Radio 3Fourteen - Accidental Initiations

00:00:00.000 Transcribed by ESO, translated by —

00:00:30.000 This is Radio 314 on the Red Ice Radio Network.

00:00:45.760 Welcome back to Radio 314. This is Lana.

00:00:48.780 So I took a couple weeks off, and it's amazing how much different the world can look when you stay offline.

00:00:54.020 Joining me today is Andris Jones, an actor, musician, writer, and the host creator of Radio 8Ball.

00:00:59.000 Best known in film circles for his role in Nightmare on Elm Street 4, Jones has also toured extensively as a musician in support of his band The Previous.

00:01:07.400 His first book, Accidental Initiations, In the Kabbalistic Tree of Olympia, was published by Sync Book Press in 2012.

00:01:14.660 Radio 8Ball is a musical show where questions are answered by randomly selecting songs and interpreting them as the answers like musical tarot cards.

00:01:22.360 And today we'll play that game.

00:01:24.600 Jones splits his time between Olympia and Los Angeles.

00:01:27.200 Hello and welcome, Andris. How are you today?

00:01:30.560 Very good. Thanks for having me on, Lana.

00:01:33.380 Well, I know you've said this about a thousand times before, but for those who don't know about your show, Radio 8Ball, can you tell us what it is and when and how it came to be?

00:01:41.740 Radio 8Ball is a pop oracle.

00:01:44.960 It's a musical divination tool where we ask questions by picking songs at random and then interpreting those randomly chosen songs as the answers to the questions, like shaking a musical eight ball or picking a musical tarot card.

00:01:59.620 I mean, it's something that, at this point, it's something that a lot of people just do naturally.

00:02:06.220 The way that music is delivered to us is in such, you know, in the digital realm now, is something that we're always listening to music at random and a lot more people are tuning into the synchronicity of that.

00:02:17.860 But when I started the show in 1998, digital technology in terms of delivering music was just sort of starting.

00:02:25.760 And so we had this show where the idea was to play songs at random.

00:02:30.740 And actually, it wasn't even to ask questions.

00:02:33.380 It was, although I guess in some way in the back of my mind it was because I had always been sort of playing with synchronicity and divination as a musician who toured around the country.

00:02:44.600 And our band would play lots of synchronicity games.

00:02:47.620 We read that the Beatles used synchronicity games.

00:02:50.020 And so that was just sort of like a creative tool that we used.

00:02:55.900 But anyway, I'm giving you a long description of Radio 8 Ball's origins.

00:03:00.100 And actually, I've never described it quite this way.

00:03:03.280 As you said in your book, even a crappy pop song can deliver a message, right?

00:03:08.460 It's true.

00:03:09.100 Well, this is the whole – I started the show in 1998, but I really encountered – I was exploring and working with synch as an art form, but then I discovered all these synch heads, these people who put out the synch book that you're referring to that my book is in.

00:03:27.500 And the whole idea of synch is really – it's elevating the listener to a point where they can – no, if you have super intense listening, yeah, a crappy pop song is going to be – deliver God's message in a weird way.

00:03:44.580 You know, in the sense that – I don't know.

00:03:47.920 It's like when you're in love, you can hear a very bad song, and then later on, that song will still re-stimulate that feeling of love.

00:03:55.340 And if you take that to the next level, what we do on Radio 8 Ball – and we started it as a radio show, and now it's a live show that I do all over the country.

00:04:05.320 And people – and we can get into discussing it more.

00:04:07.900 But in a way, I kind of want to just demonstrate it.

00:04:09.880 We talked about doing a little musical divination to start this, and I have – on the Radio 8 Ball website, I've created a finite pop oracle that is 78 songs to correspond with the 78 tarot cards.

00:04:28.040 Most of the songs are songs that were either recorded on Radio 8 Ball.

00:04:32.780 Other artists are my songs, were artists who have been on Radio 8 Ball, and in some cases, some classics who maybe I've worked with or I just felt like had to be in the tarot deck at the time when I made this.

00:04:45.980 And sometimes when I listen to it now, I think, how could I think that card was the Prince of Discs?

00:04:49.660 But anyway, that's what we'll get.

00:04:51.640 So I was thinking you should ask a question.

00:04:54.500 Yeah, I've got a question.

00:04:56.060 You do have a question.

00:04:56.960 Yes, I do.

00:04:57.720 You have one prepared.

00:04:58.500 Excellent.

00:04:58.820 It's not anything personal, but it's going to be, you know, for humanity.

00:05:02.300 Let's go for that.

00:05:03.460 Okay, but, you know, it's always personal.

00:05:06.020 If you're asking.

00:05:06.620 That's true.

00:05:07.460 That's true.

00:05:08.040 It's always personal.

00:05:09.040 So just to let you know, it's a warning.

00:05:11.660 All righty.

00:05:12.640 Well, let's give it a try.

00:05:14.020 My question is, are Archons controlling humanity?

00:05:19.040 Are Archons controlling humanity?

00:05:22.300 That's right.

00:05:26.100 Oh, wow.

00:05:26.800 Okay, you are going to, I don't know if you'll enjoy this.

00:05:34.740 It's our answer.

00:05:35.760 These are the days.

00:05:50.240 These are the good ones.

00:05:52.660 After this, it's all downhill.

00:05:56.160 We got a raise, but something smells right.

00:06:00.220 It's all good, but who pays the bill?

00:06:03.580 I don't know what this has to do with drinking and hooking up, which is all we want to do.

00:06:11.520 This old song has started me to think.

00:06:16.320 Drink up, cause tomorrow will be true.

00:06:19.180 I've heard it said and seen it bit.

00:06:27.400 You can't stand still on a moving train.

00:06:31.820 The seats are soft and the cabins are conditioned.

00:06:35.880 You can't feel the wind and the rain.

00:06:39.780 You're out along just laughing and drinking, hooking up with whoever you do.

00:06:47.100 The train you're on is a ship that's sinking.

00:06:51.260 Drink up, cause tomorrow will be true.

00:06:55.540 Drink up, cause tomorrow will be true.

00:06:59.260 Oh, these are the days of ones and zeroes.

00:07:06.700 After this, there's nothing new.

00:07:10.700 Of all the ways we could have been heroes, this gig is the best we could do.

00:07:18.100 You'll figure out, this has to do with drinking and hooking up when those days are through.

00:07:25.980 If the harsh truth has just started to sink,

00:07:30.520 Drink up, cause tomorrow will be true.

00:07:34.460 Drink up, cause tomorrow will be true.

00:07:37.940 Drink up, cause tomorrow will be true.

00:07:47.820 Wow.

00:07:48.940 Well, that was Drink up, tomorrow will be true with me and a local Olympia band called the Mona Reels

00:07:56.760 that at that time featured one of our local greats, John Merrithew of the Noses

00:08:01.740 and a band called Sea Average on, I think he was on the keyboards,

00:08:05.680 Chad Ostinson on drums, Peter David Connolly on the key, on, uh,

00:08:11.180 what the hell was Peter on?

00:08:12.420 I don't know what was, who, oh, maybe it was John Merrithew on the drums.

00:08:15.480 At any rate, uh, I was playing bass and, uh,

00:08:18.100 that was a song that I initially wrote for an artist named Willie Wisely

00:08:22.180 who, uh, put it out on his record.

00:08:25.340 Uh, but this was my version and it's even, his version's pretty pop

00:08:29.480 and apocalyptic pop, but this, this is the really,

00:08:33.500 the real slit your wrist version.

00:08:36.200 Oh yeah, what year was this?

00:08:38.100 Uh, that would have been, I think, gotta be 2003, 2004,

00:08:44.140 written 2000, actually more like 2002, probably 2002.

00:08:49.400 So, beginning of the, beginning of the Bush era, of the second Bush era.

00:08:53.700 Yeah. And, uh, you know, the Persian Gulf War

00:08:59.020 and just sort of the, in the midst of the apocalyptic maelstrom

00:09:03.600 from, you know, Y2K to 2012.

00:09:08.360 Um, but your question was about the, uh,

00:09:13.740 whether archons are controlling humanity.

00:09:16.400 Yeah.

00:09:16.620 And, um, you'll have to explain your question to me

00:09:20.600 so that I can help you interpret it.

00:09:22.820 I think I know because there's a cat from the sync crowd

00:09:25.780 named Mark Lesperance.

00:09:28.140 No, no, uh, Mark, oh, I'm,

00:09:31.100 Alan's gonna kill me.

00:09:33.120 Uh, my brain's totally going out here.

00:09:36.200 Uh, Mark LeClaire, that's what it is.

00:09:38.640 Sorry, Alan.

00:09:39.680 Edit that out.

00:09:40.480 Um, um, uh, and he is, uh, he talks about archons,

00:09:45.980 but, um, I need to know more.

00:09:48.580 Sure, yeah.

00:09:49.440 Archons are basically, David Icke also talks about them.

00:09:52.520 A lot of people interpret it a little differently,

00:09:54.400 but interdimensional species that are basically

00:09:56.480 feeding on human, on the human race,

00:09:58.940 feeding on our energy.

00:10:00.020 So we're like their farm,

00:10:01.280 and they're the ones that are actually behind the scenes

00:10:03.360 controlling things.

00:10:05.980 And that is one of the reasons why the world is in such a mess.

00:10:10.480 Well, you know, uh, something, uh, it's interesting.

00:10:14.280 I had a friend who was a pretty energetically savvy cat,

00:10:17.060 and he had this whole theory about, um,

00:10:21.480 smoking marijuana,

00:10:22.940 that every time,

00:10:23.840 there was something about the crystals that were in marijuana,

00:10:25.940 that every time you smoked it,

00:10:27.220 you engaged some sort of, uh,

00:10:30.920 some kind of portal.

00:10:32.040 You opened up some sort of crystal portal rift,

00:10:34.960 and there were these guardians of this rift

00:10:37.520 who, uh, were there to sort of harvest that,

00:10:41.740 or if you were conscious of it,

00:10:43.180 you know, to make,

00:10:43.920 to sort of bargain with you.

00:10:45.220 So, like, the, uh,

00:10:46.040 the sort of the,

00:10:46.980 sort of the energetic,

00:10:48.720 positive, uh,

00:10:49.740 positivist in me would say that,

00:10:51.520 you know,

00:10:52.540 uh,

00:10:53.840 well, this,

00:10:54.380 but, but I was going to say that,

00:10:55.900 that, that, uh,

00:10:56.660 you can work with,

00:10:57.600 you know,

00:10:57.860 the only reason that these things take advantage of us

00:11:00.400 is because we're unconscious and unaware.

00:11:03.520 And that's one of the things I was getting from the song.

00:11:06.700 They're laughing and drinking,

00:11:07.880 and they have no idea that the ship is sinking, right?

00:11:10.580 Right.

00:11:11.120 Exactly.

00:11:12.320 Exactly.

00:11:12.980 Yeah.

00:11:13.140 I mean, in a way,

00:11:14.180 it's like,

00:11:15.280 if you're going to be a harvested by a thing that you can only,

00:11:19.020 like,

00:11:19.200 you have to be really broad-minded to actually believe in it.

00:11:23.500 Um,

00:11:24.000 if you have to,

00:11:24.540 if you're being harvested by something that's that far out of the realm

00:11:27.740 of your experience,

00:11:30.500 why not just enjoy it?

00:11:31.600 Why,

00:11:32.340 why attribute a malevolence to it?

00:11:35.520 Uh,

00:11:35.920 that,

00:11:36.240 you know,

00:11:36.400 and the way the question is like,

00:11:37.300 are they controlling humanity?

00:11:38.580 You don't know.

00:11:38.900 Maybe they're helping us,

00:11:39.980 you know,

00:11:40.520 in a way it's like,

00:11:41.420 if I was harvesting something,

00:11:43.720 I would probably take care of it better than I see humanity generally

00:11:48.240 taking care of itself.

00:11:50.180 Um,

00:11:50.940 so,

00:11:51.660 um,

00:11:52.980 I don't know.

00:11:54.060 I don't think they want their food source eating genetically modified

00:11:56.540 organisms,

00:11:56.980 but we've got a lot of those going on.

00:11:58.720 I know what's going on with that.

00:12:00.320 Um,

00:12:02.760 and of course there's the union perspective as well,

00:12:05.180 right?

00:12:05.400 That this is all in your mind.

00:12:06.660 Like you were talking about the unconscious parts of yourself,

00:12:09.040 unrealized,

00:12:09.760 the ways that you get yourself into the hot spots,

00:12:12.700 uh,

00:12:13.640 you're needing to work out your dark spots.

00:12:17.680 Yeah.

00:12:18.500 And I,

00:12:19.160 you know,

00:12:19.320 I guess,

00:12:19.760 but to me,

00:12:20.340 the song really is about surrendering to your fate.

00:12:23.100 I remember I wrote the song on the day that,

00:12:26.340 uh,

00:12:26.860 we,

00:12:28.340 uh,

00:12:28.960 I wrote the initial sketch of the song that this is before Willie and I

00:12:32.020 really worked on it and wrote,

00:12:33.100 not wrote it together.

00:12:33.820 Uh,

00:12:34.480 but I wrote the initial sketch for it,

00:12:35.820 which is what you just heard on the day that we declared that Congress gave

00:12:41.740 George W.

00:12:43.840 you the go ahead to invade Iraq.

00:12:47.960 Um,

00:12:48.480 so it really is about like,

00:12:50.740 okay,

00:12:50.960 well you get,

00:12:51.980 you know,

00:12:52.440 sort of like at that point in my life,

00:12:53.840 I knew that I had no say and I knew that things were kind of a sham.

00:12:58.540 Um,

00:12:59.060 and at the same time,

00:13:00.940 I did get very passionate about that.

00:13:02.540 I was out in the streets.

00:13:03.480 I was very passionate and I thinking,

00:13:06.260 you know,

00:13:06.440 maybe we could change that coming out of the enthusiasm that came out of WTO

00:13:10.780 and all of that.

00:13:12.460 And,

00:13:12.780 and the rage that came out of the election of 2000.

00:13:16.380 Um,

00:13:17.360 and that song is really about,

00:13:19.300 is once you've lost the war,

00:13:21.340 just like,

00:13:21.780 you know,

00:13:22.000 drink up tomorrow.

00:13:22.920 We're through,

00:13:23.540 you know,

00:13:24.140 that's it.

00:13:24.840 Screw the pooch.

00:13:25.600 This is over,

00:13:26.880 you know?

00:13:27.520 So,

00:13:28.020 you know,

00:13:28.240 if you're,

00:13:28.980 but if you know that's the case,

00:13:30.260 you can get kind of,

00:13:32.020 um,

00:13:33.040 I don't know,

00:13:34.100 Jedi Zen about it and only up to the bar.

00:13:38.200 Hmm.

00:13:38.740 Well,

00:13:38.920 that's a different perspective.

00:13:40.440 I would say,

00:13:41.240 I would say based on listening to that song,

00:13:43.420 yes,

00:13:43.960 something is controlling humanity.

00:13:46.520 Oh yeah.

00:13:47.260 Oh yeah.

00:13:48.040 Yeah.

00:13:48.980 But again,

00:13:49.720 it's like,

00:13:50.340 I would,

00:13:50.820 I would say,

00:13:51.360 yeah,

00:13:51.820 for me,

00:13:52.380 the,

00:13:52.640 because when I think about it,

00:13:54.100 they,

00:13:54.340 and I,

00:13:54.620 I try never in these,

00:13:56.060 in the musical divinations to tell someone else,

00:13:58.120 what their interpretation is.

00:13:59.340 The exciting part of playing with synchronicity is that anyone who listens to this is going

00:14:04.240 to have a different interpretation of that based upon their relationship to the question,

00:14:08.420 to the tonal quality of the song,

00:14:10.720 to what they like about whatever else,

00:14:12.260 you know,

00:14:12.520 all the other synchronistic things that are going on in their life that we can't,

00:14:16.520 we couldn't fathom.

00:14:18.000 But at the same time,

00:14:18.880 what I know from working with sync and is that,

00:14:21.880 uh,

00:14:22.140 that it's there,

00:14:23.140 that it's impossible to ask a question sincerely,

00:14:27.980 pick a song and get an answer and then not have something that's unique happen to you about it.

00:14:35.240 And music is,

00:14:36.200 is powerful.

00:14:37.460 so like I was saying,

00:14:38.700 like you were referencing,

00:14:39.640 it doesn't even have to be a great song.

00:14:41.720 In fact,

00:14:42.780 I think it's the most forgiving way to listen to music.

00:14:45.520 You're investing so much of yourself in it that you start to feel something like it's your own song when it's your answer.

00:14:52.380 And,

00:14:52.780 uh,

00:14:52.980 to be able to communicate that as a songwriter into people,

00:14:56.720 some people who are non songwriters,

00:14:58.380 you know,

00:14:58.620 don't have the experience of writing their own song,

00:15:01.160 but do have the,

00:15:01.760 can have the experience of owning the songs they love and really owning them because the question makes the song in the realm of radio eight ball.

00:15:09.260 Just like the viewer makes the film in the realm of,

00:15:13.020 of sync film watching.

00:15:15.620 But I don't know if I'm using terms that your audience is familiar with or not familiar with.

00:15:19.320 they'll be familiar with these terms.

00:15:21.020 Oh,

00:15:21.240 good,

00:15:21.520 good.

00:15:21.720 Don't you guys?

00:15:22.300 Yes,

00:15:22.580 they will.

00:15:23.240 Excellent.

00:15:25.320 So,

00:15:25.720 I mean,

00:15:26.000 you,

00:15:26.160 you know,

00:15:26.540 the sync book crowd.

00:15:27.560 Well,

00:15:27.700 I'm sure you have questions.

00:15:28.980 You read my book.

00:15:29.840 It's really,

00:15:30.480 I'm honored that you read my book yesterday on the two year anniversary of my beginning writing it.

00:15:37.340 Um,

00:15:37.580 so it's,

00:15:37.980 it's a young book,

00:15:39.520 uh,

00:15:39.860 still growing.

00:15:41.300 And,

00:15:41.760 but I'm very curious to know what you want to ask about it.

00:15:44.460 Whenever,

00:15:44.940 whenever I give it to someone,

00:15:47.160 I'm in part hoping they'll like it,

00:15:50.080 but also really hoping that they're going to like it.

00:15:51.700 hoping that they don't get really,

00:15:52.960 uh,

00:15:53.980 you know,

00:15:54.240 angry and,

00:15:55.000 you know,

00:15:55.640 reactive to me.

00:15:57.380 No,

00:15:57.860 it takes me a lot to be offended.

00:16:00.420 I can agree to disagree and not hate someone over it.

00:16:03.600 Unlike some other people out there.

00:16:04.960 Well,

00:16:06.400 I appreciate that.

00:16:07.660 Yeah.

00:16:08.020 I mean,

00:16:08.300 one of the,

00:16:08.880 I also read it was on father's day.

00:16:10.400 And as I,

00:16:11.200 as I understand your father was also a big influence in your life,

00:16:14.500 right?

00:16:15.420 A huge,

00:16:16.380 I mean,

00:16:16.680 huge.

00:16:16.980 Well,

00:16:17.100 obviously everyone's father is a huge influence on their life,

00:16:19.780 but he particularly was a huge influence on radio eight ball,

00:16:22.540 his dream seminars,

00:16:23.760 uh,

00:16:25.080 that he led at the evergreen state college in the sixties and in the seventies and

00:16:29.140 eighties,

00:16:29.540 uh,

00:16:30.540 where he and his class,

00:16:33.300 his class would interpret each other's dreams as if they were poetry,

00:16:37.380 um,

00:16:38.320 just sort of for the fun of it,

00:16:39.340 but also for the academic that it was,

00:16:41.620 uh,

00:16:41.760 it stimulated a part of their minds that lent itself to their other academic

00:16:45.920 pursuits pursuits.

00:16:47.820 And,

00:16:48.220 you know,

00:16:48.720 I grew up in a household where that was the family business.

00:16:51.620 So then after my father passed away,

00:16:54.200 I created the show where basically I'm doing that with music.

00:16:58.140 And so clearly there's a connection there.

00:17:02.180 Um,

00:17:02.980 and yes,

00:17:03.420 I do write about it in my book,

00:17:04.620 which is called accidental initiations.

00:17:07.380 In the Kabbalistic tree of Olympia.

00:17:09.120 It's published from sync book press.

00:17:10.740 And it's,

00:17:10.980 it's part intimate memoir includes a little geomancy,

00:17:14.220 some mysticism,

00:17:15.340 cultural myths,

00:17:16.200 self-fulfillment.

00:17:16.940 And you even include a tip for men to practice on how to control their orgasm in a section about

00:17:21.960 tantric art.

00:17:22.520 So you've pretty much tried everything,

00:17:23.920 haven't you?

00:17:25.200 I,

00:17:25.880 I have been,

00:17:27.680 uh,

00:17:29.020 hewn by life into the monster that I stand before you as now.

00:17:35.900 Um,

00:17:36.500 yeah,

00:17:36.820 I've been through,

00:17:37.380 I've had a lot of different teachers and a lot of different groups that I fell into.

00:17:41.540 And,

00:17:42.740 um,

00:17:44.800 I don't know if you'll remember,

00:17:47.340 but,

00:17:47.680 and it's going to,

00:17:48.160 this is going to date me back,

00:17:49.340 back,

00:17:49.660 but back in the early eighties,

00:17:50.820 there was a Dudley Moore film called Holy Moses.

00:17:53.680 Yeah,

00:17:53.960 I know the one.

00:17:54.760 And it's all about this guy who like,

00:17:56.620 he lives next door to Moses and he's always on the,

00:17:59.160 right on the periphery of where historic shit is happening.

00:18:02.920 Um,

00:18:03.360 I didn't even like the movie that much when I was a kid,

00:18:09.220 but over my life,

00:18:09.960 I've thought about it a lot because,

00:18:12.300 uh,

00:18:12.680 that does feel like what my life is.

00:18:14.740 It's the books called accidental initiations because my life does feel like,

00:18:18.360 and I think most people's lives are like this if they are,

00:18:20.920 if they allow it to be,

00:18:21.860 uh,

00:18:22.580 are a series of accidental initiations.

00:18:25.640 Um,

00:18:26.520 and sometimes we initiate ourselves and sometimes other people initiate us.

00:18:30.360 And sometimes we initiate others without even knowing it.

00:18:34.120 And,

00:18:34.600 you know,

00:18:35.260 initiate is really just like to engage.

00:18:38.480 Um,

00:18:39.480 and nothing more than that.

00:18:40.460 Like when we,

00:18:41.280 like we're just meeting each other,

00:18:43.020 Lana,

00:18:43.220 we are initiating each other into each other's,

00:18:46.220 into the,

00:18:47.640 whatever,

00:18:48.080 into the interviewer,

00:18:49.200 interviewee relationship or the,

00:18:51.420 you know,

00:18:51.860 sort of synchronistic,

00:18:53.800 uh,

00:18:55.720 fraternity sorority that we are a part of or whatever.

00:19:00.860 Um,

00:19:01.540 I like to go to the beginning of your book because you talk about a Kabbalistic

00:19:05.280 tree of life in Olympia,

00:19:06.820 Washington that basically revealed itself to you and the kneeling Freemason who

00:19:10.740 appears at the intended base of the tree.

00:19:13.060 So tell us how you found this tree and why it became important to you because

00:19:16.660 you use it all throughout the book to correlate it through various events in

00:19:20.120 your life.

00:19:21.100 Yes,

00:19:21.360 there is a Kabbalistic tree of life that is built into the city of Olympia and,

00:19:27.660 um,

00:19:29.720 it's not to go to Dan Brown on it because at the base of it,

00:19:32.820 there actually is a sort of kneeling Freemason statue.

00:19:36.640 And it says by the,

00:19:37.680 you know,

00:19:37.900 this is dedicated by the Freemasons of Washington state of every creed in

00:19:40.880 color.

00:19:41.160 And it's very clear,

00:19:42.900 like it's signed and it's at the base of this structure of a walking structure,

00:19:49.660 not a built up.

00:19:50.640 So like a horizontal structure on a vertical structure,

00:19:55.000 um,

00:19:55.940 that is built into the city.

00:19:58.380 And I have been playing and living and being drawn to this park,

00:20:04.680 which is,

00:20:05.000 I think most people who are from Olympia are familiar with it and have probably gone and

00:20:09.180 smoked pot in the gazebo or,

00:20:11.300 you know,

00:20:11.860 walk through it on a summer day or been to some rally there.

00:20:15.120 It's the center of town and has been since there.

00:20:18.480 I mean,

00:20:18.640 it was the,

00:20:19.080 it was the site of where the,

00:20:20.480 where the fort was before there was a town when this was just an outpost in the conquest of the Americas.

00:20:26.300 It's actually,

00:20:27.400 it actually is marked as the end of the Oregon trail.

00:20:30.980 So it's this very historic park with a kneeling Freemason at the base of it.

00:20:35.660 And,

00:20:36.100 um,

00:20:37.920 and all just interesting energy to it.

00:20:41.000 And when I was 40 years old and sort of at a very,

00:20:45.100 very weird,

00:20:46.280 I was studying Kabbalah and a lot of stuff in my life was falling away that,

00:20:51.260 uh,

00:20:52.340 seemed pretty like foundational in my life.

00:20:55.840 And,

00:20:56.240 uh,

00:20:57.520 and this structure of the Kabbalistic tree was what I was meditating on.

00:21:02.160 And while I was meditating on it,

00:21:03.680 I was,

00:21:04.380 I was going out and running and I would run this pattern in this park.

00:21:10.340 And I don't know,

00:21:12.780 there's a moment where I'd see it as if it's a movie where I'm running in it and I'm looking down and then I look around and all of a sudden the camera pulls up from where I am and reveals that this image that I've been looking at on the wall is,

00:21:27.460 and I'm at the center of it.

00:21:29.280 And all of a sudden,

00:21:30.300 and I'm in this,

00:21:32.020 I'm in this Kabbalah class with all these sort of new agey kind of people and they're all supposed to draw Kabbalistic trees and,

00:21:39.040 you know,

00:21:39.320 they're making them out of gemstones and different things like that.

00:21:42.940 And I'm feeling kind of like,

00:21:44.860 all I want to do is go out and run this stuff.

00:21:47.500 I don't know why I want to run it.

00:21:48.900 It's like I wanted to sing it when it like,

00:21:50.540 but I wasn't playing rock and roll.

00:21:51.820 I would have sung it if I was still had a band,

00:21:54.460 but I just felt like I wanted to run it.

00:21:56.220 I wouldn't want to run it.

00:21:56.880 And then all of a sudden this camera of my mind pulls back and I see myself.

00:22:01.660 I've got the coolest Kabbalistic tree of life ever.

00:22:05.040 It's encoded with every aspect of my life.

00:22:07.640 My babyhood.

00:22:08.980 I have memories there.

00:22:10.220 My childhood,

00:22:11.660 my,

00:22:12.220 you know,

00:22:12.440 there's aspects of my life all over it.

00:22:14.900 So there's this Kabbalistic tree of life that,

00:22:17.660 you know,

00:22:17.980 and it's,

00:22:18.660 I mean,

00:22:18.980 it's bloody as hell in a lot of ways.

00:22:22.260 And that realization led to a very powerful practice,

00:22:27.360 which on June 16th of 2011 led me to explode and start writing.

00:22:38.980 The book that became Accidental Initiations.

00:22:42.140 It was more like a love poem,

00:22:46.840 like not love poem,

00:22:47.820 but like a love rant slash suicide note to,

00:22:51.580 you know,

00:22:53.620 to people who would be born after I was dead from old age.

00:22:58.480 You know,

00:22:58.700 like it was just like,

00:22:59.700 you know,

00:23:00.020 and well,

00:23:00.320 you know,

00:23:00.520 it was just very,

00:23:01.800 just in a passionate explosion.

00:23:02.900 And then these crazy synchronicities started happening.

00:23:05.420 And the guy,

00:23:06.420 Alan Abadesa Green from SyncBook Press was introduced to me by Douglas Bowles just through the internet.

00:23:12.840 And so he was writing this book,

00:23:14.800 putting out this book called SyncBook Volume One,

00:23:17.780 SyncBook,

00:23:18.240 just SyncBook.

00:23:18.780 And did I have a chapter?

00:23:22.320 And I'm a musician.

00:23:23.920 I'm an actor.

00:23:24.860 I'm a producer of Radio 8 Ball.

00:23:26.760 I've done some freelance journalism,

00:23:28.340 but no one ever calls me to write anything.

00:23:30.360 So the fact that this guy was calling me to write a chapter for a book called The SyncBook,

00:23:35.300 right after I had just,

00:23:37.000 I'd had this incredible awakening inside the tree,

00:23:40.460 I should say about June 15th,

00:23:41.860 it was a full moon and a total eclipse and it was the full moon before the solstice.

00:23:49.240 It was a powerful,

00:23:50.580 really powerful night and powerful nights in this,

00:23:54.300 these powerful items,

00:23:56.020 you know,

00:23:56.200 you go hang out at the pyramids of Giza at the right time and you're going to,

00:24:00.020 you don't need to take any medicine whatsoever,

00:24:02.320 you know,

00:24:02.560 and the same applies to this.

00:24:05.200 But in this case,

00:24:06.040 I had taken,

00:24:06.800 I'll be honest,

00:24:07.280 I had taken some of the Terence McKenna and it,

00:24:11.860 and so it resulted in this explosion,

00:24:16.700 which was felt within the Sync community and drew me into the Sync community.

00:24:21.600 And it was strange because I was the last writer,

00:24:25.160 maybe one of the last,

00:24:26.340 one of two writers to be included in SyncBook.

00:24:30.080 So Alan had been working on it for a long time,

00:24:33.000 but pretty much I sent it to him and a few weeks later he was in Olympia with a copy of the book.

00:24:39.020 So I was like the last guy on the elevator.

00:24:40.760 And there I was a published writer and literally I had just gotten fired from a job.

00:24:47.480 My life was horrible.

00:24:49.360 It's not that much better now,

00:24:50.880 but it's a million times better because I found this community of Sync,

00:24:54.640 of the Sync crowd that has the kind of creative listening that I've always been writing

00:25:02.600 and creating my art for.

00:25:06.060 And at any rate,

00:25:06.900 so I took Alan on the walk through this tree and he told me,

00:25:10.820 if you,

00:25:11.120 I told him I was writing about it.

00:25:12.140 He said,

00:25:12.320 well,

00:25:12.400 if you finish the book,

00:25:13.300 we're thinking about starting a publishing house.

00:25:15.440 And if you finish it and it's good,

00:25:17.900 we'll put it out.

00:25:20.180 So yeah,

00:25:20.900 I thought that your book was basically,

00:25:22.460 you're trying to map your own walking the tree of life,

00:25:26.780 all the different phases and all the different correlations.

00:25:30.260 So do you think everyone is going through a sort of ritual drama unconsciously walking the tree of life?

00:25:36.200 Absolutely.

00:25:37.480 I think everyone is.

00:25:40.360 And until,

00:25:43.060 I don't want to say that Kabbalah is the answer because I don't know what the answer is.

00:25:47.620 But in my case,

00:25:49.800 what I learned from Kabbalah was something that I learned from a lot of my other practices,

00:25:55.700 my balanced diet of cults,

00:25:58.000 is that there are these energy centers and you can get stuck in them.

00:26:03.260 And the game really is to run the tree.

00:26:07.760 That's why my run through it,

00:26:09.620 having it as a walking labyrinth is really awesome because you don't really,

00:26:13.120 when you have that,

00:26:13.960 you walk through it and you get that that's what you do in your life.

00:26:17.660 And you don't want to get bogged down in anyone.

00:26:21.620 And you start to notice,

00:26:23.320 I mean,

00:26:23.880 you read my book.

00:26:24.780 There's one chapter that's very long.

00:26:27.140 That's the chapter where I get stuck.

00:26:29.400 That's the energy center where I get stuck as a human being.

00:26:33.260 Um,

00:26:34.120 well,

00:26:34.300 and to draw a good picture of this,

00:26:35.760 the tree of life,

00:26:36.340 it forms a geometric grid on the body,

00:26:38.360 basically consisting of PowerPoints or chakras or the Saphiroth,

00:26:41.980 right?

00:26:43.560 Absolutely.

00:26:44.380 Thank you for anything that you think needs clarifying.

00:26:47.420 Please do.

00:26:48.380 Cause you gave me free license to just talk as if everyone gets it.

00:26:53.900 More questions.

00:26:58.720 Yeah.

00:26:58.960 So how,

00:26:59.420 how can this tree of life help in self understanding?

00:27:02.920 Where did it come from?

00:27:03.920 This idea?

00:27:05.160 Well,

00:27:05.680 I'm,

00:27:06.120 I'm really not qualified.

00:27:07.960 Anything I say on that is sort of secondhand.

00:27:10.240 The,

00:27:10.380 the idea of the Kabbalah is something that I encourage people to study.

00:27:15.280 Um,

00:27:16.240 it is powerful.

00:27:17.320 And I hope that you find a really good teacher,

00:27:20.600 um,

00:27:21.360 in that regard.

00:27:23.760 For me,

00:27:25.000 just the,

00:27:25.500 what I would say to,

00:27:26.360 and I,

00:27:26.700 this is book is written for people who are not particularly Kabbalah scholars,

00:27:30.420 but people who are,

00:27:31.040 it's,

00:27:31.200 it's in a way a little travel guidebook for people who visit Olympia is there's this

00:27:36.220 Kabbalistic tree of life here.

00:27:37.740 I'm going to lay it out.

00:27:38.400 This is what happened to me when I lived around it.

00:27:41.420 It's very powerful.

00:27:43.720 Go for a walk in it and see what happens.

00:27:46.560 Um,

00:27:47.160 it is a map of consciousness and it's very well balanced and it exists.

00:27:52.220 And so why not use it again?

00:27:56.160 If you happen to grow up next to one of the pyramids that,

00:28:00.680 you know,

00:28:02.220 create a supposed network on the earth that predates modern civilization,

00:28:07.620 well,

00:28:08.080 then you're lucky to,

00:28:09.560 you know,

00:28:09.980 to be able to participate in that and you should use it.

00:28:13.040 Just like if you're next to a waterfall,

00:28:14.720 use it.

00:28:15.280 You know,

00:28:15.500 these are,

00:28:15.900 except these are,

00:28:17.540 are consciously made items left behind as artwork.

00:28:23.640 Um,

00:28:23.960 and what's interesting,

00:28:25.480 very interesting about the Kabbalistic tree of Olympia is that it's not like

00:28:29.100 this ancient thing that was placed there to be the Kabbalistic tree of life.

00:28:34.580 And then it just sort of happens to be there.

00:28:37.620 There every,

00:28:39.880 over the last 20,

00:28:41.040 ever since 1976,

00:28:42.280 since the Bicentennial,

00:28:43.940 there have been additions to the park,

00:28:46.500 little improvements,

00:28:48.060 little tweaks here and there.

00:28:49.580 And each one has brought the,

00:28:51.880 this particular walking labyrinth more in alignment with the Kabbalistic tree of life than it was before.

00:28:58.900 And very much so after the millennium,

00:29:02.660 uh,

00:29:03.060 when they built in a big mound,

00:29:07.720 right where,

00:29:08.980 I'm going to get Kabbalah-y on you,

00:29:12.600 where Chokmah is and a,

00:29:15.460 a swirl,

00:29:16.700 a sort of a yin swirl,

00:29:18.180 Fibonacci swirl,

00:29:19.160 where Bina would be.

00:29:20.440 And they are the Sephirot that,

00:29:22.800 uh,

00:29:23.900 bookend or,

00:29:24.860 or bridge the,

00:29:26.380 the abyss,

00:29:27.780 da'at.

00:29:29.040 And,

00:29:30.160 you know,

00:29:30.400 one is the,

00:29:31.000 you know,

00:29:31.360 one is the sort of masculine swirl,

00:29:33.820 and one is the feminine,

00:29:34.880 and they're above,

00:29:35.540 one is at the top of the masculine pillar in the tree of life,

00:29:38.300 and one is above the feminine pillar.

00:29:39.580 And that's just been put in since 2000.

00:29:43.020 And so,

00:29:44.720 one of the things,

00:29:46.840 I don't make any,

00:29:47.700 I don't believe,

00:29:48.680 I'm not interested in detective work.

00:29:51.640 Um,

00:29:52.380 so I haven't,

00:29:55.580 I'm not really,

00:29:56.400 I'm kind of curious for someone else to be a detective and figure out if this is intentional.

00:30:01.120 But my feeling is,

00:30:02.300 if it's not intentional,

00:30:04.540 then life is so much more magical than I even want to begin to fathom,

00:30:08.340 that it's easier,

00:30:09.680 easier to think that,

00:30:10.660 like,

00:30:11.220 someone's,

00:30:11.940 you know,

00:30:13.500 keeping this going.

00:30:14.940 Well,

00:30:15.040 in your book,

00:30:15.520 you say,

00:30:15.780 I'm going to read a little section.

00:30:17.300 Welcome to the world of 21st century geomancy.

00:30:20.040 As prophesied by art activist and former evergreen professor,

00:30:23.380 Jose Arguelles,

00:30:24.240 in his 1988 book,

00:30:25.580 Earth Ascending,

00:30:26.480 we are realigning with the sacred artifacts of our earth-wise ancestors.

00:30:30.680 In doing so,

00:30:31.240 we are bringing these artifacts to life and ourselves into alignment with their energies.

00:30:37.320 Absolutely.

00:30:38.340 God,

00:30:38.840 you know,

00:30:39.140 it's,

00:30:39.420 it's not bad.

00:30:40.680 It's not bad.

00:30:41.220 I really,

00:30:41.740 I,

00:30:42.260 you know,

00:30:42.520 any art you create when you're this close to it,

00:30:44.820 only within,

00:30:45.400 only two years out,

00:30:46.220 I really,

00:30:46.860 I think I really wish I had written a better book.

00:30:49.640 But it wasn't,

00:30:50.260 it wasn't about writing a good book.

00:30:51.800 It was about writing a very honest book that was,

00:30:54.400 that seemed genuinely inspired and,

00:30:58.560 and I will never do anything like it again.

00:31:02.120 It's very embarrassing.

00:31:03.220 And like you say,

00:31:03.700 it's,

00:31:04.520 I think you said before the interview,

00:31:06.360 you feel like,

00:31:06.860 you know me very well,

00:31:08.220 but it doesn't,

00:31:08.820 it doesn't work as a cautionary tale.

00:31:11.680 It's like,

00:31:12.120 you know,

00:31:12.680 um,

00:31:13.380 it never does.

00:31:14.240 You can tell someone,

00:31:15.520 warn them a million times that until they go through it,

00:31:18.000 it doesn't,

00:31:18.600 it's not going to soak their head,

00:31:20.420 you know?

00:31:20.940 Well,

00:31:21.200 I guess that's it.

00:31:21.920 It's not so much that it's,

00:31:23.240 it's just saying that this is true.

00:31:27.860 And in order for me to let you know that this is true and have it resonate with your truth,

00:31:33.340 I have to be totally honest in what I'm saying.

00:31:39.100 Um,

00:31:40.060 even to the point of,

00:31:41.220 you know,

00:31:42.460 even I'm saying that about that book,

00:31:44.000 there's a way that that book is a,

00:31:45.860 the ways it's dishonest are honest,

00:31:49.880 if I could say,

00:31:51.080 I don't know if that makes sense.

00:31:53.500 Um,

00:31:54.480 so anyway,

00:31:56.360 I was nice to hear you read it.

00:31:57.420 You read,

00:31:57.740 you read it very nicely.

00:31:58.480 You also have a section of the book that explains a balanced diet of cults,

00:32:02.380 which I liked.

00:32:03.020 Can you talk about that a little bit?

00:32:05.100 Um,

00:32:05.500 yeah,

00:32:05.860 I just,

00:32:06.380 I,

00:32:06.840 like I said,

00:32:07.740 I've,

00:32:08.180 I've had many different teachers.

00:32:09.860 I've fallen in with many different crowds and some of the teachers have been,

00:32:15.360 what you would think of as sacred,

00:32:17.280 like,

00:32:18.420 I don't know,

00:32:19.440 Buddhist monks or,

00:32:21.580 you know,

00:32:23.700 inspirational people with a lineage that they come from.

00:32:28.960 And some of it's,

00:32:30.100 you know,

00:32:30.220 might think of as profane,

00:32:31.420 like rock and roll or movies or,

00:32:34.120 you know,

00:32:34.960 culture,

00:32:35.820 um,

00:32:37.120 or practices,

00:32:39.200 sacred and profane.

00:32:41.220 And at a certain point,

00:32:43.440 I realized that I had developed this balanced diet of cults where I kind of had a different,

00:32:49.640 like,

00:32:50.880 I can,

00:32:52.120 I could accommodate almost any philosophy as long as I could find the,

00:32:56.380 the consciousness located in my body,

00:32:59.240 which is something I learned from the tantra cult,

00:33:01.120 which is very,

00:33:01.900 really good for the root and second chakra.

00:33:05.000 Also pretty good for the crown chakra.

00:33:06.720 So it's like good for uniting those.

00:33:09.760 I mean,

00:33:10.480 it's,

00:33:10.720 it's tantra Buddhism,

00:33:12.020 kind of good for all the chakras,

00:33:14.040 but there are some that are more resonant with particular ones.

00:33:18.060 Like,

00:33:18.820 um,

00:33:19.640 I don't know,

00:33:21.740 a lot of Judeo Christian,

00:33:22.980 I talk,

00:33:23.360 I say light for Christianity,

00:33:25.320 but I kind of think it's just like,

00:33:26.300 like a Judeo Christian thing that it's a very,

00:33:29.020 it's very heart and mind centered,

00:33:30.720 um,

00:33:33.020 you know,

00:33:33.260 which is good for certain things and not good for other things.

00:33:36.440 You know,

00:33:36.580 it's just no,

00:33:37.500 and they're good to go to like the,

00:33:39.340 I don't know,

00:33:39.720 like the supreme forgiveness of Jesus is awesome.

00:33:45.100 It's very super heart,

00:33:46.660 super,

00:33:47.260 super heart energy.

00:33:48.760 And that fills all the other chakras in a certain way.

00:33:52.200 But,

00:33:53.000 you know,

00:33:53.260 what Christianity also resonates and is attracted to itself is a lot of body haters.

00:33:57.380 And so that's not really great if you want to have an intimate relationship with another human being,

00:34:05.400 unless it's like,

00:34:06.740 unless it really is that pure heart thing,

00:34:10.860 but that pure,

00:34:11.480 you know,

00:34:11.660 you have to take as a synchromistic,

00:34:13.140 you have to take things as they are.

00:34:15.480 And the truth is that the whole Judeo Christian thing has so much,

00:34:20.100 you know,

00:34:20.340 it's just got so much blood on it.

00:34:22.240 I mean,

00:34:22.380 all these religions do,

00:34:23.940 but,

00:34:24.180 uh,

00:34:24.560 but the particular kind of,

00:34:26.800 I don't know,

00:34:27.240 just awful sex hating,

00:34:29.280 you know,

00:34:31.560 witch burning thing that a lot of the patriarchal religions have connected to them are,

00:34:37.580 they're disquieting to say the least.

00:34:39.740 Um,

00:34:40.200 but they're around us.

00:34:41.080 So you take them,

00:34:41.620 you take what you can from it and leave the rest.

00:34:44.140 Sort of a thing that I learned as an actor,

00:34:46.300 you know,

00:34:46.540 use whatever,

00:34:48.060 use whatever you can to do the role that's in front of you.

00:34:50.600 And sometimes I can,

00:34:52.460 you know,

00:34:52.620 it's great.

00:34:53.320 It's my job to be really humble and I can use the philosophy that gets me there.

00:34:57.400 And sometimes it's my job,

00:34:58.660 like in this interview,

00:34:59.380 to just totally talk my ass off and dominate and act like I'm kind of important.

00:35:04.460 And then it's important for me not,

00:35:06.520 you know,

00:35:06.680 to know which philosophy and which cult,

00:35:09.580 which teaching,

00:35:10.580 which practice,

00:35:11.280 uh,

00:35:12.480 fulfills and helps me to get to do that job.

00:35:15.240 Mm-hmm.

00:35:16.040 Um,

00:35:16.640 and today,

00:35:17.020 don't you find that our pop culture is all about feeding the root chakra?

00:35:21.120 That's all out of balance.

00:35:22.360 If you look around.

00:35:24.060 Oh,

00:35:24.500 I don't know about that.

00:35:25.520 I mean,

00:35:25.760 I'm part of a,

00:35:26.740 I think,

00:35:27.120 I think sync is part of a pop culture movement that is really aimed at the,

00:35:32.300 the third eye in a,

00:35:35.880 in a big way,

00:35:36.660 in a really powerful and important and an initiatory way.

00:35:40.600 And films like Room 237 or I don't know,

00:35:44.040 just interesting,

00:35:45.060 I don't know,

00:35:47.540 shows like,

00:35:48.700 uh,

00:35:50.100 Dan Harmon's Community or,

00:35:53.560 I don't know,

00:35:53.960 other sort of,

00:35:55.460 uh,

00:35:57.000 mind twistingly humorous,

00:35:58.920 uh,

00:36:00.280 expressions of pop culture are,

00:36:03.120 you know,

00:36:03.380 there are intelligent stuff.

00:36:04.780 You're right.

00:36:05.180 Most of the,

00:36:05.660 you know,

00:36:07.000 I'm sure porn is the most popular thing on the internet.

00:36:10.400 Um,

00:36:11.060 but aside from,

00:36:13.420 I think that has more to do with the fact that it's the only,

00:36:17.960 like that there is still a lot of shame out in the world and people are still like,

00:36:21.960 sort of hiding their sexuality in,

00:36:25.240 you know,

00:36:25.480 private little boxes and screens.

00:36:28.380 Um,

00:36:28.980 but at the same time,

00:36:32.160 we're finding out there is no privacy.

00:36:33.540 So all that private,

00:36:36.740 uh,

00:36:37.920 all that private ritual that people think they've been doing is not private at all.

00:36:43.000 It's well documented.

00:36:44.720 Yeah.

00:36:44.960 Um,

00:36:45.520 it's great because in a way nobody will ever be able to be blackmailed for,

00:36:49.140 for masturbating again because everybody.

00:36:54.420 But it seems like people are happy to volunteer all this information and put it out there.

00:36:59.520 I don't know if people are happy.

00:37:00.880 I think people are,

00:37:02.120 it's what,

00:37:02.520 it goes back to your question.

00:37:04.580 People are resigned to not having control.

00:37:08.040 I think that started with the election.

00:37:09.560 For me,

00:37:10.040 it really started with the election of 2000.

00:37:12.260 When that happened,

00:37:14.020 it was so clear that things could happen in front of us in plain sight and nothing would get done about it.

00:37:21.280 Um,

00:37:22.280 and maybe that was just my naivete leading up to that point,

00:37:26.540 but I don't think I've been that naive up to that.

00:37:28.380 I'd already been through the Persian,

00:37:29.720 you know,

00:37:31.260 Persian Gulf War one,

00:37:33.060 um,

00:37:34.500 and been through being a sort of moderate little Hollywood actor and see a little bit behind the curtain of how things work.

00:37:42.080 Um,

00:37:44.140 but still,

00:37:45.640 2000 was,

00:37:47.280 2000 was huge.

00:37:50.360 Um,

00:37:51.080 I don't know if it was,

00:37:53.220 if it was for you.

00:37:54.140 I,

00:37:54.260 I feel like it was,

00:37:55.220 I think it was a big turning point for the country,

00:37:58.980 but,

00:37:59.220 uh,

00:37:59.440 but I've,

00:37:59.860 I've waited away from my book and out of my expertise.

00:38:02.520 No,

00:38:02.640 it's okay.

00:38:03.140 I wanted to ask you though,

00:38:03.940 have you analyzed or interpreted the films you've acted in?

00:38:07.420 Well,

00:38:07.980 I,

00:38:08.320 any things or messages?

00:38:10.080 I'm really glad you asked that because I always had a sense that there was some things going on there,

00:38:16.900 but I didn't know what it was.

00:38:19.560 Um,

00:38:20.520 and then Will Morgan,

00:38:23.200 who is one of the characters from sync book who I met,

00:38:27.860 uh,

00:38:28.520 he interviewed me for a show called 42 minutes that he does with Douglas Bowles on sync book radio.

00:38:34.980 And,

00:38:35.460 and he got kind of obsessed with finding the sinks in my films and what he's done over the last year.

00:38:46.160 Well,

00:38:46.740 first of all,

00:38:47.400 he made a film called psychocinematic analysis that connected the sinks of my being in the dream,

00:38:55.720 nightmare on Elm street,

00:38:56.740 the dream master with my father's work about dreams and that connecting to radio eight ball and my work with radio eight ball.

00:39:04.100 And other weird sinks like,

00:39:06.180 uh,

00:39:07.620 my working with Viggo Mortensen and sort of,

00:39:10.100 that's one of my Holy Moses things.

00:39:11.620 Viggo was,

00:39:12.500 I got Viggo as agent.

00:39:13.640 We worked on this crappy little B movie.

00:39:15.720 I don't know who Viggo,

00:39:16.480 if you know who Viggo is,

00:39:17.200 he was the,

00:39:17.760 he's King Aragorn and in,

00:39:19.720 uh,

00:39:20.220 Lord of the Rings and,

00:39:21.160 uh,

00:39:23.460 David Cronenberg's sort of the Robert De Niro to David Cronenberg's Martin Scorsese.

00:39:29.100 Forgive me if I get a little bit movie heavy on this,

00:39:32.200 you know,

00:39:32.480 again,

00:39:33.080 let me know if I need to,

00:39:34.200 you know,

00:39:34.920 explain anything.

00:39:35.920 But,

00:39:36.780 um,

00:39:37.700 so he honed in on that and,

00:39:40.560 uh,

00:39:40.900 that was a really,

00:39:41.740 it was this weird rough work.

00:39:43.520 It felt like,

00:39:44.520 as I said at the time,

00:39:45.460 it felt sort of like having your brain operated on while you're awake.

00:39:50.180 Um,

00:39:51.140 in the way,

00:39:52.840 and it did sort of rewire my brain in some certain ways and make me see sinks in my films.

00:39:58.520 In a very personal way that I had always kind of suspected,

00:40:02.400 but it takes someone else to show it to you because it would really be,

00:40:05.960 I don't know.

00:40:06.400 I mean,

00:40:06.580 I wouldn't even know how to go about trying to explain that to someone and Will did.

00:40:11.000 And then he and I started to work on films about other actors,

00:40:14.180 uh,

00:40:14.880 with me narrating and sort of helping out a little bit with the writing and him,

00:40:20.660 uh,

00:40:21.560 creating films for different actors.

00:40:23.900 And I'd already experimented with this,

00:40:25.420 with having Jake Koza,

00:40:26.760 who's probably been on this network as well,

00:40:29.540 uh,

00:40:30.500 doing,

00:40:31.280 you know,

00:40:31.580 doing films for some of the actors who have been on Radio 8 Ball,

00:40:34.700 like Seth Green and John C.

00:40:36.340 Reilly and,

00:40:37.260 um,

00:40:38.620 Radon Chong and,

00:40:39.880 you know,

00:40:40.600 a lot of other people.

00:40:42.440 And Patricia Arquette was another one.

00:40:43.860 Um,

00:40:45.740 and now having done that,

00:40:49.860 Will has started on a collect,

00:40:51.600 on a series,

00:40:53.020 really exploring these different themes of sync that,

00:40:56.520 that show up in my films.

00:40:59.380 And it's such a strange,

00:41:02.600 uh,

00:41:03.160 process working on this.

00:41:04.960 In some ways,

00:41:05.740 it's very pleasurable to my ego.

00:41:07.620 In some ways,

00:41:08.040 it's very challenging to my ego.

00:41:11.460 Because I feel like it's a totally,

00:41:13.440 I don't know,

00:41:15.320 self-indulgent exercise,

00:41:17.300 except that there's an artist,

00:41:19.540 who I really respect,

00:41:20.600 Will,

00:41:21.480 um,

00:41:22.600 who really,

00:41:23.240 who finds this meaning in,

00:41:25.580 the sort of crappy films that I've been in,

00:41:28.960 for the most part.

00:41:29.840 You know,

00:41:30.060 I think most people who were in and involved with them would recognize that

00:41:33.260 they're not great works of art,

00:41:36.100 or great works of cinema.

00:41:37.040 They have moments of okayness,

00:41:40.740 and they fit into whatever commercial thing that they fit into,

00:41:44.260 but they're not,

00:41:45.260 they're not expressing consciously the intensity that an artist like Will is picking up off of them.

00:41:54.780 And in a way that goes back,

00:41:56.200 it's just like,

00:41:56.820 it doesn't have to be a good song to be a good answer.

00:41:59.660 You don't have to be in great films to have a through line and a sync thread and a sort of these resonant themes that show up.

00:42:11.100 You just,

00:42:11.780 that's the nature of film.

00:42:13.640 Film captures these moments,

00:42:15.680 and moments,

00:42:17.840 and in some ways,

00:42:18.820 particularly in bad films,

00:42:20.120 because bad films don't have as much control over what ends up on,

00:42:22.800 on tape.

00:42:24.660 And when you leave room for the flaw,

00:42:28.220 when it's like asking the question and pushing shuffle function,

00:42:31.040 when you allow something to accidentally initiate a situation,

00:42:36.720 synchronicity happens.

00:42:38.740 And when synchronicity happens,

00:42:40.500 you are out of the normal temporal situation.

00:42:46.360 You know,

00:42:46.600 you're time traveling.

00:42:48.040 And you called cinema a psychedelic medium in your book.

00:42:51.660 Oh,

00:42:51.840 absolutely.

00:42:52.800 Absolutely.

00:42:53.160 well,

00:42:53.460 you've you're it's full immersion.

00:42:54.920 It changes your,

00:42:56.620 it makes you think that you're in a dream.

00:43:00.840 And then there,

00:43:01.840 I mean,

00:43:02.000 and then there are these other aspects of if you,

00:43:04.220 if it,

00:43:04.520 if you record yourself and a lot of people,

00:43:07.920 or someone else records you and a lot of people watch it,

00:43:10.980 then a lot of people are projecting their consciousness onto the sacred artifact of your body,

00:43:19.000 which lives outside of who you actually are.

00:43:22.060 It's the thing that's on tape and part of someone else's fantastical vision.

00:43:28.740 Do you think there are producers,

00:43:30.520 directors,

00:43:31.460 actors that are conscious of this capacity to change the reality of the viewer?

00:43:35.840 And they're consciously doing that?

00:43:38.400 Precious few.

00:43:39.280 And I hope they're listening.

00:43:40.700 I've been waiting for you all my lives.

00:43:42.500 I've been preparing.

00:43:44.300 Yeah.

00:43:44.880 No,

00:43:45.220 I think some do.

00:43:46.340 I think,

00:43:46.800 I think like,

00:43:47.940 I mean,

00:43:48.160 I'll tell you for myself,

00:43:49.920 I couldn't,

00:43:51.000 I couldn't have put this into words before encountering the sync community.

00:43:58.660 And,

00:43:59.060 uh,

00:44:01.000 even if I could,

00:44:01.800 I would have,

00:44:02.320 I would never have dared utter them because it would sound so delusional.

00:44:08.060 Like all of,

00:44:09.000 all of these films,

00:44:10.160 these crappy films that I played little roles or big roles or,

00:44:13.100 but all just sort of like,

00:44:14.380 I don't know,

00:44:14.680 there's no through line.

00:44:15.680 And I can say,

00:44:16.820 well,

00:44:17.260 there is a through line.

00:44:18.140 I don't know how or some,

00:44:19.460 but there's some way that it feels like every film I walk out of that same

00:44:23.600 character,

00:44:24.160 he puts on a different cloak or a different something,

00:44:27.340 but he walks into the next film and it feels like there's this through line.

00:44:30.660 Like I'm not bigger than the films,

00:44:33.260 but in a some,

00:44:34.140 in some way I am.

00:44:36.060 And I would say every actor is,

00:44:38.560 it's just like everyone is a God,

00:44:41.200 a creator God in their own reality.

00:44:43.040 And also everyone's just some schmo who I don't want to have anything to do

00:44:45.680 with,

00:44:46.760 you know,

00:44:46.980 or I do want to have something to do with,

00:44:48.520 but you know what I mean?

00:44:49.100 Not like everyone is on the periphery of the Godhood and everyone is at the

00:44:54.840 center of it.

00:44:56.160 Um,

00:44:57.360 but from there,

00:44:58.480 so,

00:44:58.700 you know,

00:44:58.900 from your own standpoint,

00:44:59.740 and I hope if you are living your life,

00:45:02.040 you're at the center of the Godhood of your life.

00:45:04.140 And that includes me,

00:45:06.980 you know,

00:45:07.800 but I might,

00:45:08.540 it might not.

00:45:09.120 And in a lot of cases it doesn't.

00:45:10.800 And that's,

00:45:12.040 you know,

00:45:12.480 that's the nature of,

00:45:13.680 uh,

00:45:15.200 the crazy making nature of sync is that,

00:45:18.120 you know,

00:45:18.820 and especially you add in movies,

00:45:21.180 which have our particular,

00:45:22.340 have a particular power to them.

00:45:24.800 Um,

00:45:25.760 it does get confused.

00:45:26.520 It's a,

00:45:26.820 it's very weird to be a loser movie star.

00:45:28.800 Let me read some more from your book.

00:45:31.480 You say synchronicity expands the possibility.

00:45:34.520 So while cutting off most of the psychological escape routes,

00:45:37.600 once we realize that the world as we experience,

00:45:40.280 it is singing our reflections back at us all the time.

00:45:43.280 It makes it very hard to blame anyone else for our predicament or for that

00:45:46.960 matter to deny our own power.

00:45:48.700 Although most of us still try.

00:45:50.320 So have you discovered what it is that makes this process of mirroring ourselves back happening?

00:45:59.600 Explain.

00:46:00.140 I don't understand the question.

00:46:01.660 You're saying that there's this kind of the universe is singing our reflections back to us all the time.

00:46:06.260 Do you know what it is that's making that process happen?

00:46:09.740 No,

00:46:10.040 Ken,

00:46:10.240 that's detective work.

00:46:11.220 I'm not,

00:46:11.540 I mean,

00:46:13.280 I'm fully in the,

00:46:14.160 I think,

00:46:14.580 I've think,

00:46:15.100 I think of synchronicity as an art form that,

00:46:18.240 uh,

00:46:18.860 that empowers the listener.

00:46:20.700 Um,

00:46:21.100 I can come up with a bunch of different theories and the really fun thing about encountering the sync book crowd and reading one of the sync books is that you get so many different takes on sync as a phenomenon.

00:46:35.600 Yeah,

00:46:35.840 I like to hear those because some of them are pretty interesting.

00:46:38.480 Oh yeah,

00:46:38.880 they're all,

00:46:39.460 I mean,

00:46:39.760 you can,

00:46:40.100 it's like,

00:46:40.400 well,

00:46:40.540 it's like Room 237 for people who've seen it.

00:46:42.600 I think that Room 237 is the most important,

00:46:45.200 uh,

00:46:46.800 film in the realm of sync film that has happened yet.

00:46:50.460 And it's,

00:46:52.040 and the,

00:46:52.520 the reviews of it are usually,

00:46:54.100 oh,

00:46:54.320 well,

00:46:54.480 you hear these people and some of their theories are just batshit crazy about the shining.

00:46:59.300 And some of them are interesting and oh,

00:47:00.780 it's,

00:47:00.960 it's worth watching,

00:47:02.320 you know,

00:47:02.640 but in this sort of like,

00:47:03.440 but they make it sound like it's a reality film where you're laughing at the batshit crazy idea of these conspiracy theorists.

00:47:09.880 And I'm not saying that I agree with every interpretation,

00:47:12.500 but the point of a movie like Room 237 isn't to really unravel the mystery of Kubrick's film.

00:47:21.580 I mean,

00:47:21.960 it's to say that Kubrick created a mystery that he wanted to us,

00:47:24.780 wanted us to unravel that engages a kind of a part of our thinking,

00:47:28.200 which is now,

00:47:29.580 you know,

00:47:30.820 is,

00:47:31.260 is that was ahead of its time is very,

00:47:35.080 very sinky,

00:47:35.800 you know,

00:47:36.380 and it lends itself to lots of interpretations.

00:47:39.260 And,

00:47:39.700 you know,

00:47:41.800 just like we can say that like,

00:47:43.260 uh,

00:47:45.440 we said that like a bad song can give you a good answer and a bad,

00:47:49.200 you know,

00:47:49.340 bad movies can still reveal awesome sinks.

00:47:53.360 Great movies can as well,

00:47:55.660 you know,

00:47:55.920 in the shining or citizen Kane,

00:47:58.600 or,

00:47:58.900 uh,

00:47:59.520 I don't know.

00:47:59.880 We can,

00:48:00.240 you know,

00:48:00.420 we can make a,

00:48:01.120 you know,

00:48:01.320 Rosemary's baby.

00:48:02.340 There are a lot of very sinky,

00:48:03.940 you know,

00:48:04.140 wizard of Oz,

00:48:04.800 super sinky films that are great pieces of cinema and are like the,

00:48:12.560 you know,

00:48:12.780 are,

00:48:13.460 well,

00:48:14.680 bringing it back to the quest to your question,

00:48:16.520 it's like,

00:48:17.100 I kind of think we create our own universe and we're all doing it

00:48:23.900 accidentally.

00:48:24.640 So it's like,

00:48:25.260 it's very weird.

00:48:26.040 It's very weird universe we live in very contradictory.

00:48:29.300 Um,

00:48:30.160 but if we were,

00:48:31.120 then we would create,

00:48:32.260 you know,

00:48:32.860 the archons are Jim Carrey.

00:48:36.840 The archons are the,

00:48:38.900 you know,

00:48:39.160 these resonators that we project consciousness onto and then sit and,

00:48:42.620 you know,

00:48:43.120 sit and have our communal dream to.

00:48:47.100 And,

00:48:48.520 uh,

00:48:49.760 you know,

00:48:50.020 and that in a way controls us and feeds off of us because we pay money for

00:48:54.140 it.

00:48:54.300 We pay our attention to it.

00:48:56.380 Um,

00:48:57.680 you know,

00:48:58.100 it's,

00:48:58.360 I'm not saying that the other one,

00:48:59.940 that there aren't actual beings that are doing that,

00:49:02.480 but in a way,

00:49:03.480 if beings are doing that,

00:49:04.760 we've created a fantastic metaphor for it in our media.

00:49:09.440 We create these gods that make,

00:49:13.400 that feed very well off of our attention.

00:49:17.460 And,

00:49:18.200 um,

00:49:19.580 you know,

00:49:19.800 I,

00:49:20.220 we keep them alive by believing in them,

00:49:22.380 talking about them all the time.

00:49:23.980 Right.

00:49:24.740 And even not,

00:49:25.740 and that's the power of film.

00:49:27.140 That was the case when it,

00:49:28.420 when it really was about the spoken word or the live theater or the live

00:49:32.320 performance.

00:49:32.820 But the thing about like,

00:49:34.260 say an actor,

00:49:34.700 actor like myself,

00:49:36.160 um,

00:49:37.380 if people continuing to care was what kept you alive,

00:49:41.760 then I would probably be dead now.

00:49:44.040 Cause I went through,

00:49:44.940 I've gone through periods where people don't really care.

00:49:47.320 Um,

00:49:48.840 but something about the power of film has meant that these moments were

00:49:52.640 recorded and could be drawn up.

00:49:54.540 Like there's a film that I did with Jennifer Jason Lee called the prom.

00:49:57.960 And it was directed by Steve Schoenberg who directed secretary.

00:50:01.460 It was a student film and it was,

00:50:03.140 has not been available forever.

00:50:04.320 And then just this last year it was available.

00:50:07.280 It became available on the web.

00:50:08.600 Someone just posted it.

00:50:10.320 And all of a sudden this thing that I did back in 1990,

00:50:14.200 which was actually one of the few really good things I did,

00:50:16.820 I've done as an actor,

00:50:18.740 um,

00:50:19.760 all of a sudden became available and was alive again.

00:50:23.720 Cause no one could have cared about it before cause no one could have seen it.

00:50:26.840 But the power of film is that that moment we,

00:50:29.440 we can time travel back to that.

00:50:32.040 And,

00:50:32.600 uh,

00:50:33.480 Will Morgan does that very well in the,

00:50:36.160 the first installment of the film,

00:50:37.840 uh,

00:50:38.720 the,

00:50:39.160 his synchro,

00:50:40.160 sort of what would be like his synxploration of my,

00:50:43.600 uh,

00:50:44.200 my film career called the sacred kind.

00:50:48.100 And,

00:50:48.640 um,

00:50:49.640 he does something pretty awesome with this film called the prom in it.

00:50:53.900 Um,

00:50:55.460 at any rate,

00:50:56.140 uh,

00:50:56.560 I never know how far down the rabbit hole to go.

00:50:59.180 So you mentioned,

00:51:00.300 well,

00:51:00.480 yeah,

00:51:00.600 you mentioned something about our,

00:51:01.800 our body and being a time machine,

00:51:03.760 which you get into in the book.

00:51:04.980 And I thought that was interesting as well.

00:51:06.420 You talk about memory as a kind of time travel.

00:51:09.260 Can you get into that a little bit?

00:51:11.820 Well,

00:51:11.980 absolutely.

00:51:13.040 Um,

00:51:13.480 the,

00:51:15.700 uh,

00:51:16.300 well,

00:51:16.540 just it's,

00:51:17.280 I mean,

00:51:17.480 everyone knows this experience,

00:51:18.960 you know,

00:51:19.240 if you,

00:51:19.840 you have this,

00:51:21.580 you can draw up a memory that affects your body and it is a real experience.

00:51:27.980 And we have that capacity.

00:51:29.300 You can look at that as like,

00:51:30.500 uh,

00:51:31.500 an underused capacity.

00:51:33.060 I mean,

00:51:33.400 we spend a lot of time looking at other people's memories or our communal memory on screen.

00:51:39.380 And I think that probably saps our,

00:51:41.040 our capacity,

00:51:42.460 but even at low capacity,

00:51:45.200 I think everyone who's ever lived knows what it's like to be transported back to another time.

00:51:51.580 And it's fleeting.

00:51:53.580 Um,

00:51:54.540 but it is,

00:51:55.820 it's sort of like the,

00:51:58.000 um,

00:52:00.860 it'd be the latent expression of what makes us dream of time travel.

00:52:07.660 I mean,

00:52:08.400 why do we dream of time travel?

00:52:10.000 Because we have memory.

00:52:11.300 If we didn't have memory,

00:52:12.440 we wouldn't want to create time travel.

00:52:16.380 We wouldn't fantasize about it.

00:52:18.160 Right.

00:52:18.560 Cause we'd be just in the,

00:52:19.900 we'd be in the consistent,

00:52:20.820 in the constant now.

00:52:21.920 True.

00:52:23.060 Um,

00:52:23.540 so,

00:52:24.020 and I'm not even sure if this is how I described it in my book,

00:52:27.020 but it is sort of how I described it in my book because I'm just exploding.

00:52:30.180 It's really fun to talk with someone who's read the book.

00:52:32.740 Yeah.

00:52:33.140 Cause I liked how you talk about emotional work done at the level of memory has the capacity to change an individual's future.

00:52:39.000 And I feel that as well.

00:52:41.100 Absolutely.

00:52:42.480 How explain,

00:52:43.580 like what does that resonate for you?

00:52:46.080 Yeah.

00:52:46.220 And then you say,

00:52:46.760 well,

00:52:46.900 by reintegrating whoever was lost in the undistinguished experience and allowing the time traveler to

00:52:52.080 go forward as a slightly or radically different person.

00:52:54.860 So for me,

00:52:55.600 it thinks of times,

00:52:56.360 Oh,

00:52:56.540 I wish I redid that or said that different or did that experience different.

00:53:00.600 If I do it in my head and I'm really convicted of it,

00:53:03.680 it's,

00:53:04.040 it's like I I've done the work.

00:53:06.460 I know some people,

00:53:07.400 I know some people do meditation work and try and undo the past that way.

00:53:10.760 Try and unravel some of those kinks.

00:53:12.980 I think it's possible.

00:53:14.500 I think that's what a lot of artists are doing.

00:53:16.940 I think that's what,

00:53:17.540 I mean,

00:53:17.700 a lot of ways art is a way of taking a situation where you were powering,

00:53:22.080 powerless,

00:53:23.320 reclaiming it and owning it in a way and being able to be the,

00:53:28.240 again,

00:53:28.620 the God creator at the center of it and make it,

00:53:33.180 even if it still doesn't go the way that you wanted it to,

00:53:36.640 you get to tell it in the way that you want it heard.

00:53:39.860 And that reclaims it.

00:53:42.080 I think that's the artistic impulse.

00:53:45.020 And I think in a way I keep bringing it back to sync.

00:53:47.540 Like I,

00:53:47.700 cause I,

00:53:48.380 one of the things I write about in my book is,

00:53:51.800 uh,

00:53:53.320 uh,

00:53:53.660 honor among men.

00:53:54.600 I put that at the,

00:53:55.820 at the heart of my tree.

00:53:57.860 And one of the things that I really feel like,

00:54:01.000 you know,

00:54:01.200 I was,

00:54:02.180 I ended up here on this,

00:54:03.320 on this wonderful show as a,

00:54:05.080 through the auspices of the sync book crowd.

00:54:06.940 And I feel like I want to keep sort of tossing the ball back to them because I

00:54:10.840 do feel like,

00:54:11.700 um,

00:54:13.520 the work they're doing.

00:54:16.820 And that we're doing in the realm of sync is kind of taking this in,

00:54:22.680 in a way that my father's dream seminar is taking the work that we're talking

00:54:28.340 about,

00:54:28.600 about going back and reintegrating,

00:54:30.940 uh,

00:54:31.720 painful memories or things like that.

00:54:33.500 And healing and coming out the other side,

00:54:36.100 uh,

00:54:37.140 that,

00:54:37.480 you know,

00:54:38.400 I think probably you've had other people on your show who probably talk about

00:54:41.360 that.

00:54:41.740 And,

00:54:42.400 um,

00:54:42.960 and I certainly encountered a lot of teachers who talk about that,

00:54:45.340 but one of the things that my father was about and radio eight balls about

00:54:48.280 and the sync community is about,

00:54:49.740 and just artists and art in general are about is like,

00:54:53.320 but it's fun.

00:54:55.500 You know,

00:54:55.760 that's one of the things that the healing aspect sometimes mess misses.

00:54:59.160 And I think it misses it to its detriment because I don't think you can heal as

00:55:02.360 much working hard at it as you can having fun at it.

00:55:07.180 And it's like what you're reading about.

00:55:08.840 There's no escape routes in the realm of sync.

00:55:10.880 Well,

00:55:11.160 if you cut off all escape routes,

00:55:12.520 so you,

00:55:12.880 you're,

00:55:13.400 you know,

00:55:13.580 you're going to have to face the fact that you're,

00:55:15.700 you're an idiot on some level.

00:55:17.400 Cause the same thing's going to keep hounding you until you just start cracking up.

00:55:20.700 Okay.

00:55:20.960 Already.

00:55:21.920 Right.

00:55:22.500 But then have fun with it because,

00:55:25.440 you know,

00:55:26.140 again,

00:55:26.340 if you put it into the realm of these archetypes,

00:55:28.320 you know that,

00:55:29.020 okay,

00:55:29.180 so you're the fool,

00:55:30.360 big deal,

00:55:32.180 you know,

00:55:32.540 great.

00:55:33.020 That's the,

00:55:33.400 that's one of the best cards in the,

00:55:34.800 you know,

00:55:34.980 we,

00:55:35.260 you know what our card was,

00:55:36.220 was ruin.

00:55:37.380 And we're both pretty good,

00:55:38.860 you know,

00:55:39.320 sync surfers.

00:55:40.000 So we didn't make that into something dreadful and horrible,

00:55:42.320 but you could,

00:55:43.700 but the fool card,

00:55:45.060 if that's who you are,

00:55:46.280 if that's where you find yourself,

00:55:47.720 that's like,

00:55:48.200 that's like the best place to be.

00:55:50.060 But I,

00:55:50.740 you know,

00:55:50.880 a lot of people,

00:55:51.420 a lot of us are very,

00:55:52.380 you know,

00:55:52.500 it's one of the things that is the most frightening to most people,

00:55:54.820 is to be,

00:55:58.200 to be the fool.

00:56:02.360 You know,

00:56:02.900 everyone wants to be Jim Carrey because they think he makes a lot of money and he probably,

00:56:07.460 and he does,

00:56:08.080 but no one really wants to be that guy.

00:56:10.440 No one wants to be,

00:56:11.260 or they would.

00:56:12.680 I mean,

00:56:13.360 it's hard to be that much of a goofball and always fall down,

00:56:17.420 you know,

00:56:18.360 and do it gracefully.

00:56:19.700 I'm sure he has his somber moments as well.

00:56:22.760 Oh yeah.

00:56:23.480 Oh,

00:56:23.660 I'm sure.

00:56:23.960 I'm sure.

00:56:25.040 But his job is to be that,

00:56:28.300 to be that archetype for us.

00:56:32.160 You know,

00:56:32.560 he does,

00:56:32.980 he,

00:56:33.140 yeah.

00:56:33.760 No,

00:56:33.980 go on.

00:56:34.420 What were you going to say?

00:56:34.800 No,

00:56:34.940 no,

00:56:35.400 I was going to say,

00:56:36.120 I just think he does,

00:56:36.920 yeah,

00:56:37.140 he does the,

00:56:38.060 he does the tears of a clown thing really well.

00:56:42.460 He does it very well.

00:56:43.740 And,

00:56:43.900 and he's another guy,

00:56:46.180 I feel like,

00:56:46.700 I'm my holy Moses.

00:56:47.680 I'm on the periphery,

00:56:48.400 the periphery of him.

00:56:49.520 The guy who directed Ace Ventura and Liar Liar is a director named Tom,

00:56:53.940 Shadyak,

00:56:54.680 who your audience may be aware of because he did this great film called I Am.

00:56:59.160 And,

00:56:59.640 and he was my acting coach.

00:57:02.100 And I write about him in the book,

00:57:03.760 Accidental Initiations.

00:57:04.680 He was one of my big accidental initiators.

00:57:06.880 And that was right before he went on to,

00:57:09.920 you know,

00:57:10.900 to launch Jim Carrey into the stratosphere.

00:57:13.720 And again,

00:57:14.380 it's this thing of like,

00:57:15.400 wow,

00:57:15.660 it's like a volcano,

00:57:16.640 like sprouting up right over the,

00:57:19.160 like right across from my apartment.

00:57:22.420 You know,

00:57:22.980 just like having the tree emerge in my life and accidental initiations.

00:57:27.160 Is he the one who told you that our bodies can't tell the difference between a imagined experience and the real thing?

00:57:33.040 Absolutely.

00:57:34.220 You're reading comprehension is marvelous.

00:57:36.920 I took notes.

00:57:39.640 Yes,

00:57:40.200 he is the one who said that.

00:57:41.660 And I,

00:57:42.160 he got that,

00:57:42.980 I'm sure from Sandy Meisner or whoever taught him his Sanford Meisner technique,

00:57:48.000 which is who,

00:57:48.800 what we were studying.

00:57:49.480 And for those of you who are actors or familiar with acting,

00:57:53.300 the Sanford Meisner technique is the ultimate in sync acting techniques.

00:57:58.000 And it's part of what made me the great actor that I am not.

00:58:04.860 Because it made me have to leave Hollywood and do a lot of craziness that took me out of the,

00:58:10.680 out of the game,

00:58:11.640 but made me,

00:58:13.460 you know,

00:58:14.860 from the outside of our temporal game,

00:58:19.420 this is the,

00:58:20.000 the thing I've been learning from Will Morgan's films is that the life I'm leading now is still informing the films that I did back when I did them.

00:58:32.080 Because again,

00:58:32.580 that's the nature of film is that they capture everything and not just me.

00:58:36.400 Probably everyone in it are still affecting these films.

00:58:39.520 And in a weird way,

00:58:40.200 because they're bad and unseen,

00:58:41.800 it's easier for us to affect them.

00:58:45.180 I know that sounds,

00:58:46.320 that sounds so crazy.

00:58:48.140 We live at like the,

00:58:49.260 the sick crowd.

00:58:50.120 We are like,

00:58:51.160 it is this,

00:58:52.140 I think sometimes I like to think of it as the beat poet,

00:58:54.640 but it's a,

00:58:55.820 it's crazier than that.

00:58:57.780 And we're,

00:58:58.580 none of us are probably as good writers as that,

00:59:00.460 but you know,

00:59:01.260 So are you,

00:59:01.760 are you pretty much every day looking out for syncs at this point?

00:59:05.640 Um,

00:59:06.120 no,

00:59:07.260 I am,

00:59:07.980 I take sync for granted.

00:59:09.560 Every day I am,

00:59:11.740 it's more like I spend most of my day addressing the way that people do have to deal with sync when they come into my orbit.

00:59:22.380 Every,

00:59:22.920 like every time I call someone,

00:59:24.380 they're like,

00:59:24.900 oh,

00:59:25.140 it's so weird.

00:59:25.780 I was just thinking about,

00:59:27.280 you know,

00:59:27.620 you,

00:59:27.900 it's,

00:59:29.580 and I,

00:59:29.820 that's sort of what you focus on,

00:59:32.260 you attract.

00:59:33.220 And my connection to sync is very,

00:59:35.600 very pure.

00:59:36.380 It comes through my father and it comes,

00:59:38.480 it has come accidentally.

00:59:40.040 And,

00:59:40.720 you know,

00:59:41.240 it's,

00:59:41.680 um,

00:59:43.380 so

00:59:43.740 that's,

00:59:46.100 it might just be that I notice it all the time.

00:59:48.700 I take it for granted.

00:59:49.880 It's sort of like,

00:59:51.340 you know,

00:59:52.540 do you live your day looking for air or,

00:59:55.940 you know,

00:59:57.140 people.

00:59:57.760 They're around.

00:59:58.520 We live around air and people and we live around sync.

01:00:00.740 Actually,

01:00:01.060 we are constantly.

01:00:03.360 Sinking.

01:00:04.140 And then occasionally,

01:00:05.880 you know,

01:00:06.180 and more occasionally,

01:00:07.320 if you pay attention to it,

01:00:08.220 you encounter other people who you get to recognize that with.

01:00:12.060 Yeah.

01:00:13.040 And there was,

01:00:13.680 there was a time Henrik and I were having a lot of food syncs for some

01:00:17.000 reason.

01:00:17.620 It was getting pretty ridiculous.

01:00:19.000 Like anytime we'd sit down and watch something,

01:00:21.460 if we were just eating something about,

01:00:24.320 about to have something,

01:00:25.340 it was like,

01:00:25.620 it came up in the movie or the show for some reason.

01:00:29.400 Wow.

01:00:29.780 Powerful.

01:00:30.280 Well,

01:00:30.420 that's a real,

01:00:30.920 that would be like a really powerful third chakra sink where,

01:00:36.180 you know,

01:00:37.700 the,

01:00:37.860 the stomach,

01:00:39.520 you know,

01:00:39.820 I don't know where you were in your relationship,

01:00:41.320 but I'm,

01:00:41.820 but that would be a kind of thing.

01:00:43.060 I'm sorry.

01:00:43.480 I,

01:00:43.640 I,

01:00:43.940 I'm just pretty interpreting it for myself.

01:00:46.140 That's fine.

01:00:46.820 Go for it.

01:00:47.200 But if it was me and I was in a relationship and that was what we were

01:00:49.880 having,

01:00:50.200 it would be this very,

01:00:51.360 this thing of like,

01:00:52.760 wow,

01:00:53.320 we're making a home together.

01:00:54.920 And this is,

01:00:56.940 that's a powerful energy to engage when you,

01:01:00.460 when you merge,

01:01:02.140 like merging second chakra,

01:01:04.300 people are doing that all the time.

01:01:06.980 And in a weird way through art,

01:01:08.820 we get to merge our upper chakras in a lot of ways,

01:01:11.080 but the,

01:01:12.000 one of the most intimate mergings is that third chakra to urge is the,

01:01:16.660 to merge the belly,

01:01:17.720 the primal influence and the prime,

01:01:19.640 the primal will to,

01:01:21.460 you know,

01:01:22.000 to,

01:01:22.260 to feed and be fed and to be.

01:01:24.760 And think about it.

01:01:25.420 What do humans do when they get together?

01:01:27.300 We always eat.

01:01:28.700 There's always food involved.

01:01:31.080 And like everything it's,

01:01:32.520 there is,

01:01:32.920 it applies to everything else too.

01:01:35.360 So,

01:01:35.900 you know,

01:01:36.220 there's a third aspect,

01:01:37.080 there's a third chakra aspect of all of the other chakras.

01:01:41.540 There's a hungry eating aspect of our hearts.

01:01:44.080 You know,

01:01:44.340 we got to watch out for that.

01:01:45.400 Well,

01:01:45.540 we got to watch out for all of those,

01:01:46.920 but also engage them because it can be really powerful.

01:01:49.540 Yeah.

01:01:50.220 So I have to ask you a question.

01:01:52.000 Why do Jewish,

01:01:52.620 Jewish mystics say that 40 is the ideal age to begin to study the Kabbalah?

01:01:56.980 What is it about 40?

01:01:59.300 Again,

01:02:00.060 I,

01:02:00.560 not being a detective,

01:02:01.560 I can't answer the question.

01:02:02.680 but you're Jewish.

01:02:03.400 I thought you would know.

01:02:04.540 I will,

01:02:04.940 I will answer it.

01:02:06.420 I will answer it experientially is that I,

01:02:09.160 as a pretty non-practicing Jew who grew up in a very non-Jewish town,

01:02:18.680 found myself,

01:02:20.480 but I'm,

01:02:21.060 I've been very,

01:02:21.860 I've,

01:02:22.620 as one of my teachers,

01:02:24.200 Greenway,

01:02:24.720 I think probably said it in,

01:02:26.200 in my book.

01:02:26.880 And he inspired me to think this way,

01:02:30.500 to be,

01:02:30.880 I,

01:02:31.000 I'm,

01:02:31.600 I'm really straight with the medicine,

01:02:33.280 whatever,

01:02:34.200 whatever the medicine is,

01:02:35.340 if it's Buddhism,

01:02:36.100 if it's the Terence McKenna,

01:02:39.620 if it's the,

01:02:40.660 you know,

01:02:40.860 whatever,

01:02:41.360 I try and be,

01:02:43.060 I try and take it for what it is.

01:02:46.820 And,

01:02:47.860 so,

01:02:52.180 I'll tell you that from the,

01:02:55.440 my,

01:02:55.680 that my personal experience was,

01:02:57.360 I found myself in a class when I was 40,

01:03:00.360 having a Kabbalah class that costs a lot more money than I could afford,

01:03:04.800 being basically thrown at my feet right around my,

01:03:08.060 right after my 40th birthday by a teacher who I really respected with people who were strangely sync attracted to me.

01:03:15.400 And in the first class they said,

01:03:17.780 well,

01:03:18.140 you know,

01:03:18.460 this is usually taught to people when they're 40 and only men,

01:03:21.740 only Jewish men when they're 40.

01:03:23.520 And I was like,

01:03:24.100 well,

01:03:24.420 I'm glad we're not doing it that way because that's oppressive.

01:03:27.400 But on the other hand,

01:03:29.760 in my case,

01:03:31.800 it's totally true.

01:03:33.600 And my experience was that I don't know what everyone else got out of it,

01:03:38.440 but I wouldn't have wanted,

01:03:41.320 in a weird way,

01:03:41.940 I wouldn't have wanted to know what I found out there any earlier.

01:03:47.240 But at the same time,

01:03:48.260 I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

01:03:49.680 Like,

01:03:50.180 I liked,

01:03:51.200 I like having lived 40 years of my life ignorant of that tree and being just drawn to it in ignorance.

01:03:58.300 And then being able to have the next 40 years of my life to consciously work it as someone who's tending it for its contribution to future generations,

01:04:10.960 rather than mining it to fill myself,

01:04:15.780 which is what my life was about before I was 40.

01:04:19.600 It was really about,

01:04:21.360 and I think everyone should be in a kind of way.

01:04:23.120 It's like filling yourself.

01:04:24.140 Fill yourself up.

01:04:24.820 Fill,

01:04:25.020 fill,

01:04:25.220 fill.

01:04:25.580 There's so much in life you don't know.

01:04:27.040 Take it in.

01:04:27.800 Let it make you,

01:04:28.580 you know,

01:04:29.160 and use it.

01:04:29.980 Become powerful.

01:04:30.640 But at a certain point,

01:04:33.640 you are,

01:04:34.360 it shifts.

01:04:34.920 There's something energetically that shifts.

01:04:36.520 And it's like,

01:04:37.920 okay,

01:04:38.320 well,

01:04:38.720 the most powerful thing now is to make other people powerful because they're going to be around and you're not.

01:04:44.740 You know?

01:04:45.280 Yeah.

01:04:45.760 And I'm a young old person and I've discovered Kabbalah right at the beginning of that shift.

01:04:53.660 And so in answer to your question,

01:04:55.740 I don't think it's a rule that is,

01:04:58.540 I think it's an oppressive rule.

01:05:00.600 And at the same time,

01:05:01.820 it probably is a good rule.

01:05:03.780 At least in my life,

01:05:05.220 it was.

01:05:06.280 Maybe when you get certain things out of your system,

01:05:08.640 then you have the focus and the concentration,

01:05:10.880 or maybe you're ready to hear certain things at that point.

01:05:12.920 I think it's interesting,

01:05:14.200 though,

01:05:14.340 to also live your life and be naive to a lot of things and then look back and analyze yourself,

01:05:19.480 how you handled those things when you didn't understand certain principles.

01:05:23.940 Absolutely.

01:05:25.320 Absolutely.

01:05:25.960 That's the,

01:05:27.360 I mean,

01:05:28.800 that's half the fun of being an artist is creating things that remind you,

01:05:34.900 like these little talismans to remind you,

01:05:37.580 or just like if you were,

01:05:38.440 someone writes a journal and goes back and checks it.

01:05:40.860 It's fun to go back and see,

01:05:42.920 where you were.

01:05:44.180 And if you're an artist,

01:05:44.920 you get to do that in an interesting way.

01:05:46.680 You're kind of,

01:05:47.060 your audience is your future self.

01:05:49.960 Like if you can entertain it,

01:05:51.020 if you can entertain your future self,

01:05:52.780 then you are a truly successful artist.

01:05:55.460 I think too,

01:05:56.220 looking back,

01:05:56.800 at least for my life,

01:05:57.520 a lot of my biggest weaknesses are actually my biggest strengths.

01:06:02.060 I just didn't know how to harness and use them yet.

01:06:04.440 So they were taken advantage of all the time.

01:06:07.820 And now I understand what they are and I'm using them in a different way now that I'm 34.

01:06:11.560 Yeah.

01:06:13.700 That's,

01:06:14.180 that's a funny sink.

01:06:15.320 There's a song line that has that long,

01:06:18.480 that's not that number in it,

01:06:20.020 but that would be a tremendously obscure rabbit hole to try and squeeze into,

01:06:24.400 which at right towards probably the end of our show.

01:06:26.780 That's right.

01:06:27.440 Well,

01:06:27.700 if you can,

01:06:28.320 please tell everyone about your websites,

01:06:30.300 book,

01:06:30.800 et cetera.

01:06:31.160 Um,

01:06:32.200 well,

01:06:32.780 uh,

01:06:33.900 right now,

01:06:34.440 radio eight ball.com is down,

01:06:36.320 but the Indiegogo site that I use to raise the funds to fix the radio eight ball.com,

01:06:41.540 which will be back in August is,

01:06:43.680 uh,

01:06:43.900 is at radio eight ball.com.

01:06:45.660 And there are some really interesting videos there.

01:06:47.360 I'd recommend checking it out.

01:06:48.460 It's a nice little retrospective of radio eight ball.

01:06:52.220 Um,

01:06:53.600 until we actually get the website back up.

01:06:55.520 My book is called accidental initiations.

01:06:57.860 It's available from sync book press.

01:07:00.680 Um,

01:07:01.160 if you go to accidental initiations.com,

01:07:03.700 you'll find my blog,

01:07:05.040 which is the seek,

01:07:05.940 which was written as the sequel to the book.

01:07:07.900 I encourage you to read the book before the sequel and the links to,

01:07:11.720 uh,

01:07:12.740 to the book to buy,

01:07:13.680 purchasing the book are available at accidental initiations.com.

01:07:18.800 Um,

01:07:20.500 I'm on Facebook.

01:07:21.440 I encourage you to become a fan or a friend of me,

01:07:25.300 or,

01:07:25.940 uh,

01:07:27.260 radio eight ball,

01:07:28.160 particularly radio eight ball.

01:07:29.360 I post all kinds of interesting things there.

01:07:31.500 I'm at radio eight ball,

01:07:32.860 uh,

01:07:33.780 on Twitter.

01:07:35.340 And I just,

01:07:37.020 I'm really,

01:07:37.760 uh,

01:07:38.240 very,

01:07:38.840 I feel very,

01:07:39.740 uh,

01:07:40.260 honored to be on the show.

01:07:41.700 And I also feel very,

01:07:43.200 uh,

01:07:43.820 I know I,

01:07:44.540 I just spewed and talked and talked and talked,

01:07:46.900 but I figured that's what you got to do when you're being interviewed.

01:07:49.080 But I,

01:07:49.640 I do feel humbled by the invitation and by your attention to the book.

01:07:54.320 And I wish we had three or four hours to talk about it.

01:07:58.040 Um,

01:07:58.400 because I,

01:07:58.900 I'd rather like,

01:07:59.740 I really would rather hear you talk about my book than hear me talk about my book.

01:08:03.700 Well,

01:08:04.120 thank you so much,

01:08:04.820 Andres.

01:08:05.040 I appreciate it.

01:08:05.700 And to everyone listening,

01:08:06.940 ask a question,

01:08:07.900 randomly pull a song,

01:08:09.000 see what you can find.

01:08:09.960 Right,

01:08:10.240 Andres?

01:08:10.540 Absolutely.

01:08:12.100 Uh,

01:08:12.620 I do that and,

01:08:13.880 uh,

01:08:15.160 come to,

01:08:15.700 come to Olympia and walk the tree.

01:08:17.500 Um,

01:08:17.720 and fun,

01:08:18.320 you know,

01:08:18.540 and,

01:08:18.740 and,

01:08:19.060 and honestly,

01:08:20.380 the,

01:08:20.680 if there's one point in my book,

01:08:22.540 uh,

01:08:22.880 you don't have to,

01:08:24.080 these are encoded.

01:08:25.440 They're a reflection of our consciousness.

01:08:27.240 You could probably find a Kabbalistic,

01:08:29.200 a walking labyrinth of a Kabbalistic tree of life somewhere near you.

01:08:32.760 And if you can't,

01:08:33.460 you can create,

01:08:34.020 if you,

01:08:34.220 if you haven't,

01:08:34.760 you know,

01:08:34.980 create one,

01:08:36.000 um,

01:08:36.360 or come to Olympia and have some fun with the one that I found because it's a blast.

01:08:39.980 And I'd love to meet you.

01:08:41.660 I thought about leaving everyone with a song called Olympia by Hole,

01:08:45.760 but instead I decided to pick something called Tree Fingers by Radiohead,

01:08:49.680 which was released in the year 2000,

01:08:51.120 which I know you said the year 2000 was something for you.

01:08:53.940 It also makes me think of Conan O'Brien's In the Year 2000 skits.

01:08:57.240 Do you remember those?

01:08:58.880 Uh,

01:08:59.240 no,

01:08:59.540 no,

01:08:59.680 I'm sorry.

01:09:00.080 I wish I could scat with you on that one.

01:09:01.920 You,

01:09:02.080 you threw it past me.

01:09:04.120 Ah,

01:09:04.560 all right.

01:09:05.340 Okay.

01:09:05.580 Well,

01:09:05.820 thanks for listening everyone.

01:09:06.940 And thank you,

01:09:07.560 Andres.

01:09:08.720 Thanks a lot.

01:09:09.980 Thanks a lot.

01:09:39.980 Andres.

01:10:09.980 Thank you.

01:10:39.980 Thank you.

01:11:09.980 Thank you.

01:11:39.980 Thank you.

01:12:09.980 Thank you.

Radio 3Fourteen - June 20, 2013

Accidental Initiations

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