Order of Man - VIC BLENDS ｜ Turning Your Struggles Into Strengths

00:00:00.000 You guys have heard me talk a lot about our role as protectors, providers, and presiders,

00:00:04.580 not only within the walls of our home, but also within our communities. Not only do we have the

00:00:10.540 opportunity to give back to those in need, we actually have a moral obligation to do so,

00:00:16.080 especially if we have the means to do it. My guest today is a man who is doing exactly that.

00:00:22.060 His name is Victor Fontanez. You may know him as Vic Blenz, and he has made a name for himself

00:00:27.880 through offering practical life advice for the young men that he gives haircuts to

00:00:32.380 as he serves his community in Atlanta. Vic is 22 years old, but you're going to hear so much

00:00:38.980 incredible wisdom come from him. And frankly, I mean, I scheduled a podcast, but I was honestly

00:00:47.060 taken back by how much this man inspired me personally to do and to be better for myself.

00:00:54.360 You're a man of action. You live life to the fullest. Embrace your fears and boldly charge

00:00:59.820 your own path. When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time. Every time. You are not

00:01:05.680 easily deterred or defeated. Rugged. Resilient. Strong. This is your life. This is who you are.

00:01:12.860 This is who you will become. At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call

00:01:18.180 yourself a man. Gentlemen, what is going on today? My name is Ryan Michler. I'm the host. I'm also the

00:01:23.980 founder of the Order of Man podcast, a movement. Welcome here and welcome back. Glad you're tuning

00:01:28.740 in. Man, I can't tell you how incredible it is to see what this thing has done over the past seven.

00:01:36.140 We're over seven years into this thing now. I could not have imagined in my wildest dreams

00:01:41.080 what opportunities this would present, what it would mean to culture, what it would mean to society,

00:01:46.500 what it would mean to millions and millions, literally millions. That's so strange to say even

00:01:52.140 around the, around the U S around the planet. Ah, man, I'm humbled. I'm honored that we could

00:02:00.720 bring these conversations to you and help this mission of reclaiming and restoring masculinity.

00:02:06.260 We've got a very powerful podcast today. His name is Vic Fontanis. He goes by Vic blends on the socials.

00:02:13.620 And we'll talk more about that in a minute. Before we get into that, I just want to mention that we've

00:02:18.120 got a couple of events coming up that I want you to be very aware of and attend. If you can,

00:02:23.220 the first one is the man in caged event. This is an event with Steven Mansfield, Bedros Koulian,

00:02:28.840 John Lovell with warrior poet society, uh, Tanner Guzzi, a good and long-term friend of mine,

00:02:35.400 Jack Donovan, Matt Boudreau, founder of Acton Academy. He's partnered up with Tim Kennedy guys.

00:02:40.940 We've got an incredible lineup of guys at this event. So if you can make it to central Northern

00:02:48.000 California on May 7th, please do. And if you want all of the details on what that looks like and

00:02:54.240 what you'll experience and what this will be like, go to manuncaged.com slash live manuncaged.com

00:03:02.620 slash live get registered. We only have, we started with a hundred spots. We're probably less than half

00:03:10.120 of that right now. So it's a manuncaged.com slash live get signed up ASAP and get your butt out to

00:03:17.100 California. We're going into the belly of the beast in California to talk about reclaiming and

00:03:23.040 restoring masculinity again, manuncaged.com slash live. All right, let me get to Vic because this,

00:03:30.500 I was going to say kid that's, he's not a kid. This young man, I will say he's 22 years old

00:03:36.020 is phenomenal. He's going to blow you away. One of my all-time favorite podcasts. He's from a small

00:03:43.620 town in North Carolina. He's gained national attention for his approach to reaching the young

00:03:50.120 men in Atlanta. His name is Victor Fontana's. He goes by Vic blends. As I said earlier on the socials,

00:03:56.800 a lot of you may have seen him. He's got a presence of over 10 million people on Instagram,

00:04:03.440 on Tik TOK. This guy started cutting hair in his mom's garage. And, and at this point,

00:04:09.280 he's quite literally becoming one of the most renowned celebrity barbers. He doesn't talk about

00:04:14.480 that a whole lot, but, but he is, uh, and frankly, business moguls in the country, but more important

00:04:20.340 than all of that, Vic has an incredible heart to serve men, uh, and has been working even to establish

00:04:26.900 the very first barber school in the California state penitentiary, uh, to give those men a chance

00:04:34.420 to contribute to society and live life in a very meaningful way. So gentlemen, I hope you enjoy

00:04:42.040 this podcast and I hope you're inspired as much as I was inspired by it personally.

00:04:47.740 Vic, what's up, man?

00:04:48.740 Man, chillin' brother.

00:04:49.660 Glad you're here.

00:04:50.460 I appreciate y'all having me, man.

00:04:51.700 Yeah. I've been, uh, I've been really excited to have you cause I think the conversations you're

00:04:55.780 having from what I've seen with, with the young men that you're, you know, cutting their hair,

00:04:59.700 like that's what people need now more than ever. I think there's a huge, huge void in masculinity

00:05:06.000 and manliness and men stepping up to help a lot of these young men. I'm really curious though,

00:05:09.980 where, where that desire and ambition comes from.

00:05:12.700 I mean, the desire to want to reach out and help people and ultimately inspire them. You know,

00:05:19.060 it was an idea that I had starting in eighth grade, right? It was the first time I discovered

00:05:23.500 what motivational speaking was. I was running track and I remember my coach vividly telling me

00:05:28.820 that track is a mental sport. For you to run, you have to have your mind right, right? If you,

00:05:33.480 if you come ready on race day, you could be, you could win the race. Yeah. So I was like, man,

00:05:37.500 how do I get my mind right? So I started going on YouTube and searching best motivational speeches,

00:05:41.760 trying to get my mind, you know, ready the night before to go run. And I discovered who Eric Thomas

00:05:46.180 was, man. So yeah, I was watching motivational speaking and to see the power that somebody could

00:05:51.100 have in their voice alone to make me feel the way, to be ready to run the next day. That was

00:05:56.020 something that, that sparked it for me. I was like, man, this is dope. So, you know, through high

00:06:00.660 school, I'm listening to other motivational speakers. I'm going through the hallways and while

00:06:04.960 everybody's playing, you know, music through their ears and I'm the one walking to, you know,

00:06:09.180 third period of science playing, you know, if you want, you, you got to want it as bad

00:06:12.940 as you want to breathe. So I'm like trying to get hyped through high school. And as I was running

00:06:17.060 track and running across country and boxing and doing all these sports, like getting my

00:06:21.060 mental was what was important for me, but it was never something that I think people wanted

00:06:25.160 to hear from me. And that stopped me from doing it. I wanted to pursue that journey because

00:06:29.480 I didn't think that I looked the part. I didn't think that I sounded the part. I didn't think

00:06:33.300 my age was going to be able to match the part of what a motivational speaker should

00:06:37.200 look like or sound like. So I never really pursued that. So coming into just a couple

00:06:43.460 of years ago, I say about, you know, right when, right before COVID started, before I

00:06:48.400 moved to Atlanta, I started doing a few videos wanting to speak. And at that moment, I'm just

00:06:53.840 just talking whatever I would hear on YouTube and trying to dabble in it and just saying the

00:06:59.240 generic motivational things. And, you know, it was doing all right. It wasn't doing what I

00:07:04.220 expected it to do or what I envisioned it to do. And I stopped, you know, I let all the

00:07:09.100 hate and all the people on Instagram that told me to stop doing that shit, to shut up and cut

00:07:13.320 hair and to stop, you know, trying to speak and be somebody on, on, on Instagram. I let

00:07:18.100 that all get to me and ultimately it stopped me from pursuing that dream that I had.

00:07:21.820 And then when COVID hit and, you know, I can't cut hair anymore and the livelihood of what I built

00:07:27.800 my business and my brand on was took it from me. I'm sitting at the house stuck. And the quote that

00:07:33.520 I heard in the middle of the pandemic was, don't let what you're good at define who you are. Who are

00:07:38.680 you? If you can't do what you're good at. So when I heard that, I'm sitting at the house thinking

00:07:43.460 like, damn, who is Victor Fonson as if I can never cut hair again? That was a question that I had to ask

00:07:49.220 myself and challenge myself on because I've built my brand and my, my likeliness to, you know,

00:07:55.100 attach to this one thing. And, you know, it, God took it from me and I didn't have a, I didn't have

00:08:00.900 a say so whether I'm able to go do that or not. So now I'm limited on the impact I thought I could

00:08:06.260 bring to the world. And I think that the pandemic, you know, and sorry to anybody, you know, I pray for

00:08:12.140 anybody that has gone through a hard time during that pandemic or has lost somebody or gone through a

00:08:16.620 time that has sent them back. Um, I think, you know, as humans, you know, we're chasing the flesh

00:08:22.160 our whole lives. And it's very rare that we all get stopped and get told to sit down by God and say,

00:08:29.260 let me take control of what we're supposed to be doing here. And that's what I felt like the

00:08:33.120 pandemic was for me. It was that I was chasing this barbering, you know, dream of cutting all these

00:08:39.540 celebrities and rappers and being this hair cutter that, you know, God's plan for me was

00:08:46.180 different from day one, right? Like it was already written in the things that I was supposed to do

00:08:50.600 and accomplish. And until that pandemic came and it came and I was forced to sit down and stop doing

00:08:56.040 so, you know, I wasn't really woke to what he had written for me. So that's why I started speaking

00:09:02.620 more at is when I couldn't do the one thing I thought I was only good at.

00:09:05.820 Yeah. It's, it's always interesting because, and I found very much the same way as like when we find

00:09:10.520 a path that we want to be on, or we find, uh, you know, maybe somebody that we, we, uh, resonate

00:09:16.460 with, we think, Oh, I got to do it like him. Right. And, and then it doesn't work for us the same way,

00:09:21.420 but it's found that the best thing you can do is found in doing it different as being different.

00:09:25.560 So when you say, yeah, I don't look the part, I don't speak the part, I got the age, all that kind

00:09:29.540 of stuff. You thought that was a hindrance, but if you tap into that and unlock that, that's actually

00:09:34.780 probably what set you on the path. It's the strength. It's the, that's the strength. And

00:09:37.860 you know, I've reminded people of that now that all the things that you think make you different

00:09:42.840 for negative reasons are the things that make you different for positive reasons. Right. I thought

00:09:47.060 I wasn't old enough to be able to speak about things that people will relate to. Guess what?

00:09:50.660 That makes me different because they've never heard a young man talk about it the way that I have.

00:09:55.180 Right. I thought my voice sounded too weird to be on a microphone. Guess what? That's why when

00:09:59.400 people hear me speak out now, they say, oh, I heard your voice and I turned around and it was you,

00:10:03.140 right? Like everything about you that you feel like is holding you back from pursuing the dream

00:10:08.000 that you have and the way you envision yourself, those are all the strengths. And once you believe

00:10:12.060 in those things and you find a lot of, you know, you find that confidence in it, everything will

00:10:18.200 change, right? You got to love yourself to do so. What's it like now that I've seen the last couple

00:10:24.300 of videos that you put up where again, you're, you're cutting these young men's hair where they

00:10:28.560 actually recognize you. I watched one the other day and it was a young man and he was like, I can't,

00:10:33.860 I can't believe this is happening. This is crazy. Cause nobody would have recognized you when you

00:10:37.360 started. They probably thought you're some strange, weird dude. You probably still get that.

00:10:42.240 But then to have somebody actually acknowledge and recognize you, how does that feel? What does,

00:10:46.300 what does that feel like? I mean, it's a surreal feeling. I don't think it's something for me

00:10:48.980 that I'll ever get old. You know, it's very hard now because like I'm around a lot of successful

00:10:54.840 people and I see them like mad that people come up and they want to take pictures and they want to

00:11:00.260 support them. But like, for me, this is everything I pray for word for word. Exactly. And I, and I

00:11:05.620 always tell myself that if you ask God to eat and he fills your plate up, you got to keep up with

00:11:10.020 your appetite. So everything that I got coming forth to me, like, this is what I asked for. So who am I to

00:11:15.080 be ungrateful for the things that God has given me now? So to have a young kid say, Oh, wow,

00:11:19.840 you're Vic blends. Like I can watch your videos. I want a haircut. Like, man, I prayed for that to

00:11:26.000 happen one day because I remember sitting in the garage, you know, going on live with nobody joining

00:11:30.660 the live or nobody watching the videos and nobody supporting. Like I remember those times and I could

00:11:36.640 still feel it. Like I feel it vividly and I remind myself of those things every day. So when these

00:11:41.920 blessings come forth to me, I don't want to take it for granted. I don't want to act like

00:11:45.820 always nothing now. You know, the fact that somebody is inspired, but what I do is the

00:11:50.800 ultimate gift and I will never take it for granted. You know, I remember that day, like it

00:11:55.360 wasn't too long ago. So like we was trying to go out and shoot a video. And as much as people know

00:12:00.540 who I am, sometimes when we go out there and try to bless people with free cuts to have

00:12:03.740 conversations, sometimes we strike out. Sometimes we don't find nobody. Sometimes, you know,

00:12:08.300 the people we ask, everybody's just too busy or you got something else going on. It doesn't always

00:12:14.020 end up as successful as we think. And I've posted videos of all the no's we might get in a day, but

00:12:18.880 we went to this random park and we sat down and I'm just looking at the water thinking,

00:12:25.480 and I just hear this kid behind me and he's like, wait. Oh, he called you out. He called me out.

00:12:30.440 Oh, that's funny. And I'm like, what's up, man? He's like, oh my gosh, I watched a video. You that

00:12:34.320 dude? I'm like, yeah. And he knows it's a young, it's a young man. So, you know, before I cut or

00:12:39.460 do anything with young kids, I always got to ask parent permission. I'm not out there trying to

00:12:44.840 make content of nobody's kids without having a thorough conversation with parents.

00:12:48.600 There's a lot of weirdos out there too. A lot of weirdos out there. Yeah. I don't want to be that

00:12:51.960 guy that's just doing this weird stuff for social media. So I just wanted to be, you know,

00:12:55.760 as transparent as I can with the parents and they were all cool with him, man. And they were just for

00:12:59.560 anything else to make the kid happy, which I appreciate it as well.

00:13:02.100 Yeah. What are the, what are some trends that you're hearing from these young men? I mean,

00:13:05.620 I'm sure there's things you hear a bunch, you hear it over and over again. Um, are there things that

00:13:10.140 you hear that, that, you know, cut, cut you deep or, or impact you more deeply than others when you

00:13:15.340 hear about some of these stories that these guys are going through? I mean, what they're dealing with.

00:13:19.160 Yeah. I mean, everything that they go through is so different. And, you know, like a lot of people

00:13:22.840 always ask me what was the most impactful conversation I might've had. And like, everybody goes through

00:13:26.600 different things. And I think that's the true beauty of what I do. And, you know, we're exploring

00:13:31.580 the human mind, you know, like everybody's got different thoughts and different things that

00:13:36.260 they've been challenged with or gone through. And every kid goes through something different.

00:13:40.960 Right. I think a lot of kids now are going through, through, through the bullying age,

00:13:43.900 right. Middle school and high school. And they're trying to find out who themselves are trying to

00:13:48.100 figure out what their path is or what they really want to do. And that's the thing that I try to

00:13:53.220 encourage them to do is just find out who you are and stick to it. Right. Because I wish I would have

00:13:58.340 done so earlier in high school. You know, I got my best friend here watching as well. And I just

00:14:03.200 wish that I would have known who I was a long time ago, the same way that he did because he knew

00:14:08.640 who himself was. And we always joke about it, but he got into a lot of fights in high school.

00:14:12.580 And I'm like, damn, I'm like, why are you fighting so much? But it was because he knew who he was.

00:14:16.020 And when he saw some shit that he didn't like or some shit that he didn't agree with,

00:14:19.680 he spoke on it. And if I could go back, I would have just spent more time with myself instead of

00:14:24.740 trying to blend in and be with certain groups or be accepted. That was something that I admired

00:14:29.060 about my friend and I picked up on. And now I can learn from that experience and push it forward to

00:14:34.400 other young kids to just try to stick by what they believe in and what they really want to do.

00:14:39.440 Right. And everything else will handle itself.

00:14:42.300 Yeah. So one of the things I know you talk a lot about is your dad. It sounds like you had a great

00:14:47.560 relationship with your dad. And so what's it like coming from that position of having this relationship

00:14:52.900 with your father to seeing a lot of probably these young men and dealing with the people that you do

00:14:58.180 who don't have those male influences in their lives? Why speak to them directly when you come

00:15:04.360 from a position where you're like, yeah, I had all of that. Was there something else that said,

00:15:09.680 no, I need to speak to these kids?

00:15:11.300 No, I just see a lot of power in my age. To be 22 and be given the knowledge that I have from God,

00:15:16.600 I know it's not for selfish reasons. I know it's not just for myself to benefit off of.

00:15:20.940 And, you know, I'm not, you have kids?

00:15:23.400 Yeah, I've got four.

00:15:24.280 So from a dad perspective, you could feel me when, and I could feel it for myself. Like,

00:15:29.680 I remember my parents trying to teach me things and I was like, man, you don't know what I'm

00:15:33.340 going through. You don't know what I feel like.

00:15:36.280 Too big of a disconnect.

00:15:37.260 Yeah, too big of a disconnect. And it's like all the things that our parents have been telling us

00:15:40.760 our whole life growing up are the things that we needed to hear, but we didn't want to hear it

00:15:44.500 from them. So I'm looking at myself as a 22 year old man. Now, you know, 18, 19, when I started

00:15:51.560 picking up some of these things, like I was blessed with a lot of knowledge at a young age.

00:15:55.640 And I feel like it's to be a vessel to other young kids that might not have that outlet to listen to.

00:16:01.380 Right. Cause some of us don't have the father figures that I might've had, but if I'm able to

00:16:05.740 bridge the gap and listen and hear from a guy with experience and age, and I could get the message,

00:16:11.340 guess what? I just want to give it back out to the ones that might not hear it and might not see

00:16:15.440 it from the guys like you. Yeah. So I just see power in my age. Yeah. That makes a lot of sense.

00:16:19.600 I see that too. Cause I think there's probably, you were talking about it earlier on Instagram or

00:16:23.920 wherever people telling you to shut up and just cut hair. And, and so I could see how the age might be

00:16:29.500 a perceived barrier, but again, that's what makes it strong is that you're so you're closer to them in

00:16:34.500 age than maybe their parents or their grandparents or whatever. Uh, you know, talking to them as an

00:16:38.680 authority figure and somebody just talking to them. It was more so just like a, a burning

00:16:43.060 motivation that, that I've always had while we were younger to, to, cause we, we don't really have

00:16:48.160 for this generation, right. For my generation being, you know, 18, 19, 20, 21, we don't have

00:16:54.260 a figure or a person to look up to. That's going to say, Oh, this is what we need to do to push this

00:17:01.160 generation forward and achieve the things we want to achieve. Everybody our age has popped on social

00:17:06.540 media for, you know, no offense to it, you know, for something that is probably quick, you know,

00:17:11.760 that it might be just dancing or rapping or music or whatever. And all these are great art forms,

00:17:16.540 but a lot of these guys are telling kids to pop pills, to do drugs, to slide on the ops, whatever,

00:17:22.460 you know, whatever they might want to put out there. But like, who do we have for our age to look

00:17:26.660 up to that's going to show kids, this is what real success might look like. This is what you're really

00:17:31.120 going to have to go through. These are the emotions you're going to have to handle. These are the things you

00:17:34.720 might have to battle with your friends and the real shit, the real shit that might not be the

00:17:38.840 coolest to look at. It might not be the coolest to hear, you know, and I get it. Like I want to be

00:17:43.640 a motivational speaker. A lot of our kids, you know, a lot of the people our age, they want to go get

00:17:48.260 turnt up. They want to go drink and smoke, right? So I want to be the guy that's like, nah, I'm going

00:17:52.340 to be in this other lane here. I'm not going to drink. I'm not going to smoke. I'm going to go through

00:17:56.140 the shit and I'm going to put it out exactly the way that I'm going through it. So y'all can learn from

00:18:00.020 the shit that I have to go through. Like we didn't have that and we, we, I'm trying to be it now, but

00:18:04.680 that was the motivation. Like who do we have to look up to? When you were, uh, when you were growing

00:18:10.000 up and you're talking about, uh, the way that you were different than most of your peers, you know,

00:18:15.500 they were doing things that you weren't and you were listening to motivational speeches and trying

00:18:19.180 to get on track. What was the temptation to deviate from that difficult from you in, in your

00:18:24.680 surroundings or were you so convicted in it that it just was a non-issue? I mean, I was extremely

00:18:30.260 convicted. I knew exactly what I had to do. And I, and I stood by that for, for a lot of the times,

00:18:35.440 man, but it's always been times where, you know, I've slipped up and fell into temptation and fell

00:18:39.080 into the influence of my friends want to, you know, want me to come kick it with them again or go

00:18:44.200 drink or go smoking. Every time that I do so, I learned my lesson, right? Like every time that I let go

00:18:49.580 of that conviction I had with myself and I fell into the temptation of what people wanted me to do,

00:18:53.920 I learned my lesson every time. It always bit me right back. Right. So I just remind myself of

00:19:00.100 that, you know, like, yo, I know where I got to go. I know what I got to do and I'll get punished by

00:19:05.780 God every time that I go against that. You know, I remember, you know, one of the days that it was

00:19:10.520 really the last day that I hung out with my, my high school friend, you know, like I don't smoke,

00:19:15.100 don't drink. It's not something I normally do. We used to do it early in high school. You know,

00:19:18.940 like every kid, you got to do it once. You got to get through that. To know like, oh, this is not

00:19:23.400 for me. I ain't going to act like I'm no saint. You know, we used to get turned up too, but it's

00:19:26.740 just, you got to go through it to know this ain't for me. So, you know, I was just graduated going to

00:19:32.080 barber school, trying to pursue like this dream that I had and I was locked in, right? All my friends

00:19:37.080 going to college and I'm the one that sat back in my brother's garage with no AC trying to make

00:19:41.960 shit shake out of this tiny ass garage. And, you know, I just, you know, not that I cut my friends

00:19:48.480 off and I'm just going a different direction. There's no love lost, right? If it's a real

00:19:51.960 friendship, if you got to do what you got to do, then I got to respect that and push that forward,

00:19:57.160 right? I shouldn't be mad at you for doing what you have to do. All of our lives are different. So

00:20:01.020 sometimes as friends, some can't see that. Yeah. So I'm not trying to, you know, disregard the

00:20:06.780 friendship that we had, but I'm just trying to make sure I do what I have to do.

00:20:11.020 And it was one night that they invited me back out. They're like, yo, Vic, we ain't seen you in a

00:20:15.040 while. We really want you to come hang out, come hang out with us, come chill with us, come drink

00:20:18.680 with us, go whatever. It's a Sunday night. I got barber school the next day, 8 a.m. I'm just feeling

00:20:24.260 the guilt, right? Because we've been friends for, you know, going on 10 years. I'm like, man, you're

00:20:28.740 right. Y'all are my friends. You've been my day ones, whatever. Like, all right, I miss y'all too.

00:20:33.660 I'm going to come drink with y'all. But y'all got to make sure I get home in the morning because I got

00:20:37.880 barber school. That was my only non-negotiable make sure I get home in the morning. Right.

00:20:42.680 That's all I wanted. Like, I don't care how lit I get. As long as you get me to my bed,

00:20:46.280 I'll fucking, I'll figure a way to get up and brush my teeth. I'll make it to school.

00:20:50.740 So I go there. We start drinking. I pass out. Right. I get drunk. I get, I get messed up or

00:20:57.240 whatever. I follow this. I was throwing up. I remember, you know, falling asleep in the

00:21:01.080 bathroom, woke up in the morning. I'm still in the bathroom, still by the toilet. I'm sleeping

00:21:07.120 in the, in the, in the crevice of the toilet. I'm like, damn, you know, like what happened

00:21:11.800 to all the friends that said they got me instead of they're going to get me right back to the

00:21:15.100 crib. And, you know, the ones that said they were going to make sure that I get my shit done

00:21:18.780 for the better of me, not just for what I could do for them this night. They all left.

00:21:22.920 I woke up, I'm late. You know, it's like, it's like 11 o'clock. School's already started.

00:21:27.620 I'm, you know, and barber school works off hours. So you got to get the faster hours and

00:21:31.640 the faster you graduate. So that's really bothering me because they knew how much this

00:21:35.100 shit meant to me. And I, I just fell into it, you know? And what it was, was that I had

00:21:40.120 to learn that time didn't equal loyalty. And it doesn't matter how long you've known

00:21:44.240 somebody, if they're not there for the betterment of yourself and to push

00:21:48.760 you forward as a friend, you don't need them. It doesn't matter how long you've known

00:21:52.640 somebody, you're right. Like time doesn't equal loyalty at the end of the day. And I've

00:21:57.240 met guys in the last couple of years that have stood by me, that have done more for

00:22:01.400 me genuinely than I could ever ask for from anybody that I might've known as we were

00:22:05.360 a kid. So that was a lesson that I learned. And from that day forward, like I, it was

00:22:11.460 hard for me to speak to those guys. And it was just, like I said, like, you know,

00:22:15.200 every time that I found that temptation, I learned my lesson.

00:22:19.080 I like that you're saying too, because a lot of times people think that, um, they

00:22:22.860 need to deliberately and intentionally cut friends out. But you also say what you just

00:22:27.440 said is that, you know, you evolve, you grow, you find new friends and it just kind of

00:22:31.000 over time gradually replaces that. If you're replacing it with good activities and things

00:22:35.960 that are actually going to drive the, drive the needle forward.

00:22:38.840 Yeah. Sometimes the separation, you know, they say you got to separate to elevate and

00:22:42.460 it's not you switching up or changing up on your day ones. Like if you, my boy and you

00:22:49.360 really fuck with me and you want me to win, then you shouldn't want me doing the shit

00:22:52.740 that isn't going to better me. You shouldn't be wanting that for me as a friend, right?

00:22:56.720 You shouldn't be mad at me for not coming to smoke a drink with y'all because I'm trying

00:23:00.580 to go and pursue my dream. Do you get any pushback from those guys? I mean, it

00:23:05.840 sounds like you're not as tight maybe as you once were, but do you get any pushback

00:23:09.640 from, you know, people in, in, in your past, whether it's friends or even relatives

00:23:14.000 who are like, Oh, look what you're trying to be. I know who you really are. Look what

00:23:17.620 you're trying to be now. This isn't you. Do you get any of that sort of thing?

00:23:20.340 I mean, whether I do or I don't like I'm at peace with myself and that's the most

00:23:24.820 important thing. I can't live my life off the opinion of whatever's my think. I know

00:23:30.060 I'm following everything that God told me to do. I know I'm happy with myself. I know

00:23:33.840 I'm making an impact on this world. And if anybody got something else to say about

00:23:37.060 it, like fuck them. And that's honestly how I feel. And I know that my heart has

00:23:42.060 been right for everybody. You know, I've done right through my heart for anybody

00:23:45.780 that I've came across and I've never went into any relationship with non genuine

00:23:50.180 intentions for them. And I know that I gave those guys my genuine love. I know I

00:23:54.820 gave them my, my, my best foot forward every time. And no matter how they feel

00:23:58.940 about me now, I know that I could look back and say, I never did anybody dirty to

00:24:03.000 get to where I'm at. And I could live with myself. I could look in the mirror

00:24:05.840 every day and feel confident in looking at that man and saying, yo, you did right.

00:24:09.500 Everything you got come up for yourself. You earned. Yeah. You know, so no matter how

00:24:12.800 they feel about it, you know, I'm going to do that, that, that, that word is bond,

00:24:16.740 right? Like word is bond to me. And whatever the last thing I told you is the last

00:24:20.760 thing I'm standing on, even if we haven't spoke for years. And the last thing I told

00:24:25.060 every one of those guys was I love you, right? I just got to love you from a

00:24:28.700 distance, right? You can't love everybody the same way that you love them forever.

00:24:32.580 Some people you got to learn how to love differently. And that's what I learned

00:24:35.380 that all the people that I love that I, sometimes I got to love them from, from

00:24:39.600 different places. I can't love everybody in this immediate circle right now.

00:24:42.880 Cause if I do so, I'm just going to open myself up to get hurt more and more.

00:24:46.680 So I love all those guys, you know, like I'll never forget the times we spent, but

00:24:50.960 remember time don't equal loyalty. So no matter how long I've known y'all, I can't

00:24:55.040 love y'all the same way that I loved y'all back then because our lives are just

00:24:58.080 very different right now. And there's things that I got to protect, whether it's

00:25:01.400 my family, whether it's my emotional happiness, what, you know, whatever it is,

00:25:05.660 got to love them differently. So they know I got love for them. You know,

00:25:09.300 What do you, what do you look for in people that you want in your circle now?

00:25:12.200 Like when you're, you know, you have people coming to your life and it's

00:25:15.460 interesting as you become probably more popular as you will and more well-known,

00:25:20.340 you know, those are things you're going to have to look out for. These, are these

00:25:22.660 genuine people? Are they trying to take advantage of me?

00:25:25.040 Like, what is it that you're looking for that you want people in your corner,

00:25:28.080 your circle?

00:25:28.880 I mean, all you can really look for is a genuine heart, right? Like everybody

00:25:31.920 doesn't have to have a million followers to come rock me. You don't have to have

00:25:35.300 a million dollars to come rock me. You don't got to be driving no expensive shit

00:25:38.940 to come rock me. Like all you can really look for at this point is a genuine heart

00:25:42.460 because that's probably the most scarce thing. Once you become successful, you, you,

00:25:47.180 you know, you get a certain amount of equity, your name, you don't have that

00:25:51.140 anymore. It's, it's, they say it's lonely at the top. And that's a very real statement

00:25:56.460 because to get to that top, you got to go through a lot of pain. You got to go through

00:26:01.100 a lot of people that wanted different things out of their relationship with you that said

00:26:05.880 they were there for you and really weren't. And it's lonely at the top because of the

00:26:09.120 amount of pain that you got to go through, the amount of people that are going to walk

00:26:11.600 in and out of your life and you sort of get into this defense mode. So I remind myself

00:26:16.320 that no matter where I get to in my life, look for the genuineness, like, right. Look

00:26:19.960 where the love is. And yeah, everybody doesn't have to bring, you know, like I said, a million

00:26:26.240 followers to the table to come kick it with me. I'm not that type of guy. I'm going to

00:26:29.560 look where somebody's heart is at. And if your heart is in the right place, sometimes

00:26:33.140 if all you can offer me is a conversation, that's enough because we don't get a lot of

00:26:36.560 that. Once you become, you know, this, this, this figure that people see, right. You

00:26:41.360 don't, it's not something that you always get. What's something that you talk about

00:26:44.800 going through a lot of the pain? What's some of the pain that, uh, you, you know,

00:26:48.100 you remember a story of, of you dealing with some of this hardship on your, your

00:26:52.740 path to try to follow in. And I don't want to put words in your mouth, but in God's

00:26:56.680 plan for you. Yeah. I mean, yo, the, I mean, some of the hardest shit that I had to

00:27:01.760 learn. And obviously I'm, you know, I'm young, I'm a young guy. So yeah, I ain't

00:27:04.980 gone through, you know, having kids and a wife and stuff. I know that's the word. So

00:27:08.840 people are probably like, well, yeah, so what have you gone through? Right. So what

00:27:11.660 have you gone through? But you know, like one of the hardest lessons I had to

00:27:15.640 learn was that the people, some people just, some people want to see you do good,

00:27:20.000 but not better than them. And that was a very hard lesson for me. And I remember

00:27:24.220 having, you know, mentors of, of mine that I looked up to in my hometown that I put

00:27:28.900 heart and soul into and would, would, would go to learn from and seek from, and they

00:27:33.860 will push me forward. And I feel like these are guys I want to learn from. And, you

00:27:37.300 know, these are the people that inspire me every day. And the second that you get an

00:27:42.020 inch on somebody, it immediately goes from support to envy to hate. And it's, it's

00:27:49.100 sporadic. It's almost instant. And that was a lesson that I had to learn. And that

00:27:53.300 hurt me a lot. You know, like it was guys that I looked up to in my city that, you

00:27:58.980 know, like I've, I've stood by, I've like you, if you were the barber, I would go and

00:28:03.020 stand right next to you on your shoulder for hours. And I would, I would sit there

00:28:06.900 and I would watch you cut. I would ask you questions and try to learn from you.

00:28:10.040 And, you know, it was a, it was a cute thing for them at that time. But like, I

00:28:13.540 was never into this just to be somebody's sidekick or just to be, you know, oh, like

00:28:19.020 sitting under somebody wing. Like I give gratitude and I give grace to anybody

00:28:23.680 that's ever helped me. Even the guys that hurt me now, I will never be ungrateful for

00:28:28.660 all the things that they taught me to get to where I'm at, no matter how the

00:28:31.400 relationship might've turned. So like, I will never, you know, disregard somebody's

00:28:35.580 help towards my career or my life. But, you know, I remember walking into, you

00:28:40.340 know, one of an old mentor of mine, like to his barbershop at nighttime. It was

00:28:45.300 like 8 p.m. I just got done cutting for the, for the whole day. I was cutting from

00:28:50.060 like 6 a.m. to like 8 p.m. And I was just getting off to go have my first meal

00:28:54.800 for the day. Like I was working strenuous hours and I, you know, drove by his

00:28:59.540 barbershop. I see him stealing their cut and I go in and I tap him on to show him

00:29:03.220 like, what's up, bro? First thing he says when he turns to me, mind you, like, this

00:29:07.100 is a dude, we're close. I would, I would seek, you know, knowledge from, seek love

00:29:10.880 from, seek like inspiration from. I'm thinking I'm about to just go in there and

00:29:14.960 say what's up to the homie. I tap him on the back. He got a shot full of people.

00:29:18.520 He turned back and say, oh, what's up, bro? You Hollywood now. Oh, right. You don't want

00:29:22.760 to shout me out on Instagram. What's up? I'm like, like, what is it? What are we even

00:29:26.900 talking about, bro? What are we talking about? Some Instagram ass shit right

00:29:31.440 now? Like, like, where's the, where's, this is real love right here. Like, you're

00:29:36.960 talking to me about some shit, a virtual number on a phone and that stopping you

00:29:41.780 from seeing the love that I have from you? Like, I mean, I ain't even eat today, but

00:29:45.800 I'm gonna make sure I say what's up to you before I even go put food in my mouth and

00:29:49.400 you over here talking to me about some Instagram ass shit. Like, that's, that's the

00:29:53.440 shit that fucking be hurting, man. Because I just be having love for my

00:29:57.900 people, man. And others are in it for different reasons. And like I said, like

00:30:02.040 everybody doesn't have this genuine intent for you and they want to seek some

00:30:07.240 other shit from you. And the second you get an inch on some people, it turns very

00:30:11.040 quickly. And, you know, this dude looked me in my face and told me that I would

00:30:14.760 never be shit. I cut in a garage and that's all I ever be. Yeah. That was it.

00:30:19.940 That's crazy. I mean, it hurt. It brought me to tears. I left that shop so

00:30:24.080 confused. And, you know, all you could really do at that time is thank God that

00:30:27.960 the things went that way because all that was was a snake that was in my

00:30:30.960 grass. That's all it was was a snake in my grass. And sometimes when the people

00:30:35.540 hurt you that bad, you got to be grateful for them because that never

00:30:39.460 happened. He never showed me his true colors. I probably would have still had

00:30:42.700 that dude around me to this day. Yeah. Still would have been bringing him

00:30:45.320 around, still would have been sharing all the things that I had to work for

00:30:47.960 today with him because I would have just had this loyalty. You know, I would

00:30:51.980 have been stuck to this loyalty with him through those times. Like and if he if

00:30:55.860 he that didn't happen to me like me or even happen with the people that it has

00:31:01.140 happened with, I have no idea like where my circle and my peace would be at

00:31:04.600 right now. But, you know, those are some things that really fucking cut with me

00:31:08.620 here. Yeah, I bet. So I don't mean to be condescending when I say this. So I hope

00:31:12.160 it doesn't come across because it's actually meant as a compliment. But you're 22,

00:31:15.800 22, right? So young man. But you're different than 22 year olds. Like, do you

00:31:23.320 recognize that? I mean, of course, I'm like, I'm a humble guy, but I'm also like

00:31:27.820 self aware of myself. And I just try not to. I don't like walk like you're never

00:31:35.820 going to. I don't feel that. But you're different. I'm self aware. Like I'm a smart

00:31:40.420 guy. Like, you know, and I would never downplay myself or the wittiness of what

00:31:45.200 I've been able to build. I'm very self aware that I've been given a great gift

00:31:49.320 at a young age, given a lot of potential, given a large platform, given an amazing

00:31:52.960 voice. So, of course, I get that. But it's like I said, it's for me to show others how

00:32:01.220 to get there as well. So I do get exactly what you're saying. Yeah. Is it so you've

00:32:07.160 talked a lot about your faith in God? Do you think that's what makes you

00:32:10.540 different? Are there other things where you're talking about this self

00:32:13.220 awareness? Because, yeah, 22 year olds aren't doing what you do. I mean, they're

00:32:16.980 on Instagram like they're doing that stuff, trying to get famous. But what

00:32:20.180 you're talking about and even the messages that you're sharing right now,

00:32:23.240 there's a ton of wisdom in what you're sharing that most 22 year olds just don't

00:32:27.600 have. I mean, I would be, yeah, God is a big part, but I'm not like, dog, I'm not,

00:32:33.200 I mean, my faith is everything, of course, but I'm not the dude that's like going to

00:32:38.980 just like kill y'all with the God speech. Like I'm not that type of guy. Like I got

00:32:44.840 a very strong faith. Don't get me wrong. And I'm not downplaying my faith with God.

00:32:48.200 But man, I just feel like I found out what I believe in. There are principles and

00:32:53.620 morals to being, you know, a great person that I stand on.

00:32:57.600 And I don't try to compromise that for any opportunity or any situation, any person.

00:33:02.040 And I think that that's just what I stand on. And you just don't see that a lot because

00:33:07.880 it's easy at a young age to be influenced by opportunity, by numbers, by money, by people

00:33:13.320 and trying to get this acceptance or trying to prove to people that you're different

00:33:17.780 or you're better than what you really are. But I'm just confident in myself and the

00:33:22.060 things that God got planned for me. And I know that they're coming. I know they're

00:33:24.940 down in my pipeline. Right. Like if you got faith in the plan that he got written for

00:33:30.120 you, I don't care how long it's going to take. I know it's coming. So I know that the

00:33:34.140 things that I pray for and things that I envision are coming. So I'm just confident in that.

00:33:37.800 And I'm willing to take the patience I need for it to happen. And I just, you know, like

00:33:42.680 I said, I mean, I give a lot of credit to my hometown, though, as well. Growing up in

00:33:46.280 Fayetteville, North Carolina, in a very small town, not really seeing a lot of success come

00:33:50.860 out of there. But the ones that do become successful, we learn a lot from them. You

00:33:54.900 know, we got Jay Cole. We got my brother, Dennis Smith Jr. We got Murray now. We got a lot

00:33:59.700 of dope figures from the hometown that come out. And when you're a person that gets an

00:34:04.560 opportunity to make it on a national level from a town that nobody ever looks at, you

00:34:10.540 got to you got to carry that a certain way. So I'm just extremely humbled and grateful

00:34:15.360 that, you know, God chose me out of my hometown. And I hope that I can shine a light on the

00:34:20.300 others that might be stuck in a small inner city that have the talent, but maybe not the

00:34:24.240 resources. So, you know, coming from Fayetteville, bro, like I just got to be humble. Like, you

00:34:29.060 know, shit could be worse. Like, who am I to be, you know, ungrateful now or, you

00:34:33.400 know, walk with, like, like I'm bigger than who I am, man. Like, fuck, I done beat the

00:34:37.580 odds already, man. Like everything now is just a blessing.

00:34:41.900 All right, you guys, let me hit the pause button on the conversation very quickly. I

00:34:45.700 talked about it briefly, but I need to talk about the man in caged event again. It may

00:34:50.800 not come as a surprise to you, but I believe that society at large is dead set on undermining

00:34:56.640 and ridiculing and dismissing masculinity at every single turn. And as you know, I've been

00:35:02.500 hell bent on correcting that problem so much so that I decided the end of last year to

00:35:08.700 take a trip down to Cancun. And I called up some good friends of mine because I wanted

00:35:14.820 to enlist the help of them. Bedros Koulian, John Lovell, Tanner Guzzi, Jack Donovan, Matt

00:35:22.020 Bedro, Steven Mansfield. I mean, the who's who of the masculinity space. And I wanted to

00:35:30.660 enlist them in the battle to reclaim and restore masculinity. So what we've decided to do is

00:35:39.620 we're going to be hosting our very first ever man uncaged event, May 7th, 2022. I know that

00:35:45.780 it's very short notice. We wanted to make it available. Guys are busy. Like we just, we

00:35:50.700 wanted to make it available. But again, I know it's short notice. If you can make it to central

00:35:55.340 Northern California, I guarantee that you're not going to be disappointed in this event.

00:35:59.840 Okay. So we only have limited spots. So please get registered as soon as possible at manuncaged.com

00:36:06.000 slash live manuncaged.com slash live. You're going to meet with Bedros. You're going to meet with me,

00:36:12.800 which is obviously going to be the highlight, right? Uh, John Lovell, Tanner Guzzi, Jack Donovan,

00:36:17.560 Steven Mansfield, Matt Bedro, and so many more incredible men who are all banded with me

00:36:21.980 in this fight to reclaim and restore masculinity. Again, manuncaged.com slash live. All right,

00:36:31.180 guys, do that right after the show. Cause we have limited seats for now. I'll get back to it with

00:36:35.260 Vic. Is there ever been a time in your life or even coming up where you feel like you talk about

00:36:42.600 God's plan for you might be different than the plan that you have for yourself? And how do you

00:36:47.600 differentiate between the two and decide which path you're going to follow? Yeah. I mean,

00:36:53.500 that's that, like what it said, that's the heart versus the brain, right? Like a heart versus the

00:36:58.020 brain. And you know, sometimes I, I try to follow, I follow that lead with my heart. And of course,

00:37:03.080 like sometimes you've got to think logical about situations and things like that. So

00:37:07.060 of course there's situations where I could logically think this isn't a good move for me. I get that,

00:37:12.440 but the best ideas come from, from when you have that, that fire inside and you, you kind of get

00:37:17.820 those emotions. Like you're going up a rollercoaster and when you get those type of emotions, when you

00:37:22.000 thinking about some shit you want to do, like that's the best feeling to be in. So when I, when I get

00:37:25.980 that and I, and I think about some shit that we're going to do, or we're about to get done. And I get

00:37:30.080 that like, Oh fuck, I'm going up a rollercoaster right now. I'm like, yo, I'm headed in the right

00:37:33.600 direction because if I never got that feeling for any idea I had, like I probably would still be in

00:37:38.520 favor. But when you, you get that good burning feeling like, man, I know I'm headed in the right

00:37:43.080 direction and whether I fail or whether I succeed, like I learned from it. And as long as you're

00:37:49.920 learning, you never really lose. And so, you know, I just, yeah, I mean, you know, God's plan always

00:37:56.440 come through at the end of the day, I believe. And, um, you know, even decisions that I try to make

00:38:01.240 happen that, that don't happen. I just know it wasn't meant for me and I'll chalk it up and move on to

00:38:05.460 the next one, trying to get too emotionally attached to opportunities that go left.

00:38:09.740 Or, or like you said, it, you know, you were meant to do that. It wasn't meant to pan out the way you

00:38:14.060 thought, but it was a learning opportunity. You were meant to learn that, right? You were meant to

00:38:17.320 learn that, right? Like all the, all the girlfriends we might've had that we thought were going to be

00:38:21.420 the one every time they went left, you're like, damn, you know what happened? So, you know, I was just

00:38:27.220 supposed to go through that pain because it prepared me for what's coming next. So I, I got this quote

00:38:33.080 that I heard while I was working, um, in a restaurant. They said that there's always a

00:38:37.960 test before promotion. So when I heard that, I'm like, damn, all the shit, you know, all the shit

00:38:45.020 that I'm going through that's making me go through this, you know, hurt and it's pain. It's just

00:38:51.180 preparing me for something that's way better down the road. And it's sometimes when you hear that

00:38:56.180 shit, you're in the midst of that pain. You don't even want to hear it. It's hard to hear. You don't

00:38:59.500 even want to hear that shit, man. This girl just broke my heart. She's supposed to be my wife.

00:39:03.420 She's so bad. She just left me for this other dude. I don't want to hear nothing you talking

00:39:07.080 about. And it's the faith that you got to build to say, man, I'm confident in the things that will

00:39:12.440 be meant for me will be meant for me. And all the, all the struggle, all the, all the downfall,

00:39:17.960 the pain you got to go through is just preparing you to be grateful for the things that God got coming

00:39:22.120 for you later. So when I, when I think about the friends that hurt me, you know, it prepared me to be

00:39:27.780 grateful for the friends I got now. And I know how to cherish and love those people. The mentors

00:39:32.840 that hurt me before I know how to cherish and love and grow the relationship with my mentors now in a

00:39:37.660 different way. Like I learned how to look at people. I learned how to love people differently. I learned

00:39:43.040 how to communicate with people differently through all the pain and all the bullshit I had to go through

00:39:46.860 with the people that walked in and out of my life before. There's always going to be a test before

00:39:50.320 the promotion. I may have less than 10 people in my circle right now, but out of the hundred people

00:39:55.020 that did me dirty. I know how to love these 10 people to the best 10. Yeah. One of the things

00:40:00.280 that I know is important to you, you talk about prison reform a bit. You talk about making sure

00:40:06.140 that these, these inmates who come out of prison have applicable skills, marketable skills. And

00:40:13.560 you've got a little bit of a victory in that there's in California, there's barber schools now,

00:40:18.580 right? Talk to me about that and why that's so important to you and how you see that helping these

00:40:23.680 men that come through the prison system. Yeah. I mean, y'all shout out to my brother,

00:40:27.680 Scott Budnick, you know, first and foremost for opening that, that lane of my life for me.

00:40:32.680 When, when you, when you think about like when I prayed to, to, to have impact and when I thought

00:40:38.080 about being this inspiration to people and I never thought about it in, in this lane or that lane.

00:40:44.120 I just said, that's what I want to do. And whatever God has opened for me or whatever he wants me

00:40:48.980 to be in to do so, I'm going to take. So it wasn't like I sat down before and said,

00:40:54.800 oh man, I'm going to pray to do prison reform. It's like, I prayed to have a voice. I prayed to

00:41:00.340 have impact. I prayed to use my platform. Whatever God felt was going to be meant for me will be meant

00:41:05.060 for me. So I remember just sitting at, sitting at the house and I get a DM from, from our mutual

00:41:11.680 friend, Irv Rowland. Shout out to Irv, who was a veteran NBA trainer, but also a social activist and,

00:41:17.780 you know, works in social reform. Uh, he just sent me a DM. He's like, yo,

00:41:21.920 my boy Scott Budnick wants to get in contact with you. He's a producer, produced the Hangover,

00:41:26.080 Project X, Just Mercy. And I'm like, oh, the Hangover? Yeah. Okay, bet. Give him my number.

00:41:31.560 I think this is my, I think this is my, my big opportunity on the screen. I'm about to be in

00:41:34.600 the next Hangover. Like I'm out of here. So he gives him my number. He hits me up. He's like,

00:41:39.700 hey, what's up, bro? My name is Scott Budnick, producer for the Hangover. This is down the third.

00:41:44.100 I'm like, man, what's up, bro? Like what's, what role you got for me? What's the script?

00:41:47.780 Right. He said, oh, nah, man, I work in prison reform and the people on the inside,

00:41:52.700 I really love your voice and I've been sharing your videos. I would love to bring you out to a,

00:41:56.100 to a prison in California to meet some of these guys. Right. I'm like, man, this is different.

00:42:00.040 Yeah. All right. This isn't what I'm, this is not what I imagined that, that I would be doing.

00:42:05.340 You know, like, again, it was not something I thought I could even do. I didn't think I

00:42:08.620 looked apart. I had the story for it or like had the connection for it. Or I just didn't think

00:42:13.120 that I was somewhere I could have impact that, but it's what God had in my, my plan. So I'm like,

00:42:18.580 all right, bro. You know, we get on the phone, we talked for maybe an hour and a half late night

00:42:22.300 on the phone, uh, really connected. And, you know, again, energy, man, it's, it's all about

00:42:26.600 the people that come with a genuine heart. Uh, we chopped it up. I got on a flight, maybe two weeks

00:42:31.760 later, LA. And I was in the midst of opening a creative studio. I wanted to open a creative studio

00:42:37.360 in Atlanta to, to bring together like opportunity for young creatives that might not have resources

00:42:42.940 and mentorship. Like what, like when you say creative, what, like video, like content creation,

00:42:47.960 creating content, you know, building a brand. Okay. Might've been Barbara and it might, anything

00:42:53.180 like I'm not limited to just like this, this cutting hair out. I love video production. I love

00:42:58.100 speaking. I love brand building. That's just what I, what I love. So I was about to open this 8,000

00:43:03.680 square foot building right in the heart of Midtown Atlanta, about to sign for it. It

00:43:08.460 was really, it was a hefty rent. It was definitely, it was a, I was prepared for it. I wasn't scared

00:43:13.820 to do it, but, um, that was me living in the flesh and saying, yo, this is the direction

00:43:18.060 I'm going with. I'm going to open this. I'm going to do that. And the day, right. It was,

00:43:22.680 I remember going out to LA and I was getting the contract back from my real estate agent at

00:43:27.540 the time, uh, for this commercial building. I'm about to sign the day I go to,

00:43:33.680 uh, Lancaster prison, uh, with Scott. It changed my life. And I think I'm in this direction to

00:43:39.720 open this studio, about to be locked in. It was a five year lease. Couldn't get out of

00:43:43.600 it paying like 10 grand a month. I was going to, they, I was going to be stuck. The day

00:43:48.840 I get the contract is the day we go to the prison. Can't bring your phones inside of a prison.

00:43:53.960 So I don't get to respond in time to even sign it. By the time I come out of that prison,

00:43:58.780 uh, there's, I'm like, yo, there's no way that I could, that I could stop exploring this

00:44:03.800 direction. Right. And if I was signed that contract earlier and would have had my phone

00:44:08.240 on me, I would have been locked in. I would have been on some totally other shit. So when

00:44:12.460 I left, uh, when we left that visit and we finished that weekend, Scott was like, you

00:44:16.100 know, well, there's never been a barber program in California prison history. He's like, if you

00:44:22.600 want to do so, we could start working now. It's possible. And what hit home for me in

00:44:29.360 the way that the, the reason why, you know, I, I want to see this change is because we

00:44:34.440 come from very small towns with a lack of opportunity or a lack of, you know, direction

00:44:40.120 or, or blueprint for people to make it out. And although I'm not affected personally,

00:44:44.400 like it ain't like my dad been locked up forever and I'm, you know, all this is why I want to

00:44:47.920 be here. I'm a person that has empathy for other humans. And I think as long as you

00:44:52.460 can have empathy for the things that other people go through, then you have a heart for

00:44:56.080 change. And I have empathy for growing up in the communities that we have and seeing

00:45:01.320 people be affected by incarceration in and out. And what it is, is lack of resource and

00:45:07.160 opportunity and lack of knowledge. A lot of people just don't know what they can do or

00:45:11.900 can't achieve. And I know you can't be the savior for every person out there, but you

00:45:16.420 know, if you want to see change happen, you gotta, you gotta be that change first. So if I have

00:45:21.220 an opportunity in front of me to provide men and women in the community, in these communities that

00:45:26.520 get stuck in a cycle of incarceration that have, you know, been systematically oppressed by,

00:45:31.540 if I can give them an opportunity to go back to the communities that they once hurt before

00:45:36.340 and now be able to help, then I'm doing my part, right? I'm just, I'm just fulfilling my part. And

00:45:41.680 that's all I want to do is play my part. They say the world is a stage and everybody got a role

00:45:46.640 to play. And if that's my role for right now and it's part of the movie, I'm going to do so. So

00:45:50.980 if, if I, you know, and this is providing tools, right? You teach a man, you give a man a fish to eat

00:45:56.860 for the day, you teach him how to fish to eat forever. So providing somebody with a tool like

00:46:00.860 a barber's license, you now change their role in that community from, oh, I'm going back here to

00:46:07.760 go fuck with the same homies I've been fucking with that put me in this position to be locked up like

00:46:11.520 this. I'm going to fall into the same cycle. And yes, they can go and they should be, you know,

00:46:17.020 people are going to argue and say, oh, it's, they should be, you know, strong minded and go through

00:46:21.480 the shit. But like, man, prison isn't designed for us to be, to be rehabilitated. That's not what

00:46:26.360 it is, right? It should be, but that's not what it is. You know? So a lot of these guys don't even

00:46:31.820 get the mental change to come back to the communities with a different mindset, but you're going to get

00:46:36.500 locked up, you're coming home, you're going back to the same shit, you're going back to the same people,

00:46:40.400 nothing has changed. So to give somebody now a role to come back to the communities and provide

00:46:45.340 a different perspective, to provide mentorship, to provide love, and then a haircut, like, yo,

00:46:51.100 that's different. And they're going to, they're going to make money from it. And not only are they

00:46:55.080 going to make money from it, but I'm going to show them how to make money at the highest level for it.

00:46:59.340 Like, I'm going to provide a different curriculum for them, different mentorship, different, you know,

00:47:04.120 insight on it. And hopefully they're motivated to do so because the most important role of a barber is

00:47:09.420 not just the cut that you provide, but it's the role that you play in your community as a pillar.

00:47:13.580 And that's what I want these guys to become, you know, because they have, they've had trouble

00:47:17.800 past them and they've gone through a lot of trauma and things that, you know, I pray none of us have

00:47:22.540 to go through ever, but they need to, they can speak from that experience now and be a real role

00:47:29.080 model to the kids that might be falling into the same shit because everybody needs a cut, right?

00:47:33.140 So all the kids that come through the shop, they get, they cut, they need to hear it from men that

00:47:37.180 have gone through it to say like, yo, you don't have to be in this, this path anymore. So, uh,

00:47:41.780 that, you know, it's my real motivation, man. It's just trying to make a change for the communities

00:47:44.780 that we grew up in and stop this cycle of incarceration. So, you know, we could have some

00:47:48.960 real change in our, in our lives. You're, you're right about the barbershop because they're, you

00:47:54.800 know, it's not so much anymore, but there used to be a time where all the men would get together

00:47:59.080 and they'd talk about life and they'd talk about culture and they'd work through their

00:48:02.900 differences. And then they'd bring their sons into the barber who, who their dad was getting

00:48:07.680 their haircut from. And they'd learn all these lessons from these guys. I love that. The culture

00:48:12.680 of it. Yeah. We, we grew up in a barbershop. That's, that's why I am a barber. I grew up in,

00:48:18.300 in, in a barbershop. Shout out to Barber Kings, Sean and Q, our mentors, our, our brothers, our,

00:48:24.800 our guys, like that's, we grew up in that shop. We would walk to the barbershop every Sunday

00:48:29.700 from my mom's house, from the neighborhood. And we would walk all the way down to the shop and

00:48:34.360 we were sitting there all day, really all day waiting for a cup. We getting skipped left and

00:48:39.760 right. They asking who next? Some big ass dude is standing up saying, I'm next. I know I'm next.

00:48:47.320 I'm looking at him like, yeah, you next, bro. And we just like, we will waste our whole, not wasted,

00:48:52.960 but like we would spend our whole day there just like hearing the dudes talk shit. Sean, Q, Gina,

00:48:58.420 they would just like mess with each other all day. They would like, look at, look at the, they

00:49:02.580 would look at the, the, um, the customers and be like, yo, watch this. They'd go up to the other

00:49:07.260 one and like, you know, like hit them or something like messing with them. And then it was just such

00:49:11.200 an experience to grow up there. But aside from like the funny shit that would happen there,

00:49:15.260 all the, all the walls in there were filled with history, like true history, like shit that you won't

00:49:21.500 learn in the school books. Right. It's all the shit that, um, you know, it's kind of silenced through

00:49:26.080 education nowadays and we would learn it there. We would learn about the things on the walls,

00:49:30.920 we'd have open conversations. They would, we would speak about problems going on in our city,

00:49:35.900 in our community, in the world. You know, you would, you would hear about musicians and artists

00:49:40.420 and, and, and painters and writers that you've never heard before. I would, I learned so much about

00:49:45.880 like this culture that we live in every day through living in this barbershop. And it's a beautiful

00:49:49.840 thing. And it's also a tradition that has been lost in the last couple of years through,

00:49:54.400 you know, the social media wave and things getting a little bit more personal than,

00:49:57.840 and then COVID coming. So, you know, I think it's a great thing. And ultimately, man,

00:50:02.360 this is human connection. Yeah. That's all that really comes down to it at the grand scheme of

00:50:06.100 things is human connection and mentorship. So that's like the most important thing. And that's

00:50:10.480 why we have, excuse me, such an emotional connection to it is because we went through it and we grew up in

00:50:15.820 that. What's a, what's some of the pushback that you get for some of the things you're doing within

00:50:20.980 the prison reform system? Cause, and I've changed my thought over the past, I would say a couple of

00:50:26.080 years ago. Uh, I used to think I would say things like, and I'm sure you get this, like, oh, these

00:50:30.820 people have lost their right to that, to have education. Why should I pay for their education

00:50:35.000 when they've proven, you know, that they're, they're not going to honor it or whatever it might be.

00:50:40.140 But I thought to myself over the past couple of years, you know, what, well, what's the alternative?

00:50:45.320 Lock them up and let them continue to go through that cycle. Or is there an opportunity for society to,

00:50:50.780 provide an education that either A, wasn't available to them or B, they didn't take advantage

00:50:56.920 of both can exist. Um, and, and do, do a good job for those people and do a good job for society as a

00:51:03.240 whole. I'm not sure if you get pushed back like that or anything else, but I am curious what people

00:51:07.240 say. I mean, of course it's going to be pushed back with anything you do, whether it's, you know,

00:51:11.040 prison reform or do start a podcast or shooting video, it'll be pushed back to whatever you,

00:51:16.380 you, you want to do. But if it's something you believe in, you got to go through it no matter

00:51:20.000 what somebody says. So I feel that it's in my heart. I feel God called me to do so.

00:51:24.920 So if somebody got something else to say, not that I, you know, I don't care what they got to think,

00:51:29.740 but I really don't when it comes down to me following what I think I'm here to do by God.

00:51:34.360 And who am I to judge what another man or another human should be doing? That ain't for us to say so.

00:51:41.180 Who am I to say what another human should be doing with their life or they, they right?

00:51:44.820 Like, that ain't like, who the fuck are you? You know, like, honestly, man, like they say only God

00:51:50.600 could judge, but a lot of people really don't even stand by that. And all we do is put a label on

00:51:55.840 somebody, not even knowing the situation or the shit that they had to go through and the reason

00:51:59.360 why they were even there. That's the real bullshit is why was that person even in that situation

00:52:04.540 to even feel the need to commit that crime? Like they're trying to find love in a community where

00:52:10.040 it doesn't exist. That's the real problem is that there's not even an opportunity in some of

00:52:14.480 these communities. There's not even schools. There's not even mentors. It's not even jobs

00:52:18.580 available for them to even become a working citizen of their community. Right? So there's a bigger problem

00:52:24.800 to this shit. You want to nitpick a dude for selling dope. The only opportunity he had to make a

00:52:29.260 fucking dollar was to sell dope. Right? When you're at the, at a bridge point, whereas I sell this

00:52:34.640 fucking weed or I sell whatever it is I got to sell or my kid doesn't eat, what are you going

00:52:40.400 to do? Right. You're going to go sell that weed. You have to because you're fucking using what's

00:52:44.740 in front of you. Could you get up and go move and do all this shit? Yes, you can, but there's so many

00:52:49.120 things that make it hard for a person to do so. So it's lack of opportunity, lack of knowledge,

00:52:55.500 and it's shit that could be fixed through education and things that we're able to preach out and teach

00:52:59.640 to others. But who are you to sit back and say what another person should be doing, man,

00:53:04.320 or what they should be fucking being given in their life? Like some of these guys have committed

00:53:09.060 their crimes, man, at age 14 and 15 and 16 years old. They're kids. Think about your mind at 15

00:53:16.000 and 16. Yeah. Right? Not even the same person. So now here you are as a 45 year old man, you spent

00:53:21.500 30 years locked up and you got to pay for the thing that you did at 14. Now I'm not disregarding

00:53:26.880 any type of, you know, feeling for the victims of these situations and the victims of these crimes,

00:53:31.560 bro. Like there's no, you know, like there's, there's no easy way to move past these things,

00:53:37.180 but you got to forgive to move forward. And we got to understand that these aren't the same people

00:53:42.520 anymore. Like they gone through 30 years of sitting on this crime thinking like, fuck,

00:53:47.580 if I could go back, I would fix it again. But society never gives them a chance to be seen as

00:53:51.840 human again. And that's all they want to be is, is to be seen as human, not to be seen as like

00:53:57.320 anything to be seen as a person. When I first walked into the prison, I was scared. I remember

00:54:02.460 telling Scott, like, man, these guys ain't going to fucking talk to me, man. They go. I don't know

00:54:06.520 what it is I'm walking into. I think I'm, I think I'm walking into beyond scared straight or some

00:54:10.560 shit. I think I'm walking on to like, you know, locked up on A&E or whatever. I think that's what it's

00:54:16.160 going to be like, man, I go in there. I meet some of the nicest and some of the kindest and some of

00:54:21.940 the most interesting and wisdom filled guys I've ever met in my life, like ever. And all they wanted

00:54:29.080 to be, all they wanted was just to be heard and to have a conversation with a human on the outside

00:54:33.640 that will look at them as another human and not a number. They just want to be forgiven and they

00:54:37.940 want to be seen as equal. And it is very hard, you know? And I mean, fuck, I mean, if I get backlash for

00:54:44.440 and I'm sorry, like I'm going to die standing by what I believe in. I think that's, I think that's

00:54:49.160 important when you say, Hey, I don't care what they think, but also the alternative or another

00:54:52.820 perspective is making sure that you're aware of what the pushback is. So you can drive forward

00:54:57.540 with something that's meaningful to you. Right. Yeah. But those are two different things. And I'm not

00:55:01.220 on my, you know, I say that, but I'm not, I'm not even on my platform saying fuck anybody that

00:55:06.720 thinks otherwise, like it's education, bro. If I could change the perspective, I could change the way

00:55:11.100 that we live. Right. If I could, if I could show you through the things I'm doing and I'm willing

00:55:15.500 to take the risk to do so, like maybe I could change that. So if you got something negative to

00:55:20.840 say about me and you just blatantly don't want to hear it. Yeah. Maybe it's fuck you, man. But if you

00:55:25.480 just are confused about it and got a genuine concern, man, like, yo, come have a conversation

00:55:29.440 and let's talk about it because I'm, I want to know where that concern come from. Right. That's why stuff

00:55:33.600 like this is so important. Podcasting, what you're doing in the community, because people aren't

00:55:38.240 having these kinds of conversations and what they're doing is they're seeing one aspect of

00:55:42.340 it and jump into a conclusion about something they know nothing about rather than sitting

00:55:47.120 down and saying, okay, let me ask you some questions about this from a genuine place.

00:55:51.820 Like, man, there's no easy, like I get it, man. Like victims, somebody's crime, like there's

00:55:56.520 no easy way to do so, man. But even through like trauma, like any trauma, like I've gone through

00:56:02.080 extreme trauma, like, you know, close, like life or death situations. And to the people that,

00:56:07.240 that, that, that, that did so to me, I said, I got to forgive them because that's the only

00:56:10.740 way I'm able to allow myself to heal. And I get it, man. Some shit's hard and I can't

00:56:17.120 be, I can't sit here and tell another person they have to do this. But for my experience

00:56:21.860 and me almost losing my life in certain situations, the people that have hurt me to do so, I forgive

00:56:28.420 them still. Man, that takes a lot because this shit fucking, this shit haunted me for years

00:56:33.220 through what I've been through, but I forgive the person. And more so, like I look at why was that

00:56:38.440 person in that situation in the first place to even feel that they had to hurt me in that way to

00:56:41.960 get what they wanted. And I look at the bigger picture of how can we change this shit, man? So

00:56:47.520 no other kid feels like the only way they could eat and survive is to, to, to hurt, to kill, to rob,

00:56:54.120 to steal, to do so. Like, what do we got to do? So, you know, for me, forgiving people allow me to

00:57:00.140 heal, man. And really come to peace with some of the traumas that I've been able to go through.

00:57:04.440 Have you, uh, have you taken people through and, and, uh, the process yet where they've got their

00:57:09.540 license and they're out practicing? Not currently. We're in the building phase right now where we're

00:57:14.740 building out the, the, um, the space. In the, in the prison itself or is it outside of the prison?

00:57:20.020 In the prison itself. So we're building right now, designing and it's, it's a process, you know,

00:57:24.460 working with the government and doing anything. Of course.

00:57:26.460 The red tape. It's just going to take some time. Uh, we should be looking at towards the end of

00:57:30.680 this year for the first one to be launching up and running. But I mean, the hardest thing was just

00:57:34.000 getting the concept of even be approved. Like that was a battle.

00:57:36.860 Yeah. What was that like? I mean, obviously tons of committees you have to deal with and

00:57:40.140 everything else. You know, thank God I got a guy like Scott to really push forward for these things

00:57:44.660 because he's a guy that's had 20 plus years of experience and relationships to make it go so

00:57:51.140 smoothly. Right. If it was both of us stepping in from day one of an idea, it might've

00:57:56.380 took a while, but Scott is a guy that did 20 years to build up to, to be able to have

00:58:00.540 and do so for things like this. So, you know, all shout out to Scott really like, I mean,

00:58:05.940 I got to get, I got all the credit because he's gone through the hardest of the hardest

00:58:10.400 things just to be able to have a voice in, in a scenario like this and in these rooms

00:58:14.280 and in these circles. So, uh, because of him, we're able to push forward a little bit

00:58:18.340 faster than others. But for me, it was, you know, different because I've never, I'm not

00:58:22.880 into politics like that, man, but like I've had to speak to people that look nothing like

00:58:29.200 us or understand the world that we come from, but they're in charge of some of the most critical

00:58:34.820 decisions on, on how people of our communities need to be living. And the, the, the, the level

00:58:40.800 of like, like I said, um, like the livelihood of like what they live every day, like the quality

00:58:46.260 of life that they'll be given are controlled by people that just really disconnected. So it was

00:58:50.900 my first time really sitting in a, in a conversation and in a call with these people.

00:58:55.540 And again, it's not, Oh fuck you if you don't understand, but how do I change your perspective

00:59:00.060 and allow you to, to see it from what we've been through and how do I allow us to, to get

00:59:04.580 what we, to get where we need to be going. So that was different for me having to sit down

00:59:09.640 and look at my room and assess and, and learn about how I'm going to communicate and get

00:59:13.940 this message across in the most, you know, like understanding way. Right. Like that was,

00:59:18.240 that was, it was a good time. Yeah. But there was a lot of,

00:59:20.600 I bet that was a pretty big challenge. I mean, yeah, it's just more so like communication

00:59:25.580 and learning that and, and learning that some people are not going to look how we look,

00:59:30.460 not going to sound the way that we look, but you know, the power to be able to speak

00:59:33.720 to anybody is very, very important, but more so the power to make everybody understand your

00:59:38.500 vision and understand your ideas. Right. We all got a lot of ideas, but if we could communicate

00:59:43.920 to everybody, our ideas and allow them to see them the way that we see them, our shit will

00:59:48.220 be moving forward. Right. Yeah. For you to pitch things, for you to get shit done. It's all about,

00:59:52.480 you know, telling your idea and making it easily to understand.

00:59:56.640 Have you, have you always been somebody that's good, that can do that? Because like, I'm sitting

01:00:00.040 here listening to you and, and I, and I've seen you from, from a distance on social media

01:00:04.000 and clearly you have the ability to communicate an important message. Clearly it's important to you.

01:00:09.040 Is this something you've always been able to do and it's part of your, your personality?

01:00:12.960 Yeah. I feel like I've, you know, I feel like God bless my voice before you bless my hands. Like

01:00:16.360 I've always loved to speak that I know I could like to get to this point to speak now. Like

01:00:21.460 of course it's, it's took, it's taken some work. It's not, I'm not going to say in front

01:00:25.440 like, Oh, I'm just naturally like this. Like I work in my speaking, man. I've took in, you

01:00:30.120 know, speaking classes. I've learned, I've watched videos. I've studied the craft of speaking

01:00:34.860 and how to use my voice. Cause that's my gift, man. And you know, hard work, be talented

01:00:39.200 with talent or work hard. And if I got a little bit of talent and a little bit of hard work,

01:00:43.620 like I'm trying to just keep it going and keep it pushing forward. So it's something

01:00:47.000 that I work on for sure. And, you know, my best friend will probably give you a better

01:00:50.920 answer. Cause he here, like I've, I've, I would say I spoke well, but he might know better

01:00:56.220 cause I never really think about it like that. Um, what do you think?

01:01:00.380 Yeah. You, you, you just know people.

01:01:03.700 Yeah. I mean, it's really key to emotion. I think about emotion and like, how, how do

01:01:20.620 I like, how would this make this person feel if I say something like this? And it's not

01:01:24.560 really what you say is how you say things, man. And you really got to know how to get

01:01:29.620 a message to somebody without them feeling offended, without them feeling pushed. And

01:01:32.540 I just know how I would, you know, put myself in them shoes, man. If I say just like this

01:01:36.140 to that person, you know, how are they going to feel? And then I always think about the

01:01:40.180 intent that people have, uh, versus, you know, their actions. And sometimes people got great

01:01:45.740 intent for the things they want to do and they do the wrong action or they do it in a

01:01:49.220 way that gives a different, you know, image of what they were intending to do. So, so I

01:01:53.260 assess that, right? Like what was this person's intent with what they wanted to do and how

01:01:57.760 am I going to respond to them versus what they actually do. And as long as you can see

01:02:02.020 somebody is intense in what they did to you, like if it's genuine, then you got to make

01:02:07.000 sure your response to them is going to make them understand. So, yeah. Right. You know,

01:02:11.160 that's a good point. I think that's one of the things that's a real problem in society

01:02:14.620 is people don't look at intent. And I've just come to the conclusion that most people just

01:02:18.540 don't communicate real well. And so they, they probably have better intent more often than

01:02:24.340 their ability to communicate it and relay it effectively. Yeah. So I think we need

01:02:28.240 to afford people grace when they say something dumb or do something dumb and realize that

01:02:33.920 maybe there was a good intention behind it. Maybe the intention was in it. The intention

01:02:37.020 was there, man. Like, yo, you just got to communicate. Say like, yo, I see what you were

01:02:40.480 doing, man. But, uh, it made me feel this way when you did. So, um, I appreciate that if

01:02:45.260 you want to do it differently next time, this is a way that I would appreciate you to say

01:02:48.500 or do so, you know, and you just got to communicate in a better way. But that's what I think

01:02:53.640 about a lot when I speak to people, even as I'm interviewing or cutting people on the streets,

01:02:57.840 like, you know, how do I communicate to this person? Everybody's different. So that's the

01:03:02.080 challenge with it is that sometimes I'm speaking to a 10 year old kid and sometimes I'm speaking

01:03:06.340 to a 60 year old man. Like, yeah, you got to learn how to communicate your ideas and your

01:03:12.000 thoughts to different people for allowing them to feel comfortable. Yeah. Well, what's next for you?

01:03:16.060 I mean, obviously you've got the barbershop within the prison system. You've got your own

01:03:20.560 personal brand and what you're doing. Anything else coming down the line? I mean, tons of things

01:03:24.840 that can't speak of currently yet. A lot of things in the pipeline that have hangover, right? The next

01:03:30.220 hangover. They say, yes, Scott, when you see this, make sure, make sure I'm on the list, man. So

01:03:35.080 that's right. Um, a lot of dope things. All I can say is that I'm looking to elevate my voice

01:03:40.280 and really become an inspiration to young kids and not just young kids, but anybody out there that

01:03:44.740 has a dream that they want to chase. And you want to take my voice to the highest level possible.

01:03:48.700 So that's all I hope to do in the next couple of years. Um, you know, when people ask me where I

01:03:53.580 see myself and, and, and stuff like that, like, I just want to continue to inspire, bro. And whatever

01:03:59.340 guy got planning for that, whatever platform I'm going to be on, whatever channel he wants me on,

01:04:03.440 that's where I'll be at. And, um, I just, a lot of dope shit coming, man. A lot of really dope

01:04:08.460 things. I'm excited for you. I've been looking forward to having this conversation. I was, it was

01:04:12.000 funny. I was telling Brandy and I were talking cause she helped get this set up for us. I think you

01:04:15.940 talk to her via email. And, uh, she, she wanted me to tell you to remind or remind me about this

01:04:22.400 story is that this was months and months ago. She's like, Hey, check this guy out. He'd be good

01:04:27.440 on the podcast. And I'm like, Oh yeah, cool. I'll take a look. And I kind of blew it off.

01:04:31.840 And then about three or four months later, I had followed you. And I was looking at, I'm like,

01:04:36.760 man, I love this guy's stuff. So I sent Brandy a message. I'm like, Hey, this guy would be awesome

01:04:40.460 on the podcast. She's like, I told you that three months ago. So she wanted to make sure I said that it

01:04:45.060 was, uh, it was her, indeed her idea, even though I stole credit, uh, man, shout out to Brandy for

01:04:50.360 seeing it, man. But yo, I appreciate it. Like, and that too, man, like, I don't care if you became

01:04:55.580 a fan or a supporter of something that we did. I did yesterday. As long as you're here and you see

01:05:01.940 the, you see the vision and you support it. Like, I appreciate that. I'm not a dude that's like,

01:05:06.260 Oh, if you ain't fucking me back then, you can't fuck me now, man. Like any support is,

01:05:10.620 is appreciate. I love everybody that is, you know, that can see what I'm trying to do, man.

01:05:15.220 Yeah. I appreciate you. Well, you have my support. I mean, like I said, I've been inspired. I love

01:05:19.240 this conversation. I think what you're doing is amazing. And so you have my support,

01:05:22.660 whatever I can do to help. I'm on it, man. Thank you, bro. Likewise, man. Thanks, brother.

01:05:28.060 All right, gentlemen, there you go. My conversation with the one and only Vic blends,

01:05:32.500 man. Whoa. What an incredible conversation. You heard it. I don't, I don't need to tell you.

01:05:39.000 I think the guy is awesome. The guy is solid. The guy's doing everything that we have been talking

01:05:45.220 about for seven years. So connect with Vic on the socials, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, Twitter,

01:05:51.660 blah, blah, blah, all the places and see what this guy is up to because he is, he is embodying what we

01:05:59.280 talk about. And by being able to sit down with him for an hour, hour and a half, couple hours in

01:06:04.880 Atlanta, a couple of weeks ago, I'm just telling you, I'm walking away a better man from that

01:06:09.960 conversation. I hope you are as well with that guys, make sure you connect with him. Make sure

01:06:14.960 you check out our man and caged event, man on cage.com slash live man, uncaged.com slash live

01:06:21.680 and get registered. I hope to see you in May on the 7th. But outside of that, let's go out there.

01:06:28.820 Let's take action and let's become a man. We are meant to be.

01:06:32.380 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast. You're ready to take charge of your

01:06:36.660 life and be more of the man you were meant to be. We invite you to join the order at orderofman.com.

Order of Man - April 19, 2022

VIC BLENDS ｜ Turning Your Struggles Into Strengths

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