RadixJournal - November 15, 2015


Black Friday


Episode Stats


Length

1 hour and 3 minutes

Words per minute

154.95891

Word count

9,798

Sentence count

3

Harmful content

Misogyny

9

sentences flagged

Toxicity

7

sentences flagged

Hate speech

21

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

In this episode of Conspiracy Theories, I am joined by a friend of mine who has a piece about the recent mass shooting in Paris. We talk about the aftermath of the Charlie Chaumeux shooting and how it affected him personally.

Transcript

Transcript generated with Whisper (turbo).
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 um actually it was even more personal than last time you know with the charlie abdo shooting was
00:00:07.200 a bit abstract because it happened in the morning and i just learned about it like
00:00:15.460 everyone else actually i you know on the web this time it was different because um so i as i
00:00:23.620 explained in my piece i decided to uh to go home by foot and then i so i walked by um you know this
00:00:33.020 concert facility where main shooting happened and um and then i um so i went home and actually
00:00:41.840 um one of the places uh we could say a minor shooting but i think it was something like
00:00:51.740 18 people who were killed was actually uh four blocks from where i live it's only 500 meters
00:00:59.240 and um you didn't i think you you the blocks are larger in paris but you you mentioned that you
00:01:07.200 didn't hear anything um but it almost seems like you must have i didn't say that in my piece because
00:01:14.980 it uh didn't look very serious but i was actually watching something um an episode of utopia it's a
00:01:24.180 british series that i uh recommend especially if you're interested in conspiracy series um but i
00:01:32.920 didn't hear anything but i i don't think i would have heard anything because um even if it was closed
00:01:39.640 you know um the buildings are very dense in uh in paris so it really creates a buffer uh to sounds and
00:01:49.840 you you don't hear that much actually i'm very close to um a huge boulevard where actually is um
00:01:58.900 uh one of the shootings happened and uh i don't hear the traffic from here um the only thing that you
00:02:07.780 hear now and i'm going to turn it off is as a day humidifier so now you you hear nothing and we are
00:02:16.160 very close to um a quite hectic boulevard actually so i don't think i would have heard um the the
00:02:24.660 shootings and the screams as you joked uh when i told you about it uh but it's true that after a while i
00:02:33.580 heard motorbikes uh with uh sirens um you know wailing and uh but by then i was already aware that
00:02:42.800 there was something because the way i discovered that so i finished my episode and it was about the
00:02:49.560 time when um the football or soccer as you say a game um between france and germany ended so i went
00:02:58.080 just to check the result and and i was surprised because as a result was only the you know the
00:03:05.480 second entry on the website and so i checked the result but just above i saw that uh holand had
00:03:13.840 been uh you know evacuated from the stadium and so i read an explosion and then there were very few
00:03:23.220 details so i went on google news and then i discovered of course that it was much more than
00:03:30.000 a few explosions at the stadium it was um you know it was huge but uh it's really where i learned about
00:03:38.280 it and uh and actually as i mentioned in my piece uh what's quite puzzling is that uh when i went home
00:03:47.580 and i walked by this uh concert uh room complex uh there were many people queuing and among these
00:03:56.540 people it's obvious that uh there were people who were about to be killed uh because i think
00:04:03.700 there were 1500 people and uh close to 100 were killed so uh it's um it could have it's hard to
00:04:15.040 to say that but uh putin said that when there was a huge um um terrorist attack in um in an opera
00:04:24.600 um years ago but it could have been worse actually yeah it could have been much worse much worse
00:04:31.380 because uh it's only because i think i usually don't like law enforcement but uh law enforcement but i i have
00:04:41.020 to say they did their job well because uh they managed to save maybe 90 percent of the people there
00:04:48.940 i'm just curious what is the atmosphere like afterward i i might have mentioned this on a podcast before
00:04:56.800 i was actually in new york city during 9 11 shortly after uh shortly after i graduated from college
00:05:05.000 actually um and i was actually i was in brooklyn to be exact i was actually working in this very large
00:05:12.160 um very famous old building on atlantic avenue where i was doing an internship but anyway um
00:05:19.660 it was a surreal environment because everyone was shocked and stunned and kind of numb and so it wasn't
00:05:27.920 like everyone was running around screaming and shouting like a chicken with its head cut off or something
00:05:33.540 which which i would have expected actually after something that dramatic happened within
00:05:38.620 sight of of where i was working but uh but it wasn't it was kind of a a certain kind of numbness
00:05:46.340 and and and certainly a kind of heightened awareness a lot of people in big cities are always you know
00:05:51.360 they're either staring at their smartphone or they're staring down at their feet they're walking in a
00:05:55.740 kind of pod where they're not connected but i i felt like everyone is in a way more aware
00:06:00.400 um but what is it is it a similar uh situation in paris a kind of surreal
00:06:05.880 situation where everyone's going about their everyday lives but then everything's changed
00:06:11.680 you know it uh in a way so of course it reminded me of um the day after charlie hebdo but
00:06:19.880 it reminded me much more of something very different um it's a day after jean-marie le pen managed to
00:06:28.160 make it to the second round of the presidential election in 2002 the day after you could see
00:06:34.920 people staring at each other you know the way uh did did they voted did they vote for him or
00:06:42.400 things like that and i could see the same you know um faces were really closed and uh you could really
00:06:50.520 see tension uh actually i'm so i this morning i had to uh to run an errand so i i went uh actually it
00:07:02.520 made me um closer to one of the shooting one of the places where it happened um and you know i so i i
00:07:12.880 went to this shop and everyone was uh you know extra polite and something very unnatural especially
00:07:21.060 in paris you know paris has a you know deserved reputation of um being very annoying to people
00:07:31.140 like you know waitresses uh who don't say hello or things like that and people were too polite for it 0.71
00:07:40.420 to be true you know it was really really a kind of um yeah so real experiment and actually the only
00:07:47.880 the only community that was you know untouched by uh the event was the chinese as usual you know it's 1.00
00:07:55.980 uh maybe the comparison will sound harsh but they're like cockroaches after you know a nuclear meltdown 0.95
00:08:03.600 it's uh you know nothing touches them they're just always the same and so of course um um white 0.99
00:08:12.680 population they're just selling cheap plastic shit to each other and to tourists basically still like 0.98
00:08:18.400 in chinatown and in new york city i would imagine oh they are all yeah they also sell a shitty food 0.98
00:08:26.400 actually but uh no i'm kidding sometimes sometimes it's good when you don't ask what's inside um they've
00:08:35.420 got to control the cat population in paris it would get out of hand a little more seriously um so the
00:08:41.980 white population was uh quite moved um predictably but actually we could i could witness a few women 1.00
00:08:53.200 crying on the street um but even for um muslims so arabs and blacks you know um 0.57
00:09:04.420 uh there were really you know ilatis it's because i i don't want to sound pc but most of them don't agree
00:09:17.900 with that that's not a reason for us to welcome them all of course it's not uh it's not a sufficient
00:09:24.740 reason but but they don't want to to be associated with that but at the same time they don't want to
00:09:30.740 look like traders and um and so yeah it was really you know i i didn't like that and um you know i
00:09:42.680 when i think of my uh countryman i always think when i maybe it's pretentious but when i
00:09:51.640 get on a bus sometimes i think i'm the only person having my ideas inside this bus on this bus and
00:10:00.340 for example when i a few years ago i was commuting to a city actually one hour from paris and when i was
00:10:09.840 reading medicine grant or lost rob stood out on the train i knew that i was the only person reading
00:10:16.080 that you know so it it was even more sorry for me to you know to imagine that from a point of view that
00:10:24.180 is different from most people uh actually just because i i don't have the same outlook uh so
00:10:33.120 yeah actually i'm in a way i was glad i didn't have to have too much social interactions today because
00:10:43.680 uh it's actually you know it's really uh annoyed me after charlie hebdo you know this kind of false
00:10:52.320 emotion yeah but this time i have the feeling it's a bit different and uh it's um i think related to
00:11:01.440 the nature of the victims so i'm not saying that last time they deserved uh what happened to them
00:11:08.980 but at the very least um they had it coming you know they knew that it could happen and actually
00:11:16.020 they you know they stood by it and that's why even if they were um people who are not on the same
00:11:24.520 side as others uh they could be respected for that reason yeah they did show they they showed a
00:11:31.380 certain kind of bravery and a uh yeah they stood stood by their convictions courage of their convictions
00:11:37.360 much more than uh conservatives by the way yeah and and this time it was um you know just uh passers-by
00:11:45.340 and you know people in restaurants or just listening to a concert so it touches people more and
00:11:52.940 it's less symbolic but much more um you know well i thought there it was it fosters more anxiety
00:12:00.200 i thought i thought it was perhaps more symbolic um and and i i was thinking about these when you when
00:12:06.440 you think about the symbolism of violence and certainly the world trade center and the pentagon on 9-11
00:12:15.080 that clearly had a message to it it you know and it it wasn't just that they hate our freedoms
00:12:21.080 but uh it it was a symbol it was it was an attack on global capitalism and it was attack on the united
00:12:27.900 states overseas empire or there are basically the these were the world trade center and the pentagon
00:12:33.100 were metaphors for those two things um and so and then that had certain ramifications as well uh you
00:12:41.280 could think about you know an attack in the london tube was also scary about you know around four or
00:12:46.540 five years later of of being kind of this everyday thing that people take for granted and then it
00:12:51.680 became dangerous and that that's how that's in a way some of the most frightening thing you can imagine
00:12:55.800 what i found interesting about this is that they were they were almost attacking uh westerners who
00:13:02.880 were being passive and entertained it was it was almost i i was reminded uh and again i don't i'm not
00:13:09.280 certainly not trying to make light of what happened um but i i think we should always just talk about
00:13:13.400 these things seriously and i think there's often a kind of artistic quality to terrorism that's the
00:13:18.720 right word i mean they they want to send a message it's not simply about killing people it's about
00:13:23.480 shocking people and sending a message it reminded me in a way of the uh scene from the dark knight
00:13:30.300 rises where bane uh blows up a uh a football match american football this time yeah uh and uh so there's
00:13:39.280 it's a kind of amazing scene where this person is running back it kicked off and the field is
00:13:44.200 collapsing as he's running and and everyone there it's it's like they're they're destroying the
00:13:49.440 spectacle of of of entertainment and and maybe vulgarity but also of community you know they're
00:13:57.220 they're attacking the hometown team and it was a deeply symbolic uh scene in that film and it seems
00:14:03.380 like this was the same way they were attacking a rock concert they were attacking a uh although they
00:14:08.520 they more or less failed to do this they were attacking a football match european football oh
00:14:13.320 they completely failed actually they did for the football game yeah that could have been the
00:14:17.920 worst because actually the um the stadium uh i don't know if you have been there but it's a very
00:14:25.500 symbolic one because it's the one where france organized the world cup in 98 and the only time that
00:14:32.340 france won actually you know it was a very you know for maybe six months it was a kind of a national
00:14:40.000 holiday uh because of course there was an ideological reason to that it was um which said um there was a
00:14:50.260 term of the phrase black blamber which means basically um uh black white and arab and actually
00:14:59.100 uh the team was two-thirds white so it was a lion there was only one arab out of um 22 players but
00:15:07.300 he was the best one so uh it's zidane maybe uh the name rings a bell he's the one who scored the two
00:15:14.900 first goals in the final against uh brazil yeah and and so it was a symbolic one uh you know that
00:15:23.120 it was it was this stadium which was a symbol of um post-racial and post-cultural france that was
00:15:29.900 attacked but uh the security uh system there it's like an airport and so they didn't manage to to do
00:15:38.160 it and uh the difference between um the dark night rises scene and uh this one the main one is that
00:15:45.760 uh in the movie the mayor is um actually um he's killed in an explosion and this time
00:15:53.220 as they managed to evacuate the president um who actually i noted that in my piece and uh i think it's
00:16:01.480 really important you know he was not threatened in any way but he left the stadium and uh he's a
00:16:08.940 commander in chief and you know a real a real commander wouldn't do that i don't think the
00:16:14.980 goal would have left for example uh i know i think that's a symbolism as well it probably wasn't his
00:16:22.000 decision i'm sure at this point there's a protocol where he's i agree to be snatched but nevertheless
00:16:27.560 i i think it it's still symbolic that he was you know he was evacuated and he didn't uh stay there
00:16:35.280 and kind of uh as a commander i i think that is significant oh do you was there any symbolism to
00:16:41.240 the um the attack on the restaurant that that one struck me as a little bit curious uh actually it's
00:16:48.000 just because you know it's different in america you don't really except maybe in brooklyn for that
00:16:55.320 matter um you know this kind of big terraces uh actually the weather is very mild now it's like
00:17:03.120 last weekend it it was like spring and um and uh it's very convenient because there's a climate
00:17:10.700 conference upcoming um but so you have these big terraces in paris where people are eating and
00:17:19.280 drinking and so it's very easy first to to kill many people just because you know you pass by with
00:17:27.240 a scooter or a car and uh it's very easy to do that much more than in north america where
00:17:34.800 restaurants are usually closed and you can't do that that easily but it's also symbolic because it's
00:17:43.260 um you know the parisian way of life where you have all these um hipsters or 0.99
00:17:51.040 uh this bourgeois bohens who are eating uh lavishly uh until maybe two or three a.m um on friday and 0.70
00:18:01.900 saturday nights and that's also what they were attacking and of course as a rock band the rock
00:18:08.120 concert i mean it was actually a metal concert wasn't it actually the the band name is uh refers to
00:18:17.780 middle but then i i'm not an expert so i am right i asked friends who are and they say no it's more
00:18:26.580 a rock band even if the name is uh related to middle and of course most of the fans uh were white
00:18:36.560 oh yeah most all another another very symbolic thing i'm sure the terrorists were aware of that
00:18:43.460 and another symbolic thing is that um when they stormed the place the band was playing um a song
00:18:52.540 called kiss the devil you know you know and that's why one of my first impressions when we started uh
00:19:02.360 you and i um you know text messaging is a videodrome you know the movie um from the the 80s where
00:19:10.480 you know there's a kind of a sideration produced by ultra violence which also exists of course in um
00:19:19.060 a clockwork orange where it's violence is so shocking that it almost becomes funny you know when you know
00:19:29.160 when they when they they beat this bum uh in the street uh at the very beginning of a clockwork orange 0.93
00:19:38.360 you know it's it's uh it's horrible but you know it's a very uh funny scene and that's why i cracked
00:19:47.320 some jokes just because the sorority of it was uh almost funny in a kind of um you know manic way
00:19:57.180 i'm still human i think it's important i mean obviously it's it's good to strike a balance but i think
00:20:05.060 it's important to actually crack a few jokes i think that's that's how we get through these things
00:20:09.420 i don't think it means i felt guilty this morning when i i looked at my facebook profile and oh i did
00:20:17.380 i really post that uh you know i made jokes about uh about these things and of course my feeling this
00:20:26.180 morning was very different and then it was more anger and uh actually you know after emotion you
00:20:34.000 you start questioning when you're when your brain is well balanced you you start questioning why did
00:20:41.700 it happen and of course we know why it happened it's uh it's related to to our foreign policy and
00:20:49.820 our immigration policy which are related to each other so yeah let's talk a little bit about i i think
00:20:57.320 it is worth talking about the foreign policy aspects because i i think i i have um i i was actually
00:21:03.420 traveling myself while this happened and uh so i was um i was actually in a hotel room this morning
00:21:10.040 and um i was uh watching cnn for the first time in quite some time i usually don't watch these things it
00:21:17.980 seems like the these uh channels kind of flourish around emergencies where people are huddled around
00:21:23.320 getting updated information but um yeah i i think it i i what i one thing that i noticed among other
00:21:29.940 things was that there there was this just muddled very confused nature of of the foreign policy uh
00:21:36.560 causes or or at least the way the foreign policy has informed things and they they seem to be almost
00:21:42.620 blaming assad or something which is about as close to being backwards as you could get but anyway i i
00:21:50.000 and insensitive was also yeah it's it's it's i don't want to sound like uh you know uh a liberal
00:21:57.440 journalist uh talking about sensitivity but uh every day in syria things like that happen and not
00:22:04.080 because of hasad but uh of hasad but more uh in spite of hasad yeah he protects his people and
00:22:11.280 uh he's blamed for that so i i'm really this morning i was really angry about that too and uh asad say
00:22:19.120 the say that he says he said um france just lived what we've been living for five years now
00:22:25.360 one thing i noticed i even saw a tweet from this uh horrible woman named ann marie slaughter who's 1.00
00:22:31.860 i believe the last time i paid attention to her was a while ago during the whole neocon
00:22:36.260 wars and um i i believe she was at princeton at the time despite her name she's uh uh of a certain
00:22:45.620 ethnicity but uh she was saying that um she's polish now she was saying that uh she goes asad who created 0.98
00:22:55.600 isis and i was just kind of thinking like wow that is about as close to the reverse of as you can get
00:23:03.260 but i think her her interpretation effectively is that he he radicalized moderate rebels who were
00:23:11.020 trying to overthrow him by opposing rebels who were attempting to overthrow his regime which i think
00:23:17.880 uh pretty understandable for just about everyone else on earth but anyway so he's kind of to blame it's
00:23:24.300 almost like uh imagining racism as the cause of of black poverty and then and then saying
00:23:33.080 things like you know white crime in detroit is getting out of control it just it's just weird
00:23:40.440 you know interpretation of an interpretation and uh you know i don't know i just these people
00:23:47.740 are just they must be aware of it i don't know maybe they're not aware of it you know the greatest
00:23:51.800 i don't think so the greatest con men believe their own con you know no really because um
00:23:57.800 the french media one of the very first reflexes was to um actually say of course we shouldn't blame
00:24:07.000 muslims that's and not only the media actually the politicians too so you know the corpses are still 1.00
00:24:13.440 warm and they are all already saying that which is really you know there should be there should be
00:24:20.020 trials in a healthy country against that so they say that and then uh they are uh you know compiling
00:24:28.660 all the reactions by a right-wing or far-right as they say politicians you know against islam or
00:24:37.520 for immigration restriction that was there you know this morning they were already um publishing
00:24:45.140 articles like that and i really think that you know they think that when they say that of course
00:24:51.020 it's uh asad who is to blame and um and that uh uh this kind of event uh urges us to fight racism
00:25:01.560 even more because it's a root cause of all that they really mean it and that's why they they will have
00:25:08.820 to be dealt with i won't say more but uh they will they will have to be dealt with at some point
00:25:15.080 yeah i agree i i there there is that kind of i'm reminded of uh at least stories of that i hear of
00:25:22.060 of marxist intellectuals both in the soviet union and in the west or in america uh who you know at the
00:25:29.220 very end of the regime we're talking about you know there are these residual capitalist elements uh
00:25:35.360 within the soviet sphere and that that's the reason why it looks like it's failing it's this
00:25:39.940 kind of you know we need to double down on socialism you know it's just this uh very it's a i guess a
00:25:45.400 very predictable human mentality uh that when something is is obviously failing you you you you
00:25:52.460 you double down on it you you embrace it in a relationship yeah like in a relationship sadly
00:25:57.720 uh it's it is kind of like a the abused spouse uh either male or female yeah who loves his or her
00:26:05.780 partner even more uh after being drug through the mud um yeah i i i that is definitely what's happening
00:26:14.460 uh yeah what i was let's go into that because i i think there's a couple things happening i i think
00:26:20.620 this is different than charlie hebdo i think that was almost a there was an easy response to that and
00:26:27.140 that was we knew we need to embrace free speech and all these people like angela miracle who 0.97
00:26:33.980 does not embrace free speech she has actually imprisoned people for writing things that she
00:26:40.240 feels should not be written um on basically effectively revisions of the second world war
00:26:46.420 whether these are right or wrong the fact is she imprisons people for writing things so the notion
00:26:52.260 that angela merkel was going to march on behalf of free speech is grotesque to say the least uh
00:26:58.920 with jacob zuma and netanyahu which was even more grotesque yeah right when you know their policies
00:27:06.100 yeah um so but so that was the message that and and the establishment was very very good of doing
00:27:13.260 that i i think it's going to be a little bit harder this time i think everyone is on no meme so far
00:27:18.940 yeah you don't you don't have a just you charlie or something like that you have a more it's not
00:27:25.420 quite spontaneous because the media has maybe not created these memes but you know the candles and
00:27:32.880 but candles is universal or almost universal um but this time it's more bottom-up i don't want to sound
00:27:41.800 like a libertarian but there's a healthy element in the fact that um you know people on the you know
00:27:49.340 the basis are taking over this kind of things and uh it's less like a colored revolution or something
00:27:56.900 that is obviously manufactured uh to the masses it's more you know the masses were attacked
00:28:03.540 yesterday evening and it's just that um there's no there's no response to uh to their pain i mean
00:28:13.640 you know holand said something like uh he said we are going to close the border and so i posted on
00:28:22.140 facebook um you know a table with figures of uh legal immigration uh since uh the 19th the 90s and i said
00:28:31.400 okay um so the 200 000 immigrants coming each year are going to stop uh and you know 200 000
00:28:40.240 immigrants in france is about uh the equivalent of uh one million in the u.s which i believe is a
00:28:46.480 figure yes every year from mexico and neighboring countries so this time it is different because they
00:28:55.260 really it's really harder for them to to manage it and the other thing also is that you know it's
00:29:03.260 it's the second time this year and not only the second actually because there was a failed attack in
00:29:11.040 you know on the train between holland and france last summer and there were all also minor attacks
00:29:20.720 with a few persons killed so it's harder and harder for them to say okay let's not blame anyone and
00:29:29.220 let's fight racism which is uh the obvious enemy i mean uh i think it's lincoln who said that
00:29:36.760 who said that you you can lie one time to a thousand persons and a thousand times to one person but you
00:29:46.280 can't lie a thousand times to a thousand persons and that's what they are attempting to do but uh
00:29:54.620 but it won't work and uh i think we should also mention the elections which are upcoming because it's
00:30:02.500 very uh relevant to the issue yeah i i'm just gonna mention i it seems like whenever these kinds of
00:30:10.180 disasters occur um they they often do benefit this the establishment and um and and also i would also
00:30:17.740 mention that whenever these occur there are a lot of people who think oh it's a it's a false flag
00:30:21.860 i'm kind of doing an i'm doing an alex jones impression there i just when i was thinking about
00:30:26.860 this i've just looked on info wars that alex jones is almost disappointing me over the last few years
00:30:31.660 he's become like a conservative basically and he doesn't do all that wild nonsense that used to be so
00:30:38.800 entertaining he's kind of boring now he's he's just take anyway uh but alex jones the of yesteryear
00:30:45.480 i i guarantee you would have declared that this was a false flag and it can't be believed and whatever
00:30:50.740 and okay sure that's a possibility five minutes right that's a that's that's possible that's within
00:30:56.080 the realm of possibilities okay but i don't think it it was because i think this is actually this is
00:31:01.900 kind of getting out of hand i don't think you can easily just say this is why we support you know
00:31:06.880 vulgar cartoonists in their free speech i i think this kind of attack particularly after everyone
00:31:12.100 is on edge due to the refugee crisis and all these just images from that and just everything that's 1.00
00:31:18.640 going on i i don't think this supports the establishment at all i think this is something
00:31:22.540 very different and i i think i don't know maybe i'm being optimistic uh so to speak but i don't you
00:31:30.920 know which is it's difficult to be optimistic when you have something this terrible happen but
00:31:35.440 nevertheless um i i don't i don't think so i i think this is actually going to uh i think this
00:31:42.680 is going to be understood very differently from a lot of people uh i think i think it has a potential
00:31:48.200 to be a real awakening um and uh yeah i'll just i'll just kind of leave it at that i don't know how
00:31:54.740 once it could be um because it's just it it is like yeah i i it's it doesn't fit any other script
00:32:03.320 outside of this just isn't going to work you know we can't do this we can't have these refugees we 1.00
00:32:09.700 can't have these legal immigrants who are citizens it's just not going to work it's going to end in 1.00
00:32:14.920 blood and tears and i think i don't know how you can interpret it in some other way i think for
00:32:19.620 a lot of normal people that's going to be the message even if you have a lot of people doubling
00:32:24.020 down and and it does support the establishment because the establishment gets to act tough because
00:32:28.500 i remember on cnn you you'll hear a lot of you know talk from even holand and and uh
00:32:36.320 sarkozy was supporting him from the from the right so to speak quote unquote scare quotes but
00:32:42.600 they'll say like we will be ruthless we will have no mercy i think he actually said without mercy
00:32:47.720 they'll go after him and i think that's probably true i mean i think they're going to go after
00:32:51.140 uh anyone involved uh really hard um and so they can seem tough in a way but i don't think that's
00:32:58.200 going to fully work i think this this narrative is going to get out of hand with this one yeah i agree
00:33:05.020 actually um you know propaganda is just a branch of communication and marketing and there's a law of
00:33:12.460 diminishing returns you know when you always broadcast the same ad eventually you don't get
00:33:18.980 any sales and it's the same thing here and they lack um in imagination because their software their
00:33:26.520 intellectual and ideological software is just outdated so you know um the mayor of paris um
00:33:33.440 uh the shimer or the mares uh say that uh you know it's um shimer yeah like the she wolf of the
00:33:43.600 the the ss um she says that it was a diverse paris that was attacked and when you look at the pictures
00:33:51.100 it's okay maybe there are a few uh black tokens uh there always is like in a sitcom you know okay 0.94
00:33:59.980 maybe at the at the rock concert there was a black homosexual and an arab lesbian okay granted but 0.92
00:34:08.720 you know it is a propaganda doesn't work because it's just you know people have been hearing that and
00:34:16.880 um maybe to maybe to balance what what i've just said uh it's true that people have a very short
00:34:26.600 memory especially today with uh all the solicitation from the media and uh and the social media but
00:34:34.740 still and of course i love these uh interviews uh done by this libertarian who go to people and say
00:34:40.800 you know and ask um why um against whom did we fight in um 1776 you know in america and it's very
00:34:52.340 very funny yeah exactly and uh actually there was you know um in 2012 there was um a series of
00:35:00.960 shootings in france with a muslim again uh shooting um french soldiers um and um jews actually and uh 0.91
00:35:11.480 you know after charlie abdo i asked a question on facebook and my facebook friends are
00:35:16.980 most of the time right wing or far right and they are very politicized but i i just asked
00:35:26.100 uh the month and the year uh when it occurred and actually many people had to look the web to look up
00:35:33.440 the web to answer me and uh and they were not representative of the people so it's true that
00:35:39.560 people are tend to be amnesiac and propaganda works on them but not um you know every month because now
00:35:49.760 it's really and it's not gonna stop actually you know because uh what was discovered yesterday is that
00:35:56.640 uh when uh one of the shooters was um a so-called syrian refugee so the millions that
00:36:05.860 uh merkel has just accepted okay most of them are not terrorists uh nobody ever said that because
00:36:13.420 you know the left is always uh you know attacking the right thing oh you say that no nobody says that
00:36:19.860 not even the far right nobody says that but maybe out of the million it's very likely that there are
00:36:27.780 maybe one thousand and it's enough to uh really bring turmoil and strife to a whole continent actually
00:36:36.480 especially with um open borders it's another topic but um so i don't think the propaganda will work
00:36:45.800 and why i wanted to bring the election is that um so next month there are regional elections
00:36:53.700 uh and it's very likely that uh marie le pen will win um the northern region and um
00:37:02.020 um marion maréchal le pen so her niece is going to win the southeast it's it's very likely actually and
00:37:10.960 even in the other regions they are going to win a lot of seats a lot of seats um and uh of course
00:37:20.440 uh the establishment is very concerned about it and they have no real answer not even the
00:37:28.020 mainstream right uh because usually that was uh sarkozy you know his role was to counter the far
00:37:35.860 right with a few uh race bait jokes and and that was it but it doesn't work again propaganda doesn't
00:37:43.980 work and the national front is going to win regions and one of the first reactions this
00:37:50.240 morning of a left-leaning newspaper i was to say um uh the worst thing that could happen is that it
00:37:59.680 would give more regions to the national front and i'm sure now you're reminded of a book that was
00:38:07.240 published the same day as the charlie hebdo shooting yeah you know submission by michelle welbeck
00:38:13.660 because it's exactly what happens well you know as it as it happens i'm actually i i sketched out a
00:38:19.340 quick blog i was gonna i'll post this the next day or so but uh as it happened uh i i just got the
00:38:25.060 kindle version so like a decade a good western decadent i was on a plane with my ipad reading
00:38:31.540 submission uh quite literally while the attacks were occurring uh so there's there was there's
00:38:39.220 something going on uh but yeah yeah go ahead it's i actually i would mention i i'm it's a very
00:38:45.040 and a very intriguing book i i'm just a yeah it's not it's not his best one it's not his best one
00:38:52.200 especially the style is uh you know there's never really a style with welbeck because his style
00:38:57.820 is supposed to illustrate the emptiness of the west but it's a kind of style in itself like celine
00:39:05.840 uh wrote um allegedly like uh you know a working class guy but uh everybody who tried to imitate him
00:39:13.820 uh failed uh so welbeck as a style but this time it was quite disappointing um in that field but uh
00:39:23.320 it was really the visionary aspect because uh he wrote and some people on the right on the
00:39:31.440 respectable right said that it was nonsense that um the mainstream right would support a muslim
00:39:39.280 uh from the muslim brotherhood against marine le pen but when you look at the actual reactions
00:39:45.340 when something important like what happened yesterday occurs you see that welbeck is completely spot on
00:39:53.240 because um their first first reactions say okay no racism no xenophobia and of course no national
00:40:03.020 front you know it's they're really concerned about that so for them it's more important that
00:40:08.520 national front doesn't win three or four regions instead of two than the 150 odd bodies that are
00:40:19.140 rotting away in a morgue i mean you know it's obvious between between us to say that because
00:40:26.280 we've been used to it but for many people i think they're really like how hard bills are really gonna get
00:40:34.440 mad uh on the election day and um and so before i i stop speaking um you know i've been very critical of
00:40:46.980 this party uh i won't be able to vote because i'm still registered in montreal and i didn't do the
00:40:55.360 paperwork when i had to so i i will have to wait one more year to vote in paris but so but my vote
00:41:03.700 will be canceled by uh you know uh the guy afflicted with down syndrome so i've never been a
00:41:12.820 a great fan of democracy but i think this election you know i don't like this party and i don't like
00:41:21.480 its leadership especially since uh uh what you know she did to her own father and she expelled him 0.51
00:41:29.700 you know from the party he founded he gave her everything and she thanked him by expelling him so
00:41:36.680 um i don't like them but i think it's important this time uh that people vote for them
00:41:44.300 because this party is useless in itself but it will send a message and um so it's similar to trump i i
00:41:52.800 think both you exactly i again i um trump i i think probably would be a better leader but i i think it
00:42:00.140 is his his movement is is is a little it's a backward-looking movement and i and i think also
00:42:05.840 just this um this kind of over promising he's going to negotiate a uh the west out of its nihilistic
00:42:13.520 spirals a bit much but uh nevertheless i i think it does send a message and i think it's symbolic
00:42:20.180 value is is is in donald's words huge uh so yes vote trump vote uh vote uh for marine le pen yeah
00:42:31.260 yeah um as i said yeah that said we you know it's a kind of emergency emergency measure that i i agree
00:42:43.220 with but what oftentimes uh you know alternative rights writers or activists or speakers forget
00:42:52.060 is that uh we are supposed to pull the politicians to our side and uh that doesn't mean we don't have
00:43:00.360 to be supportive when they like orban when he does something which is you know sound and right and good
00:43:07.140 but if we are always clapping when they do or most of the time they say something that that is
00:43:16.340 supposedly good uh you know it won't work and we just have to look at the far left how they they
00:43:23.940 operate i mean you know the trotskyites uh you can't imagine a smaller movement achieving uh such a big
00:43:34.060 success yeah uh you know they managed to overturn many social democratic parties in europe especially
00:43:41.980 in france actually and and in britain of course um with maybe you know sometimes it was just 10 people
00:43:51.660 in a in a room uh but they were so dedicated to uh pulling the um center left to the far left that uh
00:44:01.260 you know they were always criticizing the left for not being left-wing enough and oftentimes on the
00:44:08.480 right you know because we were mentioning uh game and uh uh sex relationships but it's like
00:44:17.160 you know right-wing people are like um guys who say oh i don't care about this girl but the 0.96
00:44:23.660 minute or the second rather uh when uh as a girl calls them you know they will rush to their phone
00:44:31.120 and say it's you and it's exactly the way they react you know it's oh um so in 2014 it was
00:44:39.480 oh we don't care about elections you know we are we are riding the tiger and uh you know going beyond
00:44:46.900 the caliuga and such things um and and then trump appeared and suddenly elections matter and democracy
00:44:55.900 is good etc it's the same thing of course with uh the loud stockbroker i was mentioning um you know
00:45:05.280 in britain and uh of course with a main open in france um uh but the result of that is they are not
00:45:14.240 pulling uh these politicians in the right direction and uh it's less true for trump but for ukip and
00:45:22.440 marine lupin is it's certainly the case they've been drifting leftward instead of rightward and
00:45:30.700 it's also because they we have to be insanely critical because that's that's that's how you
00:45:38.560 force people over to a side you're not really going to force them by clapping your hands being
00:45:43.980 oh good job i know you're trying hard you didn't achieve anything but oh you're trying hard i give
00:45:48.860 you the benefit of the doubt no we're not gonna get them that way you have to be attacking them
00:45:52.900 uh so i i i totally agree even orban actually oh especially i'm not talking about the conference
00:46:00.900 of course but um uh you know uh there's a blog uh you know ted salis uh you know yeah sure
00:46:07.820 egi is oftentimes very critical of the movement sometimes a bit too much but i think i totally he's
00:46:16.240 too critical sometimes where i i think but i'm glad he's doing it because sometimes when you go
00:46:21.720 overboard you get it's sometimes necessary and he he nicknamed orban um uh chicken way offense orban
00:46:32.180 or something like that because you know there were all these uh videos on facebook of um uh so-called
00:46:39.580 migrants uh you know escalating the um as a wire um eventually uh orban managed to to put a real 0.93
00:46:49.280 border fence and now um now there are no um entries in hungary illegal ones so but it's also because
00:46:59.840 um you know the hungarians have been expecting something from him and not just speeches and that's
00:47:08.620 why it worked because i don't think well orban is less bad than uh obviously than all the european
00:47:16.180 politicians oh yeah but but he looks a bit cynical to me and he's a kind if no one had forced him
00:47:24.440 he would have gone with the flow like many other ones i think that's probably true and i i think also
00:47:30.800 he's just in a way kind of he's in a way a kind of tragic figure like he's he's caught in a system
00:47:38.300 where he can't actually stand for europe because he he's he's unlike yabik who's who's made insane 1.00
00:47:45.520 totally insane statements and horrible statements he's actually when you when you listen to what
00:47:51.480 orban says ideologically it's actually quite sound he'll say things like what is europe does europe even
00:47:58.960 exist if we're going to be europe we must do this like he he seems to have a a sense it reminds me kind
00:48:03.840 of donald trump saying is this a nation he'll he'll he asked that question in his uh immigration uh
00:48:09.720 policy paper which is you know these are all great things to to even ask that question he's he's asking
00:48:14.860 the right question and that's half the battle um he's not asking some little tactical thing uh you
00:48:21.220 know did did they fill out all their paperwork uh correctly before entering this uh uh boundary space
00:48:28.460 that is known as europe on a map like he didn't ask that question he he asked a real question like
00:48:34.240 you know what is europe is does it have a history and a meaning and a being so i think in terms of a
00:48:39.600 lot of what he says i he or victor orban sounds quite sound to me uh we should have invited him to
00:48:46.080 become who we are yeah well i i'm willing to make up with victor orban i've said this explicitly
00:48:51.940 we have a beer summit i will probably forgive the man i'm i know he's uh he really wants that but
00:48:59.660 anyway uh yeah no i i think he is he is clearly the best european politician you know there's not
00:49:06.360 much competition we're talking about people who are you know not not only are they bad they're they're
00:49:11.760 like even worse than i would imagine that they've they've like drunk the poison of nihilism and they
00:49:18.020 like it like you know angela merkel uh but so he he is he is a lot better uh but i think he's kind
00:49:24.020 of caught in a system where he can't really do anything i mean the fact that he built a corridor
00:49:28.420 into germany i think just expresses this problem where it's kind of like okay i get it i understand
00:49:34.300 you don't want your country that you are in ruling hypothetically to be overrun and therefore you
00:49:42.320 you create this corridor but in some ways just the fact that he does that expresses the the tragedy of
00:49:47.700 the whole thing i i would say sometimes i'll say things like this to conservatives and they'll
00:49:52.820 they'll be like well but don't you support him he's easy you know it's like they they have to support
00:49:58.080 you know it's like you have to be on a team it's like it's the cowboys versus the redskins we're 0.98
00:50:04.440 cowboys fans you know it's like no we're it's not it's not what it is um so yeah i i i get that a lot
00:50:11.860 but um yeah uh it's just uh again i just to bring this back because we're kind of on a digression as
00:50:17.940 we often get on um i again i i think this this event uh might actually be a terrible thing that
00:50:25.200 gives birth to something good and and and that is i just it seems like this is just going to wake up
00:50:30.960 people uh across the continent that this is just not working like there's not it's not going to be
00:50:36.960 okay you can't go to your discotheque and forget about it all you can't go to your rock concert you
00:50:43.500 can't go watch mass sports and it's all going to be okay it's all you know this is going to work out
00:50:50.420 it might seem bad now it's all going to work out you can't really think that i mean i i think you see
00:50:54.860 this and you just you grasp it no this is not going to work out this is going to become terrible
00:50:59.060 and we're now kind of drowning in entertainment and mindless spectacle but uh you know that that's that's a
00:51:06.400 kind of calm before the storm of really serious racial and and to a degree religious conflict
00:51:13.900 but but it's really a kind of racial and civilizational conflict i think more than anything
00:51:18.260 it's not it's not doctrinal it really is a a kind of it's it's a sense of invaders wanting to tell
00:51:25.520 people who's boss and i i think most westerners have gotten to a point where we don't we all like
00:51:31.760 there is no boss like we're just all you know we're all everyone's the boss or no one is or
00:51:37.780 something you know whatever kind of liberal fantasies we have but i think they're they're
00:51:41.620 kind of used to that idea of telling someone who's boss and sometimes they have to they have
00:51:46.300 to use spectacular violence to show that they're boss and um so yeah i i think this is you know again
00:51:53.100 i i think this kind of thing has the potential to really awaken people but you know many people on
00:51:59.320 the far right um uh you know they make fun of uh i i you know i'm not uh you know i i'm not accusing
00:52:07.380 anyone it's more things that i see on on the web and on the french web um uh for this case especially
00:52:14.580 after charlie hebdo you know they made fun and i i was part of it i made um you know uh with a friend
00:52:21.280 with photoshop we made um just charlie meme with you know the um the bears with hearts and uh with
00:52:29.420 all the colors i forgot the name i forget the name but uh you know this yeah as a care bears and uh
00:52:37.720 with uh just charlie uh sign and so i i did this kind of things and i of course it was very funny to do
00:52:45.360 that um but i think the popular reaction is quite healthy actually and i i've been pleasantly surprised
00:52:54.620 and usually you know i'm i'm on the short term at least i'm pessimistic i'm more optimistic on the
00:53:02.600 long run but even on the short run i you know uh if you compare to um the bombings in madrid in 2004
00:53:11.540 and london in 2005 the reaction here now is much more healthy i mean you really have maybe it's just
00:53:20.240 on facebook or twitter or just on the street for now but people say we want uh you know isis is not
00:53:29.800 both here and uh and when you you know what happened after um you know the madrid bombing um 0.98
00:53:38.460 uh 11 years ago they blamed first the basques which was really you know it's uh even more stupid
00:53:47.000 than blaming assad actually uh like it's it's like uh if you were blaming i don't know i don't have
00:53:56.400 an american maybe quebec you know it blaming quebec for you know it doesn't make sense so that was the
00:54:03.240 first reaction of the elite and then they blamed the conservative government but uh
00:54:10.220 interesting the demonstrations were for peace yeah and i don't buy conspiracy theories for a very
00:54:17.800 simple reason is that you know for 14 centuries uh islam uh didn't need mossad and cia and
00:54:26.860 bilderberg to you know invade europe you know it's just in there it's just in islam's nature yeah 1.00
00:54:34.640 and actually it's in every civilization's nature to you know be expensive and uh try to dominate
00:54:41.860 others uh it's uh it's natural uh what's not natural is uh or elite's reaction to it but uh so you don't
00:54:51.480 need you know a kind of um a rothschild illuminati shadow meeting to to do that it's just uh you know
00:55:02.200 islam wants to take over europe not only spain and you know the parts that used to be muslim but uh 0.98
00:55:10.120 all of it and um and all the the shadow arrangements are just going to be consequences of that you know
00:55:19.200 with politicians uh selling their countries and continent just for short-term gains but
00:55:26.760 it's a it's a consequence it's not the moving uh factor here the moving factor is um islam's
00:55:35.180 awakening as it was prophesied by lost rob stoddard maybe one century ago and uh which has of course
00:55:42.500 demographic and economic consequences and uh so so that's why um it's a very primal conflict and
00:55:53.260 you know i maybe it will all fade away but i don't think it will because there will be other attacks
00:56:00.360 but i think on a very you know basic level even simple people get that yeah it's a primal and
00:56:10.840 existential conflict and not just um okay um free gaza and we'll leave you alone no i'm not gonna do
00:56:19.560 that you know even if we even if we give them what they want in the middle east actually they will ask
00:56:27.520 more of of you know because they will it will reek with weakness and they will sense it and uh try to
00:56:35.980 to get more of the bargain so so i think people get it and maybe i will be you know uh proven wrong in
00:56:48.160 the months to come but um you know many experts in france have said that uh it's gonna be like every
00:56:57.600 month now something like that so well i think there's a question i don't think uh i either you or i have an
00:57:04.800 answer to this but the clearly there's a kind of coordination that's going on that is beyond my
00:57:12.460 imagination previously there must have i mean to to pull off an attacks like this i mean there needs
00:57:19.140 to this is not you don't just call up people and say let's go do this tomorrow or something i mean
00:57:23.340 this was this was highly coordinated uh there might have been a significance to friday the 13th
00:57:28.440 uh but so you know is planned well in advance but this is highly coordinated there there has to be
00:57:33.620 logistics there has to be someone in charge and so on and so forth and um i i so i i kind of agree
00:57:40.060 with uh olan saying this is an act of war i mean this this might be something uh that does every every
00:57:47.540 month there's going to be some new uh attack it is kind of questionable i mean it gets back to this
00:57:53.720 foreign policy question of what is it is it is it is it purely civilizational is it kind of a way to
00:58:00.520 teach you this is the top you know we're top dog here uh i i i can't really i don't think you can
00:58:07.160 really explain it fully with with foreign policy i i think that's a that's a necessary just a part of
00:58:13.180 it yeah it's it's a necessary but insufficient um cause um you know but or it might even be a
00:58:20.280 catalyst and not a cause but you know anyway we i don't want to get into the weeds it's more it's
00:58:25.900 more the justification yeah it might be a justification they don't bring palestine palestine
00:58:31.460 that much now because um they've never really cared about it actually uh if they had cared about it
00:58:40.280 and i know when i say such things that people are going to yell zionist or but you know um the
00:58:48.900 neighboring arab countries have done everything they could to leave palestinians in misery and uh 1.00
00:58:56.260 and actually uh europe and america help palestinians more than the arab countries which is
00:59:03.020 quite surprising to say the least so i they are not going to bring this case that much and it's more
00:59:11.300 you know like an old left uh topic palestine it's more about um um the more recent uh iraq afghanistan and
00:59:21.380 syria and libya wars yeah and um it's a mere justification because at first they were helped by the west
00:59:31.220 and we haven't mentioned that and and we should uh most of the guys who come to the west to
00:59:38.500 uh do these things that have been armed and funded and sometimes trained by the west oh absolutely
00:59:45.300 um by the west i'm i'm talking like uh manuel oxon writer by uh the ruling class uh that we suffer
00:59:53.940 under it's not us we we should reclaim what we are and and so it's a mere justification to make it more
01:00:03.460 acceptable but um you know people less and less bait you know when there was um um two years and a half
01:00:13.300 ago in london the um these british soldiers soldiers that was beheaded by two um nigerian converts uh 0.90
01:00:22.660 they said you know in front of a smartphone things like uh um leave our countries and you will be uh left
01:00:30.580 alone and maybe that could work a few years ago but now that you have um hundreds of people who are
01:00:40.740 shot like chicken in the street uh i don't think you know this justification will fade and they're just
01:00:50.820 going to say okay we just want to dominate you and isis is more honest about it than uh previous muslim uh 0.99
01:00:59.700 muslim groups actually because there was still um marxist rhetorics in uh maybe not in al-qaeda but
01:01:08.740 in all the um former you know uh hamas and hezbollah and all these movements
01:01:17.860 you know there was a kind of um anti-colonial and maybe egalitarian on on the world level
01:01:26.500 that doesn't exist now i mean isis trade slaves they 0.87
01:01:32.580 um they don't they don't even pretend they care about equality and human rights right just say okay
01:01:39.940 we are going to apply the sharia law and and that's it and uh and in a way i prefer that
01:01:48.100 uh because it's uh it's much easier to show people what they really are than um you know
01:01:57.940 the palestine movement was more uh able to tap in western sensitivity sensibilities like uh you know
01:02:08.260 pictures of children uh it still exists today of course but when you see images of isis it's more
01:02:16.020 okay we are going to take your wives and uh trade them like slaves and uh treat them like um 1.00
01:02:24.580 comebacks uh so it's more honest and it's going to be more easy to to counter it i agree i think we
01:02:35.540 need a different uh a different establishment and a different elite to counter it uh but roman let's uh
01:02:41.940 let's put a bookmark in this uh i i think we could probably go for another hour but let's let's just
01:02:46.500 save it actually why don't we actually maybe revisit this uh soon because the thing is i'm gonna i'm
01:02:53.300 gonna work and edit this really quickly and get it up but i i think events are going to uh uh are
01:02:59.300 going to change so i think they're going to change within a week we're going to learn more
01:03:03.220 and there's going to be new things to talk about so uh let's do it again uh but thank you ramal
01:03:11.780 you