Order of Man - October 16, 2019


The Difference Between a Boy and a Man, Eliminating Friction for New Habits, and Dealing with Resentment | ASK ME ANYTHING


Episode Stats

Length

1 hour and 13 minutes

Words per Minute

184.41013

Word Count

13,615

Sentence Count

1,056

Misogynist Sentences

6

Hate Speech Sentences

5


Summary

In this episode, we talk about the importance of being a man of action, how to be a better leader, and what it means to live life to the fullest. We also talk about how important it is to be inclusive, and why it's important to include people where they should be included.


Transcript

00:00:00.000 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest, embrace your fears, and boldly chart
00:00:05.000 your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time.
00:00:10.440 You are not easily deterred or defeated, rugged, resilient, strong. This is your life. This is who
00:00:17.240 you are. This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done,
00:00:22.800 you can call yourself a man.
00:00:24.720 Hey, what's going on, man?
00:00:26.880 Not much. Ready for another AMA.
00:00:30.860 I think we're on, we're probably close to, what, 65, 70, somewhere in there?
00:00:38.240 Yeah.
00:00:38.720 Do you know?
00:00:39.760 Well, no, I don't know, because I have them numbered, but we confirmed like a few weeks
00:00:44.440 back, but the numbering was off. So if we're off one, then this is 64.
00:00:49.260 64. Yeah. Not only are you off on that, your internet is also off too, because it's cutting
00:00:56.140 in and out already. So is this going to be one of those shows? It's a little choppy. We'll see if
00:01:00.820 we can. Yeah. I'll just, I'll just mute you when we're done hearing from you or it's too choppy or
00:01:05.900 you're not saying anything worth talking about. I'll just mute you real quick and, and I'll just
00:01:10.120 riff for a while.
00:01:11.500 Yeah. Or I'll just sit here and just listen.
00:01:14.700 Yeah. Just sit there. Good. Kip. That's all. That's all we want you to do. Okay. I'll,
00:01:18.980 I'll be the brains of this operation and, uh, all right. Enough of that. All right.
00:01:25.520 We got a lot of questions today. I think we do. Do we have a Facebook questions or iron council
00:01:30.420 questions? We have a couple of guys from iron council, uh, and a few from Facebook. So a little
00:01:36.600 of both. I will say that, uh, our ask me anythings, which is this fielding questions from the Facebook
00:01:43.500 group and the iron council, um, well regarding downloads on the podcast. Um, but, uh, they are
00:01:50.640 also doing very well on your, on our YouTube channel. I almost said your YouTube channel,
00:01:54.720 our YouTube channel. It is my YouTube channel. Apparently man. She's it's our, one thing that
00:02:00.200 I try to be very aware of is I try not to say I, me, my, I'm very aware of that. Cause I used to have
00:02:08.120 trainers in the financial planning business. I would be sitting there with them, with my clients.
00:02:13.100 Like I would bring these people in to my clients and they would never use the terms us, we, our,
00:02:19.460 it was always I, me, my, I'm like, what the hell is wrong with you, man? Like I'm bringing you into
00:02:25.580 these things. Be inclusive. People are like, I've been guilty of it in the past, but I try to be very,
00:02:31.000 very aware of including people where they should and ought to be included. Just giving credit where
00:02:37.720 credit is due, but people are, well, it's either ego or some sort of like delusion or ignorance that
00:02:46.380 they don't even know they're doing it. And both are bad. Like you probably ought to address both of
00:02:50.140 them. So I, I, I try to avoid that my podcast or my channel, like this is our thing. We're doing
00:02:58.100 this, not only you and me, but the other hundreds of thousands of men who listen and who tap into us on
00:03:05.180 social media. This is a collective movement. Um, and I, I just want to make sure we acknowledge
00:03:09.920 that the guys listening are part of this just as much as you and I are part of this.
00:03:13.840 Yeah. And that's such far more empowering to have that conversation versus my, and even,
00:03:21.360 even people that might be tempted to do that at work where it's my team. I never say that either.
00:03:27.320 We've had this conversation in the past about in the iron council where guys would give me a crack,
00:03:34.560 you know, give me, give me crap for saying echo, echo this, echo that. Well, that was my way of
00:03:39.200 saying not my team, right? It's really disempowering. Yeah. It's a disempowering to your team at work
00:03:45.760 or an iron council or anywhere else to say, Oh, it's mine. No, it's ours. It's the team.
00:03:51.320 Um, and, and I think this is a good leadership. Yeah. I mean, it's just a great leadership
00:03:56.080 principle is include people. Now, when you screw it up, you take responsibility for that. Yeah. Guys,
00:04:02.460 I dropped the ball here and what, and, and it's interesting because sometimes people hear that
00:04:08.120 and they think, well, you got to be real. Like some, somebody else may have dropped the ball.
00:04:11.720 I found that more often than not, when I say, Hey, you know, I apologize. I dropped the ball. Here's
00:04:17.300 what I did. Here's where I messed up. Here's where I need to fix it. Your response is,
00:04:21.320 no, no, no, no, Ryan, I messed up. I dropped the ball here. And, and so now I'm just giving you
00:04:28.700 permission to accept ownership that it's okay that you messed up. It's okay that I screwed up.
00:04:34.440 Now, granted, if that doesn't get brought to attention, then as a leader, there might be some
00:04:39.400 things I need to do and say, but don't be so quick to pass it off on the team's fault. I mean,
00:04:45.160 as I think a lot of the times we have a tendency of, of taking credit when maybe,
00:04:51.320 it's not entirely all ours. And then dismissing failures is, Oh, my team dropped the ball.
00:04:58.700 Like you either take it all or, and that's not good or leave it all. Like you don't pick and
00:05:03.880 choose based on victories and losses. Totally. I was just telling my son this the other day,
00:05:09.980 a scenario came up and he was like, Oh, this, this is this person's fault. And I'm like,
00:05:14.520 possibly I go, but maybe you tell me, you tell me if you can grow with that mindset,
00:05:20.980 what would you improve if it's that guy's fault? And he's like, well, I wouldn't change anything.
00:05:24.820 I'm like, exactly. Now you figure out what you did wrong, but I didn't do nothing wrong.
00:05:29.580 Think about it because it's only in ownership that you can actually grow from something.
00:05:34.580 There is no growth in victimhood period. So even if it's, you know, and it's true,
00:05:40.180 I agree with you. Like if, if you take some ownership, other people will step up to the plate
00:05:44.200 as well. But there's an individual mindset that comes with saying, Hey, I could have fixed this
00:05:49.220 situation. And maybe from a boss perspective, it's providing better clarity and expectation to your
00:05:54.580 team or better communication or better preparation or something. But it's only in the space of seeing
00:06:01.400 what you could have improved that you will ever grow and do something better. Victimhood
00:06:07.340 leaves you as is. And, and, and not even to the degree of victimhood, let's just assume,
00:06:14.540 and I don't know what the scenario is, but let's just assume that somebody dropped the ball and in
00:06:20.580 your team and you felt like you did a solid job. Okay. Well, does that mean that you did a perfect job?
00:06:26.500 No. Does that mean that there's not one little instance or, or circumstance in which you couldn't
00:06:33.140 change your performance. But like you said, when you pawn it off on somebody else, you may not take,
00:06:39.120 be taking a victimhood route. You may just be closing yourself off to potential growth on top of,
00:06:44.960 maybe you are excellent. Maybe you did do an excellent job. Why wouldn't you want to get better?
00:06:51.200 Yeah. All right. Well, there's our intro guys. We're fielding questions. As you know,
00:06:56.560 at this point, hopefully a lot of new members listening to the podcast. We appreciate you being here.
00:07:01.280 We're glad you're here. We couldn't do it without you. That's for sure. Uh, we just have to listen
00:07:05.180 to each other's questions and that's not fun. Um, so yeah, let's get into it. Fielding questions
00:07:11.660 from the iron council and our Facebook group, by the way, uh, the iron council can be found at
00:07:17.040 order of man.com slash iron council. And the Facebook group is facebook.com slash groups slash
00:07:22.820 order of man. Check them both out. Excellent. So our first four questions come from the iron
00:07:29.000 council. Uh, question number one, Dan Strayla, what do you do or what have you done in the past
00:07:36.100 when you feel like you are constantly under the attack by negative thoughts and or depression?
00:07:42.100 Uh, I think, I think a lot of the times negative thoughts, potentially depression. Well, let's rule
00:07:47.480 out depression is some sort of, you know, mental illness or chronic, chronic depression. If that's the
00:07:53.060 case, you need to seek help. You need to get professional help. You need to have some counseling.
00:07:59.020 I would think that would go without saying, but inevitably when we talk about mental health issues
00:08:03.720 and depression and potentially suicidal thoughts, somebody says it. So the caveat here is that we're
00:08:09.200 talking, we're not talking about chronic depression. We're talking about instances, we'll call it a
00:08:14.840 depression and that's different, right? Everybody gets down. Everybody gets beats up, beats up on
00:08:20.060 themselves from time to time. So first and foremost, let's make that distinction. If it's chronic,
00:08:25.140 you probably ought to need to probably ought to see somebody, but outside of that, you can choose.
00:08:31.440 And that is the beauty of being conscience, conscious, sorry, conscience. I can't say that
00:08:38.100 conscious. The beauty of being conscious is that you can choose how you want to respond, how you want to
00:08:45.040 engage, how you want to behave, how you want to react. All of that is you're free to choose
00:08:50.060 how you're going to do that. So when you feel yourself getting down and dealing with negative
00:08:55.780 thoughts, choose to think of positive thoughts, choose to be an express gratitude for what you do
00:09:04.180 have. Another strategy that I've used is I get engaged and active in things that are meaningful and
00:09:10.420 significant to me. It is infinitely harder to feel down and bad about yourself when you are anxiously
00:09:18.540 engaged in a meaningful and purposeful calling, uh, or, or endeavor or task or project or whatever
00:09:25.680 the thing is. My mom and I said this in the, in past podcasts is when we were young, she'd always say
00:09:33.020 idle hands are the devil's workshop every time, all the time when we're just sitting around idle hands
00:09:37.260 are the devil's workshop. And I'd roll my eyes. I'm like, mom, man, she was right. Idle hands are
00:09:43.260 the devil's workshop, but they're also the workshop, if you will, for inner demons and negative self-talk
00:09:51.300 and self-doubt, but you can drown that out with activity. That's meaningful and engaging. So do that
00:09:56.400 pick, decide how you want to do that. There's one other thing that I think a lot of guys deal with,
00:10:01.780 with negative thoughts is, uh, the idea of, well, there's two, the comparison trap and fear of
00:10:10.040 missing out. I think those are very, very prevalent, even more so maybe than they ever
00:10:15.780 were with, because of social media. It's very easy to see what other people are doing and the
00:10:20.460 victories they're having and the vacations that are going on and the women they're dating and the
00:10:23.440 promotions they're securing and the hunts that they're doing. Like it's easy to see all of that.
00:10:27.320 It's so readily accessible and I fall, I fall prey to it. I fall prey to it quite often, actually.
00:10:34.620 And one of the things that I've started doing over the past, I would say month, maybe slightly longer
00:10:40.000 is if I feel like crap when I'm following somebody on social media, if I have any sort of negativity or
00:10:48.820 negative thoughts, I stopped following that individual. These are, these are, these individuals
00:10:53.400 aren't even negative. That's not even what I'm referring to. Most, a lot of these individuals
00:10:56.900 are positive. They're inspiring. They're motivating. I think highly of these people,
00:11:01.860 but for whatever reason, I fall prey to comparing myself to these individuals. It's not everybody.
00:11:08.420 It's just a select few comparing myself to these individuals and feeling, feeling crappy that I'm
00:11:15.480 not doing what they might be doing. So go ahead.
00:11:19.340 Yes. So it's really a compliment. If you get unfollowed by Ryan,
00:11:22.600 you could go either way. It could mean that I don't want anything to do with you because you're
00:11:28.080 a jerk, or it could mean that I really think highly of you and I want to be like you. So I got to stop
00:11:32.920 following you.
00:11:33.760 Yeah. Copy.
00:11:34.840 I'll let, I'll let you, I'll let the guys determine which camp they fall into.
00:11:39.620 Yeah. Let their own negative self-talk determine which, which scenario it is.
00:11:43.760 Yeah. That's right. So I've done that. I've unfollowed a bunch of people. I've muted other
00:11:47.900 people that I, that I, again, that I am inspired by because I was having negative thoughts when I
00:11:53.280 would, I would see their stuff and I don't want to feel like that. So I removed the negativity. I
00:11:58.820 removed all of that stuff, the temptation to compare myself to other people. I get engaged in
00:12:05.180 meaningful hobbies and activities. I surround myself with people that I have, that I like, that I
00:12:09.540 admire, respect that uplift me and that I get positive value from. And, uh, that's made a
00:12:13.860 world of difference for me.
00:12:15.320 Do you have some books that come to mind, Brian, not to put you on the spot, but.
00:12:19.640 No, I mean, not, not regarding negativity and negative self-talk. I mean, there's a lot of
00:12:24.240 great books, but I don't, I can't think of one that is specifically catered towards overcoming
00:12:30.000 negativity. I mean, there's, there's tons of books I can recommend, but I don't know that they
00:12:35.180 would, uh, actually I would say one as a man thinketh.
00:12:40.320 By James Allen. It's a classic. If you haven't read that book, that's on my top 10 of every books
00:12:45.140 that, that men need to read. So as a man thinketh by James Allen.
00:12:49.240 Yeah. Love it. All right. Bobby Javanick, Ryan, what do you do to get over resentment?
00:12:57.480 I went through some rough times last year that revealed lots of betrayal from so-called friends
00:13:01.820 and family. It's something that I don't want to carry around with me as unnecessary baggage.
00:13:07.340 Any tips or tactics on dealing with resentments? Thank you.
00:13:11.160 Yeah. When, when look like use, use it, use it, use it. I've been wronged in my life. I can't,
00:13:20.840 you know what? I can't even, I was thinking about this the other day. I don't know why I was thinking
00:13:23.820 about it. I think somebody was talking about forgiveness and I was like, I wonder if anybody's
00:13:26.940 wronged me to the point where like, I still feel bitter about it. And I couldn't think of an instance.
00:13:32.280 And I still can't think of one. When like be so consumed with improving your life, improving your
00:13:42.540 existing relationships, uh, gaining new skills, developing mastery, developing capacity,
00:13:48.100 reading a bunch of books, like being around people that you'd like just drown that out.
00:13:54.220 Drown all of it out. This goes back to the negative self-talk. Like you get to choose
00:13:58.880 your conscious. You can choose if you're going to be resent, resentful towards things. And look,
00:14:06.320 you may have been dealt a crappy hand. People may have, have cheated you and lied to you and steal,
00:14:13.340 stole from you and cheated on you and all kinds of things that says more about them than it does about
00:14:19.160 you. But what's done is done. So drown that out by winning. And I found that what I used to believe
00:14:28.280 when there was people that I was like resentful towards that I felt like had cheated me. I thought
00:14:33.580 that winning would help me get them back. Like I'll show them. And so my, my whole goal was like
00:14:40.200 winning is going to, I can shove it down their throat, right? Cause I'm winning. That's what I
00:14:44.280 used to think. But what I found out is that winning makes all of that other stuff irrelevant.
00:14:51.140 Yeah. You stopped caring about it. You stopped caring. It's indifference, right? We've heard
00:14:55.260 the adage that the opposite of love is not hate. It's indifference. If you focus so heavily on
00:15:01.220 yourself, that will become just a little, a little thing in your mind that happened a long, long time
00:15:08.000 ago that just doesn't occupy space. Like there's, and that's why I can't think of anybody right off
00:15:13.200 hand. I can think of situations, but I can't think of any particular individual that I'm still
00:15:23.340 bitter about or resentful towards because I just don't care. I can have too much other stuff going
00:15:30.500 on. I'm helping other people. I'm doing work that's engaging to me. I'm trying to lock in my diet and my
00:15:36.460 exercise. I'm trying to get better at jujitsu. I'm trying to love my wife. I'm trying to be engaged
00:15:41.020 with my kids. I have no time, attention, or capacity for that. None. And that's a pretty
00:15:47.120 good position to be in. Yeah. I can speak to this specifically. There's multiple times in my life
00:15:52.900 where I had resentment towards someone almost to the extent of that same kind of mentality. I don't
00:15:58.500 know if you'd like use, I went dark, you know, like, Oh, you know, I'm going to, I'm going to show
00:16:03.900 this person wrong. I'm going to, you know, just surpass. It was all about them initially. And the
00:16:10.560 irony is through that process of, of trying to become a better person that no longer became an
00:16:16.580 issue for me anymore. Like I didn't care. And ironically enough is over time. Then I also
00:16:22.680 realized that some of that resentment that I had based upon their actions was based upon some
00:16:27.320 interpretation, you know, that, that they wronged me that, but that wasn't an intention of theirs.
00:16:33.180 And it was more of a by-product. And, and so thoughtfulness, empathy kind of came with time
00:16:38.840 as I focus on something greater than, you know, my hate towards them, if that makes sense or my
00:16:45.080 frustration with them. So it makes complete sense. I actually would use the term maturity.
00:16:50.480 You have just matured to the point where these little things that are potentially ticky tacky,
00:16:55.540 or maybe they're not, but these things just become irrelevant because you have evolved and matured
00:17:01.040 past them. Yeah. Now to give some practical advice here, and I know it sounds trite because we talk
00:17:06.880 about it all the time. This is why the battle plan is so important. And whether you use our battle
00:17:12.800 plan or some other system that you've created or somebody else has developed or whatever, I don't
00:17:18.580 care. Like Andy Frisilla has his, uh, uh, his power list. Cool. You know, great. I don't use that
00:17:26.000 because I have my own thing. I know, I know hundreds and hundreds of guys that use that and have a lot of
00:17:30.620 success. And I think that's great. So I don't care if it's the battle plan, but having a system in
00:17:34.960 place for getting things done that are meaningful and significant to you, and then being able to track
00:17:38.660 it, being able to analyze it and review it, and then go back to the drawing board and redo it as you
00:17:43.720 evolve and grow and mature. Like you had mentioned earlier, have a plan and work the plan and review
00:17:49.560 the plan. And I promise these little things out here are going to get less and less relevant in
00:17:54.680 your life. And at some point you're going to think about it and you're gonna be like, Oh, just like I did
00:17:59.820 just a couple of days ago. What I'd said is you, you will not be it's, I know it sounds crazy to
00:18:05.540 think about right now, but you will not be able to think about somebody who's hurt you wrong. Do you
00:18:09.340 damage you, et cetera, et cetera, or at least you won't care about it. Yeah. It's interesting how we
00:18:16.020 dive into some of these questions and then there's kind of like a theme or a kind of a mantra that kind
00:18:21.980 of carries across multiple questions. Um, one thing that I heard you say that I think is pretty,
00:18:27.360 pretty profound. And, and I, this was present to me when I read the last book by, uh, John Gary
00:18:33.560 Bishop, you had him on the podcast probably about a month or so ago. And I got his latest book and it
00:18:39.400 was really interesting because in that book, he talks about removing expectation and, and et cetera,
00:18:44.680 et cetera. And, and what was interesting about it is the ultimate resolve. If I had to summarize
00:18:51.440 was to find a bigger, more impactful, uh, problem to create a bigger problem, like something that
00:19:01.240 inspires and moves you like more or less create purpose in what you're doing was the ultimate,
00:19:06.360 like, yeah, all these things happen. And how do you deal with it? Guess what? They're going to keep
00:19:10.520 coming up. So how do you deal with it? You, you have a meaningful, purposeful life. And, and I've,
00:19:16.760 I heard this phrase once is like, everyone has problems. So you might as well choose yours.
00:19:21.980 And, and I love that mentality. And if I had to put that label on you, Ryan, I'd say the order of
00:19:27.260 man movement is the problem that you took on. You took on masculinity being demonized, right? And you
00:19:34.600 ran with it. And because that problem is so big, it transcends you and it transcends my new little
00:19:41.360 problems that might, or used to maybe be in your life that where you're like, that doesn't matter
00:19:45.740 anymore. I'm tackling something far greater than myself. And these things are just minor to me.
00:19:50.720 And I, and I like that concept of just going for something bigger and it really puts these other
00:19:55.780 things at play. Right. I mean, it's just, it's little, like when you have a goal and that thing
00:20:03.320 is, is way out there and you, and you're able to zoom out, let's take the stock market. For example,
00:20:11.000 here's a great example and a visual that you guys can see as a former financial advisor,
00:20:16.820 the best way to invest in a stock market is to do it over the longterm. When I say longterm,
00:20:22.280 I'm talking about 20, 30, 40 years. And if you were to zoom out of over a 40 year timeframe,
00:20:29.040 in fact, even 10 years, you're going to have a hard time finding a 10 year period in which
00:20:35.420 generally the stock market didn't perform well. And if you zoomed out 20 years or 30 years or 40
00:20:42.220 years, you'd see yourself down here. And then over that timeframe, you'd see yourself up here.
00:20:47.080 If you zoom out, if you zoom in to a one year period, it would be amazing that you could function
00:20:55.720 in life because it's all over the place, right? It's just up and down, rollercoaster down, up,
00:21:01.300 down, slam down, go up. And this is life, you know, from a day-to-day operation. Oh man,
00:21:07.480 I got laid off. I didn't pay my bills. You know, my mortgage company's calling and potentially my
00:21:13.300 wife left me. And then I have to deal with this medical thing. And then my kid gotten in trouble
00:21:17.160 at school. Like it's a miracle that any of us survive and operate on a daily basis.
00:21:22.140 But despite all of those things that could happen on any given day, if we zoom out,
00:21:27.020 billions, billions of people have gone through these experiences. And when you zoom out, you can
00:21:34.660 see that this is an individual who has a very successful life because place their emphasis
00:21:41.460 on the long game, the long-term, like you said, something grander and bigger than themselves,
00:21:45.460 like that stock market, the one year variables scare a lot of people out of the market. But if you
00:21:50.860 scale back 10, 20, 30, 40 years, there's not one individual who would look at that and say,
00:21:55.680 well, that's a bad investment. And yeah, we do that with, with our life all the time.
00:22:01.080 There's a quote, and I'm going to butcher it because I tend to do that with quotes
00:22:03.980 is that says something to the effect of you can, you tell a lot of by a lot about a person
00:22:12.520 by what bothers them. And I, and I'm not saying that whoever asked this question, I can't remember
00:22:19.420 his name. I'm not saying that what he's dealing with shouldn't bother him. I'm not saying that at all.
00:22:24.380 I'm just saying that he may have, you're on, I think you're on mute there, Kip, but what I'm
00:22:30.120 saying is that he, he needs to learn to elevate himself above that problem. Yeah. And when he does,
00:22:37.400 that will become less relevant. Yeah. And I was just making a comment, like what Bobby's dealing
00:22:41.480 with could be pretty profound, which no doubt, whether you don't want to like it or not. Yeah.
00:22:46.380 But whether you like it or not go for something bigger than that, bigger than problem, even if
00:22:51.360 it's a big problem. Yeah. That's why when guys talk about, Hey, my wife left and, and, and I've
00:22:56.780 got two kids. Like, what do, what do I do? Focus, brother, you got two kids focus. That's the issue.
00:23:05.260 Not your wife left you. You can, you can replace all that. I know it doesn't, may not seem like it,
00:23:10.640 but that's what you're in, but you can, you can fix all that. Kip, you're a great example of that.
00:23:15.060 You know, you, you, you have some situations where, you know, you, you didn't handle it
00:23:19.000 correctly. You've admitted as much and you've become a better human being. You've fixed that,
00:23:22.600 but man, you got kids, like you've got to focus on that. And that's, what's bigger than the other
00:23:27.080 issues it might be dealing with. Yeah. All right, let's move on. All right. Joel Garcia,
00:23:32.140 there seems to be a growing movement of political bullying against conservatives and Christian
00:23:37.880 folk being the order of man is based on traditional values. How do we best work with this situation,
00:23:43.700 especially at work? I just think you need to be a decent human being. And, and look at, I think I'll
00:23:54.360 say it this way. I think that the political bullying comes from the left, the majority of the time I do.
00:24:02.640 I'm trying to be objective about that, but I do believe it comes from the left,
00:24:05.620 but I believe, and I'm going to say this as, as succinctly as I can, that, that sometimes
00:24:14.200 conservatives are just act like little bitches. You know, it's like there was a post, for example,
00:24:21.780 the other day in the Facebook group of a guy that, that was hunting and he, he'd killed a deer
00:24:27.680 and 80%, maybe even 95% of the posts were like, Hey, good job. Well done. Way to learn a skill.
00:24:35.540 Way to develop, you know, way to provide for your family. And then there was like three to 5% of
00:24:40.620 the guys were like, Oh, how dare you hunt? How dare you? And, and the hunters lost their damn
00:24:45.340 minds. It's like, guys, one guy said, Oh, I, it's posts like this that want to make me leave the
00:24:52.740 group. And I, and I wrote back to him. I said, you know, I've gone through every comment on this
00:24:56.780 thread and there's like four guys who have a problem with this guy hunting out of hundreds.
00:25:02.360 And that's why you want to leave the group. Give me a break. So both sides of the aisle need to
00:25:10.100 exercise. Well, for first stop the bullying thing and stop the silencing. I don't, I don't like that
00:25:17.740 at all. And second, just exercise some mental toughness and a little emotional resiliency,
00:25:23.420 you know, just because some, some individual comes after you because they don't believe the
00:25:28.900 same way as you, you don't need to get defensive. You need to, you don't need to lose your mind or
00:25:34.600 lose focus on what's actually relevant and what's important, which is your business and your family
00:25:39.800 and your health and all the other things that we talk about. The other thing is like, I'm not going
00:25:46.880 to say you could win people over, but sometimes people are just angry. I had a guy in the Facebook
00:25:51.520 group today. I won't get into the details, but he basically just, he resorted to name calling.
00:25:59.100 That's what he did. He resorted to name calling to me. And I, I just basically said like, what's
00:26:05.540 with the anger, dude? Like I could have resorted to name calling back, but what's that going to solve?
00:26:12.040 And so I said, what, like, why are you so angry or something along those lines? And I haven't heard
00:26:18.020 back from him, right? It's because I'm not going to get sucked into that. I'm just not interested in
00:26:22.360 that. So instead I choose to be, I try to be a decent human being that, that thinks rationally
00:26:29.920 and clear headed and level headed. I mean, that's what we talk about. That's among the virtues that
00:26:35.340 we espouse within order of man. And yet a lot of these guys that follow order of man lose their shit
00:26:42.180 completely when somebody disagrees with them or says something, you know, maybe a little hurtful.
00:26:48.620 That's why I always get a kick out of these terms. Like he verbally attacked me. Like,
00:26:53.380 what does that even mean? He verbally assaulted me. What does that mean? What does you, you,
00:26:59.820 you never learned the term sticks and stones may break my bones, but never names will never hurt
00:27:03.860 or whatever. Words will never hurt me. Like, did you not learn that phrase when you were three?
00:27:09.960 And so these, you know, these tough, these big, tough guys, they're pretending to be that way.
00:27:15.720 And yet when somebody says something counter to what they believe, they just flip their lid. So
00:27:20.440 just my thought is, yes, I agree that there is some political bullying going on. So elevate yourself,
00:27:28.820 rise above it and don't get sucked into the mud.
00:27:31.380 And, and, and be an example of, of what that looks like for people years, probably two years ago,
00:27:38.980 there was a political post. I can't even remember what it was. I've learned not to do this by the way,
00:27:43.440 but at one point there was some political statement or something on, on Facebook.
00:27:47.860 I replied back, I was kind of going back and forth, sharing my opinion with someone. And this guy
00:27:54.820 kind of a straight out attack me, uh, you and all the typical conservative, blah, blah, blah, close my,
00:27:59.940 like just totally like went after me. And what was, but even that's not an attack, right? Yeah.
00:28:05.700 It's like, he doesn't agree with you. He's making stupid statements, but that's it. Period.
00:28:11.200 Like, but, but this is the part that I love. This is the part I loved is I had a bunch of people
00:28:15.920 replied back to him that are very left, uh, swinging politically and completely stood up for
00:28:24.160 me. Hey, although I may not agree with Kip's point of view, you misunderstand him. He's not
00:28:30.500 this kind of person. He's very open-minded. He'll have dialogue with like, I didn't even have to do
00:28:34.880 anything. I, and it was so rewarding to read these comments of people that see politics drastically
00:28:40.440 different than I do. Stand up for me because why I've set this example of like, when, when someone
00:28:46.600 disagrees with me, I joke, I don't freak out, right. That I have an open conversation with them
00:28:50.960 and, and that changes their viewpoint of what's possible. So let's be the example of what's
00:28:57.060 possible. Not, not the status quo that the society has accepted as being close-minded or,
00:29:02.760 you know, immediately bitching whenever someone disagrees with you about something.
00:29:06.660 Well, and it sounds like the people who stood up for you are intelligent and that's a distinction
00:29:10.980 that we need to make as well as that. I kind of fell into the trap for a long time because I was
00:29:15.920 listening to like Hannity and Rush and these guys, I would just get fired up. I'm like, anybody who
00:29:19.940 doesn't believe with me, like me as an idiot. And look, I mean, some of them are, but it's not because
00:29:27.300 they disagree with me, right? That's not what makes them an idiot. There's other things and other
00:29:32.100 factors at play, but there's highly intelligent individuals, highly rational people on both sides
00:29:40.240 of the political spectrum who are willing to engage in these conversations, in these discussions.
00:29:44.620 So let's not just assume that because you have the radicals and we'll just say the radical, well,
00:29:49.460 both the radical left, the radical, right, that just can't seem to function like a human being
00:29:54.920 that that automatically describes the entire left or the entire right. It certainly doesn't. And I
00:30:02.200 think the majority of people, regardless of what side of the aisle you sit on are probably closer
00:30:09.120 than the media and politics would have us believe.
00:30:13.740 Totally. And things are so much more complex than what everyone thinks they are. And the other thing
00:30:19.700 that I love it too, is no one knows half of us. All that we do is regurgitate information that we
00:30:26.580 got secondhand from someone else, right? Like most political issues. I'm not calling up that individual
00:30:32.100 and doing the necessary research and understanding the backstory and all the details. No, I get some
00:30:38.700 outlet. I grabbed that data and I go, okay, that's, that's what I'm going to believe now.
00:30:44.020 That's what I needed to take the same thing. And everyone's doing that same thing. I mean,
00:30:48.200 half of us don't even, we don't spend the investment and the time necessary, or even
00:30:51.880 probably even have the resources to truly understand the complexity of most things.
00:30:56.680 We just regurgitate what we've heard from different outlets. And, and I think that gives
00:31:00.800 me empathy. When I hear someone regurgitate something and whatever, I'm like, okay, you know,
00:31:05.660 I, I see what news you listen to and kind of how you see it, but I get that you're regurgitating
00:31:10.380 and I do the same thing. I do the same thing. Yeah. Okay. Politics, huh? All right. Brock,
00:31:17.600 Brock Rabin. If you could only give one piece of advice for an iron council noob,
00:31:24.340 what would it be? Follow the system.
00:31:28.360 That's it. Uh, we have a weird tendency to like, people say this all the time. Hey,
00:31:33.320 they qualify their questions to me. They'll say, what's one that I got? I got one yesterday.
00:31:39.820 Uh, I can't even remember what it was. I had so many questions I was doing and asking me anything
00:31:43.940 over the Facebook group. And the guy said something to the effect of, you know, besides this advice
00:31:48.420 that you'd probably give, like, what's one other thing? I'm like, dude, I, I already gave you the
00:31:54.860 thing. And basically what you're saying is that's not good enough. Right. He's like that. I don't
00:32:00.640 like that. What else you got? It's like, well, why are you asking questions? So I'm not placing
00:32:06.020 the guy who asked this question. I'm just saying, just follow the system. And I know that's not a sexy
00:32:11.280 answer. I know that's not maybe what you wanted to hear. You've got the quick start. When you join,
00:32:15.360 you get a quick start, go through the seven steps to the T boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
00:32:19.700 Just follow the system. That's why it works. Go through the seven steps, get yourself on a battle
00:32:24.780 team, engage with your battle team members, do your battle plan, track your metrics on a daily basis,
00:32:31.620 engage with the iron council members and the guys on your team. And you're going to be successful.
00:32:37.280 Cool. Yeah. The end. Could I add one thing? No, I'm going to add it anyway. Unless you mute me.
00:32:45.960 Mute. I'll be like, I'll mute it. And then I'll, and then I'll hit play. Thanks, Kip. Appreciate it.
00:32:52.560 So you think everybody actually heard it.
00:32:58.000 Experiment in the iron council. If you're shy and you don't like that, don't be shy in the iron
00:33:03.800 council. Yeah. Good call. If you're timid, don't be timid in the iron council. Like it's a perfect
00:33:08.260 playground to try to reinvent yourself. If you want to be more, not abrasive, but more aggressive in
00:33:14.800 your communication, do it in our council. Assertive. There you go. One of the eight skill sets in which
00:33:21.540 all men should learn. That's right. Do you, did you move around when you were a kid, Kip at all?
00:33:26.180 I did a lot. I moved around a little bit and I remember moving to Southern Utah from Southern
00:33:34.160 California. I moved there when I was, I was 13, 14 years old. And the school that I would have went
00:33:41.720 to in California had more kids in the school than the entire population of the town. I moved to
00:33:46.440 Parowan, Utah, more kids in the high school, the entire population. I remember moving there one day,
00:33:52.760 maybe the first, I don't know, couple of months there. I, we lived in a, I lived in a house of,
00:33:58.260 I was in the second story on, on a main road that went up, uh, Brian Head Canyon, which I'm sure you're
00:34:03.880 well aware of. So I'm, I'm, I'm sleeping. It must've been, I don't know, four or 5 AM. And I hear this
00:34:11.400 just really strange noise. I'm like, what in the world is that noise? And I look out the window onto this
00:34:19.460 road and there's cowboys with cows walking down. There must've been hundreds of cows and cowboys,
00:34:29.140 like real cowboys with cows. I, like I was so blown away. I was like, where in the world did we move?
00:34:37.900 It was such a weird phenomenon coming from Southern Utah or excuse me, Southern California to Southern
00:34:42.800 Utah. Anyways, I'm, I'm digressing here. So I got, uh, when I moved there, I was, I was cool when I moved
00:34:52.500 there because I was like the, the skater slash surfer kid from Southern California. I have long hair.
00:35:02.180 Like I was cool there until people got to know me. But initially when I was there, I was, I was cool.
00:35:07.980 Okay. Now let me tie this together and tell you why I'm saying this. Nobody knows who you are. When
00:35:13.660 you join the iron council, nobody has any preconceived notions. Nobody has any prejudgments
00:35:21.560 about who you are and where you came from and what you're all about. Nobody knows you.
00:35:27.960 That's a beautiful thing because what that means, because when I moved to Southern Utah,
00:35:33.120 I played that up a little bit, right? Cause I, cause that helped me with the ladies and it helped me
00:35:37.680 with friends. Like I played that up because nobody knew that I wasn't really cool. When you join the
00:35:44.540 iron council, nobody knows you're shy. Nobody knows you're timid. Nobody knows that you have
00:35:51.500 self-esteem issues. Nobody knows about the bankruptcy that you went through. Nobody knows about the issues
00:35:58.380 you've had with your wife. Nobody knows about your alcohol abuse. Nobody knows. So you get to start
00:36:04.400 over. I'm not saying you should ignore those things, but I'm saying that this is a chance to
00:36:09.180 create a new version of yourself. That's it. A better, more improved, more mature, more capable
00:36:16.100 version of yourself. I'm not saying you get to wipe the slate clean. We don't have those opportunities
00:36:20.660 in life. You got to take what you've created for yourself, 30, 40, 50 years of what you've created in
00:36:27.880 your life and what has been created for you in a lot of ways too. You've got to take that with you.
00:36:33.220 But in a way you have this opportunity, whether you join the iron council or start a new job or move
00:36:39.100 to a new area to create the version of yourself that you want to be. And that's not disingenuous
00:36:44.820 by the way, because you were not playing this fake it till you make it thing. We're just talking about
00:36:49.780 behaving in a manner consistent with the version that you have, the vision of the version you have for
00:36:55.420 yourself. That's the only way to improve is to think about how you want to be better and then be
00:37:02.300 that way. So there you go. Awesome. Ellis Lloyd Williams, not really a question, but I'd be
00:37:11.540 interested to hear both of your opinions on how to tell the difference between giving up and quitting
00:37:16.460 while you're ahead. That's a great, that is a question. Yeah. What's the difference?
00:37:20.920 Um, well, I think in your heart, you know,
00:37:27.800 gut check. I actually don't. Okay. Let me, let me make sure I hear this correctly. What's the
00:37:32.900 difference between giving up quitting? What was the terms quitting and tell me what the term.
00:37:39.800 Yeah. Giving up and quitting while you're ahead. I don't like either of those terms.
00:37:44.640 I'm either. I was thinking like, I think I'd use different verbiage, but I've had conversations
00:37:50.340 with people about, I specifically remember in particular about, uh, uh, I don't know why I
00:37:57.060 remember this. Somebody when Brett Favre retired or, or some, I can't even remember. I don't even,
00:38:02.000 I don't watch football that much. So it was somebody, a quarterback who was really good.
00:38:05.580 And they said, Oh, he's just, you know, he's quitting while he's ahead. I'm like, no, no,
00:38:10.020 he's not. Competitors don't quit while they're ahead. Like world-class competitors don't quit
00:38:15.480 while they're ahead. Why? Because they're competitors. They want to win forever. They
00:38:19.760 want to dominate forever. Now they can't because there's some physical limitations and things like
00:38:23.800 that, that occur, but, or, and new people will get better and improve and things like that. But
00:38:28.460 why would you quit while you're ahead? I just want to get further ahead.
00:38:33.680 What word would you use instead of quitting while you're ahead?
00:38:36.900 Um, I would say what's the difference between quitting and I don't know if I would use another
00:38:45.660 word. Cause I can't imagine like stopping. See, I would just, I call that pivoting,
00:38:51.100 you know, things evolve, things change, you pivot. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I would use
00:38:58.440 pivoting or evolving for quitting while you're ahead. Yeah. So how about giving up though? So
00:39:03.720 how, what's the difference between those two and between, well, maybe quitting and then evolving.
00:39:09.740 Yeah. Gut check. When, when things are no longer meaningful to you, when you're indifferent,
00:39:17.220 that's probably a position where you ought to pivot. I was going to say quit, but I like your term
00:39:22.380 better. Like if you're, if you're pursuing something, a great example is the financial planning
00:39:27.220 practice. I was, I was good, man. I was really good as a financial advisor. I cared about my
00:39:32.380 clients. Uh, I, I stayed well-versed and researched on products and portfolios. Um, I enjoyed the
00:39:40.160 opportunity to help people with their retirement planning. Like I, I really enjoyed it for a long
00:39:45.360 time. And then there came a point where I was like, this is miserable. Every time a client would
00:39:52.220 call me, I would, I would dread it. Oh, I need to call and change my portfolio. And inside, I'm like,
00:39:58.240 Oh, I do not want to do this. And that's the point where I realized it's time for a pivot.
00:40:07.420 That's not throwing in the towel. I mean, technically, maybe technically, technically,
00:40:12.920 maybe you're quitting, but that word has a negative connotation to it. And evolution isn't negative.
00:40:19.400 Yeah. So what did I evolve into this? When you're listening to it right now, if I wouldn't have
00:40:26.940 quote unquote quit, we wouldn't be listening to this podcast. I wouldn't be living here. My family
00:40:32.100 dynamic wouldn't be nearly what it is right now. You and I can't, we probably wouldn't have our,
00:40:36.340 our friendship and our relationship. It's, it's okay to, to use your term. It's okay to pivot and
00:40:43.240 evolve. In fact, you should do that. The quote is no man steps in the same river twice for he is not
00:40:48.700 the man. And he is not the same man. And it is not the same river. If you're doing the same thing
00:40:54.560 over and over again, and you're the same guy that you were 10 years ago, you have missed the bus,
00:41:00.780 my friend. Yeah. Like you, you, you've just fallen into complacency and you know what? There is no
00:41:07.540 homeostasis. There's no point where things are just perfect and you're just going to coast indefinitely,
00:41:14.600 and you're never going to need to pivot or change. You might be falling ahead, falling behind and you
00:41:19.160 don't even realize why. Maybe it's because you have bought into the idea that you can't ever quit
00:41:24.620 and that's dangerous. But I think the distinction between the two words is, I think that's an
00:41:31.320 important distinction. I hope I addressed it. Let me ask you this question, Ryan, what if,
00:41:38.040 and I'm just going to use a workout as an example, just to make this simple, you know,
00:41:42.800 I'm going to the gym and I'm going, I don't want to do this. How much of that is at,
00:41:47.820 where do you draw that line of, uh, sticking and being disciplined to your vision and the purpose
00:41:55.420 and the grind, right. To get somewhere greater versus all. And, and, and the difference between
00:42:01.780 that motivation, like a lack of motivation and discipline, and I'm not inspired to do this anymore.
00:42:08.860 Like those seem gray. I think for some people, what distinctions would you make there?
00:42:15.200 Yeah. It just goes back to why you're doing it. The greater, the greater purpose. I mean,
00:42:22.380 that's right. So for example, this morning, uh, I, let me back up over the past four days. My wife has
00:42:32.480 had five of her girlfriends here from Southern Utah out to Maine. They're doing their thing,
00:42:36.920 having a great time for the weekend. So I've had the kids on my own for since, uh, Friday. So
00:42:42.820 Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and yesterday, Monday. Um, I got backed up on work, like really backed up
00:42:48.980 specifically on emails. So I get into the, into the office, my office this morning and I look at my
00:42:54.760 emails and I've got over a hundred emails. Do you think in my mind, I was like, Oh man, I'm really
00:43:00.600 excited about getting to all these emails. I get so motivated to get to these emails and answer
00:43:05.700 everybody that wants to pull on me for their attention. Of course not. Did I do it? You bet.
00:43:10.960 I think I've got eight now, maybe 15 based on how long a call has been. I've got eight to 15 emails
00:43:17.640 in my inbox out of a hundred plus emails. I didn't want to do it. So why did I do it? Because I know
00:43:24.180 it needs to be done and it moves me towards where I'm trying to go. I'm still motivated. I'm still
00:43:31.260 inspired by the vision, the work, the movement that what we're doing here. Yeah. So I do think
00:43:39.500 things that I don't want to do because I realized that's what needs to be done. Now, if I wasn't
00:43:44.380 inspired by the mission and the purpose and the cause, and then I get there and there's all these
00:43:49.400 emails about it. Yeah. Probably time to at least consider moving on and evolving in some way,
00:43:56.240 but I'm not there yet. And same thing with working out. I don't want to work out every day. This
00:44:01.620 morning when I woke up, I woke up at five o'clock this morning, I texted my, uh, jujitsu training
00:44:06.740 partner. And I'm like, Hey dude, are you going, you still plan on going in this morning? I was hoping,
00:44:12.240 you're hoping you would say no. I was like, please say no, please say no, please say no.
00:44:17.760 Two minutes later, get an email back. Yep. I'll see you there. Shit.
00:44:21.220 So I got changed, went to the gym, we trained. It's a great training session. Not my best, but good.
00:44:31.200 I didn't want to do it, but I realized it's good for me. And I realized it moves the needle and gets
00:44:36.320 me in the right direction and gets my day started off. Right. And so there I was because there's still
00:44:42.660 value in it to me, even though the activity may not be in the moment, something I want to necessarily
00:44:46.680 engage in. Copy. Justin Finney, how does one deal with an untrustworthy person? I work as an engineer
00:44:55.700 with the small team in which we all need to count on one another. Currently I have a team member that
00:45:00.520 has been attempting to backdoor fellow coworkers and actively tries to get members in trouble
00:45:06.920 with the company, or at least make them look incompetent. He has been with the company a long
00:45:12.760 time. So even with issues with him are brought up, they are usually shrugged off. I have distanced
00:45:18.260 myself from this individual as well as learn to choose what I say wisely around him. But I just want
00:45:23.960 to make some ideas on how to move past this each day since we work close proximity and the environment
00:45:29.940 he creates makes us uneasy daily. Yeah. I think he's handling it correctly by distancing himself and
00:45:36.480 being careful. That's, that's something that's very, very important that you would do. Um, I would
00:45:42.200 also say maybe there's an opportunity to make this guy an ally that you've overlooked. I don't, I don't
00:45:47.000 know, but there might be some opportunities where you can actually get this guy on your side and he
00:45:51.680 becomes an ally for you and stops throwing you specifically maybe under the bus. So what does that
00:45:57.580 look like by helping the guy win? If he wins, you win, you know, maybe he's driven by ego. And if you
00:46:02.940 know that then, okay, well maybe feed it a little bit and then you get the mission done and everything's
00:46:09.280 well. And then guess what? You're recognized as the guy that can work well with John when nobody else
00:46:13.180 can. Yeah. And do you end up protecting your team by making this guy an ally? You do that'll help the
00:46:20.920 other team members. So you removing yourself entirely from circumstance leads them out to dry with the,
00:46:27.960 with the wrath of the back door dude. Right. Uh, the other thing that you could do, I don't know,
00:46:34.420 like the authority and the hierarchy of how this works in this dynamic necessarily, but let's say
00:46:39.040 you are responsible to some capacity of handing out assignments and making sure that all of this gets
00:46:43.360 done. Uh, you could just distract him. And what I mean by that is just give them things that are,
00:46:51.520 have to get done, but maybe you're a trivial or just non integral to the mission itself. So he doesn't
00:46:56.700 have a whole lot of inner workings into all the other little nuances that need to be dealt with
00:47:02.260 that are more pressing. That's one thought. Um, I would also, if that's not you, then play the game,
00:47:10.400 the politics. So I would make whoever that responsibility is, I would make him my ally.
00:47:16.020 Right. So Kip, if you and I are working and you're the supervisor and you're responsible for handing out
00:47:20.500 assignments and making sure that the job is done completely, and I'm on the same level level as this
00:47:25.180 other guy, then I don't want him to be an ally to you at the expense of me. I want to be your ally.
00:47:32.600 Yeah. So what can I do to help you win? Because now as you're divvying out assignments and worrying
00:47:37.600 about things and this other guy comes to you and says, Hey, Ryan guy, you're like, what is this guy
00:47:41.780 talking about? Like you need to be so good at your job that nobody would believe anything to the
00:47:46.700 counter. Yeah. Because now I'm your ally, you and I are close. And so when this guy comes over and
00:47:53.820 says, Hey, Ryan's doing a crappy job, you're like, okay, got it. And now you recognize him as the rat
00:47:58.620 because you know how I really handle my business. Yeah. There's some, there's, those are different
00:48:04.820 strategies based on the dynamic, but I think maybe some of those will help. Totally. I think there's
00:48:10.860 some strategy around the after action review as part of the work that you're doing. So let me give
00:48:16.520 you guys an example. When we complete a project with a client, we do an after action review.
00:48:22.100 Thanks to you, Ryan and the iron council, by the way, this is worked itself into my job.
00:48:27.960 So we do a review of the project. What went well, what did not work well? What do we need to continue
00:48:33.220 doing? Exactly. Etc. Everybody that was involved in that project has input on that. So in that
00:48:41.220 scenario, if someone's going to throw someone else on the, under the bus in regards to that project,
00:48:45.740 I would hear it during the after action review and I'm okay accepting it, but guess what? I'm also
00:48:51.480 going to do, I'm going to ask the other team member, what was your take on this? How did it go?
00:48:56.560 And I'm getting his input and we're all, it's all out on the table. Does it make sense? And the
00:49:01.920 communication is clear. That's going to add some pressure on guys to be clear and succinct and
00:49:06.600 kind of be able to back up their comments because I'm going to dig into them. Like, well, what do you
00:49:12.320 mean? Like what happened specifically? And in the same token, I'm going to hear the other guy's point of
00:49:16.920 view as part of the after action view that creates an environment of transparency. And what I really
00:49:22.100 have loved about this is it allows us for extreme ownership because what has happened over the past
00:49:27.760 few months is when I get on there and then something will come up, yeah, we could have improved in that
00:49:32.340 area. And then I hear a guy go, yeah, that's on me. I think I could have done this. And then what do I
00:49:37.140 hear the next guy say? No, not entirely. I, you know, I could have done this as well. And I'm
00:49:41.400 thinking, Oh, I love this. This is perfect because now we're all in a space of growth. And so just
00:49:48.500 another strategy to kind of help nullify the poor communication, put it on the table and let everyone
00:49:53.980 actually communicate clearly after action review. That or set up a boxing ring at the, uh, at the office
00:50:02.440 and say, whoever wins wins ready. Yeah. Or mats, just get some mats out, get some mats. Let's get
00:50:08.780 this aggression out. Yeah. It'd be like uprising. All right. Go after each other. I actually do. I
00:50:14.760 actually do like that idea. I like that idea a lot. It's probably too much liability there though.
00:50:19.920 Unfortunately, unfortunately. All right. Phil Reese weaklings. I'd be curious to hear your ideas on
00:50:27.200 consumerism and the effect it has on men. Oh man. Consumer is a plague. You what? I don't think
00:50:35.580 we've ever had this question. No, I don't think I actually addressed that this morning. I think it's
00:50:40.620 on YouTube. Yeah. I put a video on YouTube about, uh, what did I call it? Um, the process of elimination.
00:50:48.040 Okay. So utilizing. Yeah. Like something along the lines of like utilizing utilization or elimination to,
00:50:55.540 um, to, to achieve more, something along those lines. That's that actually ties in nicely to what
00:51:02.040 he's talking about because consumerism is an issue. I mean, it is, it is absolutely ridiculous. We've
00:51:07.640 consumed ourselves. My wife and I were having this conversation just yesterday when we were talking
00:51:11.460 about having the house, which is bigger than we had before and having all the land. And although it's
00:51:16.480 very nice, like in many ways, it's like an additional little handcuff to what we're doing. Right. I've got
00:51:21.080 all these, these tools, like we have the zero turn mower and we have the tractor. And I'm like,
00:51:25.340 man, these are nice tools to have, except for you have to take them into the shop and get them
00:51:29.420 serviced and spend money on them and buy fuel for them. And so every time that we consume,
00:51:34.800 we tie ourselves to that consumption. Think about it on the context of food. Like if you over consume
00:51:42.140 food or the wrong types of food, you tie yourself to the consequence of that, that, that, uh,
00:51:47.400 consumption, right? You're going to get fatter essentially, and you're going to be out of
00:51:51.800 shape. And eventually if it gets bad enough, you might even contract some medical condition or
00:51:55.800 illness like diabetes, right? So what you're doing is every time you consume, you can't separate the
00:52:01.560 consumption from the, the result of the consumption. Now, sometimes it makes sense because you have to
00:52:08.700 look at it from my financial advisor side talking, you have to look at it like a, like a cost benefit
00:52:13.940 analysis, right? So if I look at, for example, my computer, that was a consumptive purchase,
00:52:20.040 right? I consumed and they bought something else to have and consume and own, but the cost of
00:52:27.140 ownership, which is getting internet for it and, you know, and the price tag on it. And then if
00:52:33.300 something goes wrong with it, and then I have to get the, the, uh, antivirus software and all that
00:52:38.580 kind of stuff, right? That's the cost assumption and the energy, just the energy of owning something
00:52:45.300 eats up, right? There's a cost learning, you know, because I got a Mac, like learning the new
00:52:49.840 keys and learning the new system, right? So I went from PC to Mac. I know that's maybe a little
00:52:54.600 taboo in your world, but people making fun of you for owning a Mac and their social consequences.
00:53:00.180 Exactly. Exactly. So those are the costs. Now the benefit is we get to do a podcast and we put it out
00:53:09.140 to hundreds of thousands and millions of people across the planet. They're impacted by the work
00:53:14.460 we're doing. I find me meaning and value in that. Uh, I get to send emails to friends and business
00:53:21.420 partnerships and people that I care about. So that's, that's the benefit. So cost benefit analysis,
00:53:27.840 but I think when it comes to consumerism, you should get, this is a personal preference.
00:53:35.480 You should get the bare minimum needed to fulfill the job requirement. This is why I'm not a car guy
00:53:44.960 is I just don't care about cars. If I bought a $250,000 Lamborghini and I don't, if that's what,
00:53:53.140 I don't even know if that's what, let's just say that's the cost of them versus a $40,000 truck.
00:53:59.420 I think I bought my truck for 35 grand. Like they both go 70 miles an hour on the freeway. Like I
00:54:06.240 can't go faster on the freeway unless I'm in Utah and then I can go 80, maybe 90. If I'm willing to
00:54:12.420 push it, you're not going to go any faster, whether you do it in a Lamborghini or a five-year-old GMC,
00:54:18.620 a three quarter ton. Yeah. So to me, no brainer. Now I'm not saying you shouldn't buy a car. A good
00:54:26.340 friend of mine, Andy Frisilla, he loves cars. The cost benefit analysis for him works out.
00:54:33.240 I look at it and say, that doesn't work for me. I can spend money here and here and here and do that
00:54:37.060 there and consume in these other ways that is much more meaningful to me. And you know what? Neither
00:54:41.000 of us are wrong. It's just whatever you're willing to do. So, but that said, over consumption is an
00:54:47.960 issue. Yeah. I really an issue because most people don't think about the cost associated with
00:54:52.680 consumption. Yeah. And it's also one other thing too. Sorry, I keep interrupting you. No,
00:54:57.700 you're fine. It's the difference between a boy and a man. So think about this. A boy
00:55:06.240 consumes more than he produces. Period. My 11 year old, my eight year old, my three year old,
00:55:15.700 they, they cost money. I have to buy them clothes. I have to feed them. They break things around
00:55:21.820 the house. I have to keep them somewhat comfortable when it comes to temperature. So we need to warm
00:55:26.840 the house. Like they they're expensive and they're not adding anything. I should, I'm trying to word
00:55:36.040 this in the right way. It's not that they're not adding anything. It's that they're not producing
00:55:39.960 value that offsets that cost in a way, if that makes sense. Right now, flip it around. A man
00:55:49.140 produces more than he consumes. I, I have abundance. Therefore I can serve myself and other people
00:55:56.180 because if I didn't have abundance, I couldn't serve men of the iron council. I couldn't serve
00:56:01.500 my kids. I couldn't serve my wife. If I wasn't abundant in, in some resource, whether that's time,
00:56:08.380 attention, energy, money. So a man naturally produces more than he consumes a child, a boy,
00:56:17.980 on the other hand, consumes more than he produces. I love that time for a family home evening about
00:56:27.440 consumption and producing, I think in the source household. I mean, that's, I even think about it
00:56:34.320 with money. Like the major problem with one of the major problems with marriages is financial issues.
00:56:40.920 And one of the biggest problems with finances, personal finances is people over consume. They
00:56:46.540 spend more than they make, which is why they have 10, 20, 40, 50, a hundred thousand dollars worth of,
00:56:52.360 uh, with, uh, personal debt that are over consuming. That's a problem because there's a huge cost that
00:56:58.880 comes with it. Five, 10, 20% interest, not to mention the stress and the agony of knowing you've
00:57:07.000 got this thing hanging over your head and how effective can you be? If all you're thinking
00:57:12.800 about is paying your mortgage and you know, you can't make your mortgage. You're not going to be
00:57:16.760 as effective with your wife or your kids, not nearly effective as at work because you're stressed
00:57:20.840 out. Yeah. And your abundance of pres being present to them is affected because the cost of that
00:57:28.040 is eating up mental capacity and stress and all kinds of other stuff. Right. They, um, just to
00:57:35.900 share, right. Listening to you, what I, what's, what's present for me is having that conversation
00:57:41.720 with my boys about the importance of what it looks like from boy to man in the space of consumption,
00:57:48.460 um, and producing. And as, as they get older, we're creating these environments for them to produce
00:57:56.440 more. So they start understanding that like, I need to pull my weight. And because ultimately to
00:58:02.460 your point is you can't serve anybody if you don't have, uh, if you're not producing anything and
00:58:08.300 you're consuming more than you produce. And so I like that dialogue having with the, with a young
00:58:13.940 man, the, about the importance of taking on more responsibility and providing more value to the
00:58:18.680 family, whether it's, you know, doing chores or, you know what I mean? Pulling their own weight,
00:58:22.580 uh, in the environment or paying for their own gas and their own vehicle and those kinds of things.
00:58:26.180 So I really liked that. The, the one thing I was going to add is before you interrupted me,
00:58:30.580 like, like four times, I think. Yeah. I'm about to interrupt you again. Hold on one second. Cause
00:58:36.260 let me share this. I'm just kidding. Go ahead. Uh, essentialism. I do have something to share.
00:58:40.960 I'll share it. Okay. Essentialism by Greg McEwen. I think this is a really good book in this space.
00:58:46.440 It, it little, it leans in the direction a little bit more about your energy and how having a lot of
00:58:53.580 things eats up a lot of time and resources. And that more is kind of less is, is kind of his tagline.
00:58:59.660 Uh, but it's a really good resource for, for this conversation. Absolutely. And Greg's actually
00:59:04.940 been on the podcast, so you can check that out as well. Yeah. By the way, if I reference a book,
00:59:09.640 it's a given that he's been on the podcast. Cause it's kind of like, I think I've told you this.
00:59:13.780 The podcast is my, is my Amazon book shopping list typically. So that's funny.
00:59:19.620 Somebody had posted something on YouTube and they said, I love this. I both love this video and hate
00:59:24.780 it. I love it. And that the information is going to give a lot of resources. I hate it. And that I
00:59:28.140 need to go buy five, buy five new books. Yeah, that's true. But books are way cheaper than
00:59:32.940 everything else. So yeah, for sure. Well, and not only that cost benefit analysis, right? You're
00:59:37.920 consuming, right? It's a consumption process. So now you have more books on the bookshelf that you need
00:59:42.620 space for and everything else and time to read it and whatnot. But the idea is that it'll produce
00:59:47.080 more than it consumes. Yeah. Um, what was I going to say? I was going to say, uh, Oh yeah. So what I
00:59:55.800 was going to share is that basically we're, we're, we should be leveraging. That's what men should be
01:00:01.960 working on is how do we leverage ourselves? Right? So for example, if you're making a hundred dollars an
01:00:07.620 hour, you should be constantly figuring out how to be able to make $200 an hour through the leverage
01:00:13.260 of your time, energy, attention, your time should be worth more because you know more, you should be
01:00:17.940 able to hire somebody to do the menial tasks. So you don't have to do it. So you can focus on the
01:00:21.240 high value tasks, but we should always, always be leveraging. And when a boy learns how to leverage,
01:00:26.960 that's when he's starting to transition over to man. Cause one, one unit equals one unit when you're a
01:00:33.000 boy, right? One unit of energy or consumption. But when you're a man, one unit equals two or three
01:00:38.780 or four or five, because you know how to use the tools effectively. So there's a great quote
01:00:42.960 by a Thomas Carlyle and I pulled it up. So I wouldn't butcher it. He says, man is a tool using
01:00:48.880 animal without tools. He is nothing with tools. He is all. So that's what separates us as men. Now
01:00:56.380 in the context of tools, we might be thinking about, you know, like actual tools, but it could be
01:01:02.180 books. It could be computer programs. It could be specialized information that you have access to
01:01:09.180 or that you don't. These are the tools at your disposal in order to leverage yourself. And as
01:01:13.880 Thomas Carlyle says, become all through the use of that leverage. Which by the way, also makes you a
01:01:22.120 better jujitsu tacticianer. Just thought I'd throw that in there. Leverage. Leverage. All right.
01:01:28.820 All right. Shane Hill. I'm a public high school woodshop teacher in a title one school. What are
01:01:34.440 some bite-sized lessons you would teach to the fatherless masses? Accountability.
01:01:42.680 Accountability. To yourself or to themselves. To themselves. Personal. I should say personal
01:01:50.480 accountability. Because I think that is something that men are good teachers of. Attaching consequence
01:01:57.900 to actions. Right? And if we don't ever learn how to do that, then we think life is consequence free.
01:02:05.120 Which is bad on both sides of the thing. Right? If you don't, if you don't think there's consequences
01:02:10.380 for your actions, let's take both sides of it. If you don't think there's consequences for negative
01:02:14.660 actions, you're going to do more dumb shit. Yeah. If you don't think there's positive beneficial
01:02:21.120 consequences for doing positive beneficial work, you're not going to do positive beneficial work
01:02:26.840 because it requires effort. And why would you do that if there's no reward? So we have to teach our
01:02:34.280 boys accountability by tying the consequence. And I think men are generally better at this.
01:02:40.540 Right? Think about it from this context. You're a five-year-old. He's learning how to ride his bike.
01:02:47.500 And he's riding down the thing. And you're pushing him on the back. And you let go. Mom's out there
01:02:53.000 cheering him on. You're out there cheering him on. He hits the stop sign. False consequence to that.
01:03:00.260 Or at least the consequence is not really going to serve that child in life because nobody in life is
01:03:07.480 going to come rescue you. Dad, however, says, yeah, that probably hurts. Maybe next time don't run into
01:03:14.020 the stop sign by doing it this way. And then he teaches the kid that there's pain when you run
01:03:19.960 into the stop sign. There's pain when you don't do it correctly. So stop doing it incorrectly.
01:03:25.800 That's a man's job. That's a man's work. So if you're in an environment where you have an
01:03:31.100 opportunity to teach these boys who don't have father figures in their home, you probably ought to start
01:03:35.720 teaching them the value of attaching consequence to action. The default thing that most dads do
01:03:42.440 from a very natural perspective obviously would be missing in fatherless homes. I love that because
01:03:50.400 sometimes I've always wondered if that was a me thing or if that's a guy thing. And it's really
01:03:57.220 interesting because I'm sure you could come up with story after story between you and your wife about
01:04:03.620 accountability versus baby. And man, it's nuts. I can't count how many times like Kiave used to
01:04:09.660 struggle with getting up for school. She would run down there, wake him up, yell at him, you know,
01:04:13.980 get up here. You're going to be late. You're going to miss a bus or whatever. And then me on the other
01:04:18.220 hand is like, I'm not going to wake him up. What if he misses a bus? He's going to have to walk to
01:04:23.580 the middle school, which is like two miles away. It's just like our natural tendency is hers is to
01:04:30.140 wake him up and help him. Mine is like, let him, let him flander. And it's only going to take like
01:04:36.860 three times walking in the wintertime for him to go, yeah, I better get my ass out of bed because I
01:04:41.760 don't want to walk. Yeah. It's funny. Well, and I think too, you know, there's a lot of people that
01:04:48.280 say, a lot of guys will say, I don't understand women, right? You're not entirely supposed to,
01:04:52.600 otherwise you would be a woman. Well, women, I don't, I don't get, understand men, right?
01:04:59.480 Because we think differently than, than you do. So yeah, obviously we don't understand each other
01:05:04.280 entirely. So that, that would make sense. Um, you said that mom's baby, their children.
01:05:12.760 Nurturing gone to the extreme is baby. Yeah. Now what we do as men, whether you want to call it
01:05:21.300 accountability or toughing them up to the extreme is bullying, right? We have, we all know abusive men
01:05:26.200 who have abused their children physically, mentally, emotionally. They think they, they justify it by
01:05:31.380 saying that they're just toughening up their kids. Well, there's a line. Yeah. There's a line where
01:05:37.560 toughening becomes bullying. There's a line where nurturing becomes babying. So this is why men and
01:05:42.700 women are so good together. Cause when you're turning into a bully and you will Kip, just like I
01:05:47.000 will, mom's there to say, Hey, take it easy. And when she turns into babying, Hey, stop babying him.
01:05:56.200 Yeah. We keep each other in check. That's the point of having a mom and a dad in the picture.
01:06:02.160 Yeah. And it's good. Like that. They're different. It's right. It's right. All right. Let's take one
01:06:08.320 more. One more. All right. Chris, uh, Chris Rice. I'm about 45 days into my battle plan and struggling
01:06:16.060 to stay motivated. I know that it takes 60 to 90 days until a habit is formed. What are some tips to
01:06:22.960 staying motivated until the habit is formed? I don't know if I buy this 45 to 60 day thing. I don't.
01:06:31.320 Um, because if you're not motivated about it or at least disciplined about it, or at least tied to
01:06:38.760 some reason why you should do it. And in 60 days or 90 days or whatever the magical number is,
01:06:45.440 you're going to reject it. That's why people who lose weight so they can have the beach body. Once
01:06:52.340 they go on the vacation that, and it's over, then they put the weight back on. And a lot of times
01:06:57.000 they put more on because, you know, they may have been disciplined for 90 days, but it was only for
01:07:01.760 that reason. Yeah. They splurge after. Right. And, and once the reason is gone, it's stripped away.
01:07:07.280 It's like, Oh, okay. I look, I do the same thing. If I have an event coming up or, or, or I don't
01:07:13.720 know, podcast appearance or something or, or, or, uh, some sort of physical event, like a marathon or a,
01:07:20.220 or a 5k, whatever I can be, I can be disciplined for a long time to get myself in check and my body
01:07:27.180 right. And my nutrition on point and get strong. But when that goes away, it's much more tempting
01:07:31.880 to neglect the gym and neglect the training and neglect everything else that you've worked so
01:07:35.420 hard to accomplish. So the reason I say this is because you, you may have lost sight of your,
01:07:43.180 your vision, right? You may have lost, lost what that means to you. So reconnect either establish
01:07:51.260 it. If you haven't done that yet, a lot of people just overlook the vision component. We're not robots.
01:07:56.740 Like we're not do this, this, this, this, this, and this, and this, that would be awesome. Except for
01:08:03.320 it just, that's not how we operate. We're not robots. We're human beings. So we have to be motivated.
01:08:09.320 We have to be inspired. We have to have visions that lead us towards, towards doing something that
01:08:14.600 we normally wouldn't do. So establish the vision or reestablish the vision. If you've lost sight of
01:08:21.880 it and maybe make some adjustments, you know, maybe, maybe the reason you're not doing it is
01:08:27.600 because you don't see the value of it tied to your vision. Maybe you don't have a vision at all.
01:08:31.060 But I think if you get to that point, uh, then you need to do some soul searching on why you're not
01:08:35.720 feeling as motivated anymore and do something to, to tweak that, to change that. And then of course,
01:08:39.820 there's the discipline thing. Of course, that's important. Eliminating temptations, reducing what
01:08:45.780 I call the friction for new habits. One, just as an example is going to the gym. Friction is up and
01:08:53.240 having to program a workout. That's friction. That would keep you from going to the gym. It has me.
01:08:59.380 Another thing of friction is minor as it sounds for anybody who goes to the gym all the time
01:09:03.240 is not having your clothes ready to go in the morning. That sounds silly, but that's friction
01:09:09.260 because then you have to get up and you're like, okay, what am I going to wear? Oh, it's dark and
01:09:13.720 I want to wake up my wife. I got to get my socks, but I don't have, I can't find matching socks.
01:09:17.260 Friction. So eliminate and remove the friction. In this case, get the workout clothes out the night
01:09:24.000 before. Program your workout the night before. Get your pre-workouts and your supplements or
01:09:29.100 whatever you're going to take out the night before. Have an accountability partner like I had this
01:09:35.980 morning with training who's like, yep, I'll see you there. Eliminated friction. That's what you need
01:09:40.560 to do to maintain the discipline as long as you have that vision in place. Yeah. And about that vision,
01:09:45.900 it's about getting present. And we've talked about this, the character of the stick. Get present to one
01:09:51.520 of those. Get present to the value and the benefit of why you're doing what you're doing. Get present
01:09:57.420 to the value of your vision or get present to the impact of it. You know, some, some people are
01:10:03.980 motivated more by the impact than the benefit, but whatever it is, you need to get kind of fired up
01:10:09.120 about that vision. So you understand where these tactics and objectives play within that overall
01:10:14.720 purpose and goal. That's the power of the secret, right? The vision boards. In my opinion, the benefit
01:10:21.080 of that vision board is you looking at the photo, reminding you of the vision. It's a, it's a
01:10:26.240 graphical representation of the vision. So, and hopefully that caused you, well, not hopefully that
01:10:32.260 should cause you to action if you automatically have a battle plan in place, but, but that's the
01:10:36.640 concept is being present to it. And then maybe have some tactics around how do you remind yourself
01:10:41.560 yourself of that vision on a regular basis is incorporated part of your morning routine or part
01:10:47.380 of your journaling process, whatever it is, you need to be present to that vision. And then guys
01:10:52.680 within the iron council, we talk about holding each other accountable. You want to hold someone
01:10:58.140 accountable, hold them accountable to the vision, right? If I give, I give Ryan shit for not doing
01:11:06.280 his tactic around his physical wellbeing, that's not that powerful, but if it's accountability to,
01:11:12.960 because I understand his vision and how that will play a part in his life and his family,
01:11:18.360 that's a different story, right? That's what we're holding people accountable to is there is who
01:11:24.800 they're capable of becoming right through the tactic and the objectives that they've set for
01:11:29.740 themselves. Yes, sir. Yeah. Great stuff. Absolutely. Yeah. So to learn more about that
01:11:37.940 conversation really on, on a day-to-day basis around tactics and holding each other accountable
01:11:44.160 and visions. And all of this is really part of the experience of being within the iron council,
01:11:50.320 our, our exclusive brotherhood. You can learn more at order of man.com slash iron council. Of
01:11:56.320 course, these questions we filled today, most of them came from the Facebook group, Ryan,
01:11:59.940 you mentioned this earlier, facebook.com slash group slash order of man, subscribe to the podcast.
01:12:05.600 This episode of the podcast is as well as many others, maybe almost everything is now getting pushed
01:12:12.140 up to Facebook. So join us on, uh, you, I mean, youtube.com slash order of man, or subscribe to
01:12:19.420 the Facebook and you can follow Mr. Mickler on Twitter and Instagram at Ryan Mickler. You want to
01:12:26.480 give us an update on events? You probably have the latest count in regards to legacy. And I don't think
01:12:31.780 I have the latest, uh, main event is probably close. I imagine if we have spots at all, we only have two or
01:12:37.200 three spots left. So if you want to be one of those people, then man, jump on it right now. Uh, legacy,
01:12:42.520 we still have spots on that. I think we're about, I don't know, 30, 40% full on that. Uh, it's a
01:12:46.360 father son event. It's June 11th through the 14th here in Maine, uh, for you and your son, uh, between
01:12:53.800 the eight or, or I should say you and your son, it could be your young man. Yeah. It could be an,
01:12:59.080 a nephew, which we've had guys out before. Um, or somebody that, you know, you have some sort of
01:13:04.340 mentorship, whatever, whatever that looks like June 11th through the 14th. That's, uh, the legacy
01:13:09.200 father son event. Um, and you can go to order man.com slash legacy, plenty of spots on that,
01:13:14.120 but I wouldn't wait too long on that either. So that's it. Anything else? We good. All right.
01:13:19.260 I think we're good. All right, guys. Uh, good questions today. Got a lot to go through. We got,
01:13:23.880 uh, philosophical. We went down the dark side of things for, for some of these things as well. Um,
01:13:28.540 I thought it was good, great conversation, great questions. Looking forward to doing this again next
01:13:32.620 week. And of course on Friday for the Friday field notes. Uh, but until then go out there,
01:13:37.060 take action and become the man you are meant to be. Thank you for listening to the order of man
01:13:41.540 podcast. You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.
01:13:46.320 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.