RadixJournal - Hailgate

00:00:00.000 hail enoch how are you oh i'm pretty good how are you uh i uh i've just kind of been through an

00:00:08.020 emotional roller coaster to be honest but i am uh doing well um i was uh it's a combination of

00:00:14.640 exhaustion uh elation um of some genuine fear to be honest uh about being attacked uh some

00:00:25.900 some feeling that i had triggered the world and the whole world hates me and uh but then also

00:00:33.840 a uh you know just a sense where i am right now which is i've gotten some rest and i am ready to

00:00:40.840 go so that's where i am that's good yeah i was wondering if you had to uh shoot uh antifa but

00:00:48.440 i suppose not um which i guess in the long run is probably a good thing i mean maybe depends

00:00:55.540 yeah uh antifa i don't i of course do not endorse any sort of violence i was talking purely in terms

00:01:02.920 of a legal self-defense type oh i i would absolutely only um engage in violence in that context but

00:01:09.300 yeah i i definitely um the thought crossed my mind that i i might be having foul smelling screaming

00:01:17.280 uh horribly tattooed uh you know people with blue hair uh barging and piercings yes

00:01:25.200 multiple facial piercings but nothing of that nothing like that's happened so yeah well i think

00:01:29.840 in in um well the other place where you live maybe that doesn't really happen um or or they maybe

00:01:37.220 understand that every hey you don't know who in this place has a gun and so in montana everyone has a

00:01:42.980 gun yes you know it's not that you don't know you do know you do know that everybody yeah so that's

00:01:50.260 you know i i don't think that's going to happen um you know i again uh and i would say this um

00:01:58.280 we we obviously we are we are generating so much attention at this point that i i do feel like we

00:02:07.980 well maybe this will change like in four or five years or something but at least for this foreseeable

00:02:13.800 future window we cannot publicly meet in a private venue um anymore and i i think in a way that's sad

00:02:22.940 like um for instance a year ago you know we had like a 175 185 people at the mpi conference and

00:02:31.460 we actually did meet at a steak restaurant and that actually went fine there was no uh nothing from

00:02:39.280 what i can know we actually did hire some security but everything was fine no doxing no antifa protests

00:02:44.740 they they just focused on the day of and even the day of we only had like a handful of people

00:02:49.900 shooting silly string um yeah you know i remember there was three excuse me there was uh three people

00:02:56.920 there when i walked through the door yeah yeah so and it was the least intimidating people you can

00:03:02.600 imagine really frankly i mean right at one point daryl the barrel might try to eat someone but

00:03:08.840 uh until that happens it was just a bunch of people shooting silly string we've now like it's we're at a

00:03:15.440 new level i mean what happened with um one person getting punched and and in the face i heard he was

00:03:21.200 kicked in the face too i mean that is just totally beyond the pale um a woman emily euclis was attacked

00:03:29.480 um i was attacked although not not in a really uh i mean it was in a vile manner but uh not in a way

00:03:36.680 that i i was ever physically threatened okay i heard about i heard about this that's why you were

00:03:41.860 wearing only of only your vest at that point yes you should have had a bane mask at that point

00:03:47.740 i think we might have to do that going forward at least there's going to be there's going to be memes

00:03:54.260 of that of those pictures um with you in a bane mask just like flexing muscles with a bane mask i hope

00:04:00.220 so um if trs doesn't create those memes then they need to go you know evaluate their their purpose but

00:04:07.240 yes exactly yeah i mean i was i was sprayed by this i don't even know what the fuck it was it was like

00:04:13.720 i don't know if i was sprayed by urine it or it was like synthetic shit smelling stuff like if you're

00:04:19.740 going to use to go hunting it basically smelled like a skunk and uh so it destroyed a dress shirt of

00:04:28.080 mine i mean again not a big deal but at the but the the whole point though is that these guys are

00:04:34.040 now physically assaulting us yeah well i mean they've always wanted to and and what i found

00:04:39.540 remarkable and um what really kind of to me drives home and if anybody doesn't understand the concept

00:04:48.160 of a narco tyranny that that night was a narco tyranny in action i wasn't there like i was there was a we

00:04:54.040 had a chat going and some people were there some people weren't and people were like up to the

00:04:58.240 minute reports on on things and i was like i was like i really you know in a perfect world we could

00:05:04.300 just shoot these people frankly like i'll be like i'm not advocating for that because obviously but

00:05:09.680 like it it's ridiculous that people can behave like this and and um you know this is a narco tyranny

00:05:16.700 in action i mean these people you were all like well-dressed well-behaved you know clients of this

00:05:23.240 restaurant you went in with every intention to eat a lot of food and pay your bill make the money

00:05:28.540 and uh you know these people were went in and trashed their restaurant basically probably terrorized

00:05:37.080 other guests terrorized the staff vandalized the staff uh there was at least one employee who who was

00:05:45.560 black by the way who got sprayed yeah yeah this is this is what i'm talking about and and uh this is

00:05:52.020 like and yeah and these people are not involved i mean it's like these people have no regard for any

00:05:59.240 social norms at all and it's and and they you know their dancing was kind of funny if you saw

00:06:06.420 i haven't seen that actually you should watch some of the videos they were doing this one this one guy

00:06:12.780 is doing this sort of very effeminate kind of snake dance type thing and this woman is doing this like

00:06:19.200 really awkward robot dance it's pretty freaking ridiculously funny that these people are taken

00:06:24.800 seriously at all but then you know from from what i heard and maybe correct me if i'm wrong

00:06:29.120 the police were reluctant to arrest any of these people despite the fact that they had clearly

00:06:34.260 violated multiple laws no arrests were made to my knowledge that's ridiculous that is ridiculous

00:06:40.660 yeah because this is not free speech i mean look we could have a debate over free speech and things

00:06:47.340 like that but like you don't actually have free speech in somebody's restaurant right like like

00:06:52.400 whatever and that's just that's justice in my world but um we don't have that uh right we don't have

00:06:59.120 that because because the these people why were these people not arrested it's imagine the reverse

00:07:04.840 right imagine we burst into uh some communist meeting or something like that and do this

00:07:13.320 oh we would all be in jail we would all be in jail and this would be an ongoing national nightmare

00:07:19.740 like we everyone would be reporting on fascist thugs you know vigilantes taking the law into their

00:07:26.880 own hands you know so on and yeah i mean it i i the other thing i mean i've i've always said this as

00:07:32.700 well like what is the psychology like could you imagine barging like trying to disrupt uh leninist

00:07:40.600 marxist gathering you know like if i heard there was a leninist marxist gathering i'd be like

00:07:45.560 that's kind of interesting i might even want to i kind of like might even want to attend and

00:07:50.080 here are these guys here are these guys in the past yeah like you know i i don't knock yourself out i

00:07:56.720 mean i i'm not i'm not gonna do anything to you but these people well their whole lives are

00:08:02.100 are based around uh annoying us i mean that we they live for us they're they're obsessed

00:08:08.140 yeah yeah and they don't really i mean well there's a there's a number of things here uh one

00:08:14.000 i actually would like to get to the point where we you know leninist marxist gatherings are

00:08:19.700 disrupted by by the state you know not not by us but by the police themselves uh and then i also think

00:08:28.060 that um although they can be interesting in their own way if if you ever have attended them uh which

00:08:34.260 i have you know when i was much younger but uh the other thing is that yeah they live for us because

00:08:41.460 they are frustrated at they believe they haven't there's an imaginary system they don't understand

00:08:50.540 their role in the system and i think one of the reasons one of the reasons they're not very effective

00:08:54.920 is that they don't understand their role in the system they think that they are anti-system when

00:09:00.520 they are they are just foot soldiers for the system um but they don't understand this and if i think if

00:09:06.680 they did understand this they would be more effective because they would actually employ

00:09:09.740 the state and its resources in ways that they don't because you know the these people would also

00:09:14.400 protest this is the other thing that makes me angry is that like hey hey police listen we back you

00:09:19.840 every time a cop shoots a black guy justifiably and the national media wants to take his scalp

00:09:25.600 we are out there backing you yeah and these people want your fucking they want you to be strung up

00:09:31.480 publicly and and you know you're gonna not arrest them when they harass us like you should take your

00:09:37.200 own side yeah like if you're not gonna take our side take your side yes yeah i mean that's

00:09:44.160 completely that's completely true um but yeah i mean it was uh it was an interesting evening

00:09:50.120 and uh i think everyone ultimately had fun i mean there is this kind of like there's this sense of

00:09:56.620 we're under threat and that builds up our community and and so on so i'm glad we did it and i'm glad we

00:10:03.760 didn't back down i mean we were just we were basically trying everything we're trying different

00:10:08.560 meetup points we were sending out misinformation about some things i won't actually mention all

00:10:14.660 the little things we did but there is misinformation out there uh which i find kind of amusing but i'll

00:10:21.660 let others uh uh you know uh you know uh unthread that kind of thing but anyway um i'm glad we did it

00:10:29.860 but i would say that like it's just clear like the world is is different now like this whatever you want

00:10:36.480 to say about trump like this guy gonna disappoint us what is he gonna do the fact is like he that

00:10:41.940 election created a psychic trauma in the in the nation and really all around the world and we are

00:10:49.300 just at a new stage right now and we need to recognize that and start adjusting accordingly and um you know

00:10:56.420 i i actually i won't mention in this stuff on the podcast because it's in in flow at the moment and

00:11:02.440 and and i think you know just by the very nature we need to keep things under wraps uh but i i do

00:11:09.000 have i have some very good ideas that i've talked with other people about and there are ways that we

00:11:16.660 can start meeting in public like in in a big way like meeting in public like 150 people 150 of us

00:11:23.700 like have a dinner and speakers and things like that but we're just gonna have to do things differently

00:11:28.640 for like let's just say the next four years um and that is uh that's a very sad thing but like this

00:11:35.740 is like this shows where we are um we still are are the alt-right i mean this is an alternative movement

00:11:42.460 we are we are anti-system we are very similar to dissidents or heretics and other ages and um we need to

00:11:50.760 we need to understand that uh we definitely need to do things publicly but believe me i am 100 percent

00:11:58.280 believe me believe me i am 100 in terms of public because that is we we need you know we're not

00:12:06.180 we're not living in a in a society where like the state is going to arrest richard spencer and shoot

00:12:13.180 him uh you know it's just that that's not where we are like we we need to we need to be public but

00:12:19.760 i think we also like over the past year we've developed more of a robust like private meetup

00:12:25.720 culture and and i think we can do we can take that to the next level and that and that's definitely

00:12:31.780 going to be i think maybe like the vast majority of conferences are going to be of a private um you

00:12:38.780 know level where there's no you know public facing aspect to it um but we need to do the public facing

00:12:46.740 aspect like we need to we need to be the like you know we're here we're not going away we're going

00:12:51.680 to change the world speaking of that uh you know i i think that there is this you know the trump

00:12:58.900 election caused this sort of as you said psychic trauma i mean quite literally with some people

00:13:03.700 like there was a i don't know if you heard yesterday there was a story that came out that some guy

00:13:08.180 who had written an article i think for i think it was slate or something like that one of these

00:13:14.180 things um i'd have to look up the article to find exactly what it was um he'd written an article

00:13:19.820 for one of the oh alternate alternate.org okay so he wrote an article called like post trump

00:13:25.480 disorder like like ptsd but where the t stands for like trump like post trump stress disorder

00:13:32.220 something like that and then he like died of a heart attack two days later like literally like

00:13:37.640 dropped dead and i'm like holy shit like this guy literally dropped dead because trump was elected

00:13:45.260 and i mean i wonder what they i mean i know what my thanksgiving was like which i'm not going to

00:13:51.400 talk about but um i wonder what thanks it was fine because we didn't talk about it but um i wonder what

00:13:57.620 it was like around the country i mean this is like a national topic of conversation like what are you

00:14:02.140 going to do the funny thing is for so many years we've seen these things where like on sort of like

00:14:08.860 huffington post and jezebel and things like this like how to deal with your racist uncle at

00:14:13.480 thanksgiving yeah but now we're coming out with like how to deal with your stupid shit lived nephew

00:14:18.940 or something like that you know like like we're putting out our versions of these i think that's

00:14:23.340 pretty good yeah but um you know i'm actually fairly maybe we differ here but i'm fairly optimistic that

00:14:30.320 the culture will shift enough that like these kinds of things won't be uh like this kind of public

00:14:39.580 thing like what happened at the restaurant in in dc won't be acceptable anymore in a couple years i i

00:14:46.480 and i i maybe i'm maybe i'm being you know hope too hopeful about that but i think barack obama

00:14:52.120 accelerated a narco tyranny in like a pretty significant way such that i don't think that when

00:14:59.620 george w bush was president that these people would not have been arrested for that kind of trespass

00:15:04.660 and vandalism i mean that was flagrant trespass and vandalism and they just got away with it

00:15:10.980 and so um and and we know that the the sort of chill the you know the chilling effect people have

00:15:18.180 to use that word chilling effect a sort of chilling effect on the police that barack obama his presidency

00:15:24.300 and eric holder and uh what's her face in the justice department that those people have had on the

00:15:30.900 police and that they're worried you know they're going to get prosecuted if they frankly come down

00:15:37.220 hard on on black people or or like these sorts of people these antifa sorts of people that that this

00:15:43.700 isn't there they're not going to have the backing of the federal government there and in fact they

00:15:48.040 might get investigated that's out the window i mean we know who the attorney general is going to be

00:15:52.220 sessions the ag now so that's that's out the window right so i'm hoping that we're going to see

00:15:57.680 maybe a little bit of a return to if not like you know what we would want at least a return of of

00:16:06.260 some some sane law and order policies i think where these people can't just flagrantly violate property

00:16:12.180 and violate people's rights like you know just like with no consequences i i i hear you and and

00:16:19.100 obviously like we'll we'll see what happens um but the only thing i would say is that is that i would

00:16:26.440 reiterate what i said before and that is that the anti-fascists are now at another level and and we

00:16:33.640 can only predict that there it's going to become even harder core that that's why that's why i'm

00:16:38.880 saying like no more public facing private events like if we do anything it has to be in a public

00:16:45.420 facility because like we went from them screaming at us but like i don't think anyone was really ever in

00:16:53.000 fear of them i mean i i remember being at the american renaissance conference like back in 2013

00:16:57.420 and uh sam i was walking you know i'm friends with sam dixon i i love the guy and we we had just like

00:17:05.020 eaten lunch or something we were walking in and and and we're kind of like oh should we walk around and

00:17:09.820 and i think we both like said to each other ah let's you know let's just walk right in front of them

00:17:13.940 you know fuck them and i remember just kind of smiling at them and waving and you get a lot of the

00:17:19.380 cheers but at no point did i really like no no one touched me no one did anything i remember another

00:17:25.700 time this is going back to the 2010 so this was like the early days of alternative right.com

00:17:31.200 and i was giving this little college uh uh little college lecture at providence college i think i've

00:17:38.060 seen a video i think i've seen a video dick spencer go away yeah it's a classic yeah yeah yeah dick spencer

00:17:43.280 i'm calling you out and then he like took off his jacket yeah and then all those like ripped over

00:17:49.020 in his jacket like superman he was like anti i've seen that i've seen that shit and uh but i don't know

00:17:55.220 if you notice my my laptop was sitting right there on the table and they didn't touch it you know so

00:18:03.360 they didn't even violate my property i think that we're now at a level where if that same situation

00:18:09.780 happened again they would have smashed my laptop they would have sprayed me with shit

00:18:13.940 of some kind like i and and i feel like you know look if you look at europe like the antifa there

00:18:21.920 like they will bring a baseball bat to a conference that they don't want so i don't think we're quite

00:18:29.280 there yet but it's we're definitely like there's been a trauma i think these guys are going to step up

00:18:36.080 their game with trump i think there's going to be all of these just shit lib people liberals who are

00:18:43.100 also going to step up their game like they're going to feel like they're the one dissident you know

00:18:48.220 saying no to hitler and yeah they're the voice in the wilderness right exactly yeah so they've been

00:18:54.360 saying that about themselves for i mean god i mean we all remember the bush years but i mean we're about

00:18:59.620 to see a wow i mean i can't we're about to see shit lib meltdowns on a level and this is actually

00:19:08.300 when i was initially supporting trump um i was it was like whatever my optimism or pessimism about

00:19:15.680 his policies at the very least we'll get to see shit lib meltdowns on a level that shouldn't be

00:19:22.720 possible and we're going to see it and we're starting to see it actual heart attacks like i yeah

00:19:27.960 actually had a heart attack you know and uh um i'm sure there have been suicides um you know but

00:19:35.680 yeah i mean i i see what you're saying and i think i think that at the same time as that is happening

00:19:42.340 we have an opportunity i mean i'm not encouraging any of us to go out and do violence against these

00:19:47.220 people but um i i do think that um one of the things that we're doing at trs is we and on some level

00:19:56.680 we want to use their psychosis against them we want to provoke them we want to get them to do

00:20:02.080 insane things publicly and we want to get them to go and protest normal stuff um i think that the

00:20:10.000 sort of now i don't know if you agree or not we never spoke about this but the identification of

00:20:14.460 where we're just saying now we're just the republican party i believe i do find this funny yeah

00:20:19.760 no i mean i think it's actually a good good strategy i mean i believe that um

00:20:23.680 at npi even there were people that were under the impression that these people were simply

00:20:27.920 protesting the republican party yeah oh i think there were people saying there's a republican

00:20:33.320 event going on in there yeah i mean there's no difference anymore i mean this is in some ways

00:20:37.700 something we can possibly use to our advantage there's no difference anymore in the rhetoric they're

00:20:41.060 going to attack us with in the rhetoric they would attack the gop with right the gop are racist

00:20:45.880 fascist scum just like us so we can just say i think we should build future events

00:20:53.000 republican republican party like i mean why not yeah like let's make this a reality and look as

00:21:00.300 i you know one thing you said a while ago uh i don't know if you said it in passing or if you

00:21:05.980 remember it but it made an impact on me and i've been saying it to people since is that there were

00:21:09.840 since the republican party is effectively the white people's party yeah uh we have to be part of it

00:21:15.960 and so that has caught on i mean that everybody you know if you were to have said that three years ago

00:21:22.600 you would have created god knows what kind of infighting you would have created but right now

00:21:27.680 everybody's on board with that i mean obviously a few exceptions but you know uh i mean everybody has

00:21:34.440 said to me that's a great that's a great meme and and we agree with that and uh so you why not i mean

00:21:40.560 i'm a registered republican so there we go yeah like we're the republican party now we have to have

00:21:47.560 that attitude yeah i think we do have to have that attitude we need to meme things into existence um i i

00:21:53.640 think the only thing that i would say is that i'm i'm in a bit of a morning after uh state emotionally

00:22:02.860 about trump right now in the sense that i was as excited as anyone and and despite the fact that i

00:22:11.240 predicted trump's victory on twitter i'll just be honest like i i was not i did not go into

00:22:17.800 tuesday evening being like oh we've got this one in the bag i mean i i was in a very very nervous mood

00:22:24.600 um i i felt like it might very well not happen and so i was totally elated when it happened and i do

00:22:31.280 think it's a just a wonderful thing um but i i'm i'm getting into a bit of a morning after

00:22:37.060 state uh in the sense that look trump as a potentiality it was just a truly amazing thing

00:22:45.840 and not just because he triggered you know shit libs and all those kind of people but

00:22:50.180 it was just this idea of like this is something new he's not a conservative he is the first step

00:22:56.400 towards identity politics for white people in the united states like just as a potentiality

00:23:02.240 it was the most amazing thing i've seen politically in my life easy uh but now i'm now he's in office

00:23:11.220 and so it's like he's an actuality and so i'm i am getting to a stage where it's like okay we need

00:23:17.640 to sober up too and we need to be we need to start being vigilant and and start criticizing him because

00:23:24.580 and let's just like break it down in terms of some of these issues uh in terms of foreign policy

00:23:30.580 the president is is a dictator of foreign policy to a huge extent and so it is just going to inherently

00:23:38.100 change there is not going to be another like libya humanitarian intervention there is definitely

00:23:43.260 not going to be in iraq with with uh trump in office or at least i hope so i mean if he goes that

00:23:49.400 far i'm just going to be like all right yeah you know i'm checking i'm checking out completely if

00:23:55.360 that happens i mean really the test there is is who he appoints as secretary of state which is i think

00:24:01.400 why everybody's sort of on on like waiting with bated breath to see who it's actually going to be

00:24:07.240 now my hope is that he appoints this frankly this liberal bernie sanders supporting woman who was

00:24:13.840 rumored that he you know well it wasn't rumored he factually had a meeting with this woman i don't know

00:24:18.120 if you heard about this um tulsi gabbard her name is she's a a democrat who is a bernie sanders

00:24:24.340 supporter and she's very anti-neocon anti-intervent basically she has you know as as we always said

00:24:30.460 like this this thing well i don't like the people that say like well we're neither left nor right

00:24:35.240 we're something different like i think we're right wing definitely but um the the yeah we shared with

00:24:41.880 the far left the the vision on foreign policy like yeah it's not for the same reasons the basis

00:24:46.760 the same basic vision that we are pro-peace like pro non-intervention and um this woman is basically

00:24:54.460 that and uh she's anti-neocon and it's uh it's great and she went and had a meeting with trump

00:25:00.600 and it was even rumored that he was going to make her secretary of state now if he does that i will be

00:25:04.820 really really happy if he appoints mit romney or some other neocon i will be very very pissed

00:25:12.400 mit romney's a bit equivocal in my book because i because mit romney is not like a died in the

00:25:20.160 world neocon you know he's he's just some upper level manager who goes with the flow that's at least

00:25:28.160 equivocal john bolton is frightening in my opinion it's not happening i'm confident that's not okay um

00:25:35.300 and i and i haven't heard anything about that um the this woman like picking a like a someone from

00:25:41.280 that is beloved by like counterpunch or anti-war.com i think that's kind of fascinating so i would i'm

00:25:48.620 i would go with that yeah i think that that's not only i think it's brilliant i think it would be

00:25:53.020 one of the best metapolitical moves like i mean trump look i'm not ready i'm not in the morning

00:25:58.720 after period yet because i haven't seen evidence that i should be yet yeah and that's because i you

00:26:04.420 know he has continually surprised and continually been actually i do not think he is a white

00:26:13.700 nationalist i do not think he is a white identitarian i think he is a nationalist though

00:26:18.800 and that right now is enough to make these people go insane but i think that uh he has continually

00:26:27.200 surprised me with actually how staunch he was on issues that i cared about and how actually brilliant

00:26:34.640 of a politician he was so i'm not counting him out yet i mean if if i'll just wait till it actually

00:26:40.940 happens till he actually and i think that in terms of him disavowing us like that's not the first time

00:26:47.680 it happened it's something he he kind of has to do and oh i'm so i'm not i'm not i'm not even mad

00:26:55.000 about that but i i am i i'm not ready to say he's he's not you know i'm not ready to say i'm in the

00:27:02.240 morning after period yet because i just haven't actually seen evidence yet when the secretary of

00:27:06.160 state pick will be huge in determining that so far you know sessions as attorney general if we can get

00:27:11.900 this kobach guy yeah in homeland security which it looks like that's already kind of out there and

00:27:17.720 like if you saw that that thing where the guy had the the paper that was like obviously angled so

00:27:24.440 that you could see it and you could zoom in and then they you know had plans about building a wall

00:27:28.900 and deporting all these illegals like right there like i don't think that was an accident yeah people

00:27:33.020 like chris kobach needs to be more secure with his files like no dude he did it on purpose come on and

00:27:38.500 trump was standing there with a smug look on his face like adjusting his uh his cufflinks gotta the

00:27:43.780 picture is brilliant and i'm like i'm like looking at trump's face i'm maybe i'm projecting but i'm

00:27:48.720 like he knows what's good he knows that they're memeing the press right now and so like i was like

00:27:52.360 does a pretty good meme and uh you know i don't know i'm still white pilled on the whole thing

00:27:57.500 we'll see that's good um yeah i look i i think the whole the the trump phenomenon has been an amazing

00:28:03.440 experience i i'm just maybe getting a little skeptical this is the other thing that i would

00:28:09.600 say is that for maybe i'm wrong about this but this is how i see it for really serious immigration

00:28:17.920 reform it has to happen in the next year and a half because you know and so we're thinking like

00:28:25.700 january 20th through let's just say january 20th 2017 through you know august 2018 that is the window

00:28:35.440 in my opinion to really do something because after that everyone's starting to think about uh elections

00:28:42.760 uh they're they're less willing to do something fairly dramatic uh you know i i think it has to

00:28:50.800 i i think he has to say he has to hit the ground running say there's a big mandate for this we've got

00:28:55.540 to go and i would all and so this is really the moment for what you could call kosher immigration

00:29:02.500 reform like this is their moment this is their 18-month period where they've got to prove themselves

00:29:07.920 or not and um and and so it's like what we need obviously the wall is great and i think but the

00:29:15.440 wall i agree with liberals like the wall is in a way more symbolism than than than reality like i'm

00:29:22.560 fine with just increased enforcement and uh various means of deportation whether you do a lot of physical

00:29:30.840 deportations that basically set a new tone and then inspire other people to engage in self-deportation

00:29:36.700 i think that's probably the best way to do it but i would say this if we get a huge wall and we get

00:29:43.120 all this deportation of you know the bad ones and the criminals but we have a path to citizenship or

00:29:49.300 something like well we're we're increasing legal immigration because we love that then i'm also out

00:29:54.800 because yeah like absolutely it just doesn't like it doesn't make sense then we're just being like

00:29:59.980 conservatives and and being like oh well immigration is wonderful it's just the the fact that they didn't

00:30:05.680 fill out the paperwork that bothers me yeah no i don't give a shit if they i don't like illegal

00:30:10.600 immigration is you know not good but that's not the the legality is not what bothers me and so you

00:30:18.780 know this is their moment and you know i think we should be talking about it and i think we should be

00:30:24.800 like the the alt-right should be on that far flank of the over to window like um we're gonna actually

00:30:32.180 we're gonna be talking about um you know net neutral immigration for the next half century

00:30:37.180 and so that and that again that's like as far as you can go but then it's still being within the

00:30:44.860 realm of possibilities in my opinion so we're going to talk about that but um again like if it if it's a

00:30:51.600 wall plus increased legal immigration or if it's a and or path to citizenship again i'm also out

00:30:57.420 right no i i completely agree um i mean the the the the the wall is is good um i would like a wall

00:31:07.140 and uh you know walls work frankly i mean yeah robert frost uh taught all of us taught this to all

00:31:14.520 of us it's funny like people kind of want to skirt around what he was really saying in that poem but

00:31:18.540 it's a brilliant poem in my opinion and um you know walls work i mean it worked for israel

00:31:25.360 i mean these people were going across the border and blowing shit up and they don't do it anymore

00:31:30.160 because they put up a wall now so i'm for a wall but you're right if if there's a wall plus like some

00:31:35.900 path then that's that's forget about it and and on sort of a deeper level of a comment with this is

00:31:41.900 that um one of the things we talked about on our show but i'll just reiterate it here is um this idea

00:31:49.460 that the way we talk about immigration is fundamentally flawed it's it's fundamentally wrong

00:31:57.000 not us but generally in the united states is because we focus on criminality and we focus on

00:32:04.340 illegality rather than uh race and identity and we do that because we can't talk about race and

00:32:12.020 identity so it's like crypto like conservatives and so like and the problem is you have to say things

00:32:17.280 like i mean as much as i love trump's initial statements i mean he didn't say they're they're

00:32:22.220 all rapists he didn't say they're all criminals or drug dealers or whatever but like many of them

00:32:27.060 are not okay so it's like you don't have to paint mexicans all with this brush of rapists and and

00:32:32.900 criminals because they're not all that okay but we just can't talk about the real issue so we have to

00:32:39.280 be like it's they're all criminals they're all illegal you know what i mean and it's in a way you're

00:32:43.300 saying things that are like worse than if you could just say look you know this is a country for our

00:32:48.560 people and they have a country for their people yeah because they're not all criminals they're they're

00:32:53.060 roofers it's like nicer and it's like in a way nicer to say than like yeah uh oh they're all criminals

00:33:00.200 and rapists it's just something you have to kind of amp up in order to get the policy you can't move

00:33:06.860 policy on the basis of race in the u.s so you have to try and make some kind of criminal crisis

00:33:12.120 and now look i think there is a lot of criminality down there and there's the cartels and a lot of

00:33:16.380 bad things happen and many of these illegal immigrants are in fact criminals and they

00:33:20.680 commit crimes and they they get away with it and then they come back and and this is all bad but

00:33:25.120 it's like fundamentally a symptom of the same problem yeah which is that we can't talk about

00:33:29.920 race in our own interest and because we can't do that all this and and there are people that talk

00:33:34.200 about race like directly opposed to our interest there are people that are legitimately attacking our

00:33:39.320 people attacking our existence they talk about race all the time and this is why these bureaucrats

00:33:44.620 let these these people that are criminals come back time and time again while many of them aren't

00:33:49.920 the majority of them aren't are not criminals they are in fact workers but like i don't care like they

00:33:55.080 should be in mexico it's their country this is our country and uh and we can't say that anymore

00:33:59.960 and because of that we have to build up this false narrative of criminality and illegality

00:34:04.620 and that then leads to the risk of of because we don't want to talk about race

00:34:08.880 where you're like well we'll just get rid of the bad ones you know and it's like well that's

00:34:12.620 really not the point yeah what you're saying is kind of funny where like uh like the alt-right is in a

00:34:18.700 way more polite like we're like they're actually they're not all rapists like it's just they've just

00:34:24.100 got to go home like they're their roofers and their their cement layers like but yeah they just

00:34:29.140 sorry you got to go and our people need to be doing those jobs yeah yeah no that that is uh that

00:34:35.540 is absolutely true um well anyway let's let's do this let's let's go right let's go right to the heart

00:34:43.300 of the big controversy let's talk about um the colorful gestures uh from another era uh that occurred

00:34:51.880 oh just waving hi just just waving just saying hi just saying hi hello yeah um look i've been in a

00:35:03.560 way accused by a lot of people in the movement like oh richard he's not you know he's not hardcore

00:35:09.940 enough he doesn't do this the fact is when i'm speaking to a journalist like i i really know my

00:35:17.220 audience and i want to communicate things to them and i want and i want them to communicate things to

00:35:23.120 their readers and to to accomplish that you you have to speak to them on on their terms but i think

00:35:31.000 anyone who's ever like listen to my podcast or or or say like listen to my speech from a year ago at

00:35:38.700 the mpi conference in 2015 like they i think they can also recognize that i i have a bit of a bombastic

00:35:45.520 side too and i i profoundly i profoundly care about the the heart of this movement and i am a radical

00:35:59.120 uh on on on the in in the truest sense of the word um so we kind of had this weird thing where a lot of

00:36:07.860 these these journalists are like oh richard he's so nice he's a cute millennial uh um you know guy

00:36:14.600 but then also he's the most you know bombastic dangerous man he's speaking in german for god's

00:36:20.540 sake like you know literally german somebody said i think that was one of the headlines i saw

00:36:26.400 literally german yes um lugan pressa by the way goes back to the 19th century i know you didn't even

00:36:36.340 say it we said it yeah yeah like when when you said this word for the lying press and every like

00:36:42.920 people yelled it out yeah yeah uh so you know it's you know it is what it is i i loved my speech i

00:36:51.780 totally stand behind uh every word of it uh i would like when i say hail trump and all that kind of

00:36:58.620 stuff look i've yes i'm being i'm being bombastic i'm being provocative and i think people need to

00:37:04.380 recognize like they need to recognize in a way alt-right culture that yeah we're not conservative

00:37:11.060 fuddy-duddies like we like to have fun we like to we we like to dial the knob to 11 sometimes

00:37:19.280 and you know it it i knew that that was an applause line i knew it was going to be highly provocative and

00:37:25.520 i also knew that it was going to create a big ovation and it wasn't just an ovation for me like

00:37:30.500 i think when i said that the that that ovation was just about the whole like year of the alt-right

00:37:36.840 where everyone was just like we fucking did it like like you know yeah no you know we memed him

00:37:42.100 into the office i mean i tried to explain to people that weren't there that felt like um this was like

00:37:49.980 an orchestrated as if you like planned to have everybody do that or whatever i was like no you

00:37:55.260 don't understand like emotions are running high it was you know um and people frankly did not know

00:38:03.220 the people in the audience did not know there were cameras still rolling um and uh you know we were

00:38:12.120 they were riding this wave of emotion and it's sort of like part of me was like you know what like

00:38:16.780 everyone fuck off if you'll excuse me like can we do something for ourselves for once yeah like this

00:38:24.620 was for us it wasn't for them it wasn't for anybody like fuck all of you like we were we were amongst

00:38:30.380 ourselves and we were like riding this wave of of high energy and this thing happened so like whatever

00:38:38.340 yeah like i don't know i just i was i was and everybody that was there

00:38:43.640 told me that you know they were extremely high energy in that moment whether they did that or not

00:38:50.680 i mean only a few people did it frankly like four or five people did that everyone's everyone jumped to

00:38:56.040 their feet and everyone was extremely high energy at that point and uh everybody and and afterwards

00:39:02.080 we were in like a very high energy mode and the funny thing is that uh you know i didn't even think

00:39:07.740 this was going to be a thing like i didn't even think about it until i saw this footage come out

00:39:11.980 monday night like after the conference people were extremely uh feeling extremely high energy

00:39:17.380 extremely um i don't know like there was just this very good mood that was going on like a lot of

00:39:23.460 camaraderie a lot of energy everybody was feeling good everybody was happy everyone's amped up and

00:39:28.440 we were talking we're chatting we hung out late late at night then we hung out again in the morning

00:39:33.040 yeah you know and everybody was just feeling really good about everything and i just did not even cross

00:39:39.080 my mind you know that this that this was even going to be a thing um so you know i think and then

00:39:45.000 some people are like okay well if you're going to be like that then it's got to be private and

00:39:50.580 i think they have a point there but you know i also don't think that i think that like on some

00:39:55.840 level i don't want to go full on like you know trolling is the only way to do things but being

00:40:05.620 transgressive has worked yeah you know to a point i'm not saying like i believe somebody said to me

00:40:13.000 somebody said to me over the course of the last few days like well if richard thinks any kind of press

00:40:20.120 is good press and why does he drink his own urine on camera and i was like okay obviously we're

00:40:26.220 going to keep this within the bounds of sanity right right but like you know i don't know i mean i'm not

00:40:31.360 even convinced that this is a bad thing frankly we we look we triggered the world um alt-right is a

00:40:38.480 household term uh we shook out the people who were who who aren't really with us and and like look

00:40:48.000 i've been one of the most i'm the mr tolerance when it comes to the alt-right and like i don't i

00:40:56.140 never believe that creating more enemies is a good thing if they want to denounce us or if they want to

00:41:02.720 be shaken off the train that that's perfectly fine but i i don't i don't ever i think you know if someone

00:41:09.320 is not attacking you and is maybe neutral or generally positive or benign then let it happen like

00:41:16.700 there's no reason to create enemies but like people like mike cernovich and like you know that

00:41:23.020 guy you know he became a force of nature he also let's just be perfectly honest plays fast and loose

00:41:30.240 with the truth uh like the truth doesn't matter it's just he's just in attack mode he jumps on waves

00:41:37.280 he jumped on you know the alt-right pro-trump wave for a while he's gonna jump on another wave

00:41:43.000 in 2017 we all know that um and he's not really one of us like meta-politically he's just not simply

00:41:50.120 not one of us and just because he wants to piss off shit libs doesn't mean that he's one of us

00:41:55.020 so like you know it's been fun you know yeah i mean we had our we had a little bit of a critique of

00:42:04.100 cernovich on our last show and then i don't really need to say much more but yes he he has been

00:42:09.920 he is what he is i don't really care about him anymore i'm like yeah at this point like i don't

00:42:15.720 care whatever yeah like he can go ahead and sell his self-help books and that's fine yeah whatever

00:42:21.580 that's all he cares about so fine whatever yeah yeah and and paul joseph wasson or people like that

00:42:26.760 like i you know i actually look i'll actually just because i'm i'm so fair like he he actually does

00:42:34.940 offer some good information he he's gotten away from the alex jones of yesteryear which is far more

00:42:40.900 entertaining but they're they're now kind of more a little more based in reality i'll i'll look at his

00:42:47.600 videos and get some you know information i'm not that impressed with him as if i'm not at all impressed

00:42:54.100 with him as a thinker or something but he's not a thinker as a news hound he's he's great so again he's

00:43:00.680 not all right he ultimately these guys ultimately don't care about what we care about and so like

00:43:07.600 it was there was gonna be a breakup uh maybe you know it happened because of this i didn't this was

00:43:13.660 not my motive to create a breakup but the breakup was inevitable so it happened on uh november 19th

00:43:20.640 2016 as opposed to like february 19th 2017 it's gonna happen and so like we're now we're now our

00:43:29.460 movement is now like it's clear what we're about i think it is important that we don't we don't like

00:43:35.440 just become larping neo-nazi doofuses i mean clearly that is not a positive strategy however

00:43:43.620 it's also clear like the alt-right is a household name it's about identity for it's about european

00:43:50.000 identity in the united states really around the world um it's about us we're serious we're also

00:43:56.280 willing to be outlandish and have fun but we're serious and that's what we want and that's what we

00:44:00.940 have we have a brand we have a ton of recognition um they're gonna hate us anyway and so we're here

00:44:08.040 i mean i'm not i have not always been a fan i mean on some level the argument like oh they're

00:44:11.900 gonna call you nazi anyway so just be one that's a non sequitur yeah i i don't buy into that yeah but

00:44:18.920 um like yeah i don't buy it's not like they're gonna call you nazi anyway so be a nazi but i think

00:44:25.240 anybody that saw that video that's on as part of our thing that knows how it is that interpreted that

00:44:34.160 as us becoming nazis is or neo-nazis or whatever is is stupid like they they all know better anybody

00:44:42.380 that's on our side that's part of this thing knows better yeah that then that was they know what that

00:44:47.200 was they understood exactly what was going on which is that it was kind of a funny larpy thing

00:44:52.700 and we were having fun with it and so like if they think that oh you know like you guys oh we

00:45:00.600 didn't know this was a neo-nazi thing it's like no no you're getting it twisted and and in some cases

00:45:05.920 i think maybe you're twisting it on purpose but like they on some level like it is true they're gonna

00:45:10.820 call us nazis anyway like they would have called npi a neo-nazi conference in the headlines no matter

00:45:15.760 what whether they had that footage or not they would have said neo-nazis gather in washington

00:45:20.740 to celebrate trump they would have said that um they've said it before uh so you know the fact

00:45:27.800 that they had that footage it was able to drive home that narrative with normies but on some level

00:45:32.900 um you know i don't know if it was good or bad i think it was less bad than people think and i think

00:45:39.060 in the end that will be a positive um so yeah i mean i also think people really need to i don't

00:45:45.300 know get a little bit of a grip and it's fine everything's fine everything's fine yeah well

00:45:49.540 we just need to go like upwards and onwards and it you know it is what it is and we're gonna make

00:45:56.160 other headlines like you know i'm yeah i'm doing something next week and at texas a&m where a man

00:46:03.580 named preston wigginton who's a very brave person uh has rented out a uh a space uh i'm gonna go there

00:46:12.100 and just because of trump just because of the npi conference like this is this is already making

00:46:18.080 headlines and we're like 10 days away uh you know there are people the news is freaking out um

00:46:25.300 chronicle of higher education is like interviewing me about it i mean this is going to be a really big

00:46:29.940 thing and you know look uh trump did some things i don't think anyone thinks that like trump benefited

00:46:36.280 from pussy grabbing that that incident you know i mean but it's like you keep like you take a hit

00:46:42.280 and you know if if the world's going to hate you you take it and you just keep moving forward i agree

00:46:49.000 this is not like pussy grabbing there's no richard spencer sex tape that's going to be released

00:46:54.620 please god no uh yeah but you know what i mean like that's not what it is uh basically it's it's

00:47:02.300 much more defensible than that there's no no one was assaulted no no no or no calls for violence

00:47:07.400 i'm i'm toasting like it's clear and actually the the media has backed off saying that i

00:47:13.660 gave a roman salute i didn't i was holding up a glass toasting i was i was smiling i was clearly

00:47:19.440 being outlandish so it's like that's where we are um i think you know we'll we'll look back upon this

00:47:25.880 a couple years from now we can determine whether it's good or bad but the fact is it's like let's

00:47:30.140 go to the next thing like i'm this texas a&m uh event is going to be huge and we're going to like

00:47:37.380 something else we're going to make another headline and we're going to make another splash

00:47:40.980 and it's it's not you know like nothing's over we're just kind of like moving forward and

00:47:47.160 in terms of the the interest like in terms of the people telling me that they support me

00:47:52.100 even if they even if they like disagreed with all this stuff and said oh that was bad like

00:47:56.300 they're they're still they're still supporting us like this movement's going to produce more good

00:48:02.000 stuff whether it's like your podcast or books we publish or or or or blogs and so on so let's just

00:48:09.400 let's just keep going um just don't you know take a like you're a boxer like take a fucking punch

00:48:16.900 you know yeah i i'll be honest though like i didn't i i mean i don't know that pussy grabbing

00:48:24.580 helped trump i wouldn't go that far right but i don't think it really hurt him and then it became

00:48:30.520 a meme like grabber by the pussy is now a meme and people it's like now a pop culture thing and in a

00:48:36.160 way it disarmed it right so like i remember when i first heard that that audio um i was riding the

00:48:42.960 bus and i saw the headlines come out and i was like oh fuck and then then i listened to it and i was

00:48:50.760 like oh that's bad yeah right and um but then within a few days grabbed by the pussy was a meme

00:48:58.300 and it was a meme even among leftists and it was a thing that people were saying and so it in a way

00:49:03.700 it made the whole thing innocent it's sort of like you remember you remember those down even the

00:49:09.340 movie downfall yeah with bruno bruno gans as hitler yeah and uh brilliant movie well depending it's

00:49:16.520 brilliant it's a good movie maybe not a brilliant movie it's it's a good acting performance by bruno

00:49:21.540 gans whether or not you like the portrayal or agree with the portrayal historically like i don't know

00:49:26.780 that guy's really intense yeah yeah yeah and that scene is fantastic okay the scene that everybody

00:49:32.780 means is a fantastic scene just for the emotion of it whether or not this is accurate or how hitler

00:49:38.180 really was or anything which i have no way of knowing i suspect it's totally not but anyway

00:49:42.780 um or maybe who knows but it's great in that what it does is it totally disarms it right and particularly

00:49:49.840 when they make hitler saying something that like the viewer of the video is supposed to sympathize with

00:49:55.460 yeah so it's like hitler's angry at something that you get angry about all the time

00:49:59.580 you know and it totally makes hitler like this not so scary crazy person anymore and it disarms

00:50:07.020 that now which is not to say like we want to be hitler but it's to say like that it disarms hitler

00:50:12.920 in people's minds so that this is not an effective weapon against us anymore you're you're absolutely

00:50:18.480 correct i mean the first one of those memes that i saw and i don't know if it was the first hitler was

00:50:23.280 actually hillary clinton and she was like losing to brock obama and like the weird connection of

00:50:29.340 hillary and hitler was also just like funny on some weird level but i've seen it also with like you know

00:50:35.640 netflix they're changing their name to quickster and they're no longer streaming or something and

00:50:41.400 yeah it's it it gets it is good but i i think what you're getting at is that like

00:50:45.720 the symbol of hitler and the hall and auschwitz and the holocaust those things are powerful like

00:50:54.480 in in their religious significance like you can study even even something that was worse like pol

00:51:00.880 pot or stalin you can actually still study those things uh historically in a dry academic fashion you

00:51:07.780 can disagree with people they're actually robust debates about the purges but but with hitler you just

00:51:13.620 simply can't and auschwitz you simply cannot do that it's like there is no like as adornos that

00:51:18.640 there's there's like no art after auschwitz you know it's like it is it becomes this the ultimate

00:51:23.840 black pill where any time something can is it looks like it's pointing in that direction it can just be

00:51:31.220 totally demeaned dismissed like you cannot go there you you know i get this question all the time

00:51:35.920 what differentiates you from hitler and i'm like what the fuck are you talking like what have i said in

00:51:41.900 this interview that is hitlerian and like i could say the same thing with like bernie sanders what do

00:51:47.580 what truly differentiates you from pol pot tell me what differentiates you from pol pot you know i would

00:51:52.860 you know it's just so it gets to that religious symbolism that like political theology and so i do

00:51:59.640 think that at the end of the day like making fun of it uh is is one of the most powerful things

00:52:06.500 that's gonna ever happen and and also as time goes on the the the the shadow of hitler begins to wane

00:52:13.840 a little bit like people we have kids now that were born in 1990 you know and they they don't have

00:52:22.280 this like just you know year after year of cultural programming and so on to think that any time a

00:52:29.300 european expresses his identity he is literally hitler like that that is just waning and even

00:52:35.440 even these sjws are kind of doing our work for us when they're like you know trump is literally hitler

00:52:41.060 it becomes so ridiculous that you just have to laugh at it so yeah i agree i think i think uh i mean this

00:52:47.520 is like i am a more serious person i mean i have my funny moments but i've definitely been more of a

00:52:52.700 serious person but i'll actually tip my cap to the trs world that like humor is more powerful than

00:53:00.580 rationality in in changing people's psychology yeah and i mean just by making the whole thing

00:53:08.640 not as like you say like being iconoclastic with it like tearing down this this religious notion of it

00:53:16.640 is because you can't have a debate about this right like since we can't debate about it then we just

00:53:22.360 all we can do is meme about it right so there's there's no debating hitler even today um we just

00:53:29.920 have memes and those memes are making the specter of hitler less of a thing and and therefore less of

00:53:37.100 a and and therefore less of a weapon that can be used against us and this this is great i mean

00:53:40.980 the whole thing where you know anytime you see some shitlib going crazy online somebody posts like that

00:53:47.460 image that's like everything i don't like is hitler yeah like the emotional child's guide to

00:53:52.680 politics or something like that you know what i mean so and like they're doing our work for us

00:53:56.800 because they're so ridiculous and they're calling things that are obviously just even like milquetoast

00:54:01.280 conservative or cuck-servative hitler you know they're calling like somebody wants to

00:54:06.720 it's almost like cut capital gains tax literally hitler you know what i mean it's like it's like

00:54:12.860 you know so it's like yeah and and so that's good for us because it means you know if if everything's

00:54:20.700 hitler then nothing's hitler and then we can finally get past this stage where we we have to be sort of

00:54:25.380 stymied and stifled by this and the thing i think i think there is a generation gap in the reactions to it

00:54:31.140 i noticed it just amongst the people that i talked to whereas everybody my age or younger

00:54:38.860 for the most part was like who gives a fuck and the older people were all kind of clutching their

00:54:45.100 pearls about it so and i think that it wasn't just us that did that in some sense society did that the

00:54:50.400 school system did that because you know in some sense like you're gonna get young men being

00:54:57.820 irreverent and rebellious like this is a thing that happens particularly you know it's just a phase it

00:55:02.580 at least you know men with testosterone have to go through um and in a way it's sort of like a

00:55:09.140 healthy thing because it prepares people to take leadership roles you know in adulthood um

00:55:15.360 and so the system that they've set up it's like i mean one of the interesting things we've seen

00:55:23.340 since trump election is there are kids in like middle school that are like chanting build the wall

00:55:30.100 you know what i mean so do you think these kids are gonna care you know and these are the people

00:55:35.700 that are gonna be joining our ranks in the next few years so do you think that like they are gonna

00:55:40.760 care about something like this no they're gonna think it's hilarious yeah you know and so while again

00:55:46.000 i think there's limits to this like transgression and trolling as propaganda this i don't think cross

00:55:51.720 those boundaries no no i i you know and i think maybe uh one criticism and i'm not even sure i agree

00:55:59.280 with this but i'm at least thinking about it is that you you can't always mix them like you know

00:56:04.760 they're you know there's the trolling and then there's the the more serious uh you know quasi academic

00:56:13.120 you know lecture kind of thing but i don't know maybe we should mix them i mean maybe you need a

00:56:20.240 little bit of that dionysian energy with some of the apollonian energy of of talking about like

00:56:28.060 what kind of world do we want to see how can we change reality i think you do need a little bit

00:56:32.500 of that dionysian fuck you thrown in there or we wouldn't be true to ourselves you know yeah that's

00:56:38.680 the thing it's sort of like i've always found that now this is this is just related to trs and

00:56:43.800 and i think but i found that whenever we've tried to not be ourselves it hasn't worked out and whenever

00:56:51.440 we've been true to ourselves we've expanded our reach like whenever we tried to sort of plan things

00:56:58.540 out and i'm not saying planning is bad but i mean whenever we tried to like craft narratives rather

00:57:03.760 than just go with our gut it's failed and i understand again that there's limits to that kind

00:57:10.100 of thinking too like obviously when you're building a bridge you need to plan it you don't go with your

00:57:14.700 gut but like you know like when it comes to propaganda which is what frankly what we do

00:57:20.880 when it comes to propaganda and and outreach and and um political messaging and things i think really

00:57:27.880 you're hitting people on emotional levels and not not rational levels i mean scott adams is mostly full

00:57:34.580 of shit but if he had anything that was worthwhile he's not the first person that said it is that people

00:57:40.080 aren't rational with politics yeah um and so you know we're not doing we're not necessarily taking

00:57:46.980 i mean the daily show it does not really necessarily take a rational approach it's like we're taking a

00:57:51.680 very you know we i don't know we just do what we do and it works out and and i do what i think

00:57:59.100 is right for the situation and you know we've done that the whole time and every time we've it's not so

00:58:06.420 much every time we tried to plan it every time we've second guessed ourselves it hasn't worked

00:58:12.100 out and whenever we just go full bore it does now there may be limits to that that will like run into

00:58:20.380 a brick wall of of you know our ceiling as nate silver would put it we've hit our ceiling but like

00:58:25.360 you know i don't know we who knows what our ceiling is but we have our ceiling is like five million

00:58:30.220 people that's great i thought right oh totally yeah i mean and and again like that video has been

00:58:36.120 viewed the last time i heard was like 40 million views or something like if one percent of those

00:58:43.480 people actually start to look into us and start to agree with it or if one percent looks at that and

00:58:49.460 they're kind of like wow these guys are like awesome like i love how just badass they are that's a huge

00:58:55.640 victory the other thing look i kept thinking that we'd hit a ceiling like i thought the alt-right had

00:59:01.840 almost hit a ceiling like in 2015 or you know or or when you uh i think uh ramsey paul actually showed

00:59:09.060 this trajectory like on google searches of the alt-right at the amaran conference last last may and

00:59:14.540 i almost thought that we had hit a ceiling at that point that it's like oh wow like we're becoming a

00:59:19.340 we're becoming a household term and then like hillary talks about us uh then you know presidents have to

00:59:26.120 denounce us or distance themselves i mean i don't know i mean let's not assume that there's this this

00:59:31.460 big ceiling out there um for our exposure and yeah um let's just kind of like do what we do and continue

00:59:39.820 to uh trigger the world and uh and and again i i agree like we need to have we can't it can't just all

00:59:49.360 be a joke i mean i think that is a danger but i don't think that's really like a problem for us i mean

00:59:54.260 we've built up a huge repertory of uh of of good stuff like you know mpi we're about to this week

01:00:04.880 we're about to release like a new book by thomas left soonish we have a translation the conservative

01:00:10.380 revolution we did this huge sam francis thing like we're not like lacking for substance artos and like

01:00:16.820 this guy named uh jason giorgiani who actually spoke briefly uh like he's he the guy is totally

01:00:22.860 amazing totally solid like we we have we have those horses and uh it's it's not like this is just a

01:00:31.420 movement of pepe pepe memes i mean so uh i i just yeah i agree i i you know coming out of it a few

01:00:38.360 days later i'm just like look we've got to be true to ourselves we we this this movement is outlandish

01:00:44.120 this movement is about breaking taboos let's just uh we we need to you know to thy own self be true

01:00:50.180 and let's just you know let's just if we're not like scaring people and if we're not kind of like

01:00:55.520 making a mistake here and there then we need to re-examine you know because when we never made any

01:01:00.820 mistakes we actually did not get anywhere yeah i mean i can't tell you how many times i thought

01:01:07.880 we made a huge mistake i mean not not we're not there not not there but i mean trs generally

01:01:14.740 in like the name of our podcast and i'm not even saying that like if it ever comes to the time

01:01:21.460 where we have our trs media company and we have a daily morning radio show i mean maybe we'll still

01:01:29.020 call it that i don't know we haven't decided that but like you know so many times i thought this was

01:01:34.220 a huge error we did it as a joke you know two and a half years ago and but now i'm like you know

01:01:40.700 what screw it like i'm not changing until you show me evidence that i have to so um well you guys have

01:01:48.320 so many listeners i mean there's no reason to change it i mean it's just yeah yeah yeah and and the

01:01:54.360 listeners have continued to go up now we possibly hit like a little bit of a peak with the trump

01:01:58.960 election and maybe we'll sure we'll come come back down a little bit but but you know the the next

01:02:03.780 plateau will be um higher than the last one and then you know we'll continue up in that sort of

01:02:09.220 ratchet fashion or maybe we'll just stay where we are i don't know i mean i get so much we get so

01:02:13.800 many emails and the thing that's so heartening is that we get so many emails of people that were

01:02:18.440 like you know i was a cuck servitive i was a shit lib i was a libertarian i mean it used to be all i

01:02:23.000 was a libertarian we're getting less and less of those because i think we might have tapped that market

01:02:27.860 that's actually fascinating that you said i think we might have tapped out that market because the

01:02:32.520 people that are still with libertarianism oh now they're left they're hopeless right they're hopeless

01:02:38.760 they're they're they're i don't know they're leftists but they're people that just want to

01:02:43.140 sell pot and you know sell pot basically you know like they're basically just potheads and people that

01:02:50.860 like to smoke weed and shoot guns and that's that's what all they want to do and it's like that's fine

01:02:55.400 you know but uh that world is not going to be available to you uh if things keep going this way

01:03:01.340 but um yeah so we're getting actually fewer and fewer people that are like yeah i was a libertarian

01:03:06.120 because at this point if you're a libertarian you know about the alt-right and if you haven't

01:03:10.380 jumped in then you're not going to so that market i think is tapped out it's saturated but this is

01:03:16.220 actually a fascinating development because i would have said that at the very least uh half of the

01:03:22.460 alt-right are former libertarians of some kind and it might actually be probably more than that yeah

01:03:27.820 but you're right like now we're we're going to reach the former leftist or the former and you know

01:03:33.980 i would always meet reach like a handful of people like that like i voted for barack obama

01:03:38.300 in 2008 like i was an environmentalist now i'm all right i i would i would meet like the individuals

01:03:44.040 like that but the overwhelming amount you know the overwhelming majority were i voted for ron paul in

01:03:49.720 2008 or 2012 but yeah now it's like i was a cuck yeah i was a cuck until 2015 because if you think about

01:03:57.800 it i mean like the alt-right is known to libertarians very well they are very and i i have still friends

01:04:04.180 with some people that are sort of skirting that line like they are harder core than they were

01:04:09.580 like a few years ago as libertarians but they're still kind of libertarian they're still kind of

01:04:14.320 you know but they they're all well aware they're all well aware and acquainted with this whole thing so

01:04:20.040 it's like if they've jumped in or they haven't and at this point there there's going to be people that

01:04:25.240 stay libertarian that are just potheads there's going to be people that ride the fence and then

01:04:29.860 there's those that have come in you know more of these riots and things like that might might do it

01:04:34.940 but uh i i do think that we're going to increasingly see former uh liberals probably most likely um

01:04:42.660 probably probably white liberals the kind of you know kids that were raised guys that were raised to

01:04:48.260 be progressives probably increasingly be the people coming over that's going to be a fascinating thing

01:04:53.580 yeah yeah i mean we've gotten more and more of those at trs so yeah yeah guys who were voted

01:04:59.580 democratic because of the environment or or they just saw them as like you know good government they

01:05:06.960 were turned off by the the ted cruz or a republican party yeah i think those are going to be actually

01:05:13.400 high quality people or you know they they thought they were going to get a girl or something i don't

01:05:20.680 know or i don't know what you know um who knows maybe because their family were always democrats like

01:05:25.760 things like this but increasingly i think that that those types of people are going to be coming over

01:05:29.980 yeah yeah conservatives will be the last ones we'll have to drag conservatives across the finish line

01:05:37.880 kicking and screaming when i i wonder if if they're also just gonna the the true cuck like the the

01:05:46.680 cruise cuck type person i i wonder if that is just a generational thing i think so you know like

01:05:54.400 those guys i mean i i think steve jobs said he said like one funny thing he was like well for technology

01:06:00.460 to advance millions of people have to die and you know that that obviously sounds kind of like funny

01:06:05.860 it's like stalling or something but what he just means is that like people get you know they're they're

01:06:11.580 attached to one way of doing things and but eventually they are going to pass and there's

01:06:16.960 going to be a new generation of people who are just ready for a new paradigm and i think that is

01:06:22.260 probably true with the the cruise cuck type thing i just i it's i don't know maybe this is my own

01:06:28.080 perspective my totally biased perspective but just how could that be attractive at this point

01:06:33.840 for a 25 year old it's not attractive to young people and i can't imagine that it would be in the

01:06:40.680 same way that um you know the people that got a little bit uh nervous and started uh counter

01:06:47.060 signaling and got upset about um the uh the mpi uh the hail gate as we were calling it hail gate or

01:06:54.920 or salute gate or whatever you want to call it um there's a definite generation gap i mean i observed

01:07:01.320 it just in my own in my own circles um and uh there's far more young people than there are older people

01:07:07.320 but the older people were sort of universally uh you know nervous about it and the young people

01:07:13.160 were like yeah so i think uh and and this is also because i mean i don't even i who went to school

01:07:20.120 high school in the 90s and you know you know uh middle school and high school in the 90s

01:07:24.880 uh we don't know i mean i think you did too uh we're the same age so um we don't know the kind

01:07:33.600 of demonization that these white kids are facing in school today like we had it somewhat they've got

01:07:38.520 it bad and i think that really for these people that have actually been demonized their whole life

01:07:44.820 as as a white particularly white males uh women to some extent and actually one thing we want to do

01:07:50.360 is increase the demonization of women on the left that's a great thing to come out of the trump

01:07:54.040 election but um no seriously the fact they're attacking white women is great because as soon as

01:07:59.360 white women are no longer in their wheelhouse that that opens up whole new worlds but they're

01:08:04.220 openly doing that i've i've seen like samantha b and yeah no i know they're openly attacking white

01:08:10.520 women and it's great we want to exacerbate that but these these kids uh like imagine going to school

01:08:18.840 like 18 years old like imagine the mind fuck they've done on you and then you hear for the first time

01:08:24.900 from people like us like you know you're fine like you didn't do anything you didn't do nothing wrong

01:08:29.860 um and you actually you should say a big fuck you to all these people that tortured you mentally

01:08:35.540 through your upbringing and just come join us and i think that's going to be a powerful appeal

01:08:39.320 that we're going to make to these people so you're absolutely right like the things that we experienced

01:08:45.320 have been amplified by a hundred like the kind of propaganda that we experienced like freshman year

01:08:52.600 in college where you have this you know orientation sessions or or things like that like it's been

01:08:58.700 multiplied by a hundred for each each of these kids like they've had white privilege written on

01:09:03.780 their face and by a sharpie like if not literally then figuratively and i mean they're almost inviting

01:09:09.980 violence against whites i mean it's really crazy and and so yeah and like i said and they're not gonna

01:09:16.340 they're not gonna care about any of these pieties about like hitler and world war ii like they are not

01:09:24.000 going to be subjected to that emotional manipulation because i mean they are gonna they were just told

01:09:30.200 you know your your shit like their their whole upbringing and it's that's not going to work out well

01:09:39.640 in the end for the left i mean that it's really not

01:09:44.720 let's put a bookmark in it on that i think that's a good place to stop well mike thanks i really

01:09:53.540 appreciate it and uh this is a great conversation sure yeah

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RadixJournal - November 29, 2016

Hailgate

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