but then
00:59:57.280
when you sit down with him, you're like, Holy cow, this guy is the real deal here. Yeah. So Goggins
01:00:02.340
was good. I really liked John Eldridge. Um, he's man, he has just been instrumental in this journey in
01:00:08.660
my life, uh, because of, you know, what he, what he teaches wild at heart. It's one of the greatest,
01:00:14.200
I think it's one of the greatest books on masculinity of all time. Yeah. Um, Brett McKay,
01:00:20.540
I sat down with him twice. Brett McKay's interviews were amazing. Uh, I think, I think maybe I wasn't,
01:00:26.380
I know I wasn't as good of an interviewer then. So as far as like somebody listening,
01:00:30.760
it probably wouldn't be that good, but for me, it was awesome because he was a huge role model of mine.
01:00:35.800
Um, I would also say Jocko, um, in particular Jocko three, cause I've done three interviews with him.
01:00:41.260
Now the third one was the best. I sat down with him face to face. That was the best interview
01:00:45.780
of the three. So yeah, Goggins, Jocko, John Eldridge and Brett McKay.
01:00:53.340
It's hard because like, as I think about that, I'm like, well, then I had Andy Frisilla on and
01:00:57.980
then Grant Cardone was cool. Cause he talked about this. Oh, and then I talked to TJ Dillashaw and that
01:01:03.120
was a cool perspective. It's like, it's, it's almost like not a fair question because it's like asking
01:01:08.780
what child is your favorite? You know, it's like, I love them all like for different reasons.
01:01:12.920
So I don't know. I can't, I don't know if I can give you a favorite, but those are certainly a few
01:01:17.500
that, that stood out in my mind. Yeah. What's interesting too, is I, as I was trying to recall
01:01:22.960
previous episodes that I really enjoyed, I enjoyed them at the time. Yeah. Yeah. We've been on this
01:01:28.200
journey for years. Right. And so when I think about like a particular interview that I really love,
01:01:33.100
I wonder if I listened to it again, if I'd enjoyed as much as I, I did back then, you know what I mean?
01:01:38.100
Yeah. Well, you probably wouldn't because you've evolved, you know, it's, it's that saying that no
01:01:43.360
man steps in the same river twice for he is not the same man. It is not the same river.
01:01:47.660
Yeah. So you've evolved. The podcast has certainly evolved and yeah, you may not enjoy a previous
01:01:54.380
conversation as much as one that you enjoy today. Probably one of my favorite episodes that,
01:01:59.240
that comes to mind is, is not because, well, it was a great conversation. Don't get me wrong
01:02:03.240
because, and it was ironic because the subject was around, uh, is that masturbation or pornography
01:02:10.460
one that you did recently? Oh yeah. Yeah. And he, he talked about tactics that I'm like, wait,
01:02:16.920
this is applicable to like any form of addiction. Like, you know what I mean? I'm like, what,
01:02:21.900
this is really insightful stuff. Um, but it's probably one of my favorites because I'll remember
01:02:26.160
forever. Um, I was in my car listening to the podcast and I'm like, Oh, this is good stuff.
01:02:32.980
And I'm on the way to the dentist. Okay. So, and I'm, I'm listening to podcasts and then I get a
01:02:38.040
phone call. And so I'm talking to the person on the phone. I pull up into the dental office and I'm
01:02:43.240
still on the phone and I walk up to go check in. I hang up with individual I'm talking to. And then
01:02:49.400
my podcast turns back on, on speaker, on my, on my cell phone. About pornography and masturbation.
01:02:57.000
Yeah. And as I'm checking in and it's just, and he starts talking, I'm like, Oh my dear Lord. And
01:03:02.980
I'm like trying to turn this thing off. I literally just ran out of the dental office as I'm trying to
01:03:08.360
turn off the volume because I was so embarrassed because there's all these people, all the ladies
01:03:13.060
are laughing. I'm like, Oh boy. They're like, what's this guy listening to you? Like tips on
01:03:17.340
masturbation. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's a good one. Yeah. So I'll, I'll, I'll remember that
01:03:25.380
episode. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. All right. Greg Schultz, describe how you incorporated your wife
01:03:31.400
into your vision. Was she on board day one or did it take time, some time to persuade?
01:03:38.060
Well, I like with order, man, I didn't come to her one day and say, I'm going to quit my financial
01:03:42.880
planning practice hunt. I'm going to teach men how to be better men full time. And we're going to make
01:03:47.180
a living and we're going to have all these opportunities open to us and it's going to be
01:03:50.820
incredible. Yeah. Because she would have laughed me out of the room. Instead, what I did is I
01:03:58.260
started another podcast. A lot of you guys don't know that I had a podcast in my financial planning
01:04:02.820
practice called wealth anatomy, and it was focused on helping medical professionals with their financial
01:04:07.200
services. So I started that. Yeah. Boring, totally boring. And I did about 20 episodes and realized
01:04:14.640
I love the medium, but this is boring. And, uh, and at that point I had thought long, long story
01:04:21.340
short, I'm cutting some of this out, but that it would be, it'd be cool to have a podcast, but centered
01:04:26.180
on being a better man. And I thought, what greater way to have conversations with men I admire and
01:04:30.860
respect than to encourage them to come on my show and share it with the world. And so I did it, you know,
01:04:36.920
just as a podcast and it took me a couple hours a day. And then it was three hours a day and then
01:04:42.960
four and then five hours a day. And so she came to me in November of 2015. So this was probably
01:04:48.200
seven months after I had started. And she said, I really appreciate that you're doing order of man
01:04:52.320
stuff. Like you seem to really like it. It's, it's uplifting for it's good for you, but you aren't
01:04:57.300
bringing as much money into the household because you're not doing as much financial planning, which
01:05:00.900
is how we were making money at the, at the time. And, and she was right. I wasn't. So she said,
01:05:06.540
you probably ought to consider a way to make money or scale back. And I wasn't going to scale back.
01:05:11.160
I mean, I wanted to double down on this thing. So we figured out a way to create a course and we
01:05:15.880
had 12 guys sign up for us called the iron council. And then we opened it up down the road.
01:05:19.880
And so like it gradually happened over a period of four years. It wasn't like I went one day and just
01:05:25.360
pulled the plug on the business and the family income and decided to do something else. I worked
01:05:29.680
my way into it and she saw that it was working. She thought, saw that it was uplifting me.
01:05:34.140
She saw that we were bringing money into the household and that started to increase. And it was just
01:05:38.040
a gradual process. It's not as sexy as the entrepreneurial Instagram type gurus will tell
01:05:43.420
you like, burn the boats, burn the bridges, go all in. Very few people do that. In fact,
01:05:48.660
I think it's not prudent. That's a nice way of putting it.
01:05:53.540
Wait, and this is so sick of those entrepreneur people on Instagram. I'm so freaking burned out on
01:05:59.500
those morons. Like I try not to be negative in this because again, words matter, but these guys who
01:06:05.720
come on and tell you to hustle and grind and 24 seven. And it's like, get a, get a, get a life,
01:06:11.680
man. Like, like entrepreneurship and business ownership is not the extent of my life. I have
01:06:18.180
so many other things I want to do. That's why when you're on Instagram and you're following me,
01:06:22.020
you're going to see pictures of me and my family and we're hiking or going on a trip or me coaching
01:06:26.260
my baseball team. Cause quite honestly, like if all you're talking about is entrepreneurship,
01:06:31.100
you're full of shit a or B your life is completely out of whack and you're not living life the way
01:06:38.980
it's meant to be lived. Yeah. And the unfortunate part is you get, we get this younger generation
01:06:43.040
coming on. I want to be an entrepreneur, right? What the hell does that mean? Right. You, I know
01:06:47.900
what you think it means. It means I have a great idea and I'm going to get rich quick. Right. That's
01:06:52.620
what they think. And show you all my, my fast cars and my fancy clothes, my beautiful women on my arm.
01:06:59.080
Get real. I just want to point out cause, and we've, we've talked about this in the past, but
01:07:04.100
you figured it out and you made it work after you tested the waters and navigated and pivoted
01:07:11.440
and adjusted. And that is life that, and that's how it works. Right. Like we sometimes sit back and
01:07:17.960
all, we got to plan this out. Right. So I, no, no, no. You actually need to act because there's a
01:07:21.900
whole bunch of stuff that you know that you don't know that you don't know. And you're not going to
01:07:26.320
know those things until you actually get on pavement and start running. Yeah. Well, and
01:07:30.280
you say, I figured it out. I mean, I figured some things out, but things will continue to evolve and
01:07:34.780
grow and change and morph. And you, this order, man, won't even be recognizable in five years,
01:07:40.100
just because we're going to continue to evolve and grow and change things and take new paths and
01:07:46.060
explore new technologies that come available. So I'm not so fixed in what we're doing that it
01:07:51.120
isn't going to evolve and grow. Yeah, totally. Let's take a couple more.
01:07:55.840
All right. Sounds good. Joshua, uh, turnings, turningza. How are, uh, are you ever going to
01:08:02.280
take live calls? So maybe do this episode live is what I'm assuming. And then any tips on family
01:08:08.740
unrest? This is a little lengthy, but I'll bang through this fairly quickly. So any tips on family
01:08:14.140
unrest? I have a brother has removed himself from the family. He says, my parents are the cause of his
01:08:18.720
issues and doesn't want anything to do with us. We love him. We'd love to have a continued
01:08:22.700
relationship with him and his wife and their kids. It makes me mad to see the way it affects my parents
01:08:27.680
who gave us such a great upbringing and have my kids grow up without their cousins. I've tried
01:08:33.940
a passive route and actively trying to address the situation. Results seem to be the same.
01:08:39.920
Let's address that one first. Yeah. Um, I think you're holding on too tight, man.
01:08:45.180
Like with just that limited statement there, I think you're holding on too tight. And I think
01:08:50.780
you're trying to manipulate your brother. He's got his own reasons. He's got his own thing going on.
01:08:56.120
I'm not saying you can't question it. I'm not saying you can't be upset about it. I'm just saying
01:09:02.360
he's got his life, man. Like he's got to live his life and you've got to live yours. So what I would do
01:09:06.920
is change the motive. Cause right now the motive sounds, uh, sounds, um, selfish. He's, he's wrong.
01:09:16.220
Let's change him. Not even that. I think it's, I think it's, I think it's different. I think what
01:09:20.600
I'm hearing is like, well, he's, he's, it's what about our parents? You know, like he's making,
01:09:26.300
he's making me mad because our parents gave us so much and, and my kids won't get to spend time
01:09:31.960
with their cousins. It doesn't even sound, sound about him to me. Sounds about, sounds more about
01:09:38.020
you. So I think if you, if you love your brother and you would love to be involved, I think you got
01:09:45.980
to change your motives, man. I think you got to try to understand him and where he's coming from.
01:09:51.180
I think you got to try to speak into him, not at him, but into him. I think you got to, you know,
01:09:57.240
go shoot guns or go bowling or go or have a barbecue or go on a hike together and not talk
01:10:02.720
about mom and dad, not talk about the cousins or all the things that he's doing wrong and right.
01:10:07.020
And what he should be doing and how he should behaving, how bad he should feel. Just like go
01:10:10.540
enjoy a hike together, you know, and, and connect. And if he chooses to reconcile and come back into
01:10:17.880
the family, great. If he chooses not to cool, you can still have a good relationship with him.
01:10:23.000
And if he chooses not to be involved at all, well, that sucks, but that's his choice. And the
01:10:30.280
more you push the greater wedge, you're going to drive between him and you and the rest of the
01:10:34.320
family. Yeah. And this is, this is one of the questions why I, why I asked you earlier to
01:10:40.060
explain that white lighthouse versus tugboat mentality, right? Because this is very much
01:10:46.680
applicable to Joshua's question. For sure. Yeah. Yeah. Now that you say that, absolutely. You know,
01:10:51.660
if you get down there in the, in the Bay and in the, in the Harbor and you try, try pushing him
01:10:55.760
around and manipulating him and coercing him and trying to get him to do things and behave
01:10:59.460
differently. So he's not crashing into the shores. I mean, you might recognize it, but unless he's
01:11:02.980
willing to do something about it, you're just going to go up there and get banged up and beat up and
01:11:07.080
everything else. And it's not a good approach. It's not going to help him. You know, it's really not,
01:11:11.760
it's going to probably going to hinder him. It's probably going to hurt him. And it's going to
01:11:14.680
certainly hurt the relationship you guys have for whatever it is. What was the first question though?
01:11:19.300
Uh, live calls. Oh, um, I don't really know what he means. Live calls on the podcast or doing like
01:11:25.900
a live podcast or what? A couple of guys have asked this question. Like, will we ever do AMAs
01:11:30.580
live where they can just call in and ask questions? Oh, like more like a radio show.
01:11:36.300
Yeah, I think that's what I assume he's talking about. Yeah, that'd be cool. I actually want to do
01:11:40.920
some live podcasting. Like when we get up to, uh, when we get up to Maine, um, yeah, just do it like
01:11:47.740
that we've got a big barn in there. So like do a live podcast in the barn and invite like 50 to
01:11:52.440
a hundred guys and just do it right there. Um, but yeah, I want to do more live stuff. I'd have to
01:11:57.400
see how to do live AMAs, but that is a pretty cool idea. Maybe we could do something on Facebook or,
01:12:02.540
or something. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. Like a Facebook live and they can just,
01:12:06.880
yeah. And then we download it as a podcast or something. Yeah. I think we can do something
01:12:09.840
like that. I'll look into that. It's a good idea. Yeah. Cool. Um, I actually have top of the hour. I have
01:12:15.180
to wrap up if that's okay. Let's call it a day, man. We got through a lot today.
01:12:19.420
Yeah. Great questions as always. So, um, yeah, we've talked about this guys. I mean, uh, the
01:12:26.040
exclusive brotherhood, the iron council and the Facebook group, those are two areas in which you
01:12:29.700
guys can get your questions submitted. Um, if you want to learn more about the exclusive
01:12:33.780
brotherhood, the iron council, that's order of man.com slash iron council. And then you, of course,
01:12:39.340
we welcome you to join the Facebook group at facebook.com slash groups slash order of man.
01:12:45.180
You can connect with Mr. Mickler on Twitter and Instagram at Ryan Mickler. And we have a couple
01:12:51.500
of things in the hopper from a schedule and, and slash event perspective. We first have the origin
01:12:56.660
main, uh, jujitsu immersion camp, August 25th through September 1st. You can sign up at origin
01:13:03.360
main.com slash order camp. And we encourage this, right? That way we get a count of how many guys are
01:13:09.140
associated to order of man. That's that's coming out to that event. Well that, and we're going to try
01:13:14.240
to do a custom rash guard as well. So if we know who's coming specifically with and through order
01:13:19.840
of man, then we can work on those, uh, rash guards a little better. Yeah. Awesome. And then your Hoyt
01:13:25.540
giveaway, if you want to touch. Yeah. Very simply guys, April 1st, we're giving away a brand new Hoyt
01:13:30.900
bow. It's called the helix. It's their, it's their newest, uh, their newest bow. And we're giving that
01:13:35.160
away again, April 1st. So all you have to do is go to order of man.com slash Hoyt, very simple
01:13:40.140
instructions to register and enter your name, which I think you can do multiple times in there
01:13:44.780
up to six times. I think there's points that you, you get for doing different things. Very simple,
01:13:49.460
very easy. Gosh, I think we have, I'm really curious now, but I think we have maybe, I don't
01:13:55.360
know, 3000 people that have signed up for that thing. That's awesome. That is awesome. And I
01:14:00.160
appreciate the support and I wish you luck. Um, but that's going to be given away on April 1st.
01:14:06.840
Yeah. 2,600 is how many people we've had signed up so far. That's cool. It's crazy.
01:14:12.180
Anyways, order of man.com slash Hoyt. All right, guys, Kip, I know you got to get going guys. We'll
01:14:15.880
let you get going. Appreciate the questions and being in this fight with us. And it is a fight.
01:14:20.040
It's a fight to reclaim and restore traditional masculinity. And I'm glad you're, uh, you're on
01:14:24.500
board with us here. All right, guys, go out there, take action, become the man you are meant to be.
01:14:29.160
Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life
01:14:33.740
and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.