Order of Man - Set Yourself Free

00:00:00.000 Every once in a while you have the opportunity to sit down and talk with someone like you've

00:00:03.260 known them for years. Although me and my guest today, Pete Roberts, have only known each other

00:00:06.780 for six months or so, we share some core values when it comes to the way that we

00:00:10.860 approach our life, our business, and our responsibilities as men. So today we talk

00:00:16.320 about how arrogance is hurting men, how to instill discipline in your children,

00:00:21.380 the importance of self-checking yourself, and how to set yourself free.

00:00:25.120 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears

00:00:29.100 and boldly chart your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every

00:00:34.840 time. You are not easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong. This is your life.

00:00:41.800 This is who you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and

00:00:47.280 done, you can call yourself a man. Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is Ryan Michler,

00:00:53.180 and I am the host and the founder of this podcast and this movement, The Order of Man. If you're new,

00:00:58.080 this is a movement about reclaiming what it means to be a man in a society that seems to have

00:01:03.800 rejected the idea altogether. We are having some conversations, some interviews, some discussions,

00:01:10.120 and the resources and everything that you need to help you be a better father, a better husband,

00:01:14.080 a better business owner, a better community leader, just a better man in general. And so,

00:01:18.400 like I said, each and every week we are interviewing some of the world's most successful men from

00:01:22.620 entrepreneurs to athletes, to warriors, to scholars, and everywhere in between. It's my

00:01:27.660 goal to bring those conversations to you so we can extract some of the wisdom from our guests and

00:01:33.540 then, of course, improve our lives. So, that's what we're doing today. I've got a great one lined

00:01:37.400 up for you, but before we do, I do want to let you know that we've got a review contest going on

00:01:42.620 right now. So, if you leave us a rating and review, and this goes such a long way in growing the

00:01:46.720 movement, make sure you do that before the end of this month, September 2018, to be entered in for

00:01:53.220 the contest. We're giving away shirts, hats, signed copies of my book, Sovereignty, one-on-one calls.

00:01:58.820 We're giving it all away in order to get those ratings and reviews and, of course, get the

00:02:03.560 visibility out for what it is we're doing. So, make sure you do that, again, before the end of

00:02:07.420 this month, 2018, to be entered in for that. Outside of that, just want to introduce you to,

00:02:12.880 normally, this is where I would say show sponsor, but I actually want to introduce you in a way to

00:02:17.840 our guest. His name is Pete Roberts, but he is the founder of Origin. Now, a lot of you guys have

00:02:23.080 heard me talk about, if you've listened to the podcast for any amount of time, Origin, not only

00:02:27.280 do I believe in what they're doing, I wanted to have Pete on the show because he's become a good

00:02:32.000 friend and that's who I want to do business with. I want to do business with the people that I know,

00:02:36.220 like, and trust, and Pete definitely falls in line with that. So, guys, if you're getting into

00:02:40.380 jiu-jitsu or have been for any amount of time, I definitely, definitely recommend their geese,

00:02:46.080 their rash guards. They've got supplements, protein, the super krill, the joint warfare.

00:02:51.300 I use it all and it's definitely helped me as I've ramped up my training when it comes to being in the

00:02:55.400 gym, but also being on the mats. And they are offering a 10% discount on any of your orders.

00:03:02.600 So, if you want to get some of their supplements, their Jocko lineup supplement, or any of their rash

00:03:07.680 guards, geese, training gear, lifestyle apparel, then make sure you go to originmain.com and use

00:03:13.360 the code ORDER, O-R-D-E-R, at checkout, originmain.com and ORDER at checkout. And that segues

00:03:20.820 very nicely into my guest. As a lot of you guys know, a couple of weeks ago, two, three weeks ago,

00:03:26.260 I was at Origins Immersion Camp and I had the chance to sit down with Jocko and Leif and JP

00:03:31.820 Donnell and Dave Burke and a lot of these guys, but I also had the opportunity to sit down with my friend,

00:03:36.160 Pete Roberts. He is the founder of Origin Maine, and we had the opportunity to sit down for a couple

00:03:42.020 hours in a very off-the-cuff interview about family, business, and just life in general. I mean, this is a

00:03:48.000 man who I really admire and respect, not only for his business acumen, but the purpose and reasoning

00:03:53.900 behind what he's doing for his family, his employees, and his community. You've heard me talk about Origin

00:03:59.980 again for months. So, now you get to meet the man behind the vision and his take on business and the world.

00:04:06.160 I didn't know what to expect coming out here. What were your expectations?

00:04:11.000 I tried not to have any. Like, if I do events like this or experiences like this,

00:04:14.880 I try to go in with not low expectations, but minimal expectations because it makes it more

00:04:19.720 enjoyable for me. It's kind of like going to a movie where you have high hopes for the movie.

00:04:23.100 You walked out, you're like, that sucked. But then you go into a movie, like I went to

00:04:26.900 Mile 22, I think it's called. Mile 22. Or Mile 21. I can't remember. It's with Mark Wahlberg.

00:04:32.920 And I thought, oh, it's going to be another one of those shows, you know? So, minimal expectations.

00:04:37.760 It was a good movie.

00:04:38.960 I love the movies.

00:04:40.000 Do you?

00:04:40.780 It's like the thing I do to detach from reality.

00:04:43.000 And you need that sometimes.

00:04:44.000 I sit in the back row by myself. Yeah.

00:04:46.120 Oh, you go to the movie by yourself?

00:04:47.240 Oh, dude. People think I'm so weird.

00:04:48.960 Yeah. I would think that.

00:04:50.240 I feel like, you're an extrovert. And I was like, no, I'm an introvert. Like, this is good

00:04:53.400 right here, that three of us in a room like this. Cool. You start packing people out,

00:04:58.540 I'm out the door.

00:04:59.300 Yeah. I can be both. I never bought into like, I'm an introvert. I'm an extrovert. We all have

00:05:04.220 the capacity to be both.

00:05:05.480 If you're in a room full of people you don't know, what is the first thing you do?

00:05:09.160 I have to force myself to engage.

00:05:11.160 So, you're an introvert. Because you'll be a wallflower. Otherwise, you recognize-

00:05:14.880 I know it's important.

00:05:15.640 Yeah. I want to be on the outskirts of this, but you force yourself to go in.

00:05:20.740 Yeah.

00:05:20.960 Because you recognize that.

00:05:22.300 So, to that point, you're right. And I think to that point, what a lot of people will do

00:05:25.900 is they'll use it as an excuse not to engage. Like, well, I can't do it because I'm an introvert.

00:05:30.860 No. Yeah. It's just an excuse. You can still do it. You've got to recognize,

00:05:34.200 hey, I'm being kind of a douchebag sitting on the wall here.

00:05:37.480 Or just not growing and not learning and not expanding and not-

00:05:40.840 Even here, like, you know, you have these guys and my buddy, Matthew Arrington, I think-

00:05:45.560 Did you meet him yet?

00:05:46.580 Probably.

00:05:47.080 Yeah. If not, I'll introduce you. But he was blown away. Like, he's a brown belt and he's

00:05:52.620 been doing jiu-jitsu for, I want to say, like, eight, nine years or so. And he walked in-

00:05:58.080 The tall guy?

00:05:58.700 Yeah.

00:05:58.980 Big guy?

00:05:59.300 Big, big tall guy.

00:06:00.200 Yeah. Yeah. So, I'm training. He looks good.

00:06:02.160 Yeah. He's not fun to train with.

00:06:04.800 Yeah.

00:06:04.940 He's good. He's good to train with. He's not fun to train with.

00:06:08.200 Yeah. Right, right.

00:06:09.600 But he walked in and he was like, dude, I hope you realize there's 14 high-level black belts

00:06:16.120 here. Like, these are not guys that just got their black belt or just some random-

00:06:19.520 Like, these are 14 high- I hope you realize. And then he said that and now I'm all intimidated.

00:06:25.460 You know, I'm like, I wouldn't have, like, really known. And he's like, you should be intimidated

00:06:29.260 right here. But you force yourself to ask questions. You force yourself to-

00:06:35.700 Say, hey, I don't know what I'm doing right here. Can you just give me some instruction?

00:06:40.140 And yeah, you feel awkward and stupid, but-

00:06:41.960 You know what's crazy is when I started training, there was one black belt in the state of Maine.

00:06:47.680 Really?

00:06:48.280 Yeah. Maybe one fresh black belt in the state of Maine.

00:06:49.980 How long have you been training for?

00:06:51.440 I started in 2006. So, 12 years.

00:06:54.980 So, yeah. But not, like, I would have thought a long- Yeah, I would have thought it was longer

00:06:58.680 than that.

00:06:58.880 Not 20 years. No, no. I went all in. I mean, I built a factory in my backyard. So,

00:07:04.920 I kind of was obsessive about it. But I used to have to travel to get the good training,

00:07:10.580 especially when I got to, like, purple belt level and I was competing. I'd drive five and

00:07:14.920 a half to six hours, train for an hour, and drive five and a half, six hours home once

00:07:19.120 a week. And then the other time during the week, I'd drive either an hour and a half or

00:07:23.140 three hours, train for an hour, hour and a half, three hours back. If you wanted high-level

00:07:27.600 guys like that, you had to travel.

00:07:30.020 So, now it's-

00:07:31.020 That's crazy.

00:07:31.360 Yeah, it's great. People don't understand how good they got it.

00:07:34.680 I complain about 30 minutes. Our gym is 30 minutes from my house. I'm like, it's too

00:07:38.700 far. Actually, it was five miles from my house.

00:07:41.360 Rafael Ribello used to travel three hours on the bus, I believe, to get to the Deco's gym

00:07:47.100 to train.

00:07:47.560 Really?

00:07:47.920 Yeah. Three hours.

00:07:49.560 That's dedication.

00:07:50.460 Yeah. Well, I mean-

00:07:51.780 If you want to be the best.

00:07:52.800 Yeah. Yeah, definitely.

00:07:54.400 A lot more easy to access now, though.

00:07:56.200 I mean, it's everywhere. And it's good jiu-jitsu everywhere, too. So, I think sometimes people

00:08:00.740 think, like, I don't think of jiu-jitsu like a traditional martial art. I think that it's

00:08:07.180 more of a way of thinking about life.

00:08:12.060 Yeah.

00:08:12.560 And mental and physical application, on-demand thinking, you know? But when you're exhausted,

00:08:20.340 you know, we're not doing katas where we're going through motions and forms and thinking

00:08:24.100 that if we were attacked, this might work. Or, this is what you do. It's not like that.

00:08:29.900 It's like, oh, I'm getting choked out and this person could kill me right now.

00:08:33.640 Yeah.

00:08:34.040 And how do I not get killed or broken?

00:08:36.900 Yeah. Well, and the only way you can get to that point and be, I wouldn't say comfortable,

00:08:41.540 but the only way you can get to that point and be cool, at least somewhat calm and collected,

00:08:45.960 is to have a big dude like yourself with your arms around my neck enough where I'm like,

00:08:51.940 okay, I know how much time I have. I know how I can maybe loosen this up a little bit.

00:08:57.640 The only way to get to that point is to put yourself in that position deliberately.

00:09:02.260 And you know what the problem with us men are? Is that we all think we're innately tough.

00:09:08.660 And we, if I blackout, bro, like if I blackout, nobody stops me. You ever heard that before?

00:09:14.900 Yeah.

00:09:15.260 I just blackout.

00:09:16.280 Yeah. It's like, what are you talking about? You blackout, you're done.

00:09:20.260 You've got about 30 seconds of like fight or flight, like opportunity. And in those 30 seconds,

00:09:26.060 if you fight and you're doing that against someone who is trained in jujitsu, you will actually

00:09:33.200 sacrifice yourself.

00:09:34.960 Like subconsciously?

00:09:36.020 Yeah. Because you won't win. Like if someone was to walk in and be like, I want to really test

00:09:41.960 my manhood because I know if I needed to, I could beat anybody in the world in a fight.

00:09:49.700 Most men think like this. I'll blackout. I go crazy. You ever heard that? I go crazy.

00:09:54.220 Yeah.

00:09:54.620 Yeah. Okay.

00:09:55.600 Cool.

00:09:56.080 Yeah. Cool.

00:09:56.500 Good luck with that.

00:09:57.100 And what happens is after the 30 seconds, I don't know what type of chemical release it is,

00:10:02.160 but they then will sacrifice themselves.

00:10:04.800 Well, I don't know what you mean. What do you mean?

00:10:06.020 Because what happens is, is they go all out for 30 seconds, max a minute. Then they,

00:10:11.300 their body fails.

00:10:12.560 Oh, I see what you're saying.

00:10:13.680 Just complete failure, like complete exhaustion.

00:10:16.280 Right.

00:10:17.020 And you can actually see in their eyes and face the fear of death. And what I mean by when

00:10:21.980 I say they sacrifice themselves, they give up, they stop their whole body and mind just

00:10:26.280 shut off.

00:10:26.640 Cause they're like, that didn't work.

00:10:27.780 Didn't work.

00:10:28.240 And luckily they can tap out.

00:10:31.060 Right.

00:10:31.680 You know, they can tap out. And sometimes a guy, a lot of times will not, and he'll just

00:10:36.480 go to sleep.

00:10:37.480 Yeah. I got choked out.

00:10:38.880 It's crazy.

00:10:39.280 Two weeks ago, three weeks. We were actually.

00:10:41.260 You didn't tap?

00:10:42.260 I didn't know.

00:10:43.360 Oh.

00:10:43.860 Like I didn't. So here's what, here's, here was the situation.

00:10:46.840 So.

00:10:47.060 So you sacrificed yourself?

00:10:48.360 No, I.

00:10:49.840 Let me.

00:10:50.480 You're like, I'm dying now.

00:10:51.220 Let me. I'm like, I'm done.

00:10:52.760 I'm done.

00:10:53.180 Just kill me.

00:10:53.680 No. So we were working on it. We were working on grips, rear naked chokes. I was sitting

00:11:00.900 with a guy and he had my back and then we would sit with somebody else across so we could

00:11:05.100 watch. Like if this guy goes out, like tell him to stop. So the guy had his arms around

00:11:09.880 my neck and he's like, what I want you to do is I just want you to put your hand on his

00:11:13.620 arm when it feels tight, but don't tap. Just feel it for a minute. Like just feel it for

00:11:19.660 a second before you tap out. So I put my hand on his arm telling him, I'm going to

00:11:23.660 I'm like, don't apply any more pressure. Just keep it there. And the next thing I know

00:11:27.900 I wake up and I'm like, where am I? Like, I didn't know where I was. I thought that people

00:11:33.880 were going to be like looking at me like, are you okay? And that's not what happened.

00:11:37.660 I was in la la land.

00:11:38.800 Oh yeah.

00:11:39.020 It was like a dream. And I looked at the guy who had his arms around my neck and he's

00:11:42.560 like, dude, are you okay? Cause I guess I started like convulsing a little bit.

00:11:45.880 Yeah. You start shaking.

00:11:46.660 Yeah. And I'm like, yeah, how long was I out for? Cause I knew what had happened. And he's

00:11:50.360 like a second. I was like, what? Like I lost complete track of time. It was crazy. It was

00:11:58.060 crazy.

00:11:58.900 We've had a few over the years. That's different though, because you're having a technique applied

00:12:03.720 to you, you expect. But when someone thinks as a man, they can beat it. I lived in the

00:12:09.560 gym every day. They go in, it's unexpected. You know that someone could knock you out by

00:12:15.660 cutting your blood off or break your arm through some, you know, right. Some hold or some move.

00:12:20.160 Yeah. But when someone still doesn't believe, which most men in the world don't believe

00:12:25.460 because they'll black out, you know, and they go to a gym and call somebody out, they find out

00:12:31.080 real quick. So mount is supposed to be like one of the most superior positions, mountain back,

00:12:35.600 back's the best. Cause they can't see you. You can see them. You can apply strikes and

00:12:38.660 control. But I had one student and he mounted the other student and the student from the bottom

00:12:43.720 had a cross choke in, but he was mounted on. And the guy on bottom is choking him out and

00:12:50.840 choking him out and choking him out. And the guy had passed out.

00:12:53.180 The guy on top passed out.

00:12:54.380 Passed out. Finally, he like went for a sleep, a sweep and he was asleep.

00:12:59.860 Oh, he didn't even know.

00:13:00.840 And he thought he killed him. He started convulsing and foaming at the mouth and everything.

00:13:05.180 Oh, geez.

00:13:05.780 Everybody's trying. I was like, guys, chill. And the guy like that choked him out and he's

00:13:09.400 a combat vet. He like ran outside and he was like throwing up.

00:13:11.460 Yeah. And I had like just lifted his legs, get that blood flowing again. And he's like shaking

00:13:16.240 and he woke up and his eyes were big. And now it's like, you're good, dude. I said, just a

00:13:20.380 little blood off the brain for a little bit too long.

00:13:23.340 Yeah. Yeah.

00:13:24.020 You know, the guy that I was training with, he's like, are you okay? I'm like, yeah,

00:13:27.820 actually dude, I feel good. I don't, I'm fine. I remember the first fight I got in though,

00:13:33.480 when I, I must've been like the first real fight and I must've been in like eighth grade and I had

00:13:39.960 never trained. I mean, I grew up with my mom. Like I didn't have a dad to show me how to throw

00:13:44.320 a punch or to rough house with me. And I can't even remember what the fight was about. And I took

00:13:48.540 a swing at this kid and the rest is a mystery as to what happened.

00:13:53.360 You blacked out.

00:13:53.840 Yeah. Like I took a swing and he must've hit me or something. And then I kind of came to,

00:13:58.740 and I was like, I'm done, I'm done, I'm done. And I just remember I had a black eye and just like

00:14:03.400 my nose was bleeding a little bit, but like, I didn't know.

00:14:05.820 What happened?

00:14:06.200 I had no idea. Yeah. My buddies were there. So he's like, yeah, he just punched you a couple

00:14:10.300 of times and you were done, but you got to put yourself in those situations. Cause it's amazing

00:14:15.100 to me how delusional we are as men in particular about like, Oh, I'll be good. I'll be good.

00:14:22.100 If that ever happened, I got this. Yeah. Right.

00:14:25.580 I think we're designed like that though. I think to protect our families, to protect our community

00:14:29.840 or whatever we are, we're protectors.

00:14:31.760 But having that level of like arrogance is not conducive to being able to effectively

00:14:36.920 protect your family or yourself, right?

00:14:39.480 Yeah, I guess. But in the mindset of a group of men to protect something, it's usually young

00:14:45.300 men who go into battle. Why young men? Cause their brains aren't fully gelled to the like

00:14:50.740 what, 25. And so they're impressionable and you can get them to do what you want them to do.

00:14:55.680 As I get older, you have kids, all of a sudden you've got this change in your brain, this chemical

00:15:01.040 release, whatever you call it. And you become innately protective of your family and your kids,

00:15:05.880 right? And you want to be safe. But when you're young, you don't see the world that way.

00:15:11.520 And I think that's by design and that's my own stupid theory, but I bet if you dug down deep,

00:15:17.720 you'd find something behind that. And I think as you progress in age, the older you get,

00:15:22.760 you start having kids, it's not as easy to convince you to do something.

00:15:27.500 Yeah. You're more skeptical, right?

00:15:28.840 Yeah, you're skeptical.

00:15:29.720 It was wisdom, I think, there.

00:15:30.780 Exactly. Exactly. So you have old men telling young men what to do.

00:15:35.260 Well, but this is why even with this mission, what we're doing here with Order of Man is so

00:15:39.180 critical because we need honorable, virtuous men leading the future generations. And what I see

00:15:46.700 in society a lot is a big, big disconnect between men who have experienced and those who have never

00:15:54.580 experienced it all. And this is why we have so many kids, boys and girls, who are confused,

00:15:59.920 they're lost, they're not driven, there's no motivation because they're impressionable,

00:16:05.300 like you're saying, and nobody's giving them what they need in order to form the right synopsis

00:16:10.180 in their brain to accomplish more in their life. It's a real challenge. That's why I think,

00:16:16.080 and we're going to see more and more of it, especially as we see the rise of fatherless

00:16:19.420 homes. It's going to get worse and worse. I mean, you see it, you have these kids that are

00:16:23.820 protesting just the dumbest shit and you're like, what are you thinking? And the problem is, is people

00:16:29.960 are telling them it's acceptable and they're not getting the other side of it, which is, hey,

00:16:34.020 settle down. You're an 18 year old kid. You don't know anything about life and you really haven't,

00:16:40.400 and people are going to be upset when I say this, but you really haven't earned the right to tell

00:16:44.400 society how it's going to be because you don't know. Yeah, I agree. I agree. But you know what?

00:16:50.260 I remember back then thinking I knew what I was talking about. Of course. And I, so I can relate

00:16:54.800 to that. And we do it now though, right? We, even now we're like, I know what I'm talking about.

00:16:58.360 Dude, I bit my tongue so many times I'm almost bitten it off. You know, like sometimes it's just like,

00:17:03.000 how many times have you like, I'm going to write an email. I'm going to write a,

00:17:06.360 I'm going to make a social media post. And you're like, type, type, type, delete, delete, delete.

00:17:10.000 Type, type, type, delete, delete, delete. I'm going to take an hour off from this. Type,

00:17:13.880 type, type, delete, delete. I'm going to sleep on this one. And then you get up the next morning.

00:17:17.520 Thank God I did not send that message. Then again, there's some wisdom in that. When you're young,

00:17:23.180 you don't care. You're like, boom. Screw everybody. Dude, if I had a platform to send what was in my

00:17:29.820 stupid young brain when I was a kid, I would have posted the stupidest shit. And that's what I see

00:17:37.000 when I look at that. Well, and part of the problem too is not only are they young brains,

00:17:41.420 but instead of giving them the right formation, the right guidance, they're being rewarded for

00:17:47.740 posting and making these ridiculous arguments and just absurd claims. And they're being rewarded

00:17:55.120 through likes and follows and clicks and shares. And so, we're actually solidifying that behavior.

00:18:01.920 Positive reinforcement.

00:18:02.300 That's all it is. We're like, that behavior is acceptable. So, do it more is what we're saying.

00:18:09.320 Yeah.

00:18:10.380 It's only going to get worse.

00:18:11.560 Yeah. I don't even know, dude. I don't even know. I remember seeing like the first Desert

00:18:16.420 Storm War, like sitting in the front of the TV with the rabbit ears, you know, and you got to like

00:18:21.380 tune it in to get it. And I remember seeing like the trucks roll in and I was so scared.

00:18:26.500 Yeah.

00:18:26.880 You know, I was like, what, 13? What was that? 91?

00:18:30.700 91. I want to say it's 90, 91.

00:18:33.120 Yeah. So, you know, young kid and sitting in the little living room growing up and being like

00:18:38.000 scared of what was happening in the world.

00:18:40.860 Yeah.

00:18:41.160 You know, and like concerned about it. But the last thing I wanted was a voice, you know,

00:18:47.920 I had faith and trust in our government that we were doing the right things and,

00:18:53.100 you know, the right steps were being taken to secure our security. The last thing I would

00:18:58.240 have done as a 13 or 15 year old is put my voice out there. But I guess it's always been

00:19:03.380 like that, you know, whether it was Vietnam or World War II or World War I, I don't even know

00:19:07.940 what changed. I think that we had some errors of complacency and profit, you know, like the

00:19:15.180 country profited with infrastructure and jobs and freedoms. And then the complacency set in

00:19:23.240 and then people forgot what we're trying to do. And you start injecting all this stuff into there,

00:19:30.420 you end up with what we have right now.

00:19:32.520 Have you seen that meme? What is it? It goes, it goes something like, I'm going to butcher this,

00:19:36.260 but hard times make good men, good men make comfortable times, comfortable times make weak

00:19:40.580 men, weak men make hard times, hard times make good men.

00:19:43.360 I've heard it. Yeah. And I think that's what we're running into. I think we're experiencing

00:19:48.260 now. I mean, I don't want to say hardship because I think generally, if you look at every metric,

00:19:53.920 not just in America, but in the world, the rates of poverty, the rates of illness,

00:19:59.920 our survivability rates, just how long we're going to live, mortality rates, education, wealth. I mean,

00:20:06.100 every metric is improving. And yet I think there's this little bit of thing on the side here that

00:20:12.860 we're starting to experience more and more where people are forgetting what it was like to, you

00:20:17.740 know, you think about your grandparents and how resilient and gritty and tough. My next door

00:20:22.800 neighbors, 90 years old. And he's one of like the toughest, he's got some, some Alzheimer's he's

00:20:29.280 dealing with now, but just gritty and tough and resilient. A couple of years ago, he's out packing

00:20:34.480 wood. I'm like, Clark, dude, I'll come do that. He's like, what do you mean? You'll do it.

00:20:40.080 Like you're not going to haul my wood. And so it's pretty cool when you start looking at those past

00:20:45.900 generations of how hardy and resilient and tough and self-reliant they were.

00:20:50.380 Well, it was a mindset too. Like you stop work and you start dying. Like there's a trade-off.

00:20:55.000 I've got my own theory. Some of them I'll bite my tongue on.

00:20:59.180 No, share them. There's a place to share them.

00:21:01.600 You know, I mean, I think you had a, I think with the initial immigration, like my yaya came

00:21:08.000 from Sparta in 1904.

00:21:10.320 Really?

00:21:10.720 Yeah. My great yaya. And she lived till 105, you know, and she worked at the Lowell Woolen Mills.

00:21:16.480 I'll tell you, and I don't think I've told many people this, from that family of immigrants,

00:21:22.940 some of the world's best business people came out of it.

00:21:26.480 And they started with nothing. You know, my grandfather was a great businessman. My cousin

00:21:31.440 Michael was a CFO of Comcast. Now runs like the biggest investment company in the world.

00:21:37.320 And what happened was there was a mindset. So like, I know my Papua and his brothers,

00:21:42.280 they used to go to the tannery. They worked when they were eight years old. They were pulling

00:21:45.880 tacks out of the hides. And my great yaya was working in the Woolen Mills. And there's this

00:21:49.900 convergence of people who came to America because they heard about the American dream.

00:21:55.260 You know, that you can be who you want to be and do what you want to do, but you just

00:22:00.840 got to be willing to work hard at it. They learned that mindset and the grit. And then

00:22:05.160 they passed it on to their kids, right? Their kids had kids, which would say the baby boomers,

00:22:11.300 which is our parents. And those parents, I will say a lot of them were, we would consider it abused

00:22:19.480 now. Let's say spanked or beat. They were disciplined by them because they grew up in

00:22:25.900 the mills and factories and it was gritty and it was dirty and no, no labor laws, no labor laws.

00:22:32.200 There's zero. And so when they have kids, they're instilling discipline. Our parents,

00:22:37.480 and I'm not saying everybody, no, from my own experiences, like in others around me that I've

00:22:42.580 seen, they wanted, I guess, raise their kids with like a little more liberal lifestyle, but I'm not

00:22:49.300 going to spank my children because I was spanked. If I stepped out of line, I got beat with a belt,

00:22:54.340 you know? And everybody in my circle did for parents and they didn't want to replicate that cycle.

00:23:00.760 You know what I mean?

00:23:01.580 Well, I think it's natural that we want our children to have it better off than we did.

00:23:05.220 Right. And I have the struggle myself, like, okay, I didn't get beat as a kid. I spanked.

00:23:11.860 Sure.

00:23:12.340 You know, and you know what? I spanked my kids once each, but it was more like an attention

00:23:16.780 getter, like rotter correction style, you know? Like, hey, I got your attention now, right?

00:23:21.440 Okay. I didn't feel good. You know, it wasn't like, bam, like you crossed the face or anything.

00:23:25.760 Well, the way you're like, I only had to do it once.

00:23:27.660 Yeah, I know. No, you know, like a spank on the ass or whatever.

00:23:31.280 Right.

00:23:31.540 You know, it's the anticipation of it more than anything.

00:23:34.760 I was afraid of my mom's wooden spoon.

00:23:37.120 Yeah.

00:23:37.540 Although by the time I was probably 10, 11, 12 years old, she could legitimately, she probably

00:23:43.360 couldn't hit me hard enough with that thing to make an impact. And yet there was still this like,

00:23:48.000 all my mom had to say is, don't make me get the wooden spoon. Okay. I'm in check.

00:23:52.420 Oh yeah. I'm in check. But now like, I think I've gotten real soft in that regard, but try to make

00:24:00.120 up for it. Like in the regard that deco gives me so much shit. Cause I'll send him a photo

00:24:05.360 to like during the winter and there's like three feet of snow on the decks around the

00:24:09.280 house. And I'd be like, I just broke out the snowblowers and I'll have like my 12 year

00:24:13.620 old and nine year old out there shoveling snow off the deck.

00:24:15.820 He doesn't like that?

00:24:17.020 Well, it's a different, it's a cultural thing in Brazil. You're, but it's like, okay, listen,

00:24:21.980 the kid's got it pretty good. It's pretty cushy. And if they've got to stack five cords

00:24:28.200 of wood, split and stack it and shovel the snow during the winter, they're at least going

00:24:32.960 to learn some work ethic.

00:24:34.460 Absolutely.

00:24:35.080 I think that we're trying to do that as men for our kids. Whereas our parents, it was enforced

00:24:42.160 through pain. You know, I think it's a whole different type of pain, but not really because

00:24:48.580 you're not breaking them down. You're building them up.

00:24:51.180 It's hardship.

00:24:52.040 It's hardship.

00:24:52.760 It's gotta be hardship.

00:24:53.640 But it was a different mindset back then. Hardship was wham, that hurts, right?

00:24:57.980 That's hardship. Get to work. Whereas now it's like, Hey, you should do this. And after

00:25:02.820 you're done, does that feel good? Are you hungry? You should be right. Because you just

00:25:07.640 exerted yourself. I think that society, a lot of us in our generation, let's say in our

00:25:14.100 forties who now have kids breaking into their teens. I think we've gotten real soft in general.

00:25:21.140 And I don't know what that's going to cause. I think the cream will rise to the top though.

00:25:26.840 I do.

00:25:27.800 Well, that's actually a really good point because, you know, we complain about that,

00:25:32.820 but at the same time, it opens up a whole world to people who are even the slightest bit ambitious

00:25:38.940 and motivated and know how to work hard or work through a little pain. Yeah. Well, I even had

00:25:44.160 guys that, you know, I went to high school with or whatever. And, you know, there was guys who would

00:25:47.960 say they were injured because they smashed their finger or whatever in sports. And I remember my coach

00:25:52.280 and say, there's a difference between hurting and being injured. If you're injured, that's one

00:25:58.280 thing. If it hurts, toughen up, play through it. Did I tell you what happened to my daughter yesterday?

00:26:02.860 I heard she got her knee cut or something. I heard something.

00:26:05.520 So we're down there training. She was in the gym and basically she did a backflip. She ate her knee

00:26:13.680 literally. Oh my God. Is that from her teeth? Yeah. So that's her knee. That's it right there.

00:26:20.000 Did you see that?

00:26:20.640 Like, and that's them stitched it out. Oh, that's a gash. I mean, that is nasty.

00:26:26.440 She cut her knee. I'm like, Oh, I hope she's okay.

00:26:28.040 Oh yeah. She cut her knee. That's not cut her knee.

00:26:29.900 And then this is her tooth is now fixed. You can see how half of it was gone. Right. And I was

00:26:36.560 like, Chloe, so she's out there and she's like, I'm a strong independent woman. That's what she's

00:26:41.920 doing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. There's blood everywhere.

00:26:45.680 Which you're proud about.

00:26:46.640 It's blood everywhere. And she started crying and she's like, she was upset because of her

00:26:51.420 tooth because school started today. She's got the image.

00:26:53.820 She's like 12 hours from school starting. And I'm like, my tooth, my tooth. I said, Chloe,

00:26:59.020 modern medicine, sweetheart. I said, they'll make your tooth new. Don't worry about it. She's

00:27:03.560 like, but everybody's going to call me toothless. And so we started joking and making fun and we

00:27:08.700 wrapped up her knee and there'll be a pretty good scar there. But it wasn't a coddle.

00:27:14.840 It wasn't a, oh my gosh, you're starting school tomorrow and you're missing your tooth and you're

00:27:21.400 going to have stitches and you can't walk. It was like, hey, listen, first day of school is going

00:27:26.400 to be a challenge. We'll try to get your face to look as good as we can. You got a beautiful face

00:27:32.360 and it's all superficial.

00:27:35.460 That isn't just, hey, you handled it right in the moment. That's, how old is she? 12, you said?

00:27:39.920 She's 12.

00:27:40.720 Is that's 12 years of handling it right. So when that situation comes.

00:27:45.760 It's not a freak out.

00:27:46.760 It's not. And you know what? You didn't make it worse. Like I know a lot of parents were like,

00:27:50.820 it's the child who's like, like a little baby that falls on the ground and baby's fine. And mom

00:27:56.060 comes up screaming, baby starts crying. It's like if the baby's crying, it means that it's

00:28:02.540 probably a small thing. Yeah. If the baby's not crying. Yeah, that's true. That's a major

00:28:06.780 thing. That's a good point. And that's how they figure out pain levels too, you know, when

00:28:11.340 they go on like a emergency call, a first responder or whatever, is the person alert and in pain,

00:28:18.880 freaking out or whatever, they'll be good.

00:28:21.220 Because they're breathing.

00:28:21.780 Yeah. And they're, they're conscious. They're making it in there. They're feeling exactly.

00:28:26.160 Right. Right. That's interesting.

00:28:27.860 Yeah. They actually do. They gauge it like that.

00:28:29.800 That makes sense. I hadn't thought about that before.

00:28:31.720 Whereas if the person is, is like out, they're missing a limb and they're like out then, oh,

00:28:36.180 they'll focus on, on that person. But we've had a lot of experience with injuries. Chloe broke the

00:28:41.760 ball off her humerus completely. She's got a scar up her arm.

00:28:45.180 How'd she do that?

00:28:46.120 Gymnastics.

00:28:47.300 So she's, she's big into gymnastics.

00:28:48.920 Well, not anymore. She's athletic and likes to jump around. And my son, collarbone from

00:28:55.300 snowboarding and he's got separated shortly, you know, and he's 15. It's just hard living

00:28:59.740 up in Maine.

00:29:01.060 It is hard living. I know I was telling you, I was considering moving up here, but this time

00:29:06.100 of year, I'm like, yeah, I can move up here. I'm like, I need to come back in December.

00:29:09.520 You do. You do because it's.

00:29:11.580 Like this isn't a fair comparison right here.

00:29:14.560 It's almost like in the springtime, you like open the door and it's like, holy shit. You

00:29:21.600 know, it's like coming out of your hole.

00:29:23.080 Right. You're like out of hibernation.

00:29:25.180 You're like, wow.

00:29:26.320 Does everything just shut down? Like, what is it like in the winter?

00:29:29.700 We take full advantage of it.

00:29:31.780 You as a family or as a business?

00:29:33.380 As a family.

00:29:34.200 Okay.

00:29:34.500 Business is different. It's hard on business. As a family, like they're skiing and snowmobiling

00:29:40.980 and, and ice fishing and, you know, and it's a lot of fun, but you know, it's funny. Jocko

00:29:47.240 was saying there's one thing for Navy SEALs like that they're looking for, or that set someone

00:29:52.740 over to be accepted and them getting through the program. You know, that one thing, the one

00:29:57.420 defining thing is that makes the metrics just a little bit more is they grew up in New England.

00:30:03.700 Just hard-eared people or what?

00:30:05.400 There's more Navy SEALs. And Jocko's theory is because of the conditioning from the weather.

00:30:09.940 What is New England? What does that all include?

00:30:12.140 The Northeast, basically, you know, Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, et cetera,

00:30:16.020 et cetera.

00:30:16.500 And there's more SEALs out of New England than any other area.

00:30:20.880 Yeah.

00:30:21.960 That makes sense though.

00:30:23.440 Yeah.

00:30:23.680 Because you're out chopping wood, pushing the snow.

00:30:26.120 Smashing fingers, losing fingers.

00:30:27.940 And probably used to the climate of cold weather, which makes you tougher.

00:30:34.740 Yep. And that's what he was saying. It's like, you can have like some of the toughest

00:30:37.460 guys come out of warm environments and the water will break them down because they've

00:30:44.720 never been that uncomfortably cold, regardless of how tough they are. Not always, but he said,

00:30:50.100 and he made a point, it's a very small metric, but they still, it's still there.

00:30:54.460 Right. Because anybody can be good. And I'm not saying Navy SEAL good, but anybody can be good

00:30:59.320 in the perfect set of variables.

00:31:01.500 Exactly. Exactly. And what they're looking for like anything, and that's what Jiu-Jitsu is,

00:31:06.420 is when the stress is on your body, what does your mind decide to do? Jiu-Jitsu teaches you

00:31:12.480 how to handle that.

00:31:13.960 Jocko said something that was pretty interesting. We did like a Q&A or something. And he said,

00:31:19.780 if I'm rolling with somebody and I out-muscle them, then his team actually makes fun of him.

00:31:27.300 And I thought about that for a minute. I'm like, why would they do that? But then I thought,

00:31:29.960 well, there's probably a situation where he'll come across a guy that he can't out-muscle. And

00:31:35.740 if all he was relying on is brute strength, he's put himself in a worse position when he finds somebody

00:31:41.940 just as strong, if not stronger than him.

00:31:43.540 Plus, that's ego taking over. You go back to that primal, I can beat this guy, which as a

00:31:51.000 Jiu-Jitsu practitioner, you really don't want to do. And Jocko would agree on that. He's like,

00:31:56.080 because you want to be able to be effective at your weakest physical moment.

00:32:01.160 Well, I think like if you can out-muscle somebody in a competition, and that's what you need to do

00:32:05.420 to win, then do it.

00:32:06.380 There you go. Out-muscle them.

00:32:07.560 As long as you can last.

00:32:09.920 Yeah, that's true. That's a good point. I think it was maybe you and me. We were rolling,

00:32:14.980 and you're so big. I could be good for a minute, but I got tired really, really fast. Really fast.

00:32:22.720 You know who my enforcer is? Every school has the knights that protect the castle type of deal,

00:32:28.120 right? So I have an enforcer. He's a 150-pound kid, and he's a computer programmer.

00:32:32.860 In your school?

00:32:33.440 Yep.

00:32:34.360 He is the most technical. It's like trying to grip water. You're not hanging on to it. It's

00:32:41.420 going to go wherever it wants. I'll have guys that come in and like, you know, like they've

00:32:46.300 never trained or anything, and they'll be big, you know, 230 pounds.

00:32:50.640 Right. And they're used to throwing people around.

00:32:52.440 Oh, yeah, yeah. And they're throwing weights around in the gym. Remember this one guy? He's

00:32:55.100 like, you know, I'm going to be training and fighting. Before he had done any training, I'm

00:32:59.420 like, oh, cool. And he's like, and I'm not doing this for me. I'm doing this for my family.

00:33:04.980 That's why I'm doing this. And I'm like, bro, what are you talking about right now?

00:33:08.900 Yeah, yeah. What do you mean?

00:33:09.520 But you get these people, and I'm like, okay, cool. I said, you want to try some jujitsu?

00:33:13.180 He's like, yeah, bro. Okay. Well, why don't you start with that kid right there? He's a little

00:33:18.500 small. I said, he can handle it. He's durable. Do what you can. I said, honestly, just see if you can get by

00:33:24.660 his legs. That's called the guard. Try to get by his legs. 30, 45 seconds, they're just, they're

00:33:30.800 spent. Yeah. They put every ounce of their being into that, and they break. It's like breaking a

00:33:37.540 wild freaking horse. That's interesting. What do you mean when you say like the protectors,

00:33:42.880 the enforcers? Like what does that actually look in practicality? Like how does that work?

00:33:47.620 I use that term in business too. How that works is there's got to be a level. You're going to have

00:33:54.220 people coming in all the time, and grappling is a competitive thing too. You need to have a small

00:34:01.380 team of people who are kind of enforce the level, right? The standard? The standard. Okay. Yeah. It's

00:34:06.900 like a standard. When someone comes in, whether they're a tough guy or whoever they are, they can

00:34:14.020 leave knowing that there's, I guess you could say something special or that there's a level. There are

00:34:20.420 a lot of, let's say, jujitsu schools that they basically play resistance yoga, right? There's

00:34:26.260 training jujitsu, and then there's like playing patty cake resistance yoga, and yoga's cool because

00:34:31.200 I do yoga for my back, but. But that has a place. It has a place. Sure. And there's only two things.

00:34:36.160 There's flow rolling, and then there's rolling. And people think there's an in-between. There's not

00:34:41.520 really an in-between. You're either flowing, and you're not submitting each other, and.

00:34:45.380 Just working technique and moves. Right. And you can do that. And then there's

00:34:49.120 training, which is rolling and training. You know, the problem is, is if you try to do this

00:34:53.300 in-between thing, you get injured, someone gets injured. Because one person thinks they're

00:34:57.480 flowing, the other person thinks they're going, and you end up with this shitty situation, a

00:35:03.120 fight, and sometimes a fight or an injury or whatever it is, like, or talking like, you

00:35:08.360 know, I thought we were just going to flow roll, and then they would beast mode on or whatever.

00:35:12.200 It's just junk. So anyways, it's really what it boils down to is that level is more of

00:35:18.660 like a culture. Hey, this is the culture of the gym. You know, you try to maintain that

00:35:22.520 culture.

00:35:23.020 Well, you need that because it's easy for, especially for somebody to come outside. This

00:35:27.260 could be a new employee or a potential new student who, if you allow them to go unchecked,

00:35:34.320 completely destroy what you've spent potentially decades creating.

00:35:39.480 That's a good way of putting it. You know, it's like checking them.

00:35:43.480 And it's funny because society is, it's like, it seems like that's like frowned upon. It's like,

00:35:47.520 no, no, no, no. Culture and even the word tribalism, like that's a swear word.

00:35:52.240 Tribalism?

00:35:52.700 And I understand like-

00:35:53.980 It's a swear word.

00:35:54.840 Well, meaning that like, oh, you don't want to be part of group think, right?

00:35:58.560 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:35:59.400 To me, I'm like, no, a tribe is good because a tribe holds each other accountable,

00:36:04.320 puts each other in check. Like if I came here and I was doing something that wasn't in line

00:36:08.560 with your mission or the objective of camp, it should be not only your right and responsibility,

00:36:14.300 but your obligation to everybody else here that is expecting the best, not to allow me to come in

00:36:21.000 and jack everything all up.

00:36:22.720 And you need to have buy-in on that. You know, what I think is interesting is that

00:36:27.900 the word I'm looking for is with immigration, right? When our grandparents came in, our great-grandparents

00:36:34.680 at this point came in, they assimilated. I think what has happened is we've decided to say

00:36:41.420 as a society, you don't have to assimilate and you don't have to conform, which changes the nature

00:36:48.380 of us. I think that's where the rift is, you know, where the fracture is.

00:36:53.100 And I think there's something to be said too, though, for bringing your own culture and your

00:36:56.780 experiences.

00:36:57.300 But if you're trying to make your way into whether it's a country or an organization,

00:37:03.940 it's your responsibility to fit in, not the organization's responsibility to help you fit

00:37:09.900 in or to change in order to help you feel better about whatever it is you're doing.

00:37:13.760 And I'm not saying you drop your, I went to every Greek picnic as a kid and we have, you know,

00:37:19.040 we have Greek Easter and we crack red eggs and, you know, all this stuff. And I'm not saying that.

00:37:24.000 What I'm saying is, is we're coming to build and to work and to succeed. You know, it's almost like

00:37:31.080 that's a bad thing. Isn't that the point of it?

00:37:34.120 Right. Well, you'd think, you'd hope.

00:37:35.480 Is to come and to work and to build and succeed. I mean, it feels freaking good when you do.

00:37:40.400 You know, why is that a bad thing to feel good about that? That's conforming as the American

00:37:45.160 dream. I still believe in it. Oh, the American dream's dead. You know, let's just use America instead.

00:37:54.460 Yeah. How much can I get? How much can I get? Right. Give me, give me, give me, give me,

00:37:57.880 give me. Yeah. No, how much can I give? That's what I appreciate about what you guys are doing.

00:38:01.660 Cause we did the factory tour a couple of days ago. And I mean, it's apparent, you know,

00:38:05.660 I liked it cause you, we saw the old looms and everything else in there and the culture that

00:38:09.360 you've created. But I think more than anything that stood out to me was everybody that was in

00:38:13.640 there. How many, how many employees do you have by the way, roughly? About 40.

00:38:16.500 Had a smile on their face. And even if they weren't smiling, they were engaged in what it is they

00:38:22.020 were doing, engaged in what was going on around them. To me, that was a pretty good indicator that

00:38:27.660 you've done a good job, a great job at creating the culture, crafting the culture, upholding the

00:38:34.660 line and the standard and expectation. It was pretty powerful to see.

00:38:38.240 I appreciate that.

00:38:39.100 It was cool.

00:38:39.580 A lot of hands and a lot of daylight.

00:38:41.360 That's right, man. I liked that. I didn't know what that meant at first. I'm like,

00:38:44.720 what does that mean? Hands and daylight.

00:38:46.140 I told you that story. So I was, you know, my father-in-law, Joe, you met him and we were

00:38:52.000 driving, you know, if you go into the woods in Maine, you'll find a stone wall and people don't

00:38:56.560 realize that Maine was 90%, New England was 90% fields at one time. And when people, when they

00:39:06.840 settled, they had to live. And so they cut the trees and they're stoned through all the

00:39:13.100 land, let's say. And they had to pick the rocks and build the rock walls by hand.

00:39:18.780 Are the rock, are the walls, are they boundaries of, or are they houses?

00:39:22.820 They define the boundaries of property.

00:39:25.280 Right. Okay.

00:39:25.980 But they're there because they were in the ground and they couldn't grow crops without moving

00:39:30.500 them. So they had to put them somewhere.

00:39:32.600 So let's make a wall.

00:39:33.420 So let's make a wall and have our boundaries. So I asked my father-in-law, Joe, and I was

00:39:39.000 like, man, these rock walls, I mean, how did they do it all? I mean, you ever cut a tree

00:39:44.720 and tried to pull the stump out? What a nightmare.

00:39:47.560 Yes.

00:39:48.100 And he goes, hands and daylight.

00:39:50.600 Oh, that's so he said that.

00:39:51.700 He's like, hands and daylight, Pete. He's like, you either do or you die. And I was like,

00:39:56.860 got it.

00:39:57.940 That is interesting. That's, it's gotta be done, right?

00:40:00.980 The only thing they had were their hands and daylight because it wasn't electricity. Sun

00:40:05.060 up to sun down.

00:40:06.060 There's a phrase, and I would say it in Latin if I knew how to speak Latin, or if I could

00:40:10.640 pronounce it correctly. The phrase is, I will find a way or make one.

00:40:14.360 Right.

00:40:15.280 And I love it because I think a lot of people come to a dead end, metaphorically, whether

00:40:19.800 that's in business or a relationship, any avenue of life, and they see the dead end and

00:40:25.460 they're like, throw up their hands. I guess I'll turn around. It's like, no, no, no, no,

00:40:28.240 no. This is not a dead end. This is an obstacle. Find a way or make the way.

00:40:33.920 Exactly. I think we're losing that a little bit. It's part of this whole, I don't even know

00:40:40.280 what to call it, on-demand society.

00:40:42.840 I think it is. Like, everything's supposed to be easy and happy.

00:40:46.240 Easy, quick, on-demand, yeah.

00:40:47.980 And comfortable.

00:40:48.620 Yeah, comfortable. Yeah, exactly.

00:40:50.340 It's like, if it's not easy, like, why would I do this? Because hard is where meaning comes

00:40:54.900 from.

00:40:55.180 Yep, yep, exactly.

00:40:57.060 Like, your business, and I'm just assuming here, would not be as personally rewarding

00:41:02.640 to you if it wasn't a challenge.

00:41:05.120 Oh, for sure.

00:41:06.500 Like, if mom and dad made the business and you never had any worries and obstacles and

00:41:11.120 things just kind of fell into place, like, that'd be cool for like a week, if that.

00:41:16.760 And then you'd be like, I'm bored.

00:41:17.880 Yeah, and that's what happens to a lot of people. And that's why second generation businesses

00:41:21.560 fail at a rate of 50%, I think.

00:41:23.980 Is that what it is?

00:41:24.480 Third generation is like, I don't know, it's a 20%, 15%. Fourth generation is really like

00:41:29.740 almost nothing.

00:41:30.640 Yeah, not even, not even existent.

00:41:32.560 Did you hear Jocko say yesterday about that business he worked at? Where was it? Germany?

00:41:36.960 Somewhere. Anyways, I don't think, I can talk much about it, but he said, Pete, they're

00:41:41.020 500-year-old business.

00:41:43.360 What?

00:41:44.560 500 years old.

00:41:45.740 That's crazy.

00:41:47.060 And he's like, they make chains. And what they used to make is armor.

00:41:52.200 Oh, really?

00:41:53.060 Real armor, 500 years. I'm blowing away, 500-year-old company?

00:41:58.180 That's crazy.

00:41:59.160 That's...

00:41:59.600 I mean, I could see one generation, because you have, you personally, for example, with

00:42:03.680 Origen, have direct influence over your children. Not control, but influence. It's easier for

00:42:10.420 you to influence, but you don't have direct influence over your grandchildren, or your

00:42:15.620 great-grandchildren, or great-great-grand... What's that? 500 years? Eight generations, or

00:42:20.580 something like that? Or maybe even more? Generations?

00:42:23.520 That's pretty crazy. That, to me, represents a level of clarity. Somebody, at some point,

00:42:31.020 knowing exactly what they stand for, and instilling that into their kids, and teaching

00:42:36.940 them to instill that in their kids. And that's insane, because I would say, until I heard that

00:42:42.380 yesterday, I would say that's impossible to do. Really? Why?

00:42:46.300 External forces will influence your grandchildren, great-grandchildren. Sure.

00:42:51.140 You know what's interesting is, you know, Carnegie, he gave all of his money away and didn't, like,

00:42:56.000 leave anything for his kids to make them find their own way. And I often think about, like,

00:43:00.980 okay, you know, like, would you do that?

00:43:02.960 On the surface, I wouldn't do that.

00:43:04.480 Right. I don't think I would either. And does that make me, like, weak? Or does it make them

00:43:10.060 strong? Or am I making them weak by making them strong, what I think is strong? There's a question

00:43:16.600 there. Like, my wife and I told our kids, like, you're paying your way through college.

00:43:20.380 If my kid was a pain in the ass, and he wasn't doing what I would consider what Micklers do,

00:43:27.760 I'm not turning the reins over my business to that punk.

00:43:30.000 Right. Exactly.

00:43:30.840 Now, on the other hand, if he's making grades, and he's doing what he needs to be doing,

00:43:35.380 and he's been involved in the business, and he's showing progress, and he's a man of integrity,

00:43:40.540 and all the things that I've tried to instill upon him, then why wouldn't I give him a leg up?

00:43:45.060 He's proven to me that he's earned the leg up. But if he's not proven that, yeah, I would be a lot

00:43:51.000 hesitant to hand something over that I have personally built and bled and sweat and cried over.

00:43:56.460 You ever heard of this guy, Jack Mitchell? He wrote that book, Hug Your Customers,

00:44:01.580 I think is what it is.

00:44:02.380 Oh, uh-uh. No.

00:44:03.280 We were talking through email recently. I'm trying to get him on the podcast. And the one thing he said

00:44:08.480 is, with his family, if one of them decides they want to get in the business, he goes and makes

00:44:15.840 them work for five years for someone else and make their own way with that company. Then they

00:44:21.700 basically have to interview to work for his company. And if he doesn't have a job available

00:44:26.520 to be interviewed for, they stay there and keep working until something comes up. He doesn't-

00:44:32.040 He doesn't make stuff available for him.

00:44:33.860 There's no nepotism at all.

00:44:35.720 I like that.

00:44:36.220 It's just, you go to work like I had to.

00:44:39.340 Right. I've thought about that with my oldest son. He's 10, so he's got time. But he's expressed

00:44:45.120 interest in doing what it is I want to do. Or what, excuse me, what it is I'm doing.

00:44:49.060 And so, I spent some time thinking about this. I'm like, you know, that's what I want. I want

00:44:53.640 that. I would love to see Order of Man be multi-generational because I believe it's important

00:44:59.100 for society, but I also believe it's something that's meaningful and significant for my

00:45:04.560 posterity, my children, right? And then so, I thought about it. I'm like, you know, he's probably

00:45:09.960 old enough that he could probably do some basic, like some cleanup, maybe some shipping of some

00:45:16.120 basic orders or something. And I'm thinking like, how can I introduce him into the business

00:45:20.940 in a way that he could advance and learn about the business and learn about hard work and

00:45:26.020 like we're saying, earn his way. I've thought a lot about that. What do you envision for

00:45:30.260 Origin? Do you envision something similar? Do you want this to be a family generational

00:45:35.000 business? Is that-

00:45:36.580 Honestly, what's more important is building something for the community as far as the

00:45:44.260 jobs that have left the state, the mills and factories that have shut down, and the displaced

00:45:49.080 workforce. That's super important to me more than my kids taking it over. I want them to do

00:45:54.620 what they want to do. That's really what I want for them to find their own path. I make them work in

00:46:00.920 the factory. What are they doing? What do they do there? My daughter has done a lot of different

00:46:05.900 things from cutting belts to doing some sewing to helping with shipping. My son has, we bought a

00:46:14.700 plant that shut down. They had a military contract. Last summer, he spent the whole summer moving

00:46:19.320 machinery, rigging and moving. I think there's like 200 sewing machines, huge cutters and everything.

00:46:26.760 We took the whole electrical infrastructure out of the building. All the bus bar boxes, drops.

00:46:31.380 They need to be organized. I need to know there's 150 computers in this. There's this,

00:46:36.260 and there's electrical boxes here. I need the bus bar here. We stripped it clean.

00:46:40.260 How old is he?

00:46:41.040 He was 14 at that time. He was working with my father-in-law, who's 61, and my nephew, who's also

00:46:47.000 14.

00:46:48.080 Is the nephew, is that that sharp kid you had him on the podcast?

00:46:51.220 Yeah.

00:46:51.660 Who's that kid?

00:46:52.640 He's been around.

00:46:53.980 He's been here?

00:46:54.540 Yeah, yeah. Nicholas.

00:46:55.560 When he was on the show, I remember even listening to the show. I think I was in Hawaii at the time.

00:47:00.340 I was like, who's this kid?

00:47:01.540 Yeah.

00:47:02.100 He's like 14 years old, and he is, man, that kid is sharp.

00:47:05.580 He's getting, I think, brought up right too. I mean, his parents both are, they work hard.

00:47:12.460 His dad is in the logging industry, and his mom's a nurse, and they have a big garden. They're

00:47:20.400 self-sufficient, and they're hunters and fish, and what's awesome is he gets that side of

00:47:25.880 life. He also gets to be at origin working, because he works during the summer, and then

00:47:32.160 he works after school during the school year, because he doesn't play traditional sports.

00:47:36.500 Does your boy do that too, or does he play sports?

00:47:38.860 He plays sports. He's a jock, and I make him work, but I let him prioritize sports over work.

00:47:46.840 There's plenty of lessons that can be learned in sports that are critical.

00:47:50.500 It's great lessons, you know, in terms of leadership and teamwork. It's good to be around

00:47:57.160 people who are better than you at something, and you work in that team to succeed.

00:48:02.800 They don't change for you. You rise to them.

00:48:04.940 Iron sharpens iron. That's a real thing. Iron does sharpen iron. There's lessons in both of

00:48:10.260 them, but they're coming at those lessons from the same perspective. The two of them meet in the

00:48:15.480 middle. They're both hunters. They both fish, but they set their priorities differently, and it's a

00:48:20.720 neat thing to see, and I think Maine gives you that opportunity.

00:48:25.900 Yeah, it's kind of built into the climate, essentially.

00:48:29.020 And that's why we decided to raise our kids here and not move away.

00:48:32.600 Have you ever moved out of the state?

00:48:33.960 No, no.

00:48:34.800 You've been here the whole time?

00:48:35.600 I mean, you're generational.

00:48:37.120 Well, I'm not. I was born in Gloucester, Massachusetts, and I'm still not a Mainer.

00:48:43.760 I'm a transplant.

00:48:44.800 You're not.

00:48:45.120 I'm a flatlander.

00:48:46.100 When do they consider you a Mainer?

00:48:47.840 Never.

00:48:48.580 You never earned that title?

00:48:49.920 Never.

00:48:50.520 Really?

00:48:51.080 Never. No.

00:48:52.000 Because I feel like I've earned that in my hometown a little bit. Well, I'm going to say

00:48:55.440 my hometown. The town I'm in right now, but I am a transplant to Utah.

00:48:59.020 They've accepted you?

00:49:00.020 Yes.

00:49:00.400 That's nice.

00:49:01.560 Well, it's the beard.

00:49:02.320 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:49:03.520 No.

00:49:04.880 I mean, everybody likes me, but they don't.

00:49:07.040 But you don't get to be a Mainer.

00:49:08.180 No, I'm a mass hole.

00:49:09.620 Yeah.

00:49:10.280 I still am.

00:49:11.100 That's funny.

00:49:11.300 Even though I moved up here when I was eight.

00:49:12.960 Really?

00:49:13.500 Yeah.

00:49:14.340 Yeah.

00:49:14.580 That's funny.

00:49:15.260 Yeah.

00:49:15.740 I mean, I get it though.

00:49:16.580 I get it.

00:49:17.600 I was like, we're having our kids in Maine.

00:49:19.980 Because you want them to be Mainers?

00:49:21.600 Yeah.

00:49:22.200 Yeah.

00:49:23.460 Native Mainers.

00:49:24.060 Native Mainers.

00:49:25.420 They'll leave though.

00:49:26.840 You can get your lifetime hunting license as long as you get it in the first five years

00:49:31.780 of life.

00:49:32.600 My kids have the lifetime hunting license.

00:49:35.400 So what does that look like?

00:49:36.900 So I think it's like 500 bucks and it's like your hunt and fish forever.

00:49:41.160 Forever.

00:49:41.440 For an entire life until you die.

00:49:43.200 What?

00:49:43.840 Yeah.

00:49:44.180 That's awesome.

00:49:45.340 Do the tags here basically work?

00:49:47.560 Like we have a draw system.

00:49:49.580 So we have to draw out.

00:49:50.560 But you guys don't have-

00:49:51.160 Only moose.

00:49:52.160 Moose.

00:49:52.620 Okay.

00:49:53.700 Everything else you just-

00:49:54.740 You just go hunt?

00:49:55.480 Yeah.

00:49:55.960 As long-

00:49:56.360 I mean, you have to have license, but you just go hunt.

00:49:58.020 You don't need to draw out like a specific unit or anything like that.

00:50:01.020 No.

00:50:01.480 Yeah.

00:50:01.680 No, I mean, there's no tags.

00:50:03.180 Right.

00:50:03.540 That's what I'm saying.

00:50:04.260 Yeah.

00:50:04.440 But there's an abundance of wildlife, so-

00:50:07.200 There is.

00:50:07.600 I'm coming up this area in the fall, well, Minnesota.

00:50:11.960 Yeah.

00:50:12.240 So for a whitetail hunt later this year.

00:50:14.940 Nice.

00:50:15.340 So that should be cool.

00:50:16.340 I'm looking forward to that.

00:50:17.600 It'll be colder than I'm used to, I'm sure.

00:50:19.220 It's rough hunting in Maine.

00:50:21.700 Why?

00:50:22.180 Is it just so thick?

00:50:23.220 Because there's not food plots.

00:50:26.000 You go into the woods and hunt-

00:50:27.700 It's forest, right?

00:50:27.960 It's forest, right?

00:50:29.500 And although there's an abundance of wildlife, tracking in Maine is awesome, but you're committing

00:50:35.520 to a real tracking over the course of a day or two, and that's going 10 miles.

00:50:42.260 The Benoits made that popular.

00:50:43.980 I don't know if you've ever seen-

00:50:44.880 No.

00:50:45.280 I've seen them.

00:50:45.920 Their grandfather was a native, taught them how to track as a Native American would, and

00:50:51.620 they're the greatest hunters in New England.

00:50:54.200 What?

00:50:54.460 The Benoits?

00:50:55.040 Is that what you said?

00:50:55.920 That's the Native American tribe?

00:50:58.040 No.

00:50:58.400 That's their family name.

00:50:59.960 Oh, okay.

00:51:00.860 I think it was their grandfather who was like the Native American.

00:51:03.680 Oh, I see.

00:51:04.320 Okay.

00:51:04.560 And so they have these books on tracking deer, and they do it in the snow, and they do it

00:51:10.460 in Maine, even though I think they're from Vermont, technically.

00:51:12.800 They go up to northern Maine.

00:51:14.300 They drive the logging roads until they find a track that they know is a 200-plus pound

00:51:19.140 buck.

00:51:19.660 One jumps out, and they track it.

00:51:21.680 And the secret is, is eventually the deer is going to stop to see what's tracking them.

00:51:26.820 It's going to pause and look back.

00:51:28.840 So you could track it for miles and miles and miles.

00:51:32.100 Eventually, it wants to pause and look back, and they've got to make sure their scent is

00:51:37.580 right in the air.

00:51:38.500 Sure.

00:51:38.820 Yeah.

00:51:39.260 A lot to it.

00:51:40.040 There's so much to it, but-

00:51:41.240 A lot we don't see or know.

00:51:42.480 No, I mean, it's a whole nother level of thinking about hunting, not sitting in a tree

00:51:46.600 stand.

00:51:46.960 You're doing it like the Natives did it.

00:51:49.340 So I've done a little bit of tracking and never been successful because-

00:51:52.920 Oh, I can't imagine how difficult it would be.

00:51:54.940 I still have the patience for it.

00:51:57.520 Men, one of the biggest reasons so many men have joined the Iron Council is the accountability

00:52:01.880 and proximity to other men who are accomplishing big things in their relationships, business,

00:52:07.260 and life.

00:52:08.020 I want to invite you to join our exclusive brotherhood, the Iron Council.

00:52:11.700 It's easy to believe that we can go at this life alone, and the truth is that we might

00:52:15.460 experience some success when we do that.

00:52:17.620 But when we miss the opportunity to band with other high-achieving men, we limit our ability

00:52:21.980 to reach our full capacity.

00:52:24.360 And that's exactly what the Iron Council is all about.

00:52:26.600 You'll be teamed up with a 15-man battle team.

00:52:29.160 You'll have access to hundreds of resources, assignments, challenges, and then you'll also

00:52:33.580 get the much-needed accountability on your path to becoming the man that you're capable

00:52:36.960 of becoming.

00:52:37.680 Contrary to popular belief, you don't have to embark on the path on your own, so make

00:52:42.500 sure you join us inside the Iron Council and you'll learn firsthand how powerful a band

00:52:46.480 of strong, ambitious men in your corner can be.

00:52:50.300 Head to orderofman.com slash ironcouncil to learn more and lock in your seat.

00:52:55.000 Again, that's orderofman.com slash ironcouncil.

00:52:57.760 In the meantime, we'll take you back to the conversation with Pete.

00:53:00.200 It was funny.

00:53:02.480 We were talking about this at dinner.

00:53:03.880 We were talking about it in the context specifically of jiu-jitsu, but do you think guys who are

00:53:08.320 like hardcore into jiu-jitsu ever get tired of it like they want to quit?

00:53:11.820 I'm like, I don't even think that would be on their radar.

00:53:14.400 There's a high failure rate in jiu-jitsu, you know.

00:53:17.580 What would you consider failure?

00:53:18.740 Just quitting?

00:53:19.420 Quitting.

00:53:19.840 Like if you're going to do something, like do it to the fullest.

00:53:22.180 Yeah.

00:53:22.440 If you don't, get the black belt.

00:53:25.500 I think it's like a 10 out of a thousand or something.

00:53:27.900 That actually seems high to me.

00:53:30.460 10 out of a thousand?

00:53:31.460 I think is what it is.

00:53:33.200 So what's that, 1%?

00:53:34.360 Yeah, 1%.

00:53:34.900 Maybe 20, maybe it's 2%.

00:53:36.320 Yeah.

00:53:37.520 I mean, that makes sense.

00:53:38.340 Yeah.

00:53:38.600 That's life.

00:53:39.560 You find that rule everywhere.

00:53:41.080 1%.

00:53:41.440 The 1% are always the best.

00:53:43.040 Is it 1%?

00:53:43.800 Is that the statistic?

00:53:44.560 I mean, I don't know if that's been documented, but in my experience, 1% always rises to the

00:53:49.420 top, roughly.

00:53:50.620 One of the metrics that we track is podcast downloads, how many people are in the Facebook group,

00:53:55.620 and one of the things that there's a direct correlation is the number of men in our Facebook

00:54:00.640 group to the number of men in our brotherhood, the Iron Council.

00:54:05.240 And since I started three and a half years ago, 1%.

00:54:08.360 And I would actually be willing to bet.

00:54:10.160 So we've got about 430 guys in there.

00:54:12.320 Half of them are, what I would say, pretty active.

00:54:16.320 I'd be willing to bet that 40 to 50 of them, I guess that's a little higher maybe because

00:54:20.600 they've paid.

00:54:21.940 10%.

00:54:22.420 Yeah.

00:54:23.020 So maybe like 10% are heavily engaged, like heavily engaged members of it.

00:54:29.500 It's like that Pareto principle, the 80-20 rule.

00:54:31.580 I don't know that.

00:54:32.280 Oh, the Pareto principle?

00:54:33.660 It talks more about effort.

00:54:35.460 So that 80% of the results that you produce will be because of 20% of the specific effort.

00:54:44.680 So like if you look at your business, for example, 80% of the revenue is coming from 20% of the

00:54:50.440 revenue sources.

00:54:51.840 Or 80% of the productivity is coming from 20% of your employees.

00:54:57.240 Hmm.

00:54:57.760 And so it's, yeah, the Pareto principle.

00:54:59.700 I've never heard that.

00:55:00.620 You check it out.

00:55:01.260 You would dig it.

00:55:01.820 You'd dive all into it.

00:55:02.840 Yeah, no, I definitely would.

00:55:03.600 Because what it teaches you is it teaches you to focus more heavily on the 20% that's

00:55:08.700 producing the 80.

00:55:10.080 But what a lot of people will do is they'll focus on the 80% of stuff that doesn't produce

00:55:17.380 anything.

00:55:18.100 I think about it and I think I got what you're saying.

00:55:21.200 I do a chart.

00:55:22.300 I do a happiness chart.

00:55:24.420 It's the same thing.

00:55:26.260 With employees?

00:55:27.340 Yep.

00:55:27.620 I do this with my managers.

00:55:28.860 There's three columns.

00:55:29.720 First column is the sad face.

00:55:33.040 There's a little smile.

00:55:33.820 There's a sad face.

00:55:34.940 That's 10%.

00:55:35.900 The middle column is 80% and that's the neutral face.

00:55:39.760 Right.

00:55:40.380 And then the last column is the happy face and that's 10%.

00:55:43.420 And I say, who do you focus on?

00:55:45.060 Who would you focus on?

00:55:46.120 The happy.

00:55:47.280 Exactly.

00:55:47.680 But I know the principle.

00:55:50.000 So that's the Pareto principle?

00:55:51.340 Yeah.

00:55:51.560 Because a lot of people talk about this all the time.

00:55:53.440 Do I focus on my strengths or weaknesses?

00:55:55.200 You focus on your strengths and you find people to fill up your weaknesses.

00:55:59.340 Exactly.

00:55:59.880 And with workforce, most people, I'd say 95% of people say you need to focus on the unhappy

00:56:05.780 people.

00:56:06.660 No.

00:56:06.900 To make them happy.

00:56:07.500 No, you don't.

00:56:08.860 Because 80% of your workforce can be swayed.

00:56:11.820 Yes.

00:56:12.240 And when they see that you're focusing on the happy people, then the ones that are unhappy,

00:56:18.180 they go away.

00:56:19.360 And the neutral ones come over real quick.

00:56:21.340 Right.

00:56:21.800 Right?

00:56:22.180 Because people in packs, they feed off each other.

00:56:25.800 And this is how we build our culture at origin.

00:56:27.740 That's how we've been able to scale so fast.

00:56:29.060 But if you're focusing on that and you get everybody on the same page, what I always want

00:56:34.040 to happen, I'm not sure it always does, but when people leave the factory, I want their

00:56:38.740 spouses getting annoyed with them talking about work.

00:56:42.900 That's an interesting way to look at it.

00:56:45.140 And they do.

00:56:46.200 I bet.

00:56:47.040 They're like, well, you shut up about origin and working in origin.

00:56:50.380 Turn it off already.

00:56:51.480 Yeah.

00:56:51.960 Exactly.

00:56:52.900 That's similar to the Pareto principle.

00:56:54.560 I mean, it applies in any, just about any context.

00:56:57.920 I mean, start looking at it.

00:56:59.380 I'll send you some stuff, but look at it and see how many different areas of life you can

00:57:04.300 get it to apply to.

00:57:05.140 Now, it's not always exactly 80-20, but the concept is that a low percentage of your effort

00:57:11.800 is producing a high percentage of the result.

00:57:15.820 Got it.

00:57:16.300 Jiu-jitsu, being new in it, I don't know, but I'm sure that there's all sorts of ways

00:57:21.160 where the lower percentage of the effort is producing most of the results.

00:57:25.200 Right.

00:57:25.740 And then there's other things that you can do that obviously increase your likelihood

00:57:28.860 of success.

00:57:29.700 But...

00:57:29.760 I would say that's true.

00:57:31.120 I would say 20% of positioning will get you to 80% of the results.

00:57:37.520 And then they get to 90, you get grips right.

00:57:39.700 Yeah, exactly.

00:57:40.000 Get this little move right.

00:57:40.920 You have to hook the grips.

00:57:41.520 Right.

00:57:42.040 Your body in the right position.

00:57:43.520 Definitely.

00:57:44.020 But those are the...

00:57:44.600 That's the extra step.

00:57:46.620 Yeah.

00:57:47.160 Yeah.

00:57:47.680 That's cool.

00:57:48.600 Yeah, you like that.

00:57:49.480 I do.

00:57:50.580 Got me thinking.

00:57:51.720 I think when we were going to talk about...

00:57:53.240 Are you okay on time?

00:57:54.200 I'm fine.

00:57:54.740 I didn't know if somebody was...

00:57:55.600 I was watching people walk by.

00:57:57.100 You got a good crew here.

00:57:58.140 Thanks, man.

00:57:59.380 One of the things I always look at, people think I'm judgy right here.

00:58:02.420 I'm not.

00:58:02.860 The way I look at people is I want to know.

00:58:05.440 Like, I want to know what makes you tick.

00:58:06.940 I want to know how people have been successful.

00:58:09.280 I want to know also people who I see who have not experienced success.

00:58:12.940 Like, why?

00:58:14.020 What's kept them back?

00:58:15.660 And one of the variables, the metrics I look at is the people around them.

00:58:21.600 If I see that somebody has managed to acquire a strong group of people around them,

00:58:28.140 then that's somebody I'm going to focus my attention on because there's something there.

00:58:33.060 I have to unpack what it is.

00:58:34.840 But with you, I look at the people that you have around you.

00:58:37.360 You've got a business partner in Jocko, the instructors that have been here, high-level

00:58:41.500 black belts.

00:58:42.260 Like, the people that are around you are high-level.

00:58:45.280 So, that speaks highly of you.

00:58:46.520 I'm always fascinated by that.

00:58:48.300 I appreciate that.

00:58:49.520 And I would say it wasn't always that way.

00:58:52.280 I grew up in Maine.

00:58:53.560 My mom moved myself and my three siblings up here to the mountains because she wanted

00:58:58.340 to get away from, like, reality a bit.

00:59:01.100 Just your mom?

00:59:01.860 My mom and dad.

00:59:02.860 But he wasn't around a whole lot.

00:59:04.980 Okay.

00:59:05.460 Really single-parent family.

00:59:07.040 So, I wasn't able to learn like my cousins learned.

00:59:11.040 Got into business and things like that.

00:59:12.960 And I kind of had to watch from afar.

00:59:15.460 Had no idea how they were doing what they were doing.

00:59:17.340 Because we were in a totally different position.

00:59:19.300 The business side of things, you mean?

00:59:20.440 Yeah, exactly.

00:59:21.080 Because I always wanted to be in business.

00:59:22.400 I just liked that.

00:59:23.520 I liked it.

00:59:24.600 My first business, I made the mistake of not getting the right people.

00:59:30.500 I got talent, but they weren't the right people.

00:59:33.580 Good distinction.

00:59:34.120 And there's a difference there.

00:59:36.060 With Origin, it was a lot about people.

00:59:39.940 And right now, as we go through our next growth phase, it's about people.

00:59:43.760 I mean, dude, I've had like so many different types of people that want to like invest.

00:59:50.000 And people get excited when they want to invest or, you know, I want to do that.

00:59:53.380 But we're trying to build a brain trust.

00:59:55.920 That's what we need.

00:59:57.520 I think Jocko and I are going to record a podcast about that because we were talking the other night.

01:00:00.900 Like when like Dodeco or myself or Jocko, whoever, Brian, when we start something together, we can accomplish more.

01:00:10.260 I'd say in three text messages would take two months of a regular company.

01:00:16.780 It's fast and it's executed.

01:00:18.600 What do you attribute that to?

01:00:20.280 A lot of detachment of ego and emotion.

01:00:23.040 Jocko says, it's funny because his philosophies that he teaches and preaches to the masses, a lot of them I had learned through sports and also business and life.

01:00:34.320 And, you know, I think what changed was two things, an extreme ownership, right, which is decentralized command and then winning at all costs.

01:00:44.460 Winning at all costs means you've got to check your ego.

01:00:48.780 So, you've got to check your emotions if you really want to win.

01:00:54.340 Sometimes you need to take yourself out of the game, right?

01:00:57.120 Right.

01:00:57.320 You can't always win and maintain that pride.

01:01:00.380 That's right.

01:01:01.120 Pride is an interesting thing.

01:01:02.420 But it's a good thing too in that I would consider you a proud, otherwise you wouldn't take pride in the way that you deliver your business or your message or those things.

01:01:12.120 But you've got to recognize when it's hindering growth too.

01:01:15.620 So, you eat crow, you know, and you recognize you need to and you just do it quickly.

01:01:21.020 Let's say Jocko and I are working on something.

01:01:23.040 I designed this really cool thing and I was like, man, this is crazy.

01:01:26.360 And he was like, let's do it in black or whatever.

01:01:29.860 That sounds like Jocko.

01:01:31.780 Let's do it in black.

01:01:32.800 And I was like, where, bro?

01:01:34.100 People are going to see this because that's my expertise, right?

01:01:36.120 Packaging or whatever.

01:01:36.740 Yeah.

01:01:37.160 No, you're good at it.

01:01:37.560 You're going to see this.

01:01:37.860 You're going to blow it up.

01:01:38.800 Like, blah, blah, blah, blah.

01:01:39.600 And I went down and I showed Brian.

01:01:41.040 He's like, that's awesome.

01:01:41.940 You know?

01:01:42.060 And then I like texted to Jocko.

01:01:44.040 He's like, it's too pretty, right?

01:01:47.040 And it's like, okay.

01:01:48.480 And Brian's like, he's like, no.

01:01:50.600 He's like, we're doing this or whatever.

01:01:52.200 Like, this looks great.

01:01:53.600 And I was like, Brian, it looks great.

01:01:54.720 I said, but if Jocko can't talk about it the way he needs to for the brand, it's not going

01:02:02.360 to be natural.

01:02:02.880 I said, you got to detach emotionally.

01:02:04.240 I'm going to, I'm going to, it's like, it's like painting the Sistine Chapel and then

01:02:09.080 whiting the whole thing out and starting over with a whole different idea.

01:02:13.820 You know?

01:02:14.420 I mean, that kind of sucks.

01:02:15.420 Not that we're painting the freaking Sistine Chapel.

01:02:17.480 It sucks because you, that's your art.

01:02:19.540 Yeah.

01:02:19.720 But I don't care.

01:02:20.800 Well, because you've trained yourself not to.

01:02:22.440 That's right.

01:02:23.600 When I was 20 years old, I cared.

01:02:26.000 Yeah.

01:02:26.260 And I'd fight for it.

01:02:27.280 For sure.

01:02:27.780 It's really commercial art.

01:02:29.600 You know, you get conditioned to it.

01:02:31.840 You get conditioned to the arm around your neck choking you out and you learn how to

01:02:36.720 escape or move or transform and get in a better position.

01:02:40.520 And it's the same thing.

01:02:41.740 It's like, oh, okay.

01:02:43.260 I got to see why he doesn't like it really quick or readjust and start from baseline again.

01:02:49.120 Right.

01:02:49.460 And we do that like this without any argument.

01:02:52.000 And sometimes I'll be like, dude, like trust me on this one.

01:02:55.820 I really think it needs that.

01:02:58.280 How do you know?

01:02:59.840 We'll just take the scenario.

01:03:00.820 You know, you have this new packaging you're coming out with.

01:03:02.960 It's a new kid's product.

01:03:04.360 Okay.

01:03:04.700 Yeah.

01:03:04.960 You have a perspective, a valid perspective.

01:03:07.740 This is your background.

01:03:08.720 He has a perspective, a valid perspective, and sometimes they're at odds with each other.

01:03:13.180 So how do you, okay, I defer to you on this one.

01:03:16.800 And maybe one time he says, I defer to you.

01:03:18.600 How do you know where to defer?

01:03:20.840 Absolute and complete detachment of emotions and ego.

01:03:25.920 Just outcome.

01:03:26.860 What's going to produce?

01:03:28.020 Winning at all costs.

01:03:29.180 And he does a great job of that.

01:03:30.800 He does an awesome job of that, you know?

01:03:32.800 No doubt.

01:03:33.580 I think I do a pretty good job too.

01:03:35.280 I want the best solution.

01:03:37.080 It doesn't have to be my solution.

01:03:38.960 The best solution.

01:03:40.020 The best solution.

01:03:40.720 Well, and you guys are on the same team.

01:03:42.180 Yeah.

01:03:42.900 Like if he wins, you win.

01:03:44.300 Right.

01:03:44.720 If you win, he wins.

01:03:45.800 That's right.

01:03:46.360 You're not at odds with each other.

01:03:47.460 Exactly.

01:03:48.480 Exactly.

01:03:49.060 And a lot of people get into a situation where they're competing with each other.

01:03:53.460 I don't care who came up with the idea.

01:03:56.320 We're all going to win.

01:03:57.180 Yes.

01:03:57.740 And the people we're working to serve are going to win.

01:03:59.480 There you go.

01:04:00.480 People forget about that.

01:04:02.040 Again, that's what you're saying earlier.

01:04:03.340 That's a pride thing.

01:04:04.140 It's an arrogance and an ego thing.

01:04:05.560 Yeah, absolutely.

01:04:06.700 The first session, like I really wanted to teach.

01:04:09.880 I don't know if I did.

01:04:10.740 Maybe for a second.

01:04:12.240 I think you taught one, maybe some technique at one point.

01:04:15.320 Yeah.

01:04:15.640 I'm okay with that.

01:04:16.580 And I sat down and I was like, you know what?

01:04:19.240 This was a lot of work getting the camp to where it is, 400 people or 200 session A, 200 session B.

01:04:26.360 All that work, I want to be able to show some of my knowledge that I've gained.

01:04:32.500 Sure, of course.

01:04:33.140 You know what's even better?

01:04:34.920 Is the place I got that knowledge, the people, the human resources, they're here.

01:04:39.940 They're here.

01:04:40.320 Ask him.

01:04:40.980 He taught it to me.

01:04:41.960 I'm going to defer to them because I'm going to show them what they showed me.

01:04:46.280 So, let me just step back away from everyone and let them do their thing.

01:04:51.320 And my ego wants me to be there, right?

01:04:55.540 Because it feels good.

01:04:57.000 Yeah.

01:04:57.520 Because it feels good.

01:05:00.380 When it comes right down to it, we're winning right now.

01:05:03.740 Like what people are saying, they're coming to me, that goes to like the best instructor I've ever met.

01:05:08.980 You know, Alexei James, all these guys, like that's what we wanted.

01:05:12.720 Ego says, well, I want you to say that about me, right?

01:05:15.880 Ego says that.

01:05:17.020 Yeah.

01:05:17.280 But the interesting thing though, from my perspective looking in, what I think is I'm like, yeah, these guys are great trainers.

01:05:23.440 And Pete brought them in.

01:05:25.900 Yeah.

01:05:26.440 Well, that's why I didn't ever think about that perspective.

01:05:29.500 That's how I think.

01:05:30.280 That's how I look at it.

01:05:31.100 I'm like, yeah, these guys are great trainers, no doubt.

01:05:34.100 And I admire, respect, and look up to what they're training us and how they're teaching us this week.

01:05:38.240 And even though we haven't had you training specifically for that, it's your doing.

01:05:43.360 That's why they're here.

01:05:44.520 Because of you.

01:05:45.840 Yeah.

01:05:46.120 I guarantee people are looking at it like that.

01:05:48.060 That'd be cool if they were.

01:05:49.120 But then again, I don't think about it because I'm trying.

01:05:51.840 The same thing in business too.

01:05:53.460 Like I told like, be little at one point.

01:05:55.660 I said, Brian, I said, have you ever taken the Myers-Briggs personality test?

01:05:59.600 Have I?

01:06:00.020 Yeah.

01:06:00.300 I've never done it.

01:06:00.900 Okay.

01:06:01.220 It's a pretty cool test.

01:06:02.460 I've never been into those things.

01:06:03.960 I wasn't either.

01:06:05.100 But one of my business advisors four years ago told me, in order for him to work with me, I need to take it.

01:06:10.760 You had to do it.

01:06:11.700 And I did.

01:06:12.840 Basically what it does is you answer a bunch of questions about different scenarios and it tells you what your personality profile is.

01:06:20.260 But don't you kind of already inherently know that about yourself?

01:06:22.800 You do.

01:06:23.180 And that's what's cool.

01:06:24.540 You do.

01:06:25.400 And so every person on this earth has strengths and weaknesses.

01:06:29.120 Sure.

01:06:29.440 And you'd say, I know what my weaknesses are, but for someone else to know what it is by the way you answer questions, that's pretty cool too because you can recognize, and a lot of times we feel like we're an individual.

01:06:44.280 Mm-hmm.

01:06:44.980 Right?

01:06:45.320 I'm an individual.

01:06:46.220 Sure.

01:06:46.680 I know my strengths and weaknesses, but do I really?

01:06:51.100 So do I really know my new CFO or my new designer?

01:06:55.400 Do I know how I should interact with them?

01:06:57.940 Well, I know I'm a good leader.

01:07:00.880 So I know how to interact with them.

01:07:02.700 I'm good.

01:07:02.880 I got this.

01:07:03.700 But I don't really know because they're an individual too.

01:07:06.960 How do I really know how they're interpreting what I'm saying and my inflection and my tone and my, you know, my facial expressions?

01:07:14.660 That's a good point.

01:07:15.560 So as you grow an enterprise, knowing that innately, you think you know innately, but knowing it factually based off science, that's even more powerful.

01:07:25.940 And the big dogs in this game, they all know.

01:07:30.020 It's just another tool.

01:07:31.300 That's a good point.

01:07:32.000 And I envision the way this could really fit into is if you do know your weaknesses, and especially when it comes to, I think, communication, is the way that you and I communicate.

01:07:40.420 I can say things differently to you than I could to my son or my wife.

01:07:45.380 Exactly.

01:07:45.700 Even though I'm trying to make the same point.

01:07:47.580 Exactly.

01:07:48.260 I would have to say it different to my 10-year-old boy than I would you.

01:07:52.160 Yes.

01:07:52.640 You got it.

01:07:53.580 Yeah, that makes sense.

01:07:54.980 That's valid.

01:07:56.020 And so, and I think that's valuable to have.

01:08:00.360 But, I'll tell him, Brian, I think I can get the company to a certain revenue level before I kind of become obsolete in a lot of what I'm doing.

01:08:10.780 He's like, bro, don't think like that.

01:08:13.320 You can do whatever, all these other guys have been able to do, Kevin Plank and Jim Gennard and all the guys that have built the big brands, Adi Dazzler and this.

01:08:21.920 I think my skills fall apart at like this revenue level.

01:08:26.620 I think over the past year, I've kind of changed my opinion on that.

01:08:32.840 Just because my personality says that that might happen doesn't mean that it has to.

01:08:41.580 True.

01:08:41.840 Because I recognized that that could be my fault.

01:08:46.920 You changed the trajectory because you started thinking that way.

01:08:49.720 Exactly.

01:08:50.480 And so, I can surround myself with people to help with those weaknesses as long as I can admit to the faults.

01:08:58.680 I think there's value in delusional is not the right word, but being a little bit…

01:09:03.500 Naive?

01:09:04.060 No, just believing that you can even though you've never proven that you can.

01:09:09.680 I think special human beings, almost like that delusion, it's like, you've never done this before.

01:09:14.860 What makes you think you could do this?

01:09:16.900 And for whatever reason, they have some sort of self-belief that continues to push them and motivate them and drive them.

01:09:23.100 You're absolutely right.

01:09:23.760 And I think it starts with that.

01:09:25.240 I think anything, if we're talking about business or life, whatever, it all starts with some of that.

01:09:29.780 I think it goes back to, as men, we kind of have that, I'm going to black out.

01:09:35.080 Like, I'm going to make it happen.

01:09:36.280 You know?

01:09:36.700 It's the same kind of mindset.

01:09:38.060 But you need some of that.

01:09:38.700 You have to have that.

01:09:40.500 Then we'd just be a bunch of dubs, man.

01:09:42.600 Right.

01:09:42.980 You know, bums.

01:09:43.840 Right.

01:09:44.100 So, but what happens is, I've never been to a casino, but I've seen like on TV, like high stakes poker or whatever.

01:09:52.560 People start to break down when the stakes get higher.

01:09:55.340 Sure.

01:09:56.140 In business, it's the same thing.

01:09:57.960 The stakes start getting higher.

01:09:59.960 Oh, we know I just have five employees.

01:10:01.660 We've got 15.

01:10:02.760 We've got 15.

01:10:03.980 We've got 100.

01:10:05.480 Wow, my payroll's like, holy cow.

01:10:08.160 You know, and the stakes, and then you start maybe doubting yourself a little bit.

01:10:11.460 And instead of doubting yourself, if you really know who you are, you know where you're going to fail in time.

01:10:19.740 Like jujitsu, there's early, there's on time, and there's late.

01:10:23.260 If you do it earlier on time, and you get that brain trust involved, they won't let you fail because you've displaced that instead of taking it all on yourself.

01:10:36.120 You know, in high stakes poker, it's you and the table.

01:10:39.120 If you had two people by your side, they're going to see something you're not seeing.

01:10:45.440 They're going to see the tell.

01:10:47.320 And then you can whisper in your ear, hey, here's what he's got.

01:10:51.080 Here's what he's got.

01:10:51.920 Yeah.

01:10:52.140 Right?

01:10:52.660 Bold.

01:10:53.680 But that's what you can do in business.

01:10:55.440 Yeah.

01:10:56.000 You can get those people involved, those human resources.

01:10:59.060 And you should.

01:10:59.820 But people get arrogant to where they don't want to.

01:11:02.140 They want to run it themselves.

01:11:03.260 One of the things I hear all the time is, lone wolf.

01:11:06.680 I'm a lone wolf.

01:11:07.640 Or the one now that I hear a lot is, and I never heard this before over the last couple months, I've heard it a couple times.

01:11:13.960 Omega.

01:11:14.900 I'm an omega wolf.

01:11:15.920 I've heard that.

01:11:16.400 Meaning I'm like all, like myself.

01:11:18.740 Alpha and the omega.

01:11:19.940 Yeah.

01:11:20.380 It's not even the alpha.

01:11:21.440 It's like the omega is the loner, right?

01:11:23.820 Because he's got it.

01:11:25.400 Like the alpha is not a loner.

01:11:27.000 Is the omega the last one?

01:11:28.360 That's beta.

01:11:28.780 I don't know how it all, anytime somebody starts getting out omega and alpha, I'm like, we're not wolves, all right?

01:11:36.020 We're a little bit more complex than that.

01:11:38.140 But the concept is that I'm an omega, so I don't need anybody else.

01:11:42.800 Like I'm all of it self-contained.

01:11:45.000 You know what that is?

01:11:45.720 That is a complete lie to yourself.

01:11:48.340 Totally.

01:11:49.020 And I'll give you a good example.

01:11:50.720 When Jocko and I got together, he reached out through his podcast.

01:11:56.540 Right.

01:11:56.740 I remember you talking about that.

01:11:57.680 I think you and I talked about that.

01:11:59.920 And I was the omega.

01:12:02.380 The lone wolf.

01:12:04.100 Something to prove, dude, I didn't want the town's help.

01:12:06.360 I didn't want the bank's help.

01:12:08.040 I didn't want the state's help.

01:12:09.920 I didn't want family help.

01:12:11.580 Hindsight is 20-20.

01:12:13.280 I mean, that's arrogant.

01:12:15.120 Why?

01:12:15.640 Because I'm not using other people's money.

01:12:18.040 Right.

01:12:18.620 Right.

01:12:19.540 That's how things start, though.

01:12:22.100 So I think there's a time for it.

01:12:24.420 There's a time to kind of be that lone wolf.

01:12:27.040 But you got to know that eventually you got to be part of a pack to hunt efficiently so that everybody can eat.

01:12:33.640 Well, I think that attitude, I almost look at it as like the chip on the shoulder.

01:12:38.140 Yeah.

01:12:38.320 I think that can actually serve you if you use it correctly.

01:12:41.100 If you use it correctly.

01:12:41.780 And win at all costs.

01:12:42.800 But it can sabotage you, too.

01:12:43.140 Yeah, yeah.

01:12:43.340 It can sabotage you.

01:12:44.300 But if you're like, I'm going to prove to myself and everybody else and you're using it to produce productive outcomes, use it.

01:12:50.260 Yeah.

01:12:50.520 But be careful it doesn't hurt you.

01:12:52.940 Yeah.

01:12:53.300 I think that's why it's so important to self-check daily, multiple times a day.

01:12:59.160 For you, is that like a deliberate and intentional methodical practice?

01:13:03.420 Or is it just kind of hardwired into your programming and the way that you operate?

01:13:07.740 It was hardwired through hardship.

01:13:09.560 Relationship, things I'm not going to share, but reconnecting with what's really important.

01:13:15.640 Why am I upset right now?

01:13:17.780 Why am I frustrated right now?

01:13:20.060 Why am I pissed right now?

01:13:21.840 If you can do that on the fly, that would be considered wisdom.

01:13:25.780 Yeah.

01:13:26.180 I can see that.

01:13:26.860 It changes the way that you interact.

01:13:28.780 And that application of information is wisdom.

01:13:31.060 Exactly.

01:13:31.840 Exactly.

01:13:32.660 Sometimes I'll catch myself like, I've got a lot going on in my mind.

01:13:36.180 It's like a camp.

01:13:36.900 Let's say, well, a lot.

01:13:37.680 I know I've got this person calling me and this person, and someone's trying to have

01:13:41.240 a conversation with me.

01:13:41.960 And I'm like looking off and I'm like, turn your face and your eyes and engage.

01:13:46.500 Yeah.

01:13:47.000 You know what I mean?

01:13:47.720 Yeah.

01:13:48.420 And just take a deep breath for a second.

01:13:50.560 Okay, go.

01:13:51.720 And sometimes be like, bro, I'm sorry.

01:13:53.620 I was like off in space.

01:13:55.460 What were you saying?

01:13:56.580 I think too often our own thoughts are more important than what's in front of us.

01:14:01.140 So making that adjustment quickly.

01:14:03.900 I've even thought that way about the podcast, the way I used to do it.

01:14:07.680 Is I'd have these scripted questions, and I would just be waiting for you to get through

01:14:12.120 your answer.

01:14:12.860 And so it was all about me and my agenda.

01:14:15.880 Exactly.

01:14:16.780 Exactly.

01:14:17.420 Versus this.

01:14:18.000 I don't have any notes.

01:14:18.920 We're just chilling on the couch.

01:14:19.940 Yeah.

01:14:20.140 Just having a conversation.

01:14:21.620 My father-in-law gave me a lot of shit about that.

01:14:24.560 Especially like when you get overwhelmed, you know, I think stress is, I don't know.

01:14:30.080 I think stress is overused.

01:14:31.280 Listen to Jocko Podcast talking about the Napoleonic Wars.

01:14:34.020 That's stress.

01:14:34.600 Oh, man.

01:14:35.400 Yeah.

01:14:35.720 Did you hear that one?

01:14:36.540 Holy crap, dude.

01:14:37.520 Yeah.

01:14:38.180 Crazy.

01:14:38.660 Okay.

01:14:39.600 Let's put ourselves there for a second.

01:14:41.800 If you let yourself go too far down the rabbit hole in your own mind, you become, I don't

01:14:48.740 know what the word is, like an omega.

01:14:51.360 Self-absorbed.

01:14:52.200 Self-absorbed.

01:14:53.140 Yeah.

01:14:53.320 You're like, the entire world revolves around me.

01:14:55.860 Yeah.

01:14:56.300 Whatever I have going on is more important than, that's easy.

01:15:00.160 I follow that all the time.

01:15:01.800 I think any high-achieving, ambitious man is probably going to fall prey to that.

01:15:06.060 I think you're probably right.

01:15:08.000 And it can be a tool too, right?

01:15:09.580 Yeah.

01:15:09.740 Sure.

01:15:10.100 To push through.

01:15:10.980 Sure.

01:15:11.520 Yeah, you need it.

01:15:12.100 Drew, you know, like my lawyers here, actually, last night we were talking to these, like,

01:15:16.940 I think it was Steve who said that, he was talking about the next recession or whatever.

01:15:21.360 We're probably, what, five years away or something.

01:15:23.440 We're going to, it's a cyclical thing.

01:15:24.840 Yeah.

01:15:25.440 Okay.

01:15:25.700 And it's been a while.

01:15:26.540 I think about that.

01:15:27.740 In an omega mindset or a self-absorbed mindset, you become unstoppable.

01:15:34.440 Nothing can stop this thing.

01:15:35.780 Oh, dude, there's a lot that can stop it.

01:15:37.920 Really?

01:15:37.980 Want to bet?

01:15:39.200 Yeah, exactly.

01:15:40.560 Your wife gets sick.

01:15:42.020 Yeah.

01:15:42.920 Yeah.

01:15:43.200 Something happens to one of your kids.

01:15:45.320 Something happens to a business partner.

01:15:47.400 There's so many things that can stop your train.

01:15:52.360 Just that little derailing, a rock on the tracks, and you're off into the weeds.

01:15:58.600 So, recognizing that can happen at any time and trying to adjust to it and surrounding

01:16:04.900 yourself with people that can, if you're not able to correct yourself, they can help correct

01:16:08.420 you.

01:16:09.100 But recognizing you also need that, I wouldn't have accepted that at 25 years old, 30 years

01:16:14.340 old.

01:16:14.860 I mean, that's important too, because you have to give other people permission to correct

01:16:19.380 your behavior.

01:16:20.080 You do.

01:16:20.860 Because if they're just correcting your behavior and you haven't expressly given permission,

01:16:25.940 you're just going to get defensive.

01:16:27.060 Yep.

01:16:27.580 And it's going to strain the relationship.

01:16:28.800 But you also have to find people who are correcting behavior from the right place, which is, I

01:16:33.680 care about you.

01:16:34.520 I want to see you win, which is why I need to correct what you're doing right now.

01:16:37.520 It's hard to find those people.

01:16:38.920 Oh, for sure.

01:16:39.540 Very hard.

01:16:40.460 For sure.

01:16:41.120 And I think there's a lot of guys out there who experience that.

01:16:43.420 You know, I feel like I'm one of them where it's like, you know, I don't have a lot of

01:16:46.780 close friends, but the couple that I do, they count.

01:16:49.740 They count.

01:16:50.200 A lot.

01:16:50.760 Yeah.

01:16:51.340 They're important to me.

01:16:52.500 Yeah.

01:16:52.780 Because they, they have permission to see something in me and say something about it.

01:16:59.980 And I have permission to, never have I questioned, oh, is this guy just trying to beat me up

01:17:05.160 or, or sabotage?

01:17:06.740 What did it?

01:17:07.120 No.

01:17:07.420 It's always, I want you to win.

01:17:09.320 I want you to thrive.

01:17:10.100 And because of that, here's why I got to tell you, I see some things that you're jacking

01:17:14.580 up right now.

01:17:15.060 Yeah.

01:17:15.360 Right.

01:17:15.740 Exactly.

01:17:16.460 Yeah.

01:17:17.380 Exactly.

01:17:18.500 Well, cool, man.

01:17:19.220 Yeah.

01:17:19.720 It's been a good conversation.

01:17:20.860 How long we've been going?

01:17:21.700 I don't know.

01:17:22.120 An hour and a half.

01:17:23.260 Oh, that's not bad.

01:17:24.460 That's easy.

01:17:25.360 I used to do like 35, 40 minute shows.

01:17:30.100 I remember.

01:17:31.100 And I would like look at the clock.

01:17:33.020 I'm like, has it been 40 minutes yet?

01:17:34.240 Like it was like going slow, but lately it's just been, our interviews have been, I don't

01:17:39.200 even call them interviews anymore.

01:17:40.380 Conversations have been going so much longer.

01:17:42.220 Well, I think people are looking for that transparency and authenticity because ultimately

01:17:47.580 we're all going through similar situations as men, you know?

01:17:52.120 We're all going through something and it's all very relatable.

01:17:55.740 If I was 25 years old and I had a resource like this, and I just discovered podcasts when

01:18:02.920 I met Jocko, you know?

01:18:04.580 I was in my own world.

01:18:06.760 And...

01:18:07.160 The Omega world.

01:18:08.080 Yeah.

01:18:08.780 Yeah.

01:18:09.180 Like, but I think the Omega thing is proving to yourself, you can do it.

01:18:15.380 There's value in that.

01:18:16.240 And there's value in that.

01:18:17.220 Sure.

01:18:17.460 For sure.

01:18:18.180 And at that point, you know you have the tools.

01:18:23.100 The problem is, is you've got to know also when to let go of that at times.

01:18:26.760 And that's the dichotomy.

01:18:29.100 That's the balance.

01:18:30.120 But...

01:18:30.320 That's why that book is so good.

01:18:31.940 Yeah.

01:18:32.420 Is because it's so true and nobody's really articulated it that well.

01:18:36.880 Is that everything that you say, like every principle that you share can be taken to an

01:18:42.860 extreme that isn't healthy.

01:18:44.360 You got to find the balance and it's, and it's not an absolute balance.

01:18:48.280 It's a sliding scale.

01:18:49.660 So sometimes it's more this and sometimes it's more the other way.

01:18:53.520 And that's a challenge, man.

01:18:54.800 That's hard.

01:18:55.780 I had something happen the other day.

01:18:57.420 I learn every day, you know, about leadership, but I haven't told anybody this yet.

01:19:02.140 I went downstairs in the factory and we have a pretty good team.

01:19:07.660 Not pretty good.

01:19:08.400 We have a freaking great team.

01:19:10.060 It's the centralized command.

01:19:11.560 People make decisions.

01:19:12.600 And the idea is that they know how to make good decisions.

01:19:17.320 I just want to interject here real quick.

01:19:18.680 And I'm sorry to interrupt you, but like, you're not training them to know which decision

01:19:23.700 is right, but how to make the right decision.

01:19:26.460 Am I understanding that?

01:19:27.520 Okay.

01:19:27.820 What we're trying to do is if they understand the goals and the process and they can see

01:19:35.200 the whole picture, then the most of the time they can make the right decisions and then

01:19:40.660 make the decision that will come to you and say, this is the decision I made.

01:19:44.580 That's that commander's intent, right?

01:19:46.780 It's like, here's our goal.

01:19:48.220 Yeah.

01:19:48.680 Commander's intent.

01:19:49.580 He talks about that.

01:19:50.240 Oh yeah.

01:19:50.640 What is, what is the intent?

01:19:52.420 What is it that we're trying to accomplish?

01:19:53.660 That's right.

01:19:54.360 Now make the decisions based on that.

01:19:56.060 And if they're not making good decisions, it's not on them.

01:20:00.560 It's on you.

01:20:01.520 No bad teams, only bad leaders.

01:20:03.280 So, you know, I went downstairs the other day and John, who's one of my first employees,

01:20:07.780 he had thrown away all of the original textiles and the roles.

01:20:13.560 Oh geez.

01:20:14.640 And they were just in the dumpster.

01:20:15.920 Ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, boom.

01:20:17.120 And my heart sank.

01:20:19.500 I bet.

01:20:20.760 Because I want them to clean up before the tour.

01:20:22.760 So this was what, Friday or something.

01:20:24.820 And I like put my hand on it, like a child.

01:20:28.620 No.

01:20:29.300 And I was like, um, I was like, why are all these roles in the dumpster?

01:20:33.900 Because I'm thinking like, what happens if we want to replicate this in the future?

01:20:37.840 What happens if I want to like hang it on the wall for sentimental value?

01:20:40.720 Yeah.

01:20:41.060 Even though I don't have anything in my office on the wall.

01:20:43.240 Uh, so I really wouldn't do that.

01:20:46.560 These were the original fabrics that you had made?

01:20:48.760 Yeah, yeah.

01:20:48.780 Like the original fabrics.

01:20:49.960 Okay.

01:20:50.780 And in my mind, these are the thoughts I had.

01:20:52.900 What if Jim Jannard had the original Oakley glasses still?

01:20:56.960 I'm thinking like, people are going to want this.

01:20:58.900 That's kind of a self-absorbed statement, right?

01:21:01.320 Sure, yeah.

01:21:01.900 To me, they're important because it took so long to get to that point of these textiles.

01:21:06.360 And he said, uh, we keep cutting them by accident.

01:21:08.900 And I paused for a second and I took my hand off the fabric and I put it on the edge of

01:21:14.760 the dumpster and, and I said, okay.

01:21:17.660 And I, and I kept walking through the factory and, you know, and I let it go.

01:21:24.080 Really?

01:21:24.620 I let it go.

01:21:25.480 I did not go pull him out of the dumpster and it felt good to let him make that decision.

01:21:32.080 And I don't know if that was the right decision or the wrong decision.

01:21:36.700 To me, the right decision would have said, slice a yard off and put the rest of the dumpster.

01:21:41.060 Right.

01:21:41.340 Keep some of it.

01:21:42.020 Sure.

01:21:42.100 Put it in a box.

01:21:42.940 We'll put it away for later.

01:21:43.900 But there was something empowering about letting him feel empowered to make the decision.

01:21:49.860 And that is part of the dichotomy of leadership too, right?

01:21:53.760 Sure.

01:21:54.440 It's the right decision for him because you've got all these old textiles, which look a lot

01:21:59.380 like the new textiles and they're wasting time and money and resources, cutting them.

01:22:05.220 Mm-hmm.

01:22:05.820 Come to find out they can't use them.

01:22:07.820 From his perspective, based on the objective, it's not serving a purpose.

01:22:11.840 Right.

01:22:12.240 It's not.

01:22:12.660 It's absolutely right to do.

01:22:14.280 And in lean manufacturing, when you sort part of the Kaizen event or strategy, 5S strategies

01:22:20.340 to sort so that you have space to work.

01:22:23.480 And if you're not using it, you throw it away.

01:22:26.540 Get rid of it.

01:22:27.180 Get rid of it.

01:22:28.000 Get it out of your life.

01:22:29.540 And these fabrics have been hanging out with us.

01:22:32.020 You know what I mean?

01:22:32.740 They've just been hanging out with us, man.

01:22:34.020 They come along with us as we go from here.

01:22:36.280 They come along and it's like, why are we doing that?

01:22:38.840 You know, like there's bigger and better things.

01:22:40.660 And you know what?

01:22:41.840 In 20 years, we'll have this podcast and we'll have this story that we're talking about and I can reflect on that and I can keep it forever.

01:22:50.960 But the textiles, they can go.

01:22:52.760 Yeah.

01:22:53.000 Without consuming some of that space.

01:22:55.300 Right.

01:22:55.660 Right.

01:22:55.960 Exactly.

01:22:56.360 Yeah.

01:22:56.840 I mean, it's amazing how often we let things consume not only our physical space, but our mental space as well.

01:23:02.200 It's like, you got to let that stuff go.

01:23:04.180 You got to let it go.

01:23:04.920 You can't move forward if you're dragging all that stuff.

01:23:07.060 I've heard some analogies.

01:23:08.120 I've got some friends who talk about the rocks.

01:23:10.520 And so people, they carry around these rocks in this backpack that they're, you know, they're on a hike and they're living life.

01:23:17.280 And it's an analogy for the baggage that we carry.

01:23:20.340 You got to take the rocks out of the backpack and set them on the road as you go and you get lighter and you get more efficient and more effective as you go.

01:23:27.560 I have a hard time doing that when it comes to the factory, physical things, not emotional, not mental things.

01:23:35.920 A bit though, a bit.

01:23:38.180 I'm not going to share that right now because some of it's fresh.

01:23:42.940 Yeah.

01:23:43.480 I don't want to throw that sewing machine away because it was our first sewing machine, man.

01:23:47.340 I get it.

01:23:47.960 You know?

01:23:48.540 I get it.

01:23:49.560 Hey, that thing needs to go to the junk pile.

01:23:51.780 I'm in the process of detaching from some of those things that got us going initially.

01:23:56.080 We're actually in, it's a little different, but we're actually doing that in the house right now.

01:24:00.240 We've been thinking about making a move.

01:24:02.120 So my wife was talking, she got on a group text or something with her girlfriends and said,

01:24:06.340 Hey, I'm going room by room in our house.

01:24:08.000 If you want something, let me know.

01:24:09.440 And she's been struggling with some stuff, but she's like, you know, this is hard to let go of this stuff,

01:24:14.780 but this is the only way we can move forward.

01:24:17.180 Yeah.

01:24:17.940 That stuff's just holding onto us.

01:24:19.360 If you haven't used it for a year, let it go.

01:24:23.260 Yeah, it's pretty good.

01:24:24.140 That's a good rule.

01:24:24.700 That's a lean life right there.

01:24:25.780 That's a good rule, right?

01:24:26.920 I know I look even just in the closet and I look, I'm like, yeah, it's one thing.

01:24:30.860 You're like, I'm never going to use that again.

01:24:33.020 You just have it there.

01:24:35.020 My wife, she purges things that she doesn't like or that I've had too long.

01:24:39.880 I had this sweatshirt.

01:24:40.680 It was yellow and it had a blue stripe through it and I wore it for 10 years.

01:24:44.940 She called it Big Bird.

01:24:47.660 And she basically said, I murdered Big Bird.

01:24:50.460 Really?

01:24:51.020 Big Bird's gone.

01:24:51.740 You will never get Big Bird again.

01:24:53.900 And I was like, I'm like, dude.

01:24:55.760 Why would you do that?

01:24:56.480 I did.

01:24:56.760 I was like, that was my favorite sweatshirt.

01:24:59.120 You know, why would you throw away Big Bird?

01:25:01.480 Yeah.

01:25:02.480 I had some sweatpants from high school.

01:25:04.920 They were wrestling sweats.

01:25:06.260 Yeah.

01:25:06.980 I had this big hole, like a big hole.

01:25:09.520 And I had my wife sew them.

01:25:11.340 So they were like sewn and they were so comfortable.

01:25:14.700 And yeah.

01:25:15.860 It's that comfort thing.

01:25:17.640 You know, hey, let's get uncomfortable.

01:25:19.360 It's the baby blanket, right?

01:25:20.200 Yeah, exactly.

01:25:21.220 Yeah.

01:25:21.700 My son has his baby blanket in his safe.

01:25:24.300 Is that right?

01:25:24.820 Yeah.

01:25:25.160 Yeah.

01:25:25.340 He detached from it at like eight.

01:25:27.800 And he's got a little safe in his room.

01:25:30.440 He folded it up and put it there ever since.

01:25:32.640 You want to hear a crazy story?

01:25:33.700 I know we got to wrap up, but back to my father-in-law, Joe.

01:25:36.780 He's got issues, right?

01:25:38.700 Because he grew up in that time.

01:25:41.000 Sure, yeah.

01:25:41.580 Right?

01:25:41.800 Where like, I remember him telling me a story.

01:25:44.160 Him and his friends went out and they were 15 and they got in a scrap and they did something.

01:25:50.920 The cops picked him up, brought him to jail.

01:25:53.800 Sure.

01:25:54.540 And the cop was friends with the family, called his dad, who was a pilot in World War II or whatever, you know.

01:26:01.480 And his dad showed up at the jail, said, open the door and wham, drove him right in the face.

01:26:08.400 Those are the times.

01:26:09.380 Yeah.

01:26:09.860 Right?

01:26:10.500 Well, when he was a kid, he had his baby blanket and he was sucking on it down at the shop or whatever, you know, eight, ten years old.

01:26:18.840 And he set it down for a minute and one of the dudes worked and thought it was a rag, took it and just ripped it up and started wiping grease with it.

01:26:24.980 And he has this scar.

01:26:27.580 He's going to kill me.

01:26:28.820 He has this emotional scar from this blanket since he was eight years old.

01:26:34.800 Yeah.

01:26:35.080 This emotional scar of that feeling of that attachment to this thing.

01:26:39.200 Just getting ripped from you.

01:26:40.360 That literally in front of your eyes, somebody just rips it up and wipes grease up with it and throws it in the trash.

01:26:47.840 And it seems like such a small thing.

01:26:50.000 Yeah.

01:26:50.280 He's still upset about it.

01:26:51.460 But he gets it, you know what I mean?

01:26:53.080 And we all get it, like me trying to hold that fabric back from going to the dumpster.

01:26:57.960 Oh, yeah.

01:26:58.640 You know, it's like, I don't want to let this go.

01:27:01.500 We think that story's silly.

01:27:03.080 It's not silly.

01:27:03.580 Come on, we do that.

01:27:04.580 Oh, yeah.

01:27:04.880 Let's do that.

01:27:05.380 Oh, yeah.

01:27:05.760 Absolutely.

01:27:06.440 So, man, set yourself free.

01:27:09.080 That's right.

01:27:09.780 We'll call the podcast this.

01:27:11.180 Cool.

01:27:11.500 Set yourself free.

01:27:12.500 I like it.

01:27:13.080 I don't know.

01:27:13.520 We'll figure something else for you.

01:27:15.240 Anyways, man, it's always good to have a conversation.

01:27:17.900 So, we got the day off and then we're going to go right back to another three days of getting after it, which will be really cool.

01:27:23.760 The question I always ask my guests at the end of every podcast, what does it mean to be a man?

01:27:28.920 I think the first time I said what it means to be a man is to raise a man.

01:27:32.660 I think if you can succeed in that, and I think that's a lifetime pursuit until your son, if you have a son, has his own sons and daughters.

01:27:42.000 Don't take that the wrong way because some people can't have kids.

01:27:45.520 We had five pregnancies.

01:27:46.660 We have two kids.

01:27:47.280 I understand the intricacies of that.

01:27:50.140 It doesn't have to be flesh and blood.

01:27:52.240 To be a man is to raise a man.

01:27:53.920 To raise a man could be being a coach, volunteering in a kids' program, adoption.

01:28:01.200 There's so many things you can do as a man.

01:28:04.640 Just think about yourself and if you can somehow get involved, if you don't have your own son, with youth at some level.

01:28:12.820 To be a man is to raise a man.

01:28:14.680 I think that's important.

01:28:15.540 Really important.

01:28:16.220 A premise of what we talk about here, for sure.

01:28:19.080 All right, man.

01:28:19.540 How do we connect with you?

01:28:20.480 How do we learn more about what you're up to and figure out what origin is all about?

01:28:24.320 Best thing would be probably to listen.

01:28:26.640 We have a Hands in Daylight podcast.

01:28:28.160 We talk a lot about trials and tribulations as we make mistakes.

01:28:33.120 And I want to interject on that because it's easy for you to say it's a good podcast, right?

01:28:38.240 But it legitimately is a good, like a really good podcast.

01:28:42.620 Appreciate that.

01:28:43.120 It's really raw, meaning that it's not like fabricated.

01:28:47.000 Like it's real.

01:28:47.820 The one I listened to on the way up, I think you just recorded a couple of days ago.

01:28:51.720 You actually took a couple calls with employees on the podcast and you were talking about,

01:28:56.660 hey, I got, you know, you got this thing at the camp, like move it here, talk with this

01:29:00.120 individual.

01:29:01.400 And so there's a lot of lessons in there that are real time and applicable in your life.

01:29:05.300 So you're right.

01:29:06.320 Great, great podcast.

01:29:07.820 Appreciate that.

01:29:08.520 Appreciate that.

01:29:09.300 So that's how they can learn, I think, about what we're doing.

01:29:12.920 And originmain.com is where we kind of got all the stuff we're making.

01:29:17.780 Yeah.

01:29:17.960 You know, we make a bunch of stuff and we're making more stuff.

01:29:20.920 More and more.

01:29:21.720 Which is going to be awesome.

01:29:22.900 So I think sharing the knowledge and just being part of the movement I want to be part of,

01:29:30.000 which is really the movement we talked about today, you know, get involved in that.

01:29:34.960 Don't listen to the podcast.

01:29:36.820 Don't go to our website.

01:29:38.440 Get involved in the movement in some capacity in your life, in your community, because I'm

01:29:43.000 telling you, we're going to need it with the way things look.

01:29:46.080 We're going to need it.

01:29:47.180 Right on, man.

01:29:47.780 We'll sync it all up so the guys know where to go and everything else.

01:29:50.120 But Pete, man, I've just appreciated you.

01:29:51.900 There's people that you meet and, you know, we haven't known each other very long, but there's

01:29:55.340 people that you meet and for whatever reason, just connect with, right?

01:29:59.480 I think both of us meet a lot of people.

01:30:01.620 There's few of them that I get to know that I connect with really well.

01:30:04.920 And so I admire you.

01:30:05.920 I respect you.

01:30:06.540 I appreciate what you're about and what you're doing and just glad to be just a small part

01:30:10.760 of it.

01:30:10.960 And I appreciate you taking some time today.

01:30:13.140 Appreciate you have me on.

01:30:14.080 And it's awesome to have you here at the camp.

01:30:16.440 And I love seeing people get involved in one of my biggest passions in life, which is

01:30:22.400 jujitsu.

01:30:22.780 And that's where lifelong friendships are made because you're sharing a very intimate

01:30:28.940 experience and you can connect on a whole nother level.

01:30:33.580 So making that commitment to kind of come up here and see what that's all about is a

01:30:39.000 start to building a lifelong relationship where we can help each other.

01:30:43.360 So I appreciate that.

01:30:44.920 Thanks, man.

01:30:45.380 Yeah, for sure.

01:30:46.040 Guys, there it is my off the cuff conversation for a couple hours.

01:30:51.500 I know that one was a little longer, a lot longer than we normally do, but Pete and I

01:30:54.960 get along so well.

01:30:56.300 And like I said earlier, we share so much of the same core values and vision behind business

01:31:01.880 and life and being a man in general.

01:31:03.580 And so we could probably talk for hours more and we would have, and we did, but we had to

01:31:08.540 get to a training for jujitsu at that immersion camp.

01:31:12.380 So I hope you enjoyed this conversation.

01:31:13.720 Make sure you connect with me, connect with Pete on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram at origin

01:31:18.860 main is where he's at hands in daylight podcast is another great podcast.

01:31:23.500 Him and Brian Littlefield do that together.

01:31:26.160 Great show on business.

01:31:27.720 Go check out everything they're doing.

01:31:29.240 You won't be disappointed.

01:31:30.060 And if you head over to their website and you end up picking up any training gear or supplements,

01:31:34.900 make sure you use the code order or D E R at checkout and you'll get that 10% discount.

01:31:40.140 So guys, as I end this, like I do every single week, I just want to thank you for being part

01:31:45.240 of this mission.

01:31:45.880 You inspire me, you uplift me and motivate me to become a better man inside the walls of

01:31:50.860 my home.

01:31:51.300 And of course in my community as well, I couldn't do this without you.

01:31:54.620 So I asked that you go out, share the message, share this podcast, leave a rating review,

01:31:58.960 get entered in for that drawing.

01:32:00.860 And then frankly, just go out there and be a good man.

01:32:03.100 Be good at being a man in your home, in your business, your community, your life.

01:32:08.220 You never know what kind of impact generational type impact that that will have.

01:32:12.300 So until tomorrow for ask me anything and Friday for our Friday field notes, go out there,

01:32:16.640 take action and become the man you are meant to be.

01:32:20.240 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

01:32:23.140 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

01:32:26.940 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

01:32:32.660 Thank you.

Order of Man - September 25, 2018

Set Yourself Free ｜ PETE ROBERTS

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