00:00:00.000But I would say one thing about this, our inaugural episode in the relaunch of Unconscious Cinema, this will be a slightly unusual one because Disclosure Day, directed by Steven Spielberg, is just released now in theaters.
00:00:25.480So I actually saw it last night on the big screen.
00:00:30.280And so for a film that we would want to look at in the future of this podcast, I think
00:00:40.240watching it three, four, five times is really necessary in order to delve into it and come
00:09:34.420most people don't regard it as obvious or that's what we forget or or they're oblivious to it
00:09:41.440they're you know they haven't been initiated as it were right yeah two two quick uh points here
00:09:48.360on this uh real quick because i want to get this out of the way uh you mentioned that this feels
00:09:53.960like it came out in the late 80s maybe or 90s or 2000s i agree with that and i i think they're
00:10:00.700this is written by david cope or kepp um who wrote jurassic park he wrote indiana jones and
00:10:10.020the kingdom of the crystal skull so you know which is not well received but is a very interesting
00:10:15.980film symbolically um and he's an older person himself i a lot of people have noticed this of
00:10:25.140um the fact that it's all about getting proof of aliens to the mainstream media it's like
00:10:31.820if only mbc would cover this there there is something i guess a little bit funny about that
00:10:39.200in this day and age in terms of the massive distrust of um the mainstream media it seems
00:10:46.520like almost this would be the last thing that he would do he would release it online or give it to
00:10:52.300WikiLeaks or I don't know uh I do think it it's from a generation that's a little bit lost in
00:11:00.820time there's they're still living in the cold war the 1990s or or something like that uh but you
00:11:07.160know fair enough it's a plot problem perhaps perhaps Spielberg is a conservative of a kind
00:11:16.100of a sort he's a liberal conservative who thinks that we should be listening to CNN and um
00:11:22.300and so on so uh there's a kind of wistful nostalgia it seems right yeah for a different
00:11:29.760america he misses this or stability of that legacy media yeah yeah yeah absolutely um there
00:11:37.920was that the the other thing to go a little bit deeper i i noticed some people who um
00:11:43.360there and and this will kind of let us launch into an interpretation because a lot of them would say
00:11:49.940like oh you know it's now like the aliens are replacing god or something and there was actually
00:11:56.540an interview with uh spielberg who at least in this interview one would get the impression that
00:12:03.300he's not just interested in ufos but he just buys into them hook line and sinker like he's a ufo
00:12:09.940ologist and basically what um spielberg said is that you know this might make you question your
00:12:17.540faith. But also, we should look beyond just the earth and God that we're all searching for is not
00:12:26.180just the God of us, but he's the God of everyone in the universe. And of course, the conservatives
00:12:33.540willfully or perhaps stupidly just misread this. And they're like, oh, yeah, liberal Spielberg0.99
00:12:43.780wants us to abandon Christianity and our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. And it's like,
00:12:49.940you just don't get it, do you? Like, I can't help you if this is your response. You're taking
00:12:57.160Christianity in a literal fashion, and you're not seeing this metaphor that Spielberg is actually
00:13:06.800helpfully spelling out for you, in fact, in these interviews. He's giving you step
00:13:13.620one for the interpretation allowing you to go the whole way and they of course reject this help and
00:13:19.600declare that he's a liberal atheist or whatever they're they're saying he's a jew he wants to make
00:13:24.720you question christianity um this is one of the most just over the top uh pro-christian and pro
00:13:32.880judaism films that i've ever seen uh it's not one of these it's not like an angel studios flick where
00:13:41.400it's sort of literally about Christians. It's a Hollywood movie, but it is imbued with actually a
00:13:51.920profound respect for Christianity and Judaism. And I think Islam might, unless I'm missing0.63
00:13:58.780something, Islam might be left out of the mix, but profound respect for Christianity and Judaism.
00:14:04.500I think those two religions are embodied in the two main characters, in my opinion. We'll see
00:14:10.020what you think and um i i just i guess it never ceases to amaze me the degree to which christians
00:14:18.500just or or modern public self-styled christian conservatives just miss the boat basically
00:14:26.220yeah it is i mean it is remarkable i i mean i i just think the guys must be being insincere
00:14:36.420and think that there's some value in creating an alien myth right you know i don't know i i
00:14:44.180because he strikes me as too intelligent to actually believe in any of this alien
00:14:48.240hogwash but maybe maybe that's incorrect right because people are strange but i think it's
00:14:56.080probably more likely he's sort of cynically part of this desire to create a kind of alien cosmology
00:15:02.820and as we'll get into in the analysis i mean the sort of subtext of that is that there there's a
00:15:09.980superior extraterrestrial i.e jews right or jewry or yahweh uh that is you know that we that we
00:15:20.100should be sort of the messenger of the these aliens this is the kind of demoralizing mythos
00:15:26.420is that we're not the top dog in the high art we're not the top dog essentially right there's
00:15:32.600someone above us yes formerly we call that yahweh or we call that god now we call this sort of
00:15:39.960invented alien cosmology essentially yes and the other thing the
00:15:45.800the context that this comes in in terms of just contemporary history really is remarkable because
00:15:54.820we have seen Disclosure Day. During COVID, there was disclosure of so-called UAPs,
00:16:04.060Unidentified Aerial Phenomenon is sort of the more politically correct name or maybe more
00:16:09.660accurate name. And I looked at the stuff and I think they're birds, basically. It's just a bunch
00:16:18.660of low flying birds i'm sorry um it's all grainy footage i'm not terribly impressed and the trump
00:16:26.940movement in 2024 was like we got to release the files you know epstein jfk mlk the ufo files they've
00:16:34.780got to come amelia earhart too that that as well um and we get these files released and they they
00:16:43.480are maybe interesting but there are also perfectly reasonable explanations for what you are seeing
00:16:52.840and i have not seen anything resembling what is aliens that is and um but this film comes in the
00:17:05.640context of that it's like a novelization of real life uh happening real time we have this
00:17:13.720this notion has been baked in at the very least since the 90s and i and i think it it goes back
00:17:21.780to the 70s even with a um a lot of films that were sort of paranoid cinema that were coming out at
00:17:30.400that point, that the government is hiding these secrets and that there's some hero, maybe an
00:17:35.800insider, maybe a journalist or someone who just releases it to the public and it changes everything.
00:17:41.660Or in the case of Disclosure Day, we're on the threshold of World War III, you know, Russia and
00:17:48.780the European Union are about to fight or something like this. We don't get told exactly what's
00:17:54.360happening, but it seems ripped from the headlines, of course. And there's this notion that this
00:18:00.120disclosure uh that we are not alone that there are there are this intelligent life in the universe
00:18:06.260sort of makes a step back and stop engaging in these petty feuds and look to the stars or towards
00:18:14.500a higher power and seek peace this seem seems to be the sort of overall geopolitical plot and
00:18:21.340and uh an upshot of all this and so this film is i i don't know it's not
00:18:30.200terribly edgy in the sense that this all of this stuff is happening right now and
00:18:40.680there is a amazing interest in ufos in congress there was a guy who came and testified to congress
00:18:51.080He, of course, has no evidence outside of secondhand hearsay, but this is all taken, and he might be mentally impaired, but we just take it very seriously, like, oh my gosh, we are not alone in the universe.
00:19:04.940This guy knew a guy who knew a guy who saw an alien, and on Fox News, there are reports of the Nords and the Greys and the reptilians and insectoids.
00:19:17.280this is all now sort of real even though this is lore that you might find on reddit uh this is
00:19:24.380sort of where we are or that you would find in like well vatsky's writing right or robert e
00:19:31.540howard uh you know species that robert e howard created i mean literally there are like kind of
00:19:37.840fictive origins to these species that are traceable that you can find whether there are
00:19:42.680accounts that people are these sort of you know unrealistic hoax accounts that people have
00:19:48.680fabricated and are presenting as real accounts of alien encounters or they're like just taken
00:19:54.620directly from fiction essentially right so it is traceable all these these like races are traceable
00:20:01.920and it does seem like i mean interestingly kind of conveniently enough it seems like
00:20:06.420the races become avatars for different races on on planet earth right yeah i mean i guess we get
00:20:13.180the cool one we get the tall nords they're even called the tall whites or the nordic aliens right0.94
00:20:18.060yeah so i guess we get the cool ones um but then there's the grays who could have they could have
00:20:23.840some significance it seems like they're kind of jewish coded in um uh spielberg's pantheon i think
00:20:30.700they are for spielberg at the very least yeah there's a sort of long history of the grays they
00:20:35.500they were on television and then hollywood started to pick them up and pop culture it's the gray
00:20:40.480alien which sort of is yeah and as early as um close encounters i think i pointed this out when
00:20:46.880we reviewed close encounters um and it's just something that occurred to me visually it just
00:20:51.460seemed like they were like inmates in auschwitz or something yeah marching from that ship just
00:20:56.300because they were so rail thin yeah and so i wondered in maybe just from a kind of young
00:21:01.680perspective maybe footage like that or images like that influenced um spielberg yeah and of
00:21:09.600course and then later he'll basically develop aliens as these sort of benevolent beings especially
00:21:15.860with et uh he also does war of the world where they are more belligerent and there's a theory
00:21:23.140that are they're entirely belligerent but there is a theory there that he's it's basically a
00:21:28.460It's a kind of Islamophobia going on in that film, right?
00:21:34.400In any case, so they were both good and bad aliens in his overall sort of pantheon that he's developed.
00:21:43.320But more consistently, it seems like they're sort of good or benevolent creatures, especially in this film, coming down to teach man, to give him technology, much like Prometheus gives technology and fire and writing to man.
00:21:58.280and so forth to play a kind of promethean role essentially vis-a-vis a man essentially yeah right
00:22:05.380so um yeah so i i and i think it's clear it's clear in his other films but i think it becomes
00:22:14.660very clear in this film what's going on that essentially they're metaphorical jews right
00:22:21.560the aliens are these metaphorical jews that are being persecuted but then it's deeper than that
00:22:27.820there are more layers there of course as well where uh this ward x i think may become a metaphor
00:22:34.680even for potentially for the catholic church on some level right to kind of parallel metaphor
00:22:41.600going on in the film where you explicitly have the catholic church but then you have ward x
00:22:46.580which may represent something like the catholic church and they have the play on words
00:22:52.320Palantir, maybe, or some sort of military industrial complex.
00:23:16.240I mean, the television station where they announced the aliens is KCEX.
00:23:20.780um and yes x for the cross um we uh this is actually a little bit of this is in
00:23:29.840i think probably volume two of the book um but uh we you know we say christmas so x right there
00:23:36.480xmas is sort of an abbreviation for christmas it's commonly used and um so it is uh it is christ x
00:23:45.000uh the cross uh i i think there's a lot there um there yeah if you look up x in the in the
00:23:52.140dictionary it'll be one of the meanings will be uh christian or christ right i'll let you continue
00:23:58.840yeah uh uh definitely yeah just to go back on some other things you were saying i guess before
00:24:04.820we delve the orthodox cross is an x the orthodox cross is an x i'll let you continue yeah yeah
00:24:10.820just to go back to a couple of things that we were you you were talking about in terms of
00:24:17.060prometheus prometheus as a outside force that is giving gifts to mankind of technology or
00:24:25.340enlightenment etc this is a very common metaphor uh it's a common metaphor in spielberg but it's
00:24:33.160common metaphor in kubrick and there's a deep connection between spielberg and kubrick
00:24:37.040The movie AI brings those two things together, that Kubrick was developing that film for some time. He died shortly after completing Eyes Wide Shut, and then Spielberg picked up the ball and took it across the goal line and created that movie in a very Spielbergian fashion.
00:24:57.460uh probably not how the it was not how the movie would have looked like if Kubrick had
00:25:04.380fully developed it but you do get a glimpse of of Kubrick there and I mean it's you know
00:25:12.540it's interesting because 2001 was on a very basic level a propaganda film for NASA and
00:25:23.440you can think of this time of we're going for it we won the second world war we have the most
00:25:33.160prosperous scientifically advanced country on the planet but the greatest country there ever was
00:25:40.220the u.s of a and we're going to be headed to the moon soon 2001 actually came out before the moon
00:25:45.960landing and new frontiers we're just going to go out there and find new galaxies and so on
00:25:53.180uh 2001 isn't like that it's very different you start out famously in with prehistoric man with
00:26:03.340some with a man who's not even quite a man yet and he's more of an ape than a man and there is this
00:26:10.100black monolith that descends and the it's all done visually but the very strong implication
00:29:22.460I think there's definitely some references to Nietzsche going on there.
00:29:25.920But you're reborn but after a new enlightenment.
00:29:30.940And so we see David Bowman as an old man in this room that's sort of Western civilization.
00:29:36.700And he's reaching out towards the monolith again and then becomes the star child. So once again, it's not like he's moved beyond Yahweh or Judaism. He's traveled a huge distance to come home, to reconnect with Yahweh, and then there's going to be some sort of next stage of enlightenment.
00:29:56.580And so I guess this is a long way of saying that the idea of coding aliens as Jews is not unusual for Kubrick or Spielberg in AI, the sort of AI alien.0.59
00:30:15.320it's a sort of variation on an alien another benign creature that can teach us something is
00:30:21.320named david um uh close encounters of the third kind you have um a evocation of mount sinai with
00:30:30.440the devil's tower clear evocation of mount sinai with the devil's tower in wyoming and um and and
00:30:38.840you have richard dreyfus's character sort of going climbing up mount sinai to make contact again
00:30:45.140And I agree, it's sort of a visual or Jungian interpretation, but these gray aliens coming out with their arms and so on, it does one reading of that would be that he's reconnecting or connecting for the first time with Holocaust survivors or or something like that.
00:31:04.200so there's that's true but when we're seeing this film though you wonder if he you know you
00:31:10.200wonder if he was kind of he he calls this film a kind of summation of all his alien films so you
00:31:15.940wonder if he had this kind of idea in mind right so in other words is it could even be a conscious
00:31:21.340reference uh to the holocaust yeah yeah very much so because in this film it seems like it is a
00:31:29.240conscious reference essentially to the holocaust or to jewish persecution generally because they've
00:31:34.760been suffering yeah and that also that could include also the suffering of early christians
00:31:40.220right the saints and so forth absolutely uh so real quick i think we could maybe even start with
00:31:49.880names and then uh kind of branch off from there but just a very brief uh synopsis uh of the film
00:32:00.600uh there is a um man named uh daniel kelner uh i do think daniel is a significant name there and
00:32:11.260um dr daniel kelner um played by josh o'connor a sort of unknown actor uh he was um recently in
00:32:19.400that Knives Out movie. But he you we first encounter him and his girlfriend who is named
00:32:30.440Jane Blankenship Blankenship and they're actually at a wrestling match. And so the opening scene of
00:32:41.820the film is a wrestler like stomping on the camera. There's a sort of evocation of of maybe
00:32:49.320a kayfabe of this false you know caducean serpents attacking one another and you see that
00:32:58.180again with there's a war going on between russia and the eu or something like this and uh basically
00:33:04.580a sort of match that's taking place but it's synthetic it's not the real conflict it's it's
00:33:11.320fake and um he has stolen uh information that is video documentation um and some alien technology
00:33:23.160from the ward x uh lab you know military industrial complex thing and he is being uh chased by colin
00:33:32.480first character who's actually named noah scanlon um so the naming conventions are here a bit on the
00:33:41.000nose as it were uh and they go on a series of chases um there's another there's a another plot
00:33:50.940that's of equal importance involving emily blunt um her name is margaret fair child fair child i
00:33:58.420think there's even a evocation of the star child um and yeah but i would say that it's also a kind
00:34:05.820racial designation as well fair yes yeah yeah yeah i think daniel is not arian uh in my the
00:34:14.460actor actually is he's irish but i don't think daniel is either yes well i'm glad that my
00:34:21.140instincts were being corroborated by yours but um but they're kind of connected they're not a
00:34:27.460love interest but they're they're connected in a shared experience and friendship yeah yeah
00:34:33.020blankenship is a little more ambiguous her character is a little more ambiguous jane
00:34:37.120blankenship but um and there's this whole episode where her eye color is changing from brown to blue
00:34:43.460i don't know if you noticed that well her blue her eyes were blue okay and and so noah scanlan
00:34:50.320has brown eyes colin firth has brown eyes and so he's so basically well let me just sum up real
00:34:57.080quick so long story short the whole film is basically a chase and uh fair child is able to
00:35:05.060have extreme empathy to the point that she can get into someone's head she knows that you know
00:35:12.280this man is having trouble with his son and needs to reconnect with them she knows that this woman
00:35:18.540has a is being abused by her husband she needs to leave she just knows everyone she knows where to
00:35:25.340drive where to go she can speak all languages and this came about after seeing a cardinal a bird
00:35:30.620interesting um and basically there's sort of two chases going on you have this amazing woman who
00:35:38.680is connected to all mankind total empathy and then you have this man daniel who has the goods he he
00:35:47.440can understand the language of the aliens and he has all the documentation and they their plots
00:35:56.860you know intertwine and the end of the film is Daniel releasing all this stuff to the mainstream
00:36:03.480media and Fairchild communicating uh to everyone with her amazing empathetic powers and uh boom
00:36:14.960And then there's a big gray that comes in on a wheelchair and has giant eyes.0.66
00:36:21.380Their powers of manipulation, basically, right?0.98
00:36:28.540But to go back to what Mark was saying, and then I'll let you go on this, because this was a very provocative scene.
00:36:35.980But Noah, the antagonist in the film, is using that empathetic power of the aliens.
00:36:43.880He's actually holding on to this like magic wand, basically a stick kind of thing. And he is able to sort of possess almost demonically other people. He can kind of get in their head and talk to them, but then he can almost become them.
00:36:58.940And this is visually articulated to us by Spielberg by the eye color changes. And so Jane, who is a Catholic, not, I don't think it's Jewish. I don't think that's implied. Jane Blankenship is Catholic. She was actually a nun, but she couldn't, she didn't like, she was, she didn't know if Jesus was, she thought Jesus was good and wonderful, but maybe not God.0.76
00:37:24.780i think that was her crisis of faith and she's now a normal woman and um she a lay woman i should
00:37:32.420say and she's in this relationship uh with daniel and uh no evil noah is like possessing her and
00:37:41.140in and this is visually shown by spielberg by their eye color changes which is interesting
00:37:46.320blue eyes but i'll let you go on that mark if you want to yeah i know i mean i so the one i found
00:37:53.220one i mean i so i found various meanings for blankenship but one that i found compelling was
00:38:00.240white sheep so it would be similar to uh fairchild and i think they seem to be kind of parallel
00:38:08.420characters as well and uh fairchild margaret fairchild as a broadcaster is a kind of priest
00:38:16.060i mean we've discussed this before like the journalist as the priest it becomes it's almost
00:38:21.020a kind of trope in gemma seems we have clark kent and uh clark means uh clergy or priest right yeah
00:38:30.120yeah and kent maybe means white so white priest so it's kind of his face his his sort of white
00:38:36.180or gentile face in his cryptos right um but with um uh margaret margaret uh fairfield so she becomes
00:38:45.680the ambassador. And I think that there's something meaningful about this. It's the concept
00:38:51.560that MacDonald uses in his book of the Gentile front man, effectively, is what we're seeing,0.55
00:38:57.780right? But we also see it in the Hebrew Bible with, I would argue with Aaron, right? Aaron
00:39:03.180becomes a kind of front man for Moses and especially Yahweh. But the concept of an angel
00:39:11.120also is the concept of a messenger. In fact, the name angel
00:39:15.280comes from a Greek word meaning messenger, right? So an angel
00:39:19.260just means messenger. But that's what she is. She's a messenger.
00:39:23.160But her name becomes meaningful because it's sort of like, well, we have to make0.80
00:39:27.340the sort of Gentiles our messenger. That's how we win.0.99
00:39:31.280That's how we convert the masses or we control the masses
00:39:35.120with our own ideas is by having the front man,
00:39:39.220essentially the fair child as the one that basically introduces the message that can be
00:39:45.260trusted by the masses and so forth right i mean that's my kind of reading of it essentially
00:39:50.880do you think just blank ship as well it's it's sort of it goes to that like white blank quality
00:39:58.780of the ship but it's a ship uh ship of state i don't know that that's also a metaphor going on
00:40:05.300there yeah sure no i mean and there could be so you know multiple things could be intended with
00:40:12.540the name right so in other words the name could have two different layers and he could be he could
00:40:17.460be working with multiple meanings of the name and it could just be perfect on a number of levels
00:40:21.920right um so one one compelling uh theory as to the etymology of the name is um white sheep which
00:40:33.960i think is you know in the context of the film i think it's it's notable but i yeah i'm not that's
00:40:38.880not the discount you're reading of it at all either you know i mean there is there is discussion
00:40:45.640in the film that like well the aliens have to appear as animals right in order to be seen benign
00:40:51.180or innocuous but on some level what spielberg is saying is that they have to appear as gentiles
00:40:56.520or they have to engage in krypsis essentially as a kind of lower form essentially and so the animals
00:41:03.580also become metaphors for gentiles as we encounter elsewhere in gem especially through
00:41:09.160decipherment of the hebrew bible and so forth right so i think that that's what's being implied
00:41:16.200with this metaphor that the aliens appear as animals so it's a metaphor for jewish cryptos
00:41:22.980essentially i i guess the cardinal is the most on the nose because the cardinal that's actually a
00:41:28.780that's like a title that's the title in the catholic church second to the pope right yes
00:41:35.040it's an ecclesiastical uh title it's a priest title but cardinals are second only to the pope
00:41:43.820they're way up in the church uh so i so i think that that metaphor is very much on the nose and
00:41:50.280that also helps us understand that it is a parallel metaphor, right? So Ward X becomes
00:42:00.160the Catholic Church. And there's, are the aliens, are the saints, the aliens are the0.77
00:42:07.840Jews that are being sort of abused by this like Gentile organization that's taking their1.00
00:42:16.480power and taking their magic and misusing it essentially uh so what really needs to happen0.99
00:42:22.700is that we need to commune directly with the jews and they need to assert like sort of direct1.00
00:42:27.160control over us essentially yeah i mean it seems like that is essentially what's going on there0.97
00:42:32.280needs to be the reform needs to be a kind of ubiquitous uh philo-semitism where we realize0.77
00:42:38.300actually these jews are kind of higher beings and we should serve them uh and so forth right0.97
00:42:44.500yes but of course we can never get there so we have to invent another myth about aliens0.99
00:42:50.020essentially that so it has to be another metaphor because the goyim will get irritated at the fact0.98
00:42:56.000the jews are superior as they have in the past yeah yeah it's another mask uh yeah i mean what0.95
00:43:04.720one quick thing just in in terms of that scene so noah is using the empathy rod0.98
00:43:12.700to like demonically possess which is also a a you know time-worn metaphor particularly in the in
00:43:20.960the catholic church you know they they still have exorcism and and so on they they like that idea of
00:43:26.600demons uh getting a hold of innocence and and so on uh richard uh i just as an aside before you
00:43:34.400continue but this is also tapping into uh this kind of conspiracy alien lore that we've had
00:43:43.420since like you know the 50s where it's like oh yeah there's esp there's uh remote viewing
00:43:50.580there's out of body experiences there's this ability to possess other humans and so forth
00:43:55.740but so in other words it's all a lot of the metaphors come from you know ancient mythology
00:44:02.300it's a kind of recycling invention mythology into this new science fiction um it's a reinvention
00:44:10.320into a kind of new science fiction you know uh lexicon effectively right but it's it's all
00:44:17.260ultimately kind of the same thing and it it's both religious you know as you say demonic possession
00:44:23.220uh mythological but now it's science fiction but it's just a kind of reinvention of these metaphors
00:44:29.340giving them different names and terms, making it sound more scientific and therefore, you know, science fiction.
00:44:37.240Yeah. Yeah. And so so Noah is getting in her mind.
00:44:43.800And when they again, Spielberg shows this to us by having their eyes.
00:44:49.860The eye becomes this constant metaphor actually going on.
00:44:55.260and so he you know colin first brown eyes are in jane's head and vice versa he has blue eyes which
00:45:02.260might also be significant but you know it it could be interesting if colin first character
00:45:09.800was coded arian like he he is a just total antagonist like his name is
00:45:18.080uh Esau or Amalek or Apollo or Mark or Marcus you know he's Mars or Apollo attacking uh but it's not
00:45:28.620that Mark but uh it's not that it's it's a it's a little more subtle because you actually do learn
00:45:36.420that Noah is a Christian Noah's name is Noah um and he is sort of this extra governmental agency
00:45:43.880that wants to have all of this knowledge and safe keeping.0.67
00:45:47.320We can't even trust presidents with it.
00:46:09.400We have to protect the flock from this terrible knowledge, and you have to kill Daniel.0.98
00:46:17.120Daniel, well, there's tribe of Dan, of course, going on right there, the tribe of the crypto-Jews, the Jews that will bite at the heels and take people by surprise.0.97
00:46:29.560That's our novel reading of that, but yes.0.97
00:46:32.240Yes, but also just Daniel, the man Daniel from the Bible, who is—
00:46:38.400They say especially Daniel of the Bible, right?
00:46:42.440After the destruction of the first temple, he maintains Judaism in captivity in Babylon.0.69
00:46:54.500So there's some elite figures that are living in the court of Nebuchadnezzar in Babylon and interpreting dreams and doing all sorts of tricks.0.70
00:47:02.280They're eventually released by Cyrus, but that comes later.
00:47:36.620or however it's put and it's like mathematical formula that tell you can be translated to
00:47:43.160english i don't know but it it's just sort of a device to say that he can read that language
00:47:49.600numerology yeah symbolism numerology as well yeah it reminds us of uh Pythagoreanism and so forth
00:47:58.420yes that too uh reminded me a little bit of elzaba i believe from wicked uh i she can read0.56
00:48:07.480the actual book and the the wizard who's a fraud can't he's almost like a gentile she's anyway i
00:48:13.640won't go down that road but he he has direct communication with the aliens whereas um fair0.64
00:48:19.880child the gentile christ maybe um christians have direct communication with people through and
00:48:28.500through empathy and so they're both sort of necessary and he was in captivity in war decks
00:48:34.520for years learned all of these truths and wants to reveal them and um so i i think the the the
00:48:42.320ultimate sort of mission of the movie is this sort of dyad you know if you were there there there's
00:48:48.700always two. There is the Jew and the Christian. There is the face that is looking towards the0.93
00:48:55.020aliens or the prophets or the martyrs or the Hebrew language itself. And then there is sort
00:49:02.020of the outside face of love and compassion and communication, which is Fairchild.
00:49:09.380uh her name is actually margaret interestingly yahweh and aaron or you know even joseph and
00:49:20.140david using the messiah uh the messiah um the dual messiah concept right um yeah yeah but there
00:49:32.720is that problem where word x is sort of the it's it's the problematic aspects of the catholic
00:49:40.220church of has there you know a lot of people who have you know listened to our work or or you know
00:49:46.780adam green or something they we we recognize and we emphasize the compatibility for lack of a better
00:49:56.040word i guess here of judaism and christianity both of these things they're ones deriving from the
00:50:01.140other they're ones referencing the other they these are not opposed and and we emphasize that
00:50:07.240however has there been have there been episodes of anti-semitism and violence within the catholic
00:50:16.660church of course there have been many of these scenes pogroms persecutions inquisitions etc
00:50:25.260and that's what ward x represents right exactly and so it's like he's using he's misusing he
00:50:32.340doesn't understand the technology that he possesses and he's misusing it in order to
00:50:39.160attack daniel to try to kill daniel as well and the fact that he fails is significant
00:50:45.980yeah i i mean the other uh i think that kilner his last name too is a common uh ashkenazi name
00:50:58.000as well it's a variation of kilner yeah um so i don't think it's i think he's intended to be read
00:51:04.640even as a jewish character um but yeah i think he ultimately on some level he's a reference to
00:51:11.920Daniel in the book of Daniel as well, right? He's a prophet, essentially. So not even necessarily
00:51:23.080intended as a crypto Jew, I guess is my point. And then also, I mean, so there are two,0.68
00:51:29.220what you're saying, I think is correct. I mean, they're the twins, Esau and Jacob.
00:51:34.520uh so on some level they represent that as well uh you know the uh the dual messiah
00:51:42.320and so forth but i think also that there could be a little bit of a broad gathering
00:51:47.160theme going on there as well right um so that's interesting i mean i think one character i found
00:51:55.760interesting was uh hugo wakefield i think yes right this black guy who i think is it's he's
00:52:03.680intended as an alien who's in disguise i think is what's going on that was my reading that was
00:52:09.820my reading too is very subtle though um because he was there during the abduction effectively
00:52:16.580that's the dialogue conveys that he was there during the alien abduction essentially right
00:52:21.680and she recognizes him at once she's like hello hugo um yes i i do think that that is what's going
00:52:31.260on but go go go on well so his name wakefield i think so the meaning there i guess would be
00:52:37.740watch field or you know i or you know vigil field he's a a sentinel of some type watch field that's
00:52:48.720the last name uh we'll return to the last name but the first name is hugo which means spirit so
00:52:54.580he's like the spirit of god maybe or in theological terms he represents a spirit
00:53:02.000but i wonder if the if the play here is he represents the spirit of woke right he's a
00:53:09.040black guy and he represents the spirit of woke as somehow i don't know facilitating a union between
00:53:16.960uh this jewish character and this female character right linking them
00:53:21.520yeah i mean you think woke and it's like political manifestations or just
00:53:26.460in a kind of deeper like awakening sense um both maybe yeah both maybe but uh i it is interesting
00:53:35.740i mean to the extent he represents a spirit i mean it's not an accident that they chose an
00:53:41.180african-american actor so he represents a kind of not just any spirit he represents kind of a
00:53:47.060black spirit you could argue right yeah um but represents a spirit of multiracial egalitarianism
00:53:55.320for example and and it's within these conditions uh that you know there would be a union between
00:54:03.100a jewish woman or a jewish man and a white woman right um so something even represent
00:54:10.740Hollywood itself because so when you meet him there in the background they're they're they're0.65
00:54:20.160creating what looks like a set so they're they're in like a dilapidated industrial part of um Kansas
00:54:28.940City I guess and um and they're in this big warehouse and you see that they're moving objects
00:54:35.460around they're creating a sort of synthetic environment and then the payoff occurs at the
00:54:40.320end of the film where they have recreated down to the thread the childhood home of Margaret Fairchild
00:54:48.160and so they want to just bring her back um you know and you know in that way if you've ever
00:54:54.760visited your old home you grew up or something if you the memories come flooding back or your
00:55:00.580old high school or something like that it is remarkable and and that's sort of what he wants
00:55:05.480to do but it is sort of it's synthetic i i think maybe even to some degree uh hugo wakefield is a
00:55:13.900stand-in for spielberg or something who's so adept at just awakening those memories just
00:55:22.420pulling the nostalgia string and and and taking you back to the that that point of innocence and
00:55:29.900so on um but again i mean it's it's but it's also revealed to be a totally synthetic fabricated
00:55:37.560thing as well so there's a little kind of sinister side to it but you go on hugo is actually an alien
00:55:43.920right so he's a pro i think he was as well although that's not made quite explicit but i i do think he
00:55:49.920he is yeah um and so he and and therefore you know the animals also can inhabit or appear as
00:56:00.060humans if they can appear as animals they can appear as humans obviously right yeah and so i
00:56:05.220think hugo is one of those examples and i i guess the other thing as far as a possible sort of
00:56:11.240bridegathering theme in the film i mean it seems evident that uh fairchild's gonna leave her
00:56:17.320boyfriend right yeah that seems and she even takes the guy's car and leaves him at a gas station0.99
00:56:22.920um but there's there's all kinds of like relationship issues before that where she
00:56:28.240wants to move to a bigger market and the guy's too much of a small timer for ultimately and um
00:56:34.880and and i think it's also meaningful in the script that she it's it's indicated that she
00:56:40.620goes east right when she leaves him she goes east so i think that this might also kind of
00:56:46.220contribute to a kind of implicit bridegathering theme now on the other hand um you know uh
00:56:53.300daniel may end up with uh jade as well but jane jane and margaret seem to be kind of parallel
00:57:00.700characters that have a kind of similar function in the film and a similar significance they're both
00:57:06.200ultimately priests of a type right they're they're mediums or a higher power effectively right
00:57:13.780Yes. So what are your thoughts on that final scene, which was almost the before the disclosure that that scene was sort of the money shot, as it were, maybe in more ways than one, where she's she's taken back psychologically to her childhood when she was abducted.
00:57:43.780And when she and Daniel were abducted in the sense of being enlightened or initiated, and the animals come to her door.
00:57:56.180She's she's actually it's very interesting because she's singing. There's there's a little bit of a reference to Snow White, much like there was a reference to Pinocchio and AI where, you know, there's there's Jim in the background, but there's also this this classic fairy tale, Disney fairy tale as well in sort of the background, but kind of the foreground.
00:58:19.020And she's actually singing, you know, a song from Snow White, which I believe it's, it's someday my friends will come. It's a classic number from the Disney film. And it's, you know, on one level, it's about a young woman yearning for a handsome man to sweep her off her feet, no doubt.
00:58:46.540But there are also deeply religious resonances in that song of someday Jesus will come.
00:58:57.260The prince is Jesus who will awaken her.
00:59:00.680And she's taken with the cardinal again outside.
00:59:06.980And then there's an invocation of another grim fairy tale, which is Hansel and Gretel.
01:00:08.300What is this, if not a metaphor of child abuse?
01:00:12.140i mean it's explicitly child abuse they're being fattened to be put into an oven i mean it's it's
01:00:18.980sort of horrifying on some level and you see the the children not escaping the house but going into
01:00:26.620the house and it's in this house that the abduction occurs there's actually a the beds are levitating
01:00:34.620they go and lie down into beds i mean there is it's all done in a very soft magical way
01:00:41.820but there are very strong sexual undercurrents to these scenes uh and a those objects the sort
01:00:52.120of magic wands are put together in a circle almost i saw it almost as a crown of thorns
01:00:58.700in a sort of abstract way the aliens are above them kind of putting their hands uh
01:01:04.520there there is a you don't have to read too much into it to see this as sort of a
01:01:10.200magical disneyified version of child abuse and um that this is the point where these two people
01:01:19.480The Fairchild Savior and Daniel connector to the Judaic past are both abducted and initiated, educated, enlightened by the aliens.
01:01:35.020And that memory is so traumatic that they've repressed, again, repressed memories of child sexual abuse is a trope.
01:01:45.400um there's even to add insult to injury here as well there's a minor theme of butterflies
01:01:54.640um which you know spielberg's evoking all of this conspiracy theory lore um one of the conspiracy
01:02:03.700one of these ass pieces of lore is based on fact which is the monarch program that was an offshoot
01:02:12.380of mk ultra and the monarch butterfly being a sort of symbol and here again we go to uh child0.87
01:02:21.100sexual abuse or at the very least brainwashing and all sorts of things like that so i what are
01:02:28.760you what did you make of all of this no i think that's the correct reading but i you know i think
01:02:36.340that um you know the fact that it's a summation of all these alien films i think that that's
01:02:43.580definitely going on in et i think that this film is worth because i think that probably
01:02:48.220if we watch this film again we'll find more kind of corroboration essentially of what you're saying
01:02:54.880but yeah i thought that of course um given ai these sort of heteroste themes in ai yes and also
01:03:04.580in um uh et right you have the alien that's in the closet i think the closet becomes a metaphor
01:03:12.160um but we we've studied we took some time to study uh the uh the tales in the hebrew bible
01:03:20.480around elisha and elijah and that's going on there elliot is a um is a form of elijah right
01:03:29.140So he's a reference to Elijah. And we see that also with Samuel and David and Jonathan. Right.
01:03:37.440So there is a sexual abuse theme. And even with the word holy in the Hebrew Bible, the most common word for holy, the holy of holies, a different vocalization of that means male cult prostitute.0.94
01:03:50.260So this is this is getting at the very core. Of the Abrahamic faith. And so that's I think you're right.0.53
01:03:58.260It's something I immediately thought when they said to Margaret Fairchild, they said, oh, we're going to go back to that moment. You're going to remember that moment. And she immediately panicked and became emotional. It was a sexual abuse. It seemed to be referencing sexual abuse, right?
01:04:17.320and then the hands are sliding up on the face uh so i think that that's correct but i think that i
01:04:24.360think the clues are also uh i would say maybe better clues appearing et um but yeah this idea
01:04:32.300of alien abduction you know i mean i don't know i mean i kind of like on some level you sort of
01:04:38.580have to hand it to uh whether the evil genius or the diabolical mind of like spielberg but he's
01:04:45.260taken it seems that he's taken these kind of you know sort of peasant folklore myths out of there
01:04:52.240and like okay well what does the alien abduction mean now and he's given it a new meaning right
01:04:57.040you know I haven't studied ufology closely enough to know the exact you know the first
01:05:06.180sort of incident of that meme you know the alien abduction but I think it's pretty it goes back as
01:05:12.960far as you know this uh ufology lore goes it's one of the the first sort of memes that people
01:05:21.220are being abducted by aliens and so forth but in close encounters right close even the term
01:05:28.360close encounters right is a little suggestive but uh but et there's a close they're not being
01:05:35.100abducted by et but it is an encounter with an alien and implicitly it's a sexual encounter with
01:05:41.780the alien so and and just the uh to go back to that in in the hebrew bible uh when elijah meets
01:05:51.280elisha doesn't he lie upon him in the attic isn't that is this the oh yeah yeah we i mean people
01:05:57.580need to go back and listen to those uh podcasts yes it's just hard to read that as anything other
01:06:04.340than child abuse to be honest um again unless you're so blinded by your reverence for
01:06:11.140the holy bible the good book that you think that that could never possibly uh be involved in any
01:06:17.940story in that uh text i i i don't think there's any other way of reading it and i i guess what
01:06:26.160what you've said in the past as well is that in in this horrible way pederasty pedophilia child
01:06:32.480abuse acts as an initiation process and again in a horrible and maybe ironic way binds the
01:06:44.040servant to the master the the protege to the to the mentor um yeah yeah they're um
01:06:53.440yeah elijah even his name appears to be a play on uh
01:07:02.680um aliyah right aliyah that's the term uh when you're uh re-migrating back to israel
01:07:13.100but uh but the word also means upper room or upper chamber roof chamber but this appears to
01:07:20.240be a kind of meeting place, both for Alicia and Elijah, where the sexual abuse occurs.
01:07:26.820So that, you know, in E.T., the metaphor is updated with the closet, right? Because we have
01:07:34.640this, we have a more modern metaphor of homosexuals being in a closet, right? So maybe that's1.00
01:07:44.940what's going on uh in et but so the encounter is in in a closet but both are implied as hidden
01:07:51.600spaces essentially like the attic where you could go and abuse a child uh woody allen supposedly
01:07:57.640abused a child in the attic right um i don't know if that's another witch hunting case or whatever
01:08:04.800but um so goes the story um so yeah i mean look i think that that's just part of the abraham
01:08:14.900faith and i i think that honestly i don't think anyone knows the abrahamic faith better than
01:08:21.260spielberg yeah right i think he's encoding all these things basically uh and he he's it seems
01:08:28.700that he's sort of intently making himself a scribe of a new religion essentially a new religion based
01:08:34.940on uh abrahamism uh which is also based on these ufos and so forth you know one that could that
01:08:42.880he's in indicating can be also compatible with existing religions like christianity and so forth
01:08:48.260yeah uh so in any case go on that i i uh well unless you want to finish your thought i know
01:08:57.320no i yeah yeah i i had some thoughts about the final it's not really the final act it's sort of
01:09:04.220the the climax of of the film where they they go to kcxe station uh there might be even a little
01:09:14.180more coding going on with that name but there there there is the let me let me make a final
01:09:18.860point though because the point i've made a bunch of times but it's worth just re-emphasizing in
01:09:24.320this episode um so sexual abuse we know is a huge problem in the catholic church
01:09:31.380and and also it's a problem among jews right so especially among the orthodox jews orthodox jews
01:09:41.580i guess there's you know these these sort of whistleblowers that report that like up to 50
01:09:46.060of the kids have been sexually abused we're not about we don't want to compare you know who's0.98
01:09:52.460worse the catholics to the jews it's fucking irrelevant right but here the the thing is though0.99
01:09:58.320it does appear to be more a feature of the religion rather than a bug and it's encoded0.98
01:10:03.960at the symbolic you know mythological symbolic level essentially um so i mean that's the the
01:10:13.560only point that i'm going to make uh or just to kind of emphasize the point that we've already
01:10:17.560made yes it's initiation um yeah it's how it's how the religion is passed on ultimately yeah i
01:10:25.620I mean, you have a core. And I guess the way we can think about it is maybe the thinking is something like, you know, through this kind of intergenerational sexual connection, you form a kind of abusive fealty, right?
01:10:41.200It's a kind of Stockholm syndrome or whatever that gives coherence or creates a greater sort of coherence, tribal coherence.
01:10:51.600And maybe this happens at the core of the religion where a great number of the people are basically oblivious.1.00
01:10:58.120They're sussmen. We're just like, you know, I mean, think of the sussmen among the Catholics.1.00
01:11:02.860It's very obvious people will defend they will die on that hill. Right.1.00
01:11:07.500So right wing Catholics who, you know, are just normies who are just like, oh, yeah.1.00
01:11:13.920oh they're just going after the church with this sexual abuse thing because it's like some jewish0.55
01:11:19.560conspiracy or some you know or whatever they it's the liberal media they have some idea but no it's1.00
01:11:25.880actually there is sexual abuse going on in the catholic church but they're sussmen they're the0.77
01:11:31.200equivalent of uh they're the gentile sussmen they're outside of this uh the circle of knowers
01:11:37.300essentially you know yes but yeah i think that that is what's going on basically yeah and
01:11:43.980spielberg knows it right um you know i don't know anything about i mean i i don't think that there's
01:11:50.760any sexual scandals around spielberg though i think the guy lives a pretty like normie life
01:11:55.560as far as i know i mean maybe you know maybe the guy will appear in some epstein files or who knows
01:12:00.200but i think he lives a pretty norm normie life but nevertheless there actually have been some
01:12:06.000accusations but there's never been real evidence and and so you know there there are accusations
01:12:12.200about all any figure of any success there's some someone's going to make an accusation so
01:12:17.240yeah i i think i think what you're what you're saying and i agree with it we're not accusing
01:12:24.280spielberg of anything and he might very well have a perfectly boring you know sex life we're not
01:12:32.260But that doesn't affect our argument at all.0.65
01:12:35.940What we are saying is that within the Jewish tradition and Christian tradition, there is this terrible tradition of initiation through child abuse.
01:12:52.060And someone who Spielberg is a knower, he would recognize this, even if never partaking in it himself.0.66
01:13:02.260Yeah, I mean, it was true among the Greeks, of course, as well, more explicitly, in the Dorian region in particular.
01:13:09.180And this affected even the cult of Apollo in the Dorian region, especially among the Spartans, right?
01:13:16.860So it's not, and I guess, so there, presumably, it served the same purpose.
01:13:22.680The Theban band, you know, Thebes, that famously defeated the Spartans, were thought to be basically, you know, a group of men that were bred this way, you know, as boy lovers and so forth.
01:13:39.600But they were a cohesive military unit, right?
01:13:44.680I mean, you know, philosophers also criticized the practice, saying it led to the opposite, ultimately.
01:13:51.700It led to weakness and coward, cowardliness and unmanliness and so forth. But, but I think that the theory behind it is that it does lead to a kind of religious fealty, essentially, and cohesiveness, right? These kind of, you're thick as thieves, you're short, you're sharing these kind of sins, evils, and terrible secrets, right?
01:14:13.900yeah um and to your point to your point that these people understand how this works like
01:14:20.700spielberg was is obviously involved in like what's known as the study group or the mega group which
01:14:27.060i'm sure you're well aware of like the les wexner and the bronfman family uh sort of like syndicate
01:14:36.360of like philanthropy you know what i'm talking about no i i've never heard of that before
01:14:42.160less okay wexner obviously was involved with epstein and so on right he founded something
01:14:48.640in the 90s that was later referred to as the study group or sometimes called the mega group
01:14:54.600and it was basically these influential uh jews in different industries who would get together0.64
01:15:01.820to sort of influence culture uh you know and sort of like meet in the back room and decide that they
01:15:08.320were going to do this thing or that thing and spielberg is a prominent member and you know
01:15:13.640was known as being part of this and whether he like ever partook in any impropriety i'm not even
01:15:21.900venturing to speculate on but just like some of these people were surely doing like sexually
01:15:30.040untoward things and uh and you know on some level i think he he does understand what like
01:15:37.440what ritualistic child abuse means for the jewish faith or within judaism yes yeah well
01:15:46.660i mean and probably richard would agree with me i mean it's not like we're not letting the guy
01:15:53.260off the hook in any way we we don't know what the guy's done and probably maybe no one will ever
01:15:59.100know or history will never know right i mean that's the problem with this particular crime
01:16:03.160is that it is basically a secret crime