RadixJournal - Europe, a Nation？

00:00:00.620 It's Monday, February 3rd, and welcome back to The McSpencer Group, the internet's most

00:00:07.520 Anglo-centric podcast. Joining me are Celtic bard Keith Woods and exuberant Albion Edward

00:00:15.140 Dutton. Top issue, Brexit is for real. As the European Parliament sang the old long

00:00:23.660 sign and the Union Jack was removed from Brussels' flag procession, the seemingly impossible

00:00:29.660 became fact. Great Britain was out of the European Union, and the Tories are riding high once

00:00:36.920 more in London. In 2016, Brexit was viewed as a major advancement for nationalism and populism.

00:00:45.060 But did the alt-right overlook or misunderstand something in all the frivolity? The panel

00:00:51.160 discusses the future of both nationalism and Europeanism.

00:00:54.920 Well, Ed, welcome to the programme. I hope you've recovered from your heavy drinking and

00:01:02.980 frivolity. Free at last. Free at last. Thank God almighty, you are free at last.

00:01:11.400 A nation once again. Oh, yes.

00:01:14.180 A nation once again. God save the Queen. The English, the English, your English are best. I

00:01:20.280 couldn't give tuppence for all of the rest. Yes, that is, that is, as we say, the rottenness

00:01:25.500 It's inwards past Calais, isn't that the phrase?

00:01:28.680 Oh, yes, that's right. That's right. There's fog in the channel. The continent is cut off.

00:01:34.220 The Irish now are contempt is beneath. He sleeps in his boots and he lies through his teeth. He blows 1.00

00:01:39.040 up policemen, or so I have heard, and blames it on Cromwell and William III. Yes, that is pretty much

00:01:45.380 the feeling. Yeah, a load of us met up in Oulu at a Nepalese restaurant, which we thought

00:01:53.520 was very colonial, very nice colonial British Empire setting. And then we celebrated heartily

00:02:00.820 throughout the night. And then we retired to a workplace of a friend who had a cellar where

00:02:07.080 we could watch the television and we counted down, sang Auld Lang Syne, which is important

00:02:11.040 to reclaim from the Remainers, Auld Lang Syne, because they've made out, it's, we had all

00:02:16.860 of the European Parliament, all of these beta males and weak, you know, I thought that was 0.88

00:02:22.380 rather touching, actually, that that was respectful.

00:02:26.900 It was an attempt to get something which is associated with tradition, which we sing in

00:02:31.180 New Year, I don't know if you're in America, but in Britain, we sing it on New Year's Eve.

00:02:34.780 It's associated with tradition. It's associated with times of change. And I felt it was an attempt

00:02:39.760 to taint that with their maladaptive ideology and make it so that we felt that we couldn't

00:02:45.560 use it ourselves. Because it was the one thing that I thought, what are we going to sing at

00:02:48.460 11, at one in the morning in Finland, seven o'clock UK? Auld Lang Syne. They tried to take

00:02:55.480 that away. So no, I wasn't happy about that. They should sing something by Chumbawamba or something

00:03:00.120 if they want to sing something. Anyway, so yes, the main thing is the movement towards freedom.

00:03:07.100 This is how the Irish would have felt in 1922, or whatever it was really, one with the free

00:03:11.400 state. And the movement towards freedom. Ireland didn't get there till what year? What year

00:03:17.300 did you become a republic? 49?

00:03:19.400 48 or 9, yeah.

00:03:21.200 48 or 9?

00:03:22.060 Oh yeah, 49.

00:03:23.560 Yeah, but it's an important step along the way to being an independent country once again,

00:03:29.020 and not a vassal state of this left wing, overlord, super state.

00:03:35.640 Well, speaking as an American, I'm glad that you're our vassal state again. You know, our little

00:03:41.920 island, our 51st state, we can kind of push you around once more. It's going to be fun.

00:03:48.860 I doubt, I don't think those would be the dynamics of it. As I've discussed before, there's no such

00:03:54.000 thing as Americans, there's English people, like yourself, who happen to live in America. And it's

00:03:59.680 the same relationship, I think, that Portugal had been having with Brazil by the 1950s, that the

00:04:05.200 power centre had moved to Brazil. But nevertheless, we're talking about Portuguese people. That makes

00:04:10.380 perfect sense to me. With the British, the Canadians, the Australians, the New Zealanders, 0.54

00:04:15.600 they're one people, British people, and the Irish, and particularly their writers, as I discussed

00:04:22.100 my video recently. And so I see, I see no reason, what's the, mainly the, the exception of Graham

00:04:32.020 Linehan. And so I see the writer of Farmer Pet and other such things, big, big, big, big, big train.

00:04:38.140 But I see no reason whatsoever why we should be unhappy about this. This is a, we're an independent

00:04:44.980 country once again, which is excellent. And also, it's finally winning at something. I was thinking

00:04:51.000 about this in political terms. Sorry, Ed, can I cut you off? Did you have a nice pint of ale with

00:04:56.700 one of the, one of the new African migrants that Boris Johnson is bringing in to replace

00:05:01.340 the Polish plumbers? Yeah. Did you celebrate that together? Well, obviously not, because I was in 0.99

00:05:07.360 Finland. But anyway, one of the, one of the things which would have been... I was in Finland this year,

00:05:13.540 and I saw a lot of Africans. I doubt you saw a lot of Africans in Finland.

00:05:19.320 I doubt you... Where? Where in Finland? Well, Helsinki.

00:05:23.300 Oh, yeah. Helsinki's gone. Helsinki's gone. I don't think that ever was really Finland.

00:05:28.620 But the proper Finland, it's not so much of an issue. But yes, it's true. It's certainly true that 0.99

00:05:34.480 that is potentially a black pill, no pun intended. But I think we have, that has to be balanced with

00:05:42.500 the positive sides of this, which is, first of all, finally winning at something. I was thinking

00:05:47.100 about this. I don't think the right has won at anything actually implemented any change in a

00:05:53.140 right-woods direction since perhaps the 1980s, since the late 1980s, when there was a... where

00:06:00.400 they had this situation where rabid leftists were promoting homosexuality and good as well

00:06:05.440 at school. And Mrs. Thatcher's government passed a law banning that. They made it illegal for

00:06:10.500 teachers to tell pupils that it was a good thing, that it was okay to be gay and to encourage

00:06:16.480 this kind of thing. And that's the last time something moved in a right-woods direction.

00:06:21.320 Since then, everything's been in the left-woods direction. Pretty much all victories have been

00:06:25.260 victories of the left. Very minor. But actually, implement something. Implement something.

00:06:31.660 This is a big thing. This would be like, actually, to Donald Trump doing something. I know he's done

00:06:35.760 not that much, but if he were here to do something. So I think it pleases me. I appreciate it's not

00:06:41.200 perfect, but it is pleasing.

00:06:43.360 All right. Before I go to Keith, Ed, what do you think will happen, not necessarily in the

00:06:52.220 immediate term, but in the next 10 to 20 years, which is a long time in politics? What do you

00:06:58.900 think will actually come from Brexit?

00:07:03.340 It's very difficult to say in the euphoria of it just having happened to have any kind of rational

00:07:08.820 view? Or you could come back to me in a few months and I might have calmed down. I was exhausted.

00:07:14.040 I was, I was exhausted yesterday. It was my son's birthday party. He had a birthday party at one of

00:07:18.580 these, we call it Theo's Lakey Mar. It's a bit like the thing you have in America, Chuck E. Cheese.

00:07:23.460 You know, Chuck E. Cheese?

00:07:24.680 Yes, I had. I went to many birthday parties there. I wonder if I had one.

00:07:28.260 Chuck E. Cheese is quite small. It's mainly based around eating and there's a small play area.

00:07:33.260 Whereas this is like a massive aircraft hangar full of an indoor jungle.

00:07:37.300 Yeah. I'm imagining a Finnish Chuck E. Cheese. You, you eat like weird, uh, uh, raw fish and 1.00

00:07:44.500 throw darts or something. You're like, it's a lot like Chuck E. Cheese.

00:07:48.280 No, it's, it's the nearest. I didn't know about this, but it was, I, there were these Mormons

00:07:52.060 that were trying to convert me to Mormonism in Olu a few years ago. These two young girls

00:07:55.880 about 2014, they were about under 20 years old. These two young girls from, uh, you, one from Utah,

00:08:00.840 they're from California. And I said to them, I haven't got time to come and watch you with a load,

00:08:04.760 get a load of shot glasses. And that's the equivalent of the church. And they all fall

00:08:08.600 down. And you tell me about Joe. So I haven't got time, but I am taking my children to Leo's

00:08:13.080 Lakeymar or Hoplop or the other one. Why don't you come there? It's free for adults. And I can sit

00:08:18.740 there with you and you can tell me about Mormonism and then you can go on all the stuff for free.

00:08:22.980 And they thought this was a brilliant idea, but then they told their supervisor and he said,

00:08:26.580 no, that's too fun. That's too, that's much too fun for your mission. You can't do that. But she, 0.96

00:08:31.460 she compared it to Chuck E. Cheese. She said it was like Chuck E. Cheese. I went into a Chuck E. Cheese

00:08:36.060 in Maryland and it was small and not very impressive. So anyway, so yeah, anyway, I was

00:08:42.940 exhausted there because I've been celebrating so much. I was almost sleeping there yesterday. I was so

00:08:46.960 tired. So I'm not, I'm not, I don't, I do not, I cannot successfully augur what will be

00:08:52.940 going on 10 years hence, but at least we won't be subject to ludicrous dictates from the European

00:08:57.960 court. At least we have to let in, we won't have a more and more people coming in. I mean,

00:09:03.600 I was in a situation a while ago I was in London. I ordered some pork scratchings at a bar in London

00:09:07.920 and the barman didn't know what they were because he wasn't British and he'd never heard of pork

00:09:12.720 scratchings. It was absolutely outrageous. And the European union did that really? Yeah. The European

00:09:17.280 union allowed for Europeans, for people who don't speak English very well to be able to come into

00:09:22.460 Britain and work in bars. Yeah. Whatever that's true. Yes. It's terrible. It is terrible because

00:09:28.120 if you are a working class English person, it's absolutely, you're a plumber. It's absolutely 1.00

00:09:32.340 outrageous that you should have to compete with people who are prepared to live off next nothing,

00:09:37.560 who've got Poland to go back to if things go badly or whatever. And your business is being wrecked

00:09:42.900 by competition. I get that actually, but I would say as low price immigrants go, you couldn't do much 1.00

00:09:52.760 better. But yeah, you are right. That evil totalitarian EU will no longer be regulating

00:09:59.420 milk chocolate and other atrocities like regulating bananas and length of the banana and so on. I mean,

00:10:05.780 you must feel just you can mock all you like. You will. You can, you can mock all you like,

00:10:12.040 but you must know that one of the things that revolutionaries do, you can mock all you wish.

00:10:19.500 But one of the things that you must know is that one of the things that revolutionaries and whatever

00:10:23.000 try to do is to undermine the confidence, to knock the confidence of the people. And one of the ways

00:10:27.620 they do that is by mocking their religion, by mocking the things they hold sacred, by mocking the

00:10:31.940 things that hold them together, by undermining their sense of confidence. And that was a big

00:10:35.540 part of what the European Union was doing. It was taking the things which make, make sense of our

00:10:40.020 world, which connects us, that's important as well, which connects us to our ancestors as a kind of

00:10:44.380 unbroken line, such as using imperial measures, or such as whatever it might be, and taking those away,

00:10:52.200 or non-imperial measures, no, imperial measures we use, such as those, and taking those away. So

00:10:58.060 there's less of a connection between us and our ancestors, less of a coherent society,

00:11:02.780 and more of a sort of a bunch of amorphous blobs who can be controlled from on high and

00:11:08.440 indoctrinated. That's what a lot of what happened in 1984 was about, take away the language, take

00:11:12.900 away individuality, take away the relationship to the past, cut off the past. That's what political

00:11:17.400 correctness does. Suddenly, we can't use this word, and this word, and this word, and we're gradually

00:11:21.460 cut off from the past, our connections with our ancestors, our sense of ourselves as a tribe. And that's

00:11:25.540 what they were doing. And it was a deliberate policy to do that. That's what they were set out to do

00:11:29.420 that. The idea was to create a sense of European-ness, based around, to make it worse. I mean, that wouldn't 0.98

00:11:35.420 necessarily be inherently bad, the idea that we should be united in the face of politics.

00:11:38.440 And forcing you to sing the Beethoven's Ninth Symphony chorale or things like that doesn't sound too awful.

00:11:44.660 No, precisely. That's not perhaps an inherently bad thing. If Europe is under attack from outside, perhaps it

00:11:49.520 would be good to have a united Europe. But that wasn't, it wasn't that kind of united Europe that was

00:11:52.840 going on. It was a united Europe based around values and moral realism and all this kind of

00:11:57.620 nonsense. So it's a leftist project. It didn't have to be. But it is. It's an Orwellian project,

00:12:03.280 which is attempting to suppress nationalism, to suppress people, therefore people's genetic

00:12:07.600 interests, suppress their ability to talk about their own invasion and do something about it.

00:12:11.340 And therefore, we're best off out of it. And Ireland is best off out of it. And Ireland is finally seeing

00:12:16.760 the consequences now. There's an election in Ireland. When is it? About 20 days' time?

00:12:20.700 Less. It's less than two weeks now, I think.

00:12:24.620 Right. And you've seen, and it's happened very rapidly, the change in Ireland over the

00:12:29.620 last 20 years is absolutely catastrophic. And as it is Europeanized and woke-ified and 1.00

00:12:38.080 all of the people who, if you'd had an abortion, would have been aborted. They haven't been.

00:12:43.280 Sorry?

00:12:43.980 And Brussels did that. They somehow had an ability to change the immigration policies.

00:12:49.920 Brussels has attacked things which are aspects of history, which are traditional things,

00:12:56.240 in an attempt to make everybody the same and to suppress individuality, including at the

00:13:01.440 national level. And also, of course, to impose free borders and free movement of people,

00:13:06.940 which does that. Because if you have diversity, it inherently undermines trust. It inherently 0.99

00:13:12.060 undermines a sense of nationalism. It inherently undermines civic life. So it does that. And also,

00:13:18.100 to bring in migration from the South.

00:13:21.300 I agree with the free migration within the European sphere. I mean, I think actually some

00:13:29.760 of the continental countries might feel lucky now that they've gotten the Great Britain out

00:13:35.460 of there, because Great Britain was engaging in demographic transformation at a much more rapid

00:13:41.900 pace than any of these other continental countries. So they might have been saved.

00:13:47.300 But Great Britain has moved from a general white... That's absolutely true. And Great Britain 0.97

00:13:52.320 has moved from a white bloc, effectively, to a non-white, you know, globalized world. 0.77

00:14:00.620 But anyway, I won't do my blackpilling yet. I'm going to wait.

00:14:04.080 Well, hang on. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. It's an empirically inaccurate statement. So

00:14:07.960 according to the latest census, England is about 15% non-white. If you look at somewhere like the 0.98

00:14:12.680 Netherlands or somewhere like that, or Belgium, it's in a much worse state, about 25%, if not more.

00:14:18.640 So it's not accurate to say that we are... There are countries in Europe that are less non-white

00:14:23.820 than us, such as Finland. But I think we're about average. And there's many that are above average

00:14:30.000 that are in a far worse state. But anyway, what is that built?

00:14:34.740 Fair enough. That is... I'll grant you that. You have moved, again, to a less white political 0.86

00:14:41.480 order by leaving the European Union, if we are to assume that the European Union is actually...

00:14:47.820 has these kind of powers of national sovereignty. I mean, the European Commission is ultimately

00:14:52.200 the nation states controlling it. But anyway, Keith, as an Irishman, what is your perspective

00:14:59.540 on this? Are you happy? Are you dispassionate? Or...

00:15:03.460 Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I think it kind of remains to be seen what will happen regarding

00:15:11.200 Brexit. I mean, definitely in the short term, pretty much every economic forecast says they're

00:15:17.220 going to suffer slightly. And there'll be a slight knock on effect to Ireland, but I'm

00:15:20.920 not too concerned about that. But in terms of Ireland's relationship with the EU, that's

00:15:25.520 kind of an interesting one, because we've probably benefited more than any country. But at the

00:15:30.860 same time, in the last few years, we've probably suffered more than any country as well, due

00:15:35.100 to some of the economic policies. And I know Ed said we'd be better off out of the EU. I

00:15:40.260 don't think that's true at all. We actually have the highest approval rate, and it's close

00:15:44.060 to 90% for staying in the EU. And that's mostly because of our economic model, which is, you know,

00:15:49.740 completely reliant on foreign direct investment from US companies that then export to the Eurozone.

00:15:55.440 And, you know, that's where all our growth has come from. But, you know, it's tricky. It's like the EU,

00:16:04.280 you know, I know Ed says that the problem is it's a left-wing project, but I think that it's more

00:16:10.200 the neoliberalism. I think the EU could actually do with a dose of leftism and economics, because

00:16:15.640 if you want to look at Ireland's a good example of this, you know, we were an economic backwater

00:16:20.880 when we joined DEC in the 70s. And it was investment programs from the EU and the infrastructure

00:16:27.500 and such here that developed us into this first world tribe and modern economy. But the big problem

00:16:33.740 into the 2000s was that we have a unified monetary policy that benefits Germany, but there's no

00:16:40.960 unified fiscal policy. So you had in the early 2000s this low growth or this low interest rate

00:16:47.900 that's there, you know, solely for the German economy, for the German export economy. And so you

00:16:54.440 had countries like Ireland where there was something of an economic bubble and also countries like Greece

00:17:00.060 and Italy able to access cheap credit. And this was absolutely disastrous for these countries. And

00:17:05.980 this is why we were then forced by the ECB to socialize 64 billion euros worth of economic banking

00:17:13.380 debt to prop up German and French banks. So this was something, this was debt that was socialized by

00:17:19.260 the Irish people for the stability of the European economy. And I think this gets to the heart of the

00:17:25.320 the problem that's at the EU, which is that it's not if it would be better if it was just committed to full

00:17:31.300 federalism. It was it would be better if it was committed to full unification rather than this halfway house where

00:17:37.160 there are elements that want federalism and then there are elements of all nationalism and you end up with this

00:17:42.500 kind of confederalism and you get elements of each. And so you have something like, you know, you've a unified

00:17:49.240 monetary theory that makes countries like Ireland or Greece or Italy suffer because they have monetary

00:17:56.560 policy that isn't at all suited to them, that's set by Germany and they have interest rates that don't

00:18:02.920 suit their economy and are usually in the, you know, the opposite of the interests of their economy because

00:18:07.100 they have a complete different approach to Germany. But then when those countries get into trouble due to that,

00:18:12.700 you don't have the EU willing to, you know, something like you see in the US, you know,

00:18:17.100 with bailouts of states and fiscal policy, modern monetary theory, these sorts of

00:18:24.500 Keynesian type policies. Instead, what you get is Germany comes and imposes austerity on countries

00:18:31.540 like Ireland and Greece. So you have a you have a monetary policy that is unified, that benefits

00:18:38.000 Germany. But then at the same time, there's no there isn't the there isn't the power there, 0.54

00:18:43.600 there isn't the will to be able to create a fiscal policy that would benefit Europe. I mean,

00:18:47.960 what the EU has been lacking the last decade is investment. And what what they did in response to

00:18:53.860 the crisis was to pass a fiscal compact treaty that means that member states now can't run a budget

00:19:00.700 deficit, which means that countries now are completely locked into this kind of monetarist sort

00:19:08.840 of center right means of managing economy. That's all about balancing your books, you know, this very,

00:19:13.880 this very German way of dealing with economics. But it means that there's a complete lack of public

00:19:18.940 spending and a complete lack of investments. Then you have all these infrastructural problems like

00:19:23.100 the, you know, the massive level of youth unemployment, especially in the southern states.

00:19:27.260 So like the the EU project as a whole is, is it's lacking any kind of idealism. It's got all these

00:19:34.900 competing interests. And it's this constant battle between federalism and opponents of it. And so you

00:19:41.020 end up with this muddied sort of halfway house that doesn't actually benefit anyone really.

00:19:46.620 Yeah, I mean, I think there, I agree with everything you said, I and I look, even, even though I might be

00:19:54.040 much more supportive of the EU than most people who might talk to in the dissident right, I recognize

00:20:02.680 these problems. And there are just kind of competing interests of Germany being still an export economy

00:20:08.760 and an industrial economy that would benefit from a weaker euro, in the sense that their stuff is less

00:20:17.320 expensive. Whereas you have been in southern Europe, I mean, Greece, I remember there was this

00:20:22.080 Greek crisis, four or five years ago, in which they were actually benefiting from a stronger policy in

00:20:30.480 the sense that they're a tourist economy, they want money coming in. And so you have these competing

00:20:35.360 interests and, you know, obviously, dramatically different cultures between, you know, Frankfurt and

00:20:41.860 Athens. And whether this can all work is a huge question. And I get it. And due to the fact that the EU

00:20:49.520 was always this conspiracy of bankers and, you know, industrial people, it wasn't able to ever be

00:20:59.520 idealistic, there was there's no real independence day, or national day for the EU, it started out as a

00:21:07.360 common market, I think there was some idealism in the sense of, if we trade, we're not going to fight,

00:21:13.120 which is, you know, reasonable assumption. But it never had that basic idealism of we are a people

00:21:25.120 and you have to start there when you start in this conspiracy of bankers and pure plutocrats and

00:21:30.480 bureaucrats, you end up in this, again, just this massive compromise in which everyone's unhappy. I agree,

00:21:37.840 there are huge problems. Go ahead, Ed.

00:21:39.620 It's a really significant thing about Britain.

00:21:42.260 Sorry, go ahead.

00:21:44.180 Irish, what was violent towards us?

00:21:46.680 No, what were you going to say?

00:21:49.320 Yeah, no, the really significant thing about Britain leaving could be more the impact it has in terms of

00:21:55.480 internal EU policy than what it has directly on Britain. I mean, Francois Hollande and Christine

00:22:00.680 Lagarde have both said that they think that this will sort of reinvigorate Europe, that this will give

00:22:05.980 Europe a new elan, because Britain entered the EU explicitly from a sort of anti-European integration

00:22:15.920 standpoint. And it's always, it's always been, it's always been pushed. Yeah, and it's always, it's always been

00:22:23.740 pushing back against integration. And it would be one of the countries that would, you know, mostly push back

00:22:29.220 against, you know, a policy, like I mentioned, like having a unified fiscal policy to enact stimulus packages,

00:22:35.720 whatever, to fix these structural problems. So you will see a realignment. And there could actually

00:22:42.680 be a realignment. You know, it's interesting. I mean, it could go a couple of ways. But one of the

00:22:48.260 things is, there's this northern voting bloc, and there's this sort of southern voting bloc of more

00:22:53.140 Eurosceptic nationalist types. And Britain, with, you know, it's 12 and a half percent of Europe,

00:22:58.280 had a large voting share. And it was voting with the more liberal elements of France and Germany and

00:23:03.160 other northern European countries. So with that gone, now, there could be a shift to a more

00:23:08.620 Italian style policy. But then at the same time, I mean, from a sort of dissident right perspective,

00:23:14.660 or whatever, if Britain had stayed in, and instead of sort of sublimating their nationalism into this,

00:23:21.380 if they'd enacted it in kind of a nationalist government, then Britain could have actually

00:23:26.460 led a more sort of Eurocentric Europe, if that makes sense, rather than this neoliberal style

00:23:34.140 Europe that's being run by Merkel and by Germany and France.

00:23:39.580 Can I add some comments? So first of all, the idea of British nationalism, it perhaps rather like the EU,

00:23:49.120 it started off as an economic union. It wasn't, there was no British nationalism. There was English

00:23:54.860 nationalism, Welsh nationalism, Irish nationalism, Scottish nationalism. And this notion of British

00:23:59.660 nationalism gradually developed throughout the 18th century. And you get things like a British 0.58

00:24:03.860 national anthem, a British flag, a sense of British history, the playing up of Celtic things in the

00:24:12.060 history of England, like Budacea or whatever, because these were things that united all of us,

00:24:18.140 both because she was living in England, and also then the other people in the Union were Celts.

00:24:23.460 And so this sense of Britishness kind of gradually developed from there. And it worked because it

00:24:28.320 was a British empire, a British movement that was in the, not just the economic, but in the ethnic and

00:24:36.540 genetic interests of the British. And it expanded into this British empire and so on. So, and I was

00:24:42.860 thinking with Germany as well, Bismarck's unification of Germany was a Prussian project in order to

00:24:49.020 maintain peace, in order to maintain the interests of Prussia, really, and the Prussian nationalism,

00:24:55.880 which then developed into this German nationalism, and happily coincided with the rise of romantic

00:25:02.040 nationalism and this idea of the Germans as one people, because they all spoke German and all this,

00:25:06.180 and they were ethnically German, this herder. So there's no reason why something can't start as an 0.98

00:25:12.060 economic project. And then which the it did remember, it was called the common market,

00:25:16.740 right, then it was called the European Economic Community. Then it was called the EC, then it was

00:25:22.400 called the European Community EC, then it was called the European Union. So there's this been this change

00:25:27.640 in terms of this, the name, the name alone tells you the change from an economic thing, to a nation

00:25:33.500 building thing. And I think that could work quite well, if it explicitly coincided with this being

00:25:40.020 potentially in the interests of all European peoples, what we have in common, ultimately us

00:25:45.700 Europeans is we are a race. And as a race, we have certain other than okay, there's people on the

00:25:51.120 borders, like the Finns, or the Italians, or the Spanish or Portuguese that have various degrees of

00:25:55.440 non European blood. But basically, we're a race. And we have certain genetic interests for that reason,

00:26:00.200 if that could coincide with the economic union, which is what you get got with Germany, it's what

00:26:04.660 you got with Great Britain, right? Britain, rather Britain. And it's there's various other examples

00:26:09.860 throughout history, then fine. But that's not what you're getting. As Keith said, there is this mismatch

00:26:14.020 of different intentions and different ideas. And you just end up with something that's a problem.

00:26:19.060 I totally agree with that. And I think some of those sentiments are kind of lurking. You'll actually

00:26:26.700 hear Brexit supporters talk about the racist EU and things like that. I think we'll all chuckle at

00:26:32.900 that. But he's not entirely wrong. I think some of those racial, basically, autarkic qualities of

00:26:45.180 having a great big market, where you're protected from dumping from the outside. There is going to be

00:26:52.960 more free exchange between countries, you can travel more easily. You know, you can, I think

00:26:59.160 one of the biggest things that's promoted the EU was the Erasmus project. Basically, young people,

00:27:07.360 you know, a young German traveling to Spain and having a Spanish girlfriend that probably did more to

00:27:13.160 promote European-ness than anything. And these ideas are lurking there, and they could be accentuated.

00:27:21.680 I think if the EU is going to, I think the EU could probably stick around just on a purely economic

00:27:28.260 basis. But if the EU is going to be something, it's going to have to call upon that. And you know,

00:27:34.320 look, Turkey and the EU, that's now out the window. No one's even talking about that. They were talking

00:27:39.060 about that 15 years ago. I remember when I was actually in Germany. And you have people who are

00:27:44.380 very flawed, like Macron, who he's a very flawed politician, granted, but he is a highly intelligent

00:27:55.060 person. And he's actually a person that I find resonates with a lot of things that I've said,

00:28:02.560 to be honest. A guy on Twitter actually gave a little conspiracy theory about that. But anyway,

00:28:07.140 he's talked about, ultimately, an EU army. And you're either going to be America's, well,

00:28:14.640 I could use the word bitch, but let's use the word pawn, because this is a sophisticated podcast. 0.96

00:28:20.420 You're going to be, militarily speaking, and to a large degree, economically speaking, 0.99

00:28:25.360 you're going to be America's pawn, you might be Russia's pawn, you might be China's pawn, 0.97

00:28:29.200 unless you can create a sense of European-ness, that that is a bigger thing that ultimately the

00:28:39.200 national identities are a part of, and that you have a real military bloc. And so there are,

00:28:46.520 these ideas are, they're lurking there. I mean, when Macron says this, he's kind of treated as,

00:28:51.580 oh, this is our intellectual president, who's, you know, so on. But he's right,

00:28:55.760 in the end of the day, if the EU is to become something real, and not this just, you know,

00:29:01.340 thing that, compromise that doesn't please anyone, it's going to have to embrace those qualities.

00:29:07.200 And I would also say, in terms of nationalism, it is no, nationalism can resonate with federalism.

00:29:14.880 And it does, in the sense of the Scottish National Party, which again, I'm not a huge fan of,

00:29:20.740 for many reasons, but they want to leave Great Britain in order to express their nationalism

00:29:27.720 in the European Union. You saw this, again, with Catalonia, trying to secede from Spain a couple

00:29:36.100 years ago. You see this all over the place. There's no real contradiction. They're not,

00:29:41.260 the EU is not going to, you know, it's not going to disallow you from,

00:29:46.160 you know, reading Shakespeare and wearing a tweed suit. It's, you can do that nationalism and of

00:29:54.220 that cultural linguistic quality of we're connected to something, a continuum that's deeper than

00:29:59.220 ourselves, is not, not only is it not opposed to federalism, it can actually be kind of accentuated

00:30:07.200 by federalism. And it's the nation state that the centralized nation state that has been most easily

00:30:16.460 most responsible for mass immigration to these countries, and the destruction of regional cultures. 0.96

00:30:23.240 You can see this in France, you can see this in Germany, you can see this in Great Britain,

00:30:27.220 as you yourself have described. The nation state is responsible for the demographic catastrophe

00:30:34.640 in Great Britain. And the nation state is much more responsible for bringing about this homogeneity

00:30:41.880 and kind of the, you know, least common denominator, last man, if you want to use that,

00:30:48.000 much more than any federal, any federated Europe that has ever existed.

00:30:53.820 So first of all, can I, can I just say, so the, first of all, the nation state has been disastrous in

00:31:00.260 this sense, when it has been run by the kind of people that want the nation state to be in the

00:31:04.100 European Union, such as Tony Blair, and other such vermin. So that's when the nation state has been

00:31:10.420 a particular acute problem in British history, when it's been run by the kind of people who are pro-EU.

00:31:15.980 It's having those values of massive, of wanting mass immigration and our destruction seems to also 0.97

00:31:21.060 call it wanting our cultural destruction.

00:31:22.820 Enoch Powell was raging against the British Immigration Party long before the Britain ever entered the EU.

00:31:31.600 He was rabidly, he was totally against being in the EU as well.

00:31:35.980 I agree with that, actually. I admire Enoch Powell tremendously.

00:31:40.140 He left the Conservative Party over that issue. As for Erasmus, two thoughts on that. One thing

00:31:46.100 that tends to bond people together is having a language, the same language. One thing that could

00:31:50.920 be, because it's easier communication, nuance, whatever. And one thing that's interesting about

00:31:55.840 that is that Erasmus was quite good in spreading English.

00:31:59.220 I know. It's a great irony.

00:32:01.960 British hegemony, or American hegemony, because you get people who were from Spain, and they go on 0.99

00:32:07.120 Erasmus' term to Finland, and they speak English to each other, and they have a child, and that child

00:32:12.020 ends up essentially trilingual. And one of those languages is English. So the third thing I noticed

00:32:17.240 is that the Erasmus thing seems to be, it seems rather lopsided. So you'd get loads of foreigners that would 1.00

00:32:21.760 come to, let's say, Durham University, where I was, or Aberdeen University, where I was. But you

00:32:26.440 wouldn't get many people from there that would do an Erasmus term. I didn't know many British

00:32:31.200 people at all that did an Erasmus term. But you would get it the other way around.

00:32:36.480 I noticed this when I was studying German at the Goethe-Institut. I would try to speak German,

00:32:42.300 obviously, as much as possible when I was there. But I would notice that a lot of, there would be

00:32:48.120 these kind of European lunch tables, where you would have an Italian, and maybe a Frenchman,

00:32:54.140 and maybe even someone from Japan or something. There are lots of Japanese learning German. I think

00:32:59.820 their rich parents just send them off to six months to learn something to get them out of the house or

00:33:04.280 something. But they were all speaking basically American business English together. And you can say,

00:33:11.000 oh, this is a debasement of national culture. And I agree with that to a certain extent. But you could

00:33:16.900 also say that we need a lingua franca that can bring us together as a race. And sometimes these

00:33:23.740 cultural differences, which can be beautiful, and which we want to preserve, can actually prevent us

00:33:29.220 from coming together in a way that I think we should. And so there's actually a kind of,

00:33:34.920 there's a certain benefit to dumbed down Americanization. I mean, I'm, you know, I'm saying

00:33:41.280 this is, as me, I'm not, I'm not promoting it. But like, there's a, we need a, we need a commonality

00:33:48.320 that we can, you know, come together around as a, as one people.

00:33:53.280 Hugely important to Kenyan nationalism, let's say, is Swahili or English.

00:33:57.480 Right.

00:33:57.620 Because it's what, it's the one way you can communicate in a country with 200 languages

00:34:01.320 or how many it has.

00:34:02.040 It's the great irony that the EU will unite in an anti-Americanism while speaking American

00:34:09.960 business English. I mean, it's a great irony of the century, but who cares at some level?

00:34:15.680 So, so long as it's working.

00:34:16.320 I'm not sure. I'm not sure. The other point that Keith, or was it you? No, it was you.

00:34:21.160 I'm not sure that this will reinvigorate the EU. I think one reaction to something like this

00:34:26.640 happening is people tend to become more kind of authoritarian and inward looking and strict

00:34:31.960 and as a kind of like a religious react. If you're under stress, you tend to become

00:34:36.280 more religious. And that finding could be transplanted to people becoming more kind of

00:34:40.060 dogmatic and fundamentalist and ideological and, and fearful of somebody else breaking

00:34:45.400 away and thus, and thus doing all they can to stop other people breaking away. But then

00:34:49.880 on the other hand, there's been a massive shock to their confidence for such a large state

00:34:54.100 to break away. And this will inspire people who want to break away in other countries that

00:35:00.220 are toying with doing so.

00:35:02.960 And it may also inspire...

00:35:03.740 Well, that's the fear now for the people running the EU is they have this, they have

00:35:07.820 this block in the South that there's clearly a strong Eurosceptic element and now Brexit has

00:35:12.520 created this precedent. So now that's, you know, that's always hanging over them. But

00:35:16.560 then at the same time, that's balanced with they've lost Britain who opposed most of the

00:35:21.280 more Eurocentric policies that they were pushing through. So it's now much easier for them to

00:35:25.300 pursue them. So it's kind of a double edged sword for these people.

00:35:29.140 And Salvini, who I'm not, I'm not 100% sold on has actually said European things. He's like,

00:35:36.720 the issue isn't just to break away, the issue is to create a Europe of nations. And he's actually

00:35:43.300 said some kind of synthetic dialectical things, which I've appreciated.

00:35:49.720 You can hear similar things from Orban and so on, a person I'm less enthused by. 0.96

00:35:54.720 Yeah, it's funny you mentioned Turkey, because that's fairly relevant to this, because

00:35:59.480 the country that was actually pushing most for Turkey to join the EU was Britain for many years.

00:36:06.040 And, you know, that gets to this again. Yeah. And that gets to another one of these splits

00:36:10.380 that's been within the European community, which is that does the EU go deeper and integrate the

00:36:18.240 countries within it more strongly or does it go broader and integrate more countries from the

00:36:25.680 outside? And that's kind of the neoliberal approach. And I forget who wrote it, but there was a there's

00:36:31.540 a prominent Jewish neoliberal in the US that wrote a book The Next Hundred Years, where he said that the

00:36:37.200 most important relationship would be the US and Turkey, you know, to stop the over reliance on

00:36:42.620 Russia for gas pipelines and so forth, all this different stuff. But yeah, one of the main things

00:36:48.360 is trade with Turkey as well. So that's that's a that's a priority for, you know, US neoliberalism.

00:36:53.440 And Britain has been strongly pushing that, you know, Britain has strongly pushed the anti-Russia

00:36:58.180 stuff. They've pushed broadening the EU into this larger trading bloc for purely economic

00:37:04.480 reasons. And so, you know, that's off the table now with Britain. And so you might actually see a

00:37:09.920 shift away from this neoliberal conception of a broader Europe as an economic trading zone and

00:37:16.720 towards a more compact, but more integrated Europe. I agree. And you and you have some people like

00:37:24.220 Macron, who's deeply flawed, but at least has these European ideas. He actually was saying this,

00:37:30.440 I believe, to a Danish gentleman who was talking about all these things that you love about being

00:37:36.100 a Dane. These are these are ultimately European and they are, you know, they are peculiar, but 0.99

00:37:41.640 they're also bigger than that. But let me kind of go off a little bit on this thing that I saw on social

00:37:48.280 media this past weekend. Apparently, someone put up a door on the cliff, you know, right by the cliffs

00:37:56.460 of Dover. And it said something, you know, it's this way out or something like that. Apparently,

00:38:02.220 that all of these people would open up the door and fall off the chalky cliffs of Dover or something

00:38:09.020 like that. But the question is really, you know, who is leaving Britain after this is done? I think

00:38:18.940 one of the fundamental reasons for the anxiety over Brexit that led to the Brexit vote among normal

00:38:28.880 workers was to a degree the Polish plumber. I think that is real. But it was fundamentally about this

00:38:37.260 massive demographic influx. And it was fear over the migration crisis of 2015. But again,

00:38:46.760 the nation state of Great Britain is fundamentally responsible for this and other nation states are

00:38:54.440 fundamentally responsible for it. The EU migration policy was effectively that any kind of refugee 0.84

00:39:01.340 should stay in the country that he enters. And it was not to grant him citizenship or send him to 0.99

00:39:09.360 London or anything like that. It was a fairly reasonable policy that, you know, could and should be

00:39:15.520 revised. But that's what it was. The demographic transformation of Great Britain was done entirely 0.53

00:39:24.160 by London. And Brussels has never had an ability to affect national immigration. It affects internal

00:39:33.700 immigration. That is, you know, a German or a Pole or a Frenchman can go to Great Britain to work or what

00:39:40.920 have you. And that, you know, again, it's kind of like a one step removed from the national immigration.

00:39:47.720 But the British immigration problem, the demographic change is just fundamentally the responsibility 0.98

00:39:55.160 of London. And if anything, you know, hordes of Poles and Germans or Italians or whatever improved 1.00

00:40:03.800 matters in terms of the racial decomposition of Britain. And it's just a fact. So we have this

00:40:11.320 situation very much like Trump, in which all of these people are feeling these natural, healthy anxieties

00:40:20.120 about what's happening, that they're being transformed. And they project the problem on to Brussels.

00:40:26.440 But if you listen to the explicit language of the Brexiteers, they are going to bring in more people

00:40:36.040 from the global south. I have never heard a Brexit. They might talk about, oh, the EU and 2015 migration,

00:40:43.360 but that's all a sham. They ultimately want greater integration with the global world. And they want

00:40:49.640 more migration, Boris Johnson, bringing in more Africans, he's reducing the the criterion, I believe,

00:40:56.360 for entrance. If you listen to these people like Daniel Hannon, who is a EU parliamentarian,

00:41:02.040 he was a journalist, and this kind of a narrow American file or narrow file, whatever the word is,

00:41:08.200 British politician and thinker. He said explicitly, this is not about racial nationalism. This is about

00:41:16.520 getting out of the stodgy continental Germanic EU and entering into a global market with, I guess,

00:41:25.400 former British colonies and bringing them in. It's about becoming more American. And so it's something 0.55

00:41:32.840 we see all the time on the right, which is bait and switch. I think most of the people who voted for

00:41:40.120 Brexit are people who have, you know, healthy instincts. But I think they're a bit deluded.

00:41:47.560 All of those Pakistanis in London, all of those, you know, Muslims engaging in rape gangs in Rotherham 1.00

00:41:56.440 and similar places, they're not exiting through that door that was set up on the Dover cliffs. They are 0.99

00:42:03.080 staying put. And if anything, their national identity is becoming kind of more firm by this

00:42:11.160 decision. So I just see the same dynamic that you see with Republican electioneering taking place with

00:42:19.320 Brexit. And so I've classified myself previously as a Euro skeptic skeptic in the sense that I've

00:42:26.680 been kind of skeptical of the Farage types, the Daniel Hannon types and so on. But I would say,

00:42:33.960 I mean, perhaps I should come out of the closet as it were in the sense that I think people like

00:42:41.320 Oswald Mosley were right when immediately after the Second World War, they recognized the geopolitics

00:42:49.160 of politics at play. They obviously recognize the genetic or racial dynamics at play. And they

00:42:56.520 said firmly, Europe a nation. We can keep our cultural, linguistic, peculiar identity. I think

00:43:06.280 that's great. And we should, everyone should strive to be kind of individualistic on a national sense

00:43:12.280 like that. But in terms of geopolitics and in terms of the real dynamic of the 21st century,

00:43:19.720 which is race, it's Europe a nation. And I'm not, you know, I don't, I hope the English stay English, 0.86

00:43:27.560 but, you know, an Englishman taking an Italian wife and having children that are, you know,

00:43:35.480 kind of a little bit mixed blood to a certain degree and kind of mixed culturally. Is this really

00:43:40.760 the problem, you know, that we're facing today? Is this an existential crisis? Clearly no.

00:43:48.600 Right. So a number of points I would like to make on that. First of all, I think the key reason why

00:43:54.920 people voted anti-Brexit in the, voted Brexit was not because of the EU itself. It was because

00:44:02.760 the elite, like the EU, and they wanted to say yours to the elite. And there's a small degree to

00:44:09.400 which they changed the elite, because they got this, these people that were on the fringes of,

00:44:13.640 let's say, the Conservative Party, and they put them in power. Right.

00:44:17.320 I.e. people like Boris Johnson and various other people of his supporters. And then they,

00:44:25.320 the Labour Party were completely isolated and ultimately sort of been really massacred.

00:44:29.960 I can't believe they'll be in power for at least 10 years. They'll probably be in opposition.

00:44:33.960 If they elect one of these two silly young girls standing to be leader, 1.00

00:44:37.320 they'll definitely be in opposition for at least 10 years. So let's hope they do. 0.99

00:44:40.040 Who are they? Just real quick.

00:44:41.240 Rebecca Long-Bailey and Lisa Nandy, who's half Indian. And, and then there's, then there's a,

00:44:51.080 there's some, there's some chap called Sakir, Sakir Starmer. If he wins, they might do all right.

00:44:56.040 But so hopefully he won't win. So I don't think he will win. Because the Labour Party people that

00:45:02.040 vote on these things are so woke. So I think that it was not yours. It wasn't the EU. You're right.

00:45:05.960 It's not the EU hasn't been, you could argue, the EU has been nowhere near as bad in terms of

00:45:09.400 destroying Britishness than the government, particularly the Blair government. And I think

00:45:15.000 that is a key, the Blair government and the Brown government, that subhuman scum that took over 1.00

00:45:20.600 the country and should frankly be answerable one day to the British people in a tribunal. 0.98

00:45:25.080 The damage they did is incalculable. There have been immigration before, of course, 1.00

00:45:28.840 but that was from a baseline of nothing, of nothing. So, of course, so apart from a few little

00:45:34.200 things here and there during the empire. And so consequently, there was a big reaction,

00:45:37.800 that there was not, what happened from 19, well, 2001 onwards, was this, just this planned

00:45:42.600 policy of destruction, rub the right's nose in diversity, suppress also artificial freedoms,

00:45:48.120 everything. I think that's, and the elite, people like David Cameron, I'm reading his memoir,

00:45:52.680 his autobiography at the moment, actually, it's quite well written, but you can see in places

00:45:56.600 he goes into these silly ways. The Michael Howard leadership of the Conservative Party in 2005

00:46:01.320 was far too right wing. You know, shut up. The Michael Howard leadership of the Conservative Party 0.99

00:46:06.360 is nowhere near as right wing as, for example, it is now. And he's saying, oh, it's far too right

00:46:11.080 wing. So if that's too right wing, what do you think of Jacob Rees-Mogg and people like that,

00:46:15.160 for goodness sake? Absolutely ridiculous. But he comes across as quite pleasant to read. 0.98

00:46:19.240 So I think it was up yours to the government, up yours to that whole system. And those people

00:46:24.200 that had done this immigration and had pursued all this damage, those people were also very pro-EU.

00:46:29.640 So I think that's where it comes from. And I think that if the government that's in power now

00:46:34.760 tries, that doesn't do something about immigration, what Mrs. Thatcher did was the immigration was far 0.97

00:46:38.600 too high under Callaghan and Wilson. And so she cut it back down, right back down to very small numbers.

00:46:44.680 And for the whole of the 1980s and the 1990s, there were very small levels of immigration.

00:46:49.320 And the racial situation stabilized. It really wasn't much of an issue by the end of the 1990s,

00:46:55.160 that these communities developed. OK, you've got the beginnings of the grooming gangs and all this

00:46:59.160 stuff. But it's sort of stabilized. You didn't have to fear that your community that was white 0.96

00:47:04.520 would become non-white. The situation was the situation. And so I think that's where we have 0.90

00:47:11.560 the EU comes in, is the EU and that whole way of thinking about the world of leftism and change

00:47:17.800 for change's sake and immigration is associated with that particular government. And then Cameron,

00:47:23.880 who really was a kind of blue labor, he really didn't do, he really wasn't a major shift with

00:47:28.600 the past. And so it was a way of removing that ruling class or that aspect of the ruling class,

00:47:34.200 because they were pissed off with the government. The solution to the problem that we have probably

00:47:41.400 ultimately will be some kind of civil war, because that's what tends to happen in all ethnically

00:47:45.400 diverse societies, always, ever. But that will be sometime, unless they can be held together somehow

00:47:52.680 through some kind of dictatorship, like Singapore or something.

00:47:56.600 I've seen some headlines about whites being a minority in Great Britain by 2060, I think was the...

00:48:04.680 2060, yeah.

00:48:05.640 Yeah, so it's basically, the 2050 number was thrown about a lot in the 90s in the United States,

00:48:12.360 and it's actually 2040 now. And we actually did a report that we think it's closer to 2035.

00:48:20.040 But again, we're just dealing with a few years, really. But yeah, I mean, Great Britain is going

00:48:26.600 exactly down the same direction as the United States, going down faster, because it's a little bit

00:48:32.920 later, but it's more or less the same time.

00:48:37.080 But the kind of things that happened when you became 20% non-white, which was about 1980,

00:48:45.800 which was the destruction of Reagan, the destruction of any kind of socialism,

00:48:49.960 the country becoming far more right wing and capitalist in a lot of ways. That's happening

00:48:55.320 in Britain now. That movement, you know, for example, free universities,

00:48:58.680 country's gone. Probably the healthcare system will go. All these things that are sustainable,

00:49:05.000 if you're an ethnostate, because you're looking after each other when you're one big family,

00:49:08.840 they go. When an area becomes 20% to 30% not of that ethnicity, they fall apart. 0.98

00:49:15.960 You even get white flight at that point. 30% has been demonstrated in a number of studies. Once

00:49:21.080 an area is 30% non-white, then whites start to leave. And it becomes overwhelmingly non-white 0.72

00:49:26.360 very, very quickly. There's a tipping point of 30%, or 25%, 30%. So yeah, we are going exactly

00:49:33.480 the same way that Americans did. America, when 20% non-white, it really started to check. 0.96

00:49:38.280 Yeah. Yeah. I don't know about Ireland, because Ireland doesn't have a free health service anyway,

00:49:43.400 do you? You have to pay to see a doctor, £50 or something. Yeah. Well, we have...

00:49:47.800 They just hand you a bottle of whiskey, is what I heard.

00:49:51.400 No, we're moving to socialized, yeah. But yeah, I think we're 20% non-white now. So, 0.71

00:49:58.200 which has been a pretty... What percent?

00:50:00.120 20%. So more than us?

00:50:02.200 Well, 20% non-Irish, actually. I'm not sure what... I'd say well over half 0.99

00:50:08.120 that is non-white. Oh, okay. 0.97

00:50:10.360 But that's not due to the EU at all, really, the migration here. That's mostly due to

00:50:16.760 a Jewish Minister for Justice we had who, in 2011, doubled our numbers of immigrant migrants

00:50:23.400 in one year when our economy was like in the worst shape it had been in 20 years,

00:50:28.120 and mostly like Nigerian and non-European migrants. So that was purely a matter of political will by

00:50:35.800 the centre-right political party, our version of the Tories, basically.

00:50:41.480 But yeah, there was... I read an article by Peter Hitchens the other day, and he said that

00:50:46.040 like Hitchens saying for the last few years has been he wants the destruction of the Tory party so that

00:50:50.840 a proper right-wing party could form in its place. But he had an interesting take on Brexit. He's kind

00:50:57.320 of blackpilled about it. And he said that he wanted to sacrifice the Conservative Party to save Britain.

00:51:03.080 But what Brexit may have done is sacrifice Britain to save the Conservative Party.

00:51:07.320 I mean, there's like, you know, I think there is a perception among probably ordinary Brexit voters that Boris Johnson is somewhat nationalist lean in.

00:51:18.600 But I mean, like Johnson has outright said that he's the only British politician that will openly say he's in favour of migration.

00:51:26.280 And I think, you know, this move to sort of like Bannon-style nationalism, this sort of economic nationalism,

00:51:34.680 patriotism, all this stuff, it's very, you know, it's very cynical because it does play on sort of national or racial sentiment.

00:51:43.720 But it's really contrary to the interests of that, because it does lead to this kind of, you know,

00:51:48.840 it sublimates like national pride into this economic nationalism, which just ends up with nation states

00:51:55.720 in this sort of race to the bottom to undercut each other. And ultimately just kind of serves the

00:52:00.520 onslaught of neoliberal capitalism that actually makes the, you know, the races within those nations

00:52:05.960 weaker to stand up to it anyway. So in a weird way, it takes the force of nationalism and it, you know,

00:52:11.560 it subverts it into furthering the forces of internationalism. So I think the, you know, the Farage

00:52:17.240 phenomenon, the Bannon phenomenon is definitely very contrary to where we're going to be going.

00:52:22.120 Absolutely. Let's, I'll mention this as well. I think one of the reasons why I am sympathetic

00:52:35.080 towards the EU is because I recognize the total silliness of the bureaucrats there and in a lot of

00:52:44.520 silliness regarding the, it's expressed ideology. But it is a structure and it is a mechanism at the

00:52:53.240 very least. And what we should be attempting to do is animate mechanisms. So these mechanisms,

00:53:00.440 whether it's the nation state, whether it's the EU, whether it's some institution that, you know,

00:53:05.160 it's subnational that you join, we want to animate it and reorient it towards our spirit. I mean,

00:53:12.360 that's the challenge. I mean, you can get out of the EU, you're, you just have a new problem,

00:53:16.840 which is now the nation state, which is filled with people who were just as silly, arguably worse 0.99

00:53:22.760 than bureaucrats. And so the same challenge is before you, it's to animate that institution 0.97

00:53:29.800 towards your end. And I think the problem with Bannonism, alongside the economic kind of race to

00:53:36.440 the bottom that you're, you're talking about, uh, is that it just, it offers this false victory to

00:53:41.720 people. You, you can go, you know, get really mad at the liberals, get really mad at impeachment and

00:53:46.920 reelect Trump. I, I actually, I, I think Trump will lose, but I can see him winning to a large extent

00:53:53.560 due to the impeachment thing of people getting fed up and say, we voted for this guy and you're trying to

00:53:58.520 cancel our vote. We're going to vote him in again, just to shove your face in the dirt. 0.99

00:54:03.800 And, but these, the, whether it's Trump or Bannon or Farage or Boris Johnson, it's, it's all this

00:54:09.400 false victory that just leads to delusion among these voters. And, uh, I, I, and again,

00:54:16.840 the fundamental challenge of animating an existing structure exists. Uh, so I, I do think that the EU

00:54:25.240 is the proper structure. I mean, flaws and all, it is the proper structure for the future. Um, and it,

00:54:31.960 I, I don't think it's going anywhere and I think at a hundred years it will be there and, and

00:54:37.080 hopefully it will have an army. It might actually have a kind of commandeered NATO even. I mean,

00:54:42.520 that, that's a possibility. I'm obviously speculating here. Uh, but I mean, that is where

00:54:48.200 we need to go and where we don't need to go is towards the false right, you know, people like the

00:54:56.080 conservatives who race bait and don't do anything or do, do things that are worse. The Trump,

00:55:01.460 the Farage, the Boris Johnson, I just think it's just an obvious false path. And we need to be

00:55:06.340 thinking about 25 years ahead of, of where we ultimately want to be now where Britain fits into

00:55:11.840 the EU. I don't know. I mean, Britain has always been, you know, kind of pulled between, uh, America

00:55:17.940 and Europe and, and what its identity is, is, is, is been a question. Um, maybe the EU will be

00:55:24.540 stronger without Britain, without that kind of, you know, Island, uh, you know, off to the left,

00:55:30.160 it will be a more Germanic, you know, you could say, uh, Prussian continental land power. I think

00:55:37.060 that would actually be a positive, perhaps this is all a very positive element for the EU. But I think

00:55:41.780 the question really is, is like, where do we want to be? And then let's start moving in that

00:55:45.420 direction, just have an end in mind and move in that direction and not just kind of go along with

00:55:50.820 the emotions of the public and say like, Oh, these Brexit voters, they've got good, healthy instincts.

00:55:56.000 So we should just go along with them and we don't want to counter signal them or, or, or so on. I

00:56:00.860 think sometimes we're going to have to counter signal them and say, no, this is the right direction.

00:56:05.140 This is where we need to be going in the 21st century and beyond.

00:56:08.940 Anyway, I mean, the, the great, the great irony is just, uh, you know, the same, uh, skepticism to

00:56:17.300 the EU as kind of a socialist institution that's taken all the member states money and spending it on

00:56:23.960 wasteful projects or whatever. Uh, the great irony is like what the, what the Eurozone economy needs

00:56:31.220 is, uh, yeah, is socialism directed, directed from a central authority in Brussels. It needs a powerful

00:56:38.520 stimulus package paid for by member states. It needs transfers of wealth that needs, you know,

00:56:43.780 long-term projects, something like, uh, God forbid, I say it, the green new deal, something like that,

00:56:49.360 that does look long-term that creates infrastructure that solves this, uh, youth unemployment crisis,

00:56:55.480 which has become an absolutely systemic. But the ECB was designed, uh, with the express purpose of

00:57:00.960 to keep inflation low and keep prices low. It's again, this German centric sort of center 0.95

00:57:06.100 right economic model. And that's what the source of much of the hostility to the EU is from these

00:57:12.060 poor economies that are suffering as a result of it. So the EU is in this weird paradox where

00:57:17.000 it's facing these Euro skeptical elements from these people that are opposed to any further

00:57:22.080 integration. But it's this weird kind of paradox where it needs this, uh, strong economic

00:57:27.440 impetus and integration and the strong economic centralization to fix a lot of these underlying

00:57:32.980 problems. Absolutely. All right, let's bookmark it. This was a good discussion. And, uh, yeah,

00:57:42.580 I think there's actually a lot more common ground in what we're saying than, uh, despite it's quite,

00:57:47.780 it's quite good because I think it, it flows quite well and you are both obviously wrong on those things

00:57:53.020 that you say, but I think, I think the, the, the, the positive thing about this is that I can help

00:57:57.160 to, you know, teach you and whatever. And it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's logic.

00:58:01.480 You can teach us to be a, uh, frivolous nationalist. Yeah. Flag waving and champagne swilling

00:58:10.780 disagreements. Lose your country. Lose your country. Lose your country. Lose your country.

00:58:15.660 Lose your top. Lose your country. Lose your country. Lose your country. Lose your country.

00:58:20.580 The Irish election. Lose your country. Lose your country. Lose your country. Lose your country.

00:58:22.600 i don't know a date it's less than two weeks now anyway is it possible that somebody you know based

00:58:29.600 could no no no no like the aim i know the nationalist party leader actually and like

00:58:36.440 their their their aim is to get one seat at this election so that's that's where they are at the

00:58:42.000 minute right okay and there's no there's no there's no eurosceptic movement at all in ireland

00:58:48.140 there's like there's an irexit party the guy that runs at his friends with nigel frage and they're 0.84

00:58:53.760 just a complete it's a complete joke for movement the national party here actually isn't in favor of

00:58:59.140 leaving the eu no the irexit sounds a bit like something else

00:59:03.800 yeah um oh well anyway good luck good luck

00:59:18.140 so

00:59:25.140 so

00:59:30.140 so

00:59:37.140 so

00:59:44.140 so

00:59:49.140 so

01:00:01.140 you

RadixJournal - February 03, 2020

Europe, a Nation？

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