RadixJournal - IVF, Jeffrey Epstein, & Elite Human Capital

00:00:00.000 Got to look at this up a second, because I'll see the note of the A.

00:00:30.000 All right, everyone.

00:00:35.200 Welcome in.

00:00:36.640 I hope we're live on Substack.

00:00:40.940 Am I?

00:00:42.320 Ah, we are live on Substack.

00:00:44.400 Wow.

00:00:45.100 Awesome.

00:00:46.080 It actually worked.

00:00:47.760 It worked.

00:00:48.380 Wow.

00:00:48.560 That's cool.

00:00:50.160 Yeah.

00:00:50.400 So I hope everyone can join in.

00:00:54.780 And so we have a special guest, Richard Hanania.

00:00:58.880 How are you doing, Richard?

00:01:00.320 Good to be back.

00:01:00.820 Doing good, Richard.

00:01:01.940 I'm just in the midst of...

00:01:03.140 Let me share this on social media, because now I have a link within...

00:01:06.340 Ooh, I can put on Twitter.

00:01:08.760 Got both the Richards.

00:01:09.780 For streaming on IVF, Epstein, and Liberal Zionists.

00:01:20.260 Maybe H1B.

00:01:22.580 Yeah, I wanted to start on racial matters.

00:01:26.520 Okay.

00:01:26.680 Along with...

00:01:28.820 I'll put the tag.

00:01:31.940 RFH always gets a big...

00:01:34.780 A lot of people on Twitter are interested in RFH, so I have to...

00:01:37.560 Mm-hmm.

00:01:38.080 I have to include her.

00:01:39.340 Okay.

00:01:39.680 There.

00:01:40.080 No.

00:01:40.620 She's universally beloved.

00:01:42.640 Yes.

00:01:44.720 You know, very innocuous presence.

00:01:46.180 Like Santa Claus.

00:01:47.780 Yes.

00:01:48.120 Well, Richard, first off, you seem to have fully switched sides at this point.

00:01:56.600 You are a card-carrying Democrat.

00:02:00.960 You voted for Donald Trump, which is interesting, for understandable reasons.

00:02:07.460 But this is, I guess, what I make of it, is that, first off, there are some policies that

00:02:16.440 might very well bother you, the tariffs and so on.

00:02:20.120 But my sense, and correct me if I'm wrong, is really about elite human capital in the sense

00:02:28.860 that non-elite human capital is accumulating in MAGA.

00:02:36.540 And even if it's not directly affecting policy, it will at some point.

00:02:43.580 And at the very least, the MAGA media sphere is so embarrassing that it's difficult to want

00:02:52.380 to be a part of this team.

00:02:53.820 Am I right about that?

00:02:55.260 And you can certainly expand or correct me.

00:02:58.340 Yeah.

00:02:58.360 I mean, we could talk about policies.

00:03:01.280 You're right.

00:03:01.600 But the idea is, like, I've seen this for a while.

00:03:05.680 I've seen what's going on with right-wing media.

00:03:07.840 I see, you know, you look at the top podcasts in the country, news podcasts, New York Times,

00:03:12.280 NPR, Tucker, and Candace.

00:03:13.880 I mean, this is not a right-left thing.

00:03:16.120 What's interesting between those categories is not one is more conservative.

00:03:19.360 One believes in a lower marginal tax rate than the other, right?

00:03:22.500 One category is, like, real news and where serious human beings gather to share information. 0.94

00:03:28.260 And another is just kind of crazy people.

00:03:30.660 And, you know, like, there's a kind of zombie Reaganism that is still there that I think

00:03:36.020 has some good policy ideas that does good things at the state level, like make housing

00:03:40.860 affordable and keep taxes low.

00:03:42.620 I mean, you know, that's good stuff.

00:03:45.360 You know, at the same time, we're getting to a place where you, you know, it is infecting

00:03:50.860 policy, and it's getting worse over time.

00:03:53.340 Like, I thought the MAHA thing, I thought Trump would toss RFK to the side after the election.

00:03:57.500 We have, I just saw this morning, there's a MAHA conference where Vance is speaking.

00:04:02.300 And he's like, well, you know, I don't like to take Tylenol.

00:04:04.740 Sometimes my back will hurt, but there's no reason to take medicine when we don't need

00:04:08.560 it.

00:04:09.040 I mean, he's just like, it's just so overwhelming.

00:04:11.920 This thing is just kind of swiping, you know, a tidal wave on the right.

00:04:17.040 The party is becoming overtaken.

00:04:18.780 There's this human capital educational polarization, more than there is a right-left thing.

00:04:23.340 And I don't know, like, in five, ten years, what policies, what are these people going

00:04:29.560 to be doing, right?

00:04:30.360 What kind of crazy things will they believe in five, ten years?

00:04:32.520 There's no, like, natural limit here.

00:04:34.360 There's no Pope, there's no William F. Buckley here to kick the birchers out of it. 1.00

00:04:40.760 You know, who's going to tell Tucker or Candace or Joe Rogan or their audience that they're

00:04:44.880 out of their minds, right?

00:04:45.900 This could spiral and get much, much worse.

00:04:48.240 So I'm just looking at kind of what's happened to the American right.

00:04:51.560 I think it's not going in some place good.

00:04:54.560 And it needs to, you know, it needs to fix this.

00:04:57.420 I don't know how it fixes.

00:04:58.400 Maybe it needs to be politically destroyed and then something needs to emerge from the

00:05:01.800 ashes.

00:05:02.520 But I don't see much reason to be optimistic here.

00:05:06.640 Yes, I feel like policymakers are responding to the online sphere and influencers and podcasters,

00:05:17.760 et cetera, in a way that I don't think we've ever seen previously.

00:05:22.460 I think we might have actually crossed a Rubicon for better and for worse.

00:05:26.800 I mean, you could say that this is great.

00:05:28.760 It's democratic.

00:05:29.900 They're responding to the people.

00:05:32.100 I think you would say that this is absolutely for the worst.

00:05:36.900 There's a lot of pandering directly to the online right from official government accounts.

00:05:44.120 The Department of Homeland Security and ICE and all that are the most dramatic.

00:05:48.880 They're making like FASH wave BAP sphere edits circa 2017.

00:05:54.460 But it's coming from the government this time.

00:05:57.760 I mean, it's really a remarkable situation.

00:06:00.760 But yeah, I think the Tylenol thing was an absolute disgrace, and I think it directly

00:06:08.080 showed influence from those people towards policymakers.

00:06:14.880 It seemed like obviously politicians always pander, but their pandering is different than

00:06:22.300 in some ways being channeled by the media.

00:06:27.200 I mean, I think it's genuinely a new thing.

00:06:29.380 I don't think you can look back on the 20th century and see the influence of grassroots

00:06:37.760 people affecting politicians in the way that that's occurring now.

00:06:41.460 So I think what you're getting at is very real, and I don't think we've seen the worst

00:06:48.580 from the Maha crowd or the Tucker crowd or so on.

00:06:52.920 I mean, is Trump going to investigate chemtrails?

00:06:56.680 I mean, I think he almost has to if this trend is going to continue.

00:07:03.480 There was the EPA administrator said that they were going to look into it, actually.

00:07:06.840 So they're ahead of you.

00:07:07.760 Yeah.

00:07:07.940 The things that you think are going to happen soon have already happened.

00:07:11.460 There's yeah, there was one after the Charlie Kirk assassination.

00:07:15.840 Patel was on Twitter talking about basically like signaling to these like Kenneth Owens people

00:07:20.560 who think TPUSA was in on it, basically saying, you know, we'll turn every rock and we'll see

00:07:26.220 what's going on here.

00:07:27.060 The Epstein thing, it's funny because they stepped on the rake with this one.

00:07:29.800 They're like, Epstein, Epstein, Epstein.

00:07:31.120 We're going to get to the bottom of this.

00:07:32.360 And then Trump was like, wait a minute.

00:07:33.580 This is just all about me.

00:07:35.200 And then they had to backtrack.

00:07:38.260 You're right.

00:07:38.860 No, it is.

00:07:39.480 It is.

00:07:40.960 You're right.

00:07:41.480 Democratic is the right word. 0.94

00:07:42.520 This is the perfection of democracy.

00:07:45.500 Politicians have always pandered.

00:07:47.740 It's the question is, who are they pandering to?

00:07:49.480 They're pandering to, I don't know, some kind of community leader who has some kind of

00:07:52.500 organic support or maybe like a trade group or some ethnic group or something.

00:07:57.040 This is this is literally who leaves the most comments, who has the most likes and retweets.

00:08:03.100 It's who gets dunked on by the biggest influencers who gets pushed around by them.

00:08:07.080 Yeah, there's never been anything like this.

00:08:09.100 There's never been just a direct line from what the people think to their elected representatives.

00:08:13.700 It's overwhelming.

00:08:14.600 It could have been both sides, but it's overwhelmingly.

00:08:17.020 concentrated on the right.

00:08:18.320 I mean, the left, you'll find some examples of this, but the right is kind of the people

00:08:22.460 who are very online or less than regular people, while the left still has like scientists

00:08:27.020 and like journalists that they actually listen to.

00:08:28.980 Oh, the liberals are listening to NPR and the New York Times Daily podcast, which I listen

00:08:34.560 to every morning.

00:08:35.440 Yeah.

00:08:35.840 You might listen to it if you're like a serious human being.

00:08:38.800 You wouldn't listen to Tucker and get anthropological curiosity.

00:08:43.120 Yeah.

00:08:43.680 No, I would hate listen or or listen to him ironically or to examine what he's doing as

00:08:49.540 an anthropologist or something.

00:08:51.160 But no, I would not take him seriously.

00:08:53.260 And so you have the the liberals who are sort of, you know, on the one hand and then on the

00:08:57.600 other hand.

00:08:58.260 And, you know, are these facts contested?

00:09:00.980 Let's get to the bottom of it.

00:09:02.020 And then you have Tucker chemtrails like it really is a stark divide.

00:09:06.180 And I agree with you.

00:09:07.420 It goes beyond left to right.

00:09:09.560 Do you think that Vance might accelerate this?

00:09:12.260 Because just thinking back, like the history of the alt right or the dissident right, we

00:09:20.000 projected on to Trump like he was a screen and so many things could be projected upon him. 0.98

00:09:27.720 Like he's a fascist. 0.90

00:09:30.240 He's the next George Washington.

00:09:32.220 He's like an anime hero.

00:09:34.320 He's a god emperor.

00:09:35.580 Like a lot of fantasy was projected onto him like a screen with someone like J.D.

00:09:40.200 Vance, the natural successor to Donald Trump.

00:09:42.440 It seems to be the reverse.

00:09:43.980 He seems to desperately like try to repeat things he saw on Twitter.

00:09:50.400 And he, you mentioned before we went on air, you mentioned Rob Dreher or Dreher, who I've

00:09:56.660 known for 15 or 20 years or I've known of at the very least.

00:10:01.460 And he's, he seems to like go, Rob Dreher seems to pick a new religion every about four

00:10:09.580 or five years.

00:10:10.120 Like he's an evangelical Christian.

00:10:11.800 He's a Catholic.

00:10:12.760 He's an Orthodox.

00:10:13.960 You see a little bit of that with Vance as well, who changed religions.

00:10:16.660 But also it's like, you know, he's a liberal millennial white Obama.

00:10:23.040 And then he's like a, a, a mainstream neocon or he was a neocon first, I guess, with from

00:10:29.080 he was a neocon.

00:10:30.260 Uh, then he's a mainstream neocon and then he's pro Trump and then he's the religious

00:10:34.420 right.

00:10:34.780 And then he's post liberal. 0.99

00:10:36.100 And then he's like a Twitter shit poster of some time. 0.99

00:10:38.720 And then he's anti Ukraine. 0.99

00:10:39.780 It, he doesn't really seem to have a core and whereas fantasies were projected onto

00:10:48.080 Trump.

00:10:48.740 It's almost like JD Vance is a fantasizer himself.

00:10:53.420 Like he, he takes on a new meme or, or way of thinking every three or four months.

00:11:00.740 That's just my read of him.

00:11:02.200 So I think it's going to get worse actually.

00:11:06.200 Yeah.

00:11:06.760 I mean, Vance, I think that's probably right.

00:11:11.440 Trump is kind of a limit to their craziness.

00:11:13.780 I mean, we see this all the time.

00:11:14.960 We see Trump talking about, Oh, the Chinese students are great.

00:11:17.480 Oh, the vaccine, you know, worked.

00:11:18.700 I mean, he'll, he'll say stuff and they'll push back on him.

00:11:21.200 You can't imagine like Vance has, you know, some of these people have really have had their

00:11:26.460 brains melted by the internet.

00:11:27.900 Like I think when Vance was picked as the vice presidential nominee, like these kind of like

00:11:32.540 red scare types, like I'm just nothing, just them, but like people of that type, people

00:11:36.700 who have like, you know, this just like highly partisan worldview that they pretend to be

00:11:41.040 like actually cool, but they're just kind of partisans.

00:11:43.980 Right.

00:11:44.460 They love Vance.

00:11:45.520 They see him as one of them because he thinks like that he's mind melted with them.

00:11:50.120 Like if somebody, some Nazi, you know, some Nazi group chat comes out, Vance's first instinct

00:11:54.800 is the same as everything.

00:11:55.880 Oh, he's a kid.

00:11:57.080 And look at what they did with Russiagate.

00:11:59.820 I mean, it's just this kind of like hollow.

00:12:02.380 What about is always ready to hit back, never acknowledging a point, always having this

00:12:07.900 partisan line.

00:12:09.420 And so I think he is like, he's probably convinced himself like to be, you know, to be one of these

00:12:15.100 people and like, you know, I don't know if he's like, you know, who knows?

00:12:21.980 He's a good, he's a good politician.

00:12:23.680 He's smart.

00:12:24.560 He could 2028.

00:12:26.020 He could realize that it's his best interest to triangulate against what doesn't Tucker

00:12:31.340 and try to be a precedent and maybe become a moderate guy.

00:12:33.840 Maybe because circumstances change.

00:12:35.440 I think he's kind of a chameleon and he could change under those circumstances.

00:12:38.280 Or maybe he's just kind of, his brain has been fossilized by like 2019, 2020 internet

00:12:45.780 memes.

00:12:46.580 He's just going to be like this post-liberal based guy, regardless of what happens.

00:12:50.500 I don't know.

00:12:51.100 I think the first scenario is more likely.

00:12:53.520 But the, you know, the second scenario of him becoming kind of assimilated back into the

00:12:58.020 elites is also possible.

00:12:59.540 And in that case, he's going to have a real, real problem with his right flank.

00:13:04.580 Absolutely.

00:13:05.020 So you mentioned Epstein a little bit back and I did want to bring him up.

00:13:10.400 We were thinking about talking about IVF, but I'll let, let me go to something very different

00:13:14.660 than that.

00:13:16.220 So we've had this shutdown and we now, Congress is back.

00:13:22.060 Thank goodness.

00:13:23.040 The government is here to help us and it's back, but they have to, they released interesting

00:13:28.820 emails that seem to indicate that Trump knew exactly what was going on.

00:13:34.620 They also show Michael Wolfe, this famed journalist and fixer type, I guess, who has been podcasting

00:13:43.180 about Epstein back for a year with Vanity Fair or something.

00:13:47.940 I've, I've listened to a few of, a few of those that he was sort of helping out Epstein as a

00:13:53.400 spin doctor of sorts.

00:13:55.700 So there's just a lot of very interesting tidbits that are coming out.

00:14:02.180 Now you, you're, you're sort of colleagues or friends at the very least with Michael Tracy.

00:14:08.180 He has gone very hard against what he calls the Epstein mythos.

00:14:14.900 And how would you represent what he's doing and, and, and maybe give us a sense of your

00:14:22.920 perspective on what this actually was?

00:14:28.180 Yeah.

00:14:28.380 So I'm, I'm pretty much at the same place where Michael is on this.

00:14:32.040 So his belief is that, okay, Jeffrey Epstein was a guy who made a lot of money and Michael

00:14:37.860 doesn't take a position on how he make his, made his money because that's something people,

00:14:41.280 at least last time I talked to him about it.

00:14:43.900 He liked young girls, young women.

00:14:48.100 He wasn't always carting, you know, them to see, make sure that they were over 18. 0.75

00:14:52.340 He had some kinds of, you know, they gave him massages and so forth.

00:14:57.020 He doesn't think there's any evidence.

00:14:59.680 And I think this is right, that there was trafficking in the sense that, you know, for

00:15:04.300 to put aside, like to get to spy on Israel or something in the sense that they were, they

00:15:08.680 had sex with any men who were not Epstein through Epstein, people who were under 18,

00:15:14.000 right?

00:15:14.260 The, and so you can go into the claims of these women and it's, it's remarkable.

00:15:19.280 Like some of them are like, you know, they stayed in contact with him for 10 years and

00:15:23.460 then they decided they had been abused.

00:15:24.920 Some of them are just, you know, fabulous.

00:15:27.220 Like one is Virginia Gufray, who was the big one, who is, I think the main person who says

00:15:31.220 I was trafficked to this person.

00:15:32.280 And that person was sued by Alan Dershowitz.

00:15:35.420 It's, she had to admit that basically that it didn't happen.

00:15:38.440 She says she misremembered someone else.

00:15:40.080 So basically went to court, but didn't hold up.

00:15:42.480 There's not, I mean, there's not much there.

00:15:44.400 She was 17 when she met Epstein.

00:15:46.360 I think she was, I don't know if it's been confirmed.

00:15:48.100 She was actually with Prince Andrew, but she was above the age of consent in the United

00:15:51.340 Kingdom, which is, which is 16.

00:15:53.260 And so there's really, once you strip away, once you take away these claims from these women

00:15:59.200 who saw a lot of them had a real, real financial interest.

00:16:01.520 Like when this, when this thing came out, basically you could go to like whichever bank, JP Morgan

00:16:06.520 and be like, you dealt with a sex trafficker, right?

00:16:09.340 Okay.

00:16:09.540 They're all like, okay, here's a big pot of money, right?

00:16:12.000 Let's like, you know, show your claim to be a victim.

00:16:14.380 You get that money.

00:16:15.040 So there's a huge, there's a huge incentive in terms of financial interest for these women 1.00

00:16:19.200 to get money.

00:16:20.500 Nobody is questioning.

00:16:21.920 Nobody is checking these claims.

00:16:23.220 When you do dig into some of these claims, they fall apart. 0.78

00:16:26.280 And basically like, this is, this is a pedo moral panic, like how few pedophiles there 0.97

00:16:33.780 are in the world that like people like having sex with 17 year old girls is like something 0.97

00:16:38.760 that like overturns our entire politics. 0.79

00:16:41.340 So I'm with Michael.

00:16:42.840 I don't, I think that these accusers, I think it's a moral panic.

00:16:45.980 I think he might've had sexual contact with people under 18.

00:16:49.280 I don't think there was a larger conspiracy.

00:16:51.020 And I think most of these, uh, supposed victims are, are cashing in.

00:16:56.800 Well, Pam Bondi at one point at a press conference said that the reason why she can't release the 0.55

00:17:02.340 Epstein files is that she has, uh, I'm trying to do a Pam Bondi impression.

00:17:07.820 She, she's rather breathless and, and, um, you know, there, there are videos of Jeffrey

00:17:13.560 Epstein abusing children, child porn, and we need to go through every minute of these

00:17:19.260 before we release she, it was a very odd statement because it seemed to be conflating what was 0.77

00:17:25.980 happening with something that is more obviously criminal, which are just actual pedophiles

00:17:34.860 and child abusers and, and things like this, that that's sort of a open and shut case in

00:17:39.980 terms of, is this wrong or not?

00:17:42.400 And she seemed to be conflating that.

00:17:44.060 Yeah.

00:17:44.520 I think they just, they, they like, you know, they don't have a high opinion of their mega

00:17:48.080 audience, but even like their opinion might've been, um, they still, they still might've

00:17:52.600 underestimated them because when Pam Bondi brings them in, brings in like Jack Vesovic and lives

00:17:56.580 of Tik TOK and says, here's the finders. 1.00

00:17:59.340 And like, she thinks they're so dumb. 0.98

00:18:00.700 Like anything she gives them, they'll be like, Whoa, thank you, ma'am. 0.99

00:18:03.000 You know, we're, we're, we're insiders now.

00:18:04.680 And like, even they could realize this was stuff that was already released.

00:18:07.580 She didn't do the basic. 1.00

00:18:08.600 She just thinks they're idiots that you're going to play to it. 1.00

00:18:10.720 It's kind of backfired on her. 1.00

00:18:12.120 So like what Pam Bondi is saying of like different points of time, I just think she's probably

00:18:16.420 not thinking too much about Epstein, like until it blew up into a thing.

00:18:20.320 And then the thought she could just say whatever she wanted and whatever sounded good in the

00:18:23.540 moment.

00:18:23.800 And then it kind of all blew up because these people really care about Epstein.

00:18:28.300 Yes.

00:18:28.900 I, and I don't think what she was claiming actually occurred, but it still is begging the

00:18:34.460 question of what it actually was.

00:18:37.220 Is your position, which is a reasonable, plausible position that it was basically just wall street,

00:18:46.020 rich people, sex parties.

00:18:49.280 It's not that different from a middle class or working class people going to Cancun and engaging

00:18:58.480 in similar behavior.

00:18:59.640 There was, there was no, they're there or because it, it also like Michael Tracy has

00:19:05.700 brought some skepticism towards the idea that this was a child trafficking pedophile ring.

00:19:11.480 And I think he makes some, some excellent points and pushback.

00:19:15.440 And I think a lot of people are afraid to push back because it's almost like you're endorsing

00:19:19.280 what's happening.

00:19:19.940 And so you just basically nod your head when, when any claim is made.

00:19:23.680 Um, that being said, there's another question.

00:19:26.900 And for me, that's the only question I'm interested in is what was it all about?

00:19:33.260 Was it just fun or because Tracy also seems to push back on an idea that it was a blackmail 0.99

00:19:40.720 ring.

00:19:41.440 And there are all of these, these have been published in the New York times.

00:19:45.020 So it must be true, but there, there are all these cameras in his, his New York home.

00:19:52.080 Um, when some, one of the, some of the, I'm forgetting his name in the moment.

00:19:56.000 One of the person first worked on this, they opened a closet and discovered hard drives and

00:20:01.380 material.

00:20:01.800 So was he just a pervert?

00:20:04.940 And I mean, I have cameras in my home.

00:20:07.360 I mean, a lot of people have cameras in their, in their home these days.

00:20:10.100 I mean, it's, it's a pretty common thing, especially if you're a rich person and you have

00:20:13.680 security.

00:20:14.100 It's not a hidden camera in your bedroom.

00:20:16.720 Isn't it?

00:20:17.260 I mean, yeah.

00:20:18.180 I mean, have kids.

00:20:20.040 Yeah.

00:20:20.280 We have like many cams and stuff and there's, Oh, we're not talking about a name.

00:20:24.340 He cam here.

00:20:25.380 No, like you have a burglar, you have alarm system.

00:20:27.600 You might worry about someone breaking in.

00:20:29.060 You might, so someone might just steal your stuff.

00:20:30.900 I don't know.

00:20:31.300 Like, it's like not that shocking.

00:20:33.840 Like, it's not that crazy to have a camera, you know, in a bedroom.

00:20:37.360 I like, it's not that insane.

00:20:39.560 Okay.

00:20:39.960 So you don't think it was a blackmail ring that, that is the,

00:20:44.100 the idea.

00:20:45.480 No, there's weird things like Jeffrey Epstein.

00:20:49.540 Like there's one where he's kind of sounds like he's trying to blackmail, um, uh, Bill

00:20:53.840 Gates or there's an email where he's like, you know, I know about your girl, something

00:20:57.400 like that.

00:20:57.860 Just something implying that he knows about his extramarital affair.

00:21:00.700 Uh, there's a few things that seem weird like that, but the thing that got people spun

00:21:05.680 up and like, this is a Zionist, you know, conspiracy to silence critics of Israel or blackmail 0.70

00:21:10.100 them. 0.99

00:21:10.400 That all comes from like this one crazy woman, uh, Virginia Gufra. 1.00

00:21:14.020 And I think there's one or two others who are, you know, literally out of their minds. 0.78

00:21:17.120 And so, yeah, I don't know why you would, why you would think that like, what is there

00:21:21.140 when you take away the kind of claims of crazy women, what else is there?

00:21:26.260 Well, I, I, what else is there is what exactly was going on.

00:21:31.560 Why is it that Alan Dershowitz and Bill Gates and Donald Trump and Steven Pinker are all going

00:21:36.340 to this island?

00:21:36.820 Because he's a rich guy and like a rich guy says, come to my party and there are girls

00:21:40.920 and like, you know, there's other famous people there.

00:21:43.140 People will go to that party.

00:21:44.660 I would go to that party.

00:21:45.740 That's not right.

00:21:47.300 He had a lot of money and wanted to be a socialite.

00:21:49.460 And yeah, I get it.

00:21:52.340 Um, so I interviewed, uh, deep left who has a sub stack and, and I would encourage people

00:22:00.440 to check him out very least.

00:22:02.160 And he made a very interesting argument and, and I felt like it brought the puzzle pieces

00:22:10.080 together because that was one thing that I would often say about Epstein is, you know,

00:22:14.580 what is it, what exactly is going on, is going on here?

00:22:17.880 Is it a massage spying?

00:22:20.020 Um, you know, at one point he was interested in fertility, basically like a, uh, like a almost

00:22:28.560 Nazi eugenics program of like rich elite people impregnating all these, you know, women and 0.99

00:22:34.860 so on, but that didn't go anywhere.

00:22:36.820 Um, Jeffrey Epstein himself died childless.

00:22:40.060 Um, and he made a, a compelling case, which is that the people who were brought to the

00:22:49.260 island, they weren't just rich people.

00:22:51.440 They were liberal Zionist types.

00:22:55.460 And what he means by that is that they are certainly Zionist. 0.70

00:23:02.200 They, they support Israel at the end of the day.

00:23:04.540 However, they don't like the settlements in the West bank.

00:23:07.740 They don't, they wouldn't like the bombardment of Gaza.

00:23:11.100 They, they wouldn't like outright seizure of the West bank.

00:23:14.920 They're not the Likud greater Israel religious fanatic types.

00:23:20.280 And they actually see those people as harming the interest of Israel, which I think is a

00:23:27.500 quite more than plausible notion that basically you let Benjamin Netanyahu and his coalition

00:23:34.140 get their hands on power and they are going to make Israel look horrible. 0.91

00:23:39.120 They're going to create perhaps regional and nuclear war. 0.92

00:23:42.220 Um, they're going to destroy Israel ironically by being its greatest supporters. 0.99

00:23:46.420 And so what we actually need is a two state solution, removal of settlements in the West

00:23:53.000 bank, et cetera.

00:23:54.400 And that these were the people.

00:23:56.820 So you, so you see like a hood Barack, um, Steven Pinker, I mentioned earlier. 0.94

00:24:02.400 Dershowitz is a little.

00:24:04.220 I mean, is that someone Steven Pinker is known for, for being a liberal Zionist?

00:24:08.160 I don't know.

00:24:08.660 He's not known for being a liberal Zionist, but he is a liberal Zionist.

00:24:13.160 Well, everyone in the elites, if you just hung out with elites, you throw a rock, like most

00:24:17.020 of them will be liberal Zionists of one form or another. 0.52

00:24:19.280 I mean, that was like the position of the time.

00:24:22.400 Fair enough.

00:24:22.940 But let me just put it out there.

00:24:24.580 So what, what he was suggesting is that the origin, the Epstein scandal and Trump's first

00:24:31.300 term was basically Likudites being like, Hey, why don't you look into a hood Barack, our 0.58

00:24:38.140 political adversary, um, and all this Epstein stuff.

00:24:42.260 And it's sort of blown up in their face in the sense that Trump was roped into all this.

00:24:47.180 And so it was basically a way of team building.

00:24:50.280 It wasn't blackmail.

00:24:51.400 Like, do we have any evidence of someone being blackmailed by the Epstein ring?

00:24:58.460 I mean, maybe we wouldn't have evidence because it would all be done secretly, but it was more

00:25:03.540 about team building.

00:25:04.720 It was like a wall street drug and sex party for these types of people to get everyone on

00:25:10.440 the same page so that they could pursue their perception of Israel's best interest.

00:25:17.740 I mean, it's, it's a story.

00:25:19.740 I mean, I, you know, I like deep left.

00:25:21.860 I encourage people to read a sub stack.

00:25:23.300 He has some good insights.

00:25:24.760 Um, you know, it's a story you could, you could tell, um, is there evidence for it?

00:25:28.620 Well, what's the evidence that a lot of these people were liberal Zionists? 0.62

00:25:31.460 Okay.

00:25:31.760 In 2000, 2010, you were a rich elite Jew. 0.89

00:25:34.160 You were probably a liberal Zionist or someone who was, uh, in politics.

00:25:38.400 Uh, the idea that like, you need some explanation and like Netanyahu is like, go after, you know,

00:25:42.980 Ehud Barak.

00:25:43.680 I don't think that's necessary because this all happened during me too.

00:25:46.940 And me too was just a case where we went through like every single man who'd ever had an accusation.

00:25:52.360 Basically, you know, Bill Cosby stuff that was decades old came up, you know, R Kelly, like there's, you know, uh, famous people, you know, Harvey Weinstein, a lot of people ended up in jail, uh, over this.

00:26:02.380 And so it was kind of natural that people would look at, uh, the Jeffrey Epstein case, which had been known and kind of been thought about and written about before.

00:26:09.720 And so there was this big piece in, uh, I think in the Miami newspaper in 2018, 2019, I don't think you need an explanation of like Trump said, you know, I think that Trump at the time also his health secretary was, um, Acosta, who was the guy who ended up getting blamed for giving Epstein the deal.

00:26:25.980 So like immediately there would be, uh, some political risk of Trump bringing this thing up.

00:26:30.860 And then Trump himself was always, you know, was always the closest person to Epstein of all these famous people that we, that we know of.

00:26:37.120 Um, and so like, it's a story, it's a fun story, but like, you know, there's other explanations for what's happened.

00:26:44.020 Okay.

00:26:45.000 Um, do you want to jump in on this RFH or?

00:26:49.720 I mean, whether or not it's a black male and all these other sort of theories, I just, I think there's something sinister about very wealthy men. 0.98

00:27:00.860 I mean, bringing 17 year old girls to parties, even if it is above the age of consent. 0.94

00:27:06.980 So from a feminist point of view, I still do find it very scandalous.

00:27:12.680 I would not deny that Epstein is problematic from a feminist point of view.

00:27:16.340 Yeah.

00:27:16.580 Yeah.

00:27:16.780 Um, okay.

00:27:22.860 So I'll just to tie a bow on this.

00:27:25.760 Do you, do you think this might be the magic bullet that somehow ends the Trump presidency?

00:27:32.260 You know, it looks.

00:27:33.480 Yeah.

00:27:33.740 Go ahead.

00:27:34.080 Finish. 0.99

00:27:34.300 Well, precisely because of this, because he got away with grab them by the pussy stuff and, and all of that stuff is water well under the bridge. 0.99

00:27:44.860 The, the difference here is that it's a wild conspiracy theory that his own people love. 0.98

00:27:52.720 So when it's just like bad policies or bad behavior, his people can just be like, ah, they can shrug, who cares?

00:28:02.480 But when it's their own thing, when QAnon turns on Trump, that's when the dynamic changes and this actually brings him down.

00:28:10.460 Um, yeah, it looked like that.

00:28:12.500 This had a lot of momentum, uh, at one point.

00:28:15.520 Um, I, I don't know.

00:28:17.320 It's like these emails that just got released today.

00:28:20.000 They weren't even emails.

00:28:20.900 They were like snippets of a conversation.

00:28:22.860 And there was one, you know, it was like one, uh, one, you couldn't even tell what the quote meant because it was so weird.

00:28:29.520 I sent it to, uh, uh, like I had it here.

00:28:32.360 Is it one email Mr. Epstein wrote to Mr. Wolf?

00:28:35.180 Of course he knew about the girls as he, as he asked Jelaine to stop.

00:28:39.400 I don't know what that means.

00:28:40.140 As he asked Jelaine, like, we don't even know what the context of this is.

00:28:43.720 It's just like a sentence fragment that makes no sense, uh, in its own terms.

00:28:48.660 And then Republicans, I just saw that New York times headline.

00:28:51.060 I wasn't able to read it.

00:28:51.820 They released their own, you know, their own thing.

00:28:54.240 So maybe there's like some snippet of like Bill Clinton, you know, whatever high-fiving or something like that. 1.00

00:28:59.080 And it's just kind of, it's like, it's such a stupid thing. 0.92

00:29:01.380 It's like, if I, like, we know that he was around these people, there's always going to be new stuff that comes out. 0.96

00:29:06.840 There's going to be emails mentioning Trump and maybe Bill Clinton and Bill Gates, uh, and so on.

00:29:11.960 The funniest, I think the funniest one, I don't know if anything will top the, uh, uh, the birthday letter.

00:29:16.740 Yeah, I was going to ask, what do you, what do you make of that weird letter?

00:29:20.960 Yeah, this one I disagreed with Tracy about because it was, he, he, he put like this like story where it's like, you know, age is just a number, Jeffrey.

00:29:31.300 You're an enigma, you're an enigma, you never, you never age.

00:29:33.760 We share our secrets together.

00:29:35.140 It's like something, it's like that level. 0.54

00:29:36.700 It's like, you couldn't, if you thought there was an inside joke of them, like having sex with young girls, like that, that's what you would write.

00:29:45.000 It's like perfectly scripted to be that.

00:29:46.740 I don't know what else it would be.

00:29:47.700 You know, does that mean underaged girls, it doesn't imply that they were underage.

00:29:52.280 It doesn't imply they were 14 or 15.

00:29:53.900 They probably liked, you know, ribbing each other and they liked 18 and 19 year old girls.

00:29:58.040 And, you know, Trump liked it.

00:29:59.320 You know, he, he would say stuff about 13s and 14 year olds back on like Howard Stern in those days.

00:30:03.440 So does that mean that they had, you know, they had sexual relations with underage girls?

00:30:07.460 I don't know, but at least they were like, you know, the Trump thing is much closer to what these conspiracy tards think it is than any other person. 0.99

00:30:15.780 Like there's no, nothing of Bill Gates, like writing, you know, writing letters to Epstein saying, you know, we share the secret.

00:30:22.140 There's nothing like that.

00:30:23.840 And so, yeah, I mean, they were Trump and him were, you know, buddies.

00:30:28.080 They were into the same stuff, obviously.

00:30:31.180 You know, what else is there?

00:30:32.380 I don't know.

00:30:32.760 Like, is there going to be anything else released that gives us anything beyond that?

00:30:36.300 Anything connected to, like, look for something connected to intelligence, connected to Israel, connected to underage girls, connected to trafficking, connected to bribery.

00:30:47.740 Like, okay, like they're going through the files.

00:30:49.280 Like, give us whatever in there that's, that's, that's something beyond, you know, Trump and Epstein like underage girls, which we know and which we'll see more evidence for, I'm sure.

00:30:57.480 Yeah, I think the letter, because they're being so, like, they're implying a lot.

00:31:05.400 They're not just coming out and saying it.

00:31:06.880 I think the implication is pretty clear that the girls are underage. 0.99

00:31:10.820 That's my read of it.

00:31:12.720 Is that other, I don't know.

00:31:14.640 Otherwise, you're just going to kind of laugh like, ha ha, don't we love 19 year olds?

00:31:19.240 Yeah.

00:31:19.600 Because that's not illegal.

00:31:21.200 There's no reason to really hide that, especially when you're that wealthy and this is, like, 20 years ago or something.

00:31:28.880 The fear of the woman looked more like a girl as well than, you know, if I were to, when I heard the letter described, I imagined, you know, a curvaceous female form, hourglass.

00:31:39.700 But it sort of looked like a, not pre-pubescent, pubescent girl.

00:31:46.740 Just verging on the people.

00:31:48.300 Now what you will, that could just be chalked up to.

00:31:50.540 I think they like the model.

00:31:51.400 Yeah, I think they like the model.

00:31:52.640 Trump is a bad artist.

00:31:53.380 Yeah, I like the model look.

00:31:54.820 Maybe they don't like the curvaceous look.

00:31:56.920 I think maybe that's what Trump and Epstein were into.

00:32:00.080 Yeah. 1.00

00:32:00.440 Well, Trump is a kind of, like, secret gay man. 0.93

00:32:03.200 Like, he's a very sassy heterosexual, so he agrees with the gays and their female preferences, which is boyish. 0.96

00:32:12.220 Yeah.

00:32:14.100 It's kind of hard to imagine Trump, like, appreciating.

00:32:17.600 I mean, obviously, he's had kids.

00:32:19.120 I'm not saying he doesn't have a sex drive or something like that, but it's, like, kind of hard to imagine him, like, appreciating a woman other than, like, I'm Donald Trump and, like, here's my supermodel wife.

00:32:28.740 Like, I just think it's the most, you know, just completely unable to connect to people at that level.

00:32:34.660 Yes.

00:32:35.440 There's a scene in Maggie Haberman's biography of Trump where he was in Atlantic City and he got out of a limousine and he told all his friends, this is what a perfect 10 looks like.

00:32:47.440 And he brought out Marla Maples.

00:32:49.800 And I do, yes, I do think he might very well be a psychopath who quite literally sees other human beings as objects.

00:32:58.020 It's just a suggestion, perhaps.

00:33:01.060 Well, yeah, he's a Gemini, so. 0.84

00:33:03.820 Gemini.

00:33:08.540 Astrology.

00:33:10.000 Okay.

00:33:12.220 Not all Gemini.

00:33:14.200 I would just not.

00:33:14.860 Hashtag not all Gemini.

00:33:16.340 You're a Taurus.

00:33:17.580 Why are you being defensive?

00:33:19.920 Well, I don't know.

00:33:21.080 I am a bit of a Taurus.

00:33:22.600 I'm kind of a bull that goes after people stubborn.

00:33:25.960 I mean, it makes some sense.

00:33:28.020 You have a lot of Taurus qualities.

00:33:29.780 It's real.

00:33:31.500 That's fair enough.

00:33:32.340 You believe in this stuff?

00:33:34.920 Whether or not it's real, it's fun.

00:33:37.300 Was that to me?

00:33:38.620 No, that was, I assumed.

00:33:40.060 I assumed to me.

00:33:40.820 You did too.

00:33:41.460 I don't know.

00:33:41.860 Yeah, that was my sexism. 0.85

00:33:43.160 Well, I mean, it's sort of, I don't know.

00:33:46.900 Yeah.

00:33:47.060 I mean, there was some experiment where a psychology class, a person, the teacher gave them all note cards, and it had these very seemingly insightful, but very vague statements about their personality.

00:34:05.960 Like, you overcame a trauma in childhood and learned to appreciate the struggle.

00:34:14.380 Just things like that.

00:34:16.160 And they handed these cards to people.

00:34:17.980 And the teacher or the instructor said, oh, yeah, we had an astrologer come and do a reading of each of you.

00:34:26.000 And he came up with this little, you know, 50-word snippet.

00:34:30.800 And this is who you are exactly.

00:34:33.280 And all of the students were just amazed.

00:34:35.640 They're like, he knows me.

00:34:37.460 He nailed it.

00:34:38.840 This is me.

00:34:39.880 And then the instructor said, please pass the note card to the person to your right.

00:34:43.960 And it was the same statement.

00:34:46.000 So they all, like all hundred people got the exact same wording.

00:34:50.000 But if you can word it in a sort of vague way, you're like, yeah, I am a Gemini.

00:34:55.280 I get it.

00:34:55.820 Yeah.

00:34:55.920 Well, let me really quick defend it in a way that will kind of appeal to both of you here.

00:35:02.240 Because you've had this take before, Richard Spencer.

00:35:06.420 Sorry, it's confusing.

00:35:07.600 You're both Richard.

00:35:09.340 That, you know, there needs to be a certain amount of, like, moralizing or whatever in society.

00:35:15.080 I think maybe people need a certain outlet for their, quote, racism or, like, prejudice.

00:35:21.040 And if, if Hanania, if you feel that racism, real racism is really bad, then maybe astrology is kind of a better way to get that impulse out. 0.75

00:35:32.180 It's a, you know, it's a relatively harmless argument I've ever heard of.

00:35:38.400 Let the girls have their fun little light racism. 1.00

00:35:41.920 It's a rivalry for the demons.

00:35:44.280 You've been paying attention to the demons people on Twitter.

00:35:47.400 Seems much, much, it seems like the people who believe in demons have deep psychological problems.

00:35:53.120 Well, yeah.

00:35:53.800 So would you rather have Tucker talking about a demon attacking him in the middle of the night or, like.

00:36:00.800 I'd rather have looking at a sign and, yeah, thinking the stars.

00:36:03.440 Democrat women being like, oh, he's such a Gemini. 1.00

00:36:05.980 He sucks. 0.99

00:36:06.520 Like, I think it's, I think it's telling that Dems kind of prefer astrology and right-wingers prefer demons. 1.00

00:36:17.120 I rarely see these right-wing women, these ethots. 1.00

00:36:20.340 I really rarely see them talking about demons.

00:36:22.960 Every time I think of someone speaking about demons on Twitter, it's always a right-wing male.

00:36:28.040 Maybe those females, maybe demons are too scary for women. 1.00

00:36:30.920 I don't know.

00:36:31.220 I haven't seen one, even though they buy into other right-wing BS.

00:36:35.840 Interesting.

00:36:37.140 That is true.

00:36:38.080 It seems to be a very male phenomenon, the demon thing. 0.94

00:36:42.080 Yeah.

00:36:42.260 Because he wrestled with a demon.

00:36:45.100 Who wrestled?

00:36:45.920 You know.

00:36:46.680 Tucker.

00:36:47.100 Tucker Carlson.

00:36:48.700 He fought a demon in his head.

00:36:49.720 I mean, it's undoubtedly correct what he said.

00:36:52.280 I don't know if he wrestled.

00:36:53.040 I mean, he was like Jacob and the angel.

00:36:56.560 I mean, he wrestled with a demon and came out the other side, a new man.

00:37:00.160 He was inspired to read the Bible immediately, and then he opened up his shirt, and he had

00:37:05.980 scratch marks.

00:37:07.460 Yeah.

00:37:08.400 I mean, I believe it.

00:37:11.220 His wife was clearly trying to kill him. 1.00

00:37:16.320 Yeah.

00:37:16.800 For once you've gotten away with it.

00:37:21.360 Okay.

00:37:21.800 Let's move on to a little more of a serious issue, because I was curious about your thoughts

00:37:32.620 on this matter.

00:37:33.260 And that is IVF, embryo selection, writ large, and this whole issue, basically, of reproduction

00:37:45.360 beyond the traditional sexual union, and so on.

00:37:52.720 Now, perhaps I simply have some romantic, capital R and lowercase r, romantic hangups about IVF.

00:38:06.600 It gives me the ick, and I'm being irrational.

00:38:10.760 I can at least make some logical arguments against it, and I would be curious to hear your responses.

00:38:23.340 So IVF emerged in the 70s, and it was actually a woman whose fallopian tubes were blocked in some way,

00:38:33.200 and they were able to create this, you know, a Petri dish baby, a test tube baby.

00:38:38.480 And so there were problems just with the mechanics of a woman's reproductive system, 1.00

00:38:44.240 and they were able to overcome it.

00:38:46.700 But here's the problem, is that the journey of the sperm to the egg is evolved in a way that I don't think we fully appreciate.

00:39:01.340 The journey of that sperm is something like Odysseus' journey home after the Trojan War.

00:39:09.960 Like, it can take wrong turns and get lost and just die there.

00:39:15.320 The immune system is attacking it.

00:39:18.440 I mean, millions of sperm go in, and maybe like a dozen are near the egg.

00:39:24.420 I mean, it's sort of an incredible thing.

00:39:27.420 And not only that, the egg seems to select the sperm in a way that we don't quite understand.

00:39:37.580 Maybe it is random, but maybe we don't fully understand it.

00:39:42.940 And so there's all of this selection that is going on in that process.

00:39:50.440 In a Petri dish with an egg and a sperm, you are originally kind of pouring sperm onto the egg.

00:39:58.960 And I think now there's a way that they can inject sperm.

00:40:02.360 I think you might very well have seen this video that was all over Twitter of these, like, this is horrible.

00:40:09.700 These, like, nanobots, like, bringing the sperm and putting it into the egg.

00:40:14.540 So this is my very strong take here, is that millions of years of evolution is more intelligent than your science.

00:40:25.420 You don't know what you are doing.

00:40:27.640 You are very likely going to be engaging in malselection of sperm. 0.58

00:40:33.840 You know, the evolved system is going to pick out the best sperm, the top athlete, maybe the luckiest, to be fair. 0.82

00:40:43.900 But the greatest sperm survives, millions die.

00:40:49.780 You go into these labs, and who knows, you just randomly select a sperm and it gets in there.

00:40:55.120 And so we're losing this accumulation of intelligence that went into reproduction, and we're putting forth this.

00:41:06.160 So first off, what do you think of this, like, sort of initial critique of IVF, that it is dysgenic in effect?

00:41:18.180 It's dysgenic on the level of sperm selection.

00:41:20.640 So there are some people who are big boosters of this technology, who are big boosters of IVF and embryo selection, who say that basically, like, you should just stop reading the old-fashioned way.

00:41:36.520 Everyone should just do IVF, and then we'll, like, get you your predicted IQ and your predicted, you know, disease burden of the person, and then pick the best one.

00:41:44.020 Now, for your argument, I think you're right.

00:41:46.060 I think that there's too much we don't know.

00:41:49.660 So if you can reproduce naturally, go ahead and reproduce naturally.

00:41:53.600 You might get a few IQ points, maybe.

00:41:55.620 It's, like, it's very hard to know if this is, you know, like, they have these models, and they haven't run the experiments.

00:42:01.080 We haven't seen kids grow up, and, you know, some of them were embryo-selected and some of them not.

00:42:04.400 So we don't have good evidence.

00:42:06.400 There's GWAS studies where big data with, they try to predict stuff from your genome.

00:42:11.260 That science is kind of disputed.

00:42:13.020 But I think you're right on this.

00:42:16.400 And so I would not do IVF for people who are able to conceive naturally, unless maybe you have some kind of genetic, you know, disability.

00:42:23.780 If you have, you know, some Huntington's disease or something, one of those things that might get passed on, sure, do it in that case if you're high risk for something.

00:42:31.120 The case of most people who are getting IVF, though, are not doing that.

00:42:36.920 They're people who would not reproduce. 0.79

00:42:39.400 Now, if their genes…

00:42:41.020 Is that a big problem?

00:42:41.900 I mean, we…

00:42:43.400 Don't you think the liberal…

00:42:46.120 These are smart people with money.

00:42:51.460 If you're worried about the dysgenics, this is the least of your problems.

00:42:54.720 Maybe they will all come out and all have IQs like, you know, the mountains of Appalachia maybe.

00:42:59.800 I think there's been enough IVF people on board that, like, even if you are IVF, if you have two upper-class parents and they had you, your life is probably going to be okay.

00:43:09.260 Like, we should look at that evidence.

00:43:11.260 And so…

00:43:11.700 Well, I get that.

00:43:12.460 But what is wrong with you?

00:43:14.540 Even if you are some smart, elite human capital working at a law firm, what is wrong with you that you can't conceive?

00:43:21.600 Well, some people have medical problems.

00:43:24.200 I mean, I'm sorry. 0.58

00:43:25.200 I mean, not to be a total jerk here, but, like, I mean, isn't there more to being a successful human being beyond just IQ? 0.97

00:43:36.520 And if we keep allowing these weak nerds to do this, we're going to end up generation upon generation of this compounding interest of fertility treatment. 1.00

00:43:49.540 We are going to end up with people who can't even… 1.00

00:43:54.240 They can't fuck, like, to be as blunt about it as possible. 1.00

00:43:58.420 What in the hell is wrong with you if you can't do that? 1.00

00:44:01.860 And three generations down the line, we're going to have some crippled nerd race. 1.00

00:44:08.400 I mean, I think it's just a terrible thing.

00:44:11.180 I think it should be banned, to be honest.

00:44:13.640 We will have the crippled nerd race. 1.00

00:44:15.680 Yes. 0.76

00:44:16.900 Compounding interest.

00:44:18.100 Their children are going to use IVF, too.

00:44:20.080 They're going to think the same way.

00:44:21.560 They're going to have the same mechanical problems as their parents.

00:44:24.480 They're going to think like their parents because of heritability.

00:44:27.220 And it's just going to compound.

00:44:29.600 But we have this with everything. 1.00

00:44:30.460 We have three generations of imbeciles. 1.00

00:44:32.440 We have dumb people and defective people. 1.00

00:44:36.860 And the guy who has a low sperm count and is like a successful businessman or something, I'm not worried about it. 1.00

00:44:43.360 Okay, he has a low sperm count.

00:44:44.540 Maybe he's not good in bed.

00:44:45.960 Maybe his next generation won't be, right?

00:44:47.500 If you're worried about people who are having kids, like there are people with much worse socially undesirable traits who are having lots of kids.

00:44:54.620 So like start from there.

00:44:56.020 If this is a problem, we'll eventually realize it.

00:44:58.680 I mean it won't be that long.

00:44:59.640 We'll see that like they did three generations of IVF.

00:45:02.040 Oh my God, you can tell this guy's got, you know, something really, really wrong with him.

00:45:05.700 If that turns out through the case.

00:45:06.580 We'll all be the Oliver Wendell Holmes of like 2100.

00:45:10.700 Three generations of nerds is more than enough.

00:45:13.960 I don't know if they're nerds.

00:45:15.060 I mean, I don't know if that's like even true that they're just like nerds.

00:45:17.840 Like, I don't know.

00:45:18.700 They're just kind of.

00:45:19.360 It seems that way.

00:45:21.820 Richard.

00:45:22.260 What is the point of existence?

00:45:25.360 If it's not reproduction, you can't.

00:45:27.420 It's like you struggle breathing to like is is walking a problem for you? 1.00

00:45:34.060 Like, why can't you fuck? 1.00

00:45:36.220 You're asking me like it's the choice these people made. 1.00

00:45:39.000 I'm not.

00:45:39.560 I'm not.

00:45:39.940 I'm directing this at you.

00:45:41.100 Of course, I mean you in the general sense.

00:45:42.760 I'm talking to these nerds who are spending tens of thousands of dollars. 0.95

00:45:46.340 Some people have low sperm. 1.00

00:45:47.240 Some people could fuck just as good as you, Richard. 1.00

00:45:49.260 They just have low sperm counts or the woman can't get pregnant. 1.00

00:45:51.780 I seriously doubt that.

00:45:53.820 You're taking it as like an indication of like, you know, male potency or like a poetic

00:46:00.220 like romance.

00:46:00.880 Well, yeah.

00:46:01.780 Fertility is a vital sign. 1.00

00:46:04.300 It's a signal of your overall health.

00:46:07.080 Why are we helping all these sickly people? 1.00

00:46:09.560 The guys in the ghetto who have 80 kids by three different women, they are the pinnacle of 1.00

00:46:12.600 humanity?

00:46:14.580 Well, I understand that criticism. 0.99

00:46:18.160 And I'm, and I'm thinking of idiocracy with the guy who like impaled his genitals on a 0.99

00:46:23.280 gate after jumping a jet ski into a swimming pool. 0.97

00:46:26.740 And they say like, I, and he's had like 12 kids.

00:46:29.500 I get it. 1.00

00:46:30.380 But isn't there something to the fact that that idiot is vitalistic? 1.00

00:46:37.560 Yeah. 1.00

00:46:37.800 I give it to him.

00:46:39.160 Do you, do you understand? 0.83

00:46:39.860 Like, even if he is like a total just buffoon, I'll grant you that.

00:46:44.580 But like, he, he has the life force flowing through him. 0.83

00:46:49.340 And that is something.

00:46:51.800 It is, it is something.

00:46:54.340 Yeah.

00:46:54.800 It is something.

00:46:55.400 And that, I mean, whatever.

00:46:56.500 I mean, it is, you know, you're acting, you know, there is like a thing is just like

00:47:01.400 numbers and like being agnostic and waiting and seeing what happens.

00:47:05.520 You know, if, if 95% of kids were born IVF, I would say, you know, what are we doing here?

00:47:09.600 If it's like a few percentage of like people who can afford it and who are rich and who

00:47:13.720 are well off and seem to have okay outcomes, like whatever, if there's, if there's a, you

00:47:17.720 know, if there's a bad effect down the line, you know, that's, that's, I'm not like, like

00:47:23.780 nature, even if we're not having overcome nature yet, there will be a point.

00:47:28.020 And I hope humanity does get to the point.

00:47:29.660 I don't think we should just breed naturally.

00:47:32.300 We should probably have a combination of like biotech and like breeding naturally.

00:47:36.120 We should probably keep some populations breeding naturally just for the sake of genetic diversity

00:47:40.500 in case something goes wrong.

00:47:41.880 But like, eventually we'll be able to like go in and, you know, actually like know the

00:47:46.120 genes, the CRISPR takeout and, you know, genetic engineering to improve your IQ to make you

00:47:50.260 healthier, live longer.

00:47:51.420 That's great.

00:47:52.080 Like I would be in favor of that.

00:47:54.180 So we need kind of like, we need experimentation.

00:47:56.980 We need to see what works.

00:47:58.140 That will be valuable information.

00:47:59.400 If all the IVF babies after three generations all die when they're 10 or they all become impotent,

00:48:05.320 that'll be good scientific information to know.

00:48:07.640 Like we just, we shouldn't just sit here and, you know, forecast the future 100 years and

00:48:12.620 say, ban this and allow this on that basis.

00:48:14.760 Like, you know, we'll find out.

00:48:17.860 So RFH actually sent me a very interesting video that was from CBS News and they were doing

00:48:25.100 a report on an individual woman, but this actually raised a lot of important questions.

00:48:31.080 And this woman was abusing IVF in effect, and she was just in surrogacy actually at some 0.99

00:48:39.680 point.

00:48:40.460 So she was just having children.

00:48:42.960 I think she had 18 at some point and she was using these surrogates. 0.98

00:48:47.940 And there seemed to be no limiting factor to this woman just creating children willy nilly. 0.99

00:48:54.580 And there was even in this report indications that, it goes back to Epstein, child CES traffickers

00:49:04.240 might begin farming children this way as just horrifying through surrogacy and IVF.

00:49:13.980 It at least raises these questions.

00:49:17.340 But I would make two other points before I ask you to respond.

00:49:22.060 Two things.

00:49:24.660 First off, when it comes to something like a luxury product, like a Rolls Royce or a Rolex

00:49:30.680 watch or something, those are not being democratized.

00:49:34.680 No one thinks that you have a right to drive a Rolls Royce or something.

00:49:38.800 When it comes to health matters, anything that touches on health matters.

00:49:43.400 Those, the trend is that those will eventually be democratized.

00:49:47.860 And so it's not just rich nerds who are going to get their hands on this technology.

00:49:53.400 Donald Trump himself wanted to force insurance companies to cover IVF.

00:49:58.800 Tim Waltz was talking about how he used IVF or something like this.

00:50:02.480 And it's this great, good old American family thing.

00:50:05.180 Just, you know, just two babies.

00:50:06.860 Yeah.

00:50:07.040 So it's going to be democratized.

00:50:10.720 So maybe right now it's like the Collins family are using IVF, but it's not going to be that way for long.

00:50:19.260 And this is my other point about CRISPR, which would be gene editing and embryo selection, which you, there are companies now that are saying, oh, we think that there's like with this child, there's like an 80% chance he won't have your diabetes.

00:50:34.920 And then we can look at the IQ of this embryo within this range.

00:50:40.260 First off, something like human intelligence is deeply complicated, polygenic, and no doubt the whole nature and nurture thing is a virtuous cycle or a vicious cycle, I guess you could say.

00:50:55.080 But the deeply complicated trait, intelligence.

00:50:58.780 But secondly, we don't, you don't, we don't know enough.

00:51:05.320 You don't know what you're selecting for.

00:51:08.880 And you might say, oh yeah, let's just get rid of that diabetes.

00:51:13.420 But you don't know why diabetes might be there in the first place.

00:51:19.040 The classic example of this is something like sickle cell anemia, which affects African Americans.

00:51:25.240 There's a reason why that disease is prevalent in African Americans, and that it allows them to survive malaria carried by mosquitoes in their native environment.

00:51:37.100 What I'm saying is, is that you, you think that you can like correct a typo, like in a paper, you know, oh, I just misspelled that word all correct.

00:51:45.840 You don't in fact know what you're selecting for.

00:51:49.680 There, there are massive, not only is the accuracy debatable, but there might very well be massive trade-offs or opportunity costs that we don't understand that we are going to be engaging in with IVF and embryonic selection.

00:52:08.920 And again, I'll go back to my initial point.

00:52:13.060 Millions of years of evolution is more intelligent than your current science.

00:52:17.900 There's, you know, there's, there's a case for caution, but look, if you take this mentality, how, what would you say about birth control?

00:52:26.740 Right.

00:52:27.220 You, a woman, a woman has her period. 1.00

00:52:28.780 She gets, needs to get pregnant at certain times of the month. 0.97

00:52:31.340 Why do we have birth control? 0.98

00:52:32.340 I mean, you know, you don't know what you're doing when you're screwing with that.

00:52:35.460 Ozempic, you could say, you know, we are, we get fat when we eat too much for a reason.

00:52:39.340 Maybe God is trying to teach us.

00:52:40.960 I would say these things.

00:52:42.260 You would.

00:52:43.100 So you're just against science and technology.

00:52:45.020 There's nothing about genetics.

00:52:46.920 Right.

00:52:47.260 And I think that that's, you know, I think that is like not the experience of human history.

00:52:51.940 Like we've had progress, we've gotten healthier and smarter.

00:52:54.500 And like, we just don't throw up our heads at every point and say, evolution is smarter than us.

00:52:58.540 You know, you know, that's it.

00:52:59.980 Like, we're just going to stay here and do nothing.

00:53:02.400 We do stuff.

00:53:03.420 We get, you know, we get healthier.

00:53:04.720 We get, we get better.

00:53:05.600 We come up with cures for diseases.

00:53:07.300 And you're right.

00:53:08.400 I mean, there's a case to be cautious.

00:53:09.640 It's just like, if you can have a child naturally and there's no like, there's no disease that you expect to pass on.

00:53:15.660 You're not a high risk for anything.

00:53:16.880 And yeah, go ahead, breathe the normal.

00:53:18.740 It's easier.

00:53:19.180 It'll save you money.

00:53:20.080 It's more fun.

00:53:21.320 Right.

00:53:21.520 Do it, do it that way.

00:53:22.460 But then this idea like, oh, you know, I'm going to have Huntington's disease.

00:53:26.520 I'm going to have Down syndrome.

00:53:28.180 Do we really know if we want to get rid of that?

00:53:30.540 I think, I think we know enough to say we'd rather not have that.

00:53:34.240 Yeah.

00:53:34.380 I just, I don't think it'll stop at that point.

00:53:36.180 It seems that at some point, like Richard said, it will be democratized and it's going to be like taboo to conceive naturally.

00:53:45.000 I think we're so far from that.

00:53:46.740 I mean, we're so far from that.

00:53:48.480 There's like, yeah, maybe we are far from that, but yeah, you have to think all the way through.

00:53:54.080 The people who are having kids now are the people who don't have a lot.

00:53:57.960 Like there aren't a lot of Collins as compared to like religious fundamentalists who don't do any of this stuff. 0.59

00:54:02.220 Right.

00:54:02.420 So like you're worried about like the nerds using IVF outnumbering.

00:54:06.780 It's probably going to be the opposite. 0.69

00:54:10.000 Well, no, I mean, I, I, I'm, I'm worried about the development of a sickly nerd race. 1.00

00:54:17.560 Yeah.

00:54:17.700 Um, that the Collins are, I mean, there are kind of, I think you're just reacting to the Collins.

00:54:23.800 I don't know if they even did IVF.

00:54:25.380 I think they might've done it all naturally.

00:54:27.140 Um, I wouldn't be surprised if they did do IVF.

00:54:29.120 No, they've done IVF.

00:54:29.820 They did IVF in embryo selection.

00:54:31.560 Wait, are you talking about the, the, the problem glasses woman that, yeah. 1.00

00:54:36.860 Yeah.

00:54:38.060 Yeah.

00:54:38.340 No, they did IVF.

00:54:38.960 It looks like a handmaid, nerdy handmaid's tale kind of situation.

00:54:41.800 I don't think they've ever had sex. 0.97

00:54:43.280 I doubt they've ever had sex.

00:54:45.900 They don't, they're not the type. 0.50

00:54:46.900 They can't have sex. 0.78

00:54:47.920 They're no total nerds. 0.96

00:54:49.740 No.

00:54:50.780 I like different, let's have different races.

00:54:53.280 Let's experiment. 0.98

00:54:54.160 Let's, let's have a race of people who can't have sex. 1.00

00:54:58.260 They're not supposed to exist. 0.98

00:55:00.380 I wouldn't go like euthanize him because you know, he's nice. 0.99

00:55:04.240 Actually, he could have sex. 0.99

00:55:05.280 Actually, maybe he might've been good at it, but you know, you get the point. 0.98

00:55:08.100 If someone that couldn't have sex, I don't want to go like, whatever, they still might 0.99

00:55:11.080 be able to contribute something.

00:55:12.300 Maybe there'll be a bunch of sterile nerds and they'll like invent stuff. 1.00

00:55:14.980 And like, you know, the football players will, we'll have fun, you know, whatever.

00:55:18.440 It's like, we can't, we can't foresee, like we can't plan this stuff.

00:55:22.640 Like if we're at the kiss IVF being all babies being born.

00:55:26.140 Okay.

00:55:26.480 But like, we're way, way, way, way, way.

00:55:29.280 I understand that, but like, I can imagine within 20 years of CRISPR technology, maybe

00:55:36.520 using some sort of AI or something being democratized.

00:55:40.160 And we think of designer babies in the sense of like, oh, this couple, they, they can afford

00:55:46.000 to spend, you know, 200 grand on fertility treatments as they're going to create this 1.00

00:55:50.260 like high IQ baby who will get into Princeton.

00:55:52.460 And, and, and yeah, I, I sort of get problems people might have with that, but I'm worried

00:55:58.680 about something else.

00:56:00.940 I'm worried about this kind of technology being democratized and put in the hands of 1.00

00:56:07.200 idiots who are going to select for like gigantic asses. 1.00

00:56:11.640 And I'm not even joking, but you were just spending millions of dollars on Silicon asses. 1.00

00:56:18.760 Now, of course they're going to do this and it's going to, Trump will be like, it's an 0.84

00:56:23.160 American tradition.

00:56:24.820 If yes, we got to democratize this.

00:56:27.480 This world sounds fun.

00:56:29.060 You have your nerds here. 1.00

00:56:30.320 You have your giant shaking asses over here. 0.99

00:56:32.540 I mean, it's like, you have your naturals here. 0.99

00:56:34.500 You have your religious communities who don't want any part of it. 0.98

00:56:36.840 Well, you know, it'll be, it'll be diversity.

00:56:39.860 Oh my.

00:56:43.860 Okay.

00:56:44.300 Well, uh, fair enough.

00:56:48.640 Fair enough.

00:56:50.020 Um, so, so is there anything else, um, on your radar, Richard, that, uh, we should mention?

00:56:57.220 I was thinking about just doing sort of a brief live stream an hour or so, but is there, is

00:57:01.100 there anything else that, you know, has, you know, has a, has a, is a bee in your bonnet?

00:57:06.680 Um, not really.

00:57:08.260 I mean, you know, the thoughts, they go straight from my mind to the Twitter.

00:57:11.200 So you can follow that and see, see what I'm, what I'm thinking of, but no, nothing in

00:57:15.120 particular.

00:57:16.340 Yes, that is definitely true.

00:57:17.820 Um, all right.

00:57:20.200 Well, thank you for being here and, uh, we should definitely do this again.

00:57:24.840 And I continue to enjoy your Twitter and sub stacks.

00:57:29.040 So, uh, yeah, we do enjoy dunking on the same people.

00:57:33.240 It's, I enjoy your, I enjoy your insights.

00:57:36.000 I enjoy your demonology and your kind of Tucker takes.

00:57:38.540 So yeah.

00:57:40.480 Good.

00:57:41.200 Well, I will talk to you soon, Richard.

00:57:43.300 And yeah, thanks for being here as always, RFH.

00:57:45.860 And, uh, I will see you guys soon.

00:57:49.000 All right.

00:57:49.680 Bye bye.

00:58:11.200 Bye bye.

00:58:18.840 Bye.

00:58:21.100 Bye bye.

00:58:21.380 Bye bye.

00:58:22.020 Bye bye.

00:58:22.900 Bye bye.

00:58:23.340 Bye bye.

00:58:24.980 Bye bye.

00:58:25.440 Bye bye.

00:58:25.540 Bye bye.

00:58:26.280 Bye bye.

00:58:27.000 Bye bye.

00:58:28.080 Bye bye.

00:58:29.260 Bye bye.

00:58:29.440 Bye bye bye.

00:58:30.140 Bye bye.

00:58:31.080 Bye.

00:58:31.800 Bye bye bye bye.

00:58:33.340 Bye bye.

00:58:33.760 Bye bye.

00:58:34.540 Bye bye bye.

00:58:35.060 Bye bye bye.

00:58:35.660 You

RadixJournal - November 12, 2025

IVF, Jeffrey Epstein, & Elite Human Capital

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript