Order of Man - Overcoming Pride, the Proper Role of Leadership, and Advice for Starting a Business

00:00:00.000 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly chart

00:00:04.960 your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time.

00:00:10.400 You are not easily deterred, defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is your life. This is

00:00:16.940 who you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done,

00:00:22.600 you can call yourself a man. Welcome to the Order of Man podcast. You are listening to the

00:00:29.020 Ask Me Anything. I'll be running solo today as Mr. Mickler is out hunting. In fact,

00:00:35.500 he just posted on his Instagram, I believe just yesterday, got a good looking buck.

00:00:40.620 If you want to follow him on Instagram, you could do so at Ryan Mickler. That's the same handle he

00:00:46.460 also uses for Twitter. Today, we'll be fielding questions or I'll be fielding questions, I should

00:00:53.200 say, from the foundry, from the Iron Council. And we'll be diving into those questions. And

00:01:00.140 we got some good ones today. So stay tuned. Of course, as always, look out for the other episodes

00:01:07.200 of the podcast. You have the Friday field notes with Mr. Mickler on Fridays, and then the interview

00:01:14.000 show on Tuesdays. Okay, let's get into this. So Tyson Junkers, battle team leader actually for

00:01:22.480 Endeavor in the IC, he has two questions. He says, when moving to a new town and city, where would you

00:01:28.540 start looking for like-minded men besides the Iron Council? So Tyson, I would really think, what

00:01:37.080 what is it that we're looking for, right, like-minded men? And I think we go to those areas where

00:01:45.880 like-minded men are doing things. The first things that come to mind for me would be church. So based

00:01:53.020 upon your religious affiliation, that would be critical. I think the other thing would be men's

00:01:59.700 groups that are focused on doing hard things. I know that's, you know, we don't know if we're

00:02:05.700 exactly like-minded or not. But if they're doing difficult things, there's a really high probability

00:02:11.160 that they're, they're focused on improving themselves. And so anything from Brazilian

00:02:18.440 jujitsu to athletic clubs, business, entrepreneurial groups, anything around focus on improving themselves,

00:02:29.280 whether it be through sports, hobbies, activities, or, or improving their mental well-being.

00:02:37.740 Tyson's second question, I thought about starting up a local men's group. When I move, what would

00:02:42.820 attract you to join one in your area? Would it be a message of the group, the type of events or

00:02:48.440 frequency, et cetera, that I could use this as an IC recruiting tool as well. So Ryan mentions this

00:02:55.400 quite a bit. And I think it's, it's pretty profound is when it comes to creating social groups like this,

00:03:03.580 consistency is key. Mostly because you might do it once Tyson, and then it's going to fall off the

00:03:09.100 radar and you're going to lose momentum. And so I think people need to know that it's, it's reoccurring,

00:03:14.860 that it's reliable, that it's not just like this one, one time, one off scenario. And it's going to

00:03:22.480 take some time to get some numbers. For me, the one thing that would attract me is the men that go,

00:03:27.540 right? Now that doesn't help you because I'd need to go first to see what kind of men are attending,

00:03:33.120 attending the group for me to like keep coming. But a few things, at least from my perspective,

00:03:39.400 would be kind of around the message of the group. I do think activities are key,

00:03:45.220 our key. But it's really about, how's this? I want to do a group meetup or I want to go do a group

00:03:52.400 meetup. If it was just a bunch of guys like, Hey, let's just hang out. I would really want to be

00:03:57.340 intentional with the time. Like we're going to have a speaker or someone train on self-defense or

00:04:04.320 um, firearm safety or cover becoming more self-aware or training on being open, my, uh,

00:04:12.640 open-minded, uh, fatherhood, uh, sessions and an expert coming into town and, you know,

00:04:20.100 covering other subjects about, you know, fatherhood in the home or whatever. Right. So intentionality,

00:04:24.600 I think is key. I think, um, intentionality, and I think you have to have some momentum

00:04:30.240 for it to be effective. And, and without that, I don't think you would have much success. Um,

00:04:36.620 you know, Tyson, hopefully that's, that's beneficial. All right. Jonathan Moore,

00:04:40.600 he says at the main event, there was a question about how to serve your spouse without feeling

00:04:45.880 like you are a servant. How do you harmonize this sentiment with a Christian man's calling by Jesus to

00:04:53.140 be a servant leader? This is calling, uh, this calling is an underlining theme throughout the Bible.

00:04:59.400 And it is, and is expounded upon by our savior in the gospel and letters. However,

00:05:05.000 it is almost a non-existent theme with regard to manhood today. I completely agree, Jonathan.

00:05:13.720 This is, this is the problem whenever people lose their mind and we say preside or the patriarchy,

00:05:23.020 because it, it must mean unrighteous dominion. It must mean, um, an ivory tower that there's,

00:05:31.980 that people place themselves on. And, and I'm not saying that doesn't exist, but that's the

00:05:37.880 misunderstanding of leadership. I have a good example of this. Um, I'm trying, I'm trying to be

00:05:44.640 more careful with what I share on the podcasts with work. It's okay. So, so I had, I have a,

00:05:52.420 I have a team member. We're talking about, um, growing the team and having fire team leads,

00:05:59.260 uh, on the team, team leaders that will take over a certain, uh, certain team, you know,

00:06:04.520 be a direct manager for other team members. And the conversation came up of what it be, uh,

00:06:12.060 dealing with people being upset about it. And, and I think we run this in any scenario. So imagine

00:06:18.000 we have a team of 10 peers. The minute you promote one individual as being a team lead,

00:06:24.120 you run the risk of the others being offended, right? Like, Oh, well, why did he get the position

00:06:29.120 and not me or whatever? And, and I do think that runs a risk for a small period of time

00:06:34.880 until they learn through your example, that you are there to serve them,

00:06:42.580 that you are genuine in your effort to stand for them and assist them in their jobs and eliminate

00:06:50.140 things that, um, reduce their productivity and, or eliminate things that are disruptions to them

00:06:57.320 to be effective in their jobs, AKA serving them. I, I honestly do believe that once you have an

00:07:05.460 opportunity to prove that your leadership is one of service, people are going to immediately go,

00:07:11.140 yeah, he should be in that position. Him being in that position or her being in the position has

00:07:16.420 assisted, has helped me be better at what I do. And that just takes time. And, and so Jonathan,

00:07:23.640 I completely agree that this is a misunderstanding of leadership and, and it's a misunderstanding of

00:07:29.460 leadership because people do practice unrighteous dominion. We do know that that's the natural

00:07:35.600 dispensation of almost all men that whenever they get a little bit of power, they will practice

00:07:42.020 unrighteous dominion. That's why it's important that Jonathan, you and I, and other men that know

00:07:47.460 better stand up and lead correctly. And we lead from a place of service. Now, what's interesting

00:07:55.080 about your question is how to serve your spouse without feeling like a servant. Well, I think that's a,

00:08:02.820 that's probably an ego problem. And, and it's a little bit of pride like, Oh, well, I don't want

00:08:09.880 to come across like a servant. No. Right. Like if your intentionality and you're genuine on assisting

00:08:16.280 and serving your spouse, then do so and have the confidence. And maybe it's, maybe it's a little ego.

00:08:22.600 Maybe it's a lack of confidence of like feeling lesser of a person because you're serving your spouse

00:08:28.760 or serving your children. Now, should you establish some boundaries is, is there important boundaries

00:08:35.840 that you need to establish? Of course do that. But I don't think you necessarily serving your spouse

00:08:42.780 comes across as like you're any lesser of a man. If anything, it proves that you're a greater man

00:08:49.040 and we need to rise up and be the shinies example of what leaders ultimately look like.

00:08:56.460 Great question, Jonathan. Okay. Uh, Raul Allen G for post intense physical training.

00:09:06.540 What methods have you found successful for recovery? Um, sleep, cold showers, ice bath,

00:09:14.720 active stretching later in the day and yoga. I know that's kind of a quick question, but

00:09:22.040 those are the things that, that have assisted me. Hopefully that helps. All right. James Percival

00:09:29.420 took the opportunity finally to jump into the iron council. What experiences can you share with

00:09:35.980 overcoming pride? I find myself struggling with showing up in life because I feel I have to live

00:09:42.680 up to the expectations of others. Example. I won't back down from a challenge regardless of the risk

00:09:49.200 because I have been labeled as someone who won't back down from said challenge.

00:09:55.680 Overcoming pride. I think James, I would dissect what is pride for you. And, and this is kind of

00:10:05.900 funny because we can, is pride necessarily bad, right? And, and maybe it is slightly. Um, but I

00:10:14.080 don't think it's, I don't know. I, I, I don't necessarily think, hold on, I'm adjusting the mic a

00:10:20.600 little bit. Um, I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing I think, but it can be. So let's, let's

00:10:26.760 think through that. Pride is probably if, if we're going with the general definition is, um, maybe

00:10:33.980 maybe a little bit of narcissism or thinking that you're potentially better than other individuals

00:10:40.240 or sometimes pride comes across as is, is kind of the coverup of low self-esteem. And we constantly

00:10:50.680 are seeking the approval of others, um, to cover that up. So a few thoughts I'd, you know, back to

00:10:58.760 your question, a few thoughts for overcoming pride, I'd say first, uh, be self-aware, really

00:11:05.240 evaluate. Why are you doing what you do? You know, you use the example of, I, you want it back down

00:11:10.400 from regardless, you want it back down from a challenge, regardless of the risk. Why? Like,

00:11:17.240 why would you do that? Is it because you're seeking the approval of other individuals or you

00:11:24.060 just like a challenge? Um, is it an identity crisis? Be aware of why you're acting the way

00:11:32.380 you're acting. Second, I think be aware of others and think through the human condition and what's

00:11:42.940 motivating other individuals and have some empathy and some thought process around what other people

00:11:49.180 are doing. I would be open-minded and have a growth mindset. Uh, consider the idea that you

00:11:57.280 don't know everything, that there's an array of knowledge and information expertise that you're,

00:12:02.920 that you don't know about, and that's okay. And that's necessarily not a bad thing. Um, be willing

00:12:09.260 to forgive yourself for your past mistakes, realize you're a human, um, and that you're defined by your

00:12:16.480 actions and that you can move beyond your past actions. And then maybe a last couple of thoughts

00:12:24.220 is like, you know, maybe don't try to take yourself so seriously. Um, when I think about pride,

00:12:29.380 I really think like the first thing that comes to mind is, you know, the person that wants to try out

00:12:35.820 a new hobby or learn something new and they don't because they don't want to come across like the noob,

00:12:42.460 the individual that doesn't know what they're doing. And because of that, they never take action.

00:12:47.180 And, and I think that's part of just taking yourself so seriously, like you're not going

00:12:51.140 to be great at something and it's okay to be the new guide to be the greenie that is learning from

00:12:57.060 scratch. And in fact, it's quite refreshing when you get that mindset to go, Hey, I don't know

00:13:01.620 nothing about this. And I'm open and completely, um, able to absorb new information and coaching

00:13:10.380 because I've accepted the fact that I don't know this and that's okay. So, um, and then maybe

00:13:16.400 the last thing that comes to mind is maybe put your focus on something greater than yourself.

00:13:22.740 I think sometimes pride keeps in, uh, creeps in when we're really focused about us and how we show

00:13:29.540 up and what I'm doing and comparing ourselves to other individuals. And by living a purpose-driven

00:13:36.780 life and taking on something bigger than you, that allows you to focus your attention on,

00:13:41.880 on something else and not yourself. Um, I don't know. Hopefully, hopefully those help.

00:13:47.620 All right. Evan Berwick. Um, actually, Evan, I'm going to save your question for later. Uh,

00:13:55.260 his question was when starting your own brand or business, what is the biggest tuition payment

00:13:58.940 you've made in the areas of social media? What did you take away from this experience

00:14:03.140 that could be applied to life as a whole? Um, well, I, I, I'm going to answer the question,

00:14:11.460 Evan. Um, but I didn't want to answer it because you asked around social media and, uh, my experience

00:14:19.440 in, in creating a brand has been from a consulting perspective and that's business to business.

00:14:26.840 And I really didn't feel like there was a big enough play to justify trying to advertise through

00:14:32.460 social media. Um, and I've really taken the approach, uh, in my past that if I do amazing work

00:14:42.500 so much that a client is wowed and I want to be like, I want to hang out with this for a second,

00:14:50.140 not just do the job based upon client's expectations, but do it in a way that they're wowed,

00:14:58.180 that they're like, Holy crap. That was amazing. That's way better than I

00:15:01.640 exceeded my expectations. It got done quicker. We are way under budget. The, the services provided

00:15:07.940 or the product is even more superior than what we requested any way that I can wow a client.

00:15:15.000 And I really feel that when we do that, business kind of just works out like that client talks to

00:15:22.200 other clients or that client eventually leaves that company and goes somewhere else and remembers you

00:15:27.560 because you did such an amazing job. I think a good example of this is the amazing hole in the wall

00:15:36.060 restaurant that somewhat that a handful of people go to. And it is so amazing that everyone knows about

00:15:45.380 it. And despite the location, despite the building, despite all these other, like maybe even their social

00:15:54.300 media presence, despite all that people will get in line to go because of the product, AKA in this case,

00:16:02.400 and the service being provided is, is amazing. And I think when we do that, it kind of works itself

00:16:09.800 out. Now I'm, I'm probably going against some, you know, startups opinion about how to take advantage of

00:16:16.820 social media or whatever else. So maybe Evan, my advice is sure. Get advice. And we can maybe bring

00:16:22.660 this up with Ryan around social media investments and advertising, but that's all smoke and mirrors.

00:16:31.360 If what you're doing isn't amazing. So get that right first. And I kind of really feel that everything

00:16:39.100 else kind of works out its own way. And, and that's how that has worked out for me. At least I've had

00:16:45.540 success with just focusing on providing a superior product and service. All right. Next question.

00:16:54.600 Luke Watts. I have a friend who is struggling in his marriage. I've tried being a lighthouse and offer

00:17:00.080 him books, my own personal reflections, and plenty of time that I spend listening to him talk about his

00:17:05.120 marriage. He does not seem to be making a change. And I'm a bit tired of his attitude that does not seem to

00:17:11.360 take responsibility for the problems. He is seemingly always unjustly persecuted by his wife. Is there value

00:17:19.120 on me more directly intervening, like trying to facilitate conversations between them? Or is this just

00:17:25.140 asking for trouble? I want good things for them, but after 12 months, they don't seem to be addressing

00:17:31.060 things. Man, this is super tough. I mean, Luke, there, there might be, there might be an instance where

00:17:45.280 you could ask them if there would be value in you facilitating a conversation and helping them.

00:17:53.820 But not if they're not asking for help. A quote I love, and you think if I love it, I would be able to

00:18:07.300 remember it. But like before you help a sick man, ask him if he's willing to stop what is making him

00:18:13.980 sick. And unfortunately, your friend and his spouse may not even be in the right mindset to like

00:18:22.420 taking on any ownership whatsoever. And I think you're kind of seeing that in your conversations with him,

00:18:28.280 right? You're probably giving some solid advice. And he's just constantly a victim. And despite what you say,

00:18:35.440 he's not getting it. And I don't know. How's this? I haven't figured out how to get people to get it.

00:18:44.640 They, they have to come to the, to that realization on their own. And, and it doesn't seem like when you

00:18:54.060 bring logic to the table that it's enough for them. And it really sucks because

00:19:00.640 you, I, you obviously care, right? This is obviously on your mind and you want the best for them.

00:19:08.240 Um, and, and, and I'm, I'm sure, look, you're already being like a great example. Um, and you're

00:19:16.140 probably giving them some solid advice and it's just not sticking. The only other thing that I didn't

00:19:22.020 see in your question that I would maybe consider is maybe opening yourself up and sharing from a place

00:19:30.240 that is a little more vulnerable. And so that way he can relate to what you're dealing with

00:19:40.660 and potentially consider it for himself. One thing that, that I think is really powerful in our

00:19:47.240 church, we, we have this distinction. We have every, every first Sunday of the month is fast and

00:19:54.220 testimony meaning. Um, and it's interesting because over the years I have always, how's this? I've

00:20:05.560 never came to this conclusion of what makes a testimony powerful for one person versus the other.

00:20:11.120 And over the last couple of years I have finally gotten it. And, and the difference is that,

00:20:17.280 and this is if it's done correctly, a good testimony is one that I don't preach to you.

00:20:24.220 But where I share from a place of inspiration, where I share what has moved, touched, inspired me.

00:20:37.200 And I constantly share from what I got out of something like what has opened up for me,

00:20:42.820 not a, Oh, and you need to none of that just for myself. And the power of that is people don't

00:20:51.200 immediately push back by default whenever we preach sometimes. And I, by the way, I need to

00:20:57.560 remember this because I get on a soapbox and I get all preachy. Um, but when we preach,

00:21:03.680 the natural human behavior is to determine if I agree or disagree. So Luke, if you start talking

00:21:10.120 to me and going, Oh, well, Kip, you need a, but I immediately go to, well, you know, do I agree with

00:21:14.760 him? Do I not agree with him? And I'm, I'm now debating and evaluating if you're right,

00:21:19.100 or if I'm wrong or if you're right, or if you're wrong, but when you share from a place

00:21:23.860 of, Hey, this occurred and I, I learned this and man, is this a major breakthrough in my

00:21:30.400 life? And now I realize I'm showing up this way and it's really helped my marriage.

00:21:34.540 I can't argue with that. Why? Because you're not saying it has anything to do with me. You're

00:21:40.640 sharing what was present and available to you. And what's, what's powerful about that is when you

00:21:46.540 do that, people will naturally start considering it for themselves without any pressure of you saying

00:21:53.820 they should. Are you already doing that? I don't know. But one thing to consider is maybe look for

00:22:01.420 opportunities where, and maybe you don't need to share this, but maybe look for opportunities,

00:22:05.680 Luke, in your marriage, where you can reach out to this brother and say, Hey man, do you have some

00:22:11.660 time? I really wanted to share this breakthrough I had in my marriage and share how you have been

00:22:18.360 showing up a particular way and how it's been negative to your marriage. Talk about how I'll take,

00:22:23.740 how you took on some ownership. You, you know, you restored your integrity with your spouse and it's so

00:22:28.920 much better now. Maybe that will help. But in the end, when people are unwilling, there's not much

00:22:38.020 we can do. Um, I did read your quote Luke earlier and, and, uh, a quote from James Allen, uh, entered

00:22:46.420 my mind. And so I went out of my way and found it in preparation for this question. But, and this is

00:22:51.360 from James Allen's book, as a man thinketh. And by the way, back in the day, I believe in the iron

00:22:56.560 council, this used to be a required reading when you're first joined. Um, this is by far, probably

00:23:03.760 in my top two, top three books of all time. I love this book. Anyhow, here's James Allen.

00:23:09.580 A strong man cannot help a weaker unless the weaker is willing to be helped. And even when the weak man

00:23:16.300 must be become strong of himself, he must by his own efforts, develop the strength, which he admires

00:23:24.540 in another, none, but himself can alter his condition.

00:23:33.080 Tim Beck, if you are able to share, what are the objectives and tactics on your current battle plan?

00:23:40.420 And why are those specific ones on it? Do you share your battle plan with anyone inside or outside the

00:23:46.660 iron council? Um, yeah, I'll, I'll, Tim, I'll share my battle plan. So for those that aren't in the iron

00:23:54.360 council, a battle plans are our 12 week goals. We set these up on battle teams. You have teams that

00:24:01.420 hold you accountable for the objectives and tactics that you've established. Um, and then we rinse and

00:24:08.060 repeat on a quarterly basis. Uh, I'm assuming Tim's asking, cause we just started a new, uh, quarter,

00:24:14.440 fourth quarter of the year. And, um, yeah, so I'll share those, um, as I pull that up really quick.

00:24:21.920 Um, yeah, I do share it, Tim. I, I don't always share it with my wife. If I'm smart, I would. Um,

00:24:28.980 but usually sometimes I'll share it with her, um, in the iron council, believe it or not, I don't,

00:24:34.560 um, I'm not on a battle plan nowadays. And so I I'm kind of running solo, but maybe I should be

00:24:42.060 sharing this on Brocker on the leadership, uh, team. So then that way those guys can help holding

00:24:48.240 me accountable. So, you know, Tim, I'm taking that as advice from you. Um, and I'll do that. So,

00:24:54.160 all right, let me pull up my battle plan here. All right. So within the battle plan, we have four

00:24:59.200 quadrants that we focus on. Uh, we focus on, uh, calibration. We focus on connection, our condition,

00:25:07.180 and then our contribution to learn more about the battle plan or actually to sign up for a free

00:25:13.600 30, uh, 30 day battle ready. Uh, you can go to order of man.com slash battle ready. And there's

00:25:21.480 also a mobile app that we have called the battle plan app. Uh, you can search for that in Google

00:25:28.580 play or your Apple store. Um, and the URL, you know what, Chris, Chris is going to get mad at me if

00:25:37.120 I don't give you guys the proper URL and the URL for it to learn about the battle planner app is

00:25:43.820 12 week battle planner.com. All right. Let me get back to my questions here. Sorry. I would just

00:25:51.120 want to get that URL. Correct. All right. Um, calibration objective by end of this quarter to

00:25:59.160 have a draft version of a book. That's going to be very draft, but to have a draft version of a book is

00:26:05.940 my objective. Uh, the tactic that I plan to do on a daily basis is 30 minutes, daily research and

00:26:14.720 writing condition, uh, connection objective. Um, I need to foster my family relationships better.

00:26:25.740 Um, the primary tactic for that, uh, quadrant is to be fully expressed daily. And then I have a

00:26:34.480 secondary tactic of weekly date night and fully expressed daily is not holding back. So if

00:26:41.320 something is bothering me, if I'm upset, um, to ensure that I'm fully expressed, um, each day,

00:26:48.440 by the way, this is, that will be a hard tactic for me and really important condition objective,

00:26:56.060 um, is to put, um, increase 10 pounds of muscle without, uh, decreasing my body fat. Uh, the tactic

00:27:04.440 is, um, keeping to a specific diet that I'm working on with daily workouts. Contribution objective

00:27:13.480 is, uh, to be fully committed to journey team executive leadership, uh, where I work. And my primary

00:27:23.040 tactic there is dedicated focus time, 30 to 60 minutes daily.

00:27:31.940 There you go. Hopefully that helps Tim. All right. Colton Briner. I'm a young father and supporting my

00:27:41.300 wife on being our family homemaker. So I am the main source of income. Lately things have gotten tight

00:27:47.100 and has made me question if I'm being selfish, taking time for myself development, for example,

00:27:53.380 working out, reading hobbies with other men and et cetera. I have the opportunity to work longer

00:27:59.140 hours on top of my 10 to 12 hour days, which would impede on my family slash exercise time.

00:28:05.120 I feel like adding hours would just result in redlining and destroying my other facets of life.

00:28:11.380 Besides finances budget is being cut back as we speak, but any advice would be greatly appreciated.

00:28:17.600 Thanks for all you do. It's a really good question, Colton. And,

00:28:24.820 and, and it's a pitfall that I fall. I have fallen into in my life where I've always thought just work

00:28:36.940 harder, just work harder. Things are difficult, just work harder. And, and what's great is that

00:28:42.860 you're already aware that there's a cost. Everything that we do has an associated cost to it.

00:28:50.960 And the question is, what is the cost, right? For instance, I could take on, um, addressing

00:28:57.640 homelessness in Salt Lake city, Utah, and that might be very taxing. What's the cost? Is the cost

00:29:06.840 on my family time? Does the cost affect my children, my spouse, my own personal health and my own

00:29:14.480 personal wellbeing? Does it affect work and et cetera? So the fact that you're aware that there's

00:29:20.100 an associated cost to working more is like perfect because I spent like 20 years just thinking that

00:29:27.560 I was going to magically just work harder and, uh, and there's no, no actual cost to it. So,

00:29:33.260 so props there. Um, you know, and I think you're already leaning in the right direction. I would not

00:29:40.340 cut back in, in the grand scheme of things. Um, living a fulfilled life might be living one on a

00:29:50.180 tight budget and having the flexibility and your personal time and maintaining good relationships,

00:29:56.460 other individuals and feeling good physically about your body. Now, is there times and seasons?

00:30:04.400 Sure. But, but I would really time box them. Like if you need to buckle down, you have an idea and you

00:30:10.560 want to push through for a month or two and you're willing to compromise those things for a few months

00:30:14.880 just to uptick some income. Sure. But I wouldn't make it the standard. And I, and I think you're already

00:30:21.980 kind of seen the light. I think you're aware that like, there's, you know, there's a, there's a cost

00:30:28.260 to it. And I actually wouldn't pay that price. You're already in 10 to 12 hour days. Nah, or 10 to 12

00:30:35.400 hour, uh, 10 to 12 hour days. Yeah. That's already a lot. So I would focus on not working harder.

00:30:44.140 I would focus on working smarter and, and I don't know what you do for your career, but,

00:30:50.060 but there eventually is a point where you need to focus on passive income that you need to figure

00:30:56.100 out. How do I increase my financial income when it's not tied to the effort in which I put into it?

00:31:03.680 Right, right now it is, you know, that if you work 10 hours, you're going to get paid this. If you work

00:31:08.340 15, you get paid this, which means that if you want any increase in income, you have to put more time

00:31:13.800 in. So I would focus maybe some, have some intentionality around how do you generate some

00:31:20.160 passive income, um, in your current situation. So then that way it doesn't require more time from

00:31:26.500 you to be able to do what you want to do. Um, 10 to 12 is a lot, I think, and I want to sacrifice

00:31:35.180 how you're going to feel, um, better about yourself working out, uh, or your time with your family.

00:31:42.740 Cause I think those things are probably more important. So maybe focus on being a little

00:31:47.660 bit more creative on how you're generating income instead. Okay. Cash

00:31:54.440 Soliton, what are your top three pieces of advice for someone starting their own business?

00:32:02.080 Um, so I, I'll, I'll use my example. Um, when I started a consulting, my consulting company back

00:32:11.900 in, I think it was 08, 07, 08. If I remember correctly. Um, the first thing is, um, and we

00:32:24.680 say it a lot. So I sound like a broken record, minimal viable product. You don't even know if

00:32:31.720 your business idea even has a market and you think it might, but geographically your price

00:32:38.540 range, your unique set, your, your unique selling proposition. You may not have a market for it. You

00:32:43.940 don't know that. And until you actually have boots on the ground and you're actually like

00:32:48.160 trying to sell something, you're not going to confirm that. And you may decide or find out that

00:32:54.340 what you, you know, that MVP is not really what you want to do, or that service, or that product

00:32:59.920 is not really tied to what you want to accomplish. So take some action and focus on a minimal viable

00:33:05.820 product. The best example I've heard of this is a minimal viable product for a service of getting

00:33:11.780 from A to B is a skateboard, upgraded version, a bike, and eventually a Ferrari. MVP is not a

00:33:22.400 non-working Ferrari. An MVP is the skateboard. So focus on what your MVP is. And let me give you

00:33:31.360 another example. I have a good friend that wanted to start a Marshall. Well, I'll use me as an example.

00:33:36.660 So I wanted to start a consult, IT consulting firm by default. What that looked like in my mind

00:33:43.140 was, well, I got to hire like 20 consultants to start off with. We need office space. Um, we need all

00:33:51.080 these things, right. To be able to do it, which meant that I'd have to go get a business loan.

00:33:57.060 I'd have to get funding or some capital of some sort. And I have to hire a bunch of people. I have

00:34:02.660 to hire some sales reps. Like there's this big ordeal that was associated of what that looked like in my

00:34:09.600 mind. The MVP for me was, I went to headhunters and said, here's my skill. This is what I can do.

00:34:20.160 Find me a contract that is court to court. That they are willing to pay me a 1099 versus W2.

00:34:32.680 That way they're paying my company and not me as an individual. I required zero sales reps.

00:34:38.680 I required zero offices and I didn't hire anybody. At first headhunters were doing it for me

00:34:44.500 and headhunters found me a contract. My first contract was actually for the department of defense

00:34:50.520 landed that contract right after that headhunters found me another contract. I only had to use those

00:34:57.440 headhunters twice for those two large contracts. After that, I got a reputation

00:35:03.740 because I focused on high quality work so much that everyone was wowed and be more than willing to

00:35:13.540 refer me to other companies. And that's what it took. And then once I had a good enough backlog of work,

00:35:22.560 I didn't hire someone at first. I 1099 contractor. Then I hired someone part-time. Then I got someone

00:35:29.720 full-time and et cetera. And I'd rinse and repeat it until I was able to build a larger team.

00:35:37.280 Man, I don't know if that's three pieces of advice or like two or 10. So MVP. Second,

00:35:44.620 what is your new unique selling proposition? And be very clear. Can you communicate it?

00:35:50.720 And, and, and, and figure that out. So then that way, when you're focused on sales,

00:35:57.240 you can articulate why a company would choose you versus someone else. That's your unique selling

00:36:04.500 proposition. And third advice. I would recommend that you read E-Myth is a great book. Maybe a couple

00:36:12.320 books. E-Myth is a great book. StoryBrand. Consider reading that book. I love the idea of StoryBrand

00:36:19.420 because it focuses so many of us companies. We think we're the hero. Like we go into our

00:36:27.220 marketing, like hire us, we're the hero and we'll help you. But how much more powerful is it when

00:36:33.620 you're the sidekick and the client's the hero and your focus is on making them the hero. You're the

00:36:41.040 Obi-Wan Kenobi. And that's a really powerful way of thinking. And it puts the customer first

00:36:48.060 in regards to what their business objectives are and even their individual requirements are and

00:36:55.640 what they're looking for individually. So much, at least in the professional services area, so much

00:37:00.860 of what we do is on the back of someone's reputation. Whether it's a, an executive that

00:37:06.860 decided to bring us in, or it's our peers within the company that we're working with. It's really

00:37:12.080 important that we consider how our work affects them and the company as a whole. Successful

00:37:18.940 projects, one, obviously meet business requirements, but also addresses the need of the individuals

00:37:25.520 within the company and supports them in their overall objectives. Serving those stakeholders is

00:37:33.660 critical. MVP, unique selling proposition, and I'd focus on E-Myth and StoryBrand.

00:37:42.080 For the marketing side of things. George Sykes, what is the single most important issue at this

00:37:52.220 moment in time and why? Way to go deep there, George. You know, it'd be really flashy to say

00:38:04.520 the most important issues are political, right? But they're not, I don't think, I don't think they're

00:38:13.280 not. I think the most important issue in the very moment in time is how we show up in our homes and

00:38:22.240 workplaces. You, George, me, Cash, the other men in the Iron Council, everyone listening to the podcast.

00:38:31.420 I think that is the most important issue at hand is how we show up because that is the, that is the

00:38:38.740 ripple effect of how that affects our societies, our neighborhoods, our families, the next generation

00:38:46.540 and more. I really honestly believe that is the most important issue. And like Jordan Peterson would

00:38:53.840 kind of illustrate, um, far too often we get wrapped up in all these things outside of our control and

00:39:00.120 we get pissed off, but yet our own homes are broken or we're broken. And how we're showing up in our

00:39:07.240 homes is in a negative way that we're affecting our children in negative ways and et cetera. So most

00:39:14.660 important issue is us, you, you, George, me, that's my important issue. Most important issue.

00:39:25.100 Rodney Collard, uh, from battle team endeavor, those guys. All right. What does the order of man

00:39:31.580 war Eagle represent to you? So Rodney's referencing the war Eagle t-shirt. Uh, you guys can actually find

00:39:40.440 that t-shirt, um, in the order of man store, go to store.orderofman.com. It's a pretty awesome

00:39:46.380 shirt. It's, um, well, it's the war Eagle and well, I'm not going to try to explain it because it was

00:39:53.000 explaining to me, I'm going to slaughter it, but, but nonetheless, depending on what direction the

00:39:58.480 Eagles, uh, head is facing determines if, if you're at war or not. Um, and Rodney, for me, I think it goes

00:40:07.700 back to George Sykes question. It was like, what's the more most important issue. And to, to me, that

00:40:13.840 is the war with myself, um, the war against my natural tendencies against the human man, um, which

00:40:23.340 results in, in my patients with my children, the affection of love. I show them how I treat my wife,

00:40:30.740 how I show up here in the office at work. Um, man, I, I, I don't know. It sounds corny, but like,

00:40:38.500 I think our impact in the world is so huge. And, and Rodney, I think the super, super version of

00:40:45.540 Rodney, like the super, super Rodney is like your potential is amazing. And so much is made possible

00:40:54.880 if you were that version of yourself. And so I think that is what we should all be focusing on.

00:41:04.120 And, and to do that, I think it's a war with ourselves. Um, a quote comes to mind. I read

00:41:09.860 this morning on Instagram and I tagged it. Hold on. It's by Aristotle. He says, I count him braver

00:41:19.420 who overcomes his desires than him who conquers his enemies for the hardest victory is the victory

00:41:26.620 over self. And that's, I think where we have the greatest impact is our victory over self.

00:41:40.180 Hopefully that helps Rodney. Good dialogue. All right. Jake Thompson. Uh, this question is for

00:41:46.900 both you really, but do either of your misses train Brazilian jujitsu? And what are your thoughts on

00:41:53.740 advocating for our wives to train? In my opinion, it's something every woman and man really should

00:41:58.280 learn for many reasons, but would love to hear your thoughts. Totally agree. Everyone should do it.

00:42:04.920 Um, no. So to answer your question, no, my wife doesn't train. Um, and it's been, it's been

00:42:13.840 interesting. If I, if I had to guess, there's been an evolution of, of jujitsu in our family where it

00:42:20.580 was kind of like this, this weird hobby that, that, um, dad or, you know, my husband has and,

00:42:29.940 and, and that's what it was. And then over a period of time, I think the perspective of jujitsu

00:42:36.460 to my wife has changed and she gets that. It's not a hobby that it's not this negotiable thing that I

00:42:44.340 just will do once in a while that it's very much part of me as an individual. Um, so much that,

00:42:54.380 that when, you know, like for instance, someone asked me those that don't train would only ask

00:42:58.860 this question. Um, but ask me like, Oh, what's next? Like, how long do you think you'll train for?

00:43:05.320 That's a really silly question. It seems silly for guys that are practitioners in jujitsu,

00:43:10.220 because the answer to that is when I die, I will train for ever. There's no re like,

00:43:18.580 there's no reason I would stop training. Um, it's, it's part of me, right? It's, it's part of

00:43:26.980 our family. My kids know jujitsu, whether they've been training jujitsu or not, they know it

00:43:34.140 because it's part of the fiber of what we talk about and it's how we wrestle. And my two year

00:43:40.320 old thinks he knows jujitsu. Um, whenever we wrestle, he talks about it. And so it's very much

00:43:46.220 part of our family. Now my wife hasn't trained. Um, but she has given interest every so often.

00:43:54.440 She'll be like, Ooh, I, I want to, but I think it's like most things. It's a little bit,

00:43:58.720 it's a hard thing to get into. It's very difficult. Um, it's confronting it's uncomfortable.

00:44:07.160 There's, there's a lot, I think that blocks people from doing jujitsu for sure. And my wife would be

00:44:13.760 one of them. Um, now with that said some ideas, I think the key things is, especially for women is

00:44:21.640 having other women to train with. Um, if there was zero women at our school and I was trying to get

00:44:28.180 her to come in and train, the probability is next to zero. However, when we do have the conversation

00:44:34.380 about her meeting up with other girls at unified and going to class, when they go to class or going

00:44:40.740 to a woman's seminar, all of a sudden, you know, that, that interest spikes up quite a bit. Um,

00:44:48.640 and, and that increases the chances of it. Now, with that all said, it's, it's kind of like all

00:44:54.420 the other questions, you know, a few of the questions earlier today, it's like,

00:44:58.020 I can't force her though. I mean, I can logically give her the ideas and the, you know, the benefits

00:45:03.640 of it, but it's something that she wants, she needs to do. And there's even been a time where

00:45:08.640 she's like, fine, I'll do jujitsu. And I actually told her, I'm like, no, don't do jujitsu.

00:45:13.820 And she's like, why? I'm like, do it. If you want to don't do it because I'm harassing you to

00:45:20.800 and, and really think about those two, two different scenarios. I mean, we even talk about

00:45:25.780 this at work. There's a big difference in me doing something because the owner asked me to do it

00:45:32.180 versus me being bought in and wanting to do it. We show up differently. We really do. If,

00:45:38.880 if she's going to go do jujitsu, but it's only to appease me, that's not the right way to go into

00:45:45.400 it. Right. And so I'm okay with her not training. I would like her to, but I'm okay with her not

00:45:52.400 training. And if, and when that works for her, then I'll be excited. Uh, and if it never does,

00:45:59.660 that's okay too, because her growth and what works for her is, is different than me. And I honor

00:46:07.000 our differences, uh, and, and honor our, our different interests. Right. And, um, and so

00:46:14.420 I'll support her in those areas, uh, whether I, whether I quote unquote, see the same value in

00:46:19.920 them or not. You know, Ryan talks about, you know, how, um, his wife, you know, loves beekeeping

00:46:26.360 and, you know, he usually helps her and as, and has promoted that as her self-development where,

00:46:31.940 you know, his, his focus on other things. So, all right, Jake, hopefully that helps probably

00:46:38.060 not the answer you wanted to hear though. Cause you're like, man, how do we force them? Um,

00:46:41.640 but we don't. Right. So that's, uh, I think that's the focus. All right, let's hop down to

00:46:49.200 a couple other questions and then we'll probably wrap up here momentarily. Um, what's your number

00:46:55.580 one, uh, uh, I'm sorry, Billy Hulkel, uh, Hugh Kill, Billy Hulkel. What's your number one lesson

00:47:02.080 to teach your boys? I have a two-year-old and an infant. And when do I start, uh, when do I start

00:47:08.500 instilling masculinity into my boys? So first off, they're probably bubbles of masculinity already,

00:47:17.740 right? They're like crazy. And in fact, um, research this, um, I wish I, I could remember.

00:47:26.240 I believe the amount of testosterone, like I think around two starts skyrocketing in little boys.

00:47:33.520 So Billy, your, your boy probably has more testosterone than you have.

00:47:38.880 And, and then I think it skyrockets when they're young and then it skyrockets again during like

00:47:43.060 their teenage years. If I, if I remember correctly, anyhow, don't take me, take my word for it,

00:47:47.340 but regardless, I think it's very natural. Um, so I don't think it's too much of a instilling

00:47:54.680 right into them. However, I think there are some things that, that we should probably be teaching

00:47:59.980 our boys. Um, of course. Uh, and I would even say that two-year-old is not too young to start

00:48:07.180 thinking of those things. So I have a two-year-old, he's going to be three later this month. Um,

00:48:13.060 so let me think through this. What, what's the number one lesson I should be teaching him?

00:48:17.340 I, I think for me around that age is controlling his emotions. Um, and it's,

00:48:25.900 and I want to reiterate this because I don't want this to be misunderstood. And I, and I, in fact,

00:48:32.820 I had the same conversation with my eight-year-old daughter literally like last night, it's okay to

00:48:40.740 be upset. You know, I was telling her like, Kalani, control your emotions. Oh, but I feel so upset.

00:48:50.580 I'm like, it's okay to be upset. That's okay. But you need to control your reaction to it. So if

00:48:58.220 you're upset, awesome. That's, that's fine. Now, how do you talk though? Right? How do you communicate

00:49:05.300 your frustration without screaming and yelling or whatever? Same thing with the kid. That's,

00:49:10.700 that's exactly what we're doing when he starts screaming because he wants his bottle or he wants

00:49:16.700 something that he can't get. It's like, calm down, use your words, say, please. Part of that is

00:49:23.780 controlling your emotional state and the action or your reaction to the emotional state.

00:49:29.940 And so I think that at that age, I think that's probably the most critical thing.

00:49:36.120 The other, I think that would be really early on. I think two might be a little too difficult,

00:49:41.400 maybe in about a year or so is that we do hard things and make that a standard in your family that

00:49:51.720 who kills, if I'm pronounced your name correctly, or Sorenson's do hard things.

00:49:58.380 And that it's through doing hard things that we grow. The other thing that comes to mind is that

00:50:07.820 we, we are not defined by our circumstances, but how we show up in spite of them.

00:50:18.540 This is a lesson that comes to mind because my son, my oldest son has Usher syndrome.

00:50:30.360 His circumstances are tough. And so this has been very present in my life of this idea of like,

00:50:37.220 Hey, Brendan, you're not held back by your circumstances. Who you are

00:50:41.500 is what decisions you make in spite of them.

00:50:48.120 And, and some, some of our circumstances are tough and that's okay. It's, it's what we deal

00:50:53.220 with. What we do with them is what matters. So controlling your emotions and your reaction to

00:50:59.880 your emotions, your circumstances, not defining you and then doing hard things. And, and that is

00:51:06.840 how you grow. Oh, and, and I would add one other thing, Billy, because this comes up a lot with my,

00:51:11.860 with my younger kids is there's this built-in, it's really interesting. It's like this built-in idea

00:51:19.500 that whenever someone's good at something that they're, they're good at it because of some

00:51:25.360 magical gift or talent. And, and don't get me wrong. I understand that in some,

00:51:32.100 a few circumstances, that's actually true. But I think in most circumstances, it's reps.

00:51:39.920 It's all about reps. And I have to, and I've tried to remind my younger kids of that on a regular

00:51:46.060 basis, whenever they're like, Oh, Oh, she's so good at, you know, I don't know her back tuck or

00:51:51.560 whatever. It's like, Oh, it's because she's probably has put in more reps than you. She's

00:51:57.260 practiced more than you. That's the difference. Oh man, that guy, I wish I was better at football.

00:52:01.980 Awesome. Guess what you need to do? More reps, more reps. That's how you become better. You got

00:52:07.600 to practice more. Okay. Joseph Ryan, how do you maintain order and cleanliness in your home?

00:52:20.120 What are your, what are you responsible for keeping clean and orderly? How do you teach this to your

00:52:25.960 children? Oh man, I should probably skip this question, man. I, how's this? I'm the guy in our

00:52:34.720 family where if, if my wife's like, Hey, let's go to Disneyland on a vacation. Do you want to go to

00:52:42.420 Disneyland on vacation with the kids for three days? Or would you rather stay home and clean? I would say

00:52:48.620 I'd rather stay home and clean. I'm that guy. Um, so I'm Joseph. I take this to a fault where I will,

00:52:56.400 I will bypass experiences and enjoyment of life for the sake of having an orderly and clean home.

00:53:05.420 Um, how do you maintain it? I mean, in my opinion, you put stuff away. Everything has a place.

00:53:15.320 So if you move something or you use something, it goes back to where that place is. If something

00:53:21.420 doesn't have a place, it, a place need to, needs to be made for it. Period. That's, I mean, that's my

00:53:28.600 answer. And, and the only things I, that I tried to teach my kids is like, never touch things twice.

00:53:33.440 That's highly ineffective. If you grab something, don't care it halfway through the house,

00:53:38.220 drop it off, make a pile. So you can go back to the pile and move it again. That's highly

00:53:42.320 ineffective. Don't touch things twice. So everything has a place. Don't touch things twice.

00:53:48.780 And I think it's like everything else in life. It's like, you know, we could do a hell Mary

00:53:53.880 workout and try to get swole before the end of the year. We all know that's not going to work.

00:53:58.960 What works is reputation and, and consistency over a longer period of time. I think it's the

00:54:05.980 same thing for kids maintaining a clean home and for maintaining a clean house. Keep it clean every

00:54:12.700 day, every day, put away the things that need to be put away. Do your laundry on a regular basis,

00:54:18.960 pick up after yourself, do the dishes right after dinner, do it in the moment. When we do that,

00:54:25.420 we don't have to spend a Saturday cleaning a house all day.

00:54:32.380 One thought, Joseph, that comes to mind. I know this is not necessarily a question,

00:54:36.320 but as you're like teaching your children to try to keep a clean home, remember that you're trying

00:54:42.940 to teach them the importance of being clean and orderly and that you're not trying to just get

00:54:50.500 their room clean. Because there's a big difference, right? You might yell, scream and kick and be angry

00:54:57.940 and, and rude to your kids and the room might get clean. But what did you teach them?

00:55:02.600 So I would focus on how do you get buy-in? How do you get them to be self-directed, to have self-discipline

00:55:17.000 versus imposed discipline? You can impose discipline, but what happens when you go out of town?

00:55:24.200 They're not going to do it. So I would focus on how do we, how do we create self-discipline where the

00:55:32.260 kids are bought in and committed to the idea of having a clean room? That could be rewards.

00:55:41.380 That could be a logical conversation explaining the importance of having a clean room and why you want

00:55:48.500 them, try to get them on board in, in the thought process, but maybe it might just be a reward system

00:55:54.200 of, Hey guys, you need to maintain a clean room. Here's the importance. Why this is why this is

00:56:00.080 critical. And this is what's going to be made available to you guys in the event that your

00:56:05.380 room's clean and, or here's what's going to be taken away from you. If your room's not clean,

00:56:11.260 set that expectation, follow through and don't get angry. Implement the boundaries and the

00:56:20.740 consequences where they're positive or negative, but don't get angry about it. Just act upon it.

00:56:26.700 That way you're not attacking their identities or, you know, getting angry at them and they don't feel

00:56:31.640 hurt, but they're also feeling the results of not following those potential rules.

00:56:36.200 Hopefully that helps. All right. We're going to call it, I have to call it a quits. So I'm going

00:56:45.140 to go ahead and wrap up. So, you know, we talked about a handful of things. We obviously we've,

00:56:49.200 we filled the questions from the iron council, um, next week or stay tuned actually for Friday

00:56:55.360 field notes for this coming Friday to connect with Ryan, um, on Twitter and Instagram. You can connect

00:57:01.300 with him at Ryan Mickler. And of course you can get swag, um, at store.orderofman.com and just support

00:57:11.320 the movement. Uh, if I had to put a emphasis on our paraphrase, kind of what I got out of the

00:57:18.060 conversation today, this one-sided conversation is the importance of how we show up and that being the

00:57:24.680 biggest and the most important battle that we should all be focused on. And so whether that's

00:57:30.620 you joining another group or spreading the message of the iron council and the order of man, so be it,

00:57:39.540 but get on the court, be an active participant, be the man in the arena of your life and of the

00:57:47.920 lives of others and create that lasting impact that is so very much needed in the world.

00:57:52.820 Connect with Ryan and I give us feedback. Let us know how things are going. Once again,

00:57:58.620 you connect with Ryan at Ryan Mickler, and you can connect with me at Kip Sorensen on Instagram.

00:58:04.560 Thanks. And until Friday field notes, take action and become the man you were meant to be.

00:58:10.660 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life

00:58:15.000 and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at orderofman.com.

00:58:22.820 Thank you.

00:58:24.820 Thank you.

00:58:26.620 Thank you.

Order of Man - October 20, 2021

Overcoming Pride, the Proper Role of Leadership, and Advice for Starting a Business｜ ASK ME ANYTHING

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