When does money bring happiness? I'm joined by Rola Tomasi to talk about the difference between playing to win and playing not to lose, and why it's more important to play to win than to lose.
00:03:30.240Well, here's the thing is, and I have always, I don't know, I wanted to come on this.
00:03:35.420When you told me you were going to do this show, I was like, man, maybe I can get on that and talk something.
00:03:41.660Like, I usually when I'm speaking and when I'm talking about stuff, it's about intersexual dynamics.
00:03:46.940And if I cross over into other topics, such as maybe entrepreneurship or business or whatever, I don't think I talk about money all that much.
00:03:56.300But if it has to do with intersexual dynamics, I will cross over.
00:04:00.780So if it's religion or politics or whatever, as long as it is in that realm.
00:04:05.700But like in this case, it's like I think that might be interesting to sort of get my take on not necessarily how much I or what I view as far as money is concerned.
00:04:18.120But like just I think, I don't know, maybe like the best way I can say this is personal economics.
00:04:24.040Like your belief set about money, your belief set about success, because those two things are like intertwined.
00:04:31.640And the thing I was telling you is this is I've been pretty successful in my life.
00:04:46.040People, they might not know this about me because I'm always Roel Tomasi, the guy who's talking about intersection dynamics.
00:04:51.960But I have been in, I have a habit of going from creating a revenue stream for myself and then moving on to the next one.
00:05:05.060And so my primary, they always say, you know, you want to have passive forms of income.
00:05:09.800All of my active forms of income end up becoming my passive forms of income as I move on to the next project or I move on to the next thing that I'm doing in my life.
00:05:21.580You're actually quite humble, though, because you're a lot more successful than anybody would be led to know, right?
00:05:28.040I mean, you've done really well with your liquor brands.
00:05:40.520And as a result of having impact in people's lives and pursuing that purpose that you have to bring clarity to men.
00:05:47.920And I mean, like your purpose from what I understand, and I'm not putting words in your mouth here, but from what I understand it is you don't want other guys like your brother-in-law to put a noose around their neck.
00:05:56.580So when they understand these core concepts, they won't get into the mistake of pedestalizing a woman and having oneitis and going to do silly things like that.
00:06:05.760So I think that that itself is you playing to win because playing not to lose would have hid yourself in the vast shadows of the interwebs and maybe remained as Rolo Tomasi without showing your face.
00:06:20.660Like the first time we talked, when I approached you, we did a Skype interview and you would not run your camera.
00:06:45.560And I, when I was, I've been writing for all, well, in what we now call the manosphere for at least the last 18 or so years.
00:06:52.960I mean, I'm, I started, uh, I always think of my start date is like that in 2002 when I was writing for SoSuave.
00:07:01.440So, um, just about eight, well, um, gosh, almost 20 years now, but it's, um, uh, back then I had to be very careful because I never wanted to cross over
00:07:13.960my, my liquor brands or my, my real work, my real life with my online life.
00:07:20.980And that it took a long time for me to really be comfortable with finding a way to, to mix those two.
00:07:29.640And it, it took, it really took, um, the, the divestment of the company that I used to work for, for me to say, okay, maybe now is okay to do that.
00:07:39.100And it would re it used to kill me because I would deal with PR girls and I would deal with, because I was in marketing, I was in brand management.
00:07:47.020And I kept thinking, you know, if I could in some way do like a Rollo Tomasi brand of whiskey or a Rollo Tomasi brand of whatever, you know, um, any kind of, I was thinking like a brandy or a scotch or something like that at the time.
00:08:01.560And, and I, I have two liquor brands that are, I have just an ownership stake in and it's not like I own them outright.
00:08:09.000God forbid I own them outright, but, um, I have an ownership where I get royalties basically from a couple of brands and I've always wanted to at least one of them.
00:08:18.720The vodka brand I don't like I'm done with, but the, the, the whiskey brand I have been a little bit public with, it's called a tap or I whiskey.
00:08:26.540And it's, uh, I did the, the logo for it.
00:08:29.840I did the, the whole thing for a very long time.
00:08:32.340And now I'm, I just kind of sit back and let them do their own thing.
00:08:35.820But I always, I always thought, man, if I could just somehow find a way to cross over, because I I'm looking at, like, if you go and you look at the, the online presence of some of these brands that I've been associated with, all I would have to do is say, yeah, this is the, this is my brand.
00:08:51.460This is the one I endorse and it would like increase their exposure and they would make, I mean, they could make a lot of money off of it if I were to co-brand with them.
00:09:02.180I would rather have, I'd rather make like create something new for myself and, and maybe push it that way.
00:09:07.960But, um, I don't, I've never wanted to do that because I've been very careful of that because I don't know how certain brands will react to the manosphere or react to me, react to like the, my message as role of Tomasi, not my messages, you know, the guy who does the liquor brands.
00:09:26.500And so I've always been careful of that because I've seen this happen.
00:09:30.640I've seen brands become destroyed and good brands become destroyed because of a bad email or because somebody said something like right now we in, in today's society, it's, it's real easy for like particularly men to get run up the flagpole in the court of social media.
00:09:53.780So if you get like a me too accusation or even just a suspicion, that's all it takes right now.
00:09:59.560And so what happens is that's how like a doxing works or that's how, um, how, uh, guys, that's how like Antifa, like we've talked about like a Jack, um, Jack Murphy, like when he got doxed by Antifa, they came after him and they came after his, his personal life.
00:10:18.560They came after his, his family, they came after his little league coaching and they came after his job.
00:10:24.840And so, so this is, cause I'm going to tell you this from one side because I've seen this from both sides right now.
00:10:30.180When I have been working in some, in some, uh, some brands when I'm working with a few brands, the people who run those brands don't, they're not internet savvy.
00:10:40.800They don't know, they don't know about Antifa.
00:10:48.120All they know is what it is that they do.
00:10:49.900And the only concern that they have is their brand.
00:10:52.460So it's easier to fire you over an allegation than it is to go, Oh, let me, let me see if this is really legit.
00:10:59.760Let me, and let me dig into this and try to sort this out and untangle this and see if I can keep you in the job that you're in.
00:11:06.120It's, it's just simpler to say, get out of here, leave.
00:11:08.940This is like another broadcast entirely.
00:11:11.860Like this is about image management really.
00:11:13.940Well, yeah, that's what we're kind of leaning into.
00:11:15.600I want to circle it back and bring it back to money and happiness.
00:11:19.560I'm coming back to that because what, what happened is as far as like my money and my happiness was concerned, I had to make that separation because of that.
00:11:28.940So what I would end up doing and just in my, my own personal history, I've gone from, from various jobs that I've done.
00:11:35.500And those end up becoming my passive sources of income.
00:11:40.420So if I do, if I work in some capacity with like the gaming industry, I'll leave something behind me where they have to consult me or if they have to come back to me to, to get information so that they can keep their thing.
00:11:52.960Like, I think it's in the 48 laws of power where they say, you know, make yourself indispensable, you know, so that you, you know, never teach everybody all your tricks.
00:12:00.820That's always seemed like the, the, the knowledgeable thing to do.
00:12:04.000And so what I have a habit of doing is creating passive sources of income that end up, they, they used to be my main source of income.
00:12:13.260And then I move on from there and I'm kind of in a weird position right now because I kind of like right now, my, my being role Tomasi and my books and everything is competing with my income in my real life and my real job.
00:12:27.800And I never want to get to that point where, where I have to be dependent on being role Tomasi because I know that it can be taken away from me.
00:12:36.560So if you want to say, if you want to say, I want to talk about happiness and all that kind of stuff.
00:12:41.960I think really happiness comes from like people will say job security or that like, that's, to me, that's kind of like survivalism.
00:12:49.920Like you want to have jobs playing not to lose.
00:12:52.180Whenever somebody says job security, that's playing not to lose.
00:12:56.600Um, and, and so I've never, I've always thought this like, and you, you probably heard me say this before, how I think one of my, one of my posts or whatever is women need security.
00:13:09.800They want that security because of the way that they, that women evolved.
00:14:52.020I'd give you a barrel and you'd negotiate.
00:14:54.420I'll give you three chickens for a barrel.
00:14:55.820And that would be the deal sort of thing.
00:14:57.940But at some point, maybe chickens aren't re, you know, like reproducing.
00:15:01.760There was also a lot of perishable items, um, foods, for example, like corn, hay and stuff like that, which would not store.
00:15:08.260And you couldn't barter with something that had gone bad.
00:15:11.980So what you would do is they created, um, a form of value to store, which really started out with gold and silver.
00:15:18.420And like, you know, they'd kind of make it into chunks and they would trade with that, which eventually turned into paper money and credit and so on and so forth to today.
00:15:26.100So all that money really is, is it's a representation.
00:15:29.580It's a store of some value that you've created.
00:15:32.240So if I were to have accumulated a certain value of money for selling barrels to the Tomasi clan and selling barrels to the stone clan, for example, um, that would represent me manufacturing a shitload of barrels, improving their lives.
00:15:48.800And they would give me some sort of store of value in exchange for that money.
00:15:53.300So that's what it is just to kind of break that down.
00:15:55.620It's a simple term because a lot of people get very upset when you start talking about money, rich, you're out of touch.
00:16:00.760There's no way I can be a millionaire.
00:16:03.080I've heard all kinds of stories from people and excuses that they make up as far as, um, you know, money being evil and money is not an evil thing.
00:16:11.840Um, you can't have, I mean, it's very, very difficult with some exceptions with, you know, cocaine, drug dealers and stuff like that.
00:16:18.800Um, that may have been more evil people, but it's very, very difficult for you to acquire wealth and money, uh, and be evil at the same time.
00:16:30.920And, um, he does some impressive things in the world today.
00:16:34.700Now that he's retired from Microsoft, um, he's finding ways to get rid of raw sewage and developing countries to reduce and eliminate, um, you know, diseases that transmit very easily with.
00:17:09.860It brings you the ability to solve problems.
00:17:13.020I mean, a guy with a few million dollars versus a guy that's working in a secure job at a factory or something like that doesn't have the same medical options as a guy like Bill Gates would.
00:17:24.660For example, Bill Gates has far more opportunities to solve, um, a terminal illness diagnosis than somebody working his secure job.
00:17:33.500So you got to look at it from that perspective.
00:17:36.220It gives you the flexibility to do things that a lot of other people can't do because you can buy, uh, solutions to problems that you have.
00:17:43.920You can also, you know, I mean, if things bring you happiness, like for me, cars bring me happiness, right?
00:18:07.600It's the experiences at the end of the day, uh, that people remember when they're on their deathbed.
00:18:12.400They don't care about the Lamborghini they've got in the garage, but what they will remember is when they drove 7,000 miles across the U S, uh, and spent, you know, all that money to do the gold rush rally.
00:18:25.160And they went on to all these monuments and places and had those experiences and the nightclubs and the dinners and the exclusive access parties and all that sort of stuff.
00:18:50.220I've had my, my impression of money change over the years.
00:18:55.780Um, I, particularly when I went from sort of the work a day world into, okay, I need to find projects to, to make money to like, I want to be my own boss.
00:19:08.620I don't want to work for other people anymore.
00:19:11.200I had to change my mind about it because I think that when you're in sort of the nine to five work a day world, you are, you're not playing, like you said, you're not playing to win.
00:19:23.100These are people who want to just go in, put in their 40 hours a week and come back home and, and do whatever it is that be comfortable to whatever.
00:19:30.160Um, there was a time where I would have been, I would have been somewhat like that.
00:19:36.900I've always, because I'm an artist and I want to make things.
00:19:39.260And so to make things and to create things, I have to have the money to do that.
00:19:43.820I have to have some way of, of facilitating the things that I want to do.
00:19:51.000Uh, cause I wanted to be a rock star, right?
00:19:52.940When I was, when I was younger and my dad said, okay, well try to be a rock star.
00:19:57.100But, uh, why don't you, one, you get a job and, and bust your ass and then you do a, be a rock star and that'll be a project or that'd be something on the side.
00:20:50.760Um, well I traded it in, but the Hummer's like next to you go to a dealer and they don't give you jack shit.
00:20:56.200Um, but, um, but I paid for the car outright and I won't tell you exactly what it was, but it was, put it this way in my work a day life.
00:21:08.120Like, well, you know, if I was, when I was in my, my twenties, had I been like, you know, uh, even 30, 31 years old or so, I would have, I couldn't have dreamed of having a car like this much less pay for it outright.
00:21:21.800And I've, I've, I've reached a point in my life where I'm like, why, you know, why, why have a car payment?
00:21:29.820You know, if I don't have to have a car payment, why not?
00:21:45.740And I, I catch myself doing this occasionally too.
00:21:48.660Cause like when I, when I sold my house in Florida, there was a time where I like, I'll go and buy the house in Florida and it's because I want to have that house.
00:21:57.920And so I had to change my mind about it.
00:21:59.560It's like, it's not impossible to have two houses.
00:22:01.620It's not impossible to, to, you know, to, if you just think about money in a different fashion.
00:22:07.460And that's, I think that's really one of the hardest things for people to realize.
00:22:11.100And then I was answering that question by, by Dr. Sean Smith.
00:22:14.340And I said this, and people thought I was like smoking crack or something, but I said, look, money is currency.
00:22:20.140And that is, of course we call it currency, like money.
00:22:23.080We, you know, whatever, you know, currency converter and stuff like that.
00:22:28.180Because it's a current, because it's like an electrical current.
00:22:31.100You need that currency to make things happen, to turn the light on, to turn the computer on, to do whatever.
00:22:37.820There has to be some kind of underlying current, some kind of, some form of energy or whatever you want to call it.
00:22:43.700In this case, it's electricity, right?
00:22:45.220There has to be a current so that you can make something happen.
00:22:48.940And that's when I sort of changed my mind about money.
00:22:50.900When I started seeing it as not some kind of like, you know, impossible thing to get or something to like obsess over.
00:22:57.480But to use it as a raw material or use it as the raw energy to turn on the light, to make this project happen, to buy this car, to start another business, to hire somebody to help me out with something, to like, how do I get things done?
00:23:13.120And I used to worry about having no money.
00:23:18.020But once you get to a point where you can, you're confident in your capacity to generate money, then even when you get zeroed out, and we've talked about that a million times, even when you get zeroed out financially, and you can be zeroed out in a lot of different ways, you can certainly be zeroed out financially.
00:23:32.380Well, you need money to deal with that too.
00:23:35.880Like, if you ever get zeroed out, you need financial resources to solve that problem.
00:23:40.200It could come in the form of legal issues.
00:23:42.380It could come in the form of you need a large sum of cash to deal with a problem, right?
00:24:30.840Well, I got to have money to create things.
00:24:32.200I got to keep the lights on so that I can go and do what I want to do.
00:24:35.800So to me, money is necessary for happiness.
00:24:40.580Now, I could find other ways to be happy, of course, but like me as a person, I think really what it comes down to is what is it that makes you happy?
00:24:59.640Well, not going to buy you the happiness, but it can fund the things that you like to do, that you can do, that can better the world.
00:25:06.860Anybody that ever said money doesn't buy you happiness never had any.
00:25:09.820That's really what it always boils down to.
00:25:11.600And it's people who want to find, and I wanted to get to this really quick, is people want to find contentment.
00:25:18.400That's the whole thing, is people think that you, that-
00:25:21.780I don't think that contentment is enough, though, because contentment, when I hear somebody say, well, I just want to be content, again, that's playing not to lose.
00:25:29.040Playing to win is anti-fragility in my estimation.
00:25:32.260You need to lean into a position where you're anti-fragile, and one of the things that you need to be anti-fragile is money, because it can deal with a lot of problems for you.
00:26:00.880Well, and why do we think of that negatively?
00:26:03.440Because those people are dealing with discontent in a destructive fashion, in a manner that doesn't build something.
00:26:09.440You can deal with discontent creatively, or you can deal with it destructively.
00:26:13.260And most people, unfortunately, opt for the destructive thing, because they don't believe that they have the capacity to generate money, to be happy, to do the things that they want to do.
00:26:24.400And so they're discontent in a manner that is self-destructive, as opposed to constructive.
00:26:29.980The minute you can look in the mirror and be happy with what you see, you're sunk.
00:26:34.800Because even after I got my degree, even after I got to the point where I am today, I'm always thinking, what's the next project?
00:26:49.240I'm going to do this fourth book, and then I'm going to move on to writing fiction after that and see if I can do that, because that's something that I want to do.
00:26:57.060And so I think it's important for guys to, first of all, accept that there's no such thing as contentment, and there's no such thing as security.
00:27:05.720So if those are the constants for you, what are you going to do in that environment?
00:27:10.880What are you going to do with that being your reality?
00:27:14.000Well, you can either kick ass, or you can sort of just hope that things are – you can allow life to happen to you, or you can happen to life.
00:28:41.440And, like, not have people bring you down and just be able to keep on doing it without people – without other people dictating how you feel about something.
00:29:03.580There was a time, and I don't think I was quite as young as you, but there was a time where I really thought that other people's opinions of me mattered, right?
00:29:15.060And here's the God's honest truth is we do believe that.
00:29:19.160I think as social animals, as human beings, we want people to approve of us.
00:29:28.060Human beings tend to be more – well, of course, we're naturally, innately tribalistic, so we want to feel like we fit in.
00:29:33.880But it's when you start beating yourself up over that kind of stuff and over-exaggerating that into your own ego because what right now is you're very – it sounds to me anyway, so you can correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me that you're very ego-invested in the opinions of other people right now, of other guys.
00:29:52.600And that's real easy to do in high school.
00:29:54.760I understand that because you only know – you've only got one social circle, and you're kind of locked into that localized social circle.
00:30:04.520So the first thing is you have to understand that you live in a very big world, not just that little small world right there.
00:30:11.780So you can go – you could go today, and like let's just say I picked you up from wherever you're living right now, and I took you 100 miles to the next city over.
00:30:20.380You can basically decide I'm not going to be Niall today.
00:30:26.900And you could completely create this new persona for you, and other people would still – would relate to you as such, right?
00:30:34.260So when you think about it, like when you are dealing with other people, when you're dealing with like social situations, you are who you say you are.
00:30:45.420Like what is it about yourself that like – is there something in you that you want to change that you think other people would like you better because of that?
00:30:54.540Or is it just like something that you're just beating yourself up over?
00:31:01.420So just to add to that, when you care too much about what other people think about you – because this is like a show about chasing excellence and playing a win.
00:31:12.300Anybody that is on a path in their life where they're putting their dent in the universe, they're making bank, they're solving problems, they've always got critics.
00:31:21.900They've always got somebody trying to bring them down.
00:31:23.740I mean I've constantly got people trying to bring me down.
00:31:26.460They make hit pieces on me on YouTube because they've got nothing better to do with their time, right?
00:31:29.780So people will always aim at you when they think that they will benefit in some way from disparaging you, right?
00:31:37.780They think that by bringing you down, it brings them up.
00:31:41.380And the other thing that you always got to remember is hate never comes from somebody better than you.
00:31:45.280Hate always comes from somebody beneath you.
00:31:47.980People never get jealous of losers, right?
00:32:14.600And you're always going to have these crabs in the bucket, my friend.
00:32:19.080They want to bring you back down to their level.
00:32:21.360And if you find yourself, you know, surrounded by these people that are bringing you down, it's upon you to remove them from your circle of influence.
00:32:30.680Like you're never going to play to win if you, you know, hang around with a bunch of turkeys on the ground.
00:32:35.420You want to soar like an eagle, you got to get up at altitude and hang out with the other eagles, right?
00:32:41.440You know, I'll tell you, I'll just leave you with one other thing.
00:32:43.740There was a time in my life, I was about 16 years old.
00:32:46.600And there was a, like for a long time, I really wanted to make my dad proud.
00:32:52.520And then I realized that it doesn't matter whether I make him proud or not.
00:32:57.240And I wasn't, like I was trying to influence the way that somebody else thought about me rather than being focused on what it is I was doing, what my project was at that time.
00:33:09.420And, you know, what it is like building on me.
00:33:12.680And it took me a long time to come to this conclusion is that I needed to make myself my mental point of origin.
00:33:18.280And I think that's where you need to start.
00:33:20.420I wish somebody would have told me this when I was 14 years old.
00:33:24.740This is some gold shit here right now.
00:33:26.800Now, when you are thinking, when you, like one of the reasons why you beat yourself up is because you do not make yourself your mental point of origin.
00:33:34.340Now, people think that when I say that, that I mean, oh, you just need to make yourself number one or you need to be the prize or whatever.
00:33:42.120Yeah, but here's the thing is you need to get to the point where when you are faced with a decision that your first thought that enters into your brain is how is this going to affect me?
00:33:58.680How is this going, how is whatever's coming in from the outside world, how does this affect me and what am I going to do with all of this?
00:34:06.900Because most people and probably yourself right now, their first inclination, their first thought is how is this going to affect my family?
00:34:21.600What are they going to think of me if I do this too?
00:34:23.460What are they going to think of me if I do this or what, you know, and that's their first thought rather than.
00:34:28.160You'd be surprised how little people think of you.
00:34:31.720People, people really spend very little time thinking about you and your choices because they're so like, especially women, because they're so solipsistic, like all they, you know, they can't see past their own nose.
00:34:42.560So a lot of the times we spend way too much time thinking, oh, what's somebody going to think of me if I do this or if I walk away from this event or if I quit that or, you know, if I don't go here or if I don't show up on time with a gift in hand sort of thing, what are they going to think of me?
00:37:12.140So, but I think that with taking a degree or becoming a pilot, that's because I'm afraid of taking the risk, and that's kind of playing to lose.
00:39:15.120You know, it's a pretty good job, right?
00:39:16.480But, you know, you don't have any clarity around what you want to do with football, but you have purpose behind the skincare product line to solve acne for young people.
00:39:27.220That's the one that I would lean into.
00:39:53.860Put it this way, would you be satisfied to be in that, in a support role rather than playing football?
00:40:00.060Because playing football is a whole lot different than, like, managing a team or, you know, whatever it is that you're doing.
00:40:05.480So, the first one is your fantasy, or excuse me, the first one is your passion.
00:40:08.900The second one is your fantasy, because you, you think that it, it's, it's intriguing, right?
00:40:14.540It's fascinating to, to be a pilot, but in the reality, in the real world, being a, being a pilot is really kind of, you know, that you get more money, of course.
00:40:24.600But you're, you're, like Rich said, you're, it's almost a cubicle job because you're sitting in the, it really in a cubicle.
00:40:30.040So, and then third, I think this is really more your purpose, is your purpose is you, you, you've seen a problem and you want to create a solution for that problem.
00:40:40.460So, I would, I'm going to go with Rich here as well.
00:40:42.280I would say the, doing the skincare thing and starting a business and that, I mean, that's going to take some, some balls, but at least you're going to have, you'll be doing something that you have a purpose behind and that you feel like you, like, that's why I wrote the books, right?
00:40:55.800Because I wanted to help guys from, you know, killing themselves.
00:41:01.240And then, you know, I'll, yeah, well, thank you.
00:41:04.180But I, I, I try to always with everything I do, even with the book, I try to unite all of those things, like your passion, your fantasy and your, and your actual purpose, right?
00:41:15.440Like they tell you, you know, if you do the things you like that you'll never work a day in your life.
00:41:19.500Well, okay, but is that being secure or is that being, is that taking risks because you want to play to win, win life?
00:41:28.300Or is that just because you want to be secure and where you're at?
00:41:31.380And again, it goes back to what I was saying before is there's no such thing as contentment.
00:41:34.820So just because like you start a business on like, you know, helping guys solve acne problems or something, a skincare kind of thing, that doesn't mean that you're not going to later start another business that might also be just as purposeful.
00:41:49.900But I think right now that's probably your best option.
00:41:53.380But what I found is like, I, like I said, I was telling Rich before I go from project to project to project and it is, it's just the doing, I think like, no, I never, I didn't set out to become a brand man.
00:42:08.060I didn't go to school to be a brand manager for liquor brands or, or to be a writer.
00:42:12.920I certainly, I didn't major in English, but it's something that I did.
00:42:19.260I'm, I'm where I'm at right now because I got out there and I started doing stuff that, you know, that either I had a purpose for, I felt passionate about.
00:42:26.880I just want to say one more thing before I let you go.
00:42:29.080And this is going to be a very unpopular opinion.
00:42:31.260I know I'm going to ruffle some feathers, but I tend to do that.
00:42:35.240Um, if, if you go and pursue something in football, let's say, I don't know, assistant coach, maybe you coach a certain element of the game.
00:42:45.300Maybe you're doing something with stadiums.
00:42:48.880Um, that, that wouldn't be nearly as close to playing to win as creating a successful skincare line for teenagers that solves acne simply because the guy that's playing to win in football is on the pitch and is the captain of the team.
00:43:06.040So, um, you might find some happiness and some interest and success in it.
00:43:10.780But one of the, one of the things that I noticed a lot about people that watch sports a ton is they're watching other people playing to win.
00:43:18.700And they're often, you know, sitting behind a screen yelling at the TV, um, you know, with their buddies drinking beer and pretend, um, that's a really, that's a really, that's a really good observation because for all of those, for the, uh, the, the football side of things.
00:43:35.080And the pilot, you are beholden to other people, you are working for someone else, right?
00:43:41.920You're not in a, a position of being able to direct, you're not in a position of power.
00:43:46.880The guy that, the guy that plays to win is on the podium and the, and the podium winner gets all of the eyeballs, right?
00:44:32.860Um, so basically my question comes down to, um, I have to set the scene a little bit.
00:44:38.740Um, I'm 19 right now, about to turn 20.
00:44:41.100Um, I'm working as a waiter and I work for my parents' office and they're both doctors and not happy in doing either job, basically dealing with people all the time.
00:44:50.360Um, even though I'm learning how to deal with people, I definitely want to start my own business.
00:44:55.040Um, I went to school for, I went to college for a year, but I dropped out.
00:45:34.480Um, I, I think that, uh, as I was telling Frederick before, um, getting out there and doing something, just because you set out to do one thing doesn't mean it doesn't lead to something else.
00:45:46.480Um, this is what I, my daughter is 21 years old and this is what I've told her from the beginning.
00:45:51.320It's like, I didn't set out to be an author.
00:46:35.440And so you had to go and hand out flyers to everybody who was on the Hollywood strip or for, you know, you'd put them up on wherever you were, you know, you put them up on phone poles and stuff like that.
00:46:44.660To, to let everybody know, because there was no internet and you couldn't do that.
00:46:47.760So you had to build a following, like literally from grassroots.
00:46:51.580Well, what I did was I started doing, I was using my artistic talents to make these flyers.
00:46:56.600And what happened is other bands saw my flyers and they're like, dude, come over and do my flyer.
00:47:12.820And so I had that then when I got into later on and I was in a university, that was my, it was very obvious for me that I was going to get a BFA.
00:47:22.020And I wanted to, I wanted to use it in some capacity because I knew I was creative and I, I've used my creative talent in so many different ways, like visual talent, you know, or I can do video work.
00:47:35.000I can do, um, you know, I can paint, I can sculpt, I can, there's lots of things that I can do creatively.
00:47:42.860So if you are a creative individual, don't think that you're only locked into one, one area.
00:47:49.820I mean, if you're, if you're a virtuoso, if you're Eddie Van Halen, if you're like a virtuoso musician, yeah, folk go where your strengths are.
00:47:57.320But if you're a creative person, you can use that creative talent in a lot of different ways.
00:48:02.380So find out what, find out what the ways that you, that, you know, a lot of times people will just tell you, look, you know, your, your talents are right here.
00:48:09.980You're a great, I can, I'll tell you this right now.
00:48:12.060Just from looking at what, what, uh, Rich has in his wall back there.
00:48:15.740You're passionate about it enough that you wanted to go and spend that.
00:48:18.480Did you hand ink that ink that or how, how did you do that?
00:48:58.180Like you, you could create graphic work that you could upload to YouTube or you'll press the same upload button that PewDiePie presses, that Rollo Tomasi presses, that I press, right?
00:49:34.140I mean, the reason why I put the stuff behind, you know, behind the paywall and Colson's one of the guys behind the paywall, by the way, he's in my men's community.
00:49:41.100Um, is because I can better organize the content that, you know, that I present.
00:49:44.620So, you know, there's, there's like a sequence of things that you can drip out as an artist behind a paywall.
00:49:50.820I have a guy that I, uh, coached a couple of years ago and he was a musician in, I think either Argentina or Chile, um, Queen's Tongue.
00:50:00.480So I think he was either from Australia or New Zealand, maybe South Africa.
00:50:03.840I can't remember, but, um, he ran this, uh, YouTube channel and he did, um, music for jazz.
00:50:10.780Um, and when I started him out, he was like about 1900 subs and he's at like well over 140,000 now.
00:50:19.560And because of the stuff that he was putting out, he gave away lots of good free stuff again as an artist, but he put stuff behind a paywall that, that people could collaborate with him on.