Order of Man

00:00:00.220 Keeping yourself and others safe and secure is a huge part of what it means to be a man.

00:00:05.240 It falls under the protection trifecta, if you will, of our role and responsibilities as men.

00:00:10.840 That's the reason having conversations like I do today with James Yeager are so crucial.

00:00:16.020 It seems to me that too many men believe that we'll naturally rise to the situation when it's demanded from us.

00:00:22.320 But without the proper training, we're likely to find ourselves wanting and in dangerous situations and encounters.

00:00:28.720 We'd all do well to remember that we do not rise to the level of our expectations.

00:00:33.680 We fall to the level of our training.

00:00:35.980 You're a man of action.

00:00:37.300 You live life to the fullest.

00:00:38.740 Embrace your fears and boldly chart your own path.

00:00:41.680 When life knocks you down, you get back up one more time.

00:00:45.100 Every time.

00:00:46.160 You are not easily deterred or defeated.

00:00:48.440 Rugged.

00:00:49.220 Resilient.

00:00:50.220 Strong.

00:00:51.160 This is your life.

00:00:52.300 This is who you are.

00:00:53.720 This is who you will become.

00:00:55.000 At the end of the day, and after all is said and done, you can call yourself a man.

00:01:00.680 Gents, what's going on today?

00:01:01.820 My name is Ryan Mickler and I am your host and also the founder of this movement to reclaim and restore masculinity.

00:01:08.120 It's called Order of Man.

00:01:09.420 And many of you have been with us for a very long time now.

00:01:12.820 Almost five years.

00:01:14.360 Which is actually pretty crazy to think about how long we've been going.

00:01:17.440 And how long we will continue to go.

00:01:19.880 And how far we have yet to have climbed.

00:01:21.640 And we are in the business and the mission and movement of reclaiming and restoring masculinity and stepping into what it means to be a man.

00:01:32.420 A father, a husband, a business owner, a community leader, a coach, a mentor, a brother, et cetera, et cetera.

00:01:38.640 So I'm glad you're here.

00:01:39.420 Whether you're here for the very first time listening in or you've been with us for, like I said, five years.

00:01:44.120 This is the place.

00:01:44.960 This is the best place for all things manliness and learning to improve yourself as a man.

00:01:51.100 I've got a great one lined up for you today.

00:01:52.820 I say that every week because every week I do have a great one for you.

00:01:55.700 And that's part of what we're doing here is having conversations with successful men.

00:01:59.520 Men that have interesting and unique perspectives and stories and ideas and thoughts and insights.

00:02:03.840 And this one is no different.

00:02:05.820 I'm going to get to that in a minute.

00:02:07.240 I do want to mention to you that as we fall upon cold season, winter season, that you probably want to gear up.

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00:02:34.300 That's the ones I wear.

00:02:35.100 Uh, and also their hoodies, their hoodies, they like to say are, are, are made of unicorn skin and man in using some of these hoodies.

00:02:43.880 I got to tell you, it's probably, it's probably true.

00:02:46.020 These things are absolutely comfortable.

00:02:47.980 Uh, they look good and they're effective, efficient.

00:02:50.660 They're going to keep you warm and looking good in the process.

00:02:53.140 So check it out.

00:02:54.260 Origin, main.com origin, main is in the state, main.com and use the code order.

00:02:59.680 O R D E R at checkout and you will stay warm and you will look good in the process.

00:03:04.720 All right.

00:03:05.660 That's it by way of announcements today, I'm introducing you to James Yeager.

00:03:09.720 So honored to be able to introduce you to him.

00:03:11.820 Uh, most of you probably already know who he is.

00:03:13.520 This is a very fascinating man and somebody who is uniquely uniquely and extremely qualified and competent to talk about keeping yourself and others safe and secure.

00:03:23.340 Now he's currently the CEO of tactical response, which is a tactical training company.

00:03:28.060 Uh, and on his resume, it consists of two protective security details to Iraq, a chief of police, canine handler, deputy sheriff, SWAT leader, firearms instructor, and a VP of a multimillion dollar tactical gear company.

00:03:42.300 And it goes on and on and on.

00:03:43.840 I just pulled a few out of there.

00:03:45.320 Uh, so suffice it to say that there aren't many, if any more qualified individuals to talk with us about turning ourselves into the protectors that our families and communities need us to be.

00:03:58.060 James, what's going on, man?

00:04:00.340 Thanks for joining me on the order of man podcast.

00:04:02.600 Absolutely.

00:04:03.600 I've been looking forward to it.

00:04:04.640 I know, gosh, I've had to reschedule a couple of times.

00:04:07.240 Um, we had that, that event up here a couple of, well, it must've been three weeks ago.

00:04:11.620 Now.

00:04:11.840 I think I told you about that on the day that we were supposed to have a conversation.

00:04:15.440 Did you hear about that at all?

00:04:17.140 Uh, no, but, uh, for everybody listening, I get this text is like, Hey man, I know we're supposed to do a podcast, but I gotta do some hero shit.

00:04:23.980 So can you reschedule?

00:04:25.460 I'm like, yeah, I appreciate your understanding.

00:04:29.180 Uh, if anybody would understand that it would certainly be you.

00:04:33.520 Yeah, it was pretty wild.

00:04:34.860 We had this, um, there's building in a, in a neighboring town pretty close to us.

00:04:39.120 And, uh, it had been pumping full of propane because there was a leak or a malfunction with the tank.

00:04:44.880 It had been pumping full of propane upwards of 400 gallons of propane over the weekend.

00:04:51.320 And, uh, hopefully, luckily, unfortunately they evacuated everybody in the building.

00:04:57.760 Uh, there was a, it's a school bus stop right by there.

00:05:00.940 They, they got the kids out of there beforehand.

00:05:03.220 They had got on the school bus, but yeah, there were some firefighters in there when the building exploded.

00:05:08.520 Um, pretty, pretty devastating to them and their crew and the community.

00:05:13.120 It's been rough.

00:05:15.400 Wild stuff.

00:05:16.320 I guess, uh, I guess what we're talking about, whether it's a, uh, a violent encounter, a potential violent, violent encounter, or just being ready for these types of emergencies is critical.

00:05:25.960 Yep.

00:05:26.440 When it's least expected, you're elected.

00:05:29.300 Yeah, I think I, that's, that's a great way to say it.

00:05:31.680 I was looking at, uh, some, some things maybe on, uh, on Instagram today, looking at you and seeing what you were up to.

00:05:37.160 And I think you had made a post about no days off.

00:05:40.740 There's no days off.

00:05:41.480 There's no time off.

00:05:42.420 Like you've got to be on a hundred percent of the time.

00:05:45.560 Yeah.

00:05:45.960 I, I mean, like I get up and get dressed.

00:05:48.900 All these guys are like, well, I don't want to carry a gun.

00:05:51.060 That's fine.

00:05:51.520 But I carry two guns, two lights.

00:05:53.620 I carry a medical kit with two tourniquets, pressure bandages, chest seals.

00:05:57.420 Like when I, it's part of what I wear every day.

00:06:00.060 And, and this is when I'm not expecting any trouble at all.

00:06:03.880 And, uh, and there's just so many, and I know how to use all this stuff.

00:06:07.740 And, uh, and, uh, so many people want to make excuses, but nobody, I've never heard anybody, uh, retelling a story and saying, man, I'm glad I didn't have that tourniquet.

00:06:18.960 Man, I'm glad I didn't have that gun.

00:06:21.320 I've, I've just never heard anybody say anything like that.

00:06:24.300 Yeah.

00:06:24.820 Uh, what is their reasoning when they say, I just don't want to carry a gun?

00:06:27.460 I mean, it's, it's, I guess maybe not convenient.

00:06:29.780 Is that the biggest issue?

00:06:31.580 They said they're not comfortable.

00:06:32.740 And I go, they're not supposed to be, they're supposed to be comforting and, uh, like a dedication.

00:06:38.020 Same reason people won't get up and, and work out or, or, you know, whatever, just like, like a motivation, dedication.

00:06:46.640 Yeah.

00:06:48.200 Yeah.

00:06:48.560 And it seems to me just maybe even just a priority, right?

00:06:51.780 It's not a priority.

00:06:52.480 I think most people would rather remain ignorant, uh, keep the blindfold on, assume that, you know, nothing's going to happen to me.

00:06:58.140 And you know what?

00:06:58.800 Odds are it's not, but you don't want it to be the day where it does happen to you and you're not ready for it.

00:07:04.420 But here's the thing.

00:07:06.180 Like, um, you know, you know, about being a man, being a warrior, what the fuck else are we going to do?

00:07:15.840 Like walking the path is the only way I know to walk through life.

00:07:21.960 Like, I don't know how to walk through lackadaisical.

00:07:24.940 I don't know how to walk through without purpose.

00:07:27.180 I don't know how to walk through without meaning.

00:07:29.340 And I see all these guys that are unhappy with their wife and their kids and their family.

00:07:34.580 They just want to get out.

00:07:35.400 They just want to, you know, they can't, they can't stand it.

00:07:37.520 And I'm, I like everything about my life.

00:07:39.920 I love my family.

00:07:41.160 I love my grandkids and, and my wife and, and I love my job.

00:07:46.320 I love everything.

00:07:47.100 And I believe that's because I walk that path.

00:07:51.220 Uh, and not because, uh, not because I've tried to avoid it.

00:07:56.180 Yeah, you bring up a good point.

00:07:57.880 And, and I think, I mean, to go back to what we were saying, as far as it might not happen to you,

00:08:03.160 walking this path that you're talking about, isn't going to put you in a worse position.

00:08:07.040 Right.

00:08:07.780 So, so let's say you do this training and you've got medical training, firearms training,

00:08:11.220 you're prepared, you've, you've developed some level of situational awareness and you

00:08:15.120 never have to use it.

00:08:16.980 It's not like that was a waste because it improved every other area of your life.

00:08:21.800 Well, but the, the, the pursuit of this, the pursuit of mastery, I have memories.

00:08:28.880 I have fond memories of chasing this thing my whole life.

00:08:32.920 If I did something else like bowling or watching TV or, or fishing, I doubt I would be as fulfilled.

00:08:41.340 I'm 49.

00:08:42.260 And for a lot of, for a lot of guys, this is the point in their life when they're going

00:08:46.160 through their, you know, their, their crisis, you know, uh, their midlife crisis.

00:08:50.400 So they're, they're buying the convertibles and cheating on their wife and, and all of that.

00:08:54.840 And I feel completely fulfilled with my life, my business, my life.

00:08:58.700 I feel completely fulfilled.

00:08:59.840 I have no need to, to wander anywhere else and all the memories, the bonds, the, the relationships

00:09:06.460 that I have with all these people that I've been in, in combat with, or just in a training

00:09:10.540 class with, um, I, I can't imagine another thing I would have done to had this much closeness

00:09:18.500 with this many people.

00:09:20.680 When you say chasing the thing, you know, quote unquote thing, what would you define that

00:09:25.340 as?

00:09:25.600 What, what is it that you're trying to master?

00:09:27.240 Um, um, the, the, I believe the, you know, the, the mastery of the sword, you know, the,

00:09:37.520 the pistol, the, the, the self-defense, the mastery of it is, it is, it's very Bushido.

00:09:47.320 It's very much all encompassing because you shouldn't be carrying a pistol.

00:09:51.860 If you're not a good person, if you don't have a good soul, if you're, if you're a drug

00:09:55.220 abuser or alcohol abuser or whatever, you should not be carrying a pistol.

00:09:59.000 And so I don't drink, I don't smoke.

00:10:00.860 I never have, I don't do drugs.

00:10:02.140 I never have.

00:10:03.200 And it's, it's the pursuit of this, uh, this, this mastery that is, that is, um, it's a lot

00:10:15.120 of people think they have something missing from their life and it's because they are not

00:10:19.380 pursuing anything.

00:10:21.120 They have no goal.

00:10:22.200 They're just trying to get to next Friday for the weekend.

00:10:24.380 I don't have weekends.

00:10:25.760 Like I don't work.

00:10:28.200 Um, I, I don't know if I can, if I can nail this down to a, uh, according to Hoyle kind

00:10:35.100 of definition for you, but, uh, uh, the martial lifestyle is the path.

00:10:41.320 And, and when I first started walking it, I thought there would be an end or I could get

00:10:48.780 to a point where I could see further or whatever.

00:10:51.720 And I, I realized now it's just, you got to keep slugging along and, and the pursuit

00:10:57.980 of that perfection, uh, and I'm not going to say my life is perfect, but that pursuit

00:11:02.380 of that perfection is what keeps me fulfilled and keeps me on track.

00:11:07.720 It keeps me, again, uh, it keeps me honest.

00:11:11.560 It keeps me faithful to my wife and to my family and, and all of those things.

00:11:15.880 Because if, if I'm not, if I'm a liar, if I'm a cheat, if I'm a scoundrel, then I'm

00:11:20.620 obviously I'm not walking the path and cannot come in that, cannot continue.

00:11:25.700 Yeah.

00:11:26.280 You know, I imagine that the skills that you develop are very translatable to other areas

00:11:31.940 of your life.

00:11:32.820 And that's what I would say to other guys as well as, you know, training with a pistol,

00:11:36.780 uh, training with martial arts, being prepared, like this stuff is translatable.

00:11:41.920 It's not only applicable to some sort of emergency or critical situation you may find yourself

00:11:46.980 in.

00:11:48.400 Yeah.

00:11:48.940 I mean, like for instance, like if you're walking the path, you're not a road rager.

00:11:54.140 You're never going to blow your horn to show an emotion.

00:11:57.140 The only, the only way a martial artist would blow his horn is to prevent an accident, never

00:12:02.420 to show emotion.

00:12:04.480 And so that's, that's one example of it.

00:12:06.560 Like, like there's been many times I've thought to myself, if I wasn't wearing this pistol,

00:12:12.120 I'd bitch slap that motherfucker right now.

00:12:15.020 And, and it's not the way it's not the path.

00:12:19.480 I like that.

00:12:20.340 That's, that's the, uh, the adage with, with great power comes great responsibility.

00:12:24.220 Right.

00:12:24.660 And it seems like your ability to do, frankly, to do harm to another individual, uh, it seems

00:12:31.140 like you take that very seriously and you carry a lot of responsibility with that, with

00:12:34.740 that power that you have.

00:12:36.660 Absolutely.

00:12:37.180 That's a, that's a quote from Spider-Man.

00:12:38.840 I've been, that's right.

00:12:39.640 That's right.

00:12:40.480 I've been a Spider-Man fan since I was a boy.

00:12:42.900 My mom actually blames the old Spider-Man comics on my sarcasm because he was so sarcastic

00:12:48.800 back in the old comic books and stuff.

00:12:50.760 She actually blamed Spider-Man for that.

00:12:52.320 But, um, uh, well, let's talk about Spider-Man for a second.

00:12:56.060 It's a perfect example of the duality of man, the yin and yang inside of a man.

00:13:00.540 Spider-Man never had a bad day.

00:13:02.940 It never rained on Spider-Man.

00:13:04.460 Spider-Man was on top of his game.

00:13:06.060 Everything was perfect for Spider-Man.

00:13:07.840 The exact opposite was true of Peter Parker.

00:13:09.860 It was always raining on Peter Parker.

00:13:11.500 Women never liked Peter Parker.

00:13:13.040 He's always broke.

00:13:14.300 He was always, you know, it was always he's Peter Parker walked with his head down.

00:13:18.800 Spider-Man walked with his chest out.

00:13:20.620 And, uh, there was, there's, that's a very, that, that comic for me as a kid started showing

00:13:25.980 me the yin and yang of, of who each human being is.

00:13:30.680 And, um, and along those lines and, and, and I'm not saying this to nitpick with anybody

00:13:37.500 or whatever, but, uh, violence is a tool of evil and force is a tool of good.

00:13:42.740 And so like when, when, when a bank robber is shooting at the police, they're being violent.

00:13:47.380 When a cop shoots back at him, he is using force.

00:13:50.180 And I believe that is the yin and yang of, of, you know, the wicked things that men do

00:13:56.880 to each other.

00:13:57.540 I don't believe that, that I am violent.

00:14:00.220 I believe that I use force when necessary.

00:14:03.000 And violence is, uh, uh, is again, a tool of evil.

00:14:06.600 But that's interesting.

00:14:08.920 I've never looked at it like that on the surface level.

00:14:11.240 I don't know that I necessarily agree with that, but I do see the distinction of it.

00:14:16.360 I understand that, that the way I say it is, is unique and different than, than the way

00:14:21.880 most people look at it.

00:14:22.860 I don't, and I understand when somebody says, you know, this, you know, using violence,

00:14:27.920 you know, in a, in a, in a martial way, I know that it's a good thing.

00:14:31.380 I know that that's how they mean it, but, um, if we, if you look up the definitions of

00:14:35.500 those words, uh, basically the, basically there is a difference between those two things

00:14:40.660 and violence typically is what the bad guys use.

00:14:44.860 Yeah.

00:14:45.340 I think regardless to what words you decide to use, I think the point that you're making

00:14:51.140 is a good distinction.

00:14:52.940 Force to me, based on what you're saying is having the capacity to do harm or violence

00:14:57.780 to another individual, but having the morality to exercise it in the right context.

00:15:03.080 That's what it sounds like to me.

00:15:04.740 Yeah.

00:15:05.340 It's the exact same thing.

00:15:06.940 It's the morality that separates the two.

00:15:09.860 Where do you believe that, uh, that morality comes from?

00:15:13.240 Is that, is that a higher power?

00:15:14.500 Is that up to each of us to decide?

00:15:16.800 Is there some sort of standard by which it's measured?

00:15:20.400 What's your thoughts on that?

00:15:21.720 Well, it's, it's definitely nurture over nature.

00:15:24.920 I don't believe we're born with it.

00:15:26.380 I believe that the social norms that are derived with, within our communities.

00:15:30.840 I mean, if we, even within the subsets of our community, a, uh, 19 year old Marine just

00:15:37.020 out of bootcamp is different than a 19 year old kid that works at Starbucks and, uh, and

00:15:42.020 then their, their worldview is different.

00:15:43.840 Uh, even though we're from the same society, um, I believe that, uh, that the, the young Marine

00:15:49.700 has a completely different, uh, understanding of the use of force or violence or however you

00:15:55.860 want to say it because you think that's been conditioned into them is what you're saying.

00:16:00.760 Well, like for instance, when I was a boy, I have a brother, uh, and we want to play

00:16:05.420 with little cap guns when we were kids.

00:16:06.760 And my grandmother cautioned my mother, she said, don't let those boys play with those

00:16:10.460 guns.

00:16:10.780 They'll grow up to be bank robbers.

00:16:12.100 And then as I got older, I thought, why couldn't I be a cop?

00:16:16.360 Eventually I became a cop.

00:16:18.060 Well, why did it, why did it have to be bad?

00:16:19.740 So the reason I make the distinction between violence and force is because not every use

00:16:25.260 of force is violent.

00:16:27.420 You know, it's, uh, it's not, it's not a matter of rage or, uh, or to, to take something

00:16:33.680 from somebody.

00:16:34.460 Eh, eh, we, we can talk about that.

00:16:36.620 Yeah, I mean, depending on the situation, right, there might be a situation where, where

00:16:40.760 you, you potentially need to restrain somebody, but that wouldn't necessarily be violent, but

00:16:45.560 there might also be a situation where you need to, uh, fire a bullet into somebody's

00:16:50.040 chest.

00:16:50.460 And, you know, so depending on the severity and the situation you're dealt with, there's

00:16:54.060 varying degrees of that.

00:16:55.680 Right.

00:16:56.940 Where did this all start for you?

00:16:58.580 You know, you, you were talking about Spider-Man and, and, and beginning to walk this path.

00:17:04.100 Like, what did it look like for you when you got, got going?

00:17:06.880 Well, uh, as I, mom and dad got a divorce when I was five.

00:17:11.380 So I was raised with a, by a single mom and she worked all the time.

00:17:15.040 And I look back now and like, she took us to, to little league and to karate and to boxing

00:17:19.960 and all these things when we were kids.

00:17:22.000 But, uh, I grew up really poor and I, I fought a lot in school and I, and I, and I didn't want

00:17:28.060 to, I, I, I didn't, I don't want to fight, fight now.

00:17:30.860 Uh, but, um, I didn't want to, but I realized that from a very young age, if I wanted to

00:17:36.240 keep the swing at some point, I was going to have to fight for it or my, or whatever

00:17:39.980 the thing was kids always.

00:17:41.600 And I, and I grew up in a, you know, I grew up, I went to school, um, born in seventies.

00:17:47.000 So I started school in 75.

00:17:48.120 And so during the seventies and eighties, I mean, like the, the, the, you know, the typical

00:17:53.860 thing was the football coach was also the math or history teacher.

00:17:57.800 Right.

00:17:58.360 Yep.

00:17:58.940 And if you had some, if you had some disagreement with somebody in the class, he would just tell

00:18:02.880 you, wait till you go outside, or he would just say, go outside, come back in when this

00:18:07.960 is over with.

00:18:08.940 And, uh, we, we live in a, we live in a different world now, but, but I grew up and I, and I realized

00:18:14.360 very early, what was worth fighting for and what was not worth fighting for.

00:18:18.560 And it always kept coming down to about my dignity.

00:18:23.400 I didn't want the older kids, like, you know, pushing me down, sitting on my head.

00:18:27.500 I'd seen them do that to other kids.

00:18:28.880 And so it was always about my dignity and who I was as a person and self-esteem and growing

00:18:33.880 up really poor, uh, self-esteem is, is a commodity.

00:18:37.080 It's, it's hard to, uh, it's hard, it's hard to get and it's hard to keep.

00:18:40.680 And, uh, so I wanted to make sure I kept all that I had.

00:18:44.360 How do you, what do you make the distinction for now when you think about what's worth

00:18:49.460 fighting for?

00:18:50.480 Cause I mean, yeah, I hear dignity and that might be a pride thing.

00:18:53.920 I think, I think to a degree, we probably mature out of that to some degree, right?

00:18:57.760 Or maybe hopefully we should.

00:18:59.960 So how do you determine what's worth fighting for and engaging with now?

00:19:05.080 Well, I mean, I have to assume that, uh, any fight I get in now is going to be a fight

00:19:11.120 for my life because I don't, I, again, I don't, I don't go stupid places with stupid

00:19:15.060 people and do stupid shit.

00:19:16.220 So, uh, it's obviously going to, that's going to be it.

00:19:19.080 So I, in a world of, in a world of weapon system platform, people using multi-syllable

00:19:24.440 words for things that don't need it.

00:19:26.640 I will say this, here is my, here's, here is my legal lecture.

00:19:30.980 Before you put your finger on the trigger, ask yourself, whose life are you about to

00:19:37.720 save?

00:19:39.520 Hmm.

00:19:40.780 And, uh, that's, that's your legal lecture.

00:19:42.580 That's all you need to know to carry a fucking gun around.

00:19:44.500 If you follow that and you can save your life, you can save a total stranger's life.

00:19:49.540 Uh, but we don't use guns to kill people.

00:19:51.420 We use guns to save people.

00:19:52.880 And that's, and that's how I, that's how I live my life.

00:19:57.120 Yeah, that's it.

00:19:58.140 That's a valuable distinction.

00:19:59.500 And you also talk about too, I mean, at length, this is what you do, the role of, of training

00:20:05.160 with that firearm.

00:20:05.900 I think there's too many guys who believe because they have a gun on their hip that they're,

00:20:10.080 that they're safe or, you know, they're exercising their rights.

00:20:14.100 Maybe they, maybe they shouldn't necessarily be just because they're carrying a piece of

00:20:17.380 metal around on their hip.

00:20:18.640 But, uh, I mean, that training is critically important as well.

00:20:22.280 Well, um, yeah, I mean, that's a can of worms right there.

00:20:27.140 Um, I'm not saying that a person has to have training to defend themselves.

00:20:32.440 People defend themselves all the time without it.

00:20:34.620 Um, but what, what I'll tell you is this, the more training you have, the less likely

00:20:40.040 you are to even get into a situation where you need a gun.

00:20:44.720 And, uh, and what's, what's that worth?

00:20:47.060 And I tell people all the time, if you get picked to be assaulted, fight for your life,

00:20:52.760 you know, defend yourself, but then back it up.

00:20:54.680 Why did they pick you?

00:20:56.480 Like, were you not paying attention?

00:20:58.280 Look down at your phone, you know, you know, like you got picked for a reason.

00:21:02.760 And, uh, so stop getting picked.

00:21:05.820 Um, but, um, but a lot of people carry a gun, uh, as a, as a magical charm, as a talisman

00:21:11.740 to ward off evil spirits and, and, uh, unfortunately because of movies, you know, they, they think

00:21:17.620 that they don't have to practice.

00:21:18.600 They just shoot and people fly through the air and all that.

00:21:21.040 But, uh, for the people that do go out and train with me or somebody else, they realize

00:21:25.540 very quickly what they were missing.

00:21:27.800 Uh, and for a lot of people, it, it lights a fire.

00:21:30.520 It, it, it, uh, it begins a thirst that, uh, is unquenchable for, for more information.

00:21:36.880 Uh, and, uh, and I tell people all the time, they go, wow, you know, you're, you're

00:21:40.600 really lucky and I go, the more I train, the luckier I am.

00:21:45.500 And I believe that training basically makes you see more advantageous opportunities than

00:21:50.700 the untrained person.

00:21:53.040 Yeah.

00:21:53.520 I also think based on what I've experienced personally and what I've heard with other

00:21:57.700 men is that you understand the dire ramifications of using the tools and the training at your

00:22:04.340 disposal.

00:22:05.580 Like you understand that somebody is going to die and, and that's significant to you.

00:22:10.600 Somebody who doesn't have this training does not understand the consequences.

00:22:14.140 Right.

00:22:14.680 When I was policing my, my, my chiefs and sheriffs over the years said, oh, Yeager, you're doing

00:22:19.080 this training.

00:22:19.720 You must want to shoot somebody.

00:22:21.020 And I'd say, I am least likely to shoot somebody than anybody in the department because I don't

00:22:27.320 walk into dangerous situations headlong.

00:22:30.420 I use cover when I do this or that I'm, I'm most, most cops get into gunfights because

00:22:36.160 they have poor tactics leading up to the gunfight.

00:22:39.840 Um, and, uh, and so, uh, yeah, it's always that they think you're the gun nut, but actually

00:22:44.820 the furthest thing could be from, you know, furthest thing is the truth.

00:22:49.340 Yeah.

00:22:49.720 I imagine you have a bit of a persona, like, like a heart A, you know, I, I've followed

00:22:53.480 you for quite a while now and I see you engage with your family and I, I, I don't see that.

00:22:59.220 I mean, I could see how somebody might think that from the outside looking in without maybe

00:23:02.780 knowing you, but then you see like you're a human being, you, you have empathy and obviously

00:23:07.420 love for your family.

00:23:08.500 And, and I think that's important that we make that, make that, uh, very clear because

00:23:14.220 it seems to me there's a common misconception that, uh, somebody who's trained in violence

00:23:18.900 or force, whatever term you want to use, uh, is, is just the heart A and they aren't

00:23:23.540 considering some of these other factors that most of us probably wouldn't take into

00:23:26.940 consideration.

00:23:27.440 Well, it's, it's again, the, the duality of it is, um, I'm trying to get as many hours

00:23:35.520 of practice.

00:23:36.680 It's, it's, it's a long haul, uh, doing medical, uh, drills as I am doing firearms drills.

00:23:42.460 I'm way behind, but I, but I, but I practice a lot, practice it at my desk, putting tourniquets

00:23:47.000 on things like that.

00:23:48.300 And, uh, and then, uh, and I, I make sure I make time.

00:23:52.780 I want to, but I make time for my family.

00:23:55.500 I mean, we can't be all, none of us can only be one thing.

00:24:00.100 It's impossible.

00:24:01.020 And, and, and, and like, uh, sometimes guys are like, man, you know, uh, you know, I wish

00:24:06.300 I was single again.

00:24:07.160 I hear him say something like that.

00:24:08.300 And I go, no, you don't.

00:24:09.420 You, that's horrible.

00:24:10.360 I don't know any single people that are happy.

00:24:15.380 Yeah.

00:24:15.780 It's a, it's quite, it's quite the runaround from my perspective.

00:24:18.920 I remember like the dating scene and everything else.

00:24:20.860 I hated it.

00:24:21.880 I hate it.

00:24:22.560 I'm so much more fulfilled and happy in, in, in my family and with kids and, and having

00:24:27.280 that, uh, that grounding element of my life.

00:24:30.120 Yeah, absolutely.

00:24:31.600 Yeah.

00:24:32.460 Yeah.

00:24:33.160 I'd go crazy without my family.

00:24:34.840 And yeah, just, you know, and don't get me wrong.

00:24:36.940 I'm, you know, I'm on the range, a bunch of dudes are going to shoot guns.

00:24:39.760 And you know, I like, yeah, yeah, that's part of my life.

00:24:41.800 But yeah, I like, you know, nothing and guys that, guys that have never done this before,

00:24:46.680 they're missing a newborn baby sleeping on your chest is the, is the best thing in the

00:24:51.640 world.

00:24:52.320 It's the exact opposite of all the man shit that we do.

00:24:54.840 And it's absolutely the most fantastic feeling in the world.

00:24:59.080 Agreed.

00:24:59.880 Absolutely agreed.

00:25:00.700 I got a little while for me before that happens again, but, uh, they're a little outgrown

00:25:05.560 of the, they're laying on me.

00:25:06.700 If any of my kids laid on me, that might crush me at this point.

00:25:08.920 They're getting big.

00:25:10.220 Well, I'll have my sixth grandkid and, uh, my, uh, my, uh, uh, third grandson, fourth

00:25:18.240 grandson here in, uh, January.

00:25:20.720 So I plan on getting that little guy.

00:25:23.020 So yeah, congrats.

00:25:23.800 That's exciting.

00:25:24.840 I want to go back to, uh, what were you talking about with, with not being, I think, did you

00:25:29.300 use the term selected or picked, uh, what are some things that somebody who's in a public

00:25:35.240 and in an outside setting, public setting, uh, do to avoid being selected or picked by

00:25:41.180 a would-be criminal or.

00:25:42.960 It's easy.

00:25:43.620 Yeah, it's totally easy.

00:25:45.080 We are hunters.

00:25:46.100 We have binocular vision, our eyes on the front of our head.

00:25:49.100 Food has eyes on the side of its head.

00:25:51.280 Predators, which we are, walk with their head up.

00:25:53.960 Uh, I tell people all the time when they, when they have their, I don't have my phone

00:25:57.300 here.

00:25:57.540 I don't bring it into the interview, but we'll say this thing is a phone.

00:26:00.300 I tell people all the time, there's no rule that says that you have to look down at your

00:26:04.040 phone.

00:26:04.360 You can hold your phone up.

00:26:05.880 You can hold your phone up, I guess, but people don't do every time people's got their

00:26:09.180 phone up like this, they're taking a selfie.

00:26:10.480 You can walk around with your phone like that.

00:26:14.140 But I tell people all the time, uh, unless you're in a, unless you're in a relatively

00:26:18.320 safe place, don't look at your phone.

00:26:21.400 And especially if you're walking in public, you shouldn't be looking at your phone, you

00:26:26.240 know?

00:26:26.480 But, uh, basically big picture stuff, binocular vision, keep your head up, keep your shoulders

00:26:31.320 back.

00:26:31.960 That's, and that's, that's the biggest thing.

00:26:33.900 It's kind of like the, uh, the, the joke.

00:26:35.700 Uh, I don't have to outrun the bear.

00:26:37.280 I just have to outrun you, but you don't have to look like the baddest dude that ever walked

00:26:40.740 the earth.

00:26:41.120 You just have to, as they look out, like, nah, not that guy.

00:26:44.000 No, not, not him.

00:26:45.540 And, and, and you'll notice if you start walking around or keeping your head up out in public,

00:26:49.720 you're every once in a while, you're going to, you're going to catch a set of eyes looking

00:26:53.100 at you.

00:26:53.660 You're either looking at it.

00:26:54.740 You're either looking at a wolf or another sheepdog.

00:26:56.900 That's it.

00:26:57.400 That's the only eyes that you will see as you look around.

00:27:01.040 Yeah.

00:27:01.400 As you look around and you make eye contact with the dude, he's either a really good guy or a really

00:27:05.260 bad guy.

00:27:06.500 Yeah.

00:27:06.880 And even if he's a bad guy, it's good that you acknowledged him because you got your

00:27:10.040 eyes on him and he sees that you got your eyes on him.

00:27:12.860 Yep.

00:27:14.060 Uh, Pat McNamara, who I know you're, you're a friend of and with, he talks about the same

00:27:19.200 thing, 45 degree culture.

00:27:20.600 He calls it where your head's just always on that 45 degree line, looking down at your

00:27:24.200 phone, not being aware about what's going on around you.

00:27:26.860 Yeah.

00:27:27.340 It's tough.

00:27:27.920 Tough.

00:27:28.380 That's good dude, man.

00:27:29.620 He's a hundred miles an hour.

00:27:30.620 I like that guy.

00:27:31.480 No doubt.

00:27:32.080 I mean, we, we, him and I had a conversation.

00:27:33.960 I must've been about a month ago or so.

00:27:36.360 And, uh, man, fascinating, man.

00:27:39.100 Um, and like you said, I think that's a great descriptor, a hundred miles an hour, no stop,

00:27:43.500 no quit.

00:27:44.020 Just go, go, go, go, go.

00:27:45.740 Yeah.

00:27:46.080 Yeah.

00:27:46.800 Yeah.

00:27:47.040 And, uh, he's one of the few guys, uh, one of the, one of the few guys that I host here

00:27:52.700 at my range.

00:27:53.940 And, um, because I tell my students walking the path, you can't just train with me.

00:27:58.840 You can't just train with any one instructor.

00:28:00.760 And so I bring in guys that I respect like Pat and these other guys and, uh, super Dave

00:28:06.880 Harrington and John Farnham and, and, and these guys, I bring them through and I do do something

00:28:12.680 for them and I do something for my students because what I do for them is I don't charge

00:28:16.700 them a range fee to use my range.

00:28:18.200 And I, and I recruit classfuls of people for them.

00:28:21.800 And so I'm doing a favor for them and for my students.

00:28:25.900 And, uh, and then, and then my students are more fulfilled.

00:28:30.420 Uh, and my friends have another stop on their, their list.

00:28:34.000 They're trying to make their, their house payment.

00:28:35.740 Now they can make their house payment, you know?

00:28:37.240 So, uh, so it's, it's, it's, that's a lot of fun for me to do.

00:28:42.100 Is the goal of getting them multiple trainers, different looks, just to get them different

00:28:46.100 exposure, different lessons.

00:28:47.360 People learn things differently.

00:28:48.500 Is that, is that the whole idea?

00:28:50.100 It's all that.

00:28:51.440 And you don't know if what I'm telling you is correct, unless you hear somebody else say

00:28:57.740 something different or the same or whatever the case may be.

00:29:01.120 I mean, uh, uh, uh, I tell all my students, it's got, it's got to pass the smell test.

00:29:05.280 If I'm teaching you something, it smells like I'm just making something up or smells like

00:29:08.640 I'm trying to justify teaching this thing.

00:29:11.780 I said, don't listen to me.

00:29:13.140 You know, it should just make, it should just make sense.

00:29:15.960 It's like, this stuff's not that complicated.

00:29:18.040 People try to overcomplicate this stuff.

00:29:20.500 Like I was just telling you about like my legal lecture and all that stuff.

00:29:23.140 They try to overcomplicate this stuff, but it's not complicated.

00:29:26.620 Uh, it's the, the, the, the problem is, is that, um, you have to be closer to the master

00:29:32.840 end of it, uh, than the beginner side of it to make it simple.

00:29:36.260 Yeah, that's true.

00:29:38.440 I mean, even if you just look around on, on social media, look around on Instagram, every,

00:29:42.760 every dude with a gun is an expert, right?

00:29:45.060 And, and, and I've found not only when it comes to firearms training and martial arts

00:29:50.080 and things like that, that the more complicated somebody makes it, the less likely it is.

00:29:56.280 They know what they're talking about and the harder they're trying to sell you their course

00:29:59.500 or their program or whatever it is they're after.

00:30:01.760 Yeah.

00:30:02.200 I call it ordiology.

00:30:03.700 Yeah, it's true.

00:30:06.640 I give you an example.

00:30:07.860 Since we were just talking about Pat Mack, this is, this is relevant or semi-relevant.

00:30:12.040 Um, so when I take these classes, when people come through, I've been doing this a long time

00:30:17.300 and I'm not going to say I don't learn things, but I don't learn as much as I did when I was

00:30:22.500 a beginner.

00:30:22.900 And when I was a beginner, I was learning how to shoot, but now what I'm doing is I am listening

00:30:27.800 to what do they say?

00:30:30.460 What words do they use?

00:30:32.280 How are they explaining these things?

00:30:33.520 I'm looking for like the sprinkles, you know, like the, like the little stuff that just makes

00:30:37.800 it work.

00:30:38.300 And Pat Mack gave this explanation for, uh, natural point of aim.

00:30:42.920 He said comfortably on target without muscular input.

00:30:49.520 Only a master can say that.

00:30:52.320 And as soon as I heard it, as soon as I heard it, it smacked me in the face.

00:30:55.420 It's like that, like people say stuff like, you know, uh, it's enough to learn one thing.

00:31:00.300 I, not when you've spent a lot of money to go to a class, you should learn more than one

00:31:03.260 thing.

00:31:03.560 But if I was looking for one thing, that's, that was the thing that that's the reason

00:31:09.360 I attended that class that, uh, and I, and I use that in my class and I go, Hey guys,

00:31:14.460 you know, natural point of aim, I got this from Pat McNamara and I tell him just what I

00:31:17.480 told you and people go, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:31:19.920 You know, so, but, but that's my point is it's, it's obvious that Pat not only can operate

00:31:25.940 the gun, he can operate the range with the same level of, of competence when he can do

00:31:31.840 stuff like that.

00:31:34.040 Men, let me pull you away from the conversation here for just a very quick minute.

00:31:37.660 Um, over the past five years, I've, I've really considered what it is.

00:31:40.960 A lot of men are missing.

00:31:41.760 And what I've seen in a lot of men is a lack of brotherhood.

00:31:45.280 You know, most men seem to be going at life alone.

00:31:48.000 And we've all had the idea of the lone wolf.

00:31:51.340 And while I can certainly understand that a man has to learn to make it on his own, having

00:31:55.440 men who have my back, call me on my BS, support me.

00:32:00.040 All of that has proven to be some of the most valuable relationships that I've ever created.

00:32:04.180 But doing that for yourself, creating those relationships can be very, very difficult with

00:32:08.760 a demanding schedule and a lack of men who want to grow and evolve the same way that you

00:32:14.080 do.

00:32:14.600 And that's the exact reason that we created the iron council.

00:32:17.360 It's a powerful, powerful band of brothers, 500 plus of us, uh, who have voluntarily decided

00:32:23.420 that banding together into a tribe, into a group, uh, is more powerful than going at

00:32:29.300 it alone.

00:32:29.660 So each week we host calls and discussions.

00:32:32.320 We check in for accountability.

00:32:33.720 We challenge ourselves to push outside of our comfort zones.

00:32:36.760 Uh, we call each other out, support, edify, uplift, do all the things that a good brother

00:32:40.880 should do.

00:32:41.440 Uh, and if you feel like that might be a value to you in your life, we'd be honored

00:32:45.340 to have you see if there's a fit for both us and you.

00:32:48.580 And if that's the case, head to order of man.com slash iron council.

00:32:52.420 Again, order of man.com slash iron council.

00:32:55.120 Uh, you can learn more and claim your seat in the brotherhood.

00:32:57.680 Do that after our conversation for now, we'll finish things up with James.

00:33:01.200 So explain that a little bit to me with natural point of aim.

00:33:05.260 Is it basically bringing your firearm up to your, up to your eyes or up to your face

00:33:10.880 with a view from the term before?

00:33:13.780 No, never heard it.

00:33:14.700 Okay.

00:33:15.220 So imagine a sniper laying flat on the ground, looking through his scope at a target.

00:33:24.660 So natural point of aim is if you completely relaxed, is the reticle still on the target

00:33:30.620 or tensed up and everything.

00:33:34.060 Right.

00:33:34.540 So if you set your sandbag and everything up so that the gun is, and you are just laying

00:33:39.300 perfectly there, uh, then when you shoot, you're going to be a more accurate shooter

00:33:44.040 because you're not fighting the gun back and forth.

00:33:47.360 So this is like, that's like the last little bit for a rifleman to perfect is that natural

00:33:52.600 point of aim.

00:33:53.160 And it applies to every other, every other thing you're doing with a gun, but it mostly applies

00:33:58.600 to laying prone on the ground who's in some kind of position with a long gun, you know,

00:34:04.320 to shoot a long distance to where it's most critical.

00:34:07.760 Yeah.

00:34:07.800 I mean, that, that makes total sense.

00:34:09.420 I think that applies just broadly to life too, whether you're doing a podcast or training

00:34:13.700 jujitsu or archery or having conversations, how comfortable, are you so comfortable with

00:34:19.860 it that it becomes second nature and natural for you?

00:34:22.720 Right.

00:34:23.460 Right.

00:34:23.700 Yeah.

00:34:24.340 Interesting.

00:34:24.960 When you're out in public, what are some of the things that, uh, that you're observing

00:34:29.120 that you're looking for that might be a red flag, things to be aware of.

00:34:33.020 Obviously you've got your eyes up, you're scanning the environment, but what is it that you're

00:34:36.720 actually looking for observing?

00:34:39.340 So, I mean, in general, let's say for in a, in a vehicle, the most dangerous time you'll

00:34:44.820 be around your vehicles when you're getting out of it or getting into it.

00:34:47.800 That's the most likely place for attack.

00:34:50.100 Cause you're vulnerable at that point?

00:34:51.400 That, because that's where criminal, like, uh, say, say for instance, criminal, let's

00:34:55.940 say, let's talk about car thieves.

00:34:58.420 Um, if you go to the mall or wherever and you get to, you walk away from your car and

00:35:03.200 you look back for your car, if your car is still there, when you get to the door, it'll

00:35:07.720 be there when you come out of the mall.

00:35:09.320 That's how fast car thieves are.

00:35:10.940 So there's two methods, two methods for car thieves.

00:35:13.560 One is they find you in traffic and they follow you somewhere and they, and so when you're

00:35:18.820 getting out, they rob you.

00:35:20.420 Why would they, why would somebody follow you?

00:35:22.280 Is it there?

00:35:22.680 They see the vehicle.

00:35:23.640 They want that vehicle or they see you.

00:35:25.380 What is it?

00:35:25.960 Shopping for a vehicle.

00:35:27.640 Yeah.

00:35:27.820 Shopping for a vehicle.

00:35:28.840 Okay.

00:35:29.480 The other thing is they go, they go shopping while you're in the mall.

00:35:32.800 They drive up and down the rows until they find the car they want.

00:35:36.040 Then they just get somewhere and, and wait.

00:35:38.860 And then when you come out, when you're getting into your car, that's when they will approach

00:35:42.360 you.

00:35:43.000 And so those are the two, the two highest, uh, likelihoods of, of carjacking or robbery.

00:35:48.900 They don't, they don't do the, in the middle of traffic, jerking people out of the car anymore.

00:35:52.420 That's, that's, that's from the nineties.

00:35:54.100 They don't do that anymore.

00:35:54.860 They, they, they shop and they get you while the car is not moving.

00:35:59.180 It just seems like it would be easier, which is they're looking for the path of least resistance.

00:36:02.720 Mm-hmm and you, you come out, you got the arm load of stuff and all that, you know, from

00:36:07.980 the, the, the store and you're distracted and you know, all that kind of stuff.

00:36:12.120 Yeah.

00:36:12.840 Okay.

00:36:13.100 So that's what you're looking for.

00:36:14.340 If you're, if you're in a vehicle, you know, what if, what if you're in a public space,

00:36:18.060 you know, you're at Disneyland or you're at the movie theater or the mall or whatever.

00:36:22.000 I hear guys all the time.

00:36:23.500 They go, I never let anybody get within 10 feet of me.

00:36:26.360 Right.

00:36:26.880 Good luck.

00:36:29.360 All I can say is just, you know, you got to keep your head up.

00:36:32.720 Head up, you know, you just got to look around.

00:36:34.260 I just, I, I, I pass off my seemingly predatory, um, gaze at people by saying hello to everybody.

00:36:45.900 And, uh, and so what I, what I've found is that that's kind of like a sonar.

00:36:49.960 I can say hello.

00:36:51.080 And what I get back tells me a lot about that person.

00:36:53.640 You know, it's a very comfortable, Oh, Hey, how's it going?

00:36:56.520 You know, that, that tells me a lot, a lot about that person.

00:36:59.060 Um, and, uh, that's, you know, just, there's, there's no way around it.

00:37:06.260 People are going to get close and, and anybody that thinks that they're going to keep people

00:37:09.300 10 feet away from them has never been to a, an Asian country.

00:37:12.960 I'll tell you that they have no, they have no sense of personal space.

00:37:16.940 Like we do at all.

00:37:17.880 Uh, it's just, you know, something or something around the reason, the reason that, that 70%

00:37:23.940 of gunfights happen closer than 10 feet, uh, is because they cannot impose their will on

00:37:30.780 you from further away than that.

00:37:32.540 They can't take your wallet or rape you or, or whatever the case may be from across the

00:37:36.520 parking lots.

00:37:37.120 So they have to get close.

00:37:38.380 So crowds, I'm not as worried about like a crowd thing would be a pickpocket.

00:37:43.120 That would be a crowd problem, the parking lot, the lonely parking lot.

00:37:47.780 That would be the, the mugging guy, you know, the coming up with a guy for whatever.

00:37:52.880 So, you know, I mean, broad daylight, especially with people around, I'm not, I'm not worried

00:37:59.200 about a mugging.

00:38:00.440 Uh, right.

00:38:01.600 It seems to me, correct me if I'm wrong, but I mean, you talked about pickpocketing scenarios

00:38:06.140 and crowded places, but also somebody looking to inflict mass casualty would be in an environment

00:38:12.300 like that as well versus, you know, singling somebody out, trying to rob them, trying to

00:38:17.320 steal their car, et cetera, et cetera.

00:38:19.340 Yeah.

00:38:19.720 And what I tell people about like mass shootings is if the crowd of people is running a direction,

00:38:25.700 you run by yourself this way.

00:38:28.280 Yeah.

00:38:28.440 Explain that.

00:38:29.360 Yeah.

00:38:30.140 Humans, humans won't do that.

00:38:31.540 We have what's called a hurting instinct, like all other animals.

00:38:34.420 And, uh, when, when, when you hear, when you hear the term safety in numbers, that's talking

00:38:39.560 about how a group of animals, uh, reproduce to keep their species going.

00:38:46.520 So their safety in numbers means that if there's 500 zebras, if lions eat 20 of them, it's not

00:38:53.500 a real big deal for their population.

00:38:55.480 Well, if you're one of those zebras, it's a big deal.

00:38:58.500 It's a huge deal.

00:38:59.700 Safety in numbers does not apply to individual safety.

00:39:03.440 Okay.

00:39:04.000 And, uh, so, so let's say, uh, like the, the shooting in Las Vegas and everybody was

00:39:11.100 kind of crowded up.

00:39:12.100 He just shot into the crowd.

00:39:13.660 I'd rather be the one person running across.

00:39:16.900 He's not going to stop shooting into that barrel of fish to pick out one person running

00:39:23.100 across.

00:39:23.560 He's not his odds of hitting anything.

00:39:25.740 Go way down.

00:39:26.440 Every time he fires a bullet into the mob, somebody's getting hit somewhere.

00:39:32.380 Every time I try to shoot at this moving target, I'm just going to, I'm going to miss.

00:39:36.940 So I tell people all the time, I tell my kids all the time, I tell my grandkids run away

00:39:42.200 from people if there's an emergency like that.

00:39:45.480 Yeah, that's true.

00:39:46.380 Because basically you're getting off, you know, the term we hear is get off the X, right?

00:39:49.980 Get off the X.

00:39:50.840 And that's essentially what you're saying.

00:39:52.240 It sounds like is get away from being the target.

00:39:54.500 Well, I, and I think the target is the crowd.

00:39:58.320 Sure.

00:39:58.780 Right.

00:39:59.980 Not any, yeah.

00:40:00.960 In that situation, in a, in a, in a crowded environment, you individually are not the target.

00:40:06.400 As many people as possible are.

00:40:07.960 Right.

00:40:08.800 Sure.

00:40:09.140 Makes sense.

00:40:09.900 You all, I've also heard you say run, hide, fight.

00:40:12.980 So we're talking about running towards the fire, hiding, right?

00:40:15.840 Cover, not necessarily concealment, but cover.

00:40:18.340 And then shooting that guy in the face is what you said.

00:40:22.000 Well, that's run, hide, fight is a federal program where they want you to run away, hide

00:40:27.140 somewhere.

00:40:27.860 But if the guy finds you, then pick up stuff in the room and throw at him.

00:40:32.620 God changed it to run toward the gunfire, hide behind cover and shoot the motherfucker

00:40:37.020 in the face.

00:40:39.120 Do you think that is appropriate?

00:40:42.400 Like, when is that appropriate?

00:40:44.800 Like, how would you determine that that is an appropriate course of action?

00:40:47.720 I, I totally understand the running towards because you're getting away from the crowd.

00:40:52.500 I don't know if hiding and engaging is, is appropriate in all situations.

00:40:57.520 What, what situation is it not appropriate?

00:41:00.800 Um, that's a good question.

00:41:04.320 I would say.

00:41:05.400 Let me continue.

00:41:06.620 I had a guy say, well, I'm not going to do that because I've got a seven year old kid

00:41:10.140 and, and who's going to explain to him why I'm dead.

00:41:12.500 And I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm like, first off, why are you dead?

00:41:15.400 But, but, but why can you not be a hero?

00:41:17.360 But secondly, I want to see you explain to a seven year old, a kid whose father is dead,

00:41:24.060 why you could have help and chose not to.

00:41:28.480 And, uh, so it's not, it's not whether or not I'll live.

00:41:31.420 It's what can I live with?

00:41:32.880 And if I carry two guns and tourniquets and all this stuff and two lights and all this

00:41:37.660 crap and the shit comes down and I don't do anything, I'm not going to be the fucking

00:41:41.700 cop outside the door at the fucking Florida school letting kids get shot.

00:41:46.040 I'm not going to be that guy.

00:41:47.520 I'm not going to be the guy that says my family is the only ones that are important.

00:41:50.660 I'm not going to be that guy.

00:41:52.100 I'm not telling anybody else to do it.

00:41:54.120 But what I'm saying is it's not a, whether or not I live, if I do it, it's, can I live

00:42:00.060 with myself if I don't?

00:42:02.740 Yeah, that's a, that's a valid distinction.

00:42:04.700 I hadn't considered that, but I can definitely see what you're talking about.

00:42:08.420 I guess, um, it goes back to what you were saying earlier is who are you saving, right?

00:42:14.340 Whose life are you saving?

00:42:15.980 And in that situation, you are potentially saving your seven year old child or the other

00:42:21.100 hundred people that, that are behind you.

00:42:23.200 Dude, I don't know you, but when I got a text from you saying, I'm going to go over here

00:42:27.980 and see if I can help where these people got hurt.

00:42:30.060 That like whether or not you agreed with what I just said, I know what you would have

00:42:35.520 done.

00:42:36.400 Yeah.

00:42:37.060 Yeah.

00:42:37.380 I would like to think I would in that situation.

00:42:39.600 I guess you never really know, but people that are wired that way are wired that way.

00:42:44.260 Like you don't even get a choice.

00:42:46.200 Um, I, I, I see you got some red in that beard.

00:42:49.420 Yeah, that's right.

00:42:50.240 Yeah, absolutely.

00:42:51.560 Have you read, have you read the book born fighting?

00:42:54.120 No, I haven't.

00:42:54.940 I'll have to check it out.

00:42:55.620 Now you have a genetic predisposition for warfare.

00:42:59.480 All you, all teachers do.

00:43:01.660 Is that right?

00:43:02.800 Interesting.

00:43:03.960 47% of the combat deaths in Vietnam were Scotch Irish.

00:43:08.000 Oh, really?

00:43:09.320 Yeah.

00:43:10.480 Yeah.

00:43:10.740 Interesting.

00:43:11.720 There's a book called check that out.

00:43:12.960 Born fighting.

00:43:13.920 Yeah.

00:43:14.360 You, you would dig it.

00:43:15.480 You would dig it.

00:43:16.060 But, uh, I got a little red.

00:43:17.400 I got a little red in mine, but I'm not a full ginger.

00:43:20.740 I'm a day walker.

00:43:22.100 I can tan.

00:43:23.720 I can't, I go from white to red back to white.

00:43:26.660 That's all I do.

00:43:28.000 So the, the, the gingers hate me.

00:43:29.540 They can't steal my soul.

00:43:30.400 I got all your, all your powers, but none of your weaknesses.

00:43:35.000 So, all right.

00:43:35.900 So let's, let's flip that on its head a little bit.

00:43:38.220 Somebody who maybe is not predisposed to run towards the fire.

00:43:42.900 Is that something that can be programmed or should be?

00:43:46.840 I mean, is it even in their, in their blood and their DNA to do it?

00:43:49.400 I get asked a lot.

00:43:52.380 And, um, my, my thinking is that, uh, that everybody's a fighter genetically.

00:44:00.740 I mean, we've been on the earth, you know, a couple hundred lifetimes now, like you're

00:44:06.340 carrying somebody's DNA.

00:44:07.600 That was a fighter.

00:44:08.580 There's something in you.

00:44:09.680 And I mean, no doubt, no doubt the best of the best.

00:44:12.660 Right.

00:44:13.560 Uh, except for the people that are allergic to gluten.

00:44:15.860 I figure their, their family's very, very mad at them.

00:44:18.620 But anyway, I'm just kidding.

00:44:19.400 Um, but, uh, but no, I, I, I get asked all the time, you know, like, you know, what can

00:44:26.640 I do to, to make sure that I do the right thing?

00:44:29.300 And I'm like, you're doing it.

00:44:31.420 Like you're thinking about it.

00:44:32.720 You're, you know, you can make a decision.

00:44:34.580 I mean, you know, the, uh, you know, courage is not the absence of fear.

00:44:39.240 Courage means you're afraid and you do it anyway.

00:44:41.980 And, uh, uh, I'm, and I've, I've got a lot of friends and the cops and SWAT cops and rangers

00:44:50.840 and seals and special forces and Delta force and all of them.

00:44:54.760 And they've been in tons of crap.

00:44:56.800 And I go, were you scared?

00:44:57.600 And they go, fuck yeah, I'm scared.

00:44:58.920 Like none of them, none of them shy from that.

00:45:01.300 You know, uh, you know, so, but, uh, I say, if you make the decision, then the decision

00:45:07.460 is made.

00:45:09.360 Yeah.

00:45:09.840 I guess it would take for somebody who may not have, uh, have as much of that in your

00:45:13.820 DNA, like you're talking about, it would have to be more of a conscious thought ahead

00:45:17.500 of time training and thinking about it ahead of time in order to act in that situation,

00:45:22.640 act with their, their, their moral compass, if you will.

00:45:26.560 Right.

00:45:27.000 It makes sense.

00:45:28.960 Yeah.

00:45:29.940 So, yeah.

00:45:33.220 So somebody who's, who's interested, cause I know there's a lot of guys who, who would

00:45:37.660 be interested in firearms training and interested in, you know, just making themselves more capable

00:45:42.260 as, as, as like Pat would say a sentinel, right.

00:45:46.480 Or protector.

00:45:47.740 Like what is it that they should be doing?

00:45:49.460 What that, what should they be looking into?

00:45:51.320 Where do they get started?

00:45:52.640 Like, like how do we get going with this stuff?

00:45:55.100 Uh, you know, that's, that's a tough, that's a simple question.

00:46:01.320 And it's a very complex question at the same time.

00:46:04.520 Um, like if somebody came to me and say, Hey, I want to, I want to do this gun thing.

00:46:09.240 I'd say, don't buy anything.

00:46:12.200 Don't buy, don't buy anything.

00:46:13.880 Come to a class.

00:46:14.880 I'll loan you a gun and take the class.

00:46:18.060 And then when you leave the class, you'll, you'll be an educated consumer.

00:46:21.160 Sure.

00:46:21.940 But the thing we do is we start buying stuff.

00:46:24.600 We buy all this stuff, these fancy guns and all this stuff.

00:46:27.420 And, and then guys, you know, like anybody that wants adjustable sites, uh, has got a

00:46:33.260 trigger flange.

00:46:33.900 They got a real bad flange.

00:46:35.280 Anybody, anybody says, why can I buy adjustable sites for a Glock?

00:46:38.000 You dude, you, your money ahead, go get in the class.

00:46:40.760 There's nothing wrong with your stuff.

00:46:42.060 Right.

00:46:42.380 And, but, um, they're trying to compensate for lack of technique is what you're saying.

00:46:47.460 Yeah.

00:46:47.900 Yeah.

00:46:48.180 Oh, absolutely.

00:46:49.280 Sure.

00:46:49.640 And the thing is we can buy gear.

00:46:52.060 We can't buy skill.

00:46:53.740 And if we buy, if we buy a gear, like, like Terran Butler is a fantastic friend of mine.

00:46:59.520 He's crazy.

00:47:00.220 He's a fucking loon, but what a friend, what a great guy.

00:47:03.160 I've got some of the Terran guns, you know, the John Wick guns.

00:47:06.220 I've got some of them.

00:47:06.860 Oh yeah.

00:47:07.660 I can't shoot like John Wick.

00:47:09.900 Mm-hmm.

00:47:11.160 Yeah.

00:47:11.520 Yeah.

00:47:12.340 Yeah.

00:47:12.740 I've heard somewhere, I can't remember what context, but they said something to the effect

00:47:16.820 of if you could choose to have the, the gear or the skills, and it could have been sports,

00:47:23.080 it could have been in firearms training.

00:47:24.280 I don't know what it was.

00:47:25.500 You should always, always, always choose the skill because that gear you can acquire.

00:47:32.080 What you're probably talking about is I've said, I've said to people, what would you rather

00:47:36.080 have training or a gun?

00:47:39.180 Sure.

00:47:39.580 And people say gun and, and, and I go, no training.

00:47:42.860 And they're like, you're crazy.

00:47:44.120 You're crazy.

00:47:44.700 And it's funny because we're talking about here's Pat Mack again.

00:47:47.300 You'd think I'm stalking him or something when he would, I, I just floated this thing

00:47:51.760 out on, on the social media and everybody was railing against me.

00:47:54.300 Not everybody, but some people.

00:47:55.440 And so Pat Mack pulls up, gets out of his truck.

00:47:58.320 This is in front of his class.

00:47:59.760 I go, Hey Pat, if you had to choose to have a gun or have training, what would you choose?

00:48:03.200 He didn't even hesitate.

00:48:04.860 Like he didn't even hesitate.

00:48:06.260 Didn't even hesitate.

00:48:07.560 But, um, but everybody that chose gun, I asked, I said, is there anybody that chose having a

00:48:14.080 gun that has training?

00:48:16.420 Not a, one of them had any training.

00:48:19.320 So these are all novices.

00:48:20.360 So guys just getting into it.

00:48:22.480 Uh, no, there's, there's novices that have owned guns for 40 years.

00:48:26.160 I train them all the time.

00:48:27.840 Interesting.

00:48:28.480 Yeah, that's interesting.

00:48:29.760 That makes sense.

00:48:31.540 So get them into it.

00:48:32.700 So, so, uh, so firearms training, obviously what is something, um, anything else?

00:48:37.340 Like, are you, uh, are you into martial arts?

00:48:39.800 Do you, you practice any, any sort of martial art, um, uh, can jutsu occasionally, uh, I'm

00:48:46.960 in the middle of nowhere.

00:48:47.640 So it's hard for me to, to, to try.

00:48:49.900 I've been studying for 14 years, but, um, um, I, I tell my students, uh, find a reputable

00:48:58.140 mixed martial arts or Brazilian jujitsu gym.

00:49:01.320 I said, for a couple of reasons, all of us could stand to be in a little bit better physical

00:49:05.360 condition.

00:49:06.020 I said that I said, learning, learning how to fight's good because there's a whole lot

00:49:10.560 of space between not doing anything and killing a guy.

00:49:13.680 There's a whole bunch of space in the middle there.

00:49:15.480 I said, that's good.

00:49:16.620 And then also one of the tools that the criminals use is intimidation.

00:49:21.240 How are they going to intimidate you?

00:49:23.820 If two or three nights a week, you fight black belts for fun.

00:49:30.040 Good point.

00:49:31.340 Good point.

00:49:31.800 Well, I mean, so there's, there's three really good reasons to pick up some type of

00:49:38.260 or wrestling or boxing.

00:49:40.840 I tell people all the time, don't fuck around with 160 pound high school wrestler.

00:49:44.980 They will tie you in a fucking knot.

00:49:47.080 No doubt.

00:49:47.780 That's absolutely true, man.

00:49:49.740 Well, and not only that, even jujitsu, you know, I, when I, when I started training, uh,

00:49:54.380 yeah, 160 pound guys, even females, like there's no way this, this, this woman or this, this

00:50:01.260 lightweight is going to do anything to me.

00:50:03.800 And all of a sudden I'm like, he's got his arms wrapped around my neck and I'm like, okay,

00:50:08.140 I'm done.

00:50:08.680 I give, you know, it's like that training, even just a little bit goes such a long ways.

00:50:14.560 Absolutely.

00:50:14.960 Uh, I, I meant to ask you about something cause you said you, you were talking about

00:50:20.840 space, like, uh, like criminals are, are, are attempting to, to, to close space.

00:50:25.660 Right.

00:50:26.040 And so your goal in that case should be then to, um, create space, right.

00:50:33.560 Or, or close the space.

00:50:36.000 Never hang it.

00:50:36.940 Cause I've heard of it, I've heard of it defined as like, uh, maybe you have a different term

00:50:41.720 for it, but, um, green, red, green, right.

00:50:46.920 So is that, okay.

00:50:47.940 So explain it to me.

00:50:49.780 So, uh, let's say if somebody is going to attack me, um, and let's say they're, they're

00:50:55.200 raising a knife or a bat or something like that.

00:50:58.340 Well, if I'm, if I take a step back, I might just get the, the bad or whatever.

00:51:02.400 So that's when I might get my gun retention position and move into the swing.

00:51:08.900 So you don't catch the brunt end of that weapon.

00:51:11.720 Right.

00:51:12.200 So I stand, so I get hit by their arm as, as they're coming around with it.

00:51:17.120 Instead of, instead of it, that thing smacking me in my head or stabbing me in my chest.

00:51:22.880 How much of this is reactionary?

00:51:26.300 Just, and when I say reactionary, I'm not even necessarily talking about trained reaction.

00:51:31.960 I can, I can ask you your question.

00:51:33.880 If it's, if you have a pistol in your hand, it's reactionary.

00:51:36.700 You have a long gun in your hand.

00:51:38.140 It's on purpose.

00:51:39.640 Hmm.

00:51:40.000 Um, so you would not, but again, having a pistol in that reactionary is, is, it has

00:51:46.560 to be trained, right?

00:51:47.440 I mean, you're not naturally going to go for that if you had, if you don't have any training.

00:51:50.600 Oh yeah.

00:51:51.280 No, it did all the, you have to be trained.

00:51:53.560 Yeah.

00:51:54.240 I guess what I'm alluding to is, um, are you, you're familiar with Tony Blower?

00:51:58.060 I know who that is.

00:52:00.120 He talks about, and I'm, I'm not completely versed in what he addresses.

00:52:03.680 He's been on the podcast and he may be coming on again in the near future, but he talks about,

00:52:08.160 uh, the body's like flinch system, for example, where, where it will naturally without any

00:52:13.840 training naturally respond to threats and things that it sees.

00:52:18.300 A great example.

00:52:19.360 I saw a video on Instagram the other day and there was a, uh, maybe you saw it.

00:52:24.700 There was a deer that like slammed through, crashed through a barbershop window.

00:52:30.240 And there was, I think a woman sitting on the couch and she just moved, like just barely

00:52:36.460 just moved over to the left.

00:52:37.800 And that deer just went right over her shoulder without barely even touching her.

00:52:42.760 And to me, I look at that and think, well, that's, I mean, she didn't train for a deer

00:52:46.360 to come through the window.

00:52:47.200 That's just a flinch response that kept her alive.

00:52:49.340 Potentially.

00:52:49.980 It's pretty, pretty fascinating what the body can do just inherently and naturally.

00:52:54.220 So basically we've, um, all this down to very simple, parasympathetic and

00:53:00.120 sympathetic nervous system or sympathetic nervous system takes over.

00:53:03.360 We don't have any control, but a response to loud noises.

00:53:06.460 We have a lot of primal fear, sudden loss of breath, sudden loss of balance, but loud

00:53:11.020 noises is one.

00:53:12.200 The knees flex, which means the knees bend slightly out.

00:53:15.280 The shoulders come up to protect the neck.

00:53:16.960 The hands come up to protect the face.

00:53:18.520 Uh, boom.

00:53:19.360 And that's the start of response.

00:53:20.860 So when you watch these videos of crowds and there's a bomb goes off or whatever, you'll

00:53:25.300 see the whole crowd do that.

00:53:27.120 And, uh, and so, so I think, uh, I don't know, Mr.

00:53:31.560 Blair's got a fantastic reputation, but I believe that part of his, his thing is the

00:53:36.680 drills start with the hands coming up and that's where they start.

00:53:39.760 But that would, uh, that would make a lot of sense.

00:53:42.200 That's pair.

00:53:43.120 Say it again.

00:53:43.740 Parasympathetic system.

00:53:45.900 Parasympathetic.

00:53:46.900 Parasympathetic is right now.

00:53:48.500 Okay.

00:53:49.860 Sympathetic is, uh, the human response to threat where we have the adrenaline rush and,

00:53:54.400 you know, and all that stuff.

00:53:56.080 And so sympathetic is just natural response.

00:53:59.660 Parasympathetic is you training towards a certain activity to ingrain that into your

00:54:05.360 procedures.

00:54:06.560 Uh, hold on a second.

00:54:07.740 So, um, basically parasympathetic nervous system is when we are not in fear for our life

00:54:13.660 and for the, so I, I, I describe this to my students as scientist brain and caveman brain.

00:54:20.000 So when we're, when we're below 165 beats per minute, scientist brain, when our heart

00:54:26.620 rate spikes and we go above 165 and that number varies per person, but we go above 165

00:54:33.280 beats per minute, we have no control over it.

00:54:35.980 Then we switch to the caveman brain.

00:54:39.900 Is the goal to switch to the caveman brain later?

00:54:45.540 Or like, do you see what I'm saying?

00:54:46.700 Like, is it to train your body to have a natural or a different response to these situations?

00:54:51.000 Well, uh, we do five things under stress, fight, flight, freeze, uh, uh, posture, fornicate,

00:54:58.060 fight, flight, freeze, fornicate, posture, fight, flight, freeze, fornicate, posture.

00:55:03.340 So posturing is like in the South, we call bowing up.

00:55:06.540 Like, Hey, what?

00:55:07.720 Right.

00:55:08.220 Sure.

00:55:09.040 That's posturing.

00:55:10.200 Um, fornicate people kind of giggle at that one, but, but maybe not now, but the first

00:55:14.180 time you, when you had to happen, you're like, what the fuck just happened?

00:55:17.240 Okay.

00:55:17.480 That was a full on adrenaline rush.

00:55:19.360 Uh, uh, freezing is a, is a holdover from when saber to tigers hunted us.

00:55:24.080 We didn't coexist with dinosaurs, but we did coexist with tigers.

00:55:27.340 And so one of the things we would do is we'd stop because just like them, we have

00:55:32.040 credit predators eyes and we, and they are attracted to fast flickering movement.

00:55:36.660 So the freeze was a response to maybe the tiger walks past us and doesn't eat us.

00:55:42.400 And, uh, uh, people that aren't trained, uh, very well or children, they wind up doing

00:55:48.340 that quite frequently.

00:55:49.720 And, uh, a fighter flight, you learn it doesn't really necessarily work all that well.

00:55:54.040 Is that you get trained out of it again?

00:55:56.400 It's sympathetic.

00:55:57.820 Hmm.

00:55:59.300 And I believe it, I think we outgrow it mostly, but, uh, that leaves fight or flight.

00:56:04.740 And so a lot of things happened to us, but with the adrenaline rush, the big things that

00:56:08.960 happened to us are blood leaves, our extremities, blood leaves, our face, blood leaves, our

00:56:12.900 fingers.

00:56:13.780 And this is where, uh, people say he was white as a ghost or teeth were chattered.

00:56:17.980 Our hands were shaking.

00:56:18.680 It's where, it's where fingers turn to flippers.

00:56:21.160 That's why I teach people to run the slide on their gun instead of trying to find little

00:56:24.320 buttons on there because under the effects of adrenaline, uh, it's, it's tough.

00:56:28.220 And so I tell people to do this.

00:56:29.880 The scientist brain is where I'm training and the scientist brain knows, well, I'll just count

00:56:33.620 my rounds.

00:56:34.120 I'll know when to, uh, you know, I'll, I'll know when I need to reload cause I'll count

00:56:37.800 my rounds or I don't need to, to rack the slide every time because I'll, I'll know I

00:56:41.940 can just press this button or this or do this or do this and don't do anything because

00:56:45.460 I'll, because I'll have all my wits about me.

00:56:47.820 The problem is soon as that damn caveman brain takes over that motherfucker can't count.

00:56:52.900 He can't spell.

00:56:53.720 He can't read.

00:56:54.680 I, he don't know shit.

00:56:55.840 And he's not very coordinated, really strong though.

00:56:58.840 All the blood leaves and goes to our extremities from our extremities goes to our large muscle

00:57:03.080 groups in preparation for running for our life or fighting for our life.

00:57:06.500 And so he's incredibly strong, but he just can't fucking count.

00:57:10.900 So then the, the response to that is train your systems and your procedures so you can

00:57:17.240 operate in those situations.

00:57:18.800 That's why you're talking about racking the slide, for example.

00:57:21.700 Right.

00:57:21.920 So every time I do this, I do this every time I do that, I do that.

00:57:26.580 There's no thinking about it.

00:57:27.860 And that, that, that's it.

00:57:30.180 Like I do that every single time.

00:57:32.600 I don't have to think about it because the caveman doesn't think like he's, he's not,

00:57:37.480 he's not a, you know, he didn't do rodents thinker, you know, that's not the caveman.

00:57:41.980 Um, and, uh, so, um, and so what I try to tell my students is let you just trust me for

00:57:49.160 two days, taking our fighting pistol class, just do what I say.

00:57:52.320 And then, then by the end of it, after I explained the science of it and the biological reactions

00:57:57.940 and all that, by the end of it, they go, okay, this makes perfect sense.

00:58:00.320 But on the internet, people that don't have any training and furthermore, uh, to come

00:58:06.360 to training, you have to risk ego and most men are unwilling to risk ego.

00:58:11.960 Uh, so they won't go and do things.

00:58:13.660 See, getting married is why women get married.

00:58:17.220 So I don't have to have sex.

00:58:18.440 Men get married.

00:58:19.500 So they don't have to dance anymore because we fucking hate it because it fucking makes

00:58:23.260 it makes us risk our ego.

00:58:24.820 If we don't look mainly out there, it doesn't reinforce our positive self image.

00:58:28.520 We don't want to do it.

00:58:31.280 Yeah.

00:58:31.940 That, which is interesting because it's kind of counterintuitive to our, our natural

00:58:35.980 inclination as men to step into the role of protector.

00:58:38.820 It's a, it's a direct odds with it.

00:58:40.740 Cause what we ended up doing is, is exposing ourselves to all these risks for, for the

00:58:45.580 sake of maintaining our ego.

00:58:46.680 It's crazy.

00:58:47.880 Right.

00:58:48.840 It is interesting that you're talking about this, these different types of brains.

00:58:52.340 Cause I've actually experienced in my life where I turned into those and I didn't have

00:58:55.200 the term, but the flipper hands where I noticed my fingers started to tighten up a little bit

00:58:59.660 and I couldn't, I couldn't, I couldn't manipulate them.

00:59:02.680 Right.

00:59:02.800 I couldn't flex them.

00:59:04.000 And, and what's interesting is you can't out think it.

00:59:07.620 Oh, right.

00:59:08.620 I'm like, what the hell's going on?

00:59:09.640 Like I need to be able to like, come on.

00:59:11.900 And you just can't out think it.

00:59:14.440 It's just what the body does inherently.

00:59:16.460 It's pretty, it's pretty amazing and pretty kind of scary at the same time, actually.

00:59:20.520 So, so the scientist brains get insulted when I go, Hey, I'm going to, I'm going to treat

00:59:24.900 you like, I'm not going to treat you.

00:59:26.380 I'm going to, I'm going to treat your gun handling, the gun teaching, uh, like you're

00:59:30.040 dumb.

00:59:30.480 And they're like, I'm not dumb.

00:59:31.540 I'm a scientist.

00:59:32.380 And so it insults them.

00:59:33.740 So they resist it.

00:59:34.680 They resist it.

00:59:35.360 They resist it.

00:59:36.560 Yeah.

00:59:37.000 Yeah, that's interesting.

00:59:38.960 I do agree with you.

00:59:40.180 I mean, I, I, myself personally, you know, it's like, I don't, I don't want to go to training

00:59:44.100 and get choked out and I don't want to look like a fool and I don't want to ask questions

00:59:48.880 because in a way too, we've been conditioned, whether it's by our fathers or other people

00:59:52.780 that if you ask the wrong question, heaven forbid, cause you're going to get mocked and

00:59:57.140 ridiculed and made fun of.

00:59:58.800 And so we stop asking questions.

01:00:00.660 We stop putting ourselves in, uh, compromising situations that could potentially help us

01:00:05.620 down the road because we don't want to feel like that.

01:00:09.420 Yep.

01:00:10.440 Wild stuff.

01:00:11.720 Well, Hey man, we're, we're, uh, we're winding down on time a little bit here.

01:00:14.660 I want to be respectful of your time and what we had committed to.

01:00:17.360 Um, obviously we could talk about this all day and longer.

01:00:20.460 There's so much to go into, but for the sake of time, we'll let the guys connect with you

01:00:24.540 and, and, uh, and figure it out from there.

01:00:26.780 But I do want to ask you a question as we wind down.

01:00:29.460 Uh, the first one is what does it mean to be a man?

01:00:33.360 What does it mean to be a man?

01:00:35.460 And I assume you mean manly because as opposed to what womanly.

01:00:43.100 Yes.

01:00:43.540 So not so yes, manly, absolutely.

01:00:47.920 In this crazy world that we live in, man used to be a biological reference.

01:00:54.200 Sure.

01:00:54.540 And I, and I would consider that male.

01:00:57.880 I get it.

01:00:58.980 But I'm just saying, I just want to be clear.

01:01:00.740 How about this?

01:01:01.680 Uh, and I'll start with this.

01:01:03.340 Um, and you probably don't expect me to quote Albert Einstein, but, um, Einstein said to

01:01:10.200 be a warrior.

01:01:11.320 And I believe manly to be a warrior means to be, um, genuine every moment of your life.

01:01:18.340 And so I think that what being a man is, is being yourself, telling the truth, doing the

01:01:25.720 right thing.

01:01:26.880 Even when it's not popular, I believe that that's what being a man is.

01:01:30.900 I dig it.

01:01:32.280 And I appreciate that about you.

01:01:33.960 Um, like I said, I've been following you for a while and, and, and been into your stuff

01:01:37.540 and I'm gonna have to actually take some training from you.

01:01:39.560 I think that'd be a lot of fun and definitely help me as well.

01:01:41.700 Uh, but I, but I, I recognize that and acknowledge that of you as somebody who's willing to say

01:01:47.920 what needs to be said, although it may not always be popular or make people feel warm

01:01:52.740 and fuzzy.

01:01:53.500 Uh, it seems to me it's the truth and it will help people along the path.

01:01:56.660 And that's what definitely what you're doing.

01:01:57.880 So I appreciate that.

01:02:00.000 Now, normally this is where I ask people to, uh, let us know how they, how we can connect

01:02:05.140 with you, but you already told me what your response is to that.

01:02:07.520 So my, my response is always, uh, if they are too stupid to find me, I don't want their

01:02:13.680 money.

01:02:14.480 And we talked about this earlier, but if you were insulted by that, I don't want you as

01:02:18.980 a student.

01:02:19.400 And, and here's my thing.

01:02:21.180 Uh, not everybody deserves to train with me.

01:02:23.740 Not everybody, not everybody gets to there.

01:02:25.960 There's a lot of people.

01:02:27.000 I, I dissuade from, from, from training with me because they don't, I don't think they'll

01:02:31.320 appreciate it.

01:02:31.920 And I certainly won't appreciate their attendance.

01:02:33.780 What might be a red flag that would, that would be an indicator of that?

01:02:39.800 Um, people saying, I heard you do this at your classes and I don't want to do that.

01:02:45.760 Whatever that, whatever it is, you know?

01:02:48.200 Yeah.

01:02:48.860 So you think they're probably coming in with an ego or some sort of a preconceived notions

01:02:53.000 of what this is, or they think they already have it figured out.

01:02:55.180 So everything they're, they're going to try to undermine all of your training.

01:02:59.000 Um, on, uh, on the gear list for all my classes, the first thing on the gear list is an open

01:03:04.540 mind.

01:03:05.240 So when you send me a email and you say, I'm not going to do this, or I don't want to do

01:03:09.240 that in your class before you even heard why I'm teaching it or how I'm teaching it.

01:03:14.020 Uh, that tells me you don't have an open mind and you therefore don't deserve to be a student.

01:03:19.440 I can appreciate that for sure.

01:03:21.560 Definitely not popular, right?

01:03:23.780 Cause everybody has to be welcomed and everybody has to be appreciated and everybody has to feel

01:03:28.260 good, not necessarily popular, but the truth.

01:03:31.180 And I can definitely, definitely appreciate that.

01:03:33.280 Listen, listen, I trained, uh, 5,712 people last year and other instructors who are my friends,

01:03:39.880 but don't have nearly that kind of attendance.

01:03:42.220 They always come up to me and they go, man, how, how is it that you talk to people like

01:03:47.220 that and they still come to your classes?

01:03:49.540 I go, those people don't come to my classes.

01:03:52.840 Great point.

01:03:53.960 Yeah.

01:03:54.340 You're not having to convince those people, right?

01:03:58.260 No, that's good.

01:03:59.940 That's really good.

01:04:01.000 Well, Hey James, I appreciate you, man.

01:04:02.440 I know we, we had to, we had to reschedule a couple of times, which I take responsibility

01:04:05.740 for, but I do appreciate your time.

01:04:08.380 Excited to get this out to the guys.

01:04:09.760 They're really going to appreciate it.

01:04:11.020 Um, and, uh, thanks again for imparting some of that wisdom on us.

01:04:14.940 Well, well, uh, I'm holding you to coming to a class.

01:04:17.640 I'm holding you to that.

01:04:19.060 Where, so tell me where you're located.

01:04:21.220 Where's home for you.

01:04:22.180 What state?

01:04:22.860 I'm in Maine.

01:04:23.460 Uh, the closest I get to you is Pennsylvania, but Tennessee, Tennessee is my home base.

01:04:29.980 And if you came to Tennessee, I could give you the VIP treatment, which means not really

01:04:34.720 much.

01:04:36.700 Well, I'll, uh, I'll come down there.

01:04:38.420 I've got my in-laws in, uh, in the Nashville area.

01:04:40.960 So I'll come down there and pay you a visit.

01:04:42.920 I'm 75 miles West of Nashville.

01:04:44.740 And for, and for people listening, that means I'm also 75 minutes West of Nashville.

01:04:50.140 So that's right.

01:04:51.080 Cause around here it'd be, you know, two hours.

01:04:54.400 So, yeah.

01:04:56.080 All right, James, we'll let you get going.

01:04:57.520 Appreciate you, brother.

01:04:58.220 Thanks for joining us again.

01:04:59.680 Yeah, man.

01:05:00.080 Anytime.

01:05:02.060 All right, guys, there you go.

01:05:03.060 My conversation with the one and only and fascinating James Yeager.

01:05:06.320 I hope you enjoyed the conversation.

01:05:07.720 I know I certainly did.

01:05:08.900 Uh, we agreed on most everything.

01:05:10.520 There was some semantics that we, uh, we discussed a little bit and, uh, I would like

01:05:14.100 to hear your thoughts.

01:05:14.920 So connect with me, connect with James on, uh, Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, YouTube,

01:05:20.720 wherever, wherever you're doing the social media thing, we are there.

01:05:23.480 You will find us.

01:05:24.640 Uh, I would actually really like you to go over to YouTube right now.

01:05:28.800 We're in the process of growing that channel out.

01:05:30.720 I want to say we've got 86, 87,000 subscribers at this point.

01:05:36.360 Um, and based on our trajectory, we'll hit that 100,000 mark here within the next, I would

01:05:40.180 say week, week and a half.

01:05:41.380 If we haven't already, uh, it's really starting to grow and pick up.

01:05:44.760 And I'm glad that you're supporting.

01:05:46.620 I'm glad that you're enjoying it.

01:05:48.260 Uh, and, uh, couldn't be more honored to be in this battle of reclaiming and restoring

01:05:51.640 masculinity with you.

01:05:53.420 So that's all I've got for you today, guys.

01:05:55.360 Again, go over to YouTube.

01:05:56.180 If you're here, uh, listening to audio and that's the way you, you decide you want to

01:06:00.100 listen to the conversations.

01:06:01.000 I would ask that you leave us a rating and review.

01:06:03.760 I just looked the other day.

01:06:04.820 I think we've got 3,400 reviews, ratings and reviews, and it would be nice to get that

01:06:09.600 up above 4,000.

01:06:11.260 That goes a very long way.

01:06:12.460 You have no idea.

01:06:13.080 A very long way in, uh, getting this message out, promoting the visibility of the show and

01:06:19.060 then climbing the charts.

01:06:20.540 Uh, we, we hover right around anywhere from 40 to 60 on the charts and iTunes, which is great.

01:06:26.940 It's great, but there's no reason that we shouldn't be in the top 10.

01:06:29.680 And in order to do that, I'm going to need to enlist your help.

01:06:32.860 And those ratings and reviews are a very quick and easy, uh, way to boost that up.

01:06:36.760 All right, guys, that's all I've got for you.

01:06:38.500 Uh, we'll be back tomorrow for Kip and I are asking me anything, uh, but until then go

01:06:42.920 out there, take action, become the man you are meant to be.

01:06:46.260 Thank you for listening to the order of man podcast.

01:06:49.080 You're ready to take charge of your life and be more of the man you were meant to be.

01:06:52.880 We invite you to join the order at order of man.com.

01:06:59.680 We want you to join the order of man.com.

01:07:06.680 Anyway.

We Don't Rise to the Level of our Expectations, We Fall to the Level of our Training ｜ JAMES YEAGER

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