UFC LEGEND JIM MILLER ｜ Life as a Fighter
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 7 minutes
Words per Minute
186.55153
Summary
Jim Miller has been in the UFC for 16 years. He has a fight record of 37-18-1 and holds the record for the most total wins in UFC history. In addition to his incredible career, Jim is a married, father of 4, and an outdoor enthusiast. He s an outdoor hunting and fishing enthusiast and I believe one of the most solid men you ll ever meet.
Transcript
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Most men have never been in a fight in their life, or at most, a handful.
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So what does it take to enter the octagon and make a 16-year career, and counting, of
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administering and receiving the brunt end of physical violence?
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It's something my guest today, UFC legend Jim Miller, has done, and he's brought us
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so many incredible moments in the world of professional MMA.
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Today, Jim and I talk about what it takes to fight for a living and why he believes
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We cover some of the highs and lows of his career, including his debilitating battle
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with Lyme disease and also his recovery, how he shapes his training atmosphere for maximum
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results, how to win and lose with class and grace, ensuring he never puts himself into
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the victim role, and also his immense respect for men who step into the cage with him.
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You live life to the fullest, embrace your fears, and boldly chart your own path.
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When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time, every time.
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You are not easily deterred or defeated, rugged, resilient, strong.
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At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.
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Gentlemen, welcome to the Order of Man podcast.
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I'm the host and the founder of this movement that has been going strong for over nine years
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now, and I just want to first and foremost say thank you for tuning in.
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Thank you for sticking with me and this movement through the highs and lows of the past nearly
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If you are brand new to what we're doing here, I interview incredible men.
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We've got Jim Miller on the podcast, Jocko Willink, Tim Tebow, Tim Kennedy, David Goggins,
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Chris Williamson, Matthew McConaughey, Terry Crews.
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We have so many incredible men who have joined in some capacity to share and impart their wisdom
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with us, and it's my job to ask them interesting, unique, and powerful questions so that we can
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learn from each other, and that's what this movement is all about, banding together, working
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together as men all over the country for the betterment of ourselves and the people we love
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So I'm very excited for this conversation, long time in the works, with a very good man,
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Before I get to that, I want to mention a friend and show sponsor, also a friend of Jim's.
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00:03:14.960
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00:03:26.040
All right, man, let me introduce you to my guest.
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He talks a little bit about in this podcast why his nickname is A10.
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He has a fight record of 37, 18, and 1, which makes him the UFC holder of the most fights
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He is also the only man to fight in UFC 100, 200, and 300.
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So his resilience and longevity is second to none.
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In addition to his incredible career, Jim is a married family man of four children.
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He's an outdoor and hunting fishing enthusiast, and I believe one of the most solid men you'll
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Technical difficulties, but such is the way of life, right?
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You shared some really cool stuff with me, and I caught probably, I don't know, 35% of it.
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I live in the middle of the woods, so I never know if it's my connection to the internet or
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So yeah, it's a pain living out here sometimes.
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You know, most people don't think or know that there are some rural parts of New Jersey
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Most people think of lower Manhattan when they start thinking about that area, but there
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Yeah, the Appalachian Trail is like two miles that way.
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He actually over, I want to say three to four years, hiked the entire Appalachian Trail
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So he would take one summer, and he'd spend a month or two, and he'd hike part of it,
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and then the next summer, another two months, and another two months, and another two months.
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And so I was in Maine up until about a year ago, and unfortunately, that's the northernmost
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Unfortunately, I never took advantage of the opportunity to be out there and hike that.
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So the way we let off the conversation last time before anybody had the opportunity to
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hear what we were talking about because of these technical difficulties is, as I was going
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through, we've known each other for some time now, but as I was going through what I wanted
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to talk with you about, the nickname A10 really stood out to me.
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And, obviously, the Warthog is a fan favorite among men, but I'm very curious as to why
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you chose that nickname for your fight nickname.
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Well, you know, the name Jim Miller, it's kind of vanilla, right?
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So, you know, I fought for years without a nickname, and I was finally like, you know,
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like, let me try to, let's figure something out, right?
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And there's like 19 UFC fighters that are the pit bull and assassin and all this stuff.
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And, you know, when, when I was growing up, my, my uncle was a, he was a pilot in the Marine
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And he gave us, my brothers and I, a calendar with all the fighter jets in it.
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And I remember like the A10 was always my favorite, right?
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And, you know, as I grew older, the more I learned about it, I was like, man, this is
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like, you know, it's a, it's a gun they taught how to fly, essentially, right?
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And that's kind of the way that I feel about myself.
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You know, I'm, I'm, my, my athletic attributes are specifically for fighting, right?
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Like, I've got a horrible vertical, got a terrible arm.
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Like, there, there are lots of things that like, I, I get embarrassed doing, uh, when
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it, when it comes to sports, but you know, like I, I was built to be a fighter.
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And, and, uh, it, uh, I feel like it kind of works, you know, it's, uh, it's, uh, so, uh,
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uh, a little bit slower, you know, ugly looking plane.
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I had the, I had the opportunity to, to, to go see some, uh, recently when I was out in
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Vegas and yeah, you know, uh, a little off center, right?
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You said it, it's a plane built around a weapon.
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I've done a little bit of studying and cause it is an incredible machine and it really
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We're going to have a gun and then we got to figure out a way to get this thing up in
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Is there some, I want to say, did I see an article not too long ago about a revamp,
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I don't know if you know anything about this, but I thought I saw a revamp of the eight
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Everything that I've heard is that they're trying to like, uh, decommission it in the
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Uh, which again, it seems like it's kind of, uh, you know, I'm getting older, right?
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This is the planes that I got to see were, you know, just as old as I am essentially.
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And they're trying to, trying to make it retire.
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Uh, you know, in some aspects of it, yeah, I got, I got called, uh, the grandpa of the
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And I'm like, is this, is this somebody that like I beat up on the wrestling mats and then
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became a, uh, a journalist that's, that's writing this.
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Well, look, if you end up fighting again and we can talk a little bit about that, but I think
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you ought to change that nickname to grandpa, Jim, grandpa Miller and go kick his ass.
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How many more, how many more professional fights do you have left in you?
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Uh, a few, a few, you know, it, it, for me, it's, it's not necessarily about the fights.
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You know, this fight, I, I took a little bit damage, right?
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I, I probably got the worst cut that I've ever gotten.
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You know, I got 23 stitches, but then I broke my hand and, and my, uh, my toe in the fight
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and, you know, in the grand scheme of things, pretty mild injuries, uh, compared to what
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can happen, but, um, probably some of the worst, you know, uh, injuries that I've had
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Um, but like, for me, it's all about the training camp, right?
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Like if I can get through training camps, get into shape, be prepared, uh, and then perform,
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um, you know, I'm going to, I'm going to continue to do it, uh, at least for a few more.
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And, um, that's, that's really what it comes down to.
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You know, this, this camp was, was, uh, not bad, you know, like it's definitely harder
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for me to, to, to fight, you know, two times in three months, uh, nowadays, but, um, camp
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Uh, you know, I, I didn't, I didn't perform, um, but, uh, yeah, like I, I, I feel like it
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I had, I had some opportunities, uh, you know, even hurt and bleeding.
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I, I, I rocked them a couple of times and, and, um, yeah, like, uh, we'll, we'll get a
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few more in there and, um, you know, I kind of put it out there.
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Like, I don't want to fight any more than 50 times in the UFC, which is a, a ridiculous
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Uh, but that's another six fights, um, you know, two years if I'm, if I'm fighting the
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way that, you know, at the pace that I want to fight.
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But I have your record at your professional record anyways, at 37, 18 and one.
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So you're, so your goal, if I understand you correctly is to hit 50 fights in the UFC.
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Yeah, that's, uh, it's a, you know, it's going to be a lofty one.
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You know, it's, it's, it'll be a little bit tough, but, uh, uh, I like, I like putting
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those types of goals that like, they're not easy, right?
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So, uh, yeah, we'll, we'll see if we can get it done.
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And, uh, yeah, if everything goes the way it's been going the last couple of years, I
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You're the first person to fight in 100, 200 and 300.
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You said two weeks later, you know, no homo here, but you look, you look unbelievable.
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You know, uh, I've always been a pretty quick healer, right?
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So, uh, like even to the point where like my hand is broken, but they didn't cast it.
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Like I went to the hand specialist the other day and he's like, yeah, no, it's, it's healing
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But like, he's like, yeah, the way I, I guess the way I broke it, it kind of crushed
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in and, and, uh, it's not, it's not going anywhere unless I do something really bad, like
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So is the secret genetics and physiology, or is there some secret?
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Cause I see guys like Chandler and other people.
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I'm like, how the hell does this guy recover in a matter of three, four, five days where
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Uh, I honestly, I do think that it's, uh, we all, we all must share some, some type of
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Because to, to be able to go through training camps over and over again and take the, take
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the beating that you put on yourself, you have to be able to recover quickly.
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And I think that if you, if you didn't have that ability, you would probably not get too
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far into your career, um, you know, fighting it, fighting at the highest level.
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So, um, yeah, I, I think that there are a lot of guys that seem to have the same, like,
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uh, you know, Wolverine style, uh, healing factor.
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Um, but, uh, yeah, like it's, uh, you know, like the, the whole career thing, right.
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And like 44 fights in UFC, there's, there's, there's a lot of genetics and, and, and luck
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And, and, uh, you know, there's definitely design, right?
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Like I, I try not to make the same mistakes twice and I'm actually, you know, uh, I pay
00:13:54.340
attention to it and I, and I'm, and I'm, uh, very hard on myself, you know, uh, so, so I
00:14:01.080
So, um, yeah, I, I think that, uh, you know, being, being born to the parents that I was
00:14:09.420
born to is, it definitely helped me, uh, along the way here.
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So, so you said a word, you said luck and, and whenever, but anybody that says that I,
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I, I kind of cringe internally, but you're talking about who you're born to, immutable
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characteristics, people you were born to, things you had no control over.
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You're not talking about like, I'm just a lucky dude.
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You're just saying, Hey, I was, I was born in America.
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I've gotten some good genes that are built for fighting.
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Cause I don't generally like that word luck because people ascribe hard work to luck and
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it discounts what a guy like you has to go through in order to play at the level you play
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You know, uh, the, the thing is I've, I've, I've lived this life for what is it?
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Uh, it'll be, it'll be 19 years, uh, in like a few weeks.
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That, that I started training to, to compete in MMA.
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Um, and I have seen a lot of very talented, very athletic fighters just have one bad day
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You know, and, and like the, I, I know that there is like, like, yeah, like I don't, I'm
00:15:27.880
And like the, cause like I said, there's, there's, there is design.
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There's design to the way that I've, I've, uh, created my life and I've, and I've created
00:15:37.000
Um, but to not, to not have one of those devastating injuries at practice, um, you know, like when
00:15:47.020
I wasn't doing all the right things, um, yeah, there, there, there probably is just a little
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Cause I, like I said, I've seen, I've seen one group sparring fall into another group and
00:16:00.700
And it's like, that's, it's controllable to a degree, right?
00:16:07.860
Uh, uh, fighters in the match should, it should have control over where they're, where they
00:16:12.060
are in relation to everybody else, because in a fight you need to be controlling in relation
00:16:19.800
Um, but it's also just bad luck sometimes where somebody just something, something bad
00:16:28.080
And, and, uh, yeah, like fortunately, you know, knock on wood that, uh, none of those
00:16:35.460
I think also, and look, I'm trying to do it justice and like, I don't, I, the luck thing,
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I'm, I'm a little hesitant about saying it, but I also know it's a law of large numbers.
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You know, I, I, um, I have the opportunity of, of being the quote unquote,
00:16:49.800
quote team photographer for my oldest son's lacrosse team.
00:16:53.040
And there's some kids who are naturally talented and they just get it.
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Their athletic IQ is developed relative to others.
00:17:02.380
Uh, there's other kids who I think are meant to, uh, pursue the arts and other kids who
00:17:11.380
Uh, so it's difficult because when we look at somebody performing at the highest levels
00:17:16.120
like you have, we think, oh, this guy's done everything right.
00:17:19.420
But also if we're looking at it, honestly, it is the law of large numbers and you, for
00:17:25.540
whatever reason, through physiology, through hard work, determination, mindset, et cetera,
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and maybe a little luck, like you're talking about have climbed through the ranks that other
00:17:41.540
Or when I hear you say that, I also feel like maybe I'm off, but I'm hearing a little bit
00:17:47.460
of like design as in the creator's design, but maybe I'm way off.
00:17:53.120
Um, I think it's, it's more so, uh, just by like me shaping my, uh, my training atmosphere,
00:18:02.820
Like, um, I, I started my own gym about 10 years ago.
00:18:10.820
Um, you know, we were dealing with some of the big gym drama and issues, uh, that, that,
00:18:24.940
Um, but I also really whittled things down to like, Hey, I don't have to worry about
00:18:31.640
some, some new guy that a lot of times, you know, doesn't speak English or, or doesn't
00:18:38.360
speak it very well and doesn't really get the culture of the gym.
00:18:41.420
And, and, um, it comes in and it's like, you sees a target on your back, you know, during
00:18:48.620
Um, you know, so like I, I kind of created an environment where, um, um, I was like,
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Um, definitely lost out on bodies and, and, and, uh, uh, skill sets and stuff like that.
00:19:04.620
But, um, yeah, just, just, uh, just making it not so like, not so like ego driven is what
00:19:14.040
Sometimes in these bigger gyms, you get a bunch of, you know, fighters in there and everybody's
00:19:18.900
trying to, uh, win that day as opposed to get everybody better.
00:19:24.640
Cause I've trained not, obviously not nearly to the degree that you have.
00:19:28.120
And I know that when things go well, it's because I go in there and experiment and learn
00:19:33.520
When things don't go well, it's cause I'm trying to submit somebody and, and I, I fall
00:19:39.960
I fall into things that I'm comfortable with and know, and I may not even train against
00:19:44.820
upper belts because I'm more worried about winning than I am about learning and growing.
00:19:48.920
Um, yeah, you know, it's, uh, it's a, it's a fine balance.
00:19:55.560
Like you have to, you have to train yourself and it's like that, that playful aspect, right?
00:20:02.400
That's where you're going to, uh, usually be like a lot, you know, uh, I mean, I don't
00:20:10.020
know if safer is the right word, but like, you're just kind of goofing off sometimes on
00:20:14.380
the mat and just, just, just working with new things.
00:20:16.840
And Rogan, Rogan always says like beat up blue belts, right?
00:20:19.500
That's how he, he, he thinks, uh, everybody should get better at jujitsu.
00:20:23.680
Um, and my whole thing was that I was always competing with my brother who's five inches
00:20:31.380
Uh, and he was always the guy that I was trying to beat, you know?
00:20:35.140
And like, we would go back and forth, you know, through the years of like, I'd have a good
00:20:39.280
couple of weeks and he didn't have a good couple of weeks and like, uh, you know, and
00:20:44.680
like over the years, I kind of figured out like, okay, like there, there are times where
00:20:48.240
I have to, um, where, you know, I, I have to focus on like, all right, what are my strengths?
00:20:54.400
I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm going to roll or I'm going to spar and I'm going to go
00:21:00.800
Um, and then there are times where it's like, Hey, like, let's just play.
00:21:03.980
And like, if you get submitted or you get caught in something and you get taken down this
00:21:07.880
and that like, whatever, like, we're just, we're just trying to learn new things, learn
00:21:14.180
And, uh, yeah, like it's, uh, having that, uh, having that playful mindset, it's, it's,
00:21:22.800
There's obviously the times to get, to get serious and get into it and to, you know, like,
00:21:27.540
like today we win, but you know, I have to learn how to balance that.
00:21:33.300
Man, I'm just going to step away from the conversation very briefly.
00:21:36.060
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I just returned from a trip to Maine to pick up and restock all of our shirts, hats, beanies,
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And I've received over the past 12 months, so many emails about when we're going to be restocking.
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My oldest son and I, we fulfill those orders, uh, ourselves.
00:22:20.580
We have conversations together and, uh, we're, we're doing the work with your support.
00:22:35.940
We tried to do part one and the guys probably don't know this, but we had some major internet
00:22:43.660
So we figured we'd take Sunday and do part two of this discussion.
00:22:51.480
You know, uh, I live, I live in the middle of the woods.
00:22:56.100
When, when wifi gets spotty and all that stuff.
00:22:58.680
So I'll take full blame for that, uh, falling through the other day.
00:23:03.100
You know, I guess that's just part of the deal.
00:23:04.640
And I think it's okay that people hear it because we have to have some, some level of
00:23:11.180
I know there's a lot of guys out there when things don't go right or things don't always
00:23:18.900
And obviously that's not going to be conducive to any measure of success in life.
00:23:23.300
I'm sure you're familiar, familiar with that, especially in your line of work when, when
00:23:28.300
somebody else also has a say in the matter about how you perform on any given night in
00:23:36.640
You know, uh, uh, I try to consider I can actually control, you know, and over the years
00:23:45.680
I've learned that two things that I can fully control and that's my effort and my attitude.
00:23:52.500
Um, everything else there's, there's always something that bring the, you know, an opponent
00:24:00.460
There's, there's, uh, lots of variables and everything.
00:24:03.180
So, um, yeah, I just try to do it and, and, you know, keep my head screwed on.
00:24:08.500
And, uh, control the effort that I put into every task.
00:24:12.540
Well, what, what, what is it like when you, when you show up, I mean, obviously with,
00:24:18.900
with your career and the amount of, of times you've stepped in and had these fights, how
00:24:23.920
do you deal with the adversity if the night doesn't go according to plan?
00:24:28.240
Cause you know, when most people fail, it's, it's a few people know about it when you don't
00:24:35.820
perform the way that you want to, or it doesn't quite go your way.
00:24:38.580
Even if you do perform the way you want to, it's very public, uh, literally hundreds of
00:24:44.140
thousands, if not millions of people are going to watch, you know, two, uh, two seconds
00:24:48.160
of, of, uh, of something that maybe you, you didn't quite read, right, or it didn't quite
00:24:54.240
And all of a sudden, you know, that becomes an indictment on who you are because of a two
00:24:59.560
Um, you know, uh, like you said, yeah, there's, there's, uh, you know, I'm, I'm stepping into
00:25:07.700
a cage against somebody that, that has an opinion that's prepared for weeks for me.
00:25:16.520
They, they just don't, they just don't, uh, come together in a fight.
00:25:19.460
And, uh, I, I've never been the type that I, to look back, you know, like, uh, I, I'm always
00:25:25.720
focused on the next steps and what I can do, uh, to prevent those, those types of things
00:25:33.480
from happening, you know, the, the next time out.
00:25:36.140
And, and something that I've learned, uh, you know, over the years too, um, is that like
00:25:41.520
one of the, one of the things that means the most to me is like the respect for my peers.
00:25:46.020
And like, I, I look at the other fighters that have committed their lives to this sport and,
00:25:52.400
uh, like the, the, the legends of the sport that I consider the, you know, the, the Fedors
00:25:59.320
and, and Henzo and, uh, Chuck Liddell and Matt Hughes and he's got like, they've never,
00:26:07.780
They, they, they've never, uh, like trolled me, you know, after a fight.
00:26:12.660
These are the guys that, that created this sport for me and created a, uh, uh, uh, you know,
00:26:20.100
And, uh, like if I go out and, and they're not speaking negatively on me, then like, what
00:26:27.420
does it matter to me if somebody that's never actually put gloves on their hands is going
00:26:32.840
So, um, yeah, I, I try to just like focus on like carrying myself to, to my set of standards
00:26:41.800
that I've created, which are high, you know, like I, I definitely have high self and, and
00:26:52.320
Um, and yeah, like I, I kind of know that I'm not going to fully, uh, live up to those
00:26:58.480
standards, but, uh, yeah, like if I do that, then those guys that I consider legends of the
00:27:03.180
sport are going to appreciate what I do in there.
00:27:05.360
And, um, yeah, like, like you said, there's, there could be millions of people that, that
00:27:09.680
see me on a bad day, but, um, very, very few of those people have, have done what I do.
00:27:16.500
So it's, uh, you know, everybody's entitled to their opinion.
00:27:20.020
It's just that certain opinions have a little more weight than others, you know?
00:27:24.560
So, uh, yeah, I, I try to, uh, just look at it that way and, and, and keep doing what
00:27:34.020
And, you know, there's, there's, it seems like there's usually two schools of thought.
00:27:37.500
One, one says everybody's opinion matters equally, which is not the case.
00:27:45.940
There are people in my life whose opinion I care about.
00:27:49.400
So I think it's healthy when you're talking about guys that you look up to specifically
00:27:54.120
in, in, in your career, those opinions matter like that.
00:27:58.440
That is important to you because that's going to help you see what you can do and what you're
00:28:02.940
And even if those people do share something, that's not trolling you, but just some healthy
00:28:06.920
criticism or critique, if you take it correctly, it could actually make you better.
00:28:11.420
If you actually care about what these individuals say.
00:28:19.340
And I, I mean, that's the, that's the thing, right?
00:28:21.020
Like if, if one of those guys comes up to me and says like, Hey, you know, Jim, that
00:28:25.960
was, you should, you should, uh, you know, reassess, you should be a little embarrassed
00:28:30.040
the way you carried yourself or something like that.
00:28:31.640
Then I'm going to, I'm going to take it to heart, um, where, yeah, it's, uh, you know,
00:28:37.420
we live, we live in this world where there's, there's instant access to us because of our
00:28:44.900
And, and as a fighter, we're, we're very, uh, accessible, um, in, in terms of like professional
00:28:52.200
athletes, we're, we're super accessible compared to some of our peers and other sports.
00:28:56.800
Um, so yeah, like it, if some, with an account that they obviously just use for, for trolling
00:29:05.080
people, you know, comes on and says something silly, it's like, all right, well, you know,
00:29:10.740
sometimes I'll just goof off with them and, and, and, uh, you know, push their buttons
00:29:14.140
back a little bit, but, um, yeah, you, you, you can't take it to heart.
00:29:19.800
You said, uh, you, you talked about you holding yourself to this very high standard and clearly
00:29:25.300
You know, when somebody sees you perform and to the level which you have performed for a
00:29:31.680
Do you find yourself not giving yourself grace or, or not allowing yourself to, you know,
00:29:39.620
make mistakes or is there a balance there for you?
00:29:43.780
Cause I know for me, it's hard when I do screw up, I'm really self-critical and, and I get
00:29:50.800
Do you do the same thing or have you found grace in, in some of those moments of, you know,
00:29:56.040
Um, you know, more so the, the, the standards that I set upon myself, like I, I, I know that
00:30:05.140
like I could go out and I could, I could do everything right and I could still lose a fight.
00:30:09.740
Um, you know, it's, it's a, it's a fine line that we're walking.
00:30:13.000
So it's, it's not necessarily like the fight it's, it's how I carry myself.
00:30:21.960
You know, that's, that's the pressure that I put on myself.
00:30:24.480
That's the, you know, uh, uh, when I'm really like kind of, you know, heavy on myself is
00:30:31.960
Like, are you doing, are you being a good example to your kids and to, and to the other
00:30:41.340
You know, so like I could still go out and, you know, and lose a fight and still be a good
00:30:46.700
Um, and yeah, like that's where I, I, I'm really hard on myself is, is.
00:30:54.480
How I've carried myself through adversity, you know, um, you know, like I, I've been
00:31:00.080
asked quite a few times, like, ah, is there a fight that you'd like to have back?
00:31:02.840
And, you know, like the, the more that I think about it, it's like, yeah, my fight with Lyme
00:31:06.840
disease, you know, like I, I'd, I'd rather that didn't happen all the other fights.
00:31:11.600
Hey man, it's a, it's a, it's a flip of the coin when it comes down to it.
00:31:15.020
You know, you, you go out into a fight, it's 15 minutes.
00:31:20.400
And sometimes somebody has your number or sometimes you just don't perform, but the
00:31:26.140
fight with, you know, with Lyme, like, yeah, like that, that was kind of one of those things
00:31:30.060
where it's, it sets my career apart from a lot of my, my peers in having to deal with
00:31:36.400
Um, and yeah, like I, I wish that didn't happen, but you know, the, the, the, the example that
00:31:45.700
I lead carrying myself through that, through that BS of getting bit by a tick, not knowing
00:31:52.000
about it, get having, having Lyme disease, uh, undiagnosed for essentially three years.
00:31:57.780
Um, and then going through the process of, of, of healing it, which was just as brutal
00:32:03.420
on me, um, you know, like my goal was to, to not be a martyr and, and to carry myself
00:32:11.180
through that, that hard time with, with grace and, and, and, you know, humility and, and,
00:32:22.920
Um, you know, and I, and I, and I think I've, I've done that pretty well, you know, like I,
00:32:27.600
I, I try to talk about it a little bit, but I try not to like make it the biggest thing,
00:32:32.680
but, um, it's a, yeah, it's a, like that, that's, that's the hardest part is like in
00:32:42.280
failure and in the hard times is still, still doing the right thing, you know, cause that's
00:32:48.640
when, when people do have that, uh, that, uh, uh, maybe the urge to, to, to kind of break
00:32:55.920
their standards a little bit and to not live up to those standards that they, they put on
00:32:59.640
themselves. And, um, you know, it's, it's, it's not easy. Um, and I've definitely faltered
00:33:04.680
that's for sure. But, um, you know, like there's always to like, you know, I got, I got four
00:33:11.200
kids looking up to me and, you know, they're my biggest fans and I want them to, to look
00:33:17.020
at me and be like, Hey, you know, like he might not have won every fight, but like he carried
00:33:21.040
himself through those hard times, you know, and, and did the right thing.
00:33:27.660
Yeah. That's a good litmus test. So with your, with your kids, uh, what do they think about,
00:33:32.740
about what you do? You know, they, do they watch the fights? Do you like, I don't know
00:33:36.820
how old they are, but do they watch and, and are they scared? Is it, is it something they
00:33:41.500
enjoy and if they see value in, or is it something they don't like at all? What's that like?
00:33:45.860
Uh, you know, this last one was tough, right? This last one was tough because I was, I was
00:33:50.300
bleeding everywhere, uh, for, for half the fight. Uh, you know, my, my older son, he's
00:33:56.340
12. Uh, he texts me after he's like, how you, you know, how you feeling? And I was like,
00:34:01.220
I'm good, buddy. You know? And he's like, that was a pretty brutal one. And I was like,
00:34:04.140
yeah, man, like it's, that's the way it goes. Uh, so my, my kids are 13, 12, 10, and my
00:34:11.100
young was to be nine in a few days. Uh, so like they're getting to that age where they
00:34:17.960
understand what I do. Um, you know, they've, they've been around it their whole lives. Um,
00:34:23.640
you know, my, my oldest was born in 2010. So like I had already been in UFC for a year
00:34:30.980
and a half when she was born, uh, almost two years. So, um, they've, they've seen it.
00:34:37.680
They've, they've, they've been to events. Uh, and I, I, they've, they've seen me train
00:34:43.880
plenty of times, you know? Um, I still do feel like it kinda, it goes over their head
00:34:52.260
a little bit sometimes, you know, that's cause it's like, you know, what, what I do in the
00:34:57.040
octagon, I take it very seriously. Uh, you know, there's a part of me that wishes I could
00:35:01.780
have a little more fun with it sometimes, but like, it's, it's not one of those things
00:35:05.700
that I can like, uh, you know, I see some of my peers that like do these fancy walkouts
00:35:10.260
and stuff like that. And it's like, Hey, look like they're having fun, you know, like, like
00:35:14.140
we should have fun doing this stuff. Right. Technically it's still entertainment, right?
00:35:20.520
So they need to, they need to come to all the events that it sounds like don't, you're
00:35:25.380
my good luck charms here. Don't, don't be missing my fights. I need you here. You know,
00:35:30.700
I, I think too, where they're, they're still fairly young, you know, they're, as they're
00:35:34.820
getting older. Uh, it sounds like you guys are having open discussion about it too.
00:35:38.860
You know? And I, I think that's probably the key is because, because of what you do, it's
00:35:43.320
so, it's so visible, you know, physically they can see what's going, they see what's
00:35:47.680
happening in a fight. They can see what you're wearing on your face. Uh, you know, the, the,
00:35:51.780
the scars and the bruises from the fight itself. I think your ability to talk with them and
00:35:56.920
communicate effectively with them and help them understand is something that I'm not necessarily
00:36:01.700
great at, but it is something I'm trying to work on is making sure that I'm addressing
00:36:05.780
their fears or doubts or concerns. So there's no assumptions in it because I don't want my
00:36:10.760
kids to assume, you know, usually when, when they do assume people make assumptions, it
00:36:15.100
usually goes the wrong way. They're not assuming the right things. And I don't want them to
00:36:18.420
have to fill in the blanks. I want to help understand, help them understand and clearly communicate
00:36:23.460
what's happening and going on. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a fine
00:36:30.640
line, I guess, as an, uh, as a parent, especially these days too. Right. Like, uh, you know, my,
00:36:35.880
my kids see me fight people. Right. So like they, they understand that, you know, like they're,
00:36:48.240
they're exposed to physical violence, like all the time. Like every time they watch me train,
00:36:52.620
every time they watch me fight, they, they see it. They boys are wrestling. My oldest,
00:36:58.480
she's done some, uh, some Muay Thai and stuff like that. And she actually wrestled when she
00:37:03.120
was younger. Um, you know, and they're like kind of getting to that age where I could start to like
00:37:07.800
really kind of bring them into it, you know? Um, and so, yeah, it's like, kind of like, Hey,
00:37:14.000
like, here's the deal. Like I, I can show you moves. I can show you how to fight, but we need to
00:37:19.340
understand when is the right time to use the stuff that I'm showing you, you know? And that's a,
00:37:25.200
that's a, that's a balance that I, that I have to, to, to, to meet, you know, like, listen,
00:37:29.840
like you guys are allowed to, you're allowed to finish a fight, you know, like, but you're not
00:37:33.400
allowed to start a fight, you know? So, uh, there, there have been a couple instances, you know,
00:37:38.920
like, of course it's my oldest. She likes to, uh, she's, she's very protective. So, uh, she's,
00:37:45.980
she's been, she's been in a couple of scuffles, but, uh, you know, the, they, they, they seem to
00:37:52.480
be getting that where it's like, Hey, like, um, you know, there, there is a, there is a line,
00:37:58.860
like what, what I do is a, is a profession and, and it's, uh, it's a competition and a form of
00:38:05.660
entertainment, but it's also like, it's a tool that you could use in life. And I, I, you know,
00:38:12.560
my job as a father is to, you know, to, to protect and to educate and provide for my kids.
00:38:19.820
Right. Like that's so, so they don't, they don't see violence outside of, you know, me training or,
00:38:24.880
or, or fighting. Like it's, it just, it just doesn't exist because I use my, my brain and our
00:38:29.900
feet, you know, and, and we avoid any situation where that would be the case. So, um, I'm trying to,
00:38:36.580
I'm trying to raise them to be, you know, capable and, and, and, and be able to fight,
00:38:42.560
but also use their minds and their, and, you know, uh, and, and the running shoes to get away
00:38:48.180
if they need to. Yeah. I mean, that's the best defense, right. Is just not to get into these types
00:38:53.560
of situations. Obviously you're voluntarily stepping into one, but outside of the ring or the octagon,
00:38:59.320
yeah, the goal is not to get into these sorts of situations. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
00:39:05.320
You said your daughter's protective when, when, when she's in that mode, is it protective
00:39:09.660
of her siblings? Like what, what is she protective of? What is it that she's, she's, uh, her mindset
00:39:15.400
is. My, my, my oldest, she's, uh, you know, my, like my dad is, uh, he was at least before
00:39:22.660
he like squished himself through carrying heavy stuff. Uh, he was like six, four to 40 big,
00:39:27.900
big dude. Um, even bigger, like personality type. My daughter got my dad's jeans. Like she's
00:39:35.320
she's almost as tall as I am at 13. Uh, you know, it, she'll probably start slowing down
00:39:42.180
at this point, but, um, you know, like she, she could be taller than I am. And, uh, so
00:39:47.260
she's, she's protective of her friends because she is, she's like a bigger kid, you know, like
00:39:54.420
she's, she's, uh, she's probably like five, five at this point at 13 years old, which is
00:40:00.280
way taller than I was. Um, so yeah, she's protective of her friends and, and, uh, you
00:40:06.440
know, and, and her siblings, but I think a majority of the times it's happened, it's,
00:40:10.700
it's been with her, with her friends. Yeah. Well, that's good. It's a good, it's a good
00:40:15.800
characteristic to have. It's just something, and it's funny because all kids are different,
00:40:19.620
right? And so what one, what one child has as a virtuous, uh, characteristic, I would say
00:40:26.340
is being protective. Uh, but also it becomes something that it could be used, like you said
00:40:32.720
earlier in the wrong context. And it, it becomes a hindrance as opposed to something that could
00:40:38.120
positively impact your lives, your life and people around you as well. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I want
00:40:44.540
to go back to, cause you were talking about Lyme disease. So one thing, if, if you don't mind
00:40:48.940
sharing, so you were bit by a tick and, but no symptoms or anything like that for three years. And
00:40:54.520
by then, cause if I understand correctly, when you're ticks are disgusting little creatures and
00:40:59.900
so they, they're all sorts of nasty illnesses. Um, if you catch it early, I think there's a heavy,
00:41:07.220
very heavy dose or rounds of antibiotics that, that take care of the issue. But when it sets in
00:41:12.880
like that, I imagine treating it is a completely different course of action. Uh, yeah. Yeah. So,
00:41:20.340
um, you know, Lyme is one of those, the, those illnesses that's like, there's, there's new
00:41:26.140
stuff coming out every day. Right. There's, there's not enough funding for it. Um, you know, and, and
00:41:35.760
you know, like the, the, the government was using ticks as a vector. So, well, you know, like they were,
00:41:45.720
they were researching, right. So it's like, it almost has things about it that you're like,
00:41:51.260
if you were going to make something like it's, uh, maybe it would be this, but, um, because the
00:41:58.520
bacteria can, it can cross the blood brain barrier. Um, you know, and, and so what happened
00:42:04.200
to me is I, I believe that I was bit in, uh, like, like late May, early June of 2013. Um,
00:42:12.780
I had an initial set of symptoms. Uh, I don't really get headaches. Um, and I had like migraines.
00:42:20.140
I ended up getting like seven migraines in 10 days or something like that. And, um, yeah, I had,
00:42:26.940
I had a bunch of like, I was, I was really nauseous to, um, like to the point where bringing the garbage
00:42:32.900
out to the end of the driveway, I'd be like dry heaving the whole way for like two weeks,
00:42:37.100
three weeks. It was, uh, it was really weird. Um, so because of like those headaches, I went to the
00:42:42.260
doctor, I went to a neurologist, ENT, they, they did a whole bunch of tests on me. Uh, they actually
00:42:47.720
tested me for a lot of disease. Um, and about 50% of people don't even test positive for it.
00:42:53.800
Uh, interesting. So had we, yeah, had we, had we gone on some doxycycline right away,
00:42:59.800
you know, a three week, four week course, it might've knocked it out. Um, but since I didn't
00:43:06.460
test positive where it was like, kind of like, Hey, we'll see if symptoms come back and, uh, you know,
00:43:11.460
we'll address at that point. And time went on and, um, my, my symptoms that I ended up getting over
00:43:19.060
the, the, the, the course of the years before I was diagnosed with it. Um, I thought was all stuff
00:43:26.040
that like, Hey, I'm a professional fighter. Like this is what I'm supposed to do with my massive,
00:43:30.660
you know, joint pain, like to the middle pounds, super warm. And I'd go to stand up and I'd have to
00:43:37.460
like brace on my knee and, uh, you know, like be an old man. Um, at, you know, I was like early
00:43:45.980
thirties. Right. So, so at that point, it shouldn't have been like that. But, um, you know, I was having
00:43:52.280
a lot of brain fog, uh, some, some cognitive issues. Right. Um, like I would kind of get like,
00:44:00.060
I'll get like lost in rooms sometimes, you know, if I had stuff to do, I, I, I just,
00:44:07.240
I, it's hard to describe what it was like, but, um, there's a, there's a plaque, a protein that the,
00:44:13.040
the bacteria creates that's, uh, it's nearly identical to, uh, like Alzheimer's. Uh, interesting.
00:44:20.100
So like I, yeah, there, there are, there are parts of like 2015, well, 16 that like,
00:44:27.120
I don't really have really great memories of. Um, I can remember training camps and, and all sorts
00:44:33.180
of stuff way back, you know, but like there's a period where there's kind of like a, just a,
00:44:38.620
a blanket over it that I, I can't access those memories. Um, you know, and just some other stuff,
00:44:45.600
I was getting a lot of like just twitching and, and, uh, like nerve, nerve pain. Um, and it wasn't
00:44:53.760
until, uh, 2016 that, uh, I was talking to my doctor. I was doing a pre-fight physical for,
00:45:00.920
uh, UFC, uh, 196 and was talking about some of the stuff that I was dealing with. And he's like,
00:45:08.220
I, I think you might have Lyme disease, you know, we're going to run some tests. Um,
00:45:13.280
and it ended up being like, I was out in Las Vegas for, for my fight and, uh, basically just
00:45:19.160
about to start my weight cut. And he calls me up and he's like, yeah, I'm, uh, I'm pretty sure
00:45:23.520
you got Lyme disease. So when you get back, we'll, we'll, uh, we'll start a course of antibiotics.
00:45:27.420
And, um, instead of that, uh, you know, three week dose of antibiotics, I ended up being on
00:45:34.520
doxycline. Um, I did a six month stint on it, went off of it for a little bit. Yeah. Uh, and you
00:45:44.100
know, it just, it just destroys your, your gut biome and, and you know, like it causes its own
00:45:49.500
problems. Sure. Yeah. Um, you know, uh, I went off it for a little bit cause I felt way better than I
00:45:55.560
had and it came back, the line came back and really kicked my butt, uh, beginning of 2017. And, uh,
00:46:02.720
then I went on it again for another essentially like two years. Um, so it was, uh, it was a long road
00:46:09.800
out, like a really long road out. And, uh, you know, like, yeah, we're, we're talking about a few
00:46:17.300
years of, of, of my, you know, physical peak, right. As a man, like my, my, my early thirties,
00:46:25.840
right. Like I'm, um, I'm mature mentally and emotionally and, and, and physically now. And,
00:46:33.280
and I'm not starting to break down yet. Cause I'm not a 40 year old. Like I am now in a young man's
00:46:37.880
game. And, uh, yeah, it was, uh, it was taken away from me, you know, by, by a tech. And, uh,
00:46:46.420
you know, it's a, it's, it's a, it's a tough thing, but it's like, Hey, you know what? I'd rather,
00:46:52.620
I'd rather go through the tough stuff. I'd rather deal with it. And, you know, my kids are, are healthy
00:47:00.520
and strong and, and, uh, you know, uh, keep giving me stuff and, and like keep them healthy and, and,
00:47:10.020
and not having to deal with anything, you know? So, uh, these, these shoulders are, are broad enough
00:47:14.960
to handle that. So, um, that's kind of the way that I look at it. I'd rather, I'd rather I dealt
00:47:20.660
with it than, than one of my kids. Yeah. That's a, that's a really encouraging way to look at it.
00:47:25.740
I didn't, I didn't actually know that once it set in, so is Lyme disease curable?
00:47:32.180
It, there's, there's still, that's still kind of up in the air, right? Like, so, okay. So if,
00:47:37.980
if you catch it early, they say it is right. So like, if you have that, those initial symptoms
00:47:44.740
and you, you, uh, some antibiotics, uh, they say that you will, you will overcome it. Um,
00:47:52.400
once it gets a hold, um, it's really difficult to get rid of. And I kind of understand that like
00:48:02.140
at a point it could come back and it, it might be a, a new tick bite, right? It might be a new
00:48:08.560
infection or it might be some remnants of the old infection. Who knows? Um, I've, I've had the
00:48:16.440
opportunity to meet a lot of people that have dealt with some really bad cases of it over the years.
00:48:20.840
And, uh, you know, absolutely amazing, super tough people. And, and, uh, you know, it's a,
00:48:28.040
it's an unfortunate thing that it's, it's still such a, uh, like kind of taboo
00:48:34.400
illness to, to, to, to talk about, right? Like it's, um, everybody knows about it these days,
00:48:41.780
but it's like, yeah, what, what research is being done? What, what, uh,
00:48:46.160
what treatment, you know, what new treatment is coming out. And, and like, there's, there's really,
00:48:53.660
if you, if you really pay attention, there's stuff here and there. Right. But like, uh, I think most
00:48:59.540
people don't have a huge grasp on it because it's like, it's, it's not, it's not at the forefront.
00:49:06.240
Um, and it does, uh, have a, a, a massive negative effect on, on, on people's lives. You know,
00:49:12.700
especially like I said, when it gets, uh, when it goes untreated for a few years, uh, it can be
00:49:17.360
really devastating. Yeah. I mean, the first time I was really introduced to it, I had a woman who was
00:49:22.440
a client of mine. I was in financial services and she was, she had told me that she was dealing with
00:49:28.240
that, but, but there was, wasn't any visible signs that she was dealing with Lyme disease. But then I
00:49:33.960
remember she went to sign some paperwork and she could hardly even write her name. I mean, her hand
00:49:40.520
was like trembling and it was very difficult for her to write. And she told me about it. I'm like,
00:49:45.640
oh my goodness. I had no idea up to that point. I imagine that just comes with you being in, in,
00:49:51.200
in the woods of, of New Jersey. I wasn't really introduced to ticks until I moved to Maine. I mean,
00:49:55.400
there's, there are some, I think in Southern Utah, but not like Maine. It's crazy. Yeah. Uh, the,
00:50:03.080
the thing, right. Is that it's like, I've, I've found more ticks on me, you know, working in my own
00:50:11.540
garden than I have, uh, you know, in the woods and really, yeah. Like over the years,
00:50:20.200
I like, I, yeah, I, I'm a, I'm an outdoorsman. I hunt, I fish, I, I, I do all this stuff. Uh,
00:50:30.180
you know, anytime I can be out in the woods, I'm, I'm in the woods and the amount of like hunters and,
00:50:38.080
and anglers that I've met at some of these, you know, uh, fundraising events and stuff like that
00:50:43.980
is pretty small. Like a majority, it's just the majority of people. It's just normal people.
00:50:51.500
Right. Like, and that's the, that's the crazy thing too, is it's a, it's a deer tick. We think
00:50:55.720
deer. Uh, but the, the, the thing that spreads those ticks the most is the mouse, right? The
00:51:03.860
white footed mouse. So, um, yeah, yeah. So like I, I preach it all the time. I live in an old house.
00:51:10.640
I've got a dirt for basement. So I, I deal with, I deal with mice, right? Like we've, we, we got some
00:51:15.160
cats and they're, they're pretty good now. So, but, uh, like, uh, with, with, with no quarter,
00:51:21.900
right. Especially like this time of year, spring, things warming up, right. They, they like it in the
00:51:28.520
fall and the spring, right. They, they, they come into the house, just show them no quarter,
00:51:34.760
those little bastards. Right. So, um, it's, uh, yeah, it's, it's, uh, it's, it's, it's kind
00:51:42.880
of funny that, uh, there, I've met a few like hunters over the years, but, but, uh, a majority
00:51:51.240
people, it's just, yeah, they, they don't, they don't even really know. Maybe they went to a park
00:51:57.760
or this or that. Um, but it's, uh, it, it, it doesn't, those little things, man, they, they,
00:52:03.920
they can be anywhere and it doesn't really matter. I almost wonder if part of the reason
00:52:09.920
is, is because when you're out in the woods, you know, to check for ticks, right? If you've
00:52:13.600
spent any amount of time out there, you know, you're supposed to be checking. And so you're
00:52:16.600
actually vigilant about it. But if you're at the park or working in your garden or it's just
00:52:21.860
not, not, not as common for someone to have to check for that. So they're probably not. And I
00:52:26.460
wonder if it's, has more to do with that than anything else.
00:52:30.940
Yeah, probably. Right. Like when, when I, you know, when I go hunting, I'm, I'm layering
00:52:36.800
and this and that. Right. So I've got base layers on, which is going to keep them off most of the time.
00:52:40.920
And like Turkey season, I'm, I'm taking steps to, you know, uh, uh, to keep them away from me,
00:52:50.440
right. Bug spray and this and that. And, uh, and all those, I know that I'm pants, that sort of thing.
00:52:55.660
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so, so it's like, uh, yeah, I think that you just, you're out in the
00:53:02.680
yard for a walk or something like that. You're not really expecting it, but they can be absolutely
00:53:06.640
anywhere. Yeah. Have you always been an outdoorsman? I mean, obviously you're big into hunting and I've
00:53:12.700
followed your account and you pretty closely. And I think is that you've got a Montana knife company
00:53:17.140
hat on. I think you had the hoodie on the other day. Like obviously they're, they're, they're big fans
00:53:22.240
of what we're doing. I'm big fans of what they're doing. So I love to see people supporting them,
00:53:26.020
but have you always, did you grow up in the outdoors or, or what, what did that look like?
00:53:31.760
Uh, yeah. You know, um, when, when I was, uh, a kid, right? Like it was, I didn't start hunting
00:53:39.880
when I was until I was like, I think 15, 15 or 16. Um, uh, my dad didn't want to like push us into it.
00:53:49.260
Like he grew up running, uh, bird dogs and beagles and, um, you know, hunting, hunting in,
00:53:57.500
in New Jersey was a lot different when he was a kid. Um, and even like when I was a kid, it was,
00:54:02.720
it was different than it is today, but, uh, he didn't, he worked six days a week, so he didn't
00:54:09.020
have the time to, to get us our, uh, hunters education and all this stuff. So, um, he let my
00:54:17.340
brothers and I take that on ourselves. And when my oldest brother got his driver's license, we,
00:54:21.680
we, uh, we went and we, we got our hunters education and, and, and, uh, started down that
00:54:28.680
road. But like, as kids, we grew up hearing all the stories of him and, you know, our grandfather
00:54:34.840
and, and all the things that they would do. And we lived, we lived in the woods when I was a kid.
00:54:39.860
It was, it was the best. Like, it was awesome. I mean, we would, we would be two miles from the
00:54:45.380
house sometimes, some days, like during the summer and like my oldest brother being four
00:54:49.940
years older than me, it's like a 10 year old, an eight year old and a six year old, just like
00:54:54.700
two miles through the woods in the, in the, you know, it's like just during the eighties,
00:54:59.300
it was just, it was different. It was a different time. Right. Uh, you know, so like, yeah, we would,
00:55:05.200
we would always be just going on adventures and doing stuff. Right. Um, so like once I,
00:55:12.640
once I got my hunting license, yeah, so it was always something I wanted to do. And, and, um,
00:55:17.520
uh, like, yeah, started, started down that road. And I've, I've learned a lot,
00:55:24.000
particularly in the last like couple of years. Right. Like, like I, I like crap about social
00:55:31.740
media. I don't think it's the best thing, but like, I've learned a lot off of it. Uh, particularly
00:55:37.080
in the things that I enjoy doing, like, like hunting and fishing. Right. And I've had the opportunity
00:55:41.360
to meet a lot of people through social media, uh, that, uh, that are way better, you know,
00:55:47.520
hunters and fishermen than I am. Um, so yeah, so it's always, it's always been, uh, uh, a part
00:55:54.680
of my, my life essentially, um, just either dreaming about it or once I got my license and
00:56:00.260
yeah, it was, uh, I was, I was always trying to, uh, to get in the woods and it took me a
00:56:04.620
couple of years to get a deer and this and that, you know, and, and, uh, but, uh, it's, uh,
00:56:08.880
yeah, now, now I feel like hunting is more of a, it's just a lifestyle to me because like
00:56:14.700
we do eat it as much as we can. Um, you know, whether it's the venison or elk. Um, so, uh,
00:56:23.820
yeah, it's, I've, I've been able to make it part of, part of our lives and, and now it's
00:56:29.380
like really introducing the kids and trying to get them out there. They've all helped,
00:56:33.380
you know, process animals and stuff like that. They've all been pheasant hunting. Um,
00:56:39.220
so yeah, so now it's like trying to, to get them, uh, you know, into the outdoors as well,
00:56:44.960
which is, is, is, is fun. It's like, it's, it's a, it's, there's a trade-off. There's definitely a
00:56:50.140
trade-off with it, but, uh, it's fun to, to get them out and, you know, experiencing it.
00:56:54.680
Yeah, no, I feel the same way. I mean, I, I, I didn't start hunting until about
00:56:58.280
eight years ago, eight, eight years, maybe, maybe closer to nine, somewhere in there now,
00:57:02.680
but, uh, it's, it's, it's more than hunting it. Like you said, it's, it's a lifestyle. It's ingrained
00:57:07.980
in me as it sounds like it is with you. And man, I'm always encouraging guys who listen to
00:57:12.780
go on a hunt, you know, go, go on a, uh, high success ratio pig hunt, spend time in the woods.
00:57:18.280
If you like it, cool, you know, keep doing it. If you don't cool. But I think everybody needs
00:57:23.820
to take advantage of the opportunity to go harvest their own food because, and it's not
00:57:30.020
just about that, but that is a big component. And there's a sense of pride and satisfaction
00:57:34.720
and actually being connected with nature that I think every man ought to, ought to experience
00:57:40.420
to some degree. Yeah, I think, I think everyone should experience it. You know, like it, it's,
00:57:47.000
it's, uh, it's, it is important to, to, to have a little bit more like, like knowledge
00:57:58.580
of, of, of where your meat comes from, right? Like going through that process and, and, um,
00:58:05.880
you know, sharing, sharing it with people is probably my favorite thing, right? Like making
00:58:11.820
some, some backstraps for people that have never had venison before and just like caveman
00:58:18.040
in it, right? Just plopping them off the grill and slicing things on a cutting board and everybody's
00:58:22.680
diving in with their fingers. It's like, it's, it's the best. It's the best to see the look
00:58:28.460
on people. It's like, Oh my God, this, this is great. Hey, so good. It's like, yeah, you
00:58:34.520
know, the, the, the, the first couple of deer I shot didn't taste that great. Cause like
00:58:38.720
my, my, uh, field care wasn't as good and this and that, like I've learned a lot through
00:58:44.340
the process, uh, you know, of years, right? Like over 20 years of doing it. But, uh, yeah,
00:58:52.520
now it's like, Hey, if you, if you do things the right way and, and, uh, you know, learn
00:58:56.940
a few different things, like, yeah, it's like, it's so, it's so good. And it's, uh, there's
00:59:03.040
a, uh, an appreciation, I think that, that, uh, people kind of develop, you know, for,
00:59:11.920
for, uh, for their food, you know? And like, we, we kind of trade, we trade our health for
00:59:19.260
convenience these days and it's, uh, it, it sucks, you know? Like I, I, every time I get,
00:59:27.880
you know, I, I, I barely ever eat fast food, but when I do, it's like, like I kind of hate
00:59:32.760
myself for it a little bit, you know? And it's like, like, man, like, like it's, yeah,
00:59:37.620
it tastes good. Right. But it's like, ah, like this, this sucks. Uh, cause I would rather
00:59:42.300
it be like, Hey, I'm taking a piece of a deer elk or whatever. And, and, and eating
00:59:49.500
that way. I'd rather eat that way all the time. But, uh, you know, yeah, like I, I, uh, I like
00:59:56.140
to try to do things the, the harder way and put a little more effort into them and, uh, you
01:00:01.380
know, sharing, sharing the game that I, that I harvest with people is, is, uh, yeah, that's,
01:00:07.460
there's no, there's no harder way. So I enjoy it. Yeah. Well, it seems like you, you do like
01:00:13.440
to take the harder path and, uh, and there's obviously a lot of value in that, you know,
01:00:17.840
not to make it harder for making it harder, but harder because from what I hear it's fulfilling
01:00:23.380
and there's, there's value in learning and growing and becoming tougher physically, mentally,
01:00:28.440
emotionally. What, what's next for you? I think, I think a couple of days ago, you told
01:00:32.620
me you have a goal of 50 professional fights. Is that right? 50 fights?
01:00:37.640
Uh, that's 50 UFC fights. Uh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, that's, that's, that's, that's the hard
01:00:46.480
stop. So, um, yeah. Is that your hard stop or your wife's hard stop? Or what is, what is
01:00:53.360
that like? That's, that's my hard stop. Yeah. She, uh, she could see me stop at any time.
01:01:00.720
She'd be happy. Um, you know, but, uh, yeah. Um, I'm still, I'm still trying to figure that
01:01:09.980
out, you know, like, uh, you know, I, I've, I've been able to be a professional fighter
01:01:18.100
and I think there's, there's a difference between fighting professionally and being a professional
01:01:21.160
fighter. Right. Like I, because I had the support of my wife, I was able to, in the beginning,
01:01:26.200
just dive in and, and, uh, and try to make this a career and, and, uh, you know, things
01:01:32.900
worked out. So I've, I've been a professional fighter for a while now and been able to pay
01:01:36.880
our bills through fighting. And, um, it's, uh, it's been awesome. And it's also been like,
01:01:44.920
man, like, uh, I I've been spoiled with having control over my schedule and all this stuff.
01:01:51.000
And like being able to do the things that I want to do. And, um, um, I'm preparing myself
01:01:58.780
for a day where I don't have the ability to do all the, the, the things that I want to
01:02:02.960
do, you know, because something will take my time, you know, uh, the, my, whatever it
01:02:08.500
is to, to, to, to provide for the family will take more of my time. Um, I don't know.
01:02:15.400
I'm, I'm, I'm going to do some, some, uh, some analyst work for the UFC, uh, at, uh, I think
01:02:21.520
it's, uh, what is it? UFC 302, um, which is, uh, a newer card. Um, I think it's June 2nd
01:02:28.860
or something like that. Um, you know, I've, I've, I've done some, I've done some commentating
01:02:33.500
in the past and, and I do enjoy it. Um, you know, I w I want a couple of different things,
01:02:42.000
you know, like that's the problem is like, I want, I want part of my life to revolve
01:02:47.800
around the outdoors. So it's easier to bring my kids. Um, but I also understand that like,
01:02:53.800
that's not a, that's not an easy lifestyle. That's, uh, you know, uh, I look at like the
01:03:01.320
outdoor world and, and the, the, the people that I'm close to who have, who have made it
01:03:06.300
their lives. I look at it as like the whole, the whole sponsorship game in MMA. And I never
01:03:12.980
really enjoyed that type of stuff either. So, um, yeah, I'm just trying to figure it out.
01:03:17.980
But I think that, uh, I think that, you know, obviously like media is, is, is going to be
01:03:25.120
a part of a part of the next step. So, um, trying to work on my, my talking skills and not words
01:03:33.140
often, but, uh, yeah, like, uh, I'm going to be probably in front of a camera in one way,
01:03:41.100
shape or form. So, um, just kind of preparing myself for that. Awesome. Well, I appreciate your
01:03:47.540
time. Um, I've been wanting to do this for some time now, so I'm glad that we finally were able
01:03:51.620
to make it work. And even if we did have to span it over, uh, two different sessions because of our,
01:03:56.020
our internet issues. Um, but, uh, let, please let the guys know where to connect with you,
01:04:01.900
follow a little bit more about your career. And then also as things, you know, eventually do
01:04:06.120
navigate into, uh, wherever else you feel like going, we'd love to follow along and see what you're up
01:04:12.440
to. Yeah. Um, you know, I'm, I'm really only primarily on, uh, Instagram, uh, these days.
01:04:19.920
So it's, uh, Jim Miller underscore one 55. Um, you know, it's, uh, I'm, I'm battling this social
01:04:26.680
media thing. I'm trying to, I'm trying to be present in my life and, you know, my family and do
01:04:32.180
the things and, and take my own advice. Right. And like work on myself and not so much for the
01:04:39.440
entertainment of other people. Right. I think that people kind of get caught up in, in the
01:04:45.960
social media aspects, uh, uh, of, of daily life these days. But, uh, yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm trying,
01:04:53.580
I'm, I'm, I'm working on myself to be posted here anymore. And, uh, but yeah, that's, that's pretty
01:04:59.180
much only where I'm at. Um, at the moment, got some, some stuff in the works that I'll be posting up,
01:05:05.780
uh, shortly, uh, some, uh, some t-shirts and, and all that fun stuff and, and, uh, getting that
01:05:12.580
going. So, um, yeah, that's, that's really it. That's really it. I gotta, I gotta get the YouTube
01:05:16.800
up too. You know, like I gotta, I gotta get, I gotta get on there. There's always something.
01:05:21.340
There's always something. Well, Jim, I appreciate you, man. You and I all stay in touch. Please let me
01:05:25.960
know if there's ways I can support you and what you have going on. Cause, uh, I'm all about that.
01:05:30.460
I want to, I want to help people, especially if they do podcasts with me and they believe in what
01:05:34.020
we're doing. I want to, I want to support that way. We'll sync everything up, man. Again,
01:05:37.840
appreciate you. Thanks for joining me today. No problem. Thanks for having me, man. I hope you
01:05:44.820
enjoyed that conversation with Jim Miller. I know that the technical difficulties might've been a
01:05:49.000
little distracting. Uh, we got to make it work. And we talked a little bit about resilience and
01:05:53.360
adapting and that's something that Jim does well. And we got to make those pivots and changes, uh, in
01:05:58.640
order to put a product out and in order to, uh, fulfill our, our responsibilities and commitments
01:06:04.400
and promises. So I hope you enjoyed the episode. Please connect with Jim on Instagram. That's where
01:06:08.800
he's most active. Sounds like he's got some things in the works. So you're going to want to make sure
01:06:13.400
you're following him over there. Uh, and then if you would, before you sign out real quick, just take a
01:06:18.080
screenshot right now. Uh, you're probably listening to this on your phone. And if you are just take a
01:06:22.320
screenshot, if it's on Spotify or Apple podcasts or wherever it might be screenshot posted up on
01:06:28.600
Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, tag Jim, tag myself at Ryan Mickler and get the word out, help us get
01:06:35.040
the word out to reclaim and restore masculinity. When I look around, I'm a little nervous, quite
01:06:39.840
frankly, about the lack of manliness and masculinity in society. And if we have information that is going
01:06:45.000
to be useful for other men to serve themselves and their families and loved ones, then let's make
01:06:49.940
sure that we get it to the masses. This is how I do that. So please take that screenshot, check out,
01:06:55.300
uh, Jim on Instagram, tag me on that. Outside of that, check out the store and my good friends over
01:07:00.520
at Montana knife company.com using that code order of man. All right, guys, that's all I've got for you
01:07:06.700
today. We'll be back tomorrow for our ask me anything until then go out there, take action
01:07:13.760
Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your
01:07:22.780
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