Playing to Win - 004 - Winners Never Quit, and Quitters Never Win

00:00:00.240 Does my audio sound good? We good? Yeah, your audio sounds awesome, man. That's, you know,

00:00:03.880 it's a kickoff statement for our live broadcast. What's up, Jay? How you doing, brother? Richard,

00:00:10.060 man, it's an honor and privilege to be here. And I'm very excited to share my story. And I

00:00:14.480 appreciate the opportunity, man. Yeah, thanks for carving out some time. It's always it's always

00:00:18.840 fun. You know, last time I saw you in person, I was I was in LA in September with my daughter

00:00:23.380 doing a daddy daughter kind of retreat. And we, you know, we connected and there were some little

00:00:26.960 ears at the table. So we didn't talk about too much of the stuff that we're going to get into

00:00:30.120 tonight. It's true. But yeah, like I really want to dive down this rabbit hole of like the playing

00:00:35.000 to win story of Jay Campbell, because you're like around the same age as me, you're just a little

00:00:39.400 bit older, even though you look a lot younger, damn you. I don't know about that. But I mean,

00:00:44.460 like your whole story about a lot of the obstacles and roadblocks that kind of dropped in your way

00:00:51.120 actually became the way for you. You know, the whole notion of this series that I'm doing on my

00:00:55.400 channel playing to win is really there's, there's two ways guys can play in life, you know, we can

00:00:59.540 play to win or we can play not to lose. And to clarify, I'm a big advocate of guys, especially in

00:01:05.200 their younger years, 20s and 30s, aiming to play to win in their lives, like taking bigger risks,

00:01:10.100 because the ROI and the payoff will be exceptionally higher, there's going to be a number of times,

00:01:14.480 it's just not going to work out too. But there's also the playing not to lose component, which

00:01:18.580 at some point in your life, you're going to pivot when you've done really well, you've taken the

00:01:23.320 risks, you've, you know, you've 100x, whatever it was that you're doing, and you need to kind of

00:01:27.640 pay play a little bit more defensively. But you still have maybe like a 5x return, which is still

00:01:33.160 pretty, pretty decent. But I want to kind of, I don't know, like, where do you want to start this

00:01:37.680 story, man? Because like, you've got, you've got quite an interesting thing going on. I mean,

00:01:41.440 like I met you, like I was introduced to you, as an optimization guy, when I was first looking at

00:01:47.480 testosterone replacement therapy. I don't know how your name came up. But it was like,

00:01:52.540 yeah, you need to talk to this guy. And then we connected, we did a few broadcasts,

00:01:56.760 we did some private product, you know, broadcast from our community. And I've always known you as

00:02:00.380 like the testosterone optimization guy, but you're a lot more than that. Like you're an entrepreneur,

00:02:04.880 you've done a lot of, you've done a lot of, like, interesting and strange things in some cases.

00:02:11.020 Emphasis on strange, for sure.

00:02:13.540 And I mean, like, you're a bit of a biohacker, too, right? I mean, like, in a sense, it's a lot

00:02:17.240 different from, I mean, I see guys like Ben Greenfield doing stem cell injections in his dick,

00:02:22.300 sort of thing, right? And you know, you like you kind of lean into like an era, like a decade and

00:02:27.720 a half a little bit ahead of him for like the more, I'm not going to say older guy, I'm gonna

00:02:32.500 say more seasoned guy.

00:02:33.860 No, for sure. I am the older guy, though. Yeah. And that's an honor, man. I mean, Ben and I are

00:02:37.320 friends. I know you guys are friends, too. And I appreciate that. In fact, actually, I have a big

00:02:42.200 shout out. And Ben's book coming because his PR company just let me know he said his his book coming,

00:02:48.500 by the way, Boundless. I've read the intro. And, you know, kind of a little bit of the first

00:02:54.080 chapter, which is what they're giving out to his friends and insiders and whatnot. It is absolutely

00:02:58.480 amazing. This book is this book is epic, dude. Yeah, he's. Yeah, that'll be a good read. So I'll

00:03:04.060 definitely grab that one. But yeah. So what's the Batman origin story of Jay Campbell? Like you were

00:03:09.940 the oldest of nine kids growing up in a highly religious home from what I gathered.

00:03:15.500 Yeah, dude, totally. Yeah, kick it off from there. Yeah, sure. Extremely Roman Catholic. My mom and

00:03:21.960 dad were, you know, they came from my dad came from like Appalachian mountain trash. Truthfully,

00:03:29.220 you know, we call it Appalachian hardscrabble. He was the first in his family to go to college. His

00:03:33.900 dad was like a seventh grade, you know, sixth or seventh grade education. It was a sales guy. And

00:03:37.780 his mom was like a ruthless homemaker. And he was very, very. How do I say it? You know,

00:03:44.840 he was a go getter. And as when he went to high school and stuff like that, he was like a three

00:03:48.900 star, you know, three sports star. And he was also the valedictorian of his high school class. So he

00:03:53.380 was like, you know, a guy who took care of business. He met my wife. My mom was a beautiful

00:03:58.640 woman who went to the University of Kentucky. She dropped out. They're from northern Kentucky,

00:04:03.000 by the way, Cincinnati area. And they started having kids, man. And my mom actually gave birth of one

00:04:08.240 before me. And his name was Christopher J. And he died essentially of SIDS or it's stillborn or

00:04:13.180 whatever you want to call it. And they named me after him. And then she ended up having

00:04:17.060 damn dude, nine more, eight more kids, six boys and three girls. So what's that like being the oldest

00:04:21.800 of like that many children? Like too many guys that have that many siblings. Like I got, I know Pat

00:04:28.000 Campbell. I think he's like one of 11 or something like that. It's a ton. Yeah. Pat and I know each

00:04:32.740 other. We're probably, we're probably related somewhere, but, uh, dude, it was crazy. I mean,

00:04:38.460 you know, um, there was never a dull moment, you know, you're, you're, you're with, so it was three

00:04:43.760 of us in a row back to back all year apart. And then my mom and dad took two year break and then

00:04:48.200 they have my sister and then two more brothers back to back. And then I'm sorry, a sister and then a

00:04:54.080 two year break and then three more boys in a row. And then they took a little bit more of a break and

00:04:57.640 had two more daughters. But I mean, bro, I mean, until I was 18 years old, I was changing diapers,

00:05:02.000 doing clothes, you know, loads of wash, making food for my brothers and sisters, my siblings.

00:05:08.460 Um, it was a very interesting, you were like the household assistant, right? Like that's usually

00:05:12.680 the oldest was such a large family too. Exactly brother. And my dad was ascending the corporate

00:05:18.780 ladder. I mean, he had nine miles to feed, right? So he was traveling and really not around. And

00:05:24.380 I tell people, and this is, you know, at the time I couldn't stand my parents for this, but

00:05:29.400 you know, I love them now and respect them for who they are and what they did. It's truly

00:05:34.020 amazing accomplishment. But, um, I was in five high schools in five States in four years,

00:05:40.540 right? So I was the new guy literally every single year. So I was leaving girlfriends, friends,

00:05:47.660 athletic, um, you know, competitors and peers behind. And so I started in New York, went to

00:05:53.500 Pennsylvania from Pennsylvania, went to Ohio from Ohio, went to Georgia. And then before my senior

00:05:58.660 year was over, my dad actually moved again to Clearwater, Florida. And again, he was ascending

00:06:03.400 the corporate ladder of the businesses that he was in, which was kind of newspaper media marketing.

00:06:07.760 Uh, but it was, it was, it was, you know, at the time it was a difficult high school and childhood

00:06:13.660 and stuff like that, but it truly prepared me to be the person that I became. And also even was

00:06:19.880 because I was able to build relationships with people easy. Right. It was like, it was do or die

00:06:24.160 everywhere I went. You said, um, in some of your notes to me that your, that your household was

00:06:29.080 like highly religious. Like what was that like growing up? Cause I remember in my household,

00:06:32.740 like my, my dad kind of leaned into this Jehovah's witness thing for about three or four years,

00:06:38.540 which created a ton of conflict between my parents. Cause my mom's side of the family was

00:06:42.660 like Greek Orthodox. Right. Right. And, and then they just kind of both gave up on it. Cause it was

00:06:47.080 just too much to deal with. Uh, and then they both like lean back into religion in the later years.

00:06:51.480 It seems like that's what most people tend to do when they're kind of trying to reconcile,

00:06:55.140 you know, the autumn years of their lives sort of thing. But what was that like for you? Cause I

00:06:59.740 mean, you're not that religious today. You're more spiritual. You're kind of like a woo. And I'm not

00:07:04.080 saying this to be disparaging or to make funny, but you're more of like a woo woo kind of like crystal

00:07:08.580 guy. Right. Exactly. Not in a, not in a psychopath way. Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, you're exactly right.

00:07:14.400 It's well said. Yeah. So Roman Catholic, you know, people would ask my dad when he was,

00:07:18.820 when we were growing up, he's Mr. Campbell, you have nine kids. Are you rich? And he would say,

00:07:22.460 yeah, I'm rich in kids. So, but, uh, yeah, just like, uh, you know, every Sunday, my parents weren't

00:07:28.460 like making us go to church every day, but I mean, you know, I went to Catholic school, uh, up until I

00:07:33.980 was a sophomore in high school. So yeah, I was in mass every day, dude, literally, you know, confession,

00:07:39.040 you know, first communion, you know, all that stuff. I mean, I, I've suppressed all that stuff.

00:07:44.540 I have a very funny story from my last year in ninth grade when I was in, uh, uh, Utica,

00:07:50.140 New York, upstate New York. I was at, um, Notre Dame high school. And one of my professors was,

00:07:55.500 our professors teachers was a priest. He was an Anglican priest and, uh, he spoke Latin and I was

00:08:00.700 in a class of Latin. Remember the days of being in Latin, Richard, Canada, we did French, but can you

00:08:07.240 imagine the kids of today, if they actually had to go to Latin class and give me a break. But, uh,

00:08:11.120 I just remember him telling me a story and this is when I really turned my back on organized

00:08:15.860 religion, but he said that he was seeking everything. And he climbed to the top of a

00:08:20.900 pyramid. He was in this group with a bunch of people as a, as a priest. And he, when he got to

00:08:25.020 the top, he was expecting to see the light, right. Divine salvation. And he finds Bedouins selling Pepsi.

00:08:33.100 So he was like, uh, I remember telling me the story, like everyone in the classroom,

00:08:38.100 this is the story he told. And that was when I was like, okay, organized religion and me are not

00:08:41.700 going to get along. Yeah. Yeah. I had a hard time with that too. I mean, yeah. Okay. So, um,

00:08:47.500 talk to me about like the formative years after school. Cause I mean, you got into basketball,

00:08:51.920 like you're a big guy. I mean, you can't tell by the video, but you're at least as tall as I am.

00:08:55.420 And you're built like a brick shithouse and you're ripped too. Um, but like, like how did you get

00:09:00.480 into athletics and talk about kind of like the transition from there? Sure, man. So I was always a

00:09:06.300 really competitive athlete. Uh, my dad was actually, again, a road scholar. So it was like a

00:09:10.480 lot to look up to, uh, live up to. Um, so I played basketball and baseball in high school. And

00:09:15.200 truthfully, I was really, really, really good in basketball, but because back then they didn't

00:09:20.840 have like the recruiting budgets and the video and all this tough tech they have today. Um, as I kept

00:09:25.800 moving, I would fall behind from a recruiting standpoint. So I was offered, or at the time when I

00:09:31.080 was a junior in Ohio, I was offered a bunch of schools, probably division one, I would have ended up

00:09:35.120 going, but then I had to move for my senior year again. And I ended up, thankfully I did get a

00:09:39.500 scholarship, um, to play division two at a school called Georgia Southwestern in America's Georgia.

00:09:44.140 Uh, they were a college then they're now a university in Georgia. Uh, and I did play,

00:09:48.560 you know, I played, uh, for three years and my ankles just broke down and, uh, that stopped playing.

00:09:54.800 And then, you know, I graduated from college in 1993. Um, and I moved out to Southern California

00:10:00.200 and I stopped playing really dude for a while just because I was burned. And, uh, then I started

00:10:05.380 picking it up again, playing about four years later, I started playing a really competitive

00:10:08.960 adult men's leagues. I was probably like 26 or 27. And that kind of led me to the origin story of

00:10:14.480 like, you know, who I, how I became like the TRT testosterone optimization guy. Cause I got kicked

00:10:19.900 in the testicles, um, playing in a really competitive league. And, uh, you know, I didn't realize it.

00:10:25.220 I had no idea what was going on, but like three or four weeks later, I started to break down,

00:10:28.800 got really tired. It was achy. My lower back was bothering me. It was really bad. And so I was

00:10:33.420 lucky, dude, I went to a PPO doctor. Uh, this was, I was 29 years old, by the way. And, uh,

00:10:38.540 he referred me to an endocrinologist guy ended up being a Harvard educated or Harvard trained and

00:10:43.720 educated endocrinologist, Dr. Raymond Scruggs, who worked at the new help, uh, health Institute out

00:10:49.500 here in Los Angeles. And, um, you know, he said to me, he ran tests and he's like, dude, you got the

00:10:53.760 testosterone of a geriatric. And he's like, look, you know, I, I work with guys on this all the

00:10:58.640 time. And again, remember this is back in 1999. There were very few physicians. Again, I was in

00:11:04.100 the right place at the right time, but there's no coincidences, right? Cause look what ended up

00:11:08.040 happening from this. But, uh, he said, look, I can put you on a very low dose of therapeutic

00:11:11.240 testosterone, get you back to normal. You'll be, you know, right, right as rain within, you know,

00:11:15.940 eight to 10 weeks. And sure enough, that's exactly what happened. And then he was like, okay,

00:11:19.360 well, I'm going to take you off. I'm like, no, you're not taking me off, bro.

00:11:22.640 Yeah. Did they, did they try anything like Clomid or HCG to start up your system again?

00:11:27.160 No, this guy was so smart. I mean, he knew everything. I mean, he, you know, basically

00:11:31.180 gave me HCG along with it because he knew that I didn't have kids and that I wanted to maintain

00:11:35.820 fertility, but he was just like, nope, very low dose of therapeutic tasks. I think it was like

00:11:39.380 a hundred milligrams of siponate and, uh, you know, HCG three shots. So every other day, very low dose of

00:11:45.400 that too. So he was a brilliant doc. Um, and you know, I worked with him for a couple of years. He ended up

00:11:50.160 moving his office. He went down further down to orange County. And, um, you know, I ended up

00:11:54.980 moving to a closer doc where I was and, you know, I worked out, I don't know how many docs I've

00:11:58.760 working with. I don't even think about counting backup, but over the years, but you know, then

00:12:02.340 in the corporate world where I was at that time, which I was in the automotive digital marketing

00:12:06.200 space, people would just come up to me and they'd see in the shape I was in. They'd always be like,

00:12:10.660 dude, how do you stay in that type of condition? And I was very, you know, no filter,

00:12:14.460 Jay Campbell always telling the truth. Like, look, I use therapeutic testosterone. So

00:12:17.640 you'd always get one or two, right? You get the one guy be like, what the fuck, bro?

00:12:23.100 You're on steroids, bro. Or you get that people like you, right? Or smart people,

00:12:28.420 sophisticated. Who'd be like, interesting. Tell me more. And so I would always, you know,

00:12:32.920 have those types of people and I would tell them more. And, you know, eventually, obviously Mike,

00:12:36.160 you, you know, this Mike Cernovich and I were really good friends and he was like, dude,

00:12:39.920 you got to write a book about this. He's like, you know, more about this than anyone,

00:12:43.040 including doctors. And so fast at this point, cause well, fast forward.

00:12:47.020 Yeah. So I would say, I would say when Mike said that to me, I was around 30,

00:12:52.100 somewhere between 38 and 40, you know, and honestly the book, as you know, didn't come

00:12:56.080 out until 2015. So there were a lot of things that kind of got in the way of that. And,

00:13:00.280 you know, I've been very open about my story. When I first wrote the first white paper,

00:13:03.800 I sent it to Rick Collins, you know, who's probably the world's leading attorney now on all

00:13:08.080 that stuff. And I also sent it to Nelson Virgil. I sent it to Bill Llewellyn and it was one of the

00:13:12.940 guys sent it to, and actually so funny now Bill Llewellyn is one of my business partners, but

00:13:16.760 you know, they all saw it and they were all basically like, well, not Nelson, that's later

00:13:21.920 story. But, but you know, Rick Collins, Rick Collins is an amazing person, by the way. I love

00:13:26.300 Rick. Shout out to Rick, but he didn't know me from Adam. He read it. He was like, dude,

00:13:29.940 your book is sensational. He's like, but I can't guarantee you any kind of indemnification

00:13:34.940 from liability as a non-medical person writing a book about, you know, therapeutic testosterone.

00:13:39.120 You don't have a medical license. So it takes one person, as he would say, one Senator,

00:13:43.840 and you're going to be paying me $250,000, right. To stay out of jail. So I was like,

00:13:48.300 I'm shelving it. You know, at that time I was, you know, with my current wife, um, Monica Diaz,

00:13:54.580 Monica Campbell, actually is a real name. And now it's officially it'll be in a couple of days. But,

00:13:59.320 uh, well, I was like, no, I'm not going to touch it, dude. I don't want any of that heat. We have a

00:14:03.140 successful real estate business and brand don't going to touch it. And then, you know, fast forward

00:14:07.380 about three months, Nelson Virgil finally read it. And he was in Venezuela at the time when I sent

00:14:11.980 him the book and he was, he literally emailed me in the middle of the night. He's like, I don't know

00:14:15.480 who you are, but we got to talk. And, um, so I, you know, talk to him and he's like, look, man,

00:14:20.040 I'm on panels. I told him what Rick said. And he said, look, I'm on panels with the FDA and the DEA.

00:14:25.040 He's like, your book is sensational. Men have to read this book and don't worry about, you know,

00:14:30.340 Rick, he's just being a good attorney. That's what they do, but you need to put this book into the world.

00:14:34.680 Now that's a great example of the title of this series, right? Cause we're talking about playing

00:14:39.440 to win versus playing not to lose lawyers and accountants in my experience in business and in

00:14:44.520 life will always give you advice that will lead to you playing not to lose. Exactly. Right. You

00:14:49.580 might get a small return on the advice that they get. They usually keep you safe. They cross your

00:14:53.540 T's and dot the I's because I mean, their ass is on the line, right? Like they got to do these to kind

00:14:57.300 of protect your best interest when you hire them to do work for you. The advice you got from Nelson

00:15:01.700 was play to win, which is what you did. And that, and, and it's those risks that you take as a guy

00:15:07.840 in today's world that will leapfrog you into a new, a new level, a new category of, um, something,

00:15:15.760 you know, there's always, there's always doors that you, that you come up upon that you don't

00:15:19.940 even know that are there until you start playing to win. And then you kind of like walk up to something

00:15:24.300 you're like, Oh, let me open this one and see what's in it. And you'll walk through and you kind

00:15:27.480 of, you know, create this new path for yourself, which what's, which is kind of what turned you

00:15:30.960 into this new version of the optimization guy. Right. Yeah, no, a hundred percent. And, uh, yeah,

00:15:36.280 thank God for Nelson because nothing, you know, none of that, the book wouldn't have gone through.

00:15:41.140 Right. And then obviously subsequently that book came out in November of 2015. Um, and Mike and I

00:15:46.660 were, what is that guy doing right now, by the way, Nelson? Oh, you know, he's, yeah, he's great. I mean,

00:15:51.780 he's got a big forum that he runs. It's a Excel mail and he also owns a discounted labs.com. So

00:15:58.200 he's, you know, he's an awesome dude. Um, he does some consulting I'm sure for other people and stuff

00:16:02.660 like that, but, uh, he was a very powerful mentor to me at the time that I really needed it. Uh, him

00:16:07.940 and I have, you know, kind of gone our separate paths. I mean, I know I can reach out to him if I

00:16:11.320 needed to, but he's a great person and I, you know, I never ever speak. I saw a couple of his videos

00:16:16.420 that encouraged me to start using, uh, testosterone and HCG in the same pin. Yeah. I got tired of doing

00:16:24.060 so many free pins. I just kind of followed that protocol for a bit and that worked really well

00:16:27.980 as well. So I just curious about what he was up to. No. Well, listen, Nelson is a pioneer. I mean,

00:16:32.020 let me throw a shout out to him. I mean, this is a man who literally was, you know, again,

00:16:35.560 as I always say, stepping on the shoulders of giants, but I mean, this was a man who used therapeutic

00:16:39.320 testosterone to survive, right? Like he wrote his book with Michael Mooney back in the nineties. And that was one of

00:16:45.740 the first books that I read to learn about this. Right. Cause when I first started using therapeutic

00:16:49.660 testosterone, there was nothing Russian and Bulgarian training manuals. Right. But like,

00:16:54.820 unless you could read Russian or translate Bulgarian, you weren't going to get much.

00:16:58.080 It was nothing on PubMed or Medline. What about Dan Duchesne? What did he write? The

00:17:03.660 so underground steroid handbook. So yeah, that one. Yeah. Yeah. So I read that book, of course. I mean,

00:17:08.860 I read pretty much, I mean, obviously, you know, I'm a prolific reader. You know, I've got a bookcase

00:17:13.260 over here against a wall that has over 800 books in it, but I, I mean, I just tore through anything

00:17:18.620 that had anything to do with utilizing therapeutic testosterone, anything around the realms of

00:17:24.160 performance enhancement or, you know, improvement because of what I felt in my first six to eight

00:17:29.020 months using testosterone, I was like, well, wait a minute, if people could do this, what about other

00:17:32.900 stuff? You know? So that's when I really, and this is in the early part of my thirties, this is on my

00:17:37.580 first wife, uh, to lead into where the story we're going to get to, to my second wife, who I have my two

00:17:42.600 beautiful daughters with before I met, you know, the greatest thing that ever happened to me, which

00:17:46.080 is Monica. Uh, but it was in my, you know, in my literally in my thirties, when I first started

00:17:51.700 using therapeutic testosterone, like you said, I was one of the world's probably first biohackers,

00:17:56.320 you know, no BS. In fact, the medical conference that I just came back from, um, AMMG over the

00:18:01.860 weekend, I met a doctor who kind of walked up to me. He's like, yeah, bro. He's like, it's just Dave

00:18:05.500 Asprey, Ben Greenfield and you, man. And I was kind of like, wow, I felt really distinguished to be

00:18:10.320 putting in that company. But I mean, there's other people that I owe, you know, shout outs to,

00:18:15.540 um, and I'm happy to mention their names, but dude, I was very studious of this. I read so much

00:18:20.960 research. I mean, as you know, both of my books, right. The manual and the Bible, I mean, every

00:18:25.560 single conceivable piece of peer reviewed data is in that books regarding the therapeutic benefits of

00:18:32.620 using testosterone. I mean, I left nothing out because I knew that I would be attacked and assailed as a

00:18:38.000 non, you know, licensed, you know, medical professional to be writing books like that.

00:18:44.080 Yeah. Um, here, I'm going to drop it in the chat. Cause I see you guys like we're going to try to

00:18:48.680 cover as much as possible tonight. I mean, we got 90 minutes scheduled for this, so we got plenty of

00:18:52.620 time and hopefully we'll have some, some time towards the end to take some questions, but I got

00:18:56.300 a link there that I'm going to post for Jay's, uh, books on testosterone replacement therapy and,

00:19:00.720 uh, peptides. We'll talk about peptides more in a bit and intermittent fasting, but you can check out

00:19:06.640 all that stuff over there. We'll get into more details there. I want to, I want to go back to the

00:19:10.120 story about the divorce. Cause you had a first marriage that like went completely sideways. Like

00:19:13.780 you had a kidnapping issue and all this stuff. And there was, um, you mentioned something about,

00:19:18.120 you know, like an attempted suicide moment for you as well. Yeah. So, um, so where do I start?

00:19:24.300 So, so actually she was my second marriage. So my first marriage and Richard, there's no

00:19:28.780 coincidences life. This is so amazing. Um, my first marriage is, it was to a woman by the name of

00:19:34.140 Kelly Hinsley. And she's an amazing person. I actually have spoken to her on the phone the last

00:19:38.000 two days and we were literally divorced in 2002. It's just a funny coincidence. We own a, we still

00:19:43.620 own a property in big bear, you know, the vacation resort area of California together. Um, and we had

00:19:50.220 another person through a, it's a long story, but anyway, I've never talked to her and her and I've

00:19:54.880 communicated in the last two days, but she was my first wife. Uh, and we were married for not even a

00:19:59.440 year and a half. And then I met my ex who again, gave me my daughters. And truthfully, when we met,

00:20:05.560 everything was great, man. Um, we didn't have children obviously. And, uh, I was very successful.

00:20:10.020 I worked as a, you know, I wasn't in real estate. I was, uh, I was in digital automotive. Um, so I

00:20:16.480 worked for Kelly blue book and I rose up the ladder. I was one of four guys that built the

00:20:21.880 dealer sales division at KBB from zero to literally like, I mean, massive amount of recurring

00:20:27.460 revenue a month. I don't want to quote, but somewhere between 20 and 30 million and three

00:20:31.280 years. So, you know, because we built it and we had like kind of an open-ended compensation

00:20:35.380 plan then, and my boss was a really cool guy, Joe Verneza, shout out to Joe. Um, we, we were

00:20:40.880 making a lot of money and first four or five years of making all that money, my ex and I

00:20:48.160 had a, you know, quote unquote, good relationship. Now looking back where I am, where I am spiritually

00:20:53.140 and consciously now, I mean, I was not a good person, Richard. You know, I was, as you

00:20:57.300 said before, and I've said to you before, I was essentially, fuck you pay me. I was very

00:21:01.380 ego driven. I was all about the money. I was all about, you know, getting the best deal,

00:21:06.900 the highest gross, you know, taking advantage of people as we used to say in the digital

00:21:10.360 automotive space, we'd say ripping people's heads off. Right. So, you know, that's what

00:21:14.460 I did. What is it? What is the digital automotive space entail? I'm not sure that I'm clear on

00:21:18.700 that. Yeah, sure. So yeah, just, yeah, for sure. I know you're a car guy. Um, just basically

00:21:22.840 being on the marketing side in the car business. So in the retail side, and you know, I, I built

00:21:27.580 a lot of relationships actually in the OEM side of the world too, but, uh, you know,

00:21:32.340 we built the dealer segment or dealer sales division for Kelly blue book, right. One digital,

00:21:40.120 you know, automotive blew up. Right. So you had, you had KBB.com and then you had auto trader

00:21:45.720 after it. And then you had, of course, Edmonds. And so like, those were the three biggest automotive

00:21:50.180 sites. So like, that's kind of the space and the stomping ground that I ran in. And, you

00:21:54.220 know, I met through that, through that relationship, I met pretty much anyone who was influential

00:21:57.980 on the, um, you know, the dealer side in the United States and really all over, even in

00:22:02.660 Canada and the United and Mexico too. Okay. So marriage starts to go sideways. What happened?

00:22:09.400 The money dried up. So, yeah, so exactly. So, um, so fast forward, we're married. We have

00:22:14.920 our first two children or only two children. And, uh, my first child was born when I was 37

00:22:19.220 and my second daughter. So Alexander is my first daughter. You met Gabrielle and my second

00:22:24.260 daughter. They're now 12 and 10 or they'll be 12 and 10. They're almost 12 and 10. They're

00:22:27.640 11 and nine, but they're almost 12 and 10. And, um, yeah, the recession hit right. 2008,

00:22:33.560 2009. Um, I was still actually doing really, really well, um, with Kelly blue book, even

00:22:40.120 during the first year and a half of the recession. But then in 2010, me and my boss and another

00:22:46.200 guy, um, they basically, they let us go and we didn't have any idea why they let us go. But then

00:22:51.960 a week later they announced the sale of the company to auto trader, right? So it was one of

00:22:55.620 those typical strategic corporate assassinations where you owe a guy a bunch of money in stock and

00:23:01.060 you owe a guy in salary and bonus and all that. And you're just like, you know, cutting and shedding,

00:23:04.680 um, salary. So that was in 2010. I literally, my daughter was just born. She was like three weeks

00:23:11.040 old. So it was a very shock to my system, but because I was, you know, very, very esteemed

00:23:16.300 in my industry. I took another gig literally within two months. I took a month off, um, to

00:23:21.780 be spend time with my daughter and stuff like that. But then, uh, we took another gig and

00:23:25.180 then that gig wanted me to move. I was living in Southern California still in Pasadena. They

00:23:29.400 wanted me to move to Vegas and this is in 2010, like in March. And, um, remember in 2010, that

00:23:35.080 was still, you know, very terrible economy, a lot of consolidation. I moved to Vegas. I sold my

00:23:40.120 house. I moved my family to Las Vegas. And within a month of taking that job, that company got bought

00:23:46.880 out and they liquidated their entire sales force. So I had like a, I think I was like the Western,

00:23:51.520 not Western. I think I was a national sales manager. I don't even remember. It's all blur.

00:23:55.420 And so I went from having an amazing job with Kelly blue book for nine years and making a lot,

00:23:59.380 like I was making close to half a million dollars a year, um, to having no job, you know,

00:24:05.320 or losing two jobs in a matter of six months. And I'd already now moved my family to Las Vegas.

00:24:12.360 And over the next year, year and a half, everything just went south, bro. Like you said,

00:24:17.840 struggle with income. Thankfully I had a ton of money saved up, but my ex was used to living a

00:24:22.880 very, very expensive life and extravagantly and all those other things. And again, I wasn't as,

00:24:28.880 I wasn't as frugal as I needed to be. We burned through money and you know, the next year and a half

00:24:34.060 living in the way we lived in Vegas. And we, you know, we lived in a really nice ritzy suburb,

00:24:38.600 um, in red rock country club, you know, nice gated community and everything went south and she

00:24:45.080 had an affair. And I was, by the way, I just full disclosure, if anybody watches this, um,

00:24:51.120 previous to my first daughter or my second daughter being bored, uh, my ex and I did not have sex and I

00:24:58.100 did cheat on her and I came clean and I admitted it to her. We even went to counseling over it. You know,

00:25:03.600 neither here nor there, both of us were at fault. And then after we went to counseling,

00:25:08.740 um, and the counselor said, you know, look, if you guys are going to save this, you guys got to

00:25:13.340 both take some responsibility and stuff. So I went through all that, but my ex, um, at the time

00:25:19.140 really never forgave me. And subsequently then she, at the end of our marriage was, um, was having an

00:25:25.900 affair with somebody very close to me, actually. Did she start, did she start banging this guy when the

00:25:31.020 money dried up or as the money was drying up? Like, like what, because I mean, there's a sound

00:25:35.660 bite, which comes up often and it's, uh, women don't care about the struggle. They hang out at

00:25:39.800 the finish line. Right. And I know that you're not deep into this space, but I mean, like I see this

00:25:45.360 happen in so many times in conversations. It's like, you know, you move to Vegas, the money dries up,

00:25:50.320 you know, stuff starts going sideways in the relationship. But like,

00:25:53.560 does that make any sense to you whatsoever? Like, can you look back on it in hindsight and be like,

00:26:01.760 oh yeah, now I see what happened sort of thing. Like, is the hindsight 2020 for you there?

00:26:05.660 Dude, it's a hundred percent. It makes sense. I mean, there's no question there's that there was

00:26:09.460 that element. Um, because I mean, at the end when everything, and I'll get to the story, but,

00:26:14.940 um, you know, I was, I back with back to, was it a Steve from accounting or Kevin from sales?

00:26:20.140 No, it wasn't anybody from my job. It was actually a guy, um, that trained with us,

00:26:26.680 um, at the gym, you know, it was a bro. So, uh, and honestly, like I've forgiven him and we'll get

00:26:32.300 to that, you know, this part of the show that I forgive everyone. I don't live in, you know,

00:26:35.420 with grudge or blame or judgment or any of that stuff. But, um, um, essentially I was doing better,

00:26:42.440 you know, at the time that it all happened, but again, it was a culmination of, you know,

00:26:46.460 her not forgiving me for what happened and then her, you know, falling in love, so to speak with

00:26:51.180 this next person and everything. But, you know, I'll just get to the story. I mean, this is, this

00:26:54.120 is November of 2011. And again, still living in Vegas, really, really nice house, you know,

00:26:59.700 giant house, essentially a palatial estate in a, in red rock country club in Las Vegas.

00:27:04.000 And I go away on a business trip to Chicago and I come back and, um, knock at the door,

00:27:11.940 you know, Las Vegas Metro PD, um, in the morning at like six o'clock in the morning, I'm sound asleep.

00:27:17.560 And, you know, they come in and they say, are you Jay Campbell? I'm like, yeah, I'm Jay Campbell.

00:27:20.620 And they're like, uh, Mr. Campbell, can we come in? I'm like, what's going on? You know,

00:27:23.660 it's one of those things. I'm fast forwarding the story because there's a lot. And, uh, you know,

00:27:27.600 they say, well, I don't think you understand the law of Nevada. And I'm like, uh, of course I

00:27:31.040 understand the law in Nevada. What are you talking about? And, um, then they say to me,

00:27:35.320 well, you know, your wife at the time called us last night and said, you beat her up and blah,

00:27:39.440 blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, you know, this was a domestic violence charge. Yeah, exactly.

00:27:44.780 So then they came in and you know, I'm like, what's going on? I mean, I'm out of it, dude.

00:27:50.260 Like I just been in Chicago the whole week and I see that my daughters are not in the bedroom.

00:27:55.480 Their drawers are pulled out. Their clothes are gone. She's not there. And I, you know,

00:27:59.580 I was used to waking up sometimes in the morning with her not being in the room. So

00:28:03.520 nothing was out of the ordinary for me. And this is on a Saturday morning in Nevada.

00:28:09.320 And again, I didn't know any of this. And again, her and her friend planned this whole thing

00:28:13.200 because they knew the system and they knew the, they knew how it worked. But in Nevada,

00:28:16.660 they have like a domestic violence or at the time. And again, this is back in 2011. They have

00:28:20.920 like a cooling off penalty. If you get arrested for domestic violence. And by the way, Nevada in the

00:28:24.660 United States has the worst domestic violence laws and rules around domestic violence. So all it

00:28:30.500 takes is a call, a charge, basically just an allegation. And they take the person who is the

00:28:38.400 biggest physical being to jail. Right. So I'm not joking. Yeah. So I am not joking.

00:28:44.720 Jay though. Like it's, it's pretty much that, that way, almost everywhere now in North America.

00:28:49.300 I have a friend that, you know, his wife cheated on him. Right. And you know, he's in a separation

00:28:54.500 period. He got pissed off at one point and he pointed his finger at her face and he said,

00:28:58.740 fuck you, you're a liar. And she didn't like that. So she called the cops and they started to go

00:29:03.300 through this whole DV situation. It ended up cooling off, but it's, but it's a huge risk for a lot of

00:29:09.420 guys. I mean, guys have no idea that it's a tool in women's toolboxes and it, and if you're going

00:29:14.180 through an acrimonious divorce or there's a conflict or, or she's looking for an advantage,

00:29:20.000 one of the most advantageous things that women can do during a divorce is, um, alleged domestic

00:29:25.260 violence. I mean, yeah. I mean, she cleans out the drawers, takes it. Right. Is this when the

00:29:29.720 kids got kidnapped? Yeah. Yeah. So, so, so basically the story goes, I go in on Saturday morning and,

00:29:35.660 you know, back to the Vegas thing, they have a 72 hour cooling off the deal in Vegas. Right. And then

00:29:42.420 Saturday, were you sitting in jail for 72 hours? Dude, I was in for five days. I wasn't, you know,

00:29:47.180 I was in, so Saturday and Sunday, the court calendar doesn't count in Nevada. So you can't

00:29:51.280 even call an attorney. So, so again, this was very, so the cops show up at your house and then

00:29:56.260 they haul you away in a patrol car. They literally take me in. Yep. Absolutely. Hog time. He put me in

00:30:00.120 the back. Literally do they hog time. He put me in the back and they knew I was a, you know, a quote unquote,

00:30:05.620 not a derelict. Right. That's all I'll say. But, you know, and actually one of the cops I ended up becoming

00:30:10.020 friends with later, because at that time of my life, I was actually still, I just started

00:30:14.720 competing in men's physique competitions. And he knew me from another guy that was a cop who was

00:30:20.820 also a competitor. And so he was like, you're Jay Campbell, right? Yeah. I'm Jake. Yeah. When I

00:30:25.880 was nobody, I was just like a local competitor. And he was like, man, he's like, I'm going to give

00:30:29.280 you some, uh, go back and get your backpack and a change of clothes. Um, but you know, that, you know,

00:30:34.920 so he gave me that leniency and they were very cool with me too. When they took me down to, um,

00:30:38.860 processing in a Clark County detention center, which is by the way, if you're familiar with

00:30:44.000 Clark County detention center, they have a reality television show about it. So bad. And so, and

00:30:49.340 again, you know, take me from this like exclusive suburb in West Vegas, all the way downtown to

00:30:53.620 Vegas, hog time. He put me in, I expect like, I, so first off I'm shell shocked, right? I have no

00:30:59.080 idea what's going on. And I figured I'll get a call to my attorney. And then I find out, Oh no,

00:31:03.840 you're not getting a call to your attorney until Monday you got, and then you got, you're going

00:31:08.440 to have to be in jail until the cooling off things over. So dude, fast forward a very long story.

00:31:14.260 Um, when I did call on Monday, I talked to my brother. I always say this, by the way,

00:31:18.820 if this ever happens to you as a man, you better have a person that you can call in your life that

00:31:24.820 will take the call no matter what, because Richard, I don't know if you know this, but in Cal, you know,

00:31:28.880 in California, not California, but in Nevada. Um, it's, uh, you are getting a collect call from

00:31:35.940 blank detention center, right? Which was Clark County detention center. So if somebody is

00:31:39.540 thinking that you're getting pranked to hang up, you're screwed. They don't answer. Yeah. So

00:31:43.260 thankfully my brother, yeah. Thankfully my brother and I have had that conversation before

00:31:47.220 and he answered and he's like, dude, I don't know what's going on. You get like literally 90 seconds.

00:31:50.820 And I said, I don't know what's going on either. I said, get the best defense attorney in Las Vegas.

00:31:54.880 I don't care what it costs. Just get him and blah, blah, blah. So what did it cost to clean

00:31:59.640 up the DV charge? So dude, all said and done is four and a half years later, it cost me over 30

00:32:05.860 grand, but it wasn't just DV bro. I was charged with four, four third degree felonies. I was

00:32:12.800 charged with kidnapping, all sorts of nonsense. I mean, you can't even imagine. I still have a folder,

00:32:18.800 you know, in one of my drawers. Well, why wouldn't she throw everything she possibly could at you to

00:32:22.840 get the advantage that she's looking for? Well, from what I, from what I, so in speaking to her

00:32:27.340 since then, and again, I have no animosity towards her, her and I are great. Um, I think they just

00:32:32.340 make up charges because when you find out how brutal system is and how broken it is, they're

00:32:36.580 just trying to, you know, slap things on you because the state can get restituted. That's the

00:32:40.500 way it works. It's such a scam. But, um, so there were so many absurd charges. Um, you know,

00:32:46.600 I just remember getting on Wednesday night, it's a funny story. I'm chain gang to a bunch of like,

00:32:50.940 you know, armed robbers. And by the way, I'm on the ninth floor of Clark County detention center,

00:32:55.560 which is nothing but attempted murderers, murderers and armed robbers. Right. Cause I'm

00:32:59.520 considered a violence, a violent offender, domestic violence. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. So, um, but I'm

00:33:04.580 only there for five days and it wasn't that bad other than the food was horrible. I met some amazing

00:33:08.300 people there. I actually met a guy that who was essentially a lifelong convict, um, who I helped

00:33:13.600 cause it was, dude, this was before Thanksgiving. It was the week before Thanksgiving. So when he got out,

00:33:18.300 he got out, he got processed out the next day that I did too. And he called me and I was like, dude,

00:33:23.280 I'm taking you to Thanksgiving. We're going to meet anyway. It's so funny. I don't know what

00:33:26.320 happened to the guy. I'm sure he went back into system cause that's what most people do. But

00:33:29.500 I got out. Hold on a sec. Let me ask you a question. So it costs you about 30 grand to clean

00:33:33.860 up the DV charge. Um, I've heard people say that if you're going through a divorce in a state where

00:33:39.840 DV is a common tool and her toolbox on the exit, you want to have about 40 to 50 grand set aside

00:33:47.880 to deal with any kind of potential issue like this. Well, by the way, that was just my divorce.

00:33:53.100 I'm sorry. That was just me paying the attorney. Yeah. You're screwed, dude.

00:33:56.340 So you're sitting in the slammer until. So, so, so, so dude, that is a great point. And I'm so glad

00:34:02.180 you brought this up. This is must listen to YouTube. So here's how this went down. I'm sitting there on

00:34:06.900 a Wednesday at my arraignment. Okay. Now remember I've been in there since Saturday morning and I'm in an

00:34:12.700 orange jumpsuit. And like I said, I have a crip and a blood on each side of me. And you know,

00:34:16.920 they asked them to stand up and they, the judge writes the, or the district attorney says the

00:34:20.540 charges out for me before they could announce them. All of a sudden I hear your honor, uh, aside

00:34:27.980 and it's my attorney and I don't know him from Adam, but he's just a little dude. He's an amazing

00:34:31.740 guy, bald at a guy. His name is Jack Buchanan. And he walks up and he whispers in the district

00:34:36.540 attorney's here. And then the district attorney, you know, nods and goes up to the judge and the

00:34:41.640 judge then says, uh, uh, in the, in the, in the case of Jay Campbell, you have been O R'd,

00:34:46.840 right. Which means you've been released on your own recognizance. Now here's the freaky thing.

00:34:51.460 I was charged with all of these crazy charges and, and on, you know, cause they give you the

00:34:56.060 charges before you're, you know, before they're read to you and you understand, and you're also

00:34:59.280 understanding like what you're faced from a sentence. And dude, I was sentenced potentially

00:35:05.000 to life. I'm not kidding you. That's how much nonsense there was. So the fact that I was,

00:35:10.260 and so I'm thinking in my, it's going to cost me 50 grand just to get bond based on all the

00:35:15.500 charges added up. But dude, that's how, how broken and corrupt the whole system of jurisprudence is

00:35:20.340 because Jack Buchanan, it was like one of the top defense attorneys in all of Las Vegas.

00:35:24.440 And also Jack, if you hear this, man, I love you, man. Shout outs to you. We're good friends. Now

00:35:27.880 they just have the ability to just whisper in the ear of the DA. And then the DA says, Oh, you know,

00:35:33.160 this guy's a good person. He's not going to run. He's not a flight risk and boom, you can just walk out.

00:35:37.560 Now back to what you were saying. If I was a broke dude with no standing in society. Yeah,

00:35:43.000 dude, I'm going to be in there a long time. So that's how it works. Okay. So there's a false

00:35:47.540 DV charge. You're in the slammer. She's emptied out the drawer. She's taking the accounts too.

00:35:53.380 Yeah. Get out all the bank accounts. Okay. I mean like she planned this obviously. Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

00:35:58.900 So, so, uh, where did she go? I'll get to that. So I get out Wednesday night and, and again, by the

00:36:05.280 way, that was Wednesday. And Jack, after that, Jack then comes up and whispers in my ear as I'm

00:36:10.100 chain gang, seriously. And he's like, well, man, I'd asked to shake your hand, but you're a little

00:36:14.800 bit indisposed right now. So he's literally making jokes with me. I'm like at rock bottom of my life.

00:36:19.520 Right. So like a part of me is like, I want to strangle this dude. But then the other part of me is

00:36:24.340 like, dude, this guy is so confident. He must know what's up. But he then says to me, he goes,

00:36:27.860 Jay, you will be out processed and free by tonight at nine o'clock or sooner. And I will see you first

00:36:35.400 thing Friday morning in my office at 9am. Are we clear? And I was like, I mean, again, I'm like,

00:36:40.640 this guy's nuts. Right. Sure enough. That was probably like three to 30 or two, two or two or 30

00:36:45.800 in the afternoon that day. I did. I got out that night, dude, the Clark County detention center in Las

00:36:51.380 Vegas. You're in downtown Las Vegas. I shit you not. When they push you out, when you get out of

00:36:56.500 processing, they push you into a dark alley. Literally, there's no lights. So is that the

00:37:02.680 back door? Yeah, it's the back door. So I'm like, I got my backpack and you know what I was allowed to

00:37:08.300 take with me, which was like sweatpants and a hoodie. And I, I make my way down to the closest place

00:37:14.380 there was the, the gold nugget casino. Cause it's literally like maybe two blocks over. And I was

00:37:19.520 familiar with that place too. And I went in there and I'm, I get my first meal. I'm challenged. I

00:37:24.080 haven't eaten legit food in five days. It's so bad in the system. And I'm sitting there and I'm like,

00:37:29.580 turn on my cell phone, open up my laptop. You know, I have a wireless router or whatever that's in my

00:37:34.460 bag for work and stuff. And I'm just like going through shit. And I'm like, holy shit, I just lost

00:37:38.220 five days of my life. And I'm attempting to go on my accounts and look up online and figure stuff out.

00:37:43.940 And you know, to make a long story short, bro, um, I was in total shock. I had no clue at that

00:37:50.580 time what had really happened to me. I didn't know she had planned all this. I didn't know any

00:37:53.760 of this stuff has happened, but what did you see any of this coming? No, no, none of it. It was

00:38:00.100 like a flying pan to the forehead. I mean, who, who thinks that their wife is going to put them in

00:38:04.540 jail? Yeah. Well, clearly. I mean, I mean, honestly, I mean, smart red flags when you were married.

00:38:11.980 Like, did you see any red flags when you were married? So there were definitely red flags in

00:38:15.940 the earlier part of the year, um, before we started going to counseling because she started

00:38:20.060 to act like, um, that she couldn't ever forgive me for what happened. Um, and you know, so yes,

00:38:27.280 there were, but nothing like this, dude, nothing, nothing like this, you know? Um, but again,

00:38:32.780 she was having your laptop, you're having your first, you know, fine meal and you're looking at

00:38:36.620 your bank accounts going, Hmm, all the money's gone. What happened? So I honestly,

00:38:41.980 like, I didn't even know what to do because like, who's going to believe me. So I obviously I called

00:38:46.640 Mike and I said, dude, you know, and he was at the time, he was like very supportive and very

00:38:52.500 believing on me. But then once you start telling people, and by the way, dude, I never got disclosure

00:38:58.180 from my ex until two years later. And she actually told me at a Christmas, and this is when I had gotten

00:39:04.520 my daughter's back, which we'll get to that story. But, uh, she was like, look, you know,

00:39:07.760 everything you figured out is exactly how it happened, but I'm not going to report repeat

00:39:11.240 it. So don't ask me to. Right. So, but I had to uncover everything, dude. Like I had no idea.

00:39:17.960 So she did kidnap both of my daughters. Um, she took them to her parents in Houston and basically

00:39:26.240 dropped them off and said that her and I were going through, you know, some troubles for the time

00:39:31.560 being. And would you watch them for a couple of weeks while I sort my stuff out and then proceeded

00:39:35.980 to like gallivant around the country with the guy she was doing this with, who was a photographer.

00:39:41.140 And again, for the purposes of not disparaging her or him, I don't even want to talk about it,

00:39:46.100 but it was, dude, it was so harrowing because I had to piece everything together as to what

00:39:51.420 happened to me. And then of course, you know, I use Mike Cernovich cause he was one of my best

00:39:55.000 friends at the time and really helped me. And obviously he's an attorney. He has, you know,

00:39:57.960 legal understanding of things. No one seemingly would believe me as it went deeper down the next

00:40:03.440 couple of months. In fact, Richard, when I went back from my crypt to crypt for my house in Atlanta,

00:40:08.940 my mom and dad's home for Atlanta, Georgia for Christmas, I was at sailed, attacked,

00:40:14.940 castigated. I mean, they just treated me like a pariah. You know, one of my brothers literally

00:40:20.100 pulled up an iPad. This is back in 2011 that had my one, you know, my, uh, my, my mug shot

00:40:27.140 at my charges and put it up in the middle of the room. It likes the night before Christmas. And I was

00:40:32.380 just like, I had to leave, dude. I mean, I was, it was so, so devastating. So, you know,

00:40:36.960 fast forward, the next four months were the most horrific of my life. My kids are gone.

00:40:45.420 And what people don't understand is, and you know, this, but people for, for the listeners,

00:40:49.400 when you're charged with these kinds of things and you have, um, you know, a protective order,

00:40:54.740 child protective services order against you, they're called a PTO. Um, you're not even allowed

00:41:00.160 to attempt to initiate conversation. In fact, if you do email, text, anything, even through a friend

00:41:06.340 of a friend attempting to communicate to these people, they can come back out, re-arrest you,

00:41:11.400 triple, double, quadruple the charges that you're still have. Cause remember I'm out, right? They've

00:41:15.880 released me, but I still have all these charges to stand for. They're still on my record.

00:41:19.320 Let me ask this question. Did, how did she allege domestic violence against you? Like, did she,

00:41:25.520 like, did she run into a wall and crack her nose or something? Or like, what did she do to herself?

00:41:30.300 Um, dude, nothing that I, as far as I know, and that's a story that I really,

00:41:34.320 so it was just points and sputter. Jay's a bad man. Come and pick them up. Yeah. Yeah. And that's,

00:41:40.080 and you've heard this a lot of people, this happens to dude. No, I've seen this happen a lot. I mean,

00:41:43.960 yeah. So, I mean, again, without disparaging her and the system and we know it's so broken and stuff

00:41:49.520 like that, you know, just to fast forward. So everybody can understand like how harrowing this was.

00:41:53.320 Um, the first 30 days, rich, I couldn't even get back into my house, right? I'm living in this

00:41:59.580 amazing house and I'm not even allowed to go there because the temporary protective order,

00:42:03.600 um, is covered for the house. And even though she's gone and I found out she ended up being in

00:42:09.920 Florida, the kids were in Houston or with her parents, but I couldn't even get back in there.

00:42:14.380 So when I met with Jack, my attorney that Friday, so again, two days later, I had Thanksgiving dinner

00:42:18.580 by myself, uh, with friends. I was for the next week and a half until Jack was able to quash the

00:42:24.720 PTO. I was couch surfing and staying in hotels. You know, it was, you don't have a job at this

00:42:30.240 time. No. So I guess this is when, no, no. So I haven't lost my job yet. That's the best part.

00:42:35.600 So of all that shit in the five days, my brother, when I told him on Monday and said, get the attorney,

00:42:40.860 he, I gave him the number of my manager. I worked for, I was working for Edmonds, by the way,

00:42:45.000 the automotive site. Um, I said, you need to call her, um, and, and let her know everything.

00:42:50.720 And that, you know, I'll be exonerated that I did nothing, blah, blah, blah, blah. And so somehow,

00:42:54.760 somehow there was actually a story to this too. They kept me on. And I was, by the way, I was

00:42:59.060 again, a very high, you didn't lose your job, man. Well, I was very high. I did eventually,

00:43:04.080 but I was a very high level sales manager and they needed me strategically for who I was. And then the

00:43:10.840 sad part is I found out later from Mike and other smart attorneys that they only kept me

00:43:15.660 because I had felony charges against me and they were afraid if, if, you know, they fired me or let

00:43:22.180 me go that I could sue them for wrongful termination. Cause I technically didn't do anything to get

00:43:26.140 fired. I was just allegedly charged with these. So once they dropped the felony charges back in

00:43:31.080 April, and that's what we're going to get to the attempted suicide. Um, that's when I, you know,

00:43:36.280 really hit rock bottom. Cause that was really the only thing I had left in my life. My kids are gone.

00:43:40.120 Um, and by the way, just so you know, over the next three months, I had to get divorced,

00:43:44.640 uh, because Jack told me my attorney, he was like, look, dude, he's like, you're at a point

00:43:48.780 now in your life where all you can be, should be focused and concerned is self-preservation.

00:43:53.600 Because if you attempt to reach out to your kids, right. If you reach out to your children

00:43:58.180 or attempt to, you know, connect with them in any capacity, it can be used against you and you'll

00:44:02.860 never see them. So you're in a holding pattern right now. We have to get these charges gone,

00:44:07.260 expunged, dropped, whatever. And you, you, Jay Campbell, you have to now completely have an

00:44:14.540 eye on the back of your head, right? You cannot go to bars, get drunk, smoke weed, do drugs, do

00:44:20.420 anything that could get you pulled over. Because while these charges are open, all it takes is one

00:44:27.220 suspicious, you know, cop in a, in a bad mood to pull your file and say, Oh, you're coming in.

00:44:33.760 You're a shit bag. Right. So like I, at that point in my life, and by the way, I'm 41,

00:44:38.980 I, I, everything changed for me. And this is before I even lost the job and we'll get to that

00:44:43.580 in a second, but that's, so those next three or four months, man, I had to like really change how

00:44:48.460 I live my life. And by the way, I'm living in this 4,400 square foot house, no kids, she's gone.

00:44:53.940 So it was like every day going into different parts of the room, like the sense of like missing my

00:44:58.620 kids smelling their stuff, the toys, all the stuff. It was brutal, bro. I mean, I was definitely at

00:45:03.840 rock bottom. How long did you nuts your kids for? Well, total, I didn't see them for, I was without

00:45:12.520 them for 18 months, but I did get a chance to see them 18 months. They were, yeah, I did get it. I

00:45:18.840 did get a chance to see them a year later or actually not a year later, about 10 and a half months

00:45:24.920 later, because I had met Monica. I will get to the story of the attempted suicide, but I had met

00:45:30.500 Monica and she is such an amazing person. She was able to connect with my ex and say, look, we're

00:45:36.460 going to be at a seminar, a real estate seminar in Florida. And he would love, I'll be there. Of

00:45:42.900 course, the chaperone, if it was any way you could meet us in a happy medium and he could see the girls

00:45:48.500 cause it's all he talks about and cares for. And so that was, you know, fast forward, but over those

00:45:53.820 next three or four months, you know, I, I got divorced and I had to do all, I had to pay for

00:45:57.800 everything by the way, right? 10 grand for the attorney. Of course she's not, you know, she's

00:46:01.800 not responsive. And again, I can't reach out to her. So the attorney is attempting to reach out

00:46:06.240 to her, but I got divorced. I had to get rid of my house. There was no reason to even be there

00:46:10.880 anymore. Um, so I went through all that and then I literally flew into Santa Monica, which is where

00:46:17.320 Edmunds corporation, uh, corporate headquarters are for what I thought was strategic meetings in the

00:46:22.080 early part of April. And dude, I started going up the elevator. You know, I flew out early in the

00:46:25.560 morning, like five o'clock from Vegas, McCarron. And, you know, I took a cab. This is before Uber.

00:46:30.740 I start coming up the air later and they don't stop me where I'm supposed to be going. I'm like,

00:46:33.700 what's going on? They're like, they just give me that look, you know, the corporate you're getting,

00:46:36.680 you're getting gassed. So they took me up and literally go into HR. And the girl that's gassing me

00:46:43.400 is a girl that I got the job at Edmunds the year before. What do you mean by gassing you?

00:46:48.240 Well, they just let me go, you know? So they basically just took me in and they basically said that

00:46:51.700 we're letting you go or we're, we're, you know, it was a BS story, but it was, um, we're, we're

00:46:56.040 going to, we're going to annex your territory on the Southwest and make it a corporate account

00:47:00.600 because you have too many stores connected to a big parent, like auto nation or something.

00:47:04.360 It was a BS story. Dude, when I was going through divorce, it was like the worst thing I ever dealt

00:47:08.480 with. And I dealt with some serious shit that I never, ever talk about on public stuff just cause

00:47:13.340 I, I just can't. Um, but, um, like there was a time when I was driving down the highway and I was

00:47:18.580 like this, this just sucks. And I was thinking to myself, if I just take off the seatbelt,

00:47:23.220 Florida, I was driving a four runner. If I take off the seatbelt, floor it, and then just hit a

00:47:28.260 concrete overpass pillar, it'll just be done quick. But to hear what you went through, like.

00:47:36.260 So, so I'm going to get to it. So yeah. So, you know, so, you know, so I had to give the backstory.

00:47:42.700 So anyway, so I'm going up the elevator. I get there, the girl, her name is Raina. I don't know

00:47:47.060 how her name just popped into my head, but she, I had gotten her the job at Edmonds before she's

00:47:51.380 crying as she's letting me go. It was so weird. She was like, I've never had to do this before.

00:47:55.620 And she knew that I was being gassed because they had just dropped the felony charges like three

00:48:00.100 days before. Right. So in my life, I'm thinking, wow, things are looking up. You know, I'm going

00:48:05.720 into corporate strategic meetings. My job is really good. By the way, I was the number one guy in the

00:48:09.700 whole company of Evan by percentage, number one guy in the whole company. So they dropped the felony

00:48:14.040 charges. And then of course, now I'm not a casualty to sue them. So then they, they deep six

00:48:18.580 me. So as I'm going home that day, um, I get a call from one of my brothers and my brother just

00:48:26.420 happens to say, Hey man, I just thinking of you, what's going on. And I was like, dude, I just lost

00:48:30.160 my job. And then he's like, Oh man, you know, instead of lamenting, I'm sitting in a cab on my way

00:48:35.820 back to LAX, uh, when I head back to Vegas. Um, you know, he's like, dude, is there anything I can do?

00:48:40.380 I'm like, nah, man, I'm just kind of numb right now. I'm going to go home tonight and train and

00:48:43.920 I'm sure I'll be fine, but no. And so he tells my other brother, right? So I fly home, I go back

00:48:49.900 and I'm living in an apartment now with a good friend of mine who actually is one of the people

00:48:53.620 that experienced the DMT deal with me. So she's part of the story and I walk in and she's like,

00:48:59.140 what are you doing? You're supposed to be there the next three days. I'm like, I literally, her name

00:49:02.180 was Rosanna. I was like, I literally got gassed. I said, they let me go. She's like, what do you mean

00:49:06.000 me to let you go? And I'm, you know, I told her, I'm like, I'm sure it's something to do with

00:49:09.180 what happened to me and the felony charges being dropped that I'm not a liability anymore. And

00:49:13.400 she's like, oh, so sorry. So I said, look, I'm going to, I unpacked, I grabbed my stuff. I said,

00:49:18.060 I'm going to go to the gym and I was driving at the time. This is back in 2012. Now, probably

00:49:22.100 early April or late March. I don't remember. I think it was early April. I'm driving a five 35 BMW

00:49:26.980 and, um, I go to the parking lot. I get to the parking lot. I'm fine, Richard. I feel fine.

00:49:32.200 And my other brother, who's like my right below me, who's like very successful CEO guy. He just

00:49:38.020 calls me. He just starts laying into me. He goes, you're a fucking waste. You're a total

00:49:42.560 waste of life. You're the smartest person I've ever met. And you're, you're a loser. You ruined

00:49:47.840 your life. I mean, he was just like all over me. Where did that come from? He was just, I think just

00:49:53.500 mad at like what had happened to me. I think my other brother must've called him and said, Jay got Jay

00:49:57.620 lost his job. So, I mean, like it was just one thing after the other. And I think he was calling me to

00:50:01.600 tell me, he's like, dude, I mean, I'm sure he would have eventually got to like, you need to,

00:50:05.340 you know, cheer yourself up and be who you are and all that stuff. But dude, I just couldn't hear it

00:50:09.460 anymore. I was like, Sean, man, I appreciate it. I hung up. And that's when I, that's when exactly

00:50:13.720 what you just said, dude, I literally essentially blacked out and I backed out of the, of the parking

00:50:19.200 lot. I remembered exactly where I was parked in the gym parking lot. And dude, I literally got on

00:50:24.260 Silverado and I can't remember the other ranch road. It's a huge, highly trafficked, um,

00:50:29.540 intersection or, or, uh, part of Las Vegas. And dude, I fucking floored it. I literally, I

00:50:36.020 caught dude. I closed my eyes. I closed my eyes and I floored it. And I didn't even care what was

00:50:40.340 going to happen. I mean, it was the dumbest, most irresponsible thing that a human being could do

00:50:44.900 and something. And I know what it was now. Cause I'm in touch with it, but my higher self just like

00:50:50.580 kept me on the shoulder, like really hard. And it just made open my eyes. And I was like, Oh my God,

00:50:54.380 I'm going to run into the back of this car. And thankfully there was nothing on the right side

00:50:58.740 shoulder, that lane and into the shoulder. And I somehow locked up and just sat there for a second.

00:51:03.980 It was just like, what the hell am I thinking, dude? I had the same thing, man. Like I had this,

00:51:09.320 I don't know if it was a voice or a tap on the shoulder, but I had this like moment where it's

00:51:12.460 like, you're not a fucking quitter, man. Right. Do it. No, it's your higher self, dude. I I'm, I'm,

00:51:17.080 I'm certain that when we're at our lowest, most, you know, that's my dark night of the soul,

00:51:22.500 but we're at our lowest, most despondent point. Something intervenes and says, it's not time.

00:51:29.720 And I'm not sure that everybody gets intervened because I'm sure some people make a deal that is

00:51:33.840 that time. Right. But for you and me, it wasn't our time, dude. All right. So, so you're living

00:51:39.140 by yourself. You don't have a job. You don't have access to your kids. What'd you do from there,

00:51:44.660 man? I mean, this is like, was this rock bottom for you? Like, what was this like late 30s?

00:51:48.220 So, so, so no, this is definitely 41. So this is 41. This is 2012. Um, so, so I came home. I

00:51:55.740 actually, I actually went back to all things. I actually went back to the gym. So, so, so clearly

00:52:01.320 I'm sitting there on the shoulder road and side of the road. And I'm like, I'm going to, I'm going to

00:52:05.820 rebound from this and I'm going to live the greatest life ever. And then again, that was just a thought

00:52:09.260 that went into my head and I'm still obviously a total rock bottom. So I, I went into the gym. I

00:52:12.820 actually had a really good workout and then I went home and you know, I told Rosanna, my roommate,

00:52:18.840 what, what had happened. And she's like, I'm just, I thank God. I'm so glad you're here. And then

00:52:22.420 the next three mornings, bro, I woke up, I couldn't wake up in the morning. I was literally dead.

00:52:27.280 And I remember, no, no, no, I, I, I wasn't sleeping anyway because once the kids were gone,

00:52:35.040 I just couldn't sleep, bro. And especially living in that big giant house. So now I'm in a smaller

00:52:39.580 place. I'm in like a two bedroom condo. That's probably like 1100, 900,000, whatever square

00:52:43.780 feet. And it was, it's better. I'm five months removed from like losing the kids, but no,

00:52:48.820 I wasn't sleeping and I was so skinny, bro. I was like fucking gone. I mean, I wasn't eating.

00:52:52.940 I wasn't sleeping. Um, yeah. Same thing happens to me too. When I got stresses, I can't fucking

00:52:57.760 sleep and I can't eat. Like, yeah, I mean, it's our brain. I'm about 210 pounds now. And I've gone

00:53:03.000 down to like, I'm going to say 188, 186. That's what I was like high stress. It's like,

00:53:07.980 we're the same body. We had the same body type. I was, I was the same way. I was probably like 187,

00:53:12.180 189. But, um, so anyway, so I, I just remember not waking up the next three days and I would go

00:53:18.600 to get on the bike, you know, force myself, force a will. I'm going to ride the bike. And then I

00:53:22.160 would do, I would just start crying. And Rosanna would come out and she would try to pep talk me

00:53:26.280 and stuff like that. She worked as a cocktail waitress. So she'd work at night. So she was actually

00:53:29.960 asleep and be in the morning, but she'd come out and she'd try to come for me. And, um, there was just

00:53:34.760 no comforting. And I finally, and again, very lucky, very blessed. I finally got the courage,

00:53:41.220 which was stupid now looking back on it, but I called one of my best friends who was a car dealer,

00:53:46.300 you know, he owned dealerships. His name is Ryan Galante. I love him to this day. And I said,

00:53:50.960 dude, I don't know. I hate to have to ask you this, but, and we didn't even talk about this,

00:53:55.680 but you know, I owe, you know, 3,500 a month in child support and alimony. After all that,

00:54:02.220 I still got to pay and, and, and, uh, and, and, you know, plus, you know, I got to pay for their

00:54:06.940 medical benefits. So all in, I think I was out like 4,400 a month. Um, I said, can you just give

00:54:12.220 me a job that allows me to survive? And he's like, he was literally without even thinking about,

00:54:16.340 he's like, Jay, man, of course, dude, he's like, I'll hire you any day. He's like, when do you need

00:54:19.780 to be here? When, when do you come, when can you start? And I was like, I mean, I didn't expect him

00:54:23.740 to say yes. I was like, dude, I can start as soon as I can get my stuff packed up and there. And so,

00:54:28.980 you know, two weekends later, um, I, well, okay. Yep. Two weekends later, I was back. So it was

00:54:37.140 like right around the beginning of May and I had to find an apartment, had to do all that. But dude,

00:54:40.840 I literally was living in a 300, 312 foot studio apartment in Sherman Oaks, California, paying like

00:54:47.380 absurd rent even back in 2012. But I was like happy that, you know, he, he, he created a bullshit job

00:54:54.060 for me. It was like a digital marketing director in his internet department or something, you know,

00:54:57.240 to pay me. Um, but you know, going back there, um, I got on match.com, even though I was so broken

00:55:05.660 and we could talk about that. I was so broken. I hated women. I wanted to, I literally had a,

00:55:09.380 my story was like, I wanted to have sex with three women in a 24 hour period and, and, and just defile

00:55:15.020 them, you know, just like be as horrible as I could as a person, as a human being to them. I was so lost,

00:55:19.620 so broken by what had happened to me. But, um, the only part of the story that we kind of left off,

00:55:23.960 like fast forwarded over was, you know, the, the DMT and the DMT actually happened before I lost my

00:55:31.300 job with Edmonds. And it was like literally three weeks before that happened. It was in March and

00:55:35.500 it was in LA and it was, it was me and Mike Cernovich and my roommate, Rosanna. Um, and that

00:55:41.080 without question, I feel, and who's to know, but you know, in my inner knowing, I feel that that was

00:55:47.560 the first step of healing of like, you know, integrating the trauma of everything that I had

00:55:52.600 been through. How is, how is DMT different from ayahuasca? Um, it's a good question. You don't

00:55:58.420 throw up with DMT, right? Right. You don't have like violent convulsions and stuff like DMT. Yeah.

00:56:03.820 I mean, well, so, so it's five MEO DMT. So DMT and five MEO are different. So five MEO is the strongest

00:56:09.820 ethnogen, right? It's the strongest psychedelic plant medicine. It's not a psychedelic. I mean,

00:56:14.840 I guess some people could see it as a psychedelic, but it's a very, very powerful and it's very,

00:56:18.780 very profound. And for people that are, you know, essentially rock bottom or seeking, um, you know,

00:56:24.120 therapy or, you know, you know, trauma integration, um, it's what people recommend. And truthfully at

00:56:29.800 that time of my life, I was so lost that I didn't even know what I was looking for because I was just

00:56:36.760 lost. I guess I was just like looking for a better way from where I was. Cause again, my kids are gone,

00:56:42.720 but dude, you know, my experience and I've shared this with other, on other podcasts before, but not

00:56:47.380 as deep as this, of course, um, I literally went under and it seemed like I was under for an entire

00:56:53.040 day, but it was 21 minutes. And I literally, Richard, I profoundly, it's just, just unmercilessly

00:57:00.220 just cry. And the entire room, you know, it was a very shamanic. They always say it's like a purging

00:57:06.040 experience a lot of times with ayahuasca, right? So that was your purge, like the ball is exactly.

00:57:10.860 So it was, it was a very ceremonial experience. The shaman was awesome. The people that were

00:57:15.480 there were awesome. You know, I was with Mike Cernovich. I was with Rosanna, her last name was

00:57:20.320 Solano. And, um, the whole room when I came to was literally crying and sobbing and just an abject

00:57:28.900 crazy tears. And dude, you know, I didn't even know what was going on, but then I looked around

00:57:34.600 and I'm all covered and I'm all wet and everything too. And then the shaman literally walked up to me

00:57:38.720 and he just hugged me. He said, brother, that was one of the most amazing releases that I've ever

00:57:43.860 experienced. And I've been doing shamanic ceremonies for 13 years. So, you know, I didn't know it meant

00:57:48.240 nothing to me. I'd never done it before, but you had a lot going on in your life. Clearly I released

00:57:52.800 so much. It was such a gift to be able to do that. Why did you, why did you decide to do that? Like,

00:57:58.440 why did you go, Oh, this would be a good idea. Was it just like, I got nothing else going on?

00:58:01.720 Um, no, Rosanna was, um, she had done plant medicine before and she had, you know, put in

00:58:09.160 my ear that she thought that it would be a really amazing thing for me to experience because of where

00:58:13.380 I was and what had happened to me. And she knew me and my ex when we were, you know, nowhere like

00:58:19.120 that. So she had been around me for three or four years. And, and by the way, we had no romantic

00:58:24.600 relationship or anything. She was just a really, really good friend. Um, but she thought, no, I would,

00:58:30.100 I would, I would be open to saying if I did, but she just, she was just such a good friend to me

00:58:34.580 and, um, she just recommended it. And then, you know, when I was talking to Mike, Mike was like,

00:58:39.660 well, shit, can I go to, and you know, so, you know, those people that do five DMT MEO experiences

00:58:44.900 are, that's one of the most illegal, you know, drugs on the planet. It's not a drug, obviously,

00:58:49.080 but you, they bet you, dude, they seriously bet you. So, right. So we had to like all three get

00:58:54.840 vetted before we went on that and everything. But again, I just, you know, as a final word on that,

00:58:58.520 I mean, I really know that it profoundly altered me as a, as a person.

00:59:04.240 So how did it alter you? Like, what was your aha takeaway when you kind of woke up after that 21

00:59:09.440 minutes? So I think I got to fast forward a little bit. So, um, well, the first, the first 24 hours is

00:59:15.140 insane. I mean, you feel like you are connected to like a sense of just pure love. Like we drove back

00:59:21.740 that night, you know, I drove, I drove, we parked at like an IHOP somewhere in the Hollywood Hills and I

00:59:27.840 drove Mike back to his car and he took off. And then, you know, Rosanna and I had to drive back

00:59:31.100 to Vegas and just on the ride back to Vegas. Cause we didn't get home until like 1230 that night.

00:59:36.500 But I just remember just sitting in the car and both of us were just like, we were crying and we

00:59:40.200 were laughing and we were joyous, but the whole next day, dude, I felt like it's, I mean, I mean,

00:59:45.600 honestly, it's hard to imagine. Like if you've ever done MDMA, like real pure MDMA and you have that,

00:59:51.180 you know, super 700, 800 level of consciousness vibration where you're just pure love and everything

00:59:56.300 is just perfection. I felt bits and pieces of that for at least 24 to 32 hours after.

01:00:02.540 But again, it's not, I don't want people to think it's like MDMA. It's totally different,

01:00:05.840 but you feel that profound sense of like belonging or joy or just like everything is fulfilled. And

01:00:11.720 obviously I was still in a place, Richard, where I was not fulfilled and I didn't have joy.

01:00:15.500 Right. So this was like therapy for you. This wasn't like, let's take some mushrooms and

01:00:19.640 watch the trees dance sort of thing. Right. Exactly. Yeah. No, no, nothing like that. And I would

01:00:23.640 highly recommend that anyone listening to this, who's contemplating doing that, you know, those

01:00:27.480 are different, you know, for, for, to get high, you know, whatever, that's fine. Do, do no judgment,

01:00:32.680 but don't ever take plant medicine to do that because it will, you will have a bad experience

01:00:36.780 because as, as anybody who's very familiar with plant journeys will tell you the plant is an

01:00:42.540 amplifier and it will give you exactly what you need, whether you want it or not. Yeah. Yeah. It

01:00:49.200 shows you your inner self is what I was told. Exactly. Um, okay. So you're 41, you've just

01:00:53.920 done DMT, you've had this awakening. Where do you go from here? I mean, less than a month later,

01:00:59.440 I lose my job. I then call my buddy. He's gives me a job. So I literally drive back to LA, which I've

01:01:04.800 now been gone from for three years. Cause I left in 2010. You still don't have access to your kids

01:01:09.080 though. Like you don't have custody or nothing. Oh no, no. They're still like, are they living with

01:01:12.400 mom or living with mom's grandchild? So they're living with mom. I mean, that's a good question. I

01:01:15.980 really don't know officially, but I'm pretty sure they're living with mom. Yeah. So the only time

01:01:21.200 this is again, horrified, horrifically traumatic. The only time I would ever hear from her was

01:01:25.480 literally at the end of the month, she would text me and it would be, where's my fucking money.

01:01:31.540 Right. So, so I go back to LA tail, completely tucked, thankful that I have this job opportunity.

01:01:37.940 I have a one, you know, I rented a U-Haul. I literally have a, which is silly. I have a plasma TV,

01:01:43.180 my clothes and my exercise bike. And that's it. Literally. I mean, I went from a 4,400 square foot

01:01:48.780 house to that. Right. I move into this, this tiny little one bedroom studio apartment, 310 feet in

01:01:55.400 Sherman Oaks, which I was happy to be because it was close to the dealership. I would not have traffic.

01:01:59.700 I hate traffic. I know like you, right. You can't be in traffic. And I'm there for about

01:02:05.800 five and a half months. And I admit, I met Monica on match.com four months into the deal. Now,

01:02:11.920 like I told you, and you know, no, no, no shame to admit this. I was in a bad place. Like the girls

01:02:19.260 that I would date were like garbage. I mean, not as human beings, but like I treated them like

01:02:25.000 garbage and I was just in a terrible place. And thankfully Mike and a couple other, my friends,

01:02:31.040 a couple other guys, I won't mention them because I asked them and they were like, no, don't mention

01:02:34.480 us. They were giving me books to read for man, you know, for masculinity and stuff like that.

01:02:39.880 Like I was reading Gary Zukov. I was reading tons of books. You know, I, I probably read,

01:02:44.100 I read, um, you know, Don Miguel Ruiz. I read so many books about embracing masculinity from

01:02:49.480 the bottom and stuff that that was kind of giving me a new star. I also listened to David

01:02:54.520 do it, uh, you know, the ways of the superior man, or I read his book or whatever. There's

01:02:57.940 so much I read.

01:02:59.060 Isn't Cernovich kind of like one of the original guys that got involved in like the red pill

01:03:03.000 manosphere community. Like, I don't know him that well, so I'm not too familiar.

01:03:06.760 Yeah, dude, I think so. I mean, I mean, you know, I don't want to label him or anything,

01:03:09.740 but I, I want to say that, um, you know, Mike had his blog danger and play. And before

01:03:14.860 that, um, he had crime and federalism, which was by far his best writing. He doesn't write

01:03:20.760 anything like that now. And that was when he was writing on a bridge and not worried about

01:03:24.300 political correctness and, you know, his audience and fans and all that nonsense. But like

01:03:28.280 probably, you know, without putting words in his mouth, I would say yes. But, but Mike and

01:03:33.860 I were always really good friends before the internet before, I mean, dude, when I was

01:03:37.740 26 or 25, might've been 25. I mean, so you see, he's 42 now. So he's like, we're like

01:03:43.480 a seven year difference. Like he literally came out and slept on my couch for two weeks

01:03:47.240 when he was a high school senior. And we met on, we met on the internet, like, and I think

01:03:51.200 it was a alternate fitness weights or one of the lists or no, it was the low carbon exercise

01:03:54.980 list. And that's how we met. And we always were friends way before the internet, before Mike

01:03:59.560 made all these friends on the internet and all that, we were like friends, friends. So

01:04:02.540 he was always like in my inner circle and a very close confidant, but those guys were helping

01:04:07.560 me, but I was still broken, dude. Like I'd hang out with him on the weekend. They'd be

01:04:10.380 like, I remember Mike's girlfriend who he's now married to Shauna Shogo. Shout out to Shauna.

01:04:15.460 She was like, dude, you have so much more to offer, but you're a fucking mess.

01:04:19.520 How would you reconcile yourself after all that trauma, you know, to like be able to be productive

01:04:27.280 and find a new purpose. Like a lot of the times, you know, I'll tell guys, like, you got to let

01:04:30.900 your wounds become your work sort of thing. That's a great way to say it.

01:04:34.640 How did you, like, like you kind of, like your story really isn't, you know,

01:04:39.040 anything more than, uh, pivots, you know, your entire life has been pivots, you know, your entire

01:04:44.840 time, like every time, you know, you, you know, you chase some level of excellence and you hit a

01:04:49.840 roadblock or something happens and you get detours, just like you're all right, let's pivot, you know?

01:04:54.400 And sometimes you do some dumb shit and sometimes it works. I know there's times it doesn't, but I

01:04:58.740 mean, you're in your forties now, you're pretty much still at rock bottom. All you've had is a

01:05:03.300 great DMT experience. You had some fun and now you're like, okay, I don't see my kids. Um, I'm

01:05:11.000 in LA. What do I do now? You start, you know, dating women, of course, you know, you treat some of

01:05:15.480 them like crap, Monica. Um, so what happens now? Like, is this when you kind of pivoted into the

01:05:21.140 optimization stuff and you're like, I'm going to, I'm going to become like a top shelf guy, you know,

01:05:25.040 as far as health goes or. So, yeah. So, so, you know, truth be told, I have to give amazing credit

01:05:31.520 to Monica. So when Monica met me, I was still in the phase of like, I'm going to tear this woman

01:05:37.720 apart. I mean, she sent me, it's a funny story. I'll make it very, very abrupt, very abridged.

01:05:43.740 She sent me this cool email through match and I looked at her profile and she didn't have a picture

01:05:48.460 and I'm like, but it was a very interesting email. So I agreed to meet her. And, but it was like,

01:05:53.140 my plan was to just destroy her too. I mean, I, I probably figured I would destroy her and just

01:05:57.820 our conversation. I was lost, bro. And then I met this woman who's like content. I mean,

01:06:02.940 first she's beautiful, but then like, um, I'm sitting there and she's happy. And that's what I

01:06:07.260 said to her. Like I literally verbal diarrhea it all over her in 25 minutes. Here's my story.

01:06:11.800 And she just sat there and she was like, Oh, well, you know, my story is not as interesting,

01:06:15.820 but here I am. And then like, after she was done talking in 10 minutes, I was like,

01:06:19.680 wait a minute, you're genuinely happy. And she was like, well, yeah, I mean, what do you,

01:06:25.380 isn't everybody. And I was like, no, you know, so then we, she wasn't listening to your Batman

01:06:30.720 origin story, was she? Dude. So we started walking through old town Pasadena and we were in,

01:06:36.540 I remember it was like, it was yesterday. We were in the diesel store and she was trying on an outfit

01:06:41.020 and she's like, she came out and she was like, what do you think? And I just leaned over and I kissed her.

01:06:45.840 And that's when, you know, and she tells the story too, but that's when she felt my heart.

01:06:50.100 And that's when she knew she literally was like right here on my heart. And she was like, Oh my

01:06:55.040 God, this guy's energy is insane. She's like, this is my, this is the guy for me. And she was coming

01:06:59.940 out of a divorce too. And she has her own story, not nearly as bad as mine, but she just knew.

01:07:04.980 And dude, I didn't know, you know, I thought she was just some attractive woman that I was going to

01:07:09.440 tear through again. Like I had been the previous year.

01:07:11.720 Let me ask you this question. You go through like a shit show of a marriage and a divorce. I mean,

01:07:16.700 it was your second marriage. Yeah. Are you and Monica married right now?

01:07:20.140 Yeah, we are.

01:07:21.280 So after all that trauma, what, what made you say, all right, I'll just forget those experiences

01:07:26.200 and I'm going to put myself out there and take on this risk again.

01:07:29.020 So it's a great question. I never would have done it in a million years. And there's one answer. And

01:07:34.040 four months later, um, and this is when I finally got a chance to see my daughters in that break,

01:07:41.040 right? Cause I didn't get them back for another year later. So that was that whole 18 months. But

01:07:44.600 Monica was like, look, I'm going to a real estate, a Mike Ferry real estate seminar in Miami.

01:07:49.500 Why don't you come with me? And at the tail end, we'll spend the last two days and we'll attempt

01:07:55.120 to go see her kids. And I was just like, dude, you know, it's not going to happen. She's not

01:07:58.980 going to allow it. I was just fucking verbal diarrhea. And she's like, listen, it's going to

01:08:04.140 happen, but you have to come first. I'm going to make it happen. And that's how powerful woman she

01:08:07.940 is. And I was like, I didn't even think that my boss would even give me time off. You know,

01:08:11.740 it's a car business. And so I asked him and he's like, Jay, it's your kids go. So I went and

01:08:18.400 same thing. We spent two days together at the conference. And then we did, she did somehow

01:08:23.200 connect with my ex and my ex agreed to meet us. And so we drove all the way up from Miami. They

01:08:28.200 were in Tampa, a little South of Tampa. And we met at like a waffle house or no, it wasn't a waffle

01:08:32.180 house. It was some diner and dude, worst experience of my life, best, happiest, but worst. So they get

01:08:38.800 out of the car. And by the way, my ex is there. She gave like somebody who was a friend of hers to

01:08:42.840 meet us there. And my daughter, Alex, you know, runs up to me and is like, daddy, daddy. And I'm

01:08:48.860 dude, I'm crying. I mean, I'm, I'm dead. I could start crying right now. I'm just thinking about it,

01:08:52.820 but you know, I'm holding her. And then Gabby, my baby doesn't know who I am. She literally does not

01:08:59.560 even know who I am, dude. I was devastated. I mean, I was just devastated, but thankfully Monica's there

01:09:07.800 and she's watching him. And you know, I just, I see Monica with these girls and we, and by the way,

01:09:12.360 we got a chance to spend the next day with them. We got a hotel. She let us stay with them.

01:09:17.580 And it was just the most cathartic experience of my life. The next 24 hours, I was just so happy,

01:09:22.600 but I saw the way she was with them, Richard. And I was like, you know what,

01:09:27.420 if I'm ever going to be with a woman and you know, optimally, or thankfully, if I do get my children

01:09:33.020 back, if I want my daughters to be raised by a strong, powerful, independent woman who knows

01:09:37.660 what's up, this is it. Like, there's no way, especially with my baggage and all the things

01:09:42.680 that I've been through. And so, you know, the, we, we left the next day and you know, I had to,

01:09:47.760 it was horrible. It was, you know, just terrible leaving them and having to go back to California.

01:09:51.520 I just fucked dude. Just the thought of it, the thought of it just breaks me, but man,

01:09:56.880 just the thought of it. Um, so, um, I mean, these shows run for about 90 minutes. I don't want to,

01:10:03.440 I don't want to go over on it, but, um, let's take another 10. Cause we got a couple of people

01:10:07.580 waiting to ask some questions, but let's take another 10 and kind of like lean into the

01:10:11.060 optimization story to like where you are today. Yeah. Cause I mean, you've been up like up and

01:10:15.720 down some, like that's yeah. Thank you. You know, thank you for sharing that, but yeah,

01:10:20.020 no, no, no, for sure. And I, and by the way, I, I appreciate you having given me the opportunity

01:10:25.080 cause I really never have shared it. I've talked about things bits and pieces, but I'm glad that

01:10:29.040 this is out there so people can really know. Cause like, you know, as you know, nobody is successful

01:10:34.440 without going through dark nights of the soul. It just doesn't happen. It's just some people

01:10:37.960 aren't as public about it. And so I felt like, you know what, I'm going to share my story. And

01:10:41.760 obviously I have total forgiveness and love and acceptance and allowance for my ex. I have no

01:10:47.580 issues with her. I have my daughter's back now, but just fast forward into the optimization game,

01:10:52.660 um, meeting Monica, her teaching me that I had so much to give, teaching me empowerment.

01:10:58.920 She was very woo woo. You know, I was very against it, but I acquiesced and, you know,

01:11:04.780 coalesced as I saw her power and I saw what she was. And then her and I, I mean, dude, you know,

01:11:10.080 I think I told you this, I'll just share it real quick. And, you know, fast forward to the

01:11:12.840 optimization. So the first year that her and I were together, and by the way, so I come back to

01:11:19.760 California and I'm like, you know what, this is the one. And so a month later, she says to me,

01:11:24.620 she says to me, why don't you do what you're doing for the car dealership for me? Why don't

01:11:29.180 we just go into business together? Right? So I've been dating this woman now four months and she

01:11:32.660 asked me to literally like to go into business together, which was at the time, knowing who I

01:11:36.420 am, I'd be like, you're fucking nuts, but dude, something. And again, my higher self, I presume

01:11:40.740 made me do it. We moved in together and the rest is history in our first year together working in real

01:11:46.020 estate. And by the way, I did not have a real estate license, but I was, you know, a digital

01:11:49.820 marketing ninja. We did 96 transactions together. Her and I just together, we did like $44 million

01:11:57.160 in production and made just over a million dollars in gross commission income. And this is coming from

01:12:03.000 nothing, bro. Like the year before I was nearly bankrupt. I had like $13,000 to my name in a Roth IRA

01:12:10.020 coming back to California, tail tucked, as you know, with nothing, with just a promise of a job at a

01:12:17.000 car dealership, you know, knowing I had to pay $4,200 a month. So again, focus, direction, energy,

01:12:24.840 and, and obviously intense belief, anything's possible. So then, you know, was successful in

01:12:32.040 real estate for the next couple of years. That's when Mike came back to me again. He's like, dude,

01:12:35.140 you got to write a book on testosterone. Um, him and I were originally going to write it together,

01:12:39.700 but him and I do not do business together, even though we're still the best of friends.

01:12:42.960 He's a fucking maniac. I'm a fucking maniac. We couldn't get it together. So I

01:12:46.940 finally put the book out in 2015 and, you know, subsequently written four books since then.

01:12:52.840 Um, I've made great relationships. I think, you know, now that like one of my gifts is connection

01:12:57.200 and connecting people. Um, I've become really good friends with some of the top physicians and

01:13:01.740 top clinical research experts in the world when it comes to optimization, biohacking, testosterone,

01:13:07.620 all that stuff. I also wrote two books on fasting. Um, truth be told,

01:13:12.780 I'm just posting those links again in the chat for people that have come in after truth be told,

01:13:16.780 Richard, all the stuff that I did in my formula of years, and even in my late twenties, when I met

01:13:23.340 Lyle McDonald and I did a lot of research on ketogenic dieting, and I was actually one of his

01:13:27.360 Guinea pigs slash test dummies when he wrote the first book on ketosis and ketogenic dieting way before

01:13:32.440 anybody even knew what ketogenic dieting was. And then in my thirties, when I first started therapy

01:13:36.960 testosterone and all the studying and the research and all that stuff, that's what led me to where I

01:13:42.660 am now. So it's like, I always tell guys, like, I wasn't just lucky and that I was in the right

01:13:46.920 place at the right time, but I did the work with the research. And then of course I've always been

01:13:51.280 applying it to myself. Right. And like, I've always been a student of training the human physique

01:13:56.460 and all the things that I did. So, I mean, you know, essentially I just was like doing the work

01:14:00.740 without the acclaim and not being in that industry. And then eventually I just said,

01:14:04.180 I'm going to break loose. I'm going to write this book. And now here we are.

01:14:06.960 Um, I want to, I want to link to your YouTube channel. Cause we're not going to have enough

01:14:13.120 time to really dive into the, uh, therapeutic testosterone peptides. We'll come back. We'll

01:14:18.380 do another one, dude. Yeah. Um, well, we got a private one scheduled tomorrow for my community.

01:14:23.140 So for those guys that are watching right now that are in my 1%, that's tomorrow. Um, it's on the

01:14:27.740 events tab. If you haven't seen it, make sure you check it. We're going to, we're going to do a deeper

01:14:31.280 session there with a lot of Q and a, and I really want to hit on the peptide part. Cause that's,

01:14:34.500 that's really cool stuff. Um, we've got another 10 minutes to kind of shoot the shit out. There's

01:14:40.420 a couple of people I want to throw in for questions that I see waiting there that sure

01:14:43.080 would be very interesting. What do you think is the most important lesson that you can share

01:14:46.060 with people, you know, from the zero to hero journey, like this playing to win sort of concept

01:14:50.660 that, you know, we talked about this entire show. Um, man, I, I mean, I like, I think it's just like

01:14:58.540 a statement, like, you know, um, the physical experience is a game while we're here. And, you

01:15:05.700 know, I think it's like what you focus on is what you get back. Right. So it's like, does it matter

01:15:12.120 what happens to you from an experiential level, whether it's negative or positive, the universe

01:15:17.820 doesn't label anything negative or positive. It just allows the experience to happen. So

01:15:22.320 it's up to us to not label it as negative. Right. So like when I say this and you know,

01:15:27.980 there's a silver lining and everything, right? It's a lesson. Yeah, exactly. Like when I look at

01:15:32.580 my life now, I'm so a blast. I mean, I look at it as an abundance, right? Because like those were

01:15:37.820 opportunities for me to learn from. And so I have no pain or attachment to any quote unquote negativity

01:15:43.960 that came from that. I just look at it as literally a learning experience. And it's just

01:15:48.080 like, dude, look at my amazing life. Now I have so much of my life. And, and, and just to add to that

01:15:53.340 too, and this is where people really get stuck. If you do not allow and accept everything that

01:16:01.520 happens to you, like, I'll give you an amazing statement, dude. Like this is an amazing statement.

01:16:05.060 Like the greatest gift that we can give to anyone, of course, in our life or any, anybody others

01:16:12.600 is just to be at peace with the world. Like literally that's it. If you're at peace with

01:16:18.100 whatever happens around you or to you, then you're a master. I mean, it really is that simple. How many

01:16:25.340 people react to everything that goes on versus observing and then just making strategic decisions?

01:16:32.100 I mean, it goes back to the moral of the story, right? Yeah. Winners never quit. I mean, it's,

01:16:38.260 it's, it's, it's the way it is. You're going to be dealing with ups and downs, trials and tribulations.

01:16:43.760 What are you going to do when you're in the trial or you're in the contrast? You know, you're going to

01:16:49.640 do the same thing when you win than when you lose. I always tell guys that, you know, these, these,

01:16:56.720 these obstacles that fall in your way are really just tests to see how badly it is that you want

01:17:01.200 something. Exactly. Right. Cause I mean like you'll either find a way to make it happen or you'll find an

01:17:05.220 excuse. Exactly. And I think the vast majority of guys here, they don't have the gumption to find a

01:17:10.420 solution. They'll, they'll lean on an excuse or they'll point and sputter or they'll just, you

01:17:15.680 know, it's not my fault or, you know, whatever it might be. The mainstream makes it easy, Richard.

01:17:20.620 The mainstream makes it easy for people to be victims. You know that. Well, the, yeah, I mean the

01:17:24.880 mainstream narrative, you know, culture, religion, media, government, school, like they teach you to be

01:17:30.120 a victim. They want you to be a victim because when you're a victim, you have no power policies that

01:17:35.060 gives them more power. Exactly. Right. Like you vote for laws and regulation that allow them to

01:17:41.180 control and monitor you more. A hundred percent. So it's, it's, it's crazy. Um, I'm going to throw

01:17:46.980 Sam Botta on. He's, um, I don't know if you know, Sam, I think of course I know Sam, Sam, how you doing

01:17:51.780 brother? I couldn't be better. I'm so excited, man. One of the reasons I couldn't be better now is

01:17:58.260 because of you. I mean, I got to tell you, this guy is so generous and kind and humble. I mean,

01:18:04.700 middle of the night after the hit and run accident, I mean, I didn't know what was going on. This guy

01:18:09.760 helped me with everything. And he, he told me exactly what to do, what to take. And he was right

01:18:14.560 on everything. And I'll never forget that trip we made, uh, and, uh, man, everything that, uh,

01:18:23.760 everything that we talked about, you, you, you felt, felt, followed through with it. You did it

01:18:28.160 all. I mean, look at this, everything you established and more. And, uh, look, um, I know

01:18:34.680 a lot of these guys that are watching this and, uh, every one of them has to get your books and

01:18:40.520 follow exactly what you tell them to do, because it has, you know, my body, uh, has had some struggles

01:18:46.580 and, um, you know, there's a secret ingredient behind it all. And it's been Jay Campbell. And, uh,

01:18:53.420 and, uh, you know, Ben Greenfield, um, I've been going to, uh, Matthew cook at bio reset, um,

01:18:59.800 in, uh, mountain view area, California. And, uh, man, those, those guys love you. They love you,

01:19:06.120 but I just wanted to, I wanted to thank you, uh, in front of all these guys and tell them,

01:19:11.580 I love you, brother. I love you for saying all that, man. And you know, I'm my, I'm always open

01:19:15.980 to talk, dude, you know, that you're in all my groups and I appreciate you for that. And

01:19:19.720 you, you, you always have an inner circle with me, brother. All you have to do is just reach out,

01:19:24.220 man. And I'm, I'm glad, I'm glad to hear from you. I'm glad you're doing well. And, uh,

01:19:27.780 I got love and light for you, brother. I send it to you, man. Well, I'm glad Mike introduced me to

01:19:32.420 you, man. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, man. Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Sam. See you, brother. Um, so in the,

01:19:40.960 if you guys are watching, this is a replay pinned in the top comment is the link to Jay's, um,

01:19:46.580 site with his book. So there's, so there's three, well, there's two open there right now.

01:19:51.280 There's a TRT manual. I think it's called the T I T T O T optimization Bible. Yeah. It's a T

01:19:55.580 O T Bible. It's a saucer and optimization therapy Bible. Yep. So that'll help guys like as you age

01:20:01.180 as men, um, you know, men are, sorry, women go through something called menopause. Most guys are

01:20:06.360 familiar with it, but it's, but it's obvious like it, like it happens right away. Eggs just stop. And

01:20:10.220 then their, their body just changes. But for men, andropause happens over a longer period of time.

01:20:15.060 It's very slow. Most guys don't notice it. They only start noticing it really when they start

01:20:19.420 getting fat, they get a lot of, uh, you know, belly fat. They don't wake up with morning wood

01:20:23.200 anymore. They don't have much of a libido. Um, all those things over time just start to pile up. So

01:20:28.800 that, that book will explain exactly how TRT works, why you want to take a look at it. The other one is

01:20:34.640 the intermittent fasting book, which is another great one that I've read myself. I pass it out to the guys

01:20:38.640 in my community when you gave it to me about a year, year and a half ago. And that's great. If you want

01:20:42.520 to get ripped, uh, the peptide book comes out later on this year and peptides are something that I've

01:20:47.220 been newly introduced to. Um, they're, they're sold as, um, what do they call them for research

01:20:54.040 purposes only? Well, unless you get them from Taylor made pharmacies. Yes. They're the only

01:20:59.360 compounding pharmacy in North America that has sterility control. And of course, quality, uh,

01:21:04.500 control, uh, sterility processing, quality control assurances. Yes, dude, you got to buy research

01:21:09.520 chemicals. And I've used like to, to give an example of just one peptide. Cause I mean,

01:21:14.380 we're not going to have enough time to go through them all. We're going to do this tomorrow on the

01:21:16.980 private broadcast with my guys, but to give an example of just one peptide BPC one five, seven

01:21:22.000 is incredible amino acid. Um, I can't remember who introduced actually, you know what, dude,

01:21:28.060 it was Ben that mentioned it to me a couple of years ago. And he's like, you do all this and you put

01:21:32.560 the pin in your knee and you do all this sort of shit. Cause I was asking about my knee and I'm like,

01:21:35.440 forget that. That's just, that's just too much. I'm not going to go put needles in my knee. Right.

01:21:40.160 And then you and I talked, and then I looked at BPC one five, seven again, and he's got an article.

01:21:45.500 So if you Google BPC one five, seven plus Ben Greenfield, he'll tell you exactly how to use it,

01:21:50.620 how to dosage and what it does. But as you age guys, your, your joints are going to start to

01:21:56.720 fail you. I mean, they're not going to like failing the sense where you're going to fall down,

01:21:59.820 but they're not going to be as good as they were when you were 20. Like I can't ski down Whistler anymore.

01:22:03.980 So when I ski, I'm skiing Ontario Hills, right? Cause my knees are not great, but I want to be

01:22:09.240 able to ski, you know, and have some fun with my kid and, you know, friends and stuff. So BPC one.

01:22:16.280 Believe it. Like, yeah. Remember what I told you, dude, I'm like, you start using that. You're going

01:22:19.660 to shit. It'll literally fix you in two weeks. Yeah. Well, it wasn't exactly two weeks, but I'm

01:22:24.080 gonna say about a month and I don't have any pain in my knee anymore. I can do squats again. So I'm

01:22:29.100 looking forward to the ski season. There's a whole bunch of other really good peptides. You put me into a

01:22:32.800 peptide group and you connected me with Nick. So I'm grateful for that. So take a look at, at,

01:22:37.360 uh, that link that I put there for Jay site. And, and is there a pre-order, a pre-order for the

01:22:43.180 peptide book? So not really, but for everybody that is in Richard's community or even watches this link,

01:22:49.000 we're going to sell the book when it comes out for $99 and we're going to sell it direct probably from

01:22:53.120 our, you know, sales page. I don't know if it'd be click funnels or whatever, but, uh, for everybody

01:22:57.040 who does purchases the book until Sunday night, when Richard's going to take it down, we're going

01:23:02.220 to charge you guys $79. So the book is not ready yet, but it will be out by the end of the year.

01:23:07.580 And trust me, I'm writing it along with Nick and you already know Nick and Nick is literally one of

01:23:12.360 the smartest biochemical engineers on the entire planet. He is cheap. I had, I had no idea how smart

01:23:18.680 Nick was until I started asking him questions in that WhatsApp group about the peptides that I ordered

01:23:23.740 and he's laying it all out. I'm like, okay, this guy's on. Yeah. I mean, the guys, when you say,

01:23:29.760 talk to this guy, you never introduced me to somebody that's stupid. That doesn't know what

01:23:32.840 they're talking about. There's no doubt about that. Yeah. So you guys, the book will be,

01:23:36.500 and Richard already knows this. It will be the best book on the entire world, in the entire world,

01:23:41.200 at least that I know exists on peptides. It will be how to use them. It's a game changer. Yeah. Why

01:23:46.820 they're used. And again, let's just go real quick. These things are not just for fat loss healing.

01:23:52.360 These are for brain cognition, increase muscle gain. Um, it, some of them actually stop Alzheimer's

01:24:00.040 and dementia and other neuro neurodegenerative diseases in their tracks. I mean, this is one

01:24:05.360 that lengthens your telomeres, uh, yeah, a petal on epitalan. Yeah. Like that's another one. And

01:24:11.180 Ben was talking about that as well, because it actually lowers your biological age, you know,

01:24:15.300 on a cellular level. Exactly. You want to use it once a year for about three weeks in a very specific

01:24:20.040 controlled dose and it will, uh, improve your telomeres and short or actually extend them.

01:24:24.540 But, uh, the caps, but I'm on one right now that no one has access to. It's called five amino.

01:24:30.780 And dude, I've been using this for four weeks since I came back from Taylor made. Um, nobody really

01:24:35.540 even has, it's not even in existence, but this might be the best peptide in existence. It does so many

01:24:41.540 things. And of course I'll share with your private group tomorrow, fat loss, uh, metabolism regulation.

01:24:48.520 I mean, you can actually eat a lot of food on this peptide and not gain any body fat. So if you want

01:24:55.700 to, if you're skinny or you need to put on muscle, this is what you would use. Um, also pinned in

01:25:00.500 description, if you're watching the replay, but it's entrepreneurs and cars.com forward slash

01:25:03.780 community. If you want to get into the 1% and join us live for that conversation tomorrow, do that

01:25:09.220 today. Uh, if you, if you watch this later and it's after the live broadcast, there'll be a recording

01:25:14.820 in the library that we have in there. So yeah, let me just throw something in Richard, um, to make

01:25:19.180 them realize like how valuable tomorrow really is. I'm doing a webinar with Nick and Ben Greenfield

01:25:25.960 and Ryan Smith, the top guy at Taylor made the only place in the world that sells these things, um,

01:25:32.600 in April. And that's how far out we are on each other's calendars right now to do this,

01:25:36.580 but I'm going to be dropping information tomorrow morning. And that that's going to be in that webinar

01:25:40.340 in April. Cool. Um, Gary, how you doing, man? Hey, evening. You're going to be the, uh, the second

01:25:47.060 and last question for the evening. So fire away, man. You got like five minutes. How you doing,

01:25:50.620 brother? Uh, surviving. So, um, I, I was wondering what advice you would have for somebody that, uh,

01:25:59.720 you know, and other people, not even just me, because it's so common, the, the divorce, rape,

01:26:04.560 the silver bullet, everything you went through. I know I myself, and actually surprisingly,

01:26:10.020 uh, I'm a Xennial, very early eighties tail gen X. I know a ton of others like us that are going

01:26:15.460 through this. Sure. Um, exactly what you said down to even the near the same dollar mouse,

01:26:20.920 the pressure on you and you know, the, the stress you're under with all this, like, how did you manage

01:26:28.880 that? Was, was fitness a key? Was gym key? Like, how did you make that transition? And also

01:26:34.700 from what you had described with your ex, again, myself, countless others, I know going through

01:26:41.660 this, how did you sort of bridge that gap? And perhaps the term I'm looking for, manage that

01:26:48.000 relationship with her in order to co-parent, because we all know that that sort of stuff,

01:26:52.980 it's very difficult. Your questions are phenomenal. Um, you should make a book. You

01:26:59.580 should make a book, just narrow any of those questions and creating a narrative that we

01:27:02.600 could create the answer. So the answers are very simple. Um, I met Monica and she was the bridge

01:27:08.740 because at the time she would not even speak with me and we all go through that. Right. So,

01:27:13.260 I mean, the answer, if you don't have somebody that's a bridge is time because everything heals

01:27:17.880 over time. And I know that's not really the answer you want to hear right now. Cause it sucks,

01:27:21.520 you know, especially in that initial part where you have no communication, they treat you like

01:27:25.780 shit. Where's the money, right? That's all you get. Um, yeah, but I mean, you know, to answer

01:27:31.920 your question for sure, my fitness never took a back seat. Like I always did cardio. I've told

01:27:37.560 Richard this before, you know, that cardio, you know, a lot of guys are into the weight training

01:27:41.140 and we do got a weight train. We know that, but the cardio is where you get the blood flow to your

01:27:45.620 brain. And that's really where you're going to get the endorphins and the encalphins to keep

01:27:49.860 going when you just feel like giving up dude. And I, I definitely attribute doing very consistent

01:27:55.420 cardio. Um, even if it was 20 minutes a session, you know, I always tell guys, man, when you're

01:28:00.400 going through the shit, get an exercise bike, you know, because a lot of guys don't have room for a

01:28:05.160 treadmill, you know, especially when we're down and out and we're living in these fucking shacks or

01:28:09.140 one bedroom places, you know what I mean? Cause you have no option, you know, get a, get a really

01:28:13.260 nice, you know, $400 like Schwinn life cycle. It measures your heart rate or whatever. And, you know,

01:28:18.920 just put it in there. Just get a nice bike and ride outside. And well, yeah, I mean, you can do

01:28:23.000 that too. I mean, obviously I just like being out able to roll out of the bed and jump on that MF

01:28:29.300 or put on some good, you know, binaural beats. And I read too, by the way, I mean, I'm always reading

01:28:35.020 books, you know, but I mean, dude, like it's just going to take time. You know, I was lucky that my,

01:28:41.100 you know, Monica was able to connect with my ex, but all women after three or four years,

01:28:46.440 they'll either meet somebody else and not care, or they'll just like realize that if they're going

01:28:53.080 to be a co-parent, they have to come to the table. That's just my take.

01:28:56.640 Okay. Yeah. Thanks. That's what I was curious about because I've seen so many men broken by it

01:29:02.500 and I can see why going through it until you go through it, everyone's like, Oh, that's bad dads

01:29:07.980 or all you just hear about that. Yeah. And very few people, you know, I think it's,

01:29:13.720 I'm trying not to get on a soapbox. No, it's okay. I'll look speaking, but you know,

01:29:19.680 what I see is it's such a common thing. Yourself, rich others were able to springboard from it,

01:29:27.640 which is a quality that, you know, like this is, let me try and gather my thoughts. It's like a

01:29:33.940 quality that this is something that affects all men, the society we live in. And that's the term I'm

01:29:41.140 for trying to teach that so we can all get further and survive this. I mean, you know,

01:29:47.860 just any advice, it's a teachable skill. I think it's just, I think it's just hardwired into you

01:29:52.780 as a man, like you're going to have to put up with shit. Well, I would say one, there's one thing I

01:29:58.860 agree with Richard, but there's one thing. Yeah. There's one, there's one thing you can do Gary.

01:30:03.140 And that is forgive. And when I say, when I say forgive, I mean, literally unconditionally

01:30:08.900 forgive. And it's so hard as that sounds right now, like, you know, for your ex, because I

01:30:14.040 remember being there, I'd be like, I'm not going to forgive her. She put me in jail. She destroyed

01:30:16.980 my life. But when you can actually forgive that person and just drop the attachment to the pain,

01:30:23.920 because you have pain energy. We did Richard had it. I had it. I mean, that's what we're going to kill

01:30:28.140 ourselves. It's outrageous. Yeah. So, so that really is the answer. And that is not easy to

01:30:33.720 do, but any of us can do that. And I know for a fact that like I dropped it. I mean, I was still

01:30:39.220 fighting with her two years ago. You know, she would come over to our house because she lives in

01:30:45.400 Vegas now of all places. And she would come over to be with the girls. And one day she was like,

01:30:50.200 you know, BS sitting in my house. And I'm like, what, this is not six years ago. And I blew up on her.

01:30:56.440 And, you know, Monica came to me and she's like, dude, you can't talk to her like that.

01:30:59.500 And that's when I went to bed that night. I was like, you know what? I am never going to dishonor

01:31:03.560 or just disrespect her in front. Cause my daughters were in the house. They weren't in the room and

01:31:07.600 they were in the house. No, never. So I decided that was it, dude. I was going to forgive her

01:31:12.980 and I would be done. And that's that I know will work. So that does work. So just to add to what

01:31:18.640 Jay was saying, there's the two most negative emotions that you can feel as a guy. And I learned

01:31:23.480 this in my early twenties is resentment and guilt. One's directed towards somebody else

01:31:27.580 and one's directed towards yourself. It's just a bag of bricks. And it's really, really hard for

01:31:32.280 guys to, to just drop that bag of bricks and put it down and walk away from it because we like to

01:31:38.720 fucking carry it. Like it's a sort of badge. Like it's like, you know, I got screwed over. So I'm

01:31:43.080 going to hate these people sort of thing. And honestly, like you're, you're no better than

01:31:49.480 a toxic feminist that points and sputters at the patriarchy. Exactly. It's just like,

01:31:54.780 just take ownership and control what you can. If just forget about the dumb shit. Cause it really

01:31:58.860 doesn't serve you, man. Like holding on to resentment and guilt. You think it's doing

01:32:03.800 something, but it's not doing anything. Nobody cares. Totally. Gary, think of it like this, dude.

01:32:09.500 So it's like the difference between what happened and the stories around the event. Right. So it's

01:32:16.600 like the fact is what actually happened to you. And then the story is the interpretation of the

01:32:21.700 emotion of the other people, meaning your ex, my ex, Richard's ex and just dropping it because

01:32:27.940 that's what we ended up doing is our brain starts playing games with like, they did it to us for so

01:32:32.240 and so reasons. And then we can't drop the pain. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right, Gary. I'm gonna let

01:32:38.180 you go. Thanks for hopping on, man. Thanks brother. Nice meeting you. Um, I got one last super chat

01:32:42.960 here. I want to hit before we wrap up. He's asking about hit and lists. Do you know what

01:32:46.660 hit and lists? I'm guessing hit is high intensity training. Yeah. Yeah. So lists. So, so hit is a

01:32:51.920 high intensity interval training and lists is low intensity, um, steady state. Um, so it's a great

01:32:58.220 question and I'll be happy to expound on it tomorrow. Um, so it depends on your energy system,

01:33:03.720 right? So I talk a lot about metabolic flexibility when I talk about fasting and, and, and get into the

01:33:08.100 nutrition aspect of things. If you are a bodybuilder and you are eating a caloric surplus of carbs,

01:33:15.580 protein, fat, whatever, you can absolutely do high intensity, uh, interval training because your body

01:33:21.800 is being fueled by all three of the different energy systems. You've got like aerobic pyruvate,

01:33:27.160 you've got lactic acid, and then you've got the slow intensity, um, or low intensity, whatever.

01:33:32.220 I can't think of that energy system, but there's three of them. So you can do that. But when you're

01:33:35.740 fasting and you're attempting to go for fat loss, unless you're really smart and you're doing your

01:33:42.440 cardio, like right after you've eaten, you should not do high intensity, um, interval training because

01:33:49.740 your body will burn muscle for fuel, right? You want to rely on your body burning free fatty acids.

01:33:56.900 Sometimes people will call them ketones, depending on how low your carbohydrates are as the primary

01:34:00.900 substrate when you're, when you're doing the cardio. So it's a really good question. And a lot of people

01:34:05.280 get this wrong. You do not want to be, if you're fasting or you're attempting for maximum fat loss

01:34:09.800 to really actually do high intensity interval training, because your body will burn, um, sugar,

01:34:16.680 which is again, glucose or muscle glycogen, the stored form while it's training, which will lead

01:34:21.920 to breakdown in muscle. You will have catabolism and you don't want that. So you want to do more

01:34:26.220 lists, which is, you know, kind of a moderate intensity to low intensity, steady, steady state,

01:34:30.860 because you'll burn fat tissue as the energy substrate while you're doing the cardio.

01:34:35.480 But it is a great question, by the way. So for stuff like that, um, guys that are watching right

01:34:41.280 now live that are in my community, we're doing this kind of just exclusive Q and a for you guys

01:34:46.820 tomorrow to get in some deep shit. So, um, we'll see you guys tomorrow. Jay, thank you for sharing

01:34:51.140 your, um, playing the wind story. There's some crazy stuff there. I wasn't expecting to get

01:34:55.080 that much in the way of experiences, but that was just great. Thanks brother. I appreciate you,

01:35:00.180 man. Yeah, man. Uh, thank you. Thank you. So I'll see you tomorrow. Uh, thanks everybody tonight for

01:35:04.780 watching smash the like button. If there's somebody that needs to see this broadcast,

01:35:07.820 please share it with them. Leave a comment below. If there's somebody that you'd like to see me

01:35:11.220 have on for future episode. Um, and the links to everything are pinned in the top comment again.

01:35:16.860 So if you want to get access to, uh, Jay's books and all of his content and all that stuff,

01:35:20.680 it's all there, including the links to the 1% community. If you guys want to get behind the

01:35:24.040 paywall and get into the really good stuff. All right. See you guys later. Have an awesome night.

01:35:27.620 Thanks, Jay. Richard. That was amazing, man. I appreciate you. Talk soon.

Playing to Win - March 02, 2022

004 - Winners Never Quit, and Quitters Never Win

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